1 00:00:01,320 --> 00:00:03,640 Speaker 1: Dr Amy, Welcome to the You Project. 2 00:00:04,559 --> 00:00:06,760 Speaker 2: Ah, thank you, it is so good to be here. 3 00:00:07,600 --> 00:00:09,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, well, you're impressive. 4 00:00:10,200 --> 00:00:11,879 Speaker 3: I've done a little bit of a deep dive, I've 5 00:00:11,960 --> 00:00:15,080 Speaker 3: done a shallowed a medium dive. I've watched some videos, 6 00:00:15,120 --> 00:00:21,160 Speaker 3: I've read some stuff, I've listened to some stuff. Your 7 00:00:21,160 --> 00:00:24,480 Speaker 3: work is great, You're great. Can you give rather than 8 00:00:24,520 --> 00:00:27,920 Speaker 3: me just read something off the screen, which is boring 9 00:00:28,000 --> 00:00:30,560 Speaker 3: for the listener, can you give my audience a snapshot 10 00:00:30,560 --> 00:00:31,880 Speaker 3: of who you are and what you do? 11 00:00:32,520 --> 00:00:32,920 Speaker 1: Please? 12 00:00:34,040 --> 00:00:37,080 Speaker 2: The snapshot of who I am. I am a double 13 00:00:37,080 --> 00:00:40,280 Speaker 2: board certified physician. I'm boarded in both preventive medicine which 14 00:00:40,320 --> 00:00:45,040 Speaker 2: is your chronic health and epidemiology and public health, and 15 00:00:45,080 --> 00:00:48,279 Speaker 2: then boarded an addiction medicine, and that was where I 16 00:00:48,320 --> 00:00:52,760 Speaker 2: spent the most majority of my practice, running different detok centers, 17 00:00:52,800 --> 00:00:59,040 Speaker 2: helping people get off of alcohol, opiates, pain pills, anxiety pills, 18 00:00:59,040 --> 00:01:02,080 Speaker 2: and sleep pills, every thing that we can get addicted 19 00:01:02,160 --> 00:01:06,119 Speaker 2: and dependent on. And that was not my original plan. 20 00:01:06,280 --> 00:01:10,160 Speaker 2: So I actually spent four years in general surgery first 21 00:01:10,560 --> 00:01:14,119 Speaker 2: before changing my career to addiction medicine. And the reason 22 00:01:14,160 --> 00:01:20,240 Speaker 2: for that change was because I wanted to bring trauma 23 00:01:20,280 --> 00:01:23,640 Speaker 2: into medicine, and the way that I saw that I 24 00:01:23,760 --> 00:01:26,360 Speaker 2: might be able to do that was by going through 25 00:01:26,400 --> 00:01:30,240 Speaker 2: preventive medicine and addiction medicine, as I felt that those 26 00:01:30,280 --> 00:01:35,679 Speaker 2: were most closely attached to but also already recognizing the 27 00:01:35,720 --> 00:01:39,560 Speaker 2: impact of trauma the average child experiences. Studies came out 28 00:01:39,560 --> 00:01:43,399 Speaker 2: of preventive medicine departments, for example, and then addiction medicine. 29 00:01:43,400 --> 00:01:46,520 Speaker 2: I think, especially with the work of gobor Mate, has 30 00:01:46,560 --> 00:01:50,200 Speaker 2: been bringing light to the trauma piece to addiction, so 31 00:01:50,320 --> 00:01:52,320 Speaker 2: I felt that that would be a natural home for me. 32 00:01:52,760 --> 00:01:57,400 Speaker 2: I found that no medicine is not yet quite ready 33 00:01:57,400 --> 00:02:00,960 Speaker 2: to really talk about and bring trauma in medicine, and 34 00:02:01,000 --> 00:02:04,000 Speaker 2: so that was when I left my medical practice and 35 00:02:04,120 --> 00:02:08,360 Speaker 2: have started online courses for self help individuals and practitioners. 36 00:02:09,040 --> 00:02:13,000 Speaker 2: But going all the way back, my initial initiation into 37 00:02:13,480 --> 00:02:18,080 Speaker 2: even studying trauma was becoming a foster parent and then adopting, 38 00:02:18,680 --> 00:02:22,720 Speaker 2: and I thought I knew trauma. I thought I knew 39 00:02:22,800 --> 00:02:26,680 Speaker 2: what kids who had been through trauma would need. They 40 00:02:26,760 --> 00:02:31,360 Speaker 2: needed love, stability, and time, and I found that none 41 00:02:31,440 --> 00:02:34,919 Speaker 2: of those are enough. In fact, time does not heal. 42 00:02:35,560 --> 00:02:41,000 Speaker 2: Time only compounds the problem. When we have stored trauma, unresolved, 43 00:02:41,480 --> 00:02:47,280 Speaker 2: experiences of neglect overwhelm pain, and that becomes our biology, 44 00:02:47,440 --> 00:02:50,720 Speaker 2: and that becomes our disease. And that is what now 45 00:02:50,840 --> 00:02:52,840 Speaker 2: motivates me to do the work that I do. 46 00:02:54,120 --> 00:02:57,840 Speaker 3: Wow, Wow, without throwing anyone under the bus, because you 47 00:02:57,880 --> 00:03:00,919 Speaker 3: and I are not you know, pradiction's throwing people. 48 00:03:01,000 --> 00:03:02,200 Speaker 1: No, No, we're not like that. 49 00:03:02,480 --> 00:03:08,560 Speaker 3: But of all the approaches and I guess models around 50 00:03:08,600 --> 00:03:12,840 Speaker 3: treating trauma, how many what percentage, give or take. 51 00:03:13,320 --> 00:03:15,200 Speaker 1: Do you think are not that effective? 52 00:03:16,240 --> 00:03:18,440 Speaker 3: I mean that's a I know that's a hard but 53 00:03:18,480 --> 00:03:20,799 Speaker 3: I feel like your approach, it's not unique, but it's 54 00:03:21,600 --> 00:03:26,160 Speaker 3: not typical, and like as much as of dive I've done, 55 00:03:26,200 --> 00:03:30,120 Speaker 3: it totally makes sense. And I feel like a lot 56 00:03:30,120 --> 00:03:32,600 Speaker 3: of people are perhaps doing a version of therapy or 57 00:03:32,600 --> 00:03:34,560 Speaker 3: something that's not really helping them a lot. 58 00:03:36,120 --> 00:03:38,720 Speaker 2: Well, that was my experience and that's how I started 59 00:03:38,720 --> 00:03:41,560 Speaker 2: with all of this. I found that I needed to 60 00:03:41,600 --> 00:03:44,200 Speaker 2: do my own trauma work had never been something on 61 00:03:44,240 --> 00:03:47,200 Speaker 2: my radar because I am not one who had thought 62 00:03:47,240 --> 00:03:50,360 Speaker 2: that I had trauma to have to work through. But 63 00:03:50,760 --> 00:03:53,840 Speaker 2: as I started my trauma work, I realized that my 64 00:03:54,040 --> 00:03:57,880 Speaker 2: body couldn't keep up. Yeah, my body was getting tired. 65 00:03:57,960 --> 00:04:00,680 Speaker 2: I'd go and I'd have a great therapy session, and 66 00:04:00,680 --> 00:04:05,160 Speaker 2: then I'd find myself on the couch physically exhausted, binge 67 00:04:05,200 --> 00:04:08,280 Speaker 2: eating and zoning out with movies and I'm like, something 68 00:04:08,360 --> 00:04:11,280 Speaker 2: is not right here. And then I started actually going 69 00:04:11,320 --> 00:04:15,800 Speaker 2: into therapy training. So I'm now training with therapists, and 70 00:04:16,360 --> 00:04:21,440 Speaker 2: I'm finding my mind zoning out and checking you know, 71 00:04:21,600 --> 00:04:26,440 Speaker 2: out for when they're teaching about specific things that I'm realizing, Oh, 72 00:04:26,560 --> 00:04:30,400 Speaker 2: like my mind is dissociating when it's speaking a truth 73 00:04:30,480 --> 00:04:33,960 Speaker 2: that my body is like me, that's been me, And 74 00:04:34,080 --> 00:04:37,919 Speaker 2: I was so disconnected without even knowing I was disconnected. Great, Like, 75 00:04:38,000 --> 00:04:40,760 Speaker 2: that's that's how disconnected I was. I didn't even know 76 00:04:40,960 --> 00:04:44,279 Speaker 2: I was disconnected. And so then as I started looking 77 00:04:44,320 --> 00:04:46,800 Speaker 2: at my patients and my patients are coming to me 78 00:04:46,960 --> 00:04:50,280 Speaker 2: with the same conditions that I used to have, automunity, 79 00:04:50,680 --> 00:04:56,160 Speaker 2: chronic fatigue, depression, anxiety, and I'm seeing that they are 80 00:04:56,400 --> 00:05:00,440 Speaker 2: just as get disconnected. They also have this story trauma 81 00:05:00,440 --> 00:05:02,560 Speaker 2: in their body and they don't even know it. They 82 00:05:02,560 --> 00:05:06,960 Speaker 2: don't even recognize it because it's not yelling I'm trauma, 83 00:05:07,040 --> 00:05:12,360 Speaker 2: I'm trauma. It's yelling I'm depressed, I'm anxious, I have autoimmunity. 84 00:05:13,120 --> 00:05:16,279 Speaker 2: And so when I'm realizing that most of them have 85 00:05:16,400 --> 00:05:19,680 Speaker 2: done some form of therapy and it clearly has not 86 00:05:20,160 --> 00:05:25,400 Speaker 2: changed the impact of trauma on their biology. To me, 87 00:05:25,960 --> 00:05:32,480 Speaker 2: that is not healing. To me, that's just managing behaviors 88 00:05:33,080 --> 00:05:37,159 Speaker 2: and emotions. But that's not actual healing, because for me, 89 00:05:37,839 --> 00:05:44,720 Speaker 2: healing is reversing the impact, reversing the damage, repairing the 90 00:05:44,760 --> 00:05:48,919 Speaker 2: broken pieces. And if I haven't repaired my biology and 91 00:05:48,960 --> 00:05:53,280 Speaker 2: my biology is still under the impact of my past, 92 00:05:53,680 --> 00:05:54,679 Speaker 2: that's not healing. 93 00:05:57,000 --> 00:06:00,880 Speaker 1: Wow, you're good. You should do this for a job. 94 00:06:02,080 --> 00:06:04,280 Speaker 2: I'll think about that. These creed. 