Speaker 1: I'll get a team, Greg, Anthony Harper, Anna from Anna Movement,
Speaker 1: Tiffany and Cook over there in the top left hand corner,
Speaker 1: and my bloody, my bloody page. Anyway, we'll start with
Speaker 1: tip Hi, TIF, high Hearts.
Speaker 2: How are you?
Speaker 1: Oh so good?
Speaker 3: Well?
Speaker 1: Not so good? Right now? I've got a piercing headache
Speaker 1: because ninety minutes ago you haven't even mentioned it. Can
Speaker 1: you see the top of my forehead?
Speaker 2: I can, but when you put your head up it's
Speaker 2: barely visible.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, So ninety minutes ago, I had a bloke
Speaker 1: just cutting into my head for the second time in
Speaker 1: two weeks. I also got this one, which is not
Speaker 1: very good for but you can just see that. So
Speaker 1: I had two big skin cancers cut off ninety minutes ago.
Speaker 2: Looks like wrestling sharks and.
Speaker 1: The bloody the bloody anesthetic is just starting to wear off.
Speaker 1: So if I start wearing my slurds and I start
Speaker 1: being even more incomprehensible and delusional and ridiculous than normal,
Speaker 1: you two might have to take over, do that. Anna
Speaker 1: Galtsworthy from On a Movement Wearing The Daily Talk Show,
Speaker 1: which is a now redundant but one time great podcast
Speaker 1: here in the Thriving Metropolis that Tommy et Ol featured
Speaker 1: on for a long time. Hi, how are you.
Speaker 3: I've got my friend Craig. Well, he featured on it daily,
Speaker 3: didn't he? That was his thing, Like I'm going to do.
Speaker 1: No, no, no, no, no, I'm Craig Tommy. I mean I'm
Speaker 1: talking about speaking speaking of cognitive decline, there's some right now.
Speaker 1: Well there you.
Speaker 3: Go, because I didn't know that I skipped a beat there.
Speaker 3: I thought that was pretty clear. Still referring to Tommy, Yes,
Speaker 3: daily he did.
Speaker 1: It was the daily talk show.
Speaker 3: That was his goal. Was was it one hundred days
Speaker 3: in a row? No?
Speaker 1: A thousand? They did a thousand episodes and then they
Speaker 1: then the boys pulled the pin, which is I mean,
Speaker 1: I was going to say, that's a fucking lot, but
Speaker 1: we're well past that before we go on, as I
Speaker 1: mentioned before, TIF otherwise Melissa will literally sack me from
Speaker 1: my own organization, which I do not want. Hey, everyone,
Speaker 1: guess what coming up on? Hang on? EA scrolls to
Speaker 1: the appropriate bit of the thing coming up on September
Speaker 1: nine online. That's right online, fuck no shit, yep online
Speaker 1: Between seven September nine in November eleventh, I am doing
Speaker 1: an exclusive. It's kind of exclusive because there's only fifteen
Speaker 1: people ten week mentorship me and fifteen people, it ain't cheap.
Speaker 1: So if you're looking for a bargain, this is not it.
Speaker 1: If you're looking, well, it depends on how you perceive it,
Speaker 1: I guess, but I think it's not that value. Mean,
Speaker 1: fifteen people a weekly thing between like I said, September
Speaker 1: nine and November eleven, it's a Monday night, it's ninety minutes.
Speaker 1: Knowing me, it'll go for close to hours as well
Speaker 1: as everyone who signs up for the program gets a
Speaker 1: one on one with me for forty five minutes, which
Speaker 1: also knowing me, will be an hour. And it is
Speaker 1: not for everyone. It is for people who obviously can
Speaker 1: afford it, but also for people who are ready to
Speaker 1: like have a have a crack, people who are a
Speaker 1: little bit sick and tired of being sick and tired,
Speaker 1: people who have been standing at the starting line but
Speaker 1: not really getting much beyond that for a long time.
Speaker 1: It is really kind of an amalgamation and a culmination
Speaker 1: of a lot of the stuff that I've done for
Speaker 1: the last forty years, working with bodies, working with minds,
Speaker 1: working with businesses, and organizations helping individuals and organizations and
Speaker 1: groups that think better, do better, and produce better. So
Speaker 1: that's kicking off very soon. If you want to know more,
Speaker 1: I know, go to the bloody website craigharp dot net
Speaker 1: and you'll find it. There you go sales, pitch over,
Speaker 1: take a side of fucking, take a breath whatever.
Speaker 2: There you go to si as Silk.
Speaker 1: Do you know what I do? It's clear I hate
Speaker 1: selling things, and I'm not. It's why I say it's
Speaker 1: not for everyone.
Speaker 3: That is for some.
Speaker 2: Well, actually it actually is a bargain if you ask me.
Speaker 2: The price point is magnificent.
Speaker 1: Well, a couple of people booked in and said this
Speaker 1: is not dear at all, and I went, I hate
Speaker 1: you know me, I hate selling shit. Right, I'm much
Speaker 1: more enthusiastic to talk about something that I'm doing for free,
Speaker 1: but apparently I have to pay the bills and Melissa
Speaker 1: and you which is you know, that's always a challenge.
Speaker 1: But anyway, that's what we're doing. So if you're interested,
Speaker 1: come along. Anna. How have you been? How have you been? Yeah?
Speaker 1: Have you been on Planet Anna?
Speaker 3: Planet Anna? Planet? So if we zoom right out and
Speaker 3: we look at planet Anna, she's fitter than she's ever been,
Speaker 3: Like in a really constructive, thoughtful way. She's you know,
Speaker 3: her family is as happy as she's ever been, referring
Speaker 3: to the family as she got a house, got a
Speaker 3: happy dog behind me. But zoomed in internal, Ana, she's struggling.
Speaker 1: Let's lean into that a little bit. We like Tiff
Speaker 1: and I like these conversations. We like it where there's
Speaker 1: a problem. No, well, do you know what we like?
