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Speaker 1: Michael Chamers, swell on a straight talk mate. Thanks Mark,

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Speaker 1: appreciate having me here to talk about your dream job?

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Speaker 1: Is this your dream job? You're not not being here,

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Speaker 1: but your dream job. This is the general manager of

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Speaker 1: the P and G Chiefs. Is that your dream job?

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Speaker 1: A rugby league general manager of a club, a new club.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Everyone keeps telling me, well, you're playing real life

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Speaker 2: super coach. You think that's it, that's a that's a job.

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Speaker 2: But it is, like it's been unbelievable.

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Speaker 1: I have.

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Speaker 2: I've been doing it now two months. I thought, to

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Speaker 2: be honest, I thought what I was doing was my

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Speaker 2: dream job and I loved every minute of it. Yeah

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Speaker 2: as a journalist. But yeah, so far, so good. But

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Speaker 2: come back to me after to lose the game, I

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Speaker 2: might not feel the same. Man.

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Speaker 1: It's a bit like coaching, like as probably the best job,

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Speaker 1: probably the worst job too. And now let's get into

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Speaker 1: a little bit like you mentioned me as you're coming

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Speaker 1: in that you just come back. Yeah, you took your wife,

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Speaker 1: the whole family.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, my wife had been for we went before I

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Speaker 2: made the decision to go. I took my wife over yep,

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Speaker 2: but this was our first trip as a family. So

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Speaker 2: I took my three kids. My wife's pregnant. We got

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Speaker 2: number four on the way.

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Speaker 1: Oh wow.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, it's a a good walk, boy mate. It's

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Speaker 2: a bit of kids, correct correct me? Like for me,

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Speaker 2: I just wanted to see them be happy. And it's

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Speaker 2: a big move for them, you know. Like when I

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Speaker 2: made the decision to take three kids, they are ten,

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Speaker 2: eight and six. It's a big call. But to see

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Speaker 2: them there was a special moment. Mark we went in

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Speaker 2: the afternoon down at Ella Beach, just local beach there

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Speaker 2: in Port Moresby. We had some former players with us,

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Speaker 2: Willie Mason and James Graham, justin Horrow. But to see

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Speaker 2: them walk onto the beach and all these kids, they

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Speaker 2: just they just got their life is football. They're playing

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Speaker 2: footy on the beach, simple life and they're happy. And

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Speaker 2: to see the way they embraced my children on the beach.

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Speaker 2: My kids are out there playing footy, they're all hugging them,

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Speaker 2: high five in them, same by them when we were leaving.

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Speaker 2: It was a real heartwarming feeling for me to see

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Speaker 2: that my kids are going to be embraced over there,

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Speaker 2: and not just going over there because Dad's got a

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Speaker 2: job to see them happy, and Willie Peters his son

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Speaker 2: and wife. Yeah, they came over as well. I think

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Speaker 2: everyone got a real sense of just how how important

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Speaker 2: Roga League is that country and how idolized they're going

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Speaker 2: to be. My kids are eight and ten years old.

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Speaker 2: The boys in this signing autographs at the lobes, Like

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Speaker 2: it's just no, it's like, obviously you laugh about it

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Speaker 2: with the family.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, that's cool, but it is cool.

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Speaker 2: Like, you know, there's how much of these kids. They

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Speaker 2: wouldn't know they are, but they hear the chiefs and

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Speaker 2: they're excited.

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Speaker 1: That is quite mean. Why was Willie Mason and Jimmy

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Speaker 1: Grahmer et seuch of that?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so they called me out on social media on

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Speaker 2: their podcast saying get us over there and in the

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Speaker 2: hollow sport boys, And we just thought it was a club.

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Speaker 2: You know, obviously the media had been there before and

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Speaker 2: there's been a lot of talk around LEUI and the media.

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Speaker 2: We just thought it was a club. Would be a

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Speaker 2: good opportunity for them to see it with their own eyes.

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Speaker 2: And I know that there's mainstream media, but for us,

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Speaker 2: we still have to recruit twenty eight more players. A

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Speaker 2: lot of those guys we can't talk to to November one,

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Speaker 2: so I've been with my media had on. I thought, well,

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Speaker 2: I know where the players listening to. The players are

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Speaker 2: listening to these former players. They're listening to these podcasts,

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Speaker 2: So if I can't talk to them directly, we can

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Speaker 2: talk to them through these players and they can share

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Speaker 2: their experience. So that's what's That was what drove our

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Speaker 2: decision to get them over there. And they loved it.

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Speaker 2: They absolutely loved their time over there, and they've been

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Speaker 2: great for us to hear all the positivity that's come

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Speaker 2: out of it. So I know there are a lot

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Speaker 2: of players who are listening to them, and hopefully they

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Speaker 2: might not have thought P and G's an option.

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Speaker 1: Suddenly they might, Wow, it's interesting you to talk about

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Speaker 1: your kids and your family, not really knowing P and

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Speaker 1: G like as such. End Or and Willie peoters the same,

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Speaker 1: and probably the players that went over with you. The

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Speaker 1: former players went over with you, but a lot of

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Speaker 1: people don't know who Michael Chamas is, so this is

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Speaker 1: an opportunity actually for you to speak to it. We

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Speaker 1: have a lot of rugby league followers and players sent

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Speaker 1: you listening to our show, so maybe they'd like to

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Speaker 1: know who they're going to get involved with. Who's the dude.

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Speaker 1: So let's go back a little bit. Let's go back

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Speaker 1: right back to Michael Chammas as a kid, where'd grow up?

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Speaker 1: What's the deal?

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Speaker 2: Kid from Western Sydney still am grew up brought out

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Speaker 2: penrith Way. But I spent most of my life out Marylands,

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Speaker 2: in Paramatta, went to Paramatta Marris High School. Forty was

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Speaker 2: my life. Dragons fan, didn't they in kindergarten? Didn't know numbers?

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Speaker 2: All I knew was number one was Mick Potter. Number

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Speaker 2: two was Ricky Wolford. Got in trouble for that, to

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Speaker 2: teach that, to bring my parents in. Footy was my life,

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Speaker 2: mark like it's you played a bit footy? Yeah, I

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Speaker 2: played for twenty from Ford or twenty three. Yeah, I played,

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Speaker 2: just not good enough to make it. And the only

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Speaker 2: reason I got in the media is not because I

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Speaker 2: was book smart or loved to write, like I actually

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Speaker 2: struggled in English. To be honest with.

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Speaker 1: You, really, yeah, yeah, you're such an accomplished writer though, Oh.

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Speaker 2: Well, it's taken a while to get to where I am.

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Speaker 2: And guys like Andrew Webster and my format at Evenfue

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Speaker 2: helped me a lot along the way. But I just

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Speaker 2: wanted to get involved because I loved footing and I thought,

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Speaker 2: if I can't play it, this is the next best thing.

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Speaker 2: So somehow I just got through the HC and got

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Speaker 2: into UNI, and yeah, I started journalism at UNI.

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Speaker 1: When you're doing journalism at university, did you said, having

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Speaker 1: your mind a plan, they're not going to go right?

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Speaker 1: Going to be a rugby league writer.

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Speaker 2: There was nothing else I would not have made. I

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Speaker 2: wouldn't ever have got a Sydney Morning Herald cadet ship

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Speaker 2: doing it the traditional way, which is exam interviews. Like

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Speaker 2: I don't like I'm not ashamed to say that I

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Speaker 2: live in a bubble of rugby league and sport and

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Speaker 2: my family. That's it. Like I'm not educated to the

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Speaker 2: outside world, book smart. But what I did love was

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Speaker 2: footy and I wanted to be part of that. And

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Speaker 2: thankfully with my connections living out west, playing in that competition,

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Speaker 2: that's where I started covering the local to the local newspaper,

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Speaker 2: the Paramounter Son for free. In that competition with like

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Speaker 2: like Jared Haynes, Tony Williams, Chris Keating, Hodkinson, Timmy manner.

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Speaker 2: All these guys I played with him against before I

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Speaker 2: was covering them as a young eighteen seventeen year old.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, it's sort of float on from there.

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Speaker 1: Was it like an internship while you were studying as well?

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Speaker 2: Was it even? They just rang me and said I

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Speaker 2: did an assignment on and it went to the local

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Speaker 2: paper and the journal. John McDonald rang me and said

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Speaker 2: I can't pay you, but do you want to cover

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Speaker 2: the lower grades for the paper for free? And I

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Speaker 2: was like, go to the games and cover it. And

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Speaker 2: I did that for twelve months, just every weekend covering

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Speaker 2: Jersey Flagg, Harold mattssg Ball reserved grade. And twelve months

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Speaker 2: later there was a cadetship at the Fairfield Champion and

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Speaker 2: I got that.

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Speaker 1: So, you know, because one of the things I know

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Speaker 1: about you, well, I know because I've been told by

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Speaker 1: some of the people some of the most student mines

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Speaker 1: of rugby league, is that one of them was your

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Speaker 1: former boss. One of the places you just work for,

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Speaker 1: the ultimate boss. And we won't mention his name, although

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Speaker 1: he usually it does get a run when we're talk

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Speaker 1: about rugby league and stuff. And he told me that

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Speaker 1: you're the best. You were the best more recently in

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Speaker 1: journalistic sense of getting intel, like finding out shit, just

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Speaker 1: actually getting to the bottom of a story, whatever that is.

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Speaker 1: Then I've observed you a few times a few people

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Speaker 1: I know, and I've seen you work them a bit,

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Speaker 1: not in a bad way, but like you know, you're

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Speaker 1: You're seen to get on their good side, and they

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Speaker 1: tend to trust you. And as soon as you get trusted,

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Speaker 1: you get information over time, you don't you never I

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Speaker 1: don't really ever remember seeing you hijack anybody or you know,

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Speaker 1: like hang them out to dry. Too bad anyway, I'm

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Speaker 1: in a few out there, Well there's one or two

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Speaker 1: I've seen you hang out drub but I don't mind

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Speaker 1: those ones. They're hanging them out to dry, as you know.

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Speaker 1: But generally speaking, that's not your reputation. You don't stitch

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Speaker 1: them up, but your information is usually pretty good. Where

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Speaker 1: did you learn that from? Did you learn that when

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Speaker 1: you were covering the essueball Harol Mats, et cetera. Did

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Speaker 1: you learn about that then? The importance because that's pot powerful.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I appreciate what you said, Like I just I

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Speaker 2: think you learn that as you learn it as a person,

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Speaker 2: Like what kind of person you want to be. And

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Speaker 2: I feel like in journalism everyone thinks how to get information,

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Speaker 2: well simple, people need to trust. You need to build relationships,

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Speaker 2: and if people can't trust you, you don't get information. And

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Speaker 2: part of that is not being someone who's just using

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Speaker 2: the other person for information. There is the exchange of information.

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Speaker 2: Like a lot of the people that you're referring to,

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Speaker 2: it's a two way street. You know, they want to

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Speaker 2: know what you know as much as you asking them,

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Speaker 2: but also the ability to then know, Okay, well I'm

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Speaker 2: not going to write that because it's going to burn

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Speaker 2: my relationship with that person. And to build trust. You

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Speaker 2: can take four or five years to build that trust,

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Speaker 2: but you can burn it overnight. And that's one thing

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Speaker 2: I've always pride myself on when it comes to media

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Speaker 2: is making sure you do the right thing by people.

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Speaker 2: Not everyone's going to like what you write, not everyone's

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Speaker 2: going to agree, but as long as you've given everyone

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Speaker 2: the opportunity and you've done your du diligence to make

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Speaker 2: sure what you're writing is correct. And I feel most

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Speaker 2: times that hopefully I did do that, and not everyone

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Speaker 2: will like me, but relationships everything, and it's not about

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Speaker 2: being book smart in journalism. I honestly mean that because

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Speaker 2: you just have to. It's just street smarts, common sense relationships,

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Speaker 2: that's all it is. And if you are able to

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Speaker 2: perform that trust with someone, you need to keep it.

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Speaker 1: So where'd you learn that concept? Because that's not necessarily

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Speaker 1: something that you're born with. I mean, is that a

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Speaker 1: something from your dad? Did you learn from growing up?

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Speaker 1: Did your parents teach you that?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? I think my dad and mum definitely big on

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Speaker 2: the person that you are like. And as I said,

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Speaker 2: if I was going to rely on my education or

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Speaker 2: my ability to wow people with my knowledge of the world,

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Speaker 2: that wasn't going to happen. Just be real, be someone

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Speaker 2: who people wanted to hang around. And yeah, it's hard.

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Speaker 2: Like your first five years in media, you constantly feel

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Speaker 2: like you've got no contacts, you've got no connections to

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Speaker 2: the game because everyone's already established. But I made a

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Speaker 2: decision pretty young in media that I was going to

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Speaker 2: then begin to talk to everyone that didn't have relationships.

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Speaker 2: Like you knew pretty quickly who talked to who. So

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Speaker 2: I was like, Okay, instead of talking to the CEO

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Speaker 2: or the chair, I'm going to go talk to the

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Speaker 2: assistant coach or the guy that's the c and build

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Speaker 2: relationships with them because at some point they will move

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Speaker 2: up the food chain and they'll remember that you took

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Speaker 2: the time and effort to get to know them. Now,

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Speaker 2: of course, there are others that you need to get

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Speaker 2: along with, the guys like Nick Polyitis and what but

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Speaker 2: my relationship, my relationship with Nick wasn't as good as

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Speaker 2: it was for the first ten years because he had

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Speaker 2: people he trusted. And until you earn that trust, and

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Speaker 2: until you show them that you can be trusted, they

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Speaker 2: feel like they don't need you. Why would they When

230
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Speaker 2: they've got Andrew Webster or they've got Phil Rodfield, or

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Speaker 2: they've got other people in the game, why do they

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Speaker 2: need me? And I guess the more you move up,

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Speaker 2: the more you your reputation improves in the game, the

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Speaker 2: more they start to think, Okay, well I can trust

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Speaker 2: this guy or I do need this guy. And perfect

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Speaker 2: example I think with Nick Politas is we spent a

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Speaker 2: lot of time together in Las Vegas, Yeah, in twenty

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Speaker 2: four and I was there. Yeah. I guess you get

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Speaker 2: to see people for who they are when you're in

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Speaker 2: that environment, you know, not twenty four to seven. But

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Speaker 2: we were together a lot, and I've got a lot

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Speaker 2: of respect for Nick, and I feel like, yeah, being

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Speaker 2: in that environment with him and being who I was,

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Speaker 2: helped build that relationship.

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Speaker 1: You got to the top of the food chain, though

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Speaker 1: in that regard to a mani plitis, I mean, obviously

247
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Speaker 1: velandis abdo because they gave you a job, or they

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Speaker 1: gave you the current appointment. You've got to meet player managers,

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Speaker 1: players themselves, you had relationship with players themselves. Other journalists,

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Speaker 1: you know, other journalist are pretty important to meet. You

251
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Speaker 1: can't have you can't you can't have enemy type status

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Speaker 1: with people. Out of all those categories, though, let's talk

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Speaker 1: about chairmans of clubs, because you know that most of

254
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Speaker 1: them made the elderly decision. Most of them player managers,

255
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Speaker 1: particularly high profile ones other journalists. Which area was the

256
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Speaker 1: most challenging for you in terms of what you can

257
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Speaker 1: believe or who you can believe.

258
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Speaker 2: Out of those, probably player managers. I think for the

259
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Speaker 2: first chunk of my journalism career, I sort of avoided

260
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Speaker 2: dealing a lot with agents because I felt like they

261
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Speaker 2: just wanted you to run their agenda. And that's not everyone.

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Speaker 2: But my general thought was this was going to be

263
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Speaker 2: more difficult to get the truth that it was out

264
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Speaker 2: of people in club land. So I gravitated towards CEOs

265
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Speaker 2: and chairmans, which gave me that grounding and networking in

266
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Speaker 2: the game that really helped me. And then as I

267
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Speaker 2: sort of I think going on to you, he helped

268
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Speaker 2: me with my profile, and then people wanted to talk

269
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Speaker 2: to you a bit more.

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Speaker 1: The channel on Telly, Yeah, channel.

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Speaker 2: Nine and Yeah. You started to deal a lot more

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Speaker 2: with agents. But by that stage I knew who the

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Speaker 2: ones you could trust, who the ones you don't get

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Speaker 2: along with, or you don't want to take their word

275
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Speaker 2: for things, because they might be just manipulating you to

276
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Speaker 2: get a better outcome for their clients, which I can understand.

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Speaker 2: Good luck to you.

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Speaker 1: Their clients the players.

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Speaker 2: Their clients are the players. They need to do what's

280
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Speaker 2: best for them. But I made a decision with it

281
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Speaker 2: quite a few agents that I didn't want to deal

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Speaker 2: with them because I felt like it was always on

283
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Speaker 2: their terms and that wasn't my best interest to do

284
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Speaker 2: what was best for them. I needed to do it

285
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Speaker 2: was best for our readers, and which was provided the truth.

286
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Speaker 1: Maybe you could explain to our audience. Why a play

287
00:12:55,880 --> 00:12:58,959
Speaker 1: manager would want to get you to we'll get on

288
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Speaker 1: your good side. I still play. I either get you

289
00:13:01,280 --> 00:13:03,120
Speaker 1: to speak about a player on one hundred percent Footy

290
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Speaker 1: whatever happens to be, or write a great article in

291
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Speaker 1: Sydney Morning held about them. What is it about a

292
00:13:07,679 --> 00:13:09,079
Speaker 1: player manager? What are they trying to achieve?

293
00:13:09,200 --> 00:13:11,960
Speaker 2: Oh? Sometimes you're trying to create leverage where there isn't.

294
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Speaker 2: They want to create interest. They'll tell you that this

295
00:13:15,040 --> 00:13:16,960
Speaker 2: club that's interested in my player, when that might not

296
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Speaker 2: be the case. They'll say that this play is worth

297
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Speaker 2: this amount. We've got an offer for this amount because

298
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Speaker 2: it helps them in negotiations with another club. And some

299
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Speaker 2: people might be happy to do that. I wasn't. I

300
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Speaker 2: wasn't happy to pedal someone else's agenda.

301
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Speaker 1: Because it holds again, if you are, you aren't.

