WEBVTT - Sharri | 21 May

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<v Speaker 1>Live on Sky News. This is Sharry.

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<v Speaker 2>Good Evening, Caleb Bond with you, Holly Hughes, goes Bang.

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<v Speaker 2>Here's what's coming up on the program tonight. The coalition

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<v Speaker 2>breakup is getting messier now. While this could still be

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<v Speaker 2>the best thing for both parties, the leaders need to

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<v Speaker 2>have the right intentions. My analysis in a moment and

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<v Speaker 2>now that the shock is wearing off, what does the

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<v Speaker 2>coalition break up mean for the future of the two parties. Well,

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<v Speaker 2>I'll get the perspectives from National Deputy Leader Kevin Hogan

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<v Speaker 2>and Liberal MP Garth Hamilton. And just how long has

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<v Speaker 2>Biden had prostate cancer. There's just so many questions about

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<v Speaker 2>this story that still haven't been answered. I'll attempt to

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<v Speaker 2>answer them for you. I'll speak with both the urologist

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<v Speaker 2>and Brendan O'Neill later in the show. Now, the differences

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<v Speaker 2>could not have been more stark today between the federal

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<v Speaker 2>government and what used to be the opposition.

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<v Speaker 3>In the government corner.

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<v Speaker 2>You had ALP National Secretary and campaign director Paul Erickson

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<v Speaker 2>at the National Press Club effectively on his victory lap,

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<v Speaker 2>and deservedly so, because he ran an excellent campaign.

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<v Speaker 4>Albo was in his element connecting with everyday people and

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<v Speaker 4>enjoying it. And while the Prime Minister was telling a

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<v Speaker 4>positive story about who we are and where we're going,

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<v Speaker 4>Peter Dutton was gloomy about the country, downcast about the future,

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<v Speaker 4>and most animated when he was magnifying the problems facing Australia.

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<v Speaker 2>And look, it is a fair criticism, as I wrote

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<v Speaker 2>in the Advertiser during the campaign, and I said on

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<v Speaker 2>air here, long term vision just seems to be absent

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<v Speaker 2>from politics these days. No one is really concerned with

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<v Speaker 2>the future. No one talked about tomorrow or what the

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<v Speaker 2>country looked like in a decade's time. Everyone talked about yesterday,

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<v Speaker 2>maybe today if you were lucky, I mean. In the

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<v Speaker 2>ABC debate, Anthony Alberanisi and Dutton were both asked what

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<v Speaker 2>they wanted their legacy to be. Dutton nominated nuclear power,

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<v Speaker 2>which is a real vision for the future, but that

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<v Speaker 2>was conspicuously absent from most of the campaign, and Albanez

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<v Speaker 2>he said, cheaper childcare, I mean really hardly floating the

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<v Speaker 2>dollar or creating the GST, and Ericson also identified one

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<v Speaker 2>of Dutton's other big failures.

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<v Speaker 4>The contrast was as clear as night and day. Prime

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<v Speaker 4>Minister offered authentic, measured and firm leadership and Peter Dutton

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<v Speaker 4>never missed an opportunity and miss an opportunity.

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<v Speaker 3>That just about says it all.

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<v Speaker 2>Really a bit like Garth Hamilton wrote the other day,

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<v Speaker 2>and I've been coming back.

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<v Speaker 3>To all week.

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<v Speaker 2>The best and worst thing about Dutton was the piece

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<v Speaker 2>he brought to the Liberal Party because they didn't actually

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<v Speaker 2>have the fights and put in the work. And I'll

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<v Speaker 2>talk to Garth more about that later in the show.

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<v Speaker 2>And again deservedly so, Ericson is feeling a bit cocky.

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<v Speaker 4>The fourth factor in our win was the Prime Minister's performance.

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<v Speaker 4>From the first Monday of January through to election day.

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<v Speaker 4>The Prime Minister was in the form of a lifetime.

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<v Speaker 4>Originally I wrote here that the PM didn't put a

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<v Speaker 4>foot wrong, but this would have summoned the coalition's media

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<v Speaker 4>che has got to interview the stage from the Marning

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<v Speaker 4>and Energy Union conference up in Newcastle as part of

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<v Speaker 4>a feature on Labor lies.

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<v Speaker 3>All right, fair cop.

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<v Speaker 2>But he did lie about not falling off the stage though.

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<v Speaker 2>But it seems clear that labor really couldn't believe it's luck.

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<v Speaker 4>But in past campaigns a major party might have held

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<v Speaker 4>back its centerpiece policy commitment until the final five weeks

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<v Speaker 4>to maximize cut through.

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<v Speaker 1>Peter Dutton's campaign.

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<v Speaker 4>Took this two absurd extremes with less than two weeks

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<v Speaker 4>to go on Insiders with David, Michael Sukha said the

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<v Speaker 4>Coalition was saving up their policies so that they could

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<v Speaker 4>quote connect with the strains when they're going to switch on.

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<v Speaker 4>I remember watching that interview and thinking, you haven't got

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<v Speaker 4>long now, brother.

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<v Speaker 2>Now the point is Labor is confident. I mean they

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<v Speaker 2>were clearly confident at that point as well. They're relaxed

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<v Speaker 2>and they have every reason to be right now they've

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<v Speaker 2>been vindicated basically. And the Prime Minister today, fresh from

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<v Speaker 2>his trip to Indonesia and the Vatican, he looked calm

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<v Speaker 2>and collected, more so, I think than at any time

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<v Speaker 2>I saw in his first term. And you can just

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<v Speaker 2>imagine how he and Ericson must have felt yesterday when

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<v Speaker 2>they heard that the coalition had been blown up. No

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<v Speaker 2>wonder they was so relaxed today, Which brings me to

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<v Speaker 2>the opposition corner, or what used to be the opposition.

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<v Speaker 2>Of course, now it's just the Liberal Party, Labor, cool,

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<v Speaker 2>calm and collected, Liberals and Nationals in turmoil. Now all

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<v Speaker 2>of yesterday's fun and games have continued.

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<v Speaker 3>To play out.

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<v Speaker 2>Today more guts have been spilled, and to be honest,

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<v Speaker 2>it looks like things might get worse before they get better,

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<v Speaker 2>because yesterday David Little Proud was very much casting it

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<v Speaker 2>as a little break in the relationships and time apart

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<v Speaker 2>to find each other again. We'll all be back together

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<v Speaker 2>soon once we've settled our differences.

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<v Speaker 3>But today he was.

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<v Speaker 2>Quite explicit in saying they may will not get back

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<v Speaker 2>together before the next election and instead try to wait

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<v Speaker 2>until they're in a position where the Libs would need

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<v Speaker 2>them to form government.

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<v Speaker 5>If we get to a juncture after the next election

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<v Speaker 5>where we can form a government with the Liberal Party,

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<v Speaker 5>then obviously we're going to support the Liberal Party, but

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<v Speaker 5>there will be conditions, and the conditions are about those

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<v Speaker 5>things that are core to making the lives of those

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<v Speaker 5>people that we represent better and giving them a future.

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<v Speaker 2>That doesn't sound like getting the coalition back together for

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<v Speaker 2>the sake of reforming a cohesive coalition for the benefit

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<v Speaker 2>of the country. It sounds like an ultimatum. And Susan Lee,

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<v Speaker 2>for her part, is also apparently keen to not reform

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<v Speaker 2>the coalition before the next election so she can keep

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<v Speaker 2>all the shadow cabinet positions for the Liberals. I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>that is just stupid, and I get it. As I

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<v Speaker 2>said last night, I think the Nats have a valid

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<v Speaker 2>bone to pick with the Liberals, and I can understand

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<v Speaker 2>why the Liberals are upset. But the language now today

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<v Speaker 2>is a little more aggressive than it was yesterday morning.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, if the Liberals don't come to the table,

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<v Speaker 2>and it sounds like the Nationals would just then sit

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<v Speaker 2>on the back bench indefinitely, I mean, I'm not sure

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<v Speaker 2>that's the best thing for anyone. Little Proud has also

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<v Speaker 2>been more explicit today about where he thinks things went

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<v Speaker 2>wrong with the election campaign, particularly nuclear energy, which was

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<v Speaker 2>one of the four policies the Nationals said were non

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<v Speaker 2>negotiable to keep the coalition going.

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<v Speaker 5>Nuclear plus gas plus renewables was three hundred and thirty

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<v Speaker 5>billion dollars two hundred and sixty three billion dollars ship.

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<v Speaker 1>But we couldn't sell that.

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<v Speaker 6>We didn't sell that, we weren't agile enough.

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<v Speaker 2>He also pointed out the flip flopping on work from

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<v Speaker 2>home and how labor was essentially able to paint its

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<v Speaker 2>own narrative. Sorry if Peter Dutton without any pushback.

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<v Speaker 6>If in reflection and we look at this, I think

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<v Speaker 6>we've got to be brutally honest with ourselves about why

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<v Speaker 6>we lost. When you look at where the polls were

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<v Speaker 6>Christmas time and you see where they shifted. I think

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<v Speaker 6>the Labor Party were able to make Peter data Dunton unelectable.

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<v Speaker 6>And what they couldn't do is put a vote next

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<v Speaker 6>to him, and they held their eyes and put a

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<v Speaker 6>vote next to Anthony albanetis.

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<v Speaker 3>It's hard to argue with that. Now.

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<v Speaker 2>I think the Nats are right to ask for nuclear

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<v Speaker 2>to stay, etc. I think they've been unreasonable in asking

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<v Speaker 2>for an end cabinet solidarity that would never fly. And

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<v Speaker 2>as I said last night, I think this could be

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<v Speaker 2>the best thing to get the Liberals to wake up

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<v Speaker 2>to themselves and settle on a policy agenda that creates

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<v Speaker 2>a real point of difference with Labor and could win

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<v Speaker 2>them an election. But this talk of them not getting

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<v Speaker 2>back together at all in this term, seemingly from both

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<v Speaker 2>sides of the former coalition, is not good. You know,

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<v Speaker 2>I'd like to be and I'd like to think most

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<v Speaker 2>people in both the Liberal and National parties would be

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<v Speaker 2>optimistic about things going much better than that, because if

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<v Speaker 2>they don't get back together, it will ostensibly be because

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<v Speaker 2>the Libs have completely lost their way and dumped policies

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<v Speaker 2>like nuclear energy, one of the things that he is

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<v Speaker 2>actually a point of difference, and also because a strong coalition,

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<v Speaker 2>as many elder statesmen including John Howard have pointed out,

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<v Speaker 2>is better for both parties. You have more talent, more experience,

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<v Speaker 2>more perspective. National ZMP Darren Chester, he was a former

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<v Speaker 2>minister in the Turnbull government, said this afternoon that to

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<v Speaker 2>not get back together would be a gift to the

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<v Speaker 2>Prime Minister. And the longer it goes, the harder it gets.

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<v Speaker 7>Given both the leaders have indicated they had respectful conversations

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<v Speaker 7>that both their doors are still open to further conversations. Well,

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<v Speaker 7>I'm suggesting let's have those conversations sooner rather than later.

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<v Speaker 7>The longer this goes on, I think it becomes harder

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<v Speaker 7>to reconciling differences.

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<v Speaker 2>Indeed it does. I hope the Liberal Party can see that.

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<v Speaker 2>And just for a bit of levity, I'll give the

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<v Speaker 2>final word on all this to Bob Catter.

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<v Speaker 3>It will suggest before the election that you may have.

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<v Speaker 1>Come back into the Nationals.

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<v Speaker 3>Just explain was that on?

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<v Speaker 1>Was that a real thing?

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<v Speaker 3>And where does it sit now?

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<v Speaker 8>That is as likely to happen as it is that

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<v Speaker 8>I get to have a night out with Nicole Kittman.

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<v Speaker 8>Maybe there's strong a knowledgeable rephrase that one.

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<v Speaker 1>That's just not going to happen.

