1 00:00:03,800 --> 00:00:06,380 Sean Aylmer: Welcome to the Fear and Greed daily interview, I'm Sean 2 00:00:06,410 --> 00:00:08,730 Sean Aylmer: Aylmer. I reckon we are going to hear a lot 3 00:00:08,730 --> 00:00:12,260 Sean Aylmer: about deals involving companies specializing in the metaverse and today's 4 00:00:12,260 --> 00:00:15,880 Sean Aylmer: guest is a local example of that. Perth- based digital 5 00:00:15,880 --> 00:00:20,560 Sean Aylmer: marketing business, Be Media is being acquired by Animoca Brands, 6 00:00:20,739 --> 00:00:25,090 Sean Aylmer: a $ 5 billion Metaverse unicorn described as the global leader 7 00:00:25,090 --> 00:00:29,670 Sean Aylmer: in digital entertainment, blockchain, and gamification. Following the acquisition Be 8 00:00:29,720 --> 00:00:32,989 Sean Aylmer: Media is going to manage joint ventures with Australian brands, 9 00:00:33,320 --> 00:00:37,760 Sean Aylmer: wanting to get involved in the Metaverse and NFTs. What 10 00:00:37,760 --> 00:00:40,229 Sean Aylmer: exactly does that all mean? Well, let's find out Jordan 11 00:00:40,229 --> 00:00:44,360 Sean Aylmer: Fogarty is the founder and CEO of Be Media Jordan, 12 00:00:44,420 --> 00:00:45,490 Sean Aylmer: welcome to Fear and Greed. 13 00:00:45,860 --> 00:00:46,600 Jordan Fogarty: Thanks for having me. 14 00:00:47,070 --> 00:00:51,280 Sean Aylmer: Now, lots to get my head around here. I want to get 15 00:00:51,280 --> 00:00:54,560 Sean Aylmer: definitions also. I mean, get your view of Metaverse NFTs, non- 16 00:00:54,560 --> 00:00:57,280 Sean Aylmer: fungible tokens, but first of all, what exactly does Be 17 00:00:57,380 --> 00:01:00,010 Sean Aylmer: Media do, B- E Media do? 18 00:01:00,420 --> 00:01:04,610 Jordan Fogarty: Yeah, so Be Media, we started eight years ago in the Web 1. 19 00:01:04,610 --> 00:01:08,750 Jordan Fogarty: 0 Space, which was, search and a lot of desktop 20 00:01:08,750 --> 00:01:11,270 Jordan Fogarty: usage, and then evolved into Web 2. 0, doing a 21 00:01:11,270 --> 00:01:16,610 Jordan Fogarty: lot of social and mobile advertising and projects. So, now's 22 00:01:16,610 --> 00:01:19,170 Jordan Fogarty: the next step of the journey as we evolve into 23 00:01:19,500 --> 00:01:22,059 Jordan Fogarty: the Web 3. 0 Space of the Metaverse and all 24 00:01:22,060 --> 00:01:22,569 Jordan Fogarty: that fun. 25 00:01:23,010 --> 00:01:27,780 Sean Aylmer: Okay, we'll get there in a moment. Animoca Brands, it's A- N- I- M- O- C- 26 00:01:27,780 --> 00:01:30,330 Sean Aylmer: A, Animoca Brands. Tell us about them. 27 00:01:31,510 --> 00:01:35,990 Jordan Fogarty: Amazing story. Four, five years ago was a small gaming 28 00:01:35,990 --> 00:01:39,319 Jordan Fogarty: business and then made some, the founder Yat made some 29 00:01:39,319 --> 00:01:45,150 Jordan Fogarty: incredible, investments in the very early space of this whole 30 00:01:45,370 --> 00:01:49,850 Jordan Fogarty: NFT Metaverse zone. If you like some projects, Crypto Kitties, 31 00:01:49,850 --> 00:01:52,350 Jordan Fogarty: and some other amazing projects which are now some of 32 00:01:52,510 --> 00:01:56,200 Jordan Fogarty: the top 10 businesses and projects in this whole space. 33 00:01:56,500 --> 00:02:02,020 Jordan Fogarty: So, it's primarily a gaming, blockchain gaming business and works 34 00:02:02,020 --> 00:02:04,540 Jordan Fogarty: with a lot of, we call it IP, you would 35 00:02:04,610 --> 00:02:08,660 Jordan Fogarty: know that as different brands like can work with Marvel and Formula 1 36 00:02:08,660 --> 00:02:13,160 Jordan Fogarty: and MotoGP, a lot of these different intellectual property to 37 00:02:13,160 --> 00:02:15,480 Jordan Fogarty: help bring them into the blockchain space. 