1 00:00:02,600 --> 00:00:05,040 Speaker 1: From the newsroom and news still come to day. 2 00:00:07,600 --> 00:00:10,960 Speaker 2: Hello, I'm Emily Waterson, and I'm keeping Bucky seat warm 3 00:00:11,000 --> 00:00:12,760 Speaker 2: while he's away. Not that he has much of a 4 00:00:12,800 --> 00:00:15,680 Speaker 2: say in the matter anyway. We've got so many news 5 00:00:15,680 --> 00:00:17,800 Speaker 2: stories on news dot com dot au at the moment, 6 00:00:17,840 --> 00:00:20,120 Speaker 2: but one of the ones that's really got the newsroom 7 00:00:20,160 --> 00:00:24,480 Speaker 2: talking is the new Netflix series Adolescence. The show follows 8 00:00:24,520 --> 00:00:27,840 Speaker 2: the unsettling story of a thirteen year old boys social 9 00:00:27,880 --> 00:00:31,080 Speaker 2: media fueled killing of a female classmate, and well, it's 10 00:00:31,160 --> 00:00:34,120 Speaker 2: exposed parents to a whole new dialect they weren't aware of. 11 00:00:35,400 --> 00:00:38,879 Speaker 1: Can we talk about it? Adolescents? Great mini series on Netflix. 12 00:00:38,920 --> 00:00:41,879 Speaker 3: Go watch it. Omboy who kills a young girl? I 13 00:00:41,960 --> 00:00:43,879 Speaker 3: read an article in the paper. It was about a 14 00:00:43,880 --> 00:00:46,320 Speaker 3: young boy who stabbed the young girls to death. You know, 15 00:00:47,880 --> 00:00:50,400 Speaker 3: you hate my heart, And I just think what kind 16 00:00:50,440 --> 00:00:52,280 Speaker 3: of a society we're living in at the moment where 17 00:00:52,320 --> 00:00:54,400 Speaker 3: young boys are stubbing young girls. 18 00:00:54,720 --> 00:00:56,880 Speaker 1: As a father, I'm completely wrecked. 19 00:00:57,400 --> 00:00:59,360 Speaker 4: This story didn't just hit close to harm. 20 00:00:59,440 --> 00:01:00,880 Speaker 3: It tour rate through it. 21 00:01:01,680 --> 00:01:04,960 Speaker 2: The hit show has revealed that some emojis might seem 22 00:01:05,000 --> 00:01:08,200 Speaker 2: innocent at first, but there's sometimes being used to communicate 23 00:01:08,240 --> 00:01:12,240 Speaker 2: a deeper, darker message among young people. To really break 24 00:01:12,280 --> 00:01:14,280 Speaker 2: this down, I thought i'd speak to news dot com 25 00:01:14,280 --> 00:01:25,319 Speaker 2: Dot Au journalist Claudia Popowski to unpack these hidden messages. Hi, Claudia, 26 00:01:25,400 --> 00:01:28,320 Speaker 2: thanks for joining me. And so you've done a bit 27 00:01:28,319 --> 00:01:30,600 Speaker 2: of a deep dive on news dot com about the 28 00:01:30,640 --> 00:01:34,120 Speaker 2: new hit show Adolescents. Before we get right into that, 29 00:01:34,200 --> 00:01:36,279 Speaker 2: can you just tell me what the show is about. 30 00:01:36,600 --> 00:01:39,880 Speaker 4: Yeah, So, basically, the show is about a thirteen year 31 00:01:39,920 --> 00:01:42,600 Speaker 4: old boy who has killed his classmate. And it's not 32 00:01:42,640 --> 00:01:44,920 Speaker 4: like a who done it? Like, it's not guessing whether 33 00:01:45,000 --> 00:01:47,600 Speaker 4: or not he committed this crime. It's about the fact 34 00:01:47,640 --> 00:01:49,440 Speaker 4: that he did this crime, and it's the fallout for 35 00:01:49,480 --> 00:01:53,560 Speaker 4: the family. It's the fallout for his fellow classmates and 36 00:01:53,600 --> 00:01:56,520 Speaker 4: the impact that this like crazy manisphere has on like 37 00:01:56,600 --> 00:01:57,320 Speaker 4: our young men. 38 00:01:57,440 --> 00:02:01,080 Speaker 2: Basically, you mentioned the manisphere, which refers to the online 39 00:02:01,120 --> 00:02:05,480 Speaker 2: community of men with misogynistic views. Our gender dynamics at 40 00:02:05,480 --> 00:02:07,200 Speaker 2: the core of this show exactly. 