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<v Speaker 2>All right, Joining me now, Former Victorian Liberal Party president

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<v Speaker 2>Michael Kroger and Michael Kevin Hogan admitted today that the

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<v Speaker 2>coalition breakup was not a unanimous vote within the Nationals.

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<v Speaker 3>Take a look.

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<v Speaker 9>Was the decision unanimous in the party room?

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<v Speaker 10>It wasn't unanimous, but it was quite conclusive. And again

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<v Speaker 10>it's a good point, Kenny. This was I didn't make

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<v Speaker 10>this decision. David Little Proud didn't make this decision. Bridget

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<v Speaker 10>McKenzie didn't make this decision. The Nationals federal party room

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<v Speaker 10>made this s decision.

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<v Speaker 2>Of course, so that the party remade the decision. So

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<v Speaker 2>even if you were against it, it doesn't matter. But

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<v Speaker 2>clearly there were people within the Nats who thought it

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<v Speaker 2>would be best to stick with the coalition. Did the

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<v Speaker 2>Nationals make the wrong decision?

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<v Speaker 11>Well, I certainly did, Caleb. This is not helpful to

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<v Speaker 11>the National Party, it's not helpful to the Liberal Party.

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<v Speaker 11>It certainly helps alban Easy. One of the many issues

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<v Speaker 11>going forward. If this coalition doesn't get back together, you split,

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<v Speaker 11>you know, you split the two parties. There's no cohesion.

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<v Speaker 11>It's hard to go to an election with the party separate.

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<v Speaker 11>What happens, for example, to the joint Senate tick in

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<v Speaker 11>Victoria and Bridget Mackenzie is the number two on the

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<v Speaker 11>Joint Senate tike het we won Liberals one, Nationals two,

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<v Speaker 11>Liberals three. Now we won two spots last time. But

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<v Speaker 11>at the next election Bridge and Mackenzie, what is she's

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<v Speaker 11>going to run on her own, not part of the

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<v Speaker 11>coalition ticket. I think that would make it very hard

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<v Speaker 11>for it to Winia. So the consequences of running separately

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<v Speaker 11>are potentially disastrous for both the Liberal Party and the

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<v Speaker 11>National Party. And as John Howard says, and you know

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<v Speaker 11>his rights always know, the sooner they get back together,

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<v Speaker 11>the better. And it's good to see Darren Chester, the

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<v Speaker 11>former National Party minister, saying again tonight it's better they

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<v Speaker 11>get back together sooner or later. Sooner if possible.

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<v Speaker 2>Graham Richardson joins us. Now Richo I mean albow. He

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<v Speaker 2>must be so happy to see this going on. Like

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<v Speaker 2>I said before, when I saw him today talking to

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<v Speaker 2>the media, he seemed to be more relaxed and happy

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<v Speaker 2>and confident than I saw him at any point during

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<v Speaker 2>his first term.

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<v Speaker 12>Well, I think he's got every right to be as

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<v Speaker 12>think at the moment. I mean, he's sitting there. He

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<v Speaker 12>doesn't have to do anything. He just watches the Liberals

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<v Speaker 12>and Nationals destroy themselves.

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<v Speaker 13>He doesn't have to do a thing.

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<v Speaker 12>So I think this Elbows in a perfect position at

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<v Speaker 12>the moment because all he has to do is be

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<v Speaker 12>a spectator. He doesn't have to get down on the

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<v Speaker 12>ground and fight, doesn't for say anything that's toughen and

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<v Speaker 12>hard and all the rest of it.

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<v Speaker 13>He just let the Liberals and Nationals do it to

0:12:11.559 --> 0:12:12.000
<v Speaker 13>each other.

0:12:12.600 --> 0:12:16.120
<v Speaker 2>Speaking of the breakup, this was a particularly petty part

0:12:16.160 --> 0:12:19.320
<v Speaker 2>of all I think today, The new Deputy Opposition leader

0:12:19.400 --> 0:12:23.920
<v Speaker 2>Ted O'Brien May emphasises on May have skipped out on

0:12:24.000 --> 0:12:26.920
<v Speaker 2>a Today Show interview after he discovered it beyond with

0:12:27.280 --> 0:12:30.240
<v Speaker 2>National Senator Matt Canavan and Carl Stiff and Ovic, as

0:12:30.240 --> 0:12:31.680
<v Speaker 2>you can imagine, wasn't too happy.

0:12:33.480 --> 0:12:36.240
<v Speaker 14>We asked Deputy liberally a Ted O'Brien on the show

0:12:36.440 --> 0:12:39.600
<v Speaker 14>last night, and he agreed this morning at a courtesy

0:12:39.720 --> 0:12:42.280
<v Speaker 14>we told him Matt Canavan was coming on too. All

0:12:42.360 --> 0:12:46.400
<v Speaker 14>seemed okay, and then twenty minutes ago his team rang

0:12:46.520 --> 0:12:49.800
<v Speaker 14>saying he won't come on with Canadan. I mean, you

0:12:49.840 --> 0:12:52.280
<v Speaker 14>can't make it up. It's like maths the Canberra Edition.

0:12:52.400 --> 0:12:54.160
<v Speaker 14>Matt Canavan is in the house. They made a good

0:12:54.160 --> 0:12:57.040
<v Speaker 14>morning to you. Nice to see this one. How'd your

0:12:57.040 --> 0:12:57.760
<v Speaker 14>sleep last night?

0:12:57.760 --> 0:12:58.600
<v Speaker 9>I'm not bad, mate?

0:12:59.559 --> 0:13:02.200
<v Speaker 2>God as the canber edition, how would it rate? But

0:13:02.280 --> 0:13:05.720
<v Speaker 2>Ted O'Brien, for his part, denies that he canceled.

0:13:07.360 --> 0:13:11.720
<v Speaker 9>I was told this morning that the session won't proceed.

0:13:12.080 --> 0:13:14.080
<v Speaker 9>I think they were looking at me being on. And

0:13:14.120 --> 0:13:16.640
<v Speaker 9>then it was in a station palichet. Then it was

0:13:16.679 --> 0:13:20.480
<v Speaker 9>Matt Canavan. I certainly querit, saying gee, should it be

0:13:21.000 --> 0:13:23.640
<v Speaker 9>Kevin Hogan given he as the deputy leader. But there

0:13:23.679 --> 0:13:25.920
<v Speaker 9>was no cancelation and I haven't. I can't think of

0:13:25.960 --> 0:13:27.839
<v Speaker 9>any sort of interview I've ever canceled. Matt and I

0:13:28.160 --> 0:13:31.800
<v Speaker 9>spoke a few days ago right where mates. We're both

0:13:31.840 --> 0:13:33.560
<v Speaker 9>from Queensland. We've always been friends.

0:13:34.400 --> 0:13:34.840
<v Speaker 3>Michael.

0:13:35.080 --> 0:13:37.760
<v Speaker 2>I don't know what actually happened here and the only

0:13:37.760 --> 0:13:41.679
<v Speaker 2>people who actually know were those who were involved. But regardless,

0:13:41.720 --> 0:13:42.880
<v Speaker 2>it wasn't a great look.

0:13:46.040 --> 0:13:49.560
<v Speaker 11>Well does it really matter? I mean Ted thought it

0:13:49.640 --> 0:13:53.280
<v Speaker 11>wasn't going ahead. I don't think this is an issue

0:13:53.280 --> 0:13:56.040
<v Speaker 11>at all of any substance to anybody. These things happened

0:13:56.040 --> 0:13:58.600
<v Speaker 11>from time to time. We all booking interviews and they

0:13:58.600 --> 0:14:01.640
<v Speaker 11>get canceled the last minute on occasions. So you know,

0:14:01.800 --> 0:14:03.920
<v Speaker 11>I write this as zero on the register of things

0:14:03.960 --> 0:14:04.520
<v Speaker 11>that are important.

0:14:04.600 --> 0:14:07.280
<v Speaker 2>Made to be honest, Well, it's probably not important in

0:14:07.360 --> 0:14:09.400
<v Speaker 2>the grand scheme of things, but you know, Rich, I

0:14:09.440 --> 0:14:12.480
<v Speaker 2>suppose it's just another example of where it looks like

0:14:12.760 --> 0:14:16.600
<v Speaker 2>things are going wrong, because perception is reality. Even if

0:14:16.600 --> 0:14:19.200
<v Speaker 2>this is not the truth, that is the message that

0:14:19.320 --> 0:14:22.240
<v Speaker 2>was put across this morning that Ted O'Brien didn't want

0:14:22.240 --> 0:14:24.040
<v Speaker 2>to be there, and a lot of people watching that

0:14:24.280 --> 0:14:25.400
<v Speaker 2>would have had that impression.

0:14:26.720 --> 0:14:28.640
<v Speaker 13>That's the only impression you can get.

0:14:29.360 --> 0:14:33.840
<v Speaker 12>And I think it's lamendable that we'd be at this point.

0:14:33.880 --> 0:14:37.600
<v Speaker 12>We don't need to be. I can't understand what the

0:14:37.640 --> 0:14:41.600
<v Speaker 12>problem is between him in Canadan. If there is one.

0:14:41.800 --> 0:14:43.800
<v Speaker 12>Canadan is one of my good friends. I think he's

0:14:43.880 --> 0:14:49.480
<v Speaker 12>a terrific fellow, so tess having trouble with him, then

0:14:49.520 --> 0:14:51.720
<v Speaker 12>I might intervene and so I can help get the

0:14:51.720 --> 0:14:52.520
<v Speaker 12>two of them together.

0:14:53.200 --> 0:14:55.000
<v Speaker 3>Well, we've talked enough about.

0:14:56.680 --> 0:14:59.600
<v Speaker 2>We've talked enough about the losers. Let's talk about the

0:14:59.640 --> 0:15:03.120
<v Speaker 2>winners now, shall we. The architect of Labour's historic win,

0:15:03.400 --> 0:15:06.600
<v Speaker 2>which is, of course, the LP National secretary Paul Ericson.

0:15:07.000 --> 0:15:10.400
<v Speaker 2>As I showed earlier, he gave a rather smug lecture

0:15:10.440 --> 0:15:13.720
<v Speaker 2>to the Coalition at today's National Press Club, and fair enough,

0:15:13.960 --> 0:15:16.280
<v Speaker 2>he has the runs on the board. He's earn't that right,

0:15:16.560 --> 0:15:20.360
<v Speaker 2>but he lauded Labour's embrace of renewable energy as integral

0:15:20.440 --> 0:15:21.240
<v Speaker 2>to their success.

0:15:21.280 --> 0:15:21.840
<v Speaker 3>Have a look.

0:15:22.880 --> 0:15:26.760
<v Speaker 4>The coalition needs to accept the lessons from the last

0:15:26.880 --> 0:15:30.120
<v Speaker 4>two federal elections and their last two defeats if they

0:15:30.120 --> 0:15:33.560
<v Speaker 4>want to be competitive again, and I think that starts

0:15:33.600 --> 0:15:37.160
<v Speaker 4>with facing up to the reality of climate change and

0:15:37.200 --> 0:15:40.440
<v Speaker 4>to the energy transition of the country needs to make.

0:15:41.520 --> 0:15:45.480
<v Speaker 2>Michael I described Ericson before as a bit cocky. Today

0:15:45.920 --> 0:15:49.000
<v Speaker 2>I think that's accurate, and I think the ALP would

0:15:49.000 --> 0:15:52.000
<v Speaker 2>want to be careful about getting too cocky because if

0:15:52.040 --> 0:15:56.440
<v Speaker 2>they seriously think that energy, renewable energy was one of

0:15:56.440 --> 0:16:00.560
<v Speaker 2>the things that delivered them. That thumping majority got rocks

0:16:00.560 --> 0:16:01.120
<v Speaker 2>in their heads.

0:16:03.520 --> 0:16:05.480
<v Speaker 11>They need to have one of those true believers dinners.