Speaker 1: I think, I mean, I can't speak on behalf of Tiff,
Speaker 1: but I think I'm right when I say this, but
Speaker 1: myself definitely, I like it when we don't have a bloody,
Speaker 1: superficial let's get fucking amazing, let's pump the air and
Speaker 1: let's all think better and do better, and let's let's
Speaker 1: just it. Come on. It's like, I mean, we need
Speaker 1: those moments and we need a bit of encouragement and
Speaker 1: hyperbole and fucking rah rah and fire walking and fist pumping.
Speaker 1: But sometimes I think it's good for because you're a
Speaker 1: high performia an ex those physiologist, you stand in front
Speaker 1: of groups, you're a bit of a winner, you're super smart,
Speaker 1: so as Tiff. But I think it's nice when you know,
Speaker 1: not that we want to get on here and be
Speaker 1: fucking depressed every episode and talk about our bullshit. But
Speaker 1: I think periodically it's good for people to hear, you know,
Speaker 1: what's going on that's not awesome. So what do you
Speaker 1: think that's about? Why the internal malaise the malaise?
Speaker 3: So I'm quite confident, quite quite confident I've bruised into
Speaker 3: the second stage of perimenopause.
Speaker 1: Oh wow.
Speaker 3: When we've chatted before on this topic from a clinical
Speaker 3: point of view, we've talked about how forty to fifty
Speaker 3: five percent of women experience mental health challenges in that
Speaker 3: time because it's a neurological change, i e. It's a
Speaker 3: brain change. Experience, yes, and I was quite spontaneous. It
Speaker 3: was like one day feeling like me and then actually
Speaker 3: no longer episode, longer series. Probably about four months ago
Speaker 3: I started getting something that I would call was more
Speaker 3: similar to PMDD. Like so, PMDD is a unique condition
Speaker 3: where your mental health and your concept of yourself becomes
Speaker 3: completely thrown at a particular time of your menstrual cycle
Speaker 3: and you hit the pause button.
Speaker 1: Tiff, can you look up that episode I did with Nicky?
Speaker 1: Remember we did a whole episode on that and just
Speaker 1: tell us what that number is, just because someone's going
Speaker 1: to go I want to know more about that. Yep,
Speaker 1: sorry could come.
Speaker 3: And that was happening for me, like I would hit
Speaker 3: ovulation so I hear it still have a normal menstrual cycle.
Speaker 3: It was at that stage about thirty five days, so
Speaker 3: I'd hit ovulation and that would be you know, a
Speaker 3: point where you're typically kicking goals and you're feeling quite
Speaker 3: connected and all that kind of stuff. And I started
Speaker 3: noticing that my internal dialogue did not match who I
Speaker 3: am and what I'm pursuing and how I would normally think.
Speaker 3: So I'm so happy at the level of my own
Speaker 3: of awareness because I was able to go, hang a second,
Speaker 3: who's in my head? Because that's not how I think,
Speaker 3: That's not how I go about my day. That's not
Speaker 3: what I carry around when I'm trying to relate with
Speaker 3: other people, and it's not the energy to bring to
Speaker 3: it as well. And just on a body put a front,
Speaker 3: I required much more recovery in that part, you know,
Speaker 3: that's the second half of your cycle exercise. I was
Speaker 3: much agier, took a lot longer to recover anyway, that
Speaker 3: started happening for maybe about last three or four months,
Speaker 3: and I was like, oh, yeah, that's cool. This is
Speaker 3: just a predictable pattern. And I did a few things
Speaker 3: to sort myself out, and there's a few changes and
Speaker 3: a few positives, and then all of a sudden one
Speaker 3: day woke up and the darkest cloud I've well, I
Speaker 3: can't say that I've ever been in, but the darkest
Speaker 3: cloud in the last twenty years at least was what
Speaker 3: was in my head. Wow, it wasn't it as I said.
Speaker 3: It was spontaneous. It had a low grade anxiety to it.
Speaker 3: So there was like sometimes I describe it as that
Speaker 3: you're sitting in your car. You're a neutral and you're
Speaker 3: just gently reavy, so there's a buzz in the system
Speaker 3: that's distracting. But the thoughts were more depressive, more dark.
Speaker 3: It was more like, what the heck are you doing?
Speaker 3: Are you not good enough to be doing this? It
Speaker 3: was all the self doubt and sabotage stuff that normally
Speaker 3: I could catch and go that's not how you think,
Speaker 3: and use my strategies and shift it around. But this
Speaker 3: was louder. It was more radio doom, gloom constantly in
Speaker 3: the in the Norgin and I reckon. It's been going
Speaker 3: on for about two weeks now and pretty heavy, so
Speaker 3: I shared it with my partner. I hate there's some
Speaker 3: pretty heavy stuff going on for me. We've figured out
Speaker 3: what that looks like in terms of us, and you know,
Speaker 3: when I'm waving the flag or maybe when I'm not
Speaker 3: waving the flag but need support to some degree, sort
Speaker 3: of open about it with my kids in appropriate ways.
Speaker 3: But it's an interesting one because I actually I'm starting
Speaker 3: to feel a little better. I've put another few more
Speaker 3: things into play for myself, but the energy is still
Speaker 3: really there. It's a weird thing, and I think this
Speaker 3: is where a lot of people operate in depression, is
Speaker 3: that it's just gently there with you. It's not overtly
Speaker 3: big all the time, but it just gently follows you around.
Speaker 1: Or wow, that's funny. Do you relate to this, like
Speaker 1: what what's coming up for you as you're hearing this.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I've turned a bit of a corner the last
Speaker 2: two to three weeks, but my most of my earlier
Speaker 2: this year has been that in a very physically, very
Speaker 2: physical fatigue as well, but that not recovering and not Yeah,
Speaker 2: one hundred percent relate to everything you're saying, Anna.
Speaker 1: Would you explain Anna to me the dumbest, dumbest member
Speaker 1: of the panel and.
