1 00:00:02,040 --> 00:00:04,560 Speaker 1: This is better than yesterday, making it better every single weeks. 2 00:00:04,600 --> 00:00:07,880 Speaker 1: Is twenty thirteen My nams Josha Ginsberg and I'm glad 3 00:00:07,920 --> 00:00:12,479 Speaker 1: you're here. This is a Monday episode, which is where 4 00:00:12,480 --> 00:00:16,119 Speaker 1: it's just me and I'm bringing you another edition of 5 00:00:16,160 --> 00:00:19,360 Speaker 1: twenty five Ideas for twenty twenty five, which is an 6 00:00:19,360 --> 00:00:22,400 Speaker 1: annual podcast offering. It started in twenty twenty with twenty 7 00:00:22,440 --> 00:00:24,200 Speaker 1: Ideas for twenty twenty and it's gone out from there 8 00:00:24,200 --> 00:00:27,280 Speaker 1: because for me, painting a vision of possibility is far 9 00:00:27,360 --> 00:00:30,440 Speaker 1: better than painting out a vision of fear, and with 10 00:00:30,480 --> 00:00:32,520 Speaker 1: an election on the way, I just kind of wanted 11 00:00:32,560 --> 00:00:34,440 Speaker 1: to give an idea of what it sounds like when 12 00:00:34,520 --> 00:00:38,240 Speaker 1: someone's talking about this is what we could be, rather 13 00:00:38,320 --> 00:00:40,479 Speaker 1: than we've got to stop this, We've got to break that, 14 00:00:40,640 --> 00:00:44,040 Speaker 1: we've got to act this. Putting ideas out there that 15 00:00:44,560 --> 00:00:50,080 Speaker 1: are hopefully looking to make things inclusive and better for 16 00:00:50,200 --> 00:00:53,000 Speaker 1: all of us, and you know, putting ideas out of 17 00:00:53,040 --> 00:00:55,120 Speaker 1: the world for me, which are along the lines of 18 00:00:55,120 --> 00:00:56,520 Speaker 1: what I would want for this country that I love 19 00:00:56,560 --> 00:00:58,520 Speaker 1: so much and where my children will grow up in 20 00:00:59,360 --> 00:01:02,120 Speaker 1: long after dead. So we will begin in a second, 21 00:01:02,120 --> 00:01:03,880 Speaker 1: but first I need to play some ads back in 22 00:01:03,920 --> 00:01:07,880 Speaker 1: a moment. Thanks for listening. This is better than yesterday 23 00:01:07,880 --> 00:01:10,399 Speaker 1: twenty five. It is for twenty twenty five. There are 24 00:01:10,480 --> 00:01:11,920 Speaker 1: live shows on the way. If you want to come 25 00:01:11,920 --> 00:01:13,440 Speaker 1: to one of the live gigs, and if you want 26 00:01:13,440 --> 00:01:15,080 Speaker 1: to get on the substack, I'll put the link in 27 00:01:15,120 --> 00:01:18,679 Speaker 1: the show notes. Get amongst that. So twenty five ideas 28 00:01:18,720 --> 00:01:23,120 Speaker 1: for twenty twenty five. Number eleven, the walking school bus. 29 00:01:23,640 --> 00:01:27,480 Speaker 1: It is a school bus, except it's not a bus, 30 00:01:28,000 --> 00:01:30,640 Speaker 1: it's not a vehicle, it's not anything. Because if you 31 00:01:30,640 --> 00:01:33,280 Speaker 1: want to fix traffic around schools, you got to stop 32 00:01:33,560 --> 00:01:37,360 Speaker 1: thinking like a car, all right. Anyone who lives anywhere 33 00:01:37,360 --> 00:01:40,240 Speaker 1: near primary school we do will know that from about 34 00:01:40,360 --> 00:01:42,800 Speaker 1: ten to nine to about ten past nine, it's just 35 00:01:42,840 --> 00:01:46,039 Speaker 1: a traffic jam. People are at no parking sizes, people 36 00:01:46,040 --> 00:01:48,840 Speaker 1: are double parking, They're throwing their kids out between cars. 37 00:01:48,840 --> 00:01:52,040 Speaker 1: It's so dangerous, it's no fun. And we'll keep trying 38 00:01:52,040 --> 00:01:54,440 Speaker 1: to solve these problems. I'm thinking like cars, wider roads, 39 00:01:54,480 --> 00:01:58,320 Speaker 1: more parking, drop off zones, fancy traffic management plans. There's 40 