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Speaker 1: This is the Fits In and Whip with Kate Richie podcast.

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Speaker 2: We get so excited and we get this man in

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Speaker 2: here obviously being parents ourselves. But make sure you're following

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Speaker 2: Guiding Growing Minds and you know it's another good one

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Speaker 2: as well that I've been following pop culture parenting on

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Speaker 2: Instagram and you can catch doctor Billy garg.

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Speaker 3: Good to see. It always always great to.

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Speaker 4: Be with your The minute we mentioned your name on

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Speaker 4: the show, the phonees don't stop bringing. Every parent has

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Speaker 4: a question, big or small. I feel very privileged to

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Speaker 4: be able to sit in the studio and line up

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Speaker 4: a question and ask you directly. And I want to

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Speaker 4: kick it off with this one if we can. Today

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Speaker 4: we're getting ready into Yeah, I want to talked about

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Speaker 4: conflict resolution. Okay, you know why because we have a

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Speaker 4: bit of a listening issue in my house. So long

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Speaker 4: story short.

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Speaker 5: You've had your ears cut off.

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Speaker 4: Jack comes into the kitchen ask me a question. I

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Speaker 4: tell him the answer. He walks off and says I'm

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Speaker 4: not listening to him. I then ask him to go

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Speaker 4: upstairs five times, and he while he's playing handball. I

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Speaker 4: asked him five times and he deliberately ignores me. Because

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Speaker 4: he wants to make a point that I wasn't listening

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Speaker 4: to him before, so he's not going to listen. In

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Speaker 4: the ten years of me being a parent, I've never

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Speaker 4: screamed as loud as I did the other day. And

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Speaker 4: I did it because I wanted to make an impact

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Speaker 4: and I wanted to prove that I was the parent

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Speaker 4: and this is my role now. After that, the knock

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Speaker 4: on from that was tears, and the knock on from

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Speaker 4: that was him telling Mum that I'd broken his heart

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Speaker 4: the way Dad spoke to me.

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Speaker 3: And I was like, oh, mate, that hurts to hear that.

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Speaker 4: But I think naturally, as a parent, there's a stage

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Speaker 4: where you yell at your kids.

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Speaker 3: But I really.

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Speaker 5: Yelled, he mean, like raged raged.

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Speaker 4: I raged at him, and I think he was taken

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Speaker 4: back by it.

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Speaker 3: But I wanted to make a point.

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Speaker 2: Do you do you completely cut out raising your voice altogether,

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Speaker 2: Billy as a parent?

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Speaker 3: Do you think it can be beneficial? Thank God?

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Speaker 6: The answer to that's no.

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Speaker 5: But yeah, I'm glad you asked this because we have

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Speaker 5: an listening issue at home as well, because I can

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Speaker 5: say someone's name a thousand times, and because Lisa.

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Speaker 3: Said you shouldn't have yelled like that.

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Speaker 6: No, well, you have to be yourself and you have

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Speaker 6: to express your emotions because if kids grow up seeing

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Speaker 6: us never getting frustrated, upset, angry, jealous, sad, scared, and

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Speaker 6: they feel like it's not okay for them to feel

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Speaker 6: like that, And the most important thing you do in.

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Speaker 3: That situation is repair.

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Speaker 6: The beautiful thing about it is you're showing the safety

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Speaker 6: of the relationship because he's happy to kind of give

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Speaker 6: it back to you. And what we know moving away

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Speaker 6: from the evidence of like an authoritarian the stuff we

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Speaker 6: grew up with just because I said so, is that

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Speaker 6: you actually try and help connect with kids and then

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Speaker 6: build their skills and so conflict resolution. The goal of

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Speaker 6: there is like saying, this is what happened objectively, this

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Speaker 6: is how it made me feel. This is the need

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Speaker 6: in me that I struggle with. So, Mate, I asked

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Speaker 6: you to do something, you didn't listen to me. I

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Speaker 6: felt like you were ignoring me. It made me upset

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Speaker 6: and frustrated. And I have a need to connect with

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Speaker 6: you because I think we're a beautiful partnership and we

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Speaker 6: want succeed together in this house and enjoy each other.

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Speaker 6: Because of how much I love you and how amazing

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Speaker 6: you are. How about we try this and it's a request,

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Speaker 6: not a demand, where we try and connect a bit

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Speaker 6: better and then give him something that he can achieve

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Speaker 6: pretty quickly and go, mate, that was amazing. It meant

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Speaker 6: the need in me to feel connected to you and

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Speaker 6: were in a partnership. And I just want to say

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Speaker 6: how proud I am of us doing this together. And

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Speaker 6: that's you always go towards what you're trying to achieve,

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Speaker 6: not stopping something happening, right.

