Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Something to Talk About, the Stella Podcast.
Speaker 1: I'm Sarah Lamarquin, your host, and this year I have
Speaker 1: had the privilege of sitting down with some of the
Speaker 1: biggest names in the country. Because when Estralia's celebrities are
Speaker 1: ready to talk, they come to Something to Talk About.
Speaker 1: We're continuing to publish across the summer break and we'll
Speaker 1: be back with a brand new episode on January twelfth.
Speaker 1: In the meantime, each day for the next two weeks,
Speaker 1: we'll be revisiting some of your favorite episodes from the
Speaker 1: past year. And I'm happy to report that there have
Speaker 1: been a lot of popular episodes, but out of the
Speaker 1: fifty we released in twenty twenty four, we've narrowed it
Speaker 1: down to ten conversations to revisit over the summer break.
Speaker 1: Today you'll hear from Hamish Blake in a rare in
Speaker 1: depth interview. The popular entertainer and two time Goldblogie winner
Speaker 1: join me in the studio to talk black cat lollies,
Speaker 1: the burial rituals of ancient Egypt, and his theory that
Speaker 1: a well stocked snack cupboard is the key to a
Speaker 1: happy workplace. Don't worry, we talk about his life too.
Speaker 1: Here's my chat with Hamish. Now, like all meticulously researched
Speaker 1: podcast hosts, I have referred to your Instagram bio in preparations.
Speaker 2: I can see over one page of printed stuff.
Speaker 1: That's true. I may have gone a little further than
Speaker 1: your Insta bio, but it's what we'll start.
Speaker 2: Will we've done that for anyone.
Speaker 1: I just can't and paste your Insta bio across six pages.
Speaker 1: I know this looks very daunting, doesn't it. It's like
Speaker 1: I've come in with my homework.
Speaker 2: This is a good this is a huge project.
Speaker 1: Last night I did my son's Year seven Egyptian history assignment,
Speaker 1: and what did you cover? We were talking about mummies
Speaker 1: and embalming, and I realized that mummies.
Speaker 2: Back then were something we did for the afterlife, but
Speaker 2: mummies now are someone we use for homework.
Speaker 1: This is exactly right and funnily enough for you. And
Speaker 1: I will be chatting a little bit about Lego today.
Speaker 1: And I was lamenting the fact that I had no
Speaker 1: little discarded cat Lego figurines anywhere as I did for
Speaker 1: when my oldest son was doing his year seven assignment.
Speaker 1: I don't know what Lego set had some little clearly
Speaker 1: there must like.
Speaker 2: An Egyptian thing because they loved cats.
Speaker 1: They used to embalm their pets with them as well,
Speaker 1: because then if they could be reunited together again, tough
Speaker 1: break for the cat, very tough break for the cat.
Speaker 1: If your owner unfortunately passed on, well, then.
Speaker 2: You'd be like, this doesn't look good.
Speaker 1: Anyone didn't have any lego in the house this time. Fortunately,
Speaker 1: I have a big fondness, some may say dependence on
Speaker 1: little sweets that are shaped in the shape of a
Speaker 1: black cat, made out of antisy like liquoric.
Speaker 2: I taught myself to love those as a kid because
Speaker 2: no other kids liked them, like black jelly beans. That's why.
Speaker 2: Because we didn't ever have like lollies and stuff I
Speaker 2: was of scabs. I was always like trying to like
Speaker 2: scum food of that, and so you just like taught
Speaker 2: yourself to like the stuff that people chucked away.
Speaker 1: The reason I have them is because my two sons
Speaker 1: won't eat them. They're the only lollies that will last
Speaker 1: in my house for longer than five minutes, so I
Speaker 1: had a little container of them. Anyway, I've already lost
Speaker 1: complete control of this inter do apologize six pages of preparation.
Speaker 2: And I mean I didn't need to come in hot
Speaker 2: off Egypt.
Speaker 1: I didn't need to read your Instagram bio. I could
Speaker 1: have just got straight into discarded lego pieces and lollies
Speaker 1: and our work. He was done.
Speaker 2: Totally pretty close to my heart, to be honest.
Speaker 1: As most of our readers and listeners would be aware.
Speaker 1: According to your bio, you host a weekly podcast or
Speaker 1: to some TV a few weeks a year. Huge load somehow.
Speaker 1: We will talk about those not so little podcasts in
Speaker 1: a moment, and also that TV which includes an upcoming Seaton.
Speaker 2: I hate the cover, thank you, it does, but I
Speaker 2: do have the cover for Stella is huge load, Like
Speaker 2: how does he manage? Just so my wife books and
Speaker 2: she's like, what did you say in that interview?
Speaker 1: Yeah, she will be uhcause.
Speaker 2: She genuinely does have a huge load. But if I
Speaker 2: am on the front cover pretending I have a huge load.
Speaker 1: All right, that's okay. Look, we will definitely get something
Speaker 1: in there about how Hamish manages.
Speaker 2: World class lolli scab and.
Speaker 1: Also huge workload. I mean there's a lot going on there.
Speaker 1: We're already very impressed here. Look, let's start with the
Speaker 1: big issue. How does the catering budget in the podcasting
Speaker 1: studio because we met host a couple of pods compare
Speaker 1: with that on set of a TV show.
Speaker 2: This is how much time have we got. I'll happily
Speaker 2: just talk about this for half an hour. It's my
Speaker 2: where do I How do I unpick this? I'm a
Speaker 2: firm believer in snacks. I think it's a really overlooked
Speaker 2: part of both podcasting and radio and television. It's I
Speaker 2: mean only because I've been that person, like when you
Speaker 2: rock up to work and you look at what snacks
Speaker 2: are available. Let's be honest, it really is. The message
Speaker 2: from the higher ups of this is how much we
Speaker 2: value you. If it's like some if it's just like
Speaker 2: a few pieces of fruit, it's a slap in the face.
Speaker 2: If it's good biscuits, and we all know what we
Speaker 2: mean here that UFE can buy like the non cream
Speaker 2: biscuits or cream. If you're giving someone a Kingston, you're
Speaker 2: saying to them, we tried and we love you. And
Speaker 2: it's not that much of a jump money wise right
Speaker 2: to get good biscuits versus this.
Speaker 1: Is generics buy them in bulk.
Speaker 2: You can buy them in bolk I just know what
Speaker 2: a difference it can make as a person. So back
Speaker 2: in the radio days, I was actually I would anoint
Speaker 2: myself the snap King, and we had a policy in
Speaker 2: our office in radio where I was like, whatever you
Speaker 2: guys like, because there is a you know, definitely an
Speaker 2: unfair hierarchy, both in radio and TV about like the
Speaker 2: people that are on camera versus the people that are
Speaker 2: actually doing all the work behind the scenes. So it's like,
Speaker 2: as a way to slightly address this imbalance, whatever anyone wants, like,
Speaker 2: we'll take it. Me and Andy will take care of it.
Speaker 2: Like just if you like macada, if you want oat milk, whatever,
Speaker 2: let's not have a moment at work where we're not
Speaker 2: pumped to open the fridge or the pantry. I hate
Speaker 2: that feeling when you like I need a little morale
Speaker 2: boost and you open the pantry and it's just full
Speaker 2: of morale destroying foods. So I think snacks are a
Speaker 2: huge element of morale in podcasting, there's not that you know,
Speaker 2: sometimes you're in separate studios, man, me and you are
Speaker 2: very big on like, you know, hey, everyone, let's just
Speaker 2: like let's get Nando's or Indian food, because it's like
Speaker 2: once a week you get to see each other. So
Speaker 2: again it should be like a joyful moment when I
Speaker 2: do how are the dad's dad? Which is a much
Speaker 2: smaller operation. It's just me and my mate Tim. We
Speaker 2: have a policy to that the drink like, we have
Speaker 2: a very strong please tell us your favorite drink like
Speaker 2: and be honest, like if you want a frappucino or
Speaker 2: something like, we will get it. Because again, how great
Speaker 2: is if you walk through the door and what you
Speaker 2: were like excited to have is waiting on the desk anyway,
Speaker 2: So that's sometimes so sometimes it's our footing the bill,
Speaker 2: but I see it as a very very small cost
Speaker 2: to bear for the joy that it can bring. So
Speaker 2: at Lego, I run a small kitchen backstage. There's like
Speaker 2: the general snack foods, and I'm not having to go
Speaker 2: at the production company here. They do a very good job.