Speaker 3: That wound's coming through.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right. Well I probably I
Speaker 1: am literally the dumbest, dumbest. See I clearly prove my
Speaker 1: points to me and the other I'm being presumptuous when
Speaker 1: I say males. I'm sure some males are more all
Speaker 1: over this than I am. I'm a little bit over
Speaker 1: it because I trained women for forty years going through
Speaker 1: similar stuff, so I'm a little bit more educated and aware,
Speaker 1: but not on the same page as you. Two. When
Speaker 1: you go second stage of perimenopause, could you kind of
Speaker 1: without doing a two hour workshop in a in it
Speaker 1: or to break down first stage, second stage, like what
Speaker 1: is what's how do we define that? What is the difference?
Speaker 1: How many stages are there and what's happening?
Speaker 3: So the stages that I'm referring to are the ones
Speaker 3: that because I think there's two models that people talk about,
Speaker 3: so this is the model that Professor Pryor talks about.
Speaker 3: So four stages. Stage one is you know, there's subtle
Speaker 3: changes where progesterone is starting to drop down there's no
Speaker 3: overt real changes anywhere else in life. But you might
Speaker 3: notice your skincare routine doesn't work the same. You know,
Speaker 3: you need to switch to you odor it. Like there's
Speaker 3: just you know, there's a little bit more fatigue on board.
Speaker 3: So there's just all these really subtle changes, Like you're
Speaker 3: going about life in normal and there's just all these
Speaker 3: little subtle changes going on. But in all, in all,
Speaker 3: most things are the same. From a body point of view.
Speaker 3: Some people might start changing body shape a little bit,
Speaker 3: their exercise might to start to not suit them a
Speaker 3: little bit if they're tending to exercise well, I'd say
Speaker 3: people that are overtraining will have more overt in sort
Speaker 3: of messages from their body at that point. But all
Speaker 3: in all, Stage one is pretty masked, and that for
Speaker 3: some very early can start within sort of late thirties,
Speaker 3: but definitely at the start of the forties most scales
Speaker 3: are kicking into there. Stage two, you might start to
Speaker 3: see changes in the actual menstrual cycle, you know, day
Speaker 3: one today, whatever, in terms of the menstrual bleed. And
Speaker 3: then it also can be like your cycle starts changing
Speaker 3: length a little bit. The total so it might go
Speaker 3: from twenty eight to forty or forty to thirty. You know,
Speaker 3: there's just these really subtle changes, and then you zoom along.
Speaker 3: Stage three is okay, we're skipping some stage with some cycle,
Speaker 3: and at that stage you're probably having some pretty dramatic
Speaker 3: jumps in estrogen and drops in estrogen, and slowly in
Speaker 3: the background, progesteron is just becoming lower and lower and lower.
Speaker 3: So all the time the ratios are a bit different.
Speaker 3: And our body is a prediction system, right brain and body,
Speaker 3: so it's used to this predictable rhythm that you're in before.
Speaker 3: So that starts turning up in lots of spaces because
Speaker 3: hormone receptors are pretty much on every organ in your body.
Speaker 3: And then four is where it's technically the year from
Speaker 3: the last menstrual cycle, that one day when you click over,
Speaker 3: and that's assuming that you don't have stress changing a
Speaker 3: menstrual cycle and all these other things going out fire
Speaker 3: or in all the other stuff. And then there's a
Speaker 3: one day that's stage that's part of stage four, and
Speaker 3: then you clock over into post menopause. So menopause itself
Speaker 3: is one day.
Speaker 1: Really, yeah, I did not know that. So when people
Speaker 1: say I'm going through the menopause, which they my mum
Speaker 1: and her friend. Oh I've got the menopause. So who
Speaker 1: is my mum's girlfriends? I've got the menopause. I'm in
Speaker 1: the you know. Okay, that's see live and learn, fellas
Speaker 1: and some ladies, I'm sure. And so like the thing
Speaker 1: with all of these things, you know, like with guys
Speaker 1: go through obviously nothing nearly as difficult guys go through
Speaker 1: what is clinically called antipause. We have testosterone drops and
Speaker 1: a whole bunch of things happen, but not as nearly
Speaker 1: debilitating on any level. But I guess I'm asking, But
Speaker 1: I guess with menopause, like with a lot of other
Speaker 1: physiological changes that happen to both men and women over
Speaker 1: the lifespan, that it affects women, you know, obviously in
Speaker 1: different ways to different levels. For some people they kind
Speaker 1: of sail through it with a few minor speed but
Speaker 1: nothing overly dramatic, and for other people it's almost you know,
Speaker 1: or it is debilitating for periods of time. Right, And
Speaker 1: so is that is that primarily a genetic thing or
Speaker 1: is that a lifestyle thing, a behavioral thing, or a
Speaker 1: bit of everything.
Speaker 3: I think it's like we're kind of describing with my experience,
Speaker 3: there might be a genetic factor in it. So sometimes
Speaker 3: you can look at what was my experience in puberty
Speaker 3: one and you can get a pretty similar.
Speaker 1: Alright, we're all going, what's puberty one?
Speaker 3: Puberty one?
Speaker 1: You know, we're not a clinician, right, We're just some
Speaker 1: fucks listening to you. What's puberty one? Craig with a headache,
Speaker 1: Just Craig with a bandage.
Speaker 3: Puberty one. So puity one's just puberty for everyone. Yeah,
Speaker 3: but if we look at it through that female physiology
Speaker 3: lens and then carry it through the other title you
Speaker 3: could give, perimenopause is puberty two, right, Yeah, so there
Speaker 3: can be kind of genetic biases in there. So there's
Speaker 3: a genic bias in my family for depression, right as
Speaker 3: well as like Chucky, my grandfather went to war and
Speaker 3: he was suicidal and returning for war and all, you know,
Speaker 3: all those complications, and then you go ahead and look at,
Speaker 3: you know, the epigenetic change in my nervous system that
Speaker 3: was part of my story as a teenager, and how
Speaker 3: that kind of comes into what I've carried through. So
Speaker 3: that could potentially make it a little bit more extreme
Speaker 3: for me in puberty two or perimenopause. But usually there's
Speaker 3: there's a trend within your own body that when you
Speaker 3: get to this critical window of puberty one and critical
Speaker 3: window of puberty two. From a genetics point of view,
Speaker 3: where things are recalibrating as inevitable and programmed by our bodies,
Speaker 3: that has a level of genetics to it. But absolutely
Speaker 3: the stress levels, lifestyle, all of that comes into it.
