WEBVTT - How the government’s climate targets stack up 0:00:00.360 --> 0:00:04.280 And today I'm joined by the two ministers, the Minister 0:00:04.400 --> 0:00:08.399 for Climate Change and Energy the Treasurer, but also by 0:00:08.720 --> 0:00:11.680 Matt Kean, the Chair of the Climate Change Authority. 0:00:12.119 --> 0:00:15.240 Having released the National Climate Risk Assessment, a report full 0:00:15.240 --> 0:00:18.640 of apocalyptic climate warnings, earlier this week, the government has 0:00:18.680 --> 0:00:22.279 now announced its twenty thirty five emissions target. Although it's 0:00:22.320 --> 0:00:25.040 not a target exactly, it's a target range. 0:00:25.680 --> 0:00:29.080 Today I announced that we have accepted their advice at 0:00:29.120 --> 0:00:34.040 Australia's twenty thirty five emissions target be sixty two to 0:00:34.120 --> 0:00:39.239 seventy percent. This is a responsible target, back by the science, 0:00:39.680 --> 0:00:43.440 back by a practical plan to get there, and built 0:00:43.920 --> 0:00:45.280 on proven technology. 0:00:46.000 --> 0:00:49.040 The government says the target is both achievable and ambitious, 0:00:49.360 --> 0:00:51.199 but there are others who say the government has set 0:00:51.240 --> 0:00:53.400 themselves a target that means they don't have to do 0:00:53.720 --> 0:00:54.720 or change anything. 0:00:55.840 --> 0:00:59.760 These states, the collective action from the States would already 0:01:00.080 --> 0:01:04.919 each that target range by twenty thirty five, so nationally 0:01:05.200 --> 0:01:09.319 we are adding absolutely nothing. And they know that what 0:01:09.400 --> 0:01:13.280 they're doing is not enough on the science, on the modeling, 0:01:13.600 --> 0:01:17.120 on what we're being told from every serious climate agency, 0:01:17.520 --> 0:01:20.400 and so they don't want to set themselves a target 0:01:20.440 --> 0:01:23.240 that they will fail into the future. So what we 0:01:23.360 --> 0:01:27.319 have is a target range that will mean no change 0:01:27.360 --> 0:01:30.559 to anything that they're doing and no drastic action. 0:01:32.120 --> 0:01:39.760 I'm Ruby Jones and you're listening to seven AM today 0:01:39.880 --> 0:01:43.280 contributing editor of The New Daily and Euymicus on how 0:01:43.319 --> 0:01:46.960 ambitious Australia's missions target really is and whether it's enough 0:01:46.959 --> 0:01:56.440 to keep global warming below one point five degrees. It's Friday, 0:01:56.600 --> 0:01:57.480 September nineteen. 0:02:02.840 --> 0:02:07.480 Alongside our twenty thirty five target today and the release 0:02:07.560 --> 0:02:12.800 of this report here Australia's net zero plan going forward, 0:02:13.280 --> 0:02:17.919 we're announcing significant new measures that build on our existing plans. 0:02:18.440 --> 0:02:21.679 Amy the Abbadezy government has just announced its updated emissions 0:02:21.720 --> 0:02:25.160 reduction target, committing to a reduction of somewhere between sixty 0:02:25.160 --> 0:02:28.440 two and seventy percent by twenty thirty five. And along 0:02:28.440 --> 0:02:30.919 with the target, they've announced some measures to help get there, 0:02:31.520 --> 0:02:34.560 including a five billion dollar a zero fund and two 0:02:34.560 --> 0:02:36.920 billion dollars to drive down electricity prices. 0:02:37.320 --> 0:02:41.560 This will help to accelerate long term renewable projects right 0:02:41.639 --> 0:02:46.520 across our nation. In addition to that, we know that 0:02:46.639 --> 0:02:50.320 getting emissions down in the resources sector and heavy industry 0:02:50.919 --> 0:02:54.160 is the next major area and will help heavy industry 0:02:54.200 --> 0:02:55.640 to do the heavy lifting. 