38 00:02:15,910 --> 00:02:19,760 Sean Aylmer: Okay, so when you're talking about getting brands getting involved 39 00:02:19,850 --> 00:02:25,079 Sean Aylmer: into the Metaverse and NFTs, whereabouts is that up to 40 00:02:25,080 --> 00:02:28,410 Sean Aylmer: firstly, let's explain the Metaverse. I've tried that many times, 41 00:02:28,919 --> 00:02:34,970 Sean Aylmer: particularly quoting Mark Zuckerberg really, but explain to us what the Metaverse is. You're going to be better than me. 42 00:02:35,460 --> 00:02:37,880 Jordan Fogarty: So I think a really nice way to explain it is we're 43 00:02:37,880 --> 00:02:42,590 Jordan Fogarty: so used to being on the Internet. So on our mobiles, on 44 00:02:42,600 --> 00:02:46,250 Jordan Fogarty: desktop, it's really the next evolution of the Internet, where it'll 45 00:02:46,430 --> 00:02:49,310 Jordan Fogarty: be a really immersive experience where we'll actually be in 46 00:02:49,310 --> 00:02:51,639 Jordan Fogarty: the Internet, is a really nice way, I think, to 47 00:02:51,639 --> 00:02:55,660 Jordan Fogarty: explain it, try and start to wrap your head around 48 00:02:55,660 --> 00:02:57,800 Jordan Fogarty: how it's, how it's going to be different in terms 49 00:02:57,800 --> 00:02:59,570 Jordan Fogarty: of our like actual interaction with it. 50 00:02:59,570 --> 00:03:01,300 Sean Aylmer: Yeah, the way I kind of think about it is 51 00:03:01,300 --> 00:03:03,730 Sean Aylmer: that I live in my own community and I'm physically, 52 00:03:04,120 --> 00:03:06,519 Sean Aylmer: know the coffee shop owner and know the newsagent and 53 00:03:06,520 --> 00:03:09,119 Sean Aylmer: et cetera, et cetera. And the Metaverse is actually taking 54 00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:12,570 Sean Aylmer: my persona and however I want that to be, and 55 00:03:12,570 --> 00:03:16,220 Sean Aylmer: whether you are gaming or anything else, actually being that 56 00:03:16,220 --> 00:03:20,070 Sean Aylmer: same person within that Metaverse, universe, sort of things, how 57 00:03:20,070 --> 00:03:20,690 Sean Aylmer: I think about it. 58 00:03:21,270 --> 00:03:24,230 Jordan Fogarty: Absolutely. Imagine watching a football game with three of your 59 00:03:24,230 --> 00:03:26,769 Jordan Fogarty: best mates; you're in Sydney, one of them is in 60 00:03:26,770 --> 00:03:29,110 Jordan Fogarty: Miami, one of them is in London, and you're sitting there 61 00:03:29,110 --> 00:03:34,700 Jordan Fogarty: together watching the game, experiencing it, chatting, sharing things between 62 00:03:34,700 --> 00:03:38,000 Jordan Fogarty: each other. That's what this technology can do. 63 00:03:38,890 --> 00:03:41,619 Sean Aylmer: Okay, and then NFTs is the other part of this, non- 64 00:03:41,620 --> 00:03:45,380 Sean Aylmer: fungible tokens. So perhaps your explanation first, then I'll give 65 00:03:45,880 --> 00:03:46,410 Sean Aylmer: you mine. 66 00:03:47,580 --> 00:03:50,140 Jordan Fogarty: So, I think it's good with these things to go 67 00:03:50,140 --> 00:03:54,540 Jordan Fogarty: to sort of a real- world application. So NFTs a real entry 68 00:03:54,540 --> 00:03:57,460 Jordan Fogarty: point to the Metaverse, non- fungible token. All it means 