95 00:06:05,960 --> 00:06:08,280 Speaker 3: Make a career out of it. You're quite good at it. 96 00:06:09,279 --> 00:06:16,840 Speaker 3: I feel like doc that. In terms of treatment and uh, 97 00:06:16,920 --> 00:06:19,600 Speaker 3: you know, health and wellness and the whole kind of 98 00:06:20,000 --> 00:06:25,680 Speaker 3: you know, thinking, feeling, being better medically, emotionally, psychologically, sociologically, 99 00:06:26,120 --> 00:06:29,720 Speaker 3: all of those things. When it comes to treatment, everything's 100 00:06:29,800 --> 00:06:34,280 Speaker 3: kind of treated in echo chambers in isolation. Oh so 101 00:06:34,320 --> 00:06:37,320 Speaker 3: there's the mind. Just go over there where the mind is, 102 00:06:37,760 --> 00:06:40,120 Speaker 3: and then we'll go into that other compartment over there 103 00:06:40,160 --> 00:06:43,960 Speaker 3: there the emotions over there. Oh, he's got he's got 104 00:06:44,000 --> 00:06:47,680 Speaker 3: a physical problem. That's down the corridor. Fourth door on 105 00:06:47,760 --> 00:06:51,279 Speaker 3: the left. We'll deal with the physical and then rather 106 00:06:51,279 --> 00:06:53,920 Speaker 3: than go no, everything affects everything. This is not three 107 00:06:54,000 --> 00:06:56,799 Speaker 3: or four or five systems. This is an integrated system 108 00:06:57,279 --> 00:06:59,360 Speaker 3: and everything. You know, you have a thought, there's a 109 00:06:59,560 --> 00:07:04,000 Speaker 3: there's a a physiological or biological consequence to the thought. 110 00:07:04,120 --> 00:07:07,719 Speaker 3: If you have a certain thought, that might produce happy hormones, 111 00:07:07,760 --> 00:07:11,280 Speaker 3: if you have another thought that might produce stress hormones. 112 00:07:11,720 --> 00:07:15,320 Speaker 1: If you feel if you think something positive. 113 00:07:14,920 --> 00:07:18,680 Speaker 3: Your heart rate goes up or down, or for better 114 00:07:18,760 --> 00:07:21,560 Speaker 3: or worse, it depends, you know, or like I think, 115 00:07:21,600 --> 00:07:25,760 Speaker 3: trying to understand that all of these physiological things are 116 00:07:25,840 --> 00:07:30,720 Speaker 3: byproducts of experiences or thoughts or moments in time or 117 00:07:30,720 --> 00:07:35,920 Speaker 3: emotions or Yeah, it's like trying to understand the totality 118 00:07:35,960 --> 00:07:38,320 Speaker 3: of me. You know, I live in a body, but 119 00:07:38,360 --> 00:07:43,080 Speaker 3: I'm not a body. That kind of stuff as well, and. 120 00:07:42,960 --> 00:07:47,760 Speaker 2: The lack of integration is causing this big gap in 121 00:07:47,920 --> 00:07:52,480 Speaker 2: our healing practices. Yeah, because we don't want a heal 122 00:07:52,560 --> 00:07:55,920 Speaker 2: in isolation, and whether we're talking about isolated from other 123 00:07:55,960 --> 00:08:00,320 Speaker 2: people or isolated in terms of our own compartments are 124 00:08:00,520 --> 00:08:04,000 Speaker 2: being there has to be this sense of wholeness, because 125 00:08:04,000 --> 00:08:07,880 Speaker 2: that's what healing is. Healing is a return to wholeness. 126 00:08:08,080 --> 00:08:11,800 Speaker 2: But if you're not addressing the whole aspect of you, 127 00:08:12,280 --> 00:08:14,600 Speaker 2: then you're never going to return to a sense of 128 00:08:14,800 --> 00:08:17,240 Speaker 2: wholeness in the healing process. 129 00:08:17,760 --> 00:08:20,280 Speaker 3: Yes, could you tell us a bit, as much or 130 00:08:20,280 --> 00:08:22,720 Speaker 3: as little as you want about you know, being in 131 00:08:22,800 --> 00:08:25,680 Speaker 3: medical school. How old were you when you adopted your son? 132 00:08:27,280 --> 00:08:28,520 Speaker 2: I was in my twenties. 133 00:08:29,360 --> 00:08:31,320 Speaker 1: Yeah? What what? What? 134 00:08:31,400 --> 00:08:35,200 Speaker 3: How does that happen? I mean, well, firstly, amazing, well done, 135 00:08:35,320 --> 00:08:39,360 Speaker 3: you're awesome. But why does a twenty year old who 136 00:08:40,679 --> 00:08:46,319 Speaker 3: you know is uh knees deep, nose deep in study 137 00:08:46,400 --> 00:08:48,480 Speaker 3: and research and trying to get through one of the 138 00:08:48,520 --> 00:08:49,719 Speaker 3: hardest courses. 139 00:08:49,320 --> 00:08:52,480 Speaker 1: Of all time. What leads you to go and adopt 140 00:08:52,800 --> 00:08:53,320 Speaker 1: a child? 141 00:08:55,200 --> 00:08:55,720 Speaker 2: Do you want the. 142 00:08:58,080 --> 00:08:59,040 Speaker 1: Short or as long as. 143 00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:02,800 Speaker 2: Actually acceptable answer or do you want the real answer? 144 00:09:03,040 --> 00:09:04,880 Speaker 1: I want the real answer, of course. 145 00:09:07,360 --> 00:09:11,520 Speaker 2: So on the surface, it is a very noble thing 146 00:09:11,559 --> 00:09:15,600 Speaker 2: to do, right, Wow, look at you. You adopted and 147 00:09:15,720 --> 00:09:18,280 Speaker 2: you did it while you were in medical school. Wow, 148 00:09:18,400 --> 00:09:23,080 Speaker 2: how great you are. Yeah, that's the surface answer. The 149 00:09:23,200 --> 00:09:30,720 Speaker 2: real answer is I was still searching for being worthy. 150 00:09:30,800 --> 00:09:36,720 Speaker 2: I was still searching for my sense of I matter, Yeah, 151 00:09:37,120 --> 00:09:40,600 Speaker 2: And that was how it presented for me. It presented 152 00:09:40,679 --> 00:09:45,080 Speaker 2: in high functioning, always needing to accomplish, always needing to 153 00:09:45,120 --> 00:09:49,480 Speaker 2: be busy, always needing to be creating stress for myself 154 00:09:49,520 --> 00:09:53,040 Speaker 2: so that I could feel like I'm alert and active, 155 00:09:53,559 --> 00:09:56,680 Speaker 2: because if I stopped, I would feel myself going into 156 00:09:56,720 --> 00:10:00,920 Speaker 2: this heaviness and this depression was like, no, I don't 157 00:10:01,000 --> 00:10:03,880 Speaker 2: like that feeling. Of course, now I know that that 158 00:10:03,920 --> 00:10:08,000 Speaker 2: feeling is that buried trauma. And I was trying to 159 00:10:08,160 --> 00:10:14,160 Speaker 2: escape that. Don't let me be still because I might feel, Yes, 160 00:10:14,559 --> 00:10:19,320 Speaker 2: And I had the unconscious belief that if I actually 161 00:10:19,559 --> 00:10:23,840 Speaker 2: felt the pain that I was caring from my life 162 00:10:23,880 --> 00:10:27,520 Speaker 2: and childhood, I believed that I was going to fall apart. 163 00:10:27,840 --> 00:10:29,520 Speaker 2: I'd become a puddle on the floor. 164 00:10:30,320 --> 00:10:30,520 Speaker 1: Yes. 165 00:10:30,760 --> 00:10:35,760 Speaker 2: And so it was this need for constant busyness, activity 166 00:10:35,840 --> 00:10:41,960 Speaker 2: and accomplishment. My father was also adopted, so I grew 167 00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:46,120 Speaker 2: up in a family where we were we were impacted 168 00:10:46,200 --> 00:10:50,560 Speaker 2: by his unresolved pain of being adopted and him not 169 00:10:50,720 --> 00:10:57,199 Speaker 2: ever being able to feel his pain and look at 170 00:10:57,240 --> 00:11:01,640 Speaker 2: his pain. He spent his life to escape that, making 171 00:11:01,720 --> 00:11:06,600 Speaker 2: himself busy, making him himself, trying to find ways in 172 00:11:06,640 --> 00:11:11,439 Speaker 2: which he could feel like I matter, I matter, I 173 00:11:11,520 --> 00:11:16,040 Speaker 2: am wanted, I am loved, And as the middle daughter, 174 00:11:16,720 --> 00:11:20,800 Speaker 2: I ended up being the one who was emotionally closer 175 00:11:20,840 --> 00:11:23,679 Speaker 2: to him than my sisters, and I absorbed a lot 176 00:11:23,720 --> 00:11:26,840 Speaker 2: of that. I remember, even from a very early age, 177 00:11:26,880 --> 00:11:31,040 Speaker 2: being a young girl standing watching him. I'm looking up 178 00:11:31,080 --> 00:11:33,120 Speaker 2: at him, of course, and I'm looking at him being like, 179 00:11:33,920 --> 00:11:36,080 Speaker 2: what do I need to do to make you happy? 180 00:11:37,160 --> 00:11:37,520 Speaker 1: Wow? 181 00:11:38,200 --> 00:11:40,280 Speaker 2: What do I need to do to take care of you? 182 00:11:41,160 --> 00:11:44,800 Speaker 2: And I lost myself in the process. Wow, I didn't 183 00:11:44,800 --> 00:11:48,440 Speaker 2: even know who I was. Yeah, and you take that 184 00:11:48,520 --> 00:11:51,280 Speaker 2: into adulthood, and here's an opportunity that I have to 185 00:11:51,440 --> 00:11:56,080 Speaker 2: adopt as boy who was also born to a teenage mother, 186 00:11:56,280 --> 00:12:00,800 Speaker 2: just like my father, And it was re enacting this 187 00:12:00,920 --> 00:12:06,199 Speaker 2: relationship of trying to save someone else, yes, but losing 188 00:12:06,320 --> 00:12:08,080 Speaker 2: myself in the process. 189 00:12:08,559 --> 00:12:13,120 Speaker 1: Yeah. Wow, Wow, I feel a lot of people do that. 190 00:12:13,840 --> 00:12:20,319 Speaker 4: Yeah, that's so that that kind of been smooth, that 191 00:12:20,440 --> 00:12:26,240 Speaker 4: kind of been without significant hurdles, challenges, pain, chaos. 