0:02:56.080 --> 0:02:58.240 So tell me what you make of these announcements. 0:02:58.639 --> 0:03:01.800 Yeah, I mean all of these things are basically just 0:03:02.080 --> 0:03:07.080 expanding on existing programs and existing targets. They're basically saying, 0:03:07.120 --> 0:03:10.280 we're going to expand the amount of renewable energy that 0:03:10.320 --> 0:03:12.519 we're putting into the grid, which is something that they've 0:03:12.560 --> 0:03:15.079 been doing since the first time that they were elected. 0:03:15.360 --> 0:03:18.239 And we're going to start funding other projects and other 0:03:18.280 --> 0:03:21.240 technologies that we think are going to help us get 0:03:21.320 --> 0:03:23.880 to the point that we need to get to. But 0:03:23.960 --> 0:03:27.399 the one thing that they're not doing, the absolute crucial 0:03:27.440 --> 0:03:31.040 thing they are not doing, is stopping new coal and 0:03:31.120 --> 0:03:35.040 gas expansion. And if they just did that, we could 0:03:35.080 --> 0:03:39.000 meet our climate targets. We could actually plan for a 0:03:39.080 --> 0:03:43.080 future where we would have the technology on top of 0:03:43.320 --> 0:03:46.600 building upon the cut from admissions from not having new 0:03:46.640 --> 0:03:49.720 coal and gas. But they won't do that. And so 0:03:49.800 --> 0:03:53.120 all of these announcements that they're making in terms of oh, 0:03:53.120 --> 0:03:56.240 we're going to expand this renewables program, Oh, we're going 0:03:56.320 --> 0:03:59.480 to fund green hydrogen, we're going to start funding green steel, 0:04:00.120 --> 0:04:03.440 none of that really matters because we're not doing the 0:04:03.520 --> 0:04:08.640 one thing the science, the UN, every climate agency is 0:04:08.720 --> 0:04:11.560 telling us we need to do, which is stop new 0:04:11.640 --> 0:04:13.160 coal and gas projects. 0:04:13.880 --> 0:04:18.240 And the big question in regards to the target range, 0:04:18.560 --> 0:04:22.000 obviously is how does this range of sixty two to 0:04:22.040 --> 0:04:25.000 seventy percent stack up in terms of being able to 0:04:25.040 --> 0:04:27.800 limit global warming to one point five degrees? Can that 0:04:27.839 --> 0:04:28.359 be achieved? 0:04:28.880 --> 0:04:31.080 No, it can't. We've already passed that. I mean, I 0:04:31.080 --> 0:04:34.360 think the Climate Risk Assessment Report, which was released quite 0:04:34.440 --> 0:04:36.800 recently also showed that we're already past that. 0:04:37.200 --> 0:04:41.320 Australia's first National Climate Risk Assessment is warning one and 0:04:41.320 --> 0:04:44.039 a half million Australians are at risk from sea level 0:04:44.120 --> 0:04:47.960 rises by twenty to fifty unless climate change can be limited. 0:04:48.360 --> 0:04:52.200 The assessment also warns climate related hazards will increase, heat 0:04:52.240 --> 0:04:56.960 related deaths will soar, and the cost of disaster recovery. 0:04:56.600 --> 0:04:59.280 Will jump to more than forty billion dollars a year. 0:05:00.040 --> 0:05:03.360 The minimum we needed to do was about seventy five percent. 0:05:03.720 --> 0:05:06.320 That was the bare minimum we needed to commit to 0:05:06.480 --> 0:05:10.120 by twenty thirty five, and instead we're saying, oh, you know, 0:05:10.279 --> 0:05:13.080 we can be somewhere in the low sixties and that'll 0:05:13.080 --> 0:05:16.919 still get us there. I mean, the entire Furfee around. 