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Speaker 1: Appoche production.

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Speaker 2: This podcast contains discussions of abuse, trauma, mental health, and

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Speaker 2: family conflict. Listen to Discretion is advised. Welcome to Secrets

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Speaker 2: of the Underworld. I am Neil the Muscle Cummings, and

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Speaker 2: in this episode I speak with Kobe Ryan, the surviving

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Speaker 2: son of Laurie Valo, who shares what it's like to

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Speaker 2: survive the unthinkable.

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Speaker 3: We know something is really weird going on right now.

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Speaker 3: She comes out and shows me this press release Chad

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Speaker 3: dave Bell next to Lorie saying kids are missing, they've

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Speaker 3: abandoned their home and now there's this huge search. Then

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Speaker 3: you're thinking, well, there's no way she would do anything

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Speaker 3: to those kids, Like, there's no way they're not okay.

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Speaker 3: I can't explain what grief and rage and loss and

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Speaker 3: like all of that in one pot at one time. Yeah, man,

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Speaker 3: just just absolutely changed, like life is this way, and

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Speaker 3: then life was different for the rest of time after that.

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Speaker 1: Kolbe, thank you for coming on my podcast.

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Speaker 4: You've got a very interesting life and story, bro that

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Speaker 4: I'd like to share on my podcast. Before we get

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Speaker 4: into the nitty gree I'll get to know you first

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Speaker 4: growing up, family, parents, school.

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Speaker 1: And friends.

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Speaker 4: What it was like for you before everything just came

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Speaker 4: kind of crashing down.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Man, So I grew up in Texas. I was

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Speaker 3: a sports guy, football guy. When you're in Texas like that,

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Speaker 3: you just grow up thinking you're going to make it

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Speaker 3: to the NFL. That's like the goal, right, and so

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Speaker 3: that was my thing. I'm like, I'm gonna make it

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Speaker 3: to the league. You know, growing up, I can say

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Speaker 3: now looking back, you know, I didn't know anything different.

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Speaker 3: So I didn't know that moving around a lot was

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Speaker 3: I'm not saying it's not normal, but as much as

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Speaker 3: we moved, I mean we moved sometimes every six months

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Speaker 3: to every year, so just a lot of back and forth.

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Speaker 3: There was really no stability. But that was normal all

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Speaker 3: the time. And you know, I had to make new friends.

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Speaker 3: I was one of the abilities I had as a

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Speaker 3: kid is every time you go to new school, you

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Speaker 3: got to learn a new system, you got to meet

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Speaker 3: new people. So I had to make new friends everywhere

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Speaker 3: I went, and nothing really stayed the same. So, you know,

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Speaker 3: growing up, I just had my mom til I was

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Speaker 3: about four, and then she got married for the first

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Speaker 3: time in my life that I remember. To my sister's dad.

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Speaker 3: They were only married for a short time, they had

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Speaker 3: my sister obviously together, There's a lot that went on

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Speaker 3: in that whole situation. For me, that was like a

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Speaker 3: huge dark time in my life. But I'm grateful to

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Speaker 3: obviously that I had my sister, right like that. That's

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Speaker 3: I try to take the positive out of it, yep.

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Speaker 3: But you know, that was just a lonely time for me.

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Speaker 3: And then you know, after she left, she was a

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Speaker 3: single mom again, moving again, back and forth, you know,

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Speaker 3: different places, living with my grandparents and whatnot. I knew

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Speaker 3: I craved one thing and that was that, Hey, I

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Speaker 3: just wish we had a house that we could stay in,

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Speaker 3: that I could have my friends, that I could grow

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Speaker 3: up with the same people all the time. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 3: because you know it's just at that age, it's hard,

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Speaker 3: third grade, fourth grade, You're always moving and meeting new people.

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Speaker 3: But at this point, we have my sister now, right,

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Speaker 3: so it's us three kind of versus the world. And

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Speaker 3: then she meets my dad, who's Charles, who's obviously my stepdad,

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Speaker 3: but you know, he was the father figure of my

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Speaker 3: life and she met him when I was around nine.

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Speaker 3: That's when life really changed for us. We stayed in

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Speaker 3: Austin for another like year, and then we moved to

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Speaker 3: uh Arizona. I was like thirteen, and I think everyone

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Speaker 3: knows when you hit that age at thirteen, you're just

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Speaker 3: you're really independent. You think you're the man. So I

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Speaker 3: had my gros spurt. I started playing like sports at

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Speaker 3: a high levels, like I'm that guy. So I kind

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Speaker 3: of had that separation from my family. But you know,

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Speaker 3: going into my teenage years, I was lucky to meet

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Speaker 3: my best friend, have a bunch of good people around me.

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Speaker 3: I had a school where I knew everybody and was

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Speaker 3: close to a lot of people. So that community I

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Speaker 3: created there. That was the stability that I had, and

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Speaker 3: I was grateful I had that. But obviously there's lots

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Speaker 3: of ups and downs, you know, mental health issues as

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Speaker 3: a teenager, not knowing your purpose or worth, those are

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Speaker 3: big points, you know. And then they moved again. So

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Speaker 3: they moved to Hawaii, and I'm trying to figure out

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Speaker 3: my life, trying to go and figure out I'm going

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Speaker 3: to go in the military or if I'm gonna play sports.

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Speaker 3: I still wanted to play sports. You know that you're

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Speaker 3: in that place where you're eighteen, you don't know what

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Speaker 3: you're gonna do next.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and your next move is massive for you to make.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Well, I grew up, so I grew up in

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Speaker 3: the LDS Church, and most kids at that time at eighteen, like,

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Speaker 3: you have a couple options when you are that religion.

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Speaker 3: Either go on a mission for two years, or you

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Speaker 3: get married very soon, or you go to college. You

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Speaker 3: either start your career like it's those three things. Right.

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Speaker 3: I was really torn because I felt like I had

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Speaker 3: to have an answer. Right. You want to feel like

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Speaker 3: you're not the floater. You don't want to feel like

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Speaker 3: the guy who doesn't have the answers. So I chose

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Speaker 3: to go on a mission, even though I didn't think

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Speaker 3: i'd go, And that lasted six to eight weeks, not

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Speaker 3: two years. I couldn't do it. Man. That was the

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Speaker 3: most anxiety and depressed I've been in a long time.

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Speaker 3: Like I just went and I was like, yeah, I

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Speaker 3: can't do this. I can't do this. So but when

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Speaker 3: you do that and you come back, it's so hard

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Speaker 3: because everybody knows you're not supposed to be there, right,

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Speaker 3: Like you're supposed to be gone for two years, you're

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Speaker 3: not supposed to come back. You're like twenty twenty one

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Speaker 3: years old. I'm back six weeks later, so I know

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Speaker 3: everybody at church is looking at me sideways, right, So

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Speaker 3: that was tough. But yeah, I mean, like not to

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Speaker 3: scrub through all the stuff that happened in that time.

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Speaker 3: But around when I got back, I was like, I

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Speaker 3: got to do something that I want to do for

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Speaker 3: the first time. So I ended up taking a chance

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Speaker 3: moving to Kansas with my uncle and I was like,

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Speaker 3: I got to play basketball. I just that was my dream.

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Speaker 3: And so I said, I got to figure this out.

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Speaker 3: Whatever that looks like. I don't care what school it is.

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Speaker 3: I just have to be on a college team. And

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Speaker 3: I made it. I got a scholarship for school, and

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Speaker 3: I was so grateful. My parents moved back to Arizona,

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Speaker 3: and that's when I started talking to my wife, and

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Speaker 3: that's when I'm decided not to go back to school

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Speaker 3: but to pursue a relationship with her in Arizona. We

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Speaker 3: got married in twenty eighteen. She got pregnant a couple

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Speaker 3: of months later, and then by the beginning of twenty

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Speaker 3: nineteen everything started. And twenty nineteen just went from I

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Speaker 3: don't even know how to explain it.

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Speaker 4: Just from being on a high up here and it

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Speaker 4: just yeah, I can imagine, because like you've just got married,

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Speaker 4: you know, and then it's just gone, bang, Oh, it's horrible,

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Speaker 4: Like it's just a massive explosion in your life.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, man, I mean I don't think of this is

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Speaker 3: what I try to explain to people too, because obviously

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Speaker 3: there's other young people who go through things that are

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Speaker 3: just unimaginable. But to be you know, literally twenty two

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Speaker 3: years old and had a baby right before I turned

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Speaker 3: twenty three, then your family just like explodes. So like

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Speaker 3: they got in a big fight. My mom said that

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Speaker 3: my dad was cheating on her the entire marriage, and

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Speaker 3: so she's acting like she has been cheated on right,

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Speaker 3: a scorned woman. She's like, I'm moving out. I can't

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Speaker 3: do this, I'm not staying here. Little did I know

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Speaker 3: she was cheating the entire time. But wow, she's projecting

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Speaker 3: all that on him. But I didn't know the difference.

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Speaker 3: And you know, I always say I always regret not

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Speaker 3: looking deeper into the situation. I never talked to my

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Speaker 3: dad again. I made that decision because obviously didn't know

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Speaker 3: he's going to be does have his life taken you know,

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Speaker 3: she played the part very well. She looked like she

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Speaker 3: was trying to get out of the relationship, that she

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Speaker 3: wanted nothing to do with him. He looked crazy at

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Speaker 3: the time, like he was trying to call everybody, tell

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Speaker 3: everybody she's nuts, she's crazy. I was like, all right,

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Speaker 3: and again I'm literally a young dad. I'm like, take

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Speaker 3: all this and deal with it yourselves. That's how I felt,

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Speaker 3: because I'm like, I can't handle your guys's problems. I'm

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Speaker 3: not a therapist, and I just had a baby. I

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Speaker 3: don't even know how, Like I can barely make my

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Speaker 3: rent happen. You know, you can't expect me to fix

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Speaker 3: your problems. That's how I felt in that time, really

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Speaker 3: more than anything. But yeah, twenty nineteen, just they moved

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Speaker 3: and again he moved with my little brother to Houston

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Speaker 3: to be closer to his family. Laurie moved to Hawaii,

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Speaker 3: came back just you know, crazy. But people don't understand

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Speaker 3: that that wasn't that abnormal, right, Like if you look

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Speaker 3: at it in context, it wasn't that abnormal. And then yeah,

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Speaker 3: from there it just got worse. She moved back here

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Speaker 3: and then I kid you not. I think two weeks

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Speaker 3: after she moved back here they killed my dad.

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Speaker 4: So wait, before all this happened, had she ever shown

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Speaker 4: any signs that she was like that, Like, is she

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Speaker 4: always been a nice mother to know or she just

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Speaker 4: suddenly just turned.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, you know. She was described as the Disneyland mom,

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Speaker 3: Like when we got to Arizona, you're like maybe six

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Speaker 3: and a half hours away from literal Disneyland, right from

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Speaker 3: like being able to go do fun things, go to

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Speaker 3: the beach, stuff like that. So she was like the

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Speaker 3: party starter. She was the one to take all My

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Speaker 3: best friend was like a brother, and he came with

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Speaker 3: us on all the trips we went on. It was

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Speaker 3: not like there were signs of, hey, this person is

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Speaker 3: a literal psychopath, she's going to take everyone's life. What

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Speaker 3: she was is when I was growing up, one of

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Speaker 3: the things she had a consistent theme of at first

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Speaker 3: was it she was going to pass away. Constantly telling me, hey,

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Speaker 3: I'm going to die in two years. She had this

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Speaker 3: timeline of her own death. And obviously, when you're seven

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Speaker 3: eight years old and you hear your mom tell you

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Speaker 3: I'm going to die, it's terrifying and you want to

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Speaker 3: do something about it. And it was always spiritual, right,

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Speaker 3: it was always like an angel told me that I'm

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Speaker 3: going to die. So it's not just like a thought,

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Speaker 3: this is God right, like this is what do you

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Speaker 3: do with that? There's no way you can stop that,

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Speaker 3: And so that that was really the only consistent theme there,

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Speaker 3: and then it was the end of the world stuff.

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Speaker 3: I grew up with doomsday ideology, which is simply the

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Speaker 3: world's gonna end and nothing truly matters, because what do

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Speaker 3: you have to fight for. There's no point in doing

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Speaker 3: all this stuff in your life, or yeah, there's no point.

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Speaker 3: You're just the world's going to end. We're all going

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Speaker 3: to die and that's it. Or the world's not going

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Speaker 3: to be the same, there's not going to be currency

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Speaker 3: or money. So that always did exist the entire time.

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Speaker 3: But as far as her, she's still from the outside

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Speaker 3: look like a Disneyland good mom if you want to

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Speaker 3: call her that.

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Speaker 4: Do you think that's a way of like controlling and

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Speaker 4: keeping you close sometimes?

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Speaker 3: I mean I think that that was part of her.

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Speaker 3: I look at people now in parts I think part

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Speaker 3: of her because when I was growing up, when we

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Speaker 3: were like by ourselves, right, because I never knew my dad,

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Speaker 3: so all the way up till I was like four

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Speaker 3: and a half. Maybe it was just me and her,

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Speaker 3: and so she took me to the pizza place with

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Speaker 3: the video games all the time, like she just wanted

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Speaker 3: to have fun. I think that was her way of

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Speaker 3: coping with life. It wasn't dealing with the problem, it

226
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Speaker 3: was just always having fun. So I always called out

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Speaker 3: the band aid that we were putting on over our wounds.

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Speaker 3: Every time life got hard, it was runaway, move or

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Speaker 3: go to Disneyland or do something really fun and instead

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Speaker 3: of deal with the problem, so you get this high

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Speaker 3: and then you you know, you come back to reality.

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Speaker 1: In the relationship with your dad, was it strong.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean the thing with my dad was we

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Speaker 3: just didn't connect on a lot because he was gone

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Speaker 3: a lot. Like he literally worked an insurance so he

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Speaker 3: was literally gone. And that's why the selling of him

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Speaker 3: cheating was so much more realistic because she said when

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Speaker 3: he was gone, he was cheating, right, So that was

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Speaker 3: kind of the cell point. But we had a closer

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Speaker 3: relationship the older I got, especially once I got married,

241
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Speaker 3: Like he really took a counseling slash like checking in,

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Speaker 3: like let's talk about your life role. But up until

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Speaker 3: that point, it wasn't really like that. It was kind

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Speaker 3: of like I don't know if this was a step

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Speaker 3: father to step son kind of situation or if my

246
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Speaker 3: mom was in the middle here, but we just didn't

247
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Speaker 3: have as much of a father son relationship until I

248
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Speaker 3: was older. And I don't know if that was interference

249
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Speaker 3: from LORI or if that was like, you don't tell

250
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Speaker 3: my kids what to do. I don't know. I don't

251
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Speaker 3: know that part, but I just remember that, like we

252
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Speaker 3: had a better relationship the older I got. I think

253
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Speaker 3: that's when it's like, that was the most father son

254
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Speaker 3: I've ever felt with him.

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Speaker 1: What was your relationship like with your mother's brother.

256
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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I've told people this, like he was

257
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Speaker 3: not around a lot, and then out of nowhere around

258
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Speaker 3: my wedding twenty seventeen December, because we got married in

259
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Speaker 3: January twenty eighteen. So he just started being around because

260
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Speaker 3: he drove trucks, he did the porta potties, whatever, Like

261
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Speaker 3: he was never he always did his own thing. He

262
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Speaker 3: was like if we went over to the house, he's

263
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Speaker 3: in his room by himself, Like he just wasn't that guy.

264
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Speaker 3: And then all of a sudden he was like around,

265
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Speaker 3: So I never had a real relationship with him. I

266
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Speaker 3: only have like these bits. He came to Hawaii one

267
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Speaker 3: time when I had been there before I went to

268
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Speaker 3: school and stuff. We spent like a week together. That

269
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Speaker 3: was the most time I ever spent with him, and

270
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Speaker 3: I took him to show him the island and we

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Speaker 3: listened to music and it was normal. And so the

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Speaker 3: thing is, I always knew he was weird guy, Like

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Speaker 3: he just said things I would never say, and then

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Speaker 3: he said things that I would never say to like

275
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Speaker 3: a nephew or a family member, even if I did

276
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Speaker 3: say stuff like that. So he was very off putting

277
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Speaker 3: in that way and very just beyond I was a teenager.

