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Speaker 1: This wasn't the conversation I thought we were going to have,

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Speaker 1: But now I'm just so invested in the lost story.

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Speaker 2: He said, I have a question to ask you, and

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Speaker 2: I went, okay, sure, and he was like, and you

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Speaker 2: can feel free to say no. Would you allow me

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Speaker 2: to kiss you for maybe three seconds? And if you

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Speaker 2: don't like it, you can stop.

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Speaker 3: It was so cute.

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Speaker 1: Each one of us was affected in our own way

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Speaker 1: from the restrictions around the pandemic, the COVID nineteen pandemic.

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Speaker 1: All of us have a story. It was really tough.

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Speaker 1: My guest today Linda Mariano. For her, it meant being

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Speaker 1: stuck in Australia, away from the man that she fell

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Speaker 1: in love with overseas, and not knowing if they would

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Speaker 1: ever see each other again, if that ever make it

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Speaker 1: as a couple. At the same time grappling not only

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Speaker 1: with her own journey of fertility, but working on a

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Speaker 1: lifelong tendency to be a people pleaser. Quite complicated. So,

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Speaker 1: while I'd like to say this conversation is about boundaries

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Speaker 1: and the pressures of holding on to a hard one

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Speaker 1: career as a broadcaster an international detail while navigating that

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Speaker 1: fertility and that relationship. It is. It's those things. This

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Speaker 1: is also one of the most wonderful love stories I

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Speaker 1: have heard in a long long time, and I'd like

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Speaker 1: to think I know a thing or two about love stories.

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Speaker 1: It's magnificent. Before we get there, got to pay some bills,

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Speaker 1: got to play some ads back after the break. This

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Speaker 1: is better than yesterday, helping you make it today better

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Speaker 1: than yesterday's twenty thirteen. My name is Osha Ginsburg. Thanks

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Speaker 1: for being a part of the show. I'm a podcast

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Speaker 1: best selling author. I'm a husband, I'm a dad, I'm

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Speaker 1: a step down. I'm a man who was singing along

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Speaker 1: to She Had while he rode his motorcycle over the

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Speaker 1: Sydney Harbor Bridge earlier the day. So yeah, right, I

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Speaker 1: don't in our helmet, so you don't know it was

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Speaker 1: really good. I'm also a person that likes to sing,

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Speaker 1: n rate nearly everything I do, to the point where

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Speaker 1: now even our youngest kid, Wolfgang, is like dud and

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Speaker 1: much like the demagogue in Stranger Things. When the kids,

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Speaker 1: even my wife go ah, they grow like a comere

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Speaker 1: like I feed on that. It's delicious. Thanks so much

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Speaker 1: for being here. We have a mailing list. Osha ginsburg

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Speaker 1: dot comms where it is. That's where you can get

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Speaker 1: in touch with me. Just hear reply to that. There's

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Speaker 1: also all the previous episodes we've ever made. It's nearly

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Speaker 1: a thousand, my goodness. Yeah, we've been at this for

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Speaker 1: a while. Linda Mariano's here. She's got a book. It's

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Speaker 1: called Love Language. She also has an award winning documentary

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Speaker 1: podcast called Tough Love. You get it Where you got

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Speaker 1: this podcast? You know Linda if you're in Australia. For years,

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Speaker 1: she brought us the newest music and kept us company

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Speaker 1: every night on Triple J as the host of Good

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Speaker 1: Nights with Linda Mariano. It's pretty lucky that she had

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Speaker 1: that surname and that first name when they named the show.

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Speaker 2: Now.

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Speaker 1: I was going to talk to her about music, about

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Speaker 1: the industry, about djaying, touring Europe as a DJ, how

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Speaker 1: that has changed across the course of her career. I

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Speaker 1: got that, But I also got a retelling of a

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Speaker 1: love story that gave me, at times goosebumps and moved

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Speaker 1: me to tears. It's just wonderful. I hope you enjoy

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Speaker 1: this and you feel a glow as much as I

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Speaker 1: did enjoy sitting down with Linda Mariano. How are you.

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Speaker 3: I'm doing good.

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Speaker 2: I'm I'm back in Australia for a few weeks and

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Speaker 2: it'll be it's a special time to see my family

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Speaker 2: because it'll probably be the last time that I'm in

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Speaker 2: Australia for a little while because I'm pregnant.

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Speaker 3: What so, yeah, situations, thank you, thank you.

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Speaker 2: Like it's not necessarily a ridiculously long journey, but you know,

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Speaker 2: it took me a really long time to finally reunite

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Speaker 2: with Magnus, my partner, and then moved to la and

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Speaker 2: do these things that we literally had been talking about.

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Speaker 3: Years ago, right years and years.

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Speaker 2: Ago, going oh my god, I can't wait till we

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Speaker 2: finally lived together and you know, we can start a family.

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Speaker 2: And that was back in twenty nineteen, like pre pandemic.

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Speaker 2: And then it's just taken that much longer.

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Speaker 1: And I can say this is someone who was involved

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Speaker 1: in the conception of a child when I was forty six.

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Speaker 1: I'm doing some sums on how old I'm pretty sure

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Speaker 1: you are. Five years is that's a lot at this

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Speaker 1: time of the woman's life.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, when I had originally planned to move to La,

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Speaker 2: I was about to be I think mid thirties and going, Okay,

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Speaker 2: we're not going to be long distance relationship ship anymore.

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Speaker 3: We're going to be living together, house together. Let's do it.

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Speaker 2: Let's live our life and start a family.

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Speaker 3: Let's go yeah, let's get it done.

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Speaker 2: And then, because I've been stuck here during the pandemic,

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Speaker 2: I just saw time ticking away, and yeah, as you said,

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Speaker 2: as a as a woman, it's one of those things

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Speaker 2: that almost it feels like a fucking look can I swear?

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Speaker 1: I thought I spread all the time.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I felt like a fucking looming deadline. And I

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Speaker 2: said to Magnus, I don't think that you understand how

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Speaker 2: it feels to be a woman and feel like you've

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Speaker 2: got this looming deadline that everybody else is like crossing

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Speaker 2: this line of And You're like.

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Speaker 3: Fuck, I've I've got to confront this and some if

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Speaker 3: I want it to happen.

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Speaker 1: Through your twenties, you know what your career is doing,

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Speaker 1: what you're working towards, what your north star is. Where

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Speaker 1: why conception family?

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Speaker 2: It was something I felt I never had to worry

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Speaker 2: or think about. It was I remember even turning thirty

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Speaker 2: and going, nah, not ready no, im not ready yet

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Speaker 2: and we still doing my career.

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Speaker 1: And what was not ready? What was like these things

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Speaker 1: have to be in a row, all these conditions have

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Speaker 1: to be met before I say yes.

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Speaker 2: I think it was. I think the surface level was

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Speaker 2: very much that don't have enough money, don't have the

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Speaker 2: houseport yet, don't have these things ticked off. And now

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Speaker 2: I know, Fuck, You're never going to be ready. You

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Speaker 2: just got to make a choice and love that choice

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Speaker 2: and do it. Now looking back on it, literally ten

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Speaker 2: years later, like I'll be almost forty by the time

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Speaker 2: I give birth, I can admit to myself that I

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Speaker 2: emotionally just wasn't ready. And I think the relationship I

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Speaker 2: was I was in, I couldn't admit to myself that

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Speaker 2: wasn't the one that I wanted to commit to. There

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Speaker 2: was there was a thing in me that was stopping

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Speaker 2: me from being truthful about that, and so I put

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Speaker 2: up the barriers of I just don't earn enough money.

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Speaker 2: I'm really enjoying the primetime show that I'm doing on radio.

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Speaker 2: I don't want to give up my weekends. I still

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Speaker 2: want to be djaying.

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Speaker 4: You know, it was all that stuff, and now you know,

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Speaker 4: when you look at and A Luno pregnant with her

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Speaker 4: second child at Coachella.

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Speaker 1: How does that argument sound to you?

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Speaker 3: I know, I mean it's bullshit, isn't it.

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Speaker 2: It's and you know, she was such a good friend,

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Speaker 2: and I just went, my god, you know, if you

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Speaker 2: want to do it, you you can do it if

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Speaker 2: you're with the person that you want to do it with,

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Speaker 2: if you want to give it a go. And it

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Speaker 2: was funny. I didn't feel that urge until I was

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Speaker 2: with Magnus and we could look at each other and

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Speaker 2: the eyes and go, wouldn't that be so exciting? It

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Speaker 2: wasn't a oh, let's stick the box of that.

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Speaker 3: It was a imagine if we could do that, how

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Speaker 3: cool would that be?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, which was such a different feeling, which I imagine that

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Speaker 2: you could felt as.

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Speaker 1: Well, Oh yeah, isn't wild that when we're kids, it's

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Speaker 1: fared into us. If you take your pants off in

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Speaker 1: the same room as somebody burn pregnant, lifeliver, I'll.

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Speaker 3: Be knocked up. That's it, it's going to happen.

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Speaker 2: And then you get to actually trying to conceive sometimes

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Speaker 2: and you're like, what the fuck? I was told this

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Speaker 2: was going to happen if I literally sneezed on my

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Speaker 2: boyfriend and he sneezed on me, and now.

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Speaker 3: I'm like checking ovulation. I know all the stats.

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Speaker 2: I'm trying to ignore them because they're going to psych

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Speaker 2: me out. I really don't want to be psyched out.

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Speaker 2: I've got to just relax. I just got to not stress.

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Speaker 1: Mate. Trying to on the other side of the equation,

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Speaker 1: because on the I can speak from my own personal experience.

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Speaker 1: On the male side of the equation, yes, women need

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Speaker 1: to have a certain emotional connection for the conception to happen.

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Speaker 1: Yet there are oh shall we say, products one can

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Speaker 1: buy over the counter of the chemist that can allow

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Speaker 1: the physicality of it to occur. With men, you actually

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Speaker 1: have to not be stressed. You actually have to be

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Speaker 1: in the moment, and when the tap on the shoulder comes,

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Speaker 1: they're like, oh man, I don't know, like something gets

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Speaker 1: in your brain and're like, sorry, you miss this one.

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Speaker 3: Oh my god, I know I was like that tap

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Speaker 3: on the shoulder.

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Speaker 2: I really feel for Magnus and other men that are

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Speaker 2: in that situation because I know what it's like as

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Speaker 2: the girlfriend or the want to be mum in that

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Speaker 2: situation where I'm going.

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Speaker 3: It's time. How do you feel.

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Speaker 2: If you know it's it's now all next month and

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Speaker 2: I'm just trying to be really gentle about it and

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Speaker 2: kill you if you don't just do your one job.

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Speaker 1: I had a mate, you know, I mean, you know,

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Speaker 1: people go through it. It was him and his wife.

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Speaker 1: They made a rule, never in the bed.

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Speaker 3: Oh and have they got kids?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, they ended up they ended up conceiving. But that

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Speaker 1: was part of the way that they got around that

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Speaker 1: they introduced the novelty is like never in the bed. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you know, it made it going to dinner at their

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Speaker 1: places different sensation, Like.

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Speaker 2: Okay, some of those countertops down the table right here,

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Speaker 2: we'll just accept that.

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Speaker 1: That's what's You are very clean people, no doubt during

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Speaker 1: conception time, during the tap on the shoulder, okay, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: during that moment. Yeah, it's hard, so hard though.

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Speaker 3: Did you take time? Oh yeah, bit of time on

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Speaker 3: Oh absolutely.

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Speaker 1: I would thoroughly recommend if you and I planned a

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Speaker 1: shit out of it, and I made sure. I was

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Speaker 1: very lucky to have a very empathetic production company that

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Speaker 1: I was working for at the time, and the head

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Speaker 1: of the production company basically just said to me, he said,

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Speaker 1: it's the best day of your life. I'm not going

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Speaker 1: to let you miss it's to be there. You have

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Speaker 1: to be there, and I will do whatever it takes

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Speaker 1: to get you there. And there's some pretty interesting stories

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Speaker 1: about so there's a couple of false alarms, so there's

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Speaker 1: a couple of interesting TV stories about that. But I

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Speaker 1: took essentially the first month I took four weeks, maybe

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Speaker 1: five was when I first started taking, but only a

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Speaker 1: little podcast here and there. And that's so vitally important.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that's how I feel, too, so important.

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Speaker 2: I find it really daunting as a now freelance person

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Speaker 2: because I did work within the company for so many years,

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Speaker 2: and I saw that.

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Speaker 1: Would have great Matt leave.

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Speaker 3: The comfortability of Matt Leve.

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Speaker 2: You know, I left before I got my long service leave,

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Speaker 2: like all of those things, and I just went, fuck,

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Speaker 2: you know, those sort of safety nets, that sort of security.

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Speaker 1: I saw, I'm go to America where it's like one

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Speaker 1: hundred and sixteen thousand dollars, Oh.

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Speaker 3: My god, the health insurance everything.

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Speaker 2: I'm very you know, thankful to have a partner that

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Speaker 2: very much helps me out in that zone.

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Speaker 3: But the confronting feeling of being so grateful to.

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Speaker 2: Being this position. Oh my god, we got pregnant. I'm

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Speaker 2: so happy to be doing this with you. I'm so

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Speaker 2: excited about this next step in my life. I can't

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Speaker 2: wait to progress into whatever this next era of me

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Speaker 2: is going to be, and also going, what the fuck

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Speaker 2: am I about to lose?

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Speaker 1: You know, potentially? What am I?

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Speaker 3: What am I?

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Speaker 2: I can't ignore the fact that I reckon all, grieve

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Speaker 2: or feel confronted by now I have to step back

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Speaker 2: from this, and I can't multitask this, and I can't

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Speaker 2: say yes to all these things, which I think I'll

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Speaker 2: be very grateful and happy to say no to, because

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Speaker 2: there'll be this thing that I care about more than

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Speaker 2: fucking anything in the world, undoubtedly, but it is daunting

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Speaker 2: to think about can I get back on the tool?

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Speaker 2: When can I get back on those tools again?

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Speaker 1: Well, I have no doubt that the things that got

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Speaker 1: you because similarly, there's only so many jobs to host

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Speaker 1: the night show on Triple J. In fact, there's one,

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Speaker 1: and to say there's competition for that gig is an understatement.

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Speaker 1: And the kind of person that you are, the kind

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Speaker 1: of person you have to be to do that, that's

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Speaker 1: still who you are. Don't worry, like all the things,

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Speaker 1: all the things that got you your career, all the

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Speaker 1: things that got you to a point of like, yes,

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Speaker 1: I'm going to go on to Europe as a DJ.