0:05:17.040 --> 0:05:21.520 How the Albanezy government is framing its climate emissions reduction 0:05:21.720 --> 0:05:24.960 plan is that there is going to be technology that 0:05:25.080 --> 0:05:28.440 doesn't exist yet that is going to save us in 0:05:28.480 --> 0:05:31.119 the future, that we don't need to do too much 0:05:31.320 --> 0:05:34.599 because this technology is going to come at some point 0:05:34.680 --> 0:05:38.400 between twenty fifty and that's going to make everything better, 0:05:38.560 --> 0:05:41.359 so we don't actually need to rush. That is not 0:05:41.600 --> 0:05:45.160 what the science is telling us. And I don't know 0:05:45.200 --> 0:05:49.040 how many people have actually read the Climate Risk Assessment Report. 0:05:49.480 --> 0:05:52.120 It didn't get as much coverage as it should, and 0:05:52.160 --> 0:05:54.560 that's probably because I think we all have a bit 0:05:54.600 --> 0:05:57.920 of fatigue, and I think when we're looking at modeling, 0:05:57.920 --> 0:06:00.440 we're just like, oh, well, you can model anything, but 0:06:00.520 --> 0:06:03.279 this is some serious modeling. And one of the things 0:06:03.279 --> 0:06:06.719 that was so striking to me was it basically said 0:06:07.200 --> 0:06:09.960 we are going to have one and a half million 0:06:10.080 --> 0:06:13.760 people have unlivable homes by twenty fifty. 0:06:14.120 --> 0:06:17.240 By twenty fifty, the number of coastal communities located in 0:06:17.320 --> 0:06:20.839 high and very high risk areas will increase substantially, and 0:06:20.880 --> 0:06:24.520 if current population remains the same, that will represent an 0:06:24.520 --> 0:06:28.200 increase to one point five million people impacted in coastal 0:06:28.240 --> 0:06:31.560 areas by civil rise, corrosion and other impacts. 0:06:31.920 --> 0:06:34.760 If you are currently twenty, that is when you're in 0:06:34.800 --> 0:06:38.359 your midlife, your super is still going to be another 0:06:38.720 --> 0:06:41.880 two or three decades away. From that point, you will 0:06:41.880 --> 0:06:45.040 be just starting to pay off your mortgage, if indeed 0:06:45.080 --> 0:06:49.039 you've managed to have one, you still have decades and 0:06:49.120 --> 0:06:52.960 decades of your life to live. And essentially, what the 0:06:53.000 --> 0:06:56.840 government is saying with this this target range that it's 0:06:56.880 --> 0:07:00.560 set is we don't have to rush to do anything 0:07:00.640 --> 0:07:05.359 about that, because we'll eventually work it out sometime in 0:07:05.400 --> 0:07:07.000 the future, just not now. 0:07:07.960 --> 0:07:10.480 And when you say the government is waiting on technology 0:07:10.480 --> 0:07:13.640 that doesn't really exist yet, you're talking about things like 0:07:13.760 --> 0:07:16.200 carbon capture and storage and what else. 0:07:16.600 --> 0:07:18.920 Yeah, I mean carbon capture and storage is probably the 0:07:18.920 --> 0:07:20.880 one that we know the most about, which is this 0:07:21.080 --> 0:07:25.040 idea that you can basically capture the carbon bombs and 0:07:25.080 --> 0:07:28.000 then bury them in the ground or under the sea. 0:07:28.080 --> 0:07:32.360 Australia recently is changing laws to allow you to bury 0:07:32.400 --> 0:07:36.240 carbon bombs within the ocean seabed. We don't know if 0:07:36.240 --> 0:07:38.760 it works or not, but it's like this idea of 0:07:38.760 --> 0:07:42.520 offsets as well, which is the idea that you can 0:07:42.800 --> 0:07:45.520 choose not to burn a