1 00:00:05,921 --> 00:00:07,281 Speaker 1: Apoche production. 2 00:00:11,201 --> 00:00:13,761 Speaker 2: As we start this episode, I wanted to quickly touch 3 00:00:13,921 --> 00:00:16,281 Speaker 2: on some of the news that happened the week before 4 00:00:16,761 --> 00:00:20,761 Speaker 2: we released the first episode of Who's to Blame. You've 5 00:00:20,761 --> 00:00:23,961 Speaker 2: heard in previous episodes, the tragic night where Emma Lovell 6 00:00:24,121 --> 00:00:26,921 Speaker 2: was killed by a youth offender who broke into their 7 00:00:26,921 --> 00:00:31,041 Speaker 2: home while they slept. Lee and his daughters still live 8 00:00:31,161 --> 00:00:35,121 Speaker 2: in that same house. On Sunday night before our first 9 00:00:35,120 --> 00:00:37,281 Speaker 2: episode drop, the news broke. 10 00:00:38,681 --> 00:00:41,921 Speaker 3: Good evening a gang of young criminals has struck just 11 00:00:42,120 --> 00:00:45,681 Speaker 3: meters from where Northlake's mother, Emma Lovell was stamped to 12 00:00:45,721 --> 00:00:47,441 Speaker 3: death nearly two years ago. 13 00:00:49,681 --> 00:00:51,281 Speaker 1: It's the early hours of the morning. 14 00:00:51,400 --> 00:00:54,921 Speaker 3: Teenagers in sche masks burst into a property at North Lakes. 15 00:00:56,641 --> 00:00:59,441 Speaker 4: Yeah, very unervan, very very angry as well that they 16 00:00:59,441 --> 00:01:00,441 Speaker 4: think they can just come round and. 17 00:01:00,481 --> 00:01:01,280 Speaker 2: Do things like that. 18 00:01:02,081 --> 00:01:05,161 Speaker 3: The home they targeted is directly next door to Lee love. 19 00:01:05,840 --> 00:01:07,241 Speaker 5: Yeah, it sort of brings back a lot of fears 20 00:01:07,241 --> 00:01:09,121 Speaker 5: of what happened that night. It's happened to us once. 21 00:01:09,200 --> 00:01:14,081 Speaker 5: It just won't happen in this area again. But there's 22 00:01:14,161 --> 00:01:17,121 Speaker 5: no consequence of the actions that they're doing, so they 23 00:01:17,121 --> 00:01:19,440 Speaker 5: can just be locked up one day and be let out. 24 00:01:19,481 --> 00:01:20,161 Speaker 5: The next. 25 00:01:21,481 --> 00:01:24,160 Speaker 2: We're going to speak to Lee Moore about life after 26 00:01:24,200 --> 00:01:26,961 Speaker 2: Emma's death and what his thoughts are on who's to blame. 27 00:01:27,280 --> 00:01:29,761 Speaker 2: But I thought in this episode we could explore what 28 00:01:29,881 --> 00:01:33,441 Speaker 2: drives some of these kids to commit these crimes. Laws 29 00:01:33,441 --> 00:01:36,440 Speaker 2: in Queensland, like in most other states, don't allow us 30 00:01:36,481 --> 00:01:40,321 Speaker 2: to identify youth offenders, even if they agreed to talking 31 00:01:40,360 --> 00:01:43,041 Speaker 2: to us, and even if they now are over the 32 00:01:43,081 --> 00:01:43,840 Speaker 2: age of eighteen. 33 00:01:44,401 --> 00:01:46,761 Speaker 1: I actually do want to go back to them people 34 00:01:47,401 --> 00:01:49,081 Speaker 1: and tell them how sorry I am. 35 00:01:49,361 --> 00:01:52,641 Speaker 2: That law itself, to me is a little baffling, as 36 00:01:52,681 --> 00:01:56,001 Speaker 2: I believe hearing firsthand from youth offenders on why this 37 00:01:56,041 --> 00:01:58,841 Speaker 2: is happening and what led to it happening might actually 38 00:01:58,881 --> 00:02:02,880 Speaker 2: help us understand. But either way, we can't identify them. 39 00:02:03,161 --> 00:02:05,561 Speaker 2: This first piece of audio has been taken from a 40 00:02:05,561 --> 00:02:08,921 Speaker 2: documentary that was put together by the Queensland Police Service 41 00:02:09,321 --> 00:02:12,761 Speaker 2: around their response to youth defending in twenty twenty three. 42 00:02:13,321 --> 00:02:16,201 Speaker 1: Did you think about the people you were stealing from? 43 00:02:16,401 --> 00:02:21,081 Speaker 4: No, didn't have a clue, didn't really care. But that's 44 00:02:21,081 --> 00:02:23,201 Speaker 4: the only thing I learned, because that's the only thing 45 00:02:23,240 --> 00:02:25,921 Speaker 4: we could do. You steal from the shops and from 46 00:02:25,921 --> 00:02:27,960 Speaker 4: people and all that. 47 00:02:27,960 --> 00:02:31,601 Speaker 2: That documentary has also come under fire recently due to 48 00:02:31,641 --> 00:02:33,881 Speaker 2: the first thirty seconds of the footage. 49 00:02:34,401 --> 00:02:39,881 Speaker 1: No front toys have stump stand boys stand on the ground, 50 00:02:40,721 --> 00:02:44,161 Speaker 1: on the ground, on the ground behind your back. 51 00:02:47,481 --> 00:02:50,160 Speaker 2: Do you have anything on under a red break? 52 00:02:50,361 --> 00:02:53,041 Speaker 5: You've taken anything at all under the World Center. 53 00:02:53,481 --> 00:02:55,201 Speaker 1: I just hadn't be pan exciting. 54 00:02:55,321 --> 00:02:57,281 Speaker 2: That's okay. You don't a lot of thing by buying 55 00:02:57,361 --> 00:02:59,321 Speaker 2: yourself like that. I didn't really want to get in 56 00:02:59,321 --> 00:03:04,240 Speaker 2: the carry happy choice. We've always got choices. It's no 57 00:03:04,321 --> 00:03:06,121 Speaker 2: future in doing my business. 58 00:03:06,520 --> 00:03:07,001 Speaker 1: There you go. 59 00:03:09,441 --> 00:03:11,481 Speaker 2: The issue that some had with that was that some 60 00:03:11,561 --> 00:03:14,681 Speaker 2: of the kids were handcuffed although they were complying with 61 00:03:14,721 --> 00:03:18,201 Speaker 2: the directions of the police officer. An officer is not 62 00:03:18,240 --> 00:03:20,921 Speaker 2: to handcuff a child unless the child cannot be controlled 63 00:03:20,960 --> 00:03:21,601 Speaker 2: by other means. 64 00:03:21,641 --> 00:03:24,000 Speaker 6: According to the Operational Procedures Manual. 65 00:03:23,721 --> 00:03:26,681 Speaker 3: Police did not have the power to handcuff that young 66 00:03:26,761 --> 00:03:29,881 Speaker 3: girl because she appears to have been fully complying with 67 00:03:29,921 --> 00:03:34,520 Speaker 3: their own Police are trained know that the law no 68 00:03:35,001 --> 00:03:36,321 Speaker 3: that operating manual. 69 00:03:36,881 --> 00:03:39,481 Speaker 2: The documentary itself is really well done and shows the 70 00:03:39,561 --> 00:03:42,121 Speaker 2: levels that police have to go through when tackling this 71 00:03:42,281 --> 00:03:45,841 Speaker 2: complex issue. But I guess it's a little bit sanitized 72 00:03:46,041 --> 00:03:50,761 Speaker 2: as it is made by the QPS. The next voice 73 00:03:50,761 --> 00:03:53,561 Speaker 2: you'll hear is a former youth offender. He's now over 74 00:03:53,601 --> 00:03:55,881 Speaker 2: the age of eighteen, but we've changed his voice and 75 00:03:55,961 --> 00:03:58,081 Speaker 2: taken out any identifying information. 