Speaker 1: Appoche Production. Welcome to another episode of Brave Always the
Speaker 1: CEO Series. This series we launch into the new world
Speaker 1: of brave leadership. Happy people create happy businesses, true emotionally
Speaker 1: intelligent leadership. I've picked up vombit once on our about
Speaker 1: our four flight and everybody thought, well, if it's good
Speaker 1: enough for him, I can do it.
Speaker 2: Now.
Speaker 1: We will be joined by culture and leadership experts and
Speaker 1: some superstar CEOs who will courageously tell us the truth
Speaker 1: behind their brave leadership journeys. Welcome to another episode of
Speaker 1: Brave Always the CEO series. So this is actually a
Speaker 1: pretty special one for me today. If you're from Queensland,
Speaker 1: or you're an ERL fan, or probably any sporting fan.
Speaker 1: This man needs no introduction, but he's played more than
Speaker 1: three hundred n Ral games, twenty nine Origin matches, thirty
Speaker 1: two Tests for the Kangaroos. Is a delim Award winner,
Speaker 1: two time Premiership winner and a Rugby World Cup winner.
Speaker 1: He's Alarican of football, the guy who once had a
Speaker 1: giant curly mop, the guy I have seen way too
Speaker 1: many times in a budguy, smuggler, but most importantly, someone
Speaker 1: I've had the privilege of being friends with nearly fourteen years.
Speaker 1: What come, mister Sammy Thurday.
Speaker 2: Thank you for the backhanded compliments. I appreciate it.
Speaker 1: I had to mention the hair because.
Speaker 2: I do have to. I didn't win a Daly Am.
Speaker 1: I didn't.
Speaker 2: I want a Dallly m Backrower of the Year. The
Speaker 2: Daly is well, the Dallim is the best player in
Speaker 2: the whole league. I want a positional I.
Speaker 1: Just wanted to correct about it. We'll just let that go.
Speaker 2: No, no, because I told you I wasn't going to
Speaker 2: lie to you today on this.
Speaker 1: All right, all right, fair enough? Where to start, Sammy?
Speaker 1: This was an interesting one for me because I have
Speaker 1: known you for so long and I thought this would
Speaker 1: be super easy.
Speaker 2: You know me, but you don't.
Speaker 1: Actually, Oh rah, well, Sammy born in Sydney, moved to
Speaker 1: Townsville when you're four years old. I didn't know all
Speaker 1: this stuff. And that's where you grew up in North Queensland.
Speaker 1: Growing up in Townsville. What's the best thing about Townsville?
Speaker 2: For me? As a kid? Growing up in Townsville was great.
Speaker 2: I was a sporty kid and there was a lot
Speaker 2: of different sports around. I tried my hand at everything. Again,
Speaker 2: having a lot of brothers to kind of place with.
Speaker 2: We had cricket bats, basketball hoops, baseball bats. My poor
Speaker 2: mum and dad. We had all the correct equipment when
Speaker 2: it came to playing those sports as well. So there's
Speaker 2: probably some still some holes in the firebroough sheeting in
Speaker 2: the back of the house where the cricket ball the
Speaker 2: baseball had hit the at the wall. I probably do
Speaker 2: need to get up there and fix that for mum
Speaker 2: and dad.
Speaker 1: They still have there.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Mum and Dad's still in the house that we
Speaker 2: kind of grew up in. You know. When we first
Speaker 2: moved to Townsville, we're in defense housing, so we had
Speaker 2: some pretty cool houses. And then Dad retired from the
Speaker 2: Air Force and brought a house out at Kelso and
Speaker 2: they've been living in that same house ever since.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Right, What was the worst thing about growing home
Speaker 1: Townsville The heat?
Speaker 2: It was always hot up there. I think now getting
Speaker 2: out of Townsville and seeing different places. I've got some
Speaker 2: fantastic mates who still live in Townsville and it's a
Speaker 2: beautiful place and I love going back there and visiting.
Speaker 2: But I do call Brisbane home now. I've lived in
Speaker 2: Brisbane longer than I ever did live in Townsville, but yeah,
Speaker 2: you can kind of feel a little bit stuck there sometimes,
Speaker 2: and I think, yeah, moving to Brisbane as a seventeen
Speaker 2: year old kid, you kind of open your eyes up
Speaker 2: to the possibilities that there's a lot more things out there.
Speaker 2: So again, beautiful little place forever growing Townshill and it
Speaker 2: will always have a lovely place in my heart.
Speaker 1: Was your dream to be drafted to the Cowboys?
Speaker 2: Yeah, essentially I played for Towns or Brothers. Towns of
Speaker 2: Brothers literally was out the back of the grandstand of
Speaker 2: the old stadium Dairy Farmer Stadium, Stockland Stadium one three
Speaker 2: hundred smiles Stadium. It had a few different names, a
Speaker 2: few different sponsors over the years. But yeah, I was
Speaker 2: lucky enough to play a few games there as a
Speaker 2: young kid, Curtain Raisers to a couple of the Cowboys
Speaker 2: games and would have loved to have been picked up
Speaker 2: by the Cowboys, but it just didn't work out that
Speaker 2: way and insane that too. Moving to Brisbane gave me
Speaker 2: the chance opportunity to grow up and change and probably
Speaker 2: needed to get off the teat a little bit.
Speaker 1: I mean, you're a strong lad. Was fretty like do
Speaker 1: you get sort of forced into footy. Was it a
Speaker 1: footy family, Like, did you just have to play footy
Speaker 1: or was that your thing? No, you've done something else.
Speaker 2: It wasn't my thing.
Speaker 1: Actually wasn't your thing.
Speaker 2: From the age of six to the age of twelve,
Speaker 2: we participated in the little athletics. Our club was called
Speaker 2: the Appeross Pandas Mum and dad volunteered and worked pretty hard.
Speaker 2: I think mum was a treasurer at one point there.
Speaker 2: But yeah, our small little club ran out of money
Speaker 2: and it ceased to exist. So I've probably still got
Speaker 2: some junior records at yeah, yeah, sixty meter hurdles still
Speaker 2: shot put. Wow.
Speaker 1: As a long term friend of yours, imagining you leaping
Speaker 1: over a hurdles not an image really strongly.
Speaker 2: I used to love actually, I used to love hurdles
Speaker 2: when I was a kid. Really yeah. Yeah, that's a
Speaker 2: strange sport. It is a strange sport. But yeah, I
Speaker 2: wanted to go the Olympics when I was a kid.
Speaker 2: That was my dream and goal. If it wasn't for
Speaker 2: Upper ross Pandas shutting down, I wouldn't never played rugby league.
Speaker 1: So well, speaking of like a big part of growing
Speaker 1: up your mum and dad. So your dad is obviously
Speaker 1: toy straight Aunger and your mum if I read coruickly
Speaker 1: and I've met your lovely mum and dad. Mum's from
Speaker 1: a farm girl from mister Australia.
