1 00:00:05,880 --> 00:00:08,099 Sean Aylmer: Welcome to the Fear and Greed business interview. I'm Sean 2 00:00:08,099 --> 00:00:11,520 Sean Aylmer: Aylmer. Five years ago the world of banking changed when 3 00:00:11,520 --> 00:00:13,739 Sean Aylmer: the Royal Commission into the sector made a series of 4 00:00:13,740 --> 00:00:17,789 Sean Aylmer: recommendations about how our banks should operate. Not long after 5 00:00:18,090 --> 00:00:20,939 Sean Aylmer: the pandemic hit, bringing more change with it, including a 6 00:00:20,940 --> 00:00:23,759 Sean Aylmer: very rapid shift away from cash and in the rise 7 00:00:23,759 --> 00:00:27,270 Sean Aylmer: of artificial intelligence and other technology and the seemingly endless 8 00:00:27,330 --> 00:00:30,900 Sean Aylmer: threat of scams and cyber attacks. And banks are now 9 00:00:30,900 --> 00:00:34,170 Sean Aylmer: operating in a vastly different environment to what they were 10 00:00:34,170 --> 00:00:39,630 Sean Aylmer: before. But what do we as customers actually want from 11 00:00:39,630 --> 00:00:42,989 Sean Aylmer: our banks? Are they delivering what we need and bringing 12 00:00:42,990 --> 00:00:45,870 Sean Aylmer: us along as the sector evolves or are we being 13 00:00:45,870 --> 00:00:50,969 Sean Aylmer: left behind? Consultancy publicist Sapient has released its consumer banking 14 00:00:50,969 --> 00:00:55,260 Sean Aylmer: report 2024, which surveyed more than 5, 000 Australians from all 15 00:00:55,260 --> 00:00:57,780 Sean Aylmer: walks of life to find out how they interact with 16 00:00:57,780 --> 00:01:01,440 Sean Aylmer: their banks and what they expect in the future. Andrew Lam- Po- 17 00:01:01,440 --> 00:01:05,250 Sean Aylmer: Tang is the managing director of management consulting for Publicis 18 00:01:05,250 --> 00:01:07,769 Sean Aylmer: Sapient. Andrew, welcome to Fear and Greed. 19 00:01:08,099 --> 00:01:09,749 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: Thanks, Sean. Great to be here. 20 00:01:10,379 --> 00:01:12,750 Sean Aylmer: Looking at the report, one thing jumped out at me 21 00:01:12,750 --> 00:01:17,490 Sean Aylmer: straight away. Australians don't respect banks for their benefit to 22 00:01:17,490 --> 00:01:19,920 Sean Aylmer: society. In fact, banks came in at ninth out of 23 00:01:19,950 --> 00:01:24,870 Sean Aylmer: 13 industries. What is it about banks that we don't like? 24 00:01:25,620 --> 00:01:30,539 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: Apparently, a number of things. To be fair, people have 25 00:01:30,540 --> 00:01:33,900 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: both negative and positive perceptions of banks. On the positive 26 00:01:33,900 --> 00:01:37,980 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: side, they're seen as secure, 35, a third of people 27 00:01:37,980 --> 00:01:40,709 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: see them as responsible and also trustworthy. But on the 28 00:01:40,709 --> 00:01:45,389 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: flip side, over a third see banks as expensive and 29 00:01:45,480 --> 00:01:48,840 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: 23% see them as unaccountable. So I would say we 30 00:01:48,840 --> 00:01:50,880 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: have an ambivalent relationship with our banks. 31 00:01:51,990 --> 00:01:54,540 Sean Aylmer: Why are they unaccountable? That one surprised me. I mean, 32 00:01:54,540 --> 00:01:57,210 Sean Aylmer: expensive. I kind of get particularly when interest rates are 33 00:01:57,210 --> 00:01:59,940 Sean Aylmer: high. Unaccountable, that's an interesting one. 34 00:02:00,210 --> 00:02:04,590 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: So there's clues to this in their feelings and perceptions 35 00:02:04,590 --> 00:02:08,430 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: on changes since the Royal Commission, we asked people whether 36 00:02:08,430 --> 00:02:13,109 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: they'd seen any changes. 44% said they had seen either 37 00:02:13,200 --> 00:02:17,040 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: some real change or a degree of change, but 56% 38 00:02:17,160 --> 00:02:20,340 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: basically said they didn't think they'd seen any real change. 39 00:02:20,370 --> 00:02:25,470 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: And so one interpretation is that that is essentially sort 40 00:02:25,470 --> 00:02:26,970 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: of unaccountable behavior. 