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Speaker 1: I get a team, it's Harps. Who else would it be?

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Speaker 1: It's bloody, It's me, s Tiffany and Cook. It's Samantha Wills,

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Speaker 1: and it's another episode of you project. I'm just checking.

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Speaker 1: I'm just NELLI. You know tip when you do something

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Speaker 1: and you think is it Wills or Willis? But I

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Speaker 1: did not have my glasses on because I'm an old

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Speaker 1: I'm an old dickhead. Uh, it's Wills. It's definitely Samantha Wills.

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Speaker 1: But before we get to Samantha, talk to and Cook,

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Speaker 1: the life force of the show, the engine room, the brains,

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Speaker 1: Samantha said. Samantha said, the brains, and I am a

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Speaker 1: beauty now she said that, not even me, I tiff.

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Speaker 2: It's a worry, isn't it if I'm the brains of

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Speaker 2: the organization.

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Speaker 1: Oh dear, you're right, You're not a dummy. You're not

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Speaker 1: a dummy.

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Speaker 2: You have spent the last decade getting my head punched

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Speaker 2: in for fun.

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Speaker 1: So well, that's well. You're probably not quite as smart

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Speaker 1: as you were before you started doing boxing for a

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Speaker 1: living and punching women in the face in a boxing ring.

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Speaker 1: You probably should thought that through. Have you ever punched

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Speaker 1: anyone Samantha in anger or in fun.

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Speaker 3: Not like punch Buggy in the Returns. Is about as

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Speaker 3: as violent as I've gotten.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, have you ever done have you ever done any

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Speaker 1: boxing training?

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Speaker 3: You have done a bit of boxing training.

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Speaker 1: Well, if you ever in Melbourne, we might have to

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Speaker 1: put you in tip in the ring and we see

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Speaker 1: what happens.

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Speaker 3: Oh, that escalated very quickly.

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Speaker 1: That did escalate very quickly. Hey, welcome to the You Project.

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Speaker 1: How are you?

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Speaker 3: I'm good, Thank you for having me on.

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Speaker 1: Man, thanks for being had. Where do we find? Know

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Speaker 1: where you are? But tell our listeners where you are

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Speaker 1: right now and what that place is to you.

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Speaker 2: It's i mean beautiful downtown Port mcquarie, my hometown. So

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Speaker 2: I've just come back. I've been five months in Bali.

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Speaker 2: I've been kind of setting around doing the nomadic digital

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Speaker 2: nomad life.

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Speaker 3: So back in Port McQuary for the minute.

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Speaker 1: What's your favorite other than Australia, which of course is

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Speaker 1: the hands down winner. Of course we know that obviously,

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Speaker 1: But if you had to, if you had to live

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Speaker 1: somewhere else for let's say two years, and the US

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Speaker 1: is not an option, so no US, No Australia. If

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Speaker 1: you had to live somewhere else and you needed to

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Speaker 1: start next week, where would it be for two years?

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Speaker 2: You know, I've just spent three months in Mexico City

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Speaker 2: and I absolutely loved it. It was I think the

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Speaker 2: word vibrant is overused when you're explaining trouble, but it

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Speaker 2: was a city where.

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Speaker 3: I got the word vibrant like. It was the creative

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Speaker 3: scene there, the food scene. It was awesome. So Mexico

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Speaker 3: City would be my reco It's funny.

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Speaker 1: I would not have picked that, but you are not

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Speaker 1: the first person. I wouldn't have picked it a year ago,

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Speaker 1: but now I would be more inclined. But I reckon.

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Speaker 1: Half a dozen people have told me that in the

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Speaker 1: last year. Really yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I've never been.

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Speaker 1: I've been to the States a bunch of times, but

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Speaker 1: I've never been to Mexico. Tiff, have you been to Mexico?

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Speaker 3: I have not. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I find it both intriguing and terrifying. Yeah, well, I

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Speaker 1: just because until I don't know how it is. But

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Speaker 1: for a very long time it had one of the

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Speaker 1: highest crime rates in the world, so I don't know

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Speaker 1: where that sits now. But at the same time, the

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Speaker 1: only Mexican people that I've met have been beautiful and amazing.

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Speaker 1: So my interactions and experiences have been all positive. So

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Speaker 1: I might have to I might have to put that

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Speaker 1: on my to do list at some stage. What were

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Speaker 1: you doing in Bali?

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Speaker 2: Just writing my next book, so we're kind of I

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Speaker 2: had a place in New York for many years and

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Speaker 2: then was like, let's just do a bit of a

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Speaker 2: nomad trip. So I did three months in Basico City,

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Speaker 2: three months in Argentina, and then have just done five

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Speaker 2: months in Bali. So it's been here and everywhere.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, what's the what's the place that you went to?

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Speaker 1: I don't want to throw you under the bus, but

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Speaker 1: you know, just for you, wasn't somewhere that you might

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Speaker 1: hurry back to.

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Speaker 2: That's actually really easy, And I don't want to be

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Speaker 2: mean to Argentina. But I did not like Juemos Aires.

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Speaker 2: It was it felt very quiet. I thought it would

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Speaker 2: be much more happening there, but I didn't. I didn't

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Speaker 2: love it as much as I hoped I would love it.

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Speaker 3: But the people were lovely, but I didn't love the

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Speaker 3: city that much.

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Speaker 1: I'm going to ask you a curly question straight up, Samantha,

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Speaker 1: So my PhD is in a thing called metaperception, which

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Speaker 1: is essentially your ability to understand the Samantha experience for

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Speaker 1: other people for other people. So what do you think

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Speaker 1: and this is not a loaded question, this is a

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Speaker 1: curious question. What do you think the Samantha experiences like

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Speaker 1: for others? And that's not to be confused with do

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Speaker 1: you think they like you? But what do you think

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Speaker 1: the Samantha experience is for you know, friends, strangers, colleagues, family.

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Speaker 3: That is such an interesting question.

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Speaker 2: I hope that it is, you know, I I really

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Speaker 2: hope that I lift other people.

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Speaker 3: Up to see their creative potential.

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Speaker 2: I very much hope that I'm a reflection of not

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Speaker 2: just what they're doing, but the potential of what their

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Speaker 2: ideas and what their vision can can possibly be. And

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Speaker 2: I think a lot of you know, I work a

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Speaker 2: lot one on one with people doing brand mentoring or

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Speaker 2: personal brand mentoring, and it's I just I feel like

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Speaker 2: I can see in others so much goodness and possibility,

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Speaker 2: and I hope I think they walk away being like, wow,

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Speaker 2: I never saw that about myself.

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Speaker 3: So that's what I think the smout of experience.

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Speaker 1: I hope that's yeah, yeah, perfect. It's a real skill,

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Speaker 1: and most people are not great that kind of trying

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Speaker 1: to understand because the only person in the world, you know,

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Speaker 1: same with me, and that's literally my research. But the

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Speaker 1: only person in the world who sees me like me

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Speaker 1: is me. And so you know when you think about

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Speaker 1: right now, there's you, me and Tiff in this moment,

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Speaker 1: in this conversation, but no one's having the same experience,

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Speaker 1: right of course. And so yeah, trying to And you know,

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Speaker 1: you're a creative and you're a writer, and you're a coach,

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Speaker 1: and like, part of how good you will be is

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Speaker 1: about your capacity to understand what others want to read

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Speaker 1: or what others you know, what will inspire other people,

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Speaker 1: what will connect with other people? You know, what kind

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Speaker 1: of book can I create that they won't want to

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Speaker 1: put it down? You know? So that's that's a real

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Speaker 1: skill to have insight into what others need and want,

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Speaker 1: you know.