192 00:12:26,280 --> 00:12:30,439 Speaker 3: May him tease that, what give us the snapshot of that? 193 00:12:30,720 --> 00:12:34,840 Speaker 1: How do you? I feel like that's hotter than doing medicine. 194 00:12:35,640 --> 00:12:36,040 Speaker 3: It was. 195 00:12:36,320 --> 00:12:38,959 Speaker 2: It was the hardest thing I have been through and 196 00:12:39,040 --> 00:12:43,080 Speaker 2: it led to many nights on the floor on my 197 00:12:43,200 --> 00:12:48,040 Speaker 2: knees crying, I don't know how to keep going. Now, 198 00:12:48,440 --> 00:12:54,920 Speaker 2: I will give this context that he he was very 199 00:12:54,960 --> 00:12:59,400 Speaker 2: severe in his behaviors as a result of his attachment 200 00:12:59,480 --> 00:13:05,000 Speaker 2: and trust issues. And there's usually a honeymoon period when 201 00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:07,840 Speaker 2: a new child comes into your home as an adopted 202 00:13:07,920 --> 00:13:12,960 Speaker 2: child or a foster care child, and that honeymoon period 203 00:13:13,000 --> 00:13:16,160 Speaker 2: is normal, it's expected, and it's almost like they are 204 00:13:16,160 --> 00:13:20,120 Speaker 2: on their best behavior because they too are trying to matter, 205 00:13:20,240 --> 00:13:23,320 Speaker 2: They too are trying to be loved and accepted, and 206 00:13:23,360 --> 00:13:26,320 Speaker 2: they want to belong and they know that they get 207 00:13:26,320 --> 00:13:28,840 Speaker 2: their act together in order for you to not kick 208 00:13:28,920 --> 00:13:31,679 Speaker 2: them out and reject them just like they've been rejected. 209 00:13:32,360 --> 00:13:35,000 Speaker 2: But after that honeymoon period, for me, I started to 210 00:13:35,080 --> 00:13:40,840 Speaker 2: see some real disregulation, emotional disregulation Craig. One of the 211 00:13:40,880 --> 00:13:47,240 Speaker 2: things that surprised me the most was simply telling him no, 212 00:13:48,120 --> 00:13:53,520 Speaker 2: just that simple word, two letters n oh. No would 213 00:13:53,880 --> 00:13:58,319 Speaker 2: throw him off of the edge. He could not handle no. 214 00:13:58,800 --> 00:14:01,320 Speaker 2: And I don't care if this was a no, we 215 00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:03,240 Speaker 2: can't go outside and play right now because we're going 216 00:14:03,320 --> 00:14:08,400 Speaker 2: to eat dinner, or no, you can't have that treat 217 00:14:08,520 --> 00:14:12,199 Speaker 2: and that candy because for whatever reason, it didn't matter 218 00:14:12,480 --> 00:14:16,720 Speaker 2: what it was about, just the word no he could 219 00:14:16,800 --> 00:14:20,080 Speaker 2: not handle. And what that looked like for him was 220 00:14:20,200 --> 00:14:23,760 Speaker 2: a lot of aggression and anger. He would hit me, 221 00:14:24,120 --> 00:14:28,280 Speaker 2: bite me, kick me, punch me, pee on me. And 222 00:14:28,320 --> 00:14:30,120 Speaker 2: that's just the beginning of the list. 223 00:14:30,560 --> 00:14:31,000 Speaker 1: Wow. 224 00:14:32,080 --> 00:14:38,120 Speaker 2: So if he had been less severe, Wow, I would 225 00:14:38,160 --> 00:14:41,280 Speaker 2: not have been on this journey, Craig. So I look 226 00:14:41,440 --> 00:14:43,880 Speaker 2: back and I see that because of the type of 227 00:14:43,960 --> 00:14:48,120 Speaker 2: person that I was, I'm a different version of myself now, 228 00:14:48,160 --> 00:14:51,040 Speaker 2: but the kind of person that I was then, I 229 00:14:51,160 --> 00:14:55,280 Speaker 2: needed that level of challenge for it to break me 230 00:14:55,600 --> 00:14:59,800 Speaker 2: and unravel me so that I could then take a 231 00:15:00,080 --> 00:15:04,200 Speaker 2: good look at myself and see it's not just him. 232 00:15:04,640 --> 00:15:06,760 Speaker 2: I also need healing. 233 00:15:08,360 --> 00:15:10,960 Speaker 1: How does you know this is funny? 234 00:15:11,040 --> 00:15:13,480 Speaker 3: I think about this a lot like my research is 235 00:15:13,480 --> 00:15:16,840 Speaker 3: in metapception, which is understanding how other people perceive us 236 00:15:16,880 --> 00:15:21,080 Speaker 3: and understanding the so in your case would be you 237 00:15:21,120 --> 00:15:24,760 Speaker 3: know your insight into understanding the amy experience for Craig. 238 00:15:24,880 --> 00:15:28,480 Speaker 3: Right now, I've been coaching and working with people. I 239 00:15:28,520 --> 00:15:31,600 Speaker 3: owned multiple gyms, I've trained thousands of people, work with 240 00:15:31,680 --> 00:15:34,720 Speaker 3: teams and athletes. All this stuff corporate speaker. So I'm 241 00:15:34,760 --> 00:15:37,960 Speaker 3: always in front of people, and I've always been curious about, 242 00:15:38,720 --> 00:15:42,760 Speaker 3: you know, how is this experience for them, and not 243 00:15:43,000 --> 00:15:46,360 Speaker 3: from well maybe sometimes from an insecurity perspective, I guess, 244 00:15:46,360 --> 00:15:50,360 Speaker 3: but typically more curiosity because I want I want the 245 00:15:50,400 --> 00:15:54,640 Speaker 3: presentation or the meeting or the coaching to be of 246 00:15:54,760 --> 00:15:55,560 Speaker 3: value to them. 247 00:15:56,000 --> 00:15:58,680 Speaker 1: Right then, when I dive into. 248 00:15:58,480 --> 00:16:02,400 Speaker 3: The research that I've been doing, it doesn't always align 249 00:16:02,520 --> 00:16:06,960 Speaker 3: with the real world experience, and I'm like, yeah, I 250 00:16:07,000 --> 00:16:10,360 Speaker 3: know that that's how your study went, but out of 251 00:16:10,360 --> 00:16:16,600 Speaker 3: that fucking academic little pool bubble, bloody echo chamber out 252 00:16:16,600 --> 00:16:20,000 Speaker 3: here in the world, it doesn't really work like that, right, 253 00:16:20,840 --> 00:16:24,240 Speaker 3: what's that gap between what you know and what you've 254 00:16:24,480 --> 00:16:29,680 Speaker 3: experienced personally at the coal face of the shitfest of 255 00:16:29,680 --> 00:16:31,760 Speaker 3: all that? And I know you love him and it's beautiful, 256 00:16:31,760 --> 00:16:33,280 Speaker 3: but it's also been a shitfest. 257 00:16:33,280 --> 00:16:36,800 Speaker 1: I'm sure. What's the space between the. 258 00:16:36,680 --> 00:16:41,400 Speaker 3: Research and the thinking within the psychology community or whatever 259 00:16:41,640 --> 00:16:43,440 Speaker 3: and what you learned. 260 00:16:45,560 --> 00:16:46,600 Speaker 1: Oh, Craig, You're. 261 00:16:46,400 --> 00:16:49,120 Speaker 2: Taking me right deep into my experience. And this is 262 00:16:49,200 --> 00:16:53,120 Speaker 2: what the hardest part was for me. I felt so 263 00:16:53,560 --> 00:16:57,840 Speaker 2: alone in this. Yeah, because I'm looking at the research 264 00:16:58,280 --> 00:17:01,760 Speaker 2: and I'm seeing the ever evidence based studies that well, 265 00:17:01,800 --> 00:17:04,399 Speaker 2: this therapy should work, and this therapy should work. So 266 00:17:04,440 --> 00:17:07,480 Speaker 2: what do I do as a parent who is so 267 00:17:07,640 --> 00:17:12,320 Speaker 2: dedicated to finding answers for her son. I am driving hours, 268 00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:15,960 Speaker 2: I am spending all of my money for these evidence 269 00:17:16,000 --> 00:17:19,159 Speaker 2: based treatments that actually are making him worse. 270 00:17:19,920 --> 00:17:20,160 Speaker 1: Yes. 271 00:17:21,440 --> 00:17:25,480 Speaker 2: Yes, And there came a moment when for me it 272 00:17:25,640 --> 00:17:30,560 Speaker 2: changed everything, for me being willing to stop the search 273 00:17:31,480 --> 00:17:35,240 Speaker 2: for another evidence based treatment and go with my gut 274 00:17:35,359 --> 00:17:38,679 Speaker 2: for what I saw was working. This moment came on 275 00:17:38,760 --> 00:17:42,560 Speaker 2: a hot August afternoon. We had just come in from 276 00:17:42,600 --> 00:17:45,760 Speaker 2: playing outside. It was my ritual that I get home 277 00:17:45,760 --> 00:17:48,280 Speaker 2: from the hospital because, let me remind you, I'm a 278 00:17:48,320 --> 00:17:51,439 Speaker 2: medical student during this time. So by day I'm in 279 00:17:51,480 --> 00:17:55,040 Speaker 2: the hospital clinic, I'm seeing patients, and I'm coming home 280 00:17:55,359 --> 00:17:59,840 Speaker 2: and my home is like a child psych unit. It's dangerous, 281 00:18:00,359 --> 00:18:04,040 Speaker 2: it's emotional, it's reactive. I never know when something is 282 00:18:04,080 --> 00:18:07,159 Speaker 2: going to come flying at my head. And it was 283 00:18:07,280 --> 00:18:09,919 Speaker 2: just that routine that I got into. The minute I 284 00:18:09,960 --> 00:18:12,280 Speaker 2: get home, I know that he's going to have emotions 285 00:18:12,320 --> 00:18:16,040 Speaker 2: about me being home, me having left him alone all alone, right, 286 00:18:16,119 --> 00:18:19,640 Speaker 2: like leaving him in daycare during the day for him, 287 00:18:19,680 --> 00:18:21,680 Speaker 2: that was you left me, and so we're going to 288 00:18:21,760 --> 00:18:24,000 Speaker 2: need to work through some emotions. He's a boyd Let's 289 00:18:24,040 --> 00:18:27,080 Speaker 2: go outside and play, let's play ball, let's get active. 