1 00:00:03,990 --> 00:00:06,600 Sean Aylmer: Welcome to the Fear and Greed daily interview. I'm Sean 2 00:00:06,690 --> 00:00:10,229 Sean Aylmer: Aylmer. We talk about all kinds of investments here on 3 00:00:10,230 --> 00:00:13,860 Sean Aylmer: Fear and Greed: equities, bonds, property, alternatives, you name it, 4 00:00:13,860 --> 00:00:17,610 Sean Aylmer: we've probably covered it - until now. Today, we're going to 5 00:00:17,610 --> 00:00:20,370 Sean Aylmer: get a lesson in some other asset classes, things you 6 00:00:20,370 --> 00:00:24,419 Sean Aylmer: may never have even considered as an investment - everything from 7 00:00:24,420 --> 00:00:27,720 Sean Aylmer: tequila to domain names. Of course, this is general information 8 00:00:27,720 --> 00:00:31,410 Sean Aylmer: only, and you should certainly seek professional advice before making 9 00:00:31,410 --> 00:00:35,430 Sean Aylmer: investment decisions. Stefan Von Imhof is the co- founder of 10 00:00:35,430 --> 00:00:40,380 Sean Aylmer: Alternative Investing Community Funds, Alts. co. Stefan, welcome to Fear 11 00:00:40,380 --> 00:00:40,890 Sean Aylmer: and Greed. 12 00:00:41,550 --> 00:00:42,960 Stefan Von Imhof: Thank you for having me. It's great to be here. 13 00:00:43,350 --> 00:00:46,770 Sean Aylmer: Okay, this is great. You've got things from, I'm just 14 00:00:46,770 --> 00:00:51,870 Sean Aylmer: looking at your website, billboards, artwork, cultural assets, game trading 15 00:00:51,870 --> 00:00:57,720 Sean Aylmer: cards, islands, I particularly like islands, sneakers, tickets, toys, video 16 00:00:57,720 --> 00:01:00,570 Sean Aylmer: games, et cetera, et cetera. How do you get into 17 00:01:00,990 --> 00:01:04,200 Sean Aylmer: this sort of investing, Stefan? How'd you get in anyway? 18 00:01:04,709 --> 00:01:07,080 Stefan Von Imhof: I'll tell you, I don't pretend to be an expert 19 00:01:07,080 --> 00:01:09,000 Stefan Von Imhof: on all of these, but that's exactly why we do 20 00:01:09,000 --> 00:01:11,730 Stefan Von Imhof: what we do. We try to study these esoteric, exotic 21 00:01:11,730 --> 00:01:15,690 Stefan Von Imhof: markets that are under discussed, and the way I got in 22 00:01:15,690 --> 00:01:19,950 Stefan Von Imhof: was actually through private equity. So I was at a 23 00:01:19,950 --> 00:01:23,610 Stefan Von Imhof: company in Melbourne called flipit.com, and I created the first 24 00:01:23,610 --> 00:01:26,580 Stefan Von Imhof: due diligence program. This was a way to kind of ascertain 25 00:01:26,580 --> 00:01:31,560 Stefan Von Imhof: the value of websites, which are definitely alternative investments. So 26 00:01:31,560 --> 00:01:35,160 Stefan Von Imhof: I created this framework for understanding the inherent value of 27 00:01:35,850 --> 00:01:38,400 Stefan Von Imhof: these assets, and I realized that the framework I created 28 00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:41,490 Stefan Von Imhof: could be applied to a whole other world of alternatives 29 00:01:41,490 --> 00:01:44,490 Stefan Von Imhof: that didn't really have any historical data or even just 30 00:01:44,490 --> 00:01:48,000 Stefan Von Imhof: any general understanding about how these markets work. So I 31 00:01:48,060 --> 00:01:51,630 Stefan Von Imhof: started a newsletter on Substack - that was during COVID - and 32 00:01:52,170 --> 00:01:55,110 Stefan Von Imhof: had nothing better to do during the lockdown here in 33 00:01:55,110 --> 00:01:57,990 Stefan Von Imhof: Melbourne. So for about four straight months, just kept writing 34 00:01:57,990 --> 00:02:00,630 Stefan Von Imhof: and growing the newsletter. And then I found a co- 35 00:02:00,630 --> 00:02:03,570 Stefan Von Imhof: founder, and we kind of joined forces and here we 36 00:02:03,570 --> 00:02:06,270 Stefan Von Imhof: are today, two and a half years later, approaching 90, 37 00:02:06,270 --> 00:02:08,970 Stefan Von Imhof: 000 subscribers and our investment fund as well. 38 00:02:09,450 --> 00:02:13,500 Sean Aylmer: Wow. So just broadly, what's the framework look at, without 39 00:02:13,500 --> 00:02:14,580 Sean Aylmer: getting too technical here? 40 00:02:15,419 --> 00:02:18,840 Stefan Von Imhof: It all comes down to comps. You're looking for comps. 41 00:02:18,840 --> 00:02:21,000 Stefan Von Imhof: You're looking for, just like in real estate, for example. 42 00:02:21,510 --> 00:02:23,370 Stefan Von Imhof: You look at the square footage of the house, you 43 00:02:23,370 --> 00:02:25,650 Stefan Von Imhof: look at the neighborhood, you look at the trends. You 44 00:02:25,650 --> 00:02:28,470 Stefan Von Imhof: can do that in all sorts of markets. And while 45 00:02:28,470 --> 00:02:31,139 Stefan Von Imhof: some alternative markets have that historical data and have that 46 00:02:31,139 --> 00:02:35,669 Stefan Von Imhof: analysis, you think artwork and wine, these are alternatives, but 47 00:02:35,669 --> 00:02:38,460 Stefan Von Imhof: they're also kind of closer to the mainstream. So there's 48 00:02:38,460 --> 00:02:41,220 Stefan Von Imhof: a lot of data baked in. But even in those 49 00:02:41,220 --> 00:02:44,309 Stefan Von Imhof: markets, there's some transparency missing. And that's to say nothing 50 00:02:44,310 --> 00:02:48,030 Stefan Von Imhof: about the real esoteric markets like comic books and farmland 51 00:02:48,030 --> 00:02:50,639 Stefan Von Imhof: and sneakers. So there's all sorts of, I mean, there's 52 00:02:50,639 --> 00:02:53,820 Stefan Von Imhof: markets in everything, and we basically do that comp analysis, 53 00:02:53,820 --> 00:02:56,669 Stefan Von Imhof: that hard work, that homework that no one else has 54 00:02:56,669 --> 00:02:58,680 Stefan Von Imhof: ever really done before. And that's how we're able to 55 00:02:58,680 --> 00:03:01,080 Stefan Von Imhof: figure out out, okay, what a good deal looks like. Is 56 00:03:01,080 --> 00:03:02,340 Stefan Von Imhof: it a good deal for our fund? Is it a 57 00:03:02,340 --> 00:03:04,290 Stefan Von Imhof: good deal for our investors, et cetera. 58 00:03:04,860 --> 00:03:07,470 Sean Aylmer: Okay. So you've raised money to invest in some of 59 00:03:07,470 --> 00:03:10,830 Sean Aylmer: these. Just before we talk about some of the examples, 60 00:03:11,100 --> 00:03:14,400 Sean Aylmer: how should investors, how do you think about investing in 61 00:03:14,400 --> 00:03:18,510 Sean Aylmer: alternatives? Is it a diversification play? Presumably you're not putting 62 00:03:18,510 --> 00:03:20,400 Sean Aylmer: all your eggs in one basket in any of these 63 00:03:20,400 --> 00:03:22,290 Sean Aylmer: asset classes. How do you think about it? 64 00:03:23,370 --> 00:03:27,090 Stefan Von Imhof: It's definitely a diversification play. I think that there's a 65 00:03:27,090 --> 00:03:31,350 Stefan Von Imhof: couple of converging trends happening here. I think a lot 66 00:03:31,350 --> 00:03:35,700 Stefan Von Imhof: of alternatives for sure are, were driven by ZIRP. I 67 00:03:35,700 --> 00:03:37,590 Stefan Von Imhof: think zero interest rates kind of helped a lot of 68 00:03:37,590 --> 00:03:41,310 Stefan Von Imhof: this stuff. I think the combination of technology and regulation, 69 00:03:41,310 --> 00:03:43,980 Stefan Von Imhof: especially what's known in the US as regulation A, or 70 00:03:43,980 --> 00:03:46,380 Stefan Von Imhof: reg. A. In a nutshell, it made it easier for 71 00:03:46,380 --> 00:03:49,890 Stefan Von Imhof: companies to securitize all sorts of assets. And you kind 72 00:03:49,890 --> 00:03:51,750 Stefan Von Imhof: of first started seeing it with real estate and now 73 00:03:51,750 --> 00:03:53,550 Stefan Von Imhof: you see it with collectibles and just all sorts of 74 00:03:53,550 --> 00:03:55,920 Stefan Von Imhof: different things. I think nostalgia plays a big part in 75 00:03:55,920 --> 00:03:59,700 Stefan Von Imhof: this as well. I think as Gen Xers and elder 76 00:03:59,700 --> 00:04:03,000 Stefan Von Imhof: millennials get older and get wealthier and we start to 77 00:04:03,000 --> 00:04:06,420 Stefan Von Imhof: value stuff that was a little bit forgotten, but really 78 00:04:06,420 --> 00:04:08,640 Stefan Von Imhof: retains its value quite well. But to your point, I 79 00:04:08,640 --> 00:04:11,640 Stefan Von Imhof: think diversification is the biggest thing here. You want to 80 00:04:11,640 --> 00:04:14,640 Stefan Von Imhof: be uncorrelated to the equity markets. You want to find 81 00:04:14,640 --> 00:04:17,790 Stefan Von Imhof: things that are truly uncorrelated. Crypto is not it. We've 82 00:04:17,790 --> 00:04:20,789 Stefan Von Imhof: learned that the hard way. It gets a lot more 83 00:04:20,790 --> 00:04:23,310 Stefan Von Imhof: diverse than crypto, and that's exactly why we do what 84 00:04:23,310 --> 00:04:23,550 Stefan Von Imhof: we do. 85 00:04:24,180 --> 00:04:26,969 Sean Aylmer: Okay. So let's jump into some of these alternate asset 86 00:04:26,970 --> 00:04:29,910 Sean Aylmer: classes, and I'll just remind listeners, of course, that you 87 00:04:29,910 --> 00:04:33,210 Sean Aylmer: should always seek professional financial advice to suit your own 88 00:04:33,210 --> 00:04:38,550 Sean Aylmer: personal circumstances before investing. But let's go from wine and 89 00:04:38,550 --> 00:04:41,820 Sean Aylmer: whiskey, tequila, for example. I think you've got a framework 90 00:04:41,820 --> 00:04:42,811 Sean Aylmer: for tequila, is that right? 91 00:04:42,811 --> 00:04:46,589 Stefan Von Imhof: Tequila's one of our favorites. So we've bought some big 92 00:04:46,589 --> 00:04:51,029 Stefan Von Imhof: barrels of tequila for our ALTS 1 fund. And this 93 00:04:51,029 --> 00:04:53,790 Stefan Von Imhof: is straight from the source, straight from tequila, Mexico. 94 00:04:53,850 --> 00:04:54,900 Sean Aylmer: Right. Yeah. 95 00:04:54,990 --> 00:04:58,500 Stefan Von Imhof: Yeah. And the properties of tequila that make it appealing 96 00:04:58,500 --> 00:05:02,849 Stefan Von Imhof: are fascinating because tequila has the same kind of appreciation 97 00:05:02,850 --> 00:05:05,969 Stefan Von Imhof: properties as wine or whiskey, but with one key difference. 