Speaker 1: She loved my father. I hate what he's done. I
Speaker 1: hate the pain he's caused so many people. But knowing
Speaker 1: he's going to hear my boys say these things, I
Speaker 1: know he'd be listening. I wish you'd understand how hurt
Speaker 1: I am and how much I wish he'd made different decisions,
Speaker 1: and how that if he could do all this and
Speaker 1: still have my love, like it wouldn't have taken much
Speaker 1: just to be a decent human being, and he'd help
Speaker 1: me and my kids in his life and we would
Speaker 1: have worshiped him. She'd just confess and let this will
Speaker 1: be done, and lot it. Let it stop affecting me.
Speaker 1: I was seventeen and this has chased me my entire
Speaker 1: adult life. It affects my kids, It affects every single
Speaker 1: aspect of my life. And I knew this podcast would
Speaker 1: happen one day, and I just wish he would give
Speaker 1: Christian Anne the justice and the truth that they deserve.
Speaker 2: I'm Ashley Hanson and you're listening to episode thirteen of
Speaker 2: Dear Rochelle, a podcast by True Crime Australia. This is
Speaker 2: the untold story of Rochelle Charles, a twenty three year
Speaker 2: old who was brutally murdered. Her killer has never been caught.
Speaker 2: This is the first of a two part interview with
Speaker 2: Kevin Stephen Corell's daughter as Now, she has some pretty
Speaker 2: strong beliefs about her father, particularly in relation to historic
Speaker 2: allegations for which she's been found not guilty. Jazz also
Speaker 2: believes her dad murdered Rochelle. These are only Jazz's opinions
Speaker 2: about her dad. She's come to these views through a
Speaker 2: combination of her own interactions with her father and witnessing
Speaker 2: his relationships with other people, including both of his ex wives,
Speaker 2: the first being her mother. This of course, doesn't make
Speaker 2: it proof of Kevin's guilt of any offenses. These are
Speaker 2: only Jazz's opinions, and in fact, you will hear Jazz
Speaker 2: say she doesn't have any evidence that her dad committed
Speaker 2: these crimes, but we think it's important for you to
Speaker 2: hear her story. By the way, Jazz is her nickname
Speaker 2: and for privacy reasons when not using her full name.
Speaker 2: Kevin Carrell strenuously denies any involvement in Michelle's murder.
Speaker 3: And has never been charged.
Speaker 2: He has willingly participated in three records of interview with
Speaker 2: police and provided his DNA to investigators. A coroner presiding
Speaker 2: over Rochelle's inquest made an open finding.
Speaker 3: How would you describe your relationship with your father now.
Speaker 1: We've been estranged about four or five years. There's been
Speaker 1: minimal contact between us. There was health concerns where we
Speaker 1: exchanged a few text messages that were civil, and I
Speaker 1: had concerns about him. But yeah, it's you know, I
Speaker 1: think after this his release, I don't think we'll ever
Speaker 1: speak again. And I'm okay with that. I don't. I
Speaker 1: feel like I'm hurting him right now, and it's not
Speaker 1: what I want to do. It's just I feel like
Speaker 1: I have to. I have to help with this because
Speaker 1: it's been twenty four years of them not knowing. And
Speaker 1: I'm sure my dad would understand. I actually I lost
Speaker 1: my oldest daughter in two thousand and nine under very
Speaker 1: different circumstances. But if there was someone responsible, which I
Speaker 1: wasn't as medical reason, but if there was someone responsible
Speaker 1: and they debated justice for a minute, I would be
Speaker 1: smashing the world up. And it's just it's not okay
Speaker 1: that and Christie are still fighting for justice. I think
Speaker 1: it's so wrong, and I would hope that my dad
Speaker 1: with the grief we experienced in the loss of my daughter,
Speaker 1: would understand that that's not okay for that family to
Speaker 1: still be going through this if someone needs to pay.
Speaker 1: Rochelle died violently, and I can't imagine being in their
Speaker 1: shoes how that must feel. You know, there's no one
Speaker 1: to blame for my daughter's death, but it's so unjust.
Speaker 1: It's so unfair, and to have someone that you know
Speaker 1: cause that horrificing to Rachelle. It's just so wrong that
Speaker 1: they've walked free for twenty four years.
Speaker 3: What's prompted you to speak out now?
Speaker 1: I feel like I have some insight when I hear
Speaker 1: certain things being said about my dad, some very true.
Speaker 1: I think most of the things that have been said
Speaker 1: about him by people who know him, I believe them wholeheartedly.
Speaker 1: The best chance at getting him is for people to
Speaker 1: really know who he is, and I think I'm probably
Speaker 1: one of the best people to explain who he really is.
Speaker 3: A few of.
Speaker 1: Those years he was protected in people's belief that wouldn't
Speaker 1: have it in his life if he did this, and
Speaker 1: I feel guilt for that. I also want it known
Speaker 1: that I don't defend him.
Speaker 2: Anymore Before we get into that. Who are you? What
Speaker 2: would you like people to know about you?
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 1: I feel like a very boring person Outside of this.