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Speaker 3: So you go from there, you go from the scream

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Speaker 3: to the bond.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, but the scream is the scream is all of us,

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Speaker 6: Like all of us have different versions of that. None

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Speaker 6: of us are doing it perfectly. And actually, you know,

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Speaker 6: repair is what it's all about, because I don't know

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Speaker 6: about you, but like it's really important our kids here

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Speaker 6: is say sorry.

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Speaker 3: And a lot of us.

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Speaker 6: Grew up not hearing that because it was like, oh,

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Speaker 6: I know, I've got to show that I'm the boss,

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Speaker 6: I'm in charge, I've got control, I'm the pair and

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Speaker 6: I shouldn't apologize. But it's a bit like respect forgiveness,

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Speaker 6: all those things. Kids learn how to do it themselves

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Speaker 6: by having it come to them first, and thinking about

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Speaker 6: I learned how to say sorry because of how good

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Speaker 6: it was when Mum and or Dad said it to

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Speaker 6: me when they made a mistake.

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Speaker 5: And it wasn't about winning or losing.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, And which.

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Speaker 6: Is such a good point, Kate, because what you're talking

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Speaker 6: about there is what we call negative coersion cycles, where

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Speaker 6: it's like I meant to check out and they're screaming

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Speaker 6: for a lollipop, and I'm just coming down hard on them,

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Speaker 6: and I'm saying, you're not getting the iPad if you

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Speaker 6: bring it up again, or you go all right, I'm

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Speaker 6: feeling embarrassed you screaming in front of everyone. I'll just

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Speaker 6: give you the lollipop. The problem is, if you do

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Speaker 6: the iPad move, you're more likely to do it again

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Speaker 6: and just punish them, which never works, gives no skill development,

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Speaker 6: fractures a relationship, or you just give in and they go, Man,

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Speaker 6: that worked, I just get the lollipop. So you hold

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Speaker 6: the boundary. So the beautiful thing that people seem to

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Speaker 6: struggle with is you can hold a boundary and still

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Speaker 6: meet the emotional needs of a kid.

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Speaker 4: What do you mean to hold the boundary? Do they

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Speaker 4: get the lollipop.

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Speaker 5: No, no, no, you're making it like a balance a rule.

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Speaker 6: The answer is no. We've spoken about this. I'm really

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Speaker 6: sorry you're upset about it. I can see how frustrated

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Speaker 6: it is. That must be really difficult, but mate, we're

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Speaker 6: not happening, and boundaries help us feel safe, Like I

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Speaker 6: feel safe in this room because I know you guys.

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Speaker 6: I know it's going to be safe and to be fun.

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Speaker 6: You know, it's caring and all that stuff. Whereas if

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Speaker 6: this was frantic, the rules change, sometimes you had to

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Speaker 6: go at me, sometimes you ignored me, I'd feel insecure

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Speaker 6: in the relationship. And the most important one kids have

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Speaker 6: with us is with their caregivers and educators, and boundaries

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Speaker 6: actually help us feel safe. I know what's going to happen.

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Speaker 6: I know Mum's got it well.

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Speaker 5: I think it's one of the Being able to set

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Speaker 5: boundaries is one of the most important things, even moving

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Speaker 5: forward into your adult life. I mean I think that

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Speaker 5: I think you know I've had personally, can find it

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Speaker 5: hard to set boundaries and stick with them and feel

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Speaker 5: as though I deserve to have those boundaries respected, you know,

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Speaker 5: And so I would love to look at my daughter

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Speaker 5: and think that she'll be better at it.

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Speaker 3: Than well, you know.

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Speaker 6: The hardest thing is, like I've had this, you know,

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Speaker 6: with like without getting too heavy at nine o'clock on

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Speaker 6: a morning, like you know, childhood trauma and like abusive

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Speaker 6: relationships and holding those boundaries is actually easy. And now

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Speaker 6: I have kids where I used to feel guilt and

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Speaker 6: responsibility and all those things, but now I'm like, no,

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Speaker 6: I'm actually role modeling to three little kids. How I

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Speaker 6: look after myself and hold boundaries and make sure that

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Speaker 6: there's you know, people can't treat me however they want.

