Speaker 1: Trigger on ing. Some listeners may find this podcast distressing.
Speaker 1: This is a real story about a real person that
Speaker 1: is still unfolding in real time, and any leads or
Speaker 1: information from anybody out there may help the family either
Speaker 1: find the answers or the closure they're desperately searching for.
Speaker 1: Welcome back to the disappearance of Katie Walker. As I
Speaker 1: say at the start of every episode, this is a
Speaker 1: podcast series I wish I wasn't making, but it is
Speaker 1: already proving vital with leading to new information which I
Speaker 1: will touch upon today. But before that, I just want
Speaker 1: to say thank you to you all who have got
Speaker 1: behind this content and have helped getting it out there.
Speaker 1: Over the weekend, the mainstream media have now started reporting
Speaker 1: on Katie, which her family are so very grateful for,
Speaker 1: So thank you from me and also on behalf of them. Also,
Speaker 1: before I get into today's topic, another know on the
Speaker 1: Dubai incident I discussed in the last episode. At this
Speaker 1: point in time, as far as I'm aware, the police
Speaker 1: are still yet to look into that person, despite Katie's
Speaker 1: family tracking down the exact hotel that incident occurred and
Speaker 1: telling them, and I have since been told that when
Speaker 1: that incident did occur earlier this year, in early February,
Speaker 1: and Katie did wake up to those men entering her
Speaker 1: hotel suite. Katie's friend tells me that she did scream loudly,
Speaker 1: and I'm just showing that because some of you had
Speaker 1: questioned how she reacted and implied there was maybe something
Speaker 1: a bit suspicious about that. But no, like Katie woke up,
Speaker 1: men were in her room and she screamed, that's the
Speaker 1: reality of that situation. And then, as I discussed in
Speaker 1: the last episode, she didn't go to the police. The
Speaker 1: hotel apologized and I believe they gave her a complimentary
Speaker 1: stay in exchange for not making a bigger deal of
Speaker 1: the fact they'd given someone a key card to her
Speaker 1: room for today's episode, though a lot of you I've
Speaker 1: also asked if Katie was seeing anybody in Sydney or dating,
Speaker 1: and this is a topic I was uneasy about sharing
Speaker 1: on here initially, as I know how easy it is
Speaker 1: for people to judge and make assumptions, especially when talking
Speaker 1: about a woman. But for the sake of transparency and
Speaker 1: hopefully this also leading to more information, the answer to
Speaker 1: that question is yes and no. And since returning to
Speaker 1: Sydney in February. Katie had been putting herself out there
Speaker 1: in the local community and making friends and chatting to people.
Speaker 1: And you know, she would wake up and stroll from
Speaker 1: her unit in Darling Point down to the White Rabbit
Speaker 1: Cafe for a coffee in the morning, and she'd stop
Speaker 1: in Bills for lunch on occasion, and sometimes even evening
Speaker 1: she might stop by the Royal Oak Hotel in Double
Speaker 1: Bay for a drink. And during her visits there to
Speaker 1: the Royal Oak, Katie got to know some of the
Speaker 1: other regulars, including two men. Now for background context, before
Speaker 1: I get to those two men and one of those
Speaker 1: men in particular, I just want to recap what I've
Speaker 1: previously said, and that's how since returning to Sydney, Katie
Speaker 1: was in the process of relaunching her jewelry brand and
Speaker 1: figuring out her work situation and income. And yes, she
Speaker 1: was low on money with that running out quite quickly,
Speaker 1: and her father in the UK was helping her in
Speaker 1: the meantime. He paid for the short term lease on
Speaker 1: the unit she was staying in Dialing Point. And remember,
Speaker 1: as I also mentioned in her previous podcast, at this time,
Speaker 1: Katie was arranging the sale of some of her jewelry
Speaker 1: and crystal she'd left behind in America, with the last
Speaker 1: communication she actually had with two of her best friends
Speaker 1: there being you know, confirming which bank account Katie wanted
Speaker 1: them to send, which was around ten thousand Australian dollars,
Speaker 1: which you know, of course, would really help Katie that
Speaker 1: time get back on her feet. And during this time,
Speaker 1: while sharing her story and what was going on to
Speaker 1: some of the people she got chatting to in the
Speaker 1: Royal Oak, one of those men bat the sounds of
Speaker 1: it and what I'm told sensed Katie's I don't want
Speaker 1: to say desperation, because she wasn't desperate for money, because
Speaker 1: money was coming and she was making steps to make
Speaker 1: more money. But perhaps he sends how Katie was currently
Speaker 1: at a crossroads, maybe that's the better way to say it,
Speaker 1: and she was vulnerable and he offered her his nearby
Speaker 1: place to stay for free for a while, you know,
Speaker 1: to take off the pressure of rent at that time,
Speaker 1: and you know where she was staying and having to
Speaker 1: rely on her father. And this man, as far as
Speaker 1: I'm told, he doesn't live in Sydney, but he has
Speaker 1: a place in Sydney for when he's in town on business.
