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Speaker 1: Oh here we are. We're back. Everyone, We're back. I

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Speaker 1: was going to start with a bang. I'm going to

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Speaker 1: start low. I normally come in like hey, like that.

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Speaker 1: I'm not doing that today, everyone. I'm just I'm just

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Speaker 1: lulling you in, just with that kind of low key

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Speaker 1: where we're going to build the energy through the show.

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Speaker 1: We don't want to peak too early because otherwise then

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Speaker 1: there's just gradual slide. So I'm just going to calmly

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Speaker 1: and casually say I, tiff, I.

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Speaker 2: Just felt a sense of calm just wash all over me.

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Speaker 1: It's like it's like Jesus is hosting the podcast, isn't it.

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Speaker 1: It's like the Dalai Lama has slipped into the number

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Speaker 1: one seat. Speak pick your favorite guru. How's your day going? Cookie?

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Speaker 1: Yeah good good.

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Speaker 2: Just did some rounds with REXI at the gym. Seventy

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Speaker 2: two years old, firing and like a teenager.

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Speaker 1: How much like you do a lot of of Like

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Speaker 1: you you coach people, you do a bit ofhead stuff,

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Speaker 1: but you also do a lot of practical feed on

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Speaker 1: the ground, face to face training with human strength stuff,

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Speaker 1: conditioning stuff, a lot of boxing stuff. What's your favorite

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Speaker 1: thing to do? Is it? One on one. Is it groups?

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Speaker 1: Is it boxing training? Is it like, I know, you

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Speaker 1: work with a few people with a few issues and

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Speaker 1: you kind of help them through that through almost like

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Speaker 1: physical therapy. What's your favorite face to face thing to do.

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Speaker 2: I like, I like figuring out. I like exploring what's

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Speaker 2: inside people's perceptions and that does that come through on everything?

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Speaker 2: So that doesn't that doesn't matter if it's a boxing session,

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Speaker 2: one on one, a boxing workshop, a mindset session. It's

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Speaker 2: like everything's the metaphor for that. And I feel like

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Speaker 2: that's what I'm like sneaking around DOINGOW and it's and

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Speaker 2: it's fun that because pennies just drop, or you learn

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Speaker 2: something in ways that it's like a puzzle or you

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Speaker 2: see patterns and it's cool. I like that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. I think there's like everything's intertwine. Let's say a

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Speaker 1: load to the dock before we get too deep. Hi Doc,

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Speaker 1: good morning, Good morning. How are you?

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Speaker 3: I'm good for the morning. You know I'm not really

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Speaker 3: a morning person, as you know.

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Speaker 1: Well you look we were saying before we press the

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Speaker 1: go button. Compared to it. I mean this with respect

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Speaker 1: because tips and athletes, So she looks like an athlete

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Speaker 1: and dresses like an athlete. Do you look like a

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Speaker 1: bloody runway model with your hair and your lipstick and

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Speaker 1: you I'm not saying done anything.

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Speaker 3: I just literally got up and put lipstick on.

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Speaker 1: If I'm not saying that you're not glamorous tips.

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Speaker 2: I've worn some red lppy, but at least twice in

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Speaker 2: the last five years.

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Speaker 1: Is that? Because is that? I reckon, we might see

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Speaker 1: a bit more red lippy. Doc. Because somebody doesn't have

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Speaker 1: a boyfriend, nudge, nudgewi we you can invert it. Comments

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Speaker 1: doesn't have a boyfriend? Okay, no, we know you don't,

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Speaker 1: and it's good that you don't have a boyfriend.

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Speaker 3: There's this mental health campaign called Liptember. It's for women's

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Speaker 3: mental health, and I love it because it's it's associated

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Speaker 3: with lipstick. So it's like mental health and lipstick my

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Speaker 3: two favorite things.

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Speaker 1: Well, I better get behind that.

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Speaker 3: I've got like two hundred and fifty shades of lipstick.

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Speaker 3: It's insane, and I always buy more because I'm like, oh,

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Speaker 3: I don't have that exact shade I need read see.

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Speaker 1: I just think that you admitted one of probably one

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Speaker 1: of your numerous psychological issues. It is as a psychologist

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Speaker 1: if somebody rocked up to you and said, I've got

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Speaker 1: two hundred and fifty different colored lipsticks. It's not enough.

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Speaker 1: What would you tell them?

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Speaker 3: I'd say, yeah, I totally get it. What about You're

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Speaker 3: totally fine.

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Speaker 2: The idea of trying to make a decision out of

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Speaker 2: two hundred and fifty colors every single day almost puts

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Speaker 2: me into a state of complete malfunction.

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Speaker 3: Well, I've recently organized them into like the boxes of shade,

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Speaker 3: so I've got brown, orange, pink, and red and so

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Speaker 3: then so I know like which shed I want and

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Speaker 3: then I can pick out of them.

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Speaker 1: Wow, here's a conversation organized chaos. Here's a conversation we've

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Speaker 1: never had on the show. And I'm sure there's a

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Speaker 1: lot there's a lot of people who are probably way

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Speaker 1: more interested than me. I'm interested in the psychology behind it,

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Speaker 1: the lipsticks, but the thinking, well, yeah, that is funny,

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Speaker 1: isn't It's like, I don't know what it is about.

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Speaker 1: I don't know. Do I just not care? Because I

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Speaker 1: essentially wear every day a different black T shirt. And

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Speaker 1: by the way, everyone I do have many ever Last

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Speaker 1: T shirts and many Lonsdale T shirts. They're not the

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Speaker 1: same one and any pairs of cat Go shorts. People

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Speaker 1: think I have like one shirt and one No, I

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Speaker 1: have like twenty or thirty of each. But yeah, what

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Speaker 1: do you think that's about? Doc Where I just don't

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Speaker 1: care what people think about what I wear, Like I

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Speaker 1: at all should I care?

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Speaker 3: It's not part of your sense of identity. But you know,

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Speaker 3: there's probably some aspect that you care about. It might

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Speaker 3: not be your overall like outfit that you care about,

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Speaker 3: but it might be something about how you present yourself

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Speaker 3: to the world. Ay know, like lipsticks obviously super super superficial,

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Speaker 3: but there's something for me or something about like I

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Speaker 3: don't have to have anything else put together my outfit,

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Speaker 3: my hair, but if I have lipstick and I feel

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Speaker 3: okay to present myself to.

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Speaker 1: It is so interesting because like it's my best mate's kid.

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Speaker 1: Shout out to Vincent and Laura, his daughter. She's getting

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Speaker 1: married on the weekend, and I've got a drive to

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Speaker 1: fucking forever away, but very gratefully and happy. And I

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Speaker 1: was just talking to Laura about five minutes ago, who's

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Speaker 1: getting married on Saturday, and I said, I've known her

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Speaker 1: since she was a baby. I've known all these kids

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Speaker 1: since she was a baby, and she's stayed at my

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Speaker 1: joint where I'm at right now multiple times. She was

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Speaker 1: like one of my surrogate daughters growing up. And I go,

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Speaker 1: I don't have to wear a suit, do I? And

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Speaker 1: she goes no, And I go jeans and shirt like,

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Speaker 1: which for me is formal. She goes no. I go,

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Speaker 1: what do you mean no? She goes, well, no blue jeans.

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Speaker 1: She goes, you can wear black jeans and a shirt.

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Speaker 1: I'm like, and I'm thinking, for me, ah, black jeans.

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Speaker 1: I don't have black jeans. Now, I've got to get

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Speaker 1: black jeans. That's like formal. That's like for that, I'm like,

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Speaker 1: it's a nightmare, mate. I think it's probably inherently just laziness.

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Speaker 3: Well, you've just worked out like how you want to live,

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Speaker 3: and that's completely fine, and that's but like in some

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Speaker 3: situations you might have to stretch your.

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Speaker 1: Up, do you know what? I think? To feel free

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Speaker 1: to disagree with this. But because I get up from

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Speaker 1: when I get out, like if I get up at

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Speaker 1: quarter to six ish, which I do most days, I'm

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Speaker 1: at the cafe at quarter past six nearly every day,

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Speaker 1: I meet with somebody to help them a bit, or

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Speaker 1: like an official or unofficial coaching session. If not, I'm writing,

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Speaker 1: I'm working and I'm planning for the day's podcast or

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Speaker 1: the day's coaching sessions, or the day's PhD research or

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Speaker 1: writing or the gig of you know. It's like, there's

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Speaker 1: not a lot of time in my day where I'm

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Speaker 1: doing not much. Like my most downtime in the day

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Speaker 1: is going to the gym, talking shit, lifting a few weights,

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Speaker 1: sliding into the vortex, which is the crab. My training

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Speaker 1: partner's propensity. He could talk. It's funny like if you

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Speaker 1: don't know him, he's like a mute. He's like shy,

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Speaker 1: But once you know him, he does not shut up,

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Speaker 1: which we love him for that. Anyway, I digress, But

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Speaker 1: my long winded point is I just think of all

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Speaker 1: the things I need to invest energy and attention in.

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Speaker 1: I don't want to get up every day and wonder

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Speaker 1: about what I'm going to wear and waste time on that.

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Speaker 1: So I just go shorts, T shirt, runners, you know,

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Speaker 1: hoodie done boom.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. And I'm like that a lot of the time.

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Speaker 3: I mean, look, I actually wear pajamas more than any others.

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Speaker 1: Wo. I wish I had it rocked up with Johnny

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Speaker 1: and Buddy.

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Speaker 3: I very easily could have. I know, it's like it's

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Speaker 3: like ten forty five in the morning, but I didn't

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Speaker 3: have any appointments this morning, so I mean I could

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Speaker 3: have very easily come in my pajamas and had no

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Speaker 3: issue with it at all. I remember once when I

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Speaker 3: had my first daughter, and you know how the maternal

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Speaker 3: well you might not know, but the maternal and child

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Speaker 3: health nurse comes to your house within the first week

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Speaker 3: to check on you. And I it was like two PM,

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Speaker 3: and I answered the door in my pajamas, and I

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Speaker 3: could see that she was worried about me. I'm like, no, no,

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Speaker 3: don't worry. I'm always in my This is not a

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Speaker 3: sign that ye're.

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Speaker 1: Thinking you're not depressed. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm not having postpartum.

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Speaker 1: What is it like that depression is depression? Yeah? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I was good.

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Speaker 3: That's my happy place.

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Speaker 1: I think though maybe I think we spoke about this

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Speaker 1: a little bit before we went live. I think, because

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Speaker 1: I don't know, maybe this is subconscious, but because I

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Speaker 1: used to worry about what I looked like so much,

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Speaker 1: because I was so all about my body for a

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Speaker 1: long time and all about my appearance and what people

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Speaker 1: thought of me, and you know whatever creating what I

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Speaker 1: thought at that time was the body that would I

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Speaker 1: don't know, for God's sake, harps. But anyway, I thought

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Speaker 1: people would like me more or be attracted to me,

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Speaker 1: or impressed by me or something. And so I think

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Speaker 1: I was so intertwined with what I looked like my identity,

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Speaker 1: in my sense of self and self worth and self

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Speaker 1: esteem I embarrassingly now looking back, but it was what

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Speaker 1: it was. I got so much of that through how

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Speaker 1: I looked or how I thought I looked for others,

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Speaker 1: and not that I don't care how I look now,

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Speaker 1: like I want to be in good shock. But maybe

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Speaker 1: it's a pendulum swing from that.