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Speaker 1: This is what's going to happen now and doing it,

253
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Speaker 1: all that stuff will stay. You don't lose it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you know, Yeah, very true. And yes there is never

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Speaker 1: ending laundry and yes it is. Yes, but I'll tell you,

256
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Speaker 1: I'll tell you. Maybe this will talk to you about

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Speaker 1: what I'm trying to say. I had lived in America

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Speaker 1: for ten years and I met Audrey in June of

259
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Speaker 1: twenty fourteen. I had by that point hosted I'm still

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Speaker 1: the only Australian I've ever hosted live network prime time

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Speaker 1: across America on CBS seven eight Central. Like it was

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Speaker 1: fucking unbelievable. Like this front of the front of the

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Speaker 1: front of the plane. You know, Taylor's with private jet

264
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Speaker 1: kind of stuff, right. And I was developing, and I

265
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Speaker 1: was taking pitch meetings, and I was this and that

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Speaker 1: the other, and I was hunting, hunting, hunting, hunting, and

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Speaker 1: then I met Audrey and I met Georgia, and I

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Speaker 1: was like, oh, all right, this is it. This is

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Speaker 1: what I want that whatever IDs driving me to stay

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Speaker 1: in America or in this thing that was no longer

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Speaker 1: what it is that I wanted to jump out of

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Speaker 1: bed and push towards. I wanted to like, whatever this

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Speaker 1: life is with these two people is what I want

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Speaker 1: to figure it out and within Kraky, within a year

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Speaker 1: I had moved back, I gave my green card back.

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Speaker 1: I was done. I was out because what I wanted

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Speaker 1: in life changed. Yeah, the priority, Well, absolutely, because you

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Speaker 1: said what am I gonna? What am I giving up?

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Speaker 1: It's the end of pulp fiction. You're not giving something up.

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Speaker 1: You're getting something anything. You're getting the most unbelievable reason

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Speaker 1: to get to work, to get out of bed and

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Speaker 1: get it done, to create. Yeah, because you're a freelancer

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Speaker 1: and you've got to keep a roof over the head.

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Speaker 1: So I got to make this happen.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I've even noticed it, like the same with Magnus

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Speaker 2: where he's we've both been very similar, as you said,

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Speaker 2: where you're just driving and driving.

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Speaker 3: In to create.

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Speaker 2: What's the next thing, what's the next goalpost? If I

290
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Speaker 2: get this, then I'm going to be happy. And if

291
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Speaker 2: I get this next thing that I know it's fucked.

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Speaker 2: It's fucked, and now we're trying to unlearn all of

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Speaker 2: that stuff because it's not it's not real.

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Speaker 1: Tell me about that. Tell me about because I have

295
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Speaker 1: done that too in your experience. Lam, Yeah, what is that? Oh?

296
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Speaker 1: Once I get this, then.

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Speaker 2: I think I very much got rocked out of that

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Speaker 2: through COVID, actually because I wasn't getting the things that

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Speaker 2: I wanted, and I was like, well, I'm not going

300
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Speaker 2: to get that, So I've got to be happy with

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Speaker 2: this day, and I've got to be happy with what

302
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Speaker 2: I can bring to myself in this day so that

303
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Speaker 2: I can enjoy it and be happy in the present.

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Speaker 3: But I think before that, oh, it was very goal oriented.

305
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Speaker 2: It was always like through school, if I can be

306
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Speaker 2: ducks of my primary school, then I'll make my parents happy,

307
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Speaker 2: and then I'm going to be happy because I'm going

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Speaker 2: to be a good girl.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Were you I mean I was a good girl and

311
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Speaker 2: I did do well at school?

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Speaker 1: Were you happy? I was?

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Speaker 3: How about? I was happy because I was making other

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Speaker 3: people happy?

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Speaker 2: Ah, that little that little box how I get into.

316
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Speaker 2: I was happy because I could see I've pleased you.

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Speaker 1: How sustainable is that as a source of happiness? Zero.

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Speaker 3: It's fucked. It means that's how the way.

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Speaker 2: That's the way that I operated throughout all my adult life.

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Speaker 2: Every relationship, going on a date with a guy, Oh,

321
00:17:35,240 --> 00:17:38,239
Speaker 2: you're really impressed or you're you're really happy, and you're

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Speaker 2: attracted to me. Therefore, this is a relationship I want

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Speaker 2: to be in because I'm making you happy, and making

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Speaker 2: you happy makes me happy, and.

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Speaker 3: So it's just a cycle. So I'm not actually.

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Speaker 2: Thinking about what I want or what I need. I'm

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Speaker 2: just thinking about I need to make you happy. And

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Speaker 2: now I've done that.

329
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Speaker 3: So good, it's so bad.

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Speaker 1: You've been quite open about you're in quite a long

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Speaker 1: term relationship. If it was eight or nine years?

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Speaker 3: Yeah it was. I think it was nine and a half.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, right, yeah, what was the time immediately after that,

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Speaker 1: like I mean nine years, like nine and a half.

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Speaker 1: There's grief there is There is grief for what it

336
00:18:14,840 --> 00:18:18,439
Speaker 1: could have been, what wasn't everything's entangled. There's grief for

337
00:18:20,040 --> 00:18:22,879
Speaker 1: the way that you know, once you pull out and

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Speaker 1: you're on the white angle and you're like, oh man,

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Speaker 1: I can see my part in that. Did you have

340
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Speaker 1: a moment where you're like, well, I don't want to

341
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Speaker 1: do that again, did you have a moment where you went, Okay,

342
00:18:33,840 --> 00:18:35,800
Speaker 1: better have a look at what's going on here?

343
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Speaker 3: What was it like? As soon as I got out,

344
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Speaker 3: I remember feeling.

345
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Speaker 2: So much guilt, so much guilt that I had pushed

346
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Speaker 2: away something that was not bad. Where it was I

347
00:18:53,080 --> 00:18:57,159
Speaker 2: was with a good person, a nice person, a loyal person,

348
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Speaker 2: a person that would be a great father. I felt

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Speaker 2: a lot of guilt around that, not only to him,

350
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Speaker 2: and because of how much he'd invested in me and

351
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Speaker 2: how much I knew that he loved me. I felt

352
00:19:10,520 --> 00:19:14,760
Speaker 2: a lot of guilt towards my family and that I

353
00:19:14,840 --> 00:19:19,960
Speaker 2: had something that was so stable that I then pushed

354
00:19:19,960 --> 00:19:20,920
Speaker 2: away like I felt.

355
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Speaker 3: Very much.

356
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Speaker 2: Like I had probably made the wrong decision. And then

357
00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:29,560
Speaker 2: on the flip side of that, I felt so much relief,

358
00:19:30,640 --> 00:19:35,760
Speaker 2: so much relief, and then a tiny seed of pride

359
00:19:36,880 --> 00:19:39,520
Speaker 2: because I think I knew deep down and I know

360
00:19:39,720 --> 00:19:43,159
Speaker 2: now that deep down I had not been happy for

361
00:19:43,200 --> 00:19:47,720
Speaker 2: a long time and I'd finally given in to that feeling.

362
00:19:48,800 --> 00:19:52,960
Speaker 2: But it didn't come without feeling extremely guilty. And then

363
00:19:53,040 --> 00:19:56,800
Speaker 2: after that, I do remember thinking, Okay, the next thing

364
00:19:57,240 --> 00:19:59,720
Speaker 2: that I want to do is, of course I do

365
00:19:59,800 --> 00:20:02,480
Speaker 2: want that's a good person, and that's loyal, and that

366
00:20:02,600 --> 00:20:05,040
Speaker 2: has so many of those qualities that that person had.

367
00:20:05,920 --> 00:20:12,200
Speaker 2: But I can't stay in a relationship for years when

368
00:20:12,200 --> 00:20:15,760
Speaker 2: I don't listen to how I'm feeling about it, and

369
00:20:16,160 --> 00:20:20,040
Speaker 2: when I'm clearly staying in it because I keep thinking

370
00:20:20,119 --> 00:20:24,359
Speaker 2: about how my family would react and how my friends

371
00:20:24,359 --> 00:20:26,280
Speaker 2: would react, because I think that was for me, and

372
00:20:26,320 --> 00:20:28,560
Speaker 2: the lead up to it, there was months on end

373
00:20:28,640 --> 00:20:31,800
Speaker 2: where I was feeling this gut feeling that I didn't

374
00:20:31,840 --> 00:20:34,639
Speaker 2: want to be there, but I was thinking about the

375
00:20:34,680 --> 00:20:37,000
Speaker 2: fact that we were engaged. I was thinking about his

376
00:20:37,400 --> 00:20:40,160
Speaker 2: I remember thinking about his parents so much and how

377
00:20:40,160 --> 00:20:42,280
Speaker 2: good they were to me and my parents, and how

378
00:20:42,359 --> 00:20:44,600
Speaker 2: much they loved him, And it was just all of

379
00:20:44,640 --> 00:20:48,119
Speaker 2: these external people that I was thinking how disappointed they

380
00:20:48,160 --> 00:20:50,880
Speaker 2: would be in me. So I remember thinking, I don't

381
00:20:50,880 --> 00:20:54,760
Speaker 2: want to do that again. So I need to actually

382
00:20:54,800 --> 00:20:57,480
Speaker 2: listen to myself, because there was points in that relationship

383
00:20:57,600 --> 00:21:01,760
Speaker 2: years before where all the the signs were there where

384
00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:04,919
Speaker 2: I was wanting to not be at home, or I

385
00:21:04,960 --> 00:21:06,520
Speaker 2: was wanting to go out, or I was you know

386
00:21:07,680 --> 00:21:10,280
Speaker 2: those classic yeah signs.

387
00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:14,400
Speaker 1: Did you kind of get back to the drawing board

388
00:21:14,400 --> 00:21:16,440
Speaker 1: a bit did you did you work with somebody?

389
00:21:17,119 --> 00:21:17,840
Speaker 3: I did not.

390
00:21:18,280 --> 00:21:21,399
Speaker 2: I didn't do that until after the next relationship. What

391
00:21:21,520 --> 00:21:24,600
Speaker 2: I did after that was the next relationship I went

392
00:21:24,640 --> 00:21:28,399
Speaker 2: into was really problematic on the other side, where I

393
00:21:28,520 --> 00:21:32,680
Speaker 2: was like, I'm going to choose someone really bad that

394
00:21:32,680 --> 00:21:36,160
Speaker 2: that you know that my family wouldn't approve of at all.

395
00:21:37,040 --> 00:21:39,919
Speaker 2: So I just like, yeah, I know.

396
00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:41,880
Speaker 1: I thenk green Day wrote a song called nice Guy's

397
00:21:41,920 --> 00:21:42,480
Speaker 1: Finished Last.

398
00:21:42,600 --> 00:21:44,440
Speaker 3: Yes they did, and I know.

399
00:21:44,440 --> 00:21:46,720
Speaker 1: Because are we talking neck tattoo kind of thing.

400
00:21:47,200 --> 00:21:50,720
Speaker 2: No neck tattoo, but we're talking like I'm a good

401
00:21:50,760 --> 00:21:53,400
Speaker 2: time guy and I want to go out and party,

402
00:21:53,520 --> 00:21:55,760
Speaker 2: and you know, don't really.

403
00:21:55,600 --> 00:21:58,600
Speaker 1: If I don't answer your text, you don't keep texting.

404
00:21:58,520 --> 00:22:03,040
Speaker 2: Exactly like just a bit of a bad boy. And

405
00:22:03,119 --> 00:22:05,959
Speaker 2: I went, fuck, yeah, that's I think that's what I need.

406
00:22:06,080 --> 00:22:08,080
Speaker 2: I don't want to My last one was about me

407
00:22:08,119 --> 00:22:12,080
Speaker 2: pleasing everybody else. This one is just I think that

408
00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:15,119
Speaker 2: I was still just pleasing him, but I was just

409
00:22:15,200 --> 00:22:16,600
Speaker 2: kind of shutting everybody else out.

410
00:22:16,880 --> 00:22:18,200
Speaker 3: So I was like, I'm not gonna listen to anyone

411
00:22:18,200 --> 00:22:20,040
Speaker 3: else's opinion, but I just listened to his.

412
00:22:20,560 --> 00:22:22,680
Speaker 2: So I was still It was actually the same pattern

413
00:22:22,720 --> 00:22:25,280
Speaker 2: again where it was still oh, you approve of me

414
00:22:25,359 --> 00:22:28,280
Speaker 2: and you were attracted to me, so I'll be with you.

415
00:22:28,520 --> 00:22:31,920
Speaker 1: Isn't that interesting how sometimes we can find ourselves with

416
00:22:33,119 --> 00:22:36,120
Speaker 1: we have the same relationship a number of times where

417
00:22:36,200 --> 00:22:39,359
Speaker 1: the common denominator totally there's been different people in ye.

418
00:22:39,480 --> 00:22:42,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I still played the same role in those

419
00:22:42,840 --> 00:22:45,440
Speaker 2: two relationships. But then it was when I finally came

420
00:22:45,480 --> 00:22:49,840
Speaker 2: out of that one, which lasted for about a year,

421
00:22:49,960 --> 00:22:55,800
Speaker 2: I think that ended very badly that I went, Okay,

422
00:22:55,920 --> 00:22:59,320
Speaker 2: this is not what I need and this is not

423
00:22:59,440 --> 00:23:02,480
Speaker 2: bringing out good sides in me. Because it was it

424
00:23:02,560 --> 00:23:07,359
Speaker 2: made me really anxious because I was constantly looking out

425
00:23:07,520 --> 00:23:10,919
Speaker 2: for signs and I was, you know, doing this is

426
00:23:11,000 --> 00:23:13,440
Speaker 2: something I've learned that I was doing in my career.

427
00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:16,240
Speaker 2: I've done it in every aspect of my life. Well,

428
00:23:16,240 --> 00:23:19,520
Speaker 2: I'll walk into a room and wonder how the other

429
00:23:19,560 --> 00:23:24,119
Speaker 2: person's feeling and how I can accommodate it. So you know,

430
00:23:24,600 --> 00:23:28,240
Speaker 2: with that second relationship, it's oh, he's really his moody,

431
00:23:28,320 --> 00:23:30,560
Speaker 2: he can be up and down. Let me just assess

432
00:23:30,600 --> 00:23:33,600
Speaker 2: how he's feeling that day, and then I'll I'll comment.

433
00:23:33,359 --> 00:23:39,199
Speaker 1: Out At what point did you if you did like

434
00:23:39,400 --> 00:23:41,600
Speaker 1: was there a point that came where we went my

435
00:23:41,720 --> 00:23:43,919
Speaker 1: ideas might not be getting me what I want. I

436
00:23:44,000 --> 00:23:45,359
Speaker 1: might need someone else's ideas in this.