278
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Speaker 3: I know I've said some stuff. His his was like

279
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Speaker 3: that next level, like things that you just don't say,

280
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Speaker 3: like just stuff that I'm like, like make your eyebrows

281
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Speaker 3: go up. And so yeah, I mean, there just wasn't

282
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Speaker 3: truly a relationship there because he wasn't around, and when

283
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Speaker 3: he was, I don't know, he just fit in, I

284
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Speaker 3: guess in the sense like he'd want to play board

285
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Speaker 3: games or he'll want to play rock band game that

286
00:13:26,841 --> 00:13:29,121
Speaker 3: we're all playing downstairs. So he just participated and he

287
00:13:29,161 --> 00:13:32,041
Speaker 3: always made things fun, but there was not a relationship.

288
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Speaker 1: Did you ever see a problem with him and Charles?

289
00:13:35,081 --> 00:13:38,361
Speaker 3: Nope, they never had a problem one time, nothing but

290
00:13:38,441 --> 00:13:39,681
Speaker 3: their friends if anything.

291
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Speaker 1: So what do you think spot what do you think

292
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Speaker 1: spoked it?

293
00:13:43,161 --> 00:13:46,921
Speaker 4: Then the confrontation with Charles, apparently Alex was shut.

294
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Speaker 3: In dead, Yeah, I mean that was planned that. I

295
00:13:50,081 --> 00:13:52,521
Speaker 3: don't even know. I don't think there was a fight.

296
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Speaker 3: If there was, it was provoked so they could do that.

297
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Speaker 3: I've watched the interviews on my YouTube channel. I've analyzed

298
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Speaker 3: it for myself because I never I never thought i'd

299
00:14:02,081 --> 00:14:03,641
Speaker 3: ever go to this realm. I never thought i'd talk

300
00:14:03,681 --> 00:14:06,201
Speaker 3: about this stuff. But when I did, I saw all

301
00:14:06,241 --> 00:14:09,881
Speaker 3: the holes in the conversation, and so my own personal

302
00:14:09,881 --> 00:14:12,641
Speaker 3: theory comes down. So I think so all the text,

303
00:14:12,641 --> 00:14:15,921
Speaker 3: messages and evidence shows that they were planning to kill

304
00:14:16,001 --> 00:14:19,241
Speaker 3: Charles because they believed he was a demon in possessing

305
00:14:19,401 --> 00:14:22,281
Speaker 3: Charles's body. That's what they say. I don't know if

306
00:14:22,321 --> 00:14:25,201
Speaker 3: they even believe that themselves, But as far as the

307
00:14:25,201 --> 00:14:27,881
Speaker 3: confrontation goes, I think what happened is and I hate

308
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Speaker 3: to ever sound callous when I say this, but part

309
00:14:30,281 --> 00:14:32,161
Speaker 3: of me is factual. And then the emotional part, and

310
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Speaker 3: sometimes to talk about this, I have to go very

311
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Speaker 3: factual here. I think he walked in and I think

312
00:14:37,801 --> 00:14:40,961
Speaker 3: he was killed. I don't even think there could have

313
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Speaker 3: been I don't think there was yelling. I don't even

314
00:14:42,761 --> 00:14:46,041
Speaker 3: know if there was a plan. And I had never

315
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Speaker 3: been to that house before. And then the day that

316
00:14:48,281 --> 00:14:50,281
Speaker 3: that happened, she lied to me and said that he

317
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Speaker 3: had a heart attack. So I went over there that

318
00:14:52,321 --> 00:14:53,921
Speaker 3: night and they kept showing me off. They're like, no,

319
00:14:53,921 --> 00:14:56,321
Speaker 3: you don't need to come over as fine. So I

320
00:14:56,441 --> 00:14:59,481
Speaker 3: have a burnt memory, obviously of that entire night, but

321
00:14:59,561 --> 00:15:01,801
Speaker 3: I remember how the house looked, and then when I

322
00:15:01,841 --> 00:15:05,681
Speaker 3: finally saw the body cam, I know where The only

323
00:15:05,761 --> 00:15:09,041
Speaker 3: way that that could have happened is that I think

324
00:15:09,081 --> 00:15:11,921
Speaker 3: Alex was hiding in the kitchen and popped out and

325
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Speaker 3: shot him. I genuinely don't think there was a fight.

326
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Speaker 1: So what was your thoughts when this happened, Like, like,

327
00:15:19,041 --> 00:15:19,961
Speaker 1: what's going for? Okay?

328
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Speaker 3: Yeah, man, I was at work. I'd call my mom

329
00:15:23,481 --> 00:15:27,561
Speaker 3: I think twice that morning. She didn't respond, and then

330
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Speaker 3: later in the day I worked till seven at that point,

331
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Speaker 3: so I worked ten to seven and she calls me

332
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Speaker 3: and she just tells me like, I don't know, as

333
00:15:34,561 --> 00:15:36,841
Speaker 3: clear as day, Charles had a heart attack and died

334
00:15:36,881 --> 00:15:39,961
Speaker 3: today in the house this morning. And so my heart

335
00:15:40,081 --> 00:15:43,081
Speaker 3: in my you know, just drops through my stomach and

336
00:15:43,121 --> 00:15:45,201
Speaker 3: I'm just like in shock, like I just lost Charles.

337
00:15:45,281 --> 00:15:47,521
Speaker 3: I talked to him like everything's going through your mind.

338
00:15:47,601 --> 00:15:50,081
Speaker 3: I couldn't believe it. And then I'm asking like, did

339
00:15:50,081 --> 00:15:52,241
Speaker 3: you guys watch him die? Did Tightly watch him die?

340
00:15:52,241 --> 00:15:54,281
Speaker 3: Did JJ watch him die? Did you want? Like, I'm

341
00:15:54,281 --> 00:15:57,481
Speaker 3: thinking they're traumatized. So later in the day, I'm like, hey,

342
00:15:57,481 --> 00:15:58,841
Speaker 3: I have to come see you guys. I had not

343
00:15:58,881 --> 00:16:00,521
Speaker 3: even been to their house yet. I think they've been

344
00:16:00,561 --> 00:16:03,441
Speaker 3: there two weeks if that. So I go over to

345
00:16:03,481 --> 00:16:06,241
Speaker 3: the house and they're all in there, and you know,

346
00:16:06,361 --> 00:16:08,521
Speaker 3: Tyler's the one who opens the door and she just

347
00:16:08,601 --> 00:16:10,721
Speaker 3: kind of crashes into my stomach because I'm a lot

348
00:16:10,761 --> 00:16:13,201
Speaker 3: taller than her. I go in and I see Alix

349
00:16:13,321 --> 00:16:15,481
Speaker 3: sitting on the couch and he has his head wrapped,

350
00:16:16,001 --> 00:16:17,801
Speaker 3: and I remember I kind of just tapped my head.

351
00:16:17,801 --> 00:16:20,681
Speaker 3: I was like, what's this, clear as day? He goes, oh,

352
00:16:20,761 --> 00:16:22,321
Speaker 3: Charles hit me in the head with a bat. So

353
00:16:22,361 --> 00:16:25,561
Speaker 3: I shot him in self defense something to that degree.

354
00:16:25,601 --> 00:16:29,161
Speaker 3: And I remember when you think that someone died versus

355
00:16:29,161 --> 00:16:32,761
Speaker 3: someone got killed and you hear two different things, Like,

356
00:16:32,841 --> 00:16:35,081
Speaker 3: I can't tell you. I was already in a state

357
00:16:35,121 --> 00:16:38,041
Speaker 3: of shock. That put me into like a pure freeze.

358
00:16:38,201 --> 00:16:40,681
Speaker 3: Just everything in your nervous system shut down. So I

359
00:16:40,721 --> 00:16:43,601
Speaker 3: went outside. I talked to Lorie. She's outside on the phone.

360
00:16:43,641 --> 00:16:47,481
Speaker 3: She hangs up, She's calm as can be, doesn't care.

361
00:16:47,681 --> 00:16:50,601
Speaker 3: I'd never really cussed her, but I'm just cussing. I'm

362
00:16:50,641 --> 00:16:52,841
Speaker 3: going crazy and like, what the hell is going on?

363
00:16:53,321 --> 00:16:56,801
Speaker 3: And she's just like kind of sitting there like it's unfortunate,

364
00:16:57,081 --> 00:17:00,401
Speaker 3: you know. So yeah, I don't know. I just I'll

365
00:17:00,481 --> 00:17:02,561
Speaker 3: never forget that, and I'll never forget the shock of that.

366
00:17:03,161 --> 00:17:05,481
Speaker 1: So when did you stop to see the change in

367
00:17:05,521 --> 00:17:05,921
Speaker 1: your mother?

368
00:17:06,241 --> 00:17:06,321
Speaker 3: Like?

369
00:17:06,401 --> 00:17:09,520
Speaker 4: When when was that when you thought this your mother's

370
00:17:09,600 --> 00:17:11,761
Speaker 4: changed and there's something different about it, and this is

371
00:17:11,801 --> 00:17:14,840
Speaker 4: a bit weird, and you're not liking what you're seeing.

372
00:17:14,961 --> 00:17:16,561
Speaker 3: You know. That's the thing I try to explain to

373
00:17:16,600 --> 00:17:19,680
Speaker 3: people when I talk about these situations, is there wasn't

374
00:17:19,681 --> 00:17:23,761
Speaker 3: this like light switch. This was a gradual thing. And

375
00:17:24,080 --> 00:17:26,001
Speaker 3: the only thing that she started to do more is

376
00:17:26,001 --> 00:17:28,961
Speaker 3: get really hyper spiritual, which is things like I saw Jesus.

377
00:17:29,761 --> 00:17:33,880
Speaker 3: I'm having these experiences. But did that concern you? Here's

378
00:17:33,880 --> 00:17:37,001
Speaker 3: what I'll say, yes. But also I at the time

379
00:17:37,761 --> 00:17:41,200
Speaker 3: was like, I can't deny somebody having experience. I was

380
00:17:41,241 --> 00:17:43,121
Speaker 3: just very like, I don't want to tell you yes

381
00:17:43,201 --> 00:17:44,961
Speaker 3: or no, because I don't know for a fact. I

382
00:17:45,041 --> 00:17:47,360
Speaker 3: don't really believe you myself, but I'm not going to

383
00:17:47,400 --> 00:17:49,281
Speaker 3: say to you no, you did not. And so that

384
00:17:49,360 --> 00:17:50,801
Speaker 3: was just I was just in that place. I was

385
00:17:50,880 --> 00:17:54,241
Speaker 3: very passive like that anyway with her regardless. But when

386
00:17:54,241 --> 00:17:55,481
Speaker 3: it came to that stuff, I was like, I can't

387
00:17:55,521 --> 00:17:58,161
Speaker 3: really deny that you had an experience, but I don't

388
00:17:58,201 --> 00:17:59,840
Speaker 3: have to. I don't believe you, right, I didn't think

389
00:17:59,880 --> 00:18:03,521
Speaker 3: she saw Jesus. But it wasn't a harmful thing to say.

390
00:18:03,600 --> 00:18:07,001
Speaker 3: It was just really out there. You know. Again, people

391
00:18:07,001 --> 00:18:09,801
Speaker 3: don't understand that I did not hear her talk about zombies.

392
00:18:09,840 --> 00:18:12,601
Speaker 3: I didn't hear her talk about all these horrible, crazy

393
00:18:12,640 --> 00:18:14,721
Speaker 3: things like if I would have, because the one thing

394
00:18:14,801 --> 00:18:18,241
Speaker 3: she told me is something about coming back multiple lives,

395
00:18:18,241 --> 00:18:21,080
Speaker 3: and I said, I do not believe in that, and

396
00:18:21,120 --> 00:18:23,160
Speaker 3: I told her I don't think that's true, and that

397
00:18:23,201 --> 00:18:26,681
Speaker 3: doesn't even make any sense, and she stopped. She never

398
00:18:26,681 --> 00:18:28,600
Speaker 3: told me any other other stuff. That's why it's like

399
00:18:29,080 --> 00:18:32,841
Speaker 3: listening to these trials, going back and hearing it, I'm

400
00:18:32,880 --> 00:18:35,281
Speaker 3: baffled at the stuff that they were talking about and saying.

401
00:18:35,721 --> 00:18:37,281
Speaker 1: What about your sister.

402
00:18:37,360 --> 00:18:39,360
Speaker 4: Did she ever reach out to say that mom's acting

403
00:18:39,400 --> 00:18:42,161
Speaker 4: weed or she scared or anything like that to you,

404
00:18:42,360 --> 00:18:43,080
Speaker 4: or did.

405
00:18:42,961 --> 00:18:43,680
Speaker 1: That not happen?

406
00:18:44,721 --> 00:18:48,121
Speaker 3: No? I mean, like again, remember we grew up this way.

407
00:18:48,241 --> 00:18:51,241
Speaker 3: We didn't have grandparents on the other side, we didn't

408
00:18:51,281 --> 00:18:53,720
Speaker 3: have other family members. I don't want to use the

409
00:18:53,721 --> 00:18:56,161
Speaker 3: word compair, but like when you don't know the difference

410
00:18:56,321 --> 00:18:58,120
Speaker 3: of where you are, it's like it's like if you

411
00:18:58,160 --> 00:18:59,720
Speaker 3: lived in the same place your whole life and then

412
00:18:59,721 --> 00:19:01,480
Speaker 3: one day you get on an airplane and fly across the

413
00:19:01,481 --> 00:19:04,921
Speaker 3: world and it's like, you know, Hawaii Kawai to like La,

414
00:19:05,120 --> 00:19:08,281
Speaker 3: you'd be shocked. It's like that. You know, Tylee was

415
00:19:08,360 --> 00:19:10,840
Speaker 3: young first of all, her and my mom, but it

416
00:19:10,921 --> 00:19:13,640
Speaker 3: heads a lot, and I think there's just a really

417
00:19:14,201 --> 00:19:17,481
Speaker 3: bad dynamic there. But I don't think she really knew

418
00:19:17,521 --> 00:19:19,761
Speaker 3: what to make of it either, because there's kind of

419
00:19:19,761 --> 00:19:22,761
Speaker 3: a way that you protect your mind of who you

420
00:19:22,840 --> 00:19:25,600
Speaker 3: think someone is, like I love you. That's my mom.

421
00:19:26,041 --> 00:19:28,160
Speaker 3: Like that's my mom. Like even if she's crazy, I

422
00:19:28,201 --> 00:19:29,080
Speaker 3: love her, that's my mom.

423
00:19:29,160 --> 00:19:29,321
Speaker 1: Right.

424
00:19:29,640 --> 00:19:33,880
Speaker 3: Again, there wasn't danger. There wasn't like some kind of

425
00:19:34,001 --> 00:19:37,760
Speaker 3: belief system like sacrifice each other type of crazy stuff.

426
00:19:38,120 --> 00:19:40,921
Speaker 3: So it was really just her off the wall beliefs

427
00:19:40,961 --> 00:19:43,920
Speaker 3: of this stuff. But again, she kept a lot of

428
00:19:43,961 --> 00:19:46,880
Speaker 3: this stuff in this group, this cult that they had.

429
00:19:47,321 --> 00:19:49,240
Speaker 3: I don't know who was hearing this stuff, but I

430
00:19:49,400 --> 00:19:50,921
Speaker 3: never heard any of these things.

431
00:19:51,400 --> 00:19:53,840
Speaker 1: Did things escalate when Chad got involved?

432
00:19:54,201 --> 00:19:56,561
Speaker 3: That's what's wild, right. I had no idea Chad day

433
00:19:56,561 --> 00:19:59,600
Speaker 3: Bill existed. And we're going to see the new Star

434
00:19:59,600 --> 00:20:01,720
Speaker 3: Wars movie, like the opening night. I'd never seen a

435
00:20:01,721 --> 00:20:04,161
Speaker 3: movie on opening night. And I get a phone call

436
00:20:04,281 --> 00:20:07,160
Speaker 3: from family member on my mom's side that says Alex died.

437
00:20:07,640 --> 00:20:11,081
Speaker 3: And I'm like, WHOA, Charles just got killed by Alex.