69 00:03:57,460 --> 00:04:00,760 Jordan Fogarty: is, think of it like a digital receipt. So finally, this 70 00:04:00,760 --> 00:04:03,910 Jordan Fogarty: gives you an opportunity through this amazing blockchain technology to 71 00:04:03,910 --> 00:04:08,050 Jordan Fogarty: actually own your own digital assets online. Now, it's quite 72 00:04:08,220 --> 00:04:11,120 Jordan Fogarty: a unique point because we are actually not used to 73 00:04:11,120 --> 00:04:14,700 Jordan Fogarty: the fact that the big tech titans have owned all 74 00:04:14,700 --> 00:04:17,300 Jordan Fogarty: of our assets. So we haven't been really owning everything; 75 00:04:17,300 --> 00:04:21,219 Jordan Fogarty: every Facebook post or post you've done online, have all been owned 76 00:04:21,220 --> 00:04:23,940 Jordan Fogarty: by the platforms, the data, they own the data, they 77 00:04:24,880 --> 00:04:27,839 Jordan Fogarty: own that content. So non- fungible tokens are an amazing 78 00:04:27,839 --> 00:04:31,210 Jordan Fogarty: way where you can actually, through the blockchain have verified 79 00:04:31,450 --> 00:04:35,250 Jordan Fogarty: ownership of any items. And that can go from, the 80 00:04:35,260 --> 00:04:40,260 Jordan Fogarty: people NFTing real estate it's through to sporting merchandiser even 81 00:04:40,260 --> 00:04:46,839 Jordan Fogarty: moments, it's really artwork, almost anything can be made into 82 00:04:46,839 --> 00:04:47,810 Jordan Fogarty: a non- fungible token. 83 00:04:48,300 --> 00:04:52,270 Sean Aylmer: Yeah, okay. And I mean, and were actually seeing brands, I think Qantas recently, 84 00:04:52,620 --> 00:04:54,489 Sean Aylmer: pushing into that whole space. 85 00:04:55,550 --> 00:05:00,170 Jordan Fogarty: Yeah. Exciting one this morning, the AFL has just launched 86 00:05:00,170 --> 00:05:04,070 Jordan Fogarty: a five- year partnership with footy in Australia to bring 87 00:05:04,070 --> 00:05:08,620 Jordan Fogarty: some of the best moments of the game. You think of Buddy's 88 00:05:08,620 --> 00:05:12,410 Jordan Fogarty: 1000th goal that incredible, experience in everyone running out onto 89 00:05:12,410 --> 00:05:16,039 Jordan Fogarty: the field. You know, will actually give fans the opportunity 90 00:05:16,040 --> 00:05:20,940 Jordan Fogarty: to own that piece of property and, leverage and have 91 00:05:20,940 --> 00:05:24,310 Jordan Fogarty: the upside that value appreciation, and really be able to 92 00:05:25,500 --> 00:05:30,650 Jordan Fogarty: actually be more involved with their ownership of this amazing game that we love 93 00:05:30,650 --> 00:05:31,210 Jordan Fogarty: in Australia. 94 00:05:31,580 --> 00:05:35,250 Sean Aylmer: Yeah. I mean, the way I think about that is someone owns a great 95 00:05:35,250 --> 00:05:39,010 Sean Aylmer: piece of art. The Louvre owns the Mona Lisa, lots 96 00:05:39,010 --> 00:05:41,880 Sean Aylmer: of people can copy it, but there's actually one original 97 00:05:41,910 --> 00:05:45,760 Sean Aylmer: only and that's in the Louvre in Paris. It's kind 98 00:05:45,760 --> 00:05:49,020 Sean Aylmer: of the same if in my Metaverse I own an 99 00:05:49,020 --> 00:05:53,039 Sean Aylmer: NFT, which is a Buddy Memorial kicking the goal or 100 00:05:53,040 --> 00:05:56,039 Sean Aylmer: whatever happens to be, or I'd prefer the, what happened 101 00:05:56,040 --> 00:05:57,320 Sean Aylmer: afterwards of the crowd running on perhaps. 102 00:05:57,320 --> 00:05:58,110 Jordan Fogarty: Yeah, totally. 