1 00:00:03,990 --> 00:00:06,210 Sean Aylmer: Welcome to the Fear and Greed Daily interview. I'm Sean 2 00:00:06,210 --> 00:00:09,059 Sean Aylmer: Aylmer. The pandemic saw a surge in the number of 3 00:00:09,059 --> 00:00:12,540 Sean Aylmer: people starting their business or setting up a side hustle, 4 00:00:12,869 --> 00:00:16,949 Sean Aylmer: but many small businesses overlook the importance of branding. Branding 5 00:00:16,949 --> 00:00:20,489 Sean Aylmer: represents your public identity and credibility, so it's pretty important 6 00:00:20,489 --> 00:00:23,040 Sean Aylmer: to get it right. Today we're getting a masterclass in 7 00:00:23,040 --> 00:00:26,160 Sean Aylmer: branding from someone who does it every day. Jye Smith 8 00:00:26,189 --> 00:00:29,310 Sean Aylmer: is the founder and managing director of brand agency DOUBLESTAR. 9 00:00:29,730 --> 00:00:31,109 Sean Aylmer: Jye, welcome to Fear and Greed. 10 00:00:31,620 --> 00:00:32,610 Jye Smith: Thanks very much for having me. 11 00:00:33,330 --> 00:00:36,479 Sean Aylmer: So what is branding in really simple language? It's a 12 00:00:36,479 --> 00:00:37,530 Sean Aylmer: lot more than a logo. 13 00:00:38,130 --> 00:00:41,400 Jye Smith: Yeah, it's a collection of how your business comes to 14 00:00:41,400 --> 00:00:45,479 Jye Smith: life. The way we generally talk about brand is the 15 00:00:45,479 --> 00:00:48,539 Jye Smith: things that make up your business as a whole experience. 16 00:00:48,570 --> 00:00:50,790 Jye Smith: So what it looks like, obviously everyone looks at logos 17 00:00:50,790 --> 00:00:53,068 Jye Smith: and looks at slogans, and that's very easy, but it's 18 00:00:53,070 --> 00:00:56,100 Jye Smith: also the way your brand or business behaves. And so 19 00:00:56,100 --> 00:01:00,030 Jye Smith: we often treat brands as verbs rather than nouns. So 20 00:01:00,030 --> 00:01:02,579 Jye Smith: it's a collection of the things it does, the things 21 00:01:02,580 --> 00:01:06,030 Jye Smith: it says, the tone, the style, the language, everything from 22 00:01:06,030 --> 00:01:08,850 Jye Smith: your website to the very culture inside your building. 23 00:01:09,809 --> 00:01:12,569 Sean Aylmer: Okay. And then it reminds me of a great example 24 00:01:12,569 --> 00:01:15,600 Sean Aylmer: when I was working at Fairfax and we were transferring 25 00:01:15,810 --> 00:01:18,450 Sean Aylmer: basically from print to digital. One of the great examples 26 00:01:18,450 --> 00:01:21,360 Sean Aylmer: someone gave me was National Geographic and the yellow hue 27 00:01:21,389 --> 00:01:26,520 Sean Aylmer: around stories and certainly typeface and how they present themselves 28 00:01:26,520 --> 00:01:28,770 Sean Aylmer: and things like that. But it's kind of what I'm 29 00:01:28,770 --> 00:01:31,379 Sean Aylmer: using that example simply because I think you think that 30 00:01:31,379 --> 00:01:35,039 Sean Aylmer: yellow hue around National Geographic, it evokes an emotion in 31 00:01:35,040 --> 00:01:36,509 Sean Aylmer: you, you know what it stands for. 32 00:01:37,140 --> 00:01:41,039 Jye Smith: It does. And that emotion or that nostalgia that we 33 00:01:41,039 --> 00:01:43,739 Jye Smith: now feel about National Geographic comes as a result of 34 00:01:43,740 --> 00:01:46,859 Jye Smith: its history and its heritage. If you look really deeply 35 00:01:46,859 --> 00:01:50,550 Jye Smith: at that frame, what it's doing is it's speaking much 36 00:01:50,550 --> 00:01:54,420 Jye Smith: more to putting the world into view. It's about putting 37 00:01:54,420 --> 00:01:57,809 Jye