438
00:20:11,201 --> 00:20:14,080
Speaker 3: And then six almost six months later, Alex is dead

439
00:20:14,681 --> 00:20:16,401
Speaker 3: and it's just like running through my mind as I'm

440
00:20:16,441 --> 00:20:18,801
Speaker 3: at the movies, So I'm like, this is crazy. We

441
00:20:18,840 --> 00:20:21,160
Speaker 3: get home. We hadn't stayed up past like ten o'clock

442
00:20:21,160 --> 00:20:23,640
Speaker 3: in a long time, so it's like midnight. Kelsey comes

443
00:20:23,640 --> 00:20:25,640
Speaker 3: walking out with the phone and shows me because we

444
00:20:26,001 --> 00:20:28,880
Speaker 3: at this point, on November twenty seventh, the day before Thanksgiving,

445
00:20:29,080 --> 00:20:31,241
Speaker 3: the police had said we're looking for Tyler and JJ

446
00:20:31,840 --> 00:20:34,321
Speaker 3: and I called Lourie and that's when she disconnected her phone,

447
00:20:34,640 --> 00:20:37,521
Speaker 3: right so we know something is really weird going on.

448
00:20:37,640 --> 00:20:39,521
Speaker 3: Right now, we're talking to the detectives, we're trying to

449
00:20:39,521 --> 00:20:41,880
Speaker 3: figure out what's going on. She comes out and shows

450
00:20:41,880 --> 00:20:45,281
Speaker 3: me this press release of Chad Dave Bell next to

451
00:20:45,321 --> 00:20:48,961
Speaker 3: Laurie saying in Rexburg, Idaho. Again, didn't even know where

452
00:20:48,961 --> 00:20:51,880
Speaker 3: they were. Kids are missing, they've abandoned their home and

453
00:20:52,041 --> 00:20:54,201
Speaker 3: now there's this huge search and she's married. And it's

454
00:20:54,360 --> 00:20:56,440
Speaker 3: that all that hit me in that day. So I

455
00:20:56,521 --> 00:20:58,041
Speaker 3: had no idea she was married. I had no idea

456
00:20:58,080 --> 00:20:58,720
Speaker 3: who he was.

457
00:20:59,321 --> 00:20:59,440
Speaker 1: Like.

458
00:20:59,521 --> 00:21:02,641
Speaker 3: All that hit me from that news press thing and

459
00:21:02,721 --> 00:21:05,481
Speaker 3: again where they lived, the fact that they can't find

460
00:21:05,481 --> 00:21:08,440
Speaker 3: the kids still I don't know. I again, when we

461
00:21:08,481 --> 00:21:12,281
Speaker 3: moved out in early twenty eighteen, she had all twenty

462
00:21:12,321 --> 00:21:14,961
Speaker 3: eighteen and all of that twenty nineteen in that house.

463
00:21:15,481 --> 00:21:18,640
Speaker 3: And I think that's when it escalated the most.

464
00:21:19,120 --> 00:21:22,360
Speaker 4: When your sister went missing, did you feel. That was

465
00:21:22,761 --> 00:21:25,680
Speaker 4: very strange for her. They would never leave the house

466
00:21:25,761 --> 00:21:26,721
Speaker 4: like that and not come back.

467
00:21:27,241 --> 00:21:30,041
Speaker 3: What happened was I was texting my sister and I'm like, hey,

468
00:21:30,080 --> 00:21:32,240
Speaker 3: what's going on. I'm texting her just kind of normal,

469
00:21:32,640 --> 00:21:35,360
Speaker 3: and I'm getting text back, and on her birthday I

470
00:21:35,400 --> 00:21:38,440
Speaker 3: said happy birthday to her, I'm getting these responses. I

471
00:21:38,481 --> 00:21:40,640
Speaker 3: finally just had like started having really bad feelings. I'm like,

472
00:21:41,561 --> 00:21:44,201
Speaker 3: she's missing that you'll text in it. Yes, So she

473
00:21:44,281 --> 00:21:47,160
Speaker 3: wasn't missing officially yet. This is in September, though, So

474
00:21:47,681 --> 00:21:50,321
Speaker 3: they took her life on like the ninth, and her

475
00:21:50,321 --> 00:21:53,041
Speaker 3: birthday's on the twenty fourth. My phone's getting hit back,

476
00:21:53,120 --> 00:21:54,920
Speaker 3: like you know. And then finally I'm like, hey, I

477
00:21:55,001 --> 00:21:56,481
Speaker 3: really just want to talk to you. I've been trying

478
00:21:56,521 --> 00:21:58,041
Speaker 3: to call you, like I don't know if you're mad

479
00:21:58,080 --> 00:22:01,201
Speaker 3: at me again. At the time, I'm thinking she's been

480
00:22:01,241 --> 00:22:04,761
Speaker 3: through hell everything that happened with Charles. Then they move.

481
00:22:05,241 --> 00:22:08,120
Speaker 3: You know, Tyler had a life in Arizona. She had friends, like,

482
00:22:08,201 --> 00:22:10,121
Speaker 3: she had built her life as well, because she had

483
00:22:10,160 --> 00:22:12,600
Speaker 3: to move just as much as I did, and so

484
00:22:13,001 --> 00:22:15,601
Speaker 3: she had a lot that she was leaving behind. At

485
00:22:15,600 --> 00:22:17,161
Speaker 3: that time, I'm like, you know what, I'm just gonna

486
00:22:17,160 --> 00:22:19,001
Speaker 3: give her a little space, but let her know that

487
00:22:19,041 --> 00:22:21,001
Speaker 3: I'm here. So I'm sending her pictures and videos of

488
00:22:21,160 --> 00:22:23,880
Speaker 3: my daughter, who was obviously growing up at that point,

489
00:22:24,281 --> 00:22:27,001
Speaker 3: and I'm getting, you know, just these responses back. And

490
00:22:27,041 --> 00:22:29,080
Speaker 3: finally I'm like confronted her and I'm like, can you

491
00:22:29,120 --> 00:22:31,041
Speaker 3: please like call me? Like this is weird. I have

492
00:22:31,120 --> 00:22:33,440
Speaker 3: a bad feeling in my stomach. Can you call me?

493
00:22:33,481 --> 00:22:35,761
Speaker 3: Can you talk to me? And then not too long after,

494
00:22:35,840 --> 00:22:37,481
Speaker 3: I had a conversation with Laurie and I said, Hey,

495
00:22:37,521 --> 00:22:39,801
Speaker 3: what is going on with Tyley? And she's like, well,

496
00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:42,361
Speaker 3: I took her phone. You know, she's having a really

497
00:22:42,400 --> 00:22:44,000
Speaker 3: hard time and we're trying to be safe and all

498
00:22:44,120 --> 00:22:45,521
Speaker 3: this stuff. I'm like, so, why can't I just talk

499
00:22:45,561 --> 00:22:47,880
Speaker 3: to her? And I was very upset. She's like trying

500
00:22:47,880 --> 00:22:51,681
Speaker 3: to make all these things and excuses of why. So unfortunately,

501
00:22:52,441 --> 00:22:53,880
Speaker 3: I don't want to say the word believed her, but

502
00:22:53,921 --> 00:22:56,160
Speaker 3: I just kind of was like, okay, like I confronted it,

503
00:22:56,640 --> 00:22:59,281
Speaker 3: I was told these things. I guess that's all I

504
00:22:59,281 --> 00:23:02,120
Speaker 3: can go off of. And then obviously, after the police

505
00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:04,480
Speaker 3: came to the door the next month or two months later,

506
00:23:04,561 --> 00:23:08,200
Speaker 3: whatever the case. That's when it's like this, I mean,

507
00:23:08,201 --> 00:23:09,961
Speaker 3: it hit me, and you know, I called her right then.

508
00:23:10,521 --> 00:23:12,680
Speaker 3: I called Laurie right there and talked to her for

509
00:23:12,721 --> 00:23:15,640
Speaker 3: about thirty seconds. She hung up and she disconnected her phone.

510
00:23:16,080 --> 00:23:17,161
Speaker 3: Didn't hear back from her.

511
00:23:17,681 --> 00:23:19,920
Speaker 1: Do you believe that that was your sister replying to

512
00:23:19,921 --> 00:23:20,561
Speaker 1: you in a message?

513
00:23:21,281 --> 00:23:24,120
Speaker 3: Oh no, No, she was gone. There's literal proof that

514
00:23:24,840 --> 00:23:26,881
Speaker 3: she was gone on the ninth and it was literally

515
00:23:27,481 --> 00:23:30,281
Speaker 3: Lourie and she had her phone and she was texting

516
00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:35,681
Speaker 3: me as my sister to save herself from I don't

517
00:23:35,681 --> 00:23:38,961
Speaker 3: know what her long game was, but that's always going

518
00:23:38,961 --> 00:23:42,521
Speaker 3: to be one. I've confronted Laurie on this. The phone

519
00:23:42,561 --> 00:23:44,840
Speaker 3: call that I made to her, and jail husband was

520
00:23:44,840 --> 00:23:48,241
Speaker 3: put in through the trials and so people have heard

521
00:23:48,241 --> 00:23:49,880
Speaker 3: what I said to her, and I said, you're texting

522
00:23:49,880 --> 00:23:52,761
Speaker 3: me as my dead little sister. Yeah, it's just one

523
00:23:52,761 --> 00:23:54,680
Speaker 3: of those details to just haunts you, you know. But

524
00:23:55,840 --> 00:23:59,321
Speaker 3: at the time, I just gave Tyly the space but

525
00:23:59,441 --> 00:24:02,200
Speaker 3: to go missing. No, and then you theorize, right, so

526
00:24:02,241 --> 00:24:05,360
Speaker 3: while they're missing, then you're thinking, well, there's no way

527
00:24:05,561 --> 00:24:08,041
Speaker 3: she would do anything to those kids. There's no way

528
00:24:08,160 --> 00:24:11,281
Speaker 3: like there's no way they're not okay. So they must be,

529
00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:15,281
Speaker 3: you know, shoved off into another family member or in

530
00:24:15,360 --> 00:24:18,521
Speaker 3: a farm somewhere. I mean, you just theorize, because that's

531
00:24:18,521 --> 00:24:21,601
Speaker 3: all you can do when someone's missing. And so that's

532
00:24:21,600 --> 00:24:23,001
Speaker 3: where I was at. I was just trying to think

533
00:24:23,001 --> 00:24:27,041
Speaker 3: of like every possible scenario. Obviously I was having bad

534
00:24:27,120 --> 00:24:30,041
Speaker 3: dreams about them not being alive. I was thinking as possible.

535
00:24:30,080 --> 00:24:32,521
Speaker 3: But you can't give up hope that fast. You can't

536
00:24:32,521 --> 00:24:35,761
Speaker 3: just go there because there's no answers. But yeah, I

537
00:24:35,761 --> 00:24:37,920
Speaker 3: mean in the time, I just gave her the space.

538
00:24:37,961 --> 00:24:40,480
Speaker 3: But after I learned all that stuff, then no, and

539
00:24:40,521 --> 00:24:43,601
Speaker 3: then I was really worried. My first thought was Tyley's

540
00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:46,761
Speaker 3: taking care of JJ because Laurie's in Hawaii with Chad

541
00:24:47,561 --> 00:24:51,440
Speaker 3: and they're putting all this responsibility on her. But to

542
00:24:51,561 --> 00:24:54,160
Speaker 3: find out what actually happened, No, I did not believe

543
00:24:54,201 --> 00:24:55,281
Speaker 3: that that was possible.

544
00:24:55,801 --> 00:24:58,241
Speaker 1: Describe chat to me when you fish met.

545
00:24:58,961 --> 00:25:02,561
Speaker 3: Yeah, so I've never officially met in Chad, right, You've

546
00:25:03,880 --> 00:25:06,481
Speaker 3: no no ever, I've seen him in court. I saw him.

547
00:25:06,561 --> 00:25:10,521
Speaker 3: He My mom had a trial in like early early

548
00:25:10,721 --> 00:25:13,640
Speaker 3: twenty twenty because they caught her and they arrested her

549
00:25:13,640 --> 00:25:16,561
Speaker 3: in Hawaii extra dractor. So we went up there and

550
00:25:16,561 --> 00:25:19,201
Speaker 3: he's sitting over there, and I remember we went into

551
00:25:19,241 --> 00:25:22,041
Speaker 3: the room before I was told do not like make

552
00:25:22,080 --> 00:25:25,241
Speaker 3: a face at anybody, don't really like, don't say anything,

553
00:25:25,441 --> 00:25:27,600
Speaker 3: don't like go over there, like, don't do anything. I

554
00:25:27,600 --> 00:25:29,920
Speaker 3: already had a bad feeling about this dude, And I

555
00:25:30,001 --> 00:25:32,880
Speaker 3: remember in the video of us leaving, I got up

556
00:25:32,880 --> 00:25:34,841
Speaker 3: and I just mean mugged him because I'm like, who

557
00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:38,481
Speaker 3: the f are you like this random dude who she's

558
00:25:38,561 --> 00:25:40,880
Speaker 3: married to, who she's clung to now for life with

559
00:25:40,961 --> 00:25:43,681
Speaker 3: my siblings missing, like it was anger towards both of them.

560
00:25:43,840 --> 00:25:46,920
Speaker 3: Laurie's more responsible, but so is he, And so I

561
00:25:47,001 --> 00:25:48,960
Speaker 3: just mean mugged him and looked at him, and he

562
00:25:49,041 --> 00:25:52,161
Speaker 3: just darted that head. So I said, there's something weird

563
00:25:52,201 --> 00:25:55,801
Speaker 3: about this guy. I know it. And the next time

564
00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:58,361
Speaker 3: I saw him was at his trial when I went

565
00:25:58,441 --> 00:26:01,561
Speaker 3: up there, and it was first sentencing in.

566
00:26:02,001 --> 00:26:06,761
Speaker 4: The nine months until they found the bodies. What was

567
00:26:06,801 --> 00:26:10,481
Speaker 4: going on with the with looking for them, family members,

568
00:26:10,561 --> 00:26:11,360
Speaker 4: even yourself?

569
00:26:12,120 --> 00:26:13,680
Speaker 1: How was your mom? How is it? What was your

570
00:26:13,721 --> 00:26:16,961
Speaker 1: mom doing? Like it was it only you concerned by this?

571
00:26:17,281 --> 00:26:20,120
Speaker 4: Was like by looks of it, Chad wasn't fucking concerned,

572
00:26:20,441 --> 00:26:23,001
Speaker 4: and your mom wasn't fucking concerned, So what the fuck

573
00:26:23,120 --> 00:26:25,840
Speaker 4: was going on for them nine months to find found

574
00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:26,361
Speaker 4: the bodies?

575
00:26:27,201 --> 00:26:29,480
Speaker 3: So here's what happened. This is why this this is

576
00:26:29,521 --> 00:26:32,281
Speaker 3: such an unbelievable like for me to even sit here

577
00:26:32,281 --> 00:26:34,281
Speaker 3: and talk about it, the fact that it's reality is

578
00:26:34,321 --> 00:26:37,681
Speaker 3: so sometimes it's so hard to grasp because it went

579
00:26:37,840 --> 00:26:41,641
Speaker 3: so fast. So in September, they take my sister's life

580
00:26:41,640 --> 00:26:44,201
Speaker 3: on the ninth, then they take my little brother's life

581
00:26:44,201 --> 00:26:48,840
Speaker 3: on the twenty third. Then on October second, they try

582
00:26:48,880 --> 00:26:52,961
Speaker 3: to kill my cousin's husband who I was close to too,

583
00:26:53,001 --> 00:26:56,200
Speaker 3: and then they actually attempt to kill Chad's wife. And

584
00:26:56,241 --> 00:26:58,600
Speaker 3: then a few days later they do kill Chad's wife.

585
00:26:58,921 --> 00:26:59,481
Speaker 1: That's Timmy.

586
00:26:59,561 --> 00:27:02,240
Speaker 3: Yeah, that was time Tammy, Chad's Tammy day Bille. So

587
00:27:02,600 --> 00:27:07,001
Speaker 3: it goes from September to mid October, all of that happened.

588
00:27:07,241 --> 00:27:08,120
Speaker 3: All of these people.

589
00:27:08,241 --> 00:27:10,400
Speaker 1: I'm Brandon was your Who's Brandon to you?

590
00:27:11,120 --> 00:27:15,360
Speaker 3: Brandon was technically my cousin, my first cousin's husband, so

591
00:27:15,521 --> 00:27:17,681
Speaker 3: like I always just thought of him as my cousin, right,

592
00:27:18,041 --> 00:27:21,801
Speaker 3: And so that happens very quickly, right, and then they

593
00:27:21,840 --> 00:27:25,241
Speaker 3: go get married in Hawaii, then they come back, then

594
00:27:25,281 --> 00:27:27,600
Speaker 3: they leave again and they disappear. So when they disappeared,

595
00:27:28,080 --> 00:27:32,200
Speaker 3: they had you know, December, January, February to March. I

596
00:27:32,241 --> 00:27:34,321
Speaker 3: want to say it happened in March, so it wasn't.

