1 00:00:00,960 --> 00:00:01,639 Speaker 1: I get a team. 2 00:00:01,639 --> 00:00:04,600 Speaker 2: It's Harps, it's Gilasoper's, it's cook, it's us, it's the 3 00:00:04,600 --> 00:00:09,000 Speaker 2: bloody you project. TIFs just over there at typ Central, 4 00:00:09,080 --> 00:00:12,479 Speaker 2: drinking her own body weight in protein shaken. She gave 5 00:00:12,560 --> 00:00:14,840 Speaker 2: David and Either brief That wouldn't have been a very 6 00:00:14,880 --> 00:00:17,600 Speaker 2: pleasant experience for any of us if we didn't let 7 00:00:17,600 --> 00:00:21,080 Speaker 2: her consume some calories before we press the go button. 8 00:00:21,239 --> 00:00:24,320 Speaker 1: You do have, you do have a very short light. 9 00:00:24,360 --> 00:00:27,640 Speaker 2: There's a very short timeline between when you go, oh, 10 00:00:27,680 --> 00:00:30,960 Speaker 2: I think, I'm I'm hungry and now I'm a complete 11 00:00:31,040 --> 00:00:32,880 Speaker 2: fucking lunatic and i want to punch someone. 12 00:00:32,960 --> 00:00:34,280 Speaker 1: That's not a big gap. 13 00:00:34,080 --> 00:00:34,360 Speaker 2: Is it. 14 00:00:34,600 --> 00:00:38,040 Speaker 3: When I worked in hospitality all those years ago, we 15 00:00:38,159 --> 00:00:41,880 Speaker 3: used to put an order into the kitchen for food, 16 00:00:42,640 --> 00:00:45,199 Speaker 3: and then when we went on break, someone would come 17 00:00:45,240 --> 00:00:47,960 Speaker 3: and cover us. If my food came out, was placed 18 00:00:47,960 --> 00:00:50,720 Speaker 3: in front of me, and a customer walked in, I 19 00:00:50,920 --> 00:00:56,480 Speaker 3: can't tell you the level of self control and emotional 20 00:00:56,640 --> 00:01:00,480 Speaker 3: turmoil it took me to just keep that in and 21 00:01:00,480 --> 00:01:03,440 Speaker 3: and serve the people that were standing between me and 22 00:01:03,480 --> 00:01:05,080 Speaker 3: my lunch items. 23 00:01:05,520 --> 00:01:08,440 Speaker 2: It seems like the spiritual revolution that was had in 24 00:01:08,440 --> 00:01:12,160 Speaker 2: India is long gone. I don't want to point out, 25 00:01:12,200 --> 00:01:14,119 Speaker 2: but it just seems like that might be a thing 26 00:01:14,160 --> 00:01:14,720 Speaker 2: of the past. 27 00:01:15,600 --> 00:01:17,120 Speaker 3: As long as I've got a bit of food in 28 00:01:17,160 --> 00:01:18,039 Speaker 3: my belly, I'm good. 29 00:01:18,400 --> 00:01:21,360 Speaker 2: So I don't think you can have like caveats on 30 00:01:21,400 --> 00:01:24,840 Speaker 2: your spell. It's long as except when I'm punching people 31 00:01:24,880 --> 00:01:30,039 Speaker 2: in the face. Then I'm pretty much the deli lama. 32 00:01:30,920 --> 00:01:32,960 Speaker 1: Oh well, oh well, are you a big eater? 33 00:01:33,360 --> 00:01:39,440 Speaker 4: Gillespoh not particularly, No, just normally I think I don't 34 00:01:39,480 --> 00:01:41,600 Speaker 4: think I have chiffs appetite, and I certainly don't have 35 00:01:42,400 --> 00:01:45,680 Speaker 4: So you've met my son James. He spends more time 36 00:01:45,680 --> 00:01:47,840 Speaker 4: in the gym than I suspect you do. So heats 37 00:01:47,960 --> 00:01:50,640 Speaker 4: like like there's no tomorrow. But I certainly don't eat 38 00:01:50,640 --> 00:01:51,040 Speaker 4: that much. 39 00:01:52,240 --> 00:01:54,800 Speaker 2: My days of eating what I just want to eat 40 00:01:54,840 --> 00:01:56,480 Speaker 2: whenever I want to eat their long gone. 41 00:01:56,560 --> 00:02:00,240 Speaker 1: Pity. They were good times, but it didn't work. 42 00:02:00,280 --> 00:02:05,160 Speaker 2: How wellgo the Moniker Jumbo? All through school I gave 43 00:02:05,200 --> 00:02:07,520 Speaker 2: it a good crack, though I could have eaten for Australia. 44 00:02:07,560 --> 00:02:11,520 Speaker 2: At one stage I was world class, world class glutton. 45 00:02:13,040 --> 00:02:16,919 Speaker 2: Speaking of all things food, let's talk about sugar, and 46 00:02:17,000 --> 00:02:21,840 Speaker 2: let's talk about whether or not sugar might be responsible 47 00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:25,000 Speaker 2: for ADHD in kids? 48 00:02:26,919 --> 00:02:27,400 Speaker 1: Where did that? 49 00:02:28,040 --> 00:02:30,360 Speaker 2: Where did that research come from, or where did this 50 00:02:30,480 --> 00:02:31,280 Speaker 2: idea come from? 51 00:02:31,840 --> 00:02:34,520 Speaker 4: Oh, look, it's been around for a long time, probably 52 00:02:34,639 --> 00:02:39,960 Speaker 4: since the seventies. Really, there were a few early studies 53 00:02:39,960 --> 00:02:44,480 Speaker 4: in the seventies that suggested that if you gave kids sugar, 54 00:02:45,639 --> 00:02:48,000 Speaker 4: they'd start climbing the walls and bouncing off the ceiling 55 00:02:48,040 --> 00:02:53,440 Speaker 4: fans and things like that, and that sort of caught 56 00:02:53,520 --> 00:02:56,720 Speaker 4: on because it matches what a lot of parents will 57 00:02:56,760 --> 00:02:59,359 Speaker 4: tell you. I mean, most friends will say, oh, yeah, 58 00:02:59,400 --> 00:03:03,200 Speaker 4: you can't. You can't give little Tristan, you know, a 59 00:03:03,280 --> 00:03:06,400 Speaker 4: can of full strength coke or you're you know, you'll 60 00:03:06,440 --> 00:03:08,360 Speaker 4: be cleaning up the place for the next month. 61 00:03:09,360 --> 00:03:09,600 Speaker 3: You know. 62 00:03:10,080 --> 00:03:15,240 Speaker 4: And and that's certainly how most people perceive it. They say, right, sugar, 63 00:03:16,160 --> 00:03:19,520 Speaker 4: give kids sugar. There they suddenly become hyper And so 64 00:03:19,560 --> 00:03:23,280 Speaker 4: it wasn't too far to draw the bow from there 65 00:03:23,320 --> 00:03:28,440 Speaker 4: and say, okay, well then, since hyperactivity and ADHD pretty 66 00:03:28,480 --> 00:03:30,200 Speaker 4: much mean the same thing to a lot of people, 67 00:03:31,960 --> 00:03:36,400 Speaker 4: obviously sugar causes ADHD. So that it's been around for 68 00:03:36,400 --> 00:03:40,320 Speaker 4: a while. It's based more on myth than science, and 69 00:03:40,960 --> 00:03:43,360 Speaker 4: when they eventually did get around to doing the science 70 00:03:43,400 --> 00:03:45,720 Speaker 4: on this, and you can imagine it's not a high priority. 