WEBVTT - Peter Dutton, Donald Trump Jr and the Australian weapons mogul 0:00:01.280 --> 0:00:09.920 From Schwartz Media. I'm Riby Jones. This is seven am. 0:00:09.960 --> 0:00:13.400 As Trump's radical reshaping of the US pulls into focus, 0:00:13.880 --> 0:00:16.040 so too has the list of those who have gained 0:00:16.200 --> 0:00:19.000 entry to his inner circle. And that list includes not 0:00:19.120 --> 0:00:24.079 only Australia's richest woman, but also Australia's largest private arms supplier. 0:00:25.040 --> 0:00:28.000 Robert Nayer might not be a household name yet, but 0:00:28.120 --> 0:00:31.160 the weapons mogul is a close confidant to Peter Dutton, 0:00:31.480 --> 0:00:33.720 married to a katta, as well as a fishing and 0:00:33.840 --> 0:00:37.879 hunting power to Donald Trump Junior. Today Special correspondent for 0:00:37.880 --> 0:00:41.800 the Saturday Paper, Jason Cottsugus on Robert Nya's arms empire 0:00:42.000 --> 0:00:50.040 and the impact he'll have on Australian defense policy. It's Wednesday, 0:00:50.520 --> 0:00:59.120 March twelfth. So Jason, you've recently discovered that you are 0:00:59.160 --> 0:01:03.880 now one it's removed from Donald Trump or can you 0:01:03.920 --> 0:01:05.360 tell me how that came to be? 0:01:05.840 --> 0:01:06.160 Ruby? 0:01:06.200 --> 0:01:08.800 It's a frightening thought, isn't it. But it came about 0:01:08.959 --> 0:01:12.440 because I was invited to a dinner recently at a 0:01:12.480 --> 0:01:16.920 favorite canber restaurant for the lobbying class, a Cantonese restaurant 0:01:16.959 --> 0:01:20.240 called Chairman and Yip. And this dinner was hosted by 0:01:20.880 --> 0:01:24.520 a guy called Robert Nyer. Robert is from Brisbane. He 0:01:24.600 --> 0:01:29.320 went to one of the prominent Anglican grammar schools up there, 0:01:29.319 --> 0:01:34.920 known as Churchy and after his father started selling sporting 0:01:34.959 --> 0:01:39.200 firearms at the back of their gas station in rural Queensland, 0:01:39.800 --> 0:01:44.200 Robert has managed to grow that business into an international 0:01:44.720 --> 0:01:48.960 defense company and his company is now Australia's largest private 0:01:49.080 --> 0:01:52.640 arms supplier. And during the course of this dinner, Robert 0:01:52.640 --> 0:01:55.400 and I I have started talking about his very warm 0:01:55.480 --> 0:01:59.720 and cozy relationship with Donald Trump Junior and how the 0:01:59.720 --> 0:02:03.880 two them have become quite close friends. So once I 0:02:03.920 --> 0:02:06.760 knew that I had a lot more questions to ask, I. 0:02:06.800 --> 0:02:11.800 Bet, so what did Robert Nya say to you about 0:02:12.000 --> 0:02:14.079 Trump Junior and his friendship with him? 0:02:14.360 --> 0:02:16.560 So it turns out that Donald Trump Junior and Robert 0:02:16.639 --> 0:02:19.720 Meyer they're close enough that they hang out in person 0:02:19.760 --> 0:02:22.639 every couple of months. And this friendship, of course goes 0:02:22.680 --> 0:02:26.080 back to early twenty twenty three when Robert Meya bought 0:02:26.120 --> 0:02:30.280 the US gun maker Barrett Firearms. Barrett Firearms are famous 0:02:30.320 --> 0:02:34.920 for making very high precision sniper rifles and these are 0:02:35.200 --> 0:02:38.160 apparently Donald Trump Junior's favorite, gun. 0:02:38.919 --> 0:02:43.240 Okay and Jason. We know that access to any of 0:02:43.280 --> 0:02:47.120 the Trump family is currency right now, and Trump's children 0:02:47.240 --> 0:02:51.800 especially have sway over Donald Trump. So how does this 0:02:52.040 --> 0:02:56.960 relationship factor into how Robert Nya is dealing with politicians 0:02:57.000 --> 0:02:57.840 here in Australia. 