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Speaker 1: This is the Fits In with Kate Richie podcast.

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Speaker 2: One story fits that has scripped us over the past

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Speaker 2: week or so has been the murder which we can

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Speaker 2: confirm of two of the young boys, Jesse Bird and

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Speaker 2: also Luke Davis. A man has been arrested in this case,

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Speaker 2: but the bodies are yet to be found. So we search,

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Speaker 2: We search for questions and together as a community we

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Speaker 2: do everything we can to try and help, but also

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Speaker 2: to find the answers, we go to the top. So

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Speaker 2: we welcome to the show. Police Commissioner Karen Web Welcome

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Speaker 2: to the show. Karen, thanks for coming on.

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Speaker 1: Good morning. It's great to be with you.

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Speaker 2: Christ This has obviously rattled everybody and yesterday we heard

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Speaker 2: that the dams had been searched. We were down at

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Speaker 2: the New South Wales Southern table Lands. Can you give

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Speaker 2: us an update on where the search is at for

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Speaker 2: the two young men.

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Speaker 1: Yes. Unfortunately we didn't find the bodies in those dams,

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Speaker 1: so we're still appealing for information for anyone who saw

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Speaker 1: the Toyota the White Toyota high span on and around

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Speaker 1: the five, particularly in and around Sydney between Monday and

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Speaker 1: Thursday last week and its registration number is CW eighty

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Speaker 1: two PM. So any lead, any piece of information is

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Speaker 1: welcome and not too small because we're piecing together a

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Speaker 1: very complex investigation and people can call crime stoffers anonymously

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Speaker 1: and report anything that they may have seen that may

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Speaker 1: help us find them. And our attention now is to

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Speaker 1: find Luke and Jesse and give them the family some

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Speaker 1: solace and comfort that we're doing every single thing we

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Speaker 1: can to find them. I know their families just coming

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Speaker 1: into Sydney from interstate and they'll be they're interously waiting

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Speaker 1: to hear an upsdate.

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Speaker 3: Commissioner. Obviously we need answers, and we turn our attention

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Speaker 3: to bow Lamar Condon who was a member of the force.

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Speaker 3: Is he helping you with your investigation, Commissioner.

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Speaker 1: Well, it doesn't matter before the court, so we need

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Speaker 1: to be sort of careful about what we say, but

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Speaker 1: to say that no person is assisting us to show

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Speaker 1: us where the bodies are or indicate where the bodies are,

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Speaker 1: so it is making it a more complex and difficult investigation.

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Speaker 1: And detectives are working around the clock at all leads,

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Speaker 1: and there are many and it's over a week now,

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Speaker 1: so we're still asking for public help if they have

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Speaker 1: anything that they can add to the investigation.

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Speaker 3: He has made partial admissions to this, though hasn't he

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Speaker 3: too people that he knew.

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Speaker 1: Two witnesses, which is why he's been charged with murder

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Speaker 1: based on the evidence we've got so far and our

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Speaker 1: witness accounts, et cetera. So, as I said, it's before

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Speaker 1: the court, but certainly the investigation is a long way

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Speaker 1: from over, and we're really doing a long way to

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Speaker 1: understand what has gone on over the four days.

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Speaker 2: I think the hardest part two, Commissioner, is you know

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Speaker 2: someone with some experience in the force, and correct me

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Speaker 2: if I'm wrong, But he also had family that had

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Speaker 2: served in the force for a long period of time.

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Speaker 2: Is that correct?

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Speaker 3: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: I understand that's the case. I don't know the family

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Speaker 1: members directly, but yeah, and he's been with us I

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Speaker 1: understand since about twenty eighteen, right, Yeah, But that will

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Speaker 1: be going right through obviously the circumstances in the current case,

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Speaker 1: but obviously through his background and anything that might go

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Speaker 1: to the motive and cause, I mean, your young lives.

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Speaker 2: It must be extremely frustrating, Commissioner, when you have the man,

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Speaker 2: the man who has been charged with murder and then

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Speaker 2: you've got these families screaming for help, wanting to know

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Speaker 2: where the bodies are. You have the guilty man, yet

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Speaker 2: he won't tell you where they are. How does that conversation,

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Speaker 2: how does that interrogation with.

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Speaker 1: Him go, Yeah, well it's not guilty yet before until

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Speaker 1: he goes to court, but certainly he's been charged, certainly custody.