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Speaker 3: Well, I think a lot of us grow up with

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Speaker 3: that in well, we all want kind of the sense

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Speaker 3: of belonging, right, We all want to belong. We all

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Speaker 3: want to be liked and loved and approved of, And

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Speaker 3: unfortunately there's this very high value that society places, not

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Speaker 3: just society necessarily, also it could be friends, family, and

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Speaker 3: other significant people in your life that they place on appearance.

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Speaker 3: So and when you're young, you internalize these messages. I

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Speaker 3: remember being you know, like like I'm from any an

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Speaker 3: Iranian background, and I think there's probably people from lots

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Speaker 3: of backgrounds I can relate to this, but in Iran,

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Speaker 3: like probably the top three values in Iran are education, hospitality,

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Speaker 3: and beauty. Yeah, it's very high on the list, and

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Speaker 3: so it's talked about a lot. And if you don't

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Speaker 3: measure up to those high standards, or you think you don't,

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Speaker 3: then you're gonna it's gonna feel not quite right and

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Speaker 3: you're gonna start being maybe over focused on your appearance

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Speaker 3: or over focused on how you don't measure up. Either way,

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Speaker 3: it doesn't bode well for the future because it's it's

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Speaker 3: really not one of the most important things in life.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, but it is. We do have mixed messages because

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Speaker 1: at the same time, you're right, we go, well, it's

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Speaker 1: you know, it's all about who you are, and it's

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Speaker 1: values and all that, which is true. I know I'm

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Speaker 1: saying that flippantly, but it's true. But at the same time,

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Speaker 1: we do live in a world that rewards beauty.

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Speaker 3: Absolutely, that's very.

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Speaker 1: So it's like, well, you know, if you are and

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Speaker 1: even with kids, we say to little girls and little boys,

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Speaker 1: are you beautiful? You are so gorgeous? Oh my god,

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Speaker 1: look at you and look at you. You're so handsome

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Speaker 1: in you, and everything's about how attractive they are.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it is. It's very true, and it's very hard

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Speaker 3: to protect against that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: I tried really hard with my children. Yes, to not

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Speaker 3: say those types of things is like the kind of

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Speaker 3: first thing or the regular thing. Yes, yes, but you

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Speaker 3: can't control what other people say.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's what.

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Speaker 3: You know, what we see is the kind of the

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Speaker 3: first thing that we kind of comment on often, and

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Speaker 3: that's how we.

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Speaker 1: Look and think about this. If all of a sudden,

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Speaker 1: and this is this was part of the problem for

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Speaker 1: me because I went from being you know, this movedley

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Speaker 1: i bees teenager to being a very fit, very lean

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Speaker 1: a teenager with a much better body than he had

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Speaker 1: a year ago. Then all of a sudden, you're getting

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Speaker 1: accolades and you're getting attention, and you're getting social approval,

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Speaker 1: and you're getting all of a sudden, you know, there

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Speaker 1: were you know, my chances of having a girlfriend when

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Speaker 1: I was fourteen were minus twenty six and then by

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Speaker 1: the time I was fifteen sixteen, it was not altogether zero,

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Speaker 1: you know, So you get a little bit of confidence

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Speaker 1: and a tiny bit of social acceptance and status, because

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Speaker 1: now like, and this is a horrible thing to say,

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Speaker 1: but this is how it felt to me. Now I'm

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Speaker 1: not ugly, I'm getting noticed, right, Yeah, And the truth

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Speaker 1: is I did all of a sudden my body changed.

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Speaker 1: And this is a terrible It was both a great

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Speaker 1: but also terrible experience. I'm more popular now. So you

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Speaker 1: draw this correlation between Oh, when I looked like that,

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Speaker 1: I was not that popular or noticed or accepted or approved.

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Speaker 1: Now I look like this, and this has owt come ergo.

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Speaker 1: You know, I don't know it was correlation or causation.

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Speaker 1: I think it was causation because now I'm like, oh, well,

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Speaker 1: guess what if I look pretty good, I get all

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Speaker 1: these rewards. Imagine if I looked fucking amazing, and then

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Speaker 1: then imagine if I look like a freak. Goddamn freak,

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Speaker 1: you know. And so for me, that just escalated. You're

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Speaker 1: always trying to get I think, well I was. I

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Speaker 1: think we're trying to resolve psychological and emotional issues with

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Speaker 1: a physical, you know, some kind of physical change, and

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Speaker 1: not that you not that I really understood that that age,

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Speaker 1: But that's kind of because acceptance and approval and love

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Speaker 1: like you said, and connection and belonging. I mean, all

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Speaker 1: of those are internal drivers, and we think we're going

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Speaker 1: to meet those needs with bigger biceps or a prettier

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Speaker 1: face or you know, a leader body.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. I actually had a very similar experience to you.

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Speaker 3: Like I was the quintessential nerd in high school and younger.

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Speaker 3: So not just in the fact that I was like

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Speaker 3: a good student, but like I looked like it too,

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Speaker 3: Like I had a very large Diana Prince glasses. Do

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Speaker 3: you know Diana Princes Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, the alter

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Speaker 3: ego wonder Woman. I don't know if you ever watched

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Speaker 3: that show in the eighties, but she had gigantic glass.

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Speaker 1: Linda Carter Carter, Yeah, absolutely, I had a hard crush

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Speaker 1: on Linda. I look up Linda Carter because you're too young,

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Speaker 1: look up Linda Carter wonder Woman. Yeah it's fairy. I

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Speaker 1: may have been madly in love with Linda Catter. So yeah,

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Speaker 1: I had not out of my not out of my

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Speaker 1: leg at all.

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Speaker 3: No one's out of your league, Raig. I had those glasses,

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Speaker 3: I had braces. I was like I was. I was

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Speaker 3: very skinny. I just and I didn't I had my

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Speaker 3: features were too big for my face. I had a

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Speaker 3: very like skinny face as well, and like just very

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Speaker 3: flat hair. I just did it. I mean I just

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Speaker 3: was like, if you looked up nerd in the dictionary,

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Speaker 3: that's what I look like. So when I had my

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Speaker 3: kind of I feel like change positive change in the

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Speaker 3: like if we're going to think of it as positive,

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Speaker 3: which we actually shouldn't, but how I kind of viewed

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Speaker 3: it when I was younger, around that seven sixteen seventeen

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Speaker 3: age and I and at seventeen, I actually went from

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Speaker 3: high school to university, so I had this way of

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Speaker 3: completely reinventing myself. Right nobody knew me I was the

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Speaker 3: nerdy girl from high school. I was like, it's like.

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Speaker 1: A new chapter and you could write whatever you want.

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Speaker 3: And also like I wasn't planning on like changing anything

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Speaker 3: necessarily about how I how I was in the world.

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Speaker 3: But what I noticed was what you noticed. It's like,

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Speaker 3: all of a sudden, all these people are coming at me, yeah,

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Speaker 3: and they're expressing things that I've never heard before, and

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Speaker 3: they're interested in me, and they like somebody asked me

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Speaker 3: out on the first day, and I was like, what

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Speaker 3: is actually happening. I don't understand. So it was just like, yeah, no,

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Speaker 3: it's powerful. It's powerful when you get that overt praise

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Speaker 3: for something like your appearance, because then you can get

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Speaker 3: really sucked into that being the important thing.

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Speaker 1: And then so what is I don't know if the

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Speaker 1: right question is what is the antidote or what is

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Speaker 1: the solution or what is the counterbalance? But I mean,

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Speaker 1: you know, like, and it's probably worse now. I think,

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Speaker 1: like I look at the kids in the gym, like

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Speaker 1: where I train at four o'clock in the afternoon, it's

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Speaker 1: mostly teenagers. Like, it's mostly a few young girls Jamie,

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Speaker 1: my training partner's daughter, and a lot of young teenage boys.

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Speaker 1: Who are you know? I think? And I was the

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Speaker 1: same or worse, but pretty obsessed. And it's on the

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Speaker 1: one hand, you want kids to be fit and strong

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Speaker 1: and to exercise in all of those things, which is great. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and you can't be some old fuck.

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Speaker 4: Going by the way, you know, what you look likes

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Speaker 4: not as important as whether or not you're a good Yeah,

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Speaker 4: they're like fuck off, Grandpa, Like you know, I mean

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Speaker 4: it's because they don't care, not that they don't care

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Speaker 4: what I think.

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Speaker 1: Of course they shouldn't. They don't need to. But what

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Speaker 1: I mean is it's like, yeah, but I get socially

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Speaker 1: rewarded for this, and that's really important. Yeah, Like, the

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Speaker 1: better I look, the better life is for me on

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Speaker 1: a level. And that's an kind of an awkward truth

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Speaker 1: and it shouldn't be that way, and it's not that

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Speaker 1: way for everybody. But look at the you know, like

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Speaker 1: what's happening on social media. You look at a young

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Speaker 1: attractive female, Yeah, she will have lots of followers because

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Speaker 1: she's a young attractive female, not because she's got one

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Speaker 1: hundred and forty IQ or not because she's got necessarily

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Speaker 1: some amazing skill set. She might have all of that,

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Speaker 1: by the way, but or if you're a young dude

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Speaker 1: and you're jacked or you know, it seems that things

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Speaker 1: like whether or not you're a good human, or whether

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Speaker 1: or not you've got great values, whether or not you're

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Speaker 1: brilliant academic, or whether or not you've got an incredible

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Speaker 1: skill set doesn't matter in some areas. It doesn't matter

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Speaker 1: nearly as much if we're being honest, as just what

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Speaker 1: you look like and what people think of what you

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Speaker 1: look like.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, it's really complicated when like you said

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Speaker 3: everything around you was saying it's one of the most

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Speaker 3: important things.

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Speaker 1: Yes, what about you though, in growing up where you

354
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Speaker 1: grew up where you said, Like, it's funny because you

355
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Speaker 1: said one of the priorities in Iran was like beauty,

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Speaker 1: which I understand. I spoke to my mum the other

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Speaker 1: day and she said, what did you She's asked me

358
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Speaker 1: what I did? And I said, I just met with

359
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Speaker 1: someone this morning. And said oh, and i'd met and

360
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Speaker 1: I'd had a coffee with you and said, oh, who's that?

361
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Speaker 1: And I said, oh, lady who does much? You know,

362
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Speaker 1: she's like this Iranian American psych She lives in a

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Speaker 1: She goes, oh my god, Iranian women are so beautiful.

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Speaker 1: That's my mum. I'm like, really, she goes, oh, yeah,

365
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Speaker 1: Iranian women amazing, Like there's this global reputation for yeah,

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Speaker 1: for that. And so when you said that one of

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Speaker 1: the values is beauty, it's like, yeah, I And of

368
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Speaker 1: course there's nothing wrong with being beautiful or handsome or whatever.

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Speaker 1: Of course it's great. But I guess it's about maybe

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Speaker 1: the relationship that we have with beauty.