0:02:58.720 --> 0:03:02.240 Well, that's a really interesting in question because access to 0:03:02.480 --> 0:03:04.920 the Trump White House is so sought after as you 0:03:04.919 --> 0:03:08.120 can imagine. But Robert Nyer is also very well connected 0:03:08.160 --> 0:03:11.640 here in Australia. His Bobcatter's son in law. The board 0:03:11.680 --> 0:03:15.560 of his company, the Naya Group, is stacked with political insiders, 0:03:15.600 --> 0:03:20.280 including the former Defense Minister Christopher Pine, along with a 0:03:20.400 --> 0:03:25.880 very influential former Labor Parliamentary Secretary for Defense David Feeney, 0:03:26.240 --> 0:03:29.440 who's a very close friend of the current Defense Minister 0:03:29.800 --> 0:03:33.720 Richard Miles. But I think perhaps Robert Nyer's most important 0:03:33.720 --> 0:03:37.240 political contact in Australia is the leader of the Opposition, 0:03:37.320 --> 0:03:43.080 Peter Dutton. Back when Peter Dutton was Defense Minister in 0:03:43.160 --> 0:03:46.880 twenty twenty one, he opened Robert Nyer's eleven million dollar 0:03:46.920 --> 0:03:51.960 Brisbane headquarters. Less than six months later, in April twenty 0:03:52.040 --> 0:03:55.760 twenty two, Dutton awarded the Naya grouper five hundred and 0:03:55.840 --> 0:03:59.600 twenty seven million dollar contract to the Australian Defense Force. 0:04:00.160 --> 0:04:04.440 This is involving the supply of sniper systems, assault breaching gear, 0:04:04.800 --> 0:04:08.320 and various other small arms. Peter Nutton also opened the 0:04:08.400 --> 0:04:13.240 Naya Munitions Projectile Forging Plant, which also received a twenty 0:04:13.240 --> 0:04:17.480 eight million dollar grant from the federal government. Also that month, 0:04:17.520 --> 0:04:19.960 in May twenty twenty two, which was, of course, the 0:04:20.000 --> 0:04:24.520 month of the last federal election, Robert Eyre's company sponsored 0:04:24.560 --> 0:04:29.800 there an exclusive fundraiser for the Queensland LNP. This event 0:04:29.920 --> 0:04:33.400 gave guests who were paying five thousand dollars ahead, the 0:04:33.440 --> 0:04:37.880 opportunity to participate in a live shoot that was put 0:04:37.960 --> 0:04:40.599 on by the people from the Naya group. 0:04:42.440 --> 0:04:45.080 Okay, so, as you say, there is this relationship between 0:04:45.240 --> 0:04:48.799 Naya and Dunton that has been quite lucrative for Naya. 0:04:49.200 --> 0:04:52.719 He's also very well connected beyond that and has built 0:04:52.760 --> 0:04:57.279 his company into a major defense contractor So, what did 0:04:57.320 --> 0:05:01.719 you learn about just how big his empire actually is. 0:05:02.760 --> 0:05:05.800 So when Robertnya spoke at the National Press Club in 0:05:05.880 --> 0:05:09.640 December twenty twenty three, he laid out just how significant 0:05:09.920 --> 0:05:13.400 his company is for the Australian defense sector. 0:05:14.040 --> 0:05:16.560 It has now grown to be the largest Australian owned 0:05:16.560 --> 0:05:19.400 supplier of munitions to the Australian and New Zealand defense 0:05:19.440 --> 0:05:23.560 forces in Australia. We operate half of the Australian Government's 0:05:24.000 --> 0:05:28.800 Banilla Munitions facility in Victoria, where with partners like Ray 0:05:28.880 --> 0:05:34.080 Mattal and Northrop Grumman, we're privately invested in establishing medium caliber. 0:05:34.279 --> 0:05:37.480 With all those defense contracts has come a fair bit 0:05:37.520 --> 0:05:41.480 of business success, and perhaps that's why Robert Meyer has 0:05:41.480 --> 0:05:45.880 been able to afford a Matt Black Embreya Phenom three 0:05:46.000 --> 0:05:49.960 hundred private jet. This is a seven point six million 0:05:50.040 --> 0:05:54.320 dollar flying fortress with gold trim, leather upholstery and even 0:05:54.400 --> 0:05:59.760 personalized water bottles. And just like a lot of very 0:05:59.800 --> 0:06:03.520 well the people, he's also a fairly significant political donor. 