Speaker 2: The catering's great, but I think you can boost morale
Speaker 2: by having you know, some great other foods backstage.
Speaker 1: I have to apologize. I feel like the craft services
Speaker 1: here on set of Something to Do, it's pretty.
Speaker 2: Perfect coffee, but this for a podcast, all you need
Speaker 2: is a coffee. Honestly, when I do the Hammer Shanny
Speaker 2: podcasts and they have two requirements and it's a little
Speaker 2: bit deverie, but I mean I pay for it. They
Speaker 2: just we can't leave the studio. I like to honor
Speaker 2: of This is very deep and only the people in
Speaker 2: our podcast team probably are interested in this. But I
Speaker 2: have a jar where I have mcflurry money, so I will,
Speaker 2: like at one thirty sort of just after lunch, two o'clock,
Speaker 2: I'll do it. I'll do a coffee and I'm a Flurry.
Speaker 2: I kind of think there's no better combination.
Speaker 1: For very comedy that is pick up.
Speaker 2: So it's actually a guy that works for this called Brad,
Speaker 2: and he takes it really and I appreciate how seriously
Speaker 2: he takes it because we obviously can't leave the studio
Speaker 2: because we're talking to the microphones. And if you're listening, Brad,
Speaker 2: God love you. I really respect you for that. He
Speaker 2: is diligent on it.
Speaker 1: So he's meeting his KPIs.
Speaker 2: Because he has taken and my policy is to like, Brad,
Speaker 2: get one for yourself, and he really does, but I
Speaker 2: really encourage him to get one result because I feel
Speaker 2: like a jerk making him go and get me.
Speaker 1: Mcflu myself because he's eaten Well, you've been chatting now TV.
Speaker 1: Apart from the catering, which I feel we've covered extensively,
Speaker 1: I feel that all questions have been answered everyone things
Speaker 1: and we'll have a little video of that. Apart from
Speaker 1: even mentioned obviously radio, which is where you and Andy
Speaker 1: Lee started and now you're working podcasting, and then there's
Speaker 1: been this hugely successful TV career running concurrent to that.
Speaker 1: Be an obvious question to say, how is it different?
Speaker 1: Because something that a lot of people talk about now
Speaker 1: is the fact that radio used to be a non
Speaker 1: visual medium. Now it is for you in terms of
Speaker 1: workload or just natural affinity, Is there a medium where
Speaker 1: you feel most at home?
Speaker 2: Great question. I mean, I think it's they're just different muscles,
Speaker 2: so and they're kind of like different sports, I suppose.
Speaker 2: So it's it is a little bit like, you know,
Speaker 2: you've got someone that's that really enjoys playing tennis, but
Speaker 2: then they also love netball. I would have to say,
Speaker 2: like I think, for for just pure flow, it is
Speaker 2: podcasting like and and what began is great a bit
Speaker 2: podcastings and even and even more refined, like you know,
Speaker 2: more of an analysa like a more refined serum of
Speaker 2: what radio is, because I think it comes down to,
Speaker 2: you know, you're ultimately doing it to for you know,
Speaker 2: enjoy creating moments and having a connection with your audience,
Speaker 2: which of course is what you go for in TV,
Speaker 2: or certainly an unscripted TV. You're like what Lego is,
Speaker 2: and a bunch of other shows are generally unscripted. You're
Speaker 2: trying to create something out of nothing, and that's a
Speaker 2: lot of fun. But there are there have to be
Speaker 2: so many moving parts in TV, and there has to
Speaker 2: be such a long production chain to get something on
Speaker 2: screen that just by the very nature of the length
Speaker 2: of that production chain, it can lose its excitement's spontaneity,
Speaker 2: and I think I just really love spontaneity. So you
Speaker 2: can do a lot of things to keep the magic
Speaker 2: for on camera, which we do both on Lego and
Speaker 2: then on you know, the other shows that we've done,
Speaker 2: but it's still that the distance from conception to execution
Speaker 2: can often be like weeks until you kind of that
Speaker 2: chance to do it, and that's fun, that's part of
Speaker 2: the work. That's just the nature of the beast. On podcasting,
Speaker 2: it really is a lot closer. You know that that
Speaker 2: sort of brain to mouth to ear connection is pretty instantaneous,
Speaker 2: Like you and I think that's really special, and you
Speaker 2: get to create that the most magical thing, which is
Speaker 2: to create a moment that then goes straight to a listener.
Speaker 2: And as you know from podcasting, like podcast listeners are
Speaker 2: the best just because it's by choice. It's so different
Speaker 2: to radio. And we obviously love all the people that
Speaker 2: joined us for the radio show and listened, and there
Speaker 2: was a large percentage of people you know that of
Speaker 2: course would make an appointment to listen to the show.
Speaker 2: But by and large, radio is a medium of convenience.
Speaker 2: It's like you're not getting in the car at four
Speaker 2: o'clock and hoping to find somewhere to go because you
Speaker 2: like the radio show.
Speaker 1: Some of your rested on fans.
Speaker 2: Some would and I really appreciate those people, and I
Speaker 2: was one as a kid too. I would stay in
Speaker 2: the car until six o'clock to wait till Martin molloyth finished.
Speaker 2: So there are those that make the choice radio first,
Speaker 2: life second. But by and large.
Speaker 1: Most people, yeah, you drive on the way, drive your.
Speaker 2: Kids up, and will happily keep your company while you
Speaker 2: do it, and so it's just that funny thing where
Speaker 2: with radio, someone could look your eyes and genuinely mean
Speaker 2: they could genuinely say to you, I really love your
Speaker 2: radio show. I listen every single day, or I don't
Speaker 2: listen to it all. We're on four to six Monday
Speaker 2: to Friday. That's ten hours when we were on radio.
Speaker 2: What they probably mean is on Monday he had like
Speaker 2: twenty five minutes. On Tuesday, maybe they got an hour Wednesday,
Speaker 2: possibly missed it and have forgot about that Thursday half
Speaker 2: an hour whatever. Those would be a high volume listener,
Speaker 2: but they're probably still only hearing about twenty percent of
Speaker 2: what you did that week, just because of life with podcasting,
Speaker 2: as you know, like people hear it all. And so
Speaker 2: our podcast listeners are the best because you don't have
Speaker 2: to ever reset anything. In fact, they remember more than
Speaker 2: you do about the show, and so you just end
Speaker 2: up with a much much deeper connection. And so we're like,
Speaker 2: it's the greatest fun in the world doing the Hamishinaity Podcast.
Speaker 2: We literally just get to turn up. The show kind
Speaker 2: of now is self sustains, like there's way more stuff
Speaker 2: coming into the show from our listeners and from like
Speaker 2: It doesn't rely on any sort of outside influence. You
Speaker 2: could record the show today, you could listen to the
Speaker 2: show today, you can listen to it in five years.
Speaker 2: It has nothing really to do with any topical events.
Speaker 2: And so it's in this beautiful little ecosystem that we
Speaker 2: just get to play with and it's the funnest part
Speaker 2: of our week. We're always like crying with laughter. We
Speaker 2: have the greatest time doing it, and you know, we
Speaker 2: win the ultimate prize, which is people enough people enjoy
Speaker 2: it that you get to keep doing it, which is
Speaker 2: kind of in entertainment, that's all you can hope for.
Speaker 2: If enough people enjoy it, you get to do it again.
Speaker 1: That's also obviously part of the success of Lego Masters,
Speaker 1: which is returning soon. Clearly enough people have enjoyed it
Speaker 1: that you get to get to it again because we've
Speaker 1: got a new season on the way. Your children are
Speaker 1: now six, six nine, so they're really getting into I
Speaker 1: imagine that real sweet spot for Lego because I've already
Speaker 1: mentioned my boys a bit older, they're twelve and fourteen.
Speaker 1: I remember very well the real peak Lego years.
Speaker 2: And it is and Lego knows that too as a company.
Speaker 2: And then they know that like quite a large percentage
Speaker 2: sort of drop away in teenage is and then they
Speaker 2: come back as adults. So there is actually officially from
Speaker 2: Lego I think called the Darkies, which I think is
Speaker 2: from like fifteen to like twenty because like a bunch
Speaker 2: of teenagers drop out. Other things get their attention, which
Speaker 2: I think we can all imagine. Yes, you'll remember what.