76 00:03:59,441 --> 00:04:04,081 Speaker 1: So I was little kid, often feel about grade seven 77 00:04:04,281 --> 00:04:08,441 Speaker 1: or A. And then I saw the going into high 78 00:04:08,481 --> 00:04:12,081 Speaker 1: school and it wasn't the best high school, and they 79 00:04:12,121 --> 00:04:14,161 Speaker 1: got into a work wrong group of friends, and I 80 00:04:14,161 --> 00:04:15,841 Speaker 1: started getting to drugs quite early. 81 00:04:16,681 --> 00:04:18,561 Speaker 2: How are were you when that all started to go on? 82 00:04:19,961 --> 00:04:24,921 Speaker 1: I would say about thirteen fourteen, maybe do you late 83 00:04:25,761 --> 00:04:26,440 Speaker 1: early grad eight? 84 00:04:27,721 --> 00:04:29,801 Speaker 2: I'd like to jump in with a warning here. It's 85 00:04:29,841 --> 00:04:32,001 Speaker 2: important to note that what we're about to talk about 86 00:04:32,241 --> 00:04:35,320 Speaker 2: is not to give anyone any ideas, but more importantly, 87 00:04:35,521 --> 00:04:37,561 Speaker 2: to show how easy it was for this boy to 88 00:04:37,601 --> 00:04:41,241 Speaker 2: take a wrong turn. We have spoken with numerous chemists 89 00:04:41,281 --> 00:04:43,481 Speaker 2: who all say they asked for ID and proof with 90 00:04:43,561 --> 00:04:46,801 Speaker 2: this sort of purchase. Remembering this happened some years ago, 91 00:04:47,281 --> 00:04:48,960 Speaker 2: how did it all begin? If you like? 92 00:04:49,201 --> 00:04:51,841 Speaker 1: So, my friend brought a bottle of cost syrup to school. 93 00:04:52,041 --> 00:04:57,201 Speaker 2: Cough syrup, Yeah, okay? And then so what happens next? 94 00:04:57,521 --> 00:05:00,481 Speaker 1: We started to pour some in the bottle and start 95 00:05:00,561 --> 00:05:03,041 Speaker 1: to drink it. You drink a certain the now and 96 00:05:03,081 --> 00:05:06,561 Speaker 1: you start to deal with And after that we started 97 00:05:06,601 --> 00:05:09,521 Speaker 1: doing it, or I would say, most days at school. 98 00:05:10,361 --> 00:05:12,041 Speaker 2: And so how are you getting how are you getting 99 00:05:12,081 --> 00:05:12,600 Speaker 2: cough syrup? 100 00:05:13,561 --> 00:05:15,761 Speaker 1: We were just walking into pharmaciason buying. 101 00:05:15,481 --> 00:05:18,200 Speaker 2: It as a thirteen year old, and no one's batting 102 00:05:18,201 --> 00:05:21,321 Speaker 2: an eyelid because it's cough syrup? Right, I guess yeah, 103 00:05:21,401 --> 00:05:21,921 Speaker 2: pretty much. 104 00:05:22,041 --> 00:05:23,801 Speaker 1: You just say I just used to say it was 105 00:05:23,841 --> 00:05:26,001 Speaker 1: for my parents, and they tell me anything. 106 00:05:26,961 --> 00:05:30,241 Speaker 2: What was What was it like for you as a kid, 107 00:05:30,361 --> 00:05:32,200 Speaker 2: so it was a thirteen year old as you're going 108 00:05:32,241 --> 00:05:34,400 Speaker 2: to high school. What was family life like for you 109 00:05:34,440 --> 00:05:36,721 Speaker 2: at home? Your mum and dad still together? Were they? 110 00:05:37,521 --> 00:05:37,881 Speaker 1: Yes? 111 00:05:38,320 --> 00:05:42,080 Speaker 2: Traditionally we have this view of you know, of people 112 00:05:42,121 --> 00:05:46,161 Speaker 2: who end up committing you crime from broken families that 113 00:05:47,121 --> 00:05:51,161 Speaker 2: don't care those sorts of things. Was that your family? 114 00:05:51,201 --> 00:05:52,481 Speaker 2: Is that what your family looked like? 115 00:05:52,841 --> 00:05:55,681 Speaker 1: No, so of my friend's family looked like that. But 116 00:05:55,801 --> 00:05:59,161 Speaker 1: it wasn't fine. We started off, you know, just going 117 00:05:59,161 --> 00:06:02,561 Speaker 1: into pharmacy seeing what we could buy. You could buy 118 00:06:03,001 --> 00:06:07,721 Speaker 1: a surprising amount of stuff as a thirteen and then 119 00:06:08,001 --> 00:06:11,801 Speaker 1: you and then we started to go, you know, to 120 00:06:11,880 --> 00:06:17,601 Speaker 1: drug dealers for stans, codeine, all of that type of stuff. 121 00:06:17,880 --> 00:06:20,321 Speaker 2: How do you find them as a thirteen year old? 122 00:06:20,481 --> 00:06:22,401 Speaker 2: How did you find them? 123 00:06:22,641 --> 00:06:26,080 Speaker 1: Well, by that point, a lot of my friends are 124 00:06:26,121 --> 00:06:31,601 Speaker 1: run pretty hard drugs than fourteen. Yeah, fourteen pushing it 125 00:06:31,641 --> 00:06:34,121 Speaker 1: now a lot of my friends were starting to take 126 00:06:34,161 --> 00:06:36,641 Speaker 1: half the stuff, so I could ask them for dealers, 127 00:06:37,201 --> 00:06:40,561 Speaker 1: and you could ask them for dealers drugs? 128 00:06:40,641 --> 00:06:43,001 Speaker 2: Is I guess the first part where things then start 129 00:06:43,081 --> 00:06:46,561 Speaker 2: to go a little miss. What happens to your schooling. 130 00:06:48,440 --> 00:06:51,561 Speaker 1: Your grade stuff, the job? You go from you know, 131 00:06:51,721 --> 00:06:54,440 Speaker 1: C students to a D E student? 132 00:06:56,121 --> 00:06:57,721 Speaker 2: What are you folks saying at this point? 133 00:06:57,761 --> 00:06:58,081 Speaker 1: Are they? 134 00:06:58,121 --> 00:07:00,001 Speaker 2: Are they noticing anything about you at home? 135 00:07:01,961 --> 00:07:05,881 Speaker 1: A bit? But they're not. It's not to mention yet. 136 00:07:07,880 --> 00:07:09,721 Speaker 1: I'm clearly of it off. You know, I'm going out 137 00:07:09,761 --> 00:07:12,881 Speaker 1: to MAT's houses on the weekends. I'm being home the 138 00:07:12,921 --> 00:07:19,561 Speaker 1: next morning absolutely off my face. I come home, I 139 00:07:19,681 --> 00:07:21,921 Speaker 1: go straight to my room and I take whatever I 140 00:07:21,961 --> 00:07:22,721 Speaker 1: got from that night. 141 00:07:24,521 --> 00:07:27,081 Speaker 2: And so at that stage was what was important in 142 00:07:27,121 --> 00:07:27,521 Speaker 2: your life? 143 00:07:28,201 --> 00:07:32,081 Speaker 1: Honestly? Major coming out with my friends getting absolutely fucked up. 144 00:07:35,521 --> 00:07:38,641 Speaker 2: When does it escalate from just doing drugs? On the 145 00:07:38,641 --> 00:07:42,481 Speaker 2: weekend with your mates to get into other mischiefs. 