Smith: things into perspective. It's about giving you insight and vision 38 00:01:57,809 --> 00:02:00,360 Jye Smith: into the world around you. And they're the things that 39 00:02:00,360 --> 00:02:04,350 Jye Smith: National Geographic represent and the things that the brand allows 40 00:02:04,350 --> 00:02:07,260 Jye Smith: you to do. And to say that's just a color 41 00:02:07,260 --> 00:02:13,138 Jye Smith: and just a logo is really dismissive. It's quite minimalist 42 00:02:13,139 --> 00:02:16,679 Jye Smith: in actually thinking about the power behind an organization or 43 00:02:16,679 --> 00:02:17,371 Jye Smith: a brand like that. 44 00:02:17,371 --> 00:02:22,139 Sean Aylmer: Okay, so where do I start? So let's say I've just 45 00:02:22,139 --> 00:02:25,138 Sean Aylmer: started a small business. How do I figure out my brand? 46 00:02:26,100 --> 00:02:29,639 Jye Smith: Where we like to start is speaking to what you 47 00:02:29,639 --> 00:02:32,730 Jye Smith: want your brand to mean to your customers. And when 48 00:02:32,730 --> 00:02:35,340 Jye Smith: we talk about meaning, we think of that as a 49 00:02:35,340 --> 00:02:38,429 Jye Smith: collection of what your customers need to think, feel, and 50 00:02:38,429 --> 00:02:42,179 Jye Smith: do when they come into touch with your brand. So 51 00:02:42,180 --> 00:02:44,669 Jye Smith: it might be about evoking an emotion. It might be 52 00:02:44,669 --> 00:02:48,300 Jye Smith: about enabling something they couldn't do before. It might be 53 00:02:48,300 --> 00:02:50,580 Jye Smith: about value, it might be about expertise, and it might 54 00:02:50,580 --> 00:02:53,820 Jye Smith: even be about entertainment. But at its core, what is 55 00:02:53,820 --> 00:02:56,730 Jye Smith: the purpose of your brand and why does it exist 56 00:02:56,730 --> 00:02:59,189 Jye Smith: is where we like to start. And that can get 57 00:02:59,190 --> 00:03:01,680 Jye Smith: very fluffy and it can get very airy fairy, but 58 00:03:01,680 --> 00:03:04,410 Jye Smith: if you sell sliding doors, and I've got a local 59 00:03:04,650 --> 00:03:07,200 Jye Smith: example around where I grew up in San Sousi, you 60 00:03:07,200 --> 00:03:10,049 Jye Smith: want your sliding doors to work like magic. And so 61 00:03:10,050 --> 00:03:13,048 Jye Smith: this guy has a brilliant van called Wizard Sliding Doors. 62 00:03:13,049 --> 00:03:14,520 Jye Smith: I've never met him. I just look at his van 63 00:03:14,520 --> 00:03:16,559 Jye Smith: every day and it's got a great big wizard on 64 00:03:16,559 --> 00:03:18,810 Jye Smith: it. And I'm like, it's such a great feeling to 65 00:03:18,810 --> 00:03:21,600 Jye Smith: think that he didn't take himself too seriously. He knew 66 00:03:21,600 --> 00:03:24,480 Jye Smith: what his customers wanted and he put a great big 67 00:03:24,480 --> 00:03:26,910 Jye Smith: wizard on the side of your sliding glass van door. 68 00:03:27,059 --> 00:03:28,530 Jye Smith: Then people are going to take notice. 69 00:03:28,980 --> 00:03:30,719 Sean Aylmer: Okay, so I'm going to give you a test. Fear 70 00:03:30,719 --> 00:03:34,770 Sean Aylmer: and Greed, our whole goal is to educate, to actually 71 00:03:34,770 --> 00:03:40,050 Sean Aylmer: talk about business news in an accessible way. So people 72 00:03:40,050 --> 00:03:42,900 Sean Aylmer: listen to it once, hear it, think I understand that, 73 00:03:43,140 --> 00:03:46,469 Sean Aylmer: but the purpose of what we do is to better 74 00:03:46,469 --> 00:03:50,010 Sean Aylmer: inform people. How do we think about that as a brand? 