Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: I was here on January third when Maduro was extracted
Speaker 2: from his country. It was a very surreal moment, as
Speaker 2: you can imagine. And I remember being here in Bogota
Speaker 2: in Colombia, and people were stunned because everybody was just thinking,
Speaker 2: what did just happen?
Speaker 3: And is Columbia next.
Speaker 4: Monica ville Mezza is a Colombian journalist in Bogata, where
Speaker 4: the president, Gustav Petro, has been trading bubs with Donald
Speaker 4: Trump for months.
Speaker 2: Trump had been asked a couple of times by different journalists,
Speaker 2: is Petro the Columbia president next? And he was calling
Speaker 2: him a thog, a drug trafficker. He better watch his behind.
Speaker 2: He's no friend of the United States. He's very bad,
Speaker 2: very bad guy.
Speaker 5: And he's got to watch his ass because he makes
Speaker 5: cocaine and they send it into the United States of
Speaker 5: America from Colombia.
Speaker 2: There's absolutely no proof that Petro was a drug trafficker whatsoever,
Speaker 2: but he kept sort of saying that there could be
Speaker 2: armed strikes on land in Colombia.
Speaker 1: He has cocaine mills and cocaine factories.
Speaker 4: He's not going to be doing.
Speaker 3: Good will be in operation by the US and how
Speaker 3: it sounds good.
Speaker 4: To be Columbia looks like it could be next on
Speaker 4: Trump's hit list, until an unexpected phone call turn things around.
Speaker 4: Now the volatile pair is set to meet in the
Speaker 4: White House today. I'm Nicole Johnston and you're listening to
Speaker 4: seven AM today Monica Villemza on drugs, deportations, and the
Speaker 4: danger of what could happen next if Trump and Petro
Speaker 4: don't make up. It's Tuesday, February three. So Monica, where
Speaker 4: does this all begin? Between Trump and the Colombian President
Speaker 4: Gusta Petro.
Speaker 2: To give of your audience a little bit of contact,
Speaker 2: the whole fate started when Trump's started deporting migrants. A
Speaker 2: lot of them were Colombians, and the ones he was
Speaker 2: sending to Columbia were shackled in the plane, and Petro
Speaker 2: thought that it wasn't dignified and he was very vocal
Speaker 2: about it. And then Trump said I'm going to apply
Speaker 2: tariffs on the whole country, and that was nearly catastrophic
Speaker 2: because a third of Columbian exports go to the United States.
Speaker 2: That didn't happen, But then he put Petro on something
Speaker 2: that we call here the Clinton List. It bars individuals
Speaker 2: from conducting any transaction with any company that's affiliated to
Speaker 2: the US financial system, so you essentially have to do
Speaker 2: all your transactions in cash.
Speaker 6: President of the General Assembly in my first speech.
Speaker 2: Then Petro goes to the United Nations General Assembly in
Speaker 2: September and he has a very strong vision of the
Speaker 2: war on drugs, criticizing Trump's approach.
Speaker 6: The anti drug policy is not meant to stop cocaine
Speaker 6: that is coming to the United States. The anti drug
Speaker 6: policy is to dominate the peoples of the South as
Speaker 6: a whole.
Speaker 2: Then he joins some anti Israeli protests in the street,
Speaker 2: takes a megaphone and starts saying that American soldiers should defect,
Speaker 2: which is a clear act of provocations.
Speaker 6: Gone Lord, than the Trump our. There's gone Lord and money.
Speaker 2: That Trump and all of the White House understandably are
Speaker 2: furious about this.
Speaker 1: The United States says it's revoking Colombian President Gustavo Petro's
Speaker 1: visa after he joined a pro Palestinian rally in New
Speaker 1: York on Friday and called on US soldiers to disobey
Speaker 1: President Donald Trump's orders.
Speaker 4: And mon, could you tell us a bit about the
Speaker 4: massive protests that we had on January seven after Venezuela.
Speaker 2: It was a massive protest that Petro called for. He
Speaker 2: was very critical, as you said, of Trump violating a
Speaker 2: country's sovereignty. And I think because that rhetoric had been
Speaker 2: ramped up up to that point where they said Columbia
Speaker 2: could be next, Petro, You're next.
Speaker 5: Well, the rallies on the streets across Columbia just show
Speaker 5: how much the relationship with Washington DC is deterior. Writing
Speaker 5: here in Columbia, these people have gathered to the street.