146 00:07:43,201 --> 00:07:47,041 Speaker 1: That really escalated to me when my other friends started 147 00:07:47,081 --> 00:07:50,641 Speaker 1: doing it. I was never too bad personally, but you know, 148 00:07:51,321 --> 00:07:59,281 Speaker 1: breaking into cars houses always needed money, you know, healing shit, 149 00:08:00,401 --> 00:08:03,481 Speaker 1: all the basic stuff, fighting. 150 00:08:05,641 --> 00:08:09,561 Speaker 2: And the money was about the drugs. Yes, what's the 151 00:08:09,561 --> 00:08:11,401 Speaker 2: thinking about taking a weapon into a house that you 152 00:08:11,441 --> 00:08:11,921 Speaker 2: break into. 153 00:08:13,801 --> 00:08:16,201 Speaker 1: The owner might have you know, knife, gone on a 154 00:08:16,241 --> 00:08:21,721 Speaker 1: baseball bat, and I'm not one hundred percent sure why 155 00:08:21,761 --> 00:08:24,881 Speaker 1: they'd do it, but assumeing it was the whack the 156 00:08:24,881 --> 00:08:29,241 Speaker 1: owner if they only confronted them, Yeah, it was nothing 157 00:08:29,321 --> 00:08:33,361 Speaker 1: passon to sell drugs as well. You're driven off drug dealers, 158 00:08:33,401 --> 00:08:37,081 Speaker 1: not completely, nothing personal, just they have money and we 159 00:08:37,161 --> 00:08:37,881 Speaker 1: want the money. 160 00:08:38,161 --> 00:08:40,121 Speaker 2: So what's the worst it gets for you? 161 00:08:41,001 --> 00:08:46,281 Speaker 1: The worst it gets for me? I mostly saw drugs. 162 00:08:49,081 --> 00:08:53,041 Speaker 1: I went out, solved little with the math, sold it 163 00:08:53,201 --> 00:09:01,161 Speaker 1: with a couple of other things. You know, I didn't 164 00:09:01,201 --> 00:09:04,681 Speaker 1: really want to go to Juby yep, that's where That's 165 00:09:04,681 --> 00:09:07,721 Speaker 1: where friends who stole cars and broken townses ended up. 166 00:09:07,761 --> 00:09:10,721 Speaker 1: At some point they're ankle monitors now. 167 00:09:11,161 --> 00:09:14,961 Speaker 2: And so those mates that ended up in Juvi that 168 00:09:15,041 --> 00:09:16,601 Speaker 2: do you know what their experience was like. 169 00:09:17,641 --> 00:09:21,361 Speaker 1: I know some of them when juv after stealing cars, 170 00:09:21,561 --> 00:09:25,801 Speaker 1: there's still decent kids tough wise, aren't still decent kids? 171 00:09:25,801 --> 00:09:27,641 Speaker 1: And some came back out as matheatics. 172 00:09:27,961 --> 00:09:32,281 Speaker 2: I guess in those instances juvenile detention actually got made 173 00:09:32,281 --> 00:09:34,481 Speaker 2: it worse as opposed to make it better, made it 174 00:09:34,641 --> 00:09:38,841 Speaker 2: a lot worse. Do you have any experiences or stories 175 00:09:38,841 --> 00:09:41,721 Speaker 2: of your mates in juvy and what sort of things 176 00:09:42,241 --> 00:09:44,361 Speaker 2: and how they were treated and those sorts of things. 177 00:09:46,881 --> 00:09:48,281 Speaker 1: They never really spoke about it. 178 00:09:48,921 --> 00:09:51,681 Speaker 2: What stops you from taking that next step? How do 179 00:09:51,761 --> 00:09:53,161 Speaker 2: you do you ever get arrested? 180 00:09:54,201 --> 00:09:55,201 Speaker 1: I was always lucky. 181 00:09:55,961 --> 00:09:58,161 Speaker 2: What was the moment for you that you went fuck 182 00:09:58,441 --> 00:10:00,721 Speaker 2: and I need to stop? Or did someone help you? 183 00:10:04,481 --> 00:10:08,161 Speaker 1: I just got it, became more heavily addicted, and I 184 00:10:08,601 --> 00:10:11,601 Speaker 1: just stopped caring about those things as long as I 185 00:10:11,641 --> 00:10:13,761 Speaker 1: could get money. I didn't really care about all the 186 00:10:13,801 --> 00:10:21,001 Speaker 1: adrenaline and stuff. It's just what is a lot of 187 00:10:21,081 --> 00:10:22,041 Speaker 1: stealing cars? 188 00:10:22,281 --> 00:10:25,121 Speaker 2: And at the stage are you still living with your parents? 189 00:10:25,801 --> 00:10:30,921 Speaker 1: Yes? Only recently. I got kicked out of school with 190 00:10:31,161 --> 00:10:34,601 Speaker 1: my early grade ten, so I went off the rails 191 00:10:34,601 --> 00:10:35,081 Speaker 1: a bit there. 192 00:10:36,081 --> 00:10:39,081 Speaker 2: This boy is about to enter a program that helps 193 00:10:39,121 --> 00:10:41,321 Speaker 2: with reintegrating him with the community. 194 00:10:41,521 --> 00:10:44,241 Speaker 1: Only recently I've been offered to go back there to 195 00:10:44,281 --> 00:10:47,561 Speaker 1: help me finish high school and clean up them more 196 00:10:48,281 --> 00:10:53,481 Speaker 1: reading your friend of a friend that knew the program. 197 00:10:52,921 --> 00:10:55,441 Speaker 2: And so you haven't yet entered the program yet. How 198 00:10:55,441 --> 00:10:57,081 Speaker 2: are you feeling about your life now? 199 00:10:59,001 --> 00:11:02,521 Speaker 1: It's better than it was as a teenager, but they 200 00:11:02,601 --> 00:11:08,681 Speaker 1: could definitely get better. That definitely makes a new friends 201 00:11:08,721 --> 00:11:09,921 Speaker 1: that aren't in prison. 202 00:11:10,401 --> 00:11:12,641 Speaker 2: What have you done about those friends that you used 203 00:11:12,681 --> 00:11:14,961 Speaker 2: to hang out with back in when you were thirteen 204 00:11:15,041 --> 00:11:17,201 Speaker 2: fourteen and those guys that have been to juvie? What 205 00:11:17,201 --> 00:11:18,401 Speaker 2: do you do about those friends? 206 00:11:19,201 --> 00:11:21,921 Speaker 1: Some of them have fucked me over. Some of them 207 00:11:22,001 --> 00:11:28,521 Speaker 1: I still see, but it's sad to be honest, they 208 00:11:28,561 --> 00:11:29,521 Speaker 1: were a long game. Now. 209 00:11:32,881 --> 00:11:35,961 Speaker 2: When you were a kid, before you entered high school, 210 00:11:36,001 --> 00:11:36,641 Speaker 2: what did you want to be? 211 00:11:37,481 --> 00:11:41,921 Speaker 1: I wanted to be a professional runner or professional footballer. 212 00:11:42,081 --> 00:11:42,801 Speaker 2: Were you any good? 213 00:11:43,081 --> 00:11:46,001 Speaker 1: I yeah, that was pretty decent. I wanted to meddle 214 00:11:46,441 --> 00:11:46,921 Speaker 1: just sport. 215 00:11:47,001 --> 00:11:50,841 Speaker 2: Now play a role in your in maybe your future. 216 00:11:51,641 --> 00:11:53,641 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I'm still playing. 217 00:11:54,241 --> 00:11:57,081 Speaker 2: There's going to be people that listen to this podcast 218 00:11:58,001 --> 00:12:04,761 Speaker 2: and straightway blame. If you like the parents and the families, 219 00:12:05,441 --> 00:12:07,241 Speaker 2: what do you say to those people. 