75 00:03:50,549 --> 00:03:52,889 Jye Smith: So where I would start is I would take exactly 76 00:03:52,889 --> 00:03:55,380 Jye Smith: what you've said and put it into three buckets. The 77 00:03:55,380 --> 00:03:58,710 Jye Smith: first bucket is relevance. So you're making the news accessible. 78 00:03:58,710 --> 00:04:01,320 Jye Smith: That's very relevant to me. Then the second bucket would 79 00:04:01,320 --> 00:04:04,139 Jye Smith: be credibility. And I'd spend some time asking, well why 80 00:04:04,139 --> 00:04:06,990 Jye Smith: are you guys the source people should come to engage 81 00:04:06,990 --> 00:04:09,780 Jye Smith: about these sorts of insights? And the third one's the 82 00:04:09,780 --> 00:04:13,050 Jye Smith: most important, what makes it distinctive and what are you 83 00:04:13,050 --> 00:04:15,330 Jye Smith: guys doing that no one else is doing? And then 84 00:04:15,330 --> 00:04:18,719 Jye Smith: literally wrap those three areas up of credibility, relevance, and 85 00:04:18,720 --> 00:04:22,469 Jye Smith: distinctiveness. And then we say, what image does this evoke? 86 00:04:22,469 --> 00:04:25,500 Jye Smith: What song does this evoke? What color does this evoke? 87 00:04:25,678 --> 00:04:27,690 Jye Smith: And we work around those things to come up with 88 00:04:27,690 --> 00:04:30,990 Jye Smith: what we call like brand concepts, which are the territories 89 00:04:30,990 --> 00:04:34,140 Jye Smith: that your brand might engage with. And from that we 90 00:04:34,140 --> 00:04:37,409 Jye Smith: then work with designers to visualize that. So it's exactly 91 00:04:37,410 --> 00:04:40,830 Jye Smith: what you said put into a framework and you got to 92 00:04:40,830 --> 00:04:43,289 Jye Smith: remember frameworks just frame the work. So you guys already 93 00:04:43,290 --> 00:04:45,748 Jye Smith: done all that. We're simply taking that and applying a 94 00:04:45,750 --> 00:04:46,200 Jye Smith: new lens to it. 95 00:04:46,200 --> 00:04:50,190 Sean Aylmer: Okay. Is it about, I'm just trying to decide, is 96 00:04:50,190 --> 00:04:53,100 Sean Aylmer: it about finding a point of difference or is it 97 00:04:53,100 --> 00:04:57,029 Sean Aylmer: about finding what we are best at? Which may not 98 00:04:57,029 --> 00:04:58,229 Sean Aylmer: actually be a point of difference. 99 00:04:58,980 --> 00:05:01,980 Jye Smith: Exactly. And that's why those three, I think about them 100 00:05:01,980 --> 00:05:05,519 Jye Smith: as rings. I realize I'm just about to draw in, I'm about to draw on 101 00:05:05,519 --> 00:05:10,738 Jye Smith: the air on the podcast. But your relevance and credibility, that's what you 102 00:05:10,740 --> 00:05:13,680 Jye Smith: do and why you do it better. But your distinctiveness 103 00:05:13,680 --> 00:05:16,320 Jye Smith: is how you do it differently. There's something that we 104 00:05:16,320 --> 00:05:18,599 Jye Smith: look at in brand that doesn't apply to other marketing 105 00:05:18,599 --> 00:05:21,029 Jye Smith: disciplines, and the first one is to almost ignore your 106 00:05:21,029 --> 00:05:25,050 Jye Smith: customer. Because being salient or being novel or being different, 107 00:05:25,320 --> 00:05:29,370 Jye Smith: is far more powerful than being meaningful. And people get 108 00:05:29,370 --> 00:05:31,470 Jye Smith: quite upset when they hear that sometimes. They're like, " Yeah, 109 00:05:31,470 --> 00:05:33,839 Jye Smith: but it's about how much work we've done, all these 110 00:05:33,839 --> 00:05:36,178 Jye Smith: great things that I can do and I can achieve." 