1 00:00:05,700 --> 00:00:08,010 Sean Aylmer: Welcome to the Fear and Greed Business Interview. I'm Sean 2 00:00:08,010 --> 00:00:10,650 Sean Aylmer: Aylmer. Regular listeners to the show would know we love 3 00:00:10,650 --> 00:00:15,660 Sean Aylmer: talking about unusual and alternative investments. Stefan Von Imhof, the co- 4 00:00:15,660 --> 00:00:20,370 Sean Aylmer: founder of alternative investing community fund Alts. co, A- L- T- S. 5 00:00:20,610 --> 00:00:24,329 Sean Aylmer: co, has talked us through investing in art, vinyl records, 6 00:00:24,329 --> 00:00:28,679 Sean Aylmer: tequila, domain names, watches, even water, I think. Today, we're 7 00:00:28,679 --> 00:00:32,370 Sean Aylmer: talking about investing in sporting teams. Obviously, this is general 8 00:00:32,370 --> 00:00:34,829 Sean Aylmer: information only and you should always seek professional advice before 9 00:00:34,830 --> 00:00:37,890 Sean Aylmer: making investment decisions. Stefan, welcome back to Fear and Greed. 10 00:00:38,310 --> 00:00:39,750 Stefan Von Imhof: Great to be here. Thank you for having me. 11 00:00:40,650 --> 00:00:43,440 Sean Aylmer: Now, one that we're going to start with, I know 12 00:00:43,440 --> 00:00:47,550 Sean Aylmer: is one that you guys are interested in. You've been 13 00:00:47,550 --> 00:00:52,079 Sean Aylmer: in New Zealand recently. There's talks about a new NRL 14 00:00:52,080 --> 00:00:56,040 Sean Aylmer: team, National Rugby League team there. Take me through the 15 00:00:56,910 --> 00:01:00,090 Sean Aylmer: thinking behind that and investing in a sport like that. 16 00:01:01,350 --> 00:01:04,349 Stefan Von Imhof: So, if there's one thing we've learned in our time 17 00:01:04,349 --> 00:01:08,160 Stefan Von Imhof: studying alternative markets for the past four years now, it's 18 00:01:08,160 --> 00:01:11,609 Stefan Von Imhof: that there's one alternative investment that kind of stands above 19 00:01:11,609 --> 00:01:13,560 Stefan Von Imhof: the rest. It's the one that everyone tries to get 20 00:01:13,560 --> 00:01:17,010 Stefan Von Imhof: into, and it's really, really difficult. And it's pro sports 21 00:01:17,010 --> 00:01:20,879 Stefan Von Imhof: teams. Pro sports teams are, I cannot stress this enough, 22 00:01:21,150 --> 00:01:25,920 Stefan Von Imhof: some of the world's most unfairly lucrative alternative investments, but 23 00:01:25,920 --> 00:01:29,010 Stefan Von Imhof: they're also some of the toughest ones to get into. 24 00:01:29,580 --> 00:01:33,209 Stefan Von Imhof: You typically need tens of millions of dollars to even 25 00:01:33,209 --> 00:01:36,030 Stefan Von Imhof: get a seat at the table. You need connections galore. 26 00:01:36,390 --> 00:01:38,760 Stefan Von Imhof: So, it's unlikely that most people are going to have 27 00:01:38,760 --> 00:01:42,270 Stefan Von Imhof: the opportunity to invest in, let's say, a gridiron NFL 28 00:01:42,270 --> 00:01:45,990 Stefan Von Imhof: team or a baseball team or something like that. But 29 00:01:46,199 --> 00:01:49,710 Stefan Von Imhof: as far as sports investing goes, rugby is one that 30 00:01:49,710 --> 00:01:55,500 Stefan Von Imhof: we find especially compelling. It's hugely popular here in Australia, 31 00:01:55,500 --> 00:01:59,099 Stefan Von Imhof: UK, and especially in New Zealand. But here's the thing, 32 00:01:59,250 --> 00:02:02,730 Stefan Von Imhof: despite all of the love for the sport, there's 17 NRL 33 00:02:02,730 --> 00:02:06,359 Stefan Von Imhof: teams, National Rugby League teams today, and only one of 34 00:02:06,359 --> 00:02:08,370 Stefan Von Imhof: them is actually in New Zealand, and it's on the 35 00:02:08,400 --> 00:02:11,760 Stefan Von Imhof: North Island. So, there's a special group that's bidding to 36 00:02:11,760 --> 00:02:15,660 Stefan Von Imhof: create the NRL's 18th team, and it's going to be on 37 00:02:15,660 --> 00:02:18,359 Stefan Von Imhof: the South Island. The first NRL team on the South 38 00:02:18,360 --> 00:02:20,250 Stefan Von Imhof: Island. So, we have decided to put our money where 39 00:02:20,250 --> 00:02:22,260 Stefan Von Imhof: our mouth is and invest with that group. 