41 00:02:26,970 --> 00:02:30,090 Sean Aylmer: Okay. The technology at the disposal of the banks is 42 00:02:30,090 --> 00:02:35,130 Sean Aylmer: pretty incredible. Are they using it effectively to personalize services? 43 00:02:35,460 --> 00:02:37,529 Sean Aylmer: Are they doing enough? Is it what we expect? 44 00:02:38,340 --> 00:02:40,499 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: I think they're doing less than we expect in some 45 00:02:40,500 --> 00:02:45,150 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: instances. It is interesting that you refer to the personalization 46 00:02:45,150 --> 00:02:48,090 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: challenge. That's the first of the five big themes we've 47 00:02:48,090 --> 00:02:51,899 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: identified through the survey. Most people in fact expect some 48 00:02:51,900 --> 00:02:56,219 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: form of personalized service from the banks, but interestingly, that 49 00:02:56,219 --> 00:03:00,329 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: expectation actually correlates with people visiting a physical bank branch 50 00:03:00,330 --> 00:03:05,578 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: recently rather than their digital experience, which we found very surprising. 51 00:03:06,060 --> 00:03:08,280 Sean Aylmer: Okay, so you mentioned those five things. That's one. What 52 00:03:08,280 --> 00:03:08,909 Sean Aylmer: are the others? 53 00:03:09,690 --> 00:03:12,719 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: The other four themes are the evolving role of bank 54 00:03:12,719 --> 00:03:17,608 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: branches. So that's essentially thinking ahead from this physical digital 55 00:03:17,820 --> 00:03:22,260 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: dichotomy. We look at why people are visiting branches and 56 00:03:22,290 --> 00:03:24,990 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: what their expectations are around that. And that has a 57 00:03:24,990 --> 00:03:28,709 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: lot to do with cash, which again presents a really 58 00:03:28,710 --> 00:03:33,900 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: interesting insight into expectations versus behaviors. The third theme is 59 00:03:33,900 --> 00:03:37,530 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: around what we're regarding as the new experience frontier, which 60 00:03:37,530 --> 00:03:41,730 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: is really around scams and security. So all of us 61 00:03:41,730 --> 00:03:44,760 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: are living much more of our lives online, scams, fraud, 62 00:03:45,210 --> 00:03:48,509 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: identity theft, loom, loom, much, much larger. And so we 63 00:03:48,509 --> 00:03:52,289 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: were interested to understand how people thought about that and 64 00:03:52,289 --> 00:03:55,260 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: what their expectations of banks might be in the event 65 00:03:55,440 --> 00:03:59,610 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: of an attack. Cost of living crisis, fairly top of 66 00:03:59,610 --> 00:04:02,400 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: mind for the economy, and therefore a lot of people 67 00:04:02,400 --> 00:04:05,610 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: in the country. Now that's the fourth theme. And here 68 00:04:05,610 --> 00:04:09,389 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: we were just trying to understand what do people expect 69 00:04:09,389 --> 00:04:13,050 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: from their banks in this context? And again, we found 70 00:04:13,050 --> 00:04:17,460 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: some surprising results that even though we live in an 71 00:04:17,460 --> 00:04:20,518 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: age where we're trying to protect our personal data and 72 00:04:20,520 --> 00:04:26,460 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: privacy, most people, the vast majority of people actually believe 73 00:04:26,490 --> 00:04:30,029 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: the banks should be watching our data and being proactive 74 00:04:30,240 --> 