0:16:05.520 --> 0:16:07.840
<v Speaker 11>Remember was it after the ninety three election, Richo, that

0:16:07.880 --> 0:16:10.560
<v Speaker 11>they had that true Believers dinner where Gareth Evans was

0:16:11.040 --> 0:16:14.640
<v Speaker 11>dancing around and any no one paid for the dinner

0:16:14.680 --> 0:16:19.120
<v Speaker 11>afterwards putting that aside, Yeah you remember it, no one,

0:16:19.200 --> 0:16:21.720
<v Speaker 11>No one paid, mate, you're offered. You all thought you

0:16:21.720 --> 0:16:24.880
<v Speaker 11>were going free. Look, the bottom line is this, You know,

0:16:25.320 --> 0:16:28.360
<v Speaker 11>winners write their own history. Ericson was doing absolutely the

0:16:28.400 --> 0:16:30.920
<v Speaker 11>right thing by trying to tell people why they won

0:16:30.960 --> 0:16:33.800
<v Speaker 11>the election. Half of what he said was nonsense, half

0:16:33.880 --> 0:16:36.360
<v Speaker 11>was probably true. I mean, if what he was saying

0:16:36.440 --> 0:16:38.720
<v Speaker 11>was true on that issue, then how does explain that

0:16:38.760 --> 0:16:40.360
<v Speaker 11>for a year and a half up to February this year,

0:16:40.400 --> 0:16:42.360
<v Speaker 11>Peter Dutton was fifty two forty eight in front of

0:16:42.400 --> 0:16:44.280
<v Speaker 11>the polls fifty one to forty one. For eighteen months

0:16:44.280 --> 0:16:46.680
<v Speaker 11>people thought Dutton was going to win. Know what happened

0:16:46.720 --> 0:16:49.120
<v Speaker 11>was something happened in the last eight weeks and the

0:16:49.160 --> 0:16:51.280
<v Speaker 11>only person that got close to it today, in a

0:16:51.360 --> 0:16:54.960
<v Speaker 11>rather fawning performance by the Canbra presscal who was that?

0:16:55.600 --> 0:16:57.720
<v Speaker 11>Claire Armstrong? I Thinks from the Daily Telegraph in New

0:16:57.720 --> 0:17:00.480
<v Speaker 11>South Wales who asked him about their negative care campaign. Well,

0:17:00.480 --> 0:17:02.480
<v Speaker 11>what happened in the eight weeks was two things. One

0:17:03.120 --> 0:17:05.880
<v Speaker 11>it showed the Liberal National Parties didn't have a sufficient

0:17:05.920 --> 0:17:09.160
<v Speaker 11>depth of policy offering. We acknowledge that. But secondly, Labor

0:17:09.200 --> 0:17:12.120
<v Speaker 11>ran a dirty negative campaign against Peter Dutton personally, which

0:17:12.160 --> 0:17:15.440
<v Speaker 11>they've been doing for years very successfully, and they ran

0:17:15.480 --> 0:17:17.879
<v Speaker 11>a disgraceful campaign that Peter Dutton was going to slash

0:17:17.880 --> 0:17:21.800
<v Speaker 11>and burn medi here, closed down urgent care clinics, close hospitals,

0:17:23.000 --> 0:17:25.359
<v Speaker 11>and then they lied about nuclear That's what happened in

0:17:25.359 --> 0:17:27.840
<v Speaker 11>the last eight weeks. So if what Erickson was saying

0:17:27.840 --> 0:17:31.840
<v Speaker 11>about the grandiose moved to renewables hadn't dawned on the

0:17:31.840 --> 0:17:35.160
<v Speaker 11>electric between the twenty two election in February this year, mate.

0:17:35.280 --> 0:17:38.040
<v Speaker 2>And you're right, Michael Claire Armstrong did ask him about

0:17:38.040 --> 0:17:41.879
<v Speaker 2>that negative campaign and specifically about MIDI scare, and Richo

0:17:42.320 --> 0:17:46.040
<v Speaker 2>Paul Erickson basically said, we will do medi scare again

0:17:46.160 --> 0:17:49.720
<v Speaker 2>because we know and think that it works. Well.

0:17:49.760 --> 0:17:53.920
<v Speaker 13>It does. There's no question that it works. Every time

0:17:54.400 --> 0:17:55.080
<v Speaker 13>we raise it.

0:17:55.119 --> 0:17:58.000
<v Speaker 12>I think we win those so I have no doubt

0:17:58.080 --> 0:18:02.760
<v Speaker 12>it will be used again and again and again. It's

0:18:01.760 --> 0:18:06.320
<v Speaker 12>a I think John Howard has just embraced that. When

0:18:06.359 --> 0:18:10.280
<v Speaker 12>when the many gaving was beginning, then I think he

0:18:10.359 --> 0:18:13.040
<v Speaker 12>lives that had a lot less strife. But that was

0:18:13.160 --> 0:18:15.679
<v Speaker 12>one mistake he made. And of course I am not

0:18:16.280 --> 0:18:18.240
<v Speaker 12>someone who bags out. I think how It was a

0:18:18.359 --> 0:18:21.160
<v Speaker 12>very good prime minister, but he got that wrong.

0:18:22.000 --> 0:18:24.760
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, well, you know, integrity in politics? Who'd care about that?

0:18:24.800 --> 0:18:24.960
<v Speaker 15>Now?

0:18:25.040 --> 0:18:27.560
<v Speaker 2>Elon Musk told a business for him in Qatar that

0:18:27.640 --> 0:18:29.920
<v Speaker 2>he's taking a step back from political donations.

0:18:31.200 --> 0:18:33.600
<v Speaker 3>In terms of political spending, I'm going to do.

0:18:33.680 --> 0:18:34.679
<v Speaker 13>A lot less in the future.

0:18:36.000 --> 0:18:36.760
<v Speaker 9>And why is that?

0:18:37.320 --> 0:18:38.280
<v Speaker 13>I think I've done enough?

0:18:38.800 --> 0:18:39.280
<v Speaker 4>Is it?

0:18:39.320 --> 0:18:42.199
<v Speaker 9>Is it because of blowback? Well, if I see a

0:18:42.280 --> 0:18:44.520
<v Speaker 9>reason to do political spending in the future, I will

0:18:44.520 --> 0:18:44.760
<v Speaker 9>do it.

0:18:45.080 --> 0:18:46.560
<v Speaker 1>And in an currently the reason.

0:18:47.359 --> 0:18:49.720
<v Speaker 2>It's a rapid change in approach from one of the

0:18:49.720 --> 0:18:53.080
<v Speaker 2>founding members, of course, of Trump's Department of Government Efficiency

0:18:53.240 --> 0:18:57.080
<v Speaker 2>Doge and Michael A. Do we need Elon Musk or

0:18:57.119 --> 0:19:00.119
<v Speaker 2>people like Elon Musk in politics? But b as he

0:19:00.200 --> 0:19:02.040
<v Speaker 2>just simply had enough. I mean, he's seen what's happened

0:19:02.040 --> 0:19:02.800
<v Speaker 2>to his businesses.

0:19:04.560 --> 0:19:07.360
<v Speaker 11>You certainly need people like him who have got courage

0:19:07.359 --> 0:19:10.400
<v Speaker 11>and who are fearless. But the problem is that prominent

0:19:10.400 --> 0:19:15.480
<v Speaker 11>business people being involved in politics doesn't work because there's

0:19:15.520 --> 0:19:18.679
<v Speaker 11>too many easy ways to damage their businesses through boycotts.

0:19:18.680 --> 0:19:21.959
<v Speaker 11>And we've seen what's happened in America with these Tesla

0:19:22.040 --> 0:19:27.840
<v Speaker 11>dealerships being ransacked and firebombed and cars being set alight.

0:19:27.920 --> 0:19:30.440
<v Speaker 11>So he's got commercial interests to look after, and he

0:19:30.480 --> 0:19:33.120
<v Speaker 11>should go back and look after those. You know, he's

0:19:33.119 --> 0:19:35.040
<v Speaker 11>done some excellent work on dog. I mean, all that

0:19:35.080 --> 0:19:37.960
<v Speaker 11>federal government spending in America are out of control. But

0:19:38.600 --> 0:19:40.600
<v Speaker 11>you know it's part of the age, old adage. Business

0:19:40.600 --> 0:19:45.280
<v Speaker 11>and politics don't mix, and politicians for politicians, politics politicians,

0:19:45.320 --> 0:19:49.359
<v Speaker 11>and you know, businesses for business people because they're entirely

0:19:49.359 --> 0:19:52.320
<v Speaker 11>different professions and they don't mix well together. Mate.

0:19:52.480 --> 0:19:54.439
<v Speaker 3>Are you sad to see him shut up? Richard?

0:19:55.760 --> 0:19:58.000
<v Speaker 13>Am I sad? Dude? So I missed that?

0:19:58.119 --> 0:20:00.919
<v Speaker 2>Are you sad to see him shut up not talk anymore?

0:20:01.040 --> 0:20:02.240
<v Speaker 2>Leave politics? No?

0:20:03.600 --> 0:20:06.480
<v Speaker 13>I think I can probably live with it. I think.

0:20:08.400 --> 0:20:14.040
<v Speaker 12>He's a fascinating character. And I love having fascinating characters

0:20:14.040 --> 0:20:16.920
<v Speaker 12>and politics because it gives us all something to talk about,

0:20:17.040 --> 0:20:21.879
<v Speaker 12>write about, et cetera. And the guy absolutely fascinates me.

0:20:22.000 --> 0:20:25.600
<v Speaker 12>I'd love to meet him. But as far as I'm concerned, mate,

0:20:26.560 --> 0:20:29.680
<v Speaker 12>whether he gets gets up and does more or does

0:20:29.760 --> 0:20:32.240
<v Speaker 12>less will matter little to any of us.

0:20:32.960 --> 0:20:35.520
<v Speaker 2>Michael, we've only got a minute, but quickly before we

0:20:35.560 --> 0:20:38.640
<v Speaker 2>go that the UK Foreign Secretary David Lammy has been

0:20:39.000 --> 0:20:42.960
<v Speaker 2>scathing of Israel's actions around Gaza. Sending aid in or

0:20:43.000 --> 0:20:45.080
<v Speaker 2>not sending aid in is which is what he would say.

0:20:46.000 --> 0:20:48.239
<v Speaker 2>He has said, we must call this what it is.

0:20:48.320 --> 0:20:51.439
<v Speaker 2>It is extremism, It is dangerous, it is repellent, it

0:20:51.520 --> 0:20:55.440
<v Speaker 2>is monstrous, and I condemn it in the strongest possible terms.

0:20:55.800 --> 0:20:57.960
<v Speaker 2>Is the reality not though that if you send the

0:20:58.000 --> 0:20:59.960
<v Speaker 2>aid in as he wants to a muscle, just take

0:21:00.040 --> 0:21:00.520
<v Speaker 2>it anyway.

0:21:00.560 --> 0:21:01.160
<v Speaker 3>What's the point.

0:21:03.480 --> 0:21:06.760
<v Speaker 11>Yeah, it's so easy to play to your constituency. There

0:21:06.800 --> 0:21:11.000
<v Speaker 11>are Muslim voters in Britain than there are Jews. That's

0:21:11.040 --> 0:21:15.200
<v Speaker 11>true throughout the world. Politicians are not immune to domestic pressure.

0:21:15.880 --> 0:21:18.280
<v Speaker 11>The easiest thing, the most morally proper thing for him

0:21:18.280 --> 0:21:19.560
<v Speaker 11>to do, would we just say, hang on, if her

0:21:19.600 --> 0:21:23.320
<v Speaker 11>mus had laid down their weapons straight after October seven,

0:21:24.240 --> 0:21:27.679
<v Speaker 11>there'd be you know, thousands of Palestinians alive. If Hermas

0:21:27.800 --> 0:21:31.199
<v Speaker 11>hadn't used innocent Palestinians as human shield, they'd be alive.

0:21:31.400 --> 0:21:35.880
<v Speaker 11>So the condemnation should be of Hamas and their supporters

0:21:36.640 --> 0:21:41.399
<v Speaker 11>and Iran. Israel's an easy target. But what does he

0:21:41.440 --> 0:21:43.679
<v Speaker 11>think Israel should do? What does he think they should do?

