1 00:00:05,200 --> 00:00:08,119 Speaker 1: From the Australian. Here's what's on the front. I'm Claire Harvey. 2 00:00:08,240 --> 00:00:14,560 Speaker 1: It's Monday, July seventh, twenty twenty five. A thirty four 3 00:00:14,640 --> 00:00:16,880 Speaker 1: year old New South Wales man is in custody in 4 00:00:16,960 --> 00:00:21,800 Speaker 1: Victoria after allegedly torching a synagogue in Melbourne. Over the weekend, 5 00:00:22,840 --> 00:00:26,840 Speaker 1: an Israeli restaurant in Melbourne was attacked by kefir clad protesters, 6 00:00:27,280 --> 00:00:31,560 Speaker 1: prompting Jewish leaders and Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin nettan Yahoo 7 00:00:31,920 --> 00:00:36,080 Speaker 1: to demand Anthony Albanezi take national action on anti Semitism. 8 00:00:36,560 --> 00:00:40,760 Speaker 1: That's as pro Palestinians say Australia has failed to condemn 9 00:00:40,920 --> 00:00:45,760 Speaker 1: Israel strongly enough over the war in Gaza. Home Affairs 10 00:00:45,800 --> 00:00:49,760 Speaker 1: Minister Tony Burke says the incidents were an attack on Australia. 11 00:00:53,479 --> 00:00:57,480 Speaker 1: Hush COVID lockdowns were bad for kids. According to data 12 00:00:57,480 --> 00:01:01,400 Speaker 1: from the benchmarking exam Naplan, New South Wales, Victoria and 13 00:01:01,440 --> 00:01:05,720 Speaker 1: the Act have all fallen behind Western Australia, which had 14 00:01:05,760 --> 00:01:09,280 Speaker 1: the lightest lockdowns, and the results are most pronounced for 15 00:01:09,360 --> 00:01:14,000 Speaker 1: disadvantaged kids. Researchers say that could be because wealthy parents 16 00:01:14,120 --> 00:01:18,600 Speaker 1: had more time to supervise homeschooling. That's an exclusive live 17 00:01:18,840 --> 00:01:24,800 Speaker 1: right now at the Australian dot com dot au. It's 18 00:01:24,840 --> 00:01:28,760 Speaker 1: the biggest trial of the year and now the most suspenseful, 19 00:01:29,080 --> 00:01:33,040 Speaker 1: as the jury in Aaron Patterson's triple murder case enters 20 00:01:33,120 --> 00:01:37,560 Speaker 1: its seventh day of deliberations. What's going on? Legal affairs 21 00:01:37,600 --> 00:01:46,400 Speaker 1: correspondent Ellie Dudley joins us from Morewell in Victoria's Latrobe Valley. 22 00:01:57,720 --> 00:02:00,240 Speaker 1: There's a ritual every morning in the Victorian time town 23 00:02:00,320 --> 00:02:03,880 Speaker 1: of Morewell. As the morning fog clears and the temperature 24 00:02:03,920 --> 00:02:07,800 Speaker 1: creeps up past zero and into low single figures, a 25 00:02:07,840 --> 00:02:13,679 Speaker 1: crowd of people trapes us towards the courthouse. Lawyers, journalists, magistrates, registrars, 26 00:02:13,800 --> 00:02:16,600 Speaker 1: cops and regular people accused of crimes. 27 00:02:17,639 --> 00:02:22,760 Speaker 2: Everyone's very layered up, thermal layers, puffer jackets, beanies, scarves. 28 00:02:24,360 --> 00:02:27,520 Speaker 1: Ellie Dudley's our legal affairs correspondent and along with one 29 00:02:27,560 --> 00:02:30,560 Speaker 1: of our senior reporters, John Ferguson, she's been part of 30 00:02:30,560 --> 00:02:33,440 Speaker 1: that crowd trapesing into the court every morning for the 31 00:02:33,480 --> 00:02:37,600 Speaker 1: past ten weeks. It's the business of low level justice. 