00:01:58,320 --> 00:02:02,160 Speaker 1: actually two schools near here. Have the name on the 41 00:02:02,240 --> 00:02:04,200 Speaker 1: sun visor. And there's a person in a high viz 42 00:02:04,240 --> 00:02:07,920 Speaker 1: that pushes people through and there's a number system, and yeah, 43 00:02:07,960 --> 00:02:10,720 Speaker 1: come on, what if the answer to this isn't about 44 00:02:10,760 --> 00:02:13,680 Speaker 1: cars at all? And this is where the walking school 45 00:02:13,720 --> 00:02:16,840 Speaker 1: bus comes in. It's a bunch of kids walking to 46 00:02:16,880 --> 00:02:22,280 Speaker 1: school together with adult supervisors. They walk along, they agreed 47 00:02:22,360 --> 00:02:26,240 Speaker 1: upon route, they pick up kids along the way. It's 48 00:02:26,639 --> 00:02:31,240 Speaker 1: literally like car pooling, but with feet. And that's all 49 00:02:31,280 --> 00:02:34,560 Speaker 1: it is. It happens already in Melbourne and the research 50 00:02:34,600 --> 00:02:36,959 Speaker 1: on the benefits of this is fantastic because when kids 51 00:02:36,960 --> 00:02:40,920 Speaker 1: walk to school, they are more alert. They also are fitter, 52 00:02:41,040 --> 00:02:44,639 Speaker 1: they're happier, they get a sense of perspective on where 53 00:02:44,680 --> 00:02:46,280 Speaker 1: their house is in a relation to the rest of 54 00:02:46,320 --> 00:02:48,280 Speaker 1: the world. They get to meet other kids from their 55 00:02:48,280 --> 00:02:51,200 Speaker 1: school that are a different age cohorts to them. Now, 56 00:02:52,360 --> 00:02:54,680 Speaker 1: I know what you're thinking, the same thought every parent 57 00:02:54,720 --> 00:02:56,320 Speaker 1: has about when they're sending their kid off to school. 58 00:02:56,560 --> 00:02:59,760 Speaker 1: But is it safe? Of course it's safe. These walks 59 00:02:59,760 --> 00:03:03,280 Speaker 1: are in incredibly tightly organized. They're run by volunteers from 60 00:03:03,320 --> 00:03:06,480 Speaker 1: within the school community. There's designated routes just like a 61 00:03:06,520 --> 00:03:09,920 Speaker 1: bus route. There's trained supervisors, they've got high vizvests, they 62 00:03:09,960 --> 00:03:13,040 Speaker 1: get kid counts, the kids learn row safety they learn 63 00:03:13,080 --> 00:03:17,200 Speaker 1: spatial awareness, they learn where the magpies swoop from, they 64 00:03:17,280 --> 00:03:20,639 Speaker 1: learn how to cross the street properly. It's about building community, 65 00:03:20,680 --> 00:03:23,239 Speaker 1: it's about teaching resilient it's about showing kids their legs 66 00:03:24,360 --> 00:03:28,080 Speaker 1: for walking. And of course I understand if it's wet, 67 00:03:28,120 --> 00:03:30,960 Speaker 1: if it's rainy, Yes, of course, I said. I say 68 00:03:31,000 --> 00:03:32,600 Speaker 1: this to Alf all the time. Sometimes when we're on 69 00:03:32,600 --> 00:03:34,520 Speaker 1: the bicycle we're going to digitsu or something, I'm like, 70 00:03:34,560 --> 00:03:38,280 Speaker 1: well it's lucky where waterproof? All right, you put the 71 00:03:38,360 --> 00:03:41,640 Speaker 1: right gear on, You're fine. Most walking school bus programs 72 00:03:41,680 --> 00:03:44,760 Speaker 1: around the world they have a weather policy that makes sense. 73 00:03:44,880 --> 00:03:48,080 Speaker 1: They can either actually carpool or they just hand out 74 00:03:48,080 --> 00:03:50,640 Speaker 1: ponchos and off they go. There's heaps of these in 75 00:03:50,640 --> 00:03:53,480 Speaker 1: New Zealand actually in Aukland. That's also in Melbourne. It 76 00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:57,160 Speaker 1: really works. What happens is traffic around the school really declines. 