WEBVTT - Paul Murray Live | 29 October 0:00:02.650 --> 0:00:08.270 This is Paul Murray Live. Thank you, Shari. Welcome to 0:00:08.289 --> 0:00:10.610 the Man Cave. An awful lot to get to this evening. 0:00:11.110 --> 0:00:13.270 Now, are we surprised that the people who write the 0:00:13.310 --> 0:00:16.689 rules for business don't really understand business? Why do I 0:00:16.710 --> 0:00:19.670 talk so much about business? Because so many of you 0:00:19.770 --> 0:00:22.610 are watching right now who have decided to build a 0:00:22.660 --> 0:00:25.160 life outside of the triangle of dependence. 0:00:25.620 --> 0:00:26.419 That's where I live. 0:00:26.480 --> 0:00:29.580 It's where I believe the majority of Australians live or 0:00:29.620 --> 0:00:32.260 at least want to live. But it's not what this 0:00:32.300 --> 0:00:35.019 government's interested in. They want a big state where, of course, 0:00:35.100 --> 0:00:37.620 it works one of three ways. You either work for 0:00:37.659 --> 0:00:40.100 the government, you're taking money from the government as welfare, 0:00:40.200 --> 0:00:42.199 or if you're in business, well, of course, the client 0:00:42.360 --> 0:00:45.120 is the government. And a perfect example of how they 0:00:45.159 --> 0:00:50.960 don't understand business was the tap-and-go thing a few weeks ago. Now, 0:00:50.979 --> 0:00:53.420 the Reserve Bank made a decision which was no longer 0:00:53.440 --> 0:00:57.200 can customers be charged directly for the use of a 0:00:57.260 --> 0:01:00.920 tap-and-go card for either credit or the old FPOS system. 0:01:02.140 --> 0:01:04.020 We were told a lie by the Prime Minister at 0:01:04.060 --> 0:01:04.440 the time. 0:01:04.459 --> 0:01:09.140 From today, they're banned. Saving you money every time you tap. 0:01:09.160 --> 0:01:11.940 So whether you're at the supermarket paying bills or buying 0:01:11.959 --> 0:01:14.059 a cup of coffee, the price you see is the 0:01:14.100 --> 0:01:14.820 price you pay. 0:01:15.720 --> 0:01:17.490 Of course, the price didn't disappear. 0:01:17.510 --> 0:01:22.670 Small business was very clear what the problem was for 0:01:22.709 --> 0:01:27.910 them because they were still getting charged by the financial institutions, meaning. 0:01:29.250 --> 0:01:30.090 Major backlash. 0:01:30.580 --> 0:01:33.780 Small business owners say they've been left to foot the bill. 0:01:33.880 --> 0:01:38.360 Traders warn the looming policy still threatens to shutter local businesses. 0:01:38.580 --> 0:01:41.180 But instead it's had to be absorbed by businesses. 0:01:41.980 --> 0:01:42.480 So as long as. 0:01:42.459 --> 0:01:45.820 There is a financial institution, the customer at the end, 0:01:45.980 --> 0:01:47.170 the business in the middle. 0:01:47.750 --> 0:01:48.970 There's still the charge. 0:01:48.990 --> 0:01:52.490 You just moved from the customer back to the business 0:01:52.510 --> 0:01:56.230 because they were still being charged by the financial institutions. But, 0:01:56.250 --> 0:01:58.900 of course, the greatest government of all time said, that's 0:01:59.220 --> 0:02:01.080 not true, because we said so. 0:02:02.060 --> 0:02:04.800 And it will lower fees for businesses, as I said, 0:02:04.820 --> 0:02:09.090 by about $ 910 million a year. And that it's all 0:02:09.150 --> 0:02:13.870 about saving businesses, especially small businesses, more than $ 900 million 0:02:13.910 --> 0:02:15.429 a year in interchange fees. 0:02:16.410 --> 0:02:18.690 Now, you know, the next part of this story, which 0:02:18.750 --> 0:02:22.470 was the government itself via the Australian Tax Office, which 0:02:22.510 --> 0:02:26.040 of course collects the revenue, belled the cat that there 0:02:26.060 --> 0:02:29.280 was still a fee to be paid. So much so that... 0:02:29.590 --> 0:02:33.079 When this policy was announced as a saving for everyone, 0:02:33.740 --> 0:02:37.359 they told anyone who pays a tax bill, business or private, 0:02:37.680 --> 0:02:39.179 if you do it with a credit card, you can't 0:02:39.280 --> 0:02:40.280 do it anymore. 