32 00:02:37,800 --> 00:02:41,079 Speaker 1: People who've been charged with drink driving or offensive behavior 33 00:02:41,480 --> 00:02:45,240 Speaker 1: fighting in the Street small time burglary this morning, Monday, 34 00:02:45,320 --> 00:02:48,560 Speaker 1: seven July. The thirty or so accused on the list 35 00:02:48,840 --> 00:02:53,480 Speaker 1: are overwhelmingly men, but the most recognizable accused before the 36 00:02:53,560 --> 00:02:57,040 Speaker 1: Latrobe Valley Law Courts is a woman, Aaron Patterson, a 37 00:02:57,080 --> 00:02:59,280 Speaker 1: fifty year old mum of two from the nearby town 38 00:02:59,280 --> 00:03:02,240 Speaker 1: of lean Gath who's accused of a crime that's being 39 00:03:02,280 --> 00:03:06,640 Speaker 1: followed around the world, allegedly poisoning her estranged husband's four 40 00:03:06,720 --> 00:03:11,440 Speaker 1: elderly relatives with death cap mushrooms she allegedly foraged from 41 00:03:11,440 --> 00:03:14,400 Speaker 1: the bases of oak trees around this very. 42 00:03:14,280 --> 00:03:20,200 Speaker 2: Woodland outside the courthouse in Morewell, the Latrobe Valley Law Courts, 43 00:03:20,240 --> 00:03:25,080 Speaker 2: there's a really large courtyard which I imagine usually is empty, 44 00:03:25,400 --> 00:03:29,160 Speaker 2: but at the moment it's packed with journalists, television crews, 45 00:03:29,200 --> 00:03:32,200 Speaker 2: people setting up camp waiting for this verdict to be 46 00:03:32,240 --> 00:03:32,840 Speaker 2: handed down. 47 00:03:34,240 --> 00:03:37,120 Speaker 1: Patterson has pleaded not guilty to three counts of murder 48 00:03:37,160 --> 00:03:40,520 Speaker 1: and one of attempted murder. The trial was initially set 49 00:03:40,560 --> 00:03:43,240 Speaker 1: down for about six weeks, but these things never quite 50 00:03:43,240 --> 00:03:45,880 Speaker 1: go to plan, and after two months of evidence and 51 00:03:45,960 --> 00:03:48,640 Speaker 1: a couple of weeks of legal discussion, the judge and 52 00:03:48,720 --> 00:03:51,800 Speaker 1: lawyers for both sides summing up, the jury was sent 53 00:03:51,880 --> 00:03:56,280 Speaker 1: out to deliberate, Ellie, everyone I know is full of 54 00:03:56,320 --> 00:03:59,560 Speaker 1: curiosity about the jury's deliberations. So today we're going to 55 00:03:59,640 --> 00:04:03,360 Speaker 1: ask and answer some of the big questions. First, what 56 00:04:03,520 --> 00:04:05,960 Speaker 1: happens when the jury reaches a verdict. 57 00:04:06,280 --> 00:04:08,920 Speaker 2: So, even when the jury reaches a verdict, they've been 58 00:04:08,920 --> 00:04:11,200 Speaker 2: told that there's a buzzer in the room that they're 59 00:04:11,240 --> 00:04:14,880 Speaker 2: currently deliberating in, they press that buzzer and that sends 60 00:04:14,920 --> 00:04:17,160 Speaker 2: a note to the staff of the judge to let 61 00:04:17,160 --> 00:04:19,680 Speaker 2: the judge know that a verdict has been reached. It's 62 00:04:19,720 --> 00:04:22,320 Speaker 2: the same process if the jury has a question that 63 00:04:22,360 --> 00:04:24,479 Speaker 2: they want to ask of the judge based on any 64 00:04:24,520 --> 00:04:27,239 Speaker 2: of the evidence that's been put before them throughout this trial. 65 00:04:28,400 --> 00:04:31,159 Speaker 1: Okay, and if it's guilty, what will be the next step? 66 00:04:31,520 --> 00:04:33,920 Speaker 2: The next step will be sentencing. We know that when 67 00:04:33,960 --> 00:04:36,800 Speaker 2: it comes to sentencing hearings they're often quite drawn out. 68 00:04:37,160 --> 00:04:40,080 Speaker 2: The judge, I imagine, will want to hear victim impact 69 00:04:40,080 --> 00:04:42,880 Speaker 2: statements and then Judge Christopher Biale will come to a 70 00:04:42,920 --> 00:04:45,240 Speaker 2: decision on how she should be sentenced and how long 71 00:04:45,279 --> 00:04:46,240 Speaker 2: she'll spend in prison. 