597
00:27:34,521 --> 00:27:36,801
Speaker 3: I don't know how long it was. But she got

598
00:27:36,880 --> 00:27:39,321
Speaker 3: arrested because they set those court dates for her and

599
00:27:39,360 --> 00:27:42,601
Speaker 3: she didn't respond and that was it. Like she they

600
00:27:42,681 --> 00:27:45,080
Speaker 3: finally found a law that says you have to produce

601
00:27:45,120 --> 00:27:46,920
Speaker 3: these children. Because they're trying to figure out how do

602
00:27:46,961 --> 00:27:48,721
Speaker 3: we get her, like for like, how do we actually

603
00:27:48,801 --> 00:27:52,080
Speaker 3: stop her? If she's arrested, then obviously that raises the

604
00:27:52,120 --> 00:27:55,920
Speaker 3: stakes and so for me personally, I didn't know what

605
00:27:56,001 --> 00:28:00,361
Speaker 3: to do. So this is what happens. It blows up everywhere.

606
00:28:00,441 --> 00:28:03,840
Speaker 3: Everyone is talking about this, to the point where people

607
00:28:03,880 --> 00:28:06,241
Speaker 3: are showing up at our house with cameras and mics

608
00:28:06,281 --> 00:28:09,080
Speaker 3: like this at the door. They're putting sticks in your

609
00:28:09,080 --> 00:28:10,561
Speaker 3: door to see when you leave. They're going to my

610
00:28:10,561 --> 00:28:13,840
Speaker 3: family member's houses, they're calling my work, They're everywhere, and

611
00:28:13,880 --> 00:28:17,241
Speaker 3: this is all news and reporters. The problem is at

612
00:28:17,241 --> 00:28:21,120
Speaker 3: that time they're missing but they're like, who was your dad?

613
00:28:21,761 --> 00:28:24,561
Speaker 3: What tell me? And I'm like, bro, I look, this

614
00:28:24,640 --> 00:28:26,360
Speaker 3: is just not the time. I don't care. But I

615
00:28:26,441 --> 00:28:28,801
Speaker 3: was too. I don't know what the word is. I

616
00:28:28,840 --> 00:28:30,840
Speaker 3: was just a pushover at that point. So I just

617
00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:34,321
Speaker 3: answered people's questions because I felt uncomfortable. But like, basically

618
00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:36,600
Speaker 3: how I dealt with it at first is I thought,

619
00:28:36,721 --> 00:28:39,601
Speaker 3: let's get the word out there. So all these TV

620
00:28:39,641 --> 00:28:42,200
Speaker 3: shows are like, hey, we want to focus on the

621
00:28:42,321 --> 00:28:45,441
Speaker 3: missing siblings. Let's let's get you here and we'll put

622
00:28:45,481 --> 00:28:47,681
Speaker 3: the word out here. Let's get as many people looking

623
00:28:47,681 --> 00:28:50,041
Speaker 3: at this. Every time I went to a TV show,

624
00:28:50,401 --> 00:28:52,841
Speaker 3: they made it about the whole scope and tried to

625
00:28:52,841 --> 00:28:55,720
Speaker 3: ask me all these questions about all this other stuff.

626
00:28:56,401 --> 00:28:58,841
Speaker 3: And so I was upset with that just because I

627
00:28:58,841 --> 00:29:01,081
Speaker 3: was like, look, that just really takes away, like you're

628
00:29:01,161 --> 00:29:04,440
Speaker 3: missing the essence of the point here. And so you know,

629
00:29:04,481 --> 00:29:07,681
Speaker 3: we had this whole thing where I'm talking to detectives,

630
00:29:07,961 --> 00:29:10,921
Speaker 3: I'm talking to Arizona, I'm talking to anybody who's who's

631
00:29:11,081 --> 00:29:14,001
Speaker 3: calling me. And then i'd went on probably I want

632
00:29:14,001 --> 00:29:15,720
Speaker 3: to say a few different shows, like I went on

633
00:29:15,761 --> 00:29:19,841
Speaker 3: Doctor Phil, Nancy Grace, and Dateline. I want to say

634
00:29:20,041 --> 00:29:22,081
Speaker 3: that was it like that was like the only other

635
00:29:22,121 --> 00:29:24,121
Speaker 3: public thing I was doing. You know, now I wish

636
00:29:24,201 --> 00:29:27,001
Speaker 3: I would have been more like use social media and stuff,

637
00:29:27,041 --> 00:29:29,041
Speaker 3: but at the time, I'm like, look, the FBI and

638
00:29:29,041 --> 00:29:30,761
Speaker 3: the police are the only real ones that can do

639
00:29:30,801 --> 00:29:33,480
Speaker 3: anything about anything. That was like where my mentality was.

640
00:29:34,161 --> 00:29:36,601
Speaker 3: I know that JJ's grandparents had put up like the

641
00:29:36,641 --> 00:29:40,041
Speaker 3: posters and the reward and everything like that in Rexburg

642
00:29:40,201 --> 00:29:42,561
Speaker 3: and let people know that there was like a reward

643
00:29:42,601 --> 00:29:45,801
Speaker 3: for missing you know, any information. But as far as

644
00:29:45,881 --> 00:29:48,401
Speaker 3: other people, like I said, what happened was once this

645
00:29:48,561 --> 00:29:52,841
Speaker 3: all started, my mom's family, whish would be my family

646
00:29:52,841 --> 00:29:55,921
Speaker 3: growing up, just crumbled and everybody just kind of took

647
00:29:55,961 --> 00:29:59,720
Speaker 3: different positions and all that closeness, all the things that

648
00:29:59,761 --> 00:30:03,241
Speaker 3: existed were wiped and so you know, you just don't

649
00:30:03,281 --> 00:30:05,480
Speaker 3: know who believes, what, thinks what, and it was it

650
00:30:05,521 --> 00:30:08,361
Speaker 3: was a mess. So just destroyed the family. Way outside

651
00:30:09,041 --> 00:30:12,841
Speaker 3: of what happened to my family, right, it destroyed everybody

652
00:30:13,001 --> 00:30:15,761
Speaker 3: in every single way. But during that time, yeah, just

653
00:30:15,801 --> 00:30:17,681
Speaker 3: talking to the police as much as I possibly can

654
00:30:18,321 --> 00:30:21,241
Speaker 3: and interviewing when I can, and just I gave them

655
00:30:21,241 --> 00:30:23,241
Speaker 3: everything I had. I gave them all the text message

656
00:30:23,241 --> 00:30:26,041
Speaker 3: like here's everything I can possibly give you, I still

657
00:30:26,081 --> 00:30:27,921
Speaker 3: don't have any way to help, and that I think

658
00:30:27,921 --> 00:30:30,241
Speaker 3: that's what crumbled me. It's like I can't do anything

659
00:30:30,241 --> 00:30:32,881
Speaker 3: to help you. I wish I could, but that's what

660
00:30:32,881 --> 00:30:33,441
Speaker 3: we were doing.

661
00:30:33,721 --> 00:30:36,760
Speaker 4: So even me now listening to you, even though I've

662
00:30:36,841 --> 00:30:39,121
Speaker 4: read about it, but now I'm listening to you. The

663
00:30:39,161 --> 00:30:43,081
Speaker 4: red flag for me would be when your mom got

664
00:30:43,121 --> 00:30:46,601
Speaker 4: married to Chad but her daughter is still missing and

665
00:30:46,641 --> 00:30:48,281
Speaker 4: she has you know what I mean. That's to me,

666
00:30:48,401 --> 00:30:51,681
Speaker 4: like you wouldn't do something like that because you're worried

667
00:30:51,721 --> 00:30:54,281
Speaker 4: about where your your your siblings are and your kids,

668
00:30:54,281 --> 00:30:54,760
Speaker 4: you know what I mean.

669
00:30:54,841 --> 00:30:57,281
Speaker 1: Like, So to me, that was a red flag.

670
00:30:57,521 --> 00:31:00,681
Speaker 3: One hundred percent. I mean to what got me the most.

671
00:31:00,841 --> 00:31:03,681
Speaker 3: There was a video and you know everybody found them.

672
00:31:03,721 --> 00:31:07,240
Speaker 3: So this is what's the disrespect part about where they went. So,

673
00:31:07,561 --> 00:31:09,681
Speaker 3: like I told you, they moved. We moved to Hawaii

674
00:31:09,681 --> 00:31:12,201
Speaker 3: as a family, and we were going to church there.

675
00:31:12,361 --> 00:31:14,081
Speaker 3: We were on the island of Kawaii, which is the

676
00:31:14,161 --> 00:31:18,121
Speaker 3: smallest island and it's very different than like a Wahoo

677
00:31:18,201 --> 00:31:20,601
Speaker 3: and stuff like that, and so we lived a whole

678
00:31:20,641 --> 00:31:24,401
Speaker 3: life there and all of a sudden guess where she

679
00:31:24,481 --> 00:31:27,841
Speaker 3: takes her new husband to exactly where we were, like

680
00:31:27,881 --> 00:31:29,641
Speaker 3: and I and again that was, like I would say,

681
00:31:29,641 --> 00:31:33,321
Speaker 3: the most peaceful time of our family's life because there

682
00:31:33,361 --> 00:31:36,641
Speaker 3: was no court drama with like my stepbrothers or us

683
00:31:36,761 --> 00:31:39,801
Speaker 3: or like exus, like none of that existed. It was

684
00:31:39,841 --> 00:31:42,281
Speaker 3: just like this time. And you know, JJ was like

685
00:31:42,721 --> 00:31:45,561
Speaker 3: because of his autism, he was just so disconnected, like

686
00:31:45,641 --> 00:31:48,200
Speaker 3: he just couldn't make eye contact, and so like it

687
00:31:48,241 --> 00:31:51,321
Speaker 3: took years to form a bond with him, to like

688
00:31:51,401 --> 00:31:54,881
Speaker 3: get that closeness, and so it had a lot of

689
00:31:55,161 --> 00:31:58,720
Speaker 3: great memories tied to it. She takes that dude to

690
00:31:58,841 --> 00:32:01,481
Speaker 3: almost exactly where we lived. It goes to the same

691
00:32:01,521 --> 00:32:04,721
Speaker 3: exact place we went, had Christmases and thingsgivings, the same hotel.

692
00:32:05,201 --> 00:32:07,521
Speaker 3: And this video is all these reporters finding them because

693
00:32:07,521 --> 00:32:10,441
Speaker 3: the police pulled them over and confiscated their car looking

694
00:32:10,441 --> 00:32:13,681
Speaker 3: for the kids. And you know, Nate Eaton of East

695
00:32:13,681 --> 00:32:15,321
Speaker 3: Side of Her News runs up on them and goes,

696
00:32:15,361 --> 00:32:17,401
Speaker 3: you know, where are your kids? And I remember the

697
00:32:17,441 --> 00:32:21,041
Speaker 3: gut punch because the police didn't find any sign of

698
00:32:21,121 --> 00:32:23,881
Speaker 3: Tyler or JJ. And so I'm like, I know that

699
00:32:23,921 --> 00:32:27,401
Speaker 3: island where the fuck are my sibs? Like where could

700
00:32:27,401 --> 00:32:30,321
Speaker 3: they be? Like, there's no way that they have nothing

701
00:32:30,361 --> 00:32:32,960
Speaker 3: like there because I have three kids, like you know,

702
00:32:33,041 --> 00:32:36,000
Speaker 3: pieces of paper whatever, like a trace of a child,

703
00:32:36,681 --> 00:32:39,641
Speaker 3: and there's nothing, and so I'm like, where are they?

704
00:32:39,881 --> 00:32:42,041
Speaker 3: And that's when it's like that was that gut punch,

705
00:32:42,121 --> 00:32:44,440
Speaker 3: Like they're married, they don't care, they won't answer questions,

706
00:32:44,441 --> 00:32:46,801
Speaker 3: they won't show up for court, and they're just living

707
00:32:46,801 --> 00:32:50,241
Speaker 3: their life at Kawhi Beach Resort. That's it. So yeah,

708
00:32:50,281 --> 00:32:52,440
Speaker 3: I mean seeing that, that was that moment where I

709
00:32:52,481 --> 00:32:54,921
Speaker 3: was like my heart really just dropped because that was

710
00:32:55,001 --> 00:32:58,720
Speaker 3: like it's just such a stab for so many different reasons,

711
00:32:58,721 --> 00:33:00,200
Speaker 3: but just to not know that they had there was

712
00:33:00,321 --> 00:33:02,921
Speaker 3: nothing in that car that they weren't there with them.

713
00:33:03,161 --> 00:33:06,401
Speaker 3: JJ's like seven years old, where where's where's he supposed

714
00:33:06,441 --> 00:33:08,881
Speaker 3: to be? Tyler's still sixteen? I don't care how independent

715
00:33:08,921 --> 00:33:11,961
Speaker 3: she is. So really yeah, that was that moment for real,

716
00:33:13,921 --> 00:33:15,001
Speaker 3: like I'm.

717
00:33:14,841 --> 00:33:16,601
Speaker 4: Gonna ask you so that if you can't answer it,

718
00:33:16,721 --> 00:33:20,841
Speaker 4: that's fine, I respect none, But how did they end

719
00:33:21,081 --> 00:33:21,681
Speaker 4: their lives?

720
00:33:22,641 --> 00:33:26,041
Speaker 3: I have no idea. It's that bad. I mean, Tylee

721
00:33:26,081 --> 00:33:30,960
Speaker 3: was so brutally found that they can't determine, they don't know.

722
00:33:31,841 --> 00:33:36,721
Speaker 3: That's how bad it was for her. Jj They asphyxiated

723
00:33:36,801 --> 00:33:40,561
Speaker 3: him with a trash bag and held him down and

724
00:33:40,601 --> 00:33:44,641
Speaker 3: then buried him like he was garbage. But Tyley, they

725
00:33:45,001 --> 00:33:48,721
Speaker 3: were so brutal with her. I mean, I've never heard

726
00:33:48,841 --> 00:33:52,361
Speaker 3: I still to this day, studying cases and looking at

727
00:33:52,401 --> 00:33:55,521
Speaker 3: other people's cases, I still haven't seen something very that

728
00:33:55,601 --> 00:33:58,201
Speaker 3: close to it. I just I don't even know. It's

729
00:33:58,441 --> 00:34:02,041
Speaker 3: it was so bad they couldn't identify how she was taken.

730
00:34:02,801 --> 00:34:04,921
Speaker 1: Wow, I'm so sorry to hit that.

731
00:34:05,241 --> 00:34:07,161
Speaker 3: Yeah.

732
00:34:07,201 --> 00:34:11,361
Speaker 4: So on the day that the bodies were found at

733
00:34:11,441 --> 00:34:15,161
Speaker 4: Chad's property, how long How long was it till you

734
00:34:15,241 --> 00:34:16,321
Speaker 4: found out about that?

735
00:34:17,001 --> 00:34:19,561
Speaker 3: Oh? Man, I don't know if you've ever had one

736
00:34:19,561 --> 00:34:23,041
Speaker 3: of these moments where you can remember, like every detail

737
00:34:23,281 --> 00:34:26,641
Speaker 3: of where you were. I was driving to go get

738
00:34:26,681 --> 00:34:29,681
Speaker 3: my license renewed. I got a call from the FBI

739
00:34:30,281 --> 00:34:32,281
Speaker 3: like this, and again, this is out of nowhere, because

740
00:34:32,441 --> 00:34:35,241
Speaker 3: you know, in a missing case, it's just gonna happen

741
00:34:35,281 --> 00:34:37,041
Speaker 3: like that. There's you're not gonna know, it's just gonna

742
00:34:37,041 --> 00:34:39,921
Speaker 3: be Hey, we found something, right, So I get a

743
00:34:39,921 --> 00:34:42,001
Speaker 3: call from the FBI. I had been talking to the

744
00:34:42,001 --> 00:34:43,881
Speaker 3: person from the FBI like texting and stuff, so I

745
00:34:43,921 --> 00:34:46,681
Speaker 3: knew who it was. And they call and say, hey,

746
00:34:47,281 --> 00:34:50,841
Speaker 3: Chad's been arrested, and when they found human remains on

747
00:34:50,841 --> 00:34:55,441
Speaker 3: his property. And when I tell you, I felt it

748
00:34:55,481 --> 00:34:56,681
Speaker 3: just now and I said it to you because I

749
00:34:57,041 --> 00:35:02,081
Speaker 3: felt this crash just crash out absolute like body like

750
00:35:02,121 --> 00:35:04,321
Speaker 3: it's it feels like your top of your head drops

751
00:35:04,761 --> 00:35:07,081
Speaker 3: like a like a ride, like you're falling out of

752
00:35:07,081 --> 00:35:09,761
Speaker 3: a helicopter or something. It just dropped. And then I

753
00:35:09,801 --> 00:35:12,441
Speaker 3: felt the wildest feeling I've ever felt. And it always

754
00:35:12,481 --> 00:35:15,521
Speaker 3: gets me emotional because at the same time I felt that,

755
00:35:16,041 --> 00:35:19,481
Speaker 3: I felt like someone hugged me at the same time.

