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Speaker 1: Hi, my boris, and this is straight talk. Neil Perry,

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Speaker 1: A bad damn time, may. Welcome to straight talk.

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Speaker 2: Good to be here for people when they see me.

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Speaker 2: Because I've been associated with great restaurants Propel Bar and

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Speaker 2: Grill and now Margaret. You know, we've always strived to

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Speaker 2: be the best we possibly can be. Sure, we're in

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Speaker 2: the restaurant business, but the reality of what we do

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Speaker 2: is create great memories. People will say, oh, that's just

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Speaker 2: a stake on a play. Well it's not really. It's

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Speaker 2: like a conversation I had four years ago when you

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Speaker 2: know the calf was born. It's the conversation I'm having

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Speaker 2: on Monday when my guys are out fishing and catching

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Speaker 2: King George Whiting and flathead and garfish and all these

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Speaker 2: conversations are more important than tweezers and flowers and all

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Speaker 2: the stuff that people nowadays put on. Food started my

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Speaker 2: apprenticeship when I was eighteen months old. Dad loved food

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Speaker 2: and loved cooking. He actually created who I am today

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Speaker 2: without me even realizing.

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Speaker 1: Neil Perry, A bad damn time, may, Welcome to straight Talk.

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Speaker 2: Good to be here.

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Speaker 1: Maybe it's that busy though, I mean like it's pretty

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Speaker 1: much impossible to have sort of pried you away from

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Speaker 1: what you love and do. And you most recently open

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Speaker 1: up your newest latest venture, which we'll talk about a

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Speaker 1: little bit a bit later, Songbird, but we'll talk about

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Speaker 1: a little bit downtrack. Everyone's always talking about what you

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Speaker 1: are currently doing. I want to go back to Neil

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Speaker 1: Perry right back. You're a sixty seven year old guy.

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Speaker 1: You're a little bit younger than me, not much, not much.

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Speaker 1: And Neil Perry obviously started somewhere like at some stage

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Speaker 1: right then, at some stage in his life he decided

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Speaker 1: he wanted to be in the food business. Or maybe

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Speaker 1: you're a lawyer. I don't know, what's the deal. Who

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Speaker 1: were you when you're in your fifteen sixty in that period?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well you know what I did was Zoeington Newington College,

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Speaker 2: not a year ten, and then the school sergeant essentially

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Speaker 2: said to me one week to go, you've got to

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Speaker 2: go and get your haircut. I've always been attached to hair,

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Speaker 2: as you can see having your ponytails still at sixty seven.

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Speaker 2: So I just went, there's just no way. So I

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Speaker 2: jumped on the train, went back to Dremoyne where we lived,

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Speaker 2: and just said to Mum and Dad, I'm leaving Newington

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Speaker 2: and I'm going to Dramoin Boys High. So that kind

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Speaker 2: of started two years of, you know, pretty pretty wild

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Speaker 2: school end of school for me because Newington was so

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Speaker 2: strict and there's so many rules, and then all of

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Speaker 2: a sudden you're in year you know, essentially eleven and

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Speaker 2: twelve these days, with no teachers caring whether you're there

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Speaker 2: or not and or what you do. So I just

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Speaker 2: basically played football the whole time, and I played union

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Speaker 2: and played league as well, so we did a little

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Speaker 2: bit of district and state representation and things like that.

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Speaker 2: So that was a bit of fun. And then I

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Speaker 2: decided I was going to do Hearts union, decided no,

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Speaker 2: I'll take a gap year. I started hairdressing work for

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Speaker 2: Lloyd Lomas, actually.

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Speaker 1: Lloyd Lomas and Double Bay.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it wasn't he was in the city,

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Speaker 2: then he was in just off Martin place.

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Speaker 1: I want to stop because people got to get a

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Speaker 1: bit of understanding. So we're talking about early seventies. Yes, okay,

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Speaker 1: so we're talking about the early seventies, like everybody needs

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Speaker 1: to understand this. At that period, long hair for men

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Speaker 1: was the go and because I remember my hair was

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Speaker 1: pretty long. But our school was similar, but it wasn't

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Speaker 1: a wasn't new into but it was a little Catholic

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Speaker 1: school in lakember And if you had long hair, partial collar,

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Speaker 1: long hair, then by the ways, partial color exactly, you

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Speaker 1: were in big trouble. And it was very strict rules.

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Speaker 1: Men don't have long hair. And we were going through

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Speaker 1: the age of Aquarius, et cetera, that sort of thing

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Speaker 1: going on. It was the Beatles were a big deal,

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Speaker 1: Vietnam War more correct, so people don't like to have

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Speaker 1: long hair. Wasn't just to have long hair, I mean

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Speaker 1: you were being a bit modest in it was actually

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Speaker 1: quite a quite rebellious you know, you were considered rebadious

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Speaker 1: if you didn't get your hair cut.

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Speaker 2: Absolutely. Yeah. Well, and you were a part of that.

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Speaker 2: I mean it was the earliest, early to mid seventies,

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Speaker 2: so you were part of that late sixties, you know,

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Speaker 2: kind of hippie swing thing and you know, anti war

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Speaker 2: and all that sort of stuff. So I and I

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Speaker 2: actually remember the first time I went to you know, Singapore,

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Speaker 2: I was going to stop off, but I couldn't because

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Speaker 2: it was against the law. Yeah. Yeah, for the whole

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Speaker 2: for the whole city. Yeah, so I had to start

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Speaker 2: on the plane and continue on to London, whereas I

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Speaker 2: would have loved to drop into Singapore for age. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So that was my first overseas trip, went to Europe.

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Speaker 2: I just started waiting in a restaurant to essentially, you know,

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Speaker 2: make some money to go on that trip. Then I

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Speaker 2: worked in a bar in Greece. Came home and it was.

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Speaker 1: Pretty adventurous mate for those days.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it was. My sister was over there and

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Speaker 2: I went over and I was working in a club

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Speaker 2: and it was pretty amazing actually because I was up

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Speaker 2: in Placa, which is like the red light district sort of,

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Speaker 2: I guess you'd call it, or the entertainment district. And

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Speaker 2: for all the restaurants, the restaurant's bars, and say, for

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Speaker 2: the right at Big Cropolis is right there, and Sigmund

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Speaker 2: Square or whatever it's called, it's down the bottom. But

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Speaker 2: you'd leave the bar at three in the morning and

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Speaker 2: go down and have a coffee, and you know it.

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Speaker 2: It was a pretty interesting lifestyle actually, So straight away

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Speaker 2: I got bitten by the whole I suppose the flexibility

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Speaker 2: in hospitality. So when I got back, I got a

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Speaker 2: job at the Australia Club and I was just gone

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Speaker 2: past eighteen. Then I was heading towards nineteen and I

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Speaker 2: saw an ad in the paper for an assistant manager's

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Speaker 2: job for sales at McMahon's Point, and I went for

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Speaker 2: the job and got it, which was fantastic and sales

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Speaker 2: and what sales at bit Martin's Point, so sales the restaurant.

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Speaker 2: So the really good thing there was Ross Hartman was there.

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Speaker 2: He was a really good restauranteur and so he really

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Speaker 2: I was there for three years and he started to

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Speaker 2: teach me a lot about about being a restauranteur. And

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Speaker 2: I was hiring people in the end and doing the

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Speaker 2: work ages and responsible for the food percentages and doing

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Speaker 2: the booze ordering and doing the wine tastings and you know,

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Speaker 2: working with a chef on getting fresh fish and because

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Speaker 2: I probably knew more about fresh fish than he did

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Speaker 2: it as an Irish guy, and I had grown up

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Speaker 2: with my father fishing all the time, so you know,

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Speaker 2: our holidays were Yamber in winter and Briol Lakes in summer, fishing.

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Speaker 2: He loved it. Then we lived on George's River, so

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Speaker 2: he was fishing all weekends and so my whole life,

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Speaker 2: I just eaten fish that we caught, unless we were

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Speaker 2: eating in a restaurant. So so that was a really

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Speaker 2: amazing grounding for me. And then I did a couple

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Speaker 2: of other things. But in nineteen eighty two, I just

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Speaker 2: decided that I wanted to cook and it was a

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Speaker 2: bit serendipitous. I was working at where Catalina is now,

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Speaker 2: but it was sales. Yeah, it was sales at Rose Bay,

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Speaker 2: and I.

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Speaker 1: Was sorry, that's not where. They just have it like

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Speaker 1: a fairy thing.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there was a well, there were very exactly where

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Speaker 2: it was, but essentially it was exactly the same as

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Speaker 2: it is now, but they kind of flipped the restaurant

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Speaker 2: from memory. The kitchen was where it is, but used

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Speaker 2: to enter from the back end.

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Speaker 1: I sort of remember going there.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so it was always busy and you know, just

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Speaker 2: a crazy act of fate. So so the chef actually

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Speaker 2: used to love skydiving, and he missed the landing, put

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Speaker 2: his back out, and it was Sunday lunch and he

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Speaker 2: was actually out for two weeks. So I actually I

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Speaker 2: used to expedite the pass on the other side when

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Speaker 2: it was really busy anyway, but I actually jumped in

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Speaker 2: and ran the dockets from the kitchen side and grilled

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Speaker 2: some fish. Was pretty simple stuff and wasn't in a

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Speaker 2: rocket science and I just actually loved it. I just

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Speaker 2: really really loved it and realized, you know, I've been

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Speaker 2: cooking crazy dinner parties my whole life, and Dad had

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Speaker 2: taught me so much about food that I didn't realize

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Speaker 2: at the time. But when I wrote my first cookbook,

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Speaker 2: I thought long and hard about why I ended up

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Speaker 2: in the position that I ended up in, and why

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Speaker 2: produce was so important to me. It was really all

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Speaker 2: about him, you know. He was a gardener, was a fisherman, butcher,

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Speaker 2: and we had the best of everything. We eate with

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Speaker 2: the seasons. We grew our own food. Eggs came from

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Speaker 2: chickens we had in the avery.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 2: It was really it was really an incredible upbringing for

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Speaker 2: somebody who wanted to be a chef. So I then

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Speaker 2: spent eighty two So we're talking about fairly, you know,

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Speaker 2: for a long time ago. But I worked for anywhere

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Speaker 2: between six weeks and three weeks of the three months

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Speaker 2: with a whole lot of great chefs. Damian Pinolet had

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Speaker 2: Claudes at the time. He introduced me to Stephanie Alexander.

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Speaker 2: I moved to Melbourne for three months, came and worked

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Speaker 2: for Gab Bilson at brow Waters when Tony came to

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Speaker 2: open coin Sellers and she had Brower for the first

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Speaker 2: time all by herself, and then before Yanni had started.

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Speaker 2: And then I went to work for Jenny Ferguson at

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Speaker 2: You and me met Stefano Manfredi there, which was fantastic.

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Speaker 2: That sort of kicked off a lifelong friendship. And then

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Speaker 2: I worked at Tony Pappus when we first opened the

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Speaker 2: Bayswater Brassrie, which was insane. You know, three hundred and

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Speaker 2: fifty covers turned up the first night. No one really

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Speaker 2: knew what they were doing. Tony and I were the

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Speaker 2: only ones in the kitchen, and a couple of others

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Speaker 2: knew what cooking was, and I'd only been cooking for

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Speaker 2: like nine months or whatever. And then I an old

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Speaker 2: girlfriend of mine was working with Judy McMahon at Simpson's

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Speaker 2: in the City, which is sort of off I think

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Speaker 2: it was off ash Lane actually, sort of where Justin

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Speaker 2: is now. And she said that they bought baron Joey

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Speaker 2: House and they were looking for a chef and I

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Speaker 2: was crazy enough to think that I might be able

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Speaker 2: to do this, which was ridiculous of me because I

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Speaker 2: don't even cooking about nine months. And so I went

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Speaker 2: and I sat on the lawn with McMahon and we

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Speaker 2: drank a bottle of wine together, and I rode up

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Speaker 2: on my bike. I'm not sure I should have ridden home.

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Speaker 2: Beautiful day in Palm Beach. So they had an apartment,

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Speaker 2: was looking down over the water, and I think he

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Speaker 2: must have just looked at all the places that I'd worked,

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Speaker 2: which were great places, didn't think about how long I'd

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Speaker 2: been there, and the fact that I'd only been cooking

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Speaker 2: for less than a year or a year, And so

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Speaker 2: he gave me the job as head chef. I started

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Speaker 2: in November eighty two. Leo Schofield came up in eighty

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Speaker 2: three and wrote up as a food critic as the

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Speaker 2: food Critic, the food critic, and mate, probably it's moved,

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Speaker 2: you know, moved mountains when he did a ride up

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Speaker 2: and so he came to Palm Beach. He stayed at

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Speaker 2: Baron Joey, and he went to Pete Doyle's Reflections, which

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Speaker 2: was just down the road, and he ate at Baron

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Speaker 2: Joey House and he gave me, you know, seventeen out

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Speaker 2: of twenty two hats kids. The star was the was

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Speaker 2: the headline. And yeah, I just never never looked back

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Speaker 2: from there.

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Speaker 1: When you he just sort of covered a number of years,

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Speaker 1: but you also covered a number of just about every

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Speaker 1: big name in the call of the restaurant at the

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Speaker 1: time at the time, and you know, some of those

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Speaker 1: people are sort of fairly iconic, at least in my

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Speaker 1: mind as I remember, I don't know most, but I

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Speaker 1: definitely know most of their restaurants, and they were all

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Speaker 1: very famous. And then you picked Leo Schofield, who, as

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Speaker 1: far as I'm go soon as one of Australias one

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Speaker 1: of Australia's greatest as seats like in other words, about

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Speaker 1: knowledge about what is beautiful, whether it's food, architecture, or music,

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Speaker 1: et cetera. And and.

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Speaker 2: We're hoping that he'll get to the Good Food Guide,

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Speaker 2: which is next week for the for the fortieth anniversary.

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Speaker 2: And so I was in the first guide with Baron

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Speaker 2: Joey House and still going, I think I'm the only one.

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Speaker 1: So but how is it that Neil Perry, a kid

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Speaker 1: from Newington year ten left school because his hair was

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Speaker 1: too long and didn't want to be told what to

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Speaker 1: do kid from Dramoin and Dromine then. Wasn't it what

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Speaker 1: it is now? You know, Dramoine's a fairly fancy joint now,

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Speaker 1: Dramoinen there was a in a west suburb, So it

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Speaker 1: wasn't you know, it wasn't where it is now. Put

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Speaker 1: it that way, how do you think you got to

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Speaker 1: meet all these people? Was it your naivity and therefore

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Speaker 1: applications for anything?

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Speaker 2: Look, it was really through food. And I guess I

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Speaker 2: knew all of these guys because when I was at sales,

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Speaker 2: I was earning really good money. I was running the restaurant.

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Speaker 2: You know, I was eight francs to the dollar back then,

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Speaker 2: with no with no tax on imported booze. So we

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Speaker 2: were drinking, you know, like the stuff that we drink now,

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Speaker 2: like Romniconti, you know, and Dom and Lafitte, and we

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Speaker 2: were drinking amazing Saturn's with Kim and so forth, because

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Speaker 2: they were just as cheap as a straying wines back

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Speaker 2: in those days. And now you can't afford to buy

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Speaker 2: a bottle and then a bottle of Berg. And he's

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Speaker 2: just insane now so, so you know, I knew a

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Speaker 2: lot about wine. I learned a lot about wine, and

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Speaker 2: I knew these guys. I used to eat it well

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Speaker 2: because you know, you're drinking well and you're eating well,

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Speaker 2: and you're in their restaurant. You're in the business and

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Speaker 2: they come up and talk to you, and so you

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Speaker 2: start chatting.

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Speaker 1: And so a company mayler because they guess they someone

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Speaker 1: else might be seeing it. Look, I've been trying to

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Speaker 1: get in so and So's company. I've been trying to

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Speaker 1: get Neil Perry's company for a long time, but I can't.

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Speaker 1: He won't give me a look in because you know,

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Speaker 1: you're busy whatever. Or was it just a different time.

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Speaker 2: I think it was. It was very much a different time.

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Speaker 2: So I was so lucky. Everything was so concentrated. And

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Speaker 2: you talk about Leo before he gave you a reviewer

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Speaker 2: to fill the restaurant for a year. Now you get

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Speaker 2: a review in one of the major papers, and really

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Speaker 2: the fone light ring for a week. Because it's because

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Speaker 2: the information is so desperate now about about how people

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Speaker 2: gather there their news or or not news. I mean,

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Speaker 2: just as many people are just looking at Instagram, all

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Speaker 2: all the kids that work for me all the young ones,

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Speaker 2: you know, I'll say, oh, we've got a great review

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Speaker 2: and the good food guy and then they probably don't

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Speaker 2: even know what that means.

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Speaker 1: Well, they don't buy the paper.

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Speaker 2: No, they don't even know what the paper is. And

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Speaker 2: so the reality of it is, back in those days,

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Speaker 2: I wouldn't like to be starting now trying to make

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Speaker 2: a name for myself. You know, there were half a

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Speaker 2: dozen really good restaurants in Sydney and there was a

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Speaker 2: very small pool of people that used to eat at them,

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Speaker 2: and you knew the chefs. So that's what it was like.

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Speaker 2: And so growing up through the eighties and nineties, and

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Speaker 2: you know, working with other iconic chefs like Tedsuya and

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Speaker 2: myself and Stephanomnfredi and Chrissy Manfield and David Thompson and

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Speaker 2: Mars Sawyer, you know, we were kind of like the

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Speaker 2: forefront of everything that's come after and then been joined

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Speaker 2: by guys like you, Matt Moran and so forth. Like

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Speaker 2: Matt's a decade younger than me, but you know, those

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Speaker 2: kind of guys have done well now. Peter Gilmore, of course,

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Speaker 2: you know, the sort of kind of legendary status in

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Speaker 2: Key restaurant and so forth. But I think for me

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Speaker 2: starting at that time was definitely an advantage. I wouldn't

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Speaker 2: be able to do what I did then now for sure.