40 00:02:23,070 --> 00:02:26,430 Sean Aylmer: So, what is it about sporting teams, be it the 41 00:02:26,430 --> 00:02:29,850 Sean Aylmer: one that you are talking about, or, I mean, the 42 00:02:29,850 --> 00:02:33,630 Sean Aylmer: world over, football, as in soccer, is hugely popular and 43 00:02:33,630 --> 00:02:36,029 Sean Aylmer: very difficult to get into. Obviously, the American sporting teams are 44 00:02:36,120 --> 00:02:39,839 Sean Aylmer: the same. What is it that is such an investment 45 00:02:39,839 --> 00:02:42,899 Sean Aylmer: opportunity? Because in some ways it's a bit irrational, sport, 46 00:02:43,350 --> 00:02:43,710 Sean Aylmer: I think. 47 00:02:45,060 --> 00:02:47,370 Stefan Von Imhof: It is a little irrational. Look, not all sports are 48 00:02:47,370 --> 00:02:52,049 Stefan Von Imhof: created equal. Some are much more unfairly lucrative than others. 49 00:02:52,050 --> 00:02:55,740 Stefan Von Imhof: I mean, NFL, for example, is just basically taking over 50 00:02:55,740 --> 00:02:58,590 Stefan Von Imhof: the world. As an NFL fan, I'm totally okay with 51 00:02:58,590 --> 00:03:02,639 Stefan Von Imhof: this, but that's very different than maybe something like a 52 00:03:02,639 --> 00:03:05,190 Stefan Von Imhof: pickleball team, which you could probably invest in with like $ 53 00:03:05,220 --> 00:03:08,910 Stefan Von Imhof: 30, except it's not going to go anywhere. Other teams, 54 00:03:08,910 --> 00:03:12,330 Stefan Von Imhof: other sports leagues rather, are actually protected by law. So, 55 00:03:12,330 --> 00:03:16,079 Stefan Von Imhof: like in America, Major League Baseball, you're legally not allowed 56 00:03:16,079 --> 00:03:18,960 Stefan Von Imhof: to create another league, a baseball league in America. It's in 57 00:03:18,960 --> 00:03:22,470 Stefan Von Imhof: the law. Right? So, there's some special protections, but what 58 00:03:22,470 --> 00:03:24,540 Stefan Von Imhof: we like about rugby is- 59 00:03:24,840 --> 00:03:26,550 Sean Aylmer: Stefan, I'm going to jump in there. So, it's Rugby 60 00:03:26,550 --> 00:03:29,010 Sean Aylmer: League we're talking about here as opposed to Rugby Union? 61 00:03:29,520 --> 00:03:30,480 Stefan Von Imhof: That's correct, yeah. 62 00:03:30,540 --> 00:03:31,560 Sean Aylmer: Yep. Yep. Yep. Sorry. 63 00:03:31,740 --> 00:03:34,049 Stefan Von Imhof: Yeah, absolutely. And by the way, I've learned the difference, 64 00:03:34,320 --> 00:03:37,620 Stefan Von Imhof: myself, only in the past year, but I think what's 65 00:03:37,620 --> 00:03:41,820 Stefan Von Imhof: interesting is that the difference between rugby's popularity and the actual 66 00:03:41,820 --> 00:03:46,770 Stefan Von Imhof: revenue. Rugby has a ton of viewers, but it has 67 00:03:46,770 --> 00:03:51,089 Stefan Von Imhof: a disproportionately low amount of sponsorship revenue today. And that 68 00:03:51,089 --> 00:03:55,800 Stefan Von Imhof: arbitrage, we believe, opportunity exists for the time being. It 69 00:03:55,800 --> 00:04:00,000 Stefan Von Imhof: will close at some point. And so, that's why we 70 00:04:00,000 --> 00:04:04,380 Stefan Von Imhof: like it. We feel that rugby is basically undervalued compared 71 00:04:04,380 --> 00:04:06,270 Stefan Von Imhof: to how popular it actually is. 72 00:04:06,840 --> 00:04:11,340 Sean Aylmer: Okay. Who buys these sorts of teams? I know that 73 00:04:11,639 --> 00:04:16,230 Sean Aylmer: in the case of EPL, for example, in England, and certainly 74 00:04:16,320 --> 00:04:19,710 Sean Aylmer: in US sports, often it's an owner, it's an extremely 75 00:04:19,710 --> 00:04:23,730 Sean Aylmer: rich person who owns the team. Is that normally the 76 00:04:23,730 --> 00:04:26,039 Sean Aylmer: way people invest or is it more of a private 77 00:04:26,040 --> 00:04:29,039 Sean Aylmer: equity investment? How do they run? Who are the investors? 