103 00:05:59,779 --> 00:06:02,500 Sean Aylmer: But that's mine and so, I mean, others obviously kind of know about it 104 00:06:03,060 --> 00:06:05,400 Sean Aylmer: and see it and that, but I literally own it. And there's a 105 00:06:05,920 --> 00:06:07,050 Sean Aylmer: definitely a value in that. 106 00:06:07,730 --> 00:06:10,150 Jordan Fogarty: Absolutely people go, " oh, it's just a right- click. You 107 00:06:10,150 --> 00:06:12,429 Jordan Fogarty: know, it's a JPEG, what's the value in that?" It's 108 00:06:12,430 --> 00:06:16,010 Jordan Fogarty: sort of like, well, what about this $ 50 million, bit of art 109 00:06:16,070 --> 00:06:18,839 Jordan Fogarty: on the wall? You know, like if there's a fire 110 00:06:18,839 --> 00:06:21,250 Jordan Fogarty: or anything happens or it gets stolen, like this is 111 00:06:21,680 --> 00:06:24,909 Jordan Fogarty: a bit of culture, whether it's art or sporting moment 112 00:06:24,910 --> 00:06:27,710 Jordan Fogarty: or whatever it might be. And you've got verified ownership 113 00:06:27,750 --> 00:06:29,960 Jordan Fogarty: of that on the blockchain, you can show people it 114 00:06:29,960 --> 00:06:31,450 Jordan Fogarty: in your wallet, you can be at the pub, you 115 00:06:31,450 --> 00:06:33,830 Jordan Fogarty: can pull out your wallet and actually show them that 116 00:06:33,860 --> 00:06:36,620 Jordan Fogarty: NFT, that bit of art, that moment, have all those 117 00:06:36,620 --> 00:06:40,360 Jordan Fogarty: bragging rights, but also feel that ownership and it's quite 118 00:06:40,360 --> 00:06:42,990 Jordan Fogarty: subjective isn't it? You know, we all have different tastes and different 119 00:06:43,330 --> 00:06:43,700 Jordan Fogarty: things that we like. 120 00:06:44,870 --> 00:06:53,289 Sean Aylmer: Stay with me Jordan. We'll be back in a minute. My 121 00:06:53,290 --> 00:06:56,810 Sean Aylmer: guest this morning is Jordan Fogarty, founder and CEO of 122 00:06:56,810 --> 00:07:00,700 Sean Aylmer: BE media. So what's the appetite from companies wanting to 123 00:07:00,700 --> 00:07:03,710 Sean Aylmer: get involved in the Metaverse and NFTS, what are they 124 00:07:03,710 --> 00:07:04,870 Sean Aylmer: actually wanting to do? 125 00:07:05,560 --> 00:07:11,100 Jordan Fogarty: Well, it's a great question. There's two parts to that. The first part, the appetite is incredible, like 126 00:07:11,100 --> 00:07:15,200 Jordan Fogarty: nothing I've ever seen before. And the interesting, another layer to 127 00:07:15,200 --> 00:07:18,890 Jordan Fogarty: that is they just know they damn well need to 128 00:07:18,890 --> 00:07:23,110 Jordan Fogarty: be doing something, but they don't necessarily know what. And 129 00:07:23,140 --> 00:07:26,900 Jordan Fogarty: there's a lot of buzzwords, Metaverse is a buzzword and 130 00:07:26,900 --> 00:07:30,870 Jordan Fogarty: crypto, and blockchain and they're going, I think the real 131 00:07:30,870 --> 00:07:33,240 Jordan Fogarty: goal of them is going, " how do we provide a 132 00:07:33,240 --> 00:07:39,290 Jordan Fogarty: more immersive brand experience and connection with our customers or, 133 00:07:39,290 --> 00:07:43,739 Jordan Fogarty: users?" which this space is literally unparalleled. An example of 134 00:07:43,740 --> 00:07:46,250 Jordan Fogarty: that, in the fashion space, which is an area we've got 135 00:07:46,520 --> 00:07:49,600 Jordan Fogarty: a particular focus on, as well as sport, we're looking 136 