41 00:02:07,240 --> 00:02:08,160 Speaker 1: It's all about gender. 42 00:02:08,200 --> 00:02:11,600 Speaker 4: It's all about how young men are being pulled into 43 00:02:11,639 --> 00:02:15,000 Speaker 4: this world and how they're starting to see women and 44 00:02:15,200 --> 00:02:16,799 Speaker 4: men and the dynamics between them. 45 00:02:17,240 --> 00:02:20,360 Speaker 2: So it's pretty confronting. Yeah, why do you think it 46 00:02:20,400 --> 00:02:21,440 Speaker 2: is so popular. 47 00:02:22,000 --> 00:02:23,280 Speaker 1: I think it's so popular. 48 00:02:23,400 --> 00:02:25,799 Speaker 4: And I was speaking to a parenting expert about this, 49 00:02:26,440 --> 00:02:31,560 Speaker 4: doctor Justin Coulson, and he basically said, it's real, Like 50 00:02:31,680 --> 00:02:33,320 Speaker 4: he goes, you could take out the murder and it 51 00:02:33,360 --> 00:02:37,240 Speaker 4: would still be a very real reflection of what's happening 52 00:02:37,280 --> 00:02:39,120 Speaker 4: in schools around the world kind of thing. And I 53 00:02:39,120 --> 00:02:41,640 Speaker 4: think that's why people are so gripped by it, the 54 00:02:41,680 --> 00:02:45,200 Speaker 4: fact that everyone in it seems so normal and the 55 00:02:45,280 --> 00:02:49,160 Speaker 4: family wasn't like a family that was surrounded by abuse 56 00:02:49,240 --> 00:02:51,280 Speaker 4: or anything like that. This is a very normal family 57 00:02:51,480 --> 00:02:54,799 Speaker 4: in this English town and this horrible thing happened, and 58 00:02:54,840 --> 00:02:57,320 Speaker 4: everyone's like, how did this happen? And I think that's 59 00:02:57,360 --> 00:02:59,440 Speaker 4: what's shocking to people, like how these things can so 60 00:02:59,480 --> 00:03:00,280 Speaker 4: easily happen. 61 00:03:00,080 --> 00:03:02,160 Speaker 2: And yeah, it's not blaming it on anything to do 62 00:03:02,240 --> 00:03:04,880 Speaker 2: with his life. Like in the first episode, I didn't 63 00:03:04,919 --> 00:03:06,720 Speaker 2: believe that he had done it because the show does 64 00:03:06,760 --> 00:03:09,040 Speaker 2: such a good job of emphasizing that this is just 65 00:03:09,080 --> 00:03:12,600 Speaker 2: a normal family. What are the kind of conversations you've 66 00:03:12,600 --> 00:03:14,080 Speaker 2: seen pop up since its release. 67 00:03:14,720 --> 00:03:15,400 Speaker 1: I think a. 68 00:03:15,360 --> 00:03:17,800 Speaker 4: Lot of the conversations is surrounding, like the fact that 69 00:03:18,639 --> 00:03:21,160 Speaker 4: it's just so shocking that this is happening. 70 00:03:21,240 --> 00:03:24,440 Speaker 1: I think a lot of people are finally coming to grips. 71 00:03:24,120 --> 00:03:29,240 Speaker 4: With how easy it is to kind of see young 72 00:03:29,320 --> 00:03:34,880 Speaker 4: men fall into this weird, crazy world online where you know, 73 00:03:35,160 --> 00:03:38,720 Speaker 4: they're told that only and this is like one of 74 00:03:38,760 --> 00:03:41,240 Speaker 4: the popular quotes and the kind of manosphere like in 75 00:03:41,280 --> 00:03:44,000 Speaker 4: cell community, but like eighty percent of women are in 76 00:03:44,040 --> 00:03:46,080 Speaker 4: the attracted to twenty percent of men, and it makes 77 00:03:46,120 --> 00:03:49,920 Speaker 4: them feel like horrible