Speaker 1: Other things homework and that's history something.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yea, yeah, totally psychology. I wanted to better reading
Speaker 2: a lot of the Greek classics around then. And then
Speaker 2: you know, then you come back as an adult. So yes,
Speaker 2: my kids are on the sweet spot possibly. I mean,
Speaker 2: my little girl is six, so I've been doing Lego
Speaker 2: since she was born. This our sixth year of doing
Speaker 2: I've done more of Lego Musters than any other TV
Speaker 2: show I've ever done. I've done it for longer than
Speaker 2: we much longer than we do Gap Year or any
Speaker 2: of other stuff than Andy and I did. So it's
Speaker 2: sort of yeah, it's a really long time. It's it's
Speaker 2: accidentally become like a large chunk of my life and
Speaker 2: one hundred percent of her life. I've been this person
Speaker 2: that goes and plays in this shed full of lego,
Speaker 2: so it's probably skewed her idea of what lego is like.
Speaker 2: She has more exposure to it as the thing at
Speaker 2: dad's work than what I had as a kid, which
Speaker 2: was like just standing in the toy store and coveting
Speaker 2: it and not being able to have it until it
Speaker 2: was your birthday or Christmas. So possibly have ruined her
Speaker 2: in that sense because we do I mean, I know
Speaker 2: this is admitting to theft from work, but I do
Speaker 2: take a bit from the brick pit and bring it home.
Speaker 1: What kind of things do you take?
Speaker 2: Messed up now, So it's not a complicated. She's not like, hey,
Speaker 2: bring me home like six three by eight forty five
Speaker 2: degree plates or whatever. The technical hard to.
Speaker 1: Slip into your back pocket. Can'try.
Speaker 2: They're not building incredible things. They're like, Dad, give us
Speaker 2: bring home fifty of the baby lions. Because there's all
Speaker 2: the animals and stuff in the brick pit, and it's
Speaker 2: just too much for a kid to understand, like there
Speaker 2: are buckets of these because a lot of Lego sets're
Speaker 2: gonna get like one cute animal. It's not unusual for
Speaker 2: a kid to be like, I want that whole ski
Speaker 2: resort because it comes with.
Speaker 1: The small figuring.
Speaker 2: It comes with the kitten. So you's being like one
Speaker 2: hundred and thirty dollars to get the kitten, whereas in
Speaker 2: the brick pit they just lying around. So I'm getting
Speaker 2: a lot of like it's like, you know, you hear
Speaker 2: about those like you know, car theF syndicates from like Dubai,
Speaker 2: who are like, go steal this Porsche or whatever in America.
Speaker 2: That's what I get from my daughter. I get like
Speaker 2: a hit list of things to boost from the brick pit.
Speaker 2: But unlike the criminal syndicates, I sometimes have the guts
Speaker 2: to push back on the crime boss and go I'm
Speaker 2: not boosting fifty. Maybe maybe I can get you one
Speaker 2: by the end of the season.
Speaker 1: And that's why you are Father of the Year, because
Speaker 1: you're pushing back on the crime.
Speaker 2: I still model theft, but a more reasonable level of theft.
Speaker 1: Well, I'm just going to remind you that those little
Speaker 1: animals could come in very handy. By the time she's
Speaker 1: in year seven, you're doing your Egyptian Mummy. So I'm
Speaker 1: just saying it's a good longevity play, eternal life in
Speaker 1: all its bombs. If I say the word family viewing
Speaker 1: it sounds a little bit tweet, doesn't it Probably me.
Speaker 2: It reminds me if it's a knockout, which no one
Speaker 2: will remember.
Speaker 1: Oh I remember it's a knockout very well.
Speaker 2: But that's right.
Speaker 1: And it also even before TV became so fractured with
Speaker 1: the way that Australians are consuming content now, it's very
Speaker 1: hard to get people all in the one room watching
Speaker 1: a show together. But even if logistically you pull that off,
Speaker 1: it is I find in my experience as a mum,
Speaker 1: and I'm sure a lot of our business would feel
Speaker 1: the same just finding that content now that resonates. Lego
Speaker 1: Masters is genuinely one of those shows which is really lovely.
Speaker 2: And I take that now even more than I did.
Speaker 2: The stats the ultimate compliment because again, like season one,
Speaker 2: when people there were people that would give us that
Speaker 2: feedback because we're much younger and you know, like we
Speaker 2: were in like my boy was watching Bluey, which is
Speaker 2: family viewing as well. I mean, it's the best show
Speaker 2: in the world, but most of all, like I was like, well,
Speaker 2: my daughter's a baby, so we're not. I didn't really
Speaker 2: understand what a prize that would be. Now that I
Speaker 2: have older kids, I understand it a lot more. I'm like, yes,
Speaker 2: we're not all sitting down to watch Avatar the Last Airbender.
Speaker 2: As good as that show is, there are very few
Speaker 2: things and we're not making the kids stay up so
Speaker 2: that they can watch The Curse. So it's yeah, I
Speaker 2: really understand that a lot more so. That is a
Speaker 2: huge compliment that there could be a fun thing for
Speaker 2: certain families to actually kind of watch the show. And
Speaker 2: then the ultimate layer on top of that compliment is
Speaker 2: that people play Lego while they're watching the show. And
Speaker 2: then God, everyone's just pat themselves in the back, going,
Speaker 2: look at us, what great parents we are. The kids
Speaker 2: are doing something creative. We're all watching TV together.
Speaker 1: Job done. Feeling guilt.
Speaker 2: I think we're doing this.
Speaker 1: That we're doing it, that's a victory. You've been working
Speaker 1: on TV on and off for almost twenty years. You
Speaker 1: and Andy had your first sort of version of what
Speaker 1: was then The Hamish and Andy Show in March two
Speaker 1: thousand and five, so that what it was.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I always forget. Yeah, we'retty close.
Speaker 1: To twenty Yeah, just after nineteen years. That's a period
Speaker 1: of immense change for you personally, also the industry as
Speaker 1: a whole, which I'd like to ask you about in
Speaker 1: a moment. But for you, a rising radio star in
Speaker 1: your early twenties, now married father to multiple Gold LOGI
Speaker 1: winning TV host, how has your approach changed? Is there
Speaker 1: anything that you wish you knew then that you know?
Speaker 1: And was it more fun then? I mean, you've made
Speaker 1: it sound like it's a lot of fun now maybe, though.
Speaker 2: It's a good question. It's always a tricky It's always
Speaker 2: a funny thought experiment, isn't it, Because I think you
Speaker 2: kind of go around in circles because you're always like,
Speaker 2: why you wouldn't change anything, because then it would alter
Speaker 2: history and you're going to end up somewhere else. And
Speaker 2: I'm really I love the all the ups and downs
Speaker 2: because it kind of puts you right into this moment
Speaker 2: where you are now. So that aside, like you know,
Speaker 2: I'm not going to just get too existential on the question.
Speaker 2: I was trying to answer it properly. It's it's one
Speaker 2: of those things where I'm we were really lucky to
Speaker 2: begin when we began, Like I think even just to
Speaker 2: be in that era of TV, it would be much
Speaker 2: it would be a really different prospect now if we
Speaker 2: were those people as twenty two year olds or whatever
Speaker 2: we were, And the answer for anyone would be, of
Speaker 2: course you change, Like twenty years. I was like three
Speaker 2: years into my four years into being an adult, and
Speaker 2: now you know, as a forty two year old dad,
Speaker 2: you just of course you're diff Like you hope you
Speaker 2: change every year, let alone every two decades. So I
Speaker 2: would hope I'm a vastly different person, but that retains
Speaker 2: some of the same some of the same features, some
Speaker 2: of the same characteristics that we had when we were
Speaker 2: twenty two. I think I think it was really in
Speaker 2: terms of it being fun. I think it's I think
Speaker 2: that has been the sort of the north star on
Speaker 2: any project anyway, and I think you have to. There's
Speaker 2: just no rule book for TV or radio or podcasting
Speaker 2: or any creative pursuit, songwriting, whatever creative outlet people have.