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Speaker 2: No, definitely, like what is your experience when you put

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Speaker 2: your the cre experience?

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Speaker 3: What is that?

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Speaker 1: So I mean, I've got pretty good insight because I've

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Speaker 1: been doing this a long time, but I know that,

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Speaker 1: you know, like I've done nearly seventeen hundred of these

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Speaker 1: I worked in radio for a long time, so I've

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Speaker 1: heard a lot of my own my own voice. I

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Speaker 1: fucking hate my voice, right right. I think I sound

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Speaker 1: shit and other people go, oh, you've got a really

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Speaker 1: good voice for radio or whatever, Like I sound like

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Speaker 1: a fucking idiot. But I realize that's just me. But

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Speaker 1: I know that I can be intimidating. I don't try

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Speaker 1: to be intimidating. It's the last thing I want to be.

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Speaker 1: I try to be. I mean, the problem with trying

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Speaker 1: to be what you think people want is the you

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Speaker 1: end up not being you, and now you're not a person.

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Speaker 1: You're a persona right, So you know, my values are connection,

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Speaker 1: My values are service and love and kindness, and that

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Speaker 1: sounds cheesy, but it's true. So I try to be

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Speaker 1: a living version of all of that, and sometimes I

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Speaker 1: fuck it up because I've got a big ego and

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Speaker 1: I'm a dickhead, and I'm insecure and all of those

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Speaker 1: human things. But you know it's I spend my life

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Speaker 1: talking on stages because I'm a professional speaker, but also

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Speaker 1: talking on podcasts, and so for me, it really matters

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Speaker 1: that I at the very least have an insight into

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Speaker 1: the Craig experience, because if I can't understand what it's

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Speaker 1: like being around me, then I really I really can't

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Speaker 1: create connection or rapport, trust or respect. And so you know,

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Speaker 1: whether or not it's in a writing capacity or a

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Speaker 1: speaking communication paradigm, being able to understand the Samantha experience

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Speaker 1: for the world is it's like an interpersonal superpower. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I didn't think we'd go there straight up, but thank

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Speaker 1: you for asking me.

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Speaker 3: Right we're on.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, No, it's interesting, and I think you know, and

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Speaker 2: I guess that follow up question from that, And I

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Speaker 2: asked this myself sometimes, like how do people leave you,

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Speaker 2: like when they walk away from you, how how do

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Speaker 2: they feel? What's what's in the fingerprints that we leave,

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Speaker 2: you know, on their soul? And I guess, you know,

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Speaker 2: you can't control what that is. But I think that

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Speaker 2: by osmosis should come across and I hope that people

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Speaker 2: leave me inspired to do their own creative journey.

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Speaker 1: I guess, yeah, yeah. Do you think that it's funny

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Speaker 1: because my background is in or studies in my first

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Speaker 1: degree was in science, my PhDs in science, But I

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Speaker 1: feel like I'm actually more of a creative than a scientist, right,

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Speaker 1: you know, Having written books and having just a whole

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Speaker 1: bunch of shit that I won't bore you with. But

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Speaker 1: I'm pretty good at creating something in my head and

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Speaker 1: then turning that into a real thing in the world,

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Speaker 1: a tangible thing. And that's a creative process, you know.

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Speaker 1: And even science in a way as a creative process,

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Speaker 1: because you've got to come up with an idea, a theory,

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Speaker 1: a hypothesis, and then figure out how am I going

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Speaker 1: to test that? Right? So that's a that's a problem

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Speaker 1: solving creative kind of a journey in itself.

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Speaker 3: You know.

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Speaker 2: One of the most interesting elements is when science and

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Speaker 2: creativity come together because science is so formulive, you know,

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Speaker 2: the formula base, but then putting either your own spin

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Speaker 2: on it, putting it through the language that resonates with

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Speaker 2: your audience. Like, I think there's a real beauty when

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Speaker 2: science and creativity overlap.

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Speaker 3: And that's really interesting.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure. So you've written, we'll get into your book.

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Speaker 1: You've written a new book which I'm excited to talk

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Speaker 1: to you about. And I've written I've written two books

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Speaker 1: for kids and some grown up books as well. Now,

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Speaker 1: just quickly, before we do a deep dive into the book,

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Speaker 1: was this your first time, I think, was your first

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Speaker 1: time writing a kid's book. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I've written a memoir and this is my first

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Speaker 3: kid's book.

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Speaker 1: Okay, So tell me about what you had to learn

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Speaker 1: and unlearn writing for you know, a completely different audience.

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Speaker 3: Well, I'm an.

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Speaker 2: Only child, so I didn't grow up around a lot

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Speaker 2: of young kids. I don't have kids myself, so I

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Speaker 2: had to learn pretty much everything.

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Speaker 3: But really what I did was I went back.

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Speaker 2: To what would I have wanted when I was a kid,

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Speaker 2: and that was kind of my starting point. And you know,

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Speaker 2: as a creative kid growing up, I really wanted, you know,

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Speaker 2: and growing up in the nineties in small town Australia,

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Speaker 2: there wasn't this window into the world of the internet

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Speaker 2: and what was possible. So for me, I kind of saw,

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Speaker 2: you know, hard working people and in my mind, smart

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Speaker 2: people went on to you know, get go to university,

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Speaker 2: get a degree, be lawyers, doctors, engineers, and then people

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Speaker 2: like me got jobs and then did their creativity as

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Speaker 2: a hobby. So I was like, you know, if I

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Speaker 2: could say to my little self, no, you can go

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Speaker 2: out there and be creative for your career. You can

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Speaker 2: build a life base around creativity because I just didn't

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Speaker 2: see that as an option growing up. So that was

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Speaker 2: kind of my starting point for this book to say

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Speaker 2: to kids, hey, your creativity is valuable, your ideas matter,

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Speaker 2: and there is this avenue for you should you wish

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Speaker 2: to if you don't feel smart at school, which I didn't.

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Speaker 2: You know, the message in this book is you can't

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Speaker 2: score smart without art. So that was kind of my

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Speaker 2: starting point to get that message.

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Speaker 1: You So tell me about that. Tell me about being

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Speaker 1: at school and not feeling smart.

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Speaker 3: What was that? Like?

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Speaker 2: I just it was a bit numbing, to be honest,

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Speaker 2: Like I was like, I wasn't like, oh, I know,

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Speaker 2: if I try harder, I'll get there. I just don't

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Speaker 2: think my brain worked in the way that academic kids'

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Speaker 2: brains work. And so when the teachers, you know, in

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Speaker 2: the marks or in the class, if you're in the

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Speaker 2: top ten percent of the class, it's usually based on academics.

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Speaker 3: So, you know, I was.

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Speaker 2: Doing really well in creativity and art and kind of

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Speaker 2: all these creative subjects, but I just didn't feel smart.

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Speaker 2: And I think as a kid, when you take that

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Speaker 2: feeling into adulthood, it dresses itself up as imposter syndrome.

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Speaker 3: So it kind of grows with you, it just changes outits.

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Speaker 2: And so even you know, in the outward facing by

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Speaker 2: all accounts success I've had in my career today, it

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Speaker 2: was still filled with imposter syndrome. And you know, it's

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Speaker 2: kind of this whisper of you know, this is just

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Speaker 2: a fluke, This is just borrow time you succeeding here,

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Speaker 2: Like you know, people will realize you're not that smart,

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Speaker 2: So it definitely masquerades.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that that imposter syndrome, self doubt, overthinking,

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Speaker 1: fucking self sabotage. We swear on this show, by the way,

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Speaker 1: good Yeah, so feel free. I'll open their fuck door

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Speaker 1: for you.