Speaker 1: I'm a mum of five amazing children. I work in
Speaker 1: community services, and I'm very passionate about a lot of things,
Speaker 1: human rights and feminism and yeah, I think my dad,
Speaker 1: being who he is, has shaped a lot of who
Speaker 1: I am.
Speaker 3: How is your dad shaped you?
Speaker 1: I don't think there's anyone who's been more influential who
Speaker 1: I am as a person. I think you can trace
Speaker 1: every single detail about who I am. Every fiber of
Speaker 1: my being comes from him. Whether it was the things
Speaker 1: I didn't like I became staunchly against. For example, my
Speaker 1: daddy is very He's racist and homophobic and things like that,
Speaker 1: so I am staunchly against those things. Being that my
Speaker 1: dad can't seem to tell the truth. It's very important
Speaker 1: to me. Honesty and accountability are probably the biggest things
Speaker 1: for me, and that's how I've raised my children. Accountability
Speaker 1: is so important that you know, I never told my
Speaker 1: kids that Santa was real, or the Easter money was real,
Speaker 1: or anything like that, because I wanted my kids to
Speaker 1: know that they could always believe every single word I
Speaker 1: ever said to them, which is something I've never had
Speaker 1: with my dad. Everything he ever said, good and bad,
Speaker 1: I never knew what was real and what was true.
Speaker 1: Even the good things like him saying he was proud
Speaker 1: of me. I didn't know if that was real. I
Speaker 1: didn't know if his love was real. And I think
Speaker 1: the only way that you can achieve that with your
Speaker 1: kids is to always be honest. So I didn't want
Speaker 1: them to ever think I'm lied about this And yeah,
Speaker 1: so it's it's shaped who I am, especially as a
Speaker 1: parent and the things that are important to me. I
Speaker 1: can't ever undo the harm my dad has caused his
Speaker 1: many victims, But I think because I couldn't speak out
Speaker 1: for so long, this is why it's shaped my life.
Speaker 3: To you, who is Kevin Correll? Do you love him
Speaker 3: like a father?
Speaker 1: So many of my friends were so envious of my
Speaker 1: relationship with my dad. Most people who met my dad
Speaker 1: love my dad.
Speaker 2: You know he was.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I often had a lot of friends saying they wish
Speaker 1: they had a relationship with their father's the way I
Speaker 1: did with mine. Yet underneath I knew that he was
Speaker 1: more start too. I've never been able to reconcile those feelings,
Speaker 1: and I feel a lot of guilt and shane that
Speaker 1: I've contributed it to him having twenty four years of
Speaker 1: good memories he didn't deserve to have. There was a
Speaker 1: long time, For a long time, I tried to have
Speaker 1: hope that he didn't do these things. Deep down, I knew.
Speaker 1: I've always known, not in any way that I have evidence,
Speaker 1: I just I knew he did this, So I knew
Speaker 1: he's done a lot of other things. But there was
Speaker 1: a hope, as his daughter, this is someone who experienced
Speaker 1: his love. There was a hope that it was all
Speaker 1: wrong and everyone had it wrong.
Speaker 3: But I don't know that's that's.
Speaker 1: A fairy tale.
Speaker 3: You said that you'd seen the evil Father is capable
Speaker 3: of Do you have any memories of that?
Speaker 1: I remember him hurting my stepmotherw do you remember that
Speaker 1: my mother had told me that he never hit her.
Speaker 1: I'd witnessed my mum being terrified of him my entire life.
Speaker 1: She was terrified. He's always scared her. He's still scares
Speaker 1: her now. I remember being at a party and there
Speaker 1: was an accusation that she was talking to someone that
Speaker 1: my father wasn't happy about, and we were told to
Speaker 1: get in the car, and as we were in the car,
Speaker 1: I remember that she was banging on the car window
Speaker 1: and she had blood all over her face and she's crying,
Speaker 1: and he got in the car and left her there.
Speaker 1: Outside of that, there was a violent explosions. Ever, I
Speaker 1: sensed people's fear. I also saw a lot of people
Speaker 1: be compliant with his lies. And that's the one thing
Speaker 1: that it wasn't ever taught. He never told me that
Speaker 1: I had to go along with anything. He did the
Speaker 1: same thing to my kids. No one ever said you've
Speaker 1: got to go along with lies, but everybody did. And
Speaker 1: when you see everyone compliant to someone, you know, it's
Speaker 1: natural that we will call out a lie when we
Speaker 1: hear it. But with my dad, everyone falls into line.
Speaker 1: And I don't know how, And I think that's only
Speaker 1: that dynamic is only possible when you're fearful. I can't
Speaker 1: explain how it came to be that dynamic. He wasn't
Speaker 1: controlling in the sense that anyone else would describe controlling.
Speaker 1: But I know when you weren't compliant or you didn't
Speaker 1: act a certain way, he punished you in a way
Speaker 1: that you couldn't speak to me because you just look crazy.
Speaker 1: It was sinister, it was calculated. It maybe long after
Speaker 1: the fact, but there was a passive, aggressive way in
Speaker 1: which you'd be punished for stepping out of line. As
Speaker 1: I said, he never raised his hand, he never raised
Speaker 1: his voice. He's a very calm father, but definitely would
Speaker 1: not describe him as an agro father. He was very calm,
Speaker 1: very loving unless she displeased him.