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Speaker 3: What I mean, when I was growing up, I resented

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Speaker 3: it because I didn't match that idea. So I didn't

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Speaker 3: I the focus on it. I didn't understand it because

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Speaker 3: at that age, I didn't understand that was a high

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Speaker 3: value of my culture. Like I didn't understand why that

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Speaker 3: was always the first thing people said to you. Yes

377
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Speaker 3: you know something about how you looked, or oh you

378
00:21:47,920 --> 00:21:50,000
Speaker 3: lost weight or oh you gain weight, or oh this

379
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Speaker 3: or that. And I know that that's not just part

380
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Speaker 3: of Iranian culture. That's I hear this from so many

381
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Speaker 3: you know, different families and how people are grown up,

382
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Speaker 3: Like it's literally the first thing will people comment on.

383
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Speaker 3: So I think at a really early age, I had

384
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Speaker 3: this kind of sense of I don't think this is right.

385
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Speaker 3: And so when things changed for me in terms of

386
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Speaker 3: appearance and I was getting kind of more approval in

387
00:22:18,680 --> 00:22:24,399
Speaker 3: that area, I still had this sense of, like, this

388
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Speaker 3: isn't the most important thing because I'm not a different

389
00:22:27,680 --> 00:22:34,960
Speaker 3: person like on the inside. Yes, So I think actually

390
00:22:38,560 --> 00:22:43,480
Speaker 3: it took me a while before I really realized even

391
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Speaker 3: like why my family and my family's friends behaved that way,

392
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Speaker 3: because I actually resented it for a long time, Like

393
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Speaker 3: I thought this so wrong for people to like think

394
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Speaker 3: that this is appropriate to make comments about me or

395
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Speaker 3: anybody's appearance or body. And then I actually saw a

396
00:23:04,760 --> 00:23:08,840
Speaker 3: documentary on it was about I think it was about

397
00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:13,520
Speaker 3: plastic surgery or something like that, and how there are

398
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Speaker 3: certain places in the world where it's more prevalent, and

399
00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:19,399
Speaker 3: one of them was Iran, and that the way that

400
00:23:19,440 --> 00:23:23,280
Speaker 3: they viewed it was like with pride, you know, because

401
00:23:23,600 --> 00:23:25,760
Speaker 3: and they like, like, you know, in some places, like

402
00:23:25,840 --> 00:23:28,760
Speaker 3: you want to hide that you have work done, but

403
00:23:28,920 --> 00:23:31,480
Speaker 3: in Iran it's like, no, you want to show that

404
00:23:31,560 --> 00:23:35,960
Speaker 3: you've had it done, because like you're you're looking for

405
00:23:36,200 --> 00:23:40,840
Speaker 3: this kind of ideal, kind of perfection. And I was like, oh,

406
00:23:40,960 --> 00:23:45,560
Speaker 3: I didn't realize that that's how they viewed it. And

407
00:23:45,600 --> 00:23:49,240
Speaker 3: that's the understanding just helped me resent it less, not

408
00:23:49,400 --> 00:23:53,360
Speaker 3: as like a not overall like I still don't think

409
00:23:53,400 --> 00:23:55,679
Speaker 3: that that's a healthy way of being, but like resent

410
00:23:55,720 --> 00:23:57,879
Speaker 3: it from the people from that culture who are making

411
00:23:57,880 --> 00:24:01,160
Speaker 3: those comments, because that's where they came from and that's

412
00:24:01,160 --> 00:24:04,840
Speaker 3: what they've internalized. That's that's where their belief systems came from.

413
00:24:05,320 --> 00:24:09,880
Speaker 3: But I think what's really important is to question all

414
00:24:09,920 --> 00:24:13,840
Speaker 3: of those internalized beliefs and things messages that you've grown

415
00:24:13,920 --> 00:24:17,600
Speaker 3: up with as you get older, because what's really important

416
00:24:18,920 --> 00:24:24,240
Speaker 3: is what we're actually wanting, which is underneath that, which

417
00:24:24,320 --> 00:24:30,240
Speaker 3: is that belonging in that connection and that those positive

418
00:24:30,280 --> 00:24:34,679
Speaker 3: relationships with people. Yeah, that's what we're really wanting.

419
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Speaker 1: Yeah. It's like when we talk about goals, we talk

420
00:24:37,760 --> 00:24:40,359
Speaker 1: about the what and the why. You go, well, what

421
00:24:40,440 --> 00:24:42,600
Speaker 1: I want is I want to be attractive, But what

422
00:24:42,640 --> 00:24:45,480
Speaker 1: you really want is the why. Like my reason to

423
00:24:45,520 --> 00:24:50,720
Speaker 1: be attractive is because I think that being attractive or

424
00:24:50,840 --> 00:24:53,959
Speaker 1: losing weight or whatever, building muscle or whatever is a

425
00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:56,840
Speaker 1: conduit to the thing that I want, which is love, connection,

426
00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:06,360
Speaker 1: like approval, tension, approval, all of those things. So how

427
00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:12,800
Speaker 1: do we how do we? Like, does identity matter? Like

428
00:25:13,040 --> 00:25:16,760
Speaker 1: we we the sense of self that I have or

429
00:25:16,840 --> 00:25:22,960
Speaker 1: you have that I think my identity I don't know,

430
00:25:23,520 --> 00:25:27,080
Speaker 1: like I care. I mean if I didn't say, if

431
00:25:27,119 --> 00:25:29,000
Speaker 1: I said I don't care about what people think of me,

432
00:25:29,040 --> 00:25:32,200
Speaker 1: that would be a lie. I'm not. I'm not obsessed

433
00:25:32,240 --> 00:25:35,040
Speaker 1: with it. I'm not wildly insecure about it like I

434
00:25:35,119 --> 00:25:39,199
Speaker 1: once was. Like I care, of course, of course, and

435
00:25:39,280 --> 00:25:41,400
Speaker 1: I can still get my feelings hurt, and I can

436
00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:48,280
Speaker 1: still get upset and all of those things. But is

437
00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:53,400
Speaker 1: it worth thinking about as us as individuals where our

438
00:25:53,480 --> 00:25:57,560
Speaker 1: sense of self and identity comes from? Is that that

439
00:25:57,760 --> 00:26:01,640
Speaker 1: is that a worthwhile kind of so ecological rabbit hole

440
00:26:01,720 --> 00:26:04,720
Speaker 1: to go down, for sure?

441
00:26:04,920 --> 00:26:07,639
Speaker 3: I think we should we I think I see a

442
00:26:07,680 --> 00:26:11,000
Speaker 3: lot of people who come you know, as like IM

443
00:26:11,119 --> 00:26:13,520
Speaker 3: for listeners who don't know, I'm not sure if we said,

444
00:26:13,520 --> 00:26:16,320
Speaker 3: but I'm a clinical psychologist, so I see people on

445
00:26:16,359 --> 00:26:19,600
Speaker 3: an individual basis. A lot of people come in with

446
00:26:20,119 --> 00:26:24,280
Speaker 3: issues around self worth, right, a lot of people. And

447
00:26:24,400 --> 00:26:26,960
Speaker 3: one of the things that we do together that they

448
00:26:27,400 --> 00:26:33,040
Speaker 3: may not have done at all before, or have maybe

449
00:26:33,040 --> 00:26:35,560
Speaker 3: done it a little bit but not enough, is really

450
00:26:35,680 --> 00:26:40,199
Speaker 3: question where their values and beliefs come from, right, and

451
00:26:40,320 --> 00:26:44,760
Speaker 3: whether they want to have those values and beliefs still, yes,

452
00:26:45,119 --> 00:26:51,480
Speaker 3: because we grow up with you know, we're all brainwashed, right,

453
00:26:51,560 --> 00:26:55,240
Speaker 3: and we're like where we grow up in a particular family,

454
00:26:55,320 --> 00:26:58,280
Speaker 3: in a particular society, and we're not born with all

455
00:26:58,320 --> 00:27:05,600
Speaker 3: of these ideas. We learn them over time, and some

456
00:27:05,680 --> 00:27:09,120
Speaker 3: of those messages that we get are going to help

457
00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:13,760
Speaker 3: us develop a strong identity and a healthy identity and

458
00:27:13,920 --> 00:27:19,600
Speaker 3: others may not. And what can happen as we just

459
00:27:20,080 --> 00:27:22,600
Speaker 3: well as a children, we just internalize whatever ideas are

460
00:27:22,640 --> 00:27:28,600
Speaker 3: significant others in part to us without question because we

461
00:27:28,640 --> 00:27:32,000
Speaker 3: trust that that's what they're telling us and what they're

462
00:27:32,040 --> 00:27:36,920
Speaker 3: showing us is right. But we can go through life

463
00:27:37,000 --> 00:27:38,280
Speaker 3: and never question that.

464
00:27:39,760 --> 00:27:42,359
Speaker 1: Well, I think one of the interesting yeah, I agree

465
00:27:42,400 --> 00:27:44,439
Speaker 1: with all that. We talk about this a bit here,

466
00:27:44,520 --> 00:27:48,800
Speaker 1: like when you think about your current beliefs and then

467
00:27:48,840 --> 00:27:52,879
Speaker 1: you think about when you chose them. Yeah, that's people go,

468
00:27:53,000 --> 00:27:56,200
Speaker 1: what when did you choose that? When did you when

469
00:27:56,240 --> 00:27:58,680
Speaker 1: did you decide that that was true for you? Well,

470
00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:02,560
Speaker 1: that was, you know, was the right belief And people like,

471
00:28:02,640 --> 00:28:08,680
Speaker 1: well what, because we don't We essentially just adopt, like

472
00:28:08,760 --> 00:28:11,359
Speaker 1: you said, the people in our world that we listen to,

473
00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:14,840
Speaker 1: that we respect, that we're around, maybe even some of

474
00:28:14,880 --> 00:28:17,440
Speaker 1: the people we don't fucking like, but we're around them.

475
00:28:18,040 --> 00:28:21,879
Speaker 1: They tell me I'm shit, you're shit, You're worthless. You

476
00:28:22,000 --> 00:28:24,760
Speaker 1: tell me that a thousand times, and I'm a child.

477
00:28:25,320 --> 00:28:28,639
Speaker 1: Well I believe it now because that's the messaging I'm getting.

478
00:28:29,400 --> 00:28:32,080
Speaker 1: And I never chose to have that belief. I just

479
00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:36,120
Speaker 1: have that belief as a byproduct, as a terrible byproduct

480
00:28:36,240 --> 00:28:40,160
Speaker 1: of a horrible situation, or as you said, as you said,

481
00:28:40,800 --> 00:28:43,880
Speaker 1: you know some of them serve us and positively, and

482
00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:46,920
Speaker 1: some of them don't. But it's like, yeah, when do

483
00:28:47,040 --> 00:28:50,880
Speaker 1: we do It's almost like when do we do a

484
00:28:50,920 --> 00:28:54,520
Speaker 1: stock take on our own beliefs? When do we kind

485
00:28:54,520 --> 00:28:56,880
Speaker 1: of put them up on the metaphoric hoist like the

486
00:28:56,960 --> 00:29:00,200
Speaker 1: car and the garage and walk around that belief and

487
00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:02,760
Speaker 1: kick the tires and fucking lift up the hood and go,

488
00:29:03,640 --> 00:29:05,480
Speaker 1: I don't know if this works for me? Like is

489
00:29:05,560 --> 00:29:09,200
Speaker 1: this actually? Do I believe in this? And if I do,

490
00:29:09,360 --> 00:29:12,960
Speaker 1: why do I believe it? Where did the belief come from? Yeah?