111 00:05:36,178 --> 00:05:39,330 Jye Smith: But if nobody takes notice, then it doesn't matter. And 112 00:05:39,330 --> 00:05:41,549 Jye Smith: we live in a world now where most of our 113 00:05:41,549 --> 00:05:44,460 Jye Smith: brand interactions happen on five inches of glass, in our 114 00:05:44,460 --> 00:05:48,720 Jye Smith: hand, in amongst friends, family, a thousand Instagram messages. So 115 00:05:48,839 --> 00:05:52,080 Jye Smith: once you've got someone's attention, then it's really important to 116 00:05:52,080 --> 00:05:55,409 Jye Smith: get their interest. But without attention then it's rather meaningless. 117 00:05:55,410 --> 00:05:57,809 Jye Smith: So I would always bet on being novel and being 118 00:05:57,809 --> 00:06:02,010 Jye Smith: different versus being credible and being relevant, within reason. 119 00:06:02,820 --> 00:06:06,450 Sean Aylmer: Yeah. So what about competitors? We are Fear and Greed and we have a bunch of 120 00:06:06,450 --> 00:06:09,690 Sean Aylmer: competitors and some of them are very good, how should 121 00:06:09,690 --> 00:06:12,419 Sean Aylmer: we think about our competitors? I say that with good 122 00:06:12,420 --> 00:06:13,529 Sean Aylmer: intent, don't worry, Jye. 123 00:06:13,559 --> 00:06:16,709 Jye Smith: Yeah, there are two schools of thought. There's the Jeff Bezos, 124 00:06:16,709 --> 00:06:18,930 Jye Smith: ignore your competition and do what you are good at. 125 00:06:19,049 --> 00:06:21,960 Jye Smith: And obviously you can't fault him for winning at that, 126 00:06:22,350 --> 00:06:25,589 Jye Smith: but I would probably advocate for something a little more 127 00:06:25,589 --> 00:06:29,190 Jye Smith: assertive or a little more aggressive. I would be take 128 00:06:29,460 --> 00:06:31,770 Jye Smith: a line out of, I think it's called Zag, another 129 00:06:31,770 --> 00:06:35,339 Jye Smith: book where whatever your customers are doing, do it differently 130 00:06:35,339 --> 00:06:37,620 Jye Smith: so there's a point of difference. So I would look 131 00:06:37,620 --> 00:06:41,550 Jye Smith: at your competition and if you look up business podcasts, 132 00:06:42,330 --> 00:06:45,089 Jye Smith: there's quite a number of them. And you might be looking for 133 00:06:45,089 --> 00:06:47,730 Jye Smith: the host, which is in our experience, is typically the 134 00:06:47,730 --> 00:06:50,428 Jye Smith: biggest point of difference from podcast to podcast. Or it 135 00:06:50,428 --> 00:06:53,669 Jye Smith: might be about tone. Some people hate waffle, some people 136 00:06:53,670 --> 00:06:55,770 Jye Smith: love waffle. I've listened to a bunch of your guys' 137 00:06:55,770 --> 00:07:01,169 Jye Smith: episodes and it's so to the point. It's really direct. It's very digestible and 138 00:07:01,170 --> 00:07:03,900 Jye Smith: that's great for certain modes of transport. But I tell you, 139 00:07:03,900 --> 00:07:05,880 Jye Smith: I will settle down and listen to two hours of 140 00:07:05,880 --> 00:07:08,490 Jye Smith: waffle before I get into a real podcast sometimes and 141 00:07:08,490 --> 00:07:11,819 Jye Smith: it drives my girlfriend nuts. But that for me is 142 00:07:11,820 --> 00:07:13,830 Jye Smith: a point of difference, I like. I like the stories, 143 00:07:13,830 --> 00:07:16,170 Jye Smith: I like the emotion, I like the chit chatter, but 144 00:07:16,290 --> 00:07:18,929 Jye Smith: a lot of people don't. And so it's where I 145 00:07:18,930 --> 00:07:21,029 Jye Smith: would apply the customer lens to that. 146 00:07:21,990 --> 00:07:24,030 Sean Aylmer: Stay with me, Jye. We'll be back in a minute. 