Speaker 2: Farm girl from Western Australi.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean both very like your dad is, like
Speaker 1: I would say, from what I've made of him, like
Speaker 1: just the sweetest man. Like I feel like a lot
Speaker 1: of your temperament must come from him. What did you
Speaker 1: learn from mom? Because mom's a strong woman.
Speaker 2: My mum taught us how to fight, and she taught
Speaker 2: us how to kick a footy. So again, farm girl
Speaker 2: from Western Australia, so she grew up in shearing sheds. Yeah,
Speaker 2: she knew how to fight with the best of them.
Speaker 2: She always said, ye, let them have three punches first
Speaker 2: and then you lay them out after that. Yeah, she's
Speaker 2: a wild one, but at the end of the day,
Speaker 2: she is the softest human being ever. She's all front.
Speaker 2: But my grandfather, Arthur, he pretty much worked on the
Speaker 2: farm till the day he passed away. He had four
Speaker 2: daughters to help him out on the farm. I think
Speaker 2: Mum's reasoning why she joined the air Force was because
Speaker 2: she didn't want to live that farm life anymore, so
Speaker 2: she kind of joined the air Force and that's where
Speaker 2: she met dad. Dad wanted to travel and get out
Speaker 2: of the Torres Strait and moved down. I think they
Speaker 2: were based out at Wagga Wagga there for a little
Speaker 2: while and that's where they met. Yeah, right, her dad
Speaker 2: was doing a four hundred meters running around the track
Speaker 2: with his shirt off and beautiful chocolate man.
Speaker 1: He is a beautiful chocolate man, speaking of wench like. Obviously,
Speaker 1: Mum and Dad have very different cultural backgrounds. Yeah, so
Speaker 1: did sort of coming from that mixed race family growing
Speaker 1: up in Townswold. Was that a big deal and no
Speaker 1: big deal at all?
Speaker 2: Probably see an understanding a lot more now as a
Speaker 2: an adult, But we were kids. We kind of just
Speaker 2: went about it. But I could still remember Mum getting
Speaker 2: a perm once because she just wanted to have curly
Speaker 2: hair like us kids.
Speaker 1: Are you serious?
Speaker 2: But again, you know, this is early nineties. There is
Speaker 2: a few more kind of mixed race families in Townsville
Speaker 2: than certain other places. But you know, still Mum would
Speaker 2: get people looking at her and see, I just thought
Speaker 2: it was the best thing ever. Because I kind of
Speaker 2: lived the best of both worlds, and my dad with
Speaker 2: a rich cultural heritage from the Torres Strait, and then
Speaker 2: my mum, you know, she was a staunch farmer from
Speaker 2: Western Australia, and I didn't see a lot of it,
Speaker 2: but I'm sure there was probably some stairs and stuff
Speaker 2: that both mum and dad would have had to have
Speaker 2: copped in the chin and just went about their ways.
Speaker 2: I'm un sure if anything was ever said to them
Speaker 2: about being a mixed race couple, but there's always going
Speaker 2: to be people out there that are going to cast
Speaker 2: their judgment on people.
Speaker 1: Did you ever wonder like where did you identify culturally? Like?
Speaker 2: Oh, that was probably my biggest struggle ever was I
Speaker 2: was too black to be white and I was too
Speaker 2: white to be black sometimes, So you know, that was
Speaker 2: a little bit of a struggle that I went through,
Speaker 2: especially through my teens, and not knowing where you belong,
Speaker 2: not knowing where you fit in. And I think that's
Speaker 2: probably why I leaned so much into my sport. And
Speaker 2: I going only speak personally for myself. I didn't encounter
Speaker 2: any racism when it come to sport at all. I
Speaker 2: was disabled to go out there and enjoy all the
Speaker 2: sports that I loved. There was no judgment passed on
Speaker 2: me at all. So you know, when racism creeps into sport,
Speaker 2: I think it's absolutely terrible because it's always been such
Speaker 2: a great equalizer for everyone where we've given everyone the
Speaker 2: chance and the opportunity to show their ability and I
Speaker 2: think if their ability is great and they're chosen sport,
Speaker 2: what they should be praised for it. So I didn't
Speaker 2: experience any myself, but.
Speaker 1: Yeah, good, I agree sport is the great equalizer. So
Speaker 1: you're seventeen years old when you get drafted to the Broncos,
Speaker 1: I have to ask this, how does it work? Do
Speaker 1: you a phone call or does like someone drive your
Speaker 1: house and like there's balloons, like what happens.
Speaker 2: It's a bit of a weird process. So there was
Speaker 2: a few different recruiters that came up to towns and
Speaker 2: literally sat in our house and had a cup of
Speaker 2: tea with Mum and dad and a few different conversations.
Speaker 2: But I think when the Broncos came calling, it was
Speaker 2: a perfect fit. And again the ability to stay in Queensland.
Speaker 2: So growing up in a big family environment where four brothers,
Speaker 2: he had friends and family uncles and Arnie's that would
Speaker 2: just pop in and come over for dinner and a
Speaker 2: cup of tea and come and stay a couple of
Speaker 2: nights and whatever. I grew up in a really really
Speaker 2: big family environment, so I didn't want to move to
Speaker 2: Sydney or move down to Melbourne. They were just going
Speaker 2: to be too far and then you know, cost to
Speaker 2: travel and all those types of things. So when the
Speaker 2: Broncos came calling, I was super pumped to get the
Speaker 2: opportunity to play for them, and I actually signed my
Speaker 2: Broncos contract in the car park of the old Dairy
Speaker 2: Farmer Stadium, which was a big Yeah, it kind of
Speaker 2: a big fe to the Cowboys at that point in time,
Speaker 2: but they had no space for me up there. I
Speaker 2: just knew that the opportunity to go to Brisbane and
Speaker 2: play with some of the players that were already on
Speaker 2: the roster was probably why I end up having the
Speaker 2: career that I have, you know, and being coached by
Speaker 2: Wayne Bennett, having the mentors at the time he was
Speaker 2: a coach at the time, having mentors, you know, my
Speaker 2: first year at the club, Andrew g was still there,
Speaker 2: he still had Gordon Tallis was still around and then
Speaker 2: you had Gordon the Raging Ball, Yeah, Shane Webke, Petrosisiva
Speaker 2: and these guys were Queensland Australia players at that point
Speaker 2: in time. So I think, yeah, in hindsight, the move
Speaker 2: was essential for my career and if I didn't do it,
Speaker 2: I probably wouldn't have had the career I had. But
Speaker 2: looking it was a pretty cool moment that the team
Speaker 2: that didn't want me, I'm signing a contract in the
Speaker 2: car park of their stadium. Yeah.