302
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Speaker 2: That's because I would then ring the club. I'd always

303
00:13:33,520 --> 00:13:36,559
Speaker 2: double check if someone's telling me we've got interest from No,

304
00:13:36,679 --> 00:13:38,560
Speaker 2: let's just use the Rusters for example, the Roosters are

305
00:13:38,600 --> 00:13:40,839
Speaker 2: interested in this player. I would ring Nick, or I

306
00:13:40,880 --> 00:13:42,880
Speaker 2: would ring Trent Robinson, or I would ring someone at the

307
00:13:42,880 --> 00:13:45,439
Speaker 2: club and say are you in for this person? And

308
00:13:45,480 --> 00:13:47,079
Speaker 2: then I would check that, and then I'd ring. Sometimes

309
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Speaker 2: i'd just ring the play directly if there was someone

310
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Speaker 2: I got along with, so I didn't just settle for

311
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Speaker 2: what I was told from the agent. And maybe that

312
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Speaker 2: pissed a few agents off, but that didn't bother me, because, yeah,

313
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Speaker 2: I said to you, there's more more than one way

314
00:14:01,520 --> 00:14:03,719
Speaker 2: to get information than if you haven't got a relationship

315
00:14:03,920 --> 00:14:06,800
Speaker 2: or don't want a relationship with someone, there are other

316
00:14:06,840 --> 00:14:07,840
Speaker 2: ways to find that out.

317
00:14:08,120 --> 00:14:10,959
Speaker 1: Would you actually record all your conversation? Will write notes

318
00:14:11,000 --> 00:14:12,880
Speaker 1: down and build like a doc, let's call it a

319
00:14:12,880 --> 00:14:16,440
Speaker 1: profile on players and on managers, on whatever. Did you

320
00:14:16,720 --> 00:14:19,760
Speaker 1: you just sort of build stuff up or is it

321
00:14:19,800 --> 00:14:20,840
Speaker 1: all kept up here in your head?

322
00:14:20,840 --> 00:14:23,080
Speaker 2: A lot of it is obviously take notes and yeah,

323
00:14:23,120 --> 00:14:24,920
Speaker 2: I'm very big on writing lists of things I need

324
00:14:24,920 --> 00:14:28,560
Speaker 2: to do, and even every year, like sometimes you find

325
00:14:28,600 --> 00:14:32,560
Speaker 2: yourself forgetting, not forgetting in a way where you just

326
00:14:32,560 --> 00:14:34,840
Speaker 2: completely forgot about that person, but because you have to

327
00:14:34,840 --> 00:14:37,920
Speaker 2: get through so many people that you ring, someone might

328
00:14:37,920 --> 00:14:40,040
Speaker 2: slip your mind. So every year I would read, I'd

329
00:14:40,080 --> 00:14:42,360
Speaker 2: get my spreadsheet, go by club everyone that I talk

330
00:14:42,440 --> 00:14:44,640
Speaker 2: to at that club, and write it out times it

331
00:14:44,720 --> 00:14:47,800
Speaker 2: buy whatever it is seventeen sixteen clubs, and I would

332
00:14:47,800 --> 00:14:49,760
Speaker 2: make sure they've got that list so that on a

333
00:14:49,760 --> 00:14:51,680
Speaker 2: Monday or Tuesday or Wednesday, I knew that I had

334
00:14:51,680 --> 00:14:55,040
Speaker 2: to call this person to maintain that relationship. Constantly. I

335
00:14:55,040 --> 00:14:56,480
Speaker 2: would be on the phone from the moment I woke

336
00:14:56,560 --> 00:14:58,880
Speaker 2: up to the moment, you know, sort of trying and

337
00:14:58,880 --> 00:15:02,800
Speaker 2: get the kids down, making sure. Sometimes there's no point

338
00:15:02,800 --> 00:15:04,520
Speaker 2: to the court, just saying hell, hey, hey, Mark, what's happening.

339
00:15:04,600 --> 00:15:08,680
Speaker 2: Later most of those calls would yield absolutely nothing, but

340
00:15:08,680 --> 00:15:10,520
Speaker 2: there'd be one call that someone would say, have you

341
00:15:10,520 --> 00:15:12,760
Speaker 2: heard this? Have you heard that? And that leads to

342
00:15:12,800 --> 00:15:15,720
Speaker 2: a story. And it was important for me to keep

343
00:15:15,800 --> 00:15:20,320
Speaker 2: keep a relationship with all those people and just on

344
00:15:20,360 --> 00:15:23,200
Speaker 2: the job itself though, and my wife would probably be

345
00:15:23,240 --> 00:15:26,160
Speaker 2: able to see this. It's it is difficult to be

346
00:15:26,200 --> 00:15:29,040
Speaker 2: able to be switched on all the time every day.

347
00:15:29,120 --> 00:15:32,440
Speaker 2: That job requires you to be in a constant state

348
00:15:32,440 --> 00:15:33,040
Speaker 2: of paranoia.

349
00:15:33,960 --> 00:15:35,600
Speaker 1: And in these I'm being dicked around.

350
00:15:35,920 --> 00:15:38,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, well not not even that. Just I wanted to win.

351
00:15:39,120 --> 00:15:41,160
Speaker 2: Like my competitive instinct when I wanted to play Rugula

352
00:15:41,240 --> 00:15:43,920
Speaker 2: League was I want to win, and I brought that

353
00:15:43,960 --> 00:15:47,080
Speaker 2: into journalism and I hated losing more than I had

354
00:15:47,240 --> 00:15:49,920
Speaker 2: losing more than winning sometimes, and what's losing in journalism though,

355
00:15:50,600 --> 00:15:54,280
Speaker 2: another newspaper getting eat me? Yeah, if the Telegraph beat

356
00:15:54,320 --> 00:15:58,280
Speaker 2: me to a story, it would really affect me really yeah, yeah,

357
00:15:58,320 --> 00:16:00,680
Speaker 2: a lot, and not in a healthy way. And that's

358
00:16:00,680 --> 00:16:03,280
Speaker 2: why I sort of felt a little bit towards the end.

359
00:16:04,000 --> 00:16:07,400
Speaker 2: I probably wasn't in a right headspace. I was just

360
00:16:08,240 --> 00:16:12,000
Speaker 2: so obsessed with making sure that we won or that

361
00:16:12,040 --> 00:16:14,640
Speaker 2: I didn't get beaten, and that I wanted to be

362
00:16:14,680 --> 00:16:16,920
Speaker 2: the best that it probably affected everything else, and then

363
00:16:17,000 --> 00:16:19,960
Speaker 2: maybe my family life and you know, the kids. Like

364
00:16:20,280 --> 00:16:21,520
Speaker 2: even though I was with him a lot because it

365
00:16:21,520 --> 00:16:25,680
Speaker 2: allowed flexibility to work from home, I was constantly on edge,

366
00:16:25,720 --> 00:16:29,880
Speaker 2: constantly thinking, and I wasn't present. I never felt present. Preoccupied, Yeah,

367
00:16:29,960 --> 00:16:32,120
Speaker 2: because if you don't answer your phone once, you don't

368
00:16:32,120 --> 00:16:34,560
Speaker 2: know what you're going to miss, and if you try

369
00:16:34,600 --> 00:16:37,160
Speaker 2: and switch off for a little bit, you miss something.

370
00:16:37,280 --> 00:16:39,440
Speaker 2: And I got to a point where I was actually,

371
00:16:39,560 --> 00:16:42,120
Speaker 2: you know, pretty burnt Outmark Like, I was pretty fatigued

372
00:16:42,160 --> 00:16:45,320
Speaker 2: at the end, and I could have done for the

373
00:16:45,360 --> 00:16:47,160
Speaker 2: rest of my life. I loved it, but I just

374
00:16:47,200 --> 00:16:51,040
Speaker 2: felt if I kept going that way, I'd burn out.

375
00:16:51,600 --> 00:16:54,600
Speaker 2: And when the opportunity presented itself. Probably, to be honest

376
00:16:54,600 --> 00:16:57,640
Speaker 2: with you, it's been a pretty demanding few months in

377
00:16:57,680 --> 00:17:00,520
Speaker 2: this job. But it's a different like it's a bit

378
00:17:00,520 --> 00:17:03,240
Speaker 2: more on my terms. I control what I'm doing, we

379
00:17:03,360 --> 00:17:04,160
Speaker 2: control what we're doing.

380
00:17:04,240 --> 00:17:06,920
Speaker 1: We're also responsible for what you don't do well, that's right,

381
00:17:07,080 --> 00:17:08,520
Speaker 1: I mean, that's the flip side of it. Yeah, and

382
00:17:08,560 --> 00:17:10,879
Speaker 1: you haven't hit that part of the of the journey yet. No,

383
00:17:10,920 --> 00:17:12,520
Speaker 1: because I want to talk to you just let's talk

384
00:17:12,560 --> 00:17:15,920
Speaker 1: about the job itself, as anyone in your family ever had.

385
00:17:17,080 --> 00:17:19,000
Speaker 1: So the first time was the most foreign place in

386
00:17:19,040 --> 00:17:19,560
Speaker 1: the world for you.

387
00:17:19,600 --> 00:17:21,800
Speaker 2: That went in twenty seventeen, I was at n ROL

388
00:17:21,840 --> 00:17:23,399
Speaker 2: dot com and I went and covered the Prime Minister's

389
00:17:23,440 --> 00:17:26,000
Speaker 2: game over there, which was an eye opener. And then

390
00:17:26,040 --> 00:17:28,280
Speaker 2: I went back this year, sorry last year for the

391
00:17:28,280 --> 00:17:31,280
Speaker 2: first time with Andrew Abdoh and Ray Dibb and the

392
00:17:31,359 --> 00:17:36,280
Speaker 2: chief Skies that were there. And honestly I went there

393
00:17:36,280 --> 00:17:38,440
Speaker 2: as a journey I had no thought whatsoever.

394
00:17:38,040 --> 00:17:39,280
Speaker 1: That you invited as a journalist.

395
00:17:39,400 --> 00:17:42,000
Speaker 2: Yeah. I was there for the Sydney Morning Herald writing

396
00:17:42,000 --> 00:17:43,280
Speaker 2: a story about what I was going to be like

397
00:17:43,320 --> 00:17:47,080
Speaker 2: for the Chiefs when they move in and one thing

398
00:17:47,160 --> 00:17:50,240
Speaker 2: led to another. Two months later, I was in London

399
00:17:50,320 --> 00:17:52,840
Speaker 2: with Peterful and he's and Andrew Abdot and there were

400
00:17:52,880 --> 00:17:55,840
Speaker 2: conversations around would you be interested in working at the NRL.

401
00:17:55,960 --> 00:17:58,520
Speaker 2: I'm like, it's probably not for me working at the NRL.

402
00:17:59,680 --> 00:18:02,000
Speaker 2: But then they threw up PNG and I was remember

403
00:18:02,040 --> 00:18:04,439
Speaker 2: I was at the hotel with them in London for

404
00:18:04,480 --> 00:18:08,000
Speaker 2: the Ashes tour and my first instinct was, what do

405
00:18:08,040 --> 00:18:10,199
Speaker 2: you mean, Peene, what are you talking about? You know

406
00:18:11,600 --> 00:18:14,720
Speaker 2: I don't My initial reaction was I don't want that

407
00:18:14,800 --> 00:18:16,399
Speaker 2: life for my kids. Now when I say that, I

408
00:18:16,400 --> 00:18:18,800
Speaker 2: don't mean the country's not good enough. I've just said,

409
00:18:19,119 --> 00:18:20,920
Speaker 2: you know, you know, it's like with the WOG background

410
00:18:20,960 --> 00:18:23,960
Speaker 2: and families. It's all about family and cousins and grandparents

411
00:18:24,000 --> 00:18:26,480
Speaker 2: and everyone's together and in aunties and uncles. I didn't

412
00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:28,560
Speaker 2: want my kids not to grow up around that. But

413
00:18:28,600 --> 00:18:30,399
Speaker 2: it wasn't until I stopped and actually thought about what

414
00:18:30,440 --> 00:18:32,880
Speaker 2: this opportunity would do for my children and my family

415
00:18:33,840 --> 00:18:38,640
Speaker 2: in terms of such an incredible, humbling experience for them

416
00:18:38,760 --> 00:18:42,160
Speaker 2: and being able to do something that I always dreamt

417
00:18:42,160 --> 00:18:44,480
Speaker 2: of doing but never thought it was realistic, Like who

418
00:18:44,480 --> 00:18:46,399
Speaker 2: else gets to build their own footy club from the

419
00:18:46,440 --> 00:18:49,240
Speaker 2: ground up, you know, and I've loved every minute of it.

420
00:18:49,280 --> 00:18:51,119
Speaker 2: And when they put it on the table initial reaction

421
00:18:51,160 --> 00:18:53,600
Speaker 2: with Nan no, I can't. But my wife actually said

422
00:18:53,600 --> 00:18:58,080
Speaker 2: to me, like, think about what this could do for you,

423
00:18:58,200 --> 00:19:02,120
Speaker 2: For our family, for the kids we've sort of been through.

424
00:19:02,200 --> 00:19:03,680
Speaker 2: It's been a rough few years for Like from a

425
00:19:03,720 --> 00:19:05,919
Speaker 2: family point of view. My daughter has been pretty ill

426
00:19:05,920 --> 00:19:08,680
Speaker 2: from when she was young, so that was a big

427
00:19:08,720 --> 00:19:10,840
Speaker 2: consideration for us. She's got juvenile art writers.

428
00:19:10,920 --> 00:19:12,199
Speaker 1: What's that mean to you?

429
00:19:12,480 --> 00:19:15,760
Speaker 2: So when So basically the inflammation of the joints. It's

430
00:19:15,800 --> 00:19:18,840
Speaker 2: an autoimmune disease. So she was eleven months old when

431
00:19:18,880 --> 00:19:20,639
Speaker 2: she was diagnosed. We had no idea it was going on.

432
00:19:20,680 --> 00:19:22,159
Speaker 2: They thought it was the kemia, they thought it was

433
00:19:22,200 --> 00:19:25,280
Speaker 2: a heart condition. We're in a hospital throughout the COVID period,

434
00:19:25,280 --> 00:19:28,080
Speaker 2: which was an absolute nightmare. She spent a large chunk

435
00:19:28,119 --> 00:19:32,160
Speaker 2: of her life in hospital and she struggled for years,

436
00:19:32,240 --> 00:19:35,199
Speaker 2: like simple things like rolling over in bed. I had

437
00:19:35,200 --> 00:19:36,600
Speaker 2: to physically roll her in the middle of the night.

438
00:19:36,680 --> 00:19:40,400
Speaker 2: She couldn't move. Changing a nappy was agony. So it's

439
00:19:40,480 --> 00:19:43,320
Speaker 2: been a rough journey for the family. But she's in

440
00:19:43,359 --> 00:19:45,440
Speaker 2: a good place now, and so that fear is in

441
00:19:45,480 --> 00:19:48,639
Speaker 2: your head. It's like, she's still medicated, we still have

442
00:19:48,720 --> 00:19:51,359
Speaker 2: to treat her. What if we go over there and

443
00:19:51,400 --> 00:19:53,880
Speaker 2: things just unravel. So they were so hospital something, Well,

444
00:19:53,880 --> 00:19:56,680
Speaker 2: that's that's right. If you saw her, you wouldn't notice

445
00:19:57,040 --> 00:20:00,480
Speaker 2: that she was diagnosed with juvenile last writer. Right now

446
00:20:00,520 --> 00:20:02,960
Speaker 2: she's doing well. But as parents were like, are we

447
00:20:03,040 --> 00:20:05,520
Speaker 2: doing the wrong thing by her? You know, so all

448
00:20:05,520 --> 00:20:09,240
Speaker 2: these thoughts going through your head, and I don't know.

449
00:20:09,800 --> 00:20:11,920
Speaker 2: I just took a while to come to the decision.

450
00:20:11,960 --> 00:20:14,439
Speaker 2: But I honestly believe this experience for the kids is

451
00:20:14,440 --> 00:20:17,040
Speaker 2: going to be something that they'll cherish for the rest

452
00:20:17,080 --> 00:20:17,600
Speaker 2: of their lives.

453
00:20:17,600 --> 00:20:20,000
Speaker 1: I've got her out of the line. Who was the

454
00:20:20,000 --> 00:20:22,720
Speaker 1: most influential person was of Landis Or. I mean, who

455
00:20:22,720 --> 00:20:25,400
Speaker 1: do you turn to get external advice apart from your wife?

456
00:20:25,440 --> 00:20:28,800
Speaker 2: Of course, obviously I'm close to Peter, but it's different

457
00:20:28,800 --> 00:20:30,400
Speaker 2: in this situation. They're the one's offering you the job.

458
00:20:30,680 --> 00:20:32,399
Speaker 1: He's negotia. He's on the other side of on the.

459
00:20:32,400 --> 00:20:34,760
Speaker 2: Other side of it. You know, I'm pretty fortunate. I've

460
00:20:34,760 --> 00:20:37,560
Speaker 2: got some really good mentors for me. Someone you alluded

461
00:20:37,600 --> 00:20:41,199
Speaker 2: to earlier in David Gingel. He's been enormous for me

462
00:20:41,840 --> 00:20:44,160
Speaker 2: from a media perspective, but also and guided me through that.

463
00:20:44,720 --> 00:20:49,119
Speaker 2: He was a sounding board for me. Matt Cameron, the

464
00:20:49,119 --> 00:20:53,600
Speaker 2: Panthers CEO. He's someone that I've he overlooked me as

465
00:20:53,600 --> 00:20:55,639
Speaker 2: a young kid coming through the Paramatta system, didn't pick me.

466
00:20:55,680 --> 00:20:57,320
Speaker 2: But that's why I won't go there. Won't go there.

467
00:20:57,320 --> 00:20:59,760
Speaker 1: How dumb was that didn't want me to play?

468
00:21:00,520 --> 00:21:02,359
Speaker 2: Picked A couple of guys Nave Trent Hudkinson and Chris

469
00:21:02,400 --> 00:21:05,879
Speaker 2: Keening gave Hi him anyway, he was proven right. But

470
00:21:06,000 --> 00:21:08,280
Speaker 2: I've got a lot of respect for what he's done

471
00:21:08,280 --> 00:21:10,679
Speaker 2: at Penrith and he's someone that I spoke a lot

472
00:21:10,760 --> 00:21:13,320
Speaker 2: about what this role would be like, how it would work,

473
00:21:13,680 --> 00:21:17,639
Speaker 2: Could I actually do it? So his advice Adam Droueci

474
00:21:17,680 --> 00:21:19,680
Speaker 2: at the Bulldogs, the chairman.

475
00:21:21,640 --> 00:21:23,920
Speaker 1: Also the chairman of Quantum.

476
00:21:24,000 --> 00:21:26,800
Speaker 2: Yep. Yeah, he's someone that's been that I spoke to.

477
00:21:26,840 --> 00:21:28,320
Speaker 2: I was actually in England with him at the time.