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Speaker 3: I don't need to die.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, good good. But that's I think that's everyone. You know.

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Speaker 1: It's like I've been doing a version of this forever

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Speaker 1: and I talk to you about one hundred or more

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Speaker 1: audiences a year live, and I still get up there

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Speaker 1: and think, yeah, this is the day you're going to

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Speaker 1: fuck it up, because like you you know, it's like, Craig,

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Speaker 1: you've done really well. You've been honestly, you've been pretty lucky, right,

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Speaker 1: You've had some really generous audiences. You're not that good.

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Speaker 1: You're not that good, and you know that I don't

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Speaker 1: think that really. I mean, I guess for some people

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Speaker 1: it goes away. And this is going to sound weird, Samantha,

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Speaker 1: But for me, a bit of self doubt and a

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Speaker 1: bit of imposter syndrome is good for me. Not overwhelming,

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Speaker 1: paralyzing fear. But it keeps me humble and I never

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Speaker 1: really take it. It keeps me humble in that I

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Speaker 1: don't take it for granted, and I don't think I'm great,

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Speaker 1: and the fact that I don't think I'm great makes

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Speaker 1: me work harder than if I thought I was great.

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Speaker 1: You know, that's just me.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's an interesting and I think if you can

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Speaker 2: make imposter syndrome and fear work for you, and that's

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Speaker 2: how you make it work for you. For me, I'm like,

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Speaker 2: I'm not even going to exert my energy trying to

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Speaker 2: overcome it.

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Speaker 3: I'm just going to be like, hey, I see you,

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Speaker 3: I acknowledge you.

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Speaker 2: I'm just going to step to the side and do

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Speaker 2: this speaking gig, do write this book, do whatever it is.

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Speaker 2: I'll come back to you in a sec. And I

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Speaker 2: find acknowledging it rather than trying to overcome it. For

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Speaker 2: me just silences it for enough time for me to

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Speaker 2: do the thing and be like, oh hey, old pal,

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Speaker 2: well that together again.

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Speaker 3: So it is a bit of a cycle. But to

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Speaker 3: your point, I think.

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Speaker 2: Everyone deals with it in a way that finding how

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Speaker 2: it works for you.

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Speaker 3: I think is the trick.

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Speaker 1: Yes, And I think also what you're speaking about, I

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Speaker 1: say kind of the same thing in a different way,

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Speaker 1: which is I know that my self doubt, which is

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Speaker 1: a fear based thing today, you'll fuck it up, You're

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Speaker 1: not good enough, they won't like you. That's all fear.

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Speaker 1: That's emotion, right, it's all fear. So but but I

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Speaker 1: have data, I have evidence. I have a track record

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Speaker 1: that said as well, Craig, you know you can do

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Speaker 1: this because you've done this a lot and this company

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Speaker 1: is paying you to come back, so you can't do

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Speaker 1: that shit. So I think there's this paradigm, there's this place,

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Speaker 1: Samantha where the self doubt and the fear and that

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Speaker 1: all that bullshit can coexist with the knowledge I can

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Speaker 1: actually do it, you know.

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Speaker 3: So I don't know that does your self fither come from?

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Speaker 3: Like do you have a degree in what you're going

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Speaker 3: to talk about?

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Speaker 2: Like did someone externally validate you and be like, Okay,

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Speaker 2: you pass the test, here's your certificate.

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Speaker 3: Because I feel like my self data.

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Speaker 2: I never went to university. I'm completely self taught. So

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Speaker 2: I'm like, I don't know, adult gave me the permission slip,

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Speaker 2: and you know there's I have this thing room like

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Speaker 2: you've got to sign your own permission slip. But I'm

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Speaker 2: always like and I'm just waiting for the adult to

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Speaker 2: come in. I'm like, no, no, you're the adult in

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Speaker 2: the room, like you need to get this together. So yes,

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Speaker 2: that was my question, Like, is your self doubt based

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Speaker 2: on something that someone else has validated for you?

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Speaker 1: That's so clever, that's so good. I want to speak

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Speaker 1: to your lack of degree in the moment because I

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Speaker 1: have some advice that you may or may not want. Right, Okay,

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Speaker 1: if I start coaching TIF, just tell me to shout

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Speaker 1: the fuck.

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Speaker 3: Up, right, s me an invoice? So coaching session, No,

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Speaker 3: not at all, not at all.

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Speaker 1: So my self doubt probably is without trying to sound

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Speaker 1: weird or deep like, it's not. It's just it's like

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Speaker 1: a small voice, right, It's not this overwhelming scream and

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Speaker 1: it doesn't paralyze me. But I mean you know, at

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Speaker 1: the risk of boring my audience. So I was like

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Speaker 1: a pretty mediocre kid. I was morbidly obese in school

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Speaker 1: and all this stuff, right, pick last for teams. Not

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Speaker 1: a great academic, not a brilliant creative, not like literally

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Speaker 1: not amazing at anything, like so fucking average it pretty

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Speaker 1: much everything. And I think for me, because I knew

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Speaker 1: that I wasn't brilliant, I'm still not still know that,

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Speaker 1: still okay with that, right, But I knew that I

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Speaker 1: knew that I wasn't outstanding in anything. But so that

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Speaker 1: kind of lingers a bit that I think. But it's

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Speaker 1: almost just like, I don't know, it's like you had

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Speaker 1: something cut off when you were fourteen, off your forearm

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Speaker 1: or something, and the scar is still there and the thing,

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Speaker 1: the thing's not there anymore, but the scar is and

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Speaker 1: you're aware of it. Right, So it's almost for me

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Speaker 1: like a psychological, sociological and or emotional scar that I

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Speaker 1: have a bit of an awareness of, but it doesn't

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Speaker 1: fuck me over. But just quickly back to you. I

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Speaker 1: was talking to a lady yesterday. Her name is I

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Speaker 1: can't pronounce her surname well, but it Sarah Rushbatch. Is

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Speaker 1: that her name Tiff. You know, the Gray Area drinking lady.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yep, yeah.

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Speaker 1: So I was talking to her, and I don't think

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Speaker 1: she'd mind me talking about this. So she specializes this.

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Speaker 1: You're going to go, what the fuck is he talking about.

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Speaker 1: I'll come back to you, right. She specializes in this

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Speaker 1: area called Gray Area drinking, where you know, people they're

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Speaker 1: not our coolics, but they're problem drinkers. So they might

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Speaker 1: not drink for four or five days, which is not

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Speaker 1: typical of an alcoholic, but then they'll get devastated every

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Speaker 1: weekend and then they're no good till Tuesday, but they'll

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Speaker 1: only drink two days and all of that. And she

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Speaker 1: started to work with companies and you know, she started

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Speaker 1: to go in this space and she's like, I feel

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Speaker 1: in some ways unqualified to talk about mind stuff, for

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Speaker 1: brain stuff, for psychology or human behavior because i'm you know,

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Speaker 1: and I said, well, here's the thing, and this is

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Speaker 1: and I've said this to Tiff, because TIFF's also a

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Speaker 1: corporate speaker and coaches people. And you know, I say,

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Speaker 1: you're not one. You're not pretending to be an expert

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Speaker 1: in human behavior, and you're not claiming to be too.