78 00:04:29,520 --> 00:04:32,430 Stefan Von Imhof: It's funny, it's changing right before our eyes. I mean, 79 00:04:32,730 --> 00:04:35,488 Stefan Von Imhof: sports teams used to get passed down from family to 80 00:04:35,490 --> 00:04:39,239 Stefan Von Imhof: family and ultra, ultra, ultra- high net worth investors to 81 00:04:39,240 --> 00:04:42,509 Stefan Von Imhof: each other, basically. That has definitely started to change. PE 82 00:04:42,509 --> 00:04:45,299 Stefan Von Imhof: has been a huge part of that. PE has made 83 00:04:45,299 --> 00:04:47,849 Stefan Von Imhof: a lot of moves. You may have heard in cricket, 84 00:04:47,850 --> 00:04:51,750 Stefan Von Imhof: actually, especially over in India with the IPL. The big 85 00:04:51,750 --> 00:04:54,720 Stefan Von Imhof: win that PE had was they bought the team from 86 00:04:54,720 --> 00:04:56,849 Stefan Von Imhof: Rajasthan, I forget the name of the team, but they 87 00:04:56,849 --> 00:04:59,969 Stefan Von Imhof: bought the team from Rajasthan and they won in their 88 00:04:59,969 --> 00:05:02,130 Stefan Von Imhof: first year. They won the whole thing. 89 00:05:02,130 --> 00:05:02,309 Sean Aylmer: Oh, wow. 90 00:05:02,309 --> 00:05:06,810 Stefan Von Imhof: So, their investment went up like 26X overnight. So, PE 91 00:05:06,810 --> 00:05:10,020 Stefan Von Imhof: is starting to find its way into sports teams over 92 00:05:10,020 --> 00:05:13,020 Stefan Von Imhof: in Europe with football. Actually, the NFL has loosened the 93 00:05:13,020 --> 00:05:17,039 Stefan Von Imhof: rules around PE now as well. With this particular bid, 94 00:05:17,370 --> 00:05:20,549 Stefan Von Imhof: it's pretty groundswell. There's a mix of different investors. There's 95 00:05:20,549 --> 00:05:23,669 Stefan Von Imhof: some Hollywood folks, we can't name who just yet, that 96 00:05:23,670 --> 00:05:26,580 Stefan Von Imhof: are getting in, but there's a lot of folks from 97 00:05:26,580 --> 00:05:28,710 Stefan Von Imhof: our community. There's a lot of just rugby fans who 98 00:05:28,710 --> 00:05:30,960 Stefan Von Imhof: are well off, who want to bring a team to 99 00:05:30,960 --> 00:05:34,229 Stefan Von Imhof: life on the South Island, and we think they've got 100 00:05:34,230 --> 00:05:37,950 Stefan Von Imhof: a pretty good shot. To be clear, there's two other 101 00:05:38,009 --> 00:05:40,469 Stefan Von Imhof: places that are bidding to be the 18th team as 102 00:05:40,469 --> 00:05:43,710 Stefan Von Imhof: well. One is out in Perth, and the other is 103 00:05:43,710 --> 00:05:46,980 Stefan Von Imhof: up in Papua New Guinea. So, it's basically between Perth, 104 00:05:46,980 --> 00:05:50,400 Stefan Von Imhof: Papua New Guinea and Christchurch, South Island New Zealand. One 105 00:05:50,400 --> 00:05:53,549 Stefan Von Imhof: of those three teams will be the 18th NRL team. 106 00:05:54,178 --> 00:05:55,919 Sean Aylmer: Stay with me, Stefan. We'll be back in a minute. 