Speaker 3: Tell me about the good times from your childhood.
Speaker 1: I don't know why, but the good times are harder
Speaker 1: to talk about than the bad times. I think because
Speaker 1: in this environment, telling people he's evil is easier for me,
Speaker 1: because I want to support Rochelle. Talking about how much
Speaker 1: I love my dad and the good things that most
Speaker 1: people wouldn't know feels horrible, and I've lost the ability
Speaker 1: to feel good about cherish memories I had with my dad.
Speaker 1: He was my dad's probably the funniest man I've ever known,
Speaker 1: and I hate saying that, and I don't want people
Speaker 1: to think he's a good person who deserves to be defended,
Speaker 1: because I defended him for so long, and but he
Speaker 1: so funny. He was so much fun, you know. We
Speaker 1: always joked that he was the fifth Wiggle and he
Speaker 1: was always running around playing games, making up games. He
Speaker 1: spoiled us right, and we went there once a fortnight
Speaker 1: and he had two days and he would f every
Speaker 1: last minute with Funt. I loved going to my dad's
Speaker 1: so I was, you know, daddy's little girl, and some
Speaker 1: of my best childhood memories and with my dad. I
Speaker 1: loved him. I still too.
Speaker 3: That's why this interview must be so difficult for you
Speaker 3: to do.
Speaker 1: I think knowing he's going to hear this, you know,
Speaker 1: I've talked about these things with people and the harburst
Speaker 1: so many times throughout my life, and it's got to
Speaker 1: a point where I can be stone cold clinical and
Speaker 1: this happened, and this happened, and this happened. I don't
Speaker 1: think it's fair. I think he got twenty four years
Speaker 1: that he didn't deserve, and I gave them to him.
Speaker 1: You know, my dad's entire life has been me and
Speaker 1: my kids for the last twenty four years. I gave
Speaker 1: him those years. And I feel a lot of guilt shame,
Speaker 1: and I think he's just he's been very lucky and
Speaker 1: it's time to let it go. It breaks me that
Speaker 1: Graham past without without the justice he deserved for Rachelle,
Speaker 1: for everything I could see.
Speaker 3: He was a wonderful father. He loved his daughter.
Speaker 1: And she was taken from him as the cruelest thing imaginable.
Speaker 1: And I just wish my dad would be accountable as
Speaker 1: a father. He's at certain periods in my life. He
Speaker 1: loved me very well, and he loved my children. But
Speaker 1: to me, my father is jacqualine height. He's caused us
Speaker 1: so much pain.
Speaker 3: How hurtful could he get?
Speaker 1: Uh? He once said it was my fault that my
Speaker 1: daughter died, that I was a negligent mum, and that
Speaker 1: I must have loved it because of the attention I got.
Speaker 1: He Uh, yeah, it was mainly attacking me as a mother.
Speaker 1: I do often say that, you know he was gonna
Speaker 1: go for custody of my kids and take them off me.
Speaker 1: I don't know, hide from the fact that I have.
Speaker 3: Had a lot of problems over the years, and.
Speaker 1: My kids have gotten through a huge amount of significant trauma.
Speaker 1: I was not by or abusive. I was neglectful because
Speaker 1: some days I couldn't get out of pen and my
Speaker 1: kids suffered because of that. And that's another reason I
Speaker 1: let him in their life, because the same thing he
Speaker 1: provided when I was a child, he was fun. He
Speaker 1: was My children worshiped him. I never relied on my dad,
Speaker 1: but he would step up. He would turn up every
Speaker 1: Friday afternoon and now I'm going to take the kids here,
Speaker 1: and I'm going to do this, and I'm going to
Speaker 1: do that. And I needed that with what was going
Speaker 1: on in my life. Was not in a good way
Speaker 1: in the early years of life, just trying to hurt
Speaker 1: me as much as possible, and he there was nothing
Speaker 1: that was too low for him. And then yeah, it
Speaker 1: was like it was all forgotten. But on those occasions
Speaker 1: that he brought it up, he would like our past fights,
Speaker 1: and he would bring up that, you know, he didn't
Speaker 1: kill Rochelle, and I'd apologized that I had said those things,
Speaker 1: but he never apologized to me for any of that
Speaker 1: and never got a sickle apology. He's never been able
Speaker 1: to be accountable. If I talked to him about my pain,
Speaker 1: it was always, you know, even when I accused him
Speaker 1: of killing Rochelle, it was always when we discuss it later,
Speaker 1: it wasn't denials of doing it. It was that I
Speaker 1: was the horrible person for accusing him, and he always
Speaker 1: turned it around that I was evil and I was horrible,
Speaker 1: and I was cruel. He never acknowledged anything he ever did.
Speaker 3: Did he play the victim?
Speaker 1: Always? Always I was cruel, I was horrible. The papers
Speaker 1: were against him, the policeman was after him because see
Speaker 1: you heard his daughter. My dad, whenever backed into a corner,
Speaker 1: was the victim. You know. That's the only time I'd
Speaker 1: see my dad make himself vulnerable. But it was make
Speaker 1: believe it was an act so you would feel sympathy.