71 00:03:45,760 --> 00:03:48,320 Speaker 4: You know, you're trying to kill cancer and you know 72 00:03:48,520 --> 00:03:51,320 Speaker 4: all that sort of stuff. Finding out whether or not 73 00:03:51,800 --> 00:03:54,600 Speaker 4: sugar makes kids crazy when everyone already knows the answer 74 00:03:54,640 --> 00:03:59,240 Speaker 4: is not a high priority for funding. But when they 75 00:03:59,320 --> 00:04:02,240 Speaker 4: actually I eventually did do the science, they found a 76 00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:05,320 Speaker 4: couple of things. Is that when they did placebo controlled 77 00:04:05,360 --> 00:04:10,280 Speaker 4: trials where you know, they were feeding kids things that 78 00:04:10,400 --> 00:04:13,400 Speaker 4: were sugar free as you know, given sweetness and so on, 79 00:04:13,520 --> 00:04:20,480 Speaker 4: rather than sugar, and cross matching those against kids who 80 00:04:20,480 --> 00:04:23,200 Speaker 4: were being given sugar, there was no discernible difference in 81 00:04:23,240 --> 00:04:26,760 Speaker 4: their behavior. The interesting thing was that if you told 82 00:04:26,839 --> 00:04:31,919 Speaker 4: the parents of either group that their child their group 83 00:04:32,000 --> 00:04:35,040 Speaker 4: was the one consuming the sugar, they would immediately spot 84 00:04:35,080 --> 00:04:38,200 Speaker 4: the signs of hyperactivity if they thought their child had 85 00:04:38,200 --> 00:04:44,919 Speaker 4: been given sugar. So we're entirely suggestible. And the kids 86 00:04:44,960 --> 00:04:48,560 Speaker 4: themselves too, if you told them that they were given sugar, 87 00:04:49,560 --> 00:04:54,800 Speaker 4: they would often act more hyperactive than if they weren't. 88 00:04:55,279 --> 00:05:00,640 Speaker 4: So it was really more about saying, okay, people believe this. 89 00:05:00,760 --> 00:05:05,279 Speaker 4: They deeply believe this, parents included, and they believe it 90 00:05:05,320 --> 00:05:07,440 Speaker 4: to the extent that if you do studies on this 91 00:05:07,600 --> 00:05:11,119 Speaker 4: and tell people the wrong piece of information, they believe 92 00:05:11,160 --> 00:05:15,719 Speaker 4: it anyway and start seeing what they believe. So I 93 00:05:15,720 --> 00:05:17,960 Speaker 4: guess it's more of a commentary on a sort of 94 00:05:17,960 --> 00:05:19,839 Speaker 4: a placebo effect than anything else. 95 00:05:20,320 --> 00:05:23,160 Speaker 2: That's so interesting because it is it's like I was 96 00:05:23,200 --> 00:05:24,640 Speaker 2: going to say, it's like plus. 97 00:05:24,360 --> 00:05:26,360 Speaker 1: Ebo adhd you know. 98 00:05:26,480 --> 00:05:31,000 Speaker 2: And we've we've spoken before about plus ebos and no cibos, 99 00:05:31,040 --> 00:05:33,120 Speaker 2: And we had a I don't know if I've ever 100 00:05:33,160 --> 00:05:35,320 Speaker 2: told you this, we had a dud on called Professor 101 00:05:35,360 --> 00:05:37,839 Speaker 2: Jeffrey Reddicker from Harvard Medical School. 102 00:05:37,520 --> 00:05:40,039 Speaker 1: Who's a a. 103 00:05:39,600 --> 00:05:43,040 Speaker 2: Like a PhD research and plus a doctor, plus a psychiatrist. 104 00:05:43,160 --> 00:05:46,640 Speaker 2: And yeah, he talks about you know this stuff a lot. 105 00:05:46,680 --> 00:05:49,960 Speaker 2: Obviously talks from a healer. Well not obviously because I 106 00:05:49,960 --> 00:05:52,040 Speaker 2: haven't told you this, but he talks generally from a 107 00:05:52,080 --> 00:05:53,600 Speaker 2: healing and a health point of view. 108 00:05:53,600 --> 00:05:55,360 Speaker 1: But it is pretty. 109 00:05:55,080 --> 00:06:00,520 Speaker 2: Amazing what manifests based on what we think think is 110 00:06:00,560 --> 00:06:03,520 Speaker 2: happening rather than what is actually happening. 111 00:06:04,120 --> 00:06:07,920 Speaker 4: Well, we're designed. Evolution has designed us to recognize patterns. 112 00:06:07,960 --> 00:06:13,200 Speaker 4: Patterns keep us alive. Spotting a pattern in a series 113 00:06:13,240 --> 00:06:17,560 Speaker 4: of unrelated events is how we predict the behavior of 114 00:06:17,560 --> 00:06:21,120 Speaker 4: other humans. And the behavior of animals and danger all around, 115 00:06:21,360 --> 00:06:25,640 Speaker 4: and so we are optimized for pattern recognition, and often 116 00:06:25,640 --> 00:06:27,800 Speaker 4: we can be convinced that a pattern exists where there 117 00:06:27,839 --> 00:06:31,200 Speaker 4: is no pattern. So, you know, the classic example of 118 00:06:31,920 --> 00:06:34,800 Speaker 4: you know, you might spot you might notice that ice 119 00:06:34,839 --> 00:06:38,440 Speaker 4: cream sales go up at exactly the same rate and 120 00:06:38,480 --> 00:06:42,360 Speaker 4: at the same time as shark attacks, and you'll say, obviously, 121 00:06:42,520 --> 00:06:48,119 Speaker 4: obviously ice cream causes shark attacks, or shark attack caused 122 00:06:48,160 --> 00:06:51,440 Speaker 4: ice cream consumption. Clearly that's not the case, and that's 123 00:06:51,480 --> 00:06:53,800 Speaker 4: one of the classic examples given for correlation does an 124 00:06:53,839 --> 00:06:56,599 Speaker 4: equal causation. But what often can be the case is 125 00:06:56,640 --> 00:07:01,280 Speaker 4: that something else is causing both, So you know, and 126 00:07:01,360 --> 00:07:03,880 Speaker 4: in that case, it might be that when the temperature 127 00:07:03,880 --> 00:07:07,039 Speaker 4: goes up, people buy more ice cream and people swim more, 128 00:07:07,160 --> 00:07:09,760 Speaker 4: so there's more shark attacks and more ice cream consumption. 129 00:07:10,560 --> 00:07:13,600 Speaker 4: But obviously the shark attacks are not causing the ice 130 00:07:13,600 --> 00:07:16,680 Speaker 4: cream consumption, and vice versa. But we spot those patterns 131 00:07:16,680 --> 00:07:18,760 Speaker 4: and we start to attribute menning. I mean, this is 132 00:07:18,880 --> 00:07:21,760 Speaker 4: all you studied this for years, Greig. I mean, this 133 00:07:21,840 --> 00:07:26,200 Speaker 4: is what psychology is. It's spotting patterns and making up 134 00:07:26,560 --> 00:07:28,240 Speaker 4: bs stories about them. 135 00:07:28,520 --> 00:07:31,160 Speaker 1: You can it's Okay, no, no, I can't. 136 00:07:31,200 --> 00:07:34,360 Speaker 4: I don't want to offend Tiff. You know, she's easily offended, So. 137 00:07:36,960 --> 00:07:39,520 Speaker 2: Speaking offensive, I had a lady who's been following me 138 00:07:39,600 --> 00:07:42,000 Speaker 2: for ten years who sent me a message the other day, 139 00:07:42,440 --> 00:07:44,760 Speaker 2: totally within her rights and full respect from me, and 140 00:07:44,840 --> 00:07:48,480 Speaker 2: she said, you used the sea the sea word. And 141 00:07:48,520 --> 00:07:51,520 Speaker 2: apparently I was on the pod with two ladies, so 142 00:07:51,600 --> 00:07:54,080 Speaker 2: Tiff must have been one of them, and she said, 143 00:07:54,120 --> 00:07:58,520 Speaker 2: I can't follow you anymore. Okay, okay, that's not the 144 00:07:58,520 --> 00:08:01,720 Speaker 2: first time. You must to the other episodes, but it is. 145 00:08:03,120 --> 00:08:05,800 Speaker 4: Here's an interesting factory about that