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Speaker 6: They can't harm me and hurt me and all those things,

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Speaker 6: and my kids are watching me hopefully going. Yeah, Dad

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Speaker 6: was actually good at making sure that he kept himself

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Speaker 6: safe and had expectations around relationships and all that stuff.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, and that could start with a lollipop at the supermarket,

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Speaker 5: do you know what I mean? I know, And that's

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Speaker 5: that's then what implements it further down the track.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, emotional regulation. I think we always want to know

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Speaker 6: what to do when the kid's really flipping out, either

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Speaker 6: in the school yard or at home, But it's actually

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Speaker 6: low level difficulties in safe relationships and safe environments where

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Speaker 6: you just get down on their level and connect with

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Speaker 6: them and say, hey, mate, I'm so sorry this is happening.

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Speaker 6: I'm here and it's not so you can have it.

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Speaker 6: It's like I'm still here for you though.

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Speaker 3: This is great. Any of the phones light up.

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Speaker 4: Carl's in Pannonia. Hi, Carli, Hi, how are you going good?

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Speaker 4: We have doctor Billy Garvey here.

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Speaker 3: Your question for doctor Billy.

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Speaker 1: My second child sends to be a little bit more

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Speaker 1: difficult than the other two. Is middle side child syndrome

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Speaker 1: an actual thing?

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Speaker 6: As a middle child, I'd say yes. As an actual

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Speaker 6: professional in this space. It's more to do with temperaments.

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Speaker 6: So kids have different temperaments. The easiest way to break

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Speaker 6: it is in an easy going temperament and a sensitive temperament.

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Speaker 6: About twenty to thirty percent of kids have a sensitive temperament.

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Speaker 6: I have a sensitive temperament. I was born with it.

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Speaker 6: I will always have it. We run an Unsettled Babies

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Speaker 6: clinic every week, and you can tell from about ten

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Speaker 6: to eleven months if a child will have an unsettled

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Speaker 6: temperament not. My four year old daughter has a fiery redhead.

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Speaker 6: She has a sensitive temperament. She's the eldest, but her

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Speaker 6: temperament means that you know, experiences in relationships in her

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Speaker 6: environments have a bigger impact on her emotionally than her

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Speaker 6: siblings and other kids.

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Speaker 2: Being the middle child, do you build resilience or can

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Speaker 2: that be detrimental sometimes because you're getting knocked down by

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Speaker 2: your older siblings.

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Speaker 6: Well, it's a really beautiful question. Resilience is made up

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Speaker 6: of about a one hundred different things, and resilience is

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Speaker 6: actually your ability to have a healthy process of dealing

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Speaker 6: with adversity and it's trauma or difficulties. Even lighter level

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Speaker 6: stuff doesn't give us resilience. It actually tests whether we

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Speaker 6: have it or not. And an example is you don't

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Speaker 6: learn how to swim by someone throwing the deep end

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Speaker 6: and then you figure it out. You actually learn because

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Speaker 6: someone goes This is conflict resolution at your level. This

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Speaker 6: is how to express emotions, This is how to help seek,

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Speaker 6: this is how to build your strong self esteem and

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Speaker 6: all that stuff. And then just like in the swimming pool,

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Speaker 6: you've learned in a way that you then have the

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Speaker 6: capacity to swim in water that's deeper than you can

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Speaker 6: touch the bottom. So that's how you actually build resilience.

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Speaker 6: But sibling relationships can be really protective, but they can

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Speaker 6: also be harmful. You're not guaranteed. It's a bit like

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Speaker 6: the single child stuff. Single children are not doomed to

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Speaker 6: struggle socially because they didn't have other kids growing up

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Speaker 6: with them.

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Speaker 3: It's just about how.

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Speaker 6: Do you give those skill development opportunities to kids. But

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Speaker 6: a lot of trauma can happen in homes, which you know,

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Speaker 6: household dysfunction, abuse, neglect, adverse childhood experiences exist in seventy

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Speaker 6: two percent of Australians have one of those. Twenty percent

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Speaker 6: of us have three or more, and sometimes sibling relationships

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Speaker 6: can be really impacted by that if there's not parenting.

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Speaker 6: That kind of has really good balance of warmth and

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Speaker 6: also control.

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Speaker 4: What a great question. Thanks Carly Right.

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Speaker 2: This is the Fitzi and Whipper with Cape Ritchie podcast.

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Speaker 4: Leilani, Hello, Hi.

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Speaker 1: How are you going with the Billy?