77 00:03:57,160 --> 00:04:01,840 Speaker 1: It makes it safer, makes it less intense in the mornings. 78 00:04:02,640 --> 00:04:05,200 Speaker 1: Parents save money on fuel, Parents get a little more 79 00:04:05,240 --> 00:04:07,040 Speaker 1: time in the morning because they maybe just take their 80 00:04:07,080 --> 00:04:09,240 Speaker 1: kid to where the school walking bus stops and then 81 00:04:09,280 --> 00:04:11,320 Speaker 1: they see them off. See the ladder, Jenny, Jimmy Bob 82 00:04:11,520 --> 00:04:14,640 Speaker 1: say buy you get about your day rather than wasting 83 00:04:14,640 --> 00:04:17,640 Speaker 1: forty five minutes aggravatingly are worried about parking rangers doing 84 00:04:17,720 --> 00:04:19,920 Speaker 1: if you're not being at the Kiss and Go. But 85 00:04:19,920 --> 00:04:22,640 Speaker 1: the thing about the walking school bus that I also 86 00:04:22,760 --> 00:04:26,200 Speaker 1: like is it's not a fancy solution that needs government 87 00:04:26,240 --> 00:04:31,080 Speaker 1: funding or complicated infrastructure. It needs a couple of volunteers, 88 00:04:31,360 --> 00:04:35,240 Speaker 1: some basic planning, an organization, the willingness to try something different. 89 00:04:35,600 --> 00:04:37,359 Speaker 1: The wheels on this bus don't go round and around, 90 00:04:37,440 --> 00:04:41,360 Speaker 1: they go left and right. Okay, idea number twelve. Let's 91 00:04:41,360 --> 00:04:44,320 Speaker 1: put best before dates on non food related items. When 92 00:04:44,360 --> 00:04:46,280 Speaker 1: I buy a type of cream cheese or a loaf 93 00:04:46,360 --> 00:04:48,680 Speaker 1: of bread, written right there on the packet is the 94 00:04:48,800 --> 00:04:50,960 Speaker 1: date which the people who made it say, this is 95 00:04:51,000 --> 00:04:53,800 Speaker 1: going to be good until then. And that really informs 96 00:04:53,800 --> 00:04:57,200 Speaker 1: my choices, all right, Because I'm Celiac. The bread EYE 97 00:04:57,200 --> 00:05:00,120 Speaker 1: buy is a bit more expensive than regular bread. I 98 00:05:00,120 --> 00:05:01,840 Speaker 1: put that bread in the freezer because I don't eat 99 00:05:01,839 --> 00:05:03,359 Speaker 1: that much of it, but I'd like to have it around. 100 00:05:03,440 --> 00:05:05,240 Speaker 1: But I know that if by the time I get 101 00:05:05,240 --> 00:05:06,720 Speaker 1: to the last of it it won't be gone, then 102 00:05:06,760 --> 00:05:08,920 Speaker 1: I've paid a ton of money for a bunch of bread. 103 00:05:08,960 --> 00:05:11,240 Speaker 1: That's now going in my compost. So what would it 104 00:05:11,240 --> 00:05:13,760 Speaker 1: be like if we mandated it so that manufacturers would 105 00:05:13,760 --> 00:05:15,680 Speaker 1: need to put a best before date on something like 106 00:05:15,720 --> 00:05:19,760 Speaker 1: a phone or a laptop, a car. I know it's 107 00:05:19,920 --> 00:05:22,640 Speaker 1: variable and according to how you use it. Right, if 108 00:05:22,640 --> 00:05:24,400 Speaker 1: you're using your laptop as a frisbee, it may not 109 00:05:24,480 --> 00:05:26,440 Speaker 1: last as long as a manufacturer intended. But you know 110 00:05:26,480 --> 00:05:30,440 Speaker 1: an average. We know that nothing lasts forever. So when 111 00:05:30,440 --> 00:05:32,039 Speaker 1: I buy a pair of boxes, if it says on 112 00:05:32,040 --> 00:05:34,680 Speaker 1: the inside, here, wash it in warm water on a 113 00:05:34,720 --> 00:05:38,359 Speaker 1: gentle cycle, and this is good for two years of 114 00:05:38,839 --> 00:05:40,880 Speaker 1: once a week use or one hundred and four washes, 115 00:05:40,960 --> 00:05:44,000 Speaker 1: or whichever comes first. Then I can look at it 116 00:05:44,040 --> 00:05:46,640 Speaker 1: and go, well, this