word. So I spent 146 00:08:06,240 --> 00:08:08,120 Speaker 4: I lived in Germany for a while as an exchangsion, 147 00:08:08,320 --> 00:08:12,320 Speaker 4: and there's a word. The word for that in German 148 00:08:13,360 --> 00:08:17,040 Speaker 4: is so rarely used that most women don't know it. 149 00:08:18,040 --> 00:08:22,880 Speaker 4: So if you were to use it, you wouldn't offend 150 00:08:23,040 --> 00:08:25,320 Speaker 4: most of the women around because they wouldn't know what 151 00:08:25,360 --> 00:08:30,160 Speaker 4: you're talking about. So it's that extreme a rarity to 152 00:08:30,280 --> 00:08:30,880 Speaker 4: use that word. 153 00:08:31,880 --> 00:08:35,200 Speaker 2: Well, and I think also, and I'm not I'm not 154 00:08:35,240 --> 00:08:37,640 Speaker 2: saying it's okay everyone, and I'm not justifying, and I 155 00:08:37,679 --> 00:08:40,960 Speaker 2: don't use it very often, but it's like when I 156 00:08:41,000 --> 00:08:44,600 Speaker 2: say that word I'm not talking about anyone's anatomy. It's 157 00:08:44,800 --> 00:08:49,160 Speaker 2: just I'm talking about something else, you know. But it's like, well, 158 00:08:49,880 --> 00:08:51,280 Speaker 2: I get it, I get it anyway. 159 00:08:51,600 --> 00:08:52,920 Speaker 4: Well, it's like the word moist. 160 00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:58,000 Speaker 3: You probably that's way more offensive. 161 00:08:58,440 --> 00:08:59,280 Speaker 1: What is that? 162 00:08:59,400 --> 00:09:01,800 Speaker 2: It's funny that word because there's a show called eight 163 00:09:01,840 --> 00:09:03,439 Speaker 2: out of Ten Cats does count Down? 164 00:09:03,480 --> 00:09:04,559 Speaker 1: Have you ever seen that show? 165 00:09:04,880 --> 00:09:05,160 Speaker 4: Yes? 166 00:09:05,400 --> 00:09:08,160 Speaker 2: And so the lady who is that I forget what's 167 00:09:08,160 --> 00:09:11,000 Speaker 2: her actual proper title, But anyway, she does all the words. 168 00:09:11,000 --> 00:09:11,880 Speaker 1: She's a wordsmith. 169 00:09:12,000 --> 00:09:13,520 Speaker 4: She's the dictionary lady. 170 00:09:13,600 --> 00:09:14,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, the dictionary lady. 171 00:09:15,320 --> 00:09:18,600 Speaker 2: She she cannot cope with that word. 172 00:09:19,200 --> 00:09:20,959 Speaker 4: A lot of people can't cope with that word. 173 00:09:22,640 --> 00:09:23,720 Speaker 1: What's the trigger for you? 174 00:09:23,920 --> 00:09:24,720 Speaker 4: Get into it? 175 00:09:25,000 --> 00:09:25,040 Speaker 2: No? 176 00:09:25,160 --> 00:09:28,880 Speaker 4: All right, I just looking at TIFF's face, I get 177 00:09:28,880 --> 00:09:30,640 Speaker 4: the feeling she doesn't want to talk about it. 178 00:09:31,840 --> 00:09:35,040 Speaker 2: Well, well without saying anything inappropriate. Is it just that 179 00:09:35,120 --> 00:09:38,520 Speaker 2: it what to me? It doesn't do any It's like 180 00:09:38,640 --> 00:09:40,400 Speaker 2: it could be a cake, a moist cake. 181 00:09:40,920 --> 00:09:43,440 Speaker 3: I see. But I think it's even just the sound 182 00:09:43,520 --> 00:09:46,400 Speaker 3: of the word is like the I don't know, I 183 00:09:46,440 --> 00:09:49,319 Speaker 3: don't know, I don't know, but stop it. 184 00:09:49,720 --> 00:09:52,960 Speaker 2: Well, but it rhymes with hoist and joist and like, 185 00:09:53,000 --> 00:09:55,120 Speaker 2: it's not if I say I'm going to hoist a 186 00:09:55,120 --> 00:09:57,600 Speaker 2: bag over my shoulder, you're not cringing. But if I 187 00:09:57,600 --> 00:10:00,800 Speaker 2: say I'm going to hoist a moist bag, I know 188 00:10:00,960 --> 00:10:01,560 Speaker 2: what is that? 189 00:10:03,200 --> 00:10:04,199 Speaker 3: Why it does that? 190 00:10:04,320 --> 00:10:05,040 Speaker 1: But it's just. 191 00:10:06,720 --> 00:10:11,040 Speaker 4: There's probably some bre psychological explanation for it. 192 00:10:10,480 --> 00:10:11,280 Speaker 1: Just like there is. 193 00:10:12,080 --> 00:10:14,400 Speaker 2: I was talking, as I told you, I know we've 194 00:10:14,400 --> 00:10:16,360 Speaker 2: gone off track, but fuck it is there a track. 195 00:10:16,440 --> 00:10:17,760 Speaker 1: Let's be honest. 196 00:10:18,200 --> 00:10:19,760 Speaker 4: We will get back to this because this has an 197 00:10:19,800 --> 00:10:21,800 Speaker 4: interesting ending, but we will get back to it, all right. 198 00:10:21,880 --> 00:10:22,360 Speaker 1: Yeah. 199 00:10:23,559 --> 00:10:26,160 Speaker 2: I was doing a talk today, as I told you before, 200 00:10:26,200 --> 00:10:31,520 Speaker 2: I won't say the organization, big organization, and that A 201 00:10:31,679 --> 00:10:35,560 Speaker 2: lady was asking me some questions about, you know, just 202 00:10:35,640 --> 00:10:39,079 Speaker 2: some psych stuff and I went, look and it you 203 00:10:39,640 --> 00:10:43,680 Speaker 2: sprung to mind. Halfway through a corporate presentation, I thought 204 00:10:43,679 --> 00:10:46,880 Speaker 2: to you, and I went, look, to be honest, psychology 205 00:10:46,920 --> 00:10:50,880 Speaker 2: is one of the one of the crappier sciences. You know, 206 00:10:51,360 --> 00:10:55,559 Speaker 2: It's not it's exactly it's not an exact science. 207 00:10:55,600 --> 00:10:57,560 Speaker 4: In the sense that astrology is a science. 208 00:10:58,040 --> 00:11:03,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, come on, come on, all right, So what does 209 00:11:03,440 --> 00:11:06,920 Speaker 2: sugar cause ADHD? It appears not, so what is the 210 00:11:07,920 --> 00:11:10,160 Speaker 2: insight to come out of this article. 211 00:11:10,520 --> 00:11:14,280 Speaker 4: Well, it appears that it actually does, but not in 212 00:11:14,400 --> 00:11:19,480 Speaker 4: the way that people think it does. So the reality 213 00:11:19,679 --> 00:11:24,679 Speaker 4: is that if you give a genuinely ADHD person sugar, 214 00:11:25,559 --> 00:11:29,640 Speaker 4: it's likely to calm them down, not make them more excited. 215 00:11:30,360 --> 00:11:36,719 Speaker 4: So remembering what ADHD actually is, it's a state of 216 00:11:36,760 --> 00:11:39,520 Speaker 4: the brain, a chemical state of the brain which is 217 00:11:39,559 --> 00:11:44,000 Speaker 4: created by addiction or stress or both where you become 218 00:11:44,240 --> 00:11:48,840 Speaker 4: dopamine tolerant. And what that means is that you need 219 00:11:48,920 --> 00:11:52,920 Speaker 4: more dopamine to get the same result as a normal person. 