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Speaker 6: I've got great? Thanks?

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Speaker 3: How are you?

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Speaker 1: I'm good? Thank you. You just touched on resilience just before,

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Speaker 1: and I know that we hear a lot online about

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Speaker 1: raising resilient kids. I just wanted you to maybe go

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Speaker 1: in a depth a little bit more about how the

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Speaker 1: theory on when it comes through the resilient kids today.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, great, great question. So, yeah, I think that what

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Speaker 6: we try and do in clinic, and I'm trying to

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Speaker 6: share more broadly through things like the book and the

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Speaker 6: podcast and the other work we do, is that we

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Speaker 6: want to watch the individual kid and go where are

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Speaker 6: they struggling, And that we're always trying to think about

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Speaker 6: is this an accommodation thing, like this kid needs glasses

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Speaker 6: or you know, this kid is actually has a learning

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Speaker 6: difficulty like dyslex here, And we don't tell people who

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Speaker 6: need glasses just try harder to look and see things.

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Speaker 6: We just go, cool, we need to accommodate you, who's

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Speaker 6: same as ADHD and kids sitting in classrooms, we need

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Speaker 6: to actually accommodate them. And then we give skill development

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Speaker 6: where we can, and we say we actually want to

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Speaker 6: build your capacity to emotionally regulate. And so, you know,

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Speaker 6: as a sensitive kid growing up, one of the things

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Speaker 6: that I struggled with from resilience is that I had

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Speaker 6: big feelings about little stuff that other people would go

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Speaker 6: that's not a big deal, you know, struggling at sport,

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Speaker 6: feeling like I was socially excluded all those things, and

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Speaker 6: what I needed with someone to actually teach me emotional

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Speaker 6: regulation skills. Now, for being one hundred percent honest, I

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Speaker 6: didn't learn that until my mid thirties. But I didn't

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Speaker 6: need to wait till then. It's just no one knew

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Speaker 6: how to actually give it to me. And so now

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Speaker 6: I have a skill set in building the capacity of

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Speaker 6: those kids. But there'll be other kids where they really

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Speaker 6: struggle with empathy. You know, they are very egocentric and

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Speaker 6: they think the world is theirs. Often that's kids who

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Speaker 6: have insecure attachment and combination of sense and temperament. So

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Speaker 6: if we can think about those kids and going, how

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Speaker 6: do I actually build your empathy? And empathy is a

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Speaker 6: process that kids go developmentally. You don't, you know, you're

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Speaker 6: not innately born with us. Some kids will pick it

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Speaker 6: up easier and some kids won't, and kids will insecure

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Speaker 6: self esteem, really struggle with things like that. So then

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Speaker 6: once again we go, cool, that's the thing that we're

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Speaker 6: going to build. We're going to give you empathy. And

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Speaker 6: it's a very long winded answer, but we start building

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Speaker 6: empathy in kids from a really young age. And what

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Speaker 6: we do is explore in safe when they're calm, relationships

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Speaker 6: and environments. I wonder how that person's feeling. Look in

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Speaker 6: this book, what do you reckon he's going through? I

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Speaker 6: he's happy because he's playing with the dog. Why do

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Speaker 6: you think that girl's upset? What could we do to help?

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Speaker 6: And early forms of empathy come in into preschool years

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Speaker 6: where kids will often go, I want to give that

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Speaker 6: kid something, but I'll give them what I want would

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Speaker 6: want in that situation. That's the classic little boy that

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Speaker 6: just hugs the other kid really firmly. You know, the

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Speaker 6: kid's like, I don't want a big hug, but the

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Speaker 6: kid can't conceptualize because I don't have a theory of

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Speaker 6: mind that that person's hav a different experience to me.

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Speaker 6: And that comes about four to five years of age

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Speaker 6: that you go, Whipper's having a different experience to me.

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Speaker 6: I'm actually cool being in this environment, but he might

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Speaker 6: not be. And how can I tell? Look at his

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Speaker 6: body language he's struggling. What could I do to help him?

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Speaker 6: And the sensitivity and responsiveness is watching you and going, hey, mate,

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Speaker 6: are you okay? And if you start guarding up and

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Speaker 6: wanting me away, then I adapt, whereas if you go, actually,

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Speaker 6: I'm not ok Hey, how about we go for a

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Speaker 6: cruise and go sit down somewhere where no one else

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Speaker 6: is around, and I just sit in hold space with you.

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Speaker 3: That's great.