Speaker 2: There's no like, there's no guarantees, there's no there isn't
Speaker 2: a rule. It sometimes makes sense in retrospect, like sometimes
Speaker 2: you could look at someone's trajectory and be like, oh,
Speaker 2: that was obviously the plan, but not really if you
Speaker 2: rewind to any particular moment, you're mostly just guessing and going, well,
Speaker 2: this feels like fun. Do we give it a go,
Speaker 2: and I think I think that's kind of only that's
Speaker 2: that's a pretty simple algorithm. But it's served us well
Speaker 2: to just sort of go, this seems like it contains
Speaker 2: the right amount of excitement, uncertainty, possible upside, acceptable downside.
Speaker 2: And then the questions always been does it fit into
Speaker 2: our lives at the moment, And obviously our lives have
Speaker 2: changed a great deal. But one thing I'm really proud
Speaker 2: of between and On and Eers, we've always been very
Speaker 2: clear with each other that, like, let's with this is
Speaker 2: really fun in its best form. The one thing that
Speaker 2: probably squashes this thing we have is it gets too
Speaker 2: we take on too much, or it gets too big,
Speaker 2: or one side of the equation is it's not working
Speaker 2: for them. So let's just always stay ahead of that
Speaker 2: and let's let's adapt before circumstances kind of break us.
Speaker 2: And so it's you know, the times we've wrapped up
Speaker 2: a TV show or kind of changed from radio to
Speaker 2: go into podcasting have always been because there was just
Speaker 2: something in the air that made us go, I think
Speaker 2: this will be more fun if we move in this direction.
Speaker 2: And thankfully, you know, twe years is a long time,
Speaker 2: like I thank it's worked to this to this extent.
Speaker 1: Well, it certainly has. It's always so interesting hearing people
Speaker 1: that have had great success in a certain field for
Speaker 1: a long time. And two decades is a long time
Speaker 1: in any industry, definitely in this industry. What what the
Speaker 1: guiding light was? I think I think fun, that's a
Speaker 1: great one.
Speaker 2: I think you've got to go with fun and just
Speaker 2: remember that you don't it's not a right, like you
Speaker 2: don't deserve a TV show. I've never felt that, well
Speaker 2: you don't. It's not you don't have the right to
Speaker 2: be on TV or like, no one owes it to you.
Speaker 2: So if it happens, that's great. And if it doesn't
Speaker 2: happen and you and you tried hard, that's fine as well.
Speaker 2: You know, the industries are like riddled with a bunch
Speaker 2: of luck and a bunch of things you can't control.
Speaker 2: So I also do think for anyone that has had longevity,
Speaker 2: I think it's your responsibility to acknowledge luck in the process,
Speaker 2: which isn't to say you didn't work hard, didn't try hard,
Speaker 2: didn't take risks, didn't put it on the line in
Speaker 2: a calculated way when you had to. You can do it.
Speaker 2: There are plenty of people that do all those things though,
Speaker 2: and it's just not there's a bunch of stuff out
Speaker 2: they control and it's bad timing. So I think you
Speaker 2: kind of owe it to the industry to go Anyone
Speaker 2: that ends up lasting a long time has to have
Speaker 2: had a certain amount of luck, plus the preparation and
Speaker 2: the hard working the other things that you also, I
Speaker 2: think do need to last.
Speaker 1: When you come back on and we do the bonus
Speaker 1: episode to discuss the existentialist conversation that you were tempted
Speaker 1: to go down, let's talk about luck as well, because
Speaker 1: I agree with everything, and I think it's such a.
Speaker 2: You have to because there are a lot of people
Speaker 2: out there that did everything they could in their power,
Speaker 2: and that's the brutal. You know, it's a very chancey industry,
Speaker 2: as you know, you've watched it, written about it, and
Speaker 2: it is unfortunately bit of a winner takes all too like.
Speaker 2: There's only a few few spots, and then there's plenty
Speaker 2: of people just underneath that who were just as good
Speaker 2: and for whatever reason it wasn't, it didn't happen.
Speaker 1: I love hearing it from somebody that is in a
Speaker 1: position to say a lux being an element because I
Speaker 1: often think because it was a little bit of verse
Speaker 1: sort of I want to get into generational warfare, but
Speaker 1: like a bit of verse, sort of a millennial thing
Speaker 1: going on for a while, where it was luck's got
Speaker 1: nothing to do with it. And I always think that's
Speaker 1: probably something that lucky people say. And I say that
Speaker 1: as someone that's also had periods of great lucky in
Speaker 1: my life, but say that to an unlucky person, that
Speaker 1: there's no such thing as.
Speaker 2: Luck exactly what I have. And I think there's a
Speaker 2: perception to like, if you say it's luck, then you're
Speaker 2: not like you're somehow discrediting any of the hard work,
Speaker 2: but that both are true, like you can two things
Speaker 2: can be big thing.
Speaker 1: And then for twenty years, as the industry as a whole,
Speaker 1: I know it would be tempting for me to put
Speaker 1: my sort of TV geek hat on here, so I
Speaker 1: try not to make it too industry, but i'd love
Speaker 1: to get your observations. Hamish talking a little bit about
Speaker 1: the landscape Lego Masters is dropping in twenty twenty four,
Speaker 1: and talked a bit about that splintering in those twenty years.
Speaker 1: I mean, you must have just seen such disruption, as
Speaker 1: have we all across all the genres, but specifically TV.
Speaker 1: You and Andy have recently been announced as ambassadors of Hubble.
Speaker 1: That technology alone. I mean, what does that say about
Speaker 1: the changing consumption? That's theory habits.
Speaker 2: I mean, it's a rapidly shifting world. And I think
Speaker 2: we all know. I mean everyone in everyone making TV
Speaker 2: is also a consumer, so everyone knows it from the
Speaker 2: consumption side, and there are periods in TV. I don't
Speaker 2: think we're in right now, but there have been patches
Speaker 2: in TV where you're like, I consume this really differently
Speaker 2: than the way we make it, And I think Hubble
Speaker 2: is a great example of something like that catching up.
Speaker 2: It's funny, there is a fair bit of full circle
Speaker 2: going on. But you know, Hubble is obviously made by Foxtel,
Speaker 2: who do Kale and Binge and and have the weight
Speaker 2: I suppose, or like the technological ability to do something
Speaker 2: like that. So in essence, if Hubble, the way I
Speaker 2: describe to people is if you've sat on the couch
Speaker 2: and you're like, why can't you just search for something
Speaker 2: rightout having to like jump in and out of apps
Speaker 2: and all that sort of thing. That is what hubble is,
Speaker 2: so it sort of brings everything back together. I think
Speaker 2: that's a great reflection of a technology kind of meeting
Speaker 2: people where they are on the couch going this is
Speaker 2: what we want, so you know, and that that is
Speaker 2: amazing too. When we think back to where we started,
Speaker 2: like you know, that first Hamishanity show two thousand and five.
Speaker 2: I think it was like you know, seven thirty or
Speaker 2: eight thirty at nine or something on Channel seven, and
Speaker 2: I remember we got when you're in TV. It's funny
Speaker 2: when you're in TV you care about the ratings, not
Speaker 2: that much, but to the extent like we talked about before,
Speaker 2: like if you rate high enough, you get to go again.
Speaker 2: It's not like you don't like a dollar for every
Speaker 2: rating or whatever. So no one. I never really understand
Speaker 2: whe people cared that much because I'm like, you know,
Speaker 2: well who cares? There's good stuff on. My question was
Speaker 2: always like can we keep doing it? And if the
Speaker 2: answer to that easy, yes, I kind of don't really
Speaker 2: care about ratings after that. But I remember back in
Speaker 2: that those Channel seven days we got acxed because we
Speaker 2: had fallen below like a an inconceivably low mark, which
Speaker 2: and this means nothing to anyone, because no one ever
Speaker 2: looks at the ratings except people that are in television
Speaker 2: or write about television. But there's back in those days,
Speaker 2: it was like your five city capital number had to
Speaker 2: be a million, and that was like minimum. This is
Speaker 2: in the days when Master Chef finales were doing like
Speaker 2: three million viewers and stuff, and like, you know, if
Speaker 2: Kathy Freeman had been cooking something while she's ratting one
Speaker 2: hundred meters, it'd be like a ten million viewer event.