costs a hundred bucks. It's around 117 00:05:46,680 --> 00:05:49,320 Speaker 1: a dollar a day wearing this pair of trunks. That 118 00:05:49,400 --> 00:05:51,720 Speaker 1: might be a bit much, or that's how much it 119 00:05:51,760 --> 00:05:53,640 Speaker 1: cost to have something to last that long. I get 120 00:05:53,680 --> 00:05:55,640 Speaker 1: it right. The cheap a pair might not last as long. 121 00:05:55,720 --> 00:05:58,359 Speaker 1: That's the price of something that lasts long. It'd be 122 00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:00,480 Speaker 1: good to know. I'd love to know how I should 123 00:06:00,520 --> 00:06:03,279 Speaker 1: expect my phone to last, my laptop to last, my 124 00:06:03,360 --> 00:06:06,560 Speaker 1: pair of thongs, like anything. I don't want the manufacturer 125 00:06:06,560 --> 00:06:11,040 Speaker 1: to change anything. Just be honest about how long this 126 00:06:11,160 --> 00:06:13,680 Speaker 1: thing will be good for, so that I can make 127 00:06:13,720 --> 00:06:17,120 Speaker 1: a good choice about how much money I'm going to 128 00:06:17,120 --> 00:06:19,920 Speaker 1: pay for it. Twenty five ideas for twenty twenty five. 129 00:06:20,279 --> 00:06:23,400 Speaker 1: Idea number thirteen. While we're on the subject of labeling, 130 00:06:24,880 --> 00:06:29,360 Speaker 1: Idea number thirteen. Label products with the amount of carbon 131 00:06:29,360 --> 00:06:33,400 Speaker 1: that had to get emitted to produce and ship that 132 00:06:33,480 --> 00:06:35,960 Speaker 1: product to where you bought it from. Putting a tariff 133 00:06:36,080 --> 00:06:39,120 Speaker 1: or a levee on carbon is a political guillotine in Australia, 134 00:06:39,200 --> 00:06:41,520 Speaker 1: So absolutely don't do that. I'm not asking to do that. 135 00:06:41,800 --> 00:06:43,520 Speaker 1: Just right it on the side of the box. To 136 00:06:43,520 --> 00:06:46,280 Speaker 1: build this microwave oven, to ship it from China to you, 137 00:06:46,640 --> 00:06:48,960 Speaker 1: we had to admit three hundred and five kilograms of 138 00:06:49,000 --> 00:06:53,040 Speaker 1: CO two. Enjoy your reheated pasta. These five bananas between 139 00:06:53,080 --> 00:06:55,400 Speaker 1: the fertilizer of the irrigation and transporting it down from 140 00:06:55,440 --> 00:06:57,840 Speaker 1: Queensland as about two hundred and fifty grams of CO 141 00:06:58,000 --> 00:07:00,839 Speaker 1: two perquilo. I hope you make a nice smoothie. That's cool, Like, 142 00:07:00,920 --> 00:07:02,680 Speaker 1: at least I know what's going on there. You know 143 00:07:02,760 --> 00:07:05,120 Speaker 1: that fancy new electric car look, Isn't that nice that 144 00:07:05,200 --> 00:07:06,920 Speaker 1: to get from here to there, you're no longer going 145 00:07:06,960 --> 00:07:09,800 Speaker 1: to be pumping CO two from the day you buy 146 00:07:09,840 --> 00:07:13,360 Speaker 1: the thing. However, to build it and to get it 147 00:07:13,360 --> 00:07:15,880 Speaker 1: to Australia, that's about twenty tons of CO two in 148 00:07:15,920 --> 00:07:18,640 Speaker 1: the atmosphere right about now. So, like I never said 149 00:07:18,640 --> 00:07:20,280 Speaker 1: anything about a tax, I didn't say that. I didn't 150 00:07:20,280 --> 00:07:23,480 Speaker 1: say tax, Just transparency, just transparency on how much CO 151 00:07:23,600 --> 00:07:26,520 Speaker 1: two is emitted to make the stuff that we use. 152 00:07:27,000 --> 00:07:30,440 Speaker 1: I'm not asking manufacturers to change the thing. But we 153 00:07:30,480 --> 00:07:32,960 Speaker 1: already read I really that I'm a Celiac, so I 154 00:07:33,000 --> 00:07:35,880 Speaker 1: read labels a lot, right, just read a label. I 155 00:07:35,960 --> 