0:02:40.360 --> 0:02:44.830 Why? Because they, the tax office, the government, would end 0:02:44.870 --> 0:02:45.410 up having. 0:02:45.230 --> 0:02:50.210 To wear the fees. We remember the announcement when it 0:02:50.250 --> 0:02:55.000 took place. Well, of course, the government tried to pretend 0:02:55.040 --> 0:02:56.860 that they were a little bit surprised. 0:02:56.340 --> 0:02:58.430 By this position of the tax office. 0:02:58.690 --> 0:03:01.330 So rather than cancelling the decision, they just got them 0:03:01.350 --> 0:03:03.010 to delay it for six months. 0:03:03.510 --> 0:03:05.350 Well, that, of course, turned out to be a lie too. 0:03:05.950 --> 0:03:06.269 Why? 0:03:06.889 --> 0:03:10.990 Because the Assistant Treasurer told us that he knew in 0:03:11.130 --> 0:03:14.109 July that the tax office was going. 0:03:14.030 --> 0:03:19.269 To be doing that in the first place. So what 0:03:19.290 --> 0:03:21.850 was news to us wasn't news to them. 0:03:23.530 --> 0:03:25.730 And of course, all of that meant that there was 0:03:25.960 --> 0:03:29.940 only one real thing that any medium to small business 0:03:29.960 --> 0:03:32.240 could do, and that was they couldn't absorb the fees. 0:03:32.580 --> 0:03:34.940 They had to hand it on in higher prices. So 0:03:34.980 --> 0:03:39.780 prices have gone up since this decision was made. Anyone 0:03:39.800 --> 0:03:41.710 who's been to a cafe knows it. Anyone who's dealt 0:03:41.720 --> 0:03:44.970 with a small business knows it. Now, of course, it's 0:03:45.150 --> 0:03:48.490 not going to anyone's profit apart from the financial institutions, 0:03:49.590 --> 0:03:53.540 but Why would, of course, no-one in the government realise 0:03:53.920 --> 0:03:58.460 that this would be a consequence? Because, of course, basically 0:03:58.560 --> 0:04:02.060 no-one in the government and virtually no-one in the Cabinet, 0:04:02.380 --> 0:04:05.380 and definitely not the Prime Minister, have any experience actually 0:04:05.540 --> 0:04:09.580 running a business. You see, they've worked for someone, or 0:04:09.680 --> 0:04:14.460 most likely the Labor Party, the unions or the government. So, 0:04:15.320 --> 0:04:19.230 minister after minister, no after no... That is the list 0:04:19.410 --> 0:04:21.630 of the Australian Federal Cabinet and whether it has run 0:04:21.670 --> 0:04:23.860 a small business or not. We could find two examples. 0:04:24.650 --> 0:04:27.419 One was a Northern Territory senator who ran their own 0:04:27.640 --> 0:04:30.240 media company. The other was a South Australian senator who, 0:04:30.279 --> 0:04:32.880 of course, ran a wine label in between stints in 0:04:32.900 --> 0:04:38.360 the Senate. Everything else, no connection whatsoever. Now, I've made 0:04:38.400 --> 0:04:42.960 all of these points before, but there's another element to 0:04:42.990 --> 0:04:45.770 why the system doesn't understand the impact or just doesn't 0:04:45.850 --> 0:04:48.270 care about what the impact is on those who want 0:04:48.290 --> 0:04:51.070 to live away from the government, who want to be 0:04:51.150 --> 0:04:53.550 able to earn their own living, to be able to 0:04:53.610 --> 0:04:56.989 increase their living by getting up earlier, going to bed later, 0:04:57.370 --> 0:05:01.849 working longer hours, working extra days, trying to shove that 0:05:02.150 --> 0:05:06.180 one extra job into the day and in order to 0:05:06.200 --> 0:05:08.300 be able to make more money for their family because, 0:05:09.279 --> 0:05:12.020 just like for everyone else, the cost of everything's gone up, 0:05:12.600 --> 0:05:15.640 including a small business person or any business person who's. 0:05:15.500 --> 0:05:16.690 Trying to pay off their house because. 