72 00:04:47,520 --> 00:04:50,200 Speaker 1: What about if it's not guilty, she walks free. 73 00:04:50,680 --> 00:04:53,280 Speaker 2: So I imagine that it would be quite a frenzy 74 00:04:53,360 --> 00:04:56,000 Speaker 2: if she walks straight out the front of the courthouse 75 00:04:56,360 --> 00:04:59,120 Speaker 2: on the day. If she is found not guilty, she'll 76 00:04:59,160 --> 00:05:02,320 Speaker 2: be able to go ho We've seen photos already of 77 00:05:02,520 --> 00:05:05,599 Speaker 2: her house in Leengatha that's been wrapped up in a 78 00:05:05,720 --> 00:05:10,560 Speaker 2: thick black tarpauliny sort of material. It seems like it's 79 00:05:10,560 --> 00:05:16,560 Speaker 2: been wrapped, possibly multiple times to prevent anyone taking any photos. 80 00:05:16,640 --> 00:05:19,279 Speaker 2: Perhaps if that was the intention of her, if she 81 00:05:19,320 --> 00:05:21,040 Speaker 2: were to be found not guilty, and if she were 82 00:05:21,080 --> 00:05:21,839 Speaker 2: to return home. 83 00:05:24,960 --> 00:05:27,920 Speaker 1: So what do we know about what's been happening in 84 00:05:27,960 --> 00:05:28,760 Speaker 1: that jury room? 85 00:05:29,080 --> 00:05:32,000 Speaker 2: Oh, Claire, it's the million dollar question. As a journalist 86 00:05:32,000 --> 00:05:35,479 Speaker 2: who's been down there for a long time, everyone's asking, 87 00:05:35,600 --> 00:05:37,240 Speaker 2: you know, when are they going to come back? What 88 00:05:37,240 --> 00:05:40,440 Speaker 2: do you think they're thinking? But obviously we don't know. 89 00:05:40,839 --> 00:05:43,200 Speaker 2: So they're being sequested, they have no contact with the 90 00:05:43,240 --> 00:05:46,599 Speaker 2: outside world. They're in a complete total media blackout. They 91 00:05:46,680 --> 00:05:49,920 Speaker 2: get transported from their accommodation where they're all staying together 92 00:05:49,960 --> 00:05:53,719 Speaker 2: at a hotel, to court from Mondays to Saturdays, where 93 00:05:53,760 --> 00:05:56,600 Speaker 2: they sit and deliberate from ten thirty to four fifteen, 94 00:05:56,720 --> 00:05:58,800 Speaker 2: with an hour and fifteen minute lunch break in the 95 00:05:58,800 --> 00:06:01,000 Speaker 2: middle of the day where they can't return a verdict, 96 00:06:01,400 --> 00:06:04,440 Speaker 2: and then they get transported back at night. And so 97 00:06:04,680 --> 00:06:07,920 Speaker 2: they're not deliberating on Sundays, but they are deliberating Monday 98 00:06:07,920 --> 00:06:10,320 Speaker 2: to Saturdays, meaning that we could get a verdict at 99 00:06:10,360 --> 00:06:12,560 Speaker 2: any time on Monday through Saturday. 100 00:06:13,240 --> 00:06:15,919 Speaker 1: The judge, Christopher Biale sent the jury out on Monday. 101 00:06:16,120 --> 00:06:18,520 Speaker 1: Here's a voice actor reading what he told the jury. 102 00:06:18,560 --> 00:06:21,440 Speaker 3: Ben you should only discuss the case with each other, 103 00:06:22,000 --> 00:06:23,800 Speaker 3: and you should only do that when you are all 104 00:06:23,839 --> 00:06:27,279 Speaker 3: together in the privacy of the jury room here in court. 105 00:06:28,200 --> 00:06:31,200 Speaker 3: Don't discuss when you're at the hotel. Don't get into 106 00:06:31,240 --> 00:06:33,799 Speaker 3: little groups and have discussions about the case. 107 00:06:37,960 --> 00:06:42,200 Speaker 1: On Monday morning, the jury begins its seventh day of deliberations. 