756
00:35:20,001 --> 00:35:22,001
Speaker 3: I'll never forget that because I was in like I

757
00:35:22,041 --> 00:35:23,681
Speaker 3: don't even know if the word is shock. I was

758
00:35:23,761 --> 00:35:27,521
Speaker 3: just I was just everything went like like if you

759
00:35:27,561 --> 00:35:29,081
Speaker 3: would have had a bomb go off next to you

760
00:35:29,121 --> 00:35:30,961
Speaker 3: and your ears are ringing and you're out. That's what

761
00:35:31,001 --> 00:35:33,721
Speaker 3: it felt like, like there's just no reality anymore. And

762
00:35:33,801 --> 00:35:36,881
Speaker 3: I just felt this hug, like a tangible hug, and

763
00:35:36,921 --> 00:35:40,201
Speaker 3: I pulled in and I'm just asking the weirdest questions.

764
00:35:40,201 --> 00:35:44,761
Speaker 3: I'm like, you know, are the human bones? Are the kids' bones,

765
00:35:44,841 --> 00:35:46,201
Speaker 3: like I didn't even know what to say. I'm just

766
00:35:46,201 --> 00:35:48,401
Speaker 3: like trying to think, like, is this like a Native

767
00:35:48,441 --> 00:35:52,321
Speaker 3: American burial ground? Is this like a Pioneer burial ground.

768
00:35:52,321 --> 00:35:54,161
Speaker 3: I'm like going through all these scenarios on the phone.

769
00:35:54,641 --> 00:35:56,361
Speaker 3: I guess in that place of not being able to

770
00:35:56,401 --> 00:36:00,081
Speaker 3: accept what I'm hearing. They couldn't confirm at that point,

771
00:36:00,281 --> 00:36:02,721
Speaker 3: and so we're just like you just know, but you

772
00:36:02,841 --> 00:36:05,361
Speaker 3: just don't have that for yes, like here it is.

773
00:36:05,641 --> 00:36:08,321
Speaker 3: So I finally get a call later and they confirm it,

774
00:36:08,961 --> 00:36:11,481
Speaker 3: and then we drove up to Rexburg within like a

775
00:36:11,521 --> 00:36:14,881
Speaker 3: day or two. And when I tell you, every outlet

776
00:36:15,001 --> 00:36:17,001
Speaker 3: started calling me trying to get me to be on

777
00:36:17,041 --> 00:36:20,241
Speaker 3: the TV show that that moment. I mean, man, I

778
00:36:20,281 --> 00:36:22,361
Speaker 3: was so upset, like I'm just getting blown up by

779
00:36:22,361 --> 00:36:25,361
Speaker 3: all these people. I live in Arizona. So it's like

780
00:36:25,601 --> 00:36:29,481
Speaker 3: seventeen hours. So we drive up there. I walk into

781
00:36:29,881 --> 00:36:33,761
Speaker 3: the little Rexburg police station and they tell me the

782
00:36:33,801 --> 00:36:37,561
Speaker 3: condition that they found them in, and yeah, man, just

783
00:36:37,561 --> 00:36:40,841
Speaker 3: just absolutely changed, like life is this way, and then

784
00:36:40,881 --> 00:36:43,201
Speaker 3: life was different for the rest of time after that.

785
00:36:43,561 --> 00:36:45,881
Speaker 1: How far apart would they buried the way from each other?

786
00:36:47,241 --> 00:36:51,961
Speaker 3: Not that far? They're just both discarded like garbage. Yeah,

787
00:36:52,081 --> 00:36:54,801
Speaker 3: just absolutely no regard for human life.

788
00:36:55,281 --> 00:36:57,881
Speaker 1: Okay, so I'd like, I can pitch it.

789
00:36:58,641 --> 00:37:01,641
Speaker 4: I feel what's going through your mind at this point

790
00:37:02,921 --> 00:37:07,401
Speaker 4: losing them. But the anger you must have had for

791
00:37:07,801 --> 00:37:11,801
Speaker 4: Chad at this point must have been out of control.

792
00:37:12,321 --> 00:37:14,561
Speaker 3: Oh one hundred percent. You know that was the thing

793
00:37:14,561 --> 00:37:17,081
Speaker 3: that was weird, that was actually leveraged against me. In

794
00:37:17,121 --> 00:37:20,561
Speaker 3: an article by the Sun, they like, oh, Colby Ryan

795
00:37:20,681 --> 00:37:23,081
Speaker 3: so aggressive. I'm like, what are you talking about. I'm

796
00:37:23,081 --> 00:37:25,881
Speaker 3: being honest with you. I told Laurie on the phone.

797
00:37:26,001 --> 00:37:27,881
Speaker 3: You can hear me say it. I said, I'm gonna

798
00:37:27,921 --> 00:37:29,641
Speaker 3: I want to hit your husband in the face with

799
00:37:29,641 --> 00:37:31,601
Speaker 3: a shovel, Like that's the least of things that I

800
00:37:31,641 --> 00:37:34,041
Speaker 3: want to do to him. I was mad at I

801
00:37:34,081 --> 00:37:35,681
Speaker 3: was at the point with Alex where I would have

802
00:37:35,841 --> 00:37:38,321
Speaker 3: I would have brought Alex back to life and beaten

803
00:37:38,801 --> 00:37:40,481
Speaker 3: to death and then brought him back like I was.

804
00:37:40,521 --> 00:37:44,401
Speaker 3: I was so I can't explain what grief and rage

805
00:37:45,481 --> 00:37:48,681
Speaker 3: and loss and shot like all of that in one

806
00:37:48,761 --> 00:37:52,441
Speaker 3: pot at one time. There's no there's no explanation. But

807
00:37:52,881 --> 00:37:54,801
Speaker 3: I think it's hard when you don't understand what it's

808
00:37:54,801 --> 00:37:57,801
Speaker 3: like to have someone kill someone you love, it's just

809
00:37:57,841 --> 00:38:01,561
Speaker 3: not the same as anything else, like purposely murder. There's

810
00:38:01,601 --> 00:38:04,401
Speaker 3: a different level because they took their life, they took

811
00:38:04,441 --> 00:38:07,761
Speaker 3: it on purpose, and so I just the rage, the

812
00:38:07,841 --> 00:38:11,161
Speaker 3: rage towards all three of them was unreal and it's

813
00:38:11,201 --> 00:38:13,001
Speaker 3: something I had to work through. And then I finally

814
00:38:13,761 --> 00:38:16,201
Speaker 3: got to that place where I said, look, I have

815
00:38:16,241 --> 00:38:20,521
Speaker 3: to forgive them, because the forgiveness isn't for them, it's

816
00:38:20,561 --> 00:38:22,921
Speaker 3: for me. Yeah, And so I got to that point

817
00:38:22,921 --> 00:38:24,441
Speaker 3: where I'm like, I just have to let it go

818
00:38:24,561 --> 00:38:27,281
Speaker 3: in that regard, like I can't hold onto this for

819
00:38:27,321 --> 00:38:28,921
Speaker 3: the rest of my life because it was killing me,

820
00:38:29,001 --> 00:38:31,201
Speaker 3: Like it's all I had. I was just consumed by

821
00:38:31,801 --> 00:38:33,921
Speaker 3: this whole part of my life. That's all I had,

822
00:38:33,961 --> 00:38:36,281
Speaker 3: and that's all I was. And so I finally just

823
00:38:36,401 --> 00:38:40,281
Speaker 3: made a decision to forgive Laurie, forgive Chad, and forgive Alex.

824
00:38:40,641 --> 00:38:42,721
Speaker 3: And it's a process you have to keep going back

825
00:38:42,761 --> 00:38:45,480
Speaker 3: to and say, like, I'm really upset with them again,

826
00:38:45,681 --> 00:38:47,601
Speaker 3: but I have to keep remembering what I chose to do.

827
00:38:47,721 --> 00:38:50,481
Speaker 3: They can't control my life as long as I don't

828
00:38:50,561 --> 00:38:52,561
Speaker 3: let them. So that's kind of the place that I

829
00:38:52,561 --> 00:38:52,841
Speaker 3: got to.

830
00:38:52,961 --> 00:38:56,441
Speaker 4: But in your mind, who did you think was the

831
00:38:56,481 --> 00:38:58,721
Speaker 4: person who actually did the deed out of them three?

832
00:38:59,761 --> 00:39:03,641
Speaker 3: So the evidence shows that Alex was the one, and

833
00:39:04,001 --> 00:39:06,281
Speaker 3: I mean, it makes the most sense. He's the most psychotic.

834
00:39:06,561 --> 00:39:08,081
Speaker 3: He's the one that tried to kills Hammy. He's the

835
00:39:08,121 --> 00:39:10,081
Speaker 3: one that tried to kill Brandon. I know is Alex.

836
00:39:10,801 --> 00:39:15,241
Speaker 3: But it's because Chad's a pussy honestly, so he didn't

837
00:39:15,241 --> 00:39:17,201
Speaker 3: want to put his hands on anybody. So he was

838
00:39:17,241 --> 00:39:19,281
Speaker 3: the shot caller. He's the guy sitting on the throne

839
00:39:20,081 --> 00:39:22,121
Speaker 3: with the hand wave right, go do what I say

840
00:39:22,241 --> 00:39:25,081
Speaker 3: kind of thing, So Alex was gonna do it. I

841
00:39:25,241 --> 00:39:29,961
Speaker 3: personally believe that Laurie helped. I've seen some of the

842
00:39:30,001 --> 00:39:32,321
Speaker 3: stuff in court. It just makes me think that she

843
00:39:32,641 --> 00:39:36,801
Speaker 3: actually participated more than I wanted to believe. I thought

844
00:39:36,841 --> 00:39:38,281
Speaker 3: she might have just been the one that just said

845
00:39:38,361 --> 00:39:40,241
Speaker 3: leave the door open, let Alex come in and do it.

846
00:39:40,281 --> 00:39:42,681
Speaker 3: I think she helped. I think that's who she was.

847
00:39:42,961 --> 00:39:45,841
Speaker 3: It's just my own opinion, but that's what I think.

848
00:39:45,841 --> 00:39:49,721
Speaker 3: But so again, I know Alex is the main person.

849
00:39:50,001 --> 00:39:52,681
Speaker 3: But with any other stuff, like we know Chad was

850
00:39:52,721 --> 00:39:56,721
Speaker 3: a grave digger, so he dug the graves, even though

851
00:39:56,721 --> 00:39:59,440
Speaker 3: they were shallow and like, you know, things like that,

852
00:39:59,521 --> 00:40:01,961
Speaker 3: but who actually took their lives would have been alex

853
00:40:02,281 --> 00:40:05,001
Speaker 3: Primary And then I think LORI was help.

854
00:40:05,961 --> 00:40:07,801
Speaker 4: Did you ever get the chance to speak to your

855
00:40:07,841 --> 00:40:11,201
Speaker 4: mom about this before the court case happened, when it

856
00:40:11,241 --> 00:40:15,841
Speaker 4: happened that she was already arrested inside yes, correct, Yeah, yeah,

857
00:40:15,881 --> 00:40:18,441
Speaker 4: did you get a chance stance to go or you

858
00:40:18,521 --> 00:40:20,121
Speaker 4: weren't allowed to speak to her or you didn't want

859
00:40:20,161 --> 00:40:20,761
Speaker 4: to speak to her?

860
00:40:21,161 --> 00:40:24,521
Speaker 3: No, we know we talked. So during COVID we were talking.

861
00:40:24,561 --> 00:40:26,681
Speaker 3: I was kind of trying to get to her. In

862
00:40:26,721 --> 00:40:28,881
Speaker 3: my mind, I was like, I'm going to try to

863
00:40:28,921 --> 00:40:30,561
Speaker 3: get through to her. I'm the only person that can

864
00:40:30,561 --> 00:40:32,601
Speaker 3: get through to her right now. I'd ask her a lot,

865
00:40:32,761 --> 00:40:34,281
Speaker 3: be like, hey, where are the kids at what's going on?

866
00:40:34,321 --> 00:40:36,561
Speaker 3: When this is kid, She's just constantly you know, things

867
00:40:36,601 --> 00:40:38,121
Speaker 3: will change soon and it's all going to come to light,

868
00:40:38,161 --> 00:40:40,681
Speaker 3: blah blah blah. So she's reassuring and she seems normal

869
00:40:40,721 --> 00:40:43,481
Speaker 3: by the way. She seems very normal. Yeah, And I

870
00:40:43,521 --> 00:40:46,681
Speaker 3: remember a few days before or anything happened, she said

871
00:40:46,801 --> 00:40:49,401
Speaker 3: something about the story of Abraham and Isaac, and I said,

872
00:40:49,401 --> 00:40:51,041
Speaker 3: I'm done, I'm out. And if you don't know that

873
00:40:51,081 --> 00:40:54,241
Speaker 3: from the Bible, it's when Abraham almost kills Isaac right.

874
00:40:55,521 --> 00:40:57,841
Speaker 3: That to me was like why would you even say that?

875
00:40:58,281 --> 00:41:00,121
Speaker 3: So we stopped talking, and then that happened a few

876
00:41:00,201 --> 00:41:03,481
Speaker 3: days later, maybe like six days of the most. I

877
00:41:03,561 --> 00:41:05,041
Speaker 3: just stopped. I didn't call her anymore. I was like,

878
00:41:05,121 --> 00:41:06,801
Speaker 3: why would you ever say that in this scenario? Like

879
00:41:06,841 --> 00:41:09,441
Speaker 3: you know the kids are missing, you know that story, Like,

880
00:41:09,441 --> 00:41:11,841
Speaker 3: why would you ever say that? Turns out that's the case.

881
00:41:11,841 --> 00:41:15,761
Speaker 3: So I called her three different times after I found out,

882
00:41:16,241 --> 00:41:19,921
Speaker 3: and each one of those has been obviously recorded. First

883
00:41:19,921 --> 00:41:22,001
Speaker 3: one was very confrontational, the second one was kind of like,

884
00:41:22,161 --> 00:41:25,001
Speaker 3: let it go, tell her I forgive her. And then

885
00:41:25,001 --> 00:41:27,241
Speaker 3: the third one, I interviewed her and I wanted my

886
00:41:27,321 --> 00:41:28,961
Speaker 3: questions answered, and I felt like she owed me at

887
00:41:29,001 --> 00:41:31,721
Speaker 3: least some kind of answers. So I called her and

888
00:41:31,761 --> 00:41:34,681
Speaker 3: I said, look, I want to do an interview. We're

889
00:41:34,681 --> 00:41:37,041
Speaker 3: not going to sit here like on the phone privately,

890
00:41:37,081 --> 00:41:40,201
Speaker 3: because you'll say crazy stuff. We're going to have basically

891
00:41:40,241 --> 00:41:43,361
Speaker 3: a camera of accountability here and recording. I'm going to

892
00:41:43,441 --> 00:41:44,761
Speaker 3: let you say what you need to say, but I'm

893
00:41:44,761 --> 00:41:47,041
Speaker 3: going to have these questions. So I called her while

894
00:41:47,041 --> 00:41:49,321
Speaker 3: she's in jail in Arizona, and I gave her the

895
00:41:49,361 --> 00:41:51,761
Speaker 3: opportunity with my questions to tell me what happened to

896
00:41:51,761 --> 00:41:55,921
Speaker 3: my siblings. And she tells me that Tylee was home

897
00:41:55,961 --> 00:41:59,161
Speaker 3: babysitting JJ and got mad at him or trying to

898
00:41:59,201 --> 00:42:03,201
Speaker 3: keep him quiet, and suffocated him and killed him, and

899
00:42:03,281 --> 00:42:06,241
Speaker 3: then felt so bad that she did that she killed herself,

900
00:42:07,001 --> 00:42:11,121
Speaker 3: and that my mom came home, found them, freaked out,

901
00:42:11,241 --> 00:42:14,081
Speaker 3: left and asked somebody to take care of it. And

902
00:42:14,121 --> 00:42:17,481
Speaker 3: then she was heartbroken, crying on the floor, and I

903
00:42:17,521 --> 00:42:19,801
Speaker 3: couldn't believe what she's been through. So she she's the

904
00:42:19,841 --> 00:42:22,721
Speaker 3: most if you want to know what the definition of

905
00:42:22,761 --> 00:42:25,361
Speaker 3: a narcissist is, like an actual narcissist, not just like

906
00:42:25,361 --> 00:42:27,401
Speaker 3: what people say on social media, like a real one.