Speaker 1: And when he's in town, apparently he goes to that
Speaker 1: pub often, which is where Casey met him. And you
Speaker 1: know that place he has in Sydney, yarby to the
Speaker 1: problem I met is often empty for weeks on end,
Speaker 1: by the sounds of it on what I'm told, and
Speaker 1: you know, Katie was like, wow, what a great opportunity show.
Speaker 1: And then once Katie moved her stuff in, it wasn't
Speaker 1: the good deed that she thought it was.
Speaker 2: And then the last connection she had she she she
Speaker 2: stayed at some guy's place and she said that, you know,
Speaker 2: he's gentleman. She told me about this this place that
Speaker 2: she said, Oh my god, Elizabeth, you should see this house.
Speaker 3: It's it's freaking amazing.
Speaker 2: You know, it's like a palace, right, And so the guy,
Speaker 2: you know, of course, just wants to get in her pants.
Speaker 2: So he told her that, you know, you can stay
Speaker 2: here for as long as you want, you know, And
Speaker 2: next thing, you know, after like a couple of days,
Speaker 2: he's telling her that she's got to leave because her
Speaker 2: kids are come His kids are coming over.
Speaker 1: According to Katie's friends, Elizabeth there, who I've spoken to
Speaker 1: many times. Katie was then kicked out of that place
Speaker 1: after a few days, and the nice gesture from that
Speaker 1: recent stranger, sadly wasn't all that it seemed. And I
Speaker 1: am told that that man was questioned by the police
Speaker 1: at the start of their short lived investigation when they
Speaker 1: went to the pub, and he denied having any kind
Speaker 1: of relationship with Katie and that was it. And I'm
Speaker 1: also told there was another man who Katie was seen
Speaker 1: chatting too often in the Royal Oak. He was also
Speaker 1: questioned and he also denied having any kind of relationship
Speaker 1: with Katie. So for those who have asked, you know
Speaker 1: what she's seeing someone, was she dating? When I said
Speaker 1: yes and no, it's kind of because, well people maybe
Speaker 1: assumed yes because you know, she's seen chatting with two
Speaker 1: different blokes and she briefly was moving into one of
Speaker 1: their places, but then no, because they've both denied they
Speaker 1: were dating. Again, it's quite confusing, and Katie hadn't told
Speaker 1: her friends or family you know that I I'm seeing
Speaker 1: someone have met someone, So again, I don't believe there
Speaker 1: was a romantic thing, but perhaps that first man, you know,
Speaker 1: by the sounds of it, he wanted you can imagine
Speaker 1: when she moved into his place, and then by the
Speaker 1: sounds of it, if she wasn't willing to give him that,
Speaker 1: that's likely why he was then like, oh see you
Speaker 1: like my kids are coming to town. They need this apartment.
Speaker 1: And since I started this podcast series and there was
Speaker 1: the first mention of Dubai in particular, which is a
Speaker 1: well known place where sex workers do visit, I have
Speaker 1: seen just a couple of comments online from people making
Speaker 1: assumptions on Katie and suggesting, not suggesting, but asking like, hey,
Speaker 1: is she involved in that industry? But I will answer
Speaker 1: that here and I will say no, as far as
Speaker 1: I'm told by everybody who knows Katie, that is not
Speaker 1: true in any way, And even all of my research
Speaker 1: which I've done has also shown me again that that
Speaker 1: is just not true. And I think that assumption maybe
Speaker 1: comes from some of the confusion around like what Katie
Speaker 1: did for work as a jewelry designer, because there is
Speaker 1: a noticeable lack of like an online presence for her brand,
Speaker 1: Dream of Maya.