Speaker 3: So when I'm working with corporates or people within my programs,
Speaker 3: stress management is a huge part of us. Stress management
Speaker 3: as in you know, emotional stress, psychological stress, mental stress
Speaker 3: is in workloads, life stresses, but then also exercises stress
Speaker 3: as well. So we want to look at what is stress.
Speaker 3: We want to take away that it's a bad thing
Speaker 3: and look where it is you stress.
Speaker 1: Or where it is distress.
Speaker 3: Distress, that's it, and you know that harmetic thing. It's
Speaker 3: a good version of stress until here, and that's very much.
Speaker 1: I think let's just clear that up for everyone. So
Speaker 1: when we talk, yeah, you stress is good, distress is bad.
Speaker 1: So going to the gym and working out as something
Speaker 1: as you do it the right way as a form
Speaker 1: of EU stress, you stress and distress is when Anna's
Speaker 1: screaming at me for doing a bad job and I'm
Speaker 1: getting stressed. Heytiff, while we've got the clinician on the show,
Speaker 1: do you have a do you want to be selfish
Speaker 1: and ask a question? No charge, absolutely free, like fuck it,
Speaker 1: get a console while she's here, I mean, nobody's listening.
Speaker 2: How do I just make it stop? Anna?
Speaker 3: You cannot? My friends? And I think that's a really
Speaker 3: nice question, tif because it is how we relate to
Speaker 3: it can be a massive and massive thing in terms
Speaker 3: of emotional and mental stress on it, and that can
Speaker 3: be you know, this is a relating to it as
Speaker 3: it's almost like a type of grief like I'm losing
Speaker 3: my youth or you know, I'm not seen in the
Speaker 3: workplace the same and actually putting a title on that
Speaker 3: and being mindful about how that does drive your decisions
Speaker 3: and stresses in terms of views and things. I think
Speaker 3: it's important for women to understand that when it gets
Speaker 3: to a certain point and you've run out of strategies
Speaker 3: within the lifestyle box, that you really should be or
Speaker 3: at any stage checking in with your GP as well,
Speaker 3: who's fully informed on hormone replacement therapy. Because it is
Speaker 3: shown in some things around sleep for example. There there's
Speaker 3: some good research and backing on it. There's it's relating
Speaker 3: to bone health, which can also relate to anxiety, demineralization
Speaker 3: and osteo I can't even think of the name now
Speaker 3: you're giving me blanks osteocoalcon which relates to anxiety levels
Speaker 3: from in a bit of a loop between the bone
Speaker 3: and the brain and that. Yeah, you just I think
Speaker 3: ultimately just having a conversation and starting a relationship with
Speaker 3: a GP that understands perimenopausal transition, because there's a bit
Speaker 3: of a yucky stat that that's upwards of ten visits
Speaker 3: for women before they get their symptoms taken seriously.
Speaker 1: Wow, Yeah, what what is that about it? Like, why
Speaker 1: do you think that is?
Speaker 3: There's some pretty strong data in across lots of medical
Speaker 3: medical spaces that women are not taken as seriously when
Speaker 3: fronted up in medical spaces. So pain, for example, we
Speaker 3: have to be in much much much more pain and
Speaker 3: we have to have come multiple times giving evidence of
Speaker 3: pain to be then have our pain taken seriously and
Speaker 3: medicated for whereas comparably, when they look at the studies
Speaker 3: a male coming with the same complaint would be medicated
Speaker 3: a lot earlier and a lot quicker.
Speaker 1: Wow.
Speaker 3: So that's just one example of how there's some quite
Speaker 3: big gaps gender gaps in how medicine is approached between
Speaker 3: female and male physiology.
Speaker 1: Have you been to an ED lately, either of you?
Speaker 1: Emergency department?
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm trying to think of the last time. After
Speaker 3: a run of a couple of years where I was
Speaker 3: in MD. It was a bit weird. I thought I
Speaker 3: had a curse or something.
Speaker 1: I was in that story. Well, I was in there
Speaker 1: last week when I was doing a circus trick in
Speaker 1: the gym that didn't end well. And let's just say,
Speaker 1: you know, I injured myself and I ended up. But
Speaker 1: the interesting thing is when you go in there, and
Speaker 1: this is a really interesting question, the triarche nurse or
Speaker 1: supervisor and the triarche person is the one that basically
Speaker 1: decides how hurt you are or how important you know,
Speaker 1: where you should be on the priority list. You know,
Speaker 1: So if you come in and you know your head's
Speaker 1: falling off, you'd be number one, right. But if you
Speaker 1: come in and you go, no, I tweaked ma looa back,
Speaker 1: You're going to be number forty six, and then the
Speaker 1: triage nurse asked me one to ten, how much pain
Speaker 1: are you in? And I know the system, right, and
Speaker 1: I knew if I said ten, I'm going to get
Speaker 1: bumped up. But I didn't want to say because I
Speaker 1: wasn't in ten pain. But I also wasn't in one pain.
Speaker 1: I was in like significant pain for a while, so
Speaker 1: I think I said five or six, you know. But
Speaker 1: it's funny how they there's this subjective evaluation that obviously,
Speaker 1: you know, like there could be a dude in the
Speaker 1: exact same pain as a lady and he goes nine
Speaker 1: and a half and she goes four, and they're experiencing
Speaker 1: or vice versa. It doesn't have to be gender based,
Speaker 1: but it's just it's just funny where you go in
Speaker 1: and you literally give them this score, and that will
Speaker 1: that will definitely influence how quickly you get seen. But
Speaker 1: pain is a really interesting science. If you look like
Speaker 1: you're going to say something.