0:21:43.720 --> 0:21:45.879
<v Speaker 11>How does he think they should deal with terrorists on

0:21:46.000 --> 0:21:48.640
<v Speaker 11>Israel's doorstep? Nothing, He's got nothing to say about that.

0:21:49.080 --> 0:21:52.919
<v Speaker 11>Israel is always an easy target and a poor performance

0:21:52.960 --> 0:21:54.920
<v Speaker 11>by their foreigners, to be quite frank made.

0:21:54.960 --> 0:21:57.080
<v Speaker 2>And an interesting way to talk to an ally too,

0:21:57.160 --> 0:22:00.639
<v Speaker 2>mister Kroger, mister Richardson, Yeah, to have you both asas.

0:22:00.920 --> 0:22:01.160
<v Speaker 11>Thanks.

0:22:02.200 --> 0:22:05.520
<v Speaker 2>Now let's return to the coalition breakup. As I said earlier,

0:22:05.840 --> 0:22:08.880
<v Speaker 2>the divisions have seemingly grown today to the point where

0:22:08.880 --> 0:22:11.760
<v Speaker 2>they might not come back together before the election. I

0:22:11.920 --> 0:22:14.159
<v Speaker 2>just think that's extraordinary. I don't think it's good for anyone.

0:22:14.440 --> 0:22:17.080
<v Speaker 2>But I caught up with National's deputy leader Kevin Hogan

0:22:17.080 --> 0:22:17.960
<v Speaker 2>a short time ago.

0:22:19.520 --> 0:22:21.040
<v Speaker 3>Kevin, thank you for joining me.

0:22:21.320 --> 0:22:24.119
<v Speaker 2>Of course, we spoke last week on Thursday about the

0:22:24.160 --> 0:22:28.040
<v Speaker 2>possibility of the coalition breaking up, and that is, of course,

0:22:28.440 --> 0:22:31.399
<v Speaker 2>now what has happened. So it's the morning after the

0:22:31.520 --> 0:22:34.359
<v Speaker 2>night before, as it were, Are there any regrets?

0:22:36.760 --> 0:22:39.680
<v Speaker 10>Well, look, the feeling yesterday for me, Caylor was one

0:22:39.680 --> 0:22:42.199
<v Speaker 10>of melancholy and I still feel like that. This certainly

0:22:42.240 --> 0:22:45.080
<v Speaker 10>wasn't a joyous occasion yesterday. It wasn't something that we

0:22:45.720 --> 0:22:47.920
<v Speaker 10>wanted to do and wasn't something that we set out

0:22:47.920 --> 0:22:49.879
<v Speaker 10>to do, but it was something we unfortunately felt we

0:22:49.960 --> 0:22:52.639
<v Speaker 10>had to do. But having said that as well, we

0:22:52.720 --> 0:22:54.480
<v Speaker 10>have some issues that we would like to resolve. Were

0:22:54.520 --> 0:22:57.080
<v Speaker 10>the four issues that we've been very public on that

0:22:57.119 --> 0:22:59.520
<v Speaker 10>we need as part of a deal, and I hope

0:22:59.520 --> 0:23:01.640
<v Speaker 10>that happened sooner rather than later and the band's back

0:23:01.680 --> 0:23:02.320
<v Speaker 10>together again.

0:23:03.240 --> 0:23:06.000
<v Speaker 2>Well, from what David little Proud has been saying today,

0:23:06.040 --> 0:23:09.520
<v Speaker 2>your leader, of course you may will sit on the

0:23:09.560 --> 0:23:14.160
<v Speaker 2>backbench until after the next election unless on those four

0:23:14.280 --> 0:23:17.840
<v Speaker 2>policy points the Liberal Party accedes to you.

0:23:18.560 --> 0:23:19.280
<v Speaker 3>Is that a.

0:23:19.320 --> 0:23:21.560
<v Speaker 2>Situation you would like to end up in? I mean,

0:23:21.560 --> 0:23:23.720
<v Speaker 2>are you prepared to say, Look, if we don't get

0:23:23.760 --> 0:23:27.119
<v Speaker 2>those policies, we are not rejoining with the Liberal Party

0:23:27.160 --> 0:23:30.119
<v Speaker 2>at all.

0:23:30.280 --> 0:23:33.439
<v Speaker 10>Well, Caleb, my desire is to be sitting in a

0:23:33.480 --> 0:23:38.240
<v Speaker 10>coalition with the Liberal Party tomorrow. That would be my goal. Now,

0:23:38.280 --> 0:23:41.840
<v Speaker 10>why isn't that happening, and to reprosecute those four things.

0:23:41.920 --> 0:23:44.040
<v Speaker 10>Let's take one of them, Caleb. One of them is

0:23:44.040 --> 0:23:46.600
<v Speaker 10>the Regional Australia Future Fund. We have been arguing and

0:23:46.680 --> 0:23:49.880
<v Speaker 10>trying to get that to be coalition policy for a decade.

0:23:50.119 --> 0:23:54.119
<v Speaker 10>We've got to agree to us coalition policy in the

0:23:54.200 --> 0:23:57.560
<v Speaker 10>last twelve months of the last parliament. We can't see

0:23:57.640 --> 0:23:59.720
<v Speaker 10>that because what is that that's about more money in

0:23:59.760 --> 0:24:03.560
<v Speaker 10>the re agents for childcare, for health care and for infrastructure.

0:24:03.880 --> 0:24:06.240
<v Speaker 10>I couldn't look my community in the eye and said, oh,

0:24:06.280 --> 0:24:09.880
<v Speaker 10>you know that twenty billion dollar fund that we promised,

0:24:09.880 --> 0:24:12.200
<v Speaker 10>and there'd be a b and dollarly dividend every year

0:24:12.440 --> 0:24:15.239
<v Speaker 10>going into the regions. We forego that as far as

0:24:15.840 --> 0:24:18.879
<v Speaker 10>sign a coalition agreement. That's unacceptable for us as a community.

0:24:19.160 --> 0:24:22.520
<v Speaker 10>So I am hoping that the Liberal Party can get

0:24:22.560 --> 0:24:25.119
<v Speaker 10>to the place where they see the value in those

0:24:25.160 --> 0:24:27.760
<v Speaker 10>four policies and we are in a coalition agreement by

0:24:27.760 --> 0:24:28.520
<v Speaker 10>the end of the week.

0:24:29.400 --> 0:24:32.520
<v Speaker 2>Well, you talk about how you sell your values to

0:24:32.600 --> 0:24:36.840
<v Speaker 2>the community, the rank and file members of the National Party,

0:24:37.240 --> 0:24:39.360
<v Speaker 2>how have they responded to you about this?

0:24:41.440 --> 0:24:43.560
<v Speaker 1>Well, on the ground locally, they understand.

0:24:43.640 --> 0:24:45.840
<v Speaker 10>I mean the feedback that my office has been getting

0:24:45.880 --> 0:24:47.600
<v Speaker 10>and things that we've been putting out has been one

0:24:47.640 --> 0:24:51.320
<v Speaker 10>of very much of positivity. Remember, Caleb, this is this

0:24:51.520 --> 0:24:54.840
<v Speaker 10>is a position of principle. I not that I'm complaining.

0:24:54.960 --> 0:24:59.640
<v Speaker 10>We have all foregone shadow cabinet positions which things come

0:24:59.680 --> 0:25:00.080
<v Speaker 10>with that.

0:25:00.560 --> 0:25:01.840
<v Speaker 1>We have forgotne that.

0:25:02.160 --> 0:25:05.639
<v Speaker 10>Because these four policy positions are too important us. The

0:25:05.720 --> 0:25:08.600
<v Speaker 10>vestiture been another one. We've been arguing and trying to

0:25:08.600 --> 0:25:11.480
<v Speaker 10>get the vestiture as coalition policy for up to ten

0:25:11.560 --> 0:25:14.480
<v Speaker 10>years as well. We got that as coalition policy in

0:25:14.520 --> 0:25:17.320
<v Speaker 10>the last parliament, and we just these are too important

0:25:17.359 --> 0:25:20.520
<v Speaker 10>to our farmers, too important to our local communities when

0:25:20.520 --> 0:25:23.199
<v Speaker 10>we're talking about the infrastructure and the healthcare and the

0:25:23.240 --> 0:25:27.000
<v Speaker 10>Region Australian Future Fund to give up. They're really signature

0:25:27.040 --> 0:25:28.320
<v Speaker 10>policies for us.

0:25:29.000 --> 0:25:32.200
<v Speaker 2>Clearly, not everyone in the party room back the decision.

0:25:32.240 --> 0:25:36.200
<v Speaker 2>You said earlier today that the decision was not unanimous.

0:25:36.480 --> 0:25:38.280
<v Speaker 3>Exactly how much descent was there.

0:25:40.359 --> 0:25:42.199
<v Speaker 10>We look, I don't want to go and it's not

0:25:42.240 --> 0:25:44.359
<v Speaker 10>for me too, and I don't want to break party

0:25:44.440 --> 0:25:47.080
<v Speaker 10>room confidence. I mean, the party room is a sacred

0:25:47.080 --> 0:25:48.680
<v Speaker 10>place in the sense of what happens in the party

0:25:48.760 --> 0:25:51.159
<v Speaker 10>room does and should stay in the party room. It

0:25:51.200 --> 0:25:54.040
<v Speaker 10>wasn't unanimous, but having said that, it was quite conclusive

0:25:54.119 --> 0:25:54.680
<v Speaker 10>the result.

0:25:56.200 --> 0:25:57.159
<v Speaker 3>Did you vote for it?

0:25:59.040 --> 0:25:59.440
<v Speaker 1>I did?

0:25:59.520 --> 0:26:04.200
<v Speaker 10>I did, And again this shouldn't have been a surprise either,

0:26:04.280 --> 0:26:07.600
<v Speaker 10>with all due respect to our partners or our partners

0:26:08.080 --> 0:26:10.800
<v Speaker 10>in the coalition, the Liberal Party. I think David has

0:26:10.800 --> 0:26:15.040
<v Speaker 10>said that on the Friday last Friday, we went back

0:26:15.200 --> 0:26:18.800
<v Speaker 10>to the Liberal leadership and said these four are signature policies.

0:26:19.000 --> 0:26:22.720
<v Speaker 10>They're too important for us to forego and we need

0:26:22.760 --> 0:26:25.399
<v Speaker 10>a commitment to them. So wasn't something we threw at

0:26:25.400 --> 0:26:27.080
<v Speaker 10>the last minute. It was something that we did very

0:26:27.119 --> 0:26:30.040
<v Speaker 10>early on in the negotiation, so we were disappointed when

0:26:30.040 --> 0:26:31.639
<v Speaker 10>there wasn't enough movement on them.

0:26:32.119 --> 0:26:34.800
<v Speaker 2>The argument, of course from the Liberals would be, you know,

0:26:35.119 --> 0:26:37.760
<v Speaker 2>as Susan Lee has said, we're going to go back

0:26:37.760 --> 0:26:41.199
<v Speaker 2>to the table and discuss every policy here, so we

0:26:41.240 --> 0:26:44.480
<v Speaker 2>may well come back with what you have requested of us,

0:26:44.520 --> 0:26:48.119
<v Speaker 2>but we're just not in a position to do that yet.

0:26:48.320 --> 0:26:52.200
<v Speaker 2>Why did you and the party feel it was incumbered

0:26:52.240 --> 0:26:55.520
<v Speaker 2>upon you to make the decision now to break the coalition,

0:26:55.800 --> 0:26:58.200
<v Speaker 2>as opposed to waiting for the Liberals to come back

0:26:58.240 --> 0:27:00.760
<v Speaker 2>with their point of view and making it decision, then.

0:27:02.880 --> 0:27:03.800
<v Speaker 1>Well what is we thought?