Speaker 2: So the four hundred meters, so we'd like dropped to
Speaker 2: like under eight hundred thousand, and it was like, oh
Speaker 2: my god, that's almost no one watching. And then we
Speaker 2: dropped under six hundred. I think I think we we
Speaker 2: rate it in the six hundreds. And then the network
Speaker 2: was like the way it was, the way the mood was,
Speaker 2: it was like this is never like we cannot believe this.
Speaker 2: This has never happened in the history of television. We
Speaker 2: can't believe this is this is like every Formula one
Speaker 2: car crushing at once for a race, Like this is
Speaker 2: a disaster. So they're like, well, you know, we have
Speaker 2: to like we just can't, like there's no way, there's
Speaker 2: no way we could make money from something the six hundreds. Anyway,
Speaker 2: we laugh about that now because like, as you would know,
Speaker 2: that would easily be the most popular.
Speaker 1: So they're good numbers.
Speaker 2: That's like you're getting billboards for six like that's maths numbers.
Speaker 2: So we it's so funny. We look back, like the
Speaker 2: way it was sold was like, guys, you know, what
Speaker 2: have you done? Like you've absolutely shited the bed here
Speaker 2: like this, this is just unacceptable. But that kind of
Speaker 2: we always you know, that's the yardstick that now we're
Speaker 2: looking at going these days, that's a totally that's a
Speaker 2: celebrated number because there's just fine. I think there's like
Speaker 2: a new rating system this year that I haven't really
Speaker 2: looked into too much, but I know moving they know
Speaker 2: they're moving around to kind of reflect how people watch it,
Speaker 2: because for many years I was like, wow, like you know,
Speaker 2: catch Up should absolutely be included only, and I mean
Speaker 2: we're always biased about how you watch it at home,
Speaker 2: but I'm like, I'm never watching stuff at the time,
Speaker 2: but I still like it. So when people be like,
Speaker 2: you know, your show's rated this, and then later on
Speaker 2: we'll tell you how many people watched it on catch
Speaker 2: Up as if that doesn't matter. I'm like, well, I'm
Speaker 2: a catch up person and I love shows that I
Speaker 2: watch on catch up, so it's still it still matters.
Speaker 2: That's so that's a I think I think it's moving
Speaker 2: now to Fativa to reflect that, and there's like a
Speaker 2: new way to report numbers kind of includes all of that,
Speaker 2: but it kind of has to move in that way
Speaker 2: because that's that's how we're watching TV. Like it is
Speaker 2: a very I don't think my kids, I don't think
Speaker 2: our kids are our generation will ever understand when we're like,
Speaker 2: so the show's on at eight thirty, and if you're
Speaker 2: not there, you miss it.
Speaker 1: They get so straighted if something slow happens or they
Speaker 1: want to skip through a commercial or something. And then
Speaker 1: it's like, well, back in my day when I was
Speaker 1: Karen Cole to school, we had to sit there and
Speaker 1: you had one opportunity to watch it exactly on.
Speaker 2: One of things, on one of three pipes, I mean,
Speaker 2: or the ABC if it was the bill on a
Speaker 2: Saturday night.
Speaker 1: It's the is a fascinating in nineteen years that story
Speaker 1: of those ratings, and also the flip side of that
Speaker 1: is if that had happened today, that your show would
Speaker 1: have been getting clipped and the clips from that show
Speaker 1: of you and Andy would have been going viral on TikTok,
Speaker 1: and in addition to the catch up totally, there would
Speaker 1: have been a lot of talk ability around it.
Speaker 2: And that's the other thing too, Like I know we're
Speaker 2: here to pump up TV, but people people come into
Speaker 2: like it just so happens. Like, you know, we grew
Speaker 2: up in an air where TV was the option, Like
Speaker 2: there's no there was no YouTube. YouTube didn't coming two
Speaker 2: We've been in TV for like ten years, so there
Speaker 2: was no YouTube, no TikTok, no Instagram, there was no
Speaker 2: other way like the we did community TV first, and
Speaker 2: that like we thought we were the luckiest people in
Speaker 2: the world because we were allowed to film things and
Speaker 2: edit them and then you could see them back like
Speaker 2: and again. In a pool of probably tens of thousands
Speaker 2: of people that wanted to do that, we were some
Speaker 2: of the few dozen that were like allowed to be
Speaker 2: on community TV. So like we're like, oh, we've hit
Speaker 2: the jackpot here because we've got a chance to practice.
Speaker 2: But like now that is completely times a million available
Speaker 2: on your phone and kids just innately know how to
Speaker 2: film things, know how to edit stuff, know how to
Speaker 2: create because you kind of were like, it's it's there's entertainment,
Speaker 2: but there's also just attention. Like people know how to
Speaker 2: get attention now and that is really that's the game,
Speaker 2: and it's a TV show is one way to get attention.
Speaker 2: But you have to acknowledge your you're kind of you
Speaker 2: if you if you're someone that owns a TV which
Speaker 2: I'm not, but I'd be like, all right, we make
Speaker 2: a thing that is to try and get people's attention,
Speaker 2: but we're also battling against many other things that are
Speaker 2: trying to get people's attention, not just other TV shows.
Speaker 1: And we'll be back in a moment to find out
Speaker 1: from the man himself what really happened when Sonya Krueger
Speaker 1: made a joke about Hamish in her Gold Logi acceptance
Speaker 1: speech last year. Another thing that has reflected the rapidly
Speaker 1: evolving change and disruption of the TV industry is the
Speaker 1: Logi Awards, an Australian institution, and as I'm sure you
Speaker 1: have seen Hamish for our listeners that aren't across it,
Speaker 1: they've recently announced that they're changing the categories and essentially.
Speaker 2: Can you catch me up on this because I did
Speaker 2: hear whispers. I haven't looked into it yet.
Speaker 1: Yes, So in addition to doing my son's history assignment
Speaker 1: last night, I also did catch up on LOGI awards.
Speaker 1: So my understanding is that they are going to be overhauling.
Speaker 1: It used to be the most popular and the most
Speaker 1: outstanding categories, okay, And so the popular was obviously voted
Speaker 1: on by fans and the outsta was voted on by
Speaker 1: a jury of Australian TV industry professionals. The changes are
Speaker 1: being revolved to reflect the changing nature of the industry,
Speaker 1: and I would also assume the way that people consume
Speaker 1: content and they will actually be a hybrid of those
Speaker 1: and instead of most popular and outstanding, it will be.
Speaker 2: Best okay, So he's no more outstanding.
Speaker 1: Correct, Okay. Now the Gold Logi, which is obviously an
Speaker 1: award that you have won twice, that will still be
Speaker 1: presented under the most popular banner, with the nominees decided
Speaker 1: by independent industry experts and then voted on by the public.
Speaker 2: I think that's how I mean that's chopped and changed
Speaker 2: over the years, but I think that's how it was
Speaker 2: done in the last couple of years.
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know what this means for Tom Gleeson.
Speaker 2: I reckon there was some chobbing and changing off that
Speaker 2: because I might get this wrong, but and I've always
Speaker 2: had it, like just enjoyed this as a sport, right
Speaker 2: to watch, because they were like, all right, you can
Speaker 2: to vote for. The nominees used to be able to
Speaker 2: be like put someone forward, and essentially the goal logging
Speaker 2: nominees in quotation mark were just the people that had polled.
Speaker 2: Very complicated. I don't think it's ever been simple that.
Speaker 2: From what I remember, it was like the these are
Speaker 2: like the six people that have polled the highest thus far.
Speaker 2: We will now. It just makes me laugh because it's
Speaker 2: like it sounds like the Duckworth Lewis system always in cricket,
Speaker 2: or like how you decide to tie in a golf game.
Speaker 2: So it's like, we will now continue voting for one month. Again,
Speaker 2: I think for like everything's shut. Everything's now closed, and
Speaker 2: the nominee, say for Best Actor, almost popular Actor, the
Speaker 2: winner is already in there, but we're going to show
Speaker 2: you the top five people. But the winner has already
Speaker 2: pulled those votes. So everything shut except gold LOGI nominee
Speaker 2: these which will keep open and you can continue to
Speaker 2: vote for them. I don't know if you could vote
Speaker 2: if you've already voted or whatever. But and of course
Speaker 2: that's done by the Logi's like keep the interest up
Speaker 2: to the night what like. You know, it's not certainly
Speaker 2: not my place to overhaul the logis. It sounds like
Speaker 2: I tell you what it does take into account, you know,
Speaker 2: And I say this with two hats on. One is
Speaker 2: someone that has had people vote for them before, so
Speaker 2: you're grateful for the people that could be bothered doing that.