Speaker 2: We just think that's reflective of most symptoms of perimenopause
Speaker 2: and menopause is it's an evaluation of circumstantial things and opinions.
Speaker 2: You're going and you say I'm not sleeping well, I'm
Speaker 2: feeling anxious. People get put on antidepressants and anti anxiety
Speaker 2: meds for this year. I have gone, I've been going.
Speaker 2: Am I perimenopausal? Or do I have I been bringing
Speaker 2: up some trauma and is that coming out in my
Speaker 2: body and mind? Or I am I just under long
Speaker 2: term burnout and this is the end of the road,
Speaker 2: Like or is the intermittent fasting that I was doing
Speaker 2: is that really not good for me and raising my
Speaker 2: cordinal levels? Or like how do you answer that one
Speaker 2: question of what is this cluster of symptoms all about?
Speaker 1: Or is this cat making me mental?
Speaker 2: That's very beautiful. You saw how lovely she used in
Speaker 2: that video I shared, you think very much.
Speaker 1: Let's not open the cat door again. I got it
Speaker 1: cat defense. I got in trouble. But it's true because
Speaker 1: like your stress response or your level of anxiety could
Speaker 1: be a specific thing, or it could be a combination
Speaker 1: of things, right, and it's hard to know exactly what
Speaker 1: is the main contributor or cause.
Speaker 3: It can be a real kickut and there's like there's
Speaker 3: multiple things in what you just said. Then well we
Speaker 3: could do a consolet on.
Speaker 1: It is.
Speaker 3: It's this gentle recalibration in your brain about what neurotransmitters
Speaker 3: are available for me from a prediction system that my
Speaker 3: body is used to.
Speaker 1: What does that mean in English?
Speaker 3: Because so we've got hormone receptors in our brain, estrogen, progesterone,
Speaker 3: and they have partnerships with different neurotransmitters, so they're kind
Speaker 3: of related to what drives us, what gives us particular feelings.
Speaker 3: We don't fully underne I don't want to say wheeze
Speaker 3: if I'm involved, but when we look at you know,
Speaker 3: the scientists that are looking and talking about that, we
Speaker 3: still don't fully understand where emotions come from. And there's
Speaker 3: a fantastic book by Lisa Feldman Barrett where emotions come from.
Speaker 1: She's been on the show Get Out.
Speaker 3: I have to go back, Jiff, get us the number.
Speaker 3: So this is it's an interesting thing in what you're
Speaker 3: talking about, right, Tiff, because if we go all of
Speaker 3: those things could be part of what's going on for you.
Speaker 3: And we just need to figure out where the hierarchy
Speaker 3: of decision needs to be. But that ultimately, as someone
Speaker 3: coming to their forties, am I correct?
Speaker 2: Yeah? Forty one?
Speaker 1: She wishes, she wishes fucking bodies in the rearview mirror.
Speaker 2: Bro And by the way, here went randomly curly two
Speaker 2: years ago from dead straight to curly.
Speaker 3: That you know boiling away under there is that it's
Speaker 3: not a perimenopause, isn't a switch. It doesn't just got
Speaker 3: kind of get switched on. It's this gentle transition that happens,
Speaker 3: like some people are still having babies through this time,
Speaker 3: so it gets masked into that process. To your point,
Speaker 3: you're potentially having a level of burnout, which would then
Speaker 3: exacerbate the experience of perimenopause because stress drives and sort
Speaker 3: of snatches progesterone, which is our calming foremone. So we've
Speaker 3: got this. It's interesting, right, because it could be all
Speaker 3: of those things. But which is the most powerful thing
Speaker 3: for us to look at and put our attention towards.
Speaker 3: Which is going to flick a switch in your physiology?
Speaker 3: And that's sort of less of a cookie cutter thing,
Speaker 3: but more about knowing what's happened for tiff all the
Speaker 3: way through a physiology from day zero to now, even
Speaker 3: potentially previous generations. And you know, then, how is that
Speaker 3: map out? It's and really commonly is at this point
Speaker 3: which is definitely my story as well. I'm at kind
Speaker 3: of the peak of my career. I'm really clear at
Speaker 3: what i want to do, and I'm pushing hard, and
Speaker 3: often we're climbing the ladder and there's you know, kids
Speaker 3: rocking around. Potentially there's definitely parents rocking around having troubles
Speaker 3: with their health as well. This is a heap on
Speaker 3: the plate as well from just a general stress point
Speaker 3: of view. But you trucking a little bit of burnout,
Speaker 3: and burnout and perimenopause symptoms mimic each other really similar, do.
Speaker 1: You think, Anna, So you've been kind of for all
Speaker 1: of your career until now working When you would work
Speaker 1: with women with menopause or in perimenopause, it's more even
Speaker 1: though you're trained and qualified and knowledgeable and researched, it's
Speaker 1: more theoretical. But now you've got this experiential understanding, right
Speaker 1: Like now you're like, oh, this is actually like there's
Speaker 1: a big difference between you know, I've written a million
Speaker 1: programs for people to run a marathon, but when I
Speaker 1: ran my first marathon, I went, oh, fuck, oh this
Speaker 1: is bullshit. The fuck wants this fucking marathon running? Like
Speaker 1: I reckon, I'd written a hundred programs accident as an
Speaker 1: exercise scientist for people to train for and run a marathon,
Speaker 1: and then I ran one. I went, why the fuck
Speaker 1: would anyone do? This is ridiculous right one and out.
Speaker 1: And yes, I'm comparing marathon running to menopause. I don't
Speaker 1: know why.
Speaker 3: It's a ten year thing.
Speaker 1: Well yeah, but for you, you're sitting in the middle
Speaker 1: of it, having all this knowledge and having had all
Speaker 1: this experience coaching and you know, prescribing and caring for
Speaker 1: people going through what you're now going through. How do
Speaker 1: you manage you? Because not everybody has your knowledge or
Speaker 1: skills or awareness. So like for you to go like
Speaker 1: for you to share how you feel and to describe
Speaker 1: with absolute clarity you know your hormones and your emotions
Speaker 1: and your even your psychological state. Is that an interesting
Speaker 1: albeit not fun, but an interesting process?