220 00:11:53,960 --> 00:11:58,240 Speaker 4: And so if someone is ADHD, it means that most 221 00:11:58,280 --> 00:12:00,880 Speaker 4: of the time they do not have an enough dopamine 222 00:12:00,880 --> 00:12:04,559 Speaker 4: to properly focus because their brain has become dopamine tolerant, 223 00:12:04,559 --> 00:12:07,080 Speaker 4: so they need more of it than the average person, 224 00:12:07,440 --> 00:12:09,400 Speaker 4: so most of the time they don't have enough. So 225 00:12:09,440 --> 00:12:13,440 Speaker 4: the solution to that is ADHD drugs, which are stimulants 226 00:12:13,640 --> 00:12:16,000 Speaker 4: in much the same way that cocaine is a stimulant 227 00:12:16,080 --> 00:12:18,920 Speaker 4: or nicotine is a stimulant. You give that to a 228 00:12:18,960 --> 00:12:22,000 Speaker 4: person with ADHD, it gives them a spike of dopamine. 229 00:12:22,480 --> 00:12:25,920 Speaker 4: It allows them to focus in that suddenly they have 230 00:12:26,080 --> 00:12:29,520 Speaker 4: enough dopamine to hit that threshold the rest of us 231 00:12:29,559 --> 00:12:32,040 Speaker 4: have all the time, and then they can focus. And 232 00:12:32,080 --> 00:12:34,840 Speaker 4: people with ADHD tell you that when they take those 233 00:12:34,920 --> 00:12:39,520 Speaker 4: drugs it allows them to feel normal. Suddenly their brain 234 00:12:39,559 --> 00:12:41,560 Speaker 4: isn't going all over the place at a million miles 235 00:12:41,559 --> 00:12:44,760 Speaker 4: an hour. They can just focus on the things they 236 00:12:44,800 --> 00:12:47,679 Speaker 4: need to focus on and get stuff done. And when 237 00:12:47,720 --> 00:12:50,280 Speaker 4: they first accidentally notice that this is the way those 238 00:12:50,320 --> 00:12:53,760 Speaker 4: drugs worked, they believed it to be a miracle because 239 00:12:53,800 --> 00:12:57,200 Speaker 4: they gave it to kids who were ADHD because they 240 00:12:57,240 --> 00:13:01,920 Speaker 4: were from an extremely stressful environment, ridden during the depression 241 00:13:01,960 --> 00:13:05,120 Speaker 4: in the United States, and kids that couldn't focus and 242 00:13:05,120 --> 00:13:09,000 Speaker 4: were a complete disaster in the classroom suddenly could get 243 00:13:09,040 --> 00:13:12,440 Speaker 4: a lot done and did really, really well. So that's 244 00:13:12,480 --> 00:13:15,120 Speaker 4: what the drugs do. But it's also what any addictive 245 00:13:15,120 --> 00:13:18,079 Speaker 4: substance does. And sugar is an addictive substance that produces 246 00:13:18,280 --> 00:13:24,199 Speaker 4: a dopamine spike. So giving a person who has ADHD 247 00:13:25,440 --> 00:13:30,079 Speaker 4: something like sugar should actually help them focus more than 248 00:13:31,080 --> 00:13:34,040 Speaker 4: if you didn't give it to them. So paradoxically, in 249 00:13:34,120 --> 00:13:40,000 Speaker 4: the immediate thing giving them sugar actually helps them. The 250 00:13:40,040 --> 00:13:43,960 Speaker 4: paradox there is that the thing that causes them to 251 00:13:44,120 --> 00:13:46,200 Speaker 4: not be able to focus in the first place is 252 00:13:46,240 --> 00:13:51,280 Speaker 4: getting too much stimulation, and so what you're actually doing 253 00:13:51,360 --> 00:13:55,880 Speaker 4: is building in a long term hardening of that so 254 00:13:55,920 --> 00:13:59,800 Speaker 4: that the person is actually worse when it comes to 255 00:14:00,200 --> 00:14:03,000 Speaker 4: long term state of their brain in that that extra 256 00:14:03,080 --> 00:14:07,480 Speaker 4: hit of dopamine stimulation makes them more dopamine tolerant for 257 00:14:07,520 --> 00:14:10,040 Speaker 4: the next time, so it becomes harder and harder and 258 00:14:10,120 --> 00:14:14,040 Speaker 4: harder for them to feel normal from a hit of dopamine. 259 00:14:14,360 --> 00:14:17,520 Speaker 4: So they've observed this in the drugs for a long time, 260 00:14:17,600 --> 00:14:20,840 Speaker 4: which is that you can't just give people ADHD medication 261 00:14:20,920 --> 00:14:24,040 Speaker 4: for the rest of their lives. Eventually they become get 262 00:14:24,120 --> 00:14:28,040 Speaker 4: to the point where they're tolerant of it, and the 263 00:14:28,120 --> 00:14:31,240 Speaker 4: same thing would happen here. So what that means coming 264 00:14:31,280 --> 00:14:35,400 Speaker 4: back to that does sugar give you ADHD story is yes, 265 00:14:35,480 --> 00:14:40,240 Speaker 4: it does, but not immediately. Doesn't make a kid act hyperactively, 266 00:14:40,280 --> 00:14:44,880 Speaker 4: which is why when the studies were done properly, there 267 00:14:45,040 --> 00:14:48,080 Speaker 4: was no real obvious difference between the kids given the 268 00:14:48,080 --> 00:14:51,080 Speaker 4: sugar and the ones not except when you told the 269 00:14:51,120 --> 00:14:55,960 Speaker 4: parents that they'd been given sugar. So that's why you 270 00:14:56,000 --> 00:14:58,880 Speaker 4: don't see it acutely in those studies, which is all 271 00:14:58,880 --> 00:15:01,080 Speaker 4: they ever studied. But if you look at the mechanics 272 00:15:01,120 --> 00:15:04,360 Speaker 4: of it. The reality is that someone on a diet, 273 00:15:04,400 --> 00:15:08,200 Speaker 4: a high sugar diet, is more likely to have ADHD 274 00:15:08,280 --> 00:15:12,920 Speaker 4: than someone who isn't, simply because they're continuously receiving stimulation 275 00:15:13,040 --> 00:15:13,680 Speaker 4: from the sugar. 276 00:15:14,680 --> 00:15:18,640 Speaker 2: So I know you're this is none of this is advice, anyone. 277 00:15:18,720 --> 00:15:22,160 Speaker 2: None of this is medical advice. This is just two 278 00:15:22,200 --> 00:15:30,680 Speaker 2: blokes and tiff chatting periodically. So when somebody is put 279 00:15:30,720 --> 00:15:35,200 Speaker 2: on meds for ADHD and they build a tolerance, what 280 00:15:35,440 --> 00:15:38,120 Speaker 2: typically happens. Do they just up the dose? Do they 281 00:15:38,160 --> 00:15:40,000 Speaker 2: take them off it for a while, do they change 282 00:15:40,000 --> 00:15:40,680 Speaker 2: the medication? 283 00:15:41,520 --> 00:15:45,160 Speaker 4: Initially? They initially they up the dose and then eventually 284 00:15:45,200 --> 00:15:51,120 Speaker 4: they stop giving it to them. So it's and this 285 00:15:51,280 --> 00:15:55,640 Speaker 4: is the same with many stimula and not don't just 286 00:15:55,640 --> 00:15:59,320 Speaker 4: forget about ADHD, but any anything where a person is 287 00:15:59,360 --> 00:16:02,280 Speaker 4: being give a stimulating drug. So for example, a method 288 00:16:02,320 --> 00:16:05,360 Speaker 4: owned programs where people are being given a stimulant to 289 00:16:05,400 --> 00:16:10,280 Speaker 4: try and bring them off something like heroin. Eventually they 290 00:16:10,280 --> 00:16:13,760 Speaker 4: become tolerant of it and it loses its effectiveness. And 291 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:18,520 Speaker 4: that's because the mechanism of addiction is that tolerance is 292 00:16:18,560 --> 00:16:20,960 Speaker 4: the more you the more hits you get. The more 293 00:16:21,000 --> 00:16:23,680 Speaker 4: you want, the more tolerant you become. 