478
00:21:29,480 --> 00:21:31,159
Speaker 2: We're at the Liverpool game. We're at Liverpool, I was

479
00:21:31,200 --> 00:21:33,040
Speaker 2: asked the Villa Premier League and I sat down with him.

480
00:21:33,040 --> 00:21:35,159
Speaker 2: My kids are with me. We're watching the game and

481
00:21:35,160 --> 00:21:37,520
Speaker 2: I sort of chat with him about the potential of

482
00:21:37,560 --> 00:21:40,240
Speaker 2: doing this. So guys like that, I have a lot

483
00:21:40,240 --> 00:21:43,760
Speaker 2: of respectful I hope I'm not forgetting any one of those. Obviously,

484
00:21:43,760 --> 00:21:44,840
Speaker 2: a lot of guys in the game that you do

485
00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:47,240
Speaker 2: in a relationship with the in huge. My former editor

486
00:21:47,280 --> 00:21:51,359
Speaker 2: Ben Cody at The Herald, guys like that were huge

487
00:21:51,359 --> 00:21:51,560
Speaker 2: for me.

488
00:21:51,960 --> 00:21:53,120
Speaker 1: And what got you there?

489
00:21:54,480 --> 00:21:55,080
Speaker 2: Do you know what?

490
00:21:55,080 --> 00:21:55,800
Speaker 1: What was the moment?

491
00:21:55,960 --> 00:21:59,280
Speaker 2: I just just ask myself one question, how would I

492
00:21:59,280 --> 00:22:01,040
Speaker 2: feel if someone else got this right? If I didn't

493
00:22:01,040 --> 00:22:03,040
Speaker 2: do it and someone else got it, I thought I

494
00:22:03,040 --> 00:22:04,359
Speaker 2: would regret it that the rest of my life if

495
00:22:04,400 --> 00:22:05,520
Speaker 2: I didn't give it a crack.

496
00:22:05,520 --> 00:22:07,320
Speaker 1: Feel like someone had get in the story. You should

497
00:22:07,320 --> 00:22:09,560
Speaker 1: have got yourself. Yeah, soon I was got the job.

498
00:22:09,640 --> 00:22:12,000
Speaker 2: I knew I wanted to do it. It was just

499
00:22:12,080 --> 00:22:15,320
Speaker 2: the challenge of family that was keep me from doing it.

500
00:22:15,680 --> 00:22:17,800
Speaker 2: And when I felt better for my wife about it,

501
00:22:18,200 --> 00:22:20,720
Speaker 2: and when the kids, well, my eldest was excited and

502
00:22:20,800 --> 00:22:22,600
Speaker 2: the young ones didn't quite want to leave their friends

503
00:22:22,640 --> 00:22:26,280
Speaker 2: from school. But yeah, that's why when I went last week,

504
00:22:26,320 --> 00:22:27,520
Speaker 2: it felt good. Felt right.

505
00:22:27,840 --> 00:22:32,240
Speaker 1: Before we get onto the chiefs in your journalistic career,

506
00:22:32,720 --> 00:22:35,199
Speaker 1: I mean, you had some crazy dust ups. You had

507
00:22:35,240 --> 00:22:38,760
Speaker 1: some great moments. What are some of the great Give

508
00:22:38,800 --> 00:22:40,840
Speaker 1: me a couple of the great moments you're really happy

509
00:22:40,840 --> 00:22:44,680
Speaker 1: to cover? Like yeah, in terms of fun, like cool stuff.

510
00:22:44,480 --> 00:22:47,600
Speaker 2: I went to Wimwooden and covered Winmweden a couple of times.

511
00:22:47,640 --> 00:22:51,800
Speaker 2: I went to Olympics and covered Brazil and Paris probably

512
00:22:51,840 --> 00:22:56,439
Speaker 2: the highlight in terms of absolute fun. And like the

513
00:22:56,520 --> 00:22:59,239
Speaker 2: Jared Haynes story when he went to the NFL. I

514
00:22:59,240 --> 00:23:01,400
Speaker 2: got to go over there six weeks, oh wow, and

515
00:23:01,560 --> 00:23:03,919
Speaker 2: cover that and that was you remember what it was

516
00:23:03,920 --> 00:23:05,600
Speaker 2: like at the time. It was the story of the country.

517
00:23:05,680 --> 00:23:09,760
Speaker 2: It was It's all anything anyone wanted to know about

518
00:23:09,840 --> 00:23:11,280
Speaker 2: was what was happening with Jared? Was he going to

519
00:23:11,320 --> 00:23:13,639
Speaker 2: make and would he make it exactly? And to be

520
00:23:13,760 --> 00:23:16,520
Speaker 2: there and I got exclusive with him over there. I

521
00:23:16,600 --> 00:23:19,640
Speaker 2: went to NFL headquarters in New York. It was such

522
00:23:19,640 --> 00:23:21,600
Speaker 2: an amazing experience. It was just before I had my

523
00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:26,240
Speaker 2: first child and never covered anything like that, Like I

524
00:23:26,359 --> 00:23:30,560
Speaker 2: just that was unbelievable. But in terms of personal satisfaction,

525
00:23:31,400 --> 00:23:36,000
Speaker 2: one that woul probably you know really well helping share

526
00:23:36,040 --> 00:23:39,520
Speaker 2: Angus Crichton's story did that with him sat down in

527
00:23:39,640 --> 00:23:44,600
Speaker 2: La after what he'd been through, mental health, mental health issues,

528
00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:48,080
Speaker 2: the manic episodes that he had, sitting down with him,

529
00:23:48,400 --> 00:23:50,400
Speaker 2: watching him pour his heart out for the first time,

530
00:23:50,920 --> 00:23:53,200
Speaker 2: sitting down on camera and as he's reduced to tears

531
00:23:53,240 --> 00:23:57,520
Speaker 2: reliving the hell that he went through, and then seeing

532
00:23:57,560 --> 00:24:00,720
Speaker 2: the reaction after it came out, and the just the

533
00:24:01,359 --> 00:24:05,320
Speaker 2: overwhelming amount of support that he was experiencing from everyone

534
00:24:05,320 --> 00:24:08,000
Speaker 2: that had his back, who didn't quite understand what he

535
00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:11,840
Speaker 2: was going through, who watched that story or read that

536
00:24:11,880 --> 00:24:15,239
Speaker 2: story and felt wow, Like having an impact on his

537
00:24:15,280 --> 00:24:17,960
Speaker 2: life and helping him feel better about what he'd been

538
00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:21,479
Speaker 2: through was enormous for me. Like just that you know

539
00:24:21,520 --> 00:24:23,080
Speaker 2: that you can write the big stories or break the

540
00:24:23,080 --> 00:24:26,359
Speaker 2: big story about Sam Burgess being off, you know, Jason

541
00:24:26,359 --> 00:24:29,760
Speaker 2: Demetrell or special treatment around the trail, all that stuff,

542
00:24:29,880 --> 00:24:31,840
Speaker 2: their big stories and they created a lot of attention.

543
00:24:32,359 --> 00:24:34,720
Speaker 2: But to see what you do for someone's life, like

544
00:24:35,240 --> 00:24:37,880
Speaker 2: Angus Crichton, that was special.

545
00:24:38,240 --> 00:24:40,760
Speaker 1: Why do you think Angus decided to talk to you

546
00:24:40,800 --> 00:24:41,159
Speaker 1: about it?

547
00:24:41,160 --> 00:24:41,840
Speaker 2: Then? What is it?

548
00:24:41,880 --> 00:24:43,960
Speaker 1: I mean how they go howd you go through the process,

549
00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:46,400
Speaker 1: Like maybe you want to talk about this, you pick

550
00:24:46,440 --> 00:24:47,400
Speaker 1: up on the phone, talk to him.

551
00:24:47,359 --> 00:24:51,720
Speaker 2: Or I actually rang Trent Robinson and the Roosters when

552
00:24:51,760 --> 00:24:53,560
Speaker 2: it was because I went on the World Cup just

553
00:24:53,560 --> 00:24:56,960
Speaker 2: before he went to France, and he obviously struggled in

554
00:24:56,960 --> 00:25:00,479
Speaker 2: France and ended up in a mental ward over France.

555
00:25:01,320 --> 00:25:02,920
Speaker 2: When I got back, I got wind of the fact

556
00:25:02,960 --> 00:25:06,440
Speaker 2: that he was struggling and that he was in a.

557
00:25:06,440 --> 00:25:08,520
Speaker 1: Really really dark place, so manic for a while.

558
00:25:08,600 --> 00:25:11,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was manic for a while. It was medicated.

559
00:25:11,280 --> 00:25:14,640
Speaker 2: He was in and out of out of mental rehab.

560
00:25:15,840 --> 00:25:19,240
Speaker 2: And I rang Robo and the Roosters and I was said,

561
00:25:19,520 --> 00:25:22,119
Speaker 2: this is the information I have, this is the story

562
00:25:22,160 --> 00:25:26,080
Speaker 2: that I want to write. And speaking to them, I

563
00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:32,720
Speaker 2: understood just how, just how what's the word I'm looking for?

564
00:25:33,040 --> 00:25:33,600
Speaker 1: Sensitive?

565
00:25:33,760 --> 00:25:36,439
Speaker 2: Oh? Yeah, sensitive? But just he was on edge like

566
00:25:36,720 --> 00:25:38,639
Speaker 2: and something like that could tip him over the edge.

567
00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:39,960
Speaker 1: The whole thing was sensitive.

568
00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:42,320
Speaker 2: He was, and the club explained that to me and

569
00:25:42,359 --> 00:25:44,280
Speaker 2: the sensitivities around it, and I made a decision as

570
00:25:44,280 --> 00:25:47,680
Speaker 2: a journalist that I wouldn't write the story. We let that,

571
00:25:48,400 --> 00:25:51,240
Speaker 2: We let it go. Obviously, in our industry you want

572
00:25:51,280 --> 00:25:53,399
Speaker 2: to tell the big stories. It was a big story.

573
00:25:54,119 --> 00:25:57,720
Speaker 2: But I also was respectful of the fact that doing

574
00:25:57,760 --> 00:26:00,159
Speaker 2: this was going to send somebody into a place that

575
00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:01,080
Speaker 2: wasn't good for them.

576
00:26:01,359 --> 00:26:06,000
Speaker 1: Was there some sort of journalistic and the standard that

577
00:26:06,560 --> 00:26:08,280
Speaker 1: you can make that decision or is it the other

578
00:26:08,320 --> 00:26:09,720
Speaker 1: standard the other way, like, is this a story? You

579
00:26:09,800 --> 00:26:11,240
Speaker 1: got to report it? Like, I don't understand.

580
00:26:11,920 --> 00:26:14,240
Speaker 2: I think I've been lucky enough that my editors have

581
00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:16,840
Speaker 2: always backed me to make the right call. Some editors

582
00:26:16,920 --> 00:26:18,159
Speaker 2: might force you in to write and a story. No,

583
00:26:18,280 --> 00:26:20,520
Speaker 2: that's a story, you'd write it, that's it. Whereas in

584
00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:23,440
Speaker 2: that situation they said, you do what you think is right.

585
00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:27,360
Speaker 2: We'll back yet. And that decision was not to write it.

586
00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:30,080
Speaker 2: And the manager Dave Rawens, at the time, I think

587
00:26:30,119 --> 00:26:32,520
Speaker 2: he respected the fact that we didn't do it. So

588
00:26:32,560 --> 00:26:34,040
Speaker 2: when the time came that he was in a much

589
00:26:34,040 --> 00:26:37,359
Speaker 2: better place when the opportunity came down for angers to

590
00:26:37,400 --> 00:26:41,240
Speaker 2: sit down and tell his story, I think they remembered

591
00:26:41,280 --> 00:26:43,640
Speaker 2: and respected the fact that I didn't do it when

592
00:26:43,640 --> 00:26:47,960
Speaker 2: I had the chance to. Originally, so when I had

593
00:26:47,960 --> 00:26:49,760
Speaker 2: a little bit of relationship with Angus, I wasn't close

594
00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:51,960
Speaker 2: to him, and I remember I went for a coffee

595
00:26:51,960 --> 00:26:53,760
Speaker 2: with him. It was during it was in La We

596
00:26:53,840 --> 00:26:57,640
Speaker 2: went to just somewhere down near the University of.

597
00:26:59,040 --> 00:27:02,840
Speaker 1: You see Lay they were training you c la.

598
00:27:02,520 --> 00:27:04,280
Speaker 2: You cla. We went for a coffee for about three

599
00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:07,479
Speaker 2: hours and he was quite emotional. It was quite emotional.

600
00:27:07,480 --> 00:27:09,640
Speaker 2: And then we sat back here at the SFS and

601
00:27:09,720 --> 00:27:11,480
Speaker 2: that's when he on camera for a Channel nine and

602
00:27:11,480 --> 00:27:15,120
Speaker 2: he poured his heart out and started crying going through

603
00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:18,200
Speaker 2: the story. And I know, as I said, like, they're

604
00:27:18,200 --> 00:27:20,600
Speaker 2: the ones that you will remember as a journal.

605
00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:23,080
Speaker 1: When you I was going to say, when you sat

606
00:27:23,119 --> 00:27:27,120
Speaker 1: back and watched the show itself, how did you feel

607
00:27:27,119 --> 00:27:28,520
Speaker 1: about it?

608
00:27:28,520 --> 00:27:32,280
Speaker 2: It's you're more worried about the reaction than the actual story.

609
00:27:32,440 --> 00:27:34,000
Speaker 2: Like you look at it like I'm not one to

610
00:27:34,000 --> 00:27:36,679
Speaker 2: look at comments about your stories or about you, but

611
00:27:36,760 --> 00:27:38,520
Speaker 2: I was looking at that because I was worried about

612
00:27:38,520 --> 00:27:40,280
Speaker 2: how he would be perceived, and I wanted him to

613
00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:43,400
Speaker 2: be I wanted him to look at that and think

614
00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:46,240
Speaker 2: I made the right decision trusting this guy and tell

615
00:27:46,280 --> 00:27:48,360
Speaker 2: my story and it's okay, and then it's okay. Yeah.

616
00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:51,359
Speaker 2: So I was really like checking everything, reading what eeveryone

617
00:27:51,440 --> 00:27:53,639
Speaker 2: was saying, and to see the outpouring emotion from the

618
00:27:53,680 --> 00:27:55,600
Speaker 2: Ruguay leagu community and not just the Rugul league community,

619
00:27:55,640 --> 00:27:59,000
Speaker 2: everyone get behind and rally behind him, and then to

620
00:27:59,040 --> 00:28:01,000
Speaker 2: see him then go on and play the best football

621
00:28:01,040 --> 00:28:02,720
Speaker 2: of his career. I reckon that period.

622
00:28:02,760 --> 00:28:04,679
Speaker 1: Yeah, that totally was Well, that's when he won the

623
00:28:04,680 --> 00:28:08,160
Speaker 1: best the best player you know in the Save series.

624
00:28:08,200 --> 00:28:09,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, and he was probably one of your best players,

625
00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:10,840
Speaker 2: the best player.

626
00:28:10,600 --> 00:28:12,720
Speaker 1: That he was probably the best background in the competition that.

627
00:28:12,840 --> 00:28:16,600
Speaker 2: Yeah. So to see that all flow on, Yeah, it's

628
00:28:16,640 --> 00:28:20,200
Speaker 2: so satisfying. It's yeah, it's saying that. As I said,

629
00:28:20,240 --> 00:28:21,000
Speaker 2: you don't forget that.

630
00:28:21,119 --> 00:28:24,200
Speaker 1: What were some of the shitty moments, some shitty moments.

631
00:28:24,240 --> 00:28:26,280
Speaker 2: I remember one when I was younger, actually the first

632
00:28:26,320 --> 00:28:29,960
Speaker 2: time I got sprayed Steve Crawley, Yeah he was he

633
00:28:30,000 --> 00:28:32,280
Speaker 2: was at nine. We went rold wasn't owned by Night

634
00:28:32,320 --> 00:28:34,199
Speaker 2: at the time, and it was in the days of

635
00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:38,960
Speaker 2: the NRL season was moving across into the cricket period

636
00:28:39,400 --> 00:28:41,440
Speaker 2: and Round one class with that, remember the Try series

637
00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:43,280
Speaker 2: I used to play classed with the final I think

638
00:28:43,280 --> 00:28:44,880
Speaker 2: it might have been Australia Salanka and I remember wrote

639
00:28:44,920 --> 00:28:47,120
Speaker 2: the story about channel. I had a big decision to

640
00:28:47,120 --> 00:28:49,720
Speaker 2: make whether to go with Broncos Eels on the main

641
00:28:49,760 --> 00:28:54,160
Speaker 2: channel or Australia Slanka final. And we did that story,

642
00:28:54,280 --> 00:28:56,880
Speaker 2: which you know it's fair story. The next day the

643
00:28:56,880 --> 00:28:58,360
Speaker 2: bosses were like, all right, you now need to go

644
00:28:58,400 --> 00:29:00,160
Speaker 2: to David gin You who I didn't know at the time.

645
00:29:00,520 --> 00:29:03,320
Speaker 2: He's a CEO. Don't worry about Steve Crawley. You need

646
00:29:03,360 --> 00:29:05,040
Speaker 2: to go to the top and find out what's going on.

647
00:29:05,080 --> 00:29:08,920
Speaker 2: Get a quote from him. And I did, coot no problem,

648
00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:11,920
Speaker 2: got the number for David Kinjall called him. I can't

649
00:29:11,920 --> 00:29:14,120
Speaker 2: even remember whether he answer or not. But not long after,

650
00:29:14,160 --> 00:29:17,600
Speaker 2: Steve Crawley rang me and he gave me an absolute

651
00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:19,959
Speaker 2: godful for going over the top of him. And I

652
00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:22,880
Speaker 2: just remember being stunned and like I didn't meet Like

653
00:29:23,120 --> 00:29:25,040
Speaker 2: I was just like, this is the first spray I've

654
00:29:25,080 --> 00:29:30,080
Speaker 2: ever copped in media. And yeah, that one lived with

655
00:29:30,120 --> 00:29:31,760
Speaker 2: me for a while because I was like, do I

656
00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:33,480
Speaker 2: really want to do this? I'm upsetting people the way

657
00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:35,880
Speaker 2: that I upset him. But you learn to develop thickskin

658
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:36,480
Speaker 2: over the time.

659
00:29:36,640 --> 00:29:40,120
Speaker 1: Do you call any sprays from anybody else? Didn't you

660
00:29:40,120 --> 00:29:41,000
Speaker 1: and Guss have a bit of.