220 00:12:07,961 --> 00:12:11,321 Speaker 1: It's not always the family. There can be other bad 221 00:12:11,401 --> 00:12:16,401 Speaker 1: influences in life. There is very real circumstances where the 222 00:12:16,521 --> 00:12:21,361 Speaker 1: parents are cracked out. But it's not always the family. 223 00:12:21,401 --> 00:12:24,201 Speaker 1: It's my family was fine. I just went to the 224 00:12:24,281 --> 00:12:25,641 Speaker 1: wrong school at the wrong time. 225 00:12:26,761 --> 00:12:28,841 Speaker 2: Who do you think is to blame for the current 226 00:12:29,601 --> 00:12:31,161 Speaker 2: crisis that we're in with youth crime. 227 00:12:32,561 --> 00:12:38,041 Speaker 1: I think there's a lot of people to blame. Most 228 00:12:38,081 --> 00:12:41,041 Speaker 1: people have a little bit of blame on them. Some 229 00:12:41,241 --> 00:12:43,121 Speaker 1: parents have a little bit of blame on them. They 230 00:12:43,201 --> 00:12:46,921 Speaker 1: could have definitely done better. The police of a decent man, 231 00:12:47,041 --> 00:12:50,921 Speaker 1: blame on them. You're going to treat someone like a criminal, 232 00:12:50,961 --> 00:12:56,401 Speaker 1: they're going to act like a criminal. And some of 233 00:12:56,401 --> 00:13:01,601 Speaker 1: the kids have a bit of blame on them. Some 234 00:13:01,641 --> 00:13:03,761 Speaker 1: of them just wanted to be cool and wanted to 235 00:13:03,801 --> 00:13:07,441 Speaker 1: be tough and started doing stupid shiit. 236 00:13:10,241 --> 00:13:13,361 Speaker 2: What's your advice to anyone that is listening to the 237 00:13:13,441 --> 00:13:19,601 Speaker 2: show that could possibly get down the same path as you? 238 00:13:19,721 --> 00:13:24,321 Speaker 1: Stick with sport, follow your dream for example, of it 239 00:13:24,361 --> 00:13:31,361 Speaker 1: ruins your life. Some people never come back. I was lucky. 240 00:13:32,961 --> 00:13:34,881 Speaker 1: As I said, I think there's a lot of time. 241 00:13:36,241 --> 00:13:40,961 Speaker 1: I think, yeah, it's hard one you need to fix 242 00:13:41,321 --> 00:13:44,681 Speaker 1: the first. Honestly, you need to help families at home 243 00:13:44,961 --> 00:13:48,361 Speaker 1: when they're fixing me, need to help them, and then 244 00:13:48,401 --> 00:13:54,961 Speaker 1: you need to help fix the police. They're just fucking assholes. 245 00:13:55,921 --> 00:13:58,041 Speaker 1: I haven't I don't have a criminal record, and I 246 00:13:58,041 --> 00:14:00,281 Speaker 1: don't treated like a criminal. Every time I pulled up, 247 00:14:00,721 --> 00:14:03,521 Speaker 1: they pull you all. You know, they take your phoe though, 248 00:14:03,721 --> 00:14:06,041 Speaker 1: they yell your bit, they go to you a one 249 00:14:06,081 --> 00:14:09,401 Speaker 1: different knife. Then they let you go every single time 250 00:14:09,441 --> 00:14:11,241 Speaker 1: you see them, and if they don't, if you don't, 251 00:14:11,361 --> 00:14:12,601 Speaker 1: then do that they take you in. 252 00:14:13,041 --> 00:14:14,641 Speaker 2: And how does that make you feel. 253 00:14:16,001 --> 00:14:16,881 Speaker 1: Fucking criminal? 254 00:14:18,041 --> 00:14:19,961 Speaker 2: And if that makes you feel like a criminal, then 255 00:14:20,161 --> 00:14:22,561 Speaker 2: I think you said earlier, if you treat me like a. 256 00:14:22,521 --> 00:14:25,921 Speaker 1: Criminal, I'm kind to act like a fucking criminal. 257 00:14:26,441 --> 00:14:30,401 Speaker 2: Yeah, how do you want to be. 258 00:14:30,361 --> 00:14:34,241 Speaker 1: Treated like a billion? Like I'm a normal person? 259 00:14:37,561 --> 00:14:41,001 Speaker 2: So what are you looking forward to about joining a program? 260 00:14:41,761 --> 00:14:44,241 Speaker 1: I'm looking forward to getting my grade ten and twelve 261 00:14:44,241 --> 00:14:47,121 Speaker 1: certificate and getting a better job. 262 00:14:49,601 --> 00:14:52,081 Speaker 2: Why is that important to your grade ten and your. 263 00:14:51,961 --> 00:14:55,481 Speaker 1: Twelve because at some point I'd like maybe too at 264 00:14:55,481 --> 00:15:01,041 Speaker 1: the university and kind of rememerk one novel education not an. 265 00:15:01,001 --> 00:15:07,641 Speaker 2: Option one of the programs that helps young people like 266 00:15:07,681 --> 00:15:11,481 Speaker 2: we've just been speaking to is the Rekindle program. It 267 00:15:11,521 --> 00:15:15,401 Speaker 2: operates out of a shed in Brisbane, Salisbury. Rekindle is 268 00:15:15,441 --> 00:15:19,601 Speaker 2: a reintegration and work experience program designed to empower young 269 00:15:19,641 --> 00:15:23,721 Speaker 2: people and ignite their potential. So Rekindle's been around for 270 00:15:24,641 --> 00:15:28,521 Speaker 2: just on a month and talk to me about its aim. 271 00:15:28,601 --> 00:15:29,841 Speaker 2: What's its aime? 272 00:15:30,201 --> 00:15:30,401 Speaker 1: Yeah? 273 00:15:30,441 --> 00:15:33,001 Speaker 6: I think you call it like a cooperative. I really 274 00:15:33,001 --> 00:15:34,801 Speaker 6: want We already have a lot of people who are 275 00:15:34,841 --> 00:15:37,161 Speaker 6: doing great stuff in the community with young people coming 276 00:15:37,201 --> 00:15:40,601 Speaker 6: out of youth justice or youth detention. We have mentors, 277 00:15:40,681 --> 00:15:45,361 Speaker 6: we have a graphic design studio, we have caterers who 278 00:15:45,401 --> 00:15:48,401 Speaker 6: have been going into the detention centers providing training and support. 279 00:15:50,241 --> 00:15:53,321 Speaker 6: And there's just so many people that want to be 280 00:15:53,361 --> 00:15:55,681 Speaker 6: able to do things and they've been doing them in isolation. 281 00:15:56,201 --> 00:15:58,281 Speaker 6: It's kind of like an experiment to see what happens 282 00:15:58,281 --> 00:16:00,801 Speaker 6: if you bring them all into one space and there's 283 00:16:00,841 --> 00:16:04,041 Speaker 6: an actual physical space where you can work from, and 284 00:16:04,081 --> 00:16:07,201 Speaker 6: the young people get to design it themselves, right, so 285 00:16:07,241 --> 00:16:10,001 Speaker 6: they get to tell us what it looks like, what 286 00:16:10,081 --> 00:16:13,081 Speaker 6: it feels like. The first cohort is kind of like 287 00:16:13,081 --> 00:16:15,681 Speaker 6: our founders. It's like there's six young people come in 288 00:16:16,281 --> 00:16:20,161 Speaker 6: and we create like discovery sessions on what artwork do 289 00:16:20,201 --> 00:16:22,361 Speaker 6: we want to hear, what type of activities do you 290 00:16:22,361 --> 00:16:26,801 Speaker 6: want to do? And then the space itself is like 291 00:16:26,841 --> 00:16:30,921 Speaker 6: a living experiment in itself in connection to food and 292 00:16:30,961 --> 00:16:35,001 Speaker 6: farmers and regeneration. So it's just like a really great collaboration. 