00:04:33,480 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: in the event that detects the possibility of us falling 75 00:04:33,480 --> 00:04:37,320 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: into financial stress. Personally, I found that fascinating because it 76 00:04:37,380 --> 00:04:39,750 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: sort of flies in the face of people wanting to 77 00:04:40,290 --> 00:04:43,109 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: remain anonymous and protect their data. And then the last 78 00:04:43,110 --> 00:04:46,409 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: big theme, not surprisingly, the Green Horizon, and here we're 79 00:04:46,410 --> 00:04:50,010 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: just trying to understand what are people's expectations of their 80 00:04:50,010 --> 00:04:54,928 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: banks with respect to sustainability and particularly green products. And 81 00:04:54,930 --> 00:04:58,830 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: we were particularly interested in understanding whether people would put 82 00:04:58,830 --> 00:05:01,469 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: their money where their mouth is, so to speak, and 83 00:05:01,620 --> 00:05:05,669 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: express a commitment to buying green products. And in fact, 84 00:05:05,730 --> 00:05:07,020 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: possibly even paying more. 85 00:05:07,680 --> 00:05:09,540 Sean Aylmer: Stay with me, Andrew, we'll be back in a minute. 86 00:05:16,830 --> 00:05:19,618 Sean Aylmer: I'm speaking to Andrew Andrew Lam- Po- Tang, managing director of 87 00:05:19,620 --> 00:05:24,000 Sean Aylmer: management consulting for Publicis Sapient. So I'm going to take 88 00:05:24,000 --> 00:05:25,110 Sean Aylmer: a few of those, and I'm going to start from 89 00:05:25,110 --> 00:05:27,630 Sean Aylmer: the last one, green horizon. Will people put their money 90 00:05:27,630 --> 00:05:30,510 Sean Aylmer: where their mouth is and become greener? 91 00:05:31,650 --> 00:05:35,130 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: So a couple of things there. First level, 75% of 92 00:05:35,130 --> 00:05:38,549 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: Australians actually say they support a bank that is openly 93 00:05:38,549 --> 00:05:42,448 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: committed to green initiatives. Not withstanding some commentary around it 94 00:05:42,450 --> 00:05:45,270 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: has to be genuine and not greenwashing. So it's great 95 00:05:45,270 --> 00:05:48,540 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: to see that level of awareness. Only 40% of people 96 00:05:48,540 --> 00:05:51,779 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: say they'd actually be prepared to pay more for socially 97 00:05:51,839 --> 00:05:55,949 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: responsible products. But what is striking there is the divide 98 00:05:55,950 --> 00:05:58,920 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: between people who are either older or younger than 45 99 00:05:58,920 --> 00:06:03,029 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: years old. So if the respondent was under 45, well 100 00:06:03,029 --> 00:06:05,428 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: over 50% of people said they would be happy to 101 00:06:05,430 --> 00:06:08,428 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: pay more in the order of five to 10% more, 102 00:06:08,428 --> 00:06:09,870 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: which is substantial. 103 00:06:10,410 --> 00:06:13,620 Sean Aylmer: Yeah, that is substantial. Well, what about the new experience 104 00:06:13,620 --> 00:06:15,808 Sean Aylmer: frontier in the idea? I mean, are we asking a 105 00:06:15,809 --> 00:06:17,909 Sean Aylmer: little bit too much of the banks potentially? Because on 106 00:06:17,910 --> 00:06:20,460 Sean Aylmer: the one hand, we want to protect our data and 107 00:06:20,460 --> 00:06:23,609 Sean Aylmer: privacy, but we also want the banks to be looking 108 00:06:23,610 --> 00:06:25,380 Sean Aylmer: out for us as well. If I understand what you're 109 00:06:25,380 --> 00:06:27,539 Sean Aylmer: saying, it's kind of having your cake and eating it. 110 00:06:28,469 --> 00:06:31,919 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: So there's