661
00:29:40,920 --> 00:29:43,040
Speaker 2: A oh that was I wouldn't say it was a spray.

662
00:29:43,080 --> 00:29:45,280
Speaker 2: We had the argument on air. I actually I did

663
00:29:45,280 --> 00:29:47,520
Speaker 2: cop sprays from Gus before that, like I when he

664
00:29:47,560 --> 00:29:49,800
Speaker 2: was at Penrith for things that some things that I

665
00:29:49,840 --> 00:29:53,600
Speaker 2: didn't even that I didn't even do. But Gus and

666
00:29:53,640 --> 00:29:55,560
Speaker 2: I actually have a lot of like. I do have

667
00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:57,080
Speaker 2: a lot of respect for Gus. I used to come

668
00:29:57,160 --> 00:30:02,040
Speaker 2: rush home after training, footage training and record his origin

669
00:30:02,160 --> 00:30:04,360
Speaker 2: is Prematch spill right, and I used to just remember

670
00:30:04,440 --> 00:30:06,680
Speaker 2: and recite it. A big part of what I did

671
00:30:06,760 --> 00:30:10,080
Speaker 2: and wanted to do was because of Gus, but I

672
00:30:10,080 --> 00:30:12,920
Speaker 2: also in my role, I had to write things that

673
00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:15,160
Speaker 2: he didn't like. And I think we fell out over

674
00:30:15,200 --> 00:30:19,320
Speaker 2: the time of Ivan Cleary getting the job at Penrith

675
00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:21,840
Speaker 2: because I was the first to report that I haven't

676
00:30:22,040 --> 00:30:25,720
Speaker 2: agreed to terms and Gus rang me abusing me about that,

677
00:30:26,160 --> 00:30:27,800
Speaker 2: saying it's wrong, that's wrong, it's wrong. But I had

678
00:30:27,880 --> 00:30:30,800
Speaker 2: pretty good mail that it was right, and he didn't.

679
00:30:31,080 --> 00:30:33,840
Speaker 2: I didn't realize at the time that I was probably

680
00:30:33,840 --> 00:30:37,479
Speaker 2: caught up in a powerplay internally from guys at Panthers

681
00:30:37,480 --> 00:30:39,920
Speaker 2: who probably wanted Gus go on, because part of Ivan

682
00:30:39,960 --> 00:30:42,800
Speaker 2: coming back was to sort of ushered Gus out the

683
00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:45,960
Speaker 2: door in breaking that story that triggered a hole. It

684
00:30:46,080 --> 00:30:50,440
Speaker 2: was a snowball effect of people starting a sideline Gus.

685
00:30:50,520 --> 00:30:53,640
Speaker 2: I didn't realize that at the time, and I think

686
00:30:53,680 --> 00:30:55,920
Speaker 2: Gus sort of felt I was aligned with the other guys,

687
00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:57,680
Speaker 2: and yeah, I.

688
00:30:57,640 --> 00:30:59,720
Speaker 1: Couldn't trust Did you do with something like that when

689
00:30:59,760 --> 00:31:02,880
Speaker 1: some like girl feel girl and he can talk and

690
00:31:02,920 --> 00:31:05,200
Speaker 1: he can he can give a spray and he can argue.

691
00:31:05,240 --> 00:31:06,800
Speaker 1: He's very good on his feet. Like the boy should

692
00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:08,560
Speaker 1: have been a barrister or something like that. He should

693
00:31:08,560 --> 00:31:09,560
Speaker 1: have been in another life.

694
00:31:09,560 --> 00:31:10,320
Speaker 2: I think he's incredible.

695
00:31:10,320 --> 00:31:12,400
Speaker 1: He just actually studied law for a while, so he

696
00:31:12,440 --> 00:31:14,680
Speaker 1: would have been a great barrister in an argument, in

697
00:31:15,160 --> 00:31:17,440
Speaker 1: argument in the court room? What do you do in

698
00:31:17,440 --> 00:31:19,600
Speaker 1: that situation? What is Michael Chammers? Did you just copet sweet?

699
00:31:20,840 --> 00:31:21,560
Speaker 1: Or do you go back?

700
00:31:21,720 --> 00:31:23,960
Speaker 2: There was a different I just in that one. I

701
00:31:24,000 --> 00:31:26,800
Speaker 2: was confident, Like in that one, I knew that was right.

702
00:31:26,880 --> 00:31:28,880
Speaker 1: You stand you around, I said, I'm.

703
00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:32,800
Speaker 2: Sorry, Gus, but my mail's right. Yeah, what can I

704
00:31:33,160 --> 00:31:35,000
Speaker 2: Whether he knew at the time or not, I don't know.

705
00:31:35,720 --> 00:31:37,440
Speaker 2: I didn't realize that. I said the power play of

706
00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:39,680
Speaker 2: them wanting to move him on in the background, but

707
00:31:40,960 --> 00:31:42,680
Speaker 2: he probably felt undermined that I was part of that

708
00:31:42,840 --> 00:31:44,680
Speaker 2: and that I had aligned with the other side. Of

709
00:31:44,680 --> 00:31:47,520
Speaker 2: the organization, so I can understand why he didn't like me.

710
00:31:47,560 --> 00:31:50,200
Speaker 2: But if the story's right, the story's right, I'll stand

711
00:31:50,240 --> 00:31:52,800
Speaker 2: my ground. But if I do something wrong by someone,

712
00:31:53,040 --> 00:31:56,360
Speaker 2: well then my responsibility to apologize. But in that situation,

713
00:31:57,560 --> 00:31:58,400
Speaker 2: the story was right.

714
00:31:58,520 --> 00:32:00,640
Speaker 1: But what do you think then when you go let's

715
00:32:00,640 --> 00:32:04,080
Speaker 1: go fast forward a few years more close to more

716
00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:08,720
Speaker 1: recent times. You know some of these people over their reputations.

717
00:32:09,280 --> 00:32:13,600
Speaker 1: Do you think to yourself, there's a story about Lucky Galvin,

718
00:32:14,400 --> 00:32:16,920
Speaker 1: Gus will never forget what happened in the past. Do

719
00:32:16,960 --> 00:32:19,080
Speaker 1: you think these people carry this through as part of

720
00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:20,640
Speaker 1: their profiling of Michael Chamis.

721
00:32:20,800 --> 00:32:23,440
Speaker 2: Yeah for sure, Yeah, for sure, and especially someone as

722
00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:26,400
Speaker 2: powerful as as gust Like he's got his yea, Gus

723
00:32:26,480 --> 00:32:27,880
Speaker 2: has been around the game a long time. He has

724
00:32:27,880 --> 00:32:30,680
Speaker 2: relationships with it, with who he needs to have relationships

725
00:32:30,680 --> 00:32:33,160
Speaker 2: in the media, and I realized a long time ago

726
00:32:33,200 --> 00:32:34,840
Speaker 2: that I was never going to be in that circle,

727
00:32:35,000 --> 00:32:36,440
Speaker 2: and I became okay with that.

728
00:32:36,600 --> 00:32:37,760
Speaker 1: Well you would have if you had to stay as

729
00:32:37,760 --> 00:32:39,880
Speaker 1: long as he did, Well, if I was there that

730
00:32:39,920 --> 00:32:42,200
Speaker 1: whole time. Yeah, he is in his sixties, Like if

731
00:32:42,200 --> 00:32:43,200
Speaker 1: you had to stay there as long.

732
00:32:43,240 --> 00:32:46,920
Speaker 2: If yeah, maybe maybe but I realized, like someone I've

733
00:32:46,960 --> 00:32:49,120
Speaker 2: got a lot of time for is Danny Widlert. Yeah,

734
00:32:49,760 --> 00:32:51,760
Speaker 2: very close to Danny. He's someone that I consider a

735
00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:53,480
Speaker 2: mental and someone when you asked about who I were

736
00:32:53,480 --> 00:32:55,880
Speaker 2: talking to about taking the job on, Danny was someone

737
00:32:55,920 --> 00:32:58,680
Speaker 2: that I was talking to. So I know Danny and

738
00:32:58,760 --> 00:33:01,080
Speaker 2: Gus are close, and I was going to be his Danny.

739
00:33:02,000 --> 00:33:05,800
Speaker 2: I never wanted to be. So I have a responsibility

740
00:33:05,800 --> 00:33:07,360
Speaker 2: when I'm sitting on that panel. As much as I

741
00:33:07,360 --> 00:33:09,040
Speaker 2: sit there and think you don't belong here in imposta,

742
00:33:09,080 --> 00:33:11,880
Speaker 2: You're sitting next to camera Smith Paul Gallon and feel

743
00:33:11,880 --> 00:33:13,920
Speaker 2: good like what are you doing here? Reality is the

744
00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:16,760
Speaker 2: only reason I am there is because I need to

745
00:33:16,800 --> 00:33:19,120
Speaker 2: do my job, and that is sometimes to question the

746
00:33:19,120 --> 00:33:21,400
Speaker 2: people that are on that panel, is to provide information

747
00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:23,640
Speaker 2: they might not want out there. That's why I get

748
00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:26,080
Speaker 2: to sit on this chair. And so that night that unfolded,

749
00:33:27,360 --> 00:33:29,360
Speaker 2: that was my job. The reason I was there and

750
00:33:29,640 --> 00:33:33,680
Speaker 2: the whole Rugby League world was asking the questions that

751
00:33:33,360 --> 00:33:36,320
Speaker 2: that I asked, that I pushed on. It wasn't because

752
00:33:36,320 --> 00:33:39,000
Speaker 2: I don't like us. Actually I like Gus. It doesn't

753
00:33:39,040 --> 00:33:40,880
Speaker 2: like me, but I like us. But it's my job

754
00:33:40,880 --> 00:33:43,920
Speaker 2: in that situation to ask the question, and that's what happened.

755
00:33:44,040 --> 00:33:46,440
Speaker 1: It's interesting you because you've got to be pretty gutsy

756
00:33:46,480 --> 00:33:48,880
Speaker 1: to maintain your role. You know, you know, you knew

757
00:33:48,880 --> 00:33:50,760
Speaker 1: what your role was. You knew your role was to

758
00:33:50,840 --> 00:33:54,400
Speaker 1: challenge the conventional discussion that's going to be happening between

759
00:33:54,440 --> 00:33:57,640
Speaker 1: all the other panelists who probably were more on Gusta's

760
00:33:57,640 --> 00:34:00,800
Speaker 1: side than say, on your side in terms of the discussion,

761
00:34:02,320 --> 00:34:04,600
Speaker 1: how bigger do you get, like nerves in your guts

762
00:34:04,680 --> 00:34:05,960
Speaker 1: and I mean, how do you feel like.

763
00:34:05,920 --> 00:34:09,839
Speaker 2: Do you get them? Honestly, I didn't think it would

764
00:34:09,840 --> 00:34:12,640
Speaker 2: play out the way it did then, Like you, you

765
00:34:12,680 --> 00:34:15,879
Speaker 2: just thought it was a question because I think what

766
00:34:16,040 --> 00:34:18,360
Speaker 2: provoked him was when he said, no other CEO or

767
00:34:18,400 --> 00:34:20,000
Speaker 2: GM of a club has to come out here and

768
00:34:20,080 --> 00:34:24,080
Speaker 2: answer these questions. And I my first reaction, whether or

769
00:34:24,080 --> 00:34:26,319
Speaker 2: it was rude or not, my first reaction was, well,

770
00:34:26,880 --> 00:34:29,319
Speaker 2: that's your choice. And I think that set him off

771
00:34:29,320 --> 00:34:32,440
Speaker 2: because you know, he's obviously paid by nine and whatnot,

772
00:34:32,719 --> 00:34:36,680
Speaker 2: so that was I think what triggered his reaction to

773
00:34:36,760 --> 00:34:39,319
Speaker 2: my questioning was his probably not liking that I said that.

774
00:34:40,120 --> 00:34:43,560
Speaker 2: But it's my job. Mark luck. If I backed away

775
00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:46,080
Speaker 2: in that situation, I would become the laughing stock of

776
00:34:46,360 --> 00:34:49,160
Speaker 2: rugby league media. Like, in that situation, it's the biggest

777
00:34:49,200 --> 00:34:51,759
Speaker 2: story in the game, probably the biggest story of one

778
00:34:51,760 --> 00:34:53,720
Speaker 2: of the biggest stories, if not the biggest that I've covered,

779
00:34:53,719 --> 00:34:56,879
Speaker 2: that whole fallout from Galvin that fell into Benji, into

780
00:34:56,920 --> 00:34:59,120
Speaker 2: Rito into Gas, and it was huge.

781
00:34:59,320 --> 00:35:00,000
Speaker 1: That was a mess.

782
00:35:00,120 --> 00:35:02,799
Speaker 2: It was a mess. So if I don't do my

783
00:35:02,880 --> 00:35:06,279
Speaker 2: job in that situation, then I'm letting my work down,

784
00:35:06,680 --> 00:35:10,080
Speaker 2: letting myself down. So I had no regrets on it.

785
00:35:10,160 --> 00:35:12,680
Speaker 2: Unfortunately it didn't Gustin like and I really spoken to

786
00:35:12,760 --> 00:35:15,560
Speaker 2: him since, But it's part of the job.

787
00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:18,839
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's interesting because I've been thinking about you now

788
00:35:18,960 --> 00:35:21,359
Speaker 1: as you're speaking about becoming a general manager or being

789
00:35:21,400 --> 00:35:24,719
Speaker 1: a general manager of a new club. So basically you've

790
00:35:24,719 --> 00:35:28,160
Speaker 1: got to be a business person now, not just a journalist.

791
00:35:28,920 --> 00:35:30,799
Speaker 1: One of the really key things here is, of course,

792
00:35:30,880 --> 00:35:34,000
Speaker 1: is recruiting. You've got to have a team. You've gotta

793
00:35:33,960 --> 00:35:36,719
Speaker 1: have a good team. And one of the things that

794
00:35:36,760 --> 00:35:40,680
Speaker 1: struck me about you is that I think I'd like

795
00:35:40,719 --> 00:35:42,000
Speaker 1: to know what you think about this, but I think

796
00:35:42,040 --> 00:35:45,960
Speaker 1: you're probably over time, not only be good at getting

797
00:35:45,960 --> 00:35:49,360
Speaker 1: the stories and being courageous and standing up to various people.

798
00:35:50,280 --> 00:35:52,880
Speaker 1: But it seems as though you've been a pretty good

799
00:35:53,560 --> 00:35:56,920
Speaker 1: become a pretty good assessor of a football player. I mean,

800
00:35:56,960 --> 00:35:59,440
Speaker 1: you're not a coach, but as GM, you're going to

801
00:35:59,480 --> 00:36:02,200
Speaker 1: have to be close to the managers. You're gonna have

802
00:36:02,320 --> 00:36:06,480
Speaker 1: no which players for which positions to choose. You're going

803
00:36:06,520 --> 00:36:08,960
Speaker 1: to have limited supply chain because a lot of them

804
00:36:08,960 --> 00:36:12,480
Speaker 1: don't leave where they are. You have to pick out

805
00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:14,000
Speaker 1: a halfback that's going to work with the five eight,

806
00:36:14,000 --> 00:36:15,600
Speaker 1: it's going to work with their centers, going to work

807
00:36:15,600 --> 00:36:18,200
Speaker 1: with the winger. You have to know all these parts. Yeah,

808
00:36:19,000 --> 00:36:22,960
Speaker 1: do you reckon You've accumulated enough enough over time? You

809
00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:25,759
Speaker 1: know with what the current stock is. Do you reckon

810
00:36:25,800 --> 00:36:27,719
Speaker 1: you've accumulated enough to put it together? And how do

811
00:36:27,719 --> 00:36:29,400
Speaker 1: you put something together once you start?

812
00:36:29,680 --> 00:36:32,840
Speaker 2: I think, well, I can't speak on the NRL's behalf,

813
00:36:32,880 --> 00:36:35,640
Speaker 2: but I think the reason that Peter and Andrew wanted

814
00:36:35,640 --> 00:36:39,640
Speaker 2: me to do it is because if I didn't know

815
00:36:39,680 --> 00:36:41,840
Speaker 2: it myself, I knew the people who could provide the answers. Like,

816
00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:43,719
Speaker 2: I'm not an expert in rugby league. I'm not going

817
00:36:43,760 --> 00:36:45,520
Speaker 2: to get involved in coaching. But I could tell you

818
00:36:46,520 --> 00:36:49,280
Speaker 2: straight away if a player was lazy, how they trained,

819
00:36:49,560 --> 00:36:53,200
Speaker 2: what their off field habits were, where they put them

820
00:36:53,200 --> 00:36:55,479
Speaker 2: as people, what their partners were like.

821
00:36:55,640 --> 00:36:57,440
Speaker 1: Or there are all data points. There are all data points,

822
00:36:57,800 --> 00:36:58,520
Speaker 1: all of them, and.

823
00:36:58,520 --> 00:37:00,000
Speaker 2: They're so important to ask more than any other clubs

824
00:37:00,080 --> 00:37:02,520
Speaker 2: because we're all living together. So the kind of person

825
00:37:02,520 --> 00:37:04,440
Speaker 2: that we wanted to bring in, which is why the

826
00:37:04,480 --> 00:37:06,480
Speaker 2: Jerome law are signing for us. It just ticked every

827
00:37:06,520 --> 00:37:08,360
Speaker 2: single box, every.

828
00:37:08,160 --> 00:37:10,600
Speaker 1: Box, Like, what give us some of the boxes.

829
00:37:11,360 --> 00:37:13,239
Speaker 2: Let's just take football side for a second, because that

830
00:37:13,320 --> 00:37:15,879
Speaker 2: put it aside. He speaks for itself his football point

831
00:37:15,880 --> 00:37:19,480
Speaker 2: of view. But I wanted to prove a point. Everyone's

832
00:37:19,480 --> 00:37:21,000
Speaker 2: saying you're not going to get anyone for his family

833
00:37:21,000 --> 00:37:23,840
Speaker 2: man over there, well I thought the opposite. To be honest,

834
00:37:23,880 --> 00:37:27,040
Speaker 2: I thought, well why not, Like you're going to live

835
00:37:27,320 --> 00:37:30,000
Speaker 2: in this village with other kids. The kids are going

836
00:37:30,040 --> 00:37:31,480
Speaker 2: to have their time with their lives. You know, they're

837
00:37:31,480 --> 00:37:34,319
Speaker 2: going to be living together, playing all afternoon, riding their

838
00:37:34,320 --> 00:37:37,160
Speaker 2: bikes around, footy all afternoon with other kids. Sounds like

839
00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:38,480
Speaker 2: a dream for the kids. To be honest with you,

840
00:37:39,080 --> 00:37:41,560
Speaker 2: after school, after school, yeah, but also in school, they

841
00:37:41,640 --> 00:37:43,600
Speaker 2: want to go together in school as well. You know

842
00:37:43,640 --> 00:37:45,880
Speaker 2: they're going to go to the same schools together. So

843
00:37:47,880 --> 00:37:50,680
Speaker 2: if I could, if we could change the narrative around

844
00:37:50,840 --> 00:37:53,400
Speaker 2: this not being a family club, it was important. So

845
00:37:53,480 --> 00:37:55,440
Speaker 2: Jerome coming over there with his three kids and his

846
00:37:55,480 --> 00:37:57,759
Speaker 2: wife said to everyone straight away, but it's good enough

847
00:37:57,760 --> 00:37:59,120
Speaker 2: for him, it's good enough for me.