0:27:04.080 --> 0:27:06.240
<v Speaker 10>And we're hoping that the Liberal Party would agree to it,

0:27:06.320 --> 0:27:09.840
<v Speaker 10>but when they didn't, we feel that if there is opposition,

0:27:09.920 --> 0:27:12.800
<v Speaker 10>and respectfully I understand that, and they're allowed.

0:27:12.520 --> 0:27:13.240
<v Speaker 1>To there is.

0:27:14.840 --> 0:27:17.639
<v Speaker 10>Quite some opposition to some of these policies within the

0:27:17.640 --> 0:27:20.400
<v Speaker 10>Liberal Party room and I respect that and I understand that.

0:27:20.920 --> 0:27:22.720
<v Speaker 10>So we felt if we didn't have a part of

0:27:22.760 --> 0:27:25.720
<v Speaker 10>the agreement straight away as we move forward and start

0:27:25.760 --> 0:27:28.280
<v Speaker 10>to attack the Labor government to form govern the next

0:27:28.280 --> 0:27:30.520
<v Speaker 10>three years, that we might never see them again.

0:27:30.800 --> 0:27:32.320
<v Speaker 1>And as I said earlier.

0:27:32.240 --> 0:27:35.760
<v Speaker 10>These four signature policies are too important for our regional communities.

0:27:35.760 --> 0:27:38.440
<v Speaker 10>Who can't get childcare, who can't get the health services

0:27:38.440 --> 0:27:40.159
<v Speaker 10>as you get in the cities, who don't have the

0:27:40.160 --> 0:27:42.320
<v Speaker 10>infrastructure that you have in the cities, is one example

0:27:42.320 --> 0:27:43.200
<v Speaker 10>of those four things.

0:27:43.840 --> 0:27:46.400
<v Speaker 1>Is too important for us, too important for our room.

0:27:47.240 --> 0:27:49.800
<v Speaker 2>What demands will you have of the Liberal Party to

0:27:49.840 --> 0:27:52.679
<v Speaker 2>get back together again? Do you want a resumption of

0:27:52.720 --> 0:27:56.960
<v Speaker 2>how things were in terms of sharing positions in shadow cabinet?

0:27:57.040 --> 0:28:00.720
<v Speaker 3>Do you want more? No?

0:28:00.840 --> 0:28:03.520
<v Speaker 10>Look, the shadow cabinet, for example, is a ratio, so

0:28:03.960 --> 0:28:06.160
<v Speaker 10>it's literally done on how many members they have, how

0:28:06.200 --> 0:28:08.159
<v Speaker 10>many members, we have you calculate it, you do it

0:28:08.200 --> 0:28:11.240
<v Speaker 10>on a pro rata system, so we weren't asking for it.

0:28:11.359 --> 0:28:12.400
<v Speaker 1>Well, we never really.

0:28:12.200 --> 0:28:15.720
<v Speaker 10>Got to that level of the discussion within the coalition

0:28:15.840 --> 0:28:18.240
<v Speaker 10>agreement because these four things were the starting point, but

0:28:18.280 --> 0:28:20.320
<v Speaker 10>we wouldn't have been asking for any more than.

0:28:20.160 --> 0:28:20.760
<v Speaker 1>We were due.

0:28:21.040 --> 0:28:22.800
<v Speaker 10>And part of that there would have been other little

0:28:22.880 --> 0:28:25.439
<v Speaker 10>nuances we were asking for about things in the Chamber,

0:28:25.480 --> 0:28:28.119
<v Speaker 10>et cetera, in question time and MPIs, but that's just

0:28:28.160 --> 0:28:31.960
<v Speaker 10>per functionary stuff. The starting point was these four policies,

0:28:32.000 --> 0:28:33.600
<v Speaker 10>three of them which we've been fighting for for a

0:28:33.640 --> 0:28:36.639
<v Speaker 10>long time, were great wins for our room in the

0:28:36.720 --> 0:28:39.240
<v Speaker 10>last Parliament to get approved by the coalition.

0:28:40.640 --> 0:28:42.680
<v Speaker 1>Because of the importance of them.

0:28:43.680 --> 0:28:46.600
<v Speaker 10>Couldn't let them go and potentially never see them again

0:28:46.680 --> 0:28:50.240
<v Speaker 10>become coalition policy. Our wish, our hope, was that the

0:28:50.280 --> 0:28:52.719
<v Speaker 10>Liberal Party would see the importance of those to our

0:28:52.800 --> 0:28:55.600
<v Speaker 10>room and say, yep, we get these, we get how

0:28:55.640 --> 0:28:57.920
<v Speaker 10>important this is to the National's party room. We think

0:28:57.920 --> 0:29:00.760
<v Speaker 10>it's important for a coalition degrement happy to make the

0:29:00.800 --> 0:29:04.240
<v Speaker 10>exception of our review for these important positions of the

0:29:04.360 --> 0:29:07.040
<v Speaker 10>Nationals and know how long you've been arguing for them,

0:29:07.640 --> 0:29:09.880
<v Speaker 10>and the rest will be up for review as we

0:29:09.960 --> 0:29:10.360
<v Speaker 10>march on.

0:29:10.440 --> 0:29:12.600
<v Speaker 1>That's what we were hoping the scenario was going to be.

0:29:13.400 --> 0:29:14.760
<v Speaker 3>Kevin Hogan, thank you for your time.

0:29:16.560 --> 0:29:20.760
<v Speaker 2>Thanks Calum Again, I say, I hope they can fix

0:29:20.800 --> 0:29:23.480
<v Speaker 2>it sooner rather than later, because the longer it goes on,

0:29:24.040 --> 0:29:26.160
<v Speaker 2>the worse it will get still to come. I'll get

0:29:26.200 --> 0:29:28.800
<v Speaker 2>the perspective of the coalition breakup from the other partner,

0:29:28.840 --> 0:29:31.760
<v Speaker 2>the Liberals, when the lnp's Garth Hamilton joins me a

0:29:31.800 --> 0:29:35.000
<v Speaker 2>little later. But first the latest details on those record

0:29:35.000 --> 0:29:37.960
<v Speaker 2>breaking floods that have swept across New South Wales and

0:29:38.000 --> 0:29:40.960
<v Speaker 2>what the next few days have in store. Meteorologist Rob

0:29:41.000 --> 0:29:42.240
<v Speaker 2>Sharp will join me next.

0:29:46.480 --> 0:29:46.760
<v Speaker 3>Well.

0:29:46.800 --> 0:29:50.000
<v Speaker 2>Record breaking floods have again in undated parts of New

0:29:50.040 --> 0:29:52.760
<v Speaker 2>South Wales. It just feels like a hamster wheel, doesn't it.

0:29:52.840 --> 0:29:55.480
<v Speaker 2>This time the Manning River has peaked at six point

0:29:55.520 --> 0:29:58.440
<v Speaker 2>four meters at Tare, and of course the SEES has

0:29:58.480 --> 0:30:01.680
<v Speaker 2>been working in overdrive to resk hundreds of trapped residents,

0:30:01.720 --> 0:30:04.040
<v Speaker 2>many of whom have been cut off from roads and

0:30:04.080 --> 0:30:06.600
<v Speaker 2>have been living on their rooftops since last and since

0:30:06.680 --> 0:30:09.800
<v Speaker 2>last night, I should say, much like the Hallerin family here,

0:30:37.040 --> 0:30:39.160
<v Speaker 2>goodness me you feel so sorry for them and what

0:30:39.200 --> 0:30:41.720
<v Speaker 2>an experience that would be with me now. Sky News

0:30:41.720 --> 0:30:46.640
<v Speaker 2>meteorologist Rob Sharp Rob Tari had record breaking flooding today.

0:30:47.000 --> 0:30:51.040
<v Speaker 2>Could floods rise to new heights in other communities, That.

0:30:51.080 --> 0:30:52.040
<v Speaker 1>Is a possibility.

0:30:52.120 --> 0:30:54.800
<v Speaker 15>That is the fear that I have that this flood

0:30:54.800 --> 0:30:57.480
<v Speaker 15>event will continue and the focus will shift just that

0:30:57.520 --> 0:31:00.840
<v Speaker 15>a little bit further north. So many can communities along

0:31:00.920 --> 0:31:05.520
<v Speaker 15>the Manning River have been flooded out completely, homes engulfed

0:31:05.520 --> 0:31:07.960
<v Speaker 15>by water, and that kind of thing is starting to

0:31:07.960 --> 0:31:10.280
<v Speaker 15>happen in a few other areas as well, and we've

0:31:10.320 --> 0:31:13.560
<v Speaker 15>seen that today. This is a shot from Kempsey from

0:31:13.560 --> 0:31:15.160
<v Speaker 15>the middle of the day. Since then, the river has

0:31:15.240 --> 0:31:18.160
<v Speaker 15>risen an extra half a meter a in Port mcquarie.

0:31:18.360 --> 0:31:21.719
<v Speaker 15>That's significant water in many of the streets as well,

0:31:21.760 --> 0:31:25.239
<v Speaker 15>as water levels continue to rise in that region too.

0:31:25.400 --> 0:31:27.880
<v Speaker 15>So over the last couple of days, this is the

0:31:27.960 --> 0:31:30.600
<v Speaker 15>rain we have seen. Areas in the peak have had

0:31:30.640 --> 0:31:34.280
<v Speaker 15>more than two hundred millimeters widespread and totals have reached

0:31:34.280 --> 0:31:37.280
<v Speaker 15>as high as five hundred millimeters up.

0:31:37.120 --> 0:31:38.280
<v Speaker 3>To nine o'clock this morning.

0:31:38.560 --> 0:31:41.160
<v Speaker 15>But since then the rain has continued to fall.

0:31:41.360 --> 0:31:42.560
<v Speaker 3>We have major.

0:31:42.280 --> 0:31:46.480
<v Speaker 15>Flooding in all of these river systems labeled here, but

0:31:46.560 --> 0:31:50.680
<v Speaker 15>my fears are greatest for the Nambucker, Maclay and Hastings

0:31:50.760 --> 0:31:53.920
<v Speaker 15>River from now on because those three are rising quite

0:31:54.000 --> 0:31:57.600
<v Speaker 15>quickly and we're continuing to see the rain in that

0:31:57.720 --> 0:32:00.280
<v Speaker 15>region as well, so you could see it's a bit

0:32:00.320 --> 0:32:03.760
<v Speaker 15>more further north than what we were seeing in previous days,

0:32:03.960 --> 0:32:06.960
<v Speaker 15>with the target being the mid North Coast and even

0:32:07.040 --> 0:32:09.720
<v Speaker 15>into southern parts of the Northern Rivers where we have

0:32:09.920 --> 0:32:13.640
<v Speaker 15>seen another ninety six in Yamber Bellinger one hundred and

0:32:13.640 --> 0:32:16.880
<v Speaker 15>fifty six, and there's even been a small location picking

0:32:16.920 --> 0:32:19.520
<v Speaker 15>up as much as one hundred and ninety milimeters just

0:32:19.600 --> 0:32:21.480
<v Speaker 15>since nine o'clock this morning.

0:32:21.720 --> 0:32:22.920
<v Speaker 3>Goodness, goodness me.

0:32:23.000 --> 0:32:25.920
<v Speaker 2>How will the rest of this weather event play out? Well?

0:32:26.000 --> 0:32:28.800
<v Speaker 15>Unfortunately, through tomorrow it's going to continue to target much

0:32:28.880 --> 0:32:31.240
<v Speaker 15>the same area. There's a severe weather warnings that stands

0:32:31.440 --> 0:32:35.840
<v Speaker 15>heavy to locally intense rainfall the potential for life threatening

0:32:35.960 --> 0:32:38.960
<v Speaker 15>flash flooding. But it's the accumulation of rain that I'm

0:32:39.000 --> 0:32:42.400
<v Speaker 15>most concerned about because it's targeting these same areas again

0:32:42.920 --> 0:32:47.320
<v Speaker 15>through tonight and into tomorrow with the low pressure trough. Unfortunately,

0:32:47.320 --> 0:32:50.960
<v Speaker 15>on top of that small low pressure system circulation is

0:32:51.120 --> 0:32:53.320
<v Speaker 15>likely to form, and that will aid the winds to

0:32:53.360 --> 0:32:56.760
<v Speaker 15>strengthen as well. So that may mean that those helicopters

0:32:57.040 --> 0:33:00.560
<v Speaker 15>may not be able to land on rooftops later tomorrow

0:33:00.880 --> 0:33:04.000
<v Speaker 15>if water levels rise to the heights that we fear

0:33:04.080 --> 0:33:06.880
<v Speaker 15>that they may, So that could be the real problem.