Speaker 1: A text message I received probably about two years ago
Speaker 1: where he acknowledged a lot of things he didn't. He
Speaker 1: didn't fully acknowledge it, but he said he was sorry
Speaker 1: for the ways he had let me down, which is
Speaker 1: I never got anything like that in my life from him.
Speaker 1: There was never any acknowledgment of anything. There was no
Speaker 1: apologies for anything until that text message, and it rowed
Speaker 1: me apart to the point I couldn't function for weeks
Speaker 1: because I needed it for forty one years. But yeah,
Speaker 1: his cruelty was mostly passive aggressive. I remember he used
Speaker 1: to record my boys and there'd be a bribe in
Speaker 1: it for them and they'd explain, but he would get
Speaker 1: them to record videos saying we don't want to live
Speaker 1: with him, but we want to live with path And
Speaker 1: I knew it was because I stood up to him
Speaker 1: with some racist comment or some whenever he saw my fistyess.
Speaker 1: He hated that. He hated that I'm passionate as me
Speaker 1: because I am as a person when it comes to
Speaker 1: my values, I am very feisty and I stand up.
Speaker 1: I can stand up for other people, just not myself.
Speaker 1: And standing up to him was hard in regards to me.
Speaker 1: But I could stand up to the other things that
Speaker 1: he said and did, and I could see how angry
Speaker 1: he'd get. He'd have a smile on his face and
Speaker 1: he'd be normal. Yeah, that would be my punishment for
Speaker 1: things like that. Or he often barred mouthed me to
Speaker 1: my children. He would encourage them to make racist comments,
Speaker 1: gay joaks, things like that, and challenge at masculinity. When
Speaker 1: they didn't, it was almost a taunting that really toxic.
Speaker 1: You know, to be a man, you must be these things.
Speaker 1: And yeah, it's definitely affected my kids.
Speaker 3: From what you've witnessed with your dad. How does he
Speaker 3: attract women?
Speaker 1: He's very charming, charismatic, he uses humor, he's like, he's
Speaker 1: very critical of other men. I think my dud views
Speaker 1: or other men as competition. It's very rare that he
Speaker 1: had close relationships with men. There were a few few
Speaker 1: friends he had. You know, he would criticize that. You know,
Speaker 1: men want to go to the pub and drink and
Speaker 1: they don't get up and dance. My dad will get
Speaker 1: up and dance with anyone. He's always the life of
Speaker 1: the party. He's not been a big drinker throughout my life.
Speaker 1: I've seen him drink a handful of times and know
Speaker 1: and only get tipsy drunk maybe once or twice. He
Speaker 1: needs to always be in control. He would use me
Speaker 1: and my children. And when I say use, you know,
Speaker 1: I think some of the love he had for me
Speaker 1: and my kids was entirely genuine. But he knew that
Speaker 1: that attracted people. That he was loving doating father and grandfather,
Speaker 1: and yeah, women I saw them idolize him. Like It
Speaker 1: still blows my mind that my father, though, gets the
Speaker 1: women he gets. They are all not only pure in heart, intelligent,
Speaker 1: loving and kind women. They're all drop dead gorgeous. And
Speaker 1: one look at my father, you go, how and yeah,
Speaker 1: he just wins them over. He lies a lot. I
Speaker 1: used to get very annoyed, you know, his friends had
Speaker 1: mentioned stuff like, you know how he bought me a car.
Speaker 1: My dad never bought me a car. I was paying
Speaker 1: it off myself. But he didn't have to lie about
Speaker 1: what he did for me. He could have just told
Speaker 1: them what he did and people would still think he
Speaker 1: was wonderful. But instead he would say that he was
Speaker 1: practically raising the kids, that I wasn't coping, and my
Speaker 1: dad was paying all my bills and he bought me
Speaker 1: a car and doing everything. Now, I understand people like
Speaker 1: to talk themselves up and want people to see them
Speaker 1: as some sort of hero, but I don't know why
Speaker 1: he had to speak about me in such a degrading way.
Speaker 1: If I saw one of my children struggling, I would
Speaker 1: just want to be there and help fix it. My
Speaker 1: dad never, through those times, ever came and such as
Speaker 1: what you need, how do I help, never try to
Speaker 1: get me any help.
Speaker 3: He used it for his advantage. You're describing a man
Speaker 3: who some might think grooms people.
Speaker 1: Yes, that's one hundred percent grooming, and somehow he grooms
Speaker 1: others to help him. How so he's never told me
Speaker 1: what I'm supposed to do. But I know I can't
Speaker 1: explain that phenomenon. I don't know how that happens.
Speaker 3: Can you think of an example that might explain it.
Speaker 1: When there was an audience that I knew, we had
Speaker 1: to act like the closest dad and daughter in the world.