290 00:18:27,560 --> 00:18:30,439 Speaker 2: And so we're coming in from our daily routine and 291 00:18:30,480 --> 00:18:35,160 Speaker 2: now we have our daily bonding time and I pull 292 00:18:35,240 --> 00:18:37,879 Speaker 2: him up into my arms, so I'm holding him. His 293 00:18:38,000 --> 00:18:40,560 Speaker 2: head is in my shoulder or my elbow as if 294 00:18:40,560 --> 00:18:43,840 Speaker 2: he were a little baby, and I rock him as 295 00:18:43,880 --> 00:18:47,399 Speaker 2: I always do to kind of promote that relaxation and 296 00:18:47,440 --> 00:18:50,520 Speaker 2: that bonding and this, you know, like attachment stuff that 297 00:18:50,560 --> 00:18:54,800 Speaker 2: I'm supposed to be doing. And I was not prepared 298 00:18:54,840 --> 00:18:58,760 Speaker 2: for what he was going to say next. He said, Mommy, 299 00:19:00,080 --> 00:19:01,560 Speaker 2: I'm going to kill you tomorrow. 300 00:19:02,880 --> 00:19:03,160 Speaker 1: Wow. 301 00:19:03,440 --> 00:19:09,280 Speaker 2: Not today, Mommy tomorrow wow. And he talked about it 302 00:19:09,359 --> 00:19:12,080 Speaker 2: as if it were talking about what we were going 303 00:19:12,119 --> 00:19:14,960 Speaker 2: to have for dinner. It was very casual for him. 304 00:19:15,000 --> 00:19:18,879 Speaker 2: It was very pallast for him. And he went on 305 00:19:19,000 --> 00:19:22,000 Speaker 2: to say that he was going to start by poking 306 00:19:22,040 --> 00:19:23,720 Speaker 2: my eyes out with sticks. 307 00:19:24,400 --> 00:19:27,800 Speaker 1: Wow. How old was he at this stage. 308 00:19:28,400 --> 00:19:30,840 Speaker 2: At that moment in that rocking chair? He was five? 309 00:19:33,400 --> 00:19:33,680 Speaker 1: Wow. 310 00:19:34,520 --> 00:19:37,639 Speaker 2: And we I mean talk about the perception that people 311 00:19:37,720 --> 00:19:40,840 Speaker 2: have of you. This is what he was going through. 312 00:19:41,240 --> 00:19:47,399 Speaker 2: He had an experience of what mom meant to him. Yes, 313 00:19:47,760 --> 00:19:51,960 Speaker 2: Mom meant someone who says she loves you and then 314 00:19:52,040 --> 00:19:57,440 Speaker 2: forgets to feed you. Yes, who abandons you, who prefers 315 00:19:57,640 --> 00:20:01,760 Speaker 2: for him. His birth mom preferred substances and drugs and 316 00:20:01,800 --> 00:20:06,000 Speaker 2: her friends to caring for him. He had fallen off 317 00:20:06,000 --> 00:20:08,680 Speaker 2: of a bed and broken his collarbone, and she had 318 00:20:08,720 --> 00:20:13,480 Speaker 2: never taken him to the hospital. So that for him 319 00:20:13,760 --> 00:20:19,879 Speaker 2: was his body's implicit memory of what Mom meant. And 320 00:20:19,960 --> 00:20:22,639 Speaker 2: so then when I step into the role of now 321 00:20:22,680 --> 00:20:28,320 Speaker 2: he's calling me mom, I'm getting his perception of mom, 322 00:20:28,720 --> 00:20:33,399 Speaker 2: and he wants nothing to do with me, even though 323 00:20:33,680 --> 00:20:38,080 Speaker 2: I am not that mom. Yeah yeah, yeah, But that's 324 00:20:38,280 --> 00:20:42,640 Speaker 2: not what his brain and his body were wired to believe. 325 00:20:43,080 --> 00:20:46,040 Speaker 2: And this is what trauma does for us. Trauma creates 326 00:20:46,080 --> 00:20:52,119 Speaker 2: these beliefs that are so deep beyond our conscious control. Logically, 327 00:20:52,240 --> 00:20:54,119 Speaker 2: he could look at me and he would even tell me. 328 00:20:54,160 --> 00:20:55,960 Speaker 2: He'd put his arm next to my arm and he'd 329 00:20:55,960 --> 00:20:59,440 Speaker 2: be like, mom, we're different colors, because he was full hispanic. 330 00:21:00,000 --> 00:21:04,560 Speaker 2: I know, look at that. So he could consciously understand 331 00:21:04,680 --> 00:21:08,439 Speaker 2: I am not his biological mom, I am not that mom. 332 00:21:08,960 --> 00:21:12,720 Speaker 2: But his body and his brain had these experiences that 333 00:21:12,840 --> 00:21:16,359 Speaker 2: had been so terrifying for him, and that is what 334 00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:20,200 Speaker 2: trauma is. Trauma is a moment where we feel terrified 335 00:21:20,640 --> 00:21:24,400 Speaker 2: for our life. Yeah, and the body holds onto those 336 00:21:24,440 --> 00:21:29,840 Speaker 2: experiences and creates our perception of the world, of others 337 00:21:30,080 --> 00:21:34,680 Speaker 2: and even ourselves. And so he had from a perception 338 00:21:34,760 --> 00:21:36,840 Speaker 2: of himself that he was unlovable. 339 00:21:38,040 --> 00:21:40,040 Speaker 3: How do you protect you in the middle of that, 340 00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:43,359 Speaker 3: because obviously, in that moment, your priority is him and 341 00:21:43,440 --> 00:21:47,280 Speaker 3: his well being and physical, mental, and emotional health and 342 00:21:47,560 --> 00:21:52,119 Speaker 3: an opportunity for him to flourish, which is why you 343 00:21:52,200 --> 00:21:53,760 Speaker 3: or a big part I guess of why you brought 344 00:21:53,840 --> 00:21:58,520 Speaker 3: him into your life. But at the same time, there's 345 00:21:58,600 --> 00:22:04,160 Speaker 3: you as well, like you'll, I mean, you know, you're 346 00:22:04,200 --> 00:22:07,119 Speaker 3: a baby yourself, kind of trying to figure out your 347 00:22:07,160 --> 00:22:11,679 Speaker 3: own shit, right, trying not to have a meltdown. And 348 00:22:11,760 --> 00:22:16,120 Speaker 3: then how do you not let his trauma become your trauma? 349 00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:19,280 Speaker 1: How do you keep how do you keep it together? 350 00:22:21,119 --> 00:22:24,119 Speaker 2: I had none of those skills at that time, Craig, 351 00:22:24,840 --> 00:22:27,840 Speaker 2: As you say, I was a baby. This was my 352 00:22:27,960 --> 00:22:30,600 Speaker 2: initiation into all of this. I didn't know what I 353 00:22:30,720 --> 00:22:31,119 Speaker 2: was doing. 354 00:22:31,720 --> 00:22:34,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, and this was. 355 00:22:34,359 --> 00:22:37,160 Speaker 2: How I learned all of this. I went into this 356 00:22:37,280 --> 00:22:42,280 Speaker 2: experience Craig feeling. I think. I think I am assuming 357 00:22:42,359 --> 00:22:45,640 Speaker 2: like a lot of twenty year olds do, right, Like, oh, okay, 358 00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:49,439 Speaker 2: you know, I've got these big dreams and plans for 359 00:22:49,560 --> 00:22:53,760 Speaker 2: my life, not realizing like how life actually goes, not 360 00:22:53,800 --> 00:22:57,520 Speaker 2: according to your plans, and and so then to come 361 00:22:57,680 --> 00:23:01,080 Speaker 2: face to face with this kind of experience it was 362 00:23:01,760 --> 00:23:05,439 Speaker 2: I mean, it was my wake up call that made 363 00:23:05,480 --> 00:23:08,320 Speaker 2: me become a different person. Now I could have chosen 364 00:23:08,359 --> 00:23:12,040 Speaker 2: a different path. I chose to go on my own 365 00:23:12,160 --> 00:23:15,479 Speaker 2: healing journey and to look at my shit. But I 366 00:23:15,520 --> 00:23:17,600 Speaker 2: could have chose not to. And I know that a 367 00:23:17,640 --> 00:23:20,960 Speaker 2: lot of parents choose not to, and that's okay too. 368 00:23:21,440 --> 00:23:25,639 Speaker 2: But this experience definitely took me from someone who was 369 00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:31,879 Speaker 2: a I would say, a professional perfectionist, a professional sure thrower, 370 00:23:32,440 --> 00:23:35,919 Speaker 2: meaning I am going to, you know, lose myself and 371 00:23:36,160 --> 00:23:38,480 Speaker 2: just take care of you and make sure that you're okay, 372 00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:42,600 Speaker 2: to realizing actually and I know this may come as 373 00:23:42,600 --> 00:23:44,840 Speaker 2: a shock to a lot of people for me to 374 00:23:44,960 --> 00:23:48,160 Speaker 2: say this kind of thing, but I had to come 375 00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:51,600 Speaker 2: to the place where I saw that in our relationship, 376 00:23:51,800 --> 00:23:56,240 Speaker 2: me and him, he was not the most important one. 377 00:23:56,480 --> 00:24:00,600 Speaker 2: The most important person in that relationship was me, because 378 00:24:00,600 --> 00:24:04,840 Speaker 2: if I'm not okay, there's no chance that he has 379 00:24:05,240 --> 00:24:05,959 Speaker 2: to be okay. 380 00:24:07,160 --> 00:24:08,480 Speaker 1: Yeah I have my. 381 00:24:09,600 --> 00:24:12,679 Speaker 2: Nervous system is not regulated. There is no way that 382 00:24:12,840 --> 00:24:16,800 Speaker 2: his nervous system has any chance of becoming regulated because 383 00:24:16,840 --> 00:24:21,280 Speaker 2: he needs me to be that anchor for him. 384 00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:26,880 Speaker 3: I think that's one of the ironies of prioritizing you. 385 00:24:27,080 --> 00:24:31,399 Speaker 3: It seems selfish, it's actually really quite it's quite aware 386 00:24:31,440 --> 00:24:35,320 Speaker 3: and quite evolved thinking. Because if every day you start 387 00:24:35,480 --> 00:24:40,320 Speaker 3: and your physically, mentally emotionally you're a three out of ten, Well, 388 00:24:41,000 --> 00:24:42,840 Speaker 3: you can't be a great mum, you can't be a 389 00:24:42,840 --> 00:24:45,280 Speaker 3: great listener, you can't be a great problem solve it 390 00:24:45,440 --> 00:24:48,600 Speaker 3: definitely can't be a great doctor, you know. So this 391 00:24:49,720 --> 00:24:51,680 Speaker 3: I always say, it's nice to be nice, but it's 392 00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:55,000 Speaker 3: not nice to be a doormat, right, and so looking 393 00:24:55,080 --> 00:25:01,520 Speaker 3: after you to be kind and compassionate to yourself first. Yeah, 394 00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:06,119 Speaker 3: I think that too, Like personally, like I've got really 395 00:25:06,240 --> 00:25:08,919 Speaker 3: old parents, who are you know, there's a few challenges 396 00:25:08,920 --> 00:25:10,280 Speaker 3: and I deal with a lot of people and I 397 00:25:10,320 --> 00:25:13,240 Speaker 3: talk to a lot of people, a lot of people 398 00:25:13,280 --> 00:25:16,280 Speaker 3: every week who have got like way bigger problems and 399 00:25:16,320 --> 00:25:19,159 Speaker 3: issues than me. My life's great. I'm very lucky. I 400 00:25:19,200 --> 00:25:21,760 Speaker 3: really don't have any you know, so I'm very grateful. 401 00:25:21,840 --> 00:25:25,760 Speaker 3: But I'm also aware that I need to I need 402 00:25:25,800 --> 00:25:28,280 Speaker 3: to be in good shape and I buy that. I 403 00:25:28,320 --> 00:25:31,919 Speaker 3: mean primarily mentally and emotionally, so that I can be 404 00:25:32,600 --> 00:25:37,040 Speaker 3: in a place to do what I do hopefully as 405 00:25:37,040 --> 00:25:40,240 Speaker 3: well as you know, my ability allows, you know, even 406 00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:44,000 Speaker 3: on a podcast, which is obviously really informal, but at 407 00:25:44,000 --> 00:25:47,199 Speaker 3: the same time, I've done nearly two thousand and every time. 408 00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:51,040 Speaker 3: My goal is that this is the best podcast I've 409 00:25:51,080 --> 00:25:53,040 Speaker 3: ever done. This is the best chat we've ever had. 410 00:25:53,280 --> 00:25:56,359 Speaker 3: This is something that people want to listen to and 411 00:25:56,400 --> 00:25:59,000 Speaker 3: tell people about and share. And not for my numbers 412 00:25:59,000 --> 00:26:01,879 Speaker 3: and not for my ego, but because it's valuable for people, 413 00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:04,640 Speaker 3: you know, so that people go, fuck, did you listen 414 00:26:04,680 --> 00:26:07,240 Speaker 3: to doctor Amy? You've got to listen to this, You've 415 00:26:07,280 --> 00:26:12,480 Speaker 3: got to like that's but you can't be that best 416 00:26:12,640 --> 00:26:14,200 Speaker 3: version of you without. 417 00:26:13,880 --> 00:26:15,960 Speaker 1: Prioritizing you to some extent. 418 00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:22,840 Speaker 3: I want to ask, what, what is something that you 419 00:26:24,040 --> 00:26:28,399 Speaker 3: know about you? I'm talking about self awareness now, something 420 00:26:28,440 --> 00:26:31,480 Speaker 3: that you know and understand about you really clearly that 421 00:26:31,560 --> 00:26:35,000 Speaker 3: you had no idea of when you're in this starting 422 00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:39,800 Speaker 3: this journey, where do I start. 423 00:26:41,560 --> 00:26:44,160 Speaker 2: It's a long It's a long list. And that's why 424 00:26:45,040 --> 00:26:47,080 Speaker 2: that's why it was actually so hard for me to 425 00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:50,919 Speaker 2: write this book that I wrote, because it was taking 426 00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:55,360 Speaker 2: everything that I've learned and how do I present it 427 00:26:55,400 --> 00:26:58,440 Speaker 2: in a way that it makes sense to someone else, 428 00:26:58,720 --> 00:27:03,960 Speaker 2: Because for me, Craig was literally learning the manual for 429 00:27:04,200 --> 00:27:08,240 Speaker 2: my body. Yes, and even as I say that, I 430 00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:12,120 Speaker 2: know the irony of that, because here I had gone 431 00:27:12,119 --> 00:27:16,880 Speaker 2: to medical school. My bachelor's degree is in cell biology, 432 00:27:18,119 --> 00:27:21,560 Speaker 2: I went through residency, and yet I got to the 433 00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:24,040 Speaker 2: end of that and I still really truly did not 434 00:27:24,200 --> 00:27:29,400 Speaker 2: understand how my nervous system works. What had been trauma 435 00:27:29,520 --> 00:27:32,120 Speaker 2: for me in my life and not just a stress 436 00:27:32,200 --> 00:27:36,719 Speaker 2: like I had said it was, and my nervous system 437 00:27:36,840 --> 00:27:43,280 Speaker 2: helps me survive life, navigate grief and loss, overcome my 438 00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:48,840 Speaker 2: childhood dynamics. I didn't know any of this, even as 439 00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:52,000 Speaker 2: a physician. And so for me to actually be able 440 00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:55,480 Speaker 2: to understand the three states of my nervous system, be 441 00:27:55,520 --> 00:27:58,760 Speaker 2: able to know which state am I end in any 442 00:27:58,880 --> 00:28:02,359 Speaker 2: given moment, what does my body then in order to 443 00:28:02,440 --> 00:28:05,919 Speaker 2: feel safe enough so that it doesn't continue to go 444 00:28:05,960 --> 00:28:10,000 Speaker 2: into those survival patterns and recreate the stories that I 445 00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:13,600 Speaker 2: don't want to be re enacting. I mean, just having 446 00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:18,600 Speaker 2: the manual from my human body has been the biggest 447 00:28:18,680 --> 00:28:19,680 Speaker 2: change in my life. 448 00:28:20,480 --> 00:28:26,000 Speaker 3: Wow, do you feel like, Okay, I'm going to say 449 00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:28,200 Speaker 3: what I feel, and then I want to know whether 450 00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:29,280 Speaker 3: or not that aligns with you. 451 00:28:29,480 --> 00:28:31,240 Speaker 1: I feel like over the years that. 452 00:28:31,200 --> 00:28:33,960 Speaker 3: We've become more and more disconnected from our body for 453 00:28:34,040 --> 00:28:37,159 Speaker 3: a range of reasons. I feel like our body, of course, 454 00:28:37,240 --> 00:28:40,320 Speaker 3: is its own wisdom. You know, it's always speaking to 455 00:28:40,440 --> 00:28:44,120 Speaker 3: us by feedback. You know, like it's brilliant, it's telling 456 00:28:44,160 --> 00:28:47,840 Speaker 3: me something, but I'm ignoring it, or I'm taking a 457 00:28:47,920 --> 00:28:52,120 Speaker 3: drug to alleviate the symptom that's like a strong message 458 00:28:52,120 --> 00:28:56,880 Speaker 3: about or whatever. And I feel like, we know the 459 00:28:56,920 --> 00:28:59,480 Speaker 3: average person knows more about their iPhone than they do 460 00:28:59,560 --> 00:29:00,479 Speaker 3: about their body. 461 00:29:01,160 --> 00:29:04,720 Speaker 1: I think that's a problem, Right, It is a problem. 462 00:29:04,800 --> 00:29:07,440 Speaker 2: And yet I would also say it's not really our fault. 463 00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:10,720 Speaker 2: I mean, who's given us the app that comes with 464 00:29:10,760 --> 00:29:13,360 Speaker 2: a manual? Right? We get that when we order something 465 00:29:13,400 --> 00:29:16,600 Speaker 2: from Amazon, here's your product, here's your manual for how 466 00:29:16,640 --> 00:29:19,800 Speaker 2: to use it. We never got that with our body. 467 00:29:19,840 --> 00:29:23,120 Speaker 2: And even as I look at our educational system, we 468 00:29:23,760 --> 00:29:28,600 Speaker 2: do not do our education in a way that aligns 469 00:29:28,680 --> 00:29:33,240 Speaker 2: with how the nervous system needs to experience life to 470 00:29:33,560 --> 00:29:40,840 Speaker 2: move to process what we're learning. So our whole society 471 00:29:41,480 --> 00:29:47,000 Speaker 2: is still promoting a sense of disconnection that only feeds 472 00:29:47,000 --> 00:29:49,000 Speaker 2: itself and becomes worse with time. 473 00:29:50,280 --> 00:29:53,720 Speaker 3: Yeah, how do we then build a relationship with our 474 00:29:53,760 --> 00:29:58,200 Speaker 3: body built around writer awareness and empathy and understanding so 475 00:29:58,240 --> 00:30:02,640 Speaker 3: that we can I might better decision, self regulate, more 476 00:30:02,680 --> 00:30:10,000 Speaker 3: effectively navigate life with this like increased connectivity with our body, 477 00:30:11,120 --> 00:30:11,960 Speaker 3: That's the question. 