0:33:07.040 --> 0:33:11.120
<v Speaker 15>That evacuations might get significantly trickier as the wind picks

0:33:11.200 --> 0:33:13.160
<v Speaker 15>up again. But you can see this rain spreads to

0:33:13.200 --> 0:33:16.440
<v Speaker 15>many regions. Twenty five to fifty millimeters is likely in

0:33:16.440 --> 0:33:20.120
<v Speaker 15>these lime green shedded areas, even Canberra, who is likely

0:33:20.160 --> 0:33:24.080
<v Speaker 15>to see thirty to ninety millimeters. In Sydney Thursday and Friday,

0:33:24.400 --> 0:33:27.000
<v Speaker 15>fifty to one hundred and twenty millimeters is likely. But

0:33:27.040 --> 0:33:29.560
<v Speaker 15>it's that north coast where in the pink sheding we're

0:33:29.600 --> 0:33:33.360
<v Speaker 15>still expecting another two hundred millimeters on top of the

0:33:33.400 --> 0:33:36.680
<v Speaker 15>three hundred to five hundred that has already fallen.

0:33:36.800 --> 0:33:39.800
<v Speaker 2>Caleb, rob I'm getting fan mail about your work here,

0:33:39.960 --> 0:33:42.280
<v Speaker 2>so thank you so much for keeping us across it.

0:33:42.280 --> 0:33:44.960
<v Speaker 2>It's been the most popular part of the show so far.

0:33:45.320 --> 0:33:48.160
<v Speaker 2>Rob Sharp, thank you for your time. Now, Donald Trump

0:33:48.320 --> 0:33:50.200
<v Speaker 2>said what a lot of people have been thinking when

0:33:50.280 --> 0:33:52.680
<v Speaker 2>it comes to Joe Biden's cancer diagnosis.

0:33:53.880 --> 0:33:58.080
<v Speaker 16>I think it's very sad. Actually, I'm surprised that it

0:33:58.200 --> 0:34:01.720
<v Speaker 16>wasn't you know, THEBLIC wasn't notified a long time ago,

0:34:01.840 --> 0:34:04.040
<v Speaker 16>because to get to stage nine, that's a long time.

0:34:04.920 --> 0:34:07.080
<v Speaker 16>I just add my physical saw that you saw the

0:34:07.120 --> 0:34:10.640
<v Speaker 16>results of that particular test. I think that testa's standard

0:34:10.840 --> 0:34:15.719
<v Speaker 16>to pretty much anybody getting a physical good physical.

0:34:16.880 --> 0:34:20.160
<v Speaker 2>And of course I wish President Biden, well you wouldn't

0:34:20.160 --> 0:34:21.440
<v Speaker 2>wish cancer on anyone.

0:34:21.760 --> 0:34:25.320
<v Speaker 3>But it's a good question. I mean, surely Biden.

0:34:24.960 --> 0:34:28.839
<v Speaker 2>Had access to the best possible medical treatment any US

0:34:28.920 --> 0:34:32.960
<v Speaker 2>citizen could have, but his prostate cancer was only discovered

0:34:33.200 --> 0:34:37.200
<v Speaker 2>when it had metastasized into the bone. Biden's office responded

0:34:37.239 --> 0:34:40.200
<v Speaker 2>today saying he hadn't had a screening for prostate cancer

0:34:40.600 --> 0:34:44.640
<v Speaker 2>since twenty fourteen. And I know screening isn't always recommended

0:34:44.680 --> 0:34:47.879
<v Speaker 2>for men over seventy, but I just don't know how

0:34:47.880 --> 0:34:50.520
<v Speaker 2>that makes anything better. I mean, it's a blood test

0:34:50.760 --> 0:34:53.880
<v Speaker 2>so easy, and you're the president of the United States.

0:34:54.360 --> 0:34:58.280
<v Speaker 2>You know you'd think you'd bother to get tested. Donald Trump,

0:34:58.360 --> 0:35:01.399
<v Speaker 2>does I mean, did Biden say that he didn't want

0:35:01.480 --> 0:35:04.359
<v Speaker 2>the test, or did his doctor decide not to do

0:35:04.440 --> 0:35:06.080
<v Speaker 2>it without discussing it with him.

0:35:06.120 --> 0:35:07.200
<v Speaker 3>It's all very odd.

0:35:07.719 --> 0:35:11.600
<v Speaker 2>The doctor Kevin O'Connor, Biden's doctor, hasn't answered any questions,

0:35:11.680 --> 0:35:13.960
<v Speaker 2>by the way, and the question I want to answered,

0:35:13.960 --> 0:35:16.760
<v Speaker 2>and I haven't really seen anyone give an answer this week,

0:35:17.080 --> 0:35:19.960
<v Speaker 2>is how long do you need to have prostate cancer

0:35:20.400 --> 0:35:24.520
<v Speaker 2>before it becomes a stage four cancer moving into the bone.

0:35:24.640 --> 0:35:28.040
<v Speaker 2>How long might have Joe Biden had this? Well for

0:35:28.080 --> 0:35:31.120
<v Speaker 2>an expert medical opinion, I'm joined now by urologist and

0:35:31.160 --> 0:35:35.319
<v Speaker 2>clinical director with the Australian Prostate Center, doctor Phil Dundee.

0:35:35.520 --> 0:35:39.160
<v Speaker 2>Doctor Dundee, the most pressing point here is that Biden

0:35:39.400 --> 0:35:41.520
<v Speaker 2>was out of the White House for four months. He

0:35:41.640 --> 0:35:43.439
<v Speaker 2>was given a clean bill of health in his time

0:35:43.480 --> 0:35:47.520
<v Speaker 2>as president. Now he has stage four prostate cancer. Now

0:35:47.600 --> 0:35:50.120
<v Speaker 2>you're a doctor, you're not a political commentator, So I'm

0:35:50.120 --> 0:35:52.359
<v Speaker 2>not going to get into the politics of it with you.

0:35:52.480 --> 0:35:53.960
<v Speaker 3>I can do that myself later.

0:35:54.320 --> 0:35:58.480
<v Speaker 2>But strictly medically speaking, is this something that could have

0:35:58.680 --> 0:36:01.600
<v Speaker 2>conceivably happened in just four months?

0:36:03.520 --> 0:36:05.600
<v Speaker 17>Well, I think it depends on whether you're talking about

0:36:05.600 --> 0:36:08.319
<v Speaker 17>the diagnosis been made or whether the disease has been

0:36:08.360 --> 0:36:11.319
<v Speaker 17>present for four months. So it's almost certain that this

0:36:11.440 --> 0:36:14.400
<v Speaker 17>process has been going on for at least ten years,

0:36:15.120 --> 0:36:18.239
<v Speaker 17>but it is possible that he has been unaware of

0:36:18.239 --> 0:36:21.600
<v Speaker 17>the diagnosis until he had the requisite testing. So I

0:36:21.640 --> 0:36:24.040
<v Speaker 17>think you mentioned about the guidelines of testing, and I

0:36:24.120 --> 0:36:27.680
<v Speaker 17>think that's where really the failure has been. I understand

0:36:27.719 --> 0:36:30.120
<v Speaker 17>that he last had a test in twenty fourteen, and

0:36:30.160 --> 0:36:31.960
<v Speaker 17>he would have been seventy one or seventy two at

0:36:31.960 --> 0:36:36.400
<v Speaker 17>that stage. Unfortunately, the US as well as Australia, recommend

0:36:36.600 --> 0:36:40.960
<v Speaker 17>against screening for prostate cancer for men in their seventies,

0:36:41.239 --> 0:36:43.520
<v Speaker 17>and that's why this situation has been able to occur.

0:36:43.680 --> 0:36:47.880
<v Speaker 17>So had he had ongoing testing through his seventies seventies,

0:36:47.920 --> 0:36:50.600
<v Speaker 17>almost certainly this would have been picked up at a

0:36:50.760 --> 0:36:54.200
<v Speaker 17>much earlier stage, and possibly at a curable stage, and

0:36:54.200 --> 0:36:56.600
<v Speaker 17>he wouldn't be facing this situation now. So I think

0:36:56.640 --> 0:36:58.080
<v Speaker 17>this is really quite a disaster.

0:36:58.640 --> 0:37:01.640
<v Speaker 2>Well, how early I have picked something up? And if

0:37:01.680 --> 0:37:03.440
<v Speaker 2>you're saying this is a process that can take up

0:37:03.440 --> 0:37:05.960
<v Speaker 2>to ten years to get to, I mean potentially this

0:37:06.000 --> 0:37:08.600
<v Speaker 2>would have been picked up before he'd even run for president.

0:37:09.320 --> 0:37:10.120
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that's right.

0:37:10.360 --> 0:37:13.200
<v Speaker 17>And ideally we like to pick up prostate cancer before

0:37:13.200 --> 0:37:17.799
<v Speaker 17>it becomes symptomatic. Almost universally, once prostate cancer becomes symptomatic.

0:37:17.840 --> 0:37:21.360
<v Speaker 17>And I understand the prostate President Biden had some urinary

0:37:21.400 --> 0:37:25.920
<v Speaker 17>symptoms and that is a sign of late stage prostate cancer. Now,

0:37:25.960 --> 0:37:28.160
<v Speaker 17>I want to reassure any men, any of your viewers

0:37:28.160 --> 0:37:31.160
<v Speaker 17>out there, who have urinary symptoms. They are very common.

0:37:31.239 --> 0:37:34.759
<v Speaker 17>They are almost never related to prostate cancer. But it

0:37:34.800 --> 0:37:37.400
<v Speaker 17>does pose a good opportunity for men to see their

0:37:37.440 --> 0:37:40.680
<v Speaker 17>primary care provider and be tested for prostate cancer. But

0:37:40.840 --> 0:37:44.440
<v Speaker 17>if he has urinary symptoms that are because of prostate cancer,

0:37:44.760 --> 0:37:47.080
<v Speaker 17>he already has late stage disease. And that's why we

0:37:47.120 --> 0:37:50.319
<v Speaker 17>recommend staging. So staging is a simple blood test. We

0:37:50.360 --> 0:37:53.160
<v Speaker 17>can pick up prostate cancer when it's confined to the prostate,

0:37:53.560 --> 0:37:56.640
<v Speaker 17>and in almost all cases we can cure men before

0:37:56.640 --> 0:37:59.000
<v Speaker 17>it escapes as long as we are able to detect

0:37:59.000 --> 0:38:01.000
<v Speaker 17>it early, and we can only do that with the

0:38:01.000 --> 0:38:02.560
<v Speaker 17>blood test just quickly.

0:38:02.800 --> 0:38:05.560
<v Speaker 2>Why would you not test after seventy I know that

0:38:05.719 --> 0:38:09.160
<v Speaker 2>seems to be the recommendation, I mean, the President of

0:38:09.200 --> 0:38:11.000
<v Speaker 2>the United States, it's there. I don't know why you

0:38:11.000 --> 0:38:14.360
<v Speaker 2>wouldn't take it, But why would you not test after seventy.

0:38:14.880 --> 0:38:18.359
<v Speaker 17>I would strongly disagree with those recommendations, and we look

0:38:18.360 --> 0:38:22.280
<v Speaker 17>at the what's called lead time in prostaate cancer, where

0:38:22.440 --> 0:38:25.520
<v Speaker 17>when we detect the prostate cancer on a screening test,

0:38:25.880 --> 0:38:28.640
<v Speaker 17>we pick it up typically around about ten years before

0:38:28.680 --> 0:38:33.120
<v Speaker 17>it becomes symptomatic. And so the recommendations have been that

0:38:33.160 --> 0:38:36.760
<v Speaker 17>men in their seventies don't require prostate cancer screening because

0:38:36.800 --> 0:38:39.520
<v Speaker 17>they are likely to die of other causes before they

0:38:39.960 --> 0:38:41.560
<v Speaker 17>develop symptomatic prostaate cancer.