0:05:16.730 --> 0:05:21.930 Remember, that's got 17 times worse under this government because 0:05:21.950 --> 0:05:25.390 that's how many interest rate rises there have been. Well, 0:05:25.500 --> 0:05:28.200 adding another layer on all of this is the professional 0:05:28.380 --> 0:05:33.279 bureaucracy that advises the professional politicians, all of which get 0:05:33.339 --> 0:05:37.350 paid by the government, all of which have government super 0:05:37.490 --> 0:05:39.289 and a whole bunch of perks. And of course, none 0:05:39.310 --> 0:05:41.950 of it comes out of their wage. They still fly 0:05:41.970 --> 0:05:46.700 for free, all the rest of it. And the tax commissioner, Well, 0:05:46.740 --> 0:05:50.700 he gave evidence in the past 24 hours about realising, yeah, 0:05:51.279 --> 0:05:53.120 I suppose if we do tell people that one of 0:05:53.140 --> 0:05:55.460 the ways they pay their tax bills, they can't pay 0:05:55.480 --> 0:05:58.490 their tax bills anymore, that might annoy a few people 0:05:58.560 --> 0:06:01.330 in business. This is what he told the Senate committee. 0:06:03.050 --> 0:06:04.190 I mean, hindsight's a wonderful thing. 0:06:04.630 --> 0:06:07.870 As I said, with the benefit of hindsight, and, you know, 0:06:07.930 --> 0:06:09.470 one always hopes to live a bit longer to get 0:06:09.490 --> 0:06:09.750 a bit. 0:06:09.670 --> 0:06:14.150 Wiser, at an early stage... if we'd had. 0:06:14.330 --> 0:06:18.070 A much more open conversation with relevant stakeholders to then say, well, 0:06:18.089 --> 0:06:20.150 what are these other options? I had jumped to the 0:06:20.190 --> 0:06:26.040 conclusion that managing cash flow related to a situation where 0:06:26.839 --> 0:06:28.719 a person or a business might be struggling. 0:06:29.700 --> 0:06:33.180 Now, is it dangerous for a pay-as-you-go employee to be 0:06:33.240 --> 0:06:34.860 making any comments about the tax commissioner? 0:06:35.320 --> 0:06:36.460 Yes, but still I will. 0:06:36.779 --> 0:06:38.669 And if there is an audit, I will think it 0:06:38.750 --> 0:06:43.360 might be linked back to this particular conversation. But I 0:06:43.400 --> 0:06:46.460 wanted to show you, of course, the reality of why 0:06:46.520 --> 0:06:48.599 credit cards matter to businesses. 0:06:48.620 --> 0:06:52.599 A credit card gives us some way to play with 0:06:52.700 --> 0:06:54.400 our cash flow within the business. 0:06:54.740 --> 0:06:56.580 It just makes us more operational. 0:06:56.920 --> 0:06:59.839 If somebody doesn't have a decent cash reserve available to 0:06:59.860 --> 0:07:03.170 then buy stock for, you know, Black Friday and Christmas trading, 0:07:03.260 --> 0:07:06.150 how are they then supposed to use that money that 0:07:06.170 --> 0:07:09.029 they would have paid their bills to the ATO with card? 0:07:10.210 --> 0:07:10.370 Well. 0:07:10.830 --> 0:07:14.310 Why put perhaps the government be blind to the reality 0:07:14.330 --> 0:07:16.930 of business and the head of the tax office be 0:07:16.970 --> 0:07:19.380 blind to business? Well, let's have a look at the 0:07:19.450 --> 0:07:21.950 biography of the tax commissioner, who I'm sure is. 0:07:21.920 --> 0:07:24.460 An excellent tax commissioner. Again, please don't audit me. 0:07:24.800 --> 0:07:27.000 Not because I'm dodgy, but it's a lot of work 0:07:27.020 --> 0:07:29.620 for everyone and there's nothing going to be found, right? 0:07:30.840 --> 0:07:33.540 Well, guess what? He has a long career in the. 0:07:33.480 --> 0:07:36.960 Australian Public Service, beginning in 1989 when he was a 0:07:37.000 --> 0:07:40.280 graduate at the Australian Customs Service. Over 35 years, he 0:07:40.300 --> 0:07:44.690 accumulated diverse experience across policy developments and program delivery in 0:07:44.730 --> 0:07:47.630 a range of portfolios. Again, fine, fair enough, but this 0:07:47.690 --> 0:07:50.470 is not an experience in business, meaning when somebody was 0:07:50.510 --> 0:07:52.370 sitting around the table, they'd go, oh, hang. 0:07:52.310 --> 0:07:54.290 On, that's going to be difficult for people. 