478 00:30:12,720 --> 00:30:15,680 Speaker 2: I remember that I had a patient and her name 479 00:30:15,720 --> 00:30:20,320 Speaker 2: was Elena, and she developed automunity one year after a 480 00:30:20,320 --> 00:30:21,000 Speaker 2: car accident. 481 00:30:22,400 --> 00:30:23,080 Speaker 1: Yeah. 482 00:30:23,160 --> 00:30:25,600 Speaker 2: I remember the first conversation that I had with her, 483 00:30:26,600 --> 00:30:30,440 Speaker 2: and she was thinking that there was no relationship of 484 00:30:30,480 --> 00:30:34,760 Speaker 2: her automunity diagnosis with anything else in her life. Yes, 485 00:30:35,720 --> 00:30:39,040 Speaker 2: it came out of the blue for her, and so 486 00:30:39,160 --> 00:30:42,480 Speaker 2: as I just started asking her some simple questions around 487 00:30:44,680 --> 00:30:48,160 Speaker 2: what happened in your childhood? What was a time in 488 00:30:48,280 --> 00:30:54,400 Speaker 2: your childhood where you didn't want to be alive, you 489 00:30:54,440 --> 00:31:00,040 Speaker 2: didn't want your reality? Yeah, And I remember the the 490 00:31:00,160 --> 00:31:03,920 Speaker 2: action that her body gave me. It was this horrified 491 00:31:04,160 --> 00:31:09,640 Speaker 2: pulling back. I don't even want to think about that. Yeah, 492 00:31:09,720 --> 00:31:11,560 Speaker 2: but that's how it shows up for a lot of people. 493 00:31:11,640 --> 00:31:15,920 Speaker 2: Is there's pain that's so buried. I don't want to 494 00:31:16,040 --> 00:31:18,959 Speaker 2: look at that. And so why would I want to 495 00:31:19,000 --> 00:31:24,200 Speaker 2: connect with my body? I intentionally don't want to feel 496 00:31:24,280 --> 00:31:27,520 Speaker 2: and connect. And I didn't think much of it until 497 00:31:27,560 --> 00:31:30,200 Speaker 2: I moved all the way into my addiction medicine practice, 498 00:31:30,280 --> 00:31:33,840 Speaker 2: and this was where it came all full to the head. 499 00:31:33,840 --> 00:31:36,720 Speaker 2: Where I'm working with a patient and I'm trying to 500 00:31:36,800 --> 00:31:39,840 Speaker 2: detox them off of a substance. And Craig, what they're 501 00:31:39,880 --> 00:31:45,480 Speaker 2: telling me is, but my substance use isn't the problem. 502 00:31:46,040 --> 00:31:50,120 Speaker 2: I only use the substance because I don't like to feel. 503 00:31:51,760 --> 00:31:54,760 Speaker 2: I don't like to feel my body. My body has 504 00:31:54,800 --> 00:32:00,440 Speaker 2: been through horrible things. My body isn't pain pain and 505 00:32:00,520 --> 00:32:05,240 Speaker 2: emotional pain. Why tell me again? Why no, no, no, doc. 506 00:32:05,480 --> 00:32:08,400 Speaker 2: I want to stay on my substance. I just don't 507 00:32:08,400 --> 00:32:10,760 Speaker 2: want it to ruin my life anymore. But I don't 508 00:32:10,760 --> 00:32:14,320 Speaker 2: want to get off my substance. And so Craig, like, 509 00:32:14,400 --> 00:32:16,640 Speaker 2: this is what I started to see as a physician. 510 00:32:17,240 --> 00:32:21,200 Speaker 2: Everyone is living disconnected, and how do I take that individual, 511 00:32:21,240 --> 00:32:24,640 Speaker 2: whether it's Elena and her automunity, or whether it's a 512 00:32:24,920 --> 00:32:29,640 Speaker 2: patient who's addicted and dependent on substances to not feel 513 00:32:30,120 --> 00:32:32,600 Speaker 2: and be able to tell them no, no, no, no, feeling 514 00:32:32,680 --> 00:32:35,960 Speaker 2: is safe. No no, no, connect with your body, because 515 00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:40,040 Speaker 2: they are literally telling me, oh no, that is the 516 00:32:40,240 --> 00:32:42,440 Speaker 2: last thing that I want to do, and I do 517 00:32:42,560 --> 00:32:46,560 Speaker 2: these things in order to not connect and feel. So 518 00:32:46,680 --> 00:32:49,640 Speaker 2: that was when I realized, I've got to change my game, 519 00:32:49,840 --> 00:32:52,360 Speaker 2: because if I'm just telling them, oh, you need to 520 00:32:52,400 --> 00:32:55,000 Speaker 2: do this mind body connection thing, They're not going to 521 00:32:55,040 --> 00:32:57,120 Speaker 2: do it and they're not going to get better. So 522 00:32:57,200 --> 00:33:00,320 Speaker 2: I actually had to break things down and creates such 523 00:33:00,360 --> 00:33:05,280 Speaker 2: a simple first step that even they would be successful 524 00:33:05,320 --> 00:33:09,160 Speaker 2: at it. And here's what I learned, Craig. For them, 525 00:33:09,960 --> 00:33:13,200 Speaker 2: it's not safe to feel safe. 526 00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:16,280 Speaker 1: What's that mean? 527 00:33:17,080 --> 00:33:19,360 Speaker 2: It means that when they if they were to really 528 00:33:19,400 --> 00:33:21,800 Speaker 2: feel safe, they would relax. 529 00:33:22,560 --> 00:33:24,120 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, if they. 530 00:33:24,040 --> 00:33:31,520 Speaker 2: Relax, their guard comes down. If they relax, their defenses soften, 531 00:33:32,240 --> 00:33:36,320 Speaker 2: and for them, that means I'm going to feel and 532 00:33:36,440 --> 00:33:40,280 Speaker 2: that is not safe. So they had built their whole 533 00:33:40,360 --> 00:33:48,440 Speaker 2: life around not allowing themselves to truly feel safe, relax 534 00:33:48,600 --> 00:33:53,000 Speaker 2: and connect with themselves. And so I had to create 535 00:33:53,040 --> 00:33:55,920 Speaker 2: that first step of connecting with their body to be 536 00:33:56,040 --> 00:33:57,960 Speaker 2: so small you're going to probably laugh at this, and 537 00:33:58,000 --> 00:34:02,400 Speaker 2: that's fine. I called it microdosing safety. 538 00:34:03,320 --> 00:34:03,600 Speaker 1: Yeah. 539 00:34:04,320 --> 00:34:06,959 Speaker 2: I had to give them such a small dose of 540 00:34:07,040 --> 00:34:10,759 Speaker 2: feeling safe to connect that they weren't scared of it, 541 00:34:11,520 --> 00:34:13,880 Speaker 2: and that they would do it again on their own 542 00:34:14,160 --> 00:34:18,839 Speaker 2: to practice building those neural pathways. So I would give 543 00:34:18,880 --> 00:34:21,160 Speaker 2: them homework because if you're only going to do it 544 00:34:21,200 --> 00:34:23,319 Speaker 2: with me, that's not going to be enough. I need 545 00:34:23,360 --> 00:34:26,399 Speaker 2: you doing this every single day to build those new 546 00:34:26,440 --> 00:34:30,920 Speaker 2: neural pathways that tell yourself it is now safe to 547 00:34:31,000 --> 00:34:33,560 Speaker 2: connect with my body. But we had to start with 548 00:34:33,800 --> 00:34:39,120 Speaker 2: micro moments, microdoses of ten seconds of actually just connecting 549 00:34:39,120 --> 00:34:42,080 Speaker 2: with your body. Ten seconds was sometimes all that they 550 00:34:42,120 --> 00:34:44,879 Speaker 2: could handle. I would have them feel their heart beat. 551 00:34:45,560 --> 00:34:50,240 Speaker 2: Just notice your heart beat, Notice your heart working hard 552 00:34:50,280 --> 00:34:53,160 Speaker 2: to keep you alive, and they'd notice it. And then 553 00:34:53,200 --> 00:34:56,359 Speaker 2: about five six, seven seconds in, they're getting uncomfortable because 554 00:34:56,360 --> 00:35:00,000 Speaker 2: they're actually pausing and feeling and so we need to 555 00:35:00,080 --> 00:35:02,719 Speaker 2: the rut attention. Okay, and now let's talk about the 556 00:35:02,760 --> 00:35:06,080 Speaker 2: weather again. Now let's talk about the project you have 557 00:35:06,239 --> 00:35:11,160 Speaker 2: going on, because more time just feeling their body was 558 00:35:11,239 --> 00:35:15,000 Speaker 2: not something they could tolerate at the beginning. This is 559 00:35:15,120 --> 00:35:18,759 Speaker 2: how much we have become a disconnected society. 560 00:35:19,600 --> 00:35:22,960 Speaker 3: And the interesting Wow, that firstly, well done, that's amazing. 561 00:35:23,160 --> 00:35:26,680 Speaker 3: But what is interesting is a bunch of things. One, 562 00:35:26,840 --> 00:35:28,480 Speaker 3: so you can put a drug in your body that's 563 00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:32,040 Speaker 3: going to change your physiology, right, you can also have 564 00:35:32,080 --> 00:35:35,399 Speaker 3: another thought that'll change your physiology. You can also go 565 00:35:35,560 --> 00:35:39,160 Speaker 3: do something that'll change your biochemistry and physiology. Right. It's 566 00:35:39,200 --> 00:35:45,040 Speaker 3: like we can create all of these internal responses by 567 00:35:45,120 --> 00:35:48,719 Speaker 3: doing a range of things that you know can can 568 00:35:48,920 --> 00:35:51,800 Speaker 3: change the biochemistry of our brain, from taking a drug 569 00:35:51,880 --> 00:35:54,520 Speaker 3: tube for me, riding a motorbike to someone lying on 570 00:35:54,560 --> 00:35:57,759 Speaker 3: the floor with a Golden retriever just freaking out, you know, 571 00:35:57,840 --> 00:36:01,480 Speaker 3: having fun for somebody else, a hot shower for somebody else, 572 00:36:01,520 --> 00:36:03,840 Speaker 3: as cigarette and a cup of coffee in the morning, 573 00:36:03,880 --> 00:36:04,680 Speaker 3: looking at the sun. 574 00:36:04,840 --> 00:36:05,040 Speaker 1: Right. 