437
00:23:46,080 --> 00:23:53,199
Speaker 2: I think when that relationship combusted, I remember talking to

438
00:23:54,880 --> 00:24:00,040
Speaker 2: girlfriends about it and about the relationship beforehand, and I

439
00:24:00,040 --> 00:24:04,440
Speaker 2: remember sitting at a cafe in Paris. I remember sitting

440
00:24:04,480 --> 00:24:06,880
Speaker 2: in a cafe in Paris because I was like, let's

441
00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:10,160
Speaker 2: go to Europe. Let's come on, gals, let's do it.

442
00:24:10,480 --> 00:24:11,640
Speaker 1: I've seen movies about this.

443
00:24:11,720 --> 00:24:14,760
Speaker 3: I've seen movie We'll have a cross on street. We'll

444
00:24:14,800 --> 00:24:17,439
Speaker 3: be at a corner cafe with those chairs that have

445
00:24:17,560 --> 00:24:18,280
Speaker 3: them weaving.

446
00:24:18,400 --> 00:24:20,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm going to meet an Algerian guy that doesn't

447
00:24:20,240 --> 00:24:21,760
Speaker 1: speak much English.

448
00:24:21,359 --> 00:24:26,600
Speaker 2: Or French exactly so, but I remember sitting there and going,

449
00:24:26,960 --> 00:24:29,200
Speaker 2: you know, this person was one extreme here.

450
00:24:29,320 --> 00:24:31,360
Speaker 3: This person was one extreme over here. This is how

451
00:24:31,400 --> 00:24:31,960
Speaker 3: I acted.

452
00:24:32,720 --> 00:24:36,359
Speaker 2: But I actually need this other thing in the middle

453
00:24:36,560 --> 00:24:39,560
Speaker 2: that I think would be better for me, which is

454
00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:44,919
Speaker 2: someone that I can learn to be honest with, and

455
00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:49,120
Speaker 2: where we can meet each other sort of where we're

456
00:24:49,119 --> 00:24:54,160
Speaker 2: at as stable people, as opposed to me leaning in

457
00:24:54,400 --> 00:24:57,239
Speaker 2: and walking on eggshells till I figure out what that

458
00:24:57,240 --> 00:24:59,600
Speaker 2: person wants you and been quite performative.

459
00:25:00,520 --> 00:25:05,440
Speaker 1: Did you Were you involved in selection when it came

460
00:25:05,520 --> 00:25:07,520
Speaker 1: to Magnets.

461
00:25:08,320 --> 00:25:11,120
Speaker 3: Actually, my friend Nina set us up.

462
00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:12,280
Speaker 1: There you go, that's all.

463
00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:14,359
Speaker 2: That's why, because you were set up sort of with

464
00:25:14,440 --> 00:25:15,160
Speaker 2: your wife as well.

465
00:25:15,480 --> 00:25:17,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, I didn't even know what she looked like.

466
00:25:17,440 --> 00:25:22,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, I remember Nina Satin was like, you know, I've

467
00:25:22,600 --> 00:25:24,080
Speaker 2: got this friend that I think you should really be

468
00:25:24,119 --> 00:25:27,000
Speaker 2: friends with. And unfortunately for you, Linda, it's the most

469
00:25:27,000 --> 00:25:29,520
Speaker 2: inconvenient choice in the world because he lives in America

470
00:25:29,600 --> 00:25:30,560
Speaker 2: and you live in Australia.

471
00:25:30,640 --> 00:25:34,400
Speaker 1: Does Nina's surname have a commonality with an American city

472
00:25:34,440 --> 00:25:35,720
Speaker 1: where there's Ena Las Vegas?

473
00:25:35,800 --> 00:25:39,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, ok, yeah, yeah, yeah. Real name is not Las Vegas,

474
00:25:39,600 --> 00:25:43,480
Speaker 2: but it's a great name. But DJ named Nina.

475
00:25:43,760 --> 00:25:44,400
Speaker 3: It's perfect.

476
00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:47,359
Speaker 2: So Nina las Vegas or the glitz and glamor that

477
00:25:47,440 --> 00:25:51,320
Speaker 2: comes with that. It was like, I think you should

478
00:25:51,440 --> 00:25:55,399
Speaker 2: become at least friends with my good friend Magnus.

479
00:25:55,640 --> 00:25:59,040
Speaker 1: I like that because then it's the the expectation is.

480
00:26:00,600 --> 00:26:02,399
Speaker 3: Yeah, it wasn't. This person's gonna be the love of

481
00:26:02,440 --> 00:26:02,879
Speaker 3: your life.

482
00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:06,480
Speaker 1: But my clock is ticking exactly.

483
00:26:06,560 --> 00:26:07,640
Speaker 3: I remember her.

484
00:26:09,440 --> 00:26:12,000
Speaker 2: Showing her phone to me that had his number in

485
00:26:12,040 --> 00:26:15,359
Speaker 2: his contact details, and I remember her going, fuck it, Linda,

486
00:26:15,520 --> 00:26:19,080
Speaker 2: just connect and I was like really. And then a

487
00:26:19,160 --> 00:26:21,760
Speaker 2: couple of drinks and I was like, okay, I'll text him,

488
00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:26,720
Speaker 2: and that's what happened. We just we became friends and

489
00:26:26,760 --> 00:26:30,360
Speaker 2: we talked on the phone, and then when we met

490
00:26:30,359 --> 00:26:35,000
Speaker 2: in person, it was like, fuck, this is this is it?

491
00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:35,960
Speaker 2: This is easy.

492
00:26:36,040 --> 00:26:37,919
Speaker 1: Was he in another country when you first texted him?

493
00:26:38,160 --> 00:26:44,160
Speaker 3: Yes, he was. He was in New York and I was.

494
00:26:44,240 --> 00:26:47,360
Speaker 2: It was on that same lady's trip where we had

495
00:26:47,359 --> 00:26:49,960
Speaker 2: been in Paris, and I've been talking to Nina about

496
00:26:49,960 --> 00:26:53,320
Speaker 2: all these things, and then we were in when we

497
00:26:53,359 --> 00:26:55,800
Speaker 2: were in London about a week later, she said, just

498
00:26:55,880 --> 00:26:56,320
Speaker 2: text him.

499
00:26:56,320 --> 00:26:56,920
Speaker 1: And then so I.

500
00:26:56,840 --> 00:26:58,440
Speaker 2: Texted him when I was in London, and then when

501
00:26:58,440 --> 00:27:00,920
Speaker 2: I got back to Sydney and we just texting between

502
00:27:01,320 --> 00:27:04,280
Speaker 2: Sydney and New York, and I remember we were texting

503
00:27:04,600 --> 00:27:08,959
Speaker 2: a bunch and he said, very bluntly, he was like,

504
00:27:09,840 --> 00:27:11,520
Speaker 2: I think we should stop texting and I'm going to

505
00:27:11,600 --> 00:27:14,720
Speaker 2: call you on Saturday at you know this time. He

506
00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:17,560
Speaker 2: was like, Saturday, six pm your time, and I thought,

507
00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:18,960
Speaker 2: the fuck, this guy's not gonna call.

508
00:27:19,720 --> 00:27:22,000
Speaker 3: So if he's going to call that's five days away.

509
00:27:22,280 --> 00:27:23,960
Speaker 1: Why would you do that? How weird?

510
00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:27,600
Speaker 2: But he did and then we just, you know, spoke

511
00:27:27,920 --> 00:27:30,760
Speaker 2: for hours and went, God, wouldn't it be so nice

512
00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:35,040
Speaker 2: if we could actually go on a physical date one day?

513
00:27:35,640 --> 00:27:39,400
Speaker 2: And then months later we'd still been texting and calling,

514
00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:42,919
Speaker 2: and there was again there was no you know, we

515
00:27:42,920 --> 00:27:45,320
Speaker 2: weren't in a relationship at that point, We've just been

516
00:27:45,359 --> 00:27:46,240
Speaker 2: getting to know each other.

517
00:27:46,359 --> 00:27:47,440
Speaker 3: It was very polite.

518
00:27:48,080 --> 00:27:50,320
Speaker 1: What did it do for you to start to get

519
00:27:50,320 --> 00:27:55,159
Speaker 1: to know someone without the physicality, without even hearing their voice.

520
00:27:56,480 --> 00:27:58,840
Speaker 3: I liked the tone of his texts.

521
00:27:59,600 --> 00:28:03,640
Speaker 2: I remember that he was the same as he He's

522
00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:08,120
Speaker 2: a very consistent person, and I think I really liked it.

523
00:28:08,160 --> 00:28:12,359
Speaker 2: He was sort of had that because Norwegian.

524
00:28:12,359 --> 00:28:12,879
Speaker 3: He's got that.

525
00:28:13,240 --> 00:28:16,800
Speaker 2: He's got a bluntness to him that's very polite and

526
00:28:17,080 --> 00:28:21,119
Speaker 2: very honest. Hello, I'm eating a piece of fish. Hello,

527
00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:23,800
Speaker 2: you know it was and he says, it's been pickled.

528
00:28:24,400 --> 00:28:27,920
Speaker 2: When you'll open the jar, you'll know it. There's been

529
00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:30,720
Speaker 2: pickled in soap. And this is what we have for breakfast,

530
00:28:30,720 --> 00:28:33,199
Speaker 2: with the brown cheese and the thing. It was a

531
00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:36,080
Speaker 2: very matter everything was very matter of fact.

532
00:28:36,240 --> 00:28:38,200
Speaker 1: I love it. My Dutch mates are like that, oh, sure,

533
00:28:38,240 --> 00:28:41,280
Speaker 1: it's good to see you. You're fat, yes, yes, hands,

534
00:28:41,360 --> 00:28:43,880
Speaker 1: it's so nice to see you too. Yeah, it's the medication.

535
00:28:44,120 --> 00:28:46,320
Speaker 3: Yes, it was not me, it was so it was.

536
00:28:46,840 --> 00:28:49,680
Speaker 2: I found it really refreshing because I didn't have to guess,

537
00:28:49,760 --> 00:28:52,240
Speaker 2: how do you I think? Because I wasn't like, how

538
00:28:52,240 --> 00:28:54,000
Speaker 2: do you feel? How can I accommodate what you're doing?

539
00:28:54,040 --> 00:28:56,320
Speaker 2: He was just like, hello, it would be nice to

540
00:28:56,320 --> 00:28:56,920
Speaker 2: go on a date.

541
00:28:56,800 --> 00:28:57,480
Speaker 3: With you sometime.

542
00:28:57,560 --> 00:29:02,000
Speaker 2: And then as our relationship progress as well, like months

543
00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:04,640
Speaker 2: down the line, I remember him going, I love you

544
00:29:04,720 --> 00:29:06,440
Speaker 2: very much, and it feels very nice to say it

545
00:29:06,440 --> 00:29:10,640
Speaker 2: to you. I remember him saying that, and I was like, because.

546
00:29:10,400 --> 00:29:12,959
Speaker 1: You're also dealing with English as the second language, so

547
00:29:13,240 --> 00:29:16,800
Speaker 1: he's translating and going the nuance is possibly.

548
00:29:17,240 --> 00:29:19,840
Speaker 3: It's just like, it's just very matter of fact.

549
00:29:20,360 --> 00:29:23,960
Speaker 1: So taking the physicality out is if you kind of

550
00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:27,080
Speaker 1: meet someone and there's saying red flags but you can

551
00:29:27,160 --> 00:29:29,840
Speaker 1: kind of vaguely see his flags behind them. Yeah, but

552
00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:32,560
Speaker 1: you're like, I'll deal with that in a second. I

553
00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:34,560
Speaker 1: just need to need to sort this out first, because

554
00:29:34,600 --> 00:29:36,120
Speaker 1: my body's telling me that I've got to do this

555
00:29:36,240 --> 00:29:43,840
Speaker 1: one thing right now. That can obfuscate things for absolute years. Yes, yes,

556
00:29:44,000 --> 00:29:46,920
Speaker 1: and then one day you go, hang on a second,

557
00:29:47,200 --> 00:29:50,960
Speaker 1: you're a dickad And I kind of knew it the

558
00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:55,360
Speaker 1: whole time, really yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah yeah. What was

559
00:29:55,360 --> 00:29:57,680
Speaker 1: it like to have that taken out of equation out

560
00:29:57,720 --> 00:29:57,840
Speaker 1: of it?

561
00:29:59,520 --> 00:30:02,920
Speaker 3: I think think it was really nice.

562
00:30:02,960 --> 00:30:06,920
Speaker 2: It was really I just remember thinking it was so

563
00:30:07,000 --> 00:30:14,120
Speaker 2: sweet and honest and flirtatious without being ever seedy. It

564
00:30:14,200 --> 00:30:18,120
Speaker 2: was like a genuine getting to know someone. I kind

565
00:30:18,160 --> 00:30:21,160
Speaker 2: of knew that I'd be attracted to him because Nina

566
00:30:21,160 --> 00:30:21,720
Speaker 2: had shown me.

567
00:30:21,640 --> 00:30:23,920
Speaker 3: A picture and she was like, I think you'd be

568
00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:26,400
Speaker 3: into him. And she was like, he dances the way

569
00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:26,880
Speaker 3: that you do.

570
00:30:27,560 --> 00:30:31,440
Speaker 2: That's important, and I was like, okay, you know that's

571
00:30:31,160 --> 00:30:32,320
Speaker 2: that could be something.

572
00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:35,280
Speaker 3: And I had like seen one or two photos of him,

573
00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:38,120
Speaker 3: but I I think I'd done the thing where I'd

574
00:30:38,120 --> 00:30:40,200
Speaker 3: stopped myself from getting caught up on the physical like

575
00:30:40,200 --> 00:30:41,760
Speaker 3: I didn't want to google him.

576
00:30:41,720 --> 00:30:43,880
Speaker 1: Or fine, I don't want to be seeing his latest

577
00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:46,200
Speaker 1: person seeing which checks have liked as fine. Yeah, Like I.

578
00:30:46,200 --> 00:30:47,400
Speaker 3: Didn't want to be doing that stuff.

579
00:30:47,480 --> 00:30:48,960
Speaker 2: So I was just I was trying to be quite

580
00:30:49,160 --> 00:30:51,640
Speaker 2: removed and just take it on the values of what

581
00:30:51,720 --> 00:30:55,200
Speaker 2: those texts were giving me, and I think it's so.

582
00:30:55,440 --> 00:30:57,720
Speaker 2: I think it really served me well because it made

583
00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:02,280
Speaker 2: our initial getting to know each other the very honest

584
00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:04,000
Speaker 2: and wholesome.