848
00:38:00,040 --> 00:38:02,400
Speaker 1: That was our first tim said other players, Yeah.

849
00:38:02,000 --> 00:38:04,799
Speaker 2: That's right. The other part of it was culturally, like,

850
00:38:04,880 --> 00:38:06,800
Speaker 2: I know he's not pupping New Guinea, but he's a

851
00:38:06,840 --> 00:38:09,479
Speaker 2: proud some old man being over there. He kept saying

852
00:38:09,520 --> 00:38:12,960
Speaker 2: about this reminds me of somehow being being back home.

853
00:38:13,840 --> 00:38:15,320
Speaker 2: This team is not just a team of P and G.

854
00:38:15,400 --> 00:38:17,320
Speaker 2: Of course, it's based in p ANDNG and has a

855
00:38:17,400 --> 00:38:19,880
Speaker 2: very strong P and G presence, but there's also two

856
00:38:19,960 --> 00:38:21,919
Speaker 2: hundred and forty million dollars of that six hundred million

857
00:38:21,920 --> 00:38:24,560
Speaker 2: the government are allocating. That's going to Pacific Pathways and

858
00:38:24,600 --> 00:38:30,320
Speaker 2: Strategy right going to Pfgo Tonga, a lot of money

859
00:38:30,320 --> 00:38:33,319
Speaker 2: going to that region. So Prime Minister James marat Bay,

860
00:38:34,320 --> 00:38:37,280
Speaker 2: he's been big on this being the team of the Pacific,

861
00:38:37,320 --> 00:38:39,239
Speaker 2: not just the team of P ANDNG. So we ticked

862
00:38:39,239 --> 00:38:42,200
Speaker 2: that box with Jerome Law. There's no better advocate for

863
00:38:42,239 --> 00:38:45,200
Speaker 2: the Polynesian community than Jerome. I've known him since I

864
00:38:45,239 --> 00:38:48,000
Speaker 2: was a teenager. I've covered him. I know what he's like.

865
00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:49,480
Speaker 2: He cops a bad rap or he did cop a

866
00:38:49,480 --> 00:38:51,840
Speaker 2: bad rap from sections of the media as being arrogant,

867
00:38:52,800 --> 00:38:55,160
Speaker 2: whatever you wanted to call him, I've seen him close.

868
00:38:55,960 --> 00:38:58,879
Speaker 2: He's not arrogant. He's a good person who always gives

869
00:38:58,880 --> 00:39:01,080
Speaker 2: his time to others around him. Last guy off the field,

870
00:39:01,840 --> 00:39:03,840
Speaker 2: he actually someone who embraces.

871
00:39:03,480 --> 00:39:05,160
Speaker 1: You mean after a game, after a game you go

872
00:39:05,200 --> 00:39:07,640
Speaker 1: and sign signs starskuy.

873
00:39:07,080 --> 00:39:09,799
Speaker 2: Every time, but also in the community, gives his time

874
00:39:09,840 --> 00:39:13,160
Speaker 2: to everyone. Some people do it because it's a show

875
00:39:13,400 --> 00:39:15,719
Speaker 2: and they have to. Some people do it because they care.

876
00:39:16,200 --> 00:39:18,279
Speaker 2: And I knew with jer Own that if we got

877
00:39:18,360 --> 00:39:20,799
Speaker 2: him to p and g that care factor that he's got,

878
00:39:20,840 --> 00:39:22,759
Speaker 2: we'd win him over because he would see just how

879
00:39:22,840 --> 00:39:24,680
Speaker 2: much it would mean to the people of Papa New

880
00:39:24,680 --> 00:39:27,280
Speaker 2: Guinea seeing him there. So when we're in the stand

881
00:39:27,360 --> 00:39:30,359
Speaker 2: and they're chanting lou Why Louie, Why, in that moment

882
00:39:30,400 --> 00:39:33,160
Speaker 2: he is sitting there, I had goosebumps, he said to me, Man,

883
00:39:33,200 --> 00:39:35,080
Speaker 2: I had goosebumps. I knew that would resonate with him

884
00:39:35,080 --> 00:39:37,399
Speaker 2: because I knew he's the kind of person that would

885
00:39:37,400 --> 00:39:39,399
Speaker 2: take that responsibility on his shoulder and want to carry

886
00:39:39,400 --> 00:39:41,920
Speaker 2: the country with him. So that was another one. He

887
00:39:41,960 --> 00:39:45,040
Speaker 2: wasn't just doing it for the check. Let's be fair,

888
00:39:45,120 --> 00:39:47,759
Speaker 2: income tax free is appealing, but there's more to it.

889
00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:51,040
Speaker 2: And he's the kind of guy that legacy and doing

890
00:39:51,080 --> 00:39:52,879
Speaker 2: stuff for people is important to him.

891
00:39:53,080 --> 00:39:54,640
Speaker 1: Because that's what I was going to do to Michael.

892
00:39:54,680 --> 00:39:57,080
Speaker 1: Had he build a culture of players that aren't just

893
00:39:57,120 --> 00:39:59,680
Speaker 1: doing it for the tax recheck, that they're actually doing

894
00:39:59,680 --> 00:40:01,440
Speaker 1: it because they want to be together. They want to

895
00:40:01,440 --> 00:40:03,000
Speaker 1: be in a Perpa New Guinea, that want to have

896
00:40:03,080 --> 00:40:04,960
Speaker 1: their families brought up there. Man, how do you do that?

897
00:40:05,000 --> 00:40:06,880
Speaker 1: And where and where does will he fit into all this?

898
00:40:07,320 --> 00:40:09,160
Speaker 2: Willy is big on that. So and that's the other

899
00:40:09,200 --> 00:40:11,680
Speaker 2: thing signing. Willie is a young coach with young kids,

900
00:40:12,160 --> 00:40:15,400
Speaker 2: but a good track record and cah of course, but

901
00:40:16,000 --> 00:40:17,920
Speaker 2: he's bringing his family with him. You know, his son's

902
00:40:17,960 --> 00:40:20,080
Speaker 2: going to live there, his wife's coming over. We are

903
00:40:20,080 --> 00:40:22,919
Speaker 2: creating that. I say this to everyone. Everyone talks about,

904
00:40:22,920 --> 00:40:25,520
Speaker 2: Oh we're a family club. No, no, no, we are

905
00:40:25,880 --> 00:40:28,200
Speaker 2: a fan. We are a family club more than anyone.

906
00:40:28,239 --> 00:40:30,439
Speaker 2: We're a real family club because we're going to live together,

907
00:40:30,480 --> 00:40:31,840
Speaker 2: we're going to train together, and we're going to play it.

908
00:40:31,880 --> 00:40:35,319
Speaker 2: Everyone's together all the time, which presents as challenges as

909
00:40:35,360 --> 00:40:37,279
Speaker 2: a certain person that you need in that environment. If

910
00:40:37,320 --> 00:40:40,799
Speaker 2: you get the wrong people, it'll unravel pretty quickly. Not me,

911
00:40:41,280 --> 00:40:43,880
Speaker 2: and that means homework. I mean this. I don't mean

912
00:40:43,920 --> 00:40:46,560
Speaker 2: this disrespectfully, but part of my job isn't just homework

913
00:40:46,560 --> 00:40:48,840
Speaker 2: on the player. It's homework on the partner and what

914
00:40:48,920 --> 00:40:50,440
Speaker 2: their environment's going to be like, what they're going to

915
00:40:50,520 --> 00:40:52,879
Speaker 2: be like in that environment. We we're living together, because

916
00:40:52,920 --> 00:40:54,759
Speaker 2: if you don't fit into that and you're going to

917
00:40:54,800 --> 00:40:57,839
Speaker 2: be problematic, then you'll cause us to be unsuccessful.

918
00:40:58,320 --> 00:41:00,560
Speaker 1: Also, you don't have you don't have his be a life,

919
00:41:00,680 --> 00:41:04,000
Speaker 1: nor does your missus or your family because they'll see it.

920
00:41:04,360 --> 00:41:07,600
Speaker 2: That's right, and money will only I'm sorry, but if

921
00:41:07,640 --> 00:41:09,840
Speaker 2: you're just coming from money and you're locking yourself up

922
00:41:09,880 --> 00:41:11,760
Speaker 2: in a room and you have no intention of embracing

923
00:41:11,800 --> 00:41:14,760
Speaker 2: the community and taking that responsibility of lifting that country

924
00:41:14,800 --> 00:41:17,440
Speaker 2: on your shoulders, then you're gonna have a miserable time.

925
00:41:17,480 --> 00:41:19,319
Speaker 2: And that means you're gonna be terrible footballer. It means

926
00:41:19,320 --> 00:41:21,359
Speaker 2: you're going to be part of a problem that causes

927
00:41:21,440 --> 00:41:25,080
Speaker 2: us an even bigger problem. I'm not worried about the

928
00:41:25,080 --> 00:41:28,040
Speaker 2: football program. I'm confident that football program will be The

929
00:41:28,040 --> 00:41:30,319
Speaker 2: players will be fine. But if they're coming home to

930
00:41:30,400 --> 00:41:33,880
Speaker 2: wives and kids who are unhappy, that's game over, like

931
00:41:34,719 --> 00:41:38,919
Speaker 2: forget it, you know. And that's why it's our responsibility

932
00:41:38,960 --> 00:41:43,080
Speaker 2: now to employ people whose sole responsibility it is to

933
00:41:43,160 --> 00:41:45,719
Speaker 2: make sure that the kids are happy. They've got their

934
00:41:45,719 --> 00:41:47,719
Speaker 2: programs to play. There's no Saturday sport. They're not going

935
00:41:47,760 --> 00:41:49,279
Speaker 2: down and playing for the local club in p ANDG.

936
00:41:49,400 --> 00:41:51,680
Speaker 2: It just doesn't exist. So we've got to do sporting

937
00:41:51,680 --> 00:41:54,240
Speaker 2: programs for them. We've got to provide the young girls

938
00:41:54,280 --> 00:41:57,080
Speaker 2: dancing classes, the partners, they've got boot camps. When we

939
00:41:57,120 --> 00:41:59,319
Speaker 2: go away and play in Sydney one weekend and the

940
00:41:59,360 --> 00:42:01,680
Speaker 2: wives and children and still back at home, what are

941
00:42:01,680 --> 00:42:03,640
Speaker 2: they doing. Are they go under the Great Barrier Reef,

942
00:42:03,680 --> 00:42:05,279
Speaker 2: it's a forty five minute flight to Canns. Are they

943
00:42:05,280 --> 00:42:06,800
Speaker 2: going up north? Are they going to the high What

944
00:42:06,800 --> 00:42:09,400
Speaker 2: are they doing? When it is full time people whose

945
00:42:09,400 --> 00:42:11,680
Speaker 2: sole purpose it is is to make sure that they've

946
00:42:11,680 --> 00:42:14,480
Speaker 2: got a purpose, they've got enjoyment, that they're living their

947
00:42:14,480 --> 00:42:15,560
Speaker 2: life as normal as they can.

948
00:42:15,680 --> 00:42:17,240
Speaker 1: That all comes under you, the general manager.

949
00:42:17,920 --> 00:42:22,320
Speaker 2: Well technically no, but yes, because to me it fits

950
00:42:22,480 --> 00:42:25,760
Speaker 2: head in hand the family's well being and the players

951
00:42:25,800 --> 00:42:30,320
Speaker 2: well being. That role is intertwined. So my focus is

952
00:42:30,360 --> 00:42:32,959
Speaker 2: to make sure the right people because if the wives

953
00:42:32,960 --> 00:42:34,920
Speaker 2: and kids are happy, the players are happy. It is

954
00:42:34,960 --> 00:42:35,480
Speaker 2: into LinkedIn.

955
00:42:35,600 --> 00:42:37,480
Speaker 1: What about recruitment of people to work in the joint

956
00:42:37,480 --> 00:42:40,319
Speaker 1: as opposed players, as oppose the talent that these people

957
00:42:40,360 --> 00:42:42,839
Speaker 1: are talent too. How do you go about building that

958
00:42:42,920 --> 00:42:46,719
Speaker 1: talent pool within, you know, within your organization because you're

959
00:42:47,000 --> 00:42:47,360
Speaker 1: the boss.

960
00:42:47,520 --> 00:42:49,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, well I'm very lucky. Willy Peters is going to

961
00:42:49,440 --> 00:42:52,000
Speaker 2: be outstanding for us right it's he's a coach that

962
00:42:52,400 --> 00:42:53,920
Speaker 2: would have been the next cup off the rank, no

963
00:42:53,960 --> 00:42:56,000
Speaker 2: doubt about it. He's won. He won the Treble in

964
00:42:56,000 --> 00:42:57,600
Speaker 2: the Super League last year for a whole k are.

965
00:42:58,360 --> 00:42:59,920
Speaker 2: Then he backed it up this year and won the

966
00:42:59,880 --> 00:43:02,200
Speaker 2: World Club Challenge against the Brisbane Broncos, which is no

967
00:43:02,280 --> 00:43:05,200
Speaker 2: mean feet. We know how good the Broncos are. He's

968
00:43:05,200 --> 00:43:07,160
Speaker 2: worked with the Australian team and the Ashes last year

969
00:43:07,200 --> 00:43:10,160
Speaker 2: as an assistant coach, So for us, that was an

970
00:43:10,200 --> 00:43:12,959
Speaker 2: important piece of the puzzle. A guy who I believe

971
00:43:13,000 --> 00:43:16,600
Speaker 2: in that environment when we're all living together, will unite people.

972
00:43:17,040 --> 00:43:19,160
Speaker 2: He's done that in my homework, speaking to people the

973
00:43:19,200 --> 00:43:21,600
Speaker 2: whole kay Are. I actually rang Jared rie Aagris when

974
00:43:21,640 --> 00:43:23,919
Speaker 2: I was doing my homework someone you're close to former

975
00:43:24,000 --> 00:43:26,440
Speaker 2: rooster's problem, and I asked Jared about what he was

976
00:43:26,520 --> 00:43:27,919
Speaker 2: like and the first thing he spoke to me about

977
00:43:27,960 --> 00:43:32,000
Speaker 2: forget football, was what his wife did for his family.

978
00:43:32,080 --> 00:43:33,000
Speaker 2: What Willy's wife did.

979
00:43:32,960 --> 00:43:35,359
Speaker 1: For Jared and his FA when Jared came over the.

980
00:43:35,239 --> 00:43:37,000
Speaker 2: Effort they went through, and I saw it firsthand this

981
00:43:37,040 --> 00:43:39,840
Speaker 2: week in Papua New Guinea when we were there. Kira,

982
00:43:40,239 --> 00:43:42,640
Speaker 2: Willy's wife, is going to be very very important for

983
00:43:42,719 --> 00:43:46,239
Speaker 2: us because she is as passionate about her role, which

984
00:43:46,320 --> 00:43:49,360
Speaker 2: is an unofficial role, about the wives and the partners

985
00:43:49,400 --> 00:43:53,680
Speaker 2: and making making a harmonious for everyone. She's going to

986
00:43:53,719 --> 00:43:55,520
Speaker 2: be She's going to be really well caught mucking around.

987
00:43:55,520 --> 00:43:57,160
Speaker 2: I was calling her the first Lady, but she is.

988
00:43:57,920 --> 00:44:00,200
Speaker 2: She is really really important for us. So as a

989
00:44:00,200 --> 00:44:03,000
Speaker 2: package deal, you get Willie, you get Kira, and that

990
00:44:03,120 --> 00:44:04,000
Speaker 2: is part of what we build.

991
00:44:04,560 --> 00:44:07,719
Speaker 1: I mean, Willie's credentials are great form and football, but

992
00:44:08,719 --> 00:44:11,960
Speaker 1: has done fantastically in terms of rugby league success in

993
00:44:12,000 --> 00:44:14,319
Speaker 1: the UK. But what about below that, because I mean

994
00:44:14,400 --> 00:44:17,319
Speaker 1: you can't just have Michael Chamis and Willie Peters, I

995
00:44:17,320 --> 00:44:20,680
Speaker 1: mean everything below. What's your bench your bench strength look

996
00:44:20,800 --> 00:44:23,800
Speaker 1: like relative to managing the business.

997
00:44:24,320 --> 00:44:26,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, well that's we're putting those pieces together now, right,

998
00:44:26,840 --> 00:44:30,759
Speaker 2: strong assistant coaches, strong headed performance and that filters all

999
00:44:30,760 --> 00:44:31,359
Speaker 2: the way down through.

1000
00:44:31,400 --> 00:44:31,520
Speaker 1: Now.

1001
00:44:31,520 --> 00:44:33,680
Speaker 2: We're also mindful of the fact that the whole reason

1002
00:44:33,680 --> 00:44:36,719
Speaker 2: this team has been brought in is because it needs

1003
00:44:36,719 --> 00:44:38,120
Speaker 2: to take pupping. You get into a level that it

1004
00:44:38,160 --> 00:44:40,120
Speaker 2: doesn't exist that at the moment when it comes to sport.