00:07:40,520 Speaker 1: understand these berries came from Chili. Really, do they not 156 00:07:40,600 --> 00:07:42,840 Speaker 1: have freezers in Australia? How come my frozen berries had 157 00:07:42,840 --> 00:07:45,160 Speaker 1: to come from Chili? I don't understand. That's a long 158 00:07:45,160 --> 00:07:50,560 Speaker 1: way away, Like we already have that there. But putting 159 00:07:50,560 --> 00:07:53,400 Speaker 1: together how much carbon had to go into the atmosphere 160 00:07:55,040 --> 00:07:57,160 Speaker 1: is something that we're not doing at this point, because 161 00:07:57,200 --> 00:08:00,760 Speaker 1: that really is the externality that I feel is missing 162 00:08:00,760 --> 00:08:04,320 Speaker 1: from our conversation about climate action and sensible climate policy 163 00:08:04,400 --> 00:08:07,120 Speaker 1: is the externality of the carbon that gets omitted for 164 00:08:07,160 --> 00:08:09,040 Speaker 1: the life that we want to live and the life 165 00:08:09,040 --> 00:08:11,160 Speaker 1: that I like living, a life with a laptop and 166 00:08:11,160 --> 00:08:13,920 Speaker 1: a phone and an electric car, electric motorbike and solar panels, 167 00:08:14,080 --> 00:08:16,840 Speaker 1: like I like this life I live. We are not 168 00:08:17,120 --> 00:08:21,000 Speaker 1: mentioning how much CO two is getting omitted by not 169 00:08:21,040 --> 00:08:23,080 Speaker 1: mentioning that. I don't know if people are actually making 170 00:08:23,080 --> 00:08:27,080 Speaker 1: it able to make an informed decision about policy and 171 00:08:27,880 --> 00:08:29,760 Speaker 1: you know, what they choose to buy, what they choose 172 00:08:29,800 --> 00:08:31,760 Speaker 1: to use, or how they choose to live their lives. 173 00:08:32,240 --> 00:08:34,400 Speaker 1: Now I do need to take a break, but I'll 174 00:08:34,400 --> 00:08:43,800 Speaker 1: be right back with the last two for today. Thanks 175 00:08:43,840 --> 00:08:46,000 Speaker 1: for listening. We're going through the twenty five ideas for 176 00:08:46,040 --> 00:08:50,959 Speaker 1: twenty twenty five idea Number fourteen family counseling for politicians. 177 00:08:51,640 --> 00:08:55,320 Speaker 1: I was thinking about this. Our politicians bicker so much 178 00:08:55,360 --> 00:08:57,920 Speaker 1: and they call each other names. Nothing gets done, and 179 00:08:57,960 --> 00:09:04,760 Speaker 1: it really reminds me of a really acrimonious divorce. If 180 00:09:05,000 --> 00:09:07,960 Speaker 1: we treated our politicians that both the ones in power 181 00:09:07,960 --> 00:09:09,960 Speaker 1: are the ones in opposition as a set of divorcing 182 00:09:10,000 --> 00:09:14,080 Speaker 1: parents and us as Australians like the kids they're trying 183 00:09:14,080 --> 00:09:18,160 Speaker 1: to coparent, that might change things. In the absence of 184 00:09:18,440 --> 00:09:21,600 Speaker 1: actual leadership, which is interested in serving the people. What 185 00:09:21,640 --> 00:09:24,560 Speaker 1: if we were to create a media blackout zone where neutral, 186 00:09:24,640 --> 00:09:29,760 Speaker 1: third party mediators helped the politicians sort out policy. It's 187 00:09:29,840 --> 00:09:31,560 Speaker 1: such a waste of time and money trying to score 188 00:09:31,559 --> 00:09:34,719 Speaker 1: political points with things which morally is pretty repugnant to 189 00:09:34,720 --> 00:09:38,880 Speaker 1: score political points with, like refugee policy, climate policy, justice policy, 190 00:09:39,320 --> 00:09:41,680 Speaker 1: adult crime for adult time might sound cool in a 191 00:09:41,720 --> 00:09:44,400 Speaker 1: campaign ad, but it does sound to me like something 192 00:09:44,440 --> 00:09:48,479 Speaker 1: a person and echo chamber came up with. In Australia, 193 00:09:48,880 --> 00:09:52,960 Speaker 1: we have unbelievably skilled family law mediators who have helped 194 00:09:53,040 --> 00:09:56,360 Speaker 1: kids of parents who are just at each other's throats 195 00:09:56,360 --> 00:09:59,600 Speaker 1: and just destroying each other. They've helped those children have 196 00:09:59,640 --> 00:10:02,880 Speaker 1: a really great life by mediating between these two people. 