forest or cut down a 0:07:45.560 --> 0:07:48.040 forest and not get rid of the sea grass, or 0:07:48.160 --> 0:07:51.600 basically just get land put aside and you're not going 0:07:51.640 --> 0:07:54.680 to touch that, and that's going to offset any of 0:07:54.720 --> 0:07:59.800 the emissions that your project is generating. But this idea 0:08:00.160 --> 0:08:03.200 that you can just offset it by not cutting down 0:08:03.280 --> 0:08:06.720 those trees and that's going to allow you to continue 0:08:06.760 --> 0:08:11.360 emitting or in some cases increasing emitting, depending on how 0:08:11.400 --> 0:08:14.800 much you're offsetting with your project, that that is going 0:08:14.840 --> 0:08:17.680 to be what saves us doesn't even make sense on 0:08:17.800 --> 0:08:22.480 the mass. But this is the sort of technology, the 0:08:22.520 --> 0:08:26.640 sort of ideas that we're being sold as the solutions 0:08:26.720 --> 0:08:30.760 to the climate crisis. So people aren't even really being 0:08:30.800 --> 0:08:33.880 able to have faith that this technology is going to 0:08:33.920 --> 0:08:36.600 come down the line and save us because what we're 0:08:36.679 --> 0:08:39.440 being told so far doesn't make sense. 0:08:43.240 --> 0:08:46.880 Coming up why climate targets aren't just an environmental problem 0:08:46.920 --> 0:08:51.080 but a diplomatic one too. 0:09:00.559 --> 0:09:02.800 This is a range that I'm hopeful that we can 0:09:02.880 --> 0:09:07.800 overachieve on our range positions Australia as a global leader 0:09:07.880 --> 0:09:12.080 on climate ambition. In fact, we are presenting a higher 0:09:12.120 --> 0:09:14.920 ambition than most other advanced economies. 0:09:15.960 --> 0:09:19.920 The Chair of the Climate Change authorities. Matt Kean. He 0:09:19.960 --> 0:09:23.360 says that this target it positions Australia as a global 0:09:23.480 --> 0:09:26.440 leader in terms of climate ambition. The government will take 0:09:26.480 --> 0:09:29.960 this target to the UN General Assembly alongside other world leaders. 0:09:30.000 --> 0:09:33.400 So how do our targets compare to what other countries 0:09:33.440 --> 0:09:33.959 are promising? 0:09:34.320 --> 0:09:36.560 Well, not great And I mean we don't even have 0:09:36.640 --> 0:09:39.120 to go that far to find people who are going 0:09:39.160 --> 0:09:41.400 to be very upset with us. The specific is going 0:09:41.480 --> 0:09:44.560 to be very, very upset with this target. They're already 0:09:44.920 --> 0:09:47.640 very upset with what Australia is doing and continuing to 0:09:47.679 --> 0:09:50.880 approve colon gas, and they've made that eminently clear in 0:09:50.960 --> 0:09:52.040 all sorts of forums. 0:09:52.320 --> 0:09:57.840 Fossil fuel production expansion is an internationally wrongful act under 0:09:57.880 --> 0:09:58.600 international law. 0:09:59.120 --> 0:10:02.680 We know from the ip PCC reports that Australia needs 0:10:02.720 --> 0:10:05.520 to do more in stopping new coal and new gas. 0:10:05.559 --> 0:10:08.760 That has been made very very clear. Even if we 0:10:08.920 --> 0:10:11.680 switch to renewables, we do all of the things that 0:10:11.720 --> 0:10:14.760 the Albanezy government is doing, and those are good things. 