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Speaker 1: I want to talk about IVF because it has been

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Speaker 1: in the headlines recently for the wrong reasons. An IVF

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Speaker 1: is an amazing technology. It is something that allows people

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Speaker 1: to have families, often when they don't think that they

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Speaker 1: were able to previously. But there's been some really shocking headlines.

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Speaker 1: It was only about two months ago that we read

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Speaker 1: that terrible story about a woman who had given birth

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Speaker 1: to someone else's baby because she had the wrong embryo implanted.

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Speaker 1: And there was another story that came out yesterday about

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Speaker 1: a same sex couple who had they wanted to have

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Speaker 1: the partner's embryo transferred and she had her own. So

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Speaker 1: again it's been the wrong embryo that they were after.

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Speaker 1: And fertility is hard enough as it is. I can't

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Speaker 1: imagine the stress that this is putting, not just obviously

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Speaker 1: these families, but other families under as well, in what

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Speaker 1: is already a stressful time.

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Speaker 2: Well, I hadn't told you guys this yet, but we

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Speaker 2: actually had Archie through IVF, through this particular company, through

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Speaker 2: on ash Yep so Yester afternoon, when Lou was reading

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Speaker 2: the story, you know, and like Archie's three and look,

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Speaker 2: he's a dead set ringer. For his brother Felix, you know,

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Speaker 2: and so we're pretty sure we're good there, but as

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Speaker 2: someone who's gone through it, like it was such a

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Speaker 2: such a personal experience, and whatever company you go through

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Speaker 2: for something like that, is that trust that you have

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Speaker 2: And just yes, there was just that weird just that

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Speaker 2: icky feeling in your guts going.

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Speaker 3: I mean, this stuff's just not good enough.

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Speaker 2: No, it isn't it's not good enough at all, and

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Speaker 2: you pay so much for it too, like it is

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Speaker 2: not a cheap exercise.

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Speaker 1: Now I don't understand enough about it. But someone who

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Speaker 1: is a fertility specialist is doctor Lynn Burmeister from Number

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Speaker 1: one Fertility.

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Speaker 3: She joins us this morning, good.

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Speaker 4: Morning, good morning everyone.

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Speaker 3: Stories like this it must just make your blood boil.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, so it's quite horrific setting these stories come out

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Speaker 4: two months ago where we saw the news about the

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Speaker 4: wrong embryo being put back into someone who's now got

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Speaker 4: a seventeen month old baby that's not genetically We still

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Speaker 4: don't know what's going to happen with that baby. It's

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Speaker 4: just terrific to hear that this has happened when we

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Speaker 4: have such future teristic technology available to us, that's something

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Speaker 4: like this could actually happen in a big IVF company

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Speaker 4: like monash Lin.

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Speaker 3: Do you think that.

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Speaker 1: Look, there's two stories that have come out and have

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Speaker 1: come out very publicly through the Herald Sun. Do you

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Speaker 1: think if these media investigations weren't happening, there would be

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Speaker 1: other things we don't know about.

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Speaker 2: Yes, it's pretty common because it's frightening.

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Speaker 4: No, No, these things aren't common. So we have to

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Speaker 4: report to our regulators. So if something does happen and

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Speaker 4: mishap happens in the lab, then they have to be

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Speaker 4: reported to our techs so they will become public knowledge.

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Speaker 4: So this is the only incident that I've heard of

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Speaker 4: or read about where the wrong embryos have been put

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Speaker 4: in and it's all by the same company. I would

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Speaker 4: say the processes must have broken down in that company

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Speaker 4: for that to happen. So when we collect eggs and

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Speaker 4: sperm and embryos in our clinic, they're all monitored by

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Speaker 4: two witnesses, so two scientists. And also we have an

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Speaker 4: ri witness system, which is an electronic witness system that

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Speaker 4: cost us more money to install, but it gives us

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Speaker 4: the benefit of tracking those embryos and those eggs and spam.

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Speaker 4: Right through their entry into the lab, so they're sort

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Speaker 4: of bar coded right through. So if a scientist accidentally

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Speaker 4: gets the wrong sperm and tries to put it with a

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Speaker 4: different egg, the alarm bells will ring and the scientists

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Speaker 4: won't be able to.