907
00:42:27,801 --> 00:42:30,721
Speaker 3: That is the definition. Everything in that entire storyline that

908
00:42:30,761 --> 00:42:34,321
Speaker 3: she built was about her being a victim and how

909
00:42:34,321 --> 00:42:37,361
Speaker 3: she did nothing wrong and how she's wrongfully convicted and

910
00:42:37,401 --> 00:42:39,441
Speaker 3: she never did anything to anybody ever, and she's just

911
00:42:39,481 --> 00:42:41,480
Speaker 3: a sweet, good person and she can't believe that she's

912
00:42:41,561 --> 00:42:44,881
Speaker 3: in this position. I did talk to her to no avail,

913
00:42:45,121 --> 00:42:48,641
Speaker 3: and that you know what that twenty four interview was

914
00:42:48,721 --> 00:42:51,201
Speaker 3: simply the final straw for me, and that was a

915
00:42:51,201 --> 00:42:53,521
Speaker 3: good thing because it broke any part of me that

916
00:42:53,601 --> 00:42:56,361
Speaker 3: was trying to hold on to the idea of who

917
00:42:56,401 --> 00:42:58,361
Speaker 3: I thought she was, because it proved to me, Hey,

918
00:42:58,441 --> 00:43:00,480
Speaker 3: this is what she's going to say to you. When

919
00:43:00,641 --> 00:43:02,041
Speaker 3: I told her, Hey, I don't even know if I'm gonna

920
00:43:02,041 --> 00:43:04,041
Speaker 3: publish this, but we're gonna make this an interview. You're

921
00:43:04,081 --> 00:43:05,481
Speaker 3: not going to ever get me one on one. I'm

922
00:43:05,481 --> 00:43:07,641
Speaker 3: gonna have recording. Not gonna happen.

923
00:43:08,161 --> 00:43:09,321
Speaker 1: Is that the last time he spoke to.

924
00:43:10,121 --> 00:43:12,841
Speaker 3: Yep, last time.

925
00:43:14,361 --> 00:43:14,641
Speaker 1: I read.

926
00:43:14,721 --> 00:43:16,361
Speaker 4: I read a few things on Chada. I don't know

927
00:43:16,361 --> 00:43:19,161
Speaker 4: if it's true what it said. Well, apparently he used

928
00:43:19,201 --> 00:43:23,001
Speaker 4: to claim claim that he could see the future.

929
00:43:23,721 --> 00:43:26,801
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's what this whole thing was. They were gathering

930
00:43:26,841 --> 00:43:30,521
Speaker 3: people to Rexburg, Idaho for this for the Second Coming,

931
00:43:30,561 --> 00:43:32,921
Speaker 3: to build a utopia, and he was the prophet, and

932
00:43:32,961 --> 00:43:35,721
Speaker 3: so everybody in that tiny little group they believed him.

933
00:43:36,241 --> 00:43:39,121
Speaker 3: They they trusted him in his abilities, and he was

934
00:43:39,161 --> 00:43:42,440
Speaker 3: telling them, hey, you've had twenty lives and you've been

935
00:43:42,481 --> 00:43:45,161
Speaker 3: married to this person, and you were killed in this

936
00:43:45,241 --> 00:43:48,241
Speaker 3: way and then you came back that was his pull.

937
00:43:48,601 --> 00:43:53,441
Speaker 3: He told people cool things about themselves because he knew

938
00:43:53,481 --> 00:43:57,321
Speaker 3: their self. I think his ability was manipulation. He saw

939
00:43:57,361 --> 00:44:00,761
Speaker 3: the people wanted to feel special, and if they told

940
00:44:00,841 --> 00:44:02,881
Speaker 3: him at all that they didn't, he knew exactly what

941
00:44:02,961 --> 00:44:05,761
Speaker 3: to say to those people. Hey, you were by the way,

942
00:44:05,801 --> 00:44:09,441
Speaker 3: No stop right there. You're a top one hundred Jesus person,

943
00:44:09,521 --> 00:44:11,601
Speaker 3: like you have no idea who you are. You have powers.

944
00:44:11,921 --> 00:44:15,161
Speaker 3: You can control the weather, you can see things in

945
00:44:15,201 --> 00:44:17,761
Speaker 3: the spirit realm, you can jump through portals. I mean,

946
00:44:18,361 --> 00:44:21,561
Speaker 3: he's off his rocker. But they believed it.

947
00:44:21,321 --> 00:44:23,201
Speaker 4: Is it true that they were trying to collect life

948
00:44:23,241 --> 00:44:26,401
Speaker 4: insurance and the Social Security.

949
00:44:25,921 --> 00:44:30,161
Speaker 3: Benefits they did. That's one of her charges. So she

950
00:44:30,281 --> 00:44:32,881
Speaker 3: was collecting that entire time till she was arrested on

951
00:44:33,241 --> 00:44:37,521
Speaker 3: both my brother and my sister. She took my sister's

952
00:44:37,601 --> 00:44:39,721
Speaker 3: money from her account that was coming in because her

953
00:44:39,801 --> 00:44:44,241
Speaker 3: dad is dead and so she's under eighteen and so

954
00:44:44,281 --> 00:44:48,561
Speaker 3: she's getting monthly payments. She rerouted that to her bank

955
00:44:48,561 --> 00:44:51,361
Speaker 3: account herself, so she was using that money. They tried

956
00:44:51,361 --> 00:44:55,161
Speaker 3: to kill Charles for his money. They got Tammy's money

957
00:44:55,201 --> 00:44:58,121
Speaker 3: because they killed her, and Chad did is the beneficiary

958
00:44:58,681 --> 00:45:01,641
Speaker 3: and then JJ was getting monthly payments as well because

959
00:45:01,681 --> 00:45:04,401
Speaker 3: his dad was killed, and so she was getting all

960
00:45:04,401 --> 00:45:06,921
Speaker 3: that money. One of her major charges that she has

961
00:45:07,521 --> 00:45:11,321
Speaker 3: is she stole so much money that in that entire time.

962
00:45:11,361 --> 00:45:13,361
Speaker 3: And then they tried to get everybody that was like

963
00:45:13,401 --> 00:45:15,841
Speaker 3: the main culprit here in this case is like people.

964
00:45:16,521 --> 00:45:19,361
Speaker 3: They wanted people's life insurance, a bunch of the husband's

965
00:45:19,801 --> 00:45:22,761
Speaker 3: life insurance or the spouse's life insurance. That was going

966
00:45:22,801 --> 00:45:24,521
Speaker 3: to be this big payout day and they were all

967
00:45:24,561 --> 00:45:29,121
Speaker 3: going to just like share in this wealth of murdered spouses.

968
00:45:29,361 --> 00:45:30,321
Speaker 3: That was what they were going for.

969
00:45:31,041 --> 00:45:32,881
Speaker 4: I know, I know you said that you've kind of

970
00:45:32,921 --> 00:45:39,281
Speaker 4: had to forgive, but surely, surely you haven't really one.

971
00:45:42,081 --> 00:45:43,881
Speaker 3: I have to go to the gym every day to

972
00:45:44,041 --> 00:45:46,881
Speaker 3: get get the hanger out. I do. I have to

973
00:45:46,961 --> 00:45:50,241
Speaker 3: ven it out. But here's what I will say forgiveness.

974
00:45:50,321 --> 00:45:52,241
Speaker 3: And and I think there's a lot of different people's

975
00:45:52,281 --> 00:45:56,641
Speaker 3: definition of forgiveness. What forgiveness is to me is they

976
00:45:56,681 --> 00:45:58,761
Speaker 3: can't control me. I can talk about it, I can

977
00:45:58,801 --> 00:46:02,001
Speaker 3: let the feelings out, but they can't keep their grip

978
00:46:02,121 --> 00:46:04,521
Speaker 3: over me. Does that make sense? Like that's how I

979
00:46:04,561 --> 00:46:07,761
Speaker 3: look at it. I choose to say I'm not gonna

980
00:46:07,841 --> 00:46:11,601
Speaker 3: let this control me. I'm not gonna sit here hating

981
00:46:11,641 --> 00:46:13,960
Speaker 3: you the way I did, thinking about you all the time,

982
00:46:14,081 --> 00:46:18,961
Speaker 3: hoping you feel the wrath of something right, Like I

983
00:46:18,961 --> 00:46:22,321
Speaker 3: don't need to show you or show up or whatever

984
00:46:22,321 --> 00:46:24,241
Speaker 3: the case is. Like that, that's what I mean by that.

985
00:46:24,321 --> 00:46:26,561
Speaker 3: So yeah, I mean it's a process. I tell people

986
00:46:26,561 --> 00:46:29,001
Speaker 3: all the time. It's really hard to just say yeah,

987
00:46:29,041 --> 00:46:31,681
Speaker 3: I forgive and then just be like that's it', that's

988
00:46:31,681 --> 00:46:33,561
Speaker 3: a one and done situation. I think it's a process

989
00:46:33,601 --> 00:46:37,041
Speaker 3: of choosing to forgive again and again and again, even

990
00:46:37,041 --> 00:46:39,601
Speaker 3: when you slip or you need to let some feelings out.

991
00:46:39,641 --> 00:46:41,801
Speaker 3: But at the end of the day, I used to

992
00:46:42,641 --> 00:46:45,041
Speaker 3: never be able to talk like this and then have

993
00:46:45,081 --> 00:46:48,921
Speaker 3: a day after. I've learned how to compartmentalize in a

994
00:46:48,961 --> 00:46:50,721
Speaker 3: healthy way in that way, So I think that's part

995
00:46:50,761 --> 00:46:53,161
Speaker 3: of that forgiveness is you're not gonna ruin my entire day.

996
00:46:53,641 --> 00:46:54,681
Speaker 1: How long did it take.

997
00:46:54,521 --> 00:46:56,881
Speaker 4: You to get over this in a way where you

998
00:46:56,921 --> 00:46:58,801
Speaker 4: could have a normal diet and.

999
00:47:00,321 --> 00:47:01,801
Speaker 1: Function years?

1000
00:47:02,481 --> 00:47:04,841
Speaker 3: I mean, if not just recently the last year.

1001
00:47:06,001 --> 00:47:07,841
Speaker 1: How much told did it take on you? Did it

1002
00:47:07,881 --> 00:47:08,641
Speaker 1: put you in a hole?

1003
00:47:09,121 --> 00:47:11,841
Speaker 3: Oh? I wrect me. It destroyed me forever. I mean,

1004
00:47:12,321 --> 00:47:15,481
Speaker 3: I look at my life as two completely separate parts,

1005
00:47:16,201 --> 00:47:19,441
Speaker 3: and it was that much of a change. And I

1006
00:47:19,601 --> 00:47:22,681
Speaker 3: was a completely different person even two years ago than

1007
00:47:22,681 --> 00:47:26,441
Speaker 3: I am today. When you go through something so drastic,

1008
00:47:26,601 --> 00:47:32,921
Speaker 3: so fast, so public, so intense, it has the ability

1009
00:47:32,961 --> 00:47:36,440
Speaker 3: it just destroys everything you ever thought. I had no hope,

1010
00:47:36,601 --> 00:47:39,841
Speaker 3: I had no anything. Bro I was completely at one

1011
00:47:39,841 --> 00:47:43,001
Speaker 3: point suicidal. And I've been I'd been there before, but

1012
00:47:43,561 --> 00:47:46,601
Speaker 3: I was done, dude, I had nothing left. I said, Look,

1013
00:47:46,641 --> 00:47:48,561
Speaker 3: I'm like, literally, I don't even have wheels on the

1014
00:47:48,561 --> 00:47:52,601
Speaker 3: car anymore. I am literally just sitting in this place.

1015
00:47:52,961 --> 00:47:54,961
Speaker 3: And I had like a metaphor where I thought, like

1016
00:47:55,041 --> 00:47:56,641
Speaker 3: I remember I was praying, and I just felt like

1017
00:47:56,681 --> 00:47:59,241
Speaker 3: I was sitting in a graveyard and everybody in front

1018
00:47:59,241 --> 00:48:01,281
Speaker 3: of me is gone, and I believe they're in heaven.

1019
00:48:01,361 --> 00:48:04,561
Speaker 3: So really, I'm just sitting here with their tombstones, and

1020
00:48:04,641 --> 00:48:07,161
Speaker 3: I can't lived my life. And yet I'm a dad, right,

1021
00:48:07,361 --> 00:48:09,441
Speaker 3: I need to figure out what's my purpose in this life.

1022
00:48:09,921 --> 00:48:13,321
Speaker 3: I'm not just Lori Valo's son. I'm my own person, right.

1023
00:48:13,361 --> 00:48:15,841
Speaker 3: But that's how I saw myself too, So I was

1024
00:48:15,921 --> 00:48:18,081
Speaker 3: just like that was it. I had nothing left to

1025
00:48:18,081 --> 00:48:20,041
Speaker 3: give anybody. I thought I can't do anything good for

1026
00:48:20,121 --> 00:48:24,321
Speaker 3: anybody until I started working in therapy, and I never

1027
00:48:24,401 --> 00:48:26,561
Speaker 3: wanted to go to therapy. I'll be a thousands, honest,

1028
00:48:26,601 --> 00:48:28,601
Speaker 3: I said, f therapy. I don't care about it. I'm

1029
00:48:28,641 --> 00:48:30,441
Speaker 3: not gonna sit there and tell somebody my feelings or

1030
00:48:31,001 --> 00:48:33,041
Speaker 3: this is embarrassing, it's hard to talk about. I don't

1031
00:48:33,041 --> 00:48:34,681
Speaker 3: want to get into all that. I want to relive it.

1032
00:48:34,881 --> 00:48:37,041
Speaker 3: That's where I was at until I worked through it.

1033
00:48:37,081 --> 00:48:40,521
Speaker 3: And really just the last two years specifically, I was

1034
00:48:40,561 --> 00:48:43,161
Speaker 3: just floating in the same spot. And then at some

1035
00:48:43,201 --> 00:48:45,401
Speaker 3: point I just got really good at ignoring it, but

1036
00:48:45,481 --> 00:48:47,601
Speaker 3: I was still carrying it with me. Right, It's like

1037
00:48:47,641 --> 00:48:50,721
Speaker 3: a backpack. It's not going anywhere, it's not getting any lighter.

1038
00:48:51,281 --> 00:48:53,561
Speaker 3: And so yeah, this last two years has just been

1039
00:48:53,601 --> 00:48:56,201
Speaker 3: a lot of like acceptance. I don't know how I

1040
00:48:56,241 --> 00:48:58,761
Speaker 3: got to this place, but on my channel I just started,

1041
00:48:59,681 --> 00:49:01,761
Speaker 3: I said, I'm just gonna watch the trials. I'm just

1042
00:49:01,801 --> 00:49:04,681
Speaker 3: gonna learn. I have all these questions because when you're

1043
00:49:04,721 --> 00:49:07,961
Speaker 3: when THEE is there, that's all you have. I'm grieving

1044
00:49:07,961 --> 00:49:11,440
Speaker 3: the people I lost and they're gone, and that's all

1045
00:49:11,481 --> 00:49:14,841
Speaker 3: that I can think of. But then over time you're like, well,

1046
00:49:15,881 --> 00:49:18,761
Speaker 3: you know, was this religious? Was this money? Was? Like?