294 00:16:24,080 --> 00:16:26,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, you know. 295 00:16:26,320 --> 00:16:28,360 Speaker 2: I have a story to telling them to be careful 296 00:16:28,360 --> 00:16:34,480 Speaker 2: how I tell, But I think I created an addict. 297 00:16:33,480 --> 00:16:34,520 Speaker 1: Not even being funny. 298 00:16:34,880 --> 00:16:38,440 Speaker 2: So I've shared on this show that every now and then, 299 00:16:38,600 --> 00:16:45,640 Speaker 2: probably once a month, I will have a a nicorette. 300 00:16:45,760 --> 00:16:49,840 Speaker 2: A two milligram nicorette tastes exactly like chewing gum. Right, 301 00:16:50,360 --> 00:16:55,200 Speaker 2: and a friend of mine, we were talking about it 302 00:16:55,640 --> 00:16:59,480 Speaker 2: and I told them, you know, and They're like, I'm 303 00:16:59,480 --> 00:17:02,400 Speaker 2: going to give it a go. I'm like, no, well 304 00:17:03,000 --> 00:17:06,640 Speaker 2: I go unless you I go. Not recommending anyway, they 305 00:17:06,640 --> 00:17:09,760 Speaker 2: did it, and they rang me to dude. He's like, 306 00:17:10,560 --> 00:17:13,240 Speaker 2: oh my god, how good is this. He goes, I've 307 00:17:13,240 --> 00:17:15,800 Speaker 2: got so like, I'm so focused, blah blah blah. Again 308 00:17:15,880 --> 00:17:19,720 Speaker 2: everyone not a recommendation. And then I saw him about 309 00:17:19,800 --> 00:17:22,720 Speaker 2: three weeks ago and he goes, I need to stop 310 00:17:22,880 --> 00:17:27,800 Speaker 2: using nicorette now. I have maybe one two milligram a month, 311 00:17:28,000 --> 00:17:30,680 Speaker 2: not even that now, and it just kind of it's 312 00:17:30,720 --> 00:17:33,040 Speaker 2: like a new tropick. It just kind of cranks up 313 00:17:33,080 --> 00:17:35,080 Speaker 2: my brain a bit. It's like having a strong coffee. 314 00:17:35,080 --> 00:17:40,400 Speaker 2: Maybe he's having ten a day, ten a day. Yeah, 315 00:17:40,480 --> 00:17:42,840 Speaker 2: he's like, if I take one, it doesn't do anything. 316 00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:44,680 Speaker 2: I've got to take two or three at a time. 317 00:17:45,400 --> 00:17:47,720 Speaker 2: And he does that three or four times a days. 318 00:17:48,080 --> 00:17:51,240 Speaker 4: And that is exactly the tolerance that we're talking about. 319 00:17:51,280 --> 00:17:54,679 Speaker 1: I'm like, you've got to stop. You've got to stop. 320 00:17:54,840 --> 00:17:57,560 Speaker 2: I'm like, what, Like, I never told him to it, 321 00:17:57,680 --> 00:17:59,879 Speaker 2: even when he said I'm going to give it a go, 322 00:18:00,080 --> 00:18:03,040 Speaker 2: I said, I wouldn't recommend it. I don't introduce something 323 00:18:03,080 --> 00:18:08,840 Speaker 2: you don't need. And anyway, yeah, I feel bad. But yeah, 324 00:18:09,720 --> 00:18:12,920 Speaker 2: he's like, he used to take one and it was amazing, 325 00:18:13,520 --> 00:18:16,919 Speaker 2: and now two or three just begins to do something. 326 00:18:16,920 --> 00:18:19,440 Speaker 2: But then he's got to depending on his day, he's 327 00:18:19,440 --> 00:18:20,359 Speaker 2: got to light up again. 328 00:18:20,520 --> 00:18:21,280 Speaker 1: Yeah. 329 00:18:21,560 --> 00:18:25,439 Speaker 4: Yeah. So that's a beautiful example of what we've been 330 00:18:25,480 --> 00:18:28,719 Speaker 4: talking about, which is the brain adjusts to that, to 331 00:18:28,800 --> 00:18:32,040 Speaker 4: that addictive substance infusion, which is a nicotine. It's the 332 00:18:32,040 --> 00:18:36,479 Speaker 4: addictive part of cigarettes, and the brain adjusts to that 333 00:18:36,680 --> 00:18:39,080 Speaker 4: by moving up a marker in the brain called delta 334 00:18:39,119 --> 00:18:42,040 Speaker 4: foss B that says how much don't mean you need 335 00:18:42,680 --> 00:18:46,919 Speaker 4: to get an effect. So your one a month is 336 00:18:46,960 --> 00:18:50,040 Speaker 4: not having any effect at all because it takes you know, 337 00:18:50,560 --> 00:18:52,680 Speaker 4: it surely it bumps it up, but then it decays 338 00:18:52,760 --> 00:18:55,399 Speaker 4: down again by the time you know you have another one. 339 00:18:55,480 --> 00:18:58,080 Speaker 4: But if you're having one a day and then that 340 00:18:58,119 --> 00:18:59,800 Speaker 4: turns into two a day, or three a day, or 341 00:18:59,840 --> 00:19:02,280 Speaker 4: four day or ten a day, then what you're doing 342 00:19:02,320 --> 00:19:04,399 Speaker 4: is pushing that up higher and higher and higher and 343 00:19:04,480 --> 00:19:07,840 Speaker 4: higher to the point where you are an addict, and 344 00:19:08,480 --> 00:19:11,960 Speaker 4: stopping doing it is going to be extremely difficult because 345 00:19:12,000 --> 00:19:16,320 Speaker 4: the cravings will be very intense. You probably don't experience 346 00:19:16,400 --> 00:19:19,479 Speaker 4: serious cravings for your nicorette because it sounds more like 347 00:19:19,520 --> 00:19:22,920 Speaker 4: it's gotten into the realm of habit rather than by 348 00:19:22,960 --> 00:19:27,920 Speaker 4: a chemical craving. So you just think, oh, I wouldn't 349 00:19:27,920 --> 00:19:29,760 Speaker 4: mind this because I'll feel better, And as long as 350 00:19:29,760 --> 00:19:32,080 Speaker 4: it stays at that low level, it probably isn't having 351 00:19:32,119 --> 00:19:35,159 Speaker 4: any real effect on the addictive mechanism. And it's the 352 00:19:35,160 --> 00:19:38,040 Speaker 4: same thing goes here with sugar. So if we're looking 353 00:19:38,080 --> 00:19:41,080 Speaker 4: at sugar, say the only sugar you know little Tristan 354 00:19:41,160 --> 00:19:45,240 Speaker 4: got was once a year at his birthday party, then 355 00:19:46,359 --> 00:19:51,000 Speaker 4: it's probably having no serious effect on him. But if 356 00:19:51,080 --> 00:19:53,760 Speaker 4: the load he's getting at the birthday party is just 357 00:19:53,960 --> 00:19:55,919 Speaker 4: twice as much as he gets every other day, of 358 00:19:56,000 --> 00:20:01,639 Speaker 4: the year, which is very likely in Australia today because 359 00:20:01,640 --> 00:20:04,680 Speaker 4: the average Australian is consuming about forty tea spoons of 360 00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:08,159 Speaker 4: sugar a day. And you know, as I said to 361 00:20:08,200 --> 00:20:11,720 Speaker 4: you before, most people when I say that say, well, 362 00:20:11,800 --> 00:20:15,240 Speaker 4: you know TIFFs have in mind because I'm not, you know, 363 00:20:15,359 --> 00:20:18,080 Speaker 4: consuming forty tea spoons of sugar. No wha, I don't 364 00:20:18,119 --> 00:20:22,760 Speaker 4: even add sugar to my tea. But the reality is, 365 00:20:22,960 --> 00:20:25,760 Speaker 4: have a bowl of nutri grain in the morning and 366 00:20:25,800 --> 00:20:27,959 Speaker 4: a glass of orange juice. You're at twenty tea spoons 367 00:20:27,960 --> 00:20:30,399 Speaker 4: before you push back from breakfast, let alone go anywhere 368 00:20:30,440 --> 00:20:34,080 Speaker 4: near a mars bar or a coke. Yes, so if 369 00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:36,640 Speaker 4: a kid is consuming forty teaspoons of sugar a day, 370 00:20:37,280 --> 00:20:42,800 Speaker 4: then they are definitely on a pathway that would rewire 371 00:20:42,840 --> 00:20:43,800 Speaker 4: their brain for addiction. 