00:07:49,600 --> 00:07:53,440 Jordan Fogarty: at doing runway shows where, you can have someone walking 137 00:07:53,440 --> 00:07:56,420 Jordan Fogarty: down the catwalk in Miami, in Sydney, in London, in 138 00:07:56,420 --> 00:07:58,820 Jordan Fogarty: Prague, if you like, and you're watching this in the 139 00:07:58,820 --> 00:08:02,400 Jordan Fogarty: metaverse of real models coming down and really, being able 140 00:08:02,400 --> 00:08:07,160 Jordan Fogarty: to buy directly off the runway, and it's the creative 141 00:08:07,160 --> 00:08:09,270 Jordan Fogarty: and artwork you can put around that, we're in the 142 00:08:09,270 --> 00:08:11,330 Jordan Fogarty: Metaverse, right. We're not in a virtual world. So we don't have, those normal, real-world 143 00:08:13,990 --> 00:08:17,090 Jordan Fogarty: constraints of how creative the creatives can be here. 144 00:08:17,730 --> 00:08:20,060 Sean Aylmer: Yeah. And I mean, what you just said, then there's a business 145 00:08:20,060 --> 00:08:23,560 Sean Aylmer: strategy behind this, this isn't just getting into it because 146 00:08:24,180 --> 00:08:27,800 Sean Aylmer: everyone is into it. There's actually a way of selling 147 00:08:27,800 --> 00:08:33,829 Sean Aylmer: clothes in this instance globally, which is far, far, touches, 148 00:08:33,830 --> 00:08:36,609 Sean Aylmer: far, far more people than they could ever do in 149 00:08:36,610 --> 00:08:37,390 Sean Aylmer: the physical world. 150 00:08:39,750 --> 00:08:44,010 Jordan Fogarty: And that's what we really recommend. You know, you hit the nail on the head. It's like anything, having a plan and 151 00:08:44,070 --> 00:08:47,160 Jordan Fogarty: a strategy and a why you are doing something. You 152 00:08:47,160 --> 00:08:49,059 Jordan Fogarty: don't want to just go in. We see people doing 153 00:08:49,059 --> 00:08:52,070 Jordan Fogarty: this, they just go in and host something random in 154 00:08:52,070 --> 00:08:55,970 Jordan Fogarty: some Metaverse space and, it's got no one there, or 155 00:08:55,970 --> 00:08:57,650 Jordan Fogarty: no one comes or no one shows up. It's like 156 00:08:58,640 --> 00:09:00,760 Jordan Fogarty: if you just put a random popup out in the 157 00:09:00,760 --> 00:09:03,140 Jordan Fogarty: desert, would you expect people to rock up there? You 158 00:09:03,140 --> 00:09:06,350 Jordan Fogarty: know, you've got to have that real planning and strategy 159 00:09:06,350 --> 00:09:08,420 Jordan Fogarty: and thought behind it to succeed. 160 00:09:09,210 --> 00:09:11,699 Sean Aylmer: At the moment, is it a space where there is 161 00:09:11,700 --> 00:09:15,840 Sean Aylmer: still first-mover advantage? I could imagine eventually it will be 162 00:09:15,840 --> 00:09:21,630 Sean Aylmer: extremely crowded, but outside some aficionados of it, I'd say 163 00:09:21,630 --> 00:09:23,340 Sean Aylmer: the majority of people don't know a lot about it. 164 00:09:23,340 --> 00:09:25,230 Sean Aylmer: So is there a first move advantage potentially? 