Speaker 3: Yes, is the short answer. And then from it, like
Speaker 3: I looped the two concepts together from a business point
Speaker 3: of view and from a like a me point of view,
Speaker 3: is when I first form directly started speaking to perimenopause
Speaker 3: rather than just people rocking in and checking where they
Speaker 3: were at, you know, within a group or program format.
Speaker 1: I was.
Speaker 3: I was taking a Chinese medicine approach to perimenopause, and
Speaker 3: they say, if you come to me with symptoms, you're
Speaker 3: seven years late. I think that's what they say. So
Speaker 3: I was recovering from my second pregnancy and a huge
Speaker 3: burnout nod to tip, huge burnout, and I was just
Speaker 3: starting to put body weight back on, and I was
Speaker 3: getting my head clear and thinking about starting another business,
Speaker 3: and I was hanging a second, I really need to
Speaker 3: be more thoughtful with my health. So I started seeing
Speaker 3: a Chinese med practitioner. And it's probably one of my
Speaker 3: proudest health things in the last four years, is because
Speaker 3: I've gone consistently and I've done that, and I've been
Speaker 3: lucky enough to have the cash to be able to
Speaker 3: do that, and that's the most consistent I've been with
Speaker 3: something outside of me making decisions for my health. So
Speaker 3: I've done that consistently for like two or three years
Speaker 3: with my amazing practitioner, and that was these teeny tiny
Speaker 3: check ins with my health every month that I would
Speaker 3: not have done before.
Speaker 1: What is the continued on, sorry, what is the divergence
Speaker 1: between your very Western training as an exercise scientist and
Speaker 1: exercise physiologist where we're all about, you know, like medicine,
Speaker 1: Western medicine and drugs and anatomy and physiology and understanding
Speaker 1: the body through a very Western science kind of lens.
Speaker 1: Like what led you to and this is not this
Speaker 1: is a curiosity, not a criticism. What led you to
Speaker 1: open the door on going and seeing a Chinese practitioner?
Speaker 1: What did you learn? Why did you do it? And
Speaker 1: what's the space between you know, what you knew in
Speaker 1: the past and what you know now having worked with
Speaker 1: that person.
Speaker 3: I just had to pause and I don't actually know
Speaker 3: if I can answer with like clarity. There's a clear
Speaker 3: feeling coming up in my body at the moment, which
Speaker 3: is like it's a warmth and it's a comfort, and
Speaker 3: it's a trust and it's not a trust. It's weird
Speaker 3: because it's not a trust because I understand what they do.
Speaker 3: It's a trust because it's just trust in maybe the
Speaker 3: deep long history of it as a medicine practice. And
Speaker 3: also this vary for me because you know, I'm a thinker.
Speaker 3: I like problem solving and you know, being I need
Speaker 3: to be thoughtful that I'm not creating problems because I
Speaker 3: am a problem solver. Yes, is that I like being
Speaker 3: able to go and trust the process but not know
Speaker 3: the process.
Speaker 1: That's called faith, that's called faith handover.
Speaker 3: So completely handover and trust the practitioner has got. I've
Speaker 3: got to click personally with the practitioner. Definitely. Still that
Speaker 3: doesn't go away, but there's there's an intrigue and also
Speaker 3: just an ability. It's a need and ability and to
Speaker 3: want to be able to let go of being the
Speaker 3: decision make it completely for my own body.
Speaker 1: So there's seven people leaning forward on their seats now
Speaker 1: going harps ask her what the fuck happens when she
Speaker 1: goes like what is the treatment? What is the medicine? Like?
Speaker 1: What do they do? What do you do?
Speaker 3: So what I can say what I do? So they
Speaker 3: work on meridians and acupuncture channels, and you know they
Speaker 3: live in the organs and they're looking for different flows
Speaker 3: in the body based on symptoms. So what I would
Speaker 3: do was come with symptoms and then how they relate
Speaker 3: to them is different to how the medicine system would
Speaker 3: relate to it. And they still treat illnesses, but ultimately
Speaker 3: what they're doing is a wellness system, so they're looking
Speaker 3: for health before it goes wrong.
Speaker 1: Yes, we're proactive, not reactive.
Speaker 3: Yeah, whereas Western medicine is inherently something's gone wrong, here's
Speaker 3: our drugs to control it, fix it, all that kind
Speaker 3: of stuff.
Speaker 1: Have I ever told you my story about I've told
Speaker 1: this two or three times, so I apologize listeners if
Speaker 1: you've heard it, Tiff, you might have heard it. But
Speaker 1: I did one hundred years ago, when I was running
Speaker 1: track side sports in Hampton down the road, I did
Speaker 1: an Advanced Diploma of Tactile Therapy, which is essentially an
Speaker 1: eighteen month course in massage, shiatsu aka pressure, reflexology, all
Speaker 1: this stuff. Right, it's kind of halfway between a cert
Speaker 1: for and a degree or something. It was. It was
Speaker 1: quite hard, right, but for me because I wasn't particularly
Speaker 1: you know, clever. Anyway, nothing's changed, but one day we
Speaker 1: did this thing. Where so, reflexology is basically in simple
Speaker 1: terms like points in the feet where they poke bits
Speaker 1: of your foot and that corresponds to a spot in
Speaker 1: your body. Right, And so in Eastern medicine, as you said,
Speaker 1: pressure points, there's like three hundred and sixty one pressure
Speaker 1: points and fourteen what they call energy meridians or meridians,
Speaker 1: and they have this you know, iridology years using the
Speaker 1: eyes to kind of treat the body or recognize things,
Speaker 1: and reflexology is the foot, right, And I really thought
Speaker 1: at this point, like I remember my teacher his name
Speaker 1: was Maurice Copeland, and I remember thinking this is bullshit.