372 00:20:44,720 --> 00:20:46,840 Speaker 2: I think when you save forty tea spoons, I think 373 00:20:46,880 --> 00:20:51,320 Speaker 2: people they they don't understand how much sugar is in 374 00:20:51,400 --> 00:20:53,879 Speaker 2: how many foods that you would not think had a 375 00:20:53,960 --> 00:20:56,680 Speaker 2: lot of sugar, right, And so we're not talking about 376 00:20:56,800 --> 00:21:01,240 Speaker 2: teaspoons of sugar, well the equivalent, but yeah, this is 377 00:21:01,280 --> 00:21:04,680 Speaker 2: not necessarily added sugar. This is just high sugar foods 378 00:21:04,720 --> 00:21:07,600 Speaker 2: that and what is interesting about this, and we've spoken 379 00:21:07,600 --> 00:21:12,280 Speaker 2: about the lack of credibility and value of these ticks, 380 00:21:12,320 --> 00:21:16,760 Speaker 2: these Foundation ticks that gets some kind of fucking nutritional 381 00:21:16,800 --> 00:21:20,399 Speaker 2: seal of approval from some pretend organization that gets paid. 382 00:21:21,880 --> 00:21:26,520 Speaker 2: Is that, like a lot of those you know, recommended 383 00:21:26,560 --> 00:21:30,159 Speaker 2: and endorsed products are super high and sugar also. 384 00:21:30,880 --> 00:21:34,040 Speaker 4: Yeah, absolutely, I mean there was for a very long 385 00:21:34,080 --> 00:21:36,760 Speaker 4: time there. I mean a tiff. I don't remember this 386 00:21:36,760 --> 00:21:38,640 Speaker 4: because it happened, you know, more than a decade ago 387 00:21:38,680 --> 00:21:42,320 Speaker 4: when she was a little girl, But Craig, you might 388 00:21:42,359 --> 00:21:49,040 Speaker 4: remember it, maybe just you might remember. The Heart Foundation 389 00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:54,919 Speaker 4: used to give ticks to McDonald's. Yeah, so McDonald's was 390 00:21:55,080 --> 00:21:59,680 Speaker 4: proudly displaying its Heart Foundation tick menu, and many of 391 00:21:59,720 --> 00:22:04,240 Speaker 4: the things on that tick menu had really shockingly high 392 00:22:04,359 --> 00:22:07,760 Speaker 4: levels of sugar in them. And when I asked the 393 00:22:07,800 --> 00:22:11,600 Speaker 4: Heart Foundation how that could possibly be the case, the 394 00:22:11,640 --> 00:22:15,600 Speaker 4: answer I got back was that sugar was not part 395 00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:19,600 Speaker 4: of what they measured as part of their tick program. 396 00:22:20,200 --> 00:22:23,800 Speaker 4: So the product could in fact be a bag of sugar. 397 00:22:24,119 --> 00:22:28,199 Speaker 4: And because it had no other particularly fat, which was 398 00:22:28,200 --> 00:22:30,200 Speaker 4: a thing they're so concerned with him. Because it had 399 00:22:30,200 --> 00:22:34,040 Speaker 4: no fat in it, it deserved a Heart Foundation tick. Now, 400 00:22:34,080 --> 00:22:36,560 Speaker 4: I don't think any manufacturer everywhere ever went to the 401 00:22:36,600 --> 00:22:38,880 Speaker 4: point of getting a Heart Foundation tick on a bag 402 00:22:38,920 --> 00:22:43,639 Speaker 4: of marshmallows. But they could have, because if you looked 403 00:22:43,640 --> 00:22:46,639 Speaker 4: at the criteria they were using, sugar didn't matter, and 404 00:22:46,680 --> 00:22:49,239 Speaker 4: there's very little else in a bag of marshmallows, so 405 00:22:49,920 --> 00:22:50,960 Speaker 4: you could have got the tick. 406 00:22:51,800 --> 00:22:55,480 Speaker 2: So ridiculous that there's not even in an organization like 407 00:22:55,520 --> 00:22:59,480 Speaker 2: the Heart Foundation, you go, surely there's one employee that 408 00:22:59,680 --> 00:23:03,080 Speaker 2: is at least smart enough to go, hey, fellas or 409 00:23:03,240 --> 00:23:04,280 Speaker 2: ladies or whatever. 410 00:23:04,080 --> 00:23:06,560 Speaker 1: It is, has anyone thought this through? 411 00:23:07,400 --> 00:23:10,600 Speaker 4: But it wasn't obvious. So that's the interesting thing you 412 00:23:10,760 --> 00:23:13,640 Speaker 4: had to ask. There was nowhere anywhere where they were 413 00:23:13,640 --> 00:23:16,679 Speaker 4: publishing how they calculated whether or not a food received 414 00:23:16,680 --> 00:23:19,720 Speaker 4: a tick. And the only reason I asked is I 415 00:23:19,840 --> 00:23:23,439 Speaker 4: noticed that foods that just were mind blowing in him 416 00:23:23,440 --> 00:23:25,520 Speaker 4: out of sugar. Like there was one food sold at 417 00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:27,879 Speaker 4: the time called roll ups or something so like a 418 00:23:27,920 --> 00:23:32,560 Speaker 4: compressed fruit fruit that you're supposed to put in your 419 00:23:32,600 --> 00:23:35,919 Speaker 4: kid's lunch box and a little snack for them, and 420 00:23:35,960 --> 00:23:38,479 Speaker 4: it's all fruits, so it must be good. Was seventy 421 00:23:38,520 --> 00:23:43,040 Speaker 4: eight percent sugar had a heart foundation tick, so mum 422 00:23:43,040 --> 00:23:45,360 Speaker 4: and the supermarket. I was looking at it and say, oh, 423 00:23:45,400 --> 00:23:48,000 Speaker 4: what'll I give you a little jeremy for school lunch. 