Speaker 1: But so you're still seventeen though, right, Like, how much
Speaker 1: pressure did you film that moment? You're going to have
Speaker 1: to move away from where you lived. There's a lot
Speaker 1: of pressure in young people that coming through at that age.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well I wasn't on that. I didn't have the
Speaker 2: biggest contract in the world. On my first side. There
Speaker 2: was a few like NRL bonuses in there if I
Speaker 2: had made the NL team and played in a game,
Speaker 2: but they were probably a lot higher than my contract
Speaker 2: was in all honesty. So I think I got like
Speaker 2: medical and then I had to apply for some living
Speaker 2: away from home allowance and also some rental assistance. But
Speaker 2: I think my first contract was like five thousand dollars
Speaker 2: plus those things, and then if I played in an
Speaker 2: NL game was like a five thousand dollars bonus. I
Speaker 2: knew that I was coming down to play in the colts,
Speaker 2: so they're under nineteens competition and my goal in that
Speaker 2: first year was just to play a bit of reserve
Speaker 2: grade footy if I could. So we played for the
Speaker 2: tom of Clydes Dales at that point in time, that
Speaker 2: was our feeder team in the NRAL, and I just
Speaker 2: wanted to hopefully get a few games playing for them,
Speaker 2: and it all kind of happened pretty quickly.
Speaker 1: My dead because four years later you wants win a premiership.
Speaker 2: I debut was my first year at the club, which
Speaker 2: was kind of funny because my first two months of training,
Speaker 2: so I came down first to November, were just just
Speaker 2: before I literally finished high school, graduated, went to our
Speaker 2: graduation and then the next week I'm in Brisbane training
Speaker 2: And in my first year I debuted for the Broncos.
Speaker 2: I was eighteen in one month. Once I had a taste,
Speaker 2: I was hooked, and it's funny the goals always changed
Speaker 2: and you always move in the posts, and you know,
Speaker 2: my goal was just to have a solid season in
Speaker 2: the colts. In two thousand and three and play a
Speaker 2: few games with Queensland Cup if I could, and I
Speaker 2: that tick that, and then I ended up debuling for
Speaker 2: the Broncos. I was like going to after So next
Speaker 2: year I played one game. Next year I want to
Speaker 2: play five games. Okay, the following year, I want to
Speaker 2: be more consistent, play more games, maybe even get a
Speaker 2: few starting positions. So forever, just reassessing goals, figuring out
Speaker 2: what they are and trying to achieve them and push hard.
Speaker 2: And yeah, very very early in my career, two thousand
Speaker 2: and six we won a premiership. I was twenty one,
Speaker 2: and yeah, it was probably the best year of my
Speaker 2: rugular league career. They booed for Queensland that year. I
Speaker 2: had my twenty first birthday in Origin camp, which was
Speaker 2: a lot of fun. Yeah, and then we won the
Speaker 2: premiership and then off the back of the team's success
Speaker 2: side then get the opportunity to play for Australia at
Speaker 2: the end of the year. I think it was a
Speaker 2: Try Nations series with New Zealand and England. I think
Speaker 2: I played twenty minutes for Australia in the game that
Speaker 2: I dibuoed, and and that was enough. I'd kind of
Speaker 2: I'd done everything in one year, which is pretty crazy
Speaker 2: and pretty hectic. So and at such a young age
Speaker 2: as well.
Speaker 1: Such a young age, I mean, what was it about
Speaker 1: the Broncos in the two thousand and six the year
Speaker 1: and the premiership? What were they doing?
Speaker 2: Like?
Speaker 1: Is there something that a team does that you sort
Speaker 1: of go That was the difference between why we won
Speaker 1: that year and while we did in another years.
Speaker 2: I look at the team now and I call it
Speaker 2: our lasagna team because we had layers to it. When
Speaker 2: you put a lasagna together and if it all matches, it's.
Speaker 1: Just thinking about lasagna now.
Speaker 2: Yeah. See, that's why I brought it up, because I
Speaker 2: know how much.
Speaker 1: You love food. Yeah, thanks, but yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, every little bit of a lasagna had to come
Speaker 2: together for us to win that game. So we had
Speaker 2: layers and depth within our team. So we had our
Speaker 2: senior players and in your Darren Lockears and Shane Webke,
Speaker 2: Petro Simin receiver, Brad Thorne, and then you know the
Speaker 2: next kind of guys underneath them. You had Corey Parker,
Speaker 2: you had Dane carl or Brent Tate, guys that had
Speaker 2: kind of been there and done some stuff. In the
Speaker 2: inner already, Justin Hodges as well, and then you had
Speaker 2: the next kind of younger guys that were coming through
Speaker 2: trying to have a crack. And it was myself, David Staggs, Daris,
Speaker 2: you had Carmichael Hunt. We had such a well balanced yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: and you know, we had the experience of our older guys.
Speaker 2: We had some guys that had been around and had
Speaker 2: a taste of representative football as well, those middle chunks
Speaker 2: of guys and then the bottom guys that the youth.
Speaker 2: You know, myself, Carmichael, David Staggs, Darius Board. Where were
Speaker 2: all these young kids bright eyed? I think it was
Speaker 2: that was Darius's first year in the NL. We played
Speaker 2: every game from Round one all the way to the
Speaker 2: Grand Final, and you think you're going to be there
Speaker 2: every year once you're a young kid, because we still
Speaker 2: had majority of our squad around for a little while
Speaker 2: after that. That was well, that was Shane Weep his last
Speaker 2: game for the Broncos ever, and what a way to
Speaker 2: send out a legend. But you know, I just thought
Speaker 2: it was going to be easy and we're just going
Speaker 2: to get to the Grand Final every year, and it
Speaker 2: just kind of doesn't happen that way.
Speaker 1: No, what does happen when you lose games? Like I'm
Speaker 1: always fascinated what was happening in the locker room? Like
Speaker 1: is it a bit ted lasso like, you know, is
Speaker 1: it positive thinking, lift you up, you're all doing well boys,
Speaker 1: or is it sort of frustration and anger? Like what
Speaker 1: does it way towards? Or is it just depend on
Speaker 1: the coach?
Speaker 2: Well, everyone has their own different emotions, you know, from
Speaker 2: a coach's point of view, like sometimes less is more.
Speaker 2: I think Wayne Bennett talks about, you know, you've probably
Speaker 2: only got two really good sprays every year and that's it.
Speaker 2: So you know, where you come in, you absolutely rip
Speaker 2: them a new one. I can still remember a moment
Speaker 2: in time where Wayne Bennett came in. We were all
Speaker 2: sitting in our little semicircle shape. His chair was right
Speaker 2: in the middle. He sat down on it, and then
Speaker 2: he looked at everyone. He stood up, and he walked out.
Speaker 2: Didn't say a thing. We kind of knew at that
Speaker 2: point in time.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a silence, Yeah, like the naughty kid.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but no, different people process it differently. Yeah, so
Speaker 2: some guys in the locker rooms want to talk about
Speaker 2: everything that happened in the game and really break it
Speaker 2: down then and there when it's fresh in their mind.