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Speaker 1: And it's funny. Neil Perry is a brand in itself,

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Speaker 1: you know, which you've been clever enough to leverage in

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Speaker 1: all sorts of ways. It seems to me at some

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Speaker 1: stage in your life outside of cooking. I don't mean

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Speaker 1: that in a differential sense like I mean cheerful cookie.

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Speaker 1: I mean you're brilliant at it, but outside of that,

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Speaker 1: it seems to me that you spent some level of

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Speaker 1: energy building the Neil Prairie brand or either consciously or

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Speaker 1: consciously order to just emerge.

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Speaker 2: No, No, I mean I think you know, the reality

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Speaker 2: of a brand is sort of a promise, right, you know.

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Speaker 2: So people talk about any image or whatever it might be,

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Speaker 2: or the graphic of a brand, it's really the emotion

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Speaker 2: that it actually brings up when you see that. And

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Speaker 2: I think for people when they see me, because I've

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Speaker 2: been associated with great restaurants, you know, rock Pool, Bluewater

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Speaker 2: Grill originally in rock Pool, and Roppul Bar and Grill

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Speaker 2: and now Margaret. You know, we've always strived to be

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Speaker 2: the best we possibly can be every day. You know,

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Speaker 2: I've always had a great philosophy to work with the guys,

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Speaker 2: you know, right from the beginning, I talk to them

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Speaker 2: about the fact that sure in the restaurant business, but

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Speaker 2: the reality of what we do is create great memories.

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Speaker 2: So so we're in the memory business. So if we don't,

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Speaker 2: you know, we can create a bad memory, lukewarm one

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Speaker 2: or a great memory. So you know, I talk to

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Speaker 2: them about hospitality, generosity, the care philosophy, which is how

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Speaker 2: we run our business, is very simple, but all of

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Speaker 2: that is really about creating this amazing memory so that

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Speaker 2: people talk about the restaurant. The strength of the brand,

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Speaker 2: like editorial and word of mouth, is much stronger than

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Speaker 2: any kind of advertising you can ever do. And we're

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Speaker 2: in a business that people like to talk about it.

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Speaker 2: You know, it's very much part of the community dining, eating, socializing.

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Speaker 2: You know, we're very lucky that's part of the human condition, right,

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Speaker 2: So we're very heavily involved in that, and it's why

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Speaker 2: I suppose chefs and restauranteurs have been put on this

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Speaker 2: pedestal because people enjoy and love to be to love

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Speaker 2: to be entertained. We're in the entertainment business, but they

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Speaker 2: love to have these great memories that they can can

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Speaker 2: think about. I mean, if you like, any one day

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Speaker 2: when we come to work, we're kind of very responsible

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Speaker 2: for things like we've got an eightieth birthday, and you

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Speaker 2: don't want Ardie Jan's eightieth birthday be completely stuffed up

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Speaker 2: for the entire family, Right, We've got a wedding celebration,

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Speaker 2: We've got an anniversary, an anniversary, We've got you know,

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Speaker 2: people have come and done wakes at the restaurant, Father's Day,

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Speaker 2: Mother's Day, like, You've got all of these celebrations that

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Speaker 2: are very important to people, and and if you stuff

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Speaker 2: it up, I mean, you know, they've got a bad

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Speaker 2: memory of someone's birthday or anniversary or whatever it might be.

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Speaker 2: So there's an amazing responsibility there, and you've really got

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Speaker 2: to make sure that every day you're on on form.

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Speaker 2: So because I really early on just decided I wanted

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Speaker 2: to be the best at what I was doing and

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Speaker 2: I wanted to try and bring really good people through

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Speaker 2: with me. That people have kind of resonated with that.

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Speaker 2: And you know, my style is very different to a

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Speaker 2: lot of other you know, I wouldn't call what I

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Speaker 2: do now fine dining. It's just a great eating But

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Speaker 2: you know, through the rock Pool days, yes I was

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Speaker 2: pushing the envelope and whatever. But for me, you know, now,

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Speaker 2: it's really it's really just about doing the best that

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Speaker 2: we possibly can, talking to our fishermen, talking to our

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Speaker 2: beef growers, making sure that the best produce comes in

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Speaker 2: to the to the restaurant, making sure that our egos

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Speaker 2: get right out of the way, and that people taste

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Speaker 2: the nature in the produce that we've actually, you know,

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Speaker 2: spent years sourcing, building relationships. You know, people say, oh,

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Speaker 2: that's just a stake on a plate, Well it's not really.

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Speaker 2: It's like a conversation I had four years ago when

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Speaker 2: you know the calf was born. It's the conversation I'm

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Speaker 2: having on Monday when my guys are out fishing and

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Speaker 2: catching King George, whiting and flathead and garfish, and you know,

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Speaker 2: whether it be coral trout or amazing bass grope or

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Speaker 2: jewfish out of the west, you know, all these all

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Speaker 2: these conversations are more important than you know, tweezers and

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Speaker 2: flowers and all the stuff that people nowadays put on food.

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Speaker 2: Interesting they don't think about where did the food come from.

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Speaker 2: They just think about how pretty it looks. And that's

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Speaker 2: not the.

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Speaker 1: Is that your revolutionary? Is that an evolution of New

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Speaker 1: Perio today or you always.

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Speaker 2: I've always been like that, even since Baron Joey days.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I was just lucky. Some guys came up

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Speaker 2: to the back door a week after we'd opened and said,

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Speaker 2: we go out fishing. I've got a fifteen kilo jewfish.

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Speaker 2: You know, I've got I've got school prawns. I've got

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Speaker 2: you know, d you fish jew jewfish which we which

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Speaker 2: now we call mull Away and so fish beautiful fish.

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Speaker 2: And we get those big fish coming into into the

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Speaker 2: Hawksbury out from sea, you know, fifteen kilos twenty kilos

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Speaker 2: massive jewfish steak. I mean the when the Harber prawn

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Speaker 2: season was on, we'd be getting the school he's out

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Speaker 2: out of Hawksbury. You know that there was just an

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Speaker 2: amazing amount of fish, and there used to be quite

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Speaker 2: a good fish shop right next to us at Baron Joey.

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Speaker 2: And then you know, we'd feed off those guys coming

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Speaker 2: and bringing stuff in from there. And then I drive

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Speaker 2: to the fish market twice a week, so seafood was

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Speaker 2: really important to us then, and that that's when I

399
00:19:43,720 --> 00:19:47,439
Speaker 2: started putting our supplies. If a fish was delivered by

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Speaker 2: a fisherman, his name went on the menu, and so

401
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Speaker 2: I pursued that ever since. And so it was the

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00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:54,440
Speaker 2: same at the Blue Water Grill. On the back of

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Speaker 2: the menu, we'd write the supplies. At the front page

404
00:19:57,119 --> 00:20:00,439
Speaker 2: of Rockpool, we'd write the supplies, bar and Grill. We

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00:20:00,560 --> 00:20:03,480
Speaker 2: name them all at Margaret I. Actually, because of the

406
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Speaker 2: relationships have been going for so long, twenty years plus,

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00:20:07,040 --> 00:20:09,560
Speaker 2: we actually call most of our supplies by their first name.

408
00:20:10,400 --> 00:20:15,240
Speaker 2: So it's Pavenheiiti's Big Ituna, It's Bruce's King, George Whiting

409
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Speaker 2: because we just have this incredible relationship with these guys

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Speaker 2: that make us. They make us, you know, we don't

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Speaker 2: make them. And that's a really important thing to focus on.

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Speaker 2: And for me, that started with my father because we

413
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Speaker 2: were digging things out of the garden, picking things out

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Speaker 2: of the garden in season. You know, we were picking

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Speaker 2: eggs out of the bums, you know, off the chickens

416
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Speaker 2: as they were trying to you know, hatch them or

417
00:20:39,520 --> 00:20:42,480
Speaker 2: running around the yard. You know, he was killing the

418
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Speaker 2: odd one and we were eating it, and we were

419
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Speaker 2: eating fresh fish that he'd catch, and he'd bring amazing

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Speaker 2: meat home and we'd have large format cuts of meat

421
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Speaker 2: cooked on the barbecue and sliced up and all this stuff.

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Speaker 2: And I had lots of great Chinese friends at that

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Speaker 2: stage that we get invited to their how and eat

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Speaker 2: amazing food, or would get invited to their wedding or

425
00:21:03,640 --> 00:21:07,280
Speaker 2: you know, their their Chinese New Year celebration, and so

426
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Speaker 2: I didn't even realize it, but I was kind of

427
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Speaker 2: getting a snapshot of food that Australians weren't really getting

428
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Speaker 2: at that time. My father ran a lot really large

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Speaker 2: abatoire and meat processing space, and so the bonus and

430
00:21:21,240 --> 00:21:25,760
Speaker 2: the butchers were like Italians, Hungarians, Greeks, you know. So

431
00:21:26,080 --> 00:21:28,320
Speaker 2: when I go and help them school holidays and go

432
00:21:28,400 --> 00:21:30,440
Speaker 2: and push meat and you do things. And when I

433
00:21:30,440 --> 00:21:33,440
Speaker 2: got older, I was sort of delivering meat and school holidays,

434
00:21:33,920 --> 00:21:35,800
Speaker 2: but you know, they'd sit down and breakfast to be

435
00:21:36,240 --> 00:21:38,960
Speaker 2: you know, sandwich with salami and pickled e plant. You know,

436
00:21:39,119 --> 00:21:41,359
Speaker 2: I was eating all this stuff and kind of just

437
00:21:41,400 --> 00:21:43,639
Speaker 2: thinking that was normal. But as I got older, I

438
00:21:43,720 --> 00:21:47,280
Speaker 2: kind of realized that that wasn't definitely, definitely not normal

439
00:21:47,280 --> 00:21:49,800
Speaker 2: that Dad was a butcher, so you know, Sunday breakfast

440
00:21:49,840 --> 00:21:53,840
Speaker 2: a big crumb lamb's brains on toast or you know,

441
00:21:53,920 --> 00:21:57,320
Speaker 2: veal kidneys or lambs kidneys or lambs fry and bacon

442
00:21:57,359 --> 00:21:59,960
Speaker 2: and tomato and tripe and you know, so we used

443
00:22:00,520 --> 00:22:04,840
Speaker 2: we had everything, and so yeah, it wasn't until kids

444
00:22:04,840 --> 00:22:06,679
Speaker 2: would come over and have a sleepover and we'd be,

445
00:22:06,800 --> 00:22:09,440
Speaker 2: you know, doing some lambs frying bacon. What the hell,

446
00:22:10,280 --> 00:22:12,480
Speaker 2: what's this? But you know, it was a really rich

447
00:22:12,640 --> 00:22:15,919
Speaker 2: food background, and Dad loved food and loved cooking, so

448
00:22:15,920 --> 00:22:18,159
Speaker 2: we'd always say, taste this, you know, taste this, what

449
00:22:18,200 --> 00:22:20,480
Speaker 2: do you remember? What do you think about? So he

450
00:22:20,720 --> 00:22:24,680
Speaker 2: actually created who I am today without me even realizing.

451
00:22:24,760 --> 00:22:27,639
Speaker 2: I've got to started my apprenticeship when I was you know,

452
00:22:27,800 --> 00:22:30,720
Speaker 2: eighteen months old or the first time I started having solids,

453
00:22:30,720 --> 00:22:34,320
Speaker 2: because you know, Dad was cooking up fresh vegetables for

454
00:22:34,440 --> 00:22:38,080
Speaker 2: me and eating crumb fresh fish and you know, so

455
00:22:38,119 --> 00:22:42,160
Speaker 2: wherever I started from was a really beautiful place of

456
00:22:42,440 --> 00:22:45,119
Speaker 2: you know, fresh seasonal ingredients. And I think don't think

457
00:22:45,160 --> 00:22:49,640
Speaker 2: people were really experiencing that normally, maybe if they lived

458
00:22:49,640 --> 00:22:51,520
Speaker 2: in the country, but certainly not in the city as

459
00:22:51,560 --> 00:22:54,480
Speaker 2: your dad at No, he passed away when Josephine was

460
00:22:54,520 --> 00:22:55,400
Speaker 2: born thirty years ago.

461
00:22:55,400 --> 00:22:57,439
Speaker 1: Wow, yeah, thirty years ago. He'd be very proud of

462
00:22:57,440 --> 00:23:00,159
Speaker 1: were your wife. Actually funny you'd say that, because when

463
00:23:00,280 --> 00:23:01,560
Speaker 1: when you were talking to me, I just trying to

464
00:23:01,560 --> 00:23:03,679
Speaker 1: remember where I first went to one of your restaurants,

465
00:23:03,720 --> 00:23:05,439
Speaker 1: and I remember it was down at the Rocks and

466
00:23:05,480 --> 00:23:08,560
Speaker 1: it was what was the name of the rock Pool,

467
00:23:08,600 --> 00:23:11,000
Speaker 1: It was the original port and I went there were

468
00:23:11,080 --> 00:23:14,440
Speaker 1: the two old mates of mine and you probably remember

469
00:23:14,560 --> 00:23:18,560
Speaker 1: Zarelazov who's now passed away and Bill Shipton who's recently

470
00:23:18,560 --> 00:23:19,040
Speaker 1: passed away.

471
00:23:20,119 --> 00:23:21,639
Speaker 2: Everyone, and they're in the.

472
00:23:21,680 --> 00:23:25,560
Speaker 1: Eighties and and I'd never been exposed to this type

473
00:23:25,560 --> 00:23:30,520
Speaker 1: of food in terms of quality price from at the time.

474
00:23:31,320 --> 00:23:36,840
Speaker 1: And but just like a complexity for me what looked

475
00:23:36,880 --> 00:23:39,119
Speaker 1: like a complexity for me in terms of sources and

476
00:23:39,160 --> 00:23:41,240
Speaker 1: things like that. And then I remember seeing you on TV.

477
00:23:41,440 --> 00:23:43,000
Speaker 1: And I don't remember what show you doing, but I

478
00:23:43,040 --> 00:23:45,080
Speaker 1: saw you on TV sort of cooking and demonstrating cook

479
00:23:45,160 --> 00:23:47,000
Speaker 1: cooking and stuff like that. But one of the things

480
00:23:47,040 --> 00:23:48,719
Speaker 1: I learned one of the things, and I've learned lots

481
00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:50,240
Speaker 1: of things from going to your restaurants of course, I

482
00:23:50,280 --> 00:23:52,160
Speaker 1: went to the rock Pool restaurant in the city, which

483
00:23:52,160 --> 00:23:55,440
Speaker 1: is very close to and I spent many In fact,

484
00:23:55,440 --> 00:23:58,760
Speaker 1: I probably at one stage there I was having my

485
00:23:58,920 --> 00:24:01,080
Speaker 1: dinner or lunch there at least you were three or

486
00:24:01,080 --> 00:24:03,520
Speaker 1: four times a week. That was. That was when I

487
00:24:03,520 --> 00:24:05,480
Speaker 1: got a decent meal and I got to learn a

488
00:24:05,480 --> 00:24:08,360
Speaker 1: lot of things about what was on your menu. So

489
00:24:08,680 --> 00:24:12,439
Speaker 1: my first introduction to the place called Cape Brim in

490
00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:15,720
Speaker 1: Australias at the bottom of Tasmani, which is where you

491
00:24:15,760 --> 00:24:19,520
Speaker 1: get you're getting mistakes from with your beef. And then

492
00:24:19,520 --> 00:24:21,840
Speaker 1: I started learning about grass fed as well. It wasn't

493
00:24:21,840 --> 00:24:25,880
Speaker 1: a thing for me, but I, like I normally would

494
00:24:25,920 --> 00:24:27,560
Speaker 1: do this. I went and research Cape Grim and I

495
00:24:27,560 --> 00:24:30,640
Speaker 1: found out that the water that falls from the sky

496
00:24:30,640 --> 00:24:32,680
Speaker 1: in Cape Grim is the cleanest water in the fl

497
00:24:33,720 --> 00:24:35,040
Speaker 1: but measured measure.

498
00:24:35,080 --> 00:24:38,080
Speaker 2: Measure, I may actually bottle water. I don't know if

499
00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:38,320
Speaker 2: you have.

500
00:24:38,560 --> 00:24:40,840
Speaker 1: I have people who bottled water. Comes and saw me

501
00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:43,359
Speaker 1: and asked me investing in the business, which I mean

502
00:24:43,359 --> 00:24:45,160
Speaker 1: I didn't. It was I did invest in because at

503
00:24:45,160 --> 00:24:47,240
Speaker 1: that stage I had bottle the water was in plastic bottles.

504
00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:47,399
Speaker 2: Yea.

505
00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:49,919
Speaker 1: They actually went to glass bottles and they ended up

506
00:24:49,920 --> 00:24:51,600
Speaker 1: being on one of the airlines.

507
00:24:51,160 --> 00:24:53,240
Speaker 2: I come from the while for.

508
00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:56,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I don't know whatever happened to them, but

509
00:24:56,600 --> 00:24:58,920
Speaker 1: I was quite impressed the fact that I thought, and

510
00:24:59,040 --> 00:25:01,119
Speaker 1: I actually worked at when I went down saw it

511
00:25:01,119 --> 00:25:04,240
Speaker 1: as how the water was collected from the rain, et cetera,

512
00:25:04,480 --> 00:25:07,679
Speaker 1: and then it was filtered, et cetera through light filtration.

513
00:25:07,880 --> 00:25:09,920
Speaker 1: But then I thought of himself, well, if the cows

514
00:25:09,920 --> 00:25:13,520
Speaker 1: are eating the grass that this water is water, he's

515
00:25:13,520 --> 00:25:16,920
Speaker 1: got to be fantastic. And I then started buying Cape Grim.