424 00:23:48,240 --> 00:23:50,800 Speaker 4: Oh this thing here, it's all fruit and it's got 425 00:23:50,800 --> 00:23:54,400 Speaker 4: a heart foundation tick must be okay. But you couldn't 426 00:23:54,400 --> 00:23:56,280 Speaker 4: have given him that much sugar, even if you'd given 427 00:23:56,359 --> 00:23:57,800 Speaker 4: him a diet of pure Mars bars. 428 00:23:59,040 --> 00:23:59,320 Speaker 1: I love. 429 00:24:00,359 --> 00:24:04,320 Speaker 2: I remember now that they're just diabetes in a wrapper 430 00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:10,359 Speaker 2: and rotten teeth. I remember one of my clients one 431 00:24:10,440 --> 00:24:15,760 Speaker 2: hundred years ago used to her go to was dried 432 00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:21,080 Speaker 2: apricots and nuts, and I'm like, so and so I 433 00:24:21,080 --> 00:24:24,120 Speaker 2: got her in my office and I looked up. I said, anyway, 434 00:24:24,160 --> 00:24:27,440 Speaker 2: the bottom line is one hundred grams of this is memory, 435 00:24:27,640 --> 00:24:30,919 Speaker 2: So I think it's, if not exact, very close. One 436 00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:35,119 Speaker 2: hundred grams of fresh apricot forty calories, one hundred grams 437 00:24:35,119 --> 00:24:38,879 Speaker 2: of dried apricot two hundred and forty calories, so six 438 00:24:38,960 --> 00:24:41,840 Speaker 2: times the calories. And I would think six times give 439 00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:44,639 Speaker 2: or take the sugar, because all it's been taken out 440 00:24:44,760 --> 00:24:46,880 Speaker 2: is the water, so you just got left sugar. 441 00:24:47,720 --> 00:24:49,480 Speaker 4: Yeah. Well, you look at those, you know, the little 442 00:24:49,560 --> 00:24:52,199 Speaker 4: little boxes of sultanas that they give kids at school. 443 00:24:52,920 --> 00:24:55,560 Speaker 4: So if you were to expand them back to their 444 00:24:55,600 --> 00:24:59,760 Speaker 4: original grapiness, it's about half a kilo of grapes. Yes, Now, 445 00:25:00,240 --> 00:25:01,760 Speaker 4: no kid is going to be able to sit down, 446 00:25:02,160 --> 00:25:04,080 Speaker 4: you know, and knock over half a kilold grapes and 447 00:25:04,119 --> 00:25:08,040 Speaker 4: then eat their little lunch. But those sultanas absolutely, and 448 00:25:08,080 --> 00:25:10,040 Speaker 4: so it's a really really fast way to give a 449 00:25:10,119 --> 00:25:11,080 Speaker 4: kid a lot of sugar. 450 00:25:11,400 --> 00:25:14,439 Speaker 2: And you know, the other thing about sultanas that I 451 00:25:14,480 --> 00:25:16,680 Speaker 2: remember reading, I don't know if it's still the same 452 00:25:16,760 --> 00:25:19,760 Speaker 2: tip you could check, but on the side of a 453 00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:25,080 Speaker 2: box the rest the ingredients said grapes and vegetable oil. 454 00:25:25,800 --> 00:25:30,960 Speaker 2: There's soaked in oil. I'm right, So we're putting sugar 455 00:25:31,280 --> 00:25:32,000 Speaker 2: in oil. 456 00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:36,680 Speaker 4: Yep, sugar in seed oil, which is a whole level 457 00:25:36,680 --> 00:25:39,359 Speaker 4: of danger. So even it wasn't for sugar, you wouldn't 458 00:25:39,359 --> 00:25:39,880 Speaker 4: want to eat it. 459 00:25:40,080 --> 00:25:44,400 Speaker 2: And it's like, not only is this shit terrible for you, 460 00:25:45,280 --> 00:25:49,960 Speaker 2: people actually think it's a great choice. It's like, I'm 461 00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:53,679 Speaker 2: a responsible parent, I'm giving my kids sultanas for lunch. 462 00:25:53,920 --> 00:25:56,399 Speaker 4: But why do they think that because the Hart Foundation's 463 00:25:56,400 --> 00:25:57,240 Speaker 4: got a tick on the thing. 464 00:25:58,600 --> 00:26:01,680 Speaker 2: Well, I mean, yeah, it's like I just think one 465 00:26:01,680 --> 00:26:04,960 Speaker 2: of the simplest things that mums and dads can do. 466 00:26:05,520 --> 00:26:08,239 Speaker 2: And I'm not not hating on anyone or judging, but 467 00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:12,960 Speaker 2: just learn how to read food labels, like learn how 468 00:26:12,960 --> 00:26:15,959 Speaker 2: to understand like the ingredients. If the number one ingredient 469 00:26:16,119 --> 00:26:18,960 Speaker 2: is sugar, then that's what most of it's made of. 470 00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:23,160 Speaker 2: Like it goes in order of volume from first thing 471 00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:26,200 Speaker 2: to last thing on the list. And you know, read 472 00:26:26,520 --> 00:26:29,199 Speaker 2: the tiny box on the back with the breakdown of 473 00:26:29,240 --> 00:26:34,000 Speaker 2: per hundred grams sodium and sugar and protein and all 474 00:26:34,040 --> 00:26:36,440 Speaker 2: the other stuff, because you can save yourself a lot 475 00:26:36,440 --> 00:26:37,000 Speaker 2: of heartache. 476 00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:40,440 Speaker 1: But remember on the front, it's not information. 477 00:26:40,600 --> 00:26:43,359 Speaker 2: The front is an ad. It's not information. It's just 478 00:26:43,440 --> 00:26:45,680 Speaker 2: trying to get you to buy whatever it is they're 479 00:26:45,680 --> 00:26:46,359 Speaker 2: trying to sell. 480 00:26:47,040 --> 00:26:47,280 Speaker 1: You know. 481 00:26:47,480 --> 00:26:50,120 Speaker 4: Yeah, you see that a lot with olive oil products. 482 00:26:50,600 --> 00:26:54,679 Speaker 4: So you'll particularly saying margarine. So you'll see the product 483 00:26:54,760 --> 00:26:58,439 Speaker 4: described as olive oil margarine or something like that on 484 00:26:58,480 --> 00:27:01,600 Speaker 4: the front of the you turn it over and read 485 00:27:01,640 --> 00:27:04,400 Speaker 4: the label, you'll see whilst there is some olive oil 486 00:27:04,440 --> 00:27:07,439 Speaker 4: in there for flavoring purposes, you know, most of the 487 00:27:07,480 --> 00:27:09,920 Speaker 4: fat in that comes from something like sunflower oil or 488 00:27:09,960 --> 00:27:13,040 Speaker 4: canola oil. Yeah, just like every other Margarine. 489 00:27:13,119 --> 00:27:15,960 Speaker 2: We spoke on this show once a year ago. I 490 00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:20,040 Speaker 2: took a photo and I'd posted it. I was trying 491 00:27:20,040 --> 00:27:23,040 Speaker 2: to get an on your recommendation. I thank you very much. 492 00:27:23,080 --> 00:27:28,640 Speaker 2: I actually got real mayo made with eggs, and that's 493 00:27:28,640 --> 00:27:31,919 Speaker 2: probably precipitated that. But I was at the supermarket. I 494 00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:34,600 Speaker 2: was trying to find mayo that's actually mayo, not made 495 00:27:34,600 --> 00:27:36,520 Speaker 2: out of vegetable oil or seed. 496 00:27:36,240 --> 00:27:39,040 Speaker 1: Oil like with that. Well bullshit, Yeah no I didn't. 497 00:27:39,359 --> 00:27:41,639 Speaker 2: You told me. You told me what to get. And 498 00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:44,960 Speaker 2: what's amazing is normal mays like four or five bucks 499 00:27:45,000 --> 00:27:48,920 Speaker 2: a jar. The real shit's like twenty and I gladly 500 00:27:48,960 --> 00:27:52,600 Speaker 2: pay the twenty, right, but yeah, and it said whole 501 00:27:52,760 --> 00:27:53,920 Speaker 2: egg mayonnaise. 