165 00:09:25,790 --> 00:09:28,599 Jordan Fogarty: I think there is absolutely a first- mover advantage, and 166 00:09:28,600 --> 00:09:30,800 Jordan Fogarty: I think it's going to come back to brands that 167 00:09:30,840 --> 00:09:33,940 Jordan Fogarty: have been successful in the past truly are looking to 168 00:09:33,940 --> 00:09:39,470 Jordan Fogarty: add a really new, unique, and valuable experience to their 169 00:09:39,700 --> 00:09:44,620 Jordan Fogarty: fans or customers that can be meaningful and they can connect 170 00:09:44,620 --> 00:09:46,540 Jordan Fogarty: a lot more deeply. You know, social media was a 171 00:09:46,540 --> 00:09:50,090 Jordan Fogarty: great evolution of how brands could connect with their users 172 00:09:50,090 --> 00:09:52,720 Jordan Fogarty: and customers and start that dialogue and conversation. A lot 173 00:09:52,720 --> 00:09:54,970 Jordan Fogarty: of people were terrified when Facebook came out, we're not 174 00:09:55,179 --> 00:09:57,880 Jordan Fogarty: sending up a Facebook page. We're not doing that. We're not 175 00:09:57,880 --> 00:10:00,200 Jordan Fogarty: used to it. This is just that next evolution where 176 00:10:00,200 --> 00:10:03,429 Jordan Fogarty: brands are going to need to think. And yeah, eventually 177 00:10:03,429 --> 00:10:07,090 Jordan Fogarty: it will become like anything. It will become busy and 178 00:10:07,090 --> 00:10:10,280 Jordan Fogarty: a lot more noise. So yeah, I definitely think it's a lot of first- 179 00:10:10,960 --> 00:10:11,569 Jordan Fogarty: mover advantage. 180 00:10:11,960 --> 00:10:15,100 Sean Aylmer: And, so in terms of BE Media, you're kind of 181 00:10:15,100 --> 00:10:19,410 Sean Aylmer: there to hold brands hands as they go into this world. 182 00:10:19,990 --> 00:10:23,090 Jordan Fogarty: Yeah, absolutely. You know, we've got a strategy team, a 183 00:10:23,090 --> 00:10:29,510 Jordan Fogarty: product development team, blockchain development, creative, 3D designers. All the 184 00:10:29,510 --> 00:10:32,679 Jordan Fogarty: elements and act project managers, account managers, all the old 185 00:10:32,679 --> 00:10:36,900 Jordan Fogarty: school business practices apply just as much here. And you know what, if 186 00:10:36,900 --> 00:10:40,530 Jordan Fogarty: anything, and conversation with my team in recent weeks and 187 00:10:40,530 --> 00:10:45,380 Jordan Fogarty: months is we need our core business principles, practices of strategy, 188 00:10:45,380 --> 00:10:49,969 Jordan Fogarty: planning, approach, as more than ever in this environment because 189 00:10:50,190 --> 00:10:54,040 Jordan Fogarty: our clients and partners are so new for them. 190 00:10:54,540 --> 00:10:59,470 Sean Aylmer: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Congratulations first on starting Be Media, but also 191 00:10:59,470 --> 00:11:03,580 Sean Aylmer: being acquired by Animoca Brands. You have a really interesting 192 00:11:03,830 --> 00:11:09,309 Sean Aylmer: story though. Like you had a, sort of a near- death experience and then you started 193 00:11:09,309 --> 00:11:12,689 Sean Aylmer: BE Media and, you were very motivated by that experience. 194 00:11:13,809 --> 00:11:17,440 Jordan Fogarty: Yeah, it was a, yeah I was... The short version, 195 00:11:17,620 --> 00:11:22,980 Jordan Fogarty: 140 kilometers, front left passenger side, into a tree, airlifted 196 00:11:22,980 --> 00:11:25,500 Jordan Fogarty: back in a coma for six or seven days, told 197 00:11:25,500 --> 00:11:29,060 Jordan Fogarty: by the doctor: " you're not going to walk again. You're 198 00:11:29,179 --> 00:11:31,089 Jordan Fogarty: not going back to uni. Your life's never going to be the same." 199 00:11:31,750 --> 00:11:34,530 Jordan Fogarty: And luckily I had that sort of I'll show you 200 00:11:34,610 --> 00:11:38,990 Jordan Fogarty: energy and did go back to studying, finished that. And 201 00:11:38,990 --> 00:11:41,370 