293 00:16:35,081 --> 00:16:38,641 Speaker 2: I think, how do those young people find rekindle? How 294 00:16:38,681 --> 00:16:39,521 Speaker 2: do they find you? 295 00:16:40,281 --> 00:16:43,041 Speaker 6: Sohaia and Albert, they've been going into use justice for 296 00:16:43,121 --> 00:16:45,441 Speaker 6: quite some time now, Hawaiia especially has been doing it 297 00:16:45,481 --> 00:16:48,161 Speaker 6: for years and years. And the way in which the 298 00:16:48,201 --> 00:16:50,641 Speaker 6: young people engage with them is like, Oh, Auntie comes 299 00:16:50,681 --> 00:16:53,001 Speaker 6: into the prison, I have a really strong connection with her. 300 00:16:53,121 --> 00:16:56,001 Speaker 6: She's here to support me. So when they get out, 301 00:16:56,161 --> 00:16:59,241 Speaker 6: Arnie picks her, picks them up and then drives them 302 00:16:59,441 --> 00:17:03,241 Speaker 6: here and then it's like, oh, there's a connection point there. 303 00:17:03,561 --> 00:17:06,521 Speaker 6: She's connected the young people to this space of the shed. 304 00:17:07,201 --> 00:17:10,961 Speaker 6: And then slowly young people introduced to other people here. 305 00:17:11,921 --> 00:17:13,521 Speaker 6: And I think one of the most important things that 306 00:17:13,561 --> 00:17:16,600 Speaker 6: we try to do is all the adults here know 307 00:17:16,681 --> 00:17:19,041 Speaker 6: what's going on, and they know how to engage with 308 00:17:19,080 --> 00:17:22,121 Speaker 6: the young people, and they know not to like try 309 00:17:22,160 --> 00:17:24,880 Speaker 6: and push yourself on to them. Dominate them, you know 310 00:17:24,921 --> 00:17:28,681 Speaker 6: what I mean, it's very open collaborative. I mean, part 311 00:17:28,721 --> 00:17:30,961 Speaker 6: of what we want to do is like work out 312 00:17:31,281 --> 00:17:35,080 Speaker 6: what's like an intrauma informed where that old people know 313 00:17:35,201 --> 00:17:38,520 Speaker 6: how to bring young people in the right way so 314 00:17:38,561 --> 00:17:40,880 Speaker 6: that young people find and it's just them finding their 315 00:17:40,880 --> 00:17:41,521 Speaker 6: own way. 316 00:17:41,801 --> 00:17:45,721 Speaker 2: We talked about, you know, sort of that village mentality 317 00:17:45,880 --> 00:17:48,561 Speaker 2: of you know, it takes a village to raise a child. 318 00:17:50,360 --> 00:17:52,920 Speaker 2: This is one part of the village. And you're aware 319 00:17:52,961 --> 00:17:55,561 Speaker 2: of other great work that's being done throughout Queensland and 320 00:17:55,600 --> 00:17:57,921 Speaker 2: throughout Australia right now in sort of this area. 321 00:17:58,041 --> 00:18:00,840 Speaker 6: Yeah, I'm plumped to be able to have access to 322 00:18:00,921 --> 00:18:03,521 Speaker 6: so many great programs. One I always talk about is 323 00:18:03,521 --> 00:18:07,161 Speaker 6: Confit Pathways in New South run by Joe Quin who 324 00:18:07,160 --> 00:18:09,321 Speaker 6: was in prison himself for nine years. I met a 325 00:18:09,321 --> 00:18:13,400 Speaker 6: businessman in there and just came out pumped to start something. 326 00:18:13,921 --> 00:18:17,160 Speaker 6: Started his own business was quite successful. Then was like 327 00:18:17,201 --> 00:18:20,561 Speaker 6: I've got to give back. And so now has five 328 00:18:20,640 --> 00:18:23,600 Speaker 6: or six different mentors in the similar historical sort of 329 00:18:23,600 --> 00:18:27,161 Speaker 6: offending as him, and he goes into youth detention centers 330 00:18:27,441 --> 00:18:31,160 Speaker 6: and creates fitness programs and then he also has a 331 00:18:31,201 --> 00:18:34,561 Speaker 6: gym in Paramatta in Sydney, and that's a social enterprise 332 00:18:34,640 --> 00:18:37,681 Speaker 6: to be able to have young people engage us a gym, 333 00:18:37,761 --> 00:18:41,561 Speaker 6: be mentored, and that's like the epitome of I think 334 00:18:41,600 --> 00:18:45,080 Speaker 6: what a good youth justice program can be. Lived experience, 335 00:18:45,801 --> 00:18:48,241 Speaker 6: has a cool factor that kids want to engage with, 336 00:18:48,640 --> 00:18:52,241 Speaker 6: has his inspirational factor of that person was me one 337 00:18:52,400 --> 00:18:54,920 Speaker 6: time and this is what he's done, and then also 338 00:18:55,001 --> 00:18:59,920 Speaker 6: creates this like great community brand. When I was growing up, 339 00:18:59,921 --> 00:19:03,521 Speaker 6: myself was so easy. He just got distracted if there 340 00:19:03,561 --> 00:19:05,521 Speaker 6: wasn't something that was keeping me in life. I was 341 00:19:05,600 --> 00:19:09,681 Speaker 6: very luckly to have like parents that were pretty normal, right, 342 00:19:09,921 --> 00:19:12,920 Speaker 6: Like we weren't killing it, but we weren't poor. I 343 00:19:12,961 --> 00:19:15,921 Speaker 6: had friends. I'd go to my friends every day, I'd 344 00:19:15,961 --> 00:19:20,041 Speaker 6: hang out. And I think that sometimes the rhetoric that 345 00:19:20,120 --> 00:19:24,441 Speaker 6: happens around youth crime or young offenders or stuff, there's 346 00:19:24,481 --> 00:19:29,601 Speaker 6: a cast that's like painted across the whole youth system, 347 00:19:30,041 --> 00:19:35,041 Speaker 6: and what they then see is I'm going to live 348 00:19:35,120 --> 00:19:38,321 Speaker 6: up to that. And if they don't have that consistent 349 00:19:38,441 --> 00:19:44,281 Speaker 6: daily engagement with positive stuff, with mentors, with opportunities and 350 00:19:44,321 --> 00:19:46,921 Speaker 6: they're in the community and they're with their friends, there's 351 00:19:46,961 --> 00:19:49,961 Speaker 6: almost like this fight or flight type mentally they all 352 00:19:49,961 --> 00:19:52,840 Speaker 6: have where it's like they don't really know what to 353 00:19:52,880 --> 00:19:58,001 Speaker 6: do in situations, and they'll act up to stay with 354 00:19:58,041 --> 00:20:00,761 Speaker 6: their crowd and they'll be like, oh, that person's like 355 00:20:00,880 --> 00:20:04,440 Speaker 6: stealing that stuff, I'm going to go with them. They'll 356 00:20:04,481 --> 00:20:07,440 Speaker 6: try and show, which means like, oh, I'll steal his 357 00:20:07,561 --> 00:20:09,840 Speaker 6: car put on Instagram, you know what I mean. And 358 00:20:09,880 --> 00:20:13,041 Speaker 6: that's