98 00:05:06,000 --> 00:05:09,089 Stefan Von Imhof: Tequila goes from blanco to anejo in just about three, four 99 00:05:09,089 --> 00:05:14,070 Stefan Von Imhof: years, whereas whiskey can take 40 years and wine can 100 00:05:14,070 --> 00:05:14,669 Stefan Von Imhof: take a decade. 101 00:05:15,089 --> 00:05:17,040 Sean Aylmer: I have to jump in here, Stefan, I'm not even 102 00:05:17,040 --> 00:05:20,490 Sean Aylmer: sure what you just told me. From what to what? 103 00:05:20,820 --> 00:05:23,490 Stefan Von Imhof: So tequila, when it hasn't matured for very long, it's 104 00:05:23,700 --> 00:05:26,909 Stefan Von Imhof: referred to as blanco, and that's kind of like silver tequila. 105 00:05:26,910 --> 00:05:27,181 Sean Aylmer: Right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. 106 00:05:27,181 --> 00:05:32,250 Stefan Von Imhof: And then anejo is the aged tequila. So that's the stuff that's 107 00:05:32,250 --> 00:05:33,779 Stefan Von Imhof: like three, four years. So it has more of a 108 00:05:33,779 --> 00:05:37,200 Stefan Von Imhof: pronounced flavor. It's more complex. And the point is it 109 00:05:37,200 --> 00:05:39,750 Stefan Von Imhof: only takes three or four years for tequila to gain 110 00:05:39,750 --> 00:05:43,500 Stefan Von Imhof: the properties that make it more valuable, whereas wine and 111 00:05:43,500 --> 00:05:46,020 Stefan Von Imhof: whiskey can take much, much longer. So that's why we 112 00:05:46,020 --> 00:05:48,810 Stefan Von Imhof: love tequila. We also love tequila. Tequila is the fastest 113 00:05:48,810 --> 00:05:51,630 Stefan Von Imhof: growing spirit in the United States, number one, fastest growing spirit. 114 00:05:52,110 --> 00:05:52,170 Sean Aylmer: Wow. 115 00:05:53,400 --> 00:05:55,170 Stefan Von Imhof: So there's a lot of reasons to that market. We've done the research, we've done the 116 00:05:55,170 --> 00:05:57,930 Stefan Von Imhof: homework, and we made our first investment about four months ago. 117 00:05:58,560 --> 00:06:07,500 Sean Aylmer: Stay with me, Stefan, we'll be back in a minute. My guest 118 00:06:07,500 --> 00:06:11,040 Sean Aylmer: this morning is Stefan Von Imhof, co- founder of Alternative 119 00:06:11,040 --> 00:06:15,480 Sean Aylmer: Investing Community Fund Alts. co. Okay, what about what other 120 00:06:15,480 --> 00:06:18,870 Sean Aylmer: markets have you invested in, perhaps rather than, we'll narrow 121 00:06:18,870 --> 00:06:20,700 Sean Aylmer: it down to something that you've invested in because you 122 00:06:20,700 --> 00:06:22,290 Sean Aylmer: think there's a case for it. 123 00:06:23,040 --> 00:06:25,440 Stefan Von Imhof: I'll tell you some of our favorite investments and why 124 00:06:25,440 --> 00:06:28,409 Stefan Von Imhof: we invested in them. So the first thing we ever 125 00:06:28,410 --> 00:06:31,620 Stefan Von Imhof: bought was actually a comic book. It was Daredevil number 126 00:06:31,620 --> 00:06:35,010 Stefan Von Imhof: one comic book, and it was highly graded, the original 127 00:06:35,010 --> 00:06:37,710 Stefan Von Imhof: print. So that felt kind of cool. I used to 128 00:06:37,710 --> 00:06:39,960 Stefan Von Imhof: love comics as a kid, so that was a good 129 00:06:39,960 --> 00:06:42,239 Stefan Von Imhof: moment. We've bought some really cool stuff. We've bought some 130 00:06:42,240 --> 00:06:45,960 Stefan Von Imhof: British modern artwork from a gallery in Great Britain. We've 131 00:06:45,960 --> 00:06:48,450 Stefan Von Imhof: bought a copy of the White Album that was owned 132 00:06:48,450 --> 00:06:49,801 Stefan Von Imhof: by John Lennon. We were able to get this to auction. 