491
00:29:13,320 --> 00:29:17,320
Speaker 1: Is there any chance that this belief could be bullshit? Yeah?

492
00:29:17,360 --> 00:29:19,360
Speaker 3: I think that you can do that at any time

493
00:29:19,360 --> 00:29:22,040
Speaker 3: in your life, Like it's never too late, but I

494
00:29:22,080 --> 00:29:25,520
Speaker 3: think as early as possible. And maybe, and you know,

495
00:29:25,680 --> 00:29:29,320
Speaker 3: probably we should in the way that we raise our children.

496
00:29:29,480 --> 00:29:37,240
Speaker 3: We should be asking questions rather than expecting our kids

497
00:29:37,240 --> 00:29:40,600
Speaker 3: to take on everything that we believe and everything that

498
00:29:40,640 --> 00:29:48,440
Speaker 3: we value. We should be supporting like critical analysis, you know,

499
00:29:48,560 --> 00:29:50,080
Speaker 3: from a very early age.

500
00:29:50,600 --> 00:29:54,040
Speaker 1: So let me ask you, Like you spoke about self

501
00:29:54,120 --> 00:29:57,400
Speaker 1: worth and then you spoke about belief, but the kicking

502
00:29:57,440 --> 00:30:02,400
Speaker 1: off point was identity. If you can so, identity, self

503
00:30:02,440 --> 00:30:05,800
Speaker 1: worth and belief how do they intersect? Like what is

504
00:30:05,840 --> 00:30:12,040
Speaker 1: the relationship between between those three things? So identity, self worth,

505
00:30:12,240 --> 00:30:17,120
Speaker 1: and belief? Like maybe start with could you just define

506
00:30:17,160 --> 00:30:21,400
Speaker 1: self worth? Like what is in just your terms? Is

507
00:30:21,440 --> 00:30:23,000
Speaker 1: that just how I see me?

508
00:30:24,880 --> 00:30:28,240
Speaker 3: Yes, it's the belief that you have about yourself and

509
00:30:28,560 --> 00:30:35,959
Speaker 3: the value that you have that is not dependent solely

510
00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:39,440
Speaker 3: on the approval of others. Right for the beliefs of

511
00:30:39,480 --> 00:30:45,440
Speaker 3: others about you. One of the really interesting things that

512
00:30:45,520 --> 00:30:49,600
Speaker 3: I've come across in terms of research, and this is

513
00:30:49,720 --> 00:30:52,160
Speaker 3: and the reason I've come across it is because it

514
00:30:52,240 --> 00:30:58,920
Speaker 3: was done by one of my professors at Emory named

515
00:30:59,200 --> 00:31:02,720
Speaker 3: doctor Marshall do Go, along with the colleague named Robin

516
00:31:02,800 --> 00:31:10,080
Speaker 3: five Ish, and they did these They did these experiments

517
00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:16,360
Speaker 3: around storytelling. So what they actually found was the more

518
00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:23,880
Speaker 3: that families told stories about their history, not just their

519
00:31:23,920 --> 00:31:31,640
Speaker 3: own immediate history, but of generations before. The more that

520
00:31:31,760 --> 00:31:36,760
Speaker 3: the children knew those stories and were able to even

521
00:31:36,880 --> 00:31:43,440
Speaker 3: detail the stories themselves, the better their identity. The stronger

522
00:31:43,480 --> 00:31:47,960
Speaker 3: their identity, the better their self esteem, the stronger their

523
00:31:48,000 --> 00:31:56,000
Speaker 3: resilience was because they developed an identity that was more

524
00:31:56,040 --> 00:32:00,840
Speaker 3: than just about themselves and even just about their immediate

525
00:32:00,920 --> 00:32:07,240
Speaker 3: family it was like this intergenerational identity yes, wow, yes,

526
00:32:07,640 --> 00:32:14,200
Speaker 3: so interesting and very robust results. So they came up

527
00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:18,760
Speaker 3: with these kinds of questions that aren't actually that complicated,

528
00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:23,040
Speaker 3: like to start with, like do you know, for instance,

529
00:32:23,640 --> 00:32:26,480
Speaker 3: where your mother was born, Do you know where your

530
00:32:26,480 --> 00:32:28,440
Speaker 3: father was born? Do you know how they met? Do

531
00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:32,240
Speaker 3: you know how your grandparents met? Do you know you

532
00:32:32,240 --> 00:32:34,600
Speaker 3: know what were some of the challenges that you know,

533
00:32:35,760 --> 00:32:40,760
Speaker 3: the people in your family experienced, you know, one, two,

534
00:32:40,840 --> 00:32:44,040
Speaker 3: three generations ago, what were the outcomes of those what

535
00:32:44,080 --> 00:32:48,000
Speaker 3: were their personality characteristics? And the more that they can

536
00:32:48,240 --> 00:32:53,000
Speaker 3: that children can actually not only like know that information,

537
00:32:53,120 --> 00:32:58,960
Speaker 3: but also relate themselves into it. So for instance, oh,

538
00:32:59,480 --> 00:33:02,880
Speaker 3: I'm like, oh that characteristic of my grandfather that sounds

539
00:33:02,920 --> 00:33:06,000
Speaker 3: a lot like me, or like that's something that I

540
00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:08,120
Speaker 3: would have done, or like what I think I would

541
00:33:08,120 --> 00:33:12,560
Speaker 3: do in that situation. The more that they feel that

542
00:33:13,240 --> 00:33:18,840
Speaker 3: connection and that belonging that goes far far deeper. Yeah,

543
00:33:18,880 --> 00:33:21,840
Speaker 3: and that really can create this really strong sense of

544
00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:26,160
Speaker 3: identity that goes beyond you know, these superficial things that

545
00:33:26,200 --> 00:33:31,440
Speaker 3: we get inundated with via social media, society or even

546
00:33:31,480 --> 00:33:33,560
Speaker 3: sometimes within our immediate families.

547
00:33:34,800 --> 00:33:37,400
Speaker 1: One of the I mean, like it or not, an

548
00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:40,760
Speaker 1: inevitability of the human experiences that other people are going

549
00:33:40,840 --> 00:33:43,560
Speaker 1: to think stuff about us, good stuff, bad stuff. Other

550
00:33:43,600 --> 00:33:47,160
Speaker 1: people are going to have opinions, just like we have opinions.

551
00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:49,200
Speaker 1: You know, you walk down the street, you see someone,

552
00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:52,320
Speaker 1: doesn't mean you're a bad human, but you're always you

553
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:57,400
Speaker 1: already have an impression like our brains, our impression formation machines,

554
00:33:57,440 --> 00:34:00,120
Speaker 1: you know. And it might just be trying to to

555
00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:03,680
Speaker 1: tech danger, or it might be curiosity. But you know,

556
00:34:03,720 --> 00:34:07,560
Speaker 1: we're always detecting and assuming and labeling and inferring, and

557
00:34:08,400 --> 00:34:15,080
Speaker 1: sometimes we're wildly right or wildly wrong. But knowing that,

558
00:34:15,200 --> 00:34:19,960
Speaker 1: I feel like some people move through the world worrying

559
00:34:20,000 --> 00:34:24,480
Speaker 1: about worrying about what other people think of them and not.

560
00:34:25,040 --> 00:34:29,319
Speaker 1: Now let's talk about let's differentiate that between between that

561
00:34:29,640 --> 00:34:34,600
Speaker 1: and my research, which is having an understanding of how

562
00:34:34,640 --> 00:34:39,440
Speaker 1: people perceive and experience us, you know, which matter accuracy,

563
00:34:39,520 --> 00:34:41,239
Speaker 1: like being able to know what it's like to be

564
00:34:41,280 --> 00:34:44,440
Speaker 1: around you, which is used the right way. It's a

565
00:34:44,600 --> 00:34:48,960
Speaker 1: social kind of superpower into personal tool that we can use. Right.

566
00:34:49,000 --> 00:34:51,239
Speaker 1: So there's that which is just knowledge and awareness which

567
00:34:51,719 --> 00:34:54,400
Speaker 1: can be used positively, but at the other end of

568
00:34:54,440 --> 00:34:59,759
Speaker 1: the scale, there's this worrying myself sick about what the

569
00:35:00,080 --> 00:35:03,560
Speaker 1: guy in the second office down the corridor thinks of me,

570
00:35:03,800 --> 00:35:06,880
Speaker 1: or my boss thinks of me, or that whoever. Like,

571
00:35:07,840 --> 00:35:11,239
Speaker 1: how do we because it's not like we want to

572
00:35:11,239 --> 00:35:14,719
Speaker 1: move through life not giving a fuck about anyone else. Yeah,

573
00:35:14,719 --> 00:35:16,680
Speaker 1: because we want to be, you know, all the things

574
00:35:16,680 --> 00:35:18,960
Speaker 1: that we want to be empathetic and kind and awareness

575
00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:21,040
Speaker 1: and have a bigger than us awareness and all those

576
00:35:21,160 --> 00:35:23,840
Speaker 1: nice things which we do. But you don't want to

577
00:35:23,880 --> 00:35:27,319
Speaker 1: spend life being worried about what people think you, right,

578
00:35:27,480 --> 00:35:29,600
Speaker 1: So can you speak to that? Yeah?

579
00:35:29,640 --> 00:35:32,719
Speaker 3: I love that topic because I think because I know

580
00:35:32,760 --> 00:35:35,040
Speaker 3: that you know, you're the expert in self awareness. And

581
00:35:36,680 --> 00:35:39,920
Speaker 3: is there such a thing as too much? Yes? Of

582
00:35:39,960 --> 00:35:41,840
Speaker 3: you know, like there's a functional part, which is what

583
00:35:41,840 --> 00:35:44,840
Speaker 3: you're talking about in researching How do people experience me

584
00:35:44,960 --> 00:35:48,040
Speaker 3: in the room? What impact am I having on other people?

585
00:35:49,280 --> 00:35:52,719
Speaker 3: Can I tell if it's you know, helpful or hindering me?

586
00:35:52,960 --> 00:35:54,160
Speaker 3: And what can I do about it?

587
00:35:54,640 --> 00:35:55,600
Speaker 1: Yeah?

588
00:35:55,880 --> 00:36:00,359
Speaker 3: And then there's the dysfunctional self awareness which I see time,

589
00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:03,200
Speaker 3: you know, when people come and see me, it's often

590
00:36:03,280 --> 00:36:09,680
Speaker 3: related to how other how is I perceived? Worry about,

591
00:36:09,920 --> 00:36:14,399
Speaker 3: rumination about and over analyzing about what was said, how

592
00:36:14,440 --> 00:36:16,719
Speaker 3: it was said, Did I make a mistake? Do they

593
00:36:16,719 --> 00:36:19,840
Speaker 3: still like me? Will they still will they still like me?