Speaker 3: You know, the states were very high.
Speaker 2: But funnily enough, when he came out and spoke to
Speaker 2: the protest, he had just gone off the phone with
Speaker 2: Trump where things were smoothed out apparently, and this meeting
Speaker 2: that we're going to have on Tuesday between both heads
Speaker 2: of states in Washington d C. Was planned during that
Speaker 2: phone call, so we know it was like fifteen minutes long.
Speaker 2: Petro talked for about forty minutes, apparently explaining that he
Speaker 2: was in fact combating drug trafficking and and you know,
Speaker 2: he was very much trying to be part of this
Speaker 2: war on drugs and cooperate, and all of a sudden,
Speaker 2: Trump ended up saying that he was honored to have
Speaker 2: spoken to the president, so everything shifted, you know, one
Speaker 2: pint eighty Petro.
Speaker 4: I mean, he sounds like quite a character. To put
Speaker 4: him mildly, could you describe first what kind of lada
Speaker 4: he is.
Speaker 3: He is a character, You're absolutely right.
Speaker 2: I mean, he was a rebel gorilla fighter M nineteen
Speaker 2: was a gorilla movement that demobilized in the nineties, so
Speaker 2: he took up arms as a gerilla fighter, then he demobilized.
Speaker 2: He is a left wing president, which is very rare
Speaker 2: in Columbia. We've had mostly center or right wing presidents
Speaker 2: in the past, and he's had controversial policies and his
Speaker 2: critics will say he's a populist. The country's not doing
Speaker 2: very well economically right now. Some people blame him, obviously,
Speaker 2: some others don't. He does have a lot of support,
Speaker 2: but he has been a different president in Columbia.
Speaker 4: So, as you said, Trump's accused Petro of trafficking cocaine
Speaker 4: to the US. Now, you've been covering the drugs trade
Speaker 4: in Columbia for years now, could you tell us how
Speaker 4: it operates there, who's behind it, where.
Speaker 2: Is it at It seems like a question that could
Speaker 2: be answered simply, but sadly it's not. The cocaine trade
Speaker 2: in Colombia is bigger than ever. Pablo Escobar, you know,
Speaker 2: with the famous dog Lord of the eighties, he could
Speaker 2: have never imagined how much cocaine there is these days.
Speaker 2: And it's basically controlled by gorilla groups that sort of
Speaker 2: starting taxing the coca crops and then started doing more
Speaker 2: than taxing and became involved in the transportation and distribution
Speaker 2: of cocaine. There's huge routes that leave Columbia through the Pacific,
Speaker 2: but also through the Caribbean. The country has two oceans,
Speaker 2: so obviously many many ports, and a lot of places
Speaker 2: that are effectively abandoned by the government. That makes this
Speaker 2: drug trade thrive. And as you can imagine, you know,
Speaker 2: places where there's not a lot of opportunity, people are poor,
Speaker 2: it does become a way out of poverty for many people.
Speaker 3: So it's something that.
Speaker 2: Clements have lived with for many years and something that's
Speaker 2: actually on the rise.
Speaker 3: Coming up.
Speaker 4: What a former gorilla fighter and a real estate tycoon
Speaker 4: have in common. So we now have this meeting set
Speaker 4: for Tuesday in the US between Trump and Petro. What
Speaker 4: is it that each leader wants to try and get
Speaker 4: out of it. Well.
Speaker 2: Look, I think Colombia because of its economy, the ties
Speaker 2: it has with America.
Speaker 3: It has been America's closest ally in the region for decades.
Speaker 3: They have military cooperation.
Speaker 2: The biggest source of financial investment independent investment in Umbia
Speaker 2: is America. I think Petro really wants to keep these
Speaker 2: ties closed. It doesn't seem like it's convenient for the
Speaker 2: economy and for security, etc. For both countries to be fighting,
Speaker 2: but especially Columbia would have a lot more to lose.
Speaker 2: I think Trump, on the other hand, wants someone to
Speaker 2: maybe help mediate with Venezuela. You know, Petro was very
Speaker 2: close and was very close to Maduro, and he's still
Speaker 2: close to the government there. It's better to have an
Speaker 2: ally in the region like it always has been in
Speaker 2: terms of counter narcotics. But the real problem is drug trafficking,
Speaker 2: and I think maybe Trump feels that if they work
Speaker 2: together they can achieve more than fighting. It's hard to tell.