1047
00:49:18,921 --> 00:49:21,801
Speaker 3: Then you just have these questions, and so I kind

1048
00:49:21,801 --> 00:49:22,961
Speaker 3: of just said, look, I'm just going to figure this

1049
00:49:22,961 --> 00:49:25,441
Speaker 3: stuff out for myself. So there's a part of this

1050
00:49:25,641 --> 00:49:29,241
Speaker 3: is just radical acceptance. There's no changing what happened. There's

1051
00:49:29,241 --> 00:49:31,921
Speaker 3: no what ifs, there's no I can I wish I

1052
00:49:31,921 --> 00:49:33,601
Speaker 3: could have saved my mom, or if I would have

1053
00:49:33,641 --> 00:49:36,281
Speaker 3: talked to her three years ago before this, if I

1054
00:49:36,321 --> 00:49:38,081
Speaker 3: would have just been more, if I would have paid

1055
00:49:38,081 --> 00:49:40,361
Speaker 3: attention more. I played that game for a long time

1056
00:49:40,361 --> 00:49:42,801
Speaker 3: and it just led nothing but shame, or what if

1057
00:49:42,801 --> 00:49:45,241
Speaker 3: I could have saved my siblings? You know, there's there's

1058
00:49:45,561 --> 00:49:48,481
Speaker 3: real survivor skilt. When everybody dies and you don't and

1059
00:49:48,561 --> 00:49:51,321
Speaker 3: every nud just dies is murdered and you are alive

1060
00:49:51,401 --> 00:49:54,440
Speaker 3: and your family left, there's the survivor skilt for sure,

1061
00:49:54,601 --> 00:49:57,321
Speaker 3: like why do I deserve to be here? So I

1062
00:49:57,361 --> 00:50:00,281
Speaker 3: had overcome all of that, and it was just the

1063
00:50:00,441 --> 00:50:04,361
Speaker 3: darkest place I've ever been in my life. Nothing to give,

1064
00:50:04,521 --> 00:50:10,001
Speaker 3: and you just have this tsunami of stuff coming at you,

1065
00:50:10,281 --> 00:50:14,841
Speaker 3: and I finally said, I'm going to do this on

1066
00:50:14,921 --> 00:50:17,921
Speaker 3: my own pace once I broke that final straw of

1067
00:50:17,961 --> 00:50:20,601
Speaker 3: hope for Lori and I hope that doesn't sound callous,

1068
00:50:20,641 --> 00:50:22,721
Speaker 3: but it's just true. Like I just I gave her

1069
00:50:22,721 --> 00:50:25,841
Speaker 3: an opportunity to look me in my eyes and tell

1070
00:50:25,881 --> 00:50:28,201
Speaker 3: me what happened. Just tell me with your words, like,

1071
00:50:28,281 --> 00:50:30,321
Speaker 3: forget everybody else in the world, it's just you and

1072
00:50:30,361 --> 00:50:32,361
Speaker 3: me right now. Tell me what happened. And that's what

1073
00:50:32,401 --> 00:50:35,121
Speaker 3: she pitched me, is that it's the people she murdered fault,

1074
00:50:35,121 --> 00:50:38,481
Speaker 3: which there's literal, factual evidence that Tyler was not around

1075
00:50:38,481 --> 00:50:42,321
Speaker 3: for weeks before JJ was killed. Like she thinks I'm stupid, right,

1076
00:50:42,441 --> 00:50:44,881
Speaker 3: or she thinks that she can sell me on this bowl.

1077
00:50:45,481 --> 00:50:47,921
Speaker 3: It just told me everything I needed to know. And

1078
00:50:48,001 --> 00:50:50,281
Speaker 3: after that moment, I just said, okay, like I can

1079
00:50:50,361 --> 00:50:53,121
Speaker 3: accept who she is. She's a monster. She's choosing to

1080
00:50:53,121 --> 00:50:55,961
Speaker 3: be this way. She's not so delusional that she can't

1081
00:50:56,521 --> 00:50:58,801
Speaker 3: think that this is wrong or right. She knows wrong

1082
00:50:58,841 --> 00:51:01,480
Speaker 3: and right. And then she did two more trials where

1083
00:51:01,521 --> 00:51:04,641
Speaker 3: she represented herself to do the same thing. She's just

1084
00:51:04,681 --> 00:51:08,321
Speaker 3: a damn I meager. She just causes damage and havoc

1085
00:51:08,961 --> 00:51:09,801
Speaker 3: what you.

1086
00:51:09,681 --> 00:51:11,561
Speaker 1: Think the right punishment should be for Yoma.

1087
00:51:12,361 --> 00:51:14,801
Speaker 3: I think she should have had the death penalty. Of

1088
00:51:14,961 --> 00:51:18,161
Speaker 3: just being honest with you. If it sounds callous, you

1089
00:51:18,201 --> 00:51:22,401
Speaker 3: need to understand that for her to not get it

1090
00:51:22,441 --> 00:51:25,281
Speaker 3: and for Chad to get it, she is more accountable

1091
00:51:25,321 --> 00:51:28,041
Speaker 3: in my opinion than Chad is. Yes, Chad called the shots.

1092
00:51:28,121 --> 00:51:30,121
Speaker 3: Chad in a sense was like, hey, they yes, they're

1093
00:51:30,161 --> 00:51:33,441
Speaker 3: a zombie, but you're the parent, you're the you're the wife,

1094
00:51:33,961 --> 00:51:36,401
Speaker 3: you took the most lives in your own things. So yes,

1095
00:51:36,441 --> 00:51:38,921
Speaker 3: I think she should have had the death penalty because

1096
00:51:39,121 --> 00:51:40,761
Speaker 3: it also is a point to say, hey, well, if

1097
00:51:40,761 --> 00:51:43,121
Speaker 3: you don't want the death penalty, don't do this right

1098
00:51:43,281 --> 00:51:45,401
Speaker 3: what I've told people, and this might sound bad, but

1099
00:51:45,601 --> 00:51:48,440
Speaker 3: I've just been honest, Like justice is a great thing.

1100
00:51:48,481 --> 00:51:51,121
Speaker 3: You want to see it, but it doesn't change the outcome.

1101
00:51:51,681 --> 00:51:54,521
Speaker 3: It doesn't change what happened, and so you just kind

1102
00:51:54,521 --> 00:51:56,561
Speaker 3: of have to take it with what it is. The

1103
00:51:56,601 --> 00:51:59,801
Speaker 3: only good thing is that she's not able to hurt

1104
00:51:59,841 --> 00:52:02,721
Speaker 3: anybody else. She's not she doesn't have the ability to

1105
00:52:02,721 --> 00:52:05,041
Speaker 3: do that. But that's that's the only real win there.

1106
00:52:05,601 --> 00:52:07,281
Speaker 1: Has she ever reached tried to reach out to you

1107
00:52:07,321 --> 00:52:09,441
Speaker 1: ever since, or you used to want to accept it.

1108
00:52:10,001 --> 00:52:13,761
Speaker 3: No, I'm sure she has so she there's like an

1109
00:52:13,801 --> 00:52:16,960
Speaker 3: app that you can go on, and that's how we talked. Yeah,

1110
00:52:17,081 --> 00:52:21,681
Speaker 3: I haven't even had that app in years, literal years. Yeah, man,

1111
00:52:21,721 --> 00:52:24,441
Speaker 3: I just I just have no reason to talk to her.

1112
00:52:24,481 --> 00:52:28,361
Speaker 3: She she wrote a long letter and she just when

1113
00:52:28,401 --> 00:52:31,121
Speaker 3: she was here in Arizona, I had a a tia

1114
00:52:31,241 --> 00:52:34,961
Speaker 3: stroke right at her the end of her trial, before

1115
00:52:35,001 --> 00:52:38,961
Speaker 3: the sentencing, and so she like had her guy call

1116
00:52:39,081 --> 00:52:40,761
Speaker 3: me in the hospital and try to connect me and her.

1117
00:52:40,801 --> 00:52:42,281
Speaker 3: I'm like, I'm not talking to her. I don't even

1118
00:52:42,361 --> 00:52:44,000
Speaker 3: know you. You can't just put me on the phone

1119
00:52:44,041 --> 00:52:46,801
Speaker 3: with her. She looks at it like I'm still her

1120
00:52:46,961 --> 00:52:50,121
Speaker 3: little baby or the one she loves the most. She

1121
00:52:50,121 --> 00:52:52,001
Speaker 3: said in the interview that losing me was worse than

1122
00:52:52,081 --> 00:52:54,801
Speaker 3: losing the kids, and that just told me everything, like

1123
00:52:55,401 --> 00:52:57,601
Speaker 3: and but also hurts, right because like the inner child

1124
00:52:57,601 --> 00:52:59,881
Speaker 3: and you was like broken over that. You you know,

1125
00:52:59,921 --> 00:53:02,041
Speaker 3: I just accepted that fact too, Like I lost my

1126
00:53:02,121 --> 00:53:04,361
Speaker 3: mom and I was really close to her as a kid,

1127
00:53:04,761 --> 00:53:06,440
Speaker 3: and you know I made her up in my head

1128
00:53:06,481 --> 00:53:10,201
Speaker 3: of who I thought she was. I lost my mom forever,

1129
00:53:10,241 --> 00:53:11,681
Speaker 3: I don't have a mom anymore either.

1130
00:53:12,721 --> 00:53:16,961
Speaker 4: So she's never been accountable for anything that has happened.

1131
00:53:17,241 --> 00:53:20,841
Speaker 3: Never, no, no, if you I can't even tell you

1132
00:53:20,881 --> 00:53:23,601
Speaker 3: if if you go online, there's about So when she

1133
00:53:23,641 --> 00:53:25,561
Speaker 3: was in Arizona, she had a lot more freedom when

1134
00:53:25,561 --> 00:53:28,361
Speaker 3: it comes to press. When she's in Idaho, she's not

1135
00:53:28,401 --> 00:53:30,841
Speaker 3: allowed to like have people physically show up. So she

1136
00:53:30,881 --> 00:53:34,161
Speaker 3: did like dateline. She did like three or four interviews

1137
00:53:34,241 --> 00:53:37,641
Speaker 3: with one woman named Brianna Whitney, and then she did

1138
00:53:37,641 --> 00:53:41,000
Speaker 3: one with Nate Eaton. She's accepting all these interviews because

1139
00:53:41,041 --> 00:53:43,201
Speaker 3: it's her chance to shine and tell you a bunch

1140
00:53:43,241 --> 00:53:47,241
Speaker 3: of bullshit. That's her best opportunity. So in those interviews, though,

1141
00:53:47,281 --> 00:53:49,801
Speaker 3: she just doubled down and doubled down on everything she's

1142
00:53:49,801 --> 00:53:53,561
Speaker 3: been saying, how she was wrongfully convicted in Idaho and

1143
00:53:54,001 --> 00:53:57,921
Speaker 3: blames everybody else and how everyone's evil. But then you

1144
00:53:57,921 --> 00:54:00,561
Speaker 3: know she's doing God's work in jail and she's there

1145
00:54:00,561 --> 00:54:03,041
Speaker 3: for the women of the jail. And then she starts

1146
00:54:03,041 --> 00:54:06,481
Speaker 3: talking about how there's no dental plan in the jail

1147
00:54:06,561 --> 00:54:08,081
Speaker 3: and if you have a rotten tooth to pull it

1148
00:54:08,081 --> 00:54:09,961
Speaker 3: out with pliers. I was like, what that I mean

1149
00:54:10,441 --> 00:54:13,601
Speaker 3: that's just who she is in general. But my point,

1150
00:54:13,681 --> 00:54:16,161
Speaker 3: the reason I bring that up is because she she

1151
00:54:16,241 --> 00:54:19,401
Speaker 3: can't answer a question straight on, and she didn't just

1152
00:54:19,401 --> 00:54:22,361
Speaker 3: double down. She as far down as you can dig

1153
00:54:22,401 --> 00:54:24,561
Speaker 3: your feet into the ground to say this is how

1154
00:54:24,561 --> 00:54:27,201
Speaker 3: it was. She did, and then she represented herself in

1155
00:54:27,241 --> 00:54:30,361
Speaker 3: back to back trials as her own lawyer where she

1156
00:54:30,401 --> 00:54:32,801
Speaker 3: could say as much stuff as she wanted, and she

1157
00:54:32,881 --> 00:54:35,961
Speaker 3: did it in the in her trial for her killing Charles,

1158
00:54:36,161 --> 00:54:38,001
Speaker 3: and then she did it against Brandon. And she just

1159
00:54:38,521 --> 00:54:40,601
Speaker 3: goes up there and pretends to be a lawyer and

1160
00:54:40,641 --> 00:54:43,641
Speaker 3: says a bunch of stuff and gets personal and fought

1161
00:54:43,641 --> 00:54:46,921
Speaker 3: with the judge. I mean, it was a literal shit show.

1162
00:54:47,161 --> 00:54:50,681
Speaker 1: So what's your view on life now after all this?

1163
00:54:54,241 --> 00:54:57,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, man, I mean, you're never gonna look at life

1164
00:54:57,041 --> 00:55:01,081
Speaker 3: the same. I've never felt safe and it didn't even

1165
00:55:01,161 --> 00:55:04,481
Speaker 3: happened to me physically, but I've never felt safe again.

1166
00:55:04,641 --> 00:55:07,321
Speaker 3: And just head on a swivel everywhere I go. Everything

1167
00:55:07,361 --> 00:55:10,841
Speaker 3: I do, even at night, I like triple on everything,

1168
00:55:11,481 --> 00:55:16,681
Speaker 3: because when you hear that your own mom will kill

1169
00:55:16,721 --> 00:55:19,921
Speaker 3: her own children in the middle of the night, they're

1170
00:55:19,961 --> 00:55:22,841
Speaker 3: just it just takes away the sense of all safety.

1171
00:55:23,681 --> 00:55:26,281
Speaker 3: I don't think you can, honest to God, do anything

1172
00:55:26,321 --> 00:55:29,081
Speaker 3: worse than that. There's just no lower than that your

1173
00:55:29,121 --> 00:55:31,361
Speaker 3: own children. I mean, there's there's people who are serio

1174
00:55:31,441 --> 00:55:35,401
Speaker 3: killers wouldn't touch their own child, right. I think that

1175
00:55:35,521 --> 00:55:37,481
Speaker 3: once I got to that point where I realized how

1176
00:55:37,881 --> 00:55:40,281
Speaker 3: the world could be and look and how evil it is,

1177
00:55:40,321 --> 00:55:44,001
Speaker 3: it just changed my perspective. But I'm still a hopeful person.

1178
00:55:44,041 --> 00:55:47,161
Speaker 3: It's not like I'm negative. I'm just thinking my eyes

1179
00:55:47,201 --> 00:55:50,441
Speaker 3: are open to like I'm going to be extra cautious.

1180
00:55:50,601 --> 00:55:52,721
Speaker 3: I'm not gonna be ignorant anymore, and I'm not going

1181
00:55:52,801 --> 00:55:55,121
Speaker 3: to think that the worst can't happen. So, you know,

1182
00:55:55,241 --> 00:55:57,041
Speaker 3: it's it's a lot to deal with. It is because

1183
00:55:57,041 --> 00:55:59,521
Speaker 3: you have to. You have to shove off a lot

1184
00:55:59,521 --> 00:56:02,481
Speaker 3: of the anxiety and stuff to function on a daily basis.

1185
00:56:02,921 --> 00:56:04,921
Speaker 1: So what have you done now? It says to keep

1186
00:56:04,921 --> 00:56:06,161
Speaker 1: the legacy is going and.

1187
00:56:07,921 --> 00:56:11,161
Speaker 4: If you started any funds for them or any you

1188
00:56:11,201 --> 00:56:12,641
Speaker 4: know things that they used to do so we can

1189
00:56:12,721 --> 00:56:16,121
Speaker 4: you can keep on remembering the name and all like that,

1190
00:56:16,241 --> 00:56:18,841
Speaker 4: or you haven't thought about doing anything like that.

1191
00:56:19,161 --> 00:56:21,601
Speaker 3: No I have. So the whole point was to wait

1192
00:56:21,641 --> 00:56:23,841
Speaker 3: till the trials were over, so they just ended in

1193
00:56:23,881 --> 00:56:27,481
Speaker 3: this last summer basically like at the end of July.