1005
00:44:40,680 --> 00:44:43,120
Speaker 2: We need to educate the administrators, You need to educate

1006
00:44:43,160 --> 00:44:45,440
Speaker 2: the coaches and to educate the players about what it

1007
00:44:45,480 --> 00:44:47,719
Speaker 2: takes to be professional, what it takes to make it

1008
00:44:47,760 --> 00:44:49,560
Speaker 2: in the NRL. So there's going to be a certain

1009
00:44:49,600 --> 00:44:51,640
Speaker 2: percentage of people in our organization who will be pupping

1010
00:44:51,640 --> 00:44:54,200
Speaker 2: the union. That's the whole point of this team is

1011
00:44:54,239 --> 00:44:56,120
Speaker 2: to help you unite P and G and provide them

1012
00:44:56,120 --> 00:44:59,600
Speaker 2: with the right tool to develop the country in the

1013
00:44:59,640 --> 00:45:01,359
Speaker 2: way they were on Ahead and James Marapo, the Prime

1014
00:45:01,360 --> 00:45:04,680
Speaker 2: Minister of p and G, knows just how important the

1015
00:45:04,760 --> 00:45:07,000
Speaker 2: chiefs are to doing that for his country. I think

1016
00:45:07,000 --> 00:45:09,359
Speaker 2: it's like a thirty five percent of the population can

1017
00:45:09,400 --> 00:45:12,719
Speaker 2: read and write. School is not compulsory. Now they're making

1018
00:45:12,719 --> 00:45:14,400
Speaker 2: it compulsory. If you're going to play rugby league for

1019
00:45:14,440 --> 00:45:16,719
Speaker 2: your school, you need to attend. You need to have

1020
00:45:16,760 --> 00:45:18,239
Speaker 2: it marked off, you need to have it ticked every

1021
00:45:18,320 --> 00:45:20,919
Speaker 2: day class if because you won't play rugby league because

1022
00:45:21,000 --> 00:45:23,160
Speaker 2: rugby league is a religion to them, so if you

1023
00:45:23,200 --> 00:45:25,520
Speaker 2: take that away from them, they won't be happy. So

1024
00:45:25,680 --> 00:45:28,160
Speaker 2: school Suddenly they're all at school. The attendance rates are

1025
00:45:28,200 --> 00:45:30,440
Speaker 2: going through the roof, really yep, because they have to.

1026
00:45:30,560 --> 00:45:31,160
Speaker 1: It's amazing.

1027
00:45:31,560 --> 00:45:33,759
Speaker 2: And he's setting up academies, Joey Grim he's setting up

1028
00:45:33,760 --> 00:45:36,360
Speaker 2: academies all across the country. Most people wouldn't know this,

1029
00:45:36,400 --> 00:45:39,840
Speaker 2: but import Moresby, that's obviously the major city of the country,

1030
00:45:40,120 --> 00:45:42,080
Speaker 2: but you cannot access any other part of the country

1031
00:45:42,160 --> 00:45:44,719
Speaker 2: unless you fly there. There's no roads, there's no infrastructure

1032
00:45:44,719 --> 00:45:47,400
Speaker 2: in place. So the logistical challenges for us as a

1033
00:45:47,600 --> 00:45:51,560
Speaker 2: country to get a football team together, it's really difficult

1034
00:45:51,600 --> 00:45:54,680
Speaker 2: because you can't just say, like you come down the road.

1035
00:45:55,000 --> 00:45:56,560
Speaker 2: If someone lives an hour and a half away. You

1036
00:45:56,600 --> 00:45:58,160
Speaker 2: can't just bring a kid from the country like you

1037
00:45:58,200 --> 00:46:00,640
Speaker 2: do here to pray in Penrith. You've got to fly them.

1038
00:46:00,640 --> 00:46:02,880
Speaker 2: You've got to relocate them away from their villages who

1039
00:46:02,960 --> 00:46:05,960
Speaker 2: have experienced nothing of a city in their whole life.

1040
00:46:06,640 --> 00:46:09,480
Speaker 2: The logistical challenges for us are a lot harder, but

1041
00:46:09,560 --> 00:46:11,200
Speaker 2: it's also part of the magic of what we're trying

1042
00:46:11,200 --> 00:46:14,440
Speaker 2: to do. Is is actually not just a football. It's

1043
00:46:14,440 --> 00:46:16,480
Speaker 2: far bigger than a rugby league team. It transcends that

1044
00:46:16,680 --> 00:46:18,520
Speaker 2: it's changing a country.

1045
00:46:18,719 --> 00:46:20,719
Speaker 1: I've watched when my kids were young at school, they

1046
00:46:20,800 --> 00:46:22,759
Speaker 1: had a couple of Capepi new Ugineon kids playing rugb

1047
00:46:22,800 --> 00:46:27,600
Speaker 1: union with them. Mate, these guys are so talented and tough,

1048
00:46:28,840 --> 00:46:31,680
Speaker 1: hard as nails, literally hard as nails, like I mean

1049
00:46:31,719 --> 00:46:35,640
Speaker 1: physically their bodies. It's like nothing hurts them. Do you

1050
00:46:35,719 --> 00:46:38,719
Speaker 1: get excited about and thought about discovering some unbelievable Papa

1051
00:46:38,760 --> 00:46:39,600
Speaker 1: Nergin in talent?

1052
00:46:39,719 --> 00:46:41,799
Speaker 2: Oh for sure, for sure. And the other difference mark

1053
00:46:41,880 --> 00:46:45,239
Speaker 2: is the fact that they don't have a the resources

1054
00:46:45,280 --> 00:46:49,200
Speaker 2: like simple things or a pathway. Yeah, but just balls boots,

1055
00:46:49,320 --> 00:46:51,880
Speaker 2: they don't. They just don't have that readily accessible like

1056
00:46:51,920 --> 00:46:53,960
Speaker 2: we do. They don't have the man nows. There's no

1057
00:46:53,960 --> 00:46:56,439
Speaker 2: community teams, there's no clubs that you can go play

1058
00:46:56,440 --> 00:46:58,360
Speaker 2: for and train on the weekend. It doesn't exist. They

1059
00:46:58,400 --> 00:47:01,560
Speaker 2: play wherever they can, whenever they can, and it's not organized.

1060
00:47:01,600 --> 00:47:03,400
Speaker 2: But that's our job and that's where the P and

1061
00:47:03,440 --> 00:47:06,160
Speaker 2: G RFL at the moment are putting so much money

1062
00:47:06,160 --> 00:47:10,279
Speaker 2: into providing them with just simple tools to get there.

1063
00:47:10,560 --> 00:47:12,560
Speaker 2: Man hours that goes into development. Where there was a

1064
00:47:12,600 --> 00:47:14,920
Speaker 2: graph the amount of man hours that goes into a

1065
00:47:15,000 --> 00:47:16,520
Speaker 2: kid by the age of sixteen in P and G

1066
00:47:16,640 --> 00:47:20,120
Speaker 2: compared to Australia. The golf is so big between them

1067
00:47:20,160 --> 00:47:23,080
Speaker 2: because they're training threes four times a week. Yeah, you

1068
00:47:23,160 --> 00:47:25,319
Speaker 2: can't compare it to the Some of these kids get

1069
00:47:25,320 --> 00:47:27,000
Speaker 2: to the age of eight and have never worn a

1070
00:47:27,000 --> 00:47:29,800
Speaker 2: pair of boots, like they're learning how to play football

1071
00:47:29,840 --> 00:47:31,439
Speaker 2: in boots Like that's the sort of thing we're talking

1072
00:47:31,480 --> 00:47:34,800
Speaker 2: about over there. So if we can close that gap

1073
00:47:35,120 --> 00:47:37,040
Speaker 2: in which they're doing at the moment with the academies

1074
00:47:37,040 --> 00:47:38,080
Speaker 2: that are in around the country.

1075
00:47:38,320 --> 00:47:40,040
Speaker 1: So these are new academies yep, yep.

1076
00:47:40,120 --> 00:47:42,279
Speaker 2: Last two or three years, there's eight of them now

1077
00:47:42,320 --> 00:47:44,160
Speaker 2: at the moment around the country for boys and girls.

1078
00:47:44,520 --> 00:47:46,600
Speaker 1: Is that an NRL initiative.

1079
00:47:46,120 --> 00:47:48,680
Speaker 2: Or it's well, it's funded funded by the NRL and

1080
00:47:48,719 --> 00:47:51,080
Speaker 2: the P and G Rugby League and the Australian P

1081
00:47:51,120 --> 00:47:54,000
Speaker 2: and G government because they see how important it is.

1082
00:47:54,239 --> 00:47:55,640
Speaker 2: But we're now going to come over the top of

1083
00:47:55,640 --> 00:47:58,279
Speaker 2: that and start up an elite academy in P and

1084
00:47:58,320 --> 00:48:00,799
Speaker 2: G in Port Moresby. You can pick the eyes out

1085
00:48:00,840 --> 00:48:02,560
Speaker 2: of the ones all around the country and say, yep,

1086
00:48:02,640 --> 00:48:05,680
Speaker 2: we've identified you. You come into our system and we

1087
00:48:05,760 --> 00:48:07,520
Speaker 2: start to develop him so that you know, it might

1088
00:48:07,560 --> 00:48:09,640
Speaker 2: only be two of every group that we progress into

1089
00:48:09,640 --> 00:48:11,680
Speaker 2: the NRL, but at least as a chance. And that's

1090
00:48:11,680 --> 00:48:14,560
Speaker 2: what I said to him from when I arrived. People

1091
00:48:14,600 --> 00:48:17,120
Speaker 2: this country no longer have to look elsewhere to achieve greatness.

1092
00:48:17,160 --> 00:48:20,160
Speaker 2: They can achieve greatness here in P and G and

1093
00:48:20,160 --> 00:48:21,680
Speaker 2: that's what we want to do. And in ten years

1094
00:48:21,760 --> 00:48:24,839
Speaker 2: time and everyone's saying, oh, it's tax free, it's unfair. Well,

1095
00:48:24,880 --> 00:48:27,239
Speaker 2: in ten years time, if the market success is going

1096
00:48:27,280 --> 00:48:29,600
Speaker 2: to be whether or not we are sustainable on our

1097
00:48:29,640 --> 00:48:32,080
Speaker 2: own with P and G kids coming through the system

1098
00:48:32,440 --> 00:48:34,760
Speaker 2: without the benefit of that tax free incentive.

1099
00:48:35,080 --> 00:48:36,640
Speaker 1: So can we just talk about the tax forre incentive?

1100
00:48:36,640 --> 00:48:38,800
Speaker 1: I mean, are you going to like that tax free?

1101
00:48:39,320 --> 00:48:40,640
Speaker 1: I don't think we've got to touch on it because

1102
00:48:40,680 --> 00:48:43,560
Speaker 1: you I mean, I mean some of the clubs are

1103
00:48:43,560 --> 00:48:46,400
Speaker 1: complaining as you would expect. And by the way, you know,

1104
00:48:46,440 --> 00:48:49,399
Speaker 1: for those people who don't know rugby league is it's

1105
00:48:49,440 --> 00:48:53,560
Speaker 1: always someone's always complaining self interest, totally self interest. But

1106
00:48:53,600 --> 00:48:56,799
Speaker 1: they're saying that the salary cap is unfair. In that

1107
00:48:57,560 --> 00:49:00,000
Speaker 1: effective your salary cap could be looked as being done

1108
00:49:00,760 --> 00:49:05,080
Speaker 1: because like if you know, I Penrhith's paying a million

1109
00:49:05,120 --> 00:49:07,440
Speaker 1: dollars to a player and he's that player's got to

1110
00:49:07,480 --> 00:49:09,719
Speaker 1: pay a half million dollars in tax, that players only

1111
00:49:09,760 --> 00:49:12,759
Speaker 1: really receiving a half million dollars net. But the same

1112
00:49:12,760 --> 00:49:16,080
Speaker 1: salary cap Penrith has as you have. But if that

1113
00:49:16,320 --> 00:49:18,800
Speaker 1: individual goes to P and G, that individual going to

1114
00:49:18,920 --> 00:49:23,200
Speaker 1: a million bucks so net and probably have a whole

1115
00:49:23,239 --> 00:49:24,759
Speaker 1: lot of other stuff paid for to as well. I

1116
00:49:24,760 --> 00:49:27,120
Speaker 1: guess you know where they're living in all those sorts

1117
00:49:27,120 --> 00:49:30,800
Speaker 1: of things. How do you how do you count that argument?

1118
00:49:31,480 --> 00:49:34,480
Speaker 2: Well, we've got the same salary cap, right, and we

1119
00:49:34,560 --> 00:49:36,279
Speaker 2: haven't paid your own law less than what is on

1120
00:49:36,440 --> 00:49:38,839
Speaker 2: the Tigers, like we're paying market value. The NRL will

1121
00:49:38,840 --> 00:49:42,759
Speaker 2: not register that contract if I wanted to signing. Let's

1122
00:49:42,760 --> 00:49:44,360
Speaker 2: just say, for arguments, say he wanted to signing for

1123
00:49:44,400 --> 00:49:47,000
Speaker 2: half that money because you deem that it's tax free

1124
00:49:47,120 --> 00:49:51,320
Speaker 2: and you can make the same amount.

1125
00:49:49,680 --> 00:49:52,319
Speaker 1: Position these net positions are is not going.

1126
00:49:52,239 --> 00:49:54,680
Speaker 2: To register that, So we're still paying for market value. Yes,

1127
00:49:54,719 --> 00:49:57,799
Speaker 2: I understand the notion that the player is benefiting from it,

1128
00:49:57,840 --> 00:49:59,400
Speaker 2: which makes it more appealing for him to come to

1129
00:49:59,400 --> 00:50:01,799
Speaker 2: the Chiefs, but you also have to have some sort

1130
00:50:01,840 --> 00:50:03,719
Speaker 2: of benefit for the player because if this is as

1131
00:50:03,760 --> 00:50:05,440
Speaker 2: important it is to the Australian government, the P and

1132
00:50:05,480 --> 00:50:07,360
Speaker 2: G government and the NFL to get it right, it

1133
00:50:07,400 --> 00:50:10,319
Speaker 2: needs to be a success. So if you're going to

1134
00:50:10,360 --> 00:50:12,640
Speaker 2: uproot somebody and I had this conversation earlier about moving

1135
00:50:12,680 --> 00:50:14,840
Speaker 2: my family away from their family. If you're going to

1136
00:50:14,880 --> 00:50:16,120
Speaker 2: do that and you're going to move to Papa, New

1137
00:50:16,120 --> 00:50:18,040
Speaker 2: Guinea and you're going to be living in a resort

1138
00:50:18,600 --> 00:50:20,279
Speaker 2: and the simple things in life that you had in

1139
00:50:20,320 --> 00:50:23,120
Speaker 2: Sydney or Brisbane or wherever you are no longer exist,

1140
00:50:23,680 --> 00:50:25,200
Speaker 2: then of course you're going to have to compensate the

1141
00:50:25,239 --> 00:50:29,760
Speaker 2: players for that, right, I believe that we are getting

1142
00:50:30,320 --> 00:50:31,840
Speaker 2: because people want to come, and there's a lot of

1143
00:50:31,880 --> 00:50:33,400
Speaker 2: them that and there are they want to come for

1144
00:50:33,920 --> 00:50:36,400
Speaker 2: the paycheck, right But because there are so many of them,

1145
00:50:36,440 --> 00:50:37,960
Speaker 2: we as a club that are able then to work

1146
00:50:38,000 --> 00:50:39,719
Speaker 2: out who are the ones that are coming from more

1147
00:50:39,760 --> 00:50:41,960
Speaker 2: than that, who are our jer own laws, who are yes,

1148
00:50:42,560 --> 00:50:44,480
Speaker 2: they're setting their families up for life, but are also

1149
00:50:44,520 --> 00:50:46,960
Speaker 2: motivated by it. And because there's a high demand for

1150
00:50:47,040 --> 00:50:49,920
Speaker 2: us for players to come our phones. Honestly, the people

1151
00:50:49,920 --> 00:50:51,880
Speaker 2: who want to come, we're knocking people back right now

1152
00:50:51,920 --> 00:50:54,120
Speaker 2: because we want to be patient, because we want to

1153
00:50:54,160 --> 00:50:56,799
Speaker 2: make sure that we get the best players, so we're

1154
00:50:56,800 --> 00:50:58,560
Speaker 2: able to pick and choose and do our homework and

1155
00:50:58,640 --> 00:51:00,759
Speaker 2: jiu delusions on these players to make sure that we

1156
00:51:00,840 --> 00:51:04,920
Speaker 2: have the right type. So the argument, the argument I

1157
00:51:05,000 --> 00:51:06,560
Speaker 2: make is no, we don't have double the salary. We've

1158
00:51:06,560 --> 00:51:08,520
Speaker 2: got the same we're just the players are benefiting a

1159
00:51:08,560 --> 00:51:12,279
Speaker 2: lot more. And but it needed that if you want

1160
00:51:12,280 --> 00:51:13,960
Speaker 2: to make it a success. The Australian government. I don't

1161
00:51:13,960 --> 00:51:16,120
Speaker 2: want to get into geo politics because that's not my

1162
00:51:16,200 --> 00:51:18,799
Speaker 2: area and I said I never would, but it's been

1163
00:51:18,800 --> 00:51:21,520
Speaker 2: made very clear to this by the Australian government. Just

1164
00:51:21,560 --> 00:51:23,360
Speaker 2: how important this deal with the P and G government

1165
00:51:23,440 --> 00:51:25,000
Speaker 2: is for the future of this country.

1166
00:51:25,360 --> 00:51:26,840
Speaker 1: You need to make it work and the future of

1167
00:51:26,880 --> 00:51:27,479
Speaker 1: P and G as.

1168
00:51:27,360 --> 00:51:28,920
Speaker 2: Well, and the future of the P and G as well.

1169
00:51:29,160 --> 00:51:31,279
Speaker 1: So does the primeister actually talking about it?

1170
00:51:31,320 --> 00:51:31,520
Speaker 2: Have you?

1171
00:51:31,600 --> 00:51:33,560
Speaker 1: Have you had a discussion with Elbow about it?

1172
00:51:33,560 --> 00:51:36,160
Speaker 2: No, I having had a chat with Albo about it.

1173
00:51:36,160 --> 00:51:39,120
Speaker 2: But I have had a few chats with Prime Minister

1174
00:51:39,200 --> 00:51:41,920
Speaker 2: Marape in P and G about it, about.

1175
00:51:41,680 --> 00:51:44,120
Speaker 1: What this like, what does it mean for them?

1176
00:51:44,480 --> 00:51:46,759
Speaker 2: Everything to them? And that's what I say this. I

1177
00:51:46,760 --> 00:51:49,200
Speaker 2: think that's what got Jerome across the line. Jerome spent

1178
00:51:49,280 --> 00:51:53,200
Speaker 2: some time with the Prime Minister and he explained just

1179
00:51:53,280 --> 00:51:56,880
Speaker 2: how important rugby league was to actually making change for

1180
00:51:56,920 --> 00:51:58,840
Speaker 2: a lot of the social issues in that country, just

1181
00:51:58,920 --> 00:52:02,799
Speaker 2: things like the education as we touched on, making change,

1182
00:52:02,800 --> 00:52:06,680
Speaker 2: the way they respect women, the domestic violence issues, the

1183
00:52:06,760 --> 00:52:11,440
Speaker 2: crime issues. Rugby league is a platform to drive social

1184
00:52:11,560 --> 00:52:13,960
Speaker 2: change because it's the only thing in that country that

1185
00:52:14,080 --> 00:52:17,200
Speaker 2: unites them. There's eight hundred and fifty languages, one thousand tribes.