197 00:10:02,920 --> 00:10:06,400 Speaker 1: So if we treated our politicians like perpetually divorcing parents 198 00:10:06,480 --> 00:10:10,960 Speaker 1: trying to co parent us and lead the country like adults, 199 00:10:11,360 --> 00:10:13,720 Speaker 1: that'd be pretty good. They can go into the room 200 00:10:14,640 --> 00:10:16,360 Speaker 1: and they come out of the room, nobody talks about 201 00:10:16,360 --> 00:10:19,680 Speaker 1: what happened in the room, and to make it really fair, 202 00:10:19,960 --> 00:10:21,679 Speaker 1: they're going to want to make a statement about what 203 00:10:21,720 --> 00:10:24,560 Speaker 1: happened in the room. That's true, But we get one 204 00:10:24,600 --> 00:10:26,280 Speaker 1: to write the other one's statement, and that one to 205 00:10:26,280 --> 00:10:29,400 Speaker 1: write that one statement, and so when they're announcing the 206 00:10:29,400 --> 00:10:32,200 Speaker 1: way forward, it's been written by the other person. Because 207 00:10:32,200 --> 00:10:34,000 Speaker 1: I'm sick of this shit, and I'm sure you are too. 208 00:10:34,320 --> 00:10:36,520 Speaker 1: Because we're not getting anywhere doing this. There has got 209 00:10:36,520 --> 00:10:39,320 Speaker 1: to be a better way. That absolutely has to be 210 00:10:40,280 --> 00:10:44,200 Speaker 1: last idea for today eight number fifteen. I've spoken about 211 00:10:44,240 --> 00:10:48,600 Speaker 1: this before, but at Desersory Visiting, immediately begin trial programs 212 00:10:48,920 --> 00:10:51,040 Speaker 1: on different ways that our prison's going to work, using 213 00:10:51,080 --> 00:10:53,439 Speaker 1: models which have been proven to be effective in other 214 00:10:53,480 --> 00:10:56,400 Speaker 1: countries in a similar economic position to us. We've got 215 00:10:56,400 --> 00:10:58,840 Speaker 1: to have a grown up conversation about prison in Australia, 216 00:10:58,880 --> 00:11:01,760 Speaker 1: all right. Currently a higher than fifty per cent chance 217 00:11:01,960 --> 00:11:04,640 Speaker 1: that within two years someone released from prison in Australia 218 00:11:04,720 --> 00:11:08,360 Speaker 1: will return to prison. Now, if my job is to 219 00:11:08,400 --> 00:11:13,319 Speaker 1: rehabilitate an offender so that they become a more integrated 220 00:11:13,360 --> 00:11:16,200 Speaker 1: part of society when they get out of prison, and 221 00:11:16,240 --> 00:11:19,199 Speaker 1: you're paying me as if I'm delivering that one hundred 222 00:11:19,200 --> 00:11:22,160 Speaker 1: percent of the time, If I deliver that less than 223 00:11:22,200 --> 00:11:23,920 Speaker 1: half of the time, you, as my boss, would sit 224 00:11:23,960 --> 00:11:26,320 Speaker 1: me down and go all right, Guinsburg, let's just let's 225 00:11:26,320 --> 00:11:27,880 Speaker 1: have a look at the methods. Take me through what 226 00:11:27,920 --> 00:11:30,960 Speaker 1: you're doing like cause I want to see if we 227 00:11:30,960 --> 00:11:32,880 Speaker 1: can get those KPIs a little bit better next quarter. 