516
00:25:16,960 --> 00:25:19,679
Speaker 1: I know that Harris Farm sells Cape Grim and now

517
00:25:19,800 --> 00:25:22,240
Speaker 1: yeah they do. Now you can get creat Cape Grim. Yeah.

518
00:25:22,280 --> 00:25:25,240
Speaker 2: I think there's a few butchers around now and there's

519
00:25:25,280 --> 00:25:28,960
Speaker 2: more more and more the you know, they're they're they're

520
00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:32,360
Speaker 2: a big producer now because they've they've brought a few

521
00:25:32,400 --> 00:25:33,680
Speaker 2: farms into the co op.

522
00:25:33,800 --> 00:25:34,760
Speaker 1: Yeah a co op.

523
00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:38,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, we're the and and to be Cape Grimm,

524
00:25:39,280 --> 00:25:41,880
Speaker 2: they need to be, you know, thirty six months, a

525
00:25:41,920 --> 00:25:46,480
Speaker 2: fully mature cow, older, better flavor profile. So one of

526
00:25:46,520 --> 00:25:49,040
Speaker 2: the reasons why I did that, So to get back

527
00:25:49,040 --> 00:25:50,719
Speaker 2: to the reason why I ended up with a restaurant

528
00:25:50,720 --> 00:25:52,960
Speaker 2: called rock Pool, and then one called Rockpool bar and grill,

529
00:25:53,760 --> 00:25:56,640
Speaker 2: John Alexander and James Packer when they decided to redo

530
00:25:56,880 --> 00:25:59,520
Speaker 2: the casino up just after James and Kerry had bought

531
00:25:59,560 --> 00:26:03,240
Speaker 2: it down in Melbourne. That you know, John had and

532
00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:07,960
Speaker 2: John Ja was really one of the most instrumental you

533
00:26:07,960 --> 00:26:11,560
Speaker 2: talk about. Leo Ja started the Good Food Guide and

534
00:26:12,320 --> 00:26:15,680
Speaker 2: started he was at Fairfax and then when he went

535
00:26:15,840 --> 00:26:21,359
Speaker 2: and ran ACP Magazines, he started the Restaurant Awards and

536
00:26:21,760 --> 00:26:25,719
Speaker 2: Restaurant of the Year for Gourmet. So that became massive

537
00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:29,120
Speaker 2: under his watch. So twice he's really created the two

538
00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:31,600
Speaker 2: definitive restaurant guides in Australia.

539
00:26:31,240 --> 00:26:36,639
Speaker 1: Another another aesthetically perfection seeking person and everything.

540
00:26:37,400 --> 00:26:40,359
Speaker 2: Absolutely And so they got me down there and there

541
00:26:40,359 --> 00:26:42,800
Speaker 2: were a number of restaurants that they showed me and

542
00:26:43,160 --> 00:26:46,080
Speaker 2: then John John a number of spaces I should say,

543
00:26:46,080 --> 00:26:49,320
Speaker 2: because there was spaces being converted there were existing restaurants. Uh.

544
00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:52,119
Speaker 2: And we went to Chiconi's, which is a beautiful restaurant,

545
00:26:52,800 --> 00:26:55,639
Speaker 2: and we sat there at dinner. I remember John Ordo

546
00:26:55,680 --> 00:26:58,240
Speaker 2: Bottle of Tinonello, which is one of my favorite Italian reads.

547
00:26:58,359 --> 00:27:01,639
Speaker 2: So we drank that. I just loved the space. I

548
00:27:01,640 --> 00:27:03,639
Speaker 2: got in the elevator with him, you know, pressed the

549
00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:06,160
Speaker 2: buttons going up and I said, mate, if you give

550
00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:10,120
Speaker 2: me that space, I'll come down tomorrow. And he said

551
00:27:10,119 --> 00:27:12,520
Speaker 2: to me, well, that's not really one of the spaces

552
00:27:12,520 --> 00:27:14,840
Speaker 2: because they're very happy. It was Lloyd's favorite restaurant, which

553
00:27:14,880 --> 00:27:18,200
Speaker 2: is another thing that Lloyd Williams and Lloyd was a

554
00:27:18,240 --> 00:27:24,480
Speaker 2: great James mentor and Kerry yeah, and so so anyway,

555
00:27:24,480 --> 00:27:25,879
Speaker 2: I've got to call. Three days later, I said, it's

556
00:27:25,920 --> 00:27:28,080
Speaker 2: yours if you want it. So that started the whole

557
00:27:28,119 --> 00:27:30,719
Speaker 2: idea and then as we as we got closer. So

558
00:27:30,760 --> 00:27:33,040
Speaker 2: it's a big space, right, So rockpools one hundred seed

559
00:27:33,080 --> 00:27:36,280
Speaker 2: restaurant fine dining, and that's pushing the envelope for size

560
00:27:36,280 --> 00:27:39,680
Speaker 2: for fine dining, and this is like a two hundred

561
00:27:39,680 --> 00:27:43,520
Speaker 2: and forty seed restaurant. And so he said to me, look,

562
00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:46,080
Speaker 2: you know, we're really investing in the name Rockpool because

563
00:27:46,080 --> 00:27:47,800
Speaker 2: we were in the top fifty restaurants in the world

564
00:27:47,800 --> 00:27:50,760
Speaker 2: at that stage. We'd finished second, fourth, and eighth and

565
00:27:51,320 --> 00:27:54,240
Speaker 2: sixteenth in the first three years. Just before we opened

566
00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:57,600
Speaker 2: in Melbourne. He said, you can do anything you like

567
00:27:57,680 --> 00:28:00,000
Speaker 2: with it, but it's got to have the name rock

568
00:28:00,119 --> 00:28:03,320
Speaker 2: Pull because that's the brand we're investing in right. So

569
00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:07,240
Speaker 2: straight away my thought went to I've always wanted to

570
00:28:07,280 --> 00:28:11,439
Speaker 2: open a steakhouse because my dad was a butcher. Meat's

571
00:28:11,440 --> 00:28:13,720
Speaker 2: always been incredibly important to me. And the only reason

572
00:28:13,760 --> 00:28:16,800
Speaker 2: Rockpool ended up a seafood restaurant is when I opened

573
00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:18,560
Speaker 2: it at eighty nine, I couldn't get the quality of

574
00:28:18,600 --> 00:28:21,840
Speaker 2: beef consistently. I wanted to, well the time. Fast forward

575
00:28:21,920 --> 00:28:25,080
Speaker 2: to two thousand and five, two thousand and six, and

576
00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:30,679
Speaker 2: you know there's different. There's David Blackmore, there's Cape Grim,

577
00:28:30,800 --> 00:28:34,360
Speaker 2: and I wanted to. I tasted older beef in in Europe,

578
00:28:34,440 --> 00:28:36,560
Speaker 2: old dairy cowse. I came back with that in mind

579
00:28:36,600 --> 00:28:39,520
Speaker 2: when I found Cape Grim, so roppul Bar and Grill

580
00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:42,880
Speaker 2: was born steak restaurant. I've always loved great seafood, so

581
00:28:42,880 --> 00:28:45,800
Speaker 2: I bought my fish supplies down with me. So I

582
00:28:45,840 --> 00:28:48,240
Speaker 2: think I created one of the great modern steakhouses in

583
00:28:48,280 --> 00:28:50,280
Speaker 2: the world because none of you have the best beef,

584
00:28:50,800 --> 00:28:54,200
Speaker 2: dry aged and butchered on the premises. But I also

585
00:28:54,280 --> 00:28:57,880
Speaker 2: had amazing fish coming in, you know, dry fillted straight

586
00:28:57,920 --> 00:29:02,840
Speaker 2: on the grill and came very became a Melbourne institution

587
00:29:02,960 --> 00:29:04,160
Speaker 2: within three months of opening.

588
00:29:04,160 --> 00:29:07,120
Speaker 1: It was I didn't realize that before the Sydney one. Yeah.

589
00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:08,960
Speaker 2: Then the Sydney one opened a bit later.

590
00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:10,920
Speaker 1: Okay, okay, I didn't realize it. And that was all

591
00:29:10,920 --> 00:29:14,000
Speaker 1: part of the casino well of the Melbourne Casina.

592
00:29:14,080 --> 00:29:16,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, And then we ended up with Spice Temple

593
00:29:16,720 --> 00:29:18,320
Speaker 2: down there as well, and.

594
00:29:18,360 --> 00:29:22,160
Speaker 1: Rosetta, which unfortunately recently closed, Yeah, which is a shame,

595
00:29:22,240 --> 00:29:23,360
Speaker 1: such a beautiful restaurant.

596
00:29:23,400 --> 00:29:25,560
Speaker 2: I did that with John Alexander. I mean, they spent

597
00:29:25,680 --> 00:29:29,120
Speaker 2: eight million dollars on it back in twenty eleven, so

598
00:29:29,360 --> 00:29:31,800
Speaker 2: I don't think you could get that much marble today.

599
00:29:31,800 --> 00:29:35,280
Speaker 1: It was insane, no way, no way. So opened a

600
00:29:35,360 --> 00:29:38,480
Speaker 1: rock pool here in Syney then. And I always wanted

601
00:29:38,520 --> 00:29:40,840
Speaker 1: to know how you went about because obviously you don't

602
00:29:40,840 --> 00:29:43,400
Speaker 1: cook every steak in every bit of fish. No how

603
00:29:43,400 --> 00:29:46,440
Speaker 1: you went about setting the menu? How do you go

604
00:29:46,440 --> 00:29:48,480
Speaker 1: about sidny menu? Do you sit down as a collaborative

605
00:29:48,480 --> 00:29:49,680
Speaker 1: thing with your stuff?

606
00:29:49,720 --> 00:29:53,840
Speaker 2: When I start a restaurant, I always write the menu

607
00:29:53,920 --> 00:29:57,480
Speaker 2: and keep that pretty tight control. I will do some

608
00:29:57,560 --> 00:30:00,960
Speaker 2: collaboration after some period of time. I see the guys

609
00:30:00,960 --> 00:30:05,160
Speaker 2: and see how they cook, and that they've come into

610
00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:07,840
Speaker 2: thinking about food the way that I do. Because about

611
00:30:07,880 --> 00:30:10,280
Speaker 2: craft of cooking. It's about really great seasoning, and it's

612
00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:13,080
Speaker 2: about really looking after the produce and cooking it beautifully.

613
00:30:13,080 --> 00:30:16,760
Speaker 2: And so, you know, the whole restaurant business is a

614
00:30:16,840 --> 00:30:20,360
Speaker 2: very collaborative business. You know, it's not about one person,

615
00:30:20,440 --> 00:30:23,000
Speaker 2: it's about the collective. And you really are as strong

616
00:30:23,040 --> 00:30:25,920
Speaker 2: as the you know, if the kitchen hands fall over

617
00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:28,720
Speaker 2: and the wet area goes to the shit, then you know,

618
00:30:28,800 --> 00:30:31,360
Speaker 2: the whole restaurants and the shit. It's basically very simple.

619
00:30:31,640 --> 00:30:33,440
Speaker 2: You know, if you've got a great team and the

620
00:30:33,440 --> 00:30:36,800
Speaker 2: whole team's pulling together, you can create this great memory

621
00:30:36,800 --> 00:30:40,200
Speaker 2: for people. So for me, especially having come from front

622
00:30:40,200 --> 00:30:42,040
Speaker 2: of house for seven years into the back of house,

623
00:30:42,160 --> 00:30:44,800
Speaker 2: was always trying to be one team as opposed to

624
00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:46,400
Speaker 2: us and them. It was very much a front of

625
00:30:46,400 --> 00:30:48,000
Speaker 2: house and back of house when I first started in

626
00:30:48,080 --> 00:30:50,640
Speaker 2: the in the eighties, and I always tried to change that.

627
00:30:50,760 --> 00:30:53,400
Speaker 2: So for me, you know, it was getting the best

628
00:30:53,440 --> 00:30:56,240
Speaker 2: chefs around me, communicating them how I felt about food,

629
00:30:56,400 --> 00:31:00,880
Speaker 2: teaching them about taste, seasoning, simplicity, teaching them about sourcing,

630
00:31:00,920 --> 00:31:05,560
Speaker 2: produced relationships, about caring about each other, the whole staff

631
00:31:05,600 --> 00:31:09,640
Speaker 2: a lot. My whole caring philosophy. The core of it

632
00:31:09,720 --> 00:31:13,720
Speaker 2: really is about caring about each other. So for us

633
00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:16,320
Speaker 2: and for my business, what I do and I did

634
00:31:16,320 --> 00:31:18,400
Speaker 2: it at Rockpool, we knew it. Now do it at Margaret,

635
00:31:18,400 --> 00:31:20,440
Speaker 2: which we call Margaret Family because my wife Sam and

636
00:31:20,440 --> 00:31:22,880
Speaker 2: I own the business and we don't really have any

637
00:31:22,920 --> 00:31:27,000
Speaker 2: other shareholders, which is awesome. We really want to make

638
00:31:27,000 --> 00:31:29,480
Speaker 2: the people who work for us better people. I mean,

639
00:31:29,640 --> 00:31:31,480
Speaker 2: you know, I'm definitely trying to make you a better cook.

640
00:31:31,480 --> 00:31:33,320
Speaker 2: I'm definitely going to make you a better Surmaria. I'm

641
00:31:33,320 --> 00:31:35,360
Speaker 2: trying to make you a better manager, a waiter, whatever

642
00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:37,560
Speaker 2: you're doing. But I'd really like to make you a

643
00:31:37,560 --> 00:31:39,840
Speaker 2: better person as well. I'd like you to be much

644
00:31:39,880 --> 00:31:45,440
Speaker 2: more aware about the environment. Community politically activated, because you know,

645
00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:49,120
Speaker 2: the younger generation are the ones that hopefully our generation

646
00:31:49,200 --> 00:31:51,080
Speaker 2: suck the marrow out of the world. So I'm hoping

647
00:31:51,440 --> 00:31:54,240
Speaker 2: that enough of these young people get invigorated that they

648
00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:56,040
Speaker 2: can try and change it and take it back. So

649
00:31:57,200 --> 00:31:59,479
Speaker 2: and I try to make them feel like they've got

650
00:31:59,520 --> 00:32:01,080
Speaker 2: to look after each other and care for each other,

651
00:32:01,080 --> 00:32:03,160
Speaker 2: and whether that's in a work sense or a personal sense,

652
00:32:03,200 --> 00:32:05,040
Speaker 2: whether that's you know, are you okay or can I

653
00:32:05,080 --> 00:32:07,560
Speaker 2: help you. So they are the sort of things that

654
00:32:08,120 --> 00:32:11,960
Speaker 2: I think create a really well rounded organization. And for me,

655
00:32:12,760 --> 00:32:15,000
Speaker 2: the one thing I'm most proud of, probably in the

656
00:32:15,200 --> 00:32:18,000
Speaker 2: in the the span of my career is it's a

657
00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:20,120
Speaker 2: long one, but I've had a lot of people that

658
00:32:20,160 --> 00:32:22,200
Speaker 2: have stayed with me for a very very long period

659
00:32:22,240 --> 00:32:24,800
Speaker 2: of time, and I think that comes down to the

660
00:32:24,840 --> 00:32:25,920
Speaker 2: culture that we create.

661
00:32:26,320 --> 00:32:30,200
Speaker 1: How would you describe yourself? I mean, you know, we're inundated.

662
00:32:30,320 --> 00:32:32,840
Speaker 1: Describe yourself in the kitchen that is, or describe yourself

663
00:32:32,840 --> 00:32:34,640
Speaker 1: in the business, but particularly in the kitchen because we

664
00:32:34,720 --> 00:32:38,160
Speaker 1: see you know, we know Gordon Rams like goods, but

665
00:32:38,200 --> 00:32:39,400
Speaker 1: that's his TV persona too.

666
00:32:39,560 --> 00:32:41,760
Speaker 2: No, no, no, that's his stick right, that's he's a

667
00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:42,440
Speaker 2: really nice guy.

668
00:32:42,440 --> 00:32:44,880
Speaker 1: But how would you correct? So how would you describe

669
00:32:44,920 --> 00:32:47,160
Speaker 1: yourself in the kitchen environment?

670
00:32:48,040 --> 00:32:50,680
Speaker 2: I think my but no, not at all. I think

671
00:32:50,720 --> 00:32:52,600
Speaker 2: my whole approach is kind of one of kind of

672
00:32:52,600 --> 00:32:55,520
Speaker 2: building people's confidence rather knocking them down. I'm always talking

673
00:32:55,520 --> 00:32:59,000
Speaker 2: to my guys about, you know, in the heat of service,

674
00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:03,080
Speaker 2: because it's a it's a stressful, full on environment. If

675
00:33:03,200 --> 00:33:06,040
Speaker 2: you just take your stress and put onto somebody else,

676
00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:10,080
Speaker 2: you're not diffusing the bomb right, it's actually creating bigger explosion.

677
00:33:10,600 --> 00:33:13,560
Speaker 2: So so you know, you really like to start yelling

678
00:33:13,600 --> 00:33:16,360
Speaker 2: at people in the middle of service just creates the bottlenecks.

679
00:33:16,400 --> 00:33:18,680
Speaker 2: But to sit down with people ask us that you know,

680
00:33:18,800 --> 00:33:21,480
Speaker 2: that really wasn't good enough. You know we're better than that.