0:06:04.080 --> 0:06:07.680 Over the three years to June twenty twenty two, Lesaya, 0:06:08.160 --> 0:06:11.640 Robert's wife and Bob Katter's daughter, gave three hundred thousand 0:06:11.720 --> 0:06:15.920 dollars to Bob Katter's Australian Party, some of which when 0:06:15.960 --> 0:06:19.320 undeclared for almost a year. In twenty twenty three, Lisa 0:06:19.360 --> 0:06:22.920 Andya contributed another one hundred thousand dollars to the Party, 0:06:23.279 --> 0:06:27.880 while the Naya Family Trust separately donated around sixty three 0:06:27.880 --> 0:06:31.040 and a half thousand dollars to the Liberal National Party 0:06:31.680 --> 0:06:34.440 since the Labor Party came to government in twenty twenty two. 0:06:35.080 --> 0:06:38.320 The Naya Family Trust has also donated around one hundred 0:06:38.360 --> 0:06:42.000 thousand dollars to the ALP for a weapons mogul. Like 0:06:42.360 --> 0:06:46.359 Robert Meyer, these aren't huge amounts of money, but it 0:06:46.400 --> 0:06:50.120 does underscore his deep connections to politics and the fact 0:06:50.160 --> 0:06:52.560 that this is a man with a significant amount of 0:06:52.560 --> 0:06:55.320 money in the bank, a lot of connections in Canberra, 0:06:55.720 --> 0:06:57.679 and now he's got a direct line to the American 0:06:57.720 --> 0:07:00.000 President via his son Don Junior. 0:07:02.800 --> 0:07:05.880 Coming up after the break, how Naya's relationship with Dutton 0:07:05.960 --> 0:07:08.320 could shape Australia's foreign policy agenda. 0:07:15.600 --> 0:07:19.160 Hi, I'm Daniel James. Seven AM tells stories that need 0:07:19.200 --> 0:07:22.080 to be told. Our journalism is founded on trust and 0:07:22.160 --> 0:07:27.120 independence and now we're increasing our coverage. Every Saturday until 0:07:27.160 --> 0:07:29.880 the election, will bring you an extra episode to break 0:07:29.880 --> 0:07:32.560 down the biggest political moments of the week. If you 0:07:32.680 --> 0:07:34.960 enjoy seven Am, the best way you can support us 0:07:35.040 --> 0:07:38.640 is by making a contribution at seven am podcast dot 0:07:38.680 --> 0:07:42.720 com dot au slash support. Thanks for listening and supporting 0:07:42.720 --> 0:07:43.120 our work. 0:07:45.560 --> 0:07:48.880 Jason, you've been profiling Robert Nayer, who is this weapons 0:07:48.920 --> 0:07:52.800 mogul who has close ties to many influential people, including 0:07:52.960 --> 0:07:58.240 Donald Trump Junior and Peter Dutton. But if his closest 0:07:58.320 --> 0:08:02.600 political relationship is as it seems with Peter Dutton, Dutton 0:08:02.640 --> 0:08:05.440 is obviously not the Prime Minister at this moment in time. 0:08:05.600 --> 0:08:08.840 So what has been close to the l and P 0:08:09.000 --> 0:08:12.440 What has that actually meant for Nia's defense contracts under 0:08:12.520 --> 0:08:13.880 this labor government. 0:08:14.720 --> 0:08:18.160 So I spoke to one defense industry executive about this 0:08:18.760 --> 0:08:21.600 and he said, look, there is a view that Robert 0:08:21.640 --> 0:08:25.040 Nya leans too heavily into his relationship with the LMP 0:08:25.520 --> 0:08:27.360 and that that has cost him when it comes to 0:08:27.800 --> 0:08:31.800 the awarding of big defense contracts under the current government. 0:08:32.360 --> 0:08:36.040 What specifically this person that I spoke to was referring 0:08:36.080 --> 0:08:39.800 to was a decision taken by the Albenze government in 0:08:39.840 --> 0:08:45.240 October last year where Naya's bid for a lucrative contract 0:08:45.320 --> 0:08:50.000 to produce the world's most in demand artillery shells went 0:08:50.120 --> 0:08:53.880 not to the Naya Group but to the French owned 0:08:54.000 --> 0:08:57.880 Talis Australia under a deal that's potentially worth hundreds of 0:08:57.880 --> 0:09:00.520 millions of dollars. So Robert I did and win that 0:09:00.600 --> 0:09:03.280 contract for the one five to five millimeter shell, and 0:09:03.320 --> 0:09:05.520 he was pretty annoyed about it. And he's now up 0:09:05.559 --> 0:09:09.839 against the same competitor again for a solid fuel rocket 0:09:09.840 --> 0:09:13.000 motor contract, so all eyes will be on whether he's 0:09:13.000 --> 0:09:13.679 snubbed again. 