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Speaker 1: You're not pretending you're a psychologist. Right, It's like, you

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Speaker 1: don't need to be a dietitian to tell someone that

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Speaker 1: McDonald's is probably not your best choice. You don't need

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Speaker 1: to be a fucking genius to go, hey, Coco pops

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Speaker 1: are probably not optimal nutrition for Brecky. Right, you don't

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Speaker 1: need a degree, and neither do you need a degree

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Speaker 1: to go, Hey, everyone, I'm Samantha. This is what I've learned,

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Speaker 1: this is these are my experiences, this is my journey,

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Speaker 1: this is what worked for me, this is what I've

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Speaker 1: come to understand, this is what I think and believe,

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Speaker 1: and these are the reasons why I'm going to share

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Speaker 1: with you my philosophy, my ideas, my experiences, and then

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Speaker 1: you take out of that what you think is relevant

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Speaker 1: and if you want, apply it. Right.

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Speaker 2: But I think that's even your voice changed in how

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Speaker 2: you're saying that, Like, I think it's very different to

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Speaker 2: be like, here's my experience, my lived experience, rather than

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Speaker 2: here's some hard data or you know, McDonald's dad or

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Speaker 2: whatever the hard data is. And I think that's a

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Speaker 2: really empowering lens to approach it with you, like, this

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Speaker 2: is my experience, this is my lived experience, and I

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Speaker 2: want to share up with you rather than I'm an

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Speaker 2: expert on this topic and let me tell you why

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Speaker 2: I'm right and you're wrong.

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Speaker 3: So absolutely, yes.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, And you know, like even the experts, it's

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Speaker 1: like I would people might call me an expert in

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Speaker 1: terms of exercise science because that's been my background. I'm

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Speaker 1: an exercise scientist and blah blah blah, and I've done

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Speaker 1: a lot in this field. But even when I prescribe

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Speaker 1: someone a program, for example, it's still an educated guess. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: and I still don't know what the fucking outcome is

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Speaker 1: going to be because everybody's body responds individually, like everyone's

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Speaker 1: physiology is different, just like everybody's brain is different. Nobody's

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Speaker 1: got the same mind as anyone else, you know.

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Speaker 3: But in your.

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Speaker 2: Case, you're like, here's the data that I have to

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Speaker 2: back up what I think is going to happen. So

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Speaker 2: it's I totally understand it and agree with what you're saying.

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Speaker 2: And I think in any any time you're speaking, though,

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Speaker 2: whether you're giving advice, whether you're just telling your story,

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Speaker 2: it's a place of vulnerability and you have to arrive

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Speaker 2: at with a place of vulnerability.

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Speaker 3: Otherwise it's just arrogance.

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Speaker 2: And I think, and to your point before, like, if

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Speaker 2: you're not feeling a bit uneasy when you've been vulnerable,

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Speaker 2: you're probably not doing it right.

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Speaker 1: Yes, definitely, But I also think I agree with you.

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Speaker 1: But when you are in front of an audience and

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Speaker 1: you you kind of have this vibe of hey, everyone,

435
00:21:14,000 --> 00:21:17,359
Speaker 1: by the way, I'm not a guru, just letting you know,

436
00:21:17,840 --> 00:21:21,359
Speaker 1: not a guru, not an expert. I'm just going to

437
00:21:21,400 --> 00:21:25,080
Speaker 1: share my journey and story. Some of you will resonate,

438
00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:27,760
Speaker 1: some of you won't. That's cool, you know. And I

439
00:21:27,800 --> 00:21:31,160
Speaker 1: think like the data that you have, the evidence that

440
00:21:31,200 --> 00:21:33,919
Speaker 1: you have, the science in inverted commas, that you have,

441
00:21:35,400 --> 00:21:40,040
Speaker 1: your results, like everything that you've been doing until now

442
00:21:40,160 --> 00:21:43,199
Speaker 1: in your business, with your creative journey, with your books,

443
00:21:43,240 --> 00:21:46,960
Speaker 1: with your writing, with your business development, with your online

444
00:21:47,000 --> 00:21:50,760
Speaker 1: with your offline. You could call all of that research.

445
00:21:51,560 --> 00:21:55,600
Speaker 1: You could call that the Samantha project and equals one

446
00:21:56,000 --> 00:21:58,399
Speaker 1: like you're the you know, it's you in the middle

447
00:21:58,400 --> 00:22:02,760
Speaker 1: of this experiment, and so people can't argue with your

448
00:22:02,800 --> 00:22:06,440
Speaker 1: own research or your own outcomes. And you're not telling

449
00:22:06,560 --> 00:22:10,200
Speaker 1: people what to do, do you know what I mean?

450
00:22:11,280 --> 00:22:14,639
Speaker 2: No, definitely, And I think that's that's the realization that

451
00:22:14,880 --> 00:22:17,040
Speaker 2: I think through the journey you get to you you're like, Okay,

452
00:22:17,280 --> 00:22:20,239
Speaker 2: the way that I explain things, or my methodology or

453
00:22:20,320 --> 00:22:22,600
Speaker 2: my you know, however I look through that lens.

454
00:22:22,960 --> 00:22:24,560
Speaker 3: That's why people resonate with you.

455
00:22:24,600 --> 00:22:26,640
Speaker 2: And then someone could be saying a very similar experience

456
00:22:26,720 --> 00:22:28,919
Speaker 2: but explain it a different way, and that's that's how

457
00:22:28,960 --> 00:22:31,399
Speaker 2: people resonate with them. So that's you know, when I

458
00:22:31,440 --> 00:22:36,199
Speaker 2: say about the imposter syndrome, it's probably more beer based

459
00:22:36,280 --> 00:22:40,600
Speaker 2: around you're just not good enough, not so much, you.

460
00:22:40,560 --> 00:22:42,320
Speaker 3: Haven't done the time, you don't know what you're doing.

461
00:22:42,440 --> 00:22:45,879
Speaker 2: So it's that continual dance with it, which to your point,

462
00:22:45,920 --> 00:22:48,520
Speaker 2: I think sometimes that you know, and the retaliator in

463
00:22:48,560 --> 00:22:50,920
Speaker 2: me is like, well, I'll show you imposter syndrome.

464
00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:52,760
Speaker 3: So in a way I do make it work.

465
00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:57,679
Speaker 1: So yeah, it comes around. So everyone, well not everyone,

466
00:22:57,720 --> 00:22:59,200
Speaker 1: but a lot of people that I have on who've

467
00:22:59,200 --> 00:23:04,280
Speaker 1: written a book. Actually, someone who's recently published Congratulations. By

468
00:23:04,320 --> 00:23:07,080
Speaker 1: the way, as we record this, it's the thirtieth of October.

469
00:23:07,160 --> 00:23:08,800
Speaker 1: This will be up in the next day or two.

470
00:23:10,760 --> 00:23:13,719
Speaker 1: Samantha's new book got released yesterday. The twenty ninth am,

471
00:23:13,720 --> 00:23:14,800
Speaker 1: I correct in saying.

472
00:23:14,600 --> 00:23:15,880
Speaker 3: That that is correct. Yep.

473
00:23:16,440 --> 00:23:19,320
Speaker 1: And the book is called Marigold's Magic Stars. Before we

474
00:23:19,359 --> 00:23:23,360
Speaker 1: talk specifically about the book, I want to know about

475
00:23:24,200 --> 00:23:29,040
Speaker 1: your writing process. Is it instinctive? Intuitive? Is it learned

476
00:23:29,720 --> 00:23:31,920
Speaker 1: as have you? How do you do it? Like? What's

477
00:23:31,920 --> 00:23:33,760
Speaker 1: your protocol? Yeah?