Speaker 2: Other guys want to get away and just kind of,
Speaker 2: you know, we'll reassess on Monday type of thing. So, yeah,
Speaker 2: different players is it differently, and you've got to kind
Speaker 2: of know and understand which players are going to want
Speaker 2: to have a talk to you about it, which players
Speaker 2: are going to want to just brush it off. And
Speaker 2: there are certain players that can kind of it's just
Speaker 2: the game.
Speaker 1: So the v of Brave is vulnerability. And I think
Speaker 1: actually you've been incredibly vulnerable publicly, especially in the last
Speaker 1: few years, about a number of things that we'll talk
Speaker 1: about it later, but I want to talk about a
Speaker 1: difficult moment your footy career. So obviously you were put
Speaker 1: into captain c and then I think it was for
Speaker 1: two seasons. Was its roughly? Yeah, like a rough a
Speaker 1: year and a half, and then obviously you step down.
Speaker 1: I'm assuming that was probably one of your more vulnerable
Speaker 1: moments or overwhelming moments. Can you talk me through that
Speaker 1: a bit.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I had to take over the captaincy after Darren Lockyer. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and I joke about it now, Jesus, I must have
Speaker 2: been a good captain because they needed two to replace me,
Speaker 2: so Corey Parker and Justin Hodges were my replacements after
Speaker 2: that point in time. But I really struggled being the
Speaker 2: captain of the team because I was unsure on what
Speaker 2: type of leader I wanted to be within the team.
Speaker 2: Without realizing I already was a leader and that's why
Speaker 2: I was chosen to be captain. And in hindsight, it's
Speaker 2: easy to look back and go, you're an idiot, but
Speaker 2: you know, I tried to be every type of leader.
Speaker 2: I tried to be the guy that was inspirational on
Speaker 2: the field. I tried to be the guy that spoke
Speaker 2: up at all the meetings. I tried to be the
Speaker 2: guy that checked in on everyone. And then there were
Speaker 2: times when I would walk around the chains rooms for
Speaker 2: a game and I would have a conversation with sixteen
Speaker 2: players about what their job was and if they were
Speaker 2: ready to go, and without having the same conversation with myself.
Speaker 2: I probably struggled a little bit too with not having
Speaker 2: strong leaders around me as well. You know, previously, when
Speaker 2: Darren Lockey was a captain, he had some great players
Speaker 2: around him still, and there was a bit of a
Speaker 2: change and a shift at the club with coaching staff,
Speaker 2: and I really felt if Wayne Bennett is at the
Speaker 2: Broncos at the time, I'm the captain. I think I
Speaker 2: captained the team for a long period of time, but
Speaker 2: you know, the support just wasn't there. So it was
Speaker 2: very tough decision. This is again, that was one of
Speaker 2: my goals to captain the Broncos and I got to
Speaker 2: achieve it, which is brilliant and I will always be
Speaker 2: known as a Broncos captain. But I wish I really
Speaker 2: focused on myself more than other people when it came
Speaker 2: to my captaincy and it was tough to front the
Speaker 2: media and stand down.
Speaker 1: And how did you get through that?
Speaker 2: I disappeared for a couple of days. Yeah, Rachel and
Speaker 2: I and the girls, we went up the Sunshine Coast
Speaker 2: for a couple of days and just kind of laid
Speaker 2: low and got my head around it and just needed
Speaker 2: to do some grounding.
Speaker 1: Did you want to be like, screw it, I'm not
Speaker 1: playing foot anymore.
Speaker 2: Don't worry. I've had plenty of those moments throughout my
Speaker 2: career where you know, the easy option is to walk away,
Speaker 2: And again, at the age of twenty one, I had
Speaker 2: achieved everything I wanted to anyway, you know, with the
Speaker 2: list you mate, except for captaining the club. You know,
Speaker 2: I had kind of ticked every box already, so I
Speaker 2: needed some time to process it and get away, spend
Speaker 2: some time with family, some close friends, and then lucky
Speaker 2: enough to have a game the following weekend.
Speaker 1: The thing is is that you are a natural leader.
Speaker 1: I mean people always think of you that way, title
Speaker 1: or not. I just think you kind of carried on
Speaker 1: to be a leader of the Broncos leader.
Speaker 2: So yeah, did.
Speaker 1: It really matter that you had the title or not?
Speaker 2: Well, that's the hardest thing. Sometimes as soon as someone
Speaker 2: tells you you're a leader, Yeah, it tickles your ego
Speaker 2: a bit. Yeah, and then you think you have to
Speaker 2: start doing things that's different. Yeah, when Dale telling you
Speaker 2: you're a leader for the things that you already do,
Speaker 2: and you know, I look back on that now and
Speaker 2: now I just try to be the best version of
Speaker 2: Sam thought I can, whether it's doing the TV stuff
Speaker 2: I do, whether it's the ambassador roles and that I do,
Speaker 2: the charity work that I do. I just tried to
Speaker 2: be the best version of myself, and that's all I
Speaker 2: could be. And if people see that as being a leader,
Speaker 2: thank you. I appreciate that.
Speaker 1: In footy when you were obviously earmarked when Darren was
Speaker 1: leaving to take over captaincy, do you get put through
Speaker 1: some kind of training or development to become a leader?
Speaker 2: Not necessarily, not at all, which.
Speaker 1: I find fast Yeah. Yeah, because as a leadership coach,
Speaker 1: I'm like, you can't just throw people into that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And that's why I said that support system wasn't there.
Speaker 2: If there was a different coaching staff there at the time,
Speaker 2: I'm sure it would have been different. There was a
Speaker 2: few changes happening at the Broncos, from coaching staff to
Speaker 2: all the office staff. Things were changing at the club
Speaker 2: and it was a time of big change. I think
Speaker 2: this might have been the first time that Wayne left
Speaker 2: the club. Yeah, so you know, he was the inaugural coach,
Speaker 2: had been there from day one, right, he'd been there
Speaker 2: from nineteen eighty eight, and yeah, he kind of everyone
Speaker 2: find was weird times.
Speaker 1: Forair, weird times. I want to talk about authenticity. It
Speaker 1: was interesting one because I know a number of sides
Speaker 1: of you, right, yeah, well your split persnel, and it
Speaker 1: is first knowing that people who then will know they
Speaker 1: might know you personally, will ask about you, or they
Speaker 1: have an idea in the head who you are and
Speaker 1: what you're like. And I know you know this, right,
Speaker 1: So do you believe it's easy to be yourself truly
Speaker 1: yourself all the time?
Speaker 2: I have many selves though, and I think we all.
Speaker 1: Have many I was actually trying to contact those, right,
Speaker 1: because sometimes they want to put you in this category
Speaker 1: of like Sammy the comedian, you know, which unfortunately you
Speaker 1: are quite fuck Do.