575 00:36:06,560 --> 00:36:10,279 Speaker 3: But also that I guess the complexity of this is 576 00:36:11,080 --> 00:36:13,880 Speaker 3: that what you'll do with John won't work with Jack 577 00:36:14,680 --> 00:36:16,040 Speaker 3: the exact same protocol. 578 00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:18,680 Speaker 1: It'd be brilliant for Jane. You need to do a 579 00:36:18,760 --> 00:36:21,239 Speaker 1: little bit less for Dolly and a bit more. 580 00:36:21,360 --> 00:36:24,120 Speaker 3: You know what I'm saying, it's like there's no single 581 00:36:24,239 --> 00:36:27,279 Speaker 3: protocol even though they might have the same symptoms or 582 00:36:27,320 --> 00:36:30,000 Speaker 3: similar or the same issue or the same what we 583 00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:34,920 Speaker 3: might call sickness, that there is no three step plan 584 00:36:35,000 --> 00:36:38,920 Speaker 3: that you universally is or is as universally effective for 585 00:36:39,040 --> 00:36:42,640 Speaker 3: every individual. So you've got to figure that out in 586 00:36:42,719 --> 00:36:46,759 Speaker 3: real time and go, let's open this door. No, fuck 587 00:36:46,800 --> 00:36:50,839 Speaker 3: that door, shut that door, Let's try this. Okay, this 588 00:36:50,920 --> 00:36:54,879 Speaker 3: is a better door. Right, that's really problem solving one 589 00:36:54,920 --> 00:37:00,600 Speaker 3: oh one in real time. And that's like that that 590 00:37:00,760 --> 00:37:04,960 Speaker 3: is the hardest but probably the most effective in inverticoma's medicine. 591 00:37:06,800 --> 00:37:10,120 Speaker 2: And this circles us back to how you started this podcast, Craig, 592 00:37:10,160 --> 00:37:13,120 Speaker 2: which was asking, I'm seeing that there's a lot of 593 00:37:13,200 --> 00:37:17,520 Speaker 2: therapy and treatment protocols that aren't really effective. And this 594 00:37:17,719 --> 00:37:21,800 Speaker 2: is why, because they're a protocol, they're not actually personalized. 595 00:37:22,400 --> 00:37:26,000 Speaker 2: And I'm liking it to going into the gym, Jane 596 00:37:26,040 --> 00:37:28,760 Speaker 2: is walking into the gym, Jack and John are walking 597 00:37:28,800 --> 00:37:30,480 Speaker 2: into the gym. They're all walking into the gym at 598 00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:33,160 Speaker 2: the same time. Are they all going to be lifting 599 00:37:33,239 --> 00:37:37,880 Speaker 2: the same weight? Well, no, because for one thing, John 600 00:37:38,200 --> 00:37:41,080 Speaker 2: is you know, hasn't taken care of himself. He's walking 601 00:37:41,120 --> 00:37:44,200 Speaker 2: in the gym and hasn't been in any exercise regimen 602 00:37:44,280 --> 00:37:47,520 Speaker 2: for thirty years, so his tolerance is really small. You're 603 00:37:47,560 --> 00:37:50,120 Speaker 2: not going to start him with something so heavy that 604 00:37:50,200 --> 00:37:53,200 Speaker 2: he's going to break. His body's going to break. But 605 00:37:53,760 --> 00:37:56,319 Speaker 2: you know Joe, well, he's been walking into the same 606 00:37:56,360 --> 00:37:59,640 Speaker 2: gem through the last thirty years. So if you gave 607 00:37:59,760 --> 00:38:02,680 Speaker 2: him the same weight as Jane, he's going to be like, 608 00:38:03,239 --> 00:38:05,640 Speaker 2: why am I even here? This isn't doing me any good, 609 00:38:06,080 --> 00:38:10,440 Speaker 2: This isn't growing my muscles, this isn't even helping me 610 00:38:11,200 --> 00:38:13,880 Speaker 2: have a better day, Like this is nothing for me, 611 00:38:15,160 --> 00:38:17,960 Speaker 2: and so it really does need to be personalized. But 612 00:38:18,080 --> 00:38:22,680 Speaker 2: here's the thing. Most practitioners don't have the integration of 613 00:38:22,719 --> 00:38:25,479 Speaker 2: the skills to be able to personalize it. They only 614 00:38:25,520 --> 00:38:29,839 Speaker 2: have one tool. They only got trained in CBT. So yeah, 615 00:38:29,960 --> 00:38:32,359 Speaker 2: that's what you're going to get. But what if you're 616 00:38:32,440 --> 00:38:36,120 Speaker 2: that person where the mind is not the entry point 617 00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:40,359 Speaker 2: for you, your entry point is actually the body, or maybe 618 00:38:40,400 --> 00:38:43,520 Speaker 2: your entry point is more the biology. But if they 619 00:38:43,520 --> 00:38:45,799 Speaker 2: don't have those tools, then maybe they don't even have 620 00:38:46,640 --> 00:38:50,600 Speaker 2: They don't even have that knowledge to know that these 621 00:38:50,600 --> 00:38:52,560 Speaker 2: are other entry points and that you should go to 622 00:38:52,600 --> 00:38:56,640 Speaker 2: see someone first who has this skill set. You're getting 623 00:38:56,920 --> 00:38:58,200 Speaker 2: the protocol. 624 00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:01,160 Speaker 1: That's not love that for you. You know the. 625 00:39:02,640 --> 00:39:06,440 Speaker 3: Analogy to that or the comparison to that. From my background, right, 626 00:39:06,520 --> 00:39:08,120 Speaker 3: so I grew up in gyms and all of that 627 00:39:08,239 --> 00:39:12,279 Speaker 3: exercise science, all that stuff and just f y I 628 00:39:13,239 --> 00:39:15,960 Speaker 3: kind of I set up the first personal training facility 629 00:39:16,000 --> 00:39:18,359 Speaker 3: in Australia thirty five years ago. So I was in 630 00:39:18,400 --> 00:39:21,040 Speaker 3: on the ground floor, very lucky, lots of fun. But 631 00:39:24,160 --> 00:39:28,239 Speaker 3: if you even still most gyms, you're going if you 632 00:39:28,320 --> 00:39:31,760 Speaker 3: see a trainer, whatever the trainer does. If the trainer 633 00:39:31,840 --> 00:39:35,160 Speaker 3: is a bodybuilder, then he or she will train most 634 00:39:35,160 --> 00:39:37,600 Speaker 3: of their clients like bodybuilders. 635 00:39:37,920 --> 00:39:39,000 Speaker 1: If there are. 636 00:39:39,120 --> 00:39:42,520 Speaker 3: If they're a functional practitioner, they do they do all 637 00:39:42,719 --> 00:39:46,200 Speaker 3: you know function then everyone's going to do functional training, right, 638 00:39:46,239 --> 00:39:48,200 Speaker 3: which I'm not saying any of they is good or bad. Right, 639 00:39:48,800 --> 00:39:51,720 Speaker 3: Or if they're an endurance athlete, then everyone's fucking running 640 00:39:51,719 --> 00:39:53,480 Speaker 3: and riding and doing interval sprints. 641 00:39:53,480 --> 00:39:55,200 Speaker 1: And you know, it's like. 642 00:39:55,440 --> 00:40:00,320 Speaker 3: They they train people the way they train themselves because 643 00:40:00,320 --> 00:40:03,319 Speaker 3: they essentially live in an echo chamber of thought and 644 00:40:03,360 --> 00:40:06,600 Speaker 3: behavior and protocol and now it doesn't matter what your 645 00:40:06,760 --> 00:40:08,359 Speaker 3: actual personal needs are. 646 00:40:08,800 --> 00:40:12,960 Speaker 1: You're on the bench press chap, you know. 647 00:40:13,640 --> 00:40:16,360 Speaker 2: And so people ask me, well, you know, does emd 648 00:40:16,560 --> 00:40:21,440 Speaker 2: R work, does horse therapy work? And I'm like, depends 649 00:40:21,480 --> 00:40:25,000 Speaker 2: on what you're trying to accomplish. But I will be 650 00:40:25,160 --> 00:40:28,840 Speaker 2: you exactly. I will tell you that if you really 651 00:40:28,880 --> 00:40:33,719 Speaker 2: want to make the most change, yeah, the fastest, the 652 00:40:33,719 --> 00:40:37,360 Speaker 2: biggest bang for your buck, Yeah, you're going to want 653 00:40:37,480 --> 00:40:44,600 Speaker 2: to seek out the integration of pieces all simultaneously, so 654 00:40:44,640 --> 00:40:47,720 Speaker 2: that you're working at the level of your mind, your thoughts, 655 00:40:47,840 --> 00:40:51,480 Speaker 2: your beliefs, and you're working with your body and the movement, 656 00:40:52,120 --> 00:40:56,759 Speaker 2: that expression of emotions, the connection with your body, and 657 00:40:56,960 --> 00:41:01,480 Speaker 2: the biology, the oxidative stress, the mitochondria, the inflammation. And 658 00:41:01,520 --> 00:41:03,799 Speaker 2: when you're working on all of those levels at the 659 00:41:03,840 --> 00:41:09,080 Speaker 2: same time, yes, you can make bigger changes happen because 660 00:41:09,120 --> 00:41:13,319 Speaker 2: they compound each other. They're synergistic. Yeah, Whereas if you 661 00:41:13,440 --> 00:41:17,359 Speaker 2: only try to do one thing, you're trying only one 662 00:41:17,400 --> 00:41:20,000 Speaker 2: thing and it's going to take a lot more effort 663 00:41:20,080 --> 00:41:23,239 Speaker 2: to create the same change with just one thing than 664 00:41:23,280 --> 00:41:25,879 Speaker 2: if you can address all the levels that have been 665 00:41:25,920 --> 00:41:29,600 Speaker 2: impacted and all the levels that need a shift and 666 00:41:29,719 --> 00:41:31,920 Speaker 2: repair and change. 