1186
00:52:17,920 --> 00:52:19,879
Speaker 2: You go down the road right, there's a young kid

1187
00:52:19,920 --> 00:52:22,200
Speaker 2: named Giro Varro. He's a young P and g boy.

1188
00:52:22,200 --> 00:52:25,600
Speaker 2: He's currently the London Broncos. Couldn't speak a word of English,

1189
00:52:25,760 --> 00:52:29,759
Speaker 2: could only speak the language of his tribe. Kids into

1190
00:52:29,760 --> 00:52:31,720
Speaker 2: a national team. He can't speak to the other players,

1191
00:52:31,800 --> 00:52:34,320
Speaker 2: even though they're from the same country. He only understands

1192
00:52:34,800 --> 00:52:37,400
Speaker 2: the language of his tribe and the tribes. A lot

1193
00:52:37,440 --> 00:52:39,400
Speaker 2: of people talk about the tension and the crime in

1194
00:52:39,480 --> 00:52:41,719
Speaker 2: p ANDNG. A lot of it is tribal mark Like

1195
00:52:42,040 --> 00:52:44,480
Speaker 2: I've been to port more than eight or nine times now,

1196
00:52:44,920 --> 00:52:46,920
Speaker 2: You've got no issues there in the city. I have

1197
00:52:47,040 --> 00:52:49,200
Speaker 2: never come across anything. The people have been nothing but loving.

1198
00:52:49,880 --> 00:52:52,400
Speaker 2: Are there issues in the Highlands, tribal issues, of course,

1199
00:52:52,800 --> 00:52:54,440
Speaker 2: But these players are going to go over there, are

1200
00:52:54,440 --> 00:52:56,080
Speaker 2: going to be adored, They're going to be gods. I

1201
00:52:56,239 --> 00:52:59,759
Speaker 2: likened it to Indian cricketers in India. They're not going

1202
00:52:59,800 --> 00:53:01,600
Speaker 2: to have issues. The issue isn't going to be safety.

1203
00:53:01,600 --> 00:53:04,360
Speaker 2: The issue is going to be being swarmed and overwhelmed

1204
00:53:04,360 --> 00:53:06,560
Speaker 2: by love, because that's what they done. They are like

1205
00:53:06,600 --> 00:53:09,400
Speaker 2: Willy Mason walked onto the beach the other day at

1206
00:53:09,440 --> 00:53:12,400
Speaker 2: Ello Beach and you know what, he's been out of

1207
00:53:12,400 --> 00:53:15,359
Speaker 2: the game, what ten fifteen years now? WILLI and these

1208
00:53:15,400 --> 00:53:17,360
Speaker 2: young kids all knew who he was. They wouldn't if

1209
00:53:17,360 --> 00:53:19,280
Speaker 2: some of it wouldn't have been been born when he played.

1210
00:53:19,880 --> 00:53:21,840
Speaker 2: Had a young kid run up and say, I'm Willie Mason.

1211
00:53:21,840 --> 00:53:23,759
Speaker 2: My name is William Like his actual name was Willy

1212
00:53:23,800 --> 00:53:27,080
Speaker 2: Mason named after him. Like it's incredible how much they

1213
00:53:27,320 --> 00:53:29,719
Speaker 2: love rugby league and I honestly until you go there

1214
00:53:29,719 --> 00:53:31,480
Speaker 2: and experience it. Like if someone said to me, i'll

1215
00:53:31,520 --> 00:53:34,200
Speaker 2: sign a contract, I don't have to go over there,

1216
00:53:34,600 --> 00:53:37,560
Speaker 2: I'm like red pen. Yeah, because you're not going for

1217
00:53:37,560 --> 00:53:39,880
Speaker 2: the right reasons. You need to see it for yourself

1218
00:53:39,880 --> 00:53:41,799
Speaker 2: to know that it's the right thing. I can't tell

1219
00:53:41,840 --> 00:53:43,440
Speaker 2: you what safety feels like. You need to feel it

1220
00:53:43,480 --> 00:53:45,560
Speaker 2: for yourself. I can't tell you what the people are like.

1221
00:53:45,600 --> 00:53:47,759
Speaker 2: You need to see it for yourself. And if you're

1222
00:53:47,760 --> 00:53:49,440
Speaker 2: not willing to do that, it just says to me

1223
00:53:49,440 --> 00:53:51,200
Speaker 2: you're going for one reason and one reason only.

1224
00:53:51,600 --> 00:53:53,840
Speaker 1: It's for the money the compound. Just give us a

1225
00:53:53,880 --> 00:53:57,520
Speaker 1: quick idea of how the compound works so well, when

1226
00:53:57,560 --> 00:53:59,680
Speaker 1: will players and families start to arrive? So what's your

1227
00:53:59,719 --> 00:54:01,160
Speaker 1: dead to get the compound up and read?

1228
00:54:01,200 --> 00:54:01,279
Speaker 2: In?

1229
00:54:01,400 --> 00:54:02,839
Speaker 1: What are we talking about a combat? We're talking about

1230
00:54:02,880 --> 00:54:04,000
Speaker 1: high walls? What are we talking about.

1231
00:54:04,360 --> 00:54:08,120
Speaker 2: So it's an existing it's an existing resort. It's called Airways, right,

1232
00:54:08,360 --> 00:54:12,839
Speaker 2: It's currently a hotel and residents. Ex On Mobile, one

1233
00:54:12,840 --> 00:54:14,239
Speaker 2: of the biggest company in the world. A lot of

1234
00:54:14,080 --> 00:54:17,280
Speaker 2: their employees live there. They've got a ton of employees

1235
00:54:17,320 --> 00:54:20,000
Speaker 2: who live in the apartments there. So it's got tennis courts,

1236
00:54:20,040 --> 00:54:25,479
Speaker 2: basketball courts, swimming pools, fields, bike tracks, whatever, whatever you need,

1237
00:54:25,560 --> 00:54:29,480
Speaker 2: it's there, right. But what we're building is well not

1238
00:54:29,520 --> 00:54:32,200
Speaker 2: we are what they are building Airways, and we're going

1239
00:54:32,280 --> 00:54:36,160
Speaker 2: to rent them out eighty brand new apartments which will

1240
00:54:36,160 --> 00:54:39,240
Speaker 2: be fully furnished and available to the NRL players and staff,

1241
00:54:39,800 --> 00:54:41,600
Speaker 2: so they'll live there. This is not like it's an

1242
00:54:41,600 --> 00:54:44,320
Speaker 2: eleven hectare site. It's not like you're living behind barbed

1243
00:54:44,320 --> 00:54:46,319
Speaker 2: wire fences that are right in front of your face

1244
00:54:46,440 --> 00:54:48,600
Speaker 2: every second of the day. It's an eleven hectare site.

1245
00:54:49,360 --> 00:54:51,719
Speaker 2: And if it's full of other expats from around the

1246
00:54:51,719 --> 00:54:52,800
Speaker 2: world and it's.

1247
00:54:52,640 --> 00:54:55,400
Speaker 1: A hotel, maybe just Footy Mont won't be.

1248
00:54:55,560 --> 00:54:59,239
Speaker 2: It won't be. It's not for everyone. Completely understand that

1249
00:54:59,400 --> 00:55:01,680
Speaker 2: living that way is not for everyone, and even for

1250
00:55:01,719 --> 00:55:03,799
Speaker 2: those who actually do enjoy it, it may have a

1251
00:55:03,800 --> 00:55:06,240
Speaker 2: certain window life span that you could be like, okay,

1252
00:55:06,480 --> 00:55:08,799
Speaker 2: I'm done now two or three years. I can't live

1253
00:55:08,800 --> 00:55:10,480
Speaker 2: a lot of this. I get that, I get it.

1254
00:55:10,680 --> 00:55:14,000
Speaker 2: The whole point of this is providing the tax incentives

1255
00:55:14,120 --> 00:55:15,600
Speaker 2: is to start it up and make it a success,

1256
00:55:15,600 --> 00:55:17,399
Speaker 2: so it doesn't rely on that in ten years time.

1257
00:55:17,840 --> 00:55:19,279
Speaker 2: So you look at a club like the Warriors and

1258
00:55:19,280 --> 00:55:21,359
Speaker 2: they're self sufficient with a lot of New Zealand kids

1259
00:55:21,400 --> 00:55:23,640
Speaker 2: coming through, but we need time to do that. So

1260
00:55:23,880 --> 00:55:25,839
Speaker 2: all these people saying it's unfair, this team will fall

1261
00:55:25,880 --> 00:55:28,200
Speaker 2: apart if you don't provide the advantages that we have

1262
00:55:28,320 --> 00:55:30,400
Speaker 2: right now. It will not come off. It will not

1263
00:55:30,600 --> 00:55:33,680
Speaker 2: get off the ground unless you provide incentives for the

1264
00:55:33,760 --> 00:55:35,879
Speaker 2: Australian or New Zealand or English players to come over

1265
00:55:35,920 --> 00:55:38,920
Speaker 2: there and turn this club into a powerhouse, because it

1266
00:55:38,920 --> 00:55:41,479
Speaker 2: will be a powerhouse. And that not the same because

1267
00:55:41,480 --> 00:55:43,600
Speaker 2: of the tax free I'm talking about when these kids

1268
00:55:43,600 --> 00:55:45,520
Speaker 2: who have got all this potential in the world, who

1269
00:55:45,520 --> 00:55:47,360
Speaker 2: have developed the right way, have got the right resources,

1270
00:55:47,360 --> 00:55:49,200
Speaker 2: and who understand what it takes to be a success.

1271
00:55:49,440 --> 00:55:52,399
Speaker 2: When they have that, the team will be predominantly pup

1272
00:55:52,440 --> 00:55:54,279
Speaker 2: in the union and they'll be successful on their own.

1273
00:55:54,320 --> 00:55:56,080
Speaker 1: What worries you the most about at this in terms

1274
00:55:56,120 --> 00:55:59,200
Speaker 1: of your task as general manager. What's the thing that's

1275
00:55:59,200 --> 00:56:00,239
Speaker 1: sort of kiping me awaken night.

1276
00:56:00,600 --> 00:56:03,240
Speaker 2: Honestly, the biggest, our biggest challenge is keeping the partners

1277
00:56:03,280 --> 00:56:04,480
Speaker 2: and kids happy.

1278
00:56:05,480 --> 00:56:07,600
Speaker 1: Outside of the players. You mean, yeah, yes, you keep

1279
00:56:07,600 --> 00:56:08,800
Speaker 1: their families happy.

1280
00:56:08,840 --> 00:56:11,120
Speaker 2: I think the football program. We're building a brand new

1281
00:56:11,120 --> 00:56:14,440
Speaker 2: center of excellence. They started work on their apartments. They

1282
00:56:14,440 --> 00:56:19,560
Speaker 2: already started that. Willie Peter's fantastic coach at Jerome LOUI

1283
00:56:19,560 --> 00:56:21,759
Speaker 2: will attract players. We will. We'll have a competitive team.

1284
00:56:22,120 --> 00:56:24,960
Speaker 2: I'm telling you now, it'll all living time by what

1285
00:56:25,000 --> 00:56:28,680
Speaker 2: our ability is to keep the wives, partners and kids happy.

1286
00:56:28,800 --> 00:56:32,120
Speaker 2: That means education for them, community work. Everyone's going to

1287
00:56:32,160 --> 00:56:34,600
Speaker 2: have different ones and needs. We need to caterence them

1288
00:56:34,920 --> 00:56:38,480
Speaker 2: because if they're bored or they're unhappy, there's that problem.

1289
00:56:38,640 --> 00:56:42,000
Speaker 1: It sounds a little bit like a Truman time environment,

1290
00:56:42,239 --> 00:56:45,080
Speaker 1: like everybody sort of going to dinner and everyone's going

1291
00:56:45,120 --> 00:56:47,279
Speaker 1: to lunch. I mean, have you had experience of this

1292
00:56:47,320 --> 00:56:49,279
Speaker 1: sort of stuff? For me, this is all probably no

1293
00:56:49,280 --> 00:56:52,920
Speaker 1: one's that experience with this, But building a community, do

1294
00:56:53,000 --> 00:56:56,880
Speaker 1: you see the normality and perhaps the excitement of the challenge.

1295
00:56:56,880 --> 00:56:59,719
Speaker 2: Oh, it's huge, it's huge, But that's I think I

1296
00:56:59,760 --> 00:57:02,239
Speaker 2: didn't experience it, but talk. I've spoken a lot of

1297
00:57:02,239 --> 00:57:04,719
Speaker 2: clubs about the COVID bubble when they were living and

1298
00:57:04,760 --> 00:57:08,600
Speaker 2: playing in Queensland. Some people hated it. The good clubs

1299
00:57:08,640 --> 00:57:10,080
Speaker 2: loved it. And that's another tick to the box of

1300
00:57:10,160 --> 00:57:14,960
Speaker 2: Jerome Lui is the Panthers boys absolutely loved the COVID bubble.

1301
00:57:15,160 --> 00:57:18,440
Speaker 2: They won a premiership that year. They were such close friends.

1302
00:57:18,440 --> 00:57:22,040
Speaker 2: Their partners became closed, their kids became close. I ran

1303
00:57:22,080 --> 00:57:25,600
Speaker 2: into Bill Edwards partner and Bill less contracted, but he lives,

1304
00:57:25,920 --> 00:57:30,040
Speaker 2: he lives not far from me, but I was. She

1305
00:57:30,880 --> 00:57:33,040
Speaker 2: was telling me how much they had the time of

1306
00:57:33,040 --> 00:57:36,240
Speaker 2: their life during that COVID period because they were such

1307
00:57:36,240 --> 00:57:39,120
Speaker 2: a tight knit group. And the proof is in the

1308
00:57:39,120 --> 00:57:41,440
Speaker 2: pudding because they went on to winter Camp Melbourne the

1309
00:57:41,440 --> 00:57:43,920
Speaker 2: Sunshine Coast as well. They loved their time. So doing

1310
00:57:43,960 --> 00:57:49,240
Speaker 2: my homework with the clubs that actually invested time and

1311
00:57:49,240 --> 00:57:51,880
Speaker 2: effort into making that a success is part of my

1312
00:57:52,000 --> 00:57:53,640
Speaker 2: job now is to say, Okay, what did you do right?

1313
00:57:53,720 --> 00:57:57,040
Speaker 2: What can we implement that you did create? Is there

1314
00:57:57,080 --> 00:57:58,520
Speaker 2: a craze for the young kids, what do you do

1315
00:57:58,560 --> 00:58:01,080
Speaker 2: with the kids who needed education, whatever it might be.

1316
00:58:02,240 --> 00:58:03,960
Speaker 2: We need to get to the bottom of what made

1317
00:58:04,000 --> 00:58:07,760
Speaker 2: that a success. But you could the fundament for me,

1318
00:58:07,880 --> 00:58:10,880
Speaker 2: from what I can see, it was the people. It

1319
00:58:11,000 --> 00:58:13,439
Speaker 2: was the relationships. And you can see Penrith they're connected group.

1320
00:58:13,440 --> 00:58:16,160
Speaker 2: They're a connected group. So that's our job now, and

1321
00:58:16,160 --> 00:58:18,720
Speaker 2: I'm part of my recruitment is to recruit in groups

1322
00:58:19,280 --> 00:58:21,360
Speaker 2: so that you sign someone they've got their best mate

1323
00:58:21,400 --> 00:58:23,640
Speaker 2: with them, or they've got their partner's best mates with

1324
00:58:23,680 --> 00:58:26,480
Speaker 2: that person. You got to recruit in groups because if

1325
00:58:26,480 --> 00:58:28,640
Speaker 2: you're coming isolated and not knowing anyone, it makes it

1326
00:58:28,640 --> 00:58:29,200
Speaker 2: a lot harder.

1327
00:58:29,840 --> 00:58:31,720
Speaker 1: I guess I'm like Jerome the way too as well.

1328
00:58:31,720 --> 00:58:34,040
Speaker 1: He experienced that period when you're talking about during the

1329
00:58:34,040 --> 00:58:37,880
Speaker 1: COVID period. He knows what he experienced, what he felt,

1330
00:58:38,040 --> 00:58:40,760
Speaker 1: as does his partner, his wife and probably his family

1331
00:58:40,800 --> 00:58:42,400
Speaker 1: true for that matter, so he can bring a bit

1332
00:58:42,440 --> 00:58:44,240
Speaker 1: of that to PNNG.

1333
00:58:44,760 --> 00:58:49,560
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, I'm not going to speak out of school

1334
00:58:49,560 --> 00:58:52,200
Speaker 2: and talk about players that could be off contract November one.

1335
00:58:52,240 --> 00:58:53,560
Speaker 2: But you don't have to be a rocket scientist to

1336
00:58:53,560 --> 00:58:55,160
Speaker 2: work out and knows you they are, who they are,

1337
00:58:55,520 --> 00:58:58,640
Speaker 2: who's played with, who his close mates, are I know

1338
00:58:58,720 --> 00:59:02,320
Speaker 2: that or that people just signing your own people want

1339
00:59:02,320 --> 00:59:02,840
Speaker 2: to play with him?

1340
00:59:03,280 --> 00:59:06,040
Speaker 1: Do you ring Benjab when you're Manhasika.

1341
00:59:07,040 --> 00:59:09,840
Speaker 2: Look, it's funny, Benji. I haven't got the closest relationship.

1342
00:59:10,600 --> 00:59:12,600
Speaker 2: We used to be close. I don't know really what happened,

1343
00:59:12,640 --> 00:59:15,600
Speaker 2: but so that wasn't you know. I spoke to his

1344
00:59:15,680 --> 00:59:18,400
Speaker 2: Benji's manager, and I rang the club, spoke to the CEO,

1345
00:59:19,880 --> 00:59:21,520
Speaker 2: and Jerome would have done this anyway. But part of

1346
00:59:21,560 --> 00:59:23,840
Speaker 2: the conversation with Jerome was you need to make sure

1347
00:59:23,880 --> 00:59:26,680
Speaker 2: that you do everything respectfully, and he would have done

1348
00:59:26,720 --> 00:59:30,040
Speaker 2: it by the Tigers because the moment you set foot

1349
00:59:30,280 --> 00:59:33,640
Speaker 2: in Papua New Guinea, you're not going through unnoticed that

1350
00:59:33,760 --> 00:59:36,040
Speaker 2: you'll be spotted the moment you walk off the plane

1351
00:59:36,080 --> 00:59:38,680
Speaker 2: by every single person who walks to that airport. It happened.