Speaker 2: It really is a wild card. I mean a lot
Speaker 2: of people here are sort of saying this could go
Speaker 2: very well or it could go very very badly, almost
Speaker 2: like a sort of repeat of the Zelenski disastrous.
Speaker 3: White House meeting that you probably remember.
Speaker 4: So what it sounds like there's a riding on this
Speaker 4: meeting between the two of them. What could it actually
Speaker 4: mean for the rest of Latin America, not just Columbia.
Speaker 2: I mean, it's a very good question. The thing that
Speaker 2: Trump is probably thinking long term is maybe recovering some
Speaker 2: of the influence that America had economically financially in terms
Speaker 2: of oil for instance, from the region being more having
Speaker 2: better ties and exploiting these resources more so that China
Speaker 2: and other players don't, you know what I mean, It's
Speaker 2: a lot more about geopolitics. So I think he wants
Speaker 2: to rely more on this neighboring countries, these countries that
Speaker 2: have historically been very close to the United States. He
Speaker 2: doesn't want China, Russia, etc. To have a growing influence
Speaker 2: which they were having in Latin America. And I think
Speaker 2: it's really interesting to see people that are leaders that
Speaker 2: really admired Trump that have become his friends, like Milay
Speaker 2: in Argentina. How you know, Trump has really given him
Speaker 2: a lifeline. He saved an economy that effectively in shambles.
Speaker 2: So he's trying to show that maybe it pays to
Speaker 2: be on his side. But of course, there's a lot
Speaker 2: of history that and you know that doesn't help in
Speaker 2: terms of these countries having a colonial past with the
Speaker 2: United States.
Speaker 4: So mon, all eyes are going to be on DC
Speaker 4: in this big meeting between Trump and Petro. What do
Speaker 4: you think is the best way for Petro to go
Speaker 4: about dealing with Trump? Because he's been pretty bullish so far.
Speaker 4: Is that working for him?
Speaker 2: I think being bullish hasn't worked. Trump doesn't take sort
Speaker 2: of humiliation or provocation very well, and I think he
Speaker 2: has definitely shown that he is willing to change his
Speaker 2: stone a little bit.
Speaker 3: Regarding Trump and vice versa.
Speaker 2: Trump really did say it was an honor to speak
Speaker 2: and I quote the word an honor to speak to
Speaker 2: President Petro. He explained things I understand it better now.
Speaker 2: So very recently, he's also talked about Maduro being sort
Speaker 2: of kidnapped and spoken against it. So I don't think
Speaker 2: they ever see ido eye on Venezuela. You know what's
Speaker 2: really interesting is that they have very opposing personalities. They said,
Speaker 2: at opposing ends of the political spectrum. They couldn't be
Speaker 2: more different than each other. You know, you have a
Speaker 2: real estate tycoon from New York and this former gorilla
Speaker 2: fighter who demobilized in the nineties.
Speaker 3: But they are very similar as well.
Speaker 2: They have these kind of very larger than live personalities.
Speaker 3: They can be quite controversial.
Speaker 2: They always tack to Twitter and like ranting and sort
Speaker 2: of attacking each other. But let me remind you that
Speaker 2: this meeting that we're going to see is still very
Speaker 2: much a wildcard. Nobody knows what's going to happen, and
Speaker 2: both personalities being sort of mombastic and controversial, it will
Speaker 2: be very interesting to see what's going to come out
Speaker 2: of it.
Speaker 4: Mon thank you so much for joining us on seven AM.
Speaker 3: Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 4: Also in the news, mortgage holders are bracing for an
Speaker 4: interest rate rise when the Reserve Bank meets later today.
Speaker 3: The majority of.
Speaker 4: Economists are expecting a quarter of a percent jump in
Speaker 4: the official cash rate due to a bump in inflation
Speaker 4: over December. It's a big u turn for the RBA,
Speaker 4: which cut interest rates as recently as August, and Australia's
Speaker 4: biggest political donors have been revealed, with Clive Palmer topping
Speaker 4: the list. Palmer donated fifty three million dollars to his
Speaker 4: own trumpet of Patriots Party, while Gina Reinhardt's company donated
Speaker 4: almost a million to right wing political lobby group Advance
Speaker 4: Labour scored more than four million dollars worth of donations
Speaker 4: from the unions. I'm Nicole Johnston. This is seven AM.
Speaker 5: Catch a later
Speaker 1: N