a really interesting dynamic happening in the market 111 00:06:31,920 --> 00:06:35,220 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: here. What we see through our data and also through 112 00:06:35,250 --> 00:06:39,270 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: recent ABS data, is that the number of people who 113 00:06:39,390 --> 00:06:43,680 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: report being subjected to some form of cyber attack has 114 00:06:43,680 --> 00:06:47,669 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: been increasing over time. But simultaneously, the number of people 115 00:06:47,670 --> 00:06:51,659 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: actually falling victim to those attacks is falling. And by 116 00:06:51,660 --> 00:06:55,710 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: some measures falling by half in the last few years. 117 00:06:56,220 --> 00:07:01,770 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: Where banks play in this area is because people rightly 118 00:07:02,160 --> 00:07:05,609 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: expect banks to look after their money and their information. 119 00:07:06,450 --> 00:07:10,349 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: Nearly 98% of customers have very high expectations of what 120 00:07:10,350 --> 00:07:13,560 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: banks should do if they happen to fall victim to 121 00:07:13,560 --> 00:07:18,450 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: a scam. And then what's really interesting is how people 122 00:07:18,450 --> 00:07:21,990 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: sort of rate that experience if in fact it happens. 123 00:07:22,080 --> 00:07:24,270 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: So we did ask the people who said they had 124 00:07:24,270 --> 00:07:27,269 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: fallen victim to a scam, whether they thought the banks 125 00:07:27,270 --> 00:07:31,170 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: were helpful in their response, 58% said they thought the 126 00:07:31,170 --> 00:07:34,500 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: banks were helpful, which means 42% did not, which is 127 00:07:34,620 --> 00:07:35,370 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: not a great number. 128 00:07:36,000 --> 00:07:38,999 Sean Aylmer: No, it surprises me somewhat though, because I think in 129 00:07:39,000 --> 00:07:41,729 Sean Aylmer: that area of security, the banks seem to lead the 130 00:07:41,730 --> 00:07:44,100 Sean Aylmer: way, and there are certainly products that are being touted 131 00:07:44,549 --> 00:07:47,099 Sean Aylmer: from some of the banks about helping in that area. 132 00:07:47,100 --> 00:07:49,290 Sean Aylmer: But if they don't have a reputation for being secure 133 00:07:49,290 --> 00:07:51,750 Sean Aylmer: or at least helping when scams hit, then that's going 134 00:07:51,750 --> 00:07:53,400 Sean Aylmer: to be a hard sell perhaps. 135 00:07:53,730 --> 00:07:57,239 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: Yes. No, and so you are talking about tools that 136 00:07:57,240 --> 00:08:01,799 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: are essentially around prevention, whereas what people were telling us 137 00:08:01,799 --> 00:08:06,059 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: was when they were in that terrible situation of having 138 00:08:06,059 --> 00:08:10,110 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: to contact their banks for help, that was where the 139 00:08:10,230 --> 00:08:12,060 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: banks really started to fall short. 140 00:08:12,600 --> 00:08:13,830 Sean Aylmer: And the other thing I just want to mention, you 141 00:08:13,830 --> 00:08:18,300 Sean Aylmer: mentioned branches and cash, use of cash. Well, banks, are 142 00:08:18,300 --> 00:08:22,799 Sean Aylmer: they moving too fast towards a more cashless society in 143 00:08:22,799 --> 00:08:24,209 Sean Aylmer: the minds of customers? 