about themselves. And it's just like 78 00:03:49,960 --> 00:03:53,400 Speaker 4: this weird way of pushing these isolated kids into these 79 00:03:53,440 --> 00:03:56,760 Speaker 4: like horrific things. And I think one part of it 80 00:03:56,800 --> 00:03:58,800 Speaker 4: that I personally found quite sad is that we don't 81 00:03:58,800 --> 00:04:01,840 Speaker 4: really focus on Katie as a person a lot. But 82 00:04:01,960 --> 00:04:04,120 Speaker 4: I don't think that's the story that was been trying 83 00:04:04,160 --> 00:04:06,520 Speaker 4: to be told in this instance. And I think you 84 00:04:06,640 --> 00:04:08,680 Speaker 4: probably could have told both stories at the same time, 85 00:04:09,160 --> 00:04:11,240 Speaker 4: but I think for it to have its full impact, 86 00:04:11,280 --> 00:04:14,040 Speaker 4: it had to focus on Jamie Miller, the thirteen year 87 00:04:14,040 --> 00:04:16,520 Speaker 4: old and all of that kind of stuff. 88 00:04:16,720 --> 00:04:19,120 Speaker 2: Yeah, I suppose it would convolute the message if they 89 00:04:19,240 --> 00:04:23,800 Speaker 2: included a whole female perspective. You mentioned this eighty twenty 90 00:04:23,880 --> 00:04:26,119 Speaker 2: percent statistic. Is that actually real? 91 00:04:26,440 --> 00:04:30,440 Speaker 4: No, I spoke to a PhD candidate from UCID. Her 92 00:04:30,520 --> 00:04:33,719 Speaker 4: name is Kate Scott, and Kate was kind of explaining 93 00:04:33,760 --> 00:04:36,360 Speaker 4: that there is nothing to back this up. She goes 94 00:04:36,400 --> 00:04:38,640 Speaker 4: a simple Google search will show that nothing will back 95 00:04:38,680 --> 00:04:39,080 Speaker 4: this up. 96 00:04:39,400 --> 00:04:41,400 Speaker 1: It's a figure. 97 00:04:41,279 --> 00:04:45,280 Speaker 4: That kind of came from studies on production and output 98 00:04:45,320 --> 00:04:48,640 Speaker 4: in business, and for some reason it has been grubbed 99 00:04:48,720 --> 00:04:51,680 Speaker 4: and run with from this like a manisphere in cell 100 00:04:51,720 --> 00:04:54,760 Speaker 4: community and what is an in cell The term means 101 00:04:54,800 --> 00:04:58,960 Speaker 4: involuntary celibate and basically their belief is that women don't 102 00:04:59,000 --> 00:05:02,839 Speaker 4: want them and they will never have access in quotation 103 00:05:02,920 --> 00:05:03,679 Speaker 4: marks to women. 104 00:05:04,040 --> 00:05:06,839 Speaker 2: So that really relates to them and their experiences of 105 00:05:06,920 --> 00:05:10,760 Speaker 2: sort of being rejected against their own will. I understand 106 00:05:10,760 --> 00:05:12,880 Speaker 2: there are more hidden terms you've unpacked in your article. 107 00:05:12,920 --> 00:05:14,280 Speaker 2: Could you tell me a bit more about those? 108 00:05:14,839 --> 00:05:15,200 Speaker 1: Yeah. 109 00:05:15,520 --> 00:05:18,640 Speaker 4: So in the first episode, the police believe that Katie 110 00:05:19,160 --> 00:05:23,000 Speaker 4: and Jamie were friends because of these Instagram comments, and 111 00:05:23,040 --> 00:05:27,120 Speaker 4: it wasn't until the police detective's son Adam pulled him 112 00:05:27,160 --> 00:05:28,960 Speaker 4: aside and was like, you're. 113 00:05:28,800 --> 00:05:29,919 Speaker 1: Not reading it properly. 