681
00:33:21,600 --> 00:33:24,520
Speaker 2: You know that wasn't cook properly, or the timing wasn't right,

682
00:33:24,680 --> 00:33:26,880
Speaker 2: or you know, come on, guys, you know the order

683
00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:29,320
Speaker 2: was completely wrong. If you walk up to a waiter

684
00:33:29,360 --> 00:33:31,160
Speaker 2: in the middle of service and start brating him like

685
00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:33,520
Speaker 2: you've got ten tables to look after, you're not going

686
00:33:33,560 --> 00:33:35,800
Speaker 2: to be in the right mental sort of space. So

687
00:33:36,160 --> 00:33:39,640
Speaker 2: my philosopher always is always about talking about things at

688
00:33:39,680 --> 00:33:43,560
Speaker 2: the right time. It's much more meaningful, you know, you know,

689
00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:46,600
Speaker 2: you know, really really walking towards the tension. So if

690
00:33:46,640 --> 00:33:48,560
Speaker 2: you see that there's a problem, you get to it

691
00:33:48,680 --> 00:33:52,280
Speaker 2: quickly and have a conversation before it becomes you know,

692
00:33:52,640 --> 00:33:55,920
Speaker 2: boils over into into a bigger issue. And also, I

693
00:33:56,000 --> 00:33:58,280
Speaker 2: just always think that if I can only really affect

694
00:33:58,280 --> 00:34:02,160
Speaker 2: myself and my mood, So when I'm doing these openings

695
00:34:02,240 --> 00:34:06,479
Speaker 2: or I'm I'm in the restaurant, you know, it's really

696
00:34:06,840 --> 00:34:09,160
Speaker 2: what can I do well. I can control myself. I

697
00:34:09,160 --> 00:34:11,160
Speaker 2: can take a couple of deep breaths. I can go

698
00:34:11,200 --> 00:34:14,240
Speaker 2: and help that person get under control. I can diffuse

699
00:34:14,320 --> 00:34:17,920
Speaker 2: this situation. But I can't do anything about all the

700
00:34:17,920 --> 00:34:20,160
Speaker 2: stuff that's happening around me, So I have to stay calm.

701
00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:22,920
Speaker 2: If I get caught up in all the chamozol that's

702
00:34:22,920 --> 00:34:26,120
Speaker 2: happening around then you know, it doesn't do anything but

703
00:34:26,160 --> 00:34:29,000
Speaker 2: sort of derail where I'm at. So my kind of

704
00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:33,200
Speaker 2: philosophy is more I suppose then I don't really find

705
00:34:33,239 --> 00:34:35,799
Speaker 2: I don't really find it a positive thing to be

706
00:34:35,800 --> 00:34:39,200
Speaker 2: berating people or bringing people down or belittling people like

707
00:34:39,280 --> 00:34:42,120
Speaker 2: some chefs do. But you know, sometimes that culture has

708
00:34:42,200 --> 00:34:44,880
Speaker 2: learned the chefs will will live through that and they

709
00:34:44,920 --> 00:34:48,319
Speaker 2: think that that's the way to behave that. Yeah, and

710
00:34:48,360 --> 00:34:50,560
Speaker 2: it's not really. I mean, I came from the front

711
00:34:50,560 --> 00:34:53,040
Speaker 2: of house, so I'm more, you know, kind of working

712
00:34:53,080 --> 00:34:55,440
Speaker 2: out sort of how's the customer feeling, how to look

713
00:34:55,440 --> 00:34:57,080
Speaker 2: after the customer, how to get my team to come

714
00:34:57,080 --> 00:34:59,040
Speaker 2: with me, how to get the best out of the chef.

715
00:34:59,160 --> 00:35:02,239
Speaker 2: So even though most people would say I'm a chef,

716
00:35:02,280 --> 00:35:05,440
Speaker 2: I always think of myself as a restauranteur first and foremost,

717
00:35:05,680 --> 00:35:07,359
Speaker 2: and I'm lucky that I can cook and I have

718
00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:10,360
Speaker 2: a really great passion for food because that stops any

719
00:35:10,800 --> 00:35:13,120
Speaker 2: chef or kitchen, you know, from trying to stand over

720
00:35:13,200 --> 00:35:16,239
Speaker 2: me or because I'm able to run all of it.

721
00:35:16,360 --> 00:35:19,560
Speaker 2: So for me, I guess I'm in a really unique

722
00:35:19,560 --> 00:35:21,920
Speaker 2: position that I kind of learned front of house and

723
00:35:21,960 --> 00:35:24,400
Speaker 2: I learned how to be a restaurant to I've got

724
00:35:24,440 --> 00:35:27,920
Speaker 2: a really, i guess, a really strong philosophy on how

725
00:35:27,960 --> 00:35:30,319
Speaker 2: I get people to come with me and grow them

726
00:35:30,360 --> 00:35:32,960
Speaker 2: and grow with them. And then I've got a really

727
00:35:33,160 --> 00:35:37,040
Speaker 2: great background in food and essentially with the restaurant and menus.

728
00:35:37,480 --> 00:35:41,040
Speaker 2: I only cook what I like, So I don't think, oh, what,

729
00:35:41,160 --> 00:35:42,920
Speaker 2: you know, what would a critic like, or what is

730
00:35:43,600 --> 00:35:45,680
Speaker 2: what would these guys like to eat. I actually cook

731
00:35:45,719 --> 00:35:48,080
Speaker 2: the food that I really love, and I've been lucky

732
00:35:48,160 --> 00:35:51,600
Speaker 2: enough that people love eating it, you know, because people

733
00:35:51,640 --> 00:35:53,600
Speaker 2: look at my large menu and go, what's your favorite dish?

734
00:35:53,640 --> 00:35:56,440
Speaker 2: Like everyone's my favorite dish, they wouldn't be on the menu,

735
00:35:56,920 --> 00:35:58,520
Speaker 2: you know. I don't put things on a menu that

736
00:35:58,560 --> 00:36:00,000
Speaker 2: I don't love to eat, and when I eat it,

737
00:36:00,080 --> 00:36:02,920
Speaker 2: my restaurants over all over the menu all the time,

738
00:36:03,400 --> 00:36:06,439
Speaker 2: because all of those things, you know, excite me. They're

739
00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:09,920
Speaker 2: all they're all beautiful produce and tastes great and seasoned.

740
00:36:09,960 --> 00:36:12,760
Speaker 1: Well, you know, when I now that I've been spending

741
00:36:12,800 --> 00:36:15,480
Speaker 1: a bit more time with you and just outside of restaurants,

742
00:36:15,520 --> 00:36:16,320
Speaker 1: and one of the things that, by the way, I

743
00:36:16,320 --> 00:36:18,759
Speaker 1: should always notice, I always notice that you're always on

744
00:36:18,760 --> 00:36:20,919
Speaker 1: the floor. Whatever you want, you always to be seen.

745
00:36:20,960 --> 00:36:22,600
Speaker 1: I can see you all the time I've seen you

746
00:36:22,800 --> 00:36:25,279
Speaker 1: at the restaurants. You are always there. You're not sort

747
00:36:25,280 --> 00:36:27,360
Speaker 1: of stand off as you're sitting up the top somewhere,

748
00:36:27,440 --> 00:36:30,160
Speaker 1: you know, watching the cash register or whatever. You're always there.

749
00:36:30,360 --> 00:36:33,200
Speaker 1: But one of my one of my observations about Neil Perry,

750
00:36:34,080 --> 00:36:37,759
Speaker 1: apart from many thousands of observations about you, is that

751
00:36:38,239 --> 00:36:42,359
Speaker 1: I would say you're a nutrition researcher. In other words,

752
00:36:42,400 --> 00:36:46,040
Speaker 1: how do I make nutrition tasty? Researching it like hit

753
00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:48,240
Speaker 1: all the things on your tongue, all the taste senses

754
00:36:48,239 --> 00:36:51,359
Speaker 1: on your tongue. But probably in addition to that, I'll

755
00:36:51,360 --> 00:36:53,400
Speaker 1: see you as a public educator, because you know, I

756
00:36:53,480 --> 00:36:56,040
Speaker 1: was just thinking to myself, what you do is you

757
00:36:56,080 --> 00:37:02,240
Speaker 1: bring to the public through you know, things you publish

758
00:37:02,560 --> 00:37:05,960
Speaker 1: through television or through radio, or through you know, magazines

759
00:37:06,000 --> 00:37:08,720
Speaker 1: or wherever you want to write. Over the overall period

760
00:37:08,760 --> 00:37:13,239
Speaker 1: of time, you you are educating. Whether it's purposely or not,

761
00:37:13,360 --> 00:37:16,440
Speaker 1: I don't know, but you are educating us on grass

762
00:37:16,480 --> 00:37:19,520
Speaker 1: fed meat, best places to source it from. You know

763
00:37:19,600 --> 00:37:21,800
Speaker 1: what a great fish is, what a king George Whiting

764
00:37:21,840 --> 00:37:25,440
Speaker 1: from Adelaida? I remember they're called what particular coffin? I

765
00:37:25,719 --> 00:37:27,399
Speaker 1: always is like if they're do you know other types

766
00:37:27,400 --> 00:37:31,160
Speaker 1: of voices you're education. You've been educating us about food

767
00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:34,240
Speaker 1: and the sources of food, particularly here in Australia. You know, Lika,

768
00:37:34,880 --> 00:37:37,120
Speaker 1: do you see yourself as a having an obligation to

769
00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:40,399
Speaker 1: be a public educator? But they're not an official.

770
00:37:40,080 --> 00:37:44,200
Speaker 2: Sense, but no, But it's something I really enjoy doing.

771
00:37:44,239 --> 00:37:47,200
Speaker 2: But I very much saw myself as that. I mean,

772
00:37:47,239 --> 00:37:50,200
Speaker 2: you know, had the Good Weekend and Good Food column

773
00:37:50,280 --> 00:37:52,719
Speaker 2: for best part of twenty years. And I think I've

774
00:37:52,760 --> 00:37:55,879
Speaker 2: been twelve books or whatever it might be. Pretty much

775
00:37:55,880 --> 00:37:58,600
Speaker 2: every single book starts out with, you know, the philosophy

776
00:37:58,640 --> 00:38:01,680
Speaker 2: of good cooking is good shop. So you know that's that.

777
00:38:01,840 --> 00:38:05,120
Speaker 2: I've always talked about the quality of ingredients and completely

778
00:38:05,200 --> 00:38:08,640
Speaker 2: understand financial pressures, but the reality of is you better

779
00:38:08,680 --> 00:38:12,040
Speaker 2: to eat less less of something but better quality than

780
00:38:12,800 --> 00:38:15,680
Speaker 2: a lot of something that's not great? So so well.

781
00:38:15,760 --> 00:38:18,680
Speaker 1: Can I still why you mean from a from a

782
00:38:18,680 --> 00:38:21,080
Speaker 1: taste point of or from a nutritional point well.

783
00:38:20,840 --> 00:38:22,759
Speaker 2: But from both actually, and I think you know, one

784
00:38:22,800 --> 00:38:25,759
Speaker 2: of the things that we've also worked hard from an

785
00:38:26,239 --> 00:38:29,319
Speaker 2: educational standpoint is things like waste. You know, it's sort

786
00:38:29,320 --> 00:38:32,520
Speaker 2: of like, you know, a third of everything that's ground

787
00:38:32,600 --> 00:38:35,440
Speaker 2: basically gets either plowed back into the ground or buried

788
00:38:35,480 --> 00:38:38,600
Speaker 2: in landfill. And you know, people fill their fridges up

789
00:38:38,640 --> 00:38:41,520
Speaker 2: with food that they don't eat or need. And so

790
00:38:42,080 --> 00:38:44,520
Speaker 2: you know, diligent shopping and knowing what you want and

791
00:38:45,840 --> 00:38:49,840
Speaker 2: investing in high quality means that you are utilizing everything

792
00:38:49,920 --> 00:38:51,879
Speaker 2: that you have and you're not wasting, and you don't

793
00:38:51,880 --> 00:38:54,880
Speaker 2: really end up spending much more money. But yeah, you know,

794
00:38:54,920 --> 00:38:58,360
Speaker 2: you're better off to eat you know, four hundred grams

795
00:38:58,440 --> 00:39:00,439
Speaker 2: or two hundred and fifty grams are really good meat

796
00:39:00,480 --> 00:39:04,120
Speaker 2: every week, then you are at a kilo of you know, rubbish,

797
00:39:04,320 --> 00:39:06,160
Speaker 2: and then have a couple of nice pieces of fish

798
00:39:06,160 --> 00:39:09,359
Speaker 2: and eat vegetables. And you know, people always say to me, oh,

799
00:39:09,920 --> 00:39:12,520
Speaker 2: you know, you're a really great chef. But you know,

800
00:39:12,560 --> 00:39:14,919
Speaker 2: how do you stay in shape and do you work

801
00:39:14,920 --> 00:39:16,480
Speaker 2: out and as well? I don't really, but I do

802
00:39:16,480 --> 00:39:18,719
Speaker 2: about twenty thousand steps a day between the restaurants and

803
00:39:18,719 --> 00:39:22,000
Speaker 2: the kitchens and whatever. But I eat really well, you know.

804
00:39:22,120 --> 00:39:24,280
Speaker 2: I drink really well as well. I drink great wine.

805
00:39:24,440 --> 00:39:25,960
Speaker 2: But I eat really well.

806
00:39:26,000 --> 00:39:26,120
Speaker 1: You know.

807
00:39:26,120 --> 00:39:28,160
Speaker 2: I eat a lot of vegetables and a lot of seafood.

808
00:39:29,000 --> 00:39:33,160
Speaker 2: I'll probably eat just vegetarian style food three four nights a.

809
00:39:33,120 --> 00:39:37,120
Speaker 1: Week as both then that there's no protein.

810
00:39:36,800 --> 00:39:39,839
Speaker 2: No protein, yeah, And then I'll eat fish and I'll

811
00:39:40,200 --> 00:39:43,040
Speaker 2: meet once a week maybe, but it'll be a beautiful steak.

812
00:39:44,040 --> 00:39:45,640
Speaker 1: And will you cook it yourself?

813
00:39:45,719 --> 00:39:47,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'll cook it myself a lot of the time.

814
00:39:48,160 --> 00:39:51,480
Speaker 2: And I'll eat at the restaurants, and I have family

815
00:39:51,520 --> 00:39:53,960
Speaker 2: meal at least three or four nights a week. So

816
00:39:54,200 --> 00:39:56,360
Speaker 2: the great thing about that is family meals at five.

817
00:39:57,120 --> 00:40:00,680
Speaker 2: Now I get to choose between Songbird or or Margaret,

818
00:40:01,200 --> 00:40:05,320
Speaker 2: depending on what I feel like. But but what family

819
00:40:05,360 --> 00:40:08,479
Speaker 2: meal is when the entire restaurant sits down front house

820
00:40:08,520 --> 00:40:10,279
Speaker 2: and kitchen, and even if there's people still in the

821
00:40:10,280 --> 00:40:12,480
Speaker 2: restaurant dining, we just tell them we're having family meal,

822
00:40:12,520 --> 00:40:15,879
Speaker 2: and that's I'll break. I feed them stuff stuff, yeah,

823
00:40:15,960 --> 00:40:17,600
Speaker 2: and then and then they get up and they work

824
00:40:18,360 --> 00:40:20,720
Speaker 2: the night. That's their break, and then their their meal.

825
00:40:20,760 --> 00:40:22,959
Speaker 2: And you know, we get bread out of Baker Blue

826
00:40:23,400 --> 00:40:26,480
Speaker 2: and family meals planned. We don't. It's not leftovers. It's

827
00:40:26,719 --> 00:40:28,920
Speaker 2: a planned meal. We buy producing and we cook it.

828
00:40:29,800 --> 00:40:32,120
Speaker 2: But the good thing about that is that I eat

829
00:40:32,120 --> 00:40:34,399
Speaker 2: that at five o'clock and I really don't eat again.

830
00:40:34,760 --> 00:40:37,319
Speaker 2: I mean, I'm tasting things and stuff, but you know,

831
00:40:37,560 --> 00:40:40,480
Speaker 2: really I think a really good a good plan for

832
00:40:40,760 --> 00:40:42,520
Speaker 2: healthy eating. And when I eat out, I eat at

833
00:40:42,840 --> 00:40:46,200
Speaker 2: six and seven and eight thirty and whatever. But you know,

834
00:40:46,200 --> 00:40:49,319
Speaker 2: if you're if you're eating early and you know you're

835
00:40:49,320 --> 00:40:52,320
Speaker 2: active because I'm still working, and you know, you're essentially

836
00:40:52,360 --> 00:40:54,960
Speaker 2: fasting for a good period of time, I think that

837
00:40:56,080 --> 00:40:59,080
Speaker 2: is a really good healthy lifestyle. And so I've been

838
00:40:59,120 --> 00:41:02,640
Speaker 2: able to maintain, you know, working two lifetimes in one

839
00:41:03,400 --> 00:41:08,160
Speaker 2: and stayed healthy and feeling good and active. I mean,

840
00:41:08,200 --> 00:41:10,120
Speaker 2: you know, I don't have much disk on L five

841
00:41:10,200 --> 00:41:14,560
Speaker 2: and I think nothing much on C six. But you know,

842
00:41:14,800 --> 00:41:17,319
Speaker 2: apart from that, you know, I've been really lucky. I'm

843
00:41:17,320 --> 00:41:19,600
Speaker 2: really healthy. I feel like active, I feel young. I

844
00:41:19,760 --> 00:41:22,080
Speaker 2: kind of. I always say to people and they say, oh,

845
00:41:22,080 --> 00:41:24,960
Speaker 2: how do you keep looking the same, And I kind

846
00:41:24,960 --> 00:41:27,480
Speaker 2: of I'm like a vampire. I live off the off

847
00:41:27,520 --> 00:41:31,840
Speaker 2: the inspiration and energy of all these amazing young people

848
00:41:31,840 --> 00:41:33,799
Speaker 2: who work for me, and I just think I'm the

849
00:41:33,800 --> 00:41:35,600
Speaker 2: same age as they are, you know, I never I

850
00:41:35,680 --> 00:41:37,759
Speaker 2: never kind of think, oh, you're in your sixties. I

851
00:41:37,800 --> 00:41:39,160
Speaker 2: just look at them and I think, well, I'm just

852
00:41:39,160 --> 00:41:40,040
Speaker 2: one of the pack, you know.