Speaker 1: So we might be preparing for a party and he
Speaker 1: barely acknowledges me, and you know, he might have the
Speaker 1: shits with me, and yeah, there was nothing. He wouldn't
Speaker 1: describe us as close at all as then when people arrived,
Speaker 1: he lived his whole life for me. I was the
Speaker 1: most beautiful girl in the room. Introduced me to everyone,
Speaker 1: this is my beautiful daughter, even though he say things
Speaker 1: behind my back that fed into it that my daughter
Speaker 1: has all these problems, but I lift her up. He
Speaker 1: didn't do that for anything else other than the audience
Speaker 1: that were watching, because they think she's got all these problems,
Speaker 1: and look at the way he builds her confidence. And
Speaker 1: I would immediately play into it. I saw partners go
Speaker 1: along with it when he would tell stories. I remember
Speaker 1: one partner who sat there through a story. They had
Speaker 1: gone on a cruise at dinner cruise and he was
Speaker 1: telling us at Christmas about this guy getting belligerent and
Speaker 1: causing a scene. And my dad said, you know, he
Speaker 1: helped kick him off the boat, and my dad got
Speaker 1: in a fight with this guy, and then his partner
Speaker 1: told me when he walked away that there was the
Speaker 1: belligerent guy on the dinner cruise. And all of that
Speaker 1: happened except the part that my dad was involved. He
Speaker 1: didn't get up from the table, but she went along
Speaker 1: with his story that he was telling him that he
Speaker 1: was with her. He was fully aware that she knew
Speaker 1: everything he was saying was a lie.
Speaker 3: She was there, but.
Speaker 1: We'd all do it, we'd comply. I started noticing my
Speaker 1: kids do it, and that's when it really hit me,
Speaker 1: because it was okay for it to be normal for me.
Speaker 1: When I saw that one of my sons was punished
Speaker 1: because he was less compliant than the others. He would
Speaker 1: be treated in a very passive, aggressive way. He would
Speaker 1: be punished in weird, sinister ways, in a normal way
Speaker 1: that you would punish a child. It was psychological. It
Speaker 1: was making him feel less than his brothers. It was
Speaker 1: something I could accept for myself, but not for my sons.
Speaker 3: What about the sinister lies? How deep do they go?
Speaker 1: He always has a story to justify anything I didn't,
Speaker 1: So I was about twelve, when my parents were sort
Speaker 1: of arguing for custody of me and a so when
Speaker 1: I found out a lot of her family secrets and
Speaker 1: found out about my dad's history, Dad got out in
Speaker 1: front of it and told me himself. He also told
Speaker 1: me some stuff about my mum trying to me against her.
Speaker 1: Thankfully mum had already told me. But as I said,
Speaker 1: never bad moused him and he told me that in
Speaker 1: the eighties he had been accused of a rape. I
Speaker 1: only knew of one rape. And he said that he
Speaker 1: was seeing a girl who was the daughter of a
Speaker 1: police officer and he had cheated on her. And he
Speaker 1: sat there and almost welled up and said, you know,
Speaker 1: I don't want to be that person. I know my
Speaker 1: dad's been unfaithful to every partner. He said, I know that.
Speaker 1: You know that makes me a really bad person. But
Speaker 1: she got angry and her father had me arrested for rape.
Speaker 1: They didn't have the SS, so this was a story.
Speaker 1: I was fed about his rape charge. I also knew
Speaker 1: there was another. I knew there was a case of
Speaker 1: armed robbery because my mum's brother was my father attempted
Speaker 1: to frame my uncle Greg for it. I knew that
Speaker 1: from my mum's family. I'd heard bits and pieces, no
Speaker 1: one went into details with me. I never knew that
Speaker 1: was an attempted rape. When I heard the full version
Speaker 1: of that, that flawed me. I haven't been able to
Speaker 1: turn off anything relating to the podcast. I follow everything.
Speaker 1: I am constantly on Facebook watching everything that he has said,
Speaker 1: and I knew I shouldn't have listened to the podcast before.
Speaker 1: So it was episode five and at the end I
Speaker 1: heard the snippet of two rape victims or the attempted
Speaker 1: rape victim and the punch bowl one.
Speaker 4: So the knock at the door, I opened it and
Speaker 4: it was ban instant melaclava. The knife was held up here.
Speaker 4: He pushed me back. I was walking down the hall
Speaker 4: to reassue him the lounge room and that he pulled
Speaker 4: a knife on me. He just came straight at me
Speaker 4: and it was just closed hard fists. Proceeded to tell
Speaker 4: me that if I didn't do what he said, he
Speaker 4: would kill my kids, and I just went down. It
Speaker 4: was like I just went smacked down on the bed.
Speaker 4: I did what he said and he read me. I
Speaker 4: remember thinking, holy shit, I'm going to die.
Speaker 1: And I got to work. I was violently ill. I
Speaker 1: had to leave work, and my son left work as well.
Speaker 1: He wasn't doing well. My mum had told me bits
Speaker 1: and pieces. She knew nothing of it being a police
Speaker 1: officer's daughter or anything like that. I had suspicions that
Speaker 1: it was more than what he said, because I knew
Speaker 1: he was a liar, but I didn't know how how
Speaker 1: many it had happened. But specifically when I heard the
Speaker 1: Gold Coast Model story, when I realized the arm robbery,
Speaker 1: the way he tried to frame my uncle Greg, I
Speaker 1: knew he tried to frame him and he left the
Speaker 1: business card. I'd heard that story so many times, but
Speaker 1: one thing that really really stuck out to me in
Speaker 1: that podcast was the way she described he kept saying
Speaker 1: money for drugs, money for drugs, and it showed me
Speaker 1: how sinister he was. My dad is completely anti drugs.