Speaker 2: You remember that we're at that rooftop at one time
Speaker 2: and I was up on stage speaking yes, and this
Speaker 2: was the first time you've ever saw at work y
Speaker 2: like work properly worked, And what did you say to me?
Speaker 1: I was like so impressed. I was like, oh my god,
Speaker 1: you're not You're actually I was gonna say, was you're
Speaker 1: really good at this?
Speaker 2: Yeah, we're all smart at work, aren't we.
Speaker 1: That's correct, we don't go there. But yeah, there's a
Speaker 1: different side to me, you're right. So I think what
Speaker 1: I was reflecting on was when people go is he
Speaker 1: always like that loud, funny you know, singing clean Dion songs,
Speaker 1: you know, his pants are always off kind of character,
Speaker 1: I'm like, yeah, he's definitely that. And he's like, then
Speaker 1: is he the other guy who can be butit quiet
Speaker 1: and reflective. Yeah, he can be that too.
Speaker 2: I think Rachel gets the same questions asked. People think
Speaker 2: that I'm intense because they knew me from football and
Speaker 2: the way that I played on the football field. But
Speaker 2: that was sam At the football player. And I think
Speaker 2: growing up with brothers is like I always back my brothers.
Speaker 2: I've got a tattoo on my chest it says one
Speaker 2: brother bleeds, all brothers bleeds. So when I played football,
Speaker 2: I was, you know, in New South Wales known as
Speaker 2: third man thirday. He would come into every push and shove. Yeah,
Speaker 2: but it doesn't mean that I'm that intense. At home.
Speaker 2: I'm a father, my husband. I've got many hats, and
Speaker 2: I think we all have many hats. And I show
Speaker 2: up in every situation that I'm in my genuine self
Speaker 2: for that situation. So I have many genuine.
Speaker 1: Selves mileon, Yeah, very genuine. I like that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think that's what we have to be.
Speaker 2: You have to show up to every occasion being our
Speaker 2: genuine selves selves myself.
Speaker 1: Yeah, A good answer, actually, all right, So that's good, alright.
Speaker 1: Twenty eighteen. The thing you've been doing your whole life
Speaker 1: comes from end. Yeah, all right, and I was round
Speaker 1: fit period, remember going your last game and all the
Speaker 1: weeks and the T shirt like and there's not a
Speaker 1: sporting person. I honestly don't believe it doesn't go through
Speaker 1: a period of like, well what now or who am I?
Speaker 1: And I can only imagine given you started so young,
Speaker 1: that was the same journey for you. Yeah, so what
Speaker 1: surprised you about that period? What did you think it
Speaker 1: was going to be like? And then wanted it actually.
Speaker 2: Turned out to I didn't know. I had no idea.
Speaker 2: You think you're prepared, but you're not really. I start
Speaker 2: again started playing rugby league at the age of twelve.
Speaker 2: All my friends at school played it. I think I
Speaker 2: made the Townsville team in my first year and we
Speaker 2: went and played against Cans and Mackay. I think the
Speaker 2: following year made the North Queensland team and then I
Speaker 2: was like, well, actually you are right at this. You
Speaker 2: know it was a great way to focus anger and
Speaker 2: frustration on other people and you could do it legally
Speaker 2: on the forefield. I think that's why my mum loved
Speaker 2: it so much. But I was fifteen when a school
Speaker 2: teacher at Kerwin High School recognized some of the talents
Speaker 2: that I had as a rugby league player. His name's
Speaker 2: George Barlett. Absolutely love him. Spoke to him on the
Speaker 2: phone the other day. He's a deputy principal now at
Speaker 2: bean Lee High School here in Queensland. But if it
Speaker 2: wasn't for him and recognizing some of the talents I
Speaker 2: had and pretty much giving me a kick in the ass,
Speaker 2: reiterated to me that I was super talented at rugby
Speaker 2: league and if I actually gave it a crack and
Speaker 2: really trained hard and applied myself, that I could probably
Speaker 2: have a professional career. And he said to me, I'll
Speaker 2: show up every day. You show up. And he had
Speaker 2: to show up anyway because he was a teacher. He
Speaker 2: had the keys of the gym. But for the next
Speaker 2: kind of two years. It's in grade eleven and grade
Speaker 2: twelve at school. I showed up and I did the
Speaker 2: training early in the morning, and I had another friend,
Speaker 2: Bevan Cameron, who would pick me up because it was
Speaker 2: kind of you know, Mum had a household full of
Speaker 2: My two younger brothers were there at the time. My
Speaker 2: two older brothers had gone but she's like, I can't
Speaker 2: drive you into school and then come back home and
Speaker 2: get the boys ready to dive back in again. So
Speaker 2: had a friend picked me up, Evan Cameron. He picked
Speaker 2: me up in him and his dad. We went to
Speaker 2: training every morning, got ready for you know, footy, and
Speaker 2: I needed a bit of a push. I needed a
Speaker 2: bit of a kick in the ass, and George was
Speaker 2: a guy that did that for me. It was absolutely
Speaker 2: push in the right direction that I needed.
Speaker 1: So it's just so much though about the impact that
Speaker 1: a good teacher or mentor can have on a child,
Speaker 1: right because on the other side of the spectrum.
Speaker 2: There's a lot of shit teachers too. Yeah, and a
Speaker 2: few as well. I loved science and biology at school.
Speaker 2: I loved it and like fascinated with the human body.
Speaker 2: But I had a science teacher who was nice to me,
Speaker 2: and I was like, oh fuck science. That I never
Speaker 2: did it again.
Speaker 1: You see. I had an art teacher who told me
Speaker 1: at eleven, laughed at my artwork, which is subjective, right,
Speaker 1: isn't it? Isn't it and said to me, you're terrible
Speaker 1: at art. And I never got over it, and I
Speaker 1: quit anything creative until this day. I still say like,
Speaker 1: if pictionary comes out, everyone in my team, I'm a
Speaker 1: terrible drawer. Yeah, and it's like such a big impact.
Speaker 2: Yes, no, so true. So you got to think from
Speaker 2: the age of fifteen, after someone you know, giving me
Speaker 2: the confidence enough to go, actually I am talented to
Speaker 2: the age of I can't even do the mask. But anyway,
Speaker 2: so from the year two thousand to the year twenty
Speaker 2: eighteen when you retired, my whole identity was attached to
Speaker 2: being a rugby league player. So for eighteen years of
Speaker 2: my life was like that's who I was, that's what
Speaker 2: I did, and that's who I am. So I think
Speaker 2: walking away from rugby league at that point in time
Speaker 2: was super hard because I still you know, I probably
Speaker 2: kicked myself in the art for this one, but I
Speaker 2: still thought I had a couple of.
Speaker 1: Good years left in me before you retire.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I still reckon I could have played a
Speaker 2: couple more years of football.
Speaker 1: So why did you retire?