585
00:31:04,680 --> 00:31:05,000
Speaker 1: I don't know.

586
00:31:05,000 --> 00:31:06,840
Speaker 2: When I say the word wholesome, it almost sounds like

587
00:31:06,880 --> 00:31:09,840
Speaker 2: it's sugarcoated. It wasn't sugarcoated, but there was something very

588
00:31:09,920 --> 00:31:14,600
Speaker 2: pure about it, and I think that made it so

589
00:31:14,640 --> 00:31:17,760
Speaker 2: that when we actually met in person, I was like, fuck,

590
00:31:17,840 --> 00:31:21,400
Speaker 2: I know the package of your brain sort of already,

591
00:31:22,560 --> 00:31:26,200
Speaker 2: and now if I'm not turned off by you in person,

592
00:31:27,040 --> 00:31:28,200
Speaker 2: this could work.

593
00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:30,479
Speaker 3: Because there was a big fear in like, fuck, I'm

594
00:31:30,520 --> 00:31:32,800
Speaker 3: gonna meet this person and I'm gonna hate the way

595
00:31:32,840 --> 00:31:35,600
Speaker 3: they eat, or I think it'll really annoy me when.

596
00:31:35,480 --> 00:31:38,640
Speaker 2: They like what if he's rude to the waiter at

597
00:31:38,680 --> 00:31:41,400
Speaker 2: a restaurant, you know, just things that you just get

598
00:31:41,440 --> 00:31:44,160
Speaker 2: when you're in person. But I knew that the set up,

599
00:31:44,480 --> 00:31:47,400
Speaker 2: the foundation so far was good, and so if we

600
00:31:47,400 --> 00:31:49,840
Speaker 2: didn't kiss each other off in person, then maybe there

601
00:31:49,840 --> 00:31:50,520
Speaker 2: could be something.

602
00:31:50,960 --> 00:31:53,800
Speaker 1: So many questions I have, so many questions were.

603
00:31:54,840 --> 00:31:56,600
Speaker 3: He was not rude to the weight stuff, Well.

604
00:31:56,520 --> 00:32:00,120
Speaker 1: That's important, but this wasn't the conversation I thought we

605
00:32:00,120 --> 00:32:01,959
Speaker 1: were going to have, But now I'm just so invested

606
00:32:02,000 --> 00:32:05,440
Speaker 1: in the lost story because you know we're coming in

607
00:32:05,440 --> 00:32:10,960
Speaker 1: at the second act, you know, while you're pregnant. Doubt

608
00:32:11,160 --> 00:32:13,920
Speaker 1: we've kind of non linear told this. You only get

609
00:32:13,960 --> 00:32:16,240
Speaker 1: the chance six to someone for the first time once.

610
00:32:16,520 --> 00:32:20,440
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, the amount of time from you should text

611
00:32:20,440 --> 00:32:24,200
Speaker 1: my friend just connect to when you're in that moment. Yep,

612
00:32:24,720 --> 00:32:28,600
Speaker 1: that's quite the sling shots getting pulled the fair h Yeah, yeah,

613
00:32:28,640 --> 00:32:30,880
Speaker 1: that's a one hundred and twenty eight bastonnaire rowl. If

614
00:32:30,880 --> 00:32:33,640
Speaker 1: you're in the DJ, well, yeah, there's a lot of

615
00:32:33,640 --> 00:32:36,520
Speaker 1: stroke like the Long Game.

616
00:32:36,720 --> 00:32:40,240
Speaker 3: The Long Game Shore. It was a fucking lot to lead.

617
00:32:40,160 --> 00:32:44,640
Speaker 1: Up to, Like there's kisses and there's kisses. I'm assuming

618
00:32:44,680 --> 00:32:46,280
Speaker 1: that was like proper fireworks.

619
00:32:46,600 --> 00:32:50,880
Speaker 2: I remember exactly. I mean, I'm sure you remember exactly

620
00:32:51,440 --> 00:32:53,880
Speaker 2: when you and ordered kiss for the first time, but

621
00:32:53,960 --> 00:32:56,840
Speaker 2: I remember we had been on our.

622
00:32:56,920 --> 00:32:57,960
Speaker 3: First date in La.

623
00:32:58,360 --> 00:33:03,000
Speaker 2: We've been texting and been on calls for maybe five

624
00:33:03,160 --> 00:33:04,080
Speaker 2: months at that.

625
00:33:04,080 --> 00:33:05,880
Speaker 1: Point, but you on a holiday.

626
00:33:06,400 --> 00:33:10,040
Speaker 2: I was in LA for a wedding night for a week,

627
00:33:10,200 --> 00:33:13,600
Speaker 2: and he happened to be there for work. Happened happened

628
00:33:13,640 --> 00:33:16,760
Speaker 2: to be there, finished up work, happened to be here

629
00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:20,840
Speaker 2: for an extra day, and then texted and said, you know,

630
00:33:20,880 --> 00:33:22,800
Speaker 2: would you like to go for a coffee? Which I

631
00:33:22,840 --> 00:33:24,920
Speaker 2: really liked because it was just very casual. It was

632
00:33:25,000 --> 00:33:26,840
Speaker 2: just daytime, daytime.

633
00:33:26,920 --> 00:33:27,880
Speaker 1: Now where did he take you?

634
00:33:27,960 --> 00:33:31,680
Speaker 2: We went to We met at Grand Central Market at

635
00:33:31,680 --> 00:33:34,080
Speaker 2: a place called GNB Coffee, so it was like kind

636
00:33:34,160 --> 00:33:37,840
Speaker 2: of downtown ish. We met there at about eleven am.

637
00:33:38,080 --> 00:33:42,720
Speaker 2: N coffee, which turned into a little snack which turned

638
00:33:42,760 --> 00:33:46,040
Speaker 2: into I had to go run an errand at the

639
00:33:46,080 --> 00:33:49,080
Speaker 2: grove to buy a wedding present for my friend.

640
00:33:49,160 --> 00:33:52,120
Speaker 1: So four hours later to drive mutually six kilometers and

641
00:33:52,160 --> 00:33:52,840
Speaker 1: back again him.

642
00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:55,640
Speaker 2: Yes, exactly in the car in the I remember the oopers,

643
00:33:56,040 --> 00:33:59,360
Speaker 2: you know, back and forth, which turned into another juice,

644
00:33:59,400 --> 00:34:01,040
Speaker 2: which turned in to a coffee, which.

645
00:34:00,880 --> 00:34:04,360
Speaker 3: Turned into are you hungry? Like do you want to

646
00:34:04,400 --> 00:34:08,880
Speaker 3: go for dinner? Ended up going to dinner at a

647
00:34:08,920 --> 00:34:12,520
Speaker 3: place called Sushi Park, which was actually near where we

648
00:34:12,600 --> 00:34:14,640
Speaker 3: live now, which is kind of been like West Hollywood.

649
00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:20,640
Speaker 2: And then I remember after dinner, we were back at

650
00:34:20,680 --> 00:34:22,239
Speaker 2: the house that he was staying at, which is a

651
00:34:22,280 --> 00:34:24,320
Speaker 2: really close friend of ours place.

652
00:34:24,800 --> 00:34:26,640
Speaker 1: There's a lot of lead up here. Yeah, there's a

653
00:34:26,640 --> 00:34:28,560
Speaker 1: lot of new did he say, do you want to

654
00:34:28,560 --> 00:34:29,799
Speaker 1: come back? Like, only it's just now.

655
00:34:30,120 --> 00:34:34,360
Speaker 2: I'm like I had conveniently left something at the house.

656
00:34:34,680 --> 00:34:37,120
Speaker 1: So we had been met earlier in the day.

657
00:34:37,200 --> 00:34:39,160
Speaker 2: We were there earlier in the day when we'd done

658
00:34:39,200 --> 00:34:41,120
Speaker 2: like a walk around the grove and we'd come back,

659
00:34:41,160 --> 00:34:43,319
Speaker 2: and I think i'd bought the I can't remember what

660
00:34:43,360 --> 00:34:46,440
Speaker 2: the wedding present was. I think it was like something

661
00:34:46,440 --> 00:34:47,880
Speaker 2: that I easily could have fit into my back. I

662
00:34:47,880 --> 00:34:50,239
Speaker 2: think was a gift voucher for Barney's, Like it was

663
00:34:50,560 --> 00:34:54,480
Speaker 2: a card, and I conveniently left it at the house

664
00:34:54,520 --> 00:34:55,520
Speaker 2: that he was staying at.

665
00:34:56,400 --> 00:34:59,920
Speaker 3: Such a prime I've left the thing, but that Barney's,

666
00:35:01,200 --> 00:35:01,879
Speaker 3: we have to go back.

667
00:35:01,920 --> 00:35:04,920
Speaker 2: So I remember we finished dinner and I was like, oh,

668
00:35:04,960 --> 00:35:07,440
Speaker 2: I've got to go back and get a card that

669
00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:10,320
Speaker 2: I left on the kitchen bench. So we went back,

670
00:35:11,360 --> 00:35:15,080
Speaker 2: got the card, and we were sitting and talking and

671
00:35:15,120 --> 00:35:19,399
Speaker 2: again it was it was that he was exactly as

672
00:35:19,440 --> 00:35:23,399
Speaker 2: his texts were, what's your coffee of choice? And how

673
00:35:23,440 --> 00:35:25,000
Speaker 2: do you are your parents still together?

674
00:35:25,280 --> 00:35:26,080
Speaker 3: What is your brother?

675
00:35:26,239 --> 00:35:26,319
Speaker 2: Like?

676
00:35:26,440 --> 00:35:29,000
Speaker 3: You know, just like very very much like that.

677
00:35:29,719 --> 00:35:33,440
Speaker 2: And then I remember he said, I have a question

678
00:35:33,560 --> 00:35:37,120
Speaker 2: to ask you, and I went, okay, sure, and he

679
00:35:37,239 --> 00:35:40,680
Speaker 2: was like, and you can feel free to say no, okay,

680
00:35:42,560 --> 00:35:45,920
Speaker 2: would you allow me to kiss you for maybe three

681
00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:47,000
Speaker 2: seconds and.

682
00:35:46,920 --> 00:35:50,799
Speaker 3: If you don't like it, you can stop? And I

683
00:35:50,840 --> 00:35:53,560
Speaker 3: was like, of course.

684
00:35:54,640 --> 00:36:02,480
Speaker 2: It was so fucking cute. It was so cute the

685
00:36:02,520 --> 00:36:05,160
Speaker 2: way he asked. I remember him sitting cross legged on

686
00:36:05,200 --> 00:36:12,160
Speaker 2: this like a low sofa for like three seconds and

687
00:36:12,200 --> 00:36:13,760
Speaker 2: if you don't like it, you can stop.

688
00:36:15,160 --> 00:36:15,720
Speaker 3: And we didn't.

689
00:36:17,800 --> 00:36:19,520
Speaker 1: That is so magnificent.

690
00:36:19,880 --> 00:36:24,080
Speaker 3: It was very, very very very fucking cute.

691
00:36:24,239 --> 00:36:31,080
Speaker 1: What a beautiful, the best love story. I I do

692
00:36:31,160 --> 00:36:33,800
Speaker 1: stuff with love stories from time to time. Very pure,

693
00:36:34,080 --> 00:36:36,080
Speaker 1: very nice, very pure, very nice.

694
00:36:36,080 --> 00:36:38,400
Speaker 3: And we didn't sleep together that night. We just kissed

695
00:36:39,080 --> 00:36:40,280
Speaker 3: and then he was flying.

696
00:36:40,320 --> 00:36:44,839
Speaker 2: It was the torn love story where I left. He

697
00:36:45,000 --> 00:36:47,920
Speaker 2: was flying back to New York the next day, and

698
00:36:47,960 --> 00:36:51,880
Speaker 2: then in the next day in the afternoon, he texted

699
00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:54,560
Speaker 2: and said, you know, how's Disneyland because I was at

700
00:36:54,560 --> 00:36:56,399
Speaker 2: Disneyland match as you do.

701
00:36:57,480 --> 00:36:58,799
Speaker 3: And I said, Disney Lane's great.

702
00:36:58,840 --> 00:37:02,359
Speaker 2: How's your flight back to New And he said, I

703
00:37:02,400 --> 00:37:06,120
Speaker 2: packed my bag, I left the house and instead of

704
00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:08,880
Speaker 2: getting into my uber, I walked and got a coffee,

705
00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:13,120
Speaker 2: so I didn't get on my flight. So if you'd

706
00:37:13,200 --> 00:37:15,439
Speaker 2: like to go on a second date, I am still

707
00:37:15,480 --> 00:37:15,920
Speaker 2: in town.

708
00:37:16,840 --> 00:37:19,200
Speaker 1: And then snow Patrol's chasing car starts playing.

709
00:37:19,400 --> 00:37:24,640
Speaker 2: I literally said, my friends, I've got to fucking get

710
00:37:24,640 --> 00:37:25,640
Speaker 2: out of Disneyland.

711
00:37:26,160 --> 00:37:26,920
Speaker 3: I'm out of here.

712
00:37:27,239 --> 00:37:29,920
Speaker 1: This is no longer the happiest place on earth, it

713
00:37:30,040 --> 00:37:31,239
Speaker 1: is the second happiest place.

714
00:37:31,600 --> 00:37:32,080
Speaker 3: I'm gone.

715
00:37:32,280 --> 00:37:35,560
Speaker 2: I'm gone, guys, I'm fucking gone. Get that uber to

716
00:37:35,600 --> 00:37:37,319
Speaker 2: the eye hop I'm out.

717
00:37:38,280 --> 00:37:39,040
Speaker 3: And that was it.

718
00:37:39,320 --> 00:37:43,960
Speaker 1: That is magnificent, a beautiful story. Yeah, he's such a

719
00:37:43,960 --> 00:37:44,920
Speaker 1: beautiful story.

720
00:37:45,280 --> 00:37:48,000
Speaker 2: So he lost his flight and then just kept canceling

721
00:37:48,040 --> 00:37:52,120
Speaker 2: it until I left at the end of that week.

722
00:37:53,040 --> 00:37:53,719
Speaker 3: And that was it.

723
00:37:54,440 --> 00:37:57,279
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, when you know, you know, yeah it was

724
00:37:57,560 --> 00:37:58,160
Speaker 1: it was it.

725
00:37:58,320 --> 00:38:03,600
Speaker 2: Really, I'd never expec experienced a purity and lack of

726
00:38:03,680 --> 00:38:06,920
Speaker 2: games bluntness like it.