0:38:41.880 --> 0:38:43.160
<v Speaker 1>And that is just not true.

0:38:42.960 --> 0:38:45.040
<v Speaker 17>Of many men in their seventies. If you look at

0:38:45.040 --> 0:38:48.400
<v Speaker 17>the statistics for men in their seventies in Australia, life

0:38:48.440 --> 0:38:52.120
<v Speaker 17>expectancy does not drop below ten years until men reach

0:38:52.400 --> 0:38:54.879
<v Speaker 17>the age of seventy nine. So not only should they

0:38:54.880 --> 0:38:58.000
<v Speaker 17>be screened in their seventies, they should be screened right

0:38:58.040 --> 0:39:01.040
<v Speaker 17>through their seventies and even into their in some cases,

0:39:01.080 --> 0:39:04.759
<v Speaker 17>because we have an expanding life expectancy, many men living

0:39:04.800 --> 0:39:07.880
<v Speaker 17>into their late eighties, early nineties, and even to one hundred.

0:39:08.320 --> 0:39:10.360
<v Speaker 17>And this is the kind of situation that we're faced

0:39:10.360 --> 0:39:12.799
<v Speaker 17>with when men don't have screening. So this is a

0:39:12.960 --> 0:39:16.040
<v Speaker 17>preventable problem and it absolutely should have been prevented.

0:39:16.360 --> 0:39:18.799
<v Speaker 3>You've been a great help, doctor Phil Dundee. Thank you.

0:39:19.080 --> 0:39:22.040
<v Speaker 2>I mean, there you go ten years that could have

0:39:22.080 --> 0:39:24.680
<v Speaker 2>taken and either they didn't test or they didn't know.

0:39:24.719 --> 0:39:26.680
<v Speaker 3>I mean, it just seems insane.

0:39:26.800 --> 0:39:29.840
<v Speaker 2>Coming up after the break Keir Starmer says he's reset

0:39:29.880 --> 0:39:33.239
<v Speaker 2>the UK's relationship with Europe, but he's torn apart his

0:39:33.360 --> 0:39:35.360
<v Speaker 2>relationship with his own voters.

0:39:35.440 --> 0:39:37.359
<v Speaker 3>Brint and O'Neill in a moment, and.

0:39:37.280 --> 0:39:39.400
<v Speaker 2>We've spent a lot of time wondering about the future

0:39:39.400 --> 0:39:42.080
<v Speaker 2>of the Nationals after the coalition break up. But what's

0:39:42.120 --> 0:39:44.359
<v Speaker 2>going to happen now in the ideological battle for the

0:39:44.360 --> 0:39:45.760
<v Speaker 2>future of the Liberal Party?

0:39:45.880 --> 0:39:46.960
<v Speaker 3>Garth Hamilton joins me.

0:39:47.000 --> 0:39:53.400
<v Speaker 2>Next, let's return to the coalition split. You heard from

0:39:53.480 --> 0:39:56.680
<v Speaker 2>Kevin Hogan a little earlier about things from the National's perspective.

0:39:56.719 --> 0:39:59.400
<v Speaker 2>But of course what all of this hangs on whether

0:39:59.440 --> 0:40:02.719
<v Speaker 2>the Coalition gets back together is the policy decisions of

0:40:02.760 --> 0:40:05.799
<v Speaker 2>the Liberal Party. Do they come to the table or

0:40:05.800 --> 0:40:07.920
<v Speaker 2>do they decide they want to go it alone. I mean,

0:40:07.960 --> 0:40:09.960
<v Speaker 2>I don't know why they'd want to, but you read

0:40:10.000 --> 0:40:13.480
<v Speaker 2>today that Susan lay Lee sorry, is prepared to do so.

0:40:13.480 --> 0:40:15.960
<v Speaker 2>So I don't know what she knows that I don't know,

0:40:16.040 --> 0:40:18.399
<v Speaker 2>but someone who I think has given the most clear

0:40:18.520 --> 0:40:21.399
<v Speaker 2>art analysis of where the campaign went wrong and part

0:40:21.400 --> 0:40:23.520
<v Speaker 2>of what needs to happen in the future is the

0:40:23.640 --> 0:40:26.320
<v Speaker 2>lnp's Garth Hamilton. I've been praising his column in The

0:40:26.360 --> 0:40:29.720
<v Speaker 2>Australian on Monday all week and he joins me. Now, Garth,

0:40:29.880 --> 0:40:32.160
<v Speaker 2>thank you for joining me. I mean, what was your

0:40:32.160 --> 0:40:35.640
<v Speaker 2>initial reaction to the news that the coalition was breaking

0:40:35.680 --> 0:40:37.600
<v Speaker 2>up for the first time in nearly forty years.

0:40:40.080 --> 0:40:42.640
<v Speaker 18>Look, I won't pretend I wasn't frustrated and a little

0:40:42.640 --> 0:40:44.879
<v Speaker 18>bit sad. And we've got a great story to tell

0:40:44.920 --> 0:40:48.040
<v Speaker 18>them the coalition. Over the last hundred years, Australian people

0:40:48.080 --> 0:40:50.640
<v Speaker 18>have turned to a center right coalition for sixty five

0:40:50.680 --> 0:40:54.200
<v Speaker 18>of those years. We are the choice that Australia regularly

0:40:54.239 --> 0:40:56.800
<v Speaker 18>makes when we're going through hard times. We should be

0:40:56.880 --> 0:40:59.239
<v Speaker 18>really proud of that. And look, I guess what really

0:40:59.320 --> 0:41:01.279
<v Speaker 18>hurts the most is that right now we've got a

0:41:01.320 --> 0:41:05.720
<v Speaker 18>Labor government that went into the election raising the prospect

0:41:05.760 --> 0:41:08.520
<v Speaker 18>of a recession coming, that just released a budget that

0:41:08.600 --> 0:41:12.440
<v Speaker 18>had ten years of deficits banked in, and yet they

0:41:12.520 --> 0:41:15.920
<v Speaker 18>took almost no mandate to the last election. And we're

0:41:15.960 --> 0:41:18.239
<v Speaker 18>letting those guys get away. Every day we're talking about

0:41:18.239 --> 0:41:21.320
<v Speaker 18>the coalition agreement. We're letting these guys get away without

0:41:21.360 --> 0:41:23.880
<v Speaker 18>being held to account, which is our job as opposition.

0:41:23.920 --> 0:41:25.319
<v Speaker 18>So we need to get back to doing our job

0:41:25.400 --> 0:41:27.520
<v Speaker 18>really quickly. The best way to do that is in

0:41:27.560 --> 0:41:28.160
<v Speaker 18>a coalition.

0:41:28.760 --> 0:41:33.080
<v Speaker 2>Well, the N's policy demands nuclear energy, force, editive divestiture

0:41:33.160 --> 0:41:38.279
<v Speaker 2>of supermarkets, the Regional Future Fund, the service obligations for

0:41:38.480 --> 0:41:42.360
<v Speaker 2>mobile phone coverage in the regions. Is there any reason

0:41:42.680 --> 0:41:45.200
<v Speaker 2>the Liberal Party could not have just set up front

0:41:45.320 --> 0:41:48.560
<v Speaker 2>look will do it to keep the coalition together. I

0:41:48.600 --> 0:41:51.200
<v Speaker 2>know Lee has said that everything is up for grabs,

0:41:51.239 --> 0:41:53.200
<v Speaker 2>but could you not have just hit that one on

0:41:53.239 --> 0:41:54.760
<v Speaker 2>the head.

0:41:56.239 --> 0:41:58.120
<v Speaker 18>Look, I think this is a bit of kobuki theater

0:41:58.160 --> 0:42:00.400
<v Speaker 18>from the NATS. They know very well we would have

0:42:00.400 --> 0:42:02.480
<v Speaker 18>been open to a discussion on all of those issues.

0:42:02.560 --> 0:42:06.400
<v Speaker 18>They have no reason to think that we wouldn't. Kevin

0:42:06.440 --> 0:42:09.040
<v Speaker 18>Hogan's a very good man. But look, I think there's

0:42:09.120 --> 0:42:13.080
<v Speaker 18>a decision that the NAT's made long ago. They weren't

0:42:13.120 --> 0:42:16.640
<v Speaker 18>looking for peaceful resolution of that. That's my belief. I

0:42:16.640 --> 0:42:18.560
<v Speaker 18>think they need to stand to account for that. I

0:42:18.800 --> 0:42:20.000
<v Speaker 18>think they need to have a good hard look at

0:42:20.040 --> 0:42:22.799
<v Speaker 18>themselves and really commit to coming back to being part

0:42:22.840 --> 0:42:25.480
<v Speaker 18>of this coalition. It's important to Australia that we do.

0:42:25.520 --> 0:42:28.880
<v Speaker 18>This isn't about parties. This is about the Australian people

0:42:28.920 --> 0:42:31.960
<v Speaker 18>and how we serve them as their representatives in Parliament.

0:42:32.360 --> 0:42:34.759
<v Speaker 2>So you now need to have this fight over policies

0:42:34.760 --> 0:42:37.399
<v Speaker 2>and that will decide whether or not the Nats want

0:42:37.440 --> 0:42:39.919
<v Speaker 2>to come back to you. And of course you wrote

0:42:40.040 --> 0:42:42.360
<v Speaker 2>on Monday about part of the direction you think the

0:42:42.400 --> 0:42:45.320
<v Speaker 2>party should take. You particularly said that you've lost confidence

0:42:45.719 --> 0:42:49.640
<v Speaker 2>in net zero and you've lost confidence in blank checkbook

0:42:49.680 --> 0:42:53.560
<v Speaker 2>politics essentially, which is what net zero has been. Are

0:42:53.640 --> 0:42:56.319
<v Speaker 2>you confident that the Party will change its tune on

0:42:56.360 --> 0:42:56.840
<v Speaker 2>this matter.

0:42:59.440 --> 0:43:01.360
<v Speaker 18>Well, what I want the Party to do is to

0:43:01.400 --> 0:43:04.360
<v Speaker 18>focus on making this a question of the economy. I

0:43:04.440 --> 0:43:07.640
<v Speaker 18>think we've allowed questions like net zero to become moral

0:43:07.760 --> 0:43:09.520
<v Speaker 18>questions and to feel that either you're all in or

0:43:09.520 --> 0:43:12.360
<v Speaker 18>you're all out. You're good, you're bad, and that's a

0:43:12.440 --> 0:43:14.879
<v Speaker 18>terrible way for us to be addressing policy, particularly when

0:43:14.880 --> 0:43:17.520
<v Speaker 18>we're the people who are the strong economic managers who

0:43:17.520 --> 0:43:20.400
<v Speaker 18>look after Australia in those hard times. Netzero should be

0:43:20.400 --> 0:43:23.160
<v Speaker 18>an economic question. We'll be setting a price tag on it,

0:43:23.239 --> 0:43:26.160
<v Speaker 18>making assessment from that point of view. That's where we

0:43:26.239 --> 0:43:28.799
<v Speaker 18>offer something to the Australian people. And I think if

0:43:28.800 --> 0:43:30.960
<v Speaker 18>we have the view once again of going back to

0:43:31.800 --> 0:43:36.360
<v Speaker 18>the economy, of having a smaller government, of low attacks,

0:43:36.400 --> 0:43:40.640
<v Speaker 18>of putting family at the heart of the state, this

0:43:40.719 --> 0:43:43.800
<v Speaker 18>is where our our heartbeat is. This is what's important

0:43:43.800 --> 0:43:46.000
<v Speaker 18>to us. This is why people have chosen a center

0:43:46.040 --> 0:43:49.000
<v Speaker 18>right coalition in the past, which have to head in

0:43:49.040 --> 0:43:50.840
<v Speaker 18>that direction again and that's where we'll find home.