133 00:06:49,801 --> 00:06:50,820 Sean Aylmer: Oh, wow. 134 00:06:51,210 --> 00:06:51,990 Stefan Von Imhof: Very cool. 135 00:06:52,020 --> 00:06:54,450 Sean Aylmer: The White Album, of course, being a Beatles album. John 136 00:06:54,450 --> 00:06:55,140 Sean Aylmer: Lennon being a member of The Beatles. Yeah. 137 00:06:55,140 --> 00:07:00,240 Stefan Von Imhof: Yeah, and vinyl records in general are basically my personal 138 00:07:00,240 --> 00:07:04,349 Stefan Von Imhof: favorite alternative investment. There's a lot of personal kind of 139 00:07:04,650 --> 00:07:08,250 Stefan Von Imhof: taste baked into that. But they actually, they keep powering 140 00:07:08,250 --> 00:07:11,100 Stefan Von Imhof: up into the right. They hold their value extremely well 141 00:07:11,100 --> 00:07:12,210 Stefan Von Imhof: on the high end, especially. 142 00:07:12,270 --> 00:07:15,210 Sean Aylmer: I've got to say, I've got an original Rolling Stones 143 00:07:15,210 --> 00:07:19,230 Sean Aylmer: album from the late sixties, and I'm hoping that will 144 00:07:19,290 --> 00:07:21,750 Sean Aylmer: retain its value, though I'm playing it too much, so 145 00:07:21,750 --> 00:07:22,230 Sean Aylmer: maybe not. 146 00:07:23,010 --> 00:07:25,140 Stefan Von Imhof: Hang on to it, don't scratch it and keep it 147 00:07:25,140 --> 00:07:27,211 Stefan Von Imhof: out of the sun and you're in good shape, man. 148 00:07:27,211 --> 00:07:27,211 Sean Aylmer: Okay. 149 00:07:27,211 --> 00:07:27,212 Stefan Von Imhof: Yeah. 150 00:07:27,212 --> 00:07:27,482 Sean Aylmer: Excellent. 151 00:07:28,320 --> 00:07:30,240 Stefan Von Imhof: So it was funny you mentioned, because we actually created 152 00:07:30,330 --> 00:07:34,020 Stefan Von Imhof: the world's first vinyl index where we're basically tracking the 153 00:07:34,020 --> 00:07:36,270 Stefan Von Imhof: prices of high- end vinyl that sold at auctions and 154 00:07:36,270 --> 00:07:38,910 Stefan Von Imhof: auction houses, and we know which artists kind of retain 155 00:07:38,910 --> 00:07:40,710 Stefan Von Imhof: the value of the best. Rolling Stones are absolutely up 156 00:07:40,710 --> 00:07:43,500 Stefan Von Imhof: there as is Pink Floyd, as are The Beatles. So 157 00:07:43,680 --> 00:07:45,570 Stefan Von Imhof: we kind of use this data that we create to 158 00:07:45,570 --> 00:07:48,270 Stefan Von Imhof: help make our investment decisions and then purchase for the 159 00:07:48,270 --> 00:07:48,870 Stefan Von Imhof: fund accordingly. 160 00:07:49,350 --> 00:07:51,480 Sean Aylmer: Okay. So let's talk about some of the other asset 161 00:07:51,480 --> 00:07:54,600 Sean Aylmer: classes, watches, I've heard you speak about watches. 