228 00:11:32,880 --> 00:11:35,280 Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying. We have to talk about this. 229 00:11:35,360 --> 00:11:38,240 Speaker 1: It's really uncomfortable to talk about, but we really, really do. 230 00:11:38,320 --> 00:11:40,640 Speaker 1: Our prisons aren't doing the job they're supposed to do. 231 00:11:41,720 --> 00:11:45,760 Speaker 1: The numbers are really clear. We are spending millions of 232 00:11:45,760 --> 00:11:49,520 Speaker 1: dollars on a very expensive revolving door that degrades that 233 00:11:49,600 --> 00:11:52,960 Speaker 1: person every single time they go through. But it doesn't 234 00:11:53,040 --> 00:11:55,200 Speaker 1: have to be this way in other parts of the world. 235 00:11:55,240 --> 00:11:58,120 Speaker 1: Other countries have figured it out and the results are 236 00:11:58,120 --> 00:12:03,400 Speaker 1: truly truly extraordinary. Take Norway for example. Instead of focusing 237 00:12:03,440 --> 00:12:06,479 Speaker 1: on punishment, in Norway, they put their energy into rehabilitation. 238 00:12:06,600 --> 00:12:11,240 Speaker 1: Their prisons provide education, proper job training, mental health support. 239 00:12:11,520 --> 00:12:14,719 Speaker 1: They treat their inmates like people who need help rather 240 00:12:14,760 --> 00:12:17,439 Speaker 1: than people who need punishment, and the results in Norway 241 00:12:17,640 --> 00:12:20,200 Speaker 1: only about one in four end up back in prison. 242 00:12:20,600 --> 00:12:23,240 Speaker 1: In the Netherlands, they focus so heavily on rehabilitation and 243 00:12:23,280 --> 00:12:27,000 Speaker 1: reducing reoffending that they are closing prisons in the Netherlands 244 00:12:27,040 --> 00:12:29,760 Speaker 1: because they don't have enough prisoners to fill them. Can 245 00:12:29,800 --> 00:12:33,200 Speaker 1: you imagine that even Texas you know the place that 246 00:12:33,320 --> 00:12:36,240 Speaker 1: is famous for being tough on crime, the open carry 247 00:12:36,440 --> 00:12:39,400 Speaker 1: weapons everywhere, Texas. Even there they figured out there might 248 00:12:39,440 --> 00:12:42,000 Speaker 1: be a better way, because in Texas they've introduced the 249 00:12:42,040 --> 00:12:45,360 Speaker 1: system where prisoners can reduce their sentences by participating in 250 00:12:45,480 --> 00:12:50,080 Speaker 1: education and vocational programs. Is pretty straightforward. You learn something useful, 251 00:12:50,160 --> 00:12:53,640 Speaker 1: you get out sooner, and it's working there now. The 252 00:12:53,679 --> 00:12:58,360 Speaker 1: immediate reaction to treating prisoners a little more kindly, I understand, 253 00:12:58,760 --> 00:13:00,800 Speaker 1: might rub people the wrong way because there's a gut 254 00:13:00,840 --> 00:13:02,880 Speaker 1: feeling prison should be tough. You do the crime, you 255 00:13:02,920 --> 00:13:05,000 Speaker 1: do the time. They shouldn't be punished, shouldn't be good, 256 00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:08,320 Speaker 1: they shouldn't have tv sh I get that when someone 257 00:13:08,320 --> 00:13:11,000 Speaker 1: does the wrong thing, it is natural for us to 258 00:13:11,040 --> 00:13:14,800 Speaker 1: want them to face consequences. But we really have to 259 00:13:14,800 --> 00:13:17,640 Speaker 1: think about the long game. And the long game is 260 00:13:17,640 --> 00:13:20,640 Speaker 1: that almost everyone in prison is going to get out 261 00:13:20,640 --> 00:13:24,360 Speaker 1: of prison eventually. The real question isn't about how tough 262 00:13:24,480 --> 00:13:27,520 Speaker 1: we can make it for people inside prison. The question 263 00:13:27,679 --> 00:13:30,200 Speaker 1: is about what kind of people do we want them 264 00:13:30,240 --> 00:13:34,240 Speaker 1: to be when they get out of prison. If I 265 00:13:34,400 --> 00:13:38,120 Speaker 1: ask you, how would you feel about someone who's just 266 00:13:38,160 --> 00:13:40,280 