Speaker 2: Because I was stubborn and didn't want to leave the Broncos.
Speaker 2: For me, there was this loyalty attach to the Brisbane Broncos,
Speaker 2: and I think the prestige of being known as a
Speaker 2: one team player really, so I can rewind back to
Speaker 2: there was a big split when I was a kid
Speaker 2: with all my mates from school and then all the
Speaker 2: guys that I played football with so at a club
Speaker 2: level when I was a junior coming through at Brothers.
Speaker 2: All my friends from my primary school played at Brothers.
Speaker 2: When we got to high school, the private school kids
Speaker 2: all played for Brothers, and then all the state school
Speaker 2: kids where I went to Kerwin State High School, they
Speaker 2: all played for Centrals. I told my mom I want
Speaker 2: to go and play for Central's and moms like, no,
Speaker 2: you can't. You go to stay loyal, that's your team.
Speaker 2: You play for Brothers. So this is ingrained me. So
Speaker 2: I didn't want to go to England when I retired
Speaker 2: because I'd had work that was lined up for me
Speaker 2: with Channel nine and a few different things as well,
Speaker 2: and I thought, if I go to England for two years,
Speaker 2: I'll be out of side, out of mind. The next
Speaker 2: person retires and you know, that job that I did
Speaker 2: have a Channel nine is gone. And the people that
Speaker 2: retired at the same time and roughly around the same
Speaker 2: time as Jonathan Thurston, Cameron Smith, East Layer, Cooper Kronk,
Speaker 2: so all the media jobs would have been gone.
Speaker 1: It's very true.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I come back and then I'm working as
Speaker 2: a bloody stop go sign guy.
Speaker 1: They have pretty good money, so.
Speaker 2: It's super hard having something wrapped up in your identity
Speaker 2: for such a long period of time. And then you know,
Speaker 2: having this internal wrestle of actually I can still play,
Speaker 2: but they're not wanting to sign with another club because
Speaker 2: of this bloody loyalty. I'm as loyal as a kick dog.
Speaker 2: At the end of the day, I'll keep coming back.
Speaker 2: It's so hilarious to say this, but you kind of
Speaker 2: go off into the wilderness into the real world, and
Speaker 2: you you have your struggle, so you pack on the weight,
Speaker 2: you don't train as much, you probably drink too much.
Speaker 2: You know, all these different things that you weren't allowed
Speaker 2: to do while you're playing. True, you know you could do.
Speaker 2: It's like, oh, it's Wednesday, I can have a beer,
Speaker 2: and then you have two beers and then.
Speaker 1: So like my normal Yeah.
Speaker 2: So bad habits start creeping in. And then when the
Speaker 2: bad habits start creeping in, your mindset's shot. Because you
Speaker 2: are institutionalized when it comes to being a professional sporting stuff.
Speaker 2: You are told where to be, what to where, we
Speaker 2: had a full time dietician. You eat these things, you know,
Speaker 2: you go to the gym that they've done your program
Speaker 2: for you. Even to the point like towards the end
Speaker 2: of my career, we got fancy and we didn't have
Speaker 2: to even bring our own tails to training anymore because
Speaker 2: they had towels and they washed the towels for you.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was like usual to leave home all over again.
Speaker 2: Yeah, pretty much and start again, start again. And I
Speaker 2: think that was my biggest downfall when I retired, was
Speaker 2: that there was a lack of routine with what I
Speaker 2: was doing with my life, and it was just like
Speaker 2: I want to do this, I want to do this,
Speaker 2: I want to do this, I want to do all
Speaker 2: the things. Yeah, you know, I want to go skiing.
Speaker 2: When to Japan? And then the world shutdown.
Speaker 1: After that, Oh that was terrible time.
Speaker 2: It was a terrible timing.
Speaker 1: At home too. You can't even do the dreams.
Speaker 2: No, I can't even do a lot of the things. So, yeah,
Speaker 2: there was so much that kind of coincided with end
Speaker 2: of twenty eighteen, retire had a family holiday over in Japan,
Speaker 2: went skiing, came back, the world shutdown. I was just
Speaker 2: like it was probably the worst time ever to retire
Speaker 2: in all.
Speaker 1: Those things properly.
Speaker 2: But again, I have to kind of lean back on
Speaker 2: that resilient space.
Speaker 1: And I was going to say, what did you learn
Speaker 1: about yourself during that?
Speaker 2: Oh I'm a suck but cow, but you need to.
Speaker 2: I think you need times where you're suki and you
Speaker 2: need times when sit with it, sit with the shit
Speaker 2: you do. You have to sit with it, you have
Speaker 2: to deal with it, and you have to try to
Speaker 2: move on. Am I perfect? Now?
Speaker 1: You talk about the fact that when you leave footy
Speaker 1: and it's not luck, I don't think. I think it's talent.
Speaker 1: You are talented in front of a camera. And you
Speaker 1: know you've done radio, You've done you know, TV, You've
Speaker 1: done lots of gigs, speaking gigs.
Speaker 2: I worked at those things too.
Speaker 1: I know you're actually really good at it. Like, do
Speaker 1: you realize how good you are in it? I've had
Speaker 1: this conversation before, and I feel like I didn't sink in.
Speaker 1: I was like, like, you sit here, and I think
Speaker 1: you could do whatever you want in that space if
Speaker 1: you just made it happen, like in a thing.
Speaker 2: There's a new show coming, yeah, Thurday Night Live. It's
Speaker 2: called when I was playing, I was so nervous to
Speaker 2: do radio, so I went and did it. The TV stuff,
Speaker 2: I was so nervous to do TV stuff, so when
Speaker 2: I did it, we used to say it to our
Speaker 2: girls all the time when they were little. It takes
Speaker 2: one second to be brave, and you know, yeah, I
Speaker 2: find it really sad now for some of our current
Speaker 2: NRL stars, and actually any sporting stars is from a
Speaker 2: broadcasters point of view, the stuff that I used to
Speaker 2: do with Channel nine was me being my genuine self
Speaker 2: and having fun. But we squashed that Now as soon
Speaker 2: as anyone shows any type of character or you know,
Speaker 2: a bit of gusto about them, we squashed them straight away.
Speaker 2: And it's so sad to see because if that happened
Speaker 2: to me when I was playing, I wouldn't do any
Speaker 2: of the I think.
Speaker 1: Someone mentioned you with the Last of your Kind because
Speaker 1: the stuff that you came out sometimes is on TV.
Speaker 1: Like for some people it was what they look forward
Speaker 1: to at the end of the game and the show,
Speaker 1: and it brought a bit of joy to a bit
Speaker 1: of misery. So you're right, I don't think it'd be
Speaker 1: tolerated in that now.