162 00:07:55,320 --> 00:07:57,960 Stefan Von Imhof: We haven't bought any watches for the fund. Watches are, 163 00:07:58,020 --> 00:08:00,390 Stefan Von Imhof: long term we like them. They're still kind of on 164 00:08:00,390 --> 00:08:03,239 Stefan Von Imhof: a downward swing right now, and we don't think we've 165 00:08:03,240 --> 00:08:05,460 Stefan Von Imhof: hit bottom yet from what we can tell and from 166 00:08:05,460 --> 00:08:07,860 Stefan Von Imhof: the folks, the experts that we've spoken with. But we're 167 00:08:07,860 --> 00:08:10,320 Stefan Von Imhof: watching, no pun intended - or maybe it was intended. We're 168 00:08:10,320 --> 00:08:16,080 Stefan Von Imhof: watching closely and definitely one potential idea for the fund. 169 00:08:16,200 --> 00:08:18,810 Stefan Von Imhof: But we haven't made any watch investments. We've invested in 170 00:08:18,810 --> 00:08:22,140 Stefan Von Imhof: some really esoteric stuff. I think the most kind of exotic 171 00:08:22,140 --> 00:08:26,970 Stefan Von Imhof: thing we've invested in is concert posters. So hear me out. 172 00:08:26,970 --> 00:08:27,660 Sean Aylmer: Wow. Yeah, yeah. 173 00:08:29,040 --> 00:08:31,080 Stefan Von Imhof: So it turns out there's a market for these kind 174 00:08:31,080 --> 00:08:34,559 Stefan Von Imhof: of old posters from the '60s. So we've actually bought 175 00:08:34,559 --> 00:08:38,610 Stefan Von Imhof: the second most expensive concert poster. It's a Grateful Dead 176 00:08:38,610 --> 00:08:41,729 Stefan Von Imhof: poster. Second most expensive concert poster ever sold at a 177 00:08:41,730 --> 00:08:45,660 Stefan Von Imhof: public auction. And that's in our fund now. So it's 178 00:08:45,660 --> 00:08:47,610 Stefan Von Imhof: not a huge market. This is the kind of stuff 179 00:08:47,610 --> 00:08:51,030 Stefan Von Imhof: that any large fund would just, I mean this would 180 00:08:51,510 --> 00:08:53,250 Stefan Von Imhof: be a rounding error for them. They wouldn't touch the 181 00:08:53,250 --> 00:08:55,710 Stefan Von Imhof: stuff with a 10- foot pole and that's where we shot. 182 00:08:56,250 --> 00:08:59,580 Sean Aylmer: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Okay, so where was the Grateful Dead concert? 183 00:08:59,880 --> 00:09:00,839 Stefan Von Imhof: It was in San Francisco. 184 00:09:01,800 --> 00:09:01,890 Sean Aylmer: Right. 185 00:09:01,890 --> 00:09:02,160 Stefan Von Imhof: Yeah. 186 00:09:03,090 --> 00:09:05,910 Sean Aylmer: What else? Have you ever gotten into things like sneakers 187 00:09:05,910 --> 00:09:07,800 Sean Aylmer: and that sort of stuff? 188 00:09:08,520 --> 00:09:11,940 Stefan Von Imhof: We haven't made an investment in sneakers yet. Sneakers is 189 00:09:11,940 --> 00:09:14,280 Stefan Von Imhof: an interesting, there's a lot of risk with sneakers. There's 190 00:09:14,280 --> 00:09:17,429 Stefan Von Imhof: also a lot of grails, so to speak. We haven't 191 00:09:17,429 --> 00:09:19,620 Stefan Von Imhof: pulled the trigger on any yet, but I think as 192 00:09:19,620 --> 00:09:22,050 Stefan Von Imhof: we kind of come to a bottom, we'll start to 193 00:09:22,320 --> 00:09:25,980 Stefan Von Imhof: consider. We've looked at quite a few markets. I think 194 00:09:26,100 --> 00:09:28,830 Stefan Von Imhof: music rights is one that really fascinates us. Now, this 195 00:09:28,830 --> 00:09:32,040 Stefan Von Imhof: takes a lot of effort, a lot of work, and 196 00:09:32,040 --> 00:09:35,130 Stefan Von Imhof: it's really tough to get quality deal flow. But man, 197 00:09:35,610 --> 00:09:38,070 Stefan Von Imhof: if you can get that quality deal flow, it's a 198 00:09:38,070 --> 00:09:41,730 Stefan Von Imhof: terrific alternative asset because it has both appreciation qualities and 199 00:09:41,820 --> 00:09:45,000 Stefan Von Imhof: cash flow. It has yield. It spits out cash, unlike 200 00:09:45,000 --> 00:09:49,410 Stefan Von Imhof: something like watches, which may appreciate, but you can't rent 201 00:09:49,410 --> 00:09:50,430 Stefan Von Imhof: the watch out or anything like that. 202 00:09:50,431 --> 00:09:53,280 Sean Aylmer: Okay, so just explain that. So music rights is owning the 203 00:09:53,280 --> 00:09:57,420 Sean Aylmer: rights to a collection or a song or an artist, 204 00:09:57,660 --> 00:10:01,740 Sean Aylmer: and then actually selling, hopefully that appreciates in value, but 205 00:10:01,740 --> 00:10:05,130 Sean Aylmer: then you can sell that sound to people who want 206 00:10:05,130 --> 00:10:06,150 Sean Aylmer: it. Is that how that works? 207 00:10:06,420 --> 00:10:09,839 Stefan Von Imhof: That's exactly right. And as it turns out, there's marketplaces 208 00:10:09,840 --> 00:10:12,660 Stefan Von Imhof: now that have popped up that facilitate that and allow 209 00:10:12,720 --> 00:10:18,660 Stefan Von Imhof: even non- accredited, non- sophisticated investors to invest in these tracks. 210 00:10:19,230 --> 00:10:19,440 Sean Aylmer: Wow. 211 00:10:19,770 --> 00:10:23,130 Stefan Von Imhof: Yeah, it's pretty fascinating what's happening across the spectrum. 212 00:10:23,850 --> 00:10:27,000 Sean Aylmer: What about domain names? Now, I have fairly regularly tried 213 00:10:27,000 --> 00:10:29,460 Sean Aylmer: to buy domain names and someone wants $ 10,000 for something, 214 00:10:29,460 --> 00:10:31,350 Sean Aylmer: which I thought I was the only person that knew. 215 00:10:31,500 --> 00:10:32,130 Sean Aylmer: Clearly not. 216 00:10:33,660 --> 00:10:36,839 Stefan Von Imhof: Domains are tricky. I personally love them. They're very addictive 217 00:10:37,230 --> 00:10:40,380 Stefan Von Imhof: to buy. I don't know about you, but I personally 218 00:10:40,380 --> 00:10:42,540 Stefan Von Imhof: have seven that I've just, I keep renewing every year. 219 00:10:42,540 --> 00:10:44,220 Stefan Von Imhof: I'm like, yeah, I'll do something with that. I never have. 220 00:10:44,220 --> 00:10:44,970 Sean Aylmer: Yeah, yeah, yeah. 221 00:10:45,390 --> 00:10:46,860 Stefan Von Imhof: You got to buy really, really well and you have to 222 00:10:46,860 --> 00:10:48,959 Stefan Von Imhof: buy a lot of them, but you can hit home 223 00:10:48,960 --> 00:10:52,740 Stefan Von Imhof: runs with domains, absolutely. There's even some interesting stuff happening 224 00:10:52,740 --> 00:10:55,710 Stefan Von Imhof: with domain leasing now. So instead of selling a domain, 225 00:10:55,710 --> 00:10:59,220 Stefan Von Imhof: so like let's say I wanted alts.com. So our company's alts. 226 00:10:59,220 --> 00:11:02,969 Stefan Von Imhof: co. I actually know who owns alts. com, and let's 227 00:11:02,970 --> 00:11:04,740 Stefan Von Imhof: just say he wants a lot of money for it. 228 00:11:04,980 --> 00:11:08,580 Stefan Von Imhof: So instead of paying him that money, we could potentially 229 00:11:08,580 --> 00:11:10,949 Stefan Von Imhof: enter into a leasing agreement whereby we pay him X 230 00:11:10,950 --> 00:11:14,309 Stefan Von Imhof: per year to basically lease the domain. And so there's 231 00:11:14,309 --> 00:11:16,890 Stefan Von Imhof: all sorts of interesting cash flow opportunities happening with domains. 