Speaker 2: She makes these very unique, beautiful gold jewelry and high
Speaker 2: end and.
Speaker 1: As far as I can tell, again by speaking to
Speaker 1: those who know Katie, it isn't big online because her brand,
Speaker 1: you know, which she spent years working on in America
Speaker 1: while married over there to her second husband, it was
Speaker 1: a small thing. It was handmade, luxury, one off custom
Speaker 1: pieces that she sewed directly to like local stores or
Speaker 1: jewelry boutiques. And it's not something that was like mass
Speaker 1: made or mass marketed, you know, whilet spamming it all
Speaker 1: over social media like we may do if we start
Speaker 1: any new small business, we want as many eyes on
Speaker 1: it as possible. But by the sounds of it, Katie's
Speaker 1: business that she was doing was the opposite of that.
Speaker 1: It was more through the people in the community. She
Speaker 1: was living in local shops, as I said, she was
Speaker 1: making and supplying to them. And it is also worth
Speaker 1: pointing out here that Katie's second husband, who she married
Speaker 1: in America and then was living with for several years,
Speaker 1: he is a wealthy man and he owns like a
Speaker 1: large healing retreat, which Katie, who is very spiritual and
Speaker 1: into all of the wellness thing, was kind of part
Speaker 1: of and living out with him while you know, doing
Speaker 1: her jewelry on the side. And then when that marriage
Speaker 1: ended in mid twenty twenty five, I believe Katie was
Speaker 1: then left with a bit of a settlement from the divorce,
Speaker 1: but that money unfortunately didn't last long.
Speaker 3: She made some bad choices, you know, after her divorce.
Speaker 1: But like, in what sense is that?
Speaker 3: Like men, you.
Speaker 2: Know, guys borrowing money to large sums of money to
Speaker 2: people that you hardly know and you have a relationship
Speaker 2: with them. This this dude in Texas who she lent
Speaker 2: one hundred thousand dollars that she really needed money, and
Speaker 2: she'd been bugging this guy and you know, but he
Speaker 2: she was just like, I know, he's got to give
Speaker 2: me my money back, or at least some of my money.
Speaker 3: I need my money.
Speaker 2: And he was just you know, put passing her off
Speaker 2: and like I, you know, I'm waiting until I get
Speaker 2: this you know whatever investments and blah blah blah. So
Speaker 2: he was just traveling all over the world, you know,
Speaker 2: jet setting basically on her money.
Speaker 3: Did show me a picture of him.
Speaker 2: I don't have a picture of him, but of course,
Speaker 2: you know I looked at him and I was like,
Speaker 2: not that.
Speaker 1: So when we talk about the last few months, then
Speaker 1: she's divorced, they've broken up. Yeah, she's owed one hundred
Speaker 1: thousand dollars from this man in Texas. Yeah, there's this
Speaker 1: issue with the guy in Dubai, which is a bit questionable.
Speaker 1: She's come to see her children in it sounds like
Speaker 1: she's running out of money quite quickly.
Speaker 2: She had already Dad was, you know, helping her out,
Speaker 2: you know, the apartment and whatnot.