107 00:06:02,970 --> 00:06:06,060 Sean Aylmer: I am speaking to Stefan von Imhof, co- founder of 108 00:06:06,060 --> 00:06:12,928 Sean Aylmer: alternative investing community fund Alts. co. Okay. So, where do 109 00:06:12,928 --> 00:06:15,210 Sean Aylmer: you get your money back from, Stefan? So, I get 110 00:06:15,210 --> 00:06:18,329 Sean Aylmer: what you're doing, how do you get your money back? 111 00:06:19,170 --> 00:06:24,390 Stefan Von Imhof: So, really, it's through sponsorship revenue. Right? And so, this 112 00:06:24,390 --> 00:06:27,450 Stefan Von Imhof: is again, where we feel that there's a disconnect between 113 00:06:27,480 --> 00:06:30,990 Stefan Von Imhof: the number of eyeballs that rugby has and the revenue 114 00:06:30,990 --> 00:06:34,050 Stefan Von Imhof: per eyeball that it has compared to other sports. So, 115 00:06:34,529 --> 00:06:35,969 Stefan Von Imhof: that's why we think this could be a really good 116 00:06:36,060 --> 00:06:39,240 Stefan Von Imhof: opportunity. But yeah, it's basically all about the sponsorship revenue 117 00:06:39,240 --> 00:06:41,910 Stefan Von Imhof: and the sponsorship rights. It gets into a very confusing 118 00:06:42,300 --> 00:06:44,760 Stefan Von Imhof: world ... The world of media rights and sponsorship rights gets 119 00:06:44,760 --> 00:06:47,580 Stefan Von Imhof: pretty intense, outside the scope, I think, of this call. 120 00:06:47,940 --> 00:06:51,000 Stefan Von Imhof: But that is primarily where you make your money. There's 121 00:06:51,000 --> 00:06:55,710 Stefan Von Imhof: also merchandising, there's ticket sales, there's licensing. You've seen what's 122 00:06:55,710 --> 00:06:59,070 Stefan Von Imhof: happened with the big sports, the Major League Baseball sports 123 00:06:59,070 --> 00:07:01,230 Stefan Von Imhof: here in Australia. Every time I walk by a cap 124 00:07:01,230 --> 00:07:03,690 Stefan Von Imhof: store, a hat store, it's all like New York Yankees, 125 00:07:03,690 --> 00:07:06,389 Stefan Von Imhof: Boston Red Sox. They're getting cut of every sale, right? 126 00:07:06,389 --> 00:07:08,580 Stefan Von Imhof: So, merchandising can be a huge part of this as 127 00:07:08,580 --> 00:07:12,359 Stefan Von Imhof: well. But yeah, primarily it's through media rights, sponsorship rights. 128 00:07:13,439 --> 00:07:16,290 Sean Aylmer: So, the Rajasthan team, I think they're the Rajasthan Royals, I 129 00:07:16,290 --> 00:07:19,230 Sean Aylmer: think, from memory, the fact that PE got into that 130 00:07:19,320 --> 00:07:22,740 Sean Aylmer: and they bought it, success matters then, I presume? 131 00:07:24,090 --> 00:07:28,049 Stefan Von Imhof: Yeah. I mean, brand matters, but brand is based on 132 00:07:28,049 --> 00:07:30,510 Stefan Von Imhof: success, ultimately. I mean, brand can only take you so 133 00:07:30,510 --> 00:07:34,020 Stefan Von Imhof: far. I think that some brands have routinely gotten lucky 134 00:07:34,020 --> 00:07:35,940 Stefan Von Imhof: with having a great brand without having a ton of 135 00:07:35,940 --> 00:07:38,700 Stefan Von Imhof: success. Others have been riding their success for a long 136 00:07:38,700 --> 00:07:41,490 Stefan Von Imhof: time, and the brand has held the value. But generally 137 00:07:41,490 --> 00:07:45,569 Stefan Von Imhof: speaking, yeah, you do want and need to do well, 138 00:07:46,230 --> 00:07:47,070 Stefan Von Imhof: as you'd imagine. 139 00:07:47,400 --> 00:07:47,489 Sean Aylmer: Yes. 140 00:07:47,549 --> 00:07:49,680 Stefan Von Imhof: Although, I don't think people expect it on day one, 141 00:07:49,680 --> 00:07:53,010 Stefan Von Imhof: or season one, or year one. But the team behind 142 00:07:53,010 --> 00:07:56,429 Stefan Von Imhof: the South Island bid is putting a lot of emphasis 143 00:07:56,429 --> 00:07:59,880 Stefan Von Imhof: on the ground- up, so that the training programs and 144 00:07:59,880 --> 00:08:02,340 Stefan Von Imhof: the social programs, that's a big part of this. I 145 00:08:02,340 --> 00:08:06,179 Stefan Von Imhof: mean, finding supply, finding rugby players isn't something that just 146 00:08:06,180 --> 00:08:07,980 Stefan Von Imhof: happens on its own. That's something you have to build 147 00:08:07,980 --> 00:08:09,900 Stefan Von Imhof: as well. So, part of the funds go to programs 148 00:08:09,900 --> 00:08:12,570 Stefan Von Imhof: like that, to really build for the long term, and 149 00:08:12,570 --> 00:08:14,460 Stefan Von Imhof: that's another thing I like about this opportunity. 