667 00:41:32,239 --> 00:41:33,520 Speaker 1: Here's one of the problems though. 668 00:41:33,520 --> 00:41:38,680 Speaker 3: Doc People's identity becomes intertwined with the thing that they do, 669 00:41:39,160 --> 00:41:43,000 Speaker 3: so they become resistant to any idea or any protocol, 670 00:41:43,120 --> 00:41:47,359 Speaker 3: or any philosophy or ideology that isn't their you know, 671 00:41:47,640 --> 00:41:50,320 Speaker 3: so fuck you and all your weird integrative ideas. 672 00:41:50,880 --> 00:41:51,680 Speaker 1: Do you know what I mean? 673 00:41:52,080 --> 00:41:56,600 Speaker 3: It's like, what I do, this is what I do? Well, 674 00:41:57,160 --> 00:42:00,160 Speaker 3: what if that's cool? But what if that's not the 675 00:42:00,160 --> 00:42:00,880 Speaker 3: best approach? 676 00:42:02,440 --> 00:42:04,840 Speaker 2: And what if that were even a trauma response? 677 00:42:05,440 --> 00:42:08,680 Speaker 1: Yes? Yes, Oh, that's so interesting. 678 00:42:09,440 --> 00:42:16,319 Speaker 2: I think that the practitioner of the future is going 679 00:42:16,360 --> 00:42:21,480 Speaker 2: to be one who is integrative and holistic, because they 680 00:42:21,480 --> 00:42:22,960 Speaker 2: are the ones who are going to be able to 681 00:42:23,000 --> 00:42:26,399 Speaker 2: actually meet a person where they are and be able 682 00:42:26,440 --> 00:42:29,680 Speaker 2: to see what is the best entry point. What is 683 00:42:29,719 --> 00:42:32,319 Speaker 2: your microdosing of safety that we need to start with. 684 00:42:32,400 --> 00:42:35,560 Speaker 2: Are you a five second microdose? Are you able to 685 00:42:35,560 --> 00:42:40,160 Speaker 2: tolerate thirty seconds? But if we're not being precise with 686 00:42:40,320 --> 00:42:43,279 Speaker 2: our tools, Craig, we're not going to be able to 687 00:42:43,280 --> 00:42:45,280 Speaker 2: create the change that is possible. 688 00:42:47,360 --> 00:42:49,400 Speaker 1: I love it micro docing safety. 689 00:42:49,440 --> 00:42:52,319 Speaker 3: I'm writing this down. This is the name of that 690 00:42:53,480 --> 00:42:56,560 Speaker 3: I tell everyone about your book what's the cold? 691 00:42:56,600 --> 00:42:59,560 Speaker 1: What's it about? Where can I get it? I am 692 00:43:00,000 --> 00:43:02,560 Speaker 1: what fining about this? Plug the shit out of that. 693 00:43:03,280 --> 00:43:06,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, I am so excited that I wrote a book 694 00:43:06,560 --> 00:43:08,920 Speaker 2: for one thing. This has been something that's been on 695 00:43:08,960 --> 00:43:13,000 Speaker 2: my heart in my mind forever. And the process was 696 00:43:13,160 --> 00:43:15,000 Speaker 2: more than what I thought it would be. I thought 697 00:43:15,000 --> 00:43:17,000 Speaker 2: it would be easy, because I mean, I do this 698 00:43:17,040 --> 00:43:20,040 Speaker 2: stuff in my sleep now, But to actually sit down 699 00:43:20,120 --> 00:43:23,279 Speaker 2: and say, if I were sitting across from Craig, how 700 00:43:23,320 --> 00:43:27,320 Speaker 2: would I walk him through this? Where would I even start? 701 00:43:27,719 --> 00:43:30,720 Speaker 2: So I just started. I decided to start the book 702 00:43:30,800 --> 00:43:34,040 Speaker 2: with Elena's story and her car accident and her in 703 00:43:34,080 --> 00:43:36,440 Speaker 2: the middle of the car accident, and then walk people 704 00:43:36,520 --> 00:43:41,120 Speaker 2: through how the body experiences a trauma, the inner experience 705 00:43:41,120 --> 00:43:43,799 Speaker 2: of that, like the inner physiology, so that they are 706 00:43:43,960 --> 00:43:48,040 Speaker 2: clear from chapter one, what is the difference between a 707 00:43:48,160 --> 00:43:50,440 Speaker 2: trauma and a stress on the body? 708 00:43:50,560 --> 00:43:50,799 Speaker 1: Yes? 709 00:43:51,200 --> 00:43:55,359 Speaker 2: Yes, From there we build on that foundation, and now 710 00:43:55,440 --> 00:43:57,120 Speaker 2: I can talk to you about, well, why does the 711 00:43:57,120 --> 00:43:59,719 Speaker 2: body hold on to that trauma response? Why does it 712 00:43:59,760 --> 00:44:02,719 Speaker 2: not just get over it or move on like we 713 00:44:02,760 --> 00:44:05,200 Speaker 2: would all like to be able to do. And then 714 00:44:05,239 --> 00:44:07,120 Speaker 2: the last sestion of the book is all of this 715 00:44:07,320 --> 00:44:10,279 Speaker 2: repair and the integration of the pieces and how to 716 00:44:10,280 --> 00:44:13,160 Speaker 2: do that integration so that people have that sense in 717 00:44:13,239 --> 00:44:16,000 Speaker 2: the roadmap for this is what I'm looking at, and 718 00:44:16,040 --> 00:44:18,640 Speaker 2: they can have success where maybe they have been stuck. 719 00:44:18,920 --> 00:44:21,080 Speaker 2: So this is a big deal for me to put 720 00:44:21,080 --> 00:44:24,080 Speaker 2: out this book on the biology of trauma. But this 721 00:44:24,160 --> 00:44:27,160 Speaker 2: is really for me a message of hope that once 722 00:44:27,239 --> 00:44:32,240 Speaker 2: we understand the science, there are so many leverage points 723 00:44:32,239 --> 00:44:35,640 Speaker 2: that are unveiled for how we can make a difference 724 00:44:35,680 --> 00:44:37,480 Speaker 2: and create a better tomorrow for ourselves. 725 00:44:38,680 --> 00:44:41,080 Speaker 3: Well, congrats, congrats on the book. I know it is. 726 00:44:41,320 --> 00:44:44,080 Speaker 3: I've written a few books. It's the idea of writting 727 00:44:44,120 --> 00:44:46,600 Speaker 3: a book and the practical reality of writing a book, 728 00:44:46,600 --> 00:44:48,080 Speaker 3: and on all what do we put on the cover? 729 00:44:48,200 --> 00:44:49,960 Speaker 1: What do we call it? How do we distribute it? 730 00:44:50,320 --> 00:44:52,520 Speaker 1: What do I self published? Do I get publisher? How 731 00:44:52,520 --> 00:44:55,040 Speaker 1: do I promote it? What about the marketing? Look, feel 732 00:44:55,080 --> 00:44:56,080 Speaker 1: what's on the back cover? 733 00:44:56,680 --> 00:45:00,000 Speaker 3: Like, there's so many things that like the actual raw 734 00:45:00,239 --> 00:45:02,919 Speaker 3: of the book, it's not easy, but it's only one 735 00:45:02,960 --> 00:45:06,879 Speaker 3: of fifty seven variables and factors. Like who knew there 736 00:45:06,960 --> 00:45:09,360 Speaker 3: was so much shit that goes into getting a book 737 00:45:09,440 --> 00:45:10,840 Speaker 3: onto a shelf. 738 00:45:11,880 --> 00:45:12,440 Speaker 1: I didn't know. 739 00:45:13,120 --> 00:45:17,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, well, but yeah, the process of writing and then 740 00:45:17,560 --> 00:45:20,879 Speaker 2: the process of launching are two very different things. 741 00:45:21,760 --> 00:45:24,279 Speaker 3: Hi, Doc, it's been great to talk to you. You're fantastic. 742 00:45:24,320 --> 00:45:26,160 Speaker 3: I'd love to talk to you again at some stage 743 00:45:26,200 --> 00:45:30,600 Speaker 3: if you're avilable. Tell people how to find you, follow you, 744 00:45:30,960 --> 00:45:34,000 Speaker 3: connect with you, all that stuff if you're interested. 745 00:45:34,960 --> 00:45:37,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, and again, I just thank you for your work, 746 00:45:37,120 --> 00:45:39,400 Speaker 2: like you are someone that I looked up to. You 747 00:45:39,440 --> 00:45:44,360 Speaker 2: have been so consistent about providing quality, value content and education. 748 00:45:44,560 --> 00:45:47,319 Speaker 2: So you're a hero of mine. In my book, so 749 00:45:47,600 --> 00:45:50,120 Speaker 2: people can find me a Biology of Trauma dot com. 750 00:45:50,160 --> 00:45:54,000 Speaker 2: They'll find the book web page, they'll find some resources 751 00:45:54,000 --> 00:45:56,080 Speaker 2: that I have for them to download with the book 752 00:45:56,120 --> 00:45:59,439 Speaker 2: for them to help integrate some of the pieces, the concepts, 753 00:45:59,560 --> 00:46:02,759 Speaker 2: the frame work, and they can find more about me. 754 00:46:03,480 --> 00:46:07,120 Speaker 2: And that's all on Biologyoftrauma dot com. 755 00:46:08,040 --> 00:46:11,440 Speaker 3: Amazing Doctor Amy will say goodbye off air in a moment, 756 00:46:11,520 --> 00:46:14,200 Speaker 3: but for now on behalf of the team and I 757 00:46:14,239 --> 00:46:14,840 Speaker 3: you're great. 758 00:46:14,960 --> 00:46:16,520 Speaker 1: Thanks for being part of the You project. 759 00:46:17,360 --> 00:46:19,520 Speaker 2: Thank you