0:07:55.270 --> 0:07:58.260 Mr Heffernan has represented Australia in international forums, including the 0:07:58.280 --> 0:08:03.900 United Nations and the International Energy Agency Organisation for Economic 0:08:03.920 --> 0:08:06.760 Co-operation and Development as well. For almost 20 years, Mr 0:08:06.780 --> 0:08:10.080 Heffernan's interests and expertise in economics and tax policy have 0:08:10.120 --> 0:08:12.840 led him to various roles inside the Australian Tax Office 0:08:12.980 --> 0:08:17.180 and the Commonwealth Treasury. So now we can add the 0:08:17.340 --> 0:08:21.430 Tax Office to the Prime Minister, to the Cabinet, to 0:08:21.500 --> 0:08:23.670 much of the public service, who, of course, make all 0:08:23.690 --> 0:08:28.030 the rules for small business but have no experience in it, meaning... 0:08:28.210 --> 0:08:31.230 They don't know what the real-world consequences of their decisions are. 0:08:31.570 --> 0:08:35.460 No matter how noble, no matter how efficient, the reality 0:08:35.620 --> 0:08:37.500 is there are millions of people who want to live 0:08:37.720 --> 0:08:41.040 outside of the purview of government, not because they're secret 0:08:41.120 --> 0:08:45.990 sovereign citizens or right-wing nutjobs. They're just people who want 0:08:46.050 --> 0:08:49.270 to be in determination of their own future, knowing the 0:08:49.390 --> 0:08:53.870 only way they get a pay rise is to work harder. Unlike, 0:08:53.910 --> 0:08:57.070 of course, the pay rises which are just automatically handed out. 0:08:58.010 --> 0:09:01.290 to politicians, to the top levels of the public service, 0:09:01.809 --> 0:09:04.350 and to the public service itself. 0:09:05.110 --> 0:09:07.349 But, of course, nothing to see here. 0:09:09.770 --> 0:09:11.080 Now, I haven't done this for a little while, but 0:09:11.100 --> 0:09:14.120 it's still worth mentioning. Can they please cut the petrol tax? 0:09:15.040 --> 0:09:17.160 Why? Because petrol is still very expensive. 0:09:17.220 --> 0:09:17.480 Why? 0:09:17.559 --> 0:09:19.179 Yes, because of the war in Iran. 0:09:19.620 --> 0:09:21.800 Yes, it was not started by the Australian government, but 0:09:22.070 --> 0:09:26.610 the Australian government takes 52 cents per litre, not to 0:09:26.670 --> 0:09:31.010 mention the 10% GST on top of the final cost 0:09:31.250 --> 0:09:36.830 of petrol. So every time petrol costs more, the GST 0:09:36.910 --> 0:09:39.350 take of it increases and, of course, that money goes 0:09:39.410 --> 0:09:43.229 back through the federal two state governments. Now, you would think, 0:09:43.350 --> 0:09:46.559 because the government's not being asked about this 52 cents 0:09:46.760 --> 0:09:50.380 per litre, that somehow petrol had gone back through the floor. Well, 0:09:50.620 --> 0:09:52.260 I know that's not the case, but as you know, 0:09:52.300 --> 0:09:55.780 I prefer to show receipts than just have feel opinions here. 0:09:56.960 --> 0:10:00.000 And as you can see, it is still way higher 0:10:00.179 --> 0:10:03.660 than it was in August, way higher than it was 0:10:04.059 --> 0:10:06.590 in September. And now it's pretty much been in the 0:10:06.630 --> 0:10:08.670 same spot for a while. The top one of those 0:10:08.730 --> 0:10:11.290 is the unleaded 91 and E10 in Sydney. The bottom 0:10:11.330 --> 0:10:16.110 is in Brisbane. Same picture, of course, in Melbourne. Now, again, 0:10:16.170 --> 0:10:17.890 back to the theme at the start of the program 0:10:17.910 --> 0:10:20.340 about it's very difficult to understand people's plight if you 0:10:20.380 --> 0:10:24.559 don't walk, like, a quarter of a mile in their 0:10:24.580 --> 0:10:28.559 shoes every now and then. So, of course, the Prime Minister, 0:10:28.620 --> 0:10:31.850 who has been an MP for 30 years... And has, 0:10:31.890 --> 0:10:34.510 of course, had all the travel allowances that means even 0:10:34.550 --> 0:10:37.500 if he drives his quote-unquote own car, the own car 0:10:37.600 --> 0:10:39.179 is one, of course, that's given to him as a 0:10:39.320 --> 0:10:42.160 local MP. And when he goes to the petrol station, 0:10:42.400 --> 0:10:43.339 he doesn't pay for it. 0:10:43.380 --> 0:10:43.600 Why? 0:10:43.820 --> 0:10:46.900 Because as a member of parliament, as a minister, as 0:10:46.940 --> 0:10:48.959 an opposition leader, as a prime minister, you get a 0:10:49.020 --> 0:10:52.540 fuel card. So you need to be briefed about the 0:10:52.559 --> 0:10:55.859 problems when it comes to petrol prices. Of course, Jim 0:10:55.880 --> 0:10:59.030 Chalmers would be exactly the same. as firstly a Member 0:10:59.050 --> 0:11:03.700 of Parliament, then a Shadow Minister, now the Treasurer. And 0:11:03.780 --> 0:11:06.920 why should they be cutting 52 cents per litre of 0:11:07.100 --> 0:11:10.339 every litre of petrol and diesel that they charge in 0:11:10.380 --> 0:11:13.080 the country? Because they say stuff like this. 0:11:14.620 --> 0:11:17.809 So this is about easing the cost of living, easing 0:11:17.850 --> 0:11:19.270 some of the pressure on people. 0:11:19.490 --> 0:11:22.450 Any cost of living measures are ones that not just 0:11:22.550 --> 0:11:27.640 address providing help for people today, but building a stronger economy. 0:11:27.950 --> 0:11:28.510 Tomorrow. 0:11:28.590 --> 0:11:30.250 We took some of the sting out of these cost 0:11:30.270 --> 0:11:33.050 of living pressures earlier in the year. 0:11:33.110 --> 0:11:36.530 So we can't do it now because petrol is not 0:11:36.630 --> 0:11:37.890 quite as high as it was before? 0:11:38.010 --> 0:11:39.500 It's still a punish. 0:11:40.260 --> 0:11:42.099 And when everything else keeps going up, and the Prime 0:11:42.120 --> 0:11:45.420 Minister himself is talking about part of the problem with 0:11:45.440 --> 0:11:46.880 the war in the Middle East is that everything gets 0:11:46.940 --> 0:11:49.380 transported around on trucks and therefore the cost of transferring 0:11:49.400 --> 0:11:50.540 is being passed on to everyone. 0:11:50.860 --> 0:11:51.120 Sure. 0:11:51.380 --> 0:11:55.150 So stop clipping the ticket along the way. The government 0:11:55.250 --> 0:11:57.230 is in a deficit and will be for the next 0:11:57.230 --> 0:12:00.089 40 years. This is not going to be the difference, 0:12:00.830 --> 0:12:04.530 but it might be the difference between the python turning 0:12:04.570 --> 0:12:09.370 you robina purple and slightly light robina purple in terms 0:12:09.410 --> 0:12:13.170 of the cost of living crisis. Surveyed today in the 0:12:13.210 --> 0:12:17.040 News Corp newspapers was very clear. 78% of people either 0:12:17.220 --> 0:12:22.630 agree or strongly agree that that the federal government should 0:12:22.770 --> 0:12:28.840 reinstate the fuel excise tax cut to make fuel cheaper. But, 0:12:28.860 --> 0:12:30.900 of course, the government wouldn't be doing that any time 0:12:30.940 --> 0:12:34.120 soon because we know when it affects politicians, it is 0:12:34.380 --> 0:12:36.660 the lead story forever. When it affects you and me, 0:12:36.800 --> 0:12:38.320 you get tough love. 0:12:39.940 --> 0:12:43.340 People shouldn't expect to see in the budget on Tuesday 0:12:43.400 --> 0:12:48.750 night an extension of that because we've made it really 0:12:48.800 --> 0:12:50.809 clear that it's a temporary thing. 0:12:51.940 --> 0:12:54.480 John Rolfe is part of the group that put that 0:12:54.540 --> 0:12:56.300 poll together. We will have a chat to him about 0:12:56.340 --> 0:12:57.760 that and a bunch of consumer issues and why he 0:12:57.780 --> 0:13:01.120 should be backing Australia in a moment or two's time. 0:13:01.140 --> 0:13:03.960 I want to talk about the grants rorts next here, 0:13:04.280 --> 0:13:07.370 the latest that we have heard about. Well, the Prime Minister, 0:13:07.470 --> 0:13:09.970 who is now continuing to dig such a hole when 0:13:10.010 --> 0:13:13.050 it comes to these grants, like the Marrickville Golf Club, 0:13:13.070 --> 0:13:15.030 that he's going to need another grant to fill the 0:13:15.070 --> 0:13:16.590 hole that he has been digging. 