147 00:07:30,570 --> 00:07:33,300 Sean Aylmer: I'm speaking to Jye Smith, founder and managing director of 148 00:07:33,300 --> 00:07:38,190 Sean Aylmer: brand agency, DOUBLESTAR CO. Back to brand, how much does 149 00:07:38,190 --> 00:07:39,779 Sean Aylmer: it need to evolve? I mean, I'm back to the 150 00:07:39,780 --> 00:07:43,920 Sean Aylmer: National Geographic that probably has evolved over the time, but 151 00:07:43,920 --> 00:07:46,859 Sean Aylmer: only minimally in my mind. I might be a hundred 152 00:07:46,859 --> 00:07:49,740 Sean Aylmer: percent wrong there. Presumably brands do have to evolve. 153 00:07:50,670 --> 00:07:53,520 Jye Smith: They do. But there's two evolutions. People when they talk 154 00:07:53,520 --> 00:07:56,100 Jye Smith: about evolution, they're generally talking about what it looks like. 155 00:07:57,000 --> 00:08:00,539 Jye Smith: And the National Geographic has gone through changes, but it's 156 00:08:00,540 --> 00:08:04,379 Jye Smith: iconic yellow frame really hasn't. But I know they've changed 157 00:08:04,379 --> 00:08:08,220 Jye Smith: font probably nine or eight times over the years. And 158 00:08:08,370 --> 00:08:11,610 Jye Smith: I'm thinking back to, I think the eighties is probably the 159 00:08:11,610 --> 00:08:14,040 Jye Smith: first magazines I would've picked up as a kid. But 160 00:08:14,040 --> 00:08:16,800 Jye Smith: it's changed a lot. But that frame has always been 161 00:08:16,800 --> 00:08:20,429 Jye Smith: a core part of their identity. Does it need to 162 00:08:20,429 --> 00:08:24,900 Jye Smith: be updated? Probably not. But it's very hard to convince 163 00:08:24,900 --> 00:08:27,300 Jye Smith: a new business that they should go with something simple 164 00:08:27,300 --> 00:08:29,610 Jye Smith: and minimal day one. We all get excited about our 165 00:08:29,610 --> 00:08:32,099 Jye Smith: business. We all want to make it amazing, and we 166 00:08:32,099 --> 00:08:35,909 Jye Smith: probably over tinker with things visually. What brands need to 167 00:08:35,910 --> 00:08:37,710 Jye Smith: do from an evolution point of view is look at, 168 00:08:37,740 --> 00:08:40,828 Jye Smith: well, what is the experience we're shaping and designing and 169 00:08:40,830 --> 00:08:43,590 Jye Smith: do those things need to update? I stayed in the 170 00:08:43,620 --> 00:08:46,858 Jye Smith: Ovolo Hotel recently and it was down in Canberra. It 171 00:08:46,860 --> 00:08:52,410 Jye Smith: was an exceptional experience. Every single physical touchpoint, digital touchpoint was 172 00:08:52,469 --> 00:08:56,670 Jye Smith: really well thought through and very modern. Now that was 173 00:08:56,670 --> 00:09:02,100 Jye Smith: very relevant to me today, nearly 40, staying somewhere that 174 00:09:02,400 --> 00:09:04,830 Jye Smith: is nice for a couple of nights in Canberra. That 175 00:09:04,830 --> 00:09:08,160 Jye Smith: was great. But that used to be the W Hotel's 176 00:09:08,160 --> 00:09:11,550 Jye Smith: signature because they did everything really cheeky and different. And 177 00:09:11,550 --> 00:09:13,950 Jye Smith: now being cheeky and different is kind of annoying in 178 00:09:13,950 --> 00:09:16,500 Jye Smith: a hotel. Whereas I think Ovolo got it right by 179 00:09:16,500 --> 00:09:20,250 Jye Smith: being more art led, being more culture led, rather than 180 00:09:20,250 --> 00:09:23,280 Jye Smith: being different for the sake of being different. And I think that's 181 00:09:23,280 --> 00:09:26,730 Jye Smith: a maturity that they had to apply because the world 182 00:09:26,730 --> 00:09:28,530 Jye Smith: has kind of grown up in the last 10 years 183 00:09:28,740 --> 00:09:30,989 Jye Smith: faster than anyone could have imagined. So there's a maturity 184 00:09:30,990 --> 00:09:32,189 Jye Smith: there they needed to reflect. 