Speaker 1: He's never touched anything. He views marijuana use as the
Speaker 1: same as heroin use. He thinks it's all disgusting, completely
Speaker 1: anti drug But my uncle was a smoker. My dad
Speaker 1: would have viewed him as disgusting for that reason, and
Speaker 1: my uncle was a lovely man. He's passing. Yeah, it
Speaker 1: made me realize that he went in there, and he
Speaker 1: was so intent on setting up my uncle that he
Speaker 1: made out it was for drugs. And that's how sinistery get.
Speaker 1: And you know, when you go back to the fingers like,
Speaker 1: I think that's the biggest mistake he made that he
Speaker 1: was telling all of us, not realizing how much that
Speaker 1: was going to backfire on him. But yeah, I think
Speaker 1: he fully thought that his charm would make people not
Speaker 1: suspect him.
Speaker 3: Have you heard him bad mouth women in general?
Speaker 1: Yes? Always?
Speaker 3: What are the kinds of things he says?
Speaker 1: He usedcore women moms a lot. When I read that
Speaker 1: about the rape in the car that shook me.
Speaker 3: She called me names and then I called her a slat.
Speaker 1: I think I called her a male and taser or something.
Speaker 1: It's wordings he would use. But he makes insinuations that
Speaker 1: when women dress a certain way that they're asking for it,
Speaker 1: and you know, those very typical tropes of his generations. Specifically,
Speaker 1: remember every case we'd hear, big cases of sexual assaults
Speaker 1: and things like that, Brittany Higgins, all that sort of stuff,
Speaker 1: he would always blame the women or say they were lying.
Speaker 1: Always he's always on the side of the person who
Speaker 1: didn't matter what evidence was there? They were always innocent.
Speaker 3: How does your father view women?
Speaker 1: He has the expectation that they are pure, kind, nurturing, soft,
Speaker 1: and anything outside of that they deserve disrespect. You know,
Speaker 1: as much as my father hated my ex husband when
Speaker 1: he hurt me, he would say things about, you know,
Speaker 1: me being a whore. And that's why he doesn't blame
Speaker 1: my ex husband for doing it. Thinks he did.
Speaker 3: Your father would call you a whore?
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, but yeah, there is a certain way that
Speaker 1: he expects women to behave.
Speaker 3: And did your mom stand by your father during these
Speaker 3: allegations back in the eighties?
Speaker 1: Mom stayed with him. I definitely don't want to speak
Speaker 1: on behalf of my mum, who is definitely not She's
Speaker 1: not supportive of me doing this. She's scared for my safety.
Speaker 1: She blames herself for a lot of what he got
Speaker 1: away with, And all I can really say is that
Speaker 1: she was very fearful of him at that time and
Speaker 1: she did what she needed to do to survive. I
Speaker 1: know my mum believes he did it. He did both
Speaker 1: the rapes. I know she remembers one of the victims
Speaker 1: who showed up at subsequent trials of other victims. She
Speaker 1: remembers her in the court and how much it broke
Speaker 1: my mom to hear her screaming, he's done it before,
Speaker 1: he'll do it again. And my mom did not talk
Speaker 1: about this stuff to me until I started asking questions.
Speaker 3: What about Elise? How did he treat Alise? From what you.
Speaker 1: Saw, Elise was very It always felt like she was
Speaker 1: sort of on eggshells and trying to do everything she
Speaker 1: could for my dad. He wasn't He didn't treat her well.
Speaker 1: She's the one that I have this story about the
Speaker 1: bloody face, And you know, I didn't see a lot
Speaker 1: of violence like that between them, but I feel like
Speaker 1: the threat was always there. I feel like Elise was
Speaker 1: always scared of that.
Speaker 3: I want you to hear how Elise describes some incidents
Speaker 3: of verbal abuse and threats allegedly by your father, And
Speaker 3: I'm interested to get your insights on those threats to
Speaker 3: see if that would be something your father would say.
Speaker 5: Yes, he did threaten me. He threatened to if I
Speaker 5: ever left him, he would help me down and find me.
Speaker 5: He would cut me up in little pieces, bury me
Speaker 5: on the beach in individual spots, to cover me in
Speaker 5: lime so nobody could smell that there was body parts there. Yeah.
Speaker 5: And then there was another time we drove part GIRoA
Speaker 5: beach and I mentioned, as we've driven past, I said,
Speaker 5: that's a really nice caravan park on that side. I said,
Speaker 5: what a lovely spot to have a caravan park, because
Speaker 5: you've just got to walk across the road and there's
Speaker 5: seven mile beach there, Like that would be a fun
Speaker 5: place to take a family like to go and stay there.
Speaker 5: And I said, look at all that bush there, and
Speaker 5: he said, yeah, look at all that bush there. He said,
Speaker 5: that'd be a good place to bury somebody. Just make
Speaker 5: sure you behave yourself.
Speaker 3: I must add.
Speaker 2: Kevin Correll vehemently denies the allegations of domestic abuse leveled
Speaker 2: against him by his former wife.
Speaker 3: Do you believe that's something your father would say? One
Speaker 3: hundred percent?