144 00:08:25,050 --> 00:08:29,160 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: Yes, but that opinion varies with age. So the older 145 00:08:29,160 --> 00:08:32,340 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: people are, the more strongly they have that belief, the 146 00:08:32,340 --> 00:08:34,530 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: younger people are, the less of an issue it is. 147 00:08:34,800 --> 00:08:38,160 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: And here's a really interesting dichotomy. The first thing that 148 00:08:38,160 --> 00:08:41,549 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: we saw that surprised me was 72% of people we 149 00:08:41,549 --> 00:08:43,679 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: surveyed said they had visited a branch in the last 150 00:08:43,679 --> 00:08:46,380 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: six months. That's a lot higher than I thought it 151 00:08:46,380 --> 00:08:50,400 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: would be. And clearly some of that is simply going 152 00:08:50,400 --> 00:08:52,470 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: to an ATM at a bank branch, right? 153 00:08:52,620 --> 00:08:52,980 Sean Aylmer: Right. 154 00:08:53,370 --> 00:08:56,189 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: When we ask people, what is it that you expect from 155 00:08:56,190 --> 00:09:00,029 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: a branch? The two out of the top three services 156 00:09:00,029 --> 00:09:04,708 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: were essentially cash handling, so withdrawals and deposits. And then 157 00:09:04,710 --> 00:09:07,590 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: when we said, " Okay, so if this is about cash, 158 00:09:07,980 --> 00:09:10,020 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: what is the role of cash in your life?" And 159 00:09:10,020 --> 00:09:13,979 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: this is where it starts to get interesting. 76% of 160 00:09:13,980 --> 00:09:18,239 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: people still carry cash around them, even though possibly a 161 00:09:18,270 --> 00:09:22,290 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: greater proportion actually use cards and digital wallets for payment. 162 00:09:23,340 --> 00:09:28,349 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: So there seems to be some psychological safety aspect to 163 00:09:28,349 --> 00:09:32,849 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: having cash on you, even though you may be one 164 00:09:32,849 --> 00:09:36,299 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: of, for example, the 53% who use cards and digital 165 00:09:36,300 --> 00:09:38,699 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: wallet almost exclusively for everyday payments. 166 00:09:39,179 --> 00:09:40,439 Sean Aylmer: Do you carry cash, Andrew? 167 00:09:41,340 --> 00:09:42,689 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: I do carry cash. 168 00:09:43,860 --> 00:09:45,689 Sean Aylmer: So Andrew and I have known each other for a while. 169 00:09:45,690 --> 00:09:48,960 Sean Aylmer: We worked at Fairfax together. And Andrew, in terms of 170 00:09:49,049 --> 00:09:52,768 Sean Aylmer: technology adoption, it's probably about three generations in front of 171 00:09:52,770 --> 00:09:55,800 Sean Aylmer: me, but I'm getting mine back here, Andrew. I haven't 172 00:09:55,800 --> 00:09:59,820 Sean Aylmer: carried cash in possibly years, certainly months and months and 173 00:09:59,820 --> 00:10:02,550 Sean Aylmer: months and months. And you do. Why do you carry cash? 174 00:10:03,450 --> 00:10:08,250 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: For exactly that reason that I suggested. You never know 175 00:10:08,250 --> 00:10:10,799 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: when you're going to need it. And more importantly, there 176 00:10:10,799 --> 00:10:13,439 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: are still a surprising number of people who've experienced a 177 00:10:13,439 --> 00:10:16,588 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: service outage while trying to pay with a card or 178 00:10:16,590 --> 00:10:19,290 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: a digital wallet. So I think there is an element 179 00:10:19,290 --> 00:10:21,330 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: of better to be safe than sorry. 180 00:10:21,599 --> 00:10:23,670 Sean Aylmer: Okay. Just the final thing we haven't, we better touch 181 00:10:23,670 --> 00:10:26,369 Sean Aylmer: on, we're out of time, but the cost of living. Are banks seem to be 182 00:10:26,370 --> 00:10:28,530 Sean Aylmer: in touch with the pressures on customers at the moment? 