108 00:06:42,480 --> 00:06:46,359 Speaker 2: Is that unusual, No, it's not unusual, particularly in a 109 00:06:46,400 --> 00:06:49,480 Speaker 2: case like this when they have seen so much evidence. 110 00:06:49,600 --> 00:06:51,359 Speaker 2: This was a trial that was supposed to last for 111 00:06:51,400 --> 00:06:54,200 Speaker 2: four to six weeks and I think we got almost 112 00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:57,000 Speaker 2: up to ten weeks of evidence for them to look at. 113 00:06:57,520 --> 00:06:59,839 Speaker 2: So no, it's not unusual. And we can also see 114 00:06:59,839 --> 00:07:03,240 Speaker 2: that in past cases that had been decided. So Kelly Lane, 115 00:07:03,279 --> 00:07:05,960 Speaker 2: who was accused of murdering her baby. The jury took 116 00:07:06,040 --> 00:07:09,359 Speaker 2: six days to convict her. George Pell who was accused 117 00:07:09,360 --> 00:07:11,920 Speaker 2: of child sex abuse, the jury deliberated for more than 118 00:07:11,960 --> 00:07:14,840 Speaker 2: four days before he was convicted, a conviction that, as 119 00:07:14,840 --> 00:07:18,640 Speaker 2: we know, was later overturned. For Northern Territory police officer 120 00:07:18,720 --> 00:07:21,400 Speaker 2: Zachary Rolfe, it took just seven hours for him to 121 00:07:21,440 --> 00:07:23,440 Speaker 2: be acquitted of murdering Kumen Jay Walker. 122 00:07:25,040 --> 00:07:28,360 Speaker 1: In another high profile matter, where Bruce Lehman was accused 123 00:07:28,360 --> 00:07:31,840 Speaker 1: of sexually assaulting Brittany Higgins, he pleaded not guilty. The 124 00:07:31,960 --> 00:07:35,080 Speaker 1: jury had been deliberating for five days when one of 125 00:07:35,120 --> 00:07:39,000 Speaker 1: them was caught with unauthorized materials in the jury room. 126 00:07:39,320 --> 00:07:41,520 Speaker 1: The judge told the court in that matter, an official 127 00:07:41,600 --> 00:07:44,840 Speaker 1: was in the room after a day's deliberations and knocked 128 00:07:44,880 --> 00:07:48,120 Speaker 1: a folder to the floor, and while picking up the 129 00:07:48,280 --> 00:07:52,000 Speaker 1: materials that fell down, found a research report which hadn't 130 00:07:52,000 --> 00:07:55,280 Speaker 1: been part of the evidence, something the juries weren't allowed 131 00:07:55,320 --> 00:07:59,280 Speaker 1: to have in there. The jury was discharged and prosecutors 132 00:07:59,320 --> 00:08:03,720 Speaker 1: declined to have another trial. So even now, I guess, ellie, 133 00:08:03,800 --> 00:08:06,960 Speaker 1: we can assume the juries under close scrutiny. 134 00:08:07,200 --> 00:08:09,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, so there are jury keepers in this case. So 135 00:08:10,200 --> 00:08:12,280 Speaker 2: Their job is just as it sounds. It's to keep 136 00:08:12,360 --> 00:08:15,720 Speaker 2: the jury and to ensure that they help them facilitate 137 00:08:15,840 --> 00:08:19,520 Speaker 2: reaching a decision without any external influences on that decision 138 00:08:19,600 --> 00:08:22,400 Speaker 2: except for the evidence that is in front of them. 139 00:08:22,720 --> 00:08:24,840 Speaker 2: The judge also did give a warning to the jury 140 00:08:24,960 --> 00:08:27,280 Speaker 2: not to reveal how their numbers were falling. 141 00:08:27,840 --> 00:08:30,000 Speaker 1: He's a voice actor reading the judge's words. 