594
00:36:20,239 --> 00:36:21,840
Speaker 3: Are they going to reject me? Are they going to

595
00:36:21,920 --> 00:36:27,160
Speaker 3: abandon me? Pretty much anything that can be functional can

596
00:36:27,200 --> 00:36:30,200
Speaker 3: be dysfunctional as well. So it's like, well, how do

597
00:36:30,239 --> 00:36:37,000
Speaker 3: you know when it's going awry? And often that's through

598
00:36:37,320 --> 00:36:42,640
Speaker 3: I guess, really knowing what are your behaviors? You know,

599
00:36:42,719 --> 00:36:45,480
Speaker 3: like if we're, for instance, we're overly relying on other

600
00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:51,920
Speaker 3: people's approval and we're anxious and fearful about being judged

601
00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:56,200
Speaker 3: or rejected or abandoned, that can lead to dysfunctional people

602
00:36:56,239 --> 00:36:59,520
Speaker 3: pleasing behaviors for Insteah, and those are things that you

603
00:36:59,560 --> 00:37:03,040
Speaker 3: can like see and notice and monitor within yourself, like

604
00:37:03,360 --> 00:37:13,879
Speaker 3: what are you actually doing? And is that helpful or

605
00:37:14,080 --> 00:37:18,279
Speaker 3: is that unhelpful? Is that healthy or is that unhealthy?

606
00:37:18,440 --> 00:37:22,080
Speaker 3: Is that functional or is that dysfunctional? And I think

607
00:37:22,160 --> 00:37:24,239
Speaker 3: one of the main, main, main things and the most

608
00:37:24,239 --> 00:37:26,440
Speaker 3: important thing in all of this is that can you

609
00:37:26,520 --> 00:37:28,960
Speaker 3: evaluate all of this without judging yourself?

610
00:37:31,200 --> 00:37:35,239
Speaker 1: I mean the problem, the problem or the challenge in

611
00:37:35,320 --> 00:37:40,040
Speaker 1: doing that is that you know, we because we're because

612
00:37:40,040 --> 00:37:43,160
Speaker 1: it's us we're thinking about and talking about it. It's

613
00:37:43,200 --> 00:37:46,400
Speaker 1: completely subjective, you know, and it's trying, and we're always

614
00:37:47,560 --> 00:37:52,439
Speaker 1: we're always interpreting what someone else is doing through our

615
00:37:52,520 --> 00:37:55,560
Speaker 1: own lens out, so we don't know what their attention is.

616
00:37:55,640 --> 00:37:57,799
Speaker 1: We don't know what that mean, you know, sometimes we do.

617
00:37:57,880 --> 00:38:00,879
Speaker 1: But like an example of this, so I don't want

618
00:38:00,880 --> 00:38:03,479
Speaker 1: to throw her under the bus. But the other day,

619
00:38:04,239 --> 00:38:08,200
Speaker 1: so I think it was on the weekend, I trained

620
00:38:09,920 --> 00:38:12,960
Speaker 1: a young lady that I've helped a bit ash who

621
00:38:13,840 --> 00:38:17,520
Speaker 1: who was on the podcast, and she's lost seventy kilos

622
00:38:17,560 --> 00:38:20,840
Speaker 1: and she's gone from really unhealthy to really healthy, and

623
00:38:20,880 --> 00:38:23,799
Speaker 1: she's changed her life and she feels and functions better

624
00:38:23,840 --> 00:38:28,440
Speaker 1: and life's better and all this stuff, right, And she

625
00:38:28,600 --> 00:38:30,440
Speaker 1: was in the gym training and I took like a

626
00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:33,120
Speaker 1: ten second video of her training, and I thought, my

627
00:38:33,520 --> 00:38:37,480
Speaker 1: listeners will maybe be interested to see here's the girl

628
00:38:37,560 --> 00:38:40,120
Speaker 1: that's lost the seventy k's and you know, right, so

629
00:38:40,160 --> 00:38:42,080
Speaker 1: I put up the video and it had twenty five

630
00:38:42,200 --> 00:38:47,320
Speaker 1: thousand views in twenty four hours, right, So I wouldn't

631
00:38:47,360 --> 00:38:51,560
Speaker 1: call that, you know, what do you call it viral?

632
00:38:51,640 --> 00:38:55,279
Speaker 1: But it went pretty well right, and all of the

633
00:38:55,480 --> 00:38:58,799
Speaker 1: comments were good, except one person asked a question which

634
00:38:58,920 --> 00:39:01,279
Speaker 1: I didn't think was negative. I think it was a

635
00:39:01,320 --> 00:39:05,160
Speaker 1: genuine question, and Ash sent me a message because she'd

636
00:39:06,560 --> 00:39:09,160
Speaker 1: thought that that person was being negative. And I'm like,

637
00:39:09,200 --> 00:39:14,320
Speaker 1: it's so funny because the overwhelming response was, oh my god,

638
00:39:14,440 --> 00:39:19,719
Speaker 1: you're amazing. That's fucking great, well done, incredible, like it

639
00:39:19,800 --> 00:39:24,120
Speaker 1: was all good, all love, all positive. Then one person

640
00:39:24,200 --> 00:39:28,480
Speaker 1: asked a question which was really just a question, and

641
00:39:28,520 --> 00:39:31,360
Speaker 1: then she sent me a message, Oh, what's with the

642
00:39:32,000 --> 00:39:35,719
Speaker 1: what's with the hate or something? And I go, what what?

643
00:39:36,520 --> 00:39:39,799
Speaker 1: I'm like, dude, you know, but it's funny that. And

644
00:39:40,040 --> 00:39:42,600
Speaker 1: I've done the same thing. I've done gigs where I

645
00:39:42,640 --> 00:39:46,319
Speaker 1: got overwhelmingly good feedback and one person who didn't love me,

646
00:39:47,120 --> 00:39:49,840
Speaker 1: but the majority, you know, it was somewhere between pretty

647
00:39:49,880 --> 00:39:53,600
Speaker 1: good and really really well received. And one person got

648
00:39:53,640 --> 00:39:55,680
Speaker 1: their nose out of joint because something I did or

649
00:39:55,719 --> 00:39:57,640
Speaker 1: said or a story and they came up and let

650
00:39:57,680 --> 00:40:00,399
Speaker 1: me know. And it was literally one out of five

651
00:40:00,520 --> 00:40:03,880
Speaker 1: hundred people, And all I thought about was the one. Yeah,

652
00:40:04,320 --> 00:40:07,680
Speaker 1: the four ninety nine had no positive impact. It was

653
00:40:07,800 --> 00:40:10,160
Speaker 1: all about the one. And I drive home being angry

654
00:40:10,200 --> 00:40:14,160
Speaker 1: and frustrated and because one person didn't like me. What

655
00:40:14,200 --> 00:40:15,840
Speaker 1: the fuck is that? Doctor?

656
00:40:16,840 --> 00:40:17,480
Speaker 2: What is that?

657
00:40:18,600 --> 00:40:23,280
Speaker 3: Oh, there's so many things. I think it hurts.

658
00:40:23,840 --> 00:40:26,839
Speaker 1: But why do we care so much about the one?

659
00:40:27,480 --> 00:40:31,479
Speaker 1: Why does that stranger that will never meet again? Why

660
00:40:31,480 --> 00:40:34,000
Speaker 1: do we allow them to have? You know, it's like

661
00:40:34,080 --> 00:40:36,400
Speaker 1: when people, you know, when people go and people have

662
00:40:36,480 --> 00:40:38,520
Speaker 1: said this to me, they go, oh, you make me

663
00:40:38,719 --> 00:40:41,839
Speaker 1: feel like that, Like, why don't make you feel? That's

664
00:40:41,920 --> 00:40:45,320
Speaker 1: just how you feel? And what I said might have

665
00:40:45,440 --> 00:40:48,200
Speaker 1: been the you know, the starting off point, it might

666
00:40:48,239 --> 00:40:52,760
Speaker 1: have been the stimulus. But the reason that I didn't

667
00:40:52,800 --> 00:40:54,319
Speaker 1: make you is because I said it to a lot

668
00:40:54,360 --> 00:40:56,600
Speaker 1: of other people and they didn't feel what you feel.

669
00:40:56,680 --> 00:41:00,400
Speaker 1: So you created that. But I've done that myself where

670
00:41:00,520 --> 00:41:03,719
Speaker 1: I get myself into a tease and it's it's definitely me,

671
00:41:03,880 --> 00:41:04,720
Speaker 1: that's the problem.

672
00:41:05,440 --> 00:41:07,080
Speaker 3: Well, we are, I mean, our brains are kind of

673
00:41:07,120 --> 00:41:15,840
Speaker 3: primed to notice the negative, the unsafe. Yeah, so that's

674
00:41:15,960 --> 00:41:19,520
Speaker 3: I guess we have that vulnerability already just being human

675
00:41:19,680 --> 00:41:23,520
Speaker 3: that we're looking for threats in the environment. And I

676
00:41:23,520 --> 00:41:30,640
Speaker 3: guess you know, we're not facing a lot of major

677
00:41:30,760 --> 00:41:34,520
Speaker 3: threats to our livelihood, you know, in terms of life

678
00:41:34,600 --> 00:41:37,640
Speaker 3: and death. But so the threats are more like too

679
00:41:37,680 --> 00:41:43,120
Speaker 3: belonging to connection, to approval and that so it sticks out,

680
00:41:44,400 --> 00:41:46,880
Speaker 3: sticks out, and it's almost like you have to train

681
00:41:47,040 --> 00:41:50,200
Speaker 3: your brain. It is actually not almost like it is

682
00:41:50,320 --> 00:41:54,360
Speaker 3: like you have to train your brain to notice and

683
00:41:54,440 --> 00:42:02,400
Speaker 3: appreciate and elevate the good things in life, the positive messages,

684
00:42:03,680 --> 00:42:08,759
Speaker 3: the healthy, the healthy things, the things to be grateful for.

685
00:42:09,480 --> 00:42:12,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, Tiffany and Cook, I've got a question for you

686
00:42:12,440 --> 00:42:17,840
Speaker 1: in this steady on, steady on, older horses, hold your horses,

687
00:42:19,040 --> 00:42:21,399
Speaker 1: Like we've spoken a bit about this, because you've been

688
00:42:21,440 --> 00:42:24,319
Speaker 1: without opening the door wide. It's just opened a little

689
00:42:24,320 --> 00:42:27,279
Speaker 1: crack where you've been let down and hurt and mistreated

690
00:42:27,280 --> 00:42:29,080
Speaker 1: and a whole lot of shit by people, as have

691
00:42:29,200 --> 00:42:34,160
Speaker 1: many people. But we're talking about you. What when it

692
00:42:34,239 --> 00:42:37,080
Speaker 1: comes down to you. But also you've had a bit

693
00:42:37,120 --> 00:42:40,640
Speaker 1: of a spiritual revolution and revelation lately, and you've kind of,

694
00:42:42,680 --> 00:42:46,279
Speaker 1: you know, and we've spoken about this. You've energetically and

695
00:42:46,320 --> 00:42:49,680
Speaker 1: perhaps spiritually and emotionally and psychologically turned a bit of

696
00:42:49,680 --> 00:42:52,200
Speaker 1: a corner. Blah blah blah all of that, which I

697
00:42:52,239 --> 00:42:54,640
Speaker 1: do mean to say that flippantly, but that's where you're

698
00:42:54,640 --> 00:42:57,440
Speaker 1: at So my question to you and maybe to you

699
00:42:57,520 --> 00:43:03,680
Speaker 1: also literally and is what's your criteria for trust, like

700
00:43:03,960 --> 00:43:08,120
Speaker 1: with people that you like? You know? It's like my

701
00:43:08,280 --> 00:43:11,799
Speaker 1: metaphor is like I know a lot of people, but

702
00:43:11,880 --> 00:43:14,360
Speaker 1: I don't trust a lot of people. Now that doesn't

703
00:43:14,400 --> 00:43:17,560
Speaker 1: mean I distrust the majority. It just means like, for

704
00:43:17,640 --> 00:43:21,600
Speaker 1: me to truly trust someone, it takes a bit because

705
00:43:21,600 --> 00:43:24,360
Speaker 1: I've had and there's no self pity in here, because

706
00:43:24,360 --> 00:43:25,920
Speaker 1: I'm just one of many. But I've had a lot

707
00:43:25,960 --> 00:43:29,600
Speaker 1: of people fuck me over a lot and backstab and

708
00:43:29,640 --> 00:43:32,160
Speaker 1: bitch and do some horrible shit, people that I really

709
00:43:32,200 --> 00:43:35,880
Speaker 1: loved and trusted and valued. So for me to actually

710
00:43:36,040 --> 00:43:39,640
Speaker 1: really trust, it's not a quick process. What about you?