Speaker 1: I'm not suggesting that that man there who she kind
Speaker 1: of loan money to or invested in whatever his business was,
Speaker 1: is any kind of suspect here. And I again feel
Speaker 1: a little uneasy sharing this stuff, but I do think
Speaker 1: it's important, and that's mostly because it really paints this
Speaker 1: picture of Katie who buy the sounds of it, and like,
Speaker 1: from what I'm understanding of her the more people I
Speaker 1: talked to, she is a woman who just seems far
Speaker 1: too trusting in people and seem to be just perhaps
Speaker 1: seeking solace and connection following her divorce in America and
Speaker 1: maybe seeking someone to help her feel grounded, you know,
Speaker 1: when there was that uncertainty. And yeah, she's then investing
Speaker 1: her time and money, you know in what her friends
Speaker 1: tell me were potentially the wrong people without the best
Speaker 1: intentions for her. And even now, like once she made
Speaker 1: it to Sydney, in February, and you know, Sydney is
Speaker 1: where she wanted to stay, to be around for her children,
Speaker 1: and she again just from hearing that story of the
Speaker 1: man in the pub, was again far too trusting in
Speaker 1: others while at this vulnerable point of her life. This
Speaker 1: is again why I think it's also so important that
Speaker 1: the police really do take their investigations seriously and like
Speaker 1: reopen it or put more effort in, or give it
Speaker 1: more resources, because because at the start, when Katie was
Speaker 1: first reported missing, and you know, they did find those
Speaker 1: men in the pub. But it feels like, again this
Speaker 1: is just what I'm being told from the various people
Speaker 1: I'm speaking to. It feels like the people the police
Speaker 1: spoke to were more questioned about Katie's state of mind
Speaker 1: and mental health as they tried to you know, almost
Speaker 1: back up this working they had of suicide. But now
Speaker 1: just given all the things I've learned, like while speaking
Speaker 1: to the people who knew Katie most, you know, and
Speaker 1: speaking to somebody knew which I'll get to next, I
Speaker 1: and Katie's family were like, we feel the police really
Speaker 1: do need to requestion every single person who Katie knows
Speaker 1: in Sydney and has had any single interaction within Sydney
Speaker 1: since coming back and even before when she previously lived
Speaker 1: in Sydney, and they even need to look beyond Sidney
Speaker 1: to be honest, like who was she talking to and
Speaker 1: interacting with in the last even year of her life,
Speaker 1: because somebody must know something, because as I've said many times,
Speaker 1: everything it just doesn't add up. And yes, someone just
Speaker 1: must know something, as discussed on this podcast series already,
Speaker 1: like the theory that Katie walked into the water unnoticed
Speaker 1: on a Saturday afternoon, it's just virtually impossible, and every
Speaker 1: single person I speak to agrees with that, and you know,
Speaker 1: to me and most people, the reality is Katie ever
Speaker 1: got into a vehicle when she stepped into that CCTV
Speaker 1: dead zone, or she went into one of the handful
Speaker 1: of apartments and houses in that little stretch of street
Speaker 1: where there was no cameras, And to me, it just
Speaker 1: feels unlikely, given the time of day and randomness of
Speaker 1: the street, that she was dragged into a car or
Speaker 1: property against her will, because just statistically, the likelihood of
Speaker 1: someone planning to do that in that location and just
Speaker 1: waiting in broad daylight hoping for what a woman to
Speaker 1: walk past they could grab like and then what you know,
Speaker 1: if that happened and then the woman's screams just didn't
Speaker 1: attract any attention. It just feels just as virtually impossible
Speaker 1: as Katie walking into the water, so so to me,
Speaker 1: and I think most people who are following this, like,
Speaker 1: the most plausible theory seems to be Katie was meeting
Speaker 1: up with somebody that she knew, and that's either she
Speaker 1: met them and got into their car, or she went
Speaker 1: into their home and they live on that street. Since
Speaker 1: my content about Katie has started rolling out, not only
Speaker 1: has it reached like hundreds of thousands of Australians who
Speaker 1: are kind of horrified by this story and also one
Speaker 1: answers and want to help, but it has also reached
Speaker 1: one lovely woman who could not believe what she was
Speaker 1: seeing because at the start of May she happened to
Speaker 1: meet Katie by chance, just while walking in the area
Speaker 1: they both lived. And this woman, you know, she spotted
Speaker 1: Katie walking alone and she said Katie perhaps looked a
Speaker 1: little stressed or like she was going through something, and
Speaker 1: instead of just walking past with her head down, like