Speaker 2: I've always tried to find balance with everything that I do,
Speaker 2: so again any of the TV stuff, any of my
Speaker 2: speaking engagements as well, again showing up as my genuine selves,
Speaker 2: and I try to bring little bits of you know,
Speaker 2: you don't want to go to see someone speaking on
Speaker 2: stage about leadership and the this is our leader does
Speaker 2: this is? It's like I have fun with it.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: When I talk about leadership, I talk about the different
Speaker 2: leaders that I've had throughout my career and what made
Speaker 2: them the good leaders that they were. I tell football
Speaker 2: stories when it comes to leadership talks because it's what
Speaker 2: I can relate to. And it's also so easy to
Speaker 2: tell those stories, isn't it. Yeah. I've come to realize
Speaker 2: now that I have so many transferable skills that came
Speaker 2: out of my rug league career that I now implemented
Speaker 2: my life and you know, hopefully they're helping me out
Speaker 2: and I'm still paying the bill sets Okay.
Speaker 1: Speaking of bravery, and I would have described you at
Speaker 1: times as being very stoic like sort of especially going
Speaker 1: through that period of transition for your career, instead of
Speaker 1: everything's sort of you know, oh yeah, it's all good.
Speaker 1: It's all good. You know, see me, everything's all right,
Speaker 1: and then you go into something really vulnerable and you
Speaker 1: go and you know, put a full series podcast out
Speaker 1: and talk about actually how tough it's been, and you
Speaker 1: talk about some real big topics around suicide and depression.
Speaker 1: I mean, even the people who know you really well
Speaker 1: were like, oh wow, where that from?
Speaker 2: There? It is because it was deep down? It was
Speaker 2: obviously deep.
Speaker 1: So what did it mean for you to share it? Like?
Speaker 1: What made you decide to open up about that stuff?
Speaker 2: I was doing some therapy at the time and opening
Speaker 2: up to my therapist and just through the conversation thought
Speaker 2: it would be beneficial to share those things again. You
Speaker 2: talk about how many people ask you to see me
Speaker 2: like that intents all the time and crazy and whatever.
Speaker 2: People ask those questions all the time. And it was
Speaker 2: to shy Upe as one of my genuine selves and
Speaker 2: tell a couple of stories. You can go and listen
Speaker 2: to the podcast.
Speaker 1: I recommend it.
Speaker 2: It's called We Are Human And there's a poem on
Speaker 2: them that I wrote about the Boy on the Wall
Speaker 2: and like that was something I buried deep and again
Speaker 2: going through a little bit of struggle. I can't even
Speaker 2: remember exactly what age I was, but yeah, I was
Speaker 2: going through a tough time again, lack of identity, didn't
Speaker 2: know where I fit in, didn't know what I wanted
Speaker 2: to do with my life. And I rode to the
Speaker 2: Kelso Dam, which is not far from my house, and
Speaker 2: towns were being pretty dry, where the damn spillway was
Speaker 2: sat on the wall, and just kind of was contemplating
Speaker 2: my own life and yeah, yeah, and then pretty damn
Speaker 2: close to just leaping, jumping off and ending it there.
Speaker 2: But so glad that I gave myself a chance to
Speaker 2: see the next day, because.
Speaker 1: Yeah, what made you get on your bike and right home.
Speaker 2: I was more worried in my mind of what my
Speaker 2: family would have gone through. So I'm glad that that
Speaker 2: was the last thought that I had. Was the you know,
Speaker 2: the literally fuck moment about you. Your family's the people
Speaker 2: that are still here are the ones that have to
Speaker 2: deal with your actions at the end of the day.
Speaker 2: They're the ones that I left behind. And I didn't
Speaker 2: want to put that burden on my parents, because yeah,
Speaker 2: I didn't have the most privileged life. It was pretty
Speaker 2: tough when Dad got out of the Air Force and
Speaker 2: struggled to find himself after a while. Again, you know,
Speaker 2: similar my dad. He joined the Air Force to travel
Speaker 2: and see Australia and do some different things. And he
Speaker 2: was in the Air Force for twenty one years and
Speaker 2: then I think he had a couple of little odd
Speaker 2: jobs there for a while. He worked at a chemist,
Speaker 2: he worked for a furniture place where he just delivered furniture,
Speaker 2: and then he end up starting to be a teacher.
Speaker 2: It showed me that you can do multiple jobs in
Speaker 2: your life. You don't have to just be put in
Speaker 2: one basket forever. And you know, it just showed me
Speaker 2: that you can achieve anything in your life and you
Speaker 2: don't have to just be stuck in one box forever.
Speaker 1: When you rode back that day, though, from what I understand,
Speaker 1: you didn't tell your parents what you were going to do, right,
Speaker 1: so they just found out probably in the last couple
Speaker 1: of years.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I had. I was sweating profusely. Yeah, I was
Speaker 2: so nervous when I had written the poem in twenty
Speaker 2: nineteen and had done some of the work I needed
Speaker 2: to do around it, you know, trying to fit in
Speaker 2: knowing understand that I am loved all those different things.
Speaker 2: And once I kind of got the poem out, I
Speaker 2: knew that well, I'm going to do a podcast around this,
Speaker 2: so I'm going to get it out there and put
Speaker 2: it out there. I need to make sure that my
Speaker 2: parents know before yep, I do, because I want them
Speaker 2: to hear it from me, not from someone else, and
Speaker 2: talk about tough conversation, but a conversation that needed to happen,
Speaker 2: and to see how supportive mom and dad were and
Speaker 2: they had no idea and I was a little angry
Speaker 2: kid and didn't understand my hormones to the point where
Speaker 2: Mum brought me a boxing back when I was a kid.
Speaker 2: She would know if I had a day at school
Speaker 2: if one of my brothers was annoying me, because I
Speaker 2: would be out there. I'd be punching the bag as
Speaker 2: hard as I could. But it was a conversation I
Speaker 2: needed to have a little bit for mom and dad,
Speaker 2: but more for myself because the burden of holding onto
Speaker 2: that for so long was massive.
Speaker 1: I think there's a theme that I look back and go,
Speaker 1: what did Sammy need in those moments in his life?
Speaker 1: Right like you think about it because you're a parent now,
Speaker 1: what did you need from your parents back then? What
Speaker 1: did you need from the coaching stuff back then? Was
Speaker 1: it someone to be able to talk to you more
Speaker 1: about how you're feeling?
Speaker 2: Oh, definitely. It's not our parents at the end of
Speaker 2: the day too, so you know, and I never placed
Speaker 2: any blame on them for our childhood at all, because
Speaker 2: they were just doing what they were taught, how they
Speaker 2: learned how to parent. We can only learn from the
Speaker 2: way that we were parented, come up with our own
Speaker 2: styles of parenting and continue to show up.
Speaker 1: You're cruising high speed towards forty as she's twelve months away,
Speaker 1: isn't it all less? So it's a milestone. I know,
Speaker 1: as a woman who's forty two, right, a lot of
Speaker 1: stuff changes. What are you not bothered by now that
Speaker 1: there's a young football player you see to get worried about, like,
Speaker 1: you know, self doubt. I think I've read a bit
Speaker 1: about you at times where oh, yeah, you know you
Speaker 1: had that self doubt, Like has that got better as
Speaker 1: you got older or worse?