727
00:38:07,040 --> 00:38:10,319
Speaker 1: Yeah, now you've just painted a beautiful picture. My heart

728
00:38:10,400 --> 00:38:14,239
Speaker 1: is swelling with joy. That sweetness, that delight must come

729
00:38:14,280 --> 00:38:17,520
Speaker 1: in handy when he's shitting you, because there's no doubt

730
00:38:17,560 --> 00:38:18,360
Speaker 1: that he shits you.

731
00:38:19,800 --> 00:38:22,399
Speaker 2: Yeah, he does not, not overly. We don't shit each

732
00:38:22,440 --> 00:38:24,319
Speaker 2: other that often. I feel like we're going to shit

733
00:38:24,400 --> 00:38:27,399
Speaker 2: each other when there's a like it's going.

734
00:38:27,400 --> 00:38:34,400
Speaker 1: To happen Champagne and balcony. You really, Yeah, I'm just

735
00:38:34,440 --> 00:38:35,399
Speaker 1: going to go my the lawn.

736
00:38:35,719 --> 00:38:37,960
Speaker 3: You just I know there's going to be there's going

737
00:38:38,040 --> 00:38:39,560
Speaker 3: to be there's going to be times.

738
00:38:39,680 --> 00:38:41,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, And that's that's a part of it. And this

739
00:38:41,440 --> 00:38:44,560
Speaker 1: is this is the thing. There is the rocky stuff

740
00:38:44,800 --> 00:38:48,480
Speaker 1: that does come and that moment you just described that

741
00:38:48,520 --> 00:38:49,680
Speaker 1: stuff's really handy.

742
00:38:50,080 --> 00:38:51,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know you can remember that.

743
00:38:52,120 --> 00:38:53,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, when I'm.

744
00:38:53,360 --> 00:38:55,120
Speaker 2: Trying to think of the thing that he does that

745
00:38:55,760 --> 00:39:01,200
Speaker 2: ships me. Sometimes you can talk really loud when he's

746
00:39:01,200 --> 00:39:01,760
Speaker 2: on the phone.

747
00:39:03,920 --> 00:39:05,560
Speaker 1: Former DJ now music producer.

748
00:39:05,719 --> 00:39:08,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, like the ship can talk talk cloud on the phone.

749
00:39:08,880 --> 00:39:11,160
Speaker 2: I mean, there's there's plenty of things. He gets annoyed.

750
00:39:11,200 --> 00:39:13,600
Speaker 2: If I put my keys in the fruit bowl. It's

751
00:39:13,640 --> 00:39:16,680
Speaker 2: just one of his weird little likes things and certain

752
00:39:16,760 --> 00:39:22,399
Speaker 2: or everywhere. Yeah, like, but yeah, I think I think

753
00:39:22,440 --> 00:39:24,640
Speaker 2: the shitty, the shitting each other will come in our

754
00:39:24,680 --> 00:39:25,680
Speaker 2: in our parents stage.

755
00:39:25,760 --> 00:39:28,080
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, you just told the most wonderful life story

756
00:39:28,080 --> 00:39:32,680
Speaker 1: and I'm so Yet. The way that you connect with

757
00:39:32,760 --> 00:39:35,400
Speaker 1: someone is really really important, But how you disagree with

758
00:39:35,440 --> 00:39:37,240
Speaker 1: someone is vital.

759
00:39:37,440 --> 00:39:41,480
Speaker 2: Yes, it is, isn't it that sort of conflict Sometimes

760
00:39:41,480 --> 00:39:44,760
Speaker 2: it's not even conflict resolution, it's like just conflict airing

761
00:39:44,800 --> 00:39:48,480
Speaker 2: out and learning how to listen to each other.

762
00:39:48,880 --> 00:39:52,680
Speaker 1: Yea, and yeah, that all you get to need.

763
00:39:52,719 --> 00:39:55,640
Speaker 2: It's hard, that's really hard.

764
00:39:55,840 --> 00:40:02,759
Speaker 1: Yeah, because there's Yeah, kids are the greatest thing, oh

765
00:40:02,840 --> 00:40:07,440
Speaker 1: my goodness, and equally the most difficult, challenging thing. Yeah,

766
00:40:07,480 --> 00:40:10,839
Speaker 1: and it's all part of it.

767
00:40:11,200 --> 00:40:14,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I think like when because we were long

768
00:40:14,640 --> 00:40:18,600
Speaker 2: distance for so long, so we'd done that meeting and

769
00:40:18,640 --> 00:40:21,920
Speaker 2: like beautiful firework, hurrah, and then we were long distance

770
00:40:21,920 --> 00:40:25,440
Speaker 2: for three years. Why shit, and we've Yeah, we were

771
00:40:25,480 --> 00:40:27,440
Speaker 2: long distance for three years after that, where we were

772
00:40:27,440 --> 00:40:29,799
Speaker 2: seeing each other, you know, every couple of months. So

773
00:40:29,800 --> 00:40:33,080
Speaker 2: it was just like fucking logistics of I can get

774
00:40:33,200 --> 00:40:36,000
Speaker 2: leave at this last week of September, Can you get

775
00:40:36,400 --> 00:40:38,200
Speaker 2: leave and you're going to be done with that album?

776
00:40:38,280 --> 00:40:39,279
Speaker 3: Can you come over and there?

777
00:40:39,440 --> 00:40:43,320
Speaker 2: Or so there was that, and then there was Hurrah,

778
00:40:43,719 --> 00:40:46,240
Speaker 2: I'm quitting my job, moving out of my house, coming

779
00:40:46,239 --> 00:40:49,600
Speaker 2: to LA We're going to make it. It's time at

780
00:40:49,600 --> 00:40:53,600
Speaker 2: the start of twenty twenty and then everything got shut down,

781
00:40:53,600 --> 00:40:56,840
Speaker 2: so there was a lot of not even that wasn't.

782
00:40:56,880 --> 00:40:59,239
Speaker 2: It wasn't like that stuff brought conflict to us, but

783
00:40:59,320 --> 00:41:04,400
Speaker 2: it brought intense tension of what the fuck are we

784
00:41:04,480 --> 00:41:04,920
Speaker 2: going to do?

785
00:41:05,200 --> 00:41:06,600
Speaker 1: So much stuff beyond your control?

786
00:41:06,880 --> 00:41:09,839
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like, how can we talk through this when

787
00:41:09,880 --> 00:41:13,120
Speaker 2: there's not really a solution to come to. It's just

788
00:41:14,040 --> 00:41:15,880
Speaker 2: I don't know when I'm going to see you. I

789
00:41:15,880 --> 00:41:17,680
Speaker 2: don't know when I'm going to be over there. I

790
00:41:17,719 --> 00:41:19,120
Speaker 2: don't know when we'll see each other again.

791
00:41:19,480 --> 00:41:24,480
Speaker 1: Very difficult. What did you learn about I guess surrendering

792
00:41:24,840 --> 00:41:29,160
Speaker 1: to things that weren't anywhere within your influence.

793
00:41:32,800 --> 00:41:39,239
Speaker 2: That you can't fight it right, fighting it is just

794
00:41:39,400 --> 00:41:40,840
Speaker 2: going to be a battle that you're just always going

795
00:41:40,920 --> 00:41:46,480
Speaker 2: to lose. I think we found, like so many people

796
00:41:47,800 --> 00:41:51,799
Speaker 2: patients that I didn't realize that we had resilience as

797
00:41:51,800 --> 00:41:55,279
Speaker 2: a couple that I didn't realize was so important that

798
00:41:55,400 --> 00:41:59,000
Speaker 2: I think, I'm sure will serve us for many years

799
00:41:59,040 --> 00:42:05,080
Speaker 2: to come, and the ability to talk through difficult feelings,

800
00:42:05,640 --> 00:42:08,520
Speaker 2: because again that was something that I'd learned in my life.

801
00:42:08,560 --> 00:42:14,040
Speaker 2: I think to always put my best Linda forward and

802
00:42:14,160 --> 00:42:17,080
Speaker 2: be that, you know, to use that performance like be

803
00:42:17,120 --> 00:42:20,320
Speaker 2: a bit performative, and everything's good, everything's great.

804
00:42:20,360 --> 00:42:21,600
Speaker 3: I got this. It's good.

805
00:42:21,640 --> 00:42:25,600
Speaker 2: So I think when I was actually when we were struggling,

806
00:42:26,640 --> 00:42:30,239
Speaker 2: you know, during COVID and we weren't able to see

807
00:42:30,239 --> 00:42:33,879
Speaker 2: each other for a year and a half. It took

808
00:42:34,000 --> 00:42:35,799
Speaker 2: us a year and a half to get reunited, and

809
00:42:35,840 --> 00:42:38,960
Speaker 2: even then it was a stretch. It was really hard

810
00:42:39,440 --> 00:42:43,440
Speaker 2: to get him into Australia kind of by the second

811
00:42:43,440 --> 00:42:48,120
Speaker 2: half of twenty twenty one. And I think it taught

812
00:42:48,200 --> 00:42:52,360
Speaker 2: us a lot about being grateful, Grateful to just be

813
00:42:52,400 --> 00:42:56,880
Speaker 2: in each other's company, grateful to have dinner together. And obviously,

814
00:42:57,120 --> 00:42:59,319
Speaker 2: you know, now we live together, there's things that can

815
00:42:59,480 --> 00:43:01,680
Speaker 2: shit each off if he's crowding me in the kitchen

816
00:43:01,680 --> 00:43:03,759
Speaker 2: and I'm trying to cook something or something that I

817
00:43:03,800 --> 00:43:07,719
Speaker 2: think there's a there's a foundation of gratefulness that I

818
00:43:07,800 --> 00:43:11,000
Speaker 2: don't think I ever would have learned if I had

819
00:43:11,040 --> 00:43:14,400
Speaker 2: not gone through something like that where I felt like

820
00:43:14,480 --> 00:43:16,919
Speaker 2: I was in a relationship but I wasn't. I didn't

821
00:43:16,960 --> 00:43:19,440
Speaker 2: have any of the things that I wanted, Like I

822
00:43:19,440 --> 00:43:22,480
Speaker 2: wanted to hug, you know, I just wanted to hug.

823
00:43:22,520 --> 00:43:25,000
Speaker 2: I just wanted to sit in silence with the person

824
00:43:25,080 --> 00:43:26,719
Speaker 2: that I loved on the couch at the end of

825
00:43:26,719 --> 00:43:27,200
Speaker 2: a hard day.

826
00:43:27,760 --> 00:43:28,480
Speaker 3: You can't do it.

827
00:43:29,040 --> 00:43:34,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's yeah, it's you made it through that you

828
00:43:34,560 --> 00:43:35,960
Speaker 1: should be Yeah.

829
00:43:36,120 --> 00:43:39,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, set for a bit, not set up for every challenge,

830
00:43:39,719 --> 00:43:42,640
Speaker 2: but you know, set up in some ways better than

831
00:43:43,360 --> 00:43:44,640
Speaker 2: I thought that we would be.

832
00:43:46,200 --> 00:43:47,960
Speaker 1: Just a moment away from Linda. I promise we'll get

833
00:43:47,960 --> 00:43:49,480
Speaker 1: back to the love story in a second. If this

834
00:43:49,560 --> 00:43:51,759
Speaker 1: podcast is bringing your value, if it's something that you think,

835
00:43:51,840 --> 00:43:54,040
Speaker 1: you know what my friend would enjoy this, please send

836
00:43:54,040 --> 00:43:56,239
Speaker 1: it to them. Just hit chair, copy the link, send

837
00:43:56,280 --> 00:43:59,800
Speaker 1: it over subscribe where you can rate review for whatever

838
00:43:59,800 --> 00:44:03,279
Speaker 1: you can do tell someone about the show that really

839
00:44:03,280 --> 00:44:06,480
Speaker 1: helps doesn't cost you anything. It helps us pay the

840
00:44:06,480 --> 00:44:08,759
Speaker 1: bills and keep the food in the fridge. We also

841
00:44:08,800 --> 00:44:10,520
Speaker 1: have a mailing listache against bog dot com. If you

842
00:44:10,520 --> 00:44:12,360
Speaker 1: want to get in touch with me, just hit reply there.

843
00:44:13,000 --> 00:44:15,160
Speaker 1: All the previous episodes are on the website as well,

844
00:44:15,840 --> 00:44:17,239
Speaker 1: or you can just get in touch with me just

845
00:44:17,400 --> 00:44:20,080
Speaker 1: DMS and Instagram. I don't want to stop this love story.

846
00:44:20,120 --> 00:44:27,400
Speaker 1: We're back in a moment. To be the kind of

847
00:44:27,400 --> 00:44:30,120
Speaker 1: person who goes like, you know what, I've got something

848
00:44:30,160 --> 00:44:32,120
Speaker 1: to say. I should be on radio. It takes some

849
00:44:32,239 --> 00:44:37,200
Speaker 1: amount of no, no, No, I am worthy of that. I

850
00:44:37,239 --> 00:44:38,560
Speaker 1: have what I have to say in the way I

851
00:44:38,560 --> 00:44:40,080
Speaker 1: approach the world, the way I feel about music, the

852
00:44:40,080 --> 00:44:43,520
Speaker 1: way I could connect with people. Yeah, I deserve that.

853
00:44:43,520 --> 00:44:46,440
Speaker 1: That is that or I'm really good at choosing music.

854
00:44:46,760 --> 00:44:48,920
Speaker 1: I should be paid to play in a nightclub full

855
00:44:48,920 --> 00:44:50,480
Speaker 1: of people who paid a lot of money to come

856
00:44:50,520 --> 00:44:52,120
Speaker 1: and have a big night out. And I'm going to

857
00:44:52,600 --> 00:44:54,920
Speaker 1: I am that. You know, how do those two things

858
00:44:54,960 --> 00:44:58,440
Speaker 1: compared to No? I am? I am an author. I'm

859
00:44:58,440 --> 00:44:59,800
Speaker 1: going to write a story. I'm going to write a

860
00:44:59,800 --> 00:45:00,960
Speaker 1: boo and you should read it.

861
00:45:01,800 --> 00:45:03,759
Speaker 3: Can you tell me you've done it as well?

862
00:45:03,960 --> 00:45:06,240
Speaker 1: Well? God, I'd like to know your answer.

863
00:45:08,000 --> 00:45:10,279
Speaker 2: It's funny when you say that, I'm like, Wow, that

864
00:45:10,320 --> 00:45:14,719
Speaker 2: person sounds really fucking confident. But when I think about

865
00:45:14,760 --> 00:45:19,319
Speaker 2: myself going into those things, I never felt confident. I

866
00:45:19,360 --> 00:45:23,239
Speaker 2: feel like I was capable, I guess, and I think

867
00:45:23,280 --> 00:45:27,160
Speaker 2: I'm learning to have more confidence and be a bit

868
00:45:27,320 --> 00:45:31,760
Speaker 2: less self deprecating. But I think I mean, in terms

869
00:45:31,800 --> 00:45:34,840
Speaker 2: of the book, was it was that someone approached me

870
00:45:34,880 --> 00:45:36,520
Speaker 2: and said, I think you can write a story, and

871
00:45:36,560 --> 00:45:37,200
Speaker 2: I think you need to.