Speaker 1: you know, let's be honest, most of us would this
Speaker 1: woman stopped and she approached Katie and she said, hey,
Speaker 1: I'm sorry to interrupt, but are you okay? And this
Speaker 1: woman and Katie then went for a little stroll together
Speaker 1: and they had a coffee, and over the weeks that
Speaker 1: followed they caught up for a coffee and a chat
Speaker 1: many times. And when I spoke to this woman, this
Speaker 1: I must say, absolutely lovely woman who got so upset
Speaker 1: when we were talking about Katie because even though she
Speaker 1: only knew her for what three four weeks, she met
Speaker 1: her at the start of May, and remember Katie went
Speaker 1: missing May twenty third. This woman just felt so strongly
Speaker 1: for Katie. And she told me how Katie had shared
Speaker 1: with her what was troubling her at that time when
Speaker 1: they first met at the start of May, and then
Speaker 1: for the weeks of their friendship, and she said that
Speaker 1: Katie had explained that now she was back here in Australia,
Speaker 1: she never wanted to leave again and she just wanted
Speaker 1: to be around for her two children, who are seventeen
Speaker 1: and nineteen. And Katie told her, you know, while reflecting
Speaker 1: over the last few years, as we all often do
Speaker 1: when we've reached like big crossroads in our lives, Katie
Speaker 1: was saying how she wishes she could go back in
Speaker 1: time and be around more and be, you know, a
Speaker 1: mom at home cooking than there is her kids came
Speaker 1: home from school. And I won't go into the specifics
Speaker 1: of why Katie didn't have custody of her children and
Speaker 1: she lived overseas, because I think that's a little too personally.
Speaker 1: You know, these things are sensitive. But over the last
Speaker 1: few years, everyone I'm speaking to us told me how
Speaker 1: Katie visited Australia often to see her children, and she
Speaker 1: on occasion would fly them to America, or she met
Speaker 1: her daughter in Dubai for like holidays, and she would
Speaker 1: send them money. And then you know, since returning to Sydney,
Speaker 1: according to this lovely woman, Katie realized that, you know,
Speaker 1: despite all of those things, the one thing she wished
Speaker 1: she gave her children more of was time. And again,
Speaker 1: I please, that's that you don't make judgments here on Katie,
Speaker 1: because these things are complex and layered, and life is
Speaker 1: complex and layered. But one thing to know that I've
Speaker 1: learned again through everyone I've spoken to, is just that
Speaker 1: Katie loved her children more than anything in the world.
Speaker 1: And as I was saying now she was back, she
Speaker 1: was adamant she wasn't ever leaving again. But away from that,
Speaker 1: and the thing Katie was stressing about when she met
Speaker 1: this lovely woman was it wasn't the money thing, because
Speaker 1: that was kind of being resolved and there was solutions
Speaker 1: there and money was coming. But it was the fact
Speaker 1: that her visa for Australia was about to expire, I
Speaker 1: believe towards the end of May. And Katie told this
Speaker 1: woman at the start of May when they first met,
Speaker 1: that she didn't have long left until it did expire,
Speaker 1: and she must leave Australia before that happened, so she
Speaker 1: can then apply for another visa while out of the country,
Speaker 1: so she can return through the proper channels and do
Speaker 1: it all like officially, because Katie said, if she didn't
Speaker 1: do that, which this is true, if she overstayed in
Speaker 1: Australia by even one day like that would impact her
Speaker 1: ability to then get a new visa and renew a visa,
Speaker 1: and it could essentially lead to her not being able
Speaker 1: to return to Australia for years. Like that's the reality
Speaker 1: of these visa situations. And you know, this woman, this
Speaker 1: lovely woman tells me. How then on May nineteen, after
Speaker 1: Katie's father in the UK had transferred Katie a bit
Speaker 1: of money into one of her friend's Australian bank accounts,
Speaker 1: they then withdrew that cash and give it to Katie.
Speaker 1: And then Katie and this woman, while you know, speaking
Speaker 1: while having their regular coffee and planning how she can
Speaker 1: fix the visa thing, they together they phoned up the
Speaker 1: flight center and they asked, is it possible for Katie
Speaker 1: to go in store and book a flight to the
Speaker 1: UK in cash? Because you know, at that point, as
Speaker 1: I just said, cash was all Katie had. And the
Speaker 1: flight center said over the phone to Katie and this
Speaker 1: woman that yes, you know, that's fine, you can book
Speaker 1: a flight in cash, paying cash. And then as that
Speaker 1: phone call ended, Katie told her friend like, great, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna go do that probably tomorrow and I will book
Speaker 1: that flight. And this was May nineteenth when she said that.