0:43:51.120 --> 0:43:53.799
<v Speaker 2>I wholeheartedly agree, Garth Hamilton, thank you for joining me.

0:43:54.120 --> 0:43:57.040
<v Speaker 2>Coming up after the break, a Conservative councilor's wife has

0:43:57.080 --> 0:44:00.000
<v Speaker 2>lost a repeal after being sentenced to thirty one months

0:44:00.200 --> 0:44:02.720
<v Speaker 2>in prison for a post on social media.

0:44:02.880 --> 0:44:04.560
<v Speaker 3>Brendan O'Neal joins me next.

0:44:07.840 --> 0:44:08.000
<v Speaker 12>Well.

0:44:08.120 --> 0:44:11.279
<v Speaker 2>UK Prime Minister Sirquias Stamer has signed Britain up to

0:44:11.320 --> 0:44:14.000
<v Speaker 2>a series of new agreements with the EU that, in

0:44:14.080 --> 0:44:17.640
<v Speaker 2>his words, resets the relationship after Brexit.

0:44:17.680 --> 0:44:17.839
<v Speaker 3>Now.

0:44:17.880 --> 0:44:22.040
<v Speaker 2>These agreements covered defense, trade and allowing EU fishing.

0:44:21.760 --> 0:44:23.520
<v Speaker 3>Vessels into UK waters.

0:44:23.560 --> 0:44:28.520
<v Speaker 19>Here he was announcing it, leadies and gentlemen, Britain is

0:44:28.600 --> 0:44:33.440
<v Speaker 19>back on the world stage, working with our partners, doing

0:44:33.560 --> 0:44:37.000
<v Speaker 19>deals that will grow our economy and putting more money

0:44:37.360 --> 0:44:39.200
<v Speaker 19>in the pockets of working.

0:44:38.880 --> 0:44:40.799
<v Speaker 3>People joining me. Now.

0:44:40.840 --> 0:44:44.520
<v Speaker 2>Brendan O'Neil, the chief political reporter for Spiked Online, and

0:44:44.640 --> 0:44:47.120
<v Speaker 2>something tells me you're not as excited by this as

0:44:47.200 --> 0:44:50.399
<v Speaker 2>Sirquias Stamer, and I suspect a lot of Brixiteers out either.

0:44:52.080 --> 0:44:54.200
<v Speaker 20>No, we absolutely are not. You know, we have to

0:44:54.239 --> 0:44:57.680
<v Speaker 20>remember that seventeen point four million people voted for Brexit

0:44:57.800 --> 0:45:00.520
<v Speaker 20>in twenty sixteen. I was one of those people, very

0:45:00.560 --> 0:45:02.840
<v Speaker 20>proud to have been one of those people, and that

0:45:02.960 --> 0:45:05.799
<v Speaker 20>was a vote to leave the European Union, to completely

0:45:05.920 --> 0:45:08.520
<v Speaker 20>cut ties with the European Union, which is an institution

0:45:08.719 --> 0:45:11.520
<v Speaker 20>we don't like. And yet this new deal that Kiirs

0:45:11.520 --> 0:45:15.719
<v Speaker 20>Starmer is trumpeting there, this takes us back into the EU. Essentially,

0:45:15.800 --> 0:45:20.400
<v Speaker 20>it brings us back under certain rules and regulations drafted

0:45:20.400 --> 0:45:23.880
<v Speaker 20>in Brussels and institutions we voted to reject. So it

0:45:23.960 --> 0:45:26.080
<v Speaker 20>kind of brings us back in by the back door.

0:45:26.200 --> 0:45:28.760
<v Speaker 20>And I think what Kirs Starmer is doing he always

0:45:28.800 --> 0:45:31.160
<v Speaker 20>hated Brexit, and what he's doing now is he's killing

0:45:31.160 --> 0:45:34.600
<v Speaker 20>it by a thousand technocratic blows, and this is part

0:45:34.640 --> 0:45:35.360
<v Speaker 20>of that process.

0:45:35.600 --> 0:45:37.839
<v Speaker 2>I just don't understand why, though, I mean, we saw

0:45:37.880 --> 0:45:41.359
<v Speaker 2>how he backled so fast on immigration last week, and

0:45:41.400 --> 0:45:44.480
<v Speaker 2>we know that he's under pressure, internal pressure from colleagues

0:45:44.760 --> 0:45:47.919
<v Speaker 2>with the surge in support for Reform UK. They're really

0:45:48.000 --> 0:45:50.880
<v Speaker 2>worried about the next election. So how does a deal

0:45:51.040 --> 0:45:55.080
<v Speaker 2>like this do anything to convince a potential Reform voter

0:45:55.239 --> 0:45:56.440
<v Speaker 2>that they should vote for labor.

0:45:57.840 --> 0:45:59.840
<v Speaker 20>It really doesn't. And in fact I think he is

0:46:00.320 --> 0:46:02.680
<v Speaker 20>the death warrant of the Labor Party, the death warrant

0:46:02.680 --> 0:46:06.279
<v Speaker 20>of the Labor government with this deal. It really is

0:46:06.360 --> 0:46:08.920
<v Speaker 20>that bad. And as you say, you know, Reform is

0:46:09.040 --> 0:46:11.760
<v Speaker 20>nipping at the heels of Labor Reform, which is Nigel

0:46:11.760 --> 0:46:15.160
<v Speaker 20>Farage's party. It's a pro Brexit party, it's wary about

0:46:15.160 --> 0:46:18.360
<v Speaker 20>mass immigration, it's against wokeness, you know, it's a party

0:46:18.400 --> 0:46:22.040
<v Speaker 20>that appeals to millions of working class voters here that

0:46:22.200 --> 0:46:26.800
<v Speaker 20>is now appealing to voters who would traditionally go for labor.

0:46:27.280 --> 0:46:30.720
<v Speaker 20>And yet still kir Starmer is pushing through this crazy deal,

0:46:30.800 --> 0:46:34.480
<v Speaker 20>this deal which makes us beholden to the European Court

0:46:34.480 --> 0:46:38.759
<v Speaker 20>of Justice. There are certain food and trade regulations that

0:46:38.800 --> 0:46:40.920
<v Speaker 20>we will have to follow, which means that if a

0:46:41.000 --> 0:46:44.600
<v Speaker 20>judgment is made in the ECJ that affects those rules,

0:46:44.640 --> 0:46:47.200
<v Speaker 20>we will have to abide by it. I'm sorry, but

0:46:47.320 --> 0:46:49.759
<v Speaker 20>a nation that has to abide by the judgments of

0:46:49.800 --> 0:46:53.359
<v Speaker 20>a foreign court is not an independent nation. And that's

0:46:53.360 --> 0:46:55.080
<v Speaker 20>what a lot of voters are waking up to, the

0:46:55.120 --> 0:46:57.719
<v Speaker 20>fact that kir Starmer is willing to sell off our

0:46:57.800 --> 0:47:00.480
<v Speaker 20>sovereignty in order to appease the European Union.

0:47:00.600 --> 0:47:02.359
<v Speaker 3>Well, let's at about the courts in the UK.

0:47:02.600 --> 0:47:05.040
<v Speaker 2>The wife of a Conservative counselor has lost to have

0:47:05.080 --> 0:47:08.279
<v Speaker 2>bid to appeal against a prison sentence. Lucy Connelly. She

0:47:08.360 --> 0:47:11.319
<v Speaker 2>was jailed for thirty one months in October after she

0:47:11.400 --> 0:47:15.200
<v Speaker 2>called for quote unquote mess deportation now and she urged

0:47:15.239 --> 0:47:18.959
<v Speaker 2>people to sit fire to hotels housing asylum seekers. Now,

0:47:19.160 --> 0:47:21.680
<v Speaker 2>you know, you don't go around doing that sort of stuff.

0:47:21.719 --> 0:47:25.520
<v Speaker 2>It is absolutely incitement to violence. But thirty one months

0:47:25.680 --> 0:47:27.000
<v Speaker 2>does seem a little extreme.

0:47:28.800 --> 0:47:32.760
<v Speaker 20>It's incredibly extreme. You know, everyone agrees, well, most decent

0:47:32.840 --> 0:47:36.520
<v Speaker 20>people agree that what she tweeted was awful. When during

0:47:36.560 --> 0:47:39.719
<v Speaker 20>those Southport riots she said burn down the hotels, by

0:47:39.800 --> 0:47:42.839
<v Speaker 20>which she meant hotels that were housing immigrants, she said,

0:47:42.840 --> 0:47:44.799
<v Speaker 20>I don't care, get rid of them all. That's an

0:47:44.800 --> 0:47:49.480
<v Speaker 20>obnoxious and potentially criminal thing to tweet. People shouldn't say

0:47:49.480 --> 0:47:51.640
<v Speaker 20>things like that. But thirty one months, two and a

0:47:51.680 --> 0:47:54.920
<v Speaker 20>half years in the slammer for something she wrote, something

0:47:54.960 --> 0:47:59.200
<v Speaker 20>she regretted writing, and something she swiftly deleted. That is extreme.

0:47:59.239 --> 0:48:02.160
<v Speaker 20>That is authority and taken to a new level. You know,

0:48:02.280 --> 0:48:05.200
<v Speaker 20>we have a two tier justice system in Britain because

0:48:05.200 --> 0:48:08.719
<v Speaker 20>there was an imam here, an Islamic preacher who a

0:48:08.760 --> 0:48:12.080
<v Speaker 20>few days after the Hamasis seventh of October attack on Israel,

0:48:12.360 --> 0:48:16.040
<v Speaker 20>he gave a sermon in which he said, cursed the Jews,

0:48:16.360 --> 0:48:20.320
<v Speaker 20>ruined their houses, destroy their homes, cursed the children of Israel.

0:48:20.320 --> 0:48:23.879
<v Speaker 20>He went on and on. No charges were brought against him,

0:48:24.120 --> 0:48:26.239
<v Speaker 20>he was not found guilty of having committed a crime.

0:48:26.280 --> 0:48:29.319
<v Speaker 20>He's still now preaching as he usually, as he always was,

0:48:29.520 --> 0:48:32.000
<v Speaker 20>and yet this woman finds herself in jail for saying

0:48:32.040 --> 0:48:35.360
<v Speaker 20>burn down the hotels. That is two tier justice and

0:48:35.400 --> 0:48:37.920
<v Speaker 20>it's another element of Keir Starmer's Britain that people are

0:48:37.920 --> 0:48:38.239
<v Speaker 20>sick of.

0:48:38.640 --> 0:48:40.640
<v Speaker 2>Just very quickly, before we go, Brindon, I want to

0:48:40.719 --> 0:48:44.200
<v Speaker 2>ask you about Joe Biden and the prostate cancer diagnosis.

0:48:44.239 --> 0:48:46.200
<v Speaker 2>Do we really believe that no one knew about this?

0:48:47.760 --> 0:48:50.239
<v Speaker 20>You know, how could they not. That's the question I

0:48:50.320 --> 0:48:54.640
<v Speaker 20>keep asking myself. You know, presidents famously get checked up

0:48:54.680 --> 0:48:56.799
<v Speaker 20>all the time to make sure that they're physically and

0:48:56.840 --> 0:48:59.920
<v Speaker 20>mentally healthy. Someone must have known, and we know that

0:49:00.040 --> 0:49:02.839
<v Speaker 20>there is a long record of people covering up Joe

0:49:02.840 --> 0:49:05.360
<v Speaker 20>Biden's full of mental frailty.

0:49:06.840 --> 0:49:09.160
<v Speaker 2>It just it seems so odd. I'm sorry, Brendan, we've

0:49:09.239 --> 0:49:11.520
<v Speaker 2>run out of time. Brendan O'Neill, thank you as always.

0:49:11.680 --> 0:49:14.279
<v Speaker 2>That's all We've got time for statue now. Paul Murray Live,