0:13:17.850 --> 0:13:19.670 As we know, the Marrickville.... 0:13:20.230 --> 0:13:23.630 Golf Club is emblematic of an overall half billion dollar 0:13:23.710 --> 0:13:29.120 electoral slush fund that was put in place by this government. Now, 0:13:29.140 --> 0:13:31.700 we know that he misled the parliament because his excuse 0:13:31.720 --> 0:13:35.140 for all of this was about sewage, but his office 0:13:35.280 --> 0:13:36.740 should have known that it was nothing to do with 0:13:36.760 --> 0:13:39.520 sewage because the New South Wales government got involved in that. 0:13:39.940 --> 0:13:41.930 He did recognise it. Oh, I might have made a mistake, 0:13:41.950 --> 0:13:44.150 but wouldn't dare correct the record. Wouldn't dare even use 0:13:44.170 --> 0:13:49.199 the word mistake. Well, he was asked further questions about 0:13:49.240 --> 0:13:52.609 it today and the 19th hole got deeper for the 0:13:52.630 --> 0:13:55.250 Prime Minister on the Marrickville golf course. 0:13:56.390 --> 0:13:59.830 Why won't the Prime Minister provide a single document confirming 0:14:00.130 --> 0:14:01.910 that the money was to pay for the sewerage works? 0:14:03.030 --> 0:14:07.429 After you, sir. The premise of the question, however, is wrong. 0:14:08.320 --> 0:14:11.460 This wasn't about invite only. This is an election commitment. 0:14:12.660 --> 0:14:15.880 Ah, the only problem is, where does this invite-only thing 0:14:15.970 --> 0:14:21.170 come from? Oh, that's right, the Centre for Public Integrity. Remember, 0:14:21.210 --> 0:14:24.710 these were the people who, of course, so outraged Helen 0:14:24.750 --> 0:14:28.080 Haynes that she was able to weaponise this politically. The 0:14:28.120 --> 0:14:30.720 Prime Minister, of course, tried to weaponise on her with 0:14:30.740 --> 0:14:32.740 the dirt sheet that, of course, definitely wasn't. 0:14:32.520 --> 0:14:34.560 A dirt sheet, it just was a compliment sheet. I'm 0:14:34.580 --> 0:14:36.460 sure there's 151. 0:14:35.660 --> 0:14:38.060 Of them for every member of Parliament sitting in the 0:14:38.080 --> 0:14:42.729 Prime Minister's filing cabinet somewhere. Well, also, inside the explanation 0:14:43.130 --> 0:14:46.170 about all of this was, no public explanation has been 0:14:46.190 --> 0:14:47.110 given as to why. 0:14:46.990 --> 0:14:49.350 A closed process was. 0:14:49.410 --> 0:14:54.710 Used or how eligibility to be invited was determined, contrary 0:14:54.850 --> 0:15:00.190 to the Commonwealth Grants Rules and Principles of 2024. To 0:15:01.610 --> 0:15:04.080 make it a little clearer for everyone sitting at the 0:15:04.120 --> 0:15:07.440 back and not paying full attention, he talks about this 0:15:07.560 --> 0:15:11.520 not being an invite-only system and Well, it's even worse 0:15:11.810 --> 0:15:12.290 than that. 0:15:12.710 --> 0:15:15.510 And take it from a friend of the government to 0:15:15.550 --> 0:15:15.950 tell you. 0:15:17.050 --> 0:15:20.910 Whereas the sports rort scandal involved a selection process that 0:15:20.930 --> 0:15:25.670 was corrupted by politics, Labor's infrastructure grants program seemed to 0:15:25.710 --> 0:15:29.710 have no process at all except to curry political favour. 0:15:30.630 --> 0:15:33.530 Well, guess who's back with another thorn in the side 0:15:33.550 --> 0:15:37.410 of the Prime Minister as that 19th hole at Marrickville Golf. 0:15:37.210 --> 0:15:40.130 Club gets deeper and deeper and deeper and deeper and deeper. 