142 00:08:30,640 --> 00:08:33,160 Speaker 3: There's one thing that must not appear in any question 143 00:08:33,240 --> 00:08:36,480 Speaker 3: that you ask, and that's the numbers. I don't want 144 00:08:36,520 --> 00:08:39,400 Speaker 3: to know about it. I don't want to hear about it. 145 00:08:40,800 --> 00:08:43,520 Speaker 1: Sometimes a jury returns to court and tells the judge 146 00:08:43,559 --> 00:08:47,280 Speaker 1: they just can't get to a unanimous verdict. Now in Victoria, 147 00:08:47,360 --> 00:08:50,600 Speaker 1: on some offenses, a judge can accept a majority verdict, 148 00:08:50,720 --> 00:08:53,360 Speaker 1: but not murder. It has to be unanimous. If a 149 00:08:53,440 --> 00:08:56,240 Speaker 1: jury is deadlocked, the judge can come in with something 150 00:08:56,280 --> 00:08:59,719 Speaker 1: called a black direction that's named after a High Court 151 00:08:59,760 --> 00:09:02,920 Speaker 1: disease vision that said judges can tell a deadlock jury 152 00:09:02,920 --> 00:09:05,520 Speaker 1: to go back into the jury room and keep going. 153 00:09:06,360 --> 00:09:08,920 Speaker 1: The High Court said a jura who holds out and 154 00:09:09,080 --> 00:09:11,960 Speaker 1: goes with his or her conscience is not breaching his 155 00:09:12,120 --> 00:09:15,040 Speaker 1: or her oath. That's a legitimate way of serving justice. 156 00:09:15,600 --> 00:09:19,040 Speaker 1: So if Justice Beale gives a black direction, he'll be 157 00:09:19,200 --> 00:09:22,920 Speaker 1: careful not to put pressure on any dura to crumble 158 00:09:23,000 --> 00:09:30,360 Speaker 1: and go with the majority. After the break the big 159 00:09:30,480 --> 00:09:42,920 Speaker 1: question of motive the jury must decide. On the surface, 160 00:09:42,960 --> 00:09:46,680 Speaker 1: this seems like a relatively straightforward matter. The Kelly Laine case, 161 00:09:46,720 --> 00:09:49,560 Speaker 1: which we discussed earlier, that was a six month trial. 162 00:09:50,040 --> 00:09:52,679 Speaker 1: This one was relatively short and the charges are all 163 00:09:52,720 --> 00:09:55,280 Speaker 1: the same because they all relate to the same meal 164 00:09:55,760 --> 00:09:58,720 Speaker 1: beef Wellington served in July twenty twenty three at a 165 00:09:58,760 --> 00:10:02,840 Speaker 1: family lunch in which Erin Patterson had also invited her husband, Simon, 166 00:10:03,200 --> 00:10:06,400 Speaker 1: he declined to attend. There are three counts of murder 167 00:10:06,440 --> 00:10:09,920 Speaker 1: relating to Simon's parents Don and Gail, and his auntie 168 00:10:09,920 --> 00:10:12,000 Speaker 1: Heather Wilkinson, she was Gail's sister. 169 00:10:12,920 --> 00:10:15,720 Speaker 3: To prove that the accused is guilty of murder, the 170 00:10:15,800 --> 00:10:21,920 Speaker 3: prosecution must prove the following four elements beyond reasonable doubt. 171 00:10:22,679 --> 00:10:26,400 Speaker 3: One the accused caused the death of the deceased by 172 00:10:26,440 --> 00:10:28,400 Speaker 3: serving the deceased a poisoned meal. 173 00:10:29,760 --> 00:10:32,800 Speaker 1: The judge that it wasn't disputed that Patterson served beef 174 00:10:32,800 --> 00:10:37,000 Speaker 1: Wellington's that she had made that were poisoned with deathcat mushrooms, 175 00:10:37,160 --> 00:10:38,680 Speaker 1: or that this caused their deaths. 176 00:10:39,800 --> 00:10:45,319 Speaker 3: Two, the accused alleged conduct was conscious, voluntary, and deliberate. 