creating their identity that they feel like they need. 359 00:20:13,600 --> 00:20:16,440 Speaker 6: So I think like that consistency of like getting up 360 00:20:16,441 --> 00:20:19,641 Speaker 6: in the morning, going to something and then coming home 361 00:20:19,640 --> 00:20:22,001 Speaker 6: and going to bed is very alien to a lot 362 00:20:22,041 --> 00:20:25,041 Speaker 6: of our young people, and we can I think there's 363 00:20:25,041 --> 00:20:28,361 Speaker 6: an opportunity to be able to provide that if there 364 00:20:28,441 --> 00:20:31,881 Speaker 6: is a strong enough connection with community mentors and those 365 00:20:31,921 --> 00:20:37,960 Speaker 6: types of things. Which is a tough ask because it 366 00:20:38,001 --> 00:20:42,360 Speaker 6: almost feels like a societal shift to be like young 367 00:20:42,441 --> 00:20:45,440 Speaker 6: people are like working through some stuff, Let's help them 368 00:20:45,441 --> 00:20:48,880 Speaker 6: for long enough to get through it. Versus young people 369 00:20:48,880 --> 00:20:53,080 Speaker 6: are marking up. Let's put them somewhere so that everyone's safe. 370 00:20:53,481 --> 00:20:56,360 Speaker 6: It's kind of like two parts in which is quite 371 00:20:56,400 --> 00:20:59,001 Speaker 6: disparate in terms of their outcomes or what you can do. 372 00:20:59,160 --> 00:21:02,481 Speaker 2: So we've asked this to everyone we've interviewed on the podcast, 373 00:21:03,441 --> 00:21:05,960 Speaker 2: and it's a loaded question. Who do you think is 374 00:21:06,001 --> 00:21:10,840 Speaker 2: to blame for our current crisis in Queensland and Australia. 375 00:21:12,561 --> 00:21:15,521 Speaker 6: This might be combative, but I think it's might be 376 00:21:15,561 --> 00:21:22,521 Speaker 6: the wrong question. I think if there's a global response 377 00:21:22,561 --> 00:21:25,001 Speaker 6: that I could give in one word two words, it 378 00:21:25,041 --> 00:21:29,241 Speaker 6: would be the system. But that's also like a cop out. 379 00:21:29,321 --> 00:21:30,001 Speaker 2: I think. 380 00:21:31,721 --> 00:21:33,680 Speaker 6: Everyone is to blame and no one is to blame 381 00:21:33,961 --> 00:21:38,840 Speaker 6: because every day there's an opportunity for an adult to 382 00:21:38,880 --> 00:21:41,201 Speaker 6: see a young person in a different light and provide 383 00:21:41,201 --> 00:21:44,680 Speaker 6: them with that pathway to being a good human, And 384 00:21:44,721 --> 00:21:46,400 Speaker 6: every day there's a choice of that young person to 385 00:21:46,441 --> 00:21:48,400 Speaker 6: be a good human and to feel like they have 386 00:21:48,441 --> 00:21:52,921 Speaker 6: an opportunity. So I would say I'd love to see 387 00:21:52,961 --> 00:21:55,401 Speaker 6: everyone meet in the middle to be able to come 388 00:21:55,400 --> 00:21:59,440 Speaker 6: together on a joint outcome, which is like a good society. 389 00:22:00,360 --> 00:22:02,681 Speaker 6: And that's going to be super difficult because it's much 390 00:22:02,721 --> 00:22:04,600 Speaker 6: easier to sit on either end of the spectrum, I 391 00:22:04,600 --> 00:22:07,001 Speaker 6: think for humans. And that's what people take notes of. 392 00:22:07,080 --> 00:22:10,840 Speaker 6: They're like, oh, that's super rough, Like I hate that 393 00:22:11,120 --> 00:22:13,720 Speaker 6: or I love that. I don't know what it is, 394 00:22:13,921 --> 00:22:15,640 Speaker 6: but I think there's some way in which you can 395 00:22:15,681 --> 00:22:17,400 Speaker 6: tell a narrative where people come and meet in the 396 00:22:17,441 --> 00:22:21,161 Speaker 6: middle and they have discussions and debate and it's heated sometimes, 397 00:22:21,561 --> 00:22:22,761 Speaker 6: but at the end of the day, the outcome is 398 00:22:22,761 --> 00:22:23,561 Speaker 6: a better society. 399 00:22:28,241 --> 00:22:31,480 Speaker 2: Across Queensland right now, there are many different programs like 400 00:22:31,521 --> 00:22:35,961 Speaker 2: Rekindle the tackle youth crime from many different angles. Some 401 00:22:36,041 --> 00:22:38,801 Speaker 2: tackle transitioning young people who are at risk of entering 402 00:22:38,840 --> 00:22:42,441 Speaker 2: youth justice with vocational training and life skills and then 403 00:22:42,481 --> 00:22:49,120 Speaker 2: transitioning them into employment or education. Some are restorative programs 404 00:22:49,160 --> 00:22:52,240 Speaker 2: that let offenders and they're victims meet in an effort 405 00:22:52,281 --> 00:22:55,121 Speaker 2: to show the offender the impact they've had on others' 406 00:22:55,160 --> 00:23:00,201 Speaker 2: lives and provide closure for the victim. There are corespond 407 00:23:00,201 --> 00:23:03,161 Speaker 2: to teams that consist of police and youth justice workers 408 00:23:03,481 --> 00:23:08,481 Speaker 2: who respond to incidents involving young people. There's Aggression Replacement 409 00:23:08,561 --> 00:23:12,001 Speaker 2: training which tries to teach young offenders how to manage 410 00:23:12,041 --> 00:23:16,441 Speaker 2: their anger and reduce aggressive behavior, aiming to prevent reoffending. 411 00:23:17,721 --> 00:23:21,600 Speaker 2: There's a conditional bail program which offer intensive supervision and 412 00:23:21,640 --> 00:23:25,201 Speaker 2: support for young people on bail, including monitoring and case 413 00:23:25,281 --> 00:23:29,200 Speaker 2: management to ensure they comply with their bail conditions and 414 00:23:29,400 --> 00:23:33,721 Speaker 2: reduce the likelihood of reoffending. And then there are adventure 415 00:23:33,761 --> 00:23:38,001 Speaker 2: based programs. These programs use outdoor activities and challenges to 416 00:23:38,041 --> 00:23:43,121 Speaker 2: build self esteem, teamwork and problem solving skills among young offenders. 417 00:23:43,961 --> 00:23:48,241 Speaker 2: Will Smith runs one of these programs in Tasmania. It's 418 00:23:48,360 --> 00:23:51,121 Speaker 2: just been given a Tasmanian State grant. Let's hear how 419 00:23:51,160 --> 00:23:54,561 Speaker 2: Will's JCP program is changing lives in Tazy. 420 00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:55,041 Speaker 1: Yeah. 421 00:23:55,080 --> 00:24:00,041 Speaker 3: So, JCP is an abbreviation for a name, John Cobbler Pounds. 422 00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:03,201 Speaker 3: John Cobbler Pounds was a bloke born in the eighteen hundreds. 