0:15:41.470 --> 0:15:43.850 And regardless of what the actual position on the sewerage is, 0:15:44.090 --> 0:15:46.840 the stink is obvious to everyone, no matter where you 0:15:46.860 --> 0:15:49.220 live in the country. The Centre for Independent Studies put 0:15:49.260 --> 0:15:54.800 out another report, independent report, into this today. A write-up 0:15:54.840 --> 0:15:59.540 of it says 98% of Labor's invite-only grants, the premise 0:15:59.560 --> 0:16:02.960 was wrong with that question, were just tick and flick 0:16:03.820 --> 0:16:06.140 by the public service because, of course, the decision had 0:16:06.240 --> 0:16:11.109 already been made. department scrutiny and political handpicked infrastructure grants 0:16:11.130 --> 0:16:13.750 had been exposed as little more than a rubber stamp. 0:16:14.270 --> 0:16:17.900 With new research finding almost 98% of projects invited to 0:16:17.960 --> 0:16:22.020 apply for funding under the Albanese government schemes ultimately. 0:16:21.660 --> 0:16:23.700 Received taxpayer money. 0:16:24.480 --> 0:16:26.740 So when there's only one application and you know what 0:16:26.760 --> 0:16:28.780 the application is because you asked them to put the 0:16:28.830 --> 0:16:33.970 money in because it so lines up with your election commitments, 0:16:34.650 --> 0:16:37.170 and as the Minister for Infrastructure told us this week, 0:16:37.510 --> 0:16:41.730 It all went via Labor HQ. It's a giant slush fund. 0:16:41.770 --> 0:16:47.030 It's not election promises. It's half a billion dollars. Oh, 0:16:47.050 --> 0:16:49.830 but we're so much better than the Liberals because they 0:16:50.170 --> 0:16:51.570 were dumb enough to put it all down on a 0:16:51.590 --> 0:16:52.570 colour-coded sheet. 0:16:53.670 --> 0:16:55.430 Well, of course, back to where Andrew Probin said. 0:16:55.750 --> 0:16:59.660 The point is this one didn't have any sheets connected 0:16:59.700 --> 0:17:02.100 to it because they didn't need to because they were 0:17:02.120 --> 0:17:03.460 the ones picking and they were picking in. 0:17:03.400 --> 0:17:06.140 The places that they knew they were going to win 0:17:06.580 --> 0:17:09.959 or they wanted. to win. But, you know, nothing to 0:17:10.030 --> 0:17:10.530 see here. 0:17:13.369 --> 0:17:15.949 Again, something that has been a dominant story over the 0:17:15.970 --> 0:17:18.369 past couple of weeks has been the threats that are 0:17:18.410 --> 0:17:22.900 posed to politicians, both federal and state. And we know 0:17:22.960 --> 0:17:24.780 that there have been plenty of people that are concerned 0:17:24.920 --> 0:17:27.280 about their safety, and rightly so. There is no part 0:17:27.300 --> 0:17:30.100 of me that minimises the seriousness of this. 0:17:31.320 --> 0:17:36.580 Members of Parliament are being inundated with abuse and threats 0:17:36.900 --> 0:17:39.260 and often threats of physical harm and violence. 0:17:39.320 --> 0:17:44.030 Encouraging the sort of violent threats which we've seen become 0:17:44.310 --> 0:17:45.530 far too prevalent. 0:17:46.330 --> 0:17:47.550 One is one too many. 0:17:47.810 --> 0:17:51.800 We don't accept that our safety and our family's safety 0:17:51.840 --> 0:17:52.939 and our staff's safety is. 0:17:52.960 --> 0:17:53.700 Put at risk. 0:17:55.450 --> 0:17:57.730 Correct, and as I've argued before, this government can find 0:17:57.810 --> 0:18:00.130 extra staff for MPs when it is for making bad 0:18:00.190 --> 0:18:01.250 social media videos. 0:18:01.530 --> 0:18:02.950 Total cost, $ 150 million. 0:18:03.210 --> 0:18:06.389 If they want to turn that into extra security, a 0:18:06.510 --> 0:18:09.130 physical person to be with politicians, I have no problem 0:18:09.150 --> 0:18:10.490 with it whatsoever, all right? 0:18:10.890 --> 0:18:11.110 None. 0:18:11.190 --> 0:18:13.710 Regardless of whether I like or dislike the politician, their 0:18:13.750 --> 0:18:17.129 safety is beyond question for obvious reasons. I mention all 0:18:17.150 --> 0:18:19.730 of this because there has been a couple of politicians 0:18:19.800 --> 0:18:23.580 which have been disappointed by the way courts eventually deal... 0:18:23.890 --> 0:18:28.300 with situations like this. Two people in the South Australian government, 0:18:28.359 --> 0:18:31.340 Labor MPs, one a minister, one a backbencher. 