Speaker 1: But I didn't say it. I just I just doubted, right.
Speaker 1: I thought, there's no way that you can fuck around
Speaker 1: with my foot and then diagnose something in my body,
Speaker 1: because it essentially you know. And so he had this.
Speaker 1: So we did night one and there's like twenty thirty
Speaker 1: students and he goes, Craig, can you come up the front.
Speaker 1: I'm like sure, So me and my magnificent feet go
Speaker 1: up the front and then he's got these two charts
Speaker 1: behind us, these a frames left foot, right foot, and
Speaker 1: all the parts of the left and right foot which
Speaker 1: correspond to different parts of the body. And he goes,
Speaker 1: he didn't say it, but this is essentially what he said,
Speaker 1: let me just fuck around with your feet. Don't tell
Speaker 1: me if you've got any issues, any pain, any anything.
Speaker 1: Let me just fuck around with your feet, which he
Speaker 1: didn't talk like that. I do. So anyway, he started
Speaker 1: on one foot and he's going through it and he's
Speaker 1: like this, this is the fucking spleen, and this represents
Speaker 1: the lungs and this is the you know, like corresponding,
Speaker 1: I'm like whatever, and then he gets onto my nothing.
Speaker 1: Then he gets onto my other foot and he touches
Speaker 1: this spot and I nearly go through the fucking roof.
Speaker 1: I didn't even know. And he goes, oh, you've got
Speaker 1: a problem with your back, and I'm like, and I
Speaker 1: actually had between my shoulder blades like heaps of pain
Speaker 1: and he goes, oh, and it's thoracic right like, and
Speaker 1: he goes hmm. He goes, well, while I'm here, do
Speaker 1: you want me to fix it? And I'm like, well,
Speaker 1: So then he fucks around with my foot for five minutes,
Speaker 1: and I'm not bullshitting, the pain that i'd had for
Speaker 1: three or four days in the middle of my back
Speaker 1: went away. And I'm like, you're a fucking wizard. I'm
Speaker 1: a little bit scared and I'm a lot impressed. But
Speaker 1: he literally diagnosed. And I'm the most skeptical person. So
Speaker 1: if I'm saying everyone, it's well, in my case, it's
Speaker 1: true that's what actually happened. But yeah, so I have
Speaker 1: at the very least I have a very open mind
Speaker 1: about Eastern medicine.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And I think for me, like when you're saying
Speaker 3: what people want to know, what it's like, I think
Speaker 3: for me, the first time I came to it was
Speaker 3: when I was pregnant, and I used it as an induction,
Speaker 3: so you know, the end of your pregnancy, when you're
Speaker 3: trying to encourage the body to naturally go into the
Speaker 3: birthing process. And I guess at that point it was
Speaker 3: if I think back on it and try and give
Speaker 3: it a title, it was me trying to connect with
Speaker 3: my body. It's classically the history with my body is
Speaker 3: I'm the boss of you body. I'll tell you what
Speaker 3: to do, I'll tell you what shape you meant to be,
Speaker 3: and I will absolutely go to the ends of earth
Speaker 3: to make you present in the way that makes me
Speaker 3: feel mentally and emotionally. Okay. So I never really connected
Speaker 3: to my body in this kind of way, which is
Speaker 3: I think pregnancy gave me that gift, which you know
Speaker 3: all of us are lucky to have that. But that's
Speaker 3: I think initially what brought me to it, and I
Speaker 3: didn't stay in that at all. I went out and
Speaker 3: then had my next version of burnout and was a
Speaker 3: mother and da da da da da, and then coming
Speaker 3: back to it again after my second trial was born,
Speaker 3: which was like six years later, and that was me
Speaker 3: needing to return to my body again by guidance by
Speaker 3: someone else. And you go into a session, you talk
Speaker 3: about you know what's brought you here. They guide your
Speaker 3: questions as well based on their world and if you
Speaker 3: are okay with needles, akaid, needles get put in. I
Speaker 3: had a couple of kind of whack versions of that
Speaker 3: actually where needles were put in and then I'm laying
Speaker 3: there and I felt like I was spinning. Wow, no ACU,
Speaker 3: no Chinese med or accub person has been able to
Speaker 3: answer to me what that was. So anyone that knows
Speaker 3: the answer, please contact Craig on me. But yeah, you
Speaker 3: get your needles on and often there's a little cute
Speaker 3: little term that they call it. They call it an
Speaker 3: acu nap. So often when you're in there, your you know,
Speaker 3: your energy channels are being aligned and the things that's
Speaker 3: being treated allows you to come into a state of
Speaker 3: recovery and relaxation. So yeah, I would meditate on the
Speaker 3: table and you know, do my little breathwork practice there
Speaker 3: and tell my brain to stop trying to fix it,
Speaker 3: let you know, trust the process and yeah, but it
Speaker 3: was also very caring because the practitioner I had, I
Speaker 3: would come in every time. It was interesting too. Sorry
Speaker 3: I'm layering, I'm jumping backwards. I would have said I'm
Speaker 3: a pretty healthy person, but having going to her monthly,
Speaker 3: I would come back and go, oh, no, you know
Speaker 3: I had a cold or no, no, this happened. No, no,
Speaker 3: this happened. No. And it was amazing how much of
Speaker 3: what was going on in my body essentially got denied
Speaker 3: because I was on the autopilot of life, was cruising along,
Speaker 3: not actually fully attending to my wellness particularly well. So
Speaker 3: having her there as a check in was really, really
Speaker 3: quite powerful.
Speaker 1: I want to lean into this idea of connecting with
Speaker 1: the body. I feel like that's a really that's probably
Speaker 1: another episode. But I feel like a lot of us
Speaker 1: are disconnected from our body, or completely identified by our body,
Speaker 1: but disconnected from what it's telling us. Disconnected from you know,
Speaker 1: we talk a lot about the body being a biofeedback system.
Speaker 1: It's always talking, it's always sending signs and signals and messages,
Speaker 1: it's always communicating. But sometimes because we're so either so unaware,
Speaker 1: so disconnected, so focused on something else, we don't listen.