185 00:09:32,849 --> 00:09:35,519 Sean Aylmer: We've been talking about a brand in terms of essentially 186 00:09:35,520 --> 00:09:38,578 Sean Aylmer: selling goods and services. What about internally and the importance 187 00:09:38,580 --> 00:09:41,280 Sean Aylmer: of a brand internally and how culture fits into it? 188 00:09:42,330 --> 00:09:45,389 Jye Smith: We really see culture as a reflection and as well 189 00:09:45,389 --> 00:09:48,480 Jye Smith: as an inception of brand. So for us, we really 190 00:09:48,480 --> 00:09:53,069 Jye Smith: break brands down into the rituals, behaviors, language and taxonomies, 191 00:09:53,219 --> 00:09:55,949 Jye Smith: even things down to the way things are signposted inside 192 00:09:55,950 --> 00:09:59,700 Jye Smith: a office or organisation, the materials you use, all those 193 00:09:59,700 --> 00:10:02,550 Jye Smith: physical touch points. But it does come down to culture 194 00:10:02,639 --> 00:10:04,979 Jye Smith: in terms of, as I mentioned, language, how do you 195 00:10:04,980 --> 00:10:07,290 Jye Smith: speak to each other? What digital tools do you use 196 00:10:07,290 --> 00:10:10,049 Jye Smith: to engage? Are you remote? Are you hybrid? Are you 197 00:10:10,049 --> 00:10:12,540 Jye Smith: in the office? All those things should be a reflection 198 00:10:12,540 --> 00:10:16,050 Jye Smith: of your brand. So if you are about openness and integrity, 199 00:10:16,260 --> 00:10:18,179 Jye Smith: then you should make sure those things are built into 200 00:10:18,179 --> 00:10:21,210 Jye Smith: your culture. And I don't mean them as big happy, 201 00:10:21,210 --> 00:10:23,670 Jye Smith: clappy signing on the walls that we also saw in 202 00:10:23,670 --> 00:10:26,009 Jye Smith: the eighties with motivation written across and somebody on standing 203 00:10:26,009 --> 00:10:28,469 Jye Smith: on the top of a mountain. I mean, we need 204 00:10:28,469 --> 00:10:30,840 Jye Smith: to do things that are built into people's KPIs. So 205 00:10:30,840 --> 00:10:33,360 Jye Smith: they know that if they can have more open and 206 00:10:33,360 --> 00:10:36,120 Jye Smith: honest conversations with their clients about something or with each 207 00:10:36,120 --> 00:10:39,030 Jye Smith: other or be candid about feedback, then those things are 208 00:10:39,030 --> 00:10:42,510 Jye Smith: actually going to contribute to their performance as an individual, 209 00:10:42,630 --> 00:10:46,708 Jye Smith: their recognition as an employee and a greater meaning or 210 00:10:46,708 --> 00:10:50,309 Jye Smith: a greater contribution they're making to the organisation. And typically 211 00:10:50,309 --> 00:10:52,170 Jye Smith: what we say is many people are aware of their 212 00:10:52,230 --> 00:10:56,670 Jye Smith: job title in an organisation, but much fewer or sometimes 213 00:10:56,670 --> 00:10:59,790 Jye Smith: very few at all aren't aware of their role within 214 00:10:59,790 --> 00:11:03,870 Jye Smith: an organisation. And that difference between role and job title 215 00:11:04,440 --> 00:11:07,290 Jye Smith: can't be overstated because it is a point of difference. 216 00:11:07,290 --> 00:11:08,968 Jye Smith: And if you've got the right kind of culture, people 217 00:11:08,970 --> 00:11:10,170 Jye Smith: understand those two things. 