Speaker 1: done twenty five years for manslaughter is something that happened 267 00:13:40,320 --> 00:13:42,439 Speaker 1: back in the nineties. They're going to move in next 268 00:13:42,440 --> 00:13:45,040 Speaker 1: door to you. Would you feel good about it? I 269 00:13:45,080 --> 00:13:47,679 Speaker 1: wouldn't because I don't believe that the prison system in 270 00:13:47,720 --> 00:13:50,880 Speaker 1: Australia would have helped that person get to a place 271 00:13:51,120 --> 00:13:54,800 Speaker 1: where they are able to live safely in a community 272 00:13:55,520 --> 00:14:00,280 Speaker 1: out after a quarter of a century behind bars. We 273 00:14:00,320 --> 00:14:02,800 Speaker 1: need to have a system that does that. Do we 274 00:14:02,840 --> 00:14:06,000 Speaker 1: want people leaving prison and Australia with the same problems 275 00:14:06,000 --> 00:14:09,400 Speaker 1: that got them there in the first place, Because, to 276 00:14:09,480 --> 00:14:13,360 Speaker 1: be really frank about it, a lot of crime, not all, 277 00:14:13,400 --> 00:14:18,400 Speaker 1: but a lot of crime is mostly a symptom of trauma, 278 00:14:18,679 --> 00:14:24,360 Speaker 1: of domestic violence, of addiction, of untreated mental health, of poverty. 279 00:14:24,480 --> 00:14:27,360 Speaker 1: If we treat the root causes rather than the symptoms, 280 00:14:27,360 --> 00:14:30,440 Speaker 1: and treat, teach people and help people we're dealing with 281 00:14:30,440 --> 00:14:34,720 Speaker 1: those root causes, you really offset the chance of the reoffending. 282 00:14:35,400 --> 00:14:38,680 Speaker 1: Now absolutely, I know there are some people who are 283 00:14:38,720 --> 00:14:42,840 Speaker 1: in prison that really need to stay in there. However, 284 00:14:43,320 --> 00:14:45,520 Speaker 1: the country is getting it right. Really do understand something 285 00:14:45,560 --> 00:14:48,680 Speaker 1: quite fundamental that prison isn't just about keeping people away 286 00:14:48,920 --> 00:14:53,160 Speaker 1: from society, it's about preparing them to rejoin it. But 287 00:14:53,240 --> 00:14:55,960 Speaker 1: what does it means investing in proper education programs, mental 288 00:14:56,000 --> 00:14:58,560 Speaker 1: health support, job training, give people real skills. Yes, I 289 00:14:58,640 --> 00:15:01,960 Speaker 1: know it costs money, that's true, it does, but that 290 00:15:02,080 --> 00:15:04,560 Speaker 1: isn't an investment that will pay off because every person 291 00:15:04,600 --> 00:15:07,640 Speaker 1: who doesn't return to prison saves us all money in 292 00:15:07,640 --> 00:15:10,520 Speaker 1: the long run. Every person who becomes a productive member 293 00:15:10,560 --> 00:15:13,640 Speaker 1: of our community instead of reoffending. It's a win for 294 00:15:13,760 --> 00:15:17,040 Speaker 1: every single one of us. The solution is fairly clear. 295 00:15:17,120 --> 00:15:18,640 Speaker 1: It's right in front of us. Other countries have shown 296 00:15:18,640 --> 00:15:20,160 Speaker 1: that it works. We just need to have the guts 297 00:15:20,200 --> 00:15:24,680 Speaker 1: to do it. All right. Look, we're back on Wednesday, 298 00:15:25,040 --> 00:15:27,480 Speaker 1: and I'll be I'll be back with more ideas for 299 00:15:27,520 --> 00:15:30,120 Speaker 1: twenty twenty five, ten more to go. We've got tickets 300 00:15:30,160 --> 00:15:32,720 Speaker 1: for live shows to get around again on the substack 301 00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:34,600 Speaker 1: as well. There's a link in the show notes for 302 00:15:34,680 --> 00:15:37,000 Speaker 1: both those things. Thanks so much for listening. I'll see 303 00:15:37,000 --> 00:15:38,040 Speaker 1: in a couple of days.