Speaker 1: I never heard threats like that, But I know that
Speaker 1: he's capable of that. I know that's how he's instilled
Speaker 1: a lot of fear and a lot of women. I
Speaker 1: know how terrified my mother is of him and other
Speaker 1: former partners of his. I remember reaching out to one
Speaker 1: in my twenties.
Speaker 3: Is this the partner that your father was seeing at
Speaker 3: the time of Rochelle's murder. Yes, we're referring to her
Speaker 3: as Alice.
Speaker 1: I'd reached out to Alice just because I absolutely adored her,
Speaker 1: and I never knew why they split up and what happened.
Speaker 1: I realized everything with the Rochelle probably played a part.
Speaker 1: But yeah, I reached out to her at work and
Speaker 1: I could hear terror in her voice, realizing that I
Speaker 1: was contacting her, And she told me she couldn't have
Speaker 1: anything to do with me. And this was one of
Speaker 1: the most beautiful souls I'd ever met, and she was
Speaker 1: terrified purely because I was his daughter, and she thought
Speaker 1: he had put me up to it. She asked me not.
Speaker 1: When I said no, I just wanted to catch up.
Speaker 1: She's please, don't tell your dad who spoke to me. Please,
Speaker 1: you can't contact me again. And I knew something quite
Speaker 1: horrific had happened, didn't know what, and I'd never asked him. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I know a lot of women are terrified of him.
Speaker 1: All the accounts these women speak of are one hundred
Speaker 1: percent tury. He liked to look at women, my dad,
Speaker 1: you know, always turning his neck looking at anything. But
Speaker 1: it was he didn't respect those women. I think my
Speaker 1: dad only respects a woman if she is a good
Speaker 1: wife and serves men, and it's compliant.
Speaker 3: How do you cope with all these traumas in your life?
Speaker 1: My kids are, Oh like, I probably get the most
Speaker 1: emotional talking about this. I don't know how with everything
Speaker 1: they've been through that they are. They're the most phenomenal humans.
Speaker 1: Just their sense of humor, their forgiveness. They're the most compassionate,
Speaker 1: beautiful human beings. And outside, I mean, they are more
Speaker 1: than enough. But my work is very significant to me
Speaker 1: as well.
Speaker 3: Why is that important to you? I can't do what
Speaker 3: he did.
Speaker 6: I can't, but if I'm doing good, I want my
Speaker 6: my DNA.
Speaker 1: To be counterbalancing in some way. And I'm not mother Teresa.
Speaker 1: I don't mean that in any way, but you know,
Speaker 1: I don't want to sound like a martyrup but I
Speaker 1: think that is very It's very significant to me that
Speaker 1: I am always trying to prevent people being cruel and evil.
Speaker 3: Did you choose that path because of your childhood? I
Speaker 3: think so?
Speaker 1: This is why I think he being his daughter has
Speaker 1: definitely shaped so much, and.
Speaker 6: I think I am.
Speaker 1: Forever trying to do something that is more significant than
Speaker 1: being his daughter. I've felt worthless most of my life,
Speaker 1: and I think I'm always about to prove that I'm
Speaker 1: not here. No, I don't want to be known as
Speaker 1: sister daughter. I want to be known as the person
Speaker 1: who helps people.
Speaker 3: How much fear did you have to push through to
Speaker 3: be able to do this interview with me?
Speaker 1: I think I would have had reason to fear if
Speaker 1: he knew I was doing it and there were you know,
Speaker 1: he knew where I lived, and there was an opportunity
Speaker 1: for him to get away with it. Yeah, I would
Speaker 1: probably be more fearful. I mean, I've always my dad
Speaker 1: had contempt for me, and I think one of the
Speaker 1: reasons he kept me in my life was because he
Speaker 1: used me as a tool and because the mother of
Speaker 1: the grandchildren, who are another source for him. I think
Speaker 1: he hates everything I stand for, because, as I said,
Speaker 1: I've built my personality around not being all the things
Speaker 1: I hate in him.
Speaker 7: You've tried to be everything he's not, yes, and it
Speaker 7: severely disappoints him. I used to believe, in order to
Speaker 7: get my kids, that he could potentially hurt me if
Speaker 7: he thought he'd get away with that. I remember a
Speaker 7: few times going to his house I'd have to pick
Speaker 7: something up or drop something off, and I would either
Speaker 7: pretend to be on the phone, or I would be
Speaker 7: on the phone to a friend and very loudly out
Speaker 7: the front of his house. I've just stopped in at
Speaker 7: my dad's I'll call you back in ten minutes. I
Speaker 7: just wanted him to know that someone knew where I was.
Speaker 7: And I know that probably sounds very dramatic. I can
Speaker 7: imagine his face as he hears me say that, But yeah,
Speaker 7: I know what he's capable of, and I know the
Speaker 7: contempt he had for me, and how damaging I am.
Speaker 7: I think I hold up a mirror to my dad
Speaker 7: of all the things he hates about himself. I think
Speaker 7: my existence pisses him off. I think if I.