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Speaker 5: Can you have too much empathy?

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Speaker 3: No, you can.

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Speaker 6: Sometimes kids who are insecure in their self esteem will

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Speaker 6: just put everyone else first, and that's where it can

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Speaker 6: tip over, where they've had so much reinforcement of being

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Speaker 6: compassionate thinking about everyone else that they haven't learned how

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Speaker 6: to hold a boundary for themselves. And often those people

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Speaker 6: are transactional in their relationships. You're only friends with me

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Speaker 6: because of what I do for you. So I want

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Speaker 6: to keep informing you that I'm a good person. I'm

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Speaker 6: going to help you and I'm always going to do

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Speaker 6: what you need, and I'm not going to ask anything

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Speaker 6: of you.

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Speaker 2: Boundaries again, Boundaries again, Stacy and Rouse Hill.

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Speaker 3: You've got doctor Billy Garvey. Stace.

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Speaker 1: I was just wanting to ask, why is there's so

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Speaker 1: much crime involving young people?

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Speaker 6: Great question, great question. I'm happy to go anywhere, so

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Speaker 6: I'll happily jump into.

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Speaker 3: This in Melbourne at the moment, isn't it quite a

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Speaker 3: bit there?

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Speaker 2: And it's like we're talking teenage kids getting mixed up

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Speaker 2: in gangs.

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Speaker 3: Billy.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, so I meet a lot of those kids in clinic.

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Speaker 6: Every week we have a behavior clinic and I get

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Speaker 6: to meet these kids. It's the greatest privilege of my

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Speaker 6: profession that I get to meet these kids that everyone

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Speaker 6: else has gone has given up on, understandably because of

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Speaker 6: a lot of challenges, and I reckon. Last week, I

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Speaker 6: probably shook two teenagers hands that I've known for three

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Speaker 6: or four years that they're going off now university or

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Speaker 6: tay for finishing school. One kid, I actually said to him,

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Speaker 6: I was like, made, how cool is this? You know

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Speaker 6: you were getting expelled four years ago and I met

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Speaker 6: you and the school was never going to have your back.

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Speaker 6: You should be really proud of yourself that you finished.

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Speaker 6: And he laughed and said, yeah, well I did get

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Speaker 6: suspended last week in the end of year twelve. But

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Speaker 6: he's going on and doing a trade. It's a beautiful kid.

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Speaker 6: He's gone and become he's gone and done forklift truck

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Speaker 6: driving because that's what I was doing when I was

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Speaker 6: his age, And like, so all these is.

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Speaker 3: It, Billy? Is it?

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Speaker 6: Like?

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Speaker 2: I mean, you know what, I've had mates that have

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Speaker 2: joined BIKI gangs, But do you know why they did

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Speaker 2: it because they felt they felt belonging, like they felt

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Speaker 2: like there was a there was a group of brothers

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Speaker 2: that were looking after them, and it was the and

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Speaker 2: they'd never had that in their life.

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Speaker 6: So amplify that God, push push that message out and

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Speaker 6: push down all this idea of we need to punish

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Speaker 6: them more, because all of the evidence shows that kids

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Speaker 6: that go into those detention centers or get incarcerated come

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Speaker 6: out worse and they're more likely to then commit acts

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Speaker 6: of antisocial behavior and crime. All those kids where you

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Speaker 6: know you're so right when we meet them, there's been

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Speaker 6: hundreds of flares over years and years that they were struggling.

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Speaker 6: And our largest last data that we had from last year.

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Speaker 6: Every three years we collect how kids are going socially,

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Speaker 6: emotionally and developmentally in school entry and the twenty twenty

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Speaker 6: four data is the worst we've seen. There's more kids

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Speaker 6: entering school with developmental risk. And the problem is if

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Speaker 6: you don't know how to socialize, you've got a language difficulty,

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Speaker 6: you have a learning difficulty, you struggle with empathy and

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Speaker 6: all those things. What happens, and you're perfectly right about this,

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Speaker 6: is you don't have a sense of belonging in school.