502 00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:58,520 Speaker 1: I'm like, yeah, giddy up. And then I looked it's ninety. 503 00:27:58,200 --> 00:28:03,040 Speaker 2: Seven percent not egg, that's right, not egg, Like ninety 504 00:28:03,080 --> 00:28:05,840 Speaker 2: seven percent of what's in this jar is not egg. 505 00:28:06,160 --> 00:28:08,000 Speaker 2: And when you look at the front, there's a picture 506 00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:11,560 Speaker 2: of an egg and it's got whole egg mayonnaise. So 507 00:28:11,600 --> 00:28:13,480 Speaker 2: you think, oh, the whole thing's made of egg. 508 00:28:14,040 --> 00:28:17,720 Speaker 4: No, well it it probably shouldn't be called mayonnaise anyway, 509 00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:22,000 Speaker 4: because mayonnaise, you know, is based on an actual traditional 510 00:28:22,040 --> 00:28:27,240 Speaker 4: recipe which developed by the French, and it consists of 511 00:28:27,240 --> 00:28:30,919 Speaker 4: olive oil and an egg. It's an emulsion. So calling 512 00:28:30,960 --> 00:28:33,560 Speaker 4: anything that isn't made that way mayonnaise, I think is 513 00:28:33,600 --> 00:28:35,800 Speaker 4: a bit out there. Anyway, whether it's whole egg or not, 514 00:28:36,760 --> 00:28:38,920 Speaker 4: it should be labeled imitation mayonnaise. 515 00:28:39,160 --> 00:28:42,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, just jumping back quickly. I know we've got 516 00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:46,800 Speaker 2: to let you go. But Tiff, do you remember you've 517 00:28:46,840 --> 00:28:49,920 Speaker 2: had Mick Call on your show, right? I don't know 518 00:28:49,960 --> 00:28:52,440 Speaker 2: if you remember this, but we were talking about, you 519 00:28:52,480 --> 00:28:54,640 Speaker 2: know how you were talking, David about people who don't 520 00:28:54,720 --> 00:28:57,280 Speaker 2: produce as much dopamine as other people and so they've 521 00:28:57,280 --> 00:29:00,640 Speaker 2: got to, you know, take something to kind of reached 522 00:29:00,640 --> 00:29:04,440 Speaker 2: their normal or what is. So we've had this guy 523 00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:11,840 Speaker 2: in a bunch, his name's mickol and his in recovery 524 00:29:12,200 --> 00:29:16,160 Speaker 2: addict alcoholic. He talks about this freely and openly, spent 525 00:29:16,240 --> 00:29:18,840 Speaker 2: lots of time in the Big House, you know, very 526 00:29:18,880 --> 00:29:22,560 Speaker 2: interesting life blah blah blah. And he told his story 527 00:29:22,720 --> 00:29:26,760 Speaker 2: on this show, and I'm sure yours, Tiff, where when 528 00:29:27,440 --> 00:29:30,760 Speaker 2: he started drinking at twelve, right, and the first thing 529 00:29:30,800 --> 00:29:36,880 Speaker 2: he drank was port and he said it was fucking disgusting. 530 00:29:37,720 --> 00:29:40,480 Speaker 2: But the moment that I started that he started to 531 00:29:40,520 --> 00:29:43,480 Speaker 2: get drunk, he's like, oh my god, life is good. 532 00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:47,120 Speaker 2: And it's like, I think he said something like, but 533 00:29:47,200 --> 00:29:50,760 Speaker 2: the first time in my life, I felt normal, Like 534 00:29:50,880 --> 00:29:54,440 Speaker 2: the anxiety went away, all of these symptoms in inverted 535 00:29:54,440 --> 00:29:58,760 Speaker 2: commas went away. And then he basically started drinking whenever 536 00:29:58,840 --> 00:30:02,280 Speaker 2: and wherever he could at twelve, not because he enjoyed 537 00:30:02,280 --> 00:30:06,040 Speaker 2: the drinking, but because he enjoyed how it made him feel, 538 00:30:06,120 --> 00:30:09,320 Speaker 2: and it was like for him an escape, you know. 539 00:30:09,480 --> 00:30:12,560 Speaker 4: So most addicts will give you that answer if you 540 00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:15,880 Speaker 4: ask them. Most addicts. If you say to an addict, 541 00:30:16,040 --> 00:30:18,160 Speaker 4: you know, why do you keep doing this when it 542 00:30:18,240 --> 00:30:21,440 Speaker 4: is causing you harm? And I'm talking about anything, whether 543 00:30:21,480 --> 00:30:27,120 Speaker 4: it's smoking or alcohol or opioids, Yeah, And they will say, 544 00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:31,920 Speaker 4: I don't want to keep doing it, but I feel 545 00:30:31,960 --> 00:30:35,680 Speaker 4: normal when I do do it. You ask any smoker, 546 00:30:36,520 --> 00:30:38,760 Speaker 4: why do you smoke? You know it's doing terrible things, 547 00:30:38,800 --> 00:30:41,000 Speaker 4: as photos all over the box telling you all awful 548 00:30:41,040 --> 00:30:43,160 Speaker 4: things it's doing to you. Why do you smoke? And 549 00:30:43,200 --> 00:30:45,239 Speaker 4: they will say, I don't want to smoke, and I 550 00:30:45,280 --> 00:30:48,000 Speaker 4: know all that stuff, but the only way I can 551 00:30:48,040 --> 00:30:53,200 Speaker 4: feel normal is when I'm smoking, And that's exactly the 552 00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:56,520 Speaker 4: effect we're talking about, where where in order to get 553 00:30:56,560 --> 00:31:00,400 Speaker 4: the required dopamine hit, you have to be doing or 554 00:31:00,720 --> 00:31:04,520 Speaker 4: going through an addictive behavior. So it's about feeling normal, 555 00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:07,960 Speaker 4: and that's really really hard to stop, really really hard 556 00:31:08,000 --> 00:31:12,120 Speaker 4: to ask someone to stop doing the one thing that 557 00:31:12,240 --> 00:31:16,680 Speaker 4: makes them feel normal. Now, alcohol is the most insidious 558 00:31:16,720 --> 00:31:18,800 Speaker 4: of them all, and we'll talk about it some other time, 559 00:31:19,200 --> 00:31:22,840 Speaker 4: because it actually has a mechanism of action that impairs 560 00:31:22,840 --> 00:31:27,480 Speaker 4: your ability to feel normal for life. So even when 561 00:31:27,480 --> 00:31:30,520 Speaker 4: you stop drinking, which is something that most other drugs 562 00:31:30,520 --> 00:31:32,920 Speaker 4: don't do. But let's get into that some other time. 563 00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:34,040 Speaker 4: There was a bit of detail in it. 564 00:31:34,400 --> 00:31:37,840 Speaker 2: Yeah, cool mate, We appreciate you will say goodbye fare 565 00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:42,360 Speaker 2: but as always fascinating and tif thank god you had 566 00:31:42,440 --> 00:31:43,960 Speaker 2: some calories before we started. 567 00:31:44,840 --> 00:31:46,360 Speaker 3: I know you're welcome.