853
00:41:40,200 --> 00:41:44,719
Speaker 1: So it's it's interesting when you say that I saw

854
00:41:44,800 --> 00:41:49,319
Speaker 1: you about I think whenever a songbird, just that it's

855
00:41:49,360 --> 00:41:52,040
Speaker 1: a baud to open, yes before Father's Day? Oh yeah, right,

856
00:41:53,120 --> 00:41:55,120
Speaker 1: And I think I saw like it maybe on the Friday,

857
00:41:55,160 --> 00:41:57,560
Speaker 1: the Saturday and you're opening for Father's Day, din or

858
00:41:57,600 --> 00:41:58,680
Speaker 1: at lun't I come away?

859
00:41:58,760 --> 00:41:59,000
Speaker 2: Yeah it?

860
00:41:59,440 --> 00:42:02,400
Speaker 1: And and you look completely fucked.

861
00:42:02,440 --> 00:42:05,560
Speaker 2: Oh man, that was so first time in my life.

862
00:42:05,680 --> 00:42:07,200
Speaker 1: I want to talk to you about that. Like, and

863
00:42:07,280 --> 00:42:09,799
Speaker 1: you look like you look like you just come off

864
00:42:09,840 --> 00:42:14,799
Speaker 1: of rejuvenation programs. So they compare to then, so and

865
00:42:14,840 --> 00:42:17,200
Speaker 1: I guess you know, like everybody thinks, you know, the

866
00:42:17,320 --> 00:42:21,520
Speaker 1: restaurant industry and particularly what you're doing is glamorous and

867
00:42:21,560 --> 00:42:24,960
Speaker 1: it's fancy, and you've got great spaces, and the food's

868
00:42:24,960 --> 00:42:26,680
Speaker 1: all there, and it all just sort of happens. I

869
00:42:26,760 --> 00:42:31,040
Speaker 1: walk in, I eat the food and beautiful wines. But

870
00:42:31,120 --> 00:42:36,560
Speaker 1: let's just behind the scenes. Maybe we can use Songbird

871
00:42:36,600 --> 00:42:39,520
Speaker 1: as a proxy is as to where it can be

872
00:42:39,600 --> 00:42:44,160
Speaker 1: really fucking odd. What is it like to get yourself

873
00:42:44,200 --> 00:42:46,480
Speaker 1: ready for an opening day? Let's just take me through it. Now.

874
00:42:46,840 --> 00:42:50,080
Speaker 1: You're and my good friends, the meleks and the palaces

875
00:42:50,120 --> 00:42:52,959
Speaker 1: and all those we love them. We love them, Dove,

876
00:42:53,080 --> 00:42:55,239
Speaker 1: don't worry. We're not gonna We're not gonna pull you back.

877
00:42:55,560 --> 00:42:58,680
Speaker 2: Charles and Charles and Patrick and and and Dan have

878
00:42:58,719 --> 00:43:01,320
Speaker 2: been fabulous, like they're great laws. And we did really

879
00:43:01,360 --> 00:43:04,840
Speaker 2: awesome stuff together with Margaret and next Door and the bakery.

880
00:43:04,880 --> 00:43:06,360
Speaker 2: You know, it was really awesome. You know a lot

881
00:43:06,360 --> 00:43:10,280
Speaker 2: of people would say, well, the hardest, the hardest opening

882
00:43:10,520 --> 00:43:12,480
Speaker 2: must have been Margaret, because the night you were about

883
00:43:12,480 --> 00:43:16,160
Speaker 2: to open, all the produces there, everything's happening. We go

884
00:43:16,239 --> 00:43:19,600
Speaker 2: into lockdown for four months. The second lockdown, the very

885
00:43:19,719 --> 00:43:21,880
Speaker 2: night we were supposed to open, I had to cancel

886
00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:27,160
Speaker 2: sixteen thousand bookings. Well, so like we seen out, Yeah,

887
00:43:27,280 --> 00:43:31,520
Speaker 2: we knew like, we're like two weeks in, we knew

888
00:43:31,520 --> 00:43:33,200
Speaker 2: it was going to I thought it'd go on till,

889
00:43:33,360 --> 00:43:35,319
Speaker 2: you know, twenty twenty one. I didn't think we'd come

890
00:43:35,320 --> 00:43:39,520
Speaker 2: out as quickly. But obviously, you know, Gladys was amazing

891
00:43:39,560 --> 00:43:43,240
Speaker 2: getting driving and then dominic after that the whole program

892
00:43:43,280 --> 00:43:46,279
Speaker 2: with vaccination and so forth, and we were really leading

893
00:43:46,360 --> 00:43:50,800
Speaker 2: the country. But you know what happened then was incredible

894
00:43:50,800 --> 00:43:55,880
Speaker 2: because we basically went into this period of neutral and

895
00:43:55,880 --> 00:43:57,880
Speaker 2: we were doing anything. Two weeks in, I was like,

896
00:43:58,200 --> 00:44:00,400
Speaker 2: I had a dark week, and then I thought, hang on,

897
00:44:00,600 --> 00:44:02,520
Speaker 2: you just got to get up and get going. This

898
00:44:02,600 --> 00:44:04,880
Speaker 2: is like all your staff are relying on you. So

899
00:44:04,880 --> 00:44:06,719
Speaker 2: we got hold of everybody. We got them back in

900
00:44:06,800 --> 00:44:09,720
Speaker 2: Providore came to city, so we joined that. We started

901
00:44:09,719 --> 00:44:12,319
Speaker 2: selling burgers and all sorts of sandwiches and stuff at

902
00:44:12,360 --> 00:44:15,600
Speaker 2: lunchtime because it's lots of people down walking and so forth.

903
00:44:15,840 --> 00:44:18,040
Speaker 2: We'd do three hundred burgers in an hour and a

904
00:44:18,080 --> 00:44:19,480
Speaker 2: half every day.

905
00:44:19,280 --> 00:44:20,080
Speaker 1: Of the week.

906
00:44:20,560 --> 00:44:23,520
Speaker 2: But what that did, like for four months, we all

907
00:44:23,560 --> 00:44:25,920
Speaker 2: worked together. It was an amazing team, and we did

908
00:44:25,920 --> 00:44:28,520
Speaker 2: a full week of training before October thirteen when we

909
00:44:28,560 --> 00:44:32,439
Speaker 2: opened again. So that actually ended up being the best

910
00:44:32,480 --> 00:44:35,239
Speaker 2: restaurant opening that we've ever done, because we all just

911
00:44:35,320 --> 00:44:36,640
Speaker 2: knew each other so well.

912
00:44:36,520 --> 00:44:38,960
Speaker 1: Because you're starting place, because we'd worked.

913
00:44:38,800 --> 00:44:42,520
Speaker 2: Together for four months. Essentially, you know, it wasn't a restaurant,

914
00:44:42,520 --> 00:44:44,600
Speaker 2: but we were there, we knew each other, we were

915
00:44:44,600 --> 00:44:48,120
Speaker 2: cooking stuff in the kitchen. It was awesome. And then

916
00:44:48,400 --> 00:44:54,959
Speaker 2: what happened with Songbird and Bobby's is essentially the base

917
00:44:55,040 --> 00:44:57,400
Speaker 2: build ran late and I had to pick a date

918
00:44:57,560 --> 00:45:00,440
Speaker 2: and I sort of put a you, We're going to

919
00:45:00,480 --> 00:45:02,960
Speaker 2: open the weekend before Father's Day. We're going to do

920
00:45:03,000 --> 00:45:05,800
Speaker 2: two weeks worth of events. I've done this about twenty

921
00:45:05,840 --> 00:45:08,400
Speaker 2: times in my life, but but I've never missed it

922
00:45:08,400 --> 00:45:11,200
Speaker 2: by so far, and so coming in to where the

923
00:45:11,239 --> 00:45:13,880
Speaker 2: two weeks of events, So that's all about cash flow.

924
00:45:13,880 --> 00:45:16,120
Speaker 2: People are paying me to do events. We can do

925
00:45:16,160 --> 00:45:17,840
Speaker 2: events with our eyes closed. I mean I can go

926
00:45:17,880 --> 00:45:22,080
Speaker 2: into a thousand people and Martin Place with a set

927
00:45:22,160 --> 00:45:24,320
Speaker 2: up kitchen there and say take some of my team,

928
00:45:24,360 --> 00:45:26,759
Speaker 2: and you know, we've done it so many times. All

929
00:45:26,760 --> 00:45:29,200
Speaker 2: the catering I did at the MCA, you volume doesn't

930
00:45:29,200 --> 00:45:32,640
Speaker 2: worry me, so I knew we could do that. We

931
00:45:32,719 --> 00:45:35,480
Speaker 2: get cash flow and we're learning about the space and

932
00:45:35,520 --> 00:45:37,720
Speaker 2: we're working together. We did the same thing when we Margaret.

933
00:45:37,719 --> 00:45:40,080
Speaker 2: It was fantastic, great, great, great way to.

934
00:45:40,280 --> 00:45:42,560
Speaker 1: Learn, mean, the rhythm of how the building works.

935
00:45:42,640 --> 00:45:44,399
Speaker 2: Yeah, the rhythm of how the building works. And you're

936
00:45:44,440 --> 00:45:46,759
Speaker 2: working within it and you're working with customers, but you've

937
00:45:46,760 --> 00:45:50,720
Speaker 2: got to set menu and everything's kind of controllable because

938
00:45:50,760 --> 00:45:53,560
Speaker 2: it's because it's like a narrow and it's really narrow.

939
00:45:53,600 --> 00:45:57,040
Speaker 2: And after that two weeks you're in really good shape.

940
00:45:57,040 --> 00:45:58,720
Speaker 2: And then you put two or three more days training

941
00:45:58,760 --> 00:46:00,839
Speaker 2: into it and then you open and you're you know,

942
00:46:00,880 --> 00:46:04,160
Speaker 2: you're in a good space and everything's done, you're ready

943
00:46:04,200 --> 00:46:06,600
Speaker 2: and you're finished. Well, this was just an absolute nightmare

944
00:46:06,640 --> 00:46:10,040
Speaker 2: because I'm running into that two weeks we realize that

945
00:46:10,080 --> 00:46:12,160
Speaker 2: we're not going to be able to get oc. The

946
00:46:12,200 --> 00:46:15,800
Speaker 2: base builders are running late. Occupations, Yeah, occupacis of it.

947
00:46:15,880 --> 00:46:17,840
Speaker 2: Base builders are running really late. They were supposed to

948
00:46:17,840 --> 00:46:21,319
Speaker 2: finish in March, then April, then June, and the end

949
00:46:21,360 --> 00:46:24,200
Speaker 2: of June and July, then beginning of August, and then

950
00:46:24,440 --> 00:46:26,719
Speaker 2: they're finishing the same day that we're finishing, which is

951
00:46:26,760 --> 00:46:31,680
Speaker 2: like the thirtieth of August, and I've got to come

952
00:46:31,680 --> 00:46:34,360
Speaker 2: down it was a nightmare, so I had to cancel everything.

953
00:46:34,360 --> 00:46:36,720
Speaker 2: There's no training, couldn't get into the space. We're standing

954
00:46:36,800 --> 00:46:39,360
Speaker 2: in Margaret talking to the guys about the food and stuff,

955
00:46:39,360 --> 00:46:42,560
Speaker 2: but that doesn't help them in the in the space.

956
00:46:42,640 --> 00:46:44,560
Speaker 2: You know, we still haven't got the occupational ccific. I've

957
00:46:44,560 --> 00:46:46,680
Speaker 2: had to cancel all of these people who are like,

958
00:46:46,719 --> 00:46:49,520
Speaker 2: you know, my corporate friends, you know Quantas, fort Us,

959
00:46:50,960 --> 00:46:57,040
Speaker 2: iw C, Combank, Combank, Private, all the people that I

960
00:46:57,120 --> 00:47:00,239
Speaker 2: were doing these events for, and they were all doing

961
00:47:00,280 --> 00:47:02,279
Speaker 2: the pre opening and the soiling point for them was

962
00:47:02,320 --> 00:47:04,520
Speaker 2: that you know, you're going to get to see Sombird first.

963
00:47:05,080 --> 00:47:07,440
Speaker 2: So none of that's happening. We can't get in Bobby's

964
00:47:07,520 --> 00:47:09,759
Speaker 2: having him set the furniture up. We started to set

965
00:47:09,800 --> 00:47:12,239
Speaker 2: the furniture up. It's a songbird. We finally get the

966
00:47:12,239 --> 00:47:15,719
Speaker 2: occupational certificate after canceling the lunch bookings four point thirty

967
00:47:15,760 --> 00:47:19,000
Speaker 2: in the afternoon. We don't have the staircase at all,

968
00:47:19,080 --> 00:47:20,919
Speaker 2: so that's all hoarded off. We've got to take people

969
00:47:21,000 --> 00:47:23,680
Speaker 2: up through the elevators. The dumb waiters are running at

970
00:47:23,719 --> 00:47:27,680
Speaker 2: fifty percent of their capacity. So like it was the

971
00:47:27,719 --> 00:47:30,440
Speaker 2: worst two weeks in I didn't sleep for two weeks.

972
00:47:30,719 --> 00:47:34,760
Speaker 2: Then we open and it was the most revolting opening

973
00:47:34,800 --> 00:47:37,439
Speaker 2: I've ever done because of all the we weren't ready.

974
00:47:37,440 --> 00:47:39,200
Speaker 2: I should have just canceled everybody. But you know, what

975
00:47:39,200 --> 00:47:41,000
Speaker 2: are you going to ring up and say to someone

976
00:47:41,040 --> 00:47:43,360
Speaker 2: two days out? I know you've got a table for

977
00:47:43,480 --> 00:47:45,399
Speaker 2: twenty for Father's Day, but I'm sure you'll be able

978
00:47:45,400 --> 00:47:47,400
Speaker 2: to go somewhere else, like you know, yeah, I.

979
00:47:47,440 --> 00:47:49,160
Speaker 1: Did you ring a missel lusen. We're not ready before.

980
00:47:49,160 --> 00:47:51,279
Speaker 2: No, no, anyway, you can really can't do that. So

981
00:47:52,120 --> 00:47:54,920
Speaker 2: so anyway we did that, I caught you know. We

982
00:47:55,040 --> 00:47:58,080
Speaker 2: finally got the staircase open two weeks later. So it

983
00:47:58,120 --> 00:48:00,680
Speaker 2: was the worst two weeks. All the dumb weight of

984
00:48:00,760 --> 00:48:03,239
Speaker 2: people in and just said, guys, this is just not

985
00:48:03,320 --> 00:48:05,439
Speaker 2: fit for purpose. I don't know what you've done. Blah

986
00:48:05,480 --> 00:48:10,320
Speaker 2: blah blah. They go, oh, they can go twice as fast,

987
00:48:10,800 --> 00:48:13,520
Speaker 2: and I'm like, well, so if I bought a Ferrari,

988
00:48:13,600 --> 00:48:15,120
Speaker 2: you're going to say they're going to put the four

989
00:48:15,160 --> 00:48:17,880
Speaker 2: cylinder engine in before I get the twelve, just in

990
00:48:17,920 --> 00:48:19,960
Speaker 2: case I can't handle the speed. Is that that what

991
00:48:20,000 --> 00:48:23,000
Speaker 2: you're saying? Oh, we didn't think too. I'm just like, oh,

992
00:48:23,040 --> 00:48:26,440
Speaker 2: my god. Anyway, we're serving two hundred people, so we

993
00:48:26,480 --> 00:48:30,120
Speaker 2: get the staircase back. Everyone's starting to work within the space.

994
00:48:30,440 --> 00:48:33,560
Speaker 2: Food's coming out really nicely. Week three four, like we're

995
00:48:33,560 --> 00:48:37,080
Speaker 2: into week eight or seven now, we've just gone seven nights.

996
00:48:38,480 --> 00:48:40,000
Speaker 2: And I had dinner there last night with a great

997
00:48:40,040 --> 00:48:42,120
Speaker 2: friend of mine Paul Harris actually was a really great

998
00:48:42,120 --> 00:48:44,640
Speaker 2: mate of David Coe was another awesome friend of mine,

999
00:48:45,239 --> 00:48:47,600
Speaker 2: passed away. One of the greatest humans ever lived.

1000
00:48:47,680 --> 00:48:49,560
Speaker 1: Unbelievable lifetime.

1001
00:48:49,640 --> 00:48:51,759
Speaker 2: Oh and he lived two lifetimes and one. That's the

1002
00:48:51,760 --> 00:48:54,879
Speaker 2: only reason you can't be sad that he didn't. Yeah,

1003
00:48:55,640 --> 00:49:00,640
Speaker 2: he did so. So the restaurant is flying now. It's beautiful,

1004
00:49:01,040 --> 00:49:07,480
Speaker 2: the foods that great, is like a four level. And

1005
00:49:07,640 --> 00:49:09,799
Speaker 2: and how it happened very organically. And if I knew

1006
00:49:09,840 --> 00:49:11,239
Speaker 2: what it was going to cost me now, I would

1007
00:49:11,320 --> 00:49:13,680
Speaker 2: never have done it, while Sam and I would have

1008
00:49:13,680 --> 00:49:15,680
Speaker 2: just gone on more holidays. I've put so much money

1009
00:49:15,719 --> 00:49:18,400
Speaker 2: into that place. But anyway, we love it. It's beautiful.

1010
00:49:18,680 --> 00:49:21,280
Speaker 2: I might get a return on investment one day, but

1011
00:49:21,280 --> 00:49:23,360
Speaker 2: but I really wanted the bar, which used to be

1012
00:49:23,400 --> 00:49:26,200
Speaker 2: the old Pelicanos And and you know the guy said,

1013
00:49:26,600 --> 00:49:28,840
Speaker 2: one of the partners just didn't want he wanted to

1014
00:49:28,840 --> 00:49:33,759
Speaker 2: go somewhere else, and yeah, yeah, and then Matthew Barricat

1015
00:49:33,840 --> 00:49:36,719
Speaker 2: and Dover talking to me, but we'd love to do

1016
00:49:36,760 --> 00:49:39,719
Speaker 2: a restaurant on a level one and ground. It's a

1017
00:49:39,800 --> 00:49:40,760
Speaker 2: very odd shape anyway.