183 00:10:29,429 --> 00:10:34,050 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: That's a really good question. I'm not sure. What we 184 00:10:34,050 --> 00:10:38,370 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: do know is that customers, again, in this area, similar 185 00:10:38,370 --> 00:10:42,900 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: to scams and security, have a very high expectation of 186 00:10:43,230 --> 00:10:48,029 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: how banks should help people address early signs of financial 187 00:10:48,119 --> 00:10:53,790 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: stress. So basically, 96% of people when we ask them, 188 00:10:53,790 --> 00:10:55,860 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: could come up with at least one way that a 189 00:10:55,860 --> 00:10:59,940 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: bank could be looking at your personal transaction data and 190 00:10:59,940 --> 00:11:03,270 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: determining whether or not you might be falling into imminent 191 00:11:03,270 --> 00:11:06,929 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: financial stress. So the examples they raised was, if I 192 00:11:06,958 --> 00:11:08,970 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: missed a payment on a credit card or a loan, 193 00:11:09,510 --> 00:11:13,230 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: if I experienced job loss or some dramatic income reduction, 194 00:11:13,559 --> 00:11:17,640 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: or whether my overdraft is unusually high, or I experience 195 00:11:17,910 --> 00:11:23,369 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: some unusual insufficient funds payment transactions. So 96% of people 196 00:11:23,369 --> 00:11:27,210 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: say if one of those signs appears, a bank should 197 00:11:27,210 --> 00:11:30,090 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: detect that and do something about it. 198 00:11:30,929 --> 00:11:34,469 Sean Aylmer: It's kind of interesting the role of banks in society. 199 00:11:34,469 --> 00:11:38,460 Sean Aylmer: So I'm moving off from the survey, but the whole 200 00:11:38,460 --> 00:11:42,689 Sean Aylmer: concept that people see banks as a utility and they have 201 00:11:42,690 --> 00:11:44,820 Sean Aylmer: a privileged place in our lives because we all need 202 00:11:44,820 --> 00:11:48,030 Sean Aylmer: a bank. But some of these results are suggesting that 203 00:11:48,090 --> 00:11:50,939 Sean Aylmer: people see it as a kind of, I've got to 204 00:11:50,940 --> 00:11:53,250 Sean Aylmer: say quasi governance, it's probably pushing it too far, but 205 00:11:53,429 --> 00:11:56,219 Sean Aylmer: a utility that's got a responsibility to us as opposed 206 00:11:56,219 --> 00:11:57,810 Sean Aylmer: to a listed company on the ASX. 207 00:11:58,590 --> 00:12:01,620 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: I think people have very high expectations of the banks, and 208 00:12:01,620 --> 00:12:04,650 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: I think that's a direct result of how intimately they're 209 00:12:04,650 --> 00:12:08,460 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: involved in our modern lives. They see every transaction we 210 00:12:08,460 --> 00:12:12,780 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: make. I think intuitively people understand that is a tremendous 211 00:12:12,780 --> 00:12:16,199 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: amount of insight that is an intimate look into people's 212 00:12:16,199 --> 00:12:20,309 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: lives. And I think for better or for worse, people 213 00:12:20,309 --> 00:12:23,490 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: have very high expectations of banks as a result. 214 00:12:24,450 --> 00:12:26,490 Sean Aylmer: Andrew, thank you for talking to Fear and Greed. 215 00:12:26,880 --> 00:12:27,750 Andrew Lam-Po-Tang: Thanks for having me Sean. 216 00:12:28,050 --> 00:12:31,020 Sean Aylmer: That was Andrew Lam- Po- Tang, managing director of management 217 00:12:31,020 --> 00:12:34,919 Sean Aylmer: consulting for Publicis Sapient. This is the Fear and Greed 218 00:12:34,920 --> 00:12:37,410 Sean Aylmer: business interview. Join us every morning for the full episode 219 00:12:37,410 --> 00:12:39,630 Sean Aylmer: of Fear and Greed, daily business news for people who 220 00:12:39,630 --> 00:12:42,450 Sean Aylmer: make their own decisions. I'm Sean Aylmer. Enjoy your day.