478
00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:36,200
Speaker 2: Well, I mean obviously very different from this kid's book

479
00:23:36,240 --> 00:23:39,399
Speaker 2: versus the memoir. The memoir I found quite difficult. I

480
00:23:39,440 --> 00:23:42,240
Speaker 2: think going back to, you know, the darkest, most vulnerable

481
00:23:42,240 --> 00:23:44,800
Speaker 2: parts of your life, revisiting them, pulling them out and

482
00:23:44,800 --> 00:23:47,399
Speaker 2: putting them on a page to be consumed, you know,

483
00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:52,359
Speaker 2: within a chapter. Definitely was a longer and more arduous process.

484
00:23:52,480 --> 00:23:56,119
Speaker 2: But you know, it metaphorically felt lighter with every page

485
00:23:56,160 --> 00:23:57,640
Speaker 2: that I wrote to get it, to get it out

486
00:23:58,000 --> 00:24:01,480
Speaker 2: and onto the page. This spook actually Marigo's Magic says.

487
00:24:01,480 --> 00:24:04,440
Speaker 2: I wrote it in one of the lockdowns, and it's

488
00:24:04,480 --> 00:24:07,240
Speaker 2: been that long in process to get it out here today.

489
00:24:07,920 --> 00:24:11,359
Speaker 2: But it actually arrived to me almost fully formed. And

490
00:24:11,400 --> 00:24:14,600
Speaker 2: I talk about creativity like this kind of bubbles that

491
00:24:14,640 --> 00:24:16,639
Speaker 2: are always floating around us and just waiting.

492
00:24:16,640 --> 00:24:18,280
Speaker 3: You know, Elizabeth Gilbert talks about there.

493
00:24:18,200 --> 00:24:20,960
Speaker 2: Trying to find a human collaborator, and I just feel

494
00:24:21,000 --> 00:24:23,439
Speaker 2: like Marigo kind of landed on me one day and

495
00:24:23,480 --> 00:24:26,360
Speaker 2: it was a middle beginning end and I sat down

496
00:24:26,359 --> 00:24:28,520
Speaker 2: at my desk. I didn't get up to you know,

497
00:24:28,640 --> 00:24:30,119
Speaker 2: check the fridge, I didn't get up to p and

498
00:24:30,400 --> 00:24:32,520
Speaker 2: I was like, this needs to come out as it's

499
00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:34,720
Speaker 2: coming into my mind and wrote kind of the first

500
00:24:34,840 --> 00:24:40,640
Speaker 2: draft in one sit down go and felt it felt

501
00:24:40,680 --> 00:24:43,240
Speaker 2: like a story that needed to be told. But it's

502
00:24:43,320 --> 00:24:45,960
Speaker 2: you know, that feels like an idyllic case as a writer,

503
00:24:46,359 --> 00:24:49,920
Speaker 2: because most writers, myself included, love having written.

504
00:24:49,600 --> 00:24:50,359
Speaker 3: But hate writing.

505
00:24:50,640 --> 00:24:55,000
Speaker 2: So it definitely felt like a unique story that downloaded

506
00:24:55,040 --> 00:24:55,320
Speaker 2: to me.

507
00:24:55,480 --> 00:24:56,800
Speaker 3: So it's been three years in.

508
00:24:56,800 --> 00:24:59,359
Speaker 2: The making though from that point, but I'm excited to

509
00:24:59,359 --> 00:24:59,960
Speaker 2: have her out there.

510
00:25:01,280 --> 00:25:05,840
Speaker 1: And it's like I think sometimes with creatives, it's like that,

511
00:25:06,440 --> 00:25:09,040
Speaker 1: you know, Marigold was there, you just needed to get

512
00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:14,240
Speaker 1: her out. It's like, you know, just percolating away. I

513
00:25:14,280 --> 00:25:21,000
Speaker 1: think tip was it Michaelangelo that sculpted the David and Bob.

514
00:25:21,119 --> 00:25:25,919
Speaker 1: Bobby always talks about when somebody asked Michelangelo how we

515
00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:30,040
Speaker 1: sculpted the David, which is arguably the most famous sculpture

516
00:25:30,080 --> 00:25:33,119
Speaker 1: in the history of art. He said, Well, the David

517
00:25:33,240 --> 00:25:36,359
Speaker 1: was always there. I just needed to I just needed

518
00:25:36,359 --> 00:25:40,040
Speaker 1: to get all the bits, the non David bits, out

519
00:25:40,040 --> 00:25:40,480
Speaker 1: of the way.

520
00:25:40,960 --> 00:25:41,280
Speaker 3: Yeah.

521
00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:43,760
Speaker 2: And I think that's the most powerful way to look

522
00:25:43,760 --> 00:25:47,000
Speaker 2: at creativity and not just as you know paint and pottery.

523
00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:49,560
Speaker 3: Will's creativity like. Creativity is life like.

524
00:25:49,600 --> 00:25:52,560
Speaker 2: What we're what we're destined to do is there if

525
00:25:52,600 --> 00:25:56,720
Speaker 2: we are brave enough to take inspired action to meet it,

526
00:25:57,000 --> 00:25:59,639
Speaker 2: if we're brave enough to take the feared and remove

527
00:25:59,760 --> 00:26:02,440
Speaker 2: you know, the unknown and walk towards it, it's there

528
00:26:02,480 --> 00:26:05,399
Speaker 2: waiting for us. But I just don't think, you know,

529
00:26:05,480 --> 00:26:07,720
Speaker 2: that's a lot easier said than done. But it's very

530
00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:09,840
Speaker 2: similar to be our process.

531
00:26:10,200 --> 00:26:12,280
Speaker 1: Hey, I don't know if you heard about this tip.

532
00:26:12,320 --> 00:26:14,359
Speaker 1: I don't know if we've spoken about this either. We

533
00:26:14,440 --> 00:26:18,119
Speaker 1: might have. But so recently, do you know who banks

534
00:26:18,119 --> 00:26:21,840
Speaker 1: he is, Samantha, I do, yes, yeah, so tif do

535
00:26:21,880 --> 00:26:27,280
Speaker 1: you know this Banksy story that was circulating recently. Yeah, yeah,

536
00:26:27,320 --> 00:26:32,639
Speaker 1: So Banksy gave this this man I think it was

537
00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:37,960
Speaker 1: eight original Banksy Samantha and to go to a market

538
00:26:38,040 --> 00:26:38,760
Speaker 1: in New York.

539
00:26:39,280 --> 00:26:42,120
Speaker 3: I don't know this story here, it's brilliant and.

540
00:26:42,040 --> 00:26:44,800
Speaker 1: So for our listeners. So he went to this stall

541
00:26:45,800 --> 00:26:47,800
Speaker 1: he set up, and I think there was like eight

542
00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:50,720
Speaker 1: or ten. So a banks is worth whatever one hundred

543
00:26:50,760 --> 00:26:53,800
Speaker 1: and two hundred US thousand dollars that he does in

544
00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:57,760
Speaker 1: fucking twelve minutes. And then you know, but it was

545
00:26:57,800 --> 00:26:59,960
Speaker 1: funny because then it had on the stall, it had

546
00:27:00,119 --> 00:27:03,520
Speaker 1: original Bankses and they were like sixty or eighty bucks

547
00:27:03,960 --> 00:27:06,680
Speaker 1: and they didn't even sell. I think they sold four

548
00:27:06,840 --> 00:27:09,360
Speaker 1: or five of them or something, but not all of them,

549
00:27:09,720 --> 00:27:13,480
Speaker 1: and people were haggling. People wanted it for forty, not sixty.