1018
00:49:41,160 --> 00:49:42,880
Speaker 1: The Longoman.

1019
00:49:45,040 --> 00:49:47,399
Speaker 2: The old the old Neville Gooseman building, so that long

1020
00:49:47,440 --> 00:49:50,319
Speaker 2: and the short of it was I basically I said, yeah,

1021
00:49:50,360 --> 00:49:53,440
Speaker 2: we'll do it Chinese restaurant. So so as we were

1022
00:49:53,480 --> 00:49:55,839
Speaker 2: designing and doing everything, was really clear that a lot

1023
00:49:55,840 --> 00:49:58,600
Speaker 2: of shared spaces and were very tight, had been very

1024
00:49:58,640 --> 00:50:01,879
Speaker 2: well managed. If someone else had the bar, it would

1025
00:50:01,920 --> 00:50:04,760
Speaker 2: be almost impossible, even just the simple things like garbage

1026
00:50:04,800 --> 00:50:08,640
Speaker 2: and bottles and cardboard, and we'd be fighting forever. So

1027
00:50:08,680 --> 00:50:11,920
Speaker 2: they came to the realization that we should have that

1028
00:50:11,640 --> 00:50:14,319
Speaker 2: the third level. And as we're designing it and we're

1029
00:50:14,360 --> 00:50:17,480
Speaker 2: walking up the staircase, I just sort of said, guys,

1030
00:50:17,800 --> 00:50:19,920
Speaker 2: are you going to cap this staircase off? It's the

1031
00:50:19,960 --> 00:50:22,160
Speaker 2: one heritage piece in the whole building which has kind

1032
00:50:22,160 --> 00:50:25,320
Speaker 2: of stayed and people aren't going to be able to

1033
00:50:25,360 --> 00:50:29,000
Speaker 2: come up or down soundproof. So the office is okay,

1034
00:50:29,680 --> 00:50:34,080
Speaker 2: and you've cut the heritage core of this thing in half.

1035
00:50:34,200 --> 00:50:36,479
Speaker 2: So that it just doesn't make sense, and they walked

1036
00:50:36,560 --> 00:50:39,000
Speaker 2: up and down and went, you're right, you know. So

1037
00:50:39,120 --> 00:50:41,719
Speaker 2: then I ended up with enough infrastructure and a two

1038
00:50:41,800 --> 00:50:44,600
Speaker 2: hundred and forty seat restaurant. And if I'd had any

1039
00:50:44,640 --> 00:50:46,279
Speaker 2: idea how much it was going to cost, I would

1040
00:50:46,280 --> 00:50:48,640
Speaker 2: have run for the hills. But I kind of based

1041
00:50:48,680 --> 00:50:51,360
Speaker 2: it on the square meteage of Margaret. And that was

1042
00:50:51,400 --> 00:50:54,040
Speaker 2: done just as we were, you know, coming out of

1043
00:50:54,080 --> 00:50:57,960
Speaker 2: the first lockdown, and builders were looking for cost much.

1044
00:50:58,800 --> 00:51:03,760
Speaker 2: The costs were like extra. So the whole project design, build,

1045
00:51:04,080 --> 00:51:08,080
Speaker 2: pre operatings. It's a thirteen million dollar four floor project. Oh,

1046
00:51:08,120 --> 00:51:10,200
Speaker 2: it's insane. No one to do it except for me.

1047
00:51:10,239 --> 00:51:13,360
Speaker 2: I'm an idiot, but I like to do things really well.

1048
00:51:13,480 --> 00:51:14,880
Speaker 2: And it is beautiful.

1049
00:51:14,920 --> 00:51:15,800
Speaker 1: It's a beautiful space.

1050
00:51:15,880 --> 00:51:19,080
Speaker 2: It's an amazing space. And you know, it's an amazing kitchen.

1051
00:51:19,360 --> 00:51:21,319
Speaker 2: It's one of the great kitchen.

1052
00:51:21,440 --> 00:51:22,359
Speaker 1: What's an amazing kitchen?

1053
00:51:22,480 --> 00:51:25,560
Speaker 2: Mean? Oh, it's all induction electric and you know we

1054
00:51:26,600 --> 00:51:32,160
Speaker 2: did we created this beautiful induction suite and beautiful induction

1055
00:51:32,239 --> 00:51:36,759
Speaker 2: or electric you know cooking via So induction actually works

1056
00:51:36,800 --> 00:51:41,360
Speaker 2: with creating a generator creates friction within the pan metal,

1057
00:51:41,400 --> 00:51:44,400
Speaker 2: the metal vibrates and creates heat and that's how it cooks.

1058
00:51:44,440 --> 00:51:46,560
Speaker 2: And it only cooks when you put the pan on

1059
00:51:46,640 --> 00:51:50,040
Speaker 2: the on the induction, either hob or the wok, and

1060
00:51:50,080 --> 00:51:53,759
Speaker 2: it's all combies that steam and roast. And and we

1061
00:51:53,880 --> 00:51:57,120
Speaker 2: did this beautiful curved radius, and then every other bench

1062
00:51:57,160 --> 00:52:00,080
Speaker 2: has got these incredible curved radiuses, which cost a shit

1063
00:52:00,080 --> 00:52:02,400
Speaker 2: of money when you're turning stateless steel like that, but

1064
00:52:02,480 --> 00:52:06,279
Speaker 2: they look beautiful, and all the floors beautiful and this

1065
00:52:06,480 --> 00:52:10,000
Speaker 2: heritage staircases, it's fantastic. And Bobby's looks amazing downstairs. One

1066
00:52:10,040 --> 00:52:12,000
Speaker 2: of the great cocktail bars in Sydney. And the menu

1067
00:52:13,480 --> 00:52:15,840
Speaker 2: sort sort of Cantonese with a little bit of Sechuan

1068
00:52:15,880 --> 00:52:18,480
Speaker 2: and Hu Nan through it, but it's mainly Cantonese. The

1069
00:52:18,560 --> 00:52:20,959
Speaker 2: roast duck is phenomenal there because it's the best duck.

1070
00:52:21,440 --> 00:52:22,919
Speaker 1: So what does that mean the best duck?

1071
00:52:23,080 --> 00:52:26,480
Speaker 2: Well, it's the Wallamar ducks that are just incredible. You

1072
00:52:26,480 --> 00:52:29,240
Speaker 2: know they're a peaking style, but you know they're really

1073
00:52:29,280 --> 00:52:33,239
Speaker 2: truly free range. The guy you know, kills about eight

1074
00:52:33,360 --> 00:52:36,840
Speaker 2: hundred a week. Peppies probably kill about one hundred and

1075
00:52:36,880 --> 00:52:40,319
Speaker 2: fifty thousand a week. So the difference between kind of

1076
00:52:40,360 --> 00:52:43,360
Speaker 2: hand tooling. A beautiful bird breasts so much thicker, the

1077
00:52:43,440 --> 00:52:46,080
Speaker 2: flavors better, the skin. We put it through a week's

1078
00:52:46,120 --> 00:52:48,719
Speaker 2: process of dry aging, so we've got a cool room

1079
00:52:48,760 --> 00:52:52,239
Speaker 2: that holds three hundred and fifty ducks and then we

1080
00:52:52,400 --> 00:52:55,440
Speaker 2: roast in a couple of different fashions to get it

1081
00:52:55,480 --> 00:52:59,560
Speaker 2: really crisp skin and beautiful, tender, tender flesh. So that's amazing.

1082
00:52:59,719 --> 00:53:02,680
Speaker 2: Dumb blinks are incredible, Ginger slot, coral trout. We bring

1083
00:53:02,840 --> 00:53:07,440
Speaker 2: that all down from from Bowen, from from Bruce Collis,

1084
00:53:07,640 --> 00:53:10,760
Speaker 2: so I'm Ben Collison, and you know it's just without

1085
00:53:10,800 --> 00:53:16,040
Speaker 2: peer steam, ginger and shalot, incredible sun farms, sumble and chicken.

1086
00:53:16,160 --> 00:53:18,320
Speaker 2: You know there there's an incredible heritage bird. And we

1087
00:53:18,760 --> 00:53:22,200
Speaker 2: do those white cut and we do them master stock

1088
00:53:22,280 --> 00:53:24,799
Speaker 2: and fried crisp, and you know, it's just it's just

1089
00:53:25,040 --> 00:53:28,120
Speaker 2: great ingredients, exactly like what Margaret is, but with Chinese seasoning.

1090
00:53:28,320 --> 00:53:31,960
Speaker 1: So how important is the to you and to your

1091
00:53:32,400 --> 00:53:34,359
Speaker 1: maybe to you first and then maybe to your guests

1092
00:53:34,360 --> 00:53:36,320
Speaker 1: and maybe to your staff as well as a third

1093
00:53:36,320 --> 00:53:41,680
Speaker 1: but the beautiful space like why why, I mean apart

1094
00:53:41,680 --> 00:53:44,960
Speaker 1: from you could in this crappy little spot here you

1095
00:53:44,960 --> 00:53:48,160
Speaker 1: could cook me the same food and I can have

1096
00:53:48,200 --> 00:53:52,760
Speaker 1: the same taste, sensation. How white Why is it so important?

1097
00:53:52,800 --> 00:53:56,400
Speaker 1: Because I remember, I remember the old the Lopulin City

1098
00:53:56,560 --> 00:53:58,479
Speaker 1: unbelievable space still is a beautiful space.

1099
00:53:58,600 --> 00:54:01,279
Speaker 2: It's one of the great art chambers in the world.

1100
00:54:01,360 --> 00:54:04,080
Speaker 2: You know, people talk about eleven Madison in New York,

1101
00:54:04,120 --> 00:54:06,239
Speaker 2: and I know Daniel is a great friend, and it's

1102
00:54:06,239 --> 00:54:09,120
Speaker 2: a beautiful space, but it's nothing like.

1103
00:54:08,800 --> 00:54:12,040
Speaker 1: Like that building is just wonderful. So how and you've

1104
00:54:12,040 --> 00:54:15,680
Speaker 1: always before that when you're down at the Rob's.

1105
00:54:14,920 --> 00:54:16,520
Speaker 2: Still a great space design space.

1106
00:54:16,600 --> 00:54:20,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, and you know the casino a bit different, but

1107
00:54:20,000 --> 00:54:23,640
Speaker 1: but Rosetta is a great space. So why is Neil

1108
00:54:23,680 --> 00:54:26,600
Speaker 1: Perry associated with such great spaces?

1109
00:54:26,680 --> 00:54:26,920
Speaker 2: Is that?

1110
00:54:27,239 --> 00:54:28,879
Speaker 1: I mean, that's what's that got to do with I mean,

1111
00:54:28,920 --> 00:54:33,200
Speaker 1: cooking and fiodpace a esthetic is really important to me.

1112
00:54:33,239 --> 00:54:35,920
Speaker 2: It always has been so so for me, it's about

1113
00:54:35,960 --> 00:54:38,560
Speaker 2: creating that great memories, about creating a great environment to

1114
00:54:38,920 --> 00:54:41,759
Speaker 2: create great service, great food, and so that you know,

1115
00:54:42,480 --> 00:54:44,560
Speaker 2: a great memory and experience as a package. You know,

1116
00:54:44,600 --> 00:54:47,520
Speaker 2: it's not like I ate some beautiful food or you know,

1117
00:54:47,560 --> 00:54:50,040
Speaker 2: you drank great wine or I had fantastic service. It's

1118
00:54:50,280 --> 00:54:54,680
Speaker 2: it's the whole motion that you have from the whole experience.

1119
00:54:54,760 --> 00:54:58,120
Speaker 2: So for us, it's really important to create beautiful spaces

1120
00:54:58,120 --> 00:55:01,200
Speaker 2: for our customers. And secondly, it's important we spend a

1121
00:55:01,239 --> 00:55:04,160
Speaker 2: lot of time designing spaces that are functional for the staff,

1122
00:55:04,400 --> 00:55:06,920
Speaker 2: right because people need to work in an environment that

1123
00:55:07,080 --> 00:55:09,759
Speaker 2: they can actually do their job really well in. And

1124
00:55:09,800 --> 00:55:12,640
Speaker 2: a lot of people because I cook for a living

1125
00:55:12,680 --> 00:55:16,200
Speaker 2: and the restaurants have always kitchens designed first and then

1126
00:55:16,239 --> 00:55:19,080
Speaker 2: we do everything else after that. I always make sure

1127
00:55:19,080 --> 00:55:23,200
Speaker 2: there's enough storage space and functional space and kitchen space.

1128
00:55:23,239 --> 00:55:25,880
Speaker 2: And you know, you say to people, I've got a

1129
00:55:26,239 --> 00:55:28,759
Speaker 2: thousand square meters or I've got six hundred square meters

1130
00:55:28,760 --> 00:55:30,239
Speaker 2: and I said, well, you've got to put forty percent

1131
00:55:30,280 --> 00:55:32,799
Speaker 2: of that aside for all the infrastructure stuff, and then

1132
00:55:32,840 --> 00:55:34,920
Speaker 2: sixty percent for the customers. And they go, oh, no,

1133
00:55:35,040 --> 00:55:37,600
Speaker 2: you know you can't do that. So they start eating

1134
00:55:37,640 --> 00:55:42,520
Speaker 2: away at all those things that make stuff really important

1135
00:55:42,560 --> 00:55:44,720
Speaker 2: from a staff perspective. I mean, there's a really large

1136
00:55:44,760 --> 00:55:48,359
Speaker 2: restaurant group that just went broke recently. I won't name,

1137
00:55:48,400 --> 00:55:51,759
Speaker 2: but they're from Martin Place and they built a massive, big,

1138
00:55:51,800 --> 00:55:55,720
Speaker 2: mega restaurant with a small kitchen, tiny pass, no prep space,

1139
00:55:56,160 --> 00:55:59,160
Speaker 2: and so they're expecting all this stuff to happen, and

1140
00:55:59,400 --> 00:56:02,440
Speaker 2: what happens is that just can't happen in the right time,

1141
00:56:03,400 --> 00:56:06,640
Speaker 2: you know, with the right level of quality and the

1142
00:56:06,760 --> 00:56:08,600
Speaker 2: number of people that you're doing. So you went up

1143
00:56:08,640 --> 00:56:09,920
Speaker 2: with a whole lot of disasters, you know.

1144
00:56:10,440 --> 00:56:12,200
Speaker 1: So I might just change tack a little bit here

1145
00:56:12,200 --> 00:56:15,560
Speaker 1: because I mentioned you earlier before we started. I thought

1146
00:56:15,600 --> 00:56:17,560
Speaker 1: I saw one of your daughters in the city, but

1147
00:56:17,640 --> 00:56:21,160
Speaker 1: maybe not. But there's till about your family for a second,

1148
00:56:22,680 --> 00:56:25,240
Speaker 1: who's working in the business, and your wife also working

1149
00:56:25,239 --> 00:56:27,799
Speaker 1: in the business. So you mentioned earlier that she's part

1150
00:56:27,840 --> 00:56:30,480
Speaker 1: of Margaret, and I think Sombird as well.

1151
00:56:30,600 --> 00:56:33,839
Speaker 2: Well, I've left, I've left most of the family at

1152
00:56:33,880 --> 00:56:37,600
Speaker 2: Margaret Margaret. But now I'm starting to go back, they'll

1153
00:56:37,640 --> 00:56:39,760
Speaker 2: start to kind of come across bow. So it's important

1154
00:56:39,800 --> 00:56:42,960
Speaker 2: to me when we open Sombird that everyone realized that

1155
00:56:43,000 --> 00:56:44,839
Speaker 2: we just have an abandoned Margaret. You know, we need

1156
00:56:44,880 --> 00:56:48,840
Speaker 2: to have two fabulous restaurants, and you know, winning Restaurant

1157
00:56:48,880 --> 00:56:50,319
Speaker 2: of the Year last year in the Good Food Guide

1158
00:56:50,360 --> 00:56:52,560
Speaker 2: and being named third best steakhouse in the world, and

1159
00:56:52,600 --> 00:56:55,920
Speaker 2: this year I was named the fifty Best Restaurants the

1160
00:56:56,560 --> 00:56:59,920
Speaker 2: Icon Award as a Margaret. They were all Margaret, but

1161
00:56:59,920 --> 00:57:03,239
Speaker 2: I was sort of named personally or as an icon,

1162
00:57:03,320 --> 00:57:06,640
Speaker 2: which which you know Thomas Keller and Alice Waters and

1163
00:57:06,719 --> 00:57:09,320
Speaker 2: Hesson Bloominthorne. I mean, all these guys have been icons

1164
00:57:09,480 --> 00:57:12,040
Speaker 2: and girls have been icons over the over the over

1165
00:57:12,080 --> 00:57:14,600
Speaker 2: the years, and so to be the first Australian and

1166
00:57:15,360 --> 00:57:17,720
Speaker 2: to get world recognition like that was fantastic. But it's

1167
00:57:18,040 --> 00:57:21,280
Speaker 2: kept the momentum at Margaret going. And I think the

1168
00:57:21,360 --> 00:57:23,800
Speaker 2: other thing is that it's genuinely a family restaurant that

1169
00:57:23,840 --> 00:57:26,560
Speaker 2: people see me having a coffee and clearing tables at

1170
00:57:26,600 --> 00:57:29,000
Speaker 2: the bakery and chatting to people at the bakery, and

1171
00:57:29,000 --> 00:57:32,040
Speaker 2: then I'm in at Margaret, and I still like this week,

1172
00:57:32,080 --> 00:57:35,240
Speaker 2: I'm doing three full shifts as cooking and calling service

1173
00:57:35,280 --> 00:57:37,760
Speaker 2: at Margaret and another couple of half ones. I'll be

1174
00:57:37,760 --> 00:57:40,160
Speaker 2: able at some bird a couple of shifts. But you know, Sam,

1175
00:57:40,160 --> 00:57:42,480
Speaker 2: my wife runs the pass on the on the waiter

1176
00:57:42,560 --> 00:57:45,840
Speaker 2: side at Margaret. She does like Thursday night, double, Friday, double,

1177
00:57:45,880 --> 00:57:50,920
Speaker 2: Saturday Sunday lunch. Macey's doing UNI and children. Yeah, Macey's

1178
00:57:51,000 --> 00:57:52,920
Speaker 2: one of my girls. And she does, like last week,

1179
00:57:52,960 --> 00:57:55,960
Speaker 2: she double for a Thursday night and then double Saturday,

1180
00:57:55,960 --> 00:57:58,400
Speaker 2: double Sunday, goes to the gym every morning, juggles a

1181
00:57:58,400 --> 00:58:00,320
Speaker 2: boyfriend and Uni. I don't know how she does it,

1182
00:58:00,360 --> 00:58:02,479
Speaker 2: but you know, she's she's got my kind of drive.