Speaker 2: But then also as someone who's sat at the logis
Speaker 2: and gone, well, the most popular show category was always
Speaker 2: an interesting category because you're like, we have a system
Speaker 2: for that. It's ratings, like that's that's kind of the system.
Speaker 2: We have little boxes and I don't know if anyone
Speaker 2: knows this or not, but we there's a system. You
Speaker 2: don't have to relog onto a website somewhere to confirm
Speaker 2: that you watched an episode of Survivor or whatever. So
Speaker 2: it has always that's always been a source of kind
Speaker 2: of like amusement amongst people to be like, how do
Speaker 2: you do this? How do you decide this? So it
Speaker 2: sounds like there's a mix of like ratings numbers and
Speaker 2: then people voting. Because I will say this, it's like
Speaker 2: whether you win, don't win, whatever, it's still like, I
Speaker 2: think it's great to have the logis when need you know,
Speaker 2: you have to have it's as an industry, it's great
Speaker 2: to have something. It's obviously better to have them than not,
Speaker 2: I think, to recognize there's much great work that happens.
Speaker 2: I'm not saying it doesn't. I don't need it doesn't.
Speaker 2: This is not me saying I want a LOGI this
Speaker 2: is me saying I think it's great, especially for crews
Speaker 2: and especially for teams that make shows, like it's a
Speaker 2: great moment of recognition for those people. But the voting
Speaker 2: system was always like you voted the highest, but it's
Speaker 2: not mandatory for strains to vote, like you voted the
Speaker 2: highest of the people that could be bothered voting, And
Speaker 2: that's a really different thing necessary. It's true, this is true,
Speaker 2: So I'd say that's what they're trying to address. So
Speaker 2: even with the gold loggie, again I say this with
Speaker 2: much gratitude for having people that could be bothered voting
Speaker 2: and for selecting me on those years. But again I
Speaker 2: think there was eight people. I think there's eight people
Speaker 2: that are up for the goal, and if you do
Speaker 2: the maths on that right, you could win if it
Speaker 2: was a very even race. You can win an eight
Speaker 2: horse race with thirteen percent of the vote. So again,
Speaker 2: I think you just have to keep it in context
Speaker 2: a little bit because I'm not like I definitely am
Speaker 2: not of the school that wants to stand and be like, yes,
Speaker 2: yes I got this, I knew it, I'm the best.
Speaker 2: I think you have to stay a little bit realistic
Speaker 2: to go technically. I could have won this with like,
Speaker 2: let's say, fifteen percent of those who voted, so I'm
Speaker 2: well aware there'd be like one hundred millions of people
Speaker 2: out there going I didn't vote for that guy. So
Speaker 2: it's lovely, but I think you have to kind of
Speaker 2: also keep it in context.
Speaker 1: It's like every election, isn't it. Every federal election, stay election,
Speaker 1: at least forty percent of the people voted for the
Speaker 1: something else and woman.
Speaker 2: I think that's why as Aussie is you have that
Speaker 2: reaction to be like, I don't vote for that, Like statistically,
Speaker 2: definitely the majority didn't vote for you. If you win
Speaker 2: the Gold Logie, like I would love you never get
Speaker 2: to see the numbers. But I would bet the farm
Speaker 2: that no one's everyone with fifty one percent of the
Speaker 2: vote in an eight person race. Interesting, there's just no way.
Speaker 1: No, no, no, no, you're right. That would be beyond
Speaker 1: time because then what would the other seven get?
Speaker 2: That's right, it would have to be I can't even
Speaker 2: think of anyone like that. It would have to be
Speaker 2: basically like Taylor Swift, who was like, oh come if
Speaker 2: you've wn't for me, and then she would win with
Speaker 2: like ninety eight percent.
Speaker 1: Maybe Taylor Swift will somehow wrangle on the generation for
Speaker 1: Gold LOGI twenty twenty four.
Speaker 2: I think it's it's great. It's obviously way above my
Speaker 2: pay grade. These are people that think about it a lot.
Speaker 2: I think we of course, like you know, it's great
Speaker 2: for the industry and for the people that make shows,
Speaker 2: especially to have a night and have the logis. And
Speaker 2: I love a big fan of tradition, and I like
Speaker 2: the idea that we can keep the tradition going. I
Speaker 2: think it's I think, by and large, if you had
Speaker 2: to pick between, do you would try and adapt to
Speaker 2: a more reflective system or do you just like steadfastly
Speaker 2: stay the same I think it's great that they're having
Speaker 2: a go at adapting.
Speaker 1: Yeah, same here and look big fan of the logis,
Speaker 1: love the logis. I used to work for TV weeks.
Speaker 1: Still don't really understand the voting. People used to ask
Speaker 1: me when I woke, But.
Speaker 2: It changed, right, It would change year on year, like
Speaker 2: the gold would change and correct.
Speaker 1: And then there was the year as you were just
Speaker 1: talking about where then the voting stayed open until very
Speaker 1: late because it used to close very very early on
Speaker 1: because TV we would go to print.
Speaker 2: Like I was actually speaking to someone. This probably won't
Speaker 2: get printed because it's it's from news Corp. But they said,
Speaker 2: like when I won the Gold Logi, they were like, well,
Speaker 2: you just won. You won the Gold Logi because back
Speaker 2: in the day, I can't remember what year it was, was
Speaker 2: around about twenty and eleven or twelve or something and
Speaker 2: Facebook was pretty new. They're like, you asked people to
Speaker 2: vote on Facebook and that's unfair. And I was like, yeah,
Speaker 2: like we put something on the Hami Shady page and
Speaker 2: most was like yeah, but isn't it like a popularity
Speaker 2: contest And they were like ye, but you use social
Speaker 2: media and that's that's a that's an unfair advantage for
Speaker 2: people that don't have social media. I'm like, all right,
Speaker 2: I said, hang on a sec. Didn't Channel ten didn't
Speaker 2: I see a full page ad in the newspaper for
Speaker 2: someone and I won't name who, but someone on Channel
Speaker 2: ten that year taken out like a full page ad
Speaker 2: because we put something very small up as a joke, right,
Speaker 2: because we're like, what a funny thing to be nominated
Speaker 2: for gold Loggie. So it's not like we ran a
Speaker 2: full fledged campaign, but we'd had mentioned something on social media.
Speaker 2: So I was like, didn't every Channel ten to take
Speaker 2: a full page ad? And they're like, yeah, but that's
Speaker 2: in the newspaper. I was like, you're not saying that
Speaker 2: my Facebook page is more powerful than a full page ad,
Speaker 2: are you, because like maybe we should sell our Facebook page.
Speaker 2: And then it got awkward and then then he was like, well,
Speaker 2: I just think the newspaper's fair because I was like,
Speaker 2: I really don't see the difference, to be honest. I
Speaker 2: was like and he was like, yeah, we just have
Speaker 2: so many people following you on social media. I was like, yeah,
Speaker 2: but again, isn't like the gold log.
Speaker 1: Paper is hopefully read by a lot of people too.
Speaker 2: I don't really understand the argument we're having here.
Speaker 1: I think the observation that campaigning or lobbying for a
Speaker 1: LOGI vote on social media has aged really well sizing that.
Speaker 2: Wouldn't you agree that's the hope of the whole hope
Speaker 2: of the logis is like, please campaign.
Speaker 1: I don't know what reported that was, but I feel
Speaker 1: like Tom Gleason just went up to them a couple
Speaker 1: of years after that and said, oh, my beer. Don't
Speaker 1: you think last year you did not win the Gold
Speaker 1: LOGI Sonya Krueger did. She of course made an acceptance
Speaker 1: speech where she I was about to say, attempted a joke,
Speaker 1: and I thought that sounds mean, but I think Sonya
Speaker 1: would be the first person to say I attempted a joke.
Speaker 1: It didn't go well. In fact, she actually addressed that
Speaker 1: whole incident a few weeks later in a column for Stella.