550
00:27:14,960 --> 00:27:18,800
Speaker 1: But it's funny, how like, I'm fascinated. I don't know,

551
00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:23,840
Speaker 1: we're digressing, but we'll come back. I'm fascinated with the

552
00:27:23,920 --> 00:27:32,160
Speaker 1: psychology of value related to art. It's like because if

553
00:27:32,200 --> 00:27:34,919
Speaker 1: you think, like, let's say I drew something that was

554
00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:39,560
Speaker 1: identical to a Banksy and everyone thought Banksy did it,

555
00:27:39,640 --> 00:27:43,680
Speaker 1: what's worth two hundergrand? But if it's the exact same thing,

556
00:27:43,720 --> 00:27:47,480
Speaker 1: I mean, identical, same canvas, same paint, same everything. But

557
00:27:48,200 --> 00:27:50,440
Speaker 1: fred Smith did it or Craig Harber did, it's worth

558
00:27:50,440 --> 00:27:54,680
Speaker 1: a dollar thirty five? You know what do you think

559
00:27:54,720 --> 00:27:59,280
Speaker 1: about that? The psychology and the value are I.

560
00:27:59,280 --> 00:28:03,400
Speaker 2: Mean, it makes absolutely no sense. I appreciate it. I

561
00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:06,440
Speaker 2: think art is valuable. I think artists should be paid

562
00:28:06,480 --> 00:28:11,200
Speaker 2: at top dollar. But to your point, like it makes

563
00:28:11,280 --> 00:28:13,080
Speaker 2: no sense when you do it, that it's a very

564
00:28:13,080 --> 00:28:17,639
Speaker 2: fickle world to live and revolve in that said having

565
00:28:18,600 --> 00:28:20,960
Speaker 2: and more so now in the same age when digital

566
00:28:21,080 --> 00:28:23,520
Speaker 2: is so easy to replicate, all things are so easy

567
00:28:23,520 --> 00:28:24,160
Speaker 2: to imitate.

568
00:28:24,359 --> 00:28:26,679
Speaker 3: So I don't know, I'm.

569
00:28:26,560 --> 00:28:29,280
Speaker 2: Not throwing my money at art, but I do appreciate

570
00:28:29,359 --> 00:28:32,680
Speaker 2: the process and I admire it from a distance. In

571
00:28:33,040 --> 00:28:35,879
Speaker 2: that echelon of when we're talking about that type of

572
00:28:35,880 --> 00:28:37,400
Speaker 2: money in art, you.

573
00:28:37,359 --> 00:28:41,400
Speaker 1: Think about think about the psychology of money and value

574
00:28:41,480 --> 00:28:47,240
Speaker 1: and perceived value. It's like, there are I was going

575
00:28:47,280 --> 00:28:50,560
Speaker 1: to do a gig. I was booked to do an

576
00:28:50,600 --> 00:28:54,840
Speaker 1: event with Now this might what I'm telling you is true,

577
00:28:54,840 --> 00:28:57,480
Speaker 1: but the number might be flawed. But I was booked

578
00:28:57,520 --> 00:29:00,840
Speaker 1: to do an event about a decade ago, and there

579
00:29:00,920 --> 00:29:04,240
Speaker 1: was like five speakers, and one of the speakers was

580
00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:07,640
Speaker 1: Lance Armstrong. Now this is before the shit hit the

581
00:29:07,680 --> 00:29:11,840
Speaker 1: fan with his right, but I was told he was

582
00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:14,200
Speaker 1: being paid quarter of a million dollars for a forty

583
00:29:14,200 --> 00:29:18,320
Speaker 1: five minute note, right, And I you know, let's just

584
00:29:18,360 --> 00:29:24,240
Speaker 1: say I wasn't getting anywhere near that, obviously, But at

585
00:29:24,240 --> 00:29:29,400
Speaker 1: the time, I'm thinking what could somebody do? Like what

586
00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:33,040
Speaker 1: could how on earth? And I was just so blunt.

587
00:29:33,120 --> 00:29:35,280
Speaker 1: Even if it was fifty grand, which it wasn't. It

588
00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:37,120
Speaker 1: was way more than that. But even if it was

589
00:29:37,200 --> 00:29:39,720
Speaker 1: fifty grand, right, And I looked, I look at that

590
00:29:39,840 --> 00:29:42,400
Speaker 1: in the marketplace and I think, you know, it's like

591
00:29:42,440 --> 00:29:44,480
Speaker 1: people who would spend a million dollars on a car,

592
00:29:44,640 --> 00:29:47,160
Speaker 1: or people who would spend Even where I live there's

593
00:29:47,200 --> 00:29:49,840
Speaker 1: a whole lot of guys and a few girls. It's

594
00:29:49,880 --> 00:29:56,400
Speaker 1: a very very cycling focused area. Right, So if you

595
00:29:56,480 --> 00:29:58,640
Speaker 1: have a bike, if you're out on Beach Road near

596
00:29:58,640 --> 00:30:01,000
Speaker 1: where I live, and your bike's not worth ten grand,

597
00:30:01,240 --> 00:30:05,520
Speaker 1: you've got a shit bike, right, you know, it's like,

598
00:30:05,920 --> 00:30:08,040
Speaker 1: who the fuck would want to spend ten or fifteen

599
00:30:08,080 --> 00:30:11,120
Speaker 1: thousand dollars on a push? Well, a lot of people,

600
00:30:11,440 --> 00:30:11,640
Speaker 1: you know.

601
00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:13,360
Speaker 3: It's interesting.

602
00:30:13,360 --> 00:30:16,400
Speaker 2: I think with the speaker one is interesting because that

603
00:30:16,440 --> 00:30:18,080
Speaker 2: makes more sense to me because I'm like, if Lance

604
00:30:18,160 --> 00:30:20,720
Speaker 2: Armstrong is going to draw a lot of people to

605
00:30:20,760 --> 00:30:23,360
Speaker 2: spend money on ticketing, that makes more sense in the

606
00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:28,040
Speaker 2: creative world to me. The bick thing, whether it's you know,

607
00:30:28,080 --> 00:30:32,440
Speaker 2: an identity a visual statement, like same as what you

608
00:30:32,520 --> 00:30:34,840
Speaker 2: choose to wear, things like that. But when you talk

609
00:30:34,880 --> 00:30:38,040
Speaker 2: about art on a canvas, that's where I'm like, oh,

610
00:30:38,160 --> 00:30:40,800
Speaker 2: that's that's a harder one to explain to me.

611
00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:46,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, all right, So give us the snapshot of Marigold.

612
00:30:47,040 --> 00:30:49,600
Speaker 1: Tell us about or as much or as little as

613
00:30:49,600 --> 00:30:50,600
Speaker 1: you want to tell us about them.

614
00:30:50,760 --> 00:30:51,480
Speaker 3: Yeah.

615
00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:54,400
Speaker 2: No, it's you know, it's an eighty page book, so

616
00:30:54,480 --> 00:30:57,080
Speaker 2: children's literature, you know, I say it's in a children's format,

617
00:30:57,080 --> 00:31:00,640
Speaker 2: but it very much is for any creative adult that

618
00:31:00,720 --> 00:31:03,280
Speaker 2: feels like they've kind of drifted from their creativity. I

619
00:31:03,320 --> 00:31:06,000
Speaker 2: think as kids, we are so innately in tune with

620
00:31:06,080 --> 00:31:10,120
Speaker 2: our intuition and our creativity. And in the book, Marigold's

621
00:31:10,120 --> 00:31:13,480
Speaker 2: intuition is represented by stars, so when she's inspired, you know,

622
00:31:13,560 --> 00:31:17,880
Speaker 2: they dance her hands and through our minds, and you know,

623
00:31:17,920 --> 00:31:20,920
Speaker 2: she has this experience where she's kind of not everything's

624
00:31:20,920 --> 00:31:22,880
Speaker 2: about creativity and get your head out of the cloud

625
00:31:22,960 --> 00:31:25,720
Speaker 2: and stop daydreaming, which I think every creative person has

626
00:31:25,800 --> 00:31:26,320
Speaker 2: been told.