Jordan Fogarty: just I think it really lit a fire. That's like, 202 00:11:42,090 --> 00:11:46,100 Jordan Fogarty: it sounds cliche, but it was like, take action and seize the day 203 00:11:46,530 --> 00:11:49,710 Jordan Fogarty: for one of a better word. And that's when I 204 00:11:49,710 --> 00:11:52,640 Jordan Fogarty: went out and started BE Media, at the right age 205 00:11:52,640 --> 00:11:55,500 Jordan Fogarty: of 23 at that age I obviously thought I knew everything 206 00:11:55,500 --> 00:11:55,851 Jordan Fogarty: like we all do. 207 00:11:55,851 --> 00:11:58,060 Sean Aylmer: Oh, you did, you did, what are you talking about? 208 00:11:58,060 --> 00:12:02,140 Jordan Fogarty: Oh yeah, I did. I did. I knew everything back then now. And then you realize how little you do 209 00:12:02,140 --> 00:12:05,699 Jordan Fogarty: know. And that was an amazing experience because it was 210 00:12:06,210 --> 00:12:10,300 Jordan Fogarty: very painful, but it also... I think it was like I started to feel, " 211 00:12:10,300 --> 00:12:13,240 Jordan Fogarty: Hey, if I can get through that. Surely, how hard 212 00:12:13,240 --> 00:12:15,110 Jordan Fogarty: could this be? Or this be?" So I probably had a 213 00:12:15,110 --> 00:12:17,500 Jordan Fogarty: beautiful naivety behind me. 214 00:12:18,809 --> 00:12:20,480 Sean Aylmer: Yeah. But, in a sense, getting through that, you were sort 215 00:12:20,480 --> 00:12:24,240 Sean Aylmer: of pushing beyond the limit a bit, and in many 216 00:12:24,240 --> 00:12:28,400 Sean Aylmer: ways, for many businesses pushing into the Metaverse and getting 217 00:12:28,400 --> 00:12:31,260 Sean Aylmer: involved in NFTs is pushing beyond, well, certainly beyond their 218 00:12:31,260 --> 00:12:32,640 Sean Aylmer: comfort zone. That's for sure. 219 00:12:33,130 --> 00:12:37,310 Jordan Fogarty: Yeah. I think it's... I've found like it's on the 220 00:12:37,320 --> 00:12:39,609 Jordan Fogarty: other side of the... Generally the hardest things I think 221 00:12:39,610 --> 00:12:42,270 Jordan Fogarty: any business owners listening right now, you have those sleepless 222 00:12:42,270 --> 00:12:46,059 Jordan Fogarty: nights, you have those times where you just want to give up, you have those times where you think it's all 223 00:12:46,059 --> 00:12:48,890 Jordan Fogarty: a mess and you've made a terrible decision. And then 224 00:12:48,890 --> 00:12:51,839 Jordan Fogarty: you persist and you push through and a month later, 225 00:12:51,840 --> 00:12:53,980 Jordan Fogarty: or six months later, you sign that epic deal or 226 00:12:54,090 --> 00:12:57,199 Jordan Fogarty: something happens, and then you're on the rollercoaster ride of " I'm killing 227 00:12:57,200 --> 00:12:58,959 Jordan Fogarty: it, I'm on top of the world". And that's the 228 00:12:58,960 --> 00:13:00,809 Jordan Fogarty: ups and downs of the journey. 229 00:13:01,200 --> 00:13:04,831 Sean Aylmer: Mm Jordan, thank you for talking to Fear and Greed. 230 00:13:04,831 --> 00:13:05,240 Jordan Fogarty: Really appreciate it. Thanks a lot. 231 00:13:05,970 --> 00:13:09,929 Sean Aylmer: Jordan Fogarty, founder and CEO of BE Media. This is 232 00:13:09,929 --> 00:13:12,209 Sean Aylmer: the Fear and Greed daily interview. Join us every morning 233 00:13:12,210 --> 00:13:14,720 Sean Aylmer: for the full episode of Fear and Greed, Australia's most 234 00:13:14,720 --> 00:13:18,230 Sean Aylmer: popular business podcast. I'm Sean Aylmer, enjoy your day.