Speaker 1: Her words here, I tried to crack a few jokes
Speaker 1: that in my head were funny, but went down like
Speaker 1: a lead balloon with the equally exhausted audience. For people
Speaker 1: that don't remember, Sonia was talking about how Hamish, who
Speaker 1: a lot of people had assumed would win the Gold
Speaker 1: again would have been a back to back victory after
Speaker 1: winning the year previously. An agent and how the agent
Speaker 1: had been saying, people are a little over Hamish. The
Speaker 1: room was a bit going, what's going on here? And
Speaker 1: then she was clarifying, I'm just joking. It didn't really
Speaker 1: say that, Hamish. You of course, the camera cut to
Speaker 1: you as it does. You haven't won the goal, then
Speaker 1: this happens. What was going through your mind?
Speaker 2: I know, pause on a real confluence of unlucky events.
Speaker 2: I mean, first of all, I mean we've got to
Speaker 2: say this right at the top. I know she's joking.
Speaker 2: I don't care for I didn't care for two seconds,
Speaker 2: like I feel really bad that. I mean, the mood
Speaker 2: of the night of logies is like more and more
Speaker 2: the media are like, yeah, yeah, great, you guys all
Speaker 2: got together and gave each other awards. Who cares? Who
Speaker 2: messed up? We want to we want we need a scandal.
Speaker 2: And that is that's the reporting. No one's the media
Speaker 2: out there to be like this is lovely, you guys
Speaker 2: look great. All these like really privileged people should give
Speaker 2: each other awards and have an even better night. Don't
Speaker 2: care about that. So they're like someone's got to mess up,
Speaker 2: and unfortunately, like they were like, okay, that's it, like
Speaker 2: we we've decided like that's the bit, like we're going
Speaker 2: to jump on that, unbeknownst to me. Unfortunately, I just
Speaker 2: didn't care at all. So the unfortunately, I think the
Speaker 2: camera cut to me and I went for a joke
Speaker 2: of my own, which was pretend to be shocked, like
Speaker 2: doing sort of like a fake what like as in
Speaker 2: like I can't believe I'm hearing that my manager thinks this,
Speaker 2: and then laughing afterwards because I'm joking around with Andy
Speaker 2: and my wife sitting next to me. So but the
Speaker 2: camera had cut away by the time we're laughing at
Speaker 2: Sonya's joke. So to the rumor probably looks like okay,
Speaker 2: that's you know, that hasn't gone that well. But I
Speaker 2: didn't care at all. You got to remember in the room,
Speaker 2: it's often much different than like whatever an article decides
Speaker 2: is like okay, this is the scandal. Foolishly or not.
Speaker 2: I'd sometimes take like weeks off Instagram, so I just
Speaker 2: wasn't on social media. Like we finished the night and again,
Speaker 2: love that Sonya one. She deserves it. It was great.
Speaker 2: I wasn't I wasn't trying to, I wasn't campaigning. I
Speaker 2: didn't I would be very grateful to win, but I
Speaker 2: was not upset because that's the funny thing about the
Speaker 2: god loggire, like you don't don't, you don't enter, you
Speaker 2: don't ask to be nominated. It's just something that pops up,
Speaker 2: and if it happens, it happens. And if it's not,
Speaker 2: that's great to go to someone else. So yeah, I
Speaker 2: was like, great, we can go home. Like I went home.
Speaker 2: I when cuddled my daughter in bed, and I was
Speaker 2: actually sitting there thinking this is so nice. This is great.
Speaker 2: I get to like lie here, I don't have to
Speaker 2: I'm not doing media. I don't have to wake up
Speaker 2: in the morning do the today. Like there's again, I'm
Speaker 2: very grateful for the honor when it happens, if it
Speaker 2: ever happens, but there is a silver lining to not
Speaker 2: having to do media in the next day. So I
Speaker 2: was just having a final time. And then I didn't
Speaker 2: realize until probably a little bit later, like maybe late
Speaker 2: in the next day, and by that stage, like the
Speaker 2: new cyclic gone and I probably should have done the
Speaker 2: right thing. I was propaty should have posted something and
Speaker 2: said I don't care about this at all, but I
Speaker 2: just wasn't paying attention to it. So unfortunately for something
Speaker 2: like the blowback happened. And then I can't remember she
Speaker 2: e mailed me or I emailed her, but I kind
Speaker 2: of realized late that next day that she was copying
Speaker 2: heat for this, so I think I maybe emailed her
Speaker 2: and just went, Hey, if this is a bother, I
Speaker 2: don't care at all. I know what it's like to
Speaker 2: be up there. Your mind's racing, You're trying to think
Speaker 2: of something to say. People are exhausted, You're trying to
Speaker 2: think of something funny to say. We'd actually done that
Speaker 2: kind of Joe, We've been on fits in whipper earlier
Speaker 2: in the week, And I think she just was like,
Speaker 2: we did this joke earlier, let's go again. So from
Speaker 2: her perspective, I completely understood all the choices she made
Speaker 2: to be there, and I didn't care at all. Probably
Speaker 2: the only the thing I felt bad about was not
Speaker 2: having enough presence to go this could be a bit
Speaker 2: of blowback for us, so I probably have the chance
Speaker 2: here to snaffle that. For her, I wasn't really paying attention,
Speaker 2: so unfortunately she I would say like felt a really
Speaker 2: unnecessary amount of heat or pressure over that. To explain
Speaker 2: herself for what was I would say, at best, just
Speaker 2: a kind of a neutral thing to say, like, it's
Speaker 2: just everyone up on stage is gone for gags the
Speaker 2: whole night right. Some hit, some don't. It's not a
Speaker 2: big deal.
Speaker 1: After the break, I asked Kamish about being in a
Speaker 1: very different life stage to his longtime friend and collaborator
Speaker 1: Andy Lee. I will have to wrap up to him
Speaker 1: because I'm going to get you over to our cover
Speaker 1: shoot for Stella that is happening after this. You have
Speaker 1: been on the cover of Stellar a couple of times before,
Speaker 1: so has your wife Zoe. And in fact, do you
Speaker 1: remember that you photographed Zoey for a feature for Stella
Speaker 1: during lockdown? Of course, you and Zoe were living in
Speaker 1: Melbourne at the time with your family.
Speaker 2: It's amazing I remember it because it to transfer those photos.
Speaker 2: I love Heart of the Morning. You know you pick
Speaker 2: favorites in your photo of them. I love hearted all
Speaker 2: of them just so I could find them. But in
Speaker 2: my day to day life it's quite hard to earn
Speaker 2: a love heart. So when I go to that album
Speaker 2: and it's just always the kids, but it has to
Speaker 2: be like a real keeper. When I go to that album,
Speaker 2: you know, there's like select shots of holidays and moments
Speaker 2: from the kids, and then just like five hundred shots.
Speaker 1: I was a lot there, wouldn't there. I love that
Speaker 1: you've kept them there in the love heart well speaking
Speaker 1: of because.
Speaker 2: I mean, but can I ask you professionally please? They
Speaker 2: were not bad shots.
Speaker 1: They were absolutely I do.
Speaker 2: Like photography, and I was like, let's really try for this, honey.
Speaker 2: So I mean, she was great. She was an amazing
Speaker 2: model to work with, last model I shot. I think
Speaker 2: as a photographer, once you shoot someone that great, you're like,
Speaker 2: I can't beat that.
Speaker 1: That's true. It would be difficult to find somebody to
Speaker 1: top to shoot that. But maybe when she does her
Speaker 1: next Doellar cover you're shooting with Stephen she today, maybe
Speaker 1: cameras correct. You and Zoe will clock up twelve years
Speaker 1: of marriage this year. People have always been very invested
Speaker 1: in your relationship. Is that sweet or does it bring
Speaker 1: a bit of pressure because there's then that expectation that
Speaker 1: you have to live up to the fairy tale ideal
Speaker 1: of total strangers.
Speaker 2: I mean, to be honest, I never really think about
Speaker 2: that but I mean it's I suppose in their general sense.
Speaker 2: If people wish you, well, that's sweet. If people have
Speaker 2: an unrealistic hope or dream for you to be something
Speaker 2: that isn't isn't real, then I would say that probably
Speaker 2: that probably says more about them than us, and it's
Speaker 2: not something I think about a lot. You know, I
Speaker 2: would say the same thing anyone would say, which is
Speaker 2: just like you know, we every relationship is different because
Speaker 2: no people are different, and so the combination of two
Speaker 2: people is always going to be a unique thing. And
Speaker 2: so you know, you try the best you can. You
Speaker 2: have ups, you have downs, you work on things, you
Speaker 2: come back, you never really feel like you're nailing it,
Speaker 2: and then but you're always in there to keep going.