Speaker 1: And I know there's no three step plan, and this
Speaker 1: is open to both of you. How do we connect
Speaker 1: with our body? I feel like I'll shut up after this.
Speaker 1: I feel like for most of humanity, most of the
Speaker 1: evolutionary time line of human kind, you know, three hundred
Speaker 1: thousand years or so, we haven't had all the shit
Speaker 1: that we have now. We haven't been so distracted, so sidetracked,
Speaker 1: so obsessed with other bullshit, and we've lived a much
Speaker 1: more natural life and been much more naturally connected. Is
Speaker 1: there is there a path back to connection? What might
Speaker 1: it look like? What might an ingredient be.
Speaker 3: We've just passed the law today where employees are allowed
Speaker 3: to know not engage in work outside of work hours. Lawfully,
Speaker 3: that's a step, but I think, yeah, I don't. From
Speaker 3: an exercise point of view, I think we really need
Speaker 3: to completely change the role of exercise. So exercise now
Speaker 3: is marketed and delivered to people as a way of
Speaker 3: controlling their body. It is not delivered to them as
Speaker 3: a way of feeling the discomfort and the resilience of
Speaker 3: a marathon run. How that relates to me as the
Speaker 3: person I would like to be and leaning into what
Speaker 3: matters in my life. It's going slowly, so slowing down.
Speaker 3: So for some people, laying still on an acupuncture table
Speaker 3: would sound like a version of hell versus you know,
Speaker 3: can we go fast and can we go slow? So
Speaker 3: for most people it's learning how to go slow, I think,
Speaker 3: or at least in my world. But also for other people,
Speaker 3: feeling discomfort and knowing what version of discomfort is appropriate
Speaker 3: for the body to feel, and trusting the body in
Speaker 3: that way. That also leans into pain as well. Pain
Speaker 3: as a signal from the body, not something to be
Speaker 3: controlled or gotten rid of, which is a fair paradigm shift.
Speaker 3: Is what is this pain trying to tell me?
Speaker 2: En?
Speaker 3: If I inquisitively say to my body, what what do
Speaker 3: you need? Rather than medicating it? And you know, I'm
Speaker 3: not denying the requirement of that for people to function,
Speaker 3: But for most of us who just have intermittent pain,
Speaker 3: what is this pain telling me about what I'm doing
Speaker 3: in my life that then therefore needs to be attended
Speaker 3: to in a different way, so I think, And also
Speaker 3: just returning to our body in the sense that when
Speaker 3: we have an emotion or a habit or a stimulus.
Speaker 3: The following response is that actually helpful? And if I
Speaker 3: actually tap in with what does that stimulus from a
Speaker 3: brain to body experience do to me? Where does it land?
Speaker 3: And then what choices do I habitually make because of
Speaker 3: that sensation that we could be way more tuned into
Speaker 3: the sensation. I've been sitting in this chair for two
Speaker 3: my bum is numb. That means I haven't had a
Speaker 3: break for me to then reboot my brain. So therefore
Speaker 3: I'm delivering this work or talking to this person and
Speaker 3: I'm not fully available. If my bom is not my
Speaker 3: brain is definitely And.
Speaker 1: I think also just recognizing that the average person and
Speaker 1: this is bro science and this is not research, but
Speaker 1: I would guess the average person in twenty twenty four,
Speaker 1: just in terms of general movement and energy expenditure, moves
Speaker 1: way less than the average Aussie in nineteen twenty four.
Speaker 1: Like you know, life just used to be more effort,
Speaker 1: more energy expenditure, more movement, more incidental exercise, more occupational exercise,
Speaker 1: you know, whereas now you if you want to build
Speaker 1: a life that involves fucking next to no movement, you
Speaker 1: can do it. You know you can, you can work
Speaker 1: from home and spend your life. You know, I mean
Speaker 1: having this conversation with my dad and you know, trying
Speaker 1: to get him too, because his life right now, because
Speaker 1: he's been crooked the last month. And I understand he's
Speaker 1: eighty five and he's been crooked, but he's literally spending
Speaker 1: twenty three and a half hours a day in a
Speaker 1: chair or in bed because he doesn't have to move much.
Speaker 1: And I'm going, I understand that's comfortable, Dad, but it's
Speaker 1: going to fucking kill you, because even though you're eighty five,
Speaker 1: you still need movement, you still need strength, you still
Speaker 1: need balance and function, and we don't need to turn
Speaker 1: you into an olympian. But for fox sake, get out
Speaker 1: of the chair. You know, it's like, it is so
Speaker 1: easy to do not much with our current lifestyle.
Speaker 3: Hey, we've got choosing now, isn't it?
Speaker 1: Oh? It is it is. I just looked at the thing.
Speaker 1: Tip's got to go. I've got to go, You've got
Speaker 1: to go. Let's continue your version of this conversation very soon,
Speaker 1: your ace. How do people find you, follow you and
Speaker 1: pay you an enormous amount of money to come and
Speaker 1: work with their organization.
Speaker 3: I am available at un a movement on Instagram, on
Speaker 3: goldswe he is my personal page on LinkedIn and a
Speaker 3: movement as well on LinkedIn as well on my website
Speaker 3: is on a movement dot com and there's a little
Speaker 3: contact me page like everyone has in you can reach out,
Speaker 3: we can have a conversation, beautiful Tiff.
Speaker 2: Yes, if anyone would like to learn more about pmd D.
Speaker 2: It was episode fifteen twenty four with Nicki Morrison and
Speaker 2: Lisa Feldman Barrett get your pen out, Anna was episode
Speaker 2: one oh seven, O.
Speaker 1: Chiff You I mean Joe Rogan has Jamie, I have you.
Speaker 2: I'm here for you.
Speaker 1: Bro Us three will say goodbye affair, but for now,
Speaker 1: thank you Anna, Thank you, Tiff, Thank you everyone, Thanks
Speaker 1: you too,