0:18:32.020 --> 0:18:33.760 Well, here's the story. 0:18:35.180 --> 0:18:37.369 For Lucy Hood, it began a long time ago, the 0:18:37.550 --> 0:18:41.030 confronting and concerning behaviour happening in front of her children, 0:18:41.050 --> 0:18:44.669 while member for Elizabeth, Ella Shaw, says she first had 0:18:44.710 --> 0:18:49.010 contact with the alleged stalker six months ago online before 0:18:49.050 --> 0:18:52.619 he followed her back to her car recently after a 0:18:52.660 --> 0:18:53.480 community event. 0:18:54.619 --> 0:18:55.119 Not cool. 0:18:56.100 --> 0:18:59.919 Well, all of this has begun its process in the courts, 0:19:00.240 --> 0:19:03.700 and guess what? The courts are, from the outside looking in, 0:19:03.980 --> 0:19:07.460 not delivering what those politicians previously would have wanted or 0:19:07.520 --> 0:19:08.500 we would have wanted. 0:19:08.359 --> 0:19:09.520 As protection for the police. 0:19:09.580 --> 0:19:09.800 Why? 0:19:09.820 --> 0:19:13.330 Because a man has been cautioned over alleged stalking of 0:19:13.380 --> 0:19:16.570 two Labor MPs. A man who allegedly stalked two South 0:19:16.609 --> 0:19:20.590 Australian members of Parliament has been cautioned, police have revealed. 0:19:21.050 --> 0:19:24.149 The 44-year-old man from Adelaide's northern suburbs was issued with 0:19:24.190 --> 0:19:28.409 a stalking caution in relation to the MPs. They relate 0:19:28.450 --> 0:19:32.229 to separate instances involving Hood and Shaw that are not connected. 0:19:32.619 --> 0:19:35.280 The man was also charged with an unrelated offence of 0:19:35.480 --> 0:19:40.139 breaching bail. So the charge wasn't about the behaviour here. Instead, 0:19:40.180 --> 0:19:40.899 it was bail. 0:19:41.380 --> 0:19:44.679 And caution is what police have handed out. 0:19:47.140 --> 0:19:50.210 Again, a disappointment that is felt by many people who 0:19:50.250 --> 0:19:55.880 expect more of the court system. Again, there are gradients 0:19:55.910 --> 0:19:59.640 of offending, which means there are gradients of punishment. And yes, 0:19:59.700 --> 0:20:02.780 caution would be at the very, very, very lowest level. 0:20:03.740 --> 0:20:07.760 But what about some weekend detentions? What about something in between? 0:20:07.800 --> 0:20:10.460 What about the community service order? What about something other 0:20:10.480 --> 0:20:16.200 to show that just like perjury or contempt of court 0:20:16.300 --> 0:20:19.220 are highly punished by courts because they are an attack 0:20:19.260 --> 0:20:23.379 on the system, that anyone who is doing anything as 0:20:23.440 --> 0:20:27.449 allegedly direct as what is being alleged here, again, they 0:20:27.490 --> 0:20:33.010 are dealt with almost disproportionately because it is the attempt 0:20:33.030 --> 0:20:35.110 to tell the rest of society, don't even think about this, 0:20:35.130 --> 0:20:38.350 because there is no leniency. But we would think that 0:20:38.470 --> 0:20:40.790 about when you close down the Sydney Harbour Bridge for 0:20:40.810 --> 0:20:43.190 a climate protest, when you glue your hands to the 0:20:43.230 --> 0:20:47.320 streets of Brisbane, when you set fire to things outside 0:20:47.710 --> 0:20:53.720 the parliament, when you tear up a politician's office. Of course, 0:20:55.240 --> 0:20:59.840 the punishment so rarely fits the crime. But sadly, these 0:20:59.880 --> 0:21:02.419 politicians are now exposed to what the rest of us are, 0:21:02.760 --> 0:21:05.900 which is a giant gulf between the hard work police 0:21:05.940 --> 0:21:08.540 have to do to go and find somebody, the hard 0:21:08.600 --> 0:21:11.080 work to be able to build a case against them, 0:21:11.280 --> 0:21:18.580 only for the person sitting at the big table to decide. 0:21:19.780 --> 0:21:20.379