114 00:05:30,040 --> 00:05:32,640 Speaker 4: You need to read in between the lines, and he 115 00:05:32,720 --> 00:05:35,200 Speaker 4: explains this whole world of hidden emojis and what they 116 00:05:35,240 --> 00:05:36,880 Speaker 4: mean and all of that kind of stuff, And I 117 00:05:36,880 --> 00:05:40,400 Speaker 4: don't think we're strangers to the idea that emojis mean 118 00:05:41,279 --> 00:05:44,600 Speaker 4: different things, and so my deep dive on this particular 119 00:05:44,640 --> 00:05:45,680 Speaker 4: series was about what. 120 00:05:45,640 --> 00:05:46,640 Speaker 1: These emojis mean. 121 00:05:47,240 --> 00:05:51,679 Speaker 4: So, for instance, the pill emoji references like the red pill, 122 00:05:51,760 --> 00:05:54,160 Speaker 4: which is a reference to the matrix, which I had 123 00:05:54,160 --> 00:05:57,160 Speaker 4: no idea about because I've never seen it. But basically, 124 00:05:57,279 --> 00:05:59,800 Speaker 4: you know, you take the blue pill and you kind 125 00:05:59,800 --> 00:06:02,800 Speaker 4: of live in ignorant bliss and continue, or you take 126 00:06:02,800 --> 00:06:04,760 Speaker 4: the red pill and you see the truth about gender 127 00:06:04,839 --> 00:06:07,200 Speaker 4: dynamics in this context kind of thing. 128 00:06:08,040 --> 00:06:08,920 Speaker 1: So that was a big one. 129 00:06:08,960 --> 00:06:11,839 Speaker 4: The kidney beans was another one, kind of meaning the 130 00:06:11,880 --> 00:06:15,680 Speaker 4: same thing. The hundred emoji, which like everyone that I've 131 00:06:15,720 --> 00:06:17,800 Speaker 4: ever met has always been like, oh yeah, one hundred percent, 132 00:06:17,880 --> 00:06:21,160 Speaker 4: like so excited, yeah, is in reference to this eighty 133 00:06:21,200 --> 00:06:23,320 Speaker 4: twenty rule that we were kind of speaking about before. 134 00:06:23,920 --> 00:06:28,320 Speaker 4: And there's so many different emojis and different meanings for 135 00:06:28,360 --> 00:06:32,760 Speaker 4: this hidden context. But when I spoke to the PhD candidate, 136 00:06:33,120 --> 00:06:35,440 Speaker 4: she was also explaining that it's not just these emojis 137 00:06:35,480 --> 00:06:38,040 Speaker 4: that we have to kind of look out for. It's 138 00:06:38,360 --> 00:06:41,160 Speaker 4: very much the slang that's being used, like men being 139 00:06:41,200 --> 00:06:46,599 Speaker 4: called chads and women being called various different other horrible inventities, 140 00:06:46,920 --> 00:06:47,880 Speaker 4: Becky's and all. 141 00:06:47,760 --> 00:06:49,760 Speaker 1: That kind of stuff. So it's really just. 142 00:06:51,880 --> 00:06:57,239 Speaker 4: This insane secret language dialect that signals to other people 143 00:06:57,360 --> 00:07:00,320 Speaker 4: in this manisphere in cell community that they're part of 144 00:07:00,360 --> 00:07:04,120 Speaker 4: it too. 145 00:07:05,839 --> 00:07:08,240 Speaker 2: And why do you think young men want to associate 146 00:07:08,240 --> 00:07:08,920 Speaker 2: themselves with. 147 00:07:08,920 --> 00:07:09,680 Speaker 1: Being an in cell? 148 00:07:09,920 --> 00:07:13,000 Speaker 4: Well, I don't think for like, in this particular show, 149 00:07:13,160 --> 00:07:15,560 Speaker 4: it was him wanting to identify as an in cel. 150 00:07:15,800 --> 00:07:18,520 Speaker 4: It was people putting this label on this thirteen year 151 00:07:18,520 --> 00:07:21,640 Speaker 4: old boy, which is insane. But I think for people 152 00:07:21,720 --> 00:07:24,760 Speaker 4: who wanting to identify and stuff like that, it's so 153 00:07:24,800 --> 00:07:27,480 Speaker 4: they can find a sense of community, which is weird 154 00:07:27,960 --> 00:07:31,880 Speaker 4: obviously to describe it that way, but that's the only 155 00:07:31,920 --> 00:07:34,160 Speaker 4: conclusion I can come to. They want other people who 156 00:07:34,560 --> 00:07:36,840 Speaker 4: feel the same way they do, and like can reinforce 157 00:07:36,880 --> 00:07:37,520 Speaker 4: their beliefs. 