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Speaker 6: You feel failure when you're there, and a sense of

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Speaker 6: belonging in school is one of the most protective factors

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Speaker 6: against adversity. As well as two nonparntal adults take a

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Speaker 6: genuine interest in me participating in community traditions, a home

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Speaker 6: where I feel safe, someone I can talk to about

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Speaker 6: my feelings, friends that genuinely care about me. That's the

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Speaker 6: stuff that actually matters. And all those kids I meet

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Speaker 6: in clinic almost always have an absence of most of

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Speaker 6: those things. And schools that expel kids are worse for

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Speaker 6: the schools behind. That is a vidom of a school

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Speaker 6: that is not resourced appropriately. And what we need to

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Speaker 6: do is when those kids kick off, we need to

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Speaker 6: look back and go look at the schools that weren't

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Speaker 6: getting enough support. Look at how poor their access was

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Speaker 6: to specialists like me. Look at how poorly supported the

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Speaker 6: parents were. You know, young single parents need better support.

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Speaker 6: This needs to start before kids are born, where we

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Speaker 6: come in and put the actual evidence in about child development,

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Speaker 6: mental health, and then you will make these communities safer

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Speaker 6: and healthier and genuinely more inclusive.

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Speaker 4: God, it's a big topic.

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Speaker 2: Do you know who you are your Robin Williams in Goodwill,

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Speaker 2: isn't it?

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Speaker 6: No, I think I'm Matt Damon. I'm trying to tell

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Speaker 6: myself it's not my fault. But everything is about trying

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Speaker 6: to prove that I'm a good person and push back

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Speaker 6: against the idea that I'm not that I heard a

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Speaker 6: lot about.

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Speaker 3: So that's I just.

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Speaker 6: Kind to be a genius, didn't I Matt Damon's like

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Speaker 6: a genius.

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Speaker 3: Add that to the baio.

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Speaker 2: But Bill, I do love how there's some really troubled

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Speaker 2: kids out there, and I love your outlooking life that

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Speaker 2: this is a great challenge for me. I really want

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Speaker 2: to help this kid. There's not many people out there

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Speaker 2: that are like that.

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Speaker 6: I'm doing it selfishly, like I'm looking for myself in clinic.

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Speaker 6: I got kicked out of high school, you know, I

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Speaker 6: was told that I had no future, and it was

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Speaker 6: just because a couple of people believed in me that

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Speaker 6: I had a different trajectory. And now I get the

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Speaker 6: privilege getting paid to try and change that journey for

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Speaker 6: other kids. So it's a selfish pursuit. But if it's

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Speaker 6: helping people, then that's beautiful.

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Speaker 3: TI.

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Speaker 6: Well.

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Speaker 5: Not if it's helping people it absolutely is. I was

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Speaker 5: just thinking ahead of Christmas. I know it's madness that

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Speaker 5: it's only just around the corner, and sometimes Christmas can

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Speaker 5: be hard for families and kids, and because I don't

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Speaker 5: think necessarily it looks the way we're told it's meant

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Speaker 5: to look, and you have, you know, dysfunction and families

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Speaker 5: and people not seeing who they should be seeing, or

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Speaker 5: being kept from who they're seeing, or someone's not getting

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Speaker 5: gifts this year, or some people can't even put meals

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Speaker 5: on the table. I don't even know what my question is,

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Speaker 5: but I think going into this time of year, when

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Speaker 5: there's a lot of pressure on parents generally and families

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Speaker 5: to make it right and make it perfect and all

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Speaker 5: of that stuff, do you have any advice kind of

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Speaker 5: for them about what your kids really want or hope

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Speaker 5: for or need, like if you could give your kid

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Speaker 5: one thing for Christmas kind of thing.

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Speaker 6: It's totally it's a beautiful it's a beautiful question. So

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Speaker 6: I'm totally know what you're saying, and it's amazing that

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Speaker 6: you're thinking outwardly about that. And I think if more

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Speaker 6: of us can think outwardly about how difficult this time

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Speaker 6: of year can be for lots of people. Then that's amazing.

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Speaker 6: It's also an opportunity to build compassion and empathy in

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Speaker 6: our kids. And I was seeing with Avet, my four

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Speaker 6: year old, the other night and talking about Christmas and

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Speaker 6: thinking about, like, what would other people like? What in

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Speaker 6: our family, like Charlie and Hardy can't write a letter,

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Speaker 6: I'm Alfie the dog can't write a letter. What do

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Speaker 6: we think they would like? Sand And do you know

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Speaker 6: the other thing that I did, I was like, I

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Speaker 6: made sure she realized that her getting presents from Santa

440
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Speaker 6: is not conditional on whether she's good or not. So

441
00:19:18,880 --> 00:19:20,840
Speaker 6: the idea of like, you need to be good to

442
00:19:20,840 --> 00:19:24,719
Speaker 6: get stuff, well, that's what we grew up with. Unconditional