Speaker 1: This was May nineteenth when they phoned the flight center.
Speaker 1: This was May nineteenth when Katie said tomorrow or you know,
Speaker 1: the day after, she will go and pay for that flight.
Speaker 1: And you know, May nineteenth, that's four days before Katie
Speaker 1: was then last scene and Katie's plan, which she told
Speaker 1: her friend when she realized yes she could book that
Speaker 1: flight in cash, was to fly back to the UK asap,
Speaker 1: essentially on the next fly over the next few days,
Speaker 1: and stay with her father while reapplying for her Australian visa,
Speaker 1: and then the day that visa comes through, like they
Speaker 1: don't take long for British citizens overseas, she would then
Speaker 1: return to Australia to be back here for her kids
Speaker 1: on a more permanent basis, and like continue building the
Speaker 1: life she'd kind of slowly started to do of those
Speaker 1: last couple of months. And that friend of Katie's, after
Speaker 1: that day where they made that phone call and Katie said, hey,
Speaker 1: tomorrow or the day after, I'm going to go book
Speaker 1: that flight, that friend never saw Katie again. And then
Speaker 1: when that friends calls our messages didn't go through to Katie,
Speaker 1: that friend assumed that Katie had just jumped on the
Speaker 1: next available flight back to the UK, you know, so
Speaker 1: she could sort her visa issues, because the last time
Speaker 1: they spoke, that was Katie's plan, and that's what she
Speaker 1: was ect I did to do because it felt like
Speaker 1: she finally had a solution which would help you know,
Speaker 1: the thing that was stressing her out, the visa thing.
Speaker 1: There was a plan there, you know, there was money
Speaker 1: coming in and then much of this friend's horror when
Speaker 1: she saw my content she realized that, you know, sadly
Speaker 1: Katie didn't get on any flight. This new information from
Speaker 1: that lovely lady who I spoke to, that I then
Speaker 1: shared with Katie's family hasn't just brought them like comfort
Speaker 1: knowing that she made such a good friend, such a
Speaker 1: kind friend during those final weeks. But to Katie's family
Speaker 1: and her friends in America, who I've also shared that
Speaker 1: information with like it's also made them even more certain
Speaker 1: that Katie just did not take her own life. Because again,
Speaker 1: on the day she went missing, not only did Katie
Speaker 1: have money finally coming in from America, as I keep saying,
Speaker 1: money that she needed and that she was using to
Speaker 1: build the new life she wanted and was going to
Speaker 1: be such a relief, but she also then had the
Speaker 1: plan how to overcome the visa issues to come back
Speaker 1: to Sydney, which she was desperate to do so she
Speaker 1: could be around for her children more than ever, the
Speaker 1: children she loved more than anything. And on that again,
Speaker 1: as I've said, many times, despite the police's theory of suicide.
Speaker 1: At present, at the time of me recording this, there
Speaker 1: is no physical proof that Katie took her own life
Speaker 1: or is even deceased for that matter. And Katie's family
Speaker 1: in the UK, who I speak to daily and are
Speaker 1: the police's points of contact in their investigation. They're also
Speaker 1: assisting me with this podcast and the content, and they're
Speaker 1: grateful for the public support. And you know, we believe
Speaker 1: sharing this part of the story could hopefully lead to
Speaker 1: more information because anyone listening who is familiar with those
Speaker 1: venues in Door Bay or the Royal Pub, or maybe
Speaker 1: you've got friends who visit them often, like, please ask
Speaker 1: about Katie. Look at her picture again, because maybe you
Speaker 1: or they remember seeing her, or remember something which you
Speaker 1: may think is nothing, but honestly, it could be a
Speaker 1: huge help and help us continue in just putting the
Speaker 1: pieces together of what happened to Katie in those final
Speaker 1: days and hopefully figure out where she is now. And
Speaker 1: as I've said before and I'll say again now to
Speaker 1: end this, someone out there must know something