158 00:07:37,680 --> 00:07:40,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, I guess it's like anything that has a special language, 159 00:07:40,360 --> 00:07:43,080 Speaker 2: it's made to sort of create a barrier that develops 160 00:07:43,080 --> 00:07:44,120 Speaker 2: a sense of belonging. 161 00:07:44,400 --> 00:07:44,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure. 162 00:07:45,000 --> 00:07:47,320 Speaker 4: And I think, like we always speak about the loneliness 163 00:07:47,360 --> 00:07:49,760 Speaker 4: pandemic when it comes to men. That's such a big 164 00:07:49,800 --> 00:07:52,560 Speaker 4: conversation point at the moment, and I think this is 165 00:07:52,680 --> 00:07:57,280 Speaker 4: their way to remedy that loneliness epidemic kind of thing. 166 00:07:57,800 --> 00:08:00,480 Speaker 2: Talking to the parent expert, doctor Colson, do you get 167 00:08:00,480 --> 00:08:03,160 Speaker 2: the idea that this is starting a new conversation between 168 00:08:03,160 --> 00:08:04,160 Speaker 2: parents and their children. 169 00:08:04,760 --> 00:08:07,200 Speaker 1: If it's not, it really should be. 170 00:08:07,360 --> 00:08:09,800 Speaker 4: Like I think the easiest way to have a conversation 171 00:08:09,920 --> 00:08:13,760 Speaker 4: with anyone is to have a cultural jumping off point. 172 00:08:14,000 --> 00:08:17,080 Speaker 4: It's so easy to be like, hey, have you seen 173 00:08:17,200 --> 00:08:20,440 Speaker 4: this show? How do you feel about this show? Do 174 00:08:20,480 --> 00:08:22,720 Speaker 4: you relate to this in any way? And I think 175 00:08:22,880 --> 00:08:26,440 Speaker 4: the biggest thing with anything like this is not to 176 00:08:26,720 --> 00:08:29,600 Speaker 4: approach it, even though like maybe you want to so 177 00:08:29,760 --> 00:08:32,640 Speaker 4: badly from a judgmental point of view, because you don't 178 00:08:32,679 --> 00:08:35,160 Speaker 4: want your children to think that this is okay. You 179 00:08:35,240 --> 00:08:37,520 Speaker 4: need to approach it with curiosity, because I think judgment 180 00:08:37,559 --> 00:08:40,520 Speaker 4: shuts down a conversation. That was kind of the understanding 181 00:08:40,520 --> 00:08:44,000 Speaker 4: that I was getting from these conversations I was having 182 00:08:44,000 --> 00:08:47,920 Speaker 4: about this show. It also is making parents turn inward 183 00:08:48,000 --> 00:08:50,800 Speaker 4: on themselves because the family, as we were saying, were 184 00:08:51,080 --> 00:08:54,079 Speaker 4: so normal, like they wanted their son to be able 185 00:08:54,120 --> 00:08:56,960 Speaker 4: to play soccer and they wanted to take him to boxing. 186 00:08:57,160 --> 00:08:59,200 Speaker 4: They were like not fuss that he was in his 187 00:08:59,320 --> 00:09:01,320 Speaker 4: room until one in the morning on the computer and 188 00:09:01,360 --> 00:09:04,520 Speaker 4: anything like that. And I think that's literally a household, 189 00:09:04,600 --> 00:09:07,240 Speaker 4: Like I could pick ten households and be like, yeah, 190 00:09:07,320 --> 00:09:09,240 Speaker 4: like it's happening in five of them kind of thing. 191 00:09:09,760 --> 00:09:12,040 Speaker 4: So I think it's really parents also turning it in 192 00:09:12,080 --> 00:09:16,200 Speaker 4: on themselves and being like, am I being careful enough? 