443
00:19:24,760 --> 00:19:27,119
Speaker 6: positive regard and love is the most important thing that

444
00:19:27,119 --> 00:19:29,760
Speaker 6: our kids feel. And the idea of if you're good,

445
00:19:29,800 --> 00:19:33,040
Speaker 6: you'll get what you want. Withdrawal of love when kids

446
00:19:33,040 --> 00:19:34,920
Speaker 6: don't do what we want them to do, is one

447
00:19:34,920 --> 00:19:37,080
Speaker 6: of the worst things that we do. So saying that

448
00:19:37,200 --> 00:19:39,760
Speaker 6: no matter what, if you're actually butting heads with me

449
00:19:39,840 --> 00:19:41,720
Speaker 6: and driving me crazy, I'm going to go towards you.

450
00:19:42,119 --> 00:19:44,560
Speaker 6: I'm going to express that it's annoying me and frustrating me.

451
00:19:44,600 --> 00:19:46,120
Speaker 6: But I'm going to try and meet your needs as

452
00:19:46,119 --> 00:19:46,800
Speaker 6: well as mine.

453
00:19:46,880 --> 00:19:48,800
Speaker 4: So when I pretended to call the north pole the

454
00:19:48,800 --> 00:19:51,480
Speaker 4: other day, is that the wrong thing to do.

455
00:19:55,880 --> 00:19:57,760
Speaker 3: I wasn't ready to be on the other.

456
00:20:00,200 --> 00:20:02,600
Speaker 4: Being a trouble maker cancel the presence.

457
00:20:03,000 --> 00:20:03,840
Speaker 3: So don't do that.

458
00:20:04,280 --> 00:20:06,959
Speaker 6: Well, No, it's interesting because on the podcast people who listen, right,

459
00:20:07,000 --> 00:20:08,679
Speaker 6: and I remember this story where Nick can I do

460
00:20:08,720 --> 00:20:11,159
Speaker 6: it with this beautiful human? He was trying you couldn't

461
00:20:11,160 --> 00:20:13,960
Speaker 6: get any boundaries around the TV, so he pretended it

462
00:20:14,000 --> 00:20:15,560
Speaker 6: was broken and got one of his mates to come

463
00:20:15,560 --> 00:20:17,640
Speaker 6: over as a repairman and say it's unfixable.

464
00:20:17,960 --> 00:20:23,080
Speaker 3: Awesome, nothing, I can walk down the door and he's like, mate,

465
00:20:23,119 --> 00:20:25,879
Speaker 3: I'm not doing that again for it. That's amazing.

466
00:20:26,119 --> 00:20:29,479
Speaker 4: It's a great question though, Christmas time, because you know,

467
00:20:29,520 --> 00:20:32,560
Speaker 4: there are there are expectations. There are family pictures that

468
00:20:32,600 --> 00:20:34,600
Speaker 4: everybody has in their mind that looks like a Coca

469
00:20:34,640 --> 00:20:37,880
Speaker 4: Cola commercial and it's often happy faces or we're pretending

470
00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:39,199
Speaker 4: to be happy at different times.

471
00:20:39,280 --> 00:20:42,680
Speaker 5: Well, and it's about trying to Okay, I know we're

472
00:20:42,720 --> 00:20:46,600
Speaker 5: probably running out of time here, but there's a lot

473
00:20:46,600 --> 00:20:49,480
Speaker 5: of Yeah, there's just a lot of pressure on and

474
00:20:49,560 --> 00:20:54,159
Speaker 5: I'm sure everyone's not only everything's a bit tight. What

475
00:20:54,560 --> 00:20:57,199
Speaker 5: do I need to be buying? Mom doesn't want me

476
00:20:57,240 --> 00:21:01,080
Speaker 5: to bring this person to lunch. I don't know what

477
00:21:01,160 --> 00:21:03,280
Speaker 5: I mean, Like, how on earth?

478
00:21:03,520 --> 00:21:04,560
Speaker 4: How good's Christmas? You know?

479
00:21:04,680 --> 00:21:05,040
Speaker 3: How good?

480
00:21:05,480 --> 00:21:08,320
Speaker 5: You know? And it tends to be the time of

481
00:21:08,440 --> 00:21:11,720
Speaker 5: year where all of these emotions that we haven't been

482
00:21:11,920 --> 00:21:18,000
Speaker 5: either regulating effectively or dealing with and moving through throughout

483
00:21:18,080 --> 00:21:20,639
Speaker 5: the year, let's just wait for that one day that

484
00:21:20,680 --> 00:21:22,399
Speaker 5: we want to make perfect and.