232 00:11:16,890 --> 00:11:18,540 Stefan Von Imhof: It is very early on that stuff. I wouldn't say 233 00:11:18,540 --> 00:11:23,190 Stefan Von Imhof: it's a very well established market. But generally with domains, 234 00:11:23,550 --> 00:11:25,230 Stefan Von Imhof: you buy well, you buy a lot of them and 235 00:11:25,230 --> 00:11:27,660 Stefan Von Imhof: it'll take a while, but eventually someone's going to want 236 00:11:27,660 --> 00:11:31,980 Stefan Von Imhof: that.com, that four letter. com that you've had forever and they'll 237 00:11:31,980 --> 00:11:34,380 Stefan Von Imhof: pay for it, especially if it's a company. Absolutely. Yeah. 238 00:11:34,830 --> 00:11:37,380 Sean Aylmer: Okay. So the fund itself, how long's it been going? 239 00:11:38,340 --> 00:11:39,929 Sean Aylmer: Can we talk about what sort of returns you are 240 00:11:39,929 --> 00:11:41,700 Sean Aylmer: getting thus far or is it too early? 241 00:11:42,120 --> 00:11:44,610 Stefan Von Imhof: Too early. We're coming up on our first year, so 242 00:11:44,610 --> 00:11:47,010 Stefan Von Imhof: we should be able to share returns shortly. I'll say 243 00:11:47,010 --> 00:11:49,830 Stefan Von Imhof: that we've definitely beat the S& P over the last 244 00:11:50,160 --> 00:11:52,710 Stefan Von Imhof: 12 months. But at the same time, let's be clear, 245 00:11:53,010 --> 00:11:56,070 Stefan Von Imhof: alternative markets have not been immune to the 2022 downturn. 246 00:11:56,550 --> 00:11:59,069 Stefan Von Imhof: I think the key is that all markets are different. We're 247 00:11:59,070 --> 00:12:02,880 Stefan Von Imhof: not looking for quick flips. We're looking for stuff that's 248 00:12:02,880 --> 00:12:05,490 Stefan Von Imhof: criminally valued in the long run. This is a 10- year 249 00:12:05,490 --> 00:12:08,130 Stefan Von Imhof: fund. This is a buy and hold. This is stuff that 250 00:12:08,280 --> 00:12:12,089 Stefan Von Imhof: we're looking for those long term plays. So we're keeping 251 00:12:12,090 --> 00:12:13,589 Stefan Von Imhof: our eye on the long- term prize here, absolutely. 252 00:12:14,160 --> 00:12:17,190 Sean Aylmer: Stefan, this is one of the more interesting investing conversations 253 00:12:17,190 --> 00:12:19,079 Sean Aylmer: I've had this year. So thank you very much for 254 00:12:19,080 --> 00:12:20,790 Sean Aylmer: talking to me here on Fear and Greed. 255 00:12:21,270 --> 00:12:21,871 Stefan Von Imhof: Thanks for having me. 256 00:12:21,871 --> 00:12:26,760 Sean Aylmer: That was Stefan Von Imhof, co- founder of Alternative Investing Community 257 00:12:26,760 --> 00:12:30,090 Sean Aylmer: Fund Alts. co. This is the Fear and Greed daily 258 00:12:30,090 --> 00:12:32,670 Sean Aylmer: interview. Remember, this is general information only, and you should 259 00:12:32,670 --> 00:12:36,030 Sean Aylmer: seek professional advice before making any investment decisions. Join us 260 00:12:36,030 --> 00:12:37,949 Sean Aylmer: every morning for the full episode of Fear and Greed, 261 00:12:37,950 --> 00:12:41,520 Sean Aylmer: Australia's most popular business podcast. I'm Sean Aylmer. Enjoy your day.