1183
00:58:02,600 --> 00:58:04,800
Speaker 2: She she's she's in it for the long haul.

1184
00:58:04,800 --> 00:58:05,720
Speaker 1: I think you do now she does.

1185
00:58:05,880 --> 00:58:10,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, Indy's you know, just just finishing HSC year

1186
00:58:10,280 --> 00:58:13,760
Speaker 2: and she does polishing out the back and she'll come forward.

1187
00:58:13,880 --> 00:58:17,640
Speaker 2: Macy hosts and Josephine, my oldest daughter, has just had

1188
00:58:17,720 --> 00:58:21,600
Speaker 2: my beautiful little granddaughter, Riley, who's like apple of my eye.

1189
00:58:21,600 --> 00:58:25,600
Speaker 2: At the moment, the other girls are getting jealous. And

1190
00:58:25,600 --> 00:58:30,400
Speaker 2: and JP runs the host desk and reservation team. Yeah yeah,

1191
00:58:30,400 --> 00:58:32,959
Speaker 2: so she's on maternity lead as well as at the moment,

1192
00:58:33,360 --> 00:58:37,680
Speaker 2: so everyone works in the family and and yeah, I

1193
00:58:37,760 --> 00:58:40,919
Speaker 2: have to get a little Riley at Margaret dot com

1194
00:58:40,960 --> 00:58:43,720
Speaker 2: at Margaret double bay dot com email address early on

1195
00:58:43,800 --> 00:58:46,280
Speaker 2: so we can start communicating to her as a as

1196
00:58:46,280 --> 00:58:47,040
Speaker 2: a restaurant group.

1197
00:58:47,320 --> 00:58:49,760
Speaker 1: I want to talk you back quickly about one last thing.

1198
00:58:49,800 --> 00:58:52,520
Speaker 1: It's you know, I could talk to for hours, because

1199
00:58:52,520 --> 00:58:54,840
Speaker 1: we don't we don't have enough time but because Australians

1200
00:58:54,840 --> 00:58:58,400
Speaker 1: don't like to listen to podcasts forty fifty minutes. But

1201
00:58:58,840 --> 00:59:00,680
Speaker 1: I could talk to you for hours, but I just

1202
00:59:00,720 --> 00:59:03,000
Speaker 1: want to talk about the phenomenon that you've created a

1203
00:59:03,000 --> 00:59:07,200
Speaker 1: baker Blue and like it's a business phenomenon. I mean

1204
00:59:07,240 --> 00:59:10,280
Speaker 1: it's actually in terms of food it's quite phenomenal too,

1205
00:59:10,320 --> 00:59:13,320
Speaker 1: but but it doesn't get the same recognition as Margaret

1206
00:59:13,360 --> 00:59:15,680
Speaker 1: and everything else that you do when they have done.

1207
00:59:16,480 --> 00:59:18,680
Speaker 1: But from a business point of view, I mean, I

1208
00:59:18,720 --> 00:59:22,240
Speaker 1: love it. I look at it. It's so busy baking

1209
00:59:22,320 --> 00:59:27,520
Speaker 1: bread effectively. I mean, I'm not undermining it. It's beautiful bread, great, great,

1210
00:59:27,560 --> 00:59:30,560
Speaker 1: great product, et cetera. But like I can imagine the

1211
00:59:30,560 --> 00:59:32,840
Speaker 1: margins are great and you're sitting in the middle of

1212
00:59:32,840 --> 00:59:35,160
Speaker 1: Double Bay. It's like you don't it's not proly sensitive

1213
00:59:35,240 --> 00:59:37,640
Speaker 1: because around they just say I'm going to Baker Blue

1214
00:59:37,640 --> 00:59:40,040
Speaker 1: to get my food and they don't think. No one

1215
00:59:40,080 --> 00:59:42,080
Speaker 1: even wouldn't even know the process. They would have a clue.

1216
00:59:42,120 --> 00:59:44,040
Speaker 1: I'm one of them. And when I say, oh that, that,

1217
00:59:44,040 --> 00:59:47,000
Speaker 1: that that, and I just look at whatever is and

1218
00:59:47,000 --> 00:59:51,560
Speaker 1: I'm putting my card on it and walk out. So

1219
00:59:51,600 --> 00:59:55,480
Speaker 1: good for you. It's not as good as cash. We

1220
00:59:55,520 --> 00:59:59,120
Speaker 1: won't talk about that, but baker Blue just quickly cover

1221
00:59:59,200 --> 01:00:00,680
Speaker 1: off where that idea come from.

1222
01:00:00,760 --> 01:00:03,720
Speaker 2: Yeah sure, well then what is it? Well, you know

1223
01:00:04,240 --> 01:00:07,480
Speaker 2: baker Blue is Mike, Mike Russell and Me and Russell,

1224
01:00:07,560 --> 01:00:09,760
Speaker 2: so they started it. Mike worked for me at the

1225
01:00:09,760 --> 01:00:11,960
Speaker 2: original Rope Bar and Grill in Sydney. On the original

1226
01:00:12,000 --> 01:00:15,200
Speaker 2: the Ropel Barn Grill in Sydney, he was the original

1227
01:00:15,280 --> 01:00:18,680
Speaker 2: second pastry chef. Catherine was the chef. He worked through

1228
01:00:18,720 --> 01:00:21,200
Speaker 2: me with me for nine months, went through to the

1229
01:00:21,240 --> 01:00:24,040
Speaker 2: first Christmas from March and then he left because he

1230
01:00:24,040 --> 01:00:26,600
Speaker 2: wanted to go and bake and I really liked him

1231
01:00:26,800 --> 01:00:28,919
Speaker 2: and it was such a shame. He went and worked

1232
01:00:28,920 --> 01:00:30,920
Speaker 2: for Iggy for a while. Then he went down to Melbourne.

1233
01:00:30,920 --> 01:00:33,800
Speaker 2: He started his own bakery and through doing some fundraisers

1234
01:00:33,840 --> 01:00:37,360
Speaker 2: with Ben Shury, I kept running into him and you

1235
01:00:37,400 --> 01:00:39,840
Speaker 2: know we just sort of get kindled the relationship back

1236
01:00:39,880 --> 01:00:41,360
Speaker 2: and I just said to him, look, as soon as

1237
01:00:41,400 --> 01:00:43,120
Speaker 2: you get your bigger bakery, we want you to do

1238
01:00:43,200 --> 01:00:46,040
Speaker 2: Roppul Bar and Grill in Melbourne, and in Melbourne with

1239
01:00:46,040 --> 01:00:49,160
Speaker 2: the bread because it's definitely the best bread. And during

1240
01:00:49,240 --> 01:00:52,640
Speaker 2: COVID I started a charity called Hope Delivery. We did

1241
01:00:52,680 --> 01:00:56,240
Speaker 2: eight hundred thousand meals, which was fantastic. We worked through

1242
01:00:56,240 --> 01:00:59,240
Speaker 2: oz Harvest as well as in Melbourne we gave out

1243
01:00:59,280 --> 01:01:03,040
Speaker 2: meals Riverside, so that was a really fantastic thing. And

1244
01:01:03,080 --> 01:01:05,600
Speaker 2: the guys from MERVAP were talking to me about potentially

1245
01:01:05,640 --> 01:01:09,880
Speaker 2: giving me a space down in South Everly, and I

1246
01:01:09,960 --> 01:01:13,280
Speaker 2: wanted to do a bakery where if you bought a

1247
01:01:13,280 --> 01:01:15,400
Speaker 2: loaf of bread, a loaf of bread went to a family,

1248
01:01:16,440 --> 01:01:18,160
Speaker 2: and that we put a cafe in and made it

1249
01:01:18,200 --> 01:01:22,200
Speaker 2: a social enterprise that we were teaching refugees and teaching

1250
01:01:23,120 --> 01:01:26,280
Speaker 2: young kids and young First Nations kids how to be

1251
01:01:26,320 --> 01:01:28,920
Speaker 2: a barista, how to serve a table, so it would

1252
01:01:28,920 --> 01:01:34,040
Speaker 2: be a community cafe. So I was talking to Mike

1253
01:01:34,240 --> 01:01:36,200
Speaker 2: so if I wanted to set up a bakery, so

1254
01:01:36,400 --> 01:01:39,440
Speaker 2: he taught me through it all and he basically, you know,

1255
01:01:39,600 --> 01:01:42,640
Speaker 2: fundamentally gave me the blueprint of this is how much

1256
01:01:42,680 --> 01:01:44,400
Speaker 2: money we would need, this is what you'd have to do,

1257
01:01:44,560 --> 01:01:47,480
Speaker 2: Da da da da. So anyway, Dove and Matthew went,

1258
01:01:47,560 --> 01:01:53,760
Speaker 2: look we've got this great space to Gilfoy next to Margaret.

1259
01:01:53,320 --> 01:01:55,120
Speaker 2: We want to do a restaurant. What do you think

1260
01:01:55,160 --> 01:01:57,520
Speaker 2: we should do. And I kind of looked at the

1261
01:01:57,560 --> 01:02:01,280
Speaker 2: space and unlike Margaret, it's got nice frontage, but it's

1262
01:02:01,400 --> 01:02:05,240
Speaker 2: essentially very long, long, narrow walls, and I went, what

1263
01:02:05,320 --> 01:02:09,800
Speaker 2: about doing something that's much more community focused that everybody

1264
01:02:09,840 --> 01:02:12,320
Speaker 2: can get involved with, because you know, coffee and bread

1265
01:02:12,320 --> 01:02:16,040
Speaker 2: and sandwiches is much more so everyday experience to what

1266
01:02:16,200 --> 01:02:18,280
Speaker 2: and it also adds, you know, for the people who

1267
01:02:18,320 --> 01:02:20,040
Speaker 2: work in the area and the people who shop in there,

1268
01:02:20,440 --> 01:02:23,240
Speaker 2: it adds a layer that the community didn't have anything

1269
01:02:23,280 --> 01:02:27,040
Speaker 2: like that at all. So I said, I rang Mike

1270
01:02:27,080 --> 01:02:29,560
Speaker 2: and I said, mate, how would you like to be

1271
01:02:29,800 --> 01:02:32,800
Speaker 2: my partner in Double Bay? And you know, he came up.

1272
01:02:32,880 --> 01:02:35,320
Speaker 2: We sat down and saw the space, had dinner with

1273
01:02:35,360 --> 01:02:39,160
Speaker 2: them at Rockpool Bar and Grill, and I essentially put

1274
01:02:39,160 --> 01:02:41,840
Speaker 2: to them a partnership with Sam and myself and Mer

1275
01:02:41,920 --> 01:02:45,520
Speaker 2: and he and they jumped at it. Restless history we've

1276
01:02:45,520 --> 01:02:49,040
Speaker 2: done it. It's massively busy. It's probably takes more money

1277
01:02:49,040 --> 01:02:52,040
Speaker 2: than any other bakery in Sydney fifty percent of its

1278
01:02:52,040 --> 01:02:55,600
Speaker 2: food service. So we make sandwiches and pizza and we

1279
01:02:55,680 --> 01:02:58,520
Speaker 2: take the best bread. It's just baked there open where

1280
01:02:58,560 --> 01:03:01,440
Speaker 2: the lounge is it comes and it's slice it. We

1281
01:03:01,520 --> 01:03:04,480
Speaker 2: put the same level of ingredients that we put into

1282
01:03:05,680 --> 01:03:09,680
Speaker 2: the quality. Like we have our butcher who gets the

1283
01:03:09,760 --> 01:03:13,480
Speaker 2: David Blackmore product here. He pumps the silver sides for us.

1284
01:03:13,760 --> 01:03:16,560
Speaker 2: The butcher that is there used to work at Rockpool

1285
01:03:16,600 --> 01:03:19,080
Speaker 2: for seven years. Pete does it to our recipe, makes

1286
01:03:19,120 --> 01:03:21,960
Speaker 2: the hams to our recipe. Everything comes in, you know,

1287
01:03:22,000 --> 01:03:25,360
Speaker 2: Pino does our salamis and and mortadella, which I think

1288
01:03:25,400 --> 01:03:29,040
Speaker 2: is the best around. You know, we use a really

1289
01:03:29,120 --> 01:03:32,400
Speaker 2: high quality chicken. We use really high quality fruit and veg.

1290
01:03:33,480 --> 01:03:36,439
Speaker 2: You know, we take the alpine salmon out of out

1291
01:03:36,440 --> 01:03:38,360
Speaker 2: of Mount Cook, out of New Zealand. We cure it

1292
01:03:38,400 --> 01:03:41,000
Speaker 2: for we don't smoke. We cure it to make a

1293
01:03:41,040 --> 01:03:44,120
Speaker 2: pastrami for our bagels because you know, I don't want

1294
01:03:44,120 --> 01:03:46,280
Speaker 2: to talk about what Tasmanian salmon is and the crab

1295
01:03:46,320 --> 01:03:48,720
Speaker 2: that you know, we talk about smoked salmon here in Australia,

1296
01:03:48,960 --> 01:03:51,000
Speaker 2: all of that stuff, you know, make the pickles. We

1297
01:03:51,080 --> 01:03:53,400
Speaker 2: do all this sort of stuff so and by the

1298
01:03:53,400 --> 01:03:57,160
Speaker 2: ways in great pastries and it makes the best sandwiches

1299
01:03:57,200 --> 01:03:59,919
Speaker 2: because you take the best ingredients, the best bread, coppertry butter,

1300
01:04:00,000 --> 01:04:01,640
Speaker 2: which is the best, you know, the best salt of

1301
01:04:01,640 --> 01:04:04,040
Speaker 2: butter going. My name's on it, so of course it

1302
01:04:04,120 --> 01:04:07,720
Speaker 2: is help. I helped create it, and you end up

1303
01:04:07,720 --> 01:04:10,440
Speaker 2: with the best sandwiches. And we have people like they

1304
01:04:10,520 --> 01:04:11,760
Speaker 2: just kill for those sandwiches.

1305
01:04:12,600 --> 01:04:15,600
Speaker 1: It's extraordinary and because I mean I often go there

1306
01:04:15,640 --> 01:04:18,360
Speaker 1: and I think the stuff's wonderful and it's funny every

1307
01:04:18,400 --> 01:04:20,520
Speaker 1: time we sin to see you. But you always sort

1308
01:04:20,520 --> 01:04:22,520
Speaker 1: of around the area of always watching him. You must

1309
01:04:22,560 --> 01:04:23,920
Speaker 1: work an enormous amount of ours.

1310
01:04:24,440 --> 01:04:26,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, I do, but I don't think about it as

1311
01:04:26,240 --> 01:04:28,320
Speaker 2: well because you love it. You know that cliche. I't

1312
01:04:28,320 --> 01:04:29,480
Speaker 2: find something you love and you have a work a

1313
01:04:29,560 --> 01:04:32,000
Speaker 2: day in your life. I mean, the whole whole thing

1314
01:04:32,080 --> 01:04:34,200
Speaker 2: is the day that I wake up and don't want

1315
01:04:34,200 --> 01:04:35,560
Speaker 2: to get up and go down and have a coffee

1316
01:04:35,560 --> 01:04:37,600
Speaker 2: at Baker Blue and chat. You know. The first thing

1317
01:04:37,640 --> 01:04:40,400
Speaker 2: I do is I look at the bread, look at

1318
01:04:40,400 --> 01:04:43,080
Speaker 2: the pastries. I go in and see George, who runs

1319
01:04:43,120 --> 01:04:45,000
Speaker 2: my food services work for me. You know, it was

1320
01:04:45,280 --> 01:04:47,400
Speaker 2: with me at baron Joe House, I'm not bar.

1321
01:04:47,720 --> 01:04:49,560
Speaker 1: Bluewater Grill with me at Rockpool Wow.

1322
01:04:49,960 --> 01:04:52,840
Speaker 2: So so you know he runs that. I chat to

1323
01:04:52,920 --> 01:04:55,080
Speaker 2: him about some of the things because he started cutting

1324
01:04:55,080 --> 01:04:56,840
Speaker 2: the bread already in the bagels. I get straight in.