711
00:43:39,920 --> 00:43:41,880
Speaker 1: What about let's start with you, Tiff.

712
00:43:42,760 --> 00:43:46,920
Speaker 2: Oh, that's a really good question. And I feel like.

713
00:43:48,840 --> 00:43:51,000
Speaker 1: I'll remind the viewers that Tiff is the girl who

714
00:43:51,080 --> 00:43:53,319
Speaker 1: wears the baseball cap that says give us a hug

715
00:43:53,320 --> 00:43:54,879
Speaker 1: and the T shirt that says fuck off.

716
00:43:54,920 --> 00:44:00,440
Speaker 2: Though I think that I think I'm I'm still in

717
00:44:00,440 --> 00:44:05,440
Speaker 2: the middle of an enormous amount of processing of that

718
00:44:05,520 --> 00:44:09,600
Speaker 2: shift that I experienced recently. I'm still in the middle

719
00:44:09,600 --> 00:44:11,880
Speaker 2: of that, and in the middle of that so in

720
00:44:11,920 --> 00:44:16,239
Speaker 2: this whole conversation, I've been listening and thinking and processing

721
00:44:16,320 --> 00:44:19,439
Speaker 2: and of everything you've been saying that relates to kind

722
00:44:19,440 --> 00:44:23,719
Speaker 2: of this. But I feel like maybe right now I'm

723
00:44:23,800 --> 00:44:32,040
Speaker 2: learning to observe who I am around people, and because

724
00:44:32,040 --> 00:44:34,080
Speaker 2: it's a me thing, like I identified a long time ago,

725
00:44:34,200 --> 00:44:36,600
Speaker 2: trust was a me thing, not a them thing, my

726
00:44:36,680 --> 00:44:41,040
Speaker 2: ability to feel safe in the world. And so I

727
00:44:41,080 --> 00:44:44,080
Speaker 2: think that's what I watch now. I watch who I

728
00:44:44,120 --> 00:44:48,080
Speaker 2: am and how I am and how I feel, and

729
00:44:48,120 --> 00:44:50,759
Speaker 2: then I go from there. I said to one of

730
00:44:50,800 --> 00:44:54,080
Speaker 2: the clients in my coaching group this week. I was

731
00:44:54,120 --> 00:44:55,800
Speaker 2: having a one on one chat with her and I

732
00:44:57,400 --> 00:45:01,439
Speaker 2: and I said that I was I am so extremely

733
00:45:01,600 --> 00:45:06,040
Speaker 2: grateful for you, because I feel like now I've popped

734
00:45:06,080 --> 00:45:11,080
Speaker 2: out the other side of a long, funky, weird time

735
00:45:11,120 --> 00:45:12,440
Speaker 2: that I didn't know I was in the middle of.

736
00:45:13,280 --> 00:45:16,120
Speaker 2: Where I feel like my perception is you must have

737
00:45:17,200 --> 00:45:19,640
Speaker 2: fucking had a shitty version of me that you would

738
00:45:19,640 --> 00:45:22,279
Speaker 2: have been experiencing a lot of the time, and you

739
00:45:22,320 --> 00:45:24,880
Speaker 2: obviously could see it, and for some reason that I

740
00:45:24,880 --> 00:45:31,440
Speaker 2: will never understand, you just stood by and like you knew,

741
00:45:32,040 --> 00:45:35,440
Speaker 2: and I was like, I don't know how you knew,

742
00:45:36,480 --> 00:45:41,720
Speaker 2: but I needed someone to do that and like, wow,

743
00:45:41,800 --> 00:45:46,120
Speaker 2: so thanks, but yeah, I'm still processing how I how

744
00:45:46,160 --> 00:45:48,360
Speaker 2: that's all coming together for me? So good question.

745
00:45:49,120 --> 00:45:53,799
Speaker 1: Yeah, I see, I mean, but it's interesting, like I

746
00:45:53,880 --> 00:45:57,319
Speaker 1: see in you. I see there's a few people in

747
00:45:57,360 --> 00:46:01,319
Speaker 1: my life that have struggled with stuff. I'll give her

748
00:46:01,360 --> 00:46:04,960
Speaker 1: a shout out because I never do. Another lady that

749
00:46:06,080 --> 00:46:09,600
Speaker 1: her name is Fi, who you know, who's who's you know?

750
00:46:10,040 --> 00:46:14,240
Speaker 1: Had challenges and struggles with things. And but I see

751
00:46:14,320 --> 00:46:20,960
Speaker 1: potential and I see possibility and I see like real

752
00:46:21,280 --> 00:46:24,279
Speaker 1: but under the because we've all got days where we're

753
00:46:24,280 --> 00:46:28,200
Speaker 1: not our best selves, right, and I'm the same. Some

754
00:46:28,320 --> 00:46:29,719
Speaker 1: days I get to the end of the day and

755
00:46:29,760 --> 00:46:31,800
Speaker 1: I'm like, excuse my language, doc, I can say it

756
00:46:31,840 --> 00:46:34,440
Speaker 1: in front tip, but I was a count today, not

757
00:46:34,520 --> 00:46:38,040
Speaker 1: all day. But I'm like, I'm better than that. But

758
00:46:38,120 --> 00:46:40,680
Speaker 1: you know, I see in her, I see in you.

759
00:46:40,840 --> 00:46:44,759
Speaker 1: I see in people the potential and the good. And

760
00:46:44,800 --> 00:46:47,520
Speaker 1: I also sometimes I'll meet people where I'm like, there's

761
00:46:47,560 --> 00:46:49,359
Speaker 1: a whole lot of darkness going on there. I don't

762
00:46:49,440 --> 00:46:52,600
Speaker 1: really want to get involved, you know, but and I

763
00:46:52,640 --> 00:46:54,719
Speaker 1: think my question, how did you?

764
00:46:54,960 --> 00:46:55,400
Speaker 2: How did you?

765
00:46:55,520 --> 00:46:59,399
Speaker 1: I don't know I know because I think this sounds weird, right,

766
00:46:59,480 --> 00:47:05,840
Speaker 1: and this this is very unscientific, but science plays. Science

767
00:47:05,920 --> 00:47:08,680
Speaker 1: is good with some things, but not everything right. And

768
00:47:11,640 --> 00:47:16,280
Speaker 1: I intuitively instinctively know things about people that I can't explain,

769
00:47:16,320 --> 00:47:18,320
Speaker 1: and I don't always get it right, but I often

770
00:47:18,360 --> 00:47:21,480
Speaker 1: get it right. And I think part of that is,

771
00:47:22,239 --> 00:47:24,839
Speaker 1: like I feel like I've said this before and it

772
00:47:24,880 --> 00:47:27,320
Speaker 1: sounds weird, but I feel like we have an access

773
00:47:27,360 --> 00:47:30,000
Speaker 1: to a kind of intelligence that we didn't really earn

774
00:47:30,080 --> 00:47:32,879
Speaker 1: or deserve. And I don't know where it comes from,

775
00:47:32,920 --> 00:47:35,640
Speaker 1: whether or not it's a subconscious wisdom or some kind

776
00:47:35,680 --> 00:47:39,839
Speaker 1: of fucking divine insight or I don't know, but there

777
00:47:39,840 --> 00:47:42,799
Speaker 1: has been many times, and I could give I could

778
00:47:42,800 --> 00:47:45,239
Speaker 1: give at least a hundred examples of times in my

779
00:47:45,360 --> 00:47:49,759
Speaker 1: life where I've known something that really protected me or

780
00:47:49,800 --> 00:47:53,680
Speaker 1: really saved me, and nobody taught me. I never learned it.

781
00:47:53,680 --> 00:47:56,400
Speaker 1: It wasn't as a result of another experience I had,

782
00:47:57,440 --> 00:47:59,360
Speaker 1: you know. And I just think that I think like

783
00:47:59,600 --> 00:48:02,000
Speaker 1: I I have an in sense with a lot of

784
00:48:02,040 --> 00:48:05,240
Speaker 1: people about whether or not they are This sounds bad,

785
00:48:05,280 --> 00:48:08,880
Speaker 1: but whether not investing time and energy in them is

786
00:48:09,000 --> 00:48:11,400
Speaker 1: a good investment. And I don't mean as a potential

787
00:48:11,480 --> 00:48:15,719
Speaker 1: return on investment. I just mean they're worth it. You know.

788
00:48:15,760 --> 00:48:17,800
Speaker 1: I had a guy last week. I won't say his

789
00:48:17,880 --> 00:48:21,239
Speaker 1: name because I don't want to embarrass him. He's in

790
00:48:21,480 --> 00:48:24,600
Speaker 1: my mentoring group that just finished, and he had his

791
00:48:25,120 --> 00:48:27,200
Speaker 1: one on one mentoring session with me, and there was

792
00:48:27,239 --> 00:48:30,200
Speaker 1: just unfinished business and it's just like I didn't want

793
00:48:30,239 --> 00:48:32,960
Speaker 1: to just go see you. So anyway, I made an

794
00:48:33,040 --> 00:48:37,799
Speaker 1: arrangement with him, and he really needs help and I

795
00:48:37,840 --> 00:48:41,800
Speaker 1: really don't have the time. My days are mental, and

796
00:48:43,840 --> 00:48:46,440
Speaker 1: I just went fuck it, And so I made four

797
00:48:46,520 --> 00:48:49,360
Speaker 1: appointments for the next four weeks with him. And I

798
00:48:49,400 --> 00:48:51,239
Speaker 1: don't say this to sound good or bad. I say

799
00:48:51,239 --> 00:48:54,200
Speaker 1: it just because it's relevant to this. You know, no costs,

800
00:48:54,280 --> 00:48:56,600
Speaker 1: know anything, and I can't do this, you know, blah

801
00:48:56,640 --> 00:48:59,719
Speaker 1: blah blah, but for everyone, of course. And he's like,

802
00:48:59,760 --> 00:49:02,480
Speaker 1: why are you doing this? Like he was crying, and

803
00:49:02,520 --> 00:49:04,040
Speaker 1: he goes, why are you doing this? I go, do

804
00:49:04,080 --> 00:49:05,879
Speaker 1: you need help? And he goes yes. I go, well,

805
00:49:05,880 --> 00:49:08,919
Speaker 1: that's why, that's it. I got it. You know. It's

806
00:49:08,960 --> 00:49:13,200
Speaker 1: like it's it doesn't and I think that I'm banging on,