872
00:45:37,200 --> 00:45:38,200
Speaker 3: Fucking back yourself.

873
00:45:40,200 --> 00:45:43,319
Speaker 2: It took I think in each of those circumstances, it

874
00:45:43,360 --> 00:45:45,640
Speaker 2: took someone else believing in.

875
00:45:45,560 --> 00:45:48,120
Speaker 3: Me before I could believe in myself.

876
00:45:48,440 --> 00:45:52,240
Speaker 2: So with radio it was that God, I was so passionate,

877
00:45:52,239 --> 00:45:56,759
Speaker 2: and I was such a nerd and just obsessed with

878
00:45:57,200 --> 00:46:01,000
Speaker 2: every article that I could find about bands and artists

879
00:46:01,000 --> 00:46:04,560
Speaker 2: and reading every weird little line of note. And then

880
00:46:04,600 --> 00:46:07,680
Speaker 2: when I started volunteering in community radio, it took the

881
00:46:07,760 --> 00:46:10,279
Speaker 2: program director to believe in me as an eighteen year

882
00:46:10,320 --> 00:46:12,200
Speaker 2: old and go I'm going to give you a show,

883
00:46:12,520 --> 00:46:15,799
Speaker 2: and me go me, I mean that's a dream, but

884
00:46:16,040 --> 00:46:18,200
Speaker 2: I don't. Am I ready for that? And I remember

885
00:46:18,239 --> 00:46:21,480
Speaker 2: her going, I'm going to give it to you Thursday afternoons.

886
00:46:21,800 --> 00:46:23,000
Speaker 3: You can they're yours.

887
00:46:23,520 --> 00:46:25,480
Speaker 2: And then similarly that was the way that it was

888
00:46:25,920 --> 00:46:30,279
Speaker 2: at Triple J and with djaying it was the same

889
00:46:31,320 --> 00:46:32,560
Speaker 2: have you ever thought about DJing?

890
00:46:33,360 --> 00:46:36,200
Speaker 3: Fuck? Yeah, it's a dream? Do you reckon? I could

891
00:46:36,239 --> 00:46:36,440
Speaker 3: do that?

892
00:46:36,880 --> 00:46:41,320
Speaker 2: I reckon you could. But I think for better or worse,

893
00:46:41,400 --> 00:46:44,640
Speaker 2: it came from someone else believing in me doing it,

894
00:46:45,080 --> 00:46:47,440
Speaker 2: And for me it had been like a dream that

895
00:46:47,840 --> 00:46:48,239
Speaker 2: I don't.

896
00:46:48,640 --> 00:46:48,959
Speaker 1: I don't.

897
00:46:49,239 --> 00:46:51,240
Speaker 3: I wonder if I ever would have had.

898
00:46:51,120 --> 00:46:57,080
Speaker 2: The guts to say I deserve this. I don't know,

899
00:46:58,160 --> 00:47:00,520
Speaker 2: I hope. So I think at this stage my life,

900
00:47:00,719 --> 00:47:02,680
Speaker 2: I like to think that I'm more confident and go,

901
00:47:03,400 --> 00:47:05,279
Speaker 2: I deserved this, and I want to do it.

902
00:47:05,320 --> 00:47:06,759
Speaker 3: I want to keep doing it. And I reckon I could.

903
00:47:06,880 --> 00:47:08,520
Speaker 3: I reckon I could do it and not do a

904
00:47:08,840 --> 00:47:10,000
Speaker 3: totally shit job at it.

905
00:47:11,320 --> 00:47:13,959
Speaker 1: I think you've got enough form to show that once

906
00:47:14,040 --> 00:47:16,800
Speaker 1: permission is given that you'll deliver.

907
00:47:17,160 --> 00:47:18,800
Speaker 3: It's only taken forty years.

908
00:47:19,040 --> 00:47:22,720
Speaker 1: It's okay, that's sometimes that's what it takes. Yeah. Yeah,

909
00:47:22,760 --> 00:47:27,560
Speaker 1: but that's also like that permission can be given by you.

910
00:47:29,680 --> 00:47:30,560
Speaker 3: That's a big point.

911
00:47:30,840 --> 00:47:31,200
Speaker 1: Yeah.

912
00:47:31,280 --> 00:47:31,640
Speaker 3: Yeah.

913
00:47:32,360 --> 00:47:36,160
Speaker 1: I was in a very similar boat. Yeah. I was

914
00:47:36,239 --> 00:47:39,759
Speaker 1: developing formats TV formats in the States. Yeah, and so

915
00:47:39,800 --> 00:47:41,200
Speaker 1: I've got this idea of it. Look, I'm not a

916
00:47:41,640 --> 00:47:44,760
Speaker 1: show careert. I'm an executive producer. And my friend Kiran

917
00:47:45,600 --> 00:47:48,960
Speaker 1: and he just leaned over to me, I'm going to

918
00:47:48,960 --> 00:47:51,319
Speaker 1: touch your shoulder. He leaned over and he goes, you're

919
00:47:51,680 --> 00:47:57,000
Speaker 1: you're a show producer. Yeah, I said, he said, that's it. Yeah.

920
00:47:57,239 --> 00:48:01,480
Speaker 1: Really yeah. And then on the back of that, maybe,

921
00:48:01,680 --> 00:48:03,839
Speaker 1: I don't know, six months later or so, I'm without

922
00:48:03,880 --> 00:48:05,759
Speaker 1: pitching and stuff like that. I was like, the only

923
00:48:05,800 --> 00:48:07,960
Speaker 1: difference between people who've got a podcast in me? Is

924
00:48:07,960 --> 00:48:13,640
Speaker 1: it one day they just started? Huh, I'll just yeah,

925
00:48:14,120 --> 00:48:16,160
Speaker 1: here we are like a thousand episodes.

926
00:48:16,440 --> 00:48:18,879
Speaker 3: Yeah, do you reckon that?

927
00:48:19,000 --> 00:48:22,400
Speaker 2: There's a It's it's a bit of an Australian thing

928
00:48:22,400 --> 00:48:26,720
Speaker 2: as well, because compared to the because you've you've obviously

929
00:48:26,760 --> 00:48:29,239
Speaker 2: lived in la for so long and now I'm there.

930
00:48:29,960 --> 00:48:32,680
Speaker 2: The confidence that people have there to go, I'm the

931
00:48:32,719 --> 00:48:35,759
Speaker 2: fucking best in the world and you're going to listen

932
00:48:35,760 --> 00:48:36,439
Speaker 2: to what I have to say.

933
00:48:36,480 --> 00:48:38,600
Speaker 3: You know, there's a there's a there's a level of

934
00:48:38,640 --> 00:48:39,640
Speaker 3: confidence there that.

935
00:48:40,320 --> 00:48:43,239
Speaker 1: Yeah, I did encounter. I don't think as a and

936
00:48:43,320 --> 00:48:45,560
Speaker 1: I've had a long time, I think about this a lot. Yeah,

937
00:48:45,560 --> 00:48:49,360
Speaker 1: I think our country is an incredibly innovative place and

938
00:48:50,800 --> 00:48:53,200
Speaker 1: just as much brain power and just as much intellectual

939
00:48:53,239 --> 00:48:57,480
Speaker 1: capital as we do mineral resources that we sell. Okay,

940
00:48:57,560 --> 00:49:01,120
Speaker 1: we are a very very, very clever country, yet so

941
00:49:01,280 --> 00:49:06,040
Speaker 1: often we don't back ourselves. Yeah that's changing, thankfully. People

942
00:49:06,120 --> 00:49:12,719
Speaker 1: are doing pretty outlandishly ambitious stuff. But as a general ruler,

943
00:49:12,719 --> 00:49:15,839
Speaker 1: I think we go I don't know, no, no, no, we're

944
00:49:15,840 --> 00:49:17,799
Speaker 1: just down here as Jolia. We can't do that. When

945
00:49:17,840 --> 00:49:23,719
Speaker 1: I got to the States. I understood that success was

946
00:49:23,760 --> 00:49:26,760
Speaker 1: a currency, but also potential of success was a currency,

947
00:49:27,120 --> 00:49:33,560
Speaker 1: and people got a lot of joy and sometimes financial

948
00:49:33,640 --> 00:49:39,239
Speaker 1: reward by backing people early, all right, because I don't know,

949
00:49:39,880 --> 00:49:43,279
Speaker 1: like on a financial level, the property market isn't like

950
00:49:43,360 --> 00:49:45,759
Speaker 1: it is anywhere else in the world as it is here,

951
00:49:45,840 --> 00:49:48,640
Speaker 1: Like our property market is completely fucking rigged in Australia, right,

952
00:49:48,680 --> 00:49:52,400
Speaker 1: So that's where capital goes into real estate in the

953
00:49:52,440 --> 00:49:55,120
Speaker 1: States not the same. You can buy a house for

954
00:49:55,160 --> 00:49:56,880
Speaker 1: a million bucks and sell it ten years later for

955
00:49:56,960 --> 00:49:59,759
Speaker 1: one point one and that's it. So people look for

956
00:49:59,760 --> 00:50:03,600
Speaker 1: the place places to put their money that it will appreciate,

957
00:50:04,040 --> 00:50:06,080
Speaker 1: and so people look for really early stage stuff. They

958
00:50:06,120 --> 00:50:08,040
Speaker 1: can go in a stock market. Yeah, but if they

959
00:50:08,080 --> 00:50:10,560
Speaker 1: go early on and go tell me about your idea. Man,

960
00:50:10,680 --> 00:50:13,479
Speaker 1: you know what, you should meet my friend Lander. She's

961
00:50:13,480 --> 00:50:15,040
Speaker 1: got a thing, right and if you to ever do

962
00:50:15,080 --> 00:50:17,200
Speaker 1: anything to either, you come talk to me because I

963
00:50:17,239 --> 00:50:20,080
Speaker 1: can help you get to there, all right. And that's

964
00:50:20,080 --> 00:50:22,680
Speaker 1: how they get their investment, not just to go you know,

965
00:50:22,880 --> 00:50:24,760
Speaker 1: five percent or ten percent. That's how they get twenty

966
00:50:24,760 --> 00:50:28,000
Speaker 1: forty one hundred x on things. And so that's been

967
00:50:28,040 --> 00:50:31,719
Speaker 1: a part of their culture for so long innovation and

968
00:50:32,840 --> 00:50:35,960
Speaker 1: you know, just back in yourself, and it really is.

969
00:50:36,040 --> 00:50:41,000
Speaker 1: It's just the magic. I'm it. You just touch yourself,

970
00:50:41,040 --> 00:50:42,799
Speaker 1: whatever it is that you want to make, just go.

971
00:50:43,320 --> 00:50:45,760
Speaker 1: I'm it. My old manager has passed away now, amazing

972
00:50:45,800 --> 00:50:47,680
Speaker 1: by John Ferreder. He said, someone's going to write the

973
00:50:47,680 --> 00:50:49,560
Speaker 1: next number one single. Someone's going to write the next

974
00:50:49,640 --> 00:50:52,800
Speaker 1: number one single. It may as well be you. Why

975
00:50:53,000 --> 00:50:56,600
Speaker 1: should it not be? Go ahead? Someone sat down at

976
00:50:56,640 --> 00:50:59,080
Speaker 1: it with a guitar or a piano and started, Yep,

977
00:51:00,160 --> 00:51:02,920
Speaker 1: there's nothing special about them. An it's more different than you.

978
00:51:02,920 --> 00:51:04,520
Speaker 1: You know, the same chords, you know, the same melodies.

979
00:51:06,400 --> 00:51:08,520
Speaker 3: Seriously, that's it.

980
00:51:09,040 --> 00:51:11,359
Speaker 1: I need to know that, and now I do. Yeah,

981
00:51:11,440 --> 00:51:12,360
Speaker 1: so I'll just start.

982
00:51:13,960 --> 00:51:17,160
Speaker 3: That's what it is, isn't it. It's that I can

983
00:51:17,200 --> 00:51:17,759
Speaker 3: go get them.

984
00:51:17,920 --> 00:51:22,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like what you're doing right now. Who knows?

985
00:51:22,480 --> 00:51:24,799
Speaker 1: Like I'm touch with whatever. I don't believe in any

986
00:51:24,800 --> 00:51:27,600
Speaker 1: of that. But everything's going to be great. Yeah, there's

987
00:51:27,640 --> 00:51:31,160
Speaker 1: going to be wild problems that you two three face

988
00:51:31,560 --> 00:51:33,200
Speaker 1: all right with a year from now you be like

989
00:51:33,280 --> 00:51:38,359
Speaker 1: what the fuck? But you believe that you will all

990
00:51:38,360 --> 00:51:40,919
Speaker 1: figure it out. Yeah, and that's not going to stop

991
00:51:40,960 --> 00:51:43,759
Speaker 1: you yeah, and that's really all it is. That's the

992
00:51:44,200 --> 00:51:46,120
Speaker 1: that's the secret source if anything is. But I do

993
00:51:46,239 --> 00:51:49,080
Speaker 1: notice that it is changing a lot here in I

994
00:51:49,120 --> 00:51:54,200
Speaker 1: think the text the tech sector has a lot to

995
00:51:54,239 --> 00:51:57,080
Speaker 1: be grateful for around that because VC money sometimes comes

996
00:51:57,120 --> 00:52:00,200
Speaker 1: from overseas, and that's the way that vcs work there.

997
00:52:00,200 --> 00:52:01,719
Speaker 1: They're like, come on, tell me what you got, show

998
00:52:01,760 --> 00:52:03,880
Speaker 1: me this for me that and so because of the

999
00:52:04,040 --> 00:52:06,080
Speaker 1: kind of silicon belly into connectedness, I think there's a

1000
00:52:06,080 --> 00:52:09,200
Speaker 1: bit of that there, but it's very different. So growing

1001
00:52:09,239 --> 00:52:11,120
Speaker 1: up in Brisbane where you never put your hand up

1002
00:52:11,120 --> 00:52:11,840
Speaker 1: and said I can do this.

1003
00:52:12,880 --> 00:52:16,040
Speaker 2: Yeah fuck no, no, no, not at all. You're you know,

1004
00:52:17,040 --> 00:52:19,759
Speaker 2: I think I do. I do think that that sort

1005
00:52:19,800 --> 00:52:21,440
Speaker 2: of tall poppy syndrome stuff.