Speaker 2: It's different self doubt now though, Okay, you know, any
Speaker 2: little idea I have or business opportunities or they think
Speaker 2: you're forever doubting yourself and thinking, you know, can I
Speaker 2: do it?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 2: But that's probably something that I do need to work on.
Speaker 2: There still is a little bit of self doubt that
Speaker 2: creeps in, and I think it creeps in for most
Speaker 2: people when it comes to anything, trying something new, doing
Speaker 2: something new, it's always scary, but you know, you just
Speaker 2: got to go back to that old one second to
Speaker 2: be brave, and you just got to leap and have
Speaker 2: a kraken. The thing that I worry and I'm concerned
Speaker 2: about is like, I want to be around for my
Speaker 2: kids when they have kids. So for me coming into
Speaker 2: my forties, I need to make sure that all right,
Speaker 2: I need to make sure I'm ticking a lot more
Speaker 2: boxes when it comes to the health side of things.
Speaker 2: I need to make sure that I see a doctor
Speaker 2: regularly and make sure that I trained so hard for
Speaker 2: so many years that I can easily use it as
Speaker 2: an excuse sometimes not too yeah, right, And I heard
Speaker 2: someone the other day talk about we would do anything
Speaker 2: for our kids, and sometimes we say we would die
Speaker 2: for our kids, but we need to start living for
Speaker 2: our kids. So that's probably something that I need to
Speaker 2: work on going forward.
Speaker 1: A little Bernie might have told me that you might
Speaker 1: be dabbling. I mean, you're a big kid yourself. Let's
Speaker 1: be honest, and it turns out you might like writing
Speaker 1: kids books too.
Speaker 2: Yes, I do. Actually, that's got some hopefully that will
Speaker 2: be coming out very soon. So I'm working. I'm working
Speaker 2: very closely with the which are the former Origin Greats,
Speaker 2: and they run a program in primary schools called the
Speaker 2: ARTI program, which is an acronym for Achieving Results through
Speaker 2: Indigenous Education. I would love to get these books out
Speaker 2: in January to start the new school year. I've been
Speaker 2: sitting on them for a little while and they're just
Speaker 2: Indigenous tales that I'd heard as a kid. And the
Speaker 2: whole idea is when I was a kid, I struggle
Speaker 2: to read now still. I remember I had to do
Speaker 2: something on the Footy Show once and they had the
Speaker 2: telepropter and I couldn't read it, and I just like
Speaker 2: froze on TV and being quick with it. I just
Speaker 2: kind of knew what we were talking about and I
Speaker 2: just spoke about it anyway without reading what was on
Speaker 2: the thing. So, you know, probably undiagnosed dyslexia. I probably
Speaker 2: got add as well. But I remember being a kid
Speaker 2: in going to school and not finding or seeing any
Speaker 2: books that I wanted to read in the library. You know,
Speaker 2: a lot of the things I've spoken about today that
Speaker 2: lack identity is like I wanted to read the dream
Speaker 2: Time Stories, but there's no Torres Strait Dreamtime Stories or
Speaker 2: all stories of the Torres Straits. So I've got a
Speaker 2: story about Gary the Garfish.
Speaker 1: Gary the garfis Garry.
Speaker 2: Garfish and how he broke his nose. I've got a
Speaker 2: story about the grandmother Turtle, how she was sick and
Speaker 2: tired of swimming around the world, and she found a
Speaker 2: sandbar and she laid down and she became an island,
Speaker 2: and all of her kids come back and they lay
Speaker 2: their eggs on the island now. So it's about motherhood
Speaker 2: and keeping your family close. And then I've got another book,
Speaker 2: which is I got to finish it, which is about
Speaker 2: the Pearl chall It's about bullying at the end of
Speaker 2: the day, so about inner beauty.
Speaker 1: Wow, I cannot wait to see these come out. This
Speaker 1: is great. I love it. Seemy. I hope you realize
Speaker 1: that you're a big advocate for the indigenous space and
Speaker 1: also for mental health. And you'll never know the answer
Speaker 1: to this, but somewhere out there, someone's listened to something
Speaker 1: and gone it's okay to say this because Sammy does,
Speaker 1: and someone's gone, do you know what? I wanted to
Speaker 1: get to know my culture more because Sammy's doing this.
Speaker 1: So I hope sometimes you remember the impact you're having
Speaker 1: on people. I think sometimes it can get lost a bit.
Speaker 1: You don't always know it.
Speaker 2: I do always tell people when I do a speech,
Speaker 2: and I always introduce myself, and I always say, well,
Speaker 2: if you don't know who I am, please don't google me.
Speaker 1: Because.
Speaker 2: Half of the stuff that comes up if you giggle me.
Speaker 1: Is nonsense as I read.
Speaker 2: So yeah, I hope that people are getting their information
Speaker 2: about Samada from podcasts, from seeing me on TV, from books,
Speaker 2: all different things.
Speaker 1: I'm going to let end with one question. Let's go
Speaker 1: back to seventeen year old SAMMI. Yeah, you're good Moper hair.
Speaker 1: Then I do miss your hair. If I'm honest, I'll
Speaker 1: be the end of the year.
Speaker 2: I'll get it fixed, little.
Speaker 1: Flitting there in the front.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'll get some plugs soon.
Speaker 1: But so seventeen year old Sammy football is off the table.
Speaker 1: In fact, all professional sports off the table. It's not
Speaker 1: going to happen, right, What else would SEMy have gone
Speaker 1: and done? If you look back now and all that
Speaker 1: was done. What career path might I be finding you
Speaker 1: in now?
Speaker 2: Well, A lot of the subjects I did at school
Speaker 2: were the direction I was going in was a building
Speaker 2: and construction industry. So eleven and grade twelve I did
Speaker 2: graphic design, I did trading business mass, I did mental work,
Speaker 2: I did woodwork. And we had a course at school
Speaker 2: too that we did was called a building construction course
Speaker 2: where we learn different skills when it come to building.
Speaker 2: So I'll probably be in the building industry. I'd probably
Speaker 2: own my own business. I'd be as big as hutches,
Speaker 2: I reckon. I love a flat pack challenge.
Speaker 1: I'm so glad you've told me that because I don't
Speaker 1: and I need someone to do mine.
Speaker 2: I liked the idea of sometimes not following the instructions.
Speaker 1: Either, great, that could just go.
Speaker 2: It's cool. It's a puzzle and you've got to put
Speaker 2: it together and figure out how it all fits.
Speaker 1: And I'll be bringing you for the next flight pack.
Speaker 1: It's been a pleasure, Sammy. Thank you so much for
Speaker 1: chatting today.
Speaker 2: Thank you