1194
00:56:28,241 --> 00:56:31,361
Speaker 3: So I'm doing a memorial for them, and that's going

1195
00:56:31,361 --> 00:56:33,281
Speaker 3: to happen, and that's fine because I wanted it to be.

1196
00:56:33,641 --> 00:56:36,081
Speaker 3: There's no trials coming up, there's no anything. It's just

1197
00:56:36,161 --> 00:56:38,841
Speaker 3: about them, So they're doing that. Then following that, I

1198
00:56:38,921 --> 00:56:40,601
Speaker 3: have some projects that I'm going to do that are

1199
00:56:40,601 --> 00:56:44,441
Speaker 3: going to focus more on my the real side of things,

1200
00:56:44,441 --> 00:56:47,161
Speaker 3: not like what everybody else has seen in media, because

1201
00:56:47,241 --> 00:56:53,001
Speaker 3: unfortunately it's very sensationalized and people just don't know, you know,

1202
00:56:53,081 --> 00:56:54,841
Speaker 3: like what it was really like, because it's just like

1203
00:56:55,641 --> 00:56:59,361
Speaker 3: it's so spun to look worse than it truly was

1204
00:56:59,401 --> 00:57:02,561
Speaker 3: sometimes and you know, when we are growing up. And

1205
00:57:02,601 --> 00:57:05,960
Speaker 3: then for me after that, that's when I'm ready to start.

1206
00:57:05,961 --> 00:57:07,881
Speaker 3: I've been talked to a lot of people about different

1207
00:57:07,921 --> 00:57:11,801
Speaker 3: things like foundations, things like that. So that's the process.

1208
00:57:11,801 --> 00:57:13,721
Speaker 3: But I'm like, I have to do it has to

1209
00:57:13,761 --> 00:57:16,401
Speaker 3: be in order to it. But I think a part

1210
00:57:16,441 --> 00:57:18,681
Speaker 3: of me is a little hesitant with their memorials because

1211
00:57:18,681 --> 00:57:20,881
Speaker 3: it just makes it so real once again, and I

1212
00:57:20,961 --> 00:57:22,721
Speaker 3: know it is, I know it is, but it's like

1213
00:57:22,801 --> 00:57:25,841
Speaker 3: that is like it's hard. It's hard to really get

1214
00:57:25,881 --> 00:57:27,961
Speaker 3: there and be like, yeah, this is this is really them,

1215
00:57:28,041 --> 00:57:29,841
Speaker 3: Like I have their ashes and like so to.

1216
00:57:29,961 --> 00:57:32,321
Speaker 1: Know, well so you actually have their ashes?

1217
00:57:32,441 --> 00:57:35,361
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, yeah cool. And it just like when you

1218
00:57:35,401 --> 00:57:38,761
Speaker 3: get a when you get a box and it's just

1219
00:57:38,801 --> 00:57:40,801
Speaker 3: a black box and it says your siblings name on it,

1220
00:57:40,841 --> 00:57:44,001
Speaker 3: and you know that that's their their like the rest

1221
00:57:44,041 --> 00:57:46,201
Speaker 3: of them. I don't know how to explain that. Man,

1222
00:57:46,241 --> 00:57:51,561
Speaker 3: it just it doesn't feel real. It just doesn't. So

1223
00:57:52,201 --> 00:57:53,961
Speaker 3: what does the future hold for you? Then?

1224
00:57:54,201 --> 00:57:56,161
Speaker 1: Kobe? Like, what what you know?

1225
00:57:56,321 --> 00:57:57,841
Speaker 4: I know you're going to do all that and as

1226
00:57:57,881 --> 00:58:00,401
Speaker 4: you said, to keep everything going, but what about you

1227
00:58:00,521 --> 00:58:01,081
Speaker 4: in general?

1228
00:58:02,441 --> 00:58:03,001
Speaker 1: What about you?

1229
00:58:04,361 --> 00:58:08,561
Speaker 3: I have spent the last few months really trying to

1230
00:58:10,441 --> 00:58:13,001
Speaker 3: be as open and raw as I can as a person,

1231
00:58:13,601 --> 00:58:16,241
Speaker 3: just so people know they're not alone, because when I

1232
00:58:16,321 --> 00:58:19,561
Speaker 3: was in that time, I was alone, Like I couldn't

1233
00:58:19,641 --> 00:58:23,921
Speaker 3: google anything to hear someone else relate to me, so

1234
00:58:23,961 --> 00:58:26,361
Speaker 3: I felt like the most lonely person. So I've spent

1235
00:58:26,441 --> 00:58:29,001
Speaker 3: a lot of my time with YouTube, Like my passion

1236
00:58:29,321 --> 00:58:34,441
Speaker 3: is stuff like this conversations where you can really allow

1237
00:58:34,521 --> 00:58:36,481
Speaker 3: people to hear that they're not alone in this world

1238
00:58:36,641 --> 00:58:39,001
Speaker 3: that even if you haven't experienced the same exact thing,

1239
00:58:39,881 --> 00:58:42,681
Speaker 3: you know, you can relate and understand about hardships and

1240
00:58:42,841 --> 00:58:45,081
Speaker 3: what it looks like to love yourself. And so I

1241
00:58:45,161 --> 00:58:48,001
Speaker 3: spent the last little bit talking about growing up and

1242
00:58:48,041 --> 00:58:51,561
Speaker 3: having trauma from the earliest point I can remember to

1243
00:58:51,721 --> 00:58:55,281
Speaker 3: now and trying to still live your life because you know,

1244
00:58:55,361 --> 00:58:59,641
Speaker 3: unfortunately we see people get to that last second and

1245
00:58:59,721 --> 00:59:02,001
Speaker 3: get to that last moment where they can't handle anymore

1246
00:59:02,321 --> 00:59:05,241
Speaker 3: and they're gone, and that's I've been there. So I've

1247
00:59:05,241 --> 00:59:07,361
Speaker 3: spent a lot of my time just focusing on mental

1248
00:59:07,361 --> 00:59:10,281
Speaker 3: health for me and then trying to regurgitate anything I've

1249
00:59:10,361 --> 00:59:13,521
Speaker 3: learned to help other people. That has literally been my

1250
00:59:13,601 --> 00:59:16,921
Speaker 3: heart from when I before this ever happened, is to

1251
00:59:16,921 --> 00:59:20,961
Speaker 3: help people through anything I possibly can. And then, you know,

1252
00:59:20,961 --> 00:59:22,961
Speaker 3: I want to create a future where people can say

1253
00:59:24,201 --> 00:59:27,041
Speaker 3: I've been through the unimaginable, but I'm going to still

1254
00:59:27,081 --> 00:59:29,641
Speaker 3: find a way to be here on this earth, and

1255
00:59:29,681 --> 00:59:33,441
Speaker 3: I'm going to find a purpose and I'm going to

1256
00:59:33,481 --> 00:59:35,481
Speaker 3: be and do something. And it's not that you have

1257
00:59:35,521 --> 00:59:38,001
Speaker 3: to prove it to the world or be a billionaire

1258
00:59:38,081 --> 00:59:40,241
Speaker 3: or anything. It's just I'm going to I'm going to

1259
00:59:40,281 --> 00:59:42,201
Speaker 3: make it through this, and I'm gonna I'm gonna come

1260
00:59:42,241 --> 00:59:44,241
Speaker 3: out on the other side of this, whatever that looks like.

1261
00:59:44,641 --> 00:59:46,441
Speaker 3: And so that's that's the future that I see for

1262
00:59:46,521 --> 00:59:50,841
Speaker 3: myself is trying to give people that hope. Any regrets,

1263
00:59:52,321 --> 00:59:56,481
Speaker 3: oh yeah, so many, so many. Not talking to Charles,

1264
00:59:57,401 --> 00:59:59,521
Speaker 3: you know, that whole time, not listening to what he

1265
00:59:59,641 --> 01:00:03,681
Speaker 3: was trying to say. I mean a million regrets, you know.

1266
01:00:03,801 --> 01:00:06,401
Speaker 3: But I also do see like I don't play the

1267
01:00:06,441 --> 01:00:09,041
Speaker 3: what if game anymore, and that that's what killed me.

1268
01:00:09,601 --> 01:00:11,561
Speaker 3: I just what if I would have talked to Lourie

1269
01:00:11,601 --> 01:00:14,281
Speaker 3: and what if I would have, you know, just paid

1270
01:00:14,281 --> 01:00:18,081
Speaker 3: attention more, or you know, a million things. What if

1271
01:00:18,121 --> 01:00:21,321
Speaker 3: I would have just had Tily stay with my house? Right,

1272
01:00:21,401 --> 01:00:24,001
Speaker 3: what if I would have anything? I could think of

1273
01:00:24,041 --> 01:00:28,921
Speaker 3: a million moments where it could have changed. But that's

1274
01:00:29,121 --> 01:00:35,481
Speaker 3: that's an endless loop with no answers. So what happened happened,

1275
01:00:35,841 --> 01:00:38,161
Speaker 3: and it's just like, well, Okay, what do I do

1276
01:00:38,281 --> 01:00:40,961
Speaker 3: with it today? Not tomorrow? How do I look? How

1277
01:00:41,001 --> 01:00:42,881
Speaker 3: do I look ten yures in the future, Like how

1278
01:00:42,881 --> 01:00:47,041
Speaker 3: do I cope with this today? And those slow progressive

1279
01:00:47,081 --> 01:00:50,361
Speaker 3: steps hopefully will get me to that next place before

1280
01:00:50,401 --> 01:00:50,641
Speaker 3: we go.

1281
01:00:51,281 --> 01:00:55,001
Speaker 4: Are you how how grateful are you to know that

1282
01:00:55,241 --> 01:00:58,961
Speaker 4: now with your family, that you have closure that you

1283
01:00:59,041 --> 01:01:01,401
Speaker 4: found you know that you found it, you know after

1284
01:01:01,521 --> 01:01:04,921
Speaker 4: nine months and all like that because of closure that

1285
01:01:05,161 --> 01:01:09,681
Speaker 4: it How close have you become now to to to

1286
01:01:09,801 --> 01:01:10,361
Speaker 4: your to.

1287
01:01:10,721 --> 01:01:12,561
Speaker 1: Your Is it a daughter that you've got now? A daughter?

1288
01:01:13,321 --> 01:01:15,081
Speaker 3: Yeah, I've got two daughters and a son. Yeah.

1289
01:01:15,241 --> 01:01:18,161
Speaker 4: Have you become closer to them now because of the

1290
01:01:18,201 --> 01:01:20,881
Speaker 4: situation that you've gone through? And you and you and

1291
01:01:20,921 --> 01:01:24,281
Speaker 4: you you kind of like it's priceless that what you

1292
01:01:24,281 --> 01:01:25,441
Speaker 4: see that you have in front of you.

1293
01:01:26,201 --> 01:01:30,801
Speaker 3: Yeah, it gives you different perspective, right, And I can

1294
01:01:30,841 --> 01:01:32,761
Speaker 3: be like any normal person where I get caught up

1295
01:01:32,841 --> 01:01:37,041
Speaker 3: in life, like or irritated at the you know, the chips,

1296
01:01:37,081 --> 01:01:40,841
Speaker 3: the pickle chips, crumbs are spread from the front and

1297
01:01:40,921 --> 01:01:44,361
Speaker 3: they've made you know, soap sand mixtures in the sink.

1298
01:01:44,921 --> 01:01:47,361
Speaker 3: But no, I mean that that's where I try to

1299
01:01:47,441 --> 01:01:50,521
Speaker 3: zoom out, like I really do. I've learned one coping

1300
01:01:50,601 --> 01:01:53,161
Speaker 3: slash skill that has come out of this is the

1301
01:01:53,201 --> 01:01:57,201
Speaker 3: ability to literally stop myself in the middle of what

1302
01:01:57,241 --> 01:01:59,521
Speaker 3: I'm going through and just like be able to try

1303
01:01:59,561 --> 01:02:01,881
Speaker 3: to find some clarity and say they're not going to

1304
01:02:01,961 --> 01:02:04,801
Speaker 3: be little forever. These are my babies, like they're always

1305
01:02:04,801 --> 01:02:07,241
Speaker 3: going to have my heart, and I want to give

1306
01:02:07,281 --> 01:02:10,761
Speaker 3: them the best version of myself because this is their childhood.

1307
01:02:10,841 --> 01:02:13,041
Speaker 3: This is this is all they get, and this is

1308
01:02:13,041 --> 01:02:14,921
Speaker 3: all they're gonna know. They don't know about this other

1309
01:02:15,001 --> 01:02:18,601
Speaker 3: stuff at a high level, right. They know they have

1310
01:02:18,641 --> 01:02:21,961
Speaker 3: another grandma, They know about Tyler and JJ and Charles,

1311
01:02:22,521 --> 01:02:25,721
Speaker 3: but you know it's my daughter's just turned seven, my

1312
01:02:25,801 --> 01:02:27,881
Speaker 3: other daughter's four, and my other and my son's one.

1313
01:02:28,281 --> 01:02:32,081
Speaker 3: So there's you don't tell them this way, but it's

1314
01:02:32,081 --> 01:02:34,041
Speaker 3: like at some point they're gonna this is their family

1315
01:02:34,121 --> 01:02:37,281
Speaker 3: legacy in a sense. And so my my goal is

1316
01:02:37,321 --> 01:02:40,561
Speaker 3: to try to be the healthiest version of myself for them.

1317
01:02:40,961 --> 01:02:44,161
Speaker 3: And it's given me a perspective on I really want

1318
01:02:44,201 --> 01:02:46,641
Speaker 3: to do everything opposite of how I grew up because

1319
01:02:46,641 --> 01:02:49,561
Speaker 3: I wasn't taught how to function in life, right, I

1320
01:02:49,601 --> 01:02:52,561
Speaker 3: wasn't taught how to like do the basic things, And

1321
01:02:52,601 --> 01:02:54,521
Speaker 3: so that that makes me want to say, hey, I'm

1322
01:02:54,561 --> 01:02:56,041
Speaker 3: gonna teach you how to do this, so you just

1323
01:02:56,081 --> 01:02:58,921
Speaker 3: don't feel so caught off guard the way I was,

1324
01:02:58,961 --> 01:03:01,121
Speaker 3: Like I didn't have any way to deal with life,

1325
01:03:01,521 --> 01:03:04,001
Speaker 3: and then I got you know, more than any any

1326
01:03:04,041 --> 01:03:06,401
Speaker 3: way I could possibly hand or anything came all at

1327
01:03:06,401 --> 01:03:08,361
Speaker 3: one time, so it was a flood. So I'd like

1328
01:03:08,401 --> 01:03:10,441
Speaker 3: to be able to teach them how to do, you know,

1329
01:03:10,481 --> 01:03:14,041
Speaker 3: emotional regulation and be able to know how to do

1330
01:03:14,281 --> 01:03:16,801
Speaker 3: the simplest of things. So that's what my mentality has

1331
01:03:16,841 --> 01:03:18,881
Speaker 3: tried to be, is just put all my energy into being,

1332
01:03:19,561 --> 01:03:21,681
Speaker 3: you know, a parent for them, a real parent.

1333
01:03:22,321 --> 01:03:24,081
Speaker 1: Well, I want to say, Koby, thank you so much

1334
01:03:24,121 --> 01:03:26,681
Speaker 1: for sharing that story.

1335
01:03:27,201 --> 01:03:29,561
Speaker 4: I'm so glad that you did, except to come on

1336
01:03:29,601 --> 01:03:33,241
Speaker 4: my podcast and share this because, as I said, it

1337
01:03:33,361 --> 01:03:37,001
Speaker 4: really took me back when I heard about it, and

1338
01:03:37,561 --> 01:03:40,041
Speaker 4: I really wanted to share this on my on my

1339
01:03:40,121 --> 01:03:42,521
Speaker 4: podcast so I could get out there to people on

1340
01:03:42,561 --> 01:03:44,281
Speaker 4: this side of the world if they haven't heard it.

1341
01:03:44,681 --> 01:03:47,881
Speaker 4: So I put my hand out to you, and you know,

1342
01:03:48,041 --> 01:03:50,681
Speaker 4: I say, you know, I hope everything goes well for

1343
01:03:50,721 --> 01:03:51,281
Speaker 4: you in the future.

1344
01:03:52,361 --> 01:03:54,161
Speaker 3: Yeah, Neil, thank you so much for having me man

1345
01:03:54,201 --> 01:04:14,121
Speaker 3: and just allowing the good conversation. I really do appreciate it.