423 00:24:03,201 --> 00:24:05,241 Speaker 3: And I just you know those late night read things 424 00:24:05,241 --> 00:24:07,001 Speaker 3: where you come across this story and I think, jeez, 425 00:24:07,041 --> 00:24:09,680 Speaker 3: that's cool, just reading a story about this bloke. And 426 00:24:09,801 --> 00:24:12,640 Speaker 3: he was fourteen, fell off a ship while he was 427 00:24:12,640 --> 00:24:15,080 Speaker 3: building it with his dad, became disabled. So he opened 428 00:24:15,160 --> 00:24:18,920 Speaker 3: up a cobbler shop, fixing and mending people's shoes, and 429 00:24:18,961 --> 00:24:20,801 Speaker 3: he then went on to live into his sixties. In 430 00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:24,360 Speaker 3: his entire life, he dedicated to help an at risk 431 00:24:24,400 --> 00:24:26,880 Speaker 3: and vulnerable kids in his shop, and he had thirty 432 00:24:26,921 --> 00:24:29,480 Speaker 3: forty fifty kids in his shop every day. Taught him 433 00:24:29,521 --> 00:24:32,481 Speaker 3: how to read and write and sort of value based systems. 434 00:24:33,001 --> 00:24:36,400 Speaker 3: Wasn't connected to any particular religion or ideal or group, 435 00:24:36,561 --> 00:24:38,440 Speaker 3: just just sort of a guy trying to do the 436 00:24:38,521 --> 00:24:41,600 Speaker 3: right thing. And when he passed away. Not many people 437 00:24:41,681 --> 00:24:44,640 Speaker 3: know this, but he became the inspiration for the whole 438 00:24:44,761 --> 00:24:48,400 Speaker 3: education system reforming to allow all young people the opportunity 439 00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:50,720 Speaker 3: to go to school. Back in the eighteen hundreds, if 440 00:24:50,721 --> 00:24:53,801 Speaker 3: he didn't have money, didn't get educated. So what they 441 00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:56,160 Speaker 3: found in that town of Portsmouth in England is that 442 00:24:56,201 --> 00:24:59,281 Speaker 3: all these kids were getting educated. So the local economy 443 00:24:59,360 --> 00:25:01,960 Speaker 3: was absolutely going through the roof. We had kids that 444 00:25:02,001 --> 00:25:04,120 Speaker 3: were able to apply for a whole range of different 445 00:25:04,241 --> 00:25:07,160 Speaker 3: jobs and skins, all sets that they wouldn't ordinarily have 446 00:25:07,201 --> 00:25:11,160 Speaker 3: in other townships. And so the education system based on 447 00:25:11,201 --> 00:25:15,680 Speaker 3: the framework of people like JCP yeah, begin to begin 448 00:25:15,721 --> 00:25:17,721 Speaker 3: to sort of slowly change the way that we work 449 00:25:17,761 --> 00:25:19,401 Speaker 3: with young people in our systems. 450 00:25:20,481 --> 00:25:23,640 Speaker 2: Well, the logo it's jigsaw piece. 451 00:25:23,521 --> 00:25:28,120 Speaker 3: Yeah, So we consider ourselves to be one piece of 452 00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:31,360 Speaker 3: the puzzle of a young person's life. So the concept 453 00:25:31,481 --> 00:25:34,001 Speaker 3: is that we're not the answer or the solution, and 454 00:25:34,041 --> 00:25:37,761 Speaker 3: we don't think anyone else is individually. Young people require 455 00:25:37,961 --> 00:25:46,401 Speaker 3: a consolidated community effort, and everyone plays a role, parents, caregivers, services, neighbors, 456 00:25:46,481 --> 00:25:50,120 Speaker 3: sporting clubs, groups, random persons walking down the street, and 457 00:25:50,321 --> 00:25:54,281 Speaker 3: us together we make up a young person's life and 458 00:25:54,681 --> 00:25:59,041 Speaker 3: a successful transition to life. So yeah, it's a reminder 459 00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:01,281 Speaker 3: for us we're just one piece of the puzzle. We're 460 00:26:01,321 --> 00:26:04,240 Speaker 3: not the solution to everything, even though at times we 461 00:26:04,321 --> 00:26:07,480 Speaker 3: might think we are. But also it's a reminder that 462 00:26:07,561 --> 00:26:11,001 Speaker 3: collaboration's key. When we were trying to, you know, successfully 463 00:26:11,001 --> 00:26:12,561 Speaker 3: transition a young person. 464 00:26:13,001 --> 00:26:15,801 Speaker 2: And Beast is the program. Talk to me about what 465 00:26:15,840 --> 00:26:17,080 Speaker 2: Beast means. Yeah, Beast. 466 00:26:17,321 --> 00:26:19,281 Speaker 3: When we're trying to name the program, we wanted to 467 00:26:19,321 --> 00:26:22,120 Speaker 3: keep it a bit separate from the organization name. Beast 468 00:26:22,281 --> 00:26:25,640 Speaker 3: is owned by the boys, so they it's their program. 469 00:26:25,801 --> 00:26:27,600 Speaker 3: You can't ask a young person to rock up to 470 00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:30,481 Speaker 3: a program they don't have ownership over. You know, those 471 00:26:30,521 --> 00:26:33,161 Speaker 3: first group of five boys, we asked them a question, 472 00:26:33,241 --> 00:26:34,521 Speaker 3: what do you want to be when you grow up? 473 00:26:34,761 --> 00:26:36,680 Speaker 3: A couple of boys. You know, I want to be 474 00:26:36,761 --> 00:26:39,921 Speaker 3: a professional basketball player or I want to be a mechanic. 475 00:26:40,281 --> 00:26:42,360 Speaker 3: One of the boys just said, oh, I don't know, 476 00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:45,281 Speaker 3: I just want to be a beast. And yeah, so 477 00:26:45,321 --> 00:26:47,681 Speaker 3: we named the Beast program after that and just sort 478 00:26:47,721 --> 00:26:50,880 Speaker 3: of it's not an acronym, it's literally just after one 479 00:26:50,921 --> 00:26:53,281 Speaker 3: of the first boys that graduated that said yeah, I 480 00:26:53,360 --> 00:26:56,241 Speaker 3: just want to be a Beast, and they created the logo, 481 00:26:56,441 --> 00:27:00,121 Speaker 3: and you know, it's their brand, it's their name. When 482 00:27:00,120 --> 00:27:02,440 Speaker 3: you see the boys in the street, they'll be branded up, 483 00:27:02,521 --> 00:27:04,640 Speaker 3: Kit it Up. They've got their own clothing line and 484 00:27:04,681 --> 00:27:07,600 Speaker 3: things they were So it just gives them my ownership 485 00:27:07,681 --> 00:27:10,041 Speaker 3: over you know, what we're trying to deliver to them. 486 00:27:10,201 --> 00:27:12,400 Speaker 3: As a disclaimer, mentioned to start with that, when we 487 00:27:12,441 --> 00:27:15,201 Speaker 3: first started working with the Five Boys, there was absolutely 488 00:27:15,281 --> 00:27:18,360 Speaker 3: no process. I would go camping every weekend with my 489 00:27:18,441 --> 00:27:22,960 Speaker 3: mates and fishing and motorbike riding, and they just tagged along, okay, 490 00:27:23,241 --> 00:27:26,201 Speaker 3: And that was the initial process. It was just let's 491 00:27:26,201 --> 00:27:28,681 Speaker 3: get them, I mean, not trying to be egotistical. Let's 492 00:27:28,681 --> 00:27:32,201 Speaker 3: get them around good people you know that don't there's 493 00:27:32,201 --> 00:27:36,961 Speaker 3: no drugs, no alcohol, not smoking, talk about positive things 494 00:27:37,880 --> 00:27:40,480 Speaker 3: and just do what we ordinarily do, which was fishing, 495 00:27:40,600 --> 00:27:42,080 Speaker 3: motorbike riding, camping. 