Speaker 1: Hamish Blake. Well, straight talk mate, Thanks, Now, this is
Speaker 1: very straight this joint. You were comfortable that.
Speaker 2: I mean I did really