807
00:49:13,239 --> 00:49:16,200
Speaker 1: but I think, you know, and sometimes I'm selfish, but

808
00:49:16,280 --> 00:49:18,799
Speaker 1: I think you know when we talk about that, that

809
00:49:18,920 --> 00:49:21,640
Speaker 1: model that I've spoken about that starts with self reflection

810
00:49:21,760 --> 00:49:24,400
Speaker 1: and it's self awareness and then goes through self regulation

811
00:49:24,560 --> 00:49:28,920
Speaker 1: and then self actualization and it ends up at self transcendence,

812
00:49:28,960 --> 00:49:32,719
Speaker 1: which for me is like that intersection of purpose and

813
00:49:32,760 --> 00:49:38,560
Speaker 1: spirituality and fulfillment and you know where because I know

814
00:49:38,680 --> 00:49:41,360
Speaker 1: when I am all about me, which is very easy

815
00:49:41,360 --> 00:49:43,880
Speaker 1: because I'm an only child, and I can be selfish,

816
00:49:44,160 --> 00:49:47,160
Speaker 1: but I unequivocally have data that tells me the more

817
00:49:47,200 --> 00:49:50,680
Speaker 1: selfish I am, the worse my life is, and the

818
00:49:50,680 --> 00:49:53,279
Speaker 1: more generous I am to a point. You know, you

819
00:49:53,320 --> 00:49:56,200
Speaker 1: can't be all things to all people, but the better

820
00:49:56,239 --> 00:50:00,759
Speaker 1: that my life goes. So what, I don't know how

821
00:50:00,760 --> 00:50:02,960
Speaker 1: the fuck we got there? What about you? DOT? What

822
00:50:03,080 --> 00:50:06,440
Speaker 1: about you? And trust? And you opening? Because I feel

823
00:50:06,480 --> 00:50:08,040
Speaker 1: like I shouldn't say this, but I'm going to say

824
00:50:08,040 --> 00:50:10,960
Speaker 1: it because I'm in a fucking roll. I feel like

825
00:50:11,120 --> 00:50:14,200
Speaker 1: you are quite reserved. I don't know how often you

826
00:50:14,440 --> 00:50:17,120
Speaker 1: open the door, like even with me, and we've had

827
00:50:17,160 --> 00:50:19,040
Speaker 1: a few copies and it's like we get on. Well,

828
00:50:19,080 --> 00:50:22,279
Speaker 1: there's no problem. Like I like you, I think you

829
00:50:22,480 --> 00:50:27,120
Speaker 1: like me. We have a good connection. But I feel like, yeah,

830
00:50:27,160 --> 00:50:29,600
Speaker 1: I don't think the door's been open opened. You know,

831
00:50:29,640 --> 00:50:32,720
Speaker 1: it's been opened a bit, But I feel like with you,

832
00:50:32,719 --> 00:50:36,279
Speaker 1: you're you're, there's not This is going to sound wrong

833
00:50:36,280 --> 00:50:38,840
Speaker 1: because it's not in an insincere way, you know, person

834
00:50:38,880 --> 00:50:44,080
Speaker 1: and persona. I think there's there's the professional public you

835
00:50:45,200 --> 00:50:47,319
Speaker 1: and sometimes I just want to mess up your hair

836
00:50:47,360 --> 00:50:50,319
Speaker 1: and pull back the Liian curtains. See what, I just

837
00:50:50,320 --> 00:50:52,600
Speaker 1: want to mess up you, wipe off your lipstick and

838
00:50:52,640 --> 00:50:54,000
Speaker 1: pull back the Liian curtain.

839
00:50:55,160 --> 00:50:58,840
Speaker 3: Oh look, I don't I completely agree with that assessment,

840
00:50:58,880 --> 00:51:01,040
Speaker 3: but I completely under stand why you said.

841
00:51:01,640 --> 00:51:02,400
Speaker 1: Yes.

842
00:51:02,840 --> 00:51:09,640
Speaker 3: I don't think I'm a different person professionally and personally. However,

843
00:51:09,800 --> 00:51:13,520
Speaker 3: I do think that there's a professional stance, yes, right,

844
00:51:14,920 --> 00:51:17,120
Speaker 3: also with clients.

845
00:51:17,200 --> 00:51:20,279
Speaker 1: Yeah, you're a clinical psychologist, so you can't get on

846
00:51:20,320 --> 00:51:22,000
Speaker 1: here and a dickhead like Tiff and I.

847
00:51:22,160 --> 00:51:24,480
Speaker 3: Well yeah, okay, so yes, so there is some of that,

848
00:51:26,880 --> 00:51:30,439
Speaker 3: but you're right now. I am in a personal way,

849
00:51:30,640 --> 00:51:36,680
Speaker 3: I am more reserved, so I don't I'm not an oversharer.

850
00:51:38,480 --> 00:51:40,640
Speaker 3: I won't tell you everything up front.

851
00:51:42,040 --> 00:51:43,719
Speaker 1: The opposite of the opposite of me.

852
00:51:43,800 --> 00:51:52,319
Speaker 3: Yeah, well maybe, yes, it's possible. Yeah, you possibly. Yeah,

853
00:51:52,320 --> 00:51:56,000
Speaker 3: you're definitely more open than me. Yeah. I think trust

854
00:51:56,080 --> 00:51:57,160
Speaker 3: is a thing.

855
00:51:57,960 --> 00:51:59,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've had.

856
00:51:59,360 --> 00:52:01,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, I've had people in my life and I'm not

857
00:52:01,480 --> 00:52:05,400
Speaker 3: going to say major events necessarily, not like super super significant,

858
00:52:05,960 --> 00:52:13,400
Speaker 3: but like if you tell everybody everything and they're not

859
00:52:13,480 --> 00:52:17,640
Speaker 3: trustworthy and then they take that and they do something

860
00:52:18,600 --> 00:52:24,680
Speaker 3: that you're not expecting or is hurtful or is you know,

861
00:52:24,920 --> 00:52:28,520
Speaker 3: just you know, like when you've been fucked over by somebody,

862
00:52:28,560 --> 00:52:31,320
Speaker 3: and it can be really small. But for me, because

863
00:52:31,360 --> 00:52:36,120
Speaker 3: I'm like, if someone tells me something, I'm a vault

864
00:52:36,239 --> 00:52:38,719
Speaker 3: Like that's my job too, rite like, but it's not

865
00:52:38,800 --> 00:52:42,600
Speaker 3: going anywhere, like you can trust, Like the trust being

866
00:52:42,640 --> 00:52:47,040
Speaker 3: trustworthy is like part of my identity. Yes, So it's

867
00:52:47,160 --> 00:52:52,200
Speaker 3: hard for me to understand sometimes when other people aren't

868
00:52:52,280 --> 00:52:56,480
Speaker 3: like that. And so I don't have that expectation for

869
00:52:56,520 --> 00:52:58,560
Speaker 3: people to be as good at it as I am.

870
00:53:00,040 --> 00:53:02,560
Speaker 3: But therefore they're not going to get as much until

871
00:53:03,120 --> 00:53:05,480
Speaker 3: I do have that expectation, like until I know that

872
00:53:05,560 --> 00:53:08,520
Speaker 3: they are. Yes, yes, And honestly there's probably not a

873
00:53:08,560 --> 00:53:13,440
Speaker 3: lot of people that are mm, So you know, I'm

874
00:53:13,480 --> 00:53:18,600
Speaker 3: probably like on the vulnerability scale, like not super high.

875
00:53:18,680 --> 00:53:22,600
Speaker 3: I'm not Brene Brown, but I related to or you.

876
00:53:23,160 --> 00:53:26,759
Speaker 3: But I related to what she said about vulnerability, and

877
00:53:26,840 --> 00:53:31,839
Speaker 3: I agree that you that it's important. I obviously every

878
00:53:31,840 --> 00:53:35,560
Speaker 3: person that comes to see me has shown vulnerability, right, yes,

879
00:53:35,600 --> 00:53:43,160
Speaker 3: And so that's why I actually respect everyone that comes

880
00:53:43,200 --> 00:53:46,240
Speaker 3: to see me so much, because I know the courage

881
00:53:46,280 --> 00:53:47,040
Speaker 3: it takes.

882
00:53:47,360 --> 00:53:50,040
Speaker 1: Well, I mean, you'll being vulnerable right now. You're being

883
00:53:50,120 --> 00:53:52,719
Speaker 1: vulnerable right now because you're talking about how you are

884
00:53:52,920 --> 00:53:56,400
Speaker 1: and you're talking to thousands of people, So yeah, you

885
00:53:56,440 --> 00:53:59,279
Speaker 1: know too. I was just thinking something then identify I

886
00:53:59,360 --> 00:54:03,839
Speaker 1: can articulate this properly, but I was thinking there were

887
00:54:03,920 --> 00:54:07,799
Speaker 1: times like, do you remember when you first started kind

888
00:54:07,800 --> 00:54:12,799
Speaker 1: of you got on board, you know, working consistently with

889
00:54:12,840 --> 00:54:17,120
Speaker 1: me as a paid gig working on Obviously you got

890
00:54:17,160 --> 00:54:19,319
Speaker 1: your own business and your own show and all that,

891
00:54:19,360 --> 00:54:23,040
Speaker 1: but you started working with me, and then I needed

892
00:54:23,080 --> 00:54:26,440
Speaker 1: a certain commitment from you. And remember it freaked you

893
00:54:26,480 --> 00:54:29,080
Speaker 1: out because you're a little bit commitment phobic. And there

894
00:54:29,160 --> 00:54:31,960
Speaker 1: was a period like there was a honeymoon period and

895
00:54:32,000 --> 00:54:34,440
Speaker 1: then you felt a bit like there was it got

896
00:54:34,480 --> 00:54:37,799
Speaker 1: a bit messy for a while, right, and then we

897
00:54:37,840 --> 00:54:41,279
Speaker 1: had a talk and it's like you were I don't know.

898
00:54:41,520 --> 00:54:43,520
Speaker 1: There was a few lumps and bumps and it all

899
00:54:43,600 --> 00:54:48,520
Speaker 1: sorted out. But then over time it's like you and

900
00:54:48,600 --> 00:54:52,560
Speaker 1: I almost have had this almost like dad daughter relationship,

901
00:54:52,920 --> 00:54:56,799
Speaker 1: right despite what other people think. Hey, everyone's never been

902
00:54:56,880 --> 00:55:02,120
Speaker 1: anything right, non right, despite all the people that go,

903
00:55:02,200 --> 00:55:04,120
Speaker 1: are you and if I go, no, never have been

904
00:55:04,760 --> 00:55:08,600
Speaker 1: and no disrespect to tif, never will be all good? Right,

905
00:55:09,200 --> 00:55:12,879
Speaker 1: more like dad and daughter that don't get on sometimes. Right.

906
00:55:13,480 --> 00:55:17,120
Speaker 1: But I think I think sometimes what you did was

907
00:55:17,160 --> 00:55:21,719
Speaker 1: because I think you couldn't believe that I was just

908
00:55:21,920 --> 00:55:25,759
Speaker 1: there for you and I just cared about you with

909
00:55:25,920 --> 00:55:29,919
Speaker 1: no agenda, and so you would push back to test it.