627
00:31:26,400 --> 00:31:28,800
Speaker 3: And you know, you talk about the scar that you

628
00:31:28,840 --> 00:31:29,480
Speaker 3: said has.

629
00:31:29,320 --> 00:31:32,440
Speaker 2: Healed over when you're fourteen, but the DNA is still there,

630
00:31:32,760 --> 00:31:34,800
Speaker 2: And I think very much when we're told those things

631
00:31:34,840 --> 00:31:37,440
Speaker 2: as kids, we hold on to them as truth. So,

632
00:31:38,000 --> 00:31:39,800
Speaker 2: you know, if we're a creative kid and we're now

633
00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:43,320
Speaker 2: a creative adult, but we've suppressed that creativity, it's going

634
00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:45,440
Speaker 2: to kind of sit as a rub on us where

635
00:31:45,440 --> 00:31:47,480
Speaker 2: we might not feel like we're doing what we're.

636
00:31:47,560 --> 00:31:49,520
Speaker 3: You know, what we meant to be doing in this life.

637
00:31:49,560 --> 00:31:51,440
Speaker 3: We're doing what we've been told we should be doing.

638
00:31:51,600 --> 00:31:54,720
Speaker 2: So that's what I hope the story resonates with people,

639
00:31:54,760 --> 00:31:57,920
Speaker 2: bit kids, be it adults, that it's you know, we

640
00:31:57,960 --> 00:32:01,720
Speaker 2: have been guided by our creativity to align with I say,

641
00:32:01,720 --> 00:32:04,680
Speaker 2: our higher self and our higher purpose, and it's our.

642
00:32:04,520 --> 00:32:06,240
Speaker 3: Responsibility to follow that.

643
00:32:06,360 --> 00:32:08,800
Speaker 2: So I hope it encourages people to get back to

644
00:32:08,880 --> 00:32:12,200
Speaker 2: their creativity and really follow that passion within.

645
00:32:13,280 --> 00:32:16,240
Speaker 1: And what kind of age group do you think, Samantha, Like,

646
00:32:16,360 --> 00:32:19,120
Speaker 1: I mean, you said adults, but did you write it

647
00:32:19,160 --> 00:32:21,480
Speaker 1: with an age group in mind? Particularly?

648
00:32:22,720 --> 00:32:24,720
Speaker 2: I wanted it to feel I would say the age

649
00:32:24,720 --> 00:32:28,120
Speaker 2: group is about six to ten. It's a hardcover book

650
00:32:28,120 --> 00:32:30,600
Speaker 2: that comes in a first edition collector's box, and I

651
00:32:30,640 --> 00:32:32,920
Speaker 2: really wanted it to feel like, if you say it,

652
00:32:33,320 --> 00:32:34,880
Speaker 2: you know a seven or eight year old. You can

653
00:32:34,920 --> 00:32:36,960
Speaker 2: read the book entirely by yourself and it feels like

654
00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:39,200
Speaker 2: you've read a grown up novel. I wanted them to

655
00:32:39,200 --> 00:32:41,160
Speaker 2: feel that sense of achievement at the end of it.

656
00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:43,440
Speaker 2: If it's a younger kid, you're probably reading it to

657
00:32:43,480 --> 00:32:47,040
Speaker 2: them over two or three nights. And we've collaborated with

658
00:32:47,080 --> 00:32:50,560
Speaker 2: Emma Leonard was an incredible Victorian illustrator, and she has

659
00:32:50,600 --> 00:32:53,720
Speaker 2: bought the world of Marigold to life so beautifully through

660
00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:57,000
Speaker 2: these watercolor and digital illustrations, and it's an illustration on

661
00:32:57,040 --> 00:32:57,600
Speaker 2: every page.

662
00:32:57,640 --> 00:32:59,080
Speaker 3: It's a beautiful art book as well.

663
00:32:59,800 --> 00:33:02,960
Speaker 1: And who did you, if anyone well other than the

664
00:33:03,000 --> 00:33:05,640
Speaker 1: adults that read it to give you bloody you know,

665
00:33:05,720 --> 00:33:09,320
Speaker 1: technical feedback or robmatic you know, did you test drive

666
00:33:09,400 --> 00:33:10,240
Speaker 1: it on any kids?

667
00:33:11,120 --> 00:33:13,760
Speaker 3: I sent it to my god kids. I've got a

668
00:33:13,800 --> 00:33:15,080
Speaker 3: few early readers that.

669
00:33:15,040 --> 00:33:18,040
Speaker 2: Read it and the most heartwarming feedback and when I

670
00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:19,800
Speaker 2: knew I was on the right track with it, where

671
00:33:19,920 --> 00:33:21,880
Speaker 2: they said, oh my gosh, Marigold is me.

672
00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:23,760
Speaker 3: I see myself in Marigold.

673
00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:26,000
Speaker 2: And I think with any type of storytelling that is

674
00:33:26,040 --> 00:33:28,440
Speaker 2: the goal, right We want to see ourselves reflected back

675
00:33:28,840 --> 00:33:32,360
Speaker 2: in a character and their experiences so all the early

676
00:33:32,400 --> 00:33:34,440
Speaker 2: readers that have had it in the last week or

677
00:33:34,440 --> 00:33:38,320
Speaker 2: so have said similar things, so it's very very encouraging.

678
00:33:39,280 --> 00:33:45,120
Speaker 1: That's amazing. Well, congratulations. Hey have you have you ever

679
00:33:45,120 --> 00:33:47,040
Speaker 1: heard of a guy called sir Ken Robinson?

680
00:33:47,560 --> 00:33:49,160
Speaker 3: Of course, yes, yeah.

681
00:33:49,240 --> 00:33:51,720
Speaker 1: Do you remember did you see his Ted talk where

682
00:33:51,760 --> 00:33:55,080
Speaker 1: he spoke about you know, do you remember this tip

683
00:33:55,160 --> 00:33:57,960
Speaker 1: where sir Ken Robinson spoke about the young girl who

684
00:33:57,960 --> 00:34:01,800
Speaker 1: couldn't focus in class and they thought she had some

685
00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:07,160
Speaker 1: intellectual disability and blah blah blah, And the assessor came

686
00:34:07,200 --> 00:34:11,960
Speaker 1: and said, oh, she's not she's not handicapped. She's an artist.

687
00:34:12,120 --> 00:34:16,320
Speaker 1: She's a creative and of course her name was Gillian

688
00:34:16,400 --> 00:34:19,560
Speaker 1: Lynn and she went on to choreograph Cats and some

689
00:34:19,600 --> 00:34:21,920
Speaker 1: of the best shows in the world. It's like, the

690
00:34:22,000 --> 00:34:27,759
Speaker 1: really interesting thing about intelligence is that it's a spectrum.

691
00:34:27,880 --> 00:34:31,359
Speaker 1: It's not a thing. It's lots of things, you know.