0:09:14.120 --> 0:09:17.120 Right, So there's a sense that he has failed to 0:09:17.320 --> 0:09:20.040 get contracts because he's too close to done. 0:09:20.200 --> 0:09:24.720 So Pat Conroy's the Minister for Defense Industry, and his 0:09:24.840 --> 0:09:27.960 office have been adamant about the fact that they have 0:09:28.080 --> 0:09:31.240 nothing to do with the actual decision making when it 0:09:31.280 --> 0:09:34.520 comes to contracts like the one that Rob and I 0:09:34.679 --> 0:09:37.200 is complaining that he missed out on. But what we 0:09:37.240 --> 0:09:39.520 do know is that when Robert and I have failed 0:09:39.520 --> 0:09:42.680 to get that project, his father in law, Bob Catter, 0:09:42.720 --> 0:09:45.880 didn't hesitate in picking up the phone and ringing the 0:09:45.920 --> 0:09:49.040 Prime Minister's office to complain and demand it that the 0:09:49.080 --> 0:09:51.760 government have another look at it. I think they surprised 0:09:52.240 --> 0:09:55.000 the Prime Minister's office because if, of course they did 0:09:55.040 --> 0:09:57.800 what Bob Catter asked of them, they would all be 0:09:57.840 --> 0:10:01.520 referred to the National Antique Eruption Commission. So it was 0:10:01.559 --> 0:10:05.000 a pretty extraordinary request from Bob cattap But I guess 0:10:05.040 --> 0:10:07.000 he was just thinking that he was doing the right 0:10:07.040 --> 0:10:09.120 thing and advocating on behalf of his. 0:10:09.440 --> 0:10:13.760 Son in law, and so someone like Robert Nia he 0:10:13.840 --> 0:10:17.000 must have thoughts on the best way to handle our 0:10:17.040 --> 0:10:21.080 relationship with the Trump administration. Did you ask him about that, 0:10:21.200 --> 0:10:24.760 about what he's observed firsthand about the Trumps and our 0:10:24.800 --> 0:10:27.319 position as a us LA well. 0:10:27.520 --> 0:10:31.520 A hot topic for the Trump administration is allies pulling 0:10:31.559 --> 0:10:35.680 their weight on defense expenditure. We've heard Donald Trump complain 0:10:35.880 --> 0:10:40.800 pretty loudly that America's European allies are not spending enough 0:10:40.840 --> 0:10:44.080 when it comes to defense, and he's calling on them 0:10:44.240 --> 0:10:48.640 to increase their defense spending from two percent of GDP 0:10:49.360 --> 0:10:53.719 to around five percent of GDP, and countries like the 0:10:53.840 --> 0:10:58.520 United Kingdom have already responded to that. The week before last, 0:10:59.160 --> 0:11:02.880 the British Prime min to Keirstarmer announced that the UK 0:11:03.040 --> 0:11:07.720 plan to increase its defense spending to three percent of 0:11:07.800 --> 0:11:12.439 GDP before the next election. Robneyer is certainly of the 0:11:12.559 --> 0:11:14.840 view that Australia needs to follow suit. 0:11:15.679 --> 0:11:19.479 Right, So, Jason, what we have is a defense contractor 0:11:19.600 --> 0:11:23.679 calling for an increase in defense spending, which is obviously 0:11:23.760 --> 0:11:28.120 not that surprising. But if he is someone with influence 0:11:28.200 --> 0:11:31.120 in the Trump administration, how significant do you think his 0:11:31.240 --> 0:11:35.080 perspective is when it comes to how Peter Dutton thinks 0:11:35.080 --> 0:11:35.760 about defense. 0:11:36.120 --> 0:11:40.719 Oh, I think it's quite significant. Peter Dutton clearly trusts Robneyer. 0:11:41.360 --> 0:11:43.560 I think if Peter Dutton was to become Prime Minister, 0:11:43.600 --> 0:11:47.480 he would definitely try to make use of Robneyer's connections 0:11:47.559 --> 0:11:51.680 to the Trump administration. And I think Robneyer himself is 0:11:51.720 --> 0:11:54.720 also someone who hasn't hidden the fact that he thinks 0:11:55.160 --> 0:11:58.600 Peter Dutton would be a better Prime minister for Australia 0:11:58.600 --> 0:12:02.240 when it comes to defense. It's pretty clear that these 0:12:02.240 --> 0:12:05.800 two have a pretty strong connection. And if Peter Dutton 0:12:05.840 --> 0:12:09.640 does win the election whenever it's called, I think we're 0:12:09.640 --> 0:12:13.200 going to see Rob now become a lot more influential 0:12:13.240 --> 0:12:16.440 when it comes to Australian defense policy making. 0:12:17.160 --> 0:12:22.920 So, Jason, if Peter Dutton wanted to lean in into 0:12:22.960 --> 0:12:25.800 his connections with Trump, he, I mean he very much could. 