910
00:55:30,920 --> 00:55:35,040
Speaker 1: And I could see when you're being like a momentary

911
00:55:35,160 --> 00:55:37,600
Speaker 1: spoilt brat. You weren't really, but you like you were

912
00:55:37,640 --> 00:55:40,920
Speaker 1: being at times a little bit of hard work, and

913
00:55:40,960 --> 00:55:43,120
Speaker 1: I'm like, yeah, I'm not going anywhere. You can throw

914
00:55:43,160 --> 00:55:46,520
Speaker 1: your fucking toys out of the cop I'm not going anywhere. Yep,

915
00:55:46,640 --> 00:55:48,879
Speaker 1: I'm still yep. You're shitting me today. You're a pain

916
00:55:48,920 --> 00:55:51,400
Speaker 1: in the ass for ten minutes, but I'm still going

917
00:55:51,480 --> 00:55:53,719
Speaker 1: to be here and you can try to fuck it

918
00:55:53,800 --> 00:55:56,080
Speaker 1: up and you can test me and see if I'm

919
00:55:56,160 --> 00:55:58,600
Speaker 1: like all the other fucking men that have let you down,

920
00:55:59,160 --> 00:56:00,799
Speaker 1: I'm just going to be here. And by the way,

921
00:56:00,840 --> 00:56:02,759
Speaker 1: I don't want anything. I don't want your money, don't

922
00:56:02,760 --> 00:56:04,520
Speaker 1: want your body, don't want to get in your pants.

923
00:56:04,560 --> 00:56:07,600
Speaker 1: It's all good, you know. And that I think because

924
00:56:07,760 --> 00:56:09,960
Speaker 1: other than your dad, I don't know that you ever

925
00:56:10,000 --> 00:56:12,719
Speaker 1: had or maybe your uncle as well, that you get

926
00:56:12,719 --> 00:56:15,440
Speaker 1: on well with, but too many men that just didn't

927
00:56:15,480 --> 00:56:17,480
Speaker 1: want anything from you in that way.

928
00:56:18,000 --> 00:56:21,160
Speaker 2: That's exactly right. And this is a huge shift that

929
00:56:21,239 --> 00:56:26,640
Speaker 2: I had in India that I resolved and feel different from.

930
00:56:26,680 --> 00:56:31,839
Speaker 2: And that was identifying and verbalizing that I didn't have

931
00:56:31,880 --> 00:56:34,760
Speaker 2: the ability to keep myself safe. So the trust stuff

932
00:56:34,800 --> 00:56:37,040
Speaker 2: was down to me. I can't be trusted how a

933
00:56:37,200 --> 00:56:39,319
Speaker 2: mate that used to always so you'd be a right

934
00:56:39,360 --> 00:56:41,319
Speaker 2: you just pune anyone in the face, and I'm like,

935
00:56:41,360 --> 00:56:45,160
Speaker 2: you don't get trauma, you don't get dissociation, you don't

936
00:56:45,160 --> 00:56:49,520
Speaker 2: get it, because that's not what happens. So I knew

937
00:56:50,000 --> 00:56:56,120
Speaker 2: that there'd been several experiences in my life where strong, independent,

938
00:56:56,280 --> 00:57:01,680
Speaker 2: courageous tiff gets overtaken and by whatever happens when you

939
00:57:02,120 --> 00:57:07,880
Speaker 2: have a dissociated type experience, and lets things happen. And

940
00:57:07,920 --> 00:57:11,879
Speaker 2: then so I think there was that. That's that's why

941
00:57:11,880 --> 00:57:13,359
Speaker 2: the wall is there. It's like, well, I can't keep

942
00:57:13,400 --> 00:57:16,480
Speaker 2: myself safe because well, Craig's paying him now, and no one,

943
00:57:17,040 --> 00:57:19,880
Speaker 2: no one gives anything without taking things I don't want

944
00:57:19,880 --> 00:57:23,600
Speaker 2: to give. No one ever does that ever, So if

945
00:57:23,600 --> 00:57:26,640
Speaker 2: he's now paying me, so our first issues arose for me.

946
00:57:27,760 --> 00:57:33,160
Speaker 2: It's really, you know, like on a subconscious level, when

947
00:57:33,200 --> 00:57:35,760
Speaker 2: all of a sudden you're a part of the team.

948
00:57:36,160 --> 00:57:38,400
Speaker 2: We're going to give you money. You're not just giving

949
00:57:38,480 --> 00:57:42,640
Speaker 2: service and leaning on me for mentoring. You're a part

950
00:57:42,640 --> 00:57:44,680
Speaker 2: of the team. There's an exchange. I was like, oh,

951
00:57:44,720 --> 00:57:46,840
Speaker 2: I'm a commodity. He's buying me. What does he want?

952
00:57:46,920 --> 00:57:48,160
Speaker 2: He gets to take whatever he wants.

953
00:57:48,200 --> 00:57:54,040
Speaker 1: Now, Wow, yeah, that's really I think you need to

954
00:57:54,120 --> 00:57:57,880
Speaker 1: chime in, Doc. We definitely need some kind of therapy

955
00:58:00,600 --> 00:58:01,240
Speaker 1: quick health.

956
00:58:01,880 --> 00:58:04,760
Speaker 3: I think you guys beautifully.

957
00:58:05,480 --> 00:58:11,040
Speaker 2: I described to you on another conversation about after letting

958
00:58:11,080 --> 00:58:14,640
Speaker 2: go of some of those things on the mountain in rituals,

959
00:58:14,720 --> 00:58:17,560
Speaker 2: after doing the work in India, and then I landed

960
00:58:17,560 --> 00:58:20,480
Speaker 2: in Delhi and I had twenty four hours there and

961
00:58:20,840 --> 00:58:23,840
Speaker 2: long store, a long, funny story short, I agreed to

962
00:58:23,880 --> 00:58:26,320
Speaker 2: go to dinner with a guy from India who was

963
00:58:26,360 --> 00:58:29,160
Speaker 2: staying at the hotel, and I would never do that

964
00:58:29,200 --> 00:58:32,480
Speaker 2: because a Delhi's not safe and I'm alone. My friends

965
00:58:32,480 --> 00:58:34,440
Speaker 2: weren't there yet, no one knew where I was, and

966
00:58:34,480 --> 00:58:39,360
Speaker 2: I was like, and I felt different because I could

967
00:58:39,440 --> 00:58:42,360
Speaker 2: feel that I wasn't that same person and I knew

968
00:58:42,360 --> 00:58:44,240
Speaker 2: that I was in control of the situation and I

969
00:58:44,280 --> 00:58:47,960
Speaker 2: wasn't going to slip into the seven year old that

970
00:58:48,120 --> 00:58:51,280
Speaker 2: just pretends something's not happening or allows things. I felt

971
00:58:51,360 --> 00:58:55,919
Speaker 2: very different in the experience. So you know, eventually, when

972
00:58:55,920 --> 00:58:58,360
Speaker 2: you have awareness on this stuff and you bring it

973
00:58:58,360 --> 00:59:00,400
Speaker 2: to the surface and you work on things and you

974
00:59:00,520 --> 00:59:03,240
Speaker 2: lean in, it changes. And that I felt like was

975
00:59:03,240 --> 00:59:08,480
Speaker 2: a really profound experience and opportunity to happen so quickly

976
00:59:08,520 --> 00:59:11,240
Speaker 2: to come up and go, oh, I have changed. I

977
00:59:11,320 --> 00:59:13,360
Speaker 2: am safe in the world. I don't need to be

978
00:59:13,440 --> 00:59:16,240
Speaker 2: the fighter that you know, like, I don't need that.

979
00:59:16,400 --> 00:59:19,200
Speaker 2: I think that's why I've been the boxer, the fighter

980
00:59:19,360 --> 00:59:22,680
Speaker 2: like I've got guns and I'll fucking knock you out.

981
00:59:22,720 --> 00:59:27,120
Speaker 2: And I'm not an attractive female that's feminine because I

982
00:59:27,160 --> 00:59:28,320
Speaker 2: don't want you to come close to me.

983
00:59:30,800 --> 00:59:34,840
Speaker 1: Wow. Wow, we could do this for another two hours,

984
00:59:35,160 --> 00:59:40,240
Speaker 1: but we can't. But that's definitely we're going to revisit that, Lilian,

985
00:59:41,000 --> 00:59:43,280
Speaker 1: How do people find you and connect with you and

986
00:59:44,560 --> 00:59:47,720
Speaker 1: come and be therapized by you? If perchance you have

987
00:59:47,760 --> 00:59:48,720
Speaker 1: an opening.

988
00:59:49,520 --> 00:59:52,640
Speaker 3: Doctor lillianneja dot com is a good place to start.

989
00:59:53,680 --> 00:59:57,440
Speaker 3: You can find me there. And some of the programs

990
00:59:57,440 --> 00:59:58,680
Speaker 3: that I have, whether you want to see me a

991
00:59:58,720 --> 01:00:04,600
Speaker 3: person or online through self help means, those are the

992
01:00:04,800 --> 01:00:08,040
Speaker 3: those are the two. Thanks.

993
01:00:08,200 --> 01:00:11,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, I have this awareness when I'm around you of

994
01:00:11,840 --> 01:00:15,600
Speaker 1: how lilting and beautiful your voices and how mine is

995
01:00:15,760 --> 01:00:22,000
Speaker 1: like fucking fingernails on a blackboard. Do you think you

996
01:00:22,000 --> 01:00:24,560
Speaker 1: have that sense? Not utif, but do you It's like

997
01:00:24,640 --> 01:00:26,640
Speaker 1: it's so like hypnotic.

998
01:00:27,480 --> 01:00:28,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's calming.

999
01:00:29,840 --> 01:00:33,760
Speaker 3: Thank you. I actually I was just asked to do

1000
01:00:33,960 --> 01:00:38,280
Speaker 3: like a voiceover for a big event. I've never done

1001
01:00:38,320 --> 01:00:41,160
Speaker 3: that before, and I was cringing. I was at the event,

1002
01:00:41,200 --> 01:00:44,240
Speaker 3: so I was cringing the whole time because nobody likes

1003
01:00:44,280 --> 01:00:48,800
Speaker 3: to hear their their own voice except crime. But yeah, no,

1004
01:00:48,880 --> 01:00:50,920
Speaker 3: it was really it was nice to be asked, and

1005
01:00:53,520 --> 01:00:57,720
Speaker 3: I appreciate the compliment. And if people like my voice.

1006
01:00:57,760 --> 01:01:00,120
Speaker 3: I do have a lot of mindfulness and relaxation and

1007
01:01:00,200 --> 01:01:03,640
Speaker 3: exercises I've recorded that you can find on Spotify if

1008
01:01:03,640 --> 01:01:06,320
Speaker 3: you like. If you want to learn some stress management

1009
01:01:06,760 --> 01:01:10,680
Speaker 3: techniques or learn how to do mindfulness practically, you can

1010
01:01:10,720 --> 01:01:12,760
Speaker 3: listen to my voice as much as you want.

1011
01:01:13,360 --> 01:01:17,920
Speaker 1: Perfect All right, well say goodbye here but for now, Doc,

1012
01:01:18,000 --> 01:01:20,080
Speaker 1: thank you, ti fulso, thank you, yes

1013
01:01:20,200 --> 01:01:23,920
Speaker 3: Thank you very much, both of you for having you