0:10:15.360 --> 0:10:17.120 But even if we do all of that, if we 0:10:17.240 --> 0:10:20.640 continue to open up coal and gas which is burned 0:10:20.640 --> 0:10:23.720 in other countries which you know aren't as far along 0:10:23.760 --> 0:10:27.560 the line of the renewable transition, or their economies haven't 0:10:27.559 --> 0:10:30.920 managed to transition to what we're all trying to do 0:10:31.160 --> 0:10:35.320 by twenty fifty. We're still responsible for that. And it's 0:10:35.360 --> 0:10:37.959 things like that that are brought up at the UN 0:10:38.040 --> 0:10:40.600 meetings that we conveniently just kind of push to the 0:10:40.720 --> 0:10:44.480 side whenever we talk about climate action, because we're trying 0:10:44.520 --> 0:10:48.120 to pretend that what we export and what we send 0:10:48.160 --> 0:10:52.040 out doesn't count to what we are doing. Of course 0:10:52.080 --> 0:10:55.880 it does. And I'm not saying we stop or coal 0:10:55.920 --> 0:10:58.880 and gas that we currently have. I'm saying that we 0:10:58.960 --> 0:11:01.160 don't need to open up up any more. 0:11:01.800 --> 0:11:04.360 And as you mentioned, our emissions targets are not just 0:11:04.400 --> 0:11:08.360 an environmental or economic issue, they're a diplomatic one. Australia 0:11:08.400 --> 0:11:10.760 has been trying to strengthen its security ties with the 0:11:10.800 --> 0:11:14.720 Pacific island nations. We've recently seen more than one agreement 0:11:14.760 --> 0:11:17.400 fail to get over the line, in particular with Papua 0:11:17.440 --> 0:11:20.520 New Guinea. So how much was climate policy a sticking 0:11:20.520 --> 0:11:22.600 point in terms of that defense agreement. 0:11:23.000 --> 0:11:25.000 Well, we know it's a sticking point not just for 0:11:25.040 --> 0:11:28.760 that defense agreement but with all of our relations with 0:11:28.880 --> 0:11:29.520 the Pacific. 0:11:30.000 --> 0:11:32.599 The government hope to emerge from the Pacific over the 0:11:32.640 --> 0:11:36.120 last two weeks, holding aloft two documents or two treaties, 0:11:36.600 --> 0:11:39.719 one from Vanuuatu, the Nakamal Agreement that it hoped to 0:11:39.760 --> 0:11:43.640 sign last week, and this defense treaty that has been 0:11:43.679 --> 0:11:46.720 talked about so widely and so broadly for the last 0:11:46.760 --> 0:11:48.800 three or four weeks in particular, and in the end 0:11:48.840 --> 0:11:50.240 it's emerging with none. 0:11:50.559 --> 0:11:54.840 So we have had Vaniwatu also say no to an agreement. 0:11:55.240 --> 0:11:58.920 It's the second time in two years where Vdiwatu has said, actually, no, 0:11:59.000 --> 0:12:03.600 we're not willing to sign away our strategic sovereignty for 0:12:03.679 --> 0:12:05.480 whatever you're offering us Australia. 0:12:06.080 --> 0:12:10.280 Some of my ministers and my mbs, they feel that 0:12:10.559 --> 0:12:14.960 it requires more discussions through particularly on some of the 0:12:14.960 --> 0:12:17.520 specific wordings in the agreement. 0:12:18.280 --> 0:12:22.280 We know from the Pacific Island Forum, from the multiple 0:12:22.320 --> 0:12:25.680 statements that have been put out by Pacific Region leaders 0:12:25.960 --> 0:12:29.839 that they want Australia to actually act seriously on this. 0:12:30.200 --> 0:12:33.800 It's because Pacific Islands know better than any of us 0:12:34.120 --> 0:12:37.439 the impacts of climate change. They are already living it. 0:12:37.559 --> 0:12:40.720 They know what it's like to see your home start 0:12:40.760 --> 0:12:45.000 to disappear underwater. Australia knows what that's like too, because 0:12:45.040 --> 0:12:50.440 we've started working on refugee deals climate refugee deals with 0:12:50.520 --> 0:12:53.920 some Pacific island regions, where basically we're saying, well, you 0:12:53.960 --> 0:12:57.120 can migrate to Australia because your home is no longer 0:12:57.160 --> 0:13:00.880 going to exist. So all of these things do count 0:13:01.160 --> 0:13:04.360 in terms of how the Pacific views us. So when 0:13:04.400 --> 0:13:07.199 we go to them and we say, oh, hey, guys, 0:13:07.520 --> 0:13:10.360 we'd really like you to make us the security partner 0:13:10.400 --> 0:13:14.800 of choice, they're increasingly saying, actually, we're not sure that 0:13:14.800 --> 0:13:17.320 that works for us, because you're not listening to what 0:13:17.440 --> 0:13:20.800 we're saying when it comes to climate, when it comes 0:13:20.800 --> 0:13:22.880 to how you treat us, when it comes to these 0:13:22.920 --> 0:13:26.240 agreements that you make with us, Why should you only 0:13:26.320 --> 0:13:29.400 ever view us through the lens of defense when you 0:13:29.520 --> 0:13:34.400 can't actually see that our entire lives, culture and nations 0:13:34.480 --> 0:13:37.480 are at risk and you're not actually doing anything about that. 0:13:39.720 --> 0:13:41.960 And it comes to a shock to a lot of people. 0:13:42.000 --> 0:13:44.280 But I speak to quite a lot of people in 0:13:44.320 --> 0:13:47.240 the Pacific or who work in the Pacific trying to 0:13:47.240 --> 0:13:50.120 get agreement from the government, and we are not popular 0:13:50.360 --> 0:13:53.200 in the Pacific, and you can see the reasons for that. 0:13:53.840 --> 0:13:56.920 So it is going to have further repercussion. So everybody 0:13:56.920 --> 0:14:01.920 who worries about China getting inroads into the Pacific, These 0:14:01.960 --> 0:14:05.160 sorts of decisions that Australia makes when it comes to climate, 0:14:05.200 --> 0:14:07.120 when it comes to the environment, when it comes to 0:14:07.160 --> 0:14:11.360 proper action, all impact on that and we're not exactly 0:14:11.440 --> 0:14:13.240 telling them that they can count on us. 0:14:16.160 --> 0:14:18.320 Well, Amy, thank you so much for your time. 0:14:18.800 --> 0:14:19.200 Thank you. 0:14:32.280 --> 0:14:34.960 Also in the news today, reactions are trickling in after 0:14:34.960 --> 0:14:39.040 the Prime Minister's emissions productions announcement yesterday. Opposition leader Susan 0:14:39.120 --> 0:14:41.760 Lee says the target quote fails on both counts, on 0:14:41.840 --> 0:14:45.080 both cost and credibility, with National's leader David Little Proud 0:14:45.480 --> 0:14:49.280 also adding they will not support the target. Meanwhile, Independent 0:14:49.320 --> 0:14:52.120 Senator David Pocock has criticized the Prime Minister for not 0:14:52.160 --> 0:14:55.120 being ambitious enough, saying the government is not listening to 0:14:55.160 --> 0:14:57.480 the science and that quote. We cannot give up on this. 0:14:58.720 --> 0:15:01.680 And Alan Jones has pleaded not guilty to twenty seven 0:15:01.760 --> 0:15:05.200 charges of indecent assault and some alleged victims have withdrawn 0:15:05.240 --> 0:15:07.440 from the case. In the first hearing for the disgraced 0:15:07.480 --> 0:15:11.360 former broadcaster held yesterday. Jones had been charged with a 0:15:11.440 --> 0:15:14.240 number of offenses in New South Wales between twenty one 0:15:14.280 --> 0:15:18.080 and twenty nineteen. Yesterday, eleven of his charges of aggravated 0:15:18.120 --> 0:15:21.360 indecent assault were downgraded and the number of victims involved 0:15:21.360 --> 0:15:24.360 in the case dropped from eleven to nine. The case 0:15:24.400 --> 0:15:26.640 will go to trial in front of a magistrate next month. 0:15:27.480 --> 0:15:30.080 I'm Ruby Jones. This is seven am. Thanks for listening.