496 00:27:42,521 --> 00:27:43,281 Speaker 2: So that was sort of. 497 00:27:43,201 --> 00:27:46,400 Speaker 3: How the program initially started. That makes me shudder in 498 00:27:46,441 --> 00:27:48,561 Speaker 3: my boots now when I look back in relation to 499 00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:52,880 Speaker 3: policy procedure, clinical governance, rist managements just pretty crazy. But 500 00:27:52,921 --> 00:27:56,440 Speaker 3: that's how it started. The process of the program now 501 00:27:56,561 --> 00:28:00,401 Speaker 3: is that we wanted to identify gaps in the system 502 00:28:00,400 --> 00:28:04,400 Speaker 3: with young people, and for me, working and coming from 503 00:28:04,441 --> 00:28:07,240 Speaker 3: the police, there's massive gaps in the system in relation 504 00:28:07,321 --> 00:28:10,281 Speaker 3: to kids that sit at the pinnacle of the system, 505 00:28:10,400 --> 00:28:14,321 Speaker 3: and so our program is specifically designed around those gaps. 506 00:28:15,241 --> 00:28:17,360 Speaker 3: And where the gap lies for us is that there 507 00:28:17,360 --> 00:28:20,360 Speaker 3: are young people that exist within our communities that commit 508 00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:23,920 Speaker 3: the majority of the crime. They commit the majority of 509 00:28:23,921 --> 00:28:29,120 Speaker 3: the serious crime, and they remain the biggest burden on 510 00:28:29,400 --> 00:28:33,281 Speaker 3: our local economy and community safety measures. And what I 511 00:28:33,321 --> 00:28:35,440 Speaker 3: mean by that is they cost a lot of money. 512 00:28:35,681 --> 00:28:37,640 Speaker 3: You know, in Tazzy, to have a young person in 513 00:28:37,681 --> 00:28:40,841 Speaker 3: our detention center costs one point three million dollars a year. 514 00:28:41,401 --> 00:28:43,960 Speaker 3: So that's a massive amount of money. Now when we 515 00:28:44,041 --> 00:28:47,121 Speaker 3: consider that the rate of receivativism is so high that 516 00:28:47,161 --> 00:28:50,041 Speaker 3: those young people will transition out of that detention center 517 00:28:50,081 --> 00:28:53,041 Speaker 3: and pretty much straight into prison. As for the majority, 518 00:28:53,641 --> 00:28:56,081 Speaker 3: the costs that they incur on the community is huge. 519 00:28:56,601 --> 00:28:58,921 Speaker 3: So there's a huge gap there, a massive gap in 520 00:28:59,001 --> 00:29:03,041 Speaker 3: working with young people who are very complex and you know, 521 00:29:03,201 --> 00:29:04,720 Speaker 3: are not just sort of getting in trouble with the 522 00:29:04,721 --> 00:29:08,440 Speaker 3: plea or having some disagreements and fights at home. I'm 523 00:29:08,481 --> 00:29:10,720 Speaker 3: talking about young people who are at that pinnacle of 524 00:29:10,721 --> 00:29:13,121 Speaker 3: the system that you know, don't have anywhere to go, 525 00:29:13,281 --> 00:29:17,761 Speaker 3: that are actively committing offenses, regularly ongoing, or a very 526 00:29:17,801 --> 00:29:20,161 Speaker 3: high risk of doing so. So the premise of the 527 00:29:20,201 --> 00:29:24,401 Speaker 3: program is that young people come and we take them 528 00:29:24,441 --> 00:29:27,241 Speaker 3: away on an outdoor adventure. So they climb them mountain 529 00:29:27,281 --> 00:29:29,721 Speaker 3: at four am in the morning, they fly in helicopters 530 00:29:29,761 --> 00:29:31,961 Speaker 3: to the middle of the central platter, they jump off 531 00:29:32,001 --> 00:29:34,641 Speaker 3: ten meter platforms in the water, and we create an 532 00:29:34,721 --> 00:29:37,440 Speaker 3: environment where we empower and uplift those young people to 533 00:29:37,481 --> 00:29:41,960 Speaker 3: feel unbelievably amazing. And you know, it's tough and challenging 534 00:29:42,001 --> 00:29:47,161 Speaker 3: and it's brutal, but it's also extreme relationship building and connection. 535 00:29:47,441 --> 00:29:50,481 Speaker 3: And so young people come and engage in this process 536 00:29:50,561 --> 00:29:52,841 Speaker 3: and we see this happening across the country. There are 537 00:29:52,881 --> 00:29:55,601 Speaker 3: programs where young people are taken away from their community, 538 00:29:55,761 --> 00:29:59,201 Speaker 3: they're put through a program, and the challenge we then 539 00:29:59,241 --> 00:30:02,601 Speaker 3: had is those programs create really good results, but they're 540 00:30:02,641 --> 00:30:06,281 Speaker 3: not sustainable results. Young people are successful whilst they're in 541 00:30:06,321 --> 00:30:09,041 Speaker 3: the program, but when they're placed back in the community 542 00:30:09,241 --> 00:30:12,881 Speaker 3: over a month two months, they revert back behaviors because 543 00:30:13,241 --> 00:30:17,521 Speaker 3: influence and environment play a massive role in the way 544 00:30:17,521 --> 00:30:21,041 Speaker 3: that young people sort of affect change. 545 00:30:22,841 --> 00:30:24,601 Speaker 2: Next time on who's to blame. 546 00:30:25,041 --> 00:30:30,801 Speaker 3: Who's to blame here in Queensland, my honest opinion, not 547 00:30:30,921 --> 00:30:36,481 Speaker 3: the police, not government services, not the young people. I 548 00:30:36,561 --> 00:30:39,161 Speaker 3: go back to our puzzle piece analogy. You know, I 549 00:30:39,161 --> 00:30:44,641 Speaker 3: think everyone plays a role. I think technology is a 550 00:30:44,721 --> 00:30:48,161 Speaker 3: massive contributor to the way that young people are being 551 00:30:48,161 --> 00:30:51,361 Speaker 3: brought up At the moment, we're talking social media, social media, 552 00:30:52,001 --> 00:30:56,760 Speaker 3: screen time, you know, the content absorption of young people 553 00:30:56,801 --> 00:31:01,801 Speaker 3: across various platforms, where we're so accustomed these days to 554 00:31:02,401 --> 00:31:05,281 Speaker 3: seeing a young person in need and stepping back as 555 00:31:05,321 --> 00:31:06,681 Speaker 3: opposed to stepping forward.