193 00:09:16,240 --> 00:09:18,319 Speaker 4: And not to pass judgment on parents at all, That's 194 00:09:18,360 --> 00:09:20,720 Speaker 4: not what this like the point of it is. It's 195 00:09:20,800 --> 00:09:23,720 Speaker 4: just to have them stop and consider and think about 196 00:09:24,120 --> 00:09:26,920 Speaker 4: this crazy new world that we're in that was different 197 00:09:26,920 --> 00:09:29,960 Speaker 4: to five, ten years ago, even like probably two years ago. 198 00:09:30,200 --> 00:09:34,000 Speaker 2: Yeah. Absolutely. I mean I'm a bit older than thirteen, 199 00:09:34,080 --> 00:09:36,560 Speaker 2: so when I was young, computers and the internet weren't 200 00:09:36,600 --> 00:09:38,840 Speaker 2: nearly as accessible as they are today. 201 00:09:38,960 --> 00:09:41,600 Speaker 4: Well, I didn't get like a personal computer myself until this, 202 00:09:41,880 --> 00:09:43,920 Speaker 4: Like I was part of that school program where they 203 00:09:43,920 --> 00:09:46,440 Speaker 4: were given out, and even then it was just for schoolwork. 204 00:09:46,640 --> 00:09:50,080 Speaker 4: Otherwise it was the computer in the bedroom, your parents' 205 00:09:50,080 --> 00:09:52,320 Speaker 4: bedroom or the study or whatever for them to walk 206 00:09:52,320 --> 00:09:54,240 Speaker 4: past whenever they want to see what the hell is 207 00:09:54,280 --> 00:09:57,400 Speaker 4: going on. But now kids have computers in the palm 208 00:09:57,400 --> 00:09:59,600 Speaker 4: of their hands. They have access to the entire world 209 00:09:59,640 --> 00:10:02,280 Speaker 4: in the part their hands, and it's just like scary 210 00:10:02,320 --> 00:10:03,920 Speaker 4: because like half the time you don't even know what 211 00:10:03,960 --> 00:10:06,240 Speaker 4: the person next to you on the train is typing. 212 00:10:06,640 --> 00:10:09,000 Speaker 1: Let alone your kid in their bedroom. 213 00:10:09,280 --> 00:10:12,800 Speaker 2: Does the parenting expert doctor Coulson recommend anything for families 214 00:10:12,840 --> 00:10:13,480 Speaker 2: to keep an eye on. 215 00:10:13,880 --> 00:10:16,839 Speaker 4: He didn't make any kind of particular references, but he 216 00:10:16,920 --> 00:10:20,320 Speaker 4: did kind of point to this weariness of maybe don't 217 00:10:20,400 --> 00:10:22,280 Speaker 4: let your kids have their phone in the bedroom or 218 00:10:22,280 --> 00:10:25,480 Speaker 4: in the bathroom. Maybe just have them in communal areas 219 00:10:25,520 --> 00:10:28,280 Speaker 4: where you can kind of at least by and have 220 00:10:28,320 --> 00:10:31,400 Speaker 4: a bit of a glance type thing. He was also 221 00:10:31,480 --> 00:10:34,319 Speaker 4: saying that, yes, these parents did seem so normal, but 222 00:10:34,360 --> 00:10:36,240 Speaker 4: their kid was running around eight thirty at nine, and 223 00:10:36,480 --> 00:10:38,440 Speaker 4: they had no idea where he was or what he 224 00:10:38,480 --> 00:10:40,960 Speaker 4: was doing and all of this kind of stuff. So 225 00:10:41,480 --> 00:10:44,840 Speaker 4: it's not the point to encourage helicopter parents. I don't 226 00:10:44,880 --> 00:10:48,880 Speaker 4: think anyone wants to encourage that kind of behavior, but 227 00:10:49,120 --> 00:10:52,280 Speaker 4: just being more open and willing to have these conversations 228 00:10:52,280 --> 00:10:55,120 Speaker 4: and being willing to say no when it comes to 229 00:10:55,920 --> 00:10:58,160 Speaker 4: certain things like phones in the bedroom. 