Speaker 1: For some reason walked into his house and no one
Speaker 1: was there, yeah, he probably hurt me. I don't think
Speaker 1: he's going to seek me out. I don't think he'd
Speaker 1: show up where he thinks my sons could be. I
Speaker 1: don't think he's a danger to me, but I understand
Speaker 1: that most of my loved ones are terrified of me
Speaker 1: doing this today.
Speaker 3: Are you doing this for any payback for your father?
Speaker 8: Oh?
Speaker 1: God, no, No, I think the hardest thing about doing
Speaker 1: this is that knowing my dad is going to hear
Speaker 1: this and how much it would probably hurt him. I
Speaker 1: don't want to hurt my dad. I don't know why
Speaker 1: it's important for me to know that he knows I
Speaker 1: love you. I can't have him her anymore. I can't,
Speaker 1: but I do love him and I'm grateful for everything
Speaker 1: he ever did for me and my kid's fam.
Speaker 3: In a previous episode, you heard Kevin Carrell's close friend
Speaker 3: and former partner, who we've called Marian, share her beliefs
Speaker 3: about why Jazz is a strange from her father and
Speaker 3: would speak out publicly against him.
Speaker 8: All I can say is I just with all the
Speaker 8: the things that his daughter has said, I know he
Speaker 8: is very self serving. She is into martyrdom. She loves
Speaker 8: people saying oh you okay, everything all right? Sorry you're
Speaker 8: going through this. She hears attention seeking and don't get
Speaker 8: me wrong, I do love the girl, but yeah, I
Speaker 8: just she would never have anything positive to say, and
Speaker 8: I've only got things that are positive to say about Kevin.
Speaker 3: Do you know why she's such a staunch supporter of
Speaker 3: your father? Can you give us some insights?
Speaker 1: I thought it had a lot to do with a
Speaker 1: lack of confidence, feeling isolated. But that attack on me
Speaker 1: when she has always always expressed to me that I'm
Speaker 1: a daughter to her, and I felt like I was
Speaker 1: hurting her that I have not been in contact with her.
Speaker 1: I would never hurt that woman. I don't know what
Speaker 1: he has said to make vicious comments like that about me.
Speaker 1: It might possibly be that I am not involved in
Speaker 1: her life anymore, but I've had nothing but love for
Speaker 1: her my whole life, as long as I've known her.
Speaker 1: I'm just blown up way this is psychological dummy he
Speaker 1: has done. And these are the things he says about me.
Speaker 1: To hear her say it, I honestly thought she was
Speaker 1: someone who would always be in my corner. That hurts.
Speaker 1: I'm not an attention seeker. This is the last thing
Speaker 1: I want. I don't. I wish I had a normal,
Speaker 1: fucking dad.
Speaker 3: They didn't have me.
Speaker 6: The fucking news.
Speaker 3: Station coming soon on, Dear Rochelle.
Speaker 1: I think he wanted to kill her, possibly as punishment
Speaker 1: for rejecting him. My personal belief is that Rachelle was
Speaker 1: aware he was defrauding Camden. There were quite a few
Speaker 1: years that I know I protected him he had said
Speaker 1: that Rachelle's fingers were cut off because she was dealing
Speaker 1: drugs for bikes. I remember just feeling like the blood
Speaker 1: had draped from my face the time he sat on
Speaker 1: my lounge and said I've never said that. He'd said
Speaker 1: it to me multiple times. Exposing my dad in any
Speaker 1: way is what we'll set him off.
Speaker 2: Dear Rochelle is a multi media production from True Crime Australia.
Speaker 2: If you want to be one of the first to
Speaker 2: find out what happens next.
Speaker 3: Go to Dear Rochelle dot com dot au.
Speaker 2: That's where eligible digital news Called Australia subscribers get early
Speaker 2: access to podcast episodes, breaking news in our live investigation
Speaker 2: and you will also find exclusive videos, interactive evidence, feature
Speaker 2: articles and more.
Speaker 3: That's de roschelle dot com dot you.
Speaker 2: If you have any tips or confidential information to share
Speaker 2: with me, Ashley Hanson, please send an email to De
Speaker 2: Rochelle at news dot com dot au. Our supervising producer
Speaker 2: and audio editor is Rehys Gunter Rachel Fountain, his executive
Speaker 2: producer and audio director. Our executive editor is Sarah Blake.
Speaker 2: Our senior journalist is Patrick Carline. Video editors are Jillian McNally,
Speaker 2: Owen Yang and Stephen Woods. Picture editors are Jeff dr
Speaker 2: Mannan and Christy Miller. Senior camera operators are Daniel Andrews
Speaker 2: and Oscar Vierra. Were sound designed by Martin Perolta and
Speaker 2: Travis Evans. Thanks also to Greg Thompson and Lenny Panerz,
Speaker 2: Show Burreo Fayguld, Vanessa Graham, Hailey Goddard, Stephen Grice, Charlotte carp,
Speaker 2: Tina Coggins, and Harry Hughes. Special thanks to The Daily Teller,
Speaker 2: Graph editor Ben English and Dear Rochelle would not be
Speaker 2: possible without the help and unwavering support of Christi and
Speaker 2: Anne Childs, Mindy Wicks, Damien Loon and Rochelle's friends. This
Speaker 2: podcast series is hosted and investigated by me Ashley Hanson