150 00:08:15,179 --> 00:08:17,849 Sean Aylmer: Okay. So, what are the big risks here? One being 151 00:08:17,849 --> 00:08:21,270 Sean Aylmer: that they give the team to Papua New Guinea or Perth. 152 00:08:21,270 --> 00:08:23,459 Sean Aylmer: Obviously, that's a big risk, but what else are you 153 00:08:23,459 --> 00:08:25,290 Sean Aylmer: talking about when you're looking at the downside? 154 00:08:25,950 --> 00:08:28,740 Stefan Von Imhof: I mean, yeah, the biggest risk is that this doesn't 155 00:08:28,740 --> 00:08:30,390 Stefan Von Imhof: work and the bid goes to one of the other 156 00:08:30,390 --> 00:08:34,050 Stefan Von Imhof: two teams, which is absolutely a fundamental risk. I do 157 00:08:34,050 --> 00:08:37,589 Stefan Von Imhof: personally believe that South Island has the best chance, and 158 00:08:37,590 --> 00:08:40,080 Stefan Von Imhof: one of the reasons for that is there's a gorgeous 159 00:08:40,080 --> 00:08:43,200 Stefan Von Imhof: new stadium that's being built in Christchurch. It's actually under 160 00:08:43,200 --> 00:08:46,980 Stefan Von Imhof: construction now, and it's going to be done in 2026. 161 00:08:47,309 --> 00:08:49,560 Stefan Von Imhof: It's called Te Kaha Stadium, and it's going to house 30, 162 00:08:49,590 --> 00:08:53,968 Stefan Von Imhof: 000 rugby fans. And actually, the New Zealand government basically 163 00:08:53,969 --> 00:08:56,670 Stefan Von Imhof: footed the bill for this. So, the infrastructure is already 164 00:08:56,670 --> 00:08:58,348 Stefan Von Imhof: in place, or it's going to be in place in 165 00:08:58,350 --> 00:09:01,290 Stefan Von Imhof: 2026. So, that's one less risk you actually have to 166 00:09:01,320 --> 00:09:03,900 Stefan Von Imhof: worry about with this bit, which is fantastic. But in 167 00:09:03,900 --> 00:09:07,588 Stefan Von Imhof: terms of other risks, I mean, yeah, look, sports teams 168 00:09:07,620 --> 00:09:10,350 Stefan Von Imhof: that have started from scratch are very different than buying 169 00:09:10,590 --> 00:09:14,130 Stefan Von Imhof: again, the New York Yankees or the Boston Red Sox, with a 170 00:09:14,130 --> 00:09:19,169 Stefan Von Imhof: long history of extremely high revenue. It'll take time for 171 00:09:19,200 --> 00:09:21,960 Stefan Von Imhof: things to get going, and that is not something that 172 00:09:21,960 --> 00:09:24,960 Stefan Von Imhof: we should ignore. But what I like about sports investing 173 00:09:24,960 --> 00:09:26,820 Stefan Von Imhof: the most is not only can you get a return, 174 00:09:26,820 --> 00:09:29,880 Stefan Von Imhof: but you get so many externalities and extra benefits from 175 00:09:30,030 --> 00:09:33,269 Stefan Von Imhof: really investing in something that you can not only believe 176 00:09:33,270 --> 00:09:36,119 Stefan Von Imhof: in and get a return from, but actually watch on 177 00:09:36,119 --> 00:09:38,040 Stefan Von Imhof: TV, go to the stadium live and know that you 178 00:09:38,040 --> 00:09:40,410 Stefan Von Imhof: were a part of it all, which is tremendously powerful. 179 00:09:41,820 --> 00:09:44,880 Sean Aylmer: If you could invest in any teams in the world, 180 00:09:45,360 --> 00:09:48,120 Sean Aylmer: what would you invest in? And unlimited money here, Stefan. 