230 00:10:58,480 --> 00:11:01,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, And I guess, excepting to some degree that by 231 00:11:01,320 --> 00:11:03,400 Speaker 2: turning a blind eye, you can lose track of the 232 00:11:03,600 --> 00:11:06,040 Speaker 2: media your child is consuming for sure. 233 00:11:06,120 --> 00:11:09,320 Speaker 4: And again, like both experts that I spoke to made 234 00:11:09,320 --> 00:11:12,080 Speaker 4: it very very clear that this is not conversations to 235 00:11:12,120 --> 00:11:15,160 Speaker 4: blame parents in any any way whatsoever, or you know, 236 00:11:15,240 --> 00:11:17,120 Speaker 4: target parents will make them feel like they're not doing 237 00:11:17,120 --> 00:11:17,880 Speaker 4: a good enough job. 238 00:11:18,320 --> 00:11:22,160 Speaker 1: It's just to open their eyes and make them consider. 239 00:11:22,240 --> 00:11:24,640 Speaker 2: How arey gonna know what a kidney bean emoji is? Yes, 240 00:11:24,960 --> 00:11:27,800 Speaker 2: unless they start a conversation, make their child feel kind 241 00:11:27,800 --> 00:11:30,360 Speaker 2: of safe enough and just learn what they're interested in 242 00:11:30,360 --> 00:11:32,120 Speaker 2: and kind of what. 243 00:11:31,520 --> 00:11:32,839 Speaker 1: What they're watching when they're dying. 244 00:11:33,040 --> 00:11:35,800 Speaker 4: Yeah, like you know what influences do you like? You know, 245 00:11:36,320 --> 00:11:38,800 Speaker 4: why do you like that influencer? Like, they're very simple 246 00:11:38,880 --> 00:11:43,280 Speaker 4: questions that have no kind of targeting whatsoever, just so 247 00:11:43,320 --> 00:11:45,679 Speaker 4: you can kind of get an understanding of the kind 248 00:11:45,720 --> 00:11:47,240 Speaker 4: of pattern of things that they're watching. 249 00:11:47,240 --> 00:11:49,360 Speaker 2: At the very least, I think that's great advice. 250 00:11:49,920 --> 00:11:51,480 Speaker 4: At the end of the day, it's a show about 251 00:11:51,480 --> 00:11:54,200 Speaker 4: thirteen year olds and this kind of crazy world that 252 00:11:54,200 --> 00:11:56,920 Speaker 4: they're thrust into and the pressure that they're experiencing to 253 00:11:57,760 --> 00:12:00,520 Speaker 4: have sex at the age of thirteen, when that is 254 00:12:00,559 --> 00:12:04,320 Speaker 4: like nowhere near developmentally where they should be at so 255 00:12:04,520 --> 00:12:08,000 Speaker 4: I think it's just kind of reinforcing and having these 256 00:12:08,040 --> 00:12:12,319 Speaker 4: conversations about what masculinity and femininity are, and what gender 257 00:12:12,360 --> 00:12:16,920 Speaker 4: dynamics are, and just like demonstrating in the easiest possible 258 00:12:16,960 --> 00:12:20,440 Speaker 4: way within your own home, what healthy relationships look like. 259 00:12:20,920 --> 00:12:24,360 Speaker 2: I think that's an important message for everyone in general. Yeah, 260 00:12:24,400 --> 00:12:26,600 Speaker 2: thank you so much Claudia for joining me. This has 261 00:12:26,640 --> 00:12:29,439 Speaker 2: been incredibly interesting. Thank you, and if you want to 262 00:12:29,480 --> 00:12:32,040 Speaker 2: find out more, head over to news dot com dot au. 263 00:12:32,280 --> 00:12:34,000 Speaker 2: Thanks for listening. We'll be back tomorrow. 264 00:12:35,040 --> 00:12:38,240 Speaker 1: Follow us, subscribe to from the newsroom wherever you get 265 00:12:38,280 --> 00:12:40,040 Speaker 1: your podcasts.