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Speaker 5: Should alarm bells be ringing right now? Should the regulator

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Speaker 5: be stepping in?

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Speaker 4: I think someone should be stepping in and seeing what

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Speaker 4: their process is to allow allow these two incidences that

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Speaker 4: have happened, and why they have happened, and if there's

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Speaker 4: any more there that might might have happened that we

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Speaker 4: don't know about it.

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Speaker 5: As Lauren just said, you know, this process when can

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Speaker 5: be can be just so anxiety inducing any way for families.

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Speaker 5: What would you say to people out there in Melbourne

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Speaker 5: who may be doing some really deep thinking right now

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Speaker 5: on the back of these two horrendous situations.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I think it's mindful to note that these incidences

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Speaker 4: are hopefully very rare, hopefully we won't see them again.

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Speaker 4: I think that the regulators need to step in and

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Speaker 4: see what's happening at one ASH right now and see

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Speaker 4: why these errors are being made. They are a publicly

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Speaker 4: listed company. And then you've also got to think about

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Speaker 4: profits over patients, So are they coming in to try

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Speaker 4: and save money to make profits. I'm a doctor owned clinic,

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Speaker 4: so everything I've invested in is to make my company

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Speaker 4: top standards, you know, top top size. I've invested in

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Speaker 4: all the latest and greatest equipment, and I've got backup

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Speaker 4: systems to ensure that these things don't happen in my clinic.

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Speaker 1: Well, and it can be overwhelming when families or people

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Speaker 1: are looking to do IVF.

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Speaker 3: How do you choose what's right for you?

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Speaker 1: Because it seems to be so many places that offer

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Speaker 1: IVF treatments and it's overwhelming to know who's good, who's safe,

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Speaker 1: who's not. It seems like a lot out there.

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Speaker 2: Sometimes price would come down to.

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Speaker 3: It as well.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, price and a lot of a lot of

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Speaker 4: the companies, the bigger companies spend a lot on advertising.

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Speaker 4: So most of my patients come from second opinions like

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Speaker 4: oh I went to doctor Lynn All, I went to

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Speaker 4: Number one Fertility. I've got my baby there, and so

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Speaker 4: it's patients trust, so they've had good experience with our company.

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Speaker 4: Still they'll recommend their friends. So I don't do a

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Speaker 4: lot of advertising. I don't need to. It's word of

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Speaker 4: mouth in my company, with a lot of the biggest

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Speaker 4: corporate companies do a lot of advertising to attract their patients.

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Speaker 1: Well, you've helped many of my friends have babies, doctor Lynn,

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Speaker 1: so thank you for that. You do an amazing job

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Speaker 1: and your team there are awesome.

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Speaker 4: Thank you so much.

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Speaker 2: Thanks for having me no worries. We appreciate you jumping

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Speaker 2: on this morning.

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Speaker 1: It's overwhelming enough, and there would be a lot of

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Speaker 1: people who have dealt with with monash ivf that will

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Speaker 1: be feeling very.

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Speaker 2: We've still got We've still got embryos in the freezer there,

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Speaker 2: and you know, because we do not that we're planning

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Speaker 2: to have other kids, but when we're going through it

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Speaker 2: with Archie, you know, just down the habit, you know.

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Speaker 1: But also have lots of friends who have frozen embryos

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Speaker 1: that aren't true if they'll use them, but they're just

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Speaker 1: not willing to take part fist.

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Speaker 5: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: But then part of me last night was like, and

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Speaker 2: I'm not trying to be dramatic, but I'm like, I

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Speaker 2: don't trust them sitting that freezer at the moment.

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Speaker 3: Do you transfer them to another I.

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Speaker 2: Believe you can, but I don't know. It just made

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Speaker 2: me think last night. I think we need to speed

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Speaker 2: up that conversation about what we want to do with them,

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Speaker 2: because at the moment I don't trust the current situation.

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Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, well there would be a lot of people

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Speaker 1: possibly feeling the same. But hopefully this is investigated properly

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Speaker 1: and dealt with accordingly because it's just not it's it's

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Speaker 1: just not good the.

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Speaker 5: Regular It has some work to do because she's a

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Speaker 5: privately owned company. They need to be answerable.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely, Jas and Lauren Lauren wake up feeling good.

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Speaker 3: Follow them on the socials

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Speaker 5: M