1352
00:59:39,200 --> 00:59:42,240
Speaker 2: It happened. So he needed to make sure that the

1353
00:59:42,280 --> 00:59:44,080
Speaker 2: Tigers were well aware of his visit. And that goes

1354
00:59:44,080 --> 00:59:46,240
Speaker 2: for any other player that we bring. I'll be telling

1355
00:59:46,280 --> 00:59:47,760
Speaker 2: them the same thing. You're not going to come in

1356
00:59:47,800 --> 00:59:50,400
Speaker 2: secret squirrel operation in and out of the country. It

1357
00:59:50,520 --> 00:59:53,960
Speaker 2: just will not happen. So everyone's saying that it was

1358
00:59:53,960 --> 00:59:58,040
Speaker 2: a publicity start to get Jerome and cameras. You cannot

1359
00:59:58,080 --> 01:00:00,840
Speaker 2: control that. The moment he arrived all over social media

1360
01:00:00,880 --> 01:00:01,520
Speaker 2: around the country.

1361
01:00:01,680 --> 01:00:03,840
Speaker 1: What do people watch footy on there? They have streaming.

1362
01:00:04,000 --> 01:00:06,040
Speaker 2: They got more footy on their TV than anywhere else.

1363
01:00:06,400 --> 01:00:08,400
Speaker 2: Like it's footy is you walk around the place, you

1364
01:00:08,440 --> 01:00:09,720
Speaker 2: go to the yacht club, or you go to the

1365
01:00:09,760 --> 01:00:12,000
Speaker 2: golf course or wherever it may be you go. There's

1366
01:00:12,000 --> 01:00:15,400
Speaker 2: all their television, what their homes, they're watching footy. Everybody

1367
01:00:15,440 --> 01:00:18,320
Speaker 2: watch footage's footy and they stream it as well. It's

1368
01:00:18,520 --> 01:00:20,360
Speaker 2: they all live and breath footy. And I'm not just

1369
01:00:20,400 --> 01:00:23,520
Speaker 2: talk at NRL Super League's on the local domestic competition

1370
01:00:23,560 --> 01:00:25,920
Speaker 2: that they just sell exit on mobile cups, on the

1371
01:00:25,960 --> 01:00:28,760
Speaker 2: women's games on there's so many sporting channels and it's

1372
01:00:28,760 --> 01:00:29,600
Speaker 2: all got rugular league.

1373
01:00:29,840 --> 01:00:31,040
Speaker 1: The women play over there as well.

1374
01:00:31,120 --> 01:00:33,560
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, which, to be fair, has been the biggest

1375
01:00:33,640 --> 01:00:38,520
Speaker 2: change because go back five or six years, the guys

1376
01:00:38,560 --> 01:00:40,720
Speaker 2: who organized the competitions were like, nut, women can't play,

1377
01:00:40,960 --> 01:00:44,240
Speaker 2: women can't play, it's not not allowed. But that's at

1378
01:00:44,280 --> 01:00:47,040
Speaker 2: a drastic change, and now they're like they're apologizing for

1379
01:00:47,040 --> 01:00:50,200
Speaker 2: the way they behaved all those years ago and realizing

1380
01:00:50,280 --> 01:00:52,720
Speaker 2: just how important it is for women to get a

1381
01:00:52,800 --> 01:00:54,080
Speaker 2: chance as well, and that's going to be part of

1382
01:00:54,080 --> 01:00:56,680
Speaker 2: what we build in the future. Eventually we'll have an

1383
01:00:56,760 --> 01:00:57,840
Speaker 2: nrl W team as well.

1384
01:00:57,880 --> 01:01:02,240
Speaker 1: Wow, Like, I'm just getting heaps of energy from me.

1385
01:01:02,320 --> 01:01:04,680
Speaker 1: Like when when you were feeling like you're a little

1386
01:01:04,720 --> 01:01:08,640
Speaker 1: jaded with journalism, how do you feel now? Like it

1387
01:01:08,800 --> 01:01:11,800
Speaker 1: just I just gauge you're just about jumping out of

1388
01:01:11,800 --> 01:01:12,760
Speaker 1: the stozzzz.

1389
01:01:13,280 --> 01:01:16,640
Speaker 2: I feel bad because the whole promise to my wife

1390
01:01:16,720 --> 01:01:18,600
Speaker 2: and family was I'd be more present. But at the

1391
01:01:18,640 --> 01:01:21,360
Speaker 2: moment it's been a bit chaotic. But he will. Now

1392
01:01:21,440 --> 01:01:23,400
Speaker 2: this is the excitement at the start. We want to

1393
01:01:23,440 --> 01:01:24,960
Speaker 2: do a good job. You've only got one shot at

1394
01:01:25,480 --> 01:01:27,280
Speaker 2: nailing the start, and I feel like we're doing a

1395
01:01:27,320 --> 01:01:30,920
Speaker 2: pretty good job of that. So it's the momentum is

1396
01:01:30,960 --> 01:01:36,920
Speaker 2: now there to continue Jerome Alex Johnston Media, it's now

1397
01:01:36,960 --> 01:01:39,080
Speaker 2: started the narrative a shift from it's.

1398
01:01:38,960 --> 01:01:39,600
Speaker 1: A great signing.

1399
01:01:39,680 --> 01:01:42,080
Speaker 2: Oh, he's huge for us, huge for the country. Yeah,

1400
01:01:42,600 --> 01:01:44,000
Speaker 2: you just don't know how important he is to the

1401
01:01:44,000 --> 01:01:48,560
Speaker 2: people of Pupping Guinea what he's done. Yeah, football wise,

1402
01:01:48,560 --> 01:01:50,160
Speaker 2: as I said, you know what he is. He's the

1403
01:01:50,160 --> 01:01:53,480
Speaker 2: greatest finisher of all time. He's got speed, He's going

1404
01:01:53,520 --> 01:01:55,920
Speaker 2: to bring leadership to you, to your dressing room. But

1405
01:01:55,960 --> 01:01:57,880
Speaker 2: he also gives the boys and girls around that country

1406
01:01:57,920 --> 01:02:00,200
Speaker 2: hope that being pupping the guinea is in a roade block,

1407
01:02:00,240 --> 01:02:03,120
Speaker 2: that you could achieve greatness, and that's what you want.

1408
01:02:03,720 --> 01:02:05,680
Speaker 1: Do you reckon in the modern game? In the modern

1409
01:02:05,880 --> 01:02:08,400
Speaker 1: history of the modern game, do you think the move

1410
01:02:09,240 --> 01:02:13,200
Speaker 1: by the NRL to include P andngs probably one of

1411
01:02:13,240 --> 01:02:17,080
Speaker 1: the most important milestones in aneral history. There are things

1412
01:02:17,120 --> 01:02:20,320
Speaker 1: in life that just keep delivering. The more time goes on,

1413
01:02:20,760 --> 01:02:23,800
Speaker 1: the more you appreciate them. Seventy five years of pen

1414
01:02:23,880 --> 01:02:28,320
Speaker 1: files range, once tasted, never forgotten, Let's keep going.

1415
01:02:29,560 --> 01:02:32,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, definitely, I think it's I honestly think it's the

1416
01:02:32,680 --> 01:02:36,520
Speaker 2: biggest move the game has ever made. Like if someone

1417
01:02:36,560 --> 01:02:37,920
Speaker 2: said to you ten years ago, they'll be a team

1418
01:02:37,920 --> 01:02:39,600
Speaker 2: of pupp in the Guinnea, you would have laughed at them.

1419
01:02:40,760 --> 01:02:43,240
Speaker 2: I would have laughed at them too. You just never

1420
01:02:43,720 --> 01:02:46,960
Speaker 2: you just never felt like it was possible in my lifetime,

1421
01:02:46,960 --> 01:02:49,200
Speaker 2: in your life, I just you just didn't see it happening,

1422
01:02:49,760 --> 01:02:51,880
Speaker 2: And forget the reasons why it happened. For a second,

1423
01:02:51,880 --> 01:02:54,560
Speaker 2: like everyone's going to say, I've had this chat with Widelock,

1424
01:02:54,600 --> 01:02:58,400
Speaker 2: Like I'm close to Danny, He's like, I don't like them.

1425
01:02:58,680 --> 01:03:02,640
Speaker 2: The motive behind this team, it's a political team. If

1426
01:03:02,680 --> 01:03:05,600
Speaker 2: you just put that aside for a second, Papa in

1427
01:03:05,600 --> 01:03:09,640
Speaker 2: your union deserve this team. Rugby league is everything to them.

1428
01:03:09,680 --> 01:03:11,720
Speaker 2: It's the only country in the world that's the national sport.

1429
01:03:11,720 --> 01:03:15,120
Speaker 2: They live and breathe it. They got ten to twelve

1430
01:03:15,160 --> 01:03:19,000
Speaker 2: million people like, it's such a huge pool of just

1431
01:03:19,320 --> 01:03:22,919
Speaker 2: devoted rugby league fans. They deserve this opportunity and whether

1432
01:03:23,000 --> 01:03:25,240
Speaker 2: or not it would have happened or not doesn't matter

1433
01:03:25,240 --> 01:03:27,560
Speaker 2: to them. It's happened. And I think right now as

1434
01:03:27,600 --> 01:03:30,200
Speaker 2: a game, everyone's got a responsibility to help make it work.

1435
01:03:30,240 --> 01:03:34,080
Speaker 2: Forget about tax incentives. Getting behind it is the best

1436
01:03:34,120 --> 01:03:35,360
Speaker 2: thing for rugby league. And I said that at the

1437
01:03:35,360 --> 01:03:40,040
Speaker 2: press conference. It's shortsighted to think that, you know why,

1438
01:03:40,560 --> 01:03:44,240
Speaker 2: suddenly it's unfair because they've got tax incentives. If rugby

1439
01:03:44,280 --> 01:03:47,600
Speaker 2: league in Papenniini thrives, the whole game thrives. I know

1440
01:03:47,680 --> 01:03:51,160
Speaker 2: it's not Souths or Roosters or Penate's responsibility to make

1441
01:03:51,200 --> 01:03:55,200
Speaker 2: that happen, but as a game, everyone will benefit from it.

1442
01:03:55,240 --> 01:03:57,840
Speaker 2: I genuinely believe that the amount of money that we

1443
01:03:57,960 --> 01:04:01,800
Speaker 2: brought into the game, the amount of opportunities if you

1444
01:04:01,840 --> 01:04:05,760
Speaker 2: want to truly be a global sport, this is I

1445
01:04:05,800 --> 01:04:08,440
Speaker 2: know it's only one island country, but it says to

1446
01:04:08,480 --> 01:04:10,320
Speaker 2: the rest of the world like, if you could do

1447
01:04:10,360 --> 01:04:13,919
Speaker 2: it in a developing country, why not then a spy

1448
01:04:14,040 --> 01:04:15,680
Speaker 2: to take this globally and then continue on.

1449
01:04:16,080 --> 01:04:18,280
Speaker 1: And I also think or by the way, all the

1450
01:04:18,400 --> 01:04:21,600
Speaker 1: existing Roguy League clubs are benefited from it in financial sense,

1451
01:04:22,440 --> 01:04:25,960
Speaker 1: and they're getting more less amount of each every other

1452
01:04:26,040 --> 01:04:28,040
Speaker 1: year too, So I mean everyone has done well out

1453
01:04:28,080 --> 01:04:30,080
Speaker 1: of it. So I don't think any rugby league club

1454
01:04:30,120 --> 01:04:31,080
Speaker 1: could cold complain about it.

1455
01:04:31,880 --> 01:04:33,800
Speaker 2: And no one was mark, No one said a word.

1456
01:04:34,400 --> 01:04:36,680
Speaker 2: Two weeks ago. Everyone was actually saying to me, why

1457
01:04:36,680 --> 01:04:38,960
Speaker 2: would you take on that job? You're not going to

1458
01:04:38,960 --> 01:04:40,760
Speaker 2: sign players to Port Moores, but you'll be back in

1459
01:04:40,800 --> 01:04:45,920
Speaker 2: media in two years. But with one signing, everyone's like, oh,

1460
01:04:45,960 --> 01:04:47,840
Speaker 2: it's unfair. This is this is going They're going to

1461
01:04:47,840 --> 01:04:49,240
Speaker 2: be a powerhouse. Now. We've got a long way to go.

1462
01:04:49,280 --> 01:04:51,320
Speaker 2: We got twenty eight players to still feel our top thirty,

1463
01:04:51,760 --> 01:04:53,680
Speaker 2: but the narrative is shifted, and now I'm our job

1464
01:04:53,720 --> 01:04:56,080
Speaker 2: to continue to shifting that narrative to show people that

1465
01:04:56,120 --> 01:04:57,640
Speaker 2: P and G can be a place that you come,

1466
01:04:57,840 --> 01:05:00,080
Speaker 2: you enjoy your work, you enjoy your living there, and

1467
01:05:00,080 --> 01:05:02,160
Speaker 2: you can have a good life. And that's how Yeah,

1468
01:05:02,200 --> 01:05:03,600
Speaker 2: that's our responsibility right now.

1469
01:05:03,720 --> 01:05:05,840
Speaker 1: And the big game will be in two or three

1470
01:05:05,920 --> 01:05:08,640
Speaker 1: or four or five or six years time, when you

1471
01:05:08,680 --> 01:05:10,919
Speaker 1: know it's all been going well and you know they're

1472
01:05:10,920 --> 01:05:13,320
Speaker 1: doing well in the game, that maybe getting top ten,

1473
01:05:13,360 --> 01:05:16,720
Speaker 1: then top eight, maybe some top four. The big test

1474
01:05:16,800 --> 01:05:18,520
Speaker 1: for you. The thing that's going to come up is

1475
01:05:18,720 --> 01:05:22,520
Speaker 1: cell recap management and recruit the management just generally like

1476
01:05:22,640 --> 01:05:26,520
Speaker 1: keeping players and replacing players and just building up your pathways.

1477
01:05:27,120 --> 01:05:28,720
Speaker 1: Then you're going to get you know, you're going to

1478
01:05:28,760 --> 01:05:30,960
Speaker 1: be in the guts of it then and that's sort

1479
01:05:31,000 --> 01:05:34,440
Speaker 1: of that's not hell, but it's hell and heaven at

1480
01:05:34,440 --> 01:05:36,840
Speaker 1: the same time. It's going to be unbelievably good but

1481
01:05:37,080 --> 01:05:38,320
Speaker 1: unbelievably challenging.

1482
01:05:38,440 --> 01:05:39,960
Speaker 2: We're in a honeymoon period right now, aren't we.

1483
01:05:40,000 --> 01:05:42,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, you totally are. But that's why you'll be energetic.

1484
01:05:42,440 --> 01:05:44,520
Speaker 1: But like I reckon, you can do it, mate, because

1485
01:05:44,960 --> 01:05:48,280
Speaker 1: you're young enough you understand the game really well. You've

1486
01:05:48,280 --> 01:05:50,120
Speaker 1: got to be this is a young men's game. This

1487
01:05:50,200 --> 01:05:52,360
Speaker 1: is for a young man, and you are a young

1488
01:05:52,400 --> 01:05:57,040
Speaker 1: man relatively speaking. Relatively speaking, but you are a young man.

1489
01:05:57,240 --> 01:05:59,120
Speaker 1: But and this is the sort of thing you can

1490
01:05:59,120 --> 01:06:01,080
Speaker 1: sort of see yourself yourself. Do you think you like

1491
01:06:01,120 --> 01:06:03,480
Speaker 1: this a twenty year gig? What are you and your

1492
01:06:03,480 --> 01:06:04,120
Speaker 1: wife talking about?

1493
01:06:04,240 --> 01:06:06,720
Speaker 2: I don't know, to be honest with you, I haven't. Obviously,

1494
01:06:06,760 --> 01:06:08,479
Speaker 2: there's two parts to it. There's the two years leading

1495
01:06:08,560 --> 01:06:10,800
Speaker 2: up setting it up, and then there's probably that two

1496
01:06:10,920 --> 01:06:14,040
Speaker 2: three year period where you're establishing the team, and then

1497
01:06:14,080 --> 01:06:17,160
Speaker 2: there's that growth period of then sustaining as I said

1498
01:06:17,160 --> 01:06:20,360
Speaker 2: to you, making sure it's pupping guinea. First period, as

1499
01:06:20,360 --> 01:06:24,480
Speaker 2: I said, building, second period, making sure we're successful. And

1500
01:06:24,520 --> 01:06:26,640
Speaker 2: then the third period is transitioning to it being self

1501
01:06:26,680 --> 01:06:30,240
Speaker 2: sustainable in pupping the guinea. And that's just admin business

1502
01:06:30,280 --> 01:06:34,320
Speaker 2: side of things coaching players. So how long I'm there

1503
01:06:34,320 --> 01:06:37,840
Speaker 2: for I have no idea, But I'm loving ever midt

1504
01:06:37,840 --> 01:06:40,640
Speaker 2: of it so far, and I hope, I hope everyone's

1505
01:06:40,640 --> 01:06:42,200
Speaker 2: going to get a second favorite team out of this,

1506
01:06:42,240 --> 01:06:45,920
Speaker 2: because you're if you get the opportunity one day to

1507
01:06:45,960 --> 01:06:48,919
Speaker 2: go over there. You can't explain just what you see

1508
01:06:48,920 --> 01:06:51,280
Speaker 2: it in their eyes. Like I remember walking through the

1509
01:06:51,320 --> 01:06:56,120
Speaker 2: school we took Jerome Law through an international school, walk

1510
01:06:56,160 --> 01:06:59,520
Speaker 2: past the classroom and two young girls they sort of

1511
01:06:59,520 --> 01:07:02,880
Speaker 2: looked looked up and they they just realized who they

1512
01:07:02,920 --> 01:07:07,200
Speaker 2: just saw and they just started screaming, really just started screaming.

1513
01:07:07,240 --> 01:07:10,120
Speaker 2: They couldn't believe that he was in their school. You

1514
01:07:10,120 --> 01:07:12,200
Speaker 2: have no idea the impact that these players are going

1515
01:07:12,200 --> 01:07:13,960
Speaker 2: to have on the people of pup New Uni. It's

1516
01:07:14,600 --> 01:07:15,600
Speaker 2: it'll be beautiful to watch.

1517
01:07:15,880 --> 01:07:18,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, that'll do me. Michael Chumas, Thanks very much mate,

1518
01:07:18,800 --> 01:07:19,160
Speaker 1: Thank you