218 00:11:11,100 --> 00:11:12,630 Sean Aylmer: Jye, we are totally out of time, but there is 219 00:11:12,630 --> 00:11:14,460 Sean Aylmer: one question I do have to ask you, which is 220 00:11:14,460 --> 00:11:17,520 Sean Aylmer: kind of a bit removed. So at DOUBLESTAR CO, you're 221 00:11:17,520 --> 00:11:19,950 Sean Aylmer: quite happy to invest or in some cases invest in 222 00:11:19,950 --> 00:11:23,550 Sean Aylmer: your team's side hustles. What's that about? How's that work? 223 00:11:24,660 --> 00:11:28,050 Jye Smith: So we're quite a young team. I started this at 224 00:11:28,230 --> 00:11:31,590 Jye Smith: 33 or 34, I guess I was, I can't remember now. It's bad. 225 00:11:32,220 --> 00:11:36,179 Jye Smith: 33. And everyone we brought in was like 22, 23 because 226 00:11:36,389 --> 00:11:37,949 Jye Smith: we were trying to be young and cool. I think 227 00:11:37,950 --> 00:11:39,269 Jye Smith: we're still young and cool. I get to say that. 228 00:11:39,660 --> 00:11:41,160 Sean Aylmer: I'm old and cool for the record, Jye. 229 00:11:43,980 --> 00:11:46,530 Jye Smith: But everyone who comes in always had a passion on 230 00:11:46,530 --> 00:11:48,270 Jye Smith: the side and it was always the first question we 231 00:11:48,270 --> 00:11:50,160 Jye Smith: ask them, " What do you do when you leave work?" 232 00:11:50,429 --> 00:11:52,830 Jye Smith: And a lot of them had these dreams in fashion 233 00:11:52,830 --> 00:11:55,620 Jye Smith: and streetwear and in art where they wanted to do things like 234 00:11:55,620 --> 00:11:59,250 Jye Smith: start a potting studio or start a sneaker gallery. And 235 00:11:59,250 --> 00:12:00,989 Jye Smith: I said to them, I said, " I want you to 236 00:12:01,049 --> 00:12:04,020 Jye Smith: bring that passion and energy just as deep into work 237 00:12:04,020 --> 00:12:06,000 Jye Smith: as you do as your side hustle." So what we 238 00:12:06,000 --> 00:12:09,510 Jye Smith: did was we committed to each of them a monetary 239 00:12:09,630 --> 00:12:12,660 Jye Smith: and a time commitment from the business back to them, 240 00:12:12,840 --> 00:12:15,209 Jye Smith: completely no strings, so that they could go and live 241 00:12:15,450 --> 00:12:18,270 Jye Smith: and breathe those different dreams they've got. Because I don't 242 00:12:18,270 --> 00:12:20,280 Jye Smith: believe side hustle should be about the side. I think 243 00:12:20,280 --> 00:12:22,679 Jye Smith: they should be about what you do when you're awake 244 00:12:22,679 --> 00:12:24,270 Jye Smith: and you're in the day, not something you're working away 245 00:12:24,270 --> 00:12:26,970 Jye Smith: at night. Because that for us is this sign of 246 00:12:26,970 --> 00:12:30,540 Jye Smith: a truly curious, ambitious, and motivated person. And that's what 247 00:12:30,540 --> 00:12:32,159 Jye Smith: we want to foster inside of DOUBLESTAR CO. 248 00:12:32,880 --> 00:12:35,160 Sean Aylmer: That's a great initiative. Jye, thank you for talking to Fear 249 00:12:35,160 --> 00:12:35,610 Sean Aylmer: and Greed. 250 00:12:36,090 --> 00:12:36,630 Jye Smith: Thank you. 251 00:12:37,290 --> 00:12:39,809 Sean Aylmer: That was Jye Smith, founder and managing director of brand 252 00:12:39,809 --> 00:12:42,870 Sean Aylmer: agency DOUBLESTAR CO. This is the Fear and Greed Daily 253 00:12:42,870 --> 00:12:44,939 Sean Aylmer: interview. Join us every morning for the full episode of 254 00:12:44,940 --> 00:12:48,059 Sean Aylmer: Fear and Greed, Australia's most popular business podcast. I'm Sean 255 00:12:48,059 --> 00:12:49,170 Sean Aylmer: Aylmer. Enjoy your day.