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Speaker 1: The families have said have phwn into mid State. I've

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Speaker 1: spoken to both families. They want answers, they want their

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Speaker 1: loved ones back, they want to understand what happens and

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Speaker 1: we want to help them have those answers.

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Speaker 3: Is it disappointing for you as well, Commissioner. I know

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Speaker 3: the Marti Gras is on and they have made a

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Speaker 3: decision overnight the board of the Marti Gras that the

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Speaker 3: New South Wales Police have been officially uninvited from marching.

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Speaker 3: I know that you're very strong that you know there

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Speaker 3: are some amazing police officers in the force that are

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Speaker 3: a part of the gay community that would be very

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Speaker 3: very disappointed that they wouldn't be a part of the

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Speaker 3: parade this weekend as am.

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Speaker 1: I and I was looking forward to participating in marching

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Speaker 1: with my troops again for another year. I mean, I

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Speaker 1: accept the decision of the board, but I am disappointed.

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Speaker 1: We've been participating in for a continuously for the last

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Speaker 1: twenty years, so it is disappointing.

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Speaker 2: It's not fair vision. Yeah, it's not fair at all.

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Speaker 2: That is frustrating. I mean, you're going to have when

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Speaker 2: people aren't people aren't robots, and communities aren't robots, and

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Speaker 2: when something goes wrong like this, obviously there's a serious situation,

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Speaker 2: but it doesn't reflect the force. So I don't know

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Speaker 2: if you can lodge a late application for a rethink

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Speaker 2: on this one, Commissioner, but it's extremely disappointing.

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Speaker 1: I will be talking with members of the community today

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Speaker 1: and maybe even the board if I get the opportunity,

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Speaker 1: because the elections of one person doesn't define the organization,

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Speaker 1: of course, and it's not represented in the organization that.

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Speaker 3: I lead, Commissioner. What is it within the inner sagnum

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Speaker 3: of the force? What is it you know, when a

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Speaker 3: member of the forces is hurt or harm we know

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Speaker 3: as a community how much that means to you guys.

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Speaker 3: But when somebody within the force uses their own means

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Speaker 3: and uses a weapon or something to do as something

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Speaker 3: a crime. How is that seen from the force? Is

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Speaker 3: that like, is it heightened? Is it magnified? Is it

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Speaker 3: something that's that you guys are obviously really disappointed with.

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Speaker 3: But what is it with you know, with you everyday

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Speaker 3: police officers, how would they.

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Speaker 1: Be feeling, Oh, like me, in shock and deeply concerned

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Speaker 1: that there's someone that was one of our own could

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Speaker 1: behave this way. So we're call for an internal review

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Speaker 1: to make sure our systems are robust. I mean, I

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Speaker 1: hope that in my lifetime that this is the only

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Speaker 1: event of this nature I see, and we will certainly

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Speaker 1: make sure that we prevent things like this from occurring

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Speaker 1: in the future. That's got a long way to go

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Speaker 1: to one look at our systems and policies, but also

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Speaker 1: in this particular investigation, and wait for the court matter

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Speaker 1: to play out, in the coroners matters to play out.

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Speaker 3: So Karen, just just before we go, is it clear

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Speaker 3: that you are searching this dam? But are you are

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Speaker 3: you pretty sure now that the body has been moved

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Speaker 3: so it could be somewhere else.

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Speaker 1: That's what we understand. We've had divers in that then

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Speaker 1: and we haven't located them, So that's why we've extended

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Speaker 1: our search and continuing our search, and we will continue

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Speaker 1: and we won't give up until we find Jesse.

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Speaker 2: And link Commissioner just quickly. Just to help paint the

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Speaker 2: picture for those that aren't completely across the story, the

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Speaker 2: accused had known Jesse or the two guys for around

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Speaker 2: a year prior to this happening. Is that correct.

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Speaker 1: I don't have the timeline specifically, really, I understand that

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Speaker 1: there's been a relationship with youccus and Jesse for some time.

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Speaker 1: I understand it might have been on and off relationship,

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Speaker 1: but I'm not sure how the eccus come to know

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Speaker 1: Luke in that situation.

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Speaker 3: Right, Okay, Well, we appreciate your time. We know how

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Speaker 3: busy and under pressure you are, Commissioner, so thank you

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Speaker 3: very much for coming on the show and updating us.

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Speaker 1: Thank you good for talking.

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Speaker 2: Thanks kin Sen. Whippa with Kate Ritchie is a nover

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