1325
01:04:57,160 --> 01:04:59,800
Speaker 2: I see Will the head baker or Nick the number

1326
01:04:59,840 --> 01:05:01,880
Speaker 2: two if it's his day, and I just say, yeah,

1327
01:05:01,920 --> 01:05:04,040
Speaker 2: great work, guys of bread, looks fantastic, or you know,

1328
01:05:04,480 --> 01:05:06,560
Speaker 2: rise a bit flat? What happened? And we work through it,

1329
01:05:07,000 --> 01:05:09,360
Speaker 2: gur pastry chef, we talk through that, so that you know,

1330
01:05:09,400 --> 01:05:12,360
Speaker 2: that's my first sort of thirty minutes down in the bakery,

1331
01:05:12,440 --> 01:05:14,640
Speaker 2: just chatting to the guys about well done, looks great,

1332
01:05:14,800 --> 01:05:17,040
Speaker 2: blah blah. Usually, you know, ninety nine percent of the

1333
01:05:17,040 --> 01:05:19,520
Speaker 2: time it's well done. Occasionally it's like, rise a bit

1334
01:05:19,560 --> 01:05:21,600
Speaker 2: flat today, what happened? You know? And they've taught me

1335
01:05:21,600 --> 01:05:24,440
Speaker 2: through because it's a living organism, right, so you know,

1336
01:05:24,480 --> 01:05:26,240
Speaker 2: all of a sudden it's wet and rainy, or it's

1337
01:05:26,280 --> 01:05:28,840
Speaker 2: humid and hot and the weather's jumping around, or a

1338
01:05:28,880 --> 01:05:31,680
Speaker 2: new batch of flower comes in that's slightly more absorbent

1339
01:05:31,880 --> 01:05:35,560
Speaker 2: or less absorbed. That's I've learned a lot, Like I've

1340
01:05:35,560 --> 01:05:38,680
Speaker 2: always appreciated flower as a chef and working with the

1341
01:05:38,680 --> 01:05:42,400
Speaker 2: guys in pastry baking as a whole new aspect of that.

1342
01:05:42,560 --> 01:05:45,439
Speaker 2: So that's where my day starts and then I'm at

1343
01:05:45,480 --> 01:05:47,720
Speaker 2: Margaret and I'm over at Sombird talking to the chefs,

1344
01:05:47,720 --> 01:05:50,400
Speaker 2: and generally for me, I would be going straight to

1345
01:05:50,480 --> 01:05:52,440
Speaker 2: the boys who are dry fillitting the fish, and I'm

1346
01:05:52,480 --> 01:05:55,240
Speaker 2: talking through what's coming in. You know what the fish

1347
01:05:55,320 --> 01:05:58,360
Speaker 2: is looking like. They're fillting and it's under rigor you

1348
01:05:58,400 --> 01:06:00,360
Speaker 2: know it's beautiful. We're talking about how much or fish

1349
01:06:00,400 --> 01:06:03,320
Speaker 2: I think we need this week, looking at the meat

1350
01:06:03,360 --> 01:06:05,840
Speaker 2: this cutbank coming in. You know, my aging room is

1351
01:06:06,240 --> 01:06:10,720
Speaker 2: out at near Brookvale in the Northern Beaches. It's just

1352
01:06:10,800 --> 01:06:13,360
Speaker 2: completely full of all the beef that we use. Our

1353
01:06:13,360 --> 01:06:15,800
Speaker 2: butcher cuts it and sends it in each day. So

1354
01:06:16,280 --> 01:06:18,360
Speaker 2: having control of that and then talking to the chefs

1355
01:06:18,400 --> 01:06:21,200
Speaker 2: about what the menu is going to be. And then

1356
01:06:21,400 --> 01:06:24,200
Speaker 2: often I'll be doing briefing if I'm on like Saturday

1357
01:06:24,200 --> 01:06:28,120
Speaker 2: and Sunday and Thursday and Friday night. Last week i did,

1358
01:06:28,680 --> 01:06:31,040
Speaker 2: I worked in the kitchen at Margaret, so I'll run

1359
01:06:31,640 --> 01:06:34,400
Speaker 2: the food side of the briefing. Every night we talk

1360
01:06:34,480 --> 01:06:36,400
Speaker 2: to all the stuff and every morning we talk to

1361
01:06:36,440 --> 01:06:38,960
Speaker 2: all the front of house stuff about what's on, what's

1362
01:06:39,000 --> 01:06:41,760
Speaker 2: in addition to the menu, where something's from, what the

1363
01:06:41,760 --> 01:06:44,760
Speaker 2: oyster change is particular, fish, you know, whatever it might be.

1364
01:06:45,640 --> 01:06:47,440
Speaker 2: The moment, we're running through a lot of things where

1365
01:06:47,520 --> 01:06:49,840
Speaker 2: winter stuff's going out and fruits are coming in and stuff,

1366
01:06:49,880 --> 01:06:52,560
Speaker 2: So those conversations are really important. I do the same

1367
01:06:52,560 --> 01:06:55,919
Speaker 2: thing at Songbird, and that's then the start of my day.

1368
01:06:55,920 --> 01:06:58,360
Speaker 2: Then I'm in the kitchen or talking to customers, and

1369
01:06:59,320 --> 01:07:02,560
Speaker 2: in the afternoon i'll be I'll be you know, doing

1370
01:07:02,600 --> 01:07:05,000
Speaker 2: some stuff with the chefs, or I'll be in doing

1371
01:07:05,080 --> 01:07:06,400
Speaker 2: At the moment, I'm working on a whole lot of

1372
01:07:06,440 --> 01:07:09,080
Speaker 2: recipes for Cobra Molive Oil because we work pretty closely

1373
01:07:09,160 --> 01:07:11,800
Speaker 2: with them. Plus that's when I sit down with my

1374
01:07:12,080 --> 01:07:15,440
Speaker 2: CEO and CFO and just run through stuff from the

1375
01:07:15,480 --> 01:07:17,920
Speaker 2: previous day of the previous week, you know, set up

1376
01:07:17,920 --> 01:07:20,040
Speaker 2: for our Wednesday meetings or whatever it might be. So

1377
01:07:20,560 --> 01:07:22,320
Speaker 2: that kind of happens, and then the weekend starts and

1378
01:07:22,320 --> 01:07:23,000
Speaker 2: it's just full on.

1379
01:07:23,160 --> 01:07:27,040
Speaker 1: It's just it's just restaurants and and the energy where's

1380
01:07:27,080 --> 01:07:29,760
Speaker 1: it coming from? You feel more energized now than you've

1381
01:07:29,760 --> 01:07:30,080
Speaker 1: ever done.

1382
01:07:30,120 --> 01:07:33,920
Speaker 2: I'd say I feel more in control of my life

1383
01:07:34,000 --> 01:07:38,680
Speaker 2: than I ever had, because I I really don't want

1384
01:07:38,680 --> 01:07:41,200
Speaker 2: to do anything else except for grow the bakeries. So

1385
01:07:41,360 --> 01:07:43,920
Speaker 2: we'll have more, We'll have more shops in Sydney, and

1386
01:07:43,920 --> 01:07:44,400
Speaker 2: I want to do it.

1387
01:07:44,440 --> 01:07:46,479
Speaker 1: More Baker Blues, Yeah, more Baker Blues.

1388
01:07:46,520 --> 01:07:48,480
Speaker 2: I don't want any more restaurants. I just want Margaret

1389
01:07:48,520 --> 01:07:51,160
Speaker 2: and Sonburn and Bobby's and next Door to run at

1390
01:07:51,160 --> 01:07:54,520
Speaker 2: the at the peak of their powers, you know, making

1391
01:07:54,520 --> 01:07:57,200
Speaker 2: people like I go to next Door once every couple

1392
01:07:57,240 --> 01:07:59,160
Speaker 2: of weeks and have the burger there, because the cheeseburger

1393
01:07:59,200 --> 01:08:01,800
Speaker 2: there's just absolutely fantastic. I have one every day, but

1394
01:08:01,800 --> 01:08:04,760
Speaker 2: then I wouldn't look like I do so, so I

1395
01:08:05,200 --> 01:08:10,520
Speaker 2: really love that. And for me, you know, I'm financially stable.

1396
01:08:11,080 --> 01:08:13,280
Speaker 2: I don't have any partners apart from Baker Blue and

1397
01:08:15,080 --> 01:08:20,480
Speaker 2: Natalie and Linden in Bobby's. There are two little partnerships,

1398
01:08:20,479 --> 01:08:23,440
Speaker 2: but they're kind of more like giving those guys opportunities

1399
01:08:23,479 --> 01:08:25,960
Speaker 2: within Sydney. I feel like I've made enough money to

1400
01:08:26,280 --> 01:08:28,439
Speaker 2: help younger, but they're all in their forties and you know,

1401
01:08:28,439 --> 01:08:31,240
Speaker 2: I'd really like to help them grow and have the

1402
01:08:31,280 --> 01:08:34,760
Speaker 2: aspirations that I've had and stabilize their life the way

1403
01:08:34,800 --> 01:08:37,160
Speaker 2: I've been able to stabilize mine, and we own our

1404
01:08:37,200 --> 01:08:39,800
Speaker 2: own businesses, you know, on the bank, it's very happy

1405
01:08:39,880 --> 01:08:42,320
Speaker 2: with me, and you know, the kids are beautiful, and

1406
01:08:42,760 --> 01:08:45,720
Speaker 2: got a gorgeous granddaughter, and you know, I mean, I

1407
01:08:45,760 --> 01:08:47,760
Speaker 2: just don't even know what more I could have in

1408
01:08:47,800 --> 01:08:49,320
Speaker 2: life that would make me happier.

1409
01:08:49,600 --> 01:08:51,880
Speaker 1: It's amazing. I can see it in your eyes, I mean,

1410
01:08:52,040 --> 01:08:55,280
Speaker 1: and I can see it and everything you do, you

1411
01:08:55,360 --> 01:08:58,519
Speaker 1: seem to be like at a really great place in

1412
01:08:59,040 --> 01:09:02,719
Speaker 1: peace of mind. It's still active energy.

1413
01:09:03,240 --> 01:09:05,640
Speaker 2: I sort of think, you know, my life's been like

1414
01:09:05,920 --> 01:09:09,400
Speaker 2: I think I break it into sort of sections of

1415
01:09:09,400 --> 01:09:12,280
Speaker 2: my life that are like there was one part that

1416
01:09:12,400 --> 01:09:15,120
Speaker 2: was that my life was growing to be able to

1417
01:09:15,160 --> 01:09:17,360
Speaker 2: create Rockpool, which was one of the great restaurants in

1418
01:09:17,400 --> 01:09:21,320
Speaker 2: the world, and that then became Rockpool Bar and Grill.

1419
01:09:21,400 --> 01:09:23,559
Speaker 2: And then I sold that business, and I never thought

1420
01:09:23,600 --> 01:09:25,200
Speaker 2: I would do that. You know, if anyone had said

1421
01:09:25,200 --> 01:09:27,479
Speaker 2: to me in the early two thousands or nineties, would

1422
01:09:27,520 --> 01:09:29,400
Speaker 2: you ever sell this? I would have said, I will

1423
01:09:29,479 --> 01:09:32,640
Speaker 2: die with this restaurant brand. You know, it's me, It's

1424
01:09:32,680 --> 01:09:36,240
Speaker 2: part of my DNA. And then I was lucky enough

1425
01:09:36,240 --> 01:09:38,519
Speaker 2: to be able to sell it. And then I was

1426
01:09:38,560 --> 01:09:41,640
Speaker 2: lucky enough to be able so I realized all that

1427
01:09:41,720 --> 01:09:43,719
Speaker 2: hard work that I put in, I realized a reward

1428
01:09:43,720 --> 01:09:45,519
Speaker 2: from that, because you know, it's like you often be

1429
01:09:45,640 --> 01:09:49,920
Speaker 2: in putting in tremendous amounts of hours and just reinvesting

1430
01:09:49,920 --> 01:09:52,320
Speaker 2: in your business and reinvesting in your business. And I

1431
01:09:52,320 --> 01:09:55,240
Speaker 2: finally got to the stage where I was able to

1432
01:09:54,520 --> 01:09:58,639
Speaker 2: know a great reward for all the energy I'd put

1433
01:09:58,640 --> 01:10:01,360
Speaker 2: in and for all the ideas that i'd and at

1434
01:10:01,400 --> 01:10:04,360
Speaker 2: that stage, I really didn't think that I'd walk away

1435
01:10:04,360 --> 01:10:07,080
Speaker 2: from it completely. But you know, COVID started and there

1436
01:10:07,080 --> 01:10:08,599
Speaker 2: are a few other things, and they wanted to take

1437
01:10:08,600 --> 01:10:10,200
Speaker 2: the business in this direction, and I wanted to go

1438
01:10:10,200 --> 01:10:13,080
Speaker 2: in that direction. And the guys from Quadrant, Chris and

1439
01:10:13,400 --> 01:10:15,400
Speaker 2: JP at the time, were really fantastic. They said, look,

1440
01:10:15,400 --> 01:10:17,000
Speaker 2: you can go and open this little restaurant. They didn't

1441
01:10:17,040 --> 01:10:18,760
Speaker 2: have to do that because I had constraints ove me

1442
01:10:18,760 --> 01:10:22,360
Speaker 2: and stuff, and you know, meeting Charles and all those

1443
01:10:22,360 --> 01:10:25,800
Speaker 2: guys was really important, and you know, found a great landlord.

1444
01:10:26,360 --> 01:10:28,200
Speaker 2: You know, I felt took a risk because the rents

1445
01:10:28,200 --> 01:10:30,200
Speaker 2: were kind of like city rents. But but you know,

1446
01:10:30,400 --> 01:10:34,080
Speaker 2: in the in the suburbs, but COVID had changed the

1447
01:10:34,120 --> 01:10:37,559
Speaker 2: way Double Bay was well, not not even Double Bay.

1448
01:10:37,600 --> 01:10:40,120
Speaker 2: All suburbs were working. People were feeling comfortable in their

1449
01:10:40,160 --> 01:10:43,000
Speaker 2: community and spending much more time there than in the city.

1450
01:10:43,040 --> 01:10:44,320
Speaker 2: And even if they went to the city, they were

1451
01:10:44,360 --> 01:10:46,960
Speaker 2: coming back to have lunch or have dinner or whatever

1452
01:10:47,000 --> 01:10:51,519
Speaker 2: it might be. And then and then you know, I've

1453
01:10:51,560 --> 01:10:55,160
Speaker 2: really now it's named after my mother, so it's so personal,

1454
01:10:55,240 --> 01:10:58,280
Speaker 2: so it won't you know, there'd be no selling this one.

1455
01:10:58,640 --> 01:11:01,840
Speaker 2: And we've kind of named it the Margaret Family because

1456
01:11:01,880 --> 01:11:04,599
Speaker 2: we don't really see as being corporate or a group.

1457
01:11:04,760 --> 01:11:07,759
Speaker 2: It's you know, it's a family that owns these businesses

1458
01:11:07,800 --> 01:11:11,519
Speaker 2: that they live in and thrive in. And our customers

1459
01:11:11,520 --> 01:11:13,439
Speaker 2: are so important to us, our staff are even more

1460
01:11:13,479 --> 01:11:15,559
Speaker 2: important to us, and we're able to make decisions every

1461
01:11:15,640 --> 01:11:18,439
Speaker 2: day not based on what the bottom line is. I

1462
01:11:18,479 --> 01:11:20,320
Speaker 2: wouldn't say we don't care about that, because you know,

1463
01:11:20,360 --> 01:11:21,800
Speaker 2: we do, because we've got to run a business. We've

1464
01:11:21,800 --> 01:11:24,160
Speaker 2: got to reward the staff and so forth. But it's

1465
01:11:24,200 --> 01:11:27,000
Speaker 2: not our main motivation. Our motivation is, you know, how

1466
01:11:27,040 --> 01:11:29,479
Speaker 2: good are we, how much joy are we bringing, how

1467
01:11:29,520 --> 01:11:33,439
Speaker 2: much enjoyment to the staff have working for us, What

1468
01:11:34,000 --> 01:11:37,439
Speaker 2: privileges we can give them and what leg up we

1469
01:11:37,479 --> 01:11:39,400
Speaker 2: can give them in their career or life or whatever,

1470
01:11:39,439 --> 01:11:42,360
Speaker 2: And that really is how we think now, or how

1471
01:11:42,400 --> 01:11:45,720
Speaker 2: I think particularly, and so for me that gives me

1472
01:11:46,320 --> 01:11:50,160
Speaker 2: so much joy and happiness. And now that I'm out

1473
01:11:50,160 --> 01:11:52,960
Speaker 2: of that little dark four week period at Somber that

1474
01:11:53,000 --> 01:11:57,320
Speaker 2: almost killed me, you know, I'm really happy and you know,

1475
01:11:57,439 --> 01:11:58,599
Speaker 2: things are going really really well.

1476
01:11:58,800 --> 01:12:02,240
Speaker 1: Well, Neil Perry, thanks for relentlessness. Thanks for continually giving

1477
01:12:02,320 --> 01:12:06,759
Speaker 1: us education about what's great food, what's a great space,

1478
01:12:06,800 --> 01:12:12,240
Speaker 1: what's a great experience, but probably right now, thanks for

1479
01:12:12,439 --> 01:12:15,439
Speaker 1: what you do to the communities within which you operate.

1480
01:12:15,479 --> 01:12:18,120
Speaker 1: That's not just your staff and your family and your

1481
01:12:18,120 --> 01:12:21,920
Speaker 1: family staff, but also the people you you serve. Thank you,

1482
01:12:22,120 --> 01:12:25,559
Speaker 1: and it's really important you are. I actually think, you know,

1483
01:12:25,720 --> 01:12:28,559
Speaker 1: I've always been Anil Perry fan, but it's easy to

1484
01:12:28,600 --> 01:12:30,240
Speaker 1: say that because Neil Perry is sort of, you know,

1485
01:12:30,600 --> 01:12:31,479
Speaker 1: iconic and famous.

1486
01:12:31,479 --> 01:12:33,120
Speaker 2: But I've just been around for a long time.

1487
01:12:33,560 --> 01:12:36,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, but that's part of the game. And thanks for

1488
01:12:36,960 --> 01:12:40,000
Speaker 1: being such a great survivor in such a tough industry

1489
01:12:40,920 --> 01:12:43,080
Speaker 1: full of critics, and you've come out shining.

1490
01:12:43,120 --> 01:12:43,360
Speaker 2: Mate.

1491
01:12:43,439 --> 01:12:43,880
Speaker 1: Well done you.

1492
01:12:44,120 --> 01:12:45,120
Speaker 2: Thanks for good