1006
00:52:22,000 --> 00:52:25,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, it doesn't service what's like, what's like Anny, what

1007
00:52:25,320 --> 00:52:26,799
Speaker 1: does magnet say about it? Hey?

1008
00:52:27,120 --> 00:52:30,080
Speaker 2: I think it's actually very similar to Australia really yeah

1009
00:52:30,120 --> 00:52:34,240
Speaker 2: in that but even it's almost like and the industry

1010
00:52:34,280 --> 00:52:38,000
Speaker 2: is even smaller. So I think for him growing up,

1011
00:52:38,480 --> 00:52:44,120
Speaker 2: he strived to sort of want to play in like

1012
00:52:44,160 --> 00:52:46,560
Speaker 2: the big pools opposed to being in like the kiddie pool.

1013
00:52:46,560 --> 00:52:48,759
Speaker 2: He was like, I could just play here for a

1014
00:52:48,800 --> 00:52:51,959
Speaker 2: really long time, and everyone's really nice to each other

1015
00:52:52,120 --> 00:52:54,440
Speaker 2: and no one says rude things, and.

1016
00:52:54,400 --> 00:52:56,759
Speaker 1: No one sounds like the FM radio scene in Adelaide. Yeah,

1017
00:52:57,000 --> 00:52:57,760
Speaker 1: no one ever leaves.

1018
00:52:57,880 --> 00:53:00,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's like, no one ever leaves, No one ever

1019
00:53:01,000 --> 00:53:04,279
Speaker 2: aims that high, like a global scale of things. But

1020
00:53:04,400 --> 00:53:08,400
Speaker 2: if I go to America and you know, do music

1021
00:53:08,560 --> 00:53:12,480
Speaker 2: and try and make it with bigger artists, then I

1022
00:53:12,480 --> 00:53:16,000
Speaker 2: could either fail miserably or I could find out what

1023
00:53:16,000 --> 00:53:17,719
Speaker 2: else is out there. And I think that it's going

1024
00:53:17,800 --> 00:53:21,080
Speaker 2: to be for me. I think it's going to be better. Yeah,

1025
00:53:21,160 --> 00:53:23,200
Speaker 2: and it paid off and now he's been there for

1026
00:53:23,320 --> 00:53:23,920
Speaker 2: ten years.

1027
00:53:24,080 --> 00:53:25,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, you learn no matter what.

1028
00:53:25,640 --> 00:53:26,040
Speaker 3: Yeah.

1029
00:53:26,120 --> 00:53:27,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, if you keep doing the same, you do what

1030
00:53:27,880 --> 00:53:30,000
Speaker 1: you've always done, you'll get your what you always get it. Yeah,

1031
00:53:30,200 --> 00:53:34,920
Speaker 1: that's it. But I'm somebody that I require, I require

1032
00:53:34,920 --> 00:53:41,440
Speaker 1: a little more stimulation. Yeah that there's certain diagnosed reasons why.

1033
00:53:41,840 --> 00:53:45,879
Speaker 1: But you know it's different brains do different things. Yeah.

1034
00:53:46,560 --> 00:53:48,759
Speaker 1: Is he had a like super I mean now fascinative,

1035
00:53:49,080 --> 00:53:51,319
Speaker 1: like is it like okay, it'd better be a number

1036
00:53:51,360 --> 00:53:53,680
Speaker 1: one dance pop smash because you're Norwegian?

1037
00:53:54,440 --> 00:54:00,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, fortunately, and unfortunately it's like the oh it's so

1038
00:54:00,560 --> 00:54:02,799
Speaker 2: you know, we talk about it a lot. It's that

1039
00:54:02,960 --> 00:54:07,400
Speaker 2: sort of thing that drives you forward to be to

1040
00:54:07,480 --> 00:54:11,160
Speaker 2: try and be the best, and you're competing with the best,

1041
00:54:11,320 --> 00:54:14,479
Speaker 2: and you know you don't want to do anything that's

1042
00:54:14,520 --> 00:54:16,480
Speaker 2: not going to be totally worth your time in a

1043
00:54:16,600 --> 00:54:21,799
Speaker 2: financial and credit way. So if we're going to do

1044
00:54:21,840 --> 00:54:23,840
Speaker 2: this song, we've got to get the biggest artist on it,

1045
00:54:23,880 --> 00:54:25,520
Speaker 2: and we want to get the collaborator, and we want

1046
00:54:25,520 --> 00:54:28,600
Speaker 2: to make sure that goes number one, and that's so

1047
00:54:28,760 --> 00:54:32,520
Speaker 2: much pressure and so it's that thing that drives you

1048
00:54:32,600 --> 00:54:35,920
Speaker 2: to full success. But it's also the reason that people

1049
00:54:35,960 --> 00:54:40,680
Speaker 2: are fucking stressed there. The hustle culture is real, and

1050
00:54:40,719 --> 00:54:44,400
Speaker 2: it feels like sometimes we talk about his work and

1051
00:54:44,440 --> 00:54:49,759
Speaker 2: it's like sometimes he can feel like he's failing if

1052
00:54:49,880 --> 00:54:54,560
Speaker 2: a song is like isn't number one and it is

1053
00:54:54,640 --> 00:54:58,920
Speaker 2: only a number ten or twenty or something, And I'm like,

1054
00:54:59,640 --> 00:55:02,600
Speaker 2: think about you when you were in Norway and you

1055
00:55:02,640 --> 00:55:05,920
Speaker 2: were your biggest dream was to produce for these artists,

1056
00:55:05,960 --> 00:55:09,040
Speaker 2: and now you've you've you've done it, and get some

1057
00:55:09,160 --> 00:55:10,399
Speaker 2: perspective and have a.

1058
00:55:10,320 --> 00:55:11,360
Speaker 3: Bit of gratitude.

1059
00:55:11,360 --> 00:55:14,520
Speaker 2: And so we we we have our respective like psychologists

1060
00:55:14,520 --> 00:55:18,040
Speaker 2: that we've worked with levels of self worth and validation.

1061
00:55:18,200 --> 00:55:20,319
Speaker 1: But it helps when your name is Magnus and you

1062
00:55:20,320 --> 00:55:22,919
Speaker 1: walk in the studio and he's got a fantastic swork

1063
00:55:22,920 --> 00:55:23,400
Speaker 1: to collection.

1064
00:55:23,640 --> 00:55:26,799
Speaker 3: He does many a sweater, many.

1065
00:55:26,640 --> 00:55:27,319
Speaker 1: I can knit.

1066
00:55:27,880 --> 00:55:32,640
Speaker 2: Boy, oh boy, I've got some of those sweaters, Christmas sweaters,

1067
00:55:33,320 --> 00:55:34,480
Speaker 2: all of those the greatest.

1068
00:55:34,760 --> 00:55:37,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, but isn't that interesting even at the top is

1069
00:55:37,520 --> 00:55:39,959
Speaker 1: to the top, top top, it's the same ship.

1070
00:55:40,640 --> 00:55:42,759
Speaker 3: Oh he's still like.

1071
00:55:44,719 --> 00:55:47,279
Speaker 2: You know, And that's how we were saying earlier to

1072
00:55:47,800 --> 00:55:50,520
Speaker 2: unlearn that sort of if this goes number one, then

1073
00:55:50,520 --> 00:55:52,440
Speaker 2: I'll be happy. And it's like, no, You've got to

1074
00:55:52,480 --> 00:55:55,080
Speaker 2: be fucking happy today right now.

1075
00:55:55,239 --> 00:55:56,359
Speaker 1: That's really all there.

1076
00:55:56,520 --> 00:56:01,239
Speaker 3: Look at his sweet great coffee. Is We're good.

1077
00:56:02,040 --> 00:56:04,719
Speaker 1: All we have is now. That is literally, this is

1078
00:56:04,760 --> 00:56:09,480
Speaker 1: all we've got, and it is being present is Sometimes

1079
00:56:09,480 --> 00:56:14,400
Speaker 1: it's hard, particularly when things are overwhelming, things like COVID

1080
00:56:14,480 --> 00:56:16,640
Speaker 1: or if in my case, when my brain wasn't working

1081
00:56:16,640 --> 00:56:20,120
Speaker 1: properly and I couldn't actually be in this moment. But

1082
00:56:20,800 --> 00:56:24,600
Speaker 1: it takes work. But once you get there, then you

1083
00:56:24,640 --> 00:56:27,799
Speaker 1: have possibility and you can make a choice. You can

1084
00:56:27,800 --> 00:56:29,640
Speaker 1: make a choice that isn't based in a future fear

1085
00:56:29,760 --> 00:56:30,600
Speaker 1: or a past regret.

1086
00:56:31,200 --> 00:56:36,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, sometimes it's so hard because that physicality of like, I.

1087
00:56:36,640 --> 00:56:41,040
Speaker 3: Don't know, stress, that stress there can be so visceral.

1088
00:56:43,040 --> 00:56:47,279
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, I'm a downregulated kind of guy. A

1089
00:56:47,280 --> 00:56:50,040
Speaker 1: lot of breathing, yes, in that sort of quite a

1090
00:56:50,040 --> 00:56:52,400
Speaker 1: bit breathing. You know.

1091
00:56:52,440 --> 00:56:55,160
Speaker 2: There's times when if Magnus has felt stressed, he's like

1092
00:56:55,360 --> 00:57:00,960
Speaker 2: to you know, like touch you know, the things noticed,

1093
00:57:01,480 --> 00:57:02,560
Speaker 2: things like that, and.

1094
00:57:02,480 --> 00:57:04,120
Speaker 1: Then talking my language.

1095
00:57:04,120 --> 00:57:06,960
Speaker 3: Mate, Yeah that's all, And I'm like, put your phone on,

1096
00:57:07,000 --> 00:57:07,600
Speaker 3: do not disturb.

1097
00:57:07,680 --> 00:57:09,799
Speaker 1: Oh, you totally go for a walk.

1098
00:57:10,560 --> 00:57:13,360
Speaker 3: Just don't listen to your manager for five minutes.

1099
00:57:14,440 --> 00:57:18,840
Speaker 1: What would you say to people who've never engaged with

1100
00:57:19,240 --> 00:57:23,720
Speaker 1: therapy or might be relating to the pattern of relationships

1101
00:57:23,720 --> 00:57:25,680
Speaker 1: you were describing earlier, what would you say to them

1102
00:57:25,720 --> 00:57:27,600
Speaker 1: about maybe I talk to somebody.

1103
00:57:28,320 --> 00:57:33,680
Speaker 3: Oh, best thing I ever did. It was the best

1104
00:57:33,680 --> 00:57:34,479
Speaker 3: thing I ever did.

1105
00:57:35,120 --> 00:57:39,400
Speaker 2: And it wasn't like I was rolling around arriving on

1106
00:57:39,440 --> 00:57:44,080
Speaker 2: the floor in a complete tragic state of what has

1107
00:57:44,120 --> 00:57:49,560
Speaker 2: happened to my life. But I could feel that something

1108
00:57:49,720 --> 00:57:52,840
Speaker 2: was brewing and something wasn't right. And I remember talking

1109
00:57:52,840 --> 00:57:56,680
Speaker 2: to my friend Michael about it and saying, I can

1110
00:57:56,720 --> 00:57:59,880
Speaker 2: feel that I'm I'm not my best self and that

1111
00:58:00,880 --> 00:58:04,360
Speaker 2: doubt starting to creep in. I'm feeling a bit sad.

1112
00:58:05,720 --> 00:58:07,760
Speaker 2: Can you help me find someone to talk to? Because

1113
00:58:07,760 --> 00:58:10,000
Speaker 2: he had a few people that he was going to recommend,

1114
00:58:11,680 --> 00:58:16,880
Speaker 2: and I just remember talking it through with my psychologists,

1115
00:58:16,960 --> 00:58:21,439
Speaker 2: a clinical psychologist that I ended up finding Olivia, and

1116
00:58:23,280 --> 00:58:27,960
Speaker 2: it helped me so much in terms of giving me

1117
00:58:29,080 --> 00:58:34,280
Speaker 2: the emotional self awareness to understand what was going on

1118
00:58:35,200 --> 00:58:36,560
Speaker 2: and my.

1119
00:58:38,160 --> 00:58:42,640
Speaker 3: Patterns of how I'd been feeling for a very long time.

1120
00:58:43,880 --> 00:58:47,920
Speaker 2: And she also gave me something that I really value

1121
00:58:48,720 --> 00:58:51,160
Speaker 2: just because of my character, which is that she also

1122
00:58:51,200 --> 00:58:53,080
Speaker 2: gave me really pragmatic advice.

1123
00:58:54,480 --> 00:58:57,040
Speaker 3: You can do this. Why don't you try doing these

1124
00:58:57,160 --> 00:58:58,280
Speaker 3: three things a day.

1125
00:58:58,640 --> 00:58:59,960
Speaker 1: I do love a takeaway.

1126
00:59:00,320 --> 00:59:01,840
Speaker 3: I love a takeaway.

1127
00:59:02,080 --> 00:59:04,880
Speaker 2: I was like, you give you know because of the

1128
00:59:04,880 --> 00:59:06,280
Speaker 2: way I'd grown up, or I was like, you give

1129
00:59:06,280 --> 00:59:08,760
Speaker 2: me a task and I will do it. So if

1130
00:59:08,760 --> 00:59:10,960
Speaker 2: you give me homework, if you told me to journal

1131
00:59:11,000 --> 00:59:15,640
Speaker 2: each day, if you you know I'm really worried about us,

1132
00:59:16,160 --> 00:59:18,880
Speaker 2: you know, having a child. Okay, I will look into

1133
00:59:18,880 --> 00:59:20,680
Speaker 2: egg freezing and I will. You know, you give me

1134
00:59:20,760 --> 00:59:25,280
Speaker 2: practical advice and I can sit and also emotionally reflect

1135
00:59:25,320 --> 00:59:29,960
Speaker 2: on what's happening, the amount of growth that I maybe

1136
00:59:30,000 --> 00:59:31,640
Speaker 2: never would have gotten to, but if I did, it'd

1137
00:59:31,640 --> 00:59:33,960
Speaker 2: probably take me another twenty five years to get to

1138
00:59:34,080 --> 00:59:37,800
Speaker 2: to understand, you know, where we come from and why

1139
00:59:37,840 --> 00:59:40,600
Speaker 2: we act certain ways. I was able to sort of

1140
00:59:40,680 --> 00:59:44,000
Speaker 2: get there in the space of probably a year, and

1141
00:59:44,320 --> 00:59:48,920
Speaker 2: for that it allows me to live my life so

1142
00:59:49,600 --> 00:59:51,440
Speaker 2: differently and so much happier.