692
00:34:31,760 --> 00:34:33,920
Speaker 2: It is that I think for so long, I know

693
00:34:34,080 --> 00:34:36,240
Speaker 2: myself growing up and I'm not sure what the school

694
00:34:36,239 --> 00:34:37,920
Speaker 2: system is like now, but for so long it was

695
00:34:37,960 --> 00:34:40,520
Speaker 2: greater just on one thing. So you kind of grow

696
00:34:40,600 --> 00:34:43,839
Speaker 2: up not thinking that that you're that, and I think,

697
00:34:43,920 --> 00:34:46,200
Speaker 2: you know, looking at what creative people have gone on

698
00:34:46,280 --> 00:34:48,359
Speaker 2: to do that might not have had that encouragement as

699
00:34:48,400 --> 00:34:53,719
Speaker 2: a kid. It's just wildly it's so intelligence all of

700
00:34:53,760 --> 00:34:55,520
Speaker 2: its own, and it's quite mesmerizing.

701
00:34:56,120 --> 00:34:59,600
Speaker 1: Wow, yeah, I'm with you, and it's look, I think

702
00:34:59,640 --> 00:35:03,759
Speaker 1: there on now you know they're you know, there's a

703
00:35:03,760 --> 00:35:06,719
Speaker 1: bunch of different you know, Joseph Steiner and Jiff what's

704
00:35:06,719 --> 00:35:10,880
Speaker 1: the other one, the other model of education. That's a

705
00:35:10,880 --> 00:35:15,239
Speaker 1: lot of people, Monsorry, yeah, Monsouri. There's quite a lot

706
00:35:15,280 --> 00:35:18,040
Speaker 1: of new kind of academic models coming out, and I

707
00:35:18,040 --> 00:35:21,919
Speaker 1: think also in mainstream schooling they're catching on. But I'm

708
00:35:21,960 --> 00:35:24,439
Speaker 1: with you, Samantha, Like when I grew up and I'm

709
00:35:24,480 --> 00:35:27,120
Speaker 1: fucking one hundred years older than you, but when I

710
00:35:27,160 --> 00:35:29,440
Speaker 1: grew up, I was I mean, I wasn't a dummy,

711
00:35:29,480 --> 00:35:31,879
Speaker 1: but yeah, you were all it was pretty much all

712
00:35:31,920 --> 00:35:37,680
Speaker 1: about academic intelligence. And I think now we're starting to

713
00:35:37,880 --> 00:35:40,960
Speaker 1: open the door and understand a little bit more broadly

714
00:35:41,000 --> 00:35:43,600
Speaker 1: what that can mean. But hopefully meet kids where they're

715
00:35:43,640 --> 00:35:49,840
Speaker 1: at in terms of their unique intelligence and ability. Just

716
00:35:49,960 --> 00:35:53,520
Speaker 1: quickly before we let you go, super good to meet you,

717
00:35:53,560 --> 00:35:57,400
Speaker 1: by the way, Great chatty, what's your next book about?

718
00:35:59,160 --> 00:36:02,319
Speaker 3: I've got two kind of on the go. I she

719
00:36:02,360 --> 00:36:04,440
Speaker 3: had got three on the go. I was in film.

720
00:36:04,200 --> 00:36:07,880
Speaker 2: School in New York a few years ago, and it

721
00:36:07,960 --> 00:36:11,200
Speaker 2: was when Roe V. Wade was overturned, and I took

722
00:36:11,239 --> 00:36:14,399
Speaker 2: it as inspiration to kind of plot out this dystopian

723
00:36:14,440 --> 00:36:16,600
Speaker 2: world of what that might look like twenty years from

724
00:36:16,640 --> 00:36:19,279
Speaker 2: now if that continues on.

725
00:36:19,520 --> 00:36:23,000
Speaker 3: So I'm working on that very dark and heavy material.

726
00:36:23,160 --> 00:36:26,680
Speaker 2: So it's my internet search history is quite grim on

727
00:36:26,719 --> 00:36:30,319
Speaker 2: that one. And I've already worked on the second book

728
00:36:30,360 --> 00:36:33,239
Speaker 2: of Marigold. And yeah, I just got a few little

729
00:36:33,239 --> 00:36:36,360
Speaker 2: projects on the go, and I keep jumping between between

730
00:36:36,360 --> 00:36:38,719
Speaker 2: them all because I feel, you know, creatively, when I'm

731
00:36:38,800 --> 00:36:41,359
Speaker 2: kind of in a project and get writer's block, I

732
00:36:41,480 --> 00:36:43,360
Speaker 2: don't want to step away and stop being creative. I

733
00:36:43,400 --> 00:36:45,640
Speaker 2: kind of want to just pivot or creative rulette I

734
00:36:45,640 --> 00:36:47,360
Speaker 2: call it, and kind of move to the next project

735
00:36:47,560 --> 00:36:49,520
Speaker 2: and allow the creativity to flow through that way.

736
00:36:49,600 --> 00:36:51,600
Speaker 3: So it still being creative, but just on a different channel.

737
00:36:52,640 --> 00:36:57,680
Speaker 1: Perfect. Now, what's this split between reading a hard copy

738
00:36:57,719 --> 00:37:00,840
Speaker 1: book and listening to books? What are you? Are you

739
00:37:01,120 --> 00:37:05,040
Speaker 1: all books or are you audible? Are you old?

740
00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:07,560
Speaker 3: I prefer old school.

741
00:37:07,600 --> 00:37:09,200
Speaker 2: I definitely prefer to have a book in my hands

742
00:37:09,200 --> 00:37:11,560
Speaker 2: because I travel so much. I definitely am a kindle girl,

743
00:37:12,719 --> 00:37:15,080
Speaker 2: but I do love an audiobook. If I'm on a

744
00:37:15,160 --> 00:37:17,799
Speaker 2: road trip, I cometing to focus unless I'm in the car,

745
00:37:17,840 --> 00:37:19,239
Speaker 2: but that's definitely an audiobook.

746
00:37:19,280 --> 00:37:22,840
Speaker 1: Time great, Now, before we let you go, what do

747
00:37:22,880 --> 00:37:24,439
Speaker 1: you want to plug? Where do you want to tell

748
00:37:24,480 --> 00:37:26,960
Speaker 1: our listeners to go and look at? Obviously? The book

749
00:37:26,960 --> 00:37:32,280
Speaker 1: everyone is called Marigold's Magic Stars by Samantha Wills, illustrated

750
00:37:32,400 --> 00:37:34,520
Speaker 1: by What's your Friend's Name? Emma Leonard.

751
00:37:34,800 --> 00:37:38,640
Speaker 2: Emma Leonard illustrated it, and it is available exclusively at

752
00:37:38,640 --> 00:37:40,120
Speaker 2: briobooks dot com dot.

753
00:37:40,000 --> 00:37:45,240
Speaker 1: Au perfect perfect, Hey, well, we appreciate you. Congratulations the book.

754
00:37:45,280 --> 00:37:49,799
Speaker 1: The book looks beautiful. I've got an e copy and

755
00:37:49,840 --> 00:37:52,080
Speaker 1: I'm not just saying this everyone, it looks fucking amazing.

756
00:37:52,239 --> 00:37:56,279
Speaker 1: So well done you, good for you, Good for you,

757
00:37:56,520 --> 00:37:59,160
Speaker 1: and good luck. We'll say goodbye off air, but for

758
00:37:59,200 --> 00:38:01,359
Speaker 1: the minute. God luck with the next books as well,

759
00:38:01,440 --> 00:38:03,560
Speaker 1: good luck with this. I hope you sell a squillion

760
00:38:04,239 --> 00:38:06,799
Speaker 1: and keep doing what you do because you're really good

761
00:38:06,840 --> 00:38:07,080
Speaker 1: at it.

762
00:38:07,480 --> 00:38:09,000
Speaker 3: I appreciate that. Thank you so much.

763
00:38:09,680 --> 00:38:10,400
Speaker 1: Thanks Amantha,