181 00:09:48,300 --> 00:09:50,879 Sean Aylmer: I mean, personally, I'd certainly go Yankees, Knicks, any New 182 00:09:50,880 --> 00:09:52,889 Sean Aylmer: York team, probably the Jets, you might not be a 183 00:09:52,889 --> 00:09:55,410 Sean Aylmer: Jets fan, but I'd go that way. What would you 184 00:09:55,410 --> 00:09:58,410 Sean Aylmer: invest in, if you could, as an investor, not with 185 00:09:58,410 --> 00:09:59,699 Sean Aylmer: your heart, with your mind? 186 00:10:01,260 --> 00:10:03,030 Stefan Von Imhof: Taking the heart out of it, huh? Well, I'll tell 187 00:10:03,030 --> 00:10:06,540 Stefan Von Imhof: you, look, the Yankees, I think are basically the strong ... 188 00:10:06,540 --> 00:10:08,519 Stefan Von Imhof: I mean, having lived in Australia now for five years 189 00:10:08,520 --> 00:10:10,560 Stefan Von Imhof: and just seeing how much Yankees gear there is here, 190 00:10:10,889 --> 00:10:13,289 Stefan Von Imhof: people that may not even follow baseball that closely, that 191 00:10:13,290 --> 00:10:15,420 Stefan Von Imhof: are just wearing the gear. It just makes you realize 192 00:10:15,420 --> 00:10:19,410 Stefan Von Imhof: how powerful, globally, the Yankees brand is. However, I was 193 00:10:19,410 --> 00:10:22,290 Stefan Von Imhof: born in Boston and I grew up in Boston, so 194 00:10:23,040 --> 00:10:25,650 Stefan Von Imhof: I could never in a million years invest in anything 195 00:10:25,650 --> 00:10:25,951 Stefan Von Imhof: New York related. 196 00:10:25,951 --> 00:10:25,952 Sean Aylmer: No, you couldn't. 197 00:10:25,952 --> 00:10:28,410 Stefan Von Imhof: No. Especially the Yankees. So, I would go with the Red Sox. 198 00:10:28,410 --> 00:10:33,179 Sean Aylmer: Righto. Stefan, I had enjoyed having you on the show 199 00:10:33,179 --> 00:10:35,520 Sean Aylmer: until that very moment. I lived in New York for 200 00:10:35,520 --> 00:10:37,290 Sean Aylmer: a while, you see, and became a great Yankees fan, 201 00:10:37,290 --> 00:10:39,660 Sean Aylmer: and my neighbor was a season pass holder, and there 202 00:10:39,660 --> 00:10:42,240 Sean Aylmer: were so many games. There were like 70 home games 203 00:10:42,240 --> 00:10:44,280 Sean Aylmer: a season. He was always looking for someone to go 204 00:10:44,280 --> 00:10:46,468 Sean Aylmer: with him, and I was working from home, so I 205 00:10:46,469 --> 00:10:49,050 Sean Aylmer: became a Yankees fan. Well, the thing I learned more 206 00:10:49,050 --> 00:10:50,790 Sean Aylmer: than anything is that you've got to hate the Red Sox. 207 00:10:51,090 --> 00:10:52,858 Stefan Von Imhof: You have to. Look, I won't hold it against you. 208 00:10:52,860 --> 00:10:53,760 Stefan Von Imhof: We can still be friends. 209 00:10:54,600 --> 00:10:56,639 Sean Aylmer: Good. Stefan, thanks for talking to Fear and Greed. 210 00:10:56,730 --> 00:10:57,120 Stefan Von Imhof: Thank you. 211 00:10:57,690 --> 00:11:00,599 Sean Aylmer: That was Stefan Von Imhof, co- founder of alternative investing 212 00:11:00,599 --> 00:11:04,920 Sean Aylmer: community fund Alts.co. That's A- L- T- S. co, C- O. 213 00:11:05,279 --> 00:11:07,290 Sean Aylmer: This is the Fear and Greed Business Interview. Remember, this 214 00:11:07,290 --> 00:11:09,960 Sean Aylmer: is general information only and you should seek professional advice 215 00:11:09,960 --> 00:11:12,960 Sean Aylmer: before making investment decisions. Join us every morning for the 216 00:11:12,960 --> 00:11:15,090 Sean Aylmer: full episode of Fear and Greed, the daily business news 217 00:11:15,090 --> 00:11:17,490 Sean Aylmer: for people who make their own decisions. I'm Sean Aylmer. 218 00:11:17,820 --> 00:11:18,419 Sean Aylmer: Enjoy your day.