485
00:21:22,680 --> 00:21:26,359
Speaker 6: Do it A doozy definitely, But I like my mum

486
00:21:27,000 --> 00:21:30,000
Speaker 6: passed away when she was in early fifties, and I

487
00:21:30,040 --> 00:21:32,399
Speaker 6: look back at all things like Christmas and that and

488
00:21:32,440 --> 00:21:35,040
Speaker 6: how busy she was, just trying to please everyone, and

489
00:21:35,080 --> 00:21:37,280
Speaker 6: I just wish that I had more time in those

490
00:21:37,359 --> 00:21:39,760
Speaker 6: days with her and so not about the food, not

491
00:21:39,800 --> 00:21:42,480
Speaker 6: about the presents, just actually sitting and being with her

492
00:21:42,600 --> 00:21:45,720
Speaker 6: and having fun with her. And that's what probably all

493
00:21:45,760 --> 00:21:48,040
Speaker 6: of our kids are going to look back and say, Actually,

494
00:21:48,040 --> 00:21:49,880
Speaker 6: it wasn't the presence, it wasn't how big a deal

495
00:21:49,960 --> 00:21:53,119
Speaker 6: it was. It was just actually having fun together and

496
00:21:53,160 --> 00:21:55,000
Speaker 6: it being about that, and fun and play is one

497
00:21:55,000 --> 00:21:57,000
Speaker 6: of the best ways we can actually connect and build

498
00:21:57,040 --> 00:21:59,080
Speaker 6: bonds with our kids, and I think if we can

499
00:21:59,119 --> 00:22:02,359
Speaker 6: try and make that goal not comparing your presence to

500
00:22:02,400 --> 00:22:05,320
Speaker 6: the other kids. You know how big a day it was,

501
00:22:05,480 --> 00:22:08,320
Speaker 6: how amazing we all set up and spread was, But

502
00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:10,560
Speaker 6: actually it was just a moment where we had some

503
00:22:10,600 --> 00:22:13,760
Speaker 6: protected space and time to just have fun together. That's

504
00:22:14,040 --> 00:22:15,560
Speaker 6: one of the best things you can do for your kids'

505
00:22:15,560 --> 00:22:17,679
Speaker 6: mental health and the relationship that you have with them now.

506
00:22:17,720 --> 00:22:19,600
Speaker 5: And I think it lets mums off the hook to

507
00:22:19,720 --> 00:22:22,320
Speaker 5: well not only mums but dads. It's like to make

508
00:22:22,400 --> 00:22:25,240
Speaker 5: this less about you proving that you've got the best

509
00:22:25,280 --> 00:22:28,000
Speaker 5: lunch on the table and just sit on the couch.

510
00:22:28,200 --> 00:22:32,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, totally, Billy. We know how busy you are. Thank

511
00:22:32,200 --> 00:22:33,640
Speaker 2: you so much. If we don't get.

512
00:22:39,080 --> 00:22:43,159
Speaker 5: Because I'm a mum, and I also know I have

513
00:22:43,320 --> 00:22:47,399
Speaker 5: the inability to stop and sit because there's always something

514
00:22:47,440 --> 00:22:47,919
Speaker 5: to do.

515
00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:53,400
Speaker 6: Because I see it in clinic and all these but

516
00:22:53,560 --> 00:22:57,639
Speaker 6: mums say it's dad's job to have fun with him.

517
00:22:59,040 --> 00:23:01,040
Speaker 3: That it's Billy.

518
00:23:01,119 --> 00:23:04,119
Speaker 2: If we don't see you before Christmas, have a lovely Christmas, Madu.

519
00:23:04,160 --> 00:23:05,480
Speaker 3: Yeah you very much for coming in.

520
00:23:05,520 --> 00:23:07,520
Speaker 6: You two everyone, You're amazing. Thanks for helping me out.

521
00:23:08,359 --> 00:23:08,520
Speaker 3: Now.

522
00:23:08,680 --> 00:23:11,000
Speaker 4: If It's in Whipper with Kate Ritchie is a Nova

523
00:23:11,040 --> 00:23:14,359
Speaker 4: podcast to walk great shows like this. Download the Nova

524
00:23:14,359 --> 00:23:17,000
Speaker 4: Player via the app store or Google playing the