0:12:25.880 --> 0:12:28.640 He has this close relationship with Robert Naya, who's friends 0:12:28.679 --> 0:12:31.720 with the Trump's. Done's also close to Gina Reinhart, who 0:12:31.760 --> 0:12:34.560 has her own relationship with the Trump family, and Dutton 0:12:34.600 --> 0:12:37.560 has talked about his ability to get things done with 0:12:37.600 --> 0:12:40.440 this administration. But do you think that there is a 0:12:40.600 --> 0:12:45.520 risk here that if he does that, because Australians I 0:12:45.559 --> 0:12:49.160 think are turned off by Trump, that anything that Dutton 0:12:49.640 --> 0:12:52.400 does that aligns with him could backfire. 0:12:53.120 --> 0:12:56.000 I think Peter Dutton has to be very careful about 0:12:56.080 --> 0:13:00.640 how closely he aligns himself with Donald Trump. After Donald 0:13:00.679 --> 0:13:03.839 Trump won the election in November, Peter Dutton came out 0:13:03.840 --> 0:13:07.000 pretty quickly to congratulate Donald Trump, and in the first 0:13:07.160 --> 0:13:10.720 weeks following that election victory, Peter Dutton was also happy 0:13:10.760 --> 0:13:13.559 to align himself with a lot of the things that 0:13:13.679 --> 0:13:16.200 Donald Trump said he would do when he became president. 0:13:16.640 --> 0:13:19.480 The risk though, for Peter Dutton is that since Donald 0:13:19.480 --> 0:13:24.160 Trump was sworn in, he has disrupted the US government 0:13:24.200 --> 0:13:27.760 to such an extent that it's now starting to really 0:13:28.400 --> 0:13:31.680 concern voters here in Australia, and that's just getting worse 0:13:31.720 --> 0:13:36.080 and worse each week. From what I'm hearing, the Labor 0:13:36.080 --> 0:13:39.480 Party is of the view that Donald Trump is hurting 0:13:40.200 --> 0:13:43.800 Peter Dutton. It's coming up in their polling. They're saying 0:13:43.880 --> 0:13:48.600 that voters believe that Peter Dutton's election slogan Let's get 0:13:48.640 --> 0:13:52.120 Australia back on track, is a little bit similar to 0:13:52.160 --> 0:13:55.040 the make America Great against slogan that has been so 0:13:55.080 --> 0:13:59.360 successful for Donald Trump, and that it is backfiring a bit. 0:14:00.040 --> 0:14:04.520 Peter Dutton, Well, Jason, thank you so much for your time. 0:14:05.160 --> 0:14:15.319 Ruby great to talk with you as always. 0:14:20.880 --> 0:14:23.800 Also in the news today, the Australian Federal Police have 0:14:23.920 --> 0:14:27.400 confirmed that the caravan found in January filled with explosives 0:14:27.400 --> 0:14:31.640 and antisemitic material was all part of a fabricated terrorist plot. 0:14:32.040 --> 0:14:34.920 The AFP found that the caravan was planted by criminals 0:14:34.920 --> 0:14:38.880 from Australia and overseas, who then intentionally informed the police 0:14:38.920 --> 0:14:42.000 of the caravan's location in order to cause fear for 0:14:42.120 --> 0:14:45.800 personal benefit. At the time, New South Wales Premier Chris 0:14:45.800 --> 0:14:50.040 Mins described the incident as terrorism. Yesterday, he defended his response, 0:14:50.080 --> 0:14:52.200 saying it would have been negligent not to take this 0:14:52.360 --> 0:14:59.080 incredibly seriously. And former Australian Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull has 0:14:59.080 --> 0:15:02.880 doubled down on his criticism of President Trump, saying Australia 0:15:02.920 --> 0:15:05.960 should not muzzle ourselves for fear of offending mister Trump. 0:15:06.280 --> 0:15:08.960 The US president took to his Truth social platform to 0:15:09.040 --> 0:15:12.360 call Turnbull chaotic and abusive, believed to be in response 0:15:12.400 --> 0:15:15.280 to Turnbull's comments in a Bloomberg interview over the weekend 0:15:15.440 --> 0:15:19.160 where he criticized Trump's leadership style. The comments come at 0:15:19.160 --> 0:15:22.520 a crucial time for Australia US relations with tariffs against 0:15:22.600 --> 0:15:26.040 Australian's steel and aluminum currently due to comments on Thursday, 0:15:26.960 --> 0:15:29.640 I'm Ruby Jones. This is seven am. See tomorrow.