Speaker 2: And so I wouldn't say the other people's opinion of
Speaker 2: our relationship is anything that takes up too much mental
Speaker 2: space to be.
Speaker 1: Honest, possibly your other significant other, well my words, Andy Lee.
Speaker 1: We've talked a little bit about your long standing friendship
Speaker 1: and of course your professional partnership collaboration. He was on
Speaker 1: the of Stella in August twenty twenty two with his
Speaker 1: partner Rebecca Harding. We shot them on location in the mansion.
Speaker 1: Apparently it was.
Speaker 2: And it was.
Speaker 1: Look, it was a beautiful shoot. And Andy told Stella
Speaker 1: in the course of that interview that you and he
Speaker 1: were in different life stages. He said they as in,
Speaker 1: you and Zoe have got two little kids generally at
Speaker 1: dinner at six o'clock, whereas Beck and I eat about
Speaker 1: ten thirty pm. So even agreeing on a time to
Speaker 1: eat can be hard, not just with Hamish and Zoe,
Speaker 1: but with a lot of friends who were deep in
Speaker 1: that family time. So we find ourselves gravitating towards our
Speaker 1: younger friends or our gay friends. And in fact, Beck
Speaker 1: also was saying that for her in particular, there's this pressure,
Speaker 1: constant questioning to the two of them, when you're going
Speaker 1: to have kids, when a you're going to quote unquote
Speaker 1: settle down. I'm going to sneak in two questions here,
Speaker 1: What could you tell me about that life cycle?
Speaker 2: Because I'm aware I know life cycle, because I mean,
Speaker 2: we joke about this all the time of the podcast.
Speaker 2: He I mean, just to any parent reading this, like
Speaker 2: imagine every weekend he just wakes up after he's had
Speaker 2: enough sleep, Like what a wild concept? And if he's tired,
Speaker 2: how's this if he wakes up and he's tired, do
Speaker 2: you know what he does? He just goes back to
Speaker 2: sleep and he can because it's quiet because Beck's also asleep.
Speaker 2: That is wild. So yeah, I mean everything else like
Speaker 2: that is a clear indicator of what life cycle we're at.
Speaker 2: But he, you know, he does it well. Again, we're
Speaker 2: just I think the fun part about and and eyes.
Speaker 2: We're very different people but have that have found an
Speaker 2: amazing but on some levels, like we've never met anyone
Speaker 2: more similar, Like there are some parts of a personality
Speaker 2: but completely lock like lego if I may use a
Speaker 2: slight piece of cross promotion, but we're also extremely different pieces.
Speaker 2: So you know, there are this is actually a perfect analogy.
Speaker 2: There are some studs and anti studs that will go together,
Speaker 2: but we're like totally different pieces too. So that's the beauty.
Speaker 2: I think that's a bit of our relationship. I think
Speaker 2: with the bits that we do together, we're in complete lockstep,
Speaker 2: and we love that we have very separate lives too.
Speaker 1: I do love that analogy, and I think it's something
Speaker 1: that we talk to a lot of women on this
Speaker 1: podcast about, is that there's always an assumption that if
Speaker 1: you're in different life stages with someone. Recently, I had
Speaker 1: Pip Edwards and Julie Bishop on the podcast together in
Speaker 1: conversation and obviously they're different ages, live in different parts
Speaker 1: of the country, completely different backgrounds. But also Pip says,
Speaker 1: first and foremost, I'm a mum. Julie Bishop doesn't have children.
Speaker 1: For some people, especially the way we view women, that's
Speaker 1: seen as an obstacle that can't be overcome in a relationship.
Speaker 1: That's I think it's so important that we're calling bs
Speaker 1: on that stereotype.
Speaker 2: And I think that's the fun of life. You just
Speaker 2: have friends from all different walks of life. Now, for myself,
Speaker 2: I'll be like, yeah, first and foremost I'm a dad,
Speaker 2: but I love having a lot of mates. I would have,
Speaker 2: you know, a vast maship. I'd say probably a close.
Speaker 2: It's a pretty even split. I've either got you know,
Speaker 2: we got friends who've got kids the same age, and
Speaker 2: I think you fall into that that becomes easy because
Speaker 2: you're doing similar things. But then there's also plenty of
Speaker 2: mates that don't have kids, and I love those guys
Speaker 2: being in the kids' lives as well because I want
Speaker 2: them to see people of all and same with a
Speaker 2: lot of friends that come in that don't have kids,
Speaker 2: just because you, as a parent, you love your kids
Speaker 2: being exposed to good, fun, positive grown ups that are
Speaker 2: doing lots of different things that aren't all just kind
Speaker 2: of cut from the same cloth.
Speaker 1: And you're saying that your friendship can even withstand if
Speaker 1: you ever wake up at five am because a small
Speaker 1: child has come looking for some water or breakfast, and
Speaker 1: you're thinking, and it's probably only got into bed two
Speaker 1: hours ago, it's probably sleeping till noon. You can even
Speaker 1: withstand that jealousy. That's a solid friendship.
Speaker 2: I can and I'm very happy for him.
Speaker 1: Final question for you want to ask about how you
Speaker 1: decide what issues that you will or won't speak up on,
Speaker 1: because we're living in a time where certain public figures
Speaker 1: are like, how come you haven't commented on this political
Speaker 1: issue or you need to make some sort of statement
Speaker 1: of where you stand on the wall in Gaza You Hamishad,
Speaker 1: you're an ambassador for Food Bank Victoria. You've lent your
Speaker 1: voice to call on the federal government to fund twelve
Speaker 1: weeks of paid parental leave for fathers and non birthing parents.
Speaker 1: You recently posted about getting a skin check, what do
Speaker 1: you choose that you will or will not speak up?
Speaker 2: I think it's pretty good question. I think it's I
Speaker 2: don't think you can. I think you could if you
Speaker 2: started to go down that slope of like, well, if
Speaker 2: you say one thing about one thing, you then have
Speaker 2: to say something about everything. I think you've also got admit,
Speaker 2: like what do what? There are certain I think the
Speaker 2: general rule is, hey, if it comes into to your
Speaker 2: orbit and it's on your radar. And this would also
Speaker 2: have been like, you know, if you have the time
Speaker 2: that day, do you have the inclination has it? Because
Speaker 2: I'm not really personing on social media that much, so
Speaker 2: this would be a different question if I was like
Speaker 2: every day I sit down for two hours and I
Speaker 2: live stream what I'm thinking about. Different situation. But as
Speaker 2: I sort of said before, like it would probably be
Speaker 2: a false read about what does this person care about
Speaker 2: or not care about to just look at someone's social
Speaker 2: media because I do delete it for weeks and things
Speaker 2: are always happening and you're just not doing stuff on
Speaker 2: social media, I guess it doesn't get talked about. So
Speaker 2: for me, I'm like, I think you have to have
Speaker 2: a what for the things that you'd end up talking
Speaker 2: about you have a personal connection and or you have
Speaker 2: those several factors kind of aligned for a moment and
Speaker 2: you're like, all right, I think this could do some
Speaker 2: good in the world to lend your voice to this.
Speaker 2: But by the same time, it doesn't mean that then
Speaker 2: everything else you're against or you have no opinion on.
Speaker 2: I do also, I also think that there are some
Speaker 2: things where you're like, well, I don't think that's what
Speaker 2: my people are coming to my account for or looking
Speaker 2: to me to say, And I think there's value in
Speaker 2: that too. There are many many avenues we can get news, resources, facts,
Speaker 2: and for me personally, in my senses like, I don't
Speaker 2: I'm not rushing to take a stand on every on
Speaker 2: everything because I don't think I think that would be
Speaker 2: you know, to respond to people. I don't think that's
Speaker 2: necessary for me to do as a Just just because
Speaker 2: you happen to be on social media, I hope.
Speaker 1: You enjoyed that episode of the summer series or something
Speaker 1: to talk about. Make sure you're following us if you're
Speaker 1: not already, because we'll be revisiting some of your favorite
Speaker 1: episodes of the past year until we're back with the
Speaker 1: brand new episode on January twelfth,