1143
00:59:52,720 --> 00:59:56,040
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, I ended up back on meds when Ordery

1144
00:59:56,120 --> 00:59:58,960
Speaker 1: was pregnant with Wolfgang Wolf meds for quite a while. Yeah,

1145
00:59:59,000 --> 01:00:02,760
Speaker 1: And as the you know, the week's ticked down, I

1146
01:00:02,800 --> 01:00:05,800
Speaker 1: was not doing well. That was quite clear they're not

1147
01:00:05,800 --> 01:00:06,880
Speaker 1: doing well. And she just took one look at me

1148
01:00:06,920 --> 01:00:09,240
Speaker 1: and she's like, I needed to get back. I need

1149
01:00:09,280 --> 01:00:10,600
Speaker 1: to go see your doctor. I need you to get

1150
01:00:10,600 --> 01:00:14,160
Speaker 1: back on mats around. And I'm so glad that she did,

1151
01:00:14,240 --> 01:00:16,080
Speaker 1: because when I'm in it, I don't know that I'm

1152
01:00:16,080 --> 01:00:22,440
Speaker 1: in it. And there's a The worst thing about having

1153
01:00:22,440 --> 01:00:26,600
Speaker 1: small children is not the sleep. It's not everything's covered

1154
01:00:26,600 --> 01:00:31,280
Speaker 1: in avocado when week bis, It's not that it's not anything.

1155
01:00:31,480 --> 01:00:34,479
Speaker 1: They don't do what you tell them, but they will

1156
01:00:34,520 --> 01:00:36,400
Speaker 1: do everything you show them.

1157
01:00:36,680 --> 01:00:37,080
Speaker 4: Mmmm.

1158
01:00:38,320 --> 01:00:40,960
Speaker 1: And you start seeing them do stuff and say stuff

1159
01:00:40,960 --> 01:00:44,080
Speaker 1: that you're like, oh Christ, that's something my fucking dad

1160
01:00:44,160 --> 01:00:47,360
Speaker 1: used to say, and they've copied that mannerism and they've

1161
01:00:47,360 --> 01:00:49,280
Speaker 1: copied that think, oh man, they don't need to go

1162
01:00:49,280 --> 01:00:53,640
Speaker 1: through life with that and that Really, if you're aware

1163
01:00:53,640 --> 01:00:58,640
Speaker 1: of it, it allows you, as a parent, in my experience,

1164
01:00:58,960 --> 01:01:01,400
Speaker 1: to go all right, there's no need for these patterns

1165
01:01:01,440 --> 01:01:03,560
Speaker 1: to continue. I can play a role and there no

1166
01:01:03,640 --> 01:01:06,280
Speaker 1: longer being in the world the way that my parents

1167
01:01:06,280 --> 01:01:08,040
Speaker 1: spoke to each other, in the way that you know,

1168
01:01:08,160 --> 01:01:11,880
Speaker 1: their relationship, you know, ran its course, does not need

1169
01:01:11,920 --> 01:01:14,160
Speaker 1: to perpetuate with this person who has nothing to do

1170
01:01:14,200 --> 01:01:17,280
Speaker 1: with those things. So I'm going to, as you mentioned,

1171
01:01:17,320 --> 01:01:19,200
Speaker 1: try to be a bit aware of what it is

1172
01:01:19,240 --> 01:01:24,040
Speaker 1: that I'm doing and in some ways almost reparent myself

1173
01:01:24,800 --> 01:01:29,600
Speaker 1: talking about it with him or with gen sometimes. But yeah,

1174
01:01:30,000 --> 01:01:33,479
Speaker 1: that's that's kind of it. You know. It's you start

1175
01:01:33,520 --> 01:01:35,320
Speaker 1: to find all these things that fly out of your

1176
01:01:35,320 --> 01:01:39,200
Speaker 1: mouth that you literally haven't because your brain goes, oh,

1177
01:01:39,240 --> 01:01:41,240
Speaker 1: the last time this happened, this was the right thing

1178
01:01:41,280 --> 01:01:42,720
Speaker 1: to say, but that was nine and eighty six.

1179
01:01:42,960 --> 01:01:44,800
Speaker 3: Yeah, oh yeah, it.

1180
01:01:44,760 --> 01:01:47,200
Speaker 1: Doesn't belong here. But this is the thing that's just

1181
01:01:47,240 --> 01:01:50,280
Speaker 1: flown out of my mouth and like, oh, I'm going

1182
01:01:50,360 --> 01:01:52,680
Speaker 1: to sort that out. Yeah, oh, because I had nothing

1183
01:01:52,680 --> 01:01:53,400
Speaker 1: to do with choicing it.

1184
01:01:53,480 --> 01:01:53,640
Speaker 4: Yeah.

1185
01:01:53,720 --> 01:01:56,840
Speaker 2: Yeah. And Magnus knows certain things that I've grown up with,

1186
01:01:56,880 --> 01:01:59,160
Speaker 2: and he's like, you know, when we have our daughter,

1187
01:01:59,200 --> 01:02:01,760
Speaker 2: you're not going to say that those things to her.

1188
01:02:02,440 --> 01:02:04,520
Speaker 3: Are You even said it to me yesterday?

1189
01:02:05,160 --> 01:02:08,320
Speaker 2: And I was like, oh, yeah, I'll make sure not

1190
01:02:08,360 --> 01:02:12,960
Speaker 2: to say that, or I need to stop myself from

1191
01:02:12,960 --> 01:02:16,360
Speaker 2: going into that old school script if you find other

1192
01:02:16,400 --> 01:02:19,160
Speaker 2: things to say right right, because the one thing your

1193
01:02:19,160 --> 01:02:23,200
Speaker 2: brain does which is wild and yeah this is don't.

1194
01:02:23,080 --> 01:02:25,960
Speaker 1: Do this or you're here as it do this. If

1195
01:02:26,000 --> 01:02:28,080
Speaker 1: you say, when you want to do this, do this instead.

1196
01:02:28,280 --> 01:02:32,240
Speaker 1: If you give your brain an option, because if you

1197
01:02:32,280 --> 01:02:37,320
Speaker 1: say don't do this, like great instead. So it's literally

1198
01:02:37,360 --> 01:02:39,680
Speaker 1: and if this then that with wolf for example, if

1199
01:02:39,760 --> 01:02:41,920
Speaker 1: you know when they do stuff, you know they you know,

1200
01:02:42,000 --> 01:02:46,040
Speaker 1: bite and claw and punch whatever, because there's boys, and

1201
01:02:46,200 --> 01:02:47,880
Speaker 1: you just try to tell them the thing to do

1202
01:02:48,040 --> 01:02:51,760
Speaker 1: instead and tell them what to do rather than don't

1203
01:02:51,800 --> 01:02:55,000
Speaker 1: do that. It's like, well, I'm for this is the

1204
01:02:55,040 --> 01:02:57,800
Speaker 1: best idea I've got right now. Give me You got

1205
01:02:57,800 --> 01:02:59,320
Speaker 1: to give them something to give them something to do.

1206
01:03:00,040 --> 01:03:03,840
Speaker 1: That's the choice. Yeah, it's good. Yeah, you're you're about

1207
01:03:03,840 --> 01:03:07,720
Speaker 1: to go down there about down the Maggie the Maggie

1208
01:03:07,760 --> 01:03:09,040
Speaker 1: Dent rabbit hole. It's going to be great.

1209
01:03:11,040 --> 01:03:13,040
Speaker 3: I look, I do look forward to it.

1210
01:03:14,360 --> 01:03:16,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's great. The other thing I'll say it is

1211
01:03:16,720 --> 01:03:21,360
Speaker 1: most definitely put headphones on and play songs.

1212
01:03:22,040 --> 01:03:22,480
Speaker 3: You did that?

1213
01:03:22,800 --> 01:03:25,040
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I did it with my youngest brother. My

1214
01:03:25,080 --> 01:03:30,480
Speaker 1: mom did my mum needed to do it and did it. Yeah,

1215
01:03:30,480 --> 01:03:31,520
Speaker 1: they recognized the song.

1216
01:03:31,600 --> 01:03:34,160
Speaker 3: They do. Yeah, we're wondering about that.

1217
01:03:34,480 --> 01:03:36,480
Speaker 1: It's a trick, like particularly if it's like something that

1218
01:03:36,600 --> 01:03:37,120
Speaker 1: is calming.

1219
01:03:37,560 --> 01:03:41,640
Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, okay. His magnus has been playing. He's been

1220
01:03:41,680 --> 01:03:44,080
Speaker 3: working with a rapper, so he's been playing like the

1221
01:03:44,160 --> 01:03:45,880
Speaker 3: rap beats. And I'm like, I don't know how calming

1222
01:03:45,920 --> 01:03:48,960
Speaker 3: that is for her, but who knows. Maybe she loves it.

1223
01:03:49,200 --> 01:03:52,439
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, whatever, Yeah, you play a song and then

1224
01:03:52,560 --> 01:03:55,960
Speaker 1: that's amazing. Yeah. And then when I knew someone who

1225
01:03:55,960 --> 01:04:01,320
Speaker 1: would sit with a bluetooth speaker, when she said, across legged,

1226
01:04:01,520 --> 01:04:03,160
Speaker 1: she put the bluetooth speaker in front of a belly

1227
01:04:03,160 --> 01:04:05,600
Speaker 1: button and play this one particular song. And then when

1228
01:04:05,640 --> 01:04:07,960
Speaker 1: baby was born, they'd play this song and baby were

1229
01:04:08,000 --> 01:04:09,680
Speaker 1: just calm because that's oh, this is the sound of

1230
01:04:09,880 --> 01:04:12,960
Speaker 1: really yeah, wild right.

1231
01:04:13,240 --> 01:04:16,160
Speaker 2: That is what that's brainwashing, that's the whatever it is

1232
01:04:16,800 --> 01:04:19,160
Speaker 2: where they're like, this is the song that will get you,

1233
01:04:19,320 --> 01:04:20,240
Speaker 2: turn you into the thing.

1234
01:04:20,520 --> 01:04:23,600
Speaker 1: It's like anything. It's when you when you hear Chasing

1235
01:04:23,600 --> 01:04:25,480
Speaker 1: Cards and snow Patrol, you remembering the text and.

1236
01:04:25,480 --> 01:04:28,000
Speaker 3: Digit I'm remembering you know all of it.

1237
01:04:28,200 --> 01:04:31,320
Speaker 2: I'm hearing Phoenix too Young and I'm going good.

1238
01:04:32,120 --> 01:04:35,640
Speaker 1: Yes, really underrated. This has been wonderful. Thank you so

1239
01:04:35,720 --> 01:04:36,320
Speaker 1: much for coming.

1240
01:04:36,640 --> 01:04:40,400
Speaker 3: Thank you for having me, and for the parenting texts.

1241
01:04:40,800 --> 01:04:42,959
Speaker 3: I'm I can't wait to get more.

1242
01:04:43,280 --> 01:04:45,280
Speaker 1: I'm around if you need me, but there's plenty of

1243
01:04:45,280 --> 01:04:46,880
Speaker 1: other people. It's a wild time.

1244
01:04:47,760 --> 01:04:50,640
Speaker 2: Oh thanks for having us, I should say, because she's

1245
01:04:50,680 --> 01:04:53,520
Speaker 2: in here and she's grumbling and he's.

1246
01:04:53,400 --> 01:04:56,280
Speaker 1: Doing the double cup right now. It's the double cup.

1247
01:04:56,560 --> 01:04:58,040
Speaker 3: When you hold the belly.

1248
01:05:00,280 --> 01:05:03,640
Speaker 1: Well, you're not in a linen shirt, so you know.

1249
01:05:03,760 --> 01:05:06,360
Speaker 2: To be honest, she actually just feels like gas most

1250
01:05:06,400 --> 01:05:09,240
Speaker 2: of the time. Yes, it's like a little farty bomb

1251
01:05:09,280 --> 01:05:09,880
Speaker 2: that's in there.

1252
01:05:10,320 --> 01:05:12,840
Speaker 1: Man, that's all part of it. It's the best ever.

1253
01:05:14,440 --> 01:05:17,440
Speaker 1: And that was Linda Mariano. The podcast that she's got,

1254
01:05:18,040 --> 01:05:20,360
Speaker 1: the one that won all the awards, and I think

1255
01:05:20,400 --> 01:05:22,800
Speaker 1: there might even be an episode with this guy coming

1256
01:05:22,880 --> 01:05:25,919
Speaker 1: up shortly. The podcast is called Tough Love, and she's

1257
01:05:25,920 --> 01:05:28,840
Speaker 1: got a book called Love Language, which is out right now.

1258
01:05:28,880 --> 01:05:31,760
Speaker 1: What a glorious story. When she was telling me that

1259
01:05:31,840 --> 01:05:37,040
Speaker 1: first kiss part, I swear man like, I've just got goosebumps,

1260
01:05:37,880 --> 01:05:40,680
Speaker 1: and it made me think about my first kiss with

1261
01:05:40,720 --> 01:05:43,280
Speaker 1: my wife, Audrey, and I hope you thought about your

1262
01:05:43,280 --> 01:05:46,320
Speaker 1: first kiss too. It was so glorious. My heart just

1263
01:05:46,760 --> 01:05:52,280
Speaker 1: skipped a beat, a perfectly eq Roland eight kick drum

1264
01:05:52,320 --> 01:05:54,520
Speaker 1: at one hundred and thirty five beats a minute through

1265
01:05:54,520 --> 01:06:01,200
Speaker 1: some serl and Vagan w bins a beat. Yeah, it's delightful.

1266
01:06:01,960 --> 01:06:03,880
Speaker 1: Hope you enjoyed that. Please let someone know about the

1267
01:06:03,880 --> 01:06:05,880
Speaker 1: show if it helps you out, it would be really

1268
01:06:05,920 --> 01:06:07,320
Speaker 1: good for us. That's a really easy way that you

1269
01:06:07,400 --> 01:06:09,320
Speaker 1: can help us out here. Thanks to everyone to helping

1270
01:06:09,320 --> 01:06:11,520
Speaker 1: you make the show today. Andy Maher on audio post,

1271
01:06:11,600 --> 01:06:13,760
Speaker 1: Mikey Ward did video post to Hi to made all

1272
01:06:13,800 --> 01:06:16,960
Speaker 1: the music. Jeaz Vient and Menzies on copy. Monica Chapman

1273
01:06:17,080 --> 01:06:20,920
Speaker 1: produce the episode. Thanks for listening. I'll be back here

1274
01:06:20,960 --> 01:06:23,800
Speaker 1: on Friday, and i'll look forward to your company then