177 00:10:46,000 --> 00:10:49,880 Speaker 3: Three at the time of the alleged conduct, the accused 178 00:10:49,920 --> 00:10:54,320 Speaker 3: intended to kill or cause really serious injury to the deceased. 179 00:10:56,040 --> 00:11:01,040 Speaker 3: Four the accused killed the deceased without lawful justification or excuse. 180 00:11:02,559 --> 00:11:05,640 Speaker 1: Deliberate is the most important word there, because that's what's 181 00:11:05,679 --> 00:11:09,960 Speaker 1: in dispute here. The defense says Patterson accidentally included death 182 00:11:09,960 --> 00:11:13,120 Speaker 1: cap mushrooms in the meal eaten by everyone, and that 183 00:11:13,360 --> 00:11:17,040 Speaker 1: she vomited after the meal and didn't become seriously unwell. 184 00:11:17,720 --> 00:11:21,040 Speaker 1: The Crown says Patterson made a death cap free version 185 00:11:21,080 --> 00:11:24,480 Speaker 1: of the meal for herself and poisoned the four plates 186 00:11:24,520 --> 00:11:31,199 Speaker 1: intended for her guests. The big missing element is a motive. 187 00:11:31,520 --> 00:11:34,160 Speaker 1: The Crown has not presented the jury with an alleged motive, 188 00:11:34,320 --> 00:11:37,120 Speaker 1: but says Aaron Patterson was hostile to Simon and his 189 00:11:37,200 --> 00:11:41,199 Speaker 1: parents after a dispute about the separation. The defense says, 190 00:11:41,240 --> 00:11:44,120 Speaker 1: in fact, Aaron Patterson had a motive not to murder. 191 00:11:44,440 --> 00:11:47,400 Speaker 1: The Patterson's and Wilkinsons were part of her very small 192 00:11:47,440 --> 00:11:51,040 Speaker 1: support network in this country town. The judge summed it 193 00:11:51,120 --> 00:11:51,800 Speaker 1: up like this. 194 00:11:52,559 --> 00:11:55,640 Speaker 3: For some murders there may be evidence of motive, but 195 00:11:55,679 --> 00:11:59,680 Speaker 3: some murders occur for no apparent reason. The motives of 196 00:11:59,720 --> 00:12:03,079 Speaker 3: such murders might only ever be known to the accused. 197 00:12:03,960 --> 00:12:07,000 Speaker 2: The jury have heard a lot of evidence and a 198 00:12:07,040 --> 00:12:10,680 Speaker 2: lot of summing up of that evidence from the defense, 199 00:12:10,800 --> 00:12:13,880 Speaker 2: from the prosecution, and then the judges charge alone that 200 00:12:14,040 --> 00:12:18,000 Speaker 2: was more than three hundred pages. So they understand that 201 00:12:18,080 --> 00:12:20,600 Speaker 2: the information that they're processing and the evidence that they're 202 00:12:20,640 --> 00:12:23,959 Speaker 2: assessing isn't to be taken lightly. And I think that 203 00:12:24,000 --> 00:12:26,240 Speaker 2: it's clear from the time that they're taking that they 204 00:12:26,240 --> 00:12:28,240 Speaker 2: want to make sure that the verdict they reach is 205 00:12:28,240 --> 00:12:29,800 Speaker 2: the right one. 206 00:12:29,880 --> 00:12:33,120 Speaker 1: Ellie Dudley is The Australian's Legal affairs correspondent and she's 207 00:12:33,200 --> 00:12:36,040 Speaker 1: ready and waiting at the Latrobe Valley Law Courts along 208 00:12:36,040 --> 00:12:40,880 Speaker 1: with our team. The Australian subscribers will get an alert 209 00:12:40,920 --> 00:12:43,480 Speaker 1: on their phones as soon as the jury reaches a verdict, 210 00:12:43,760 --> 00:12:45,720 Speaker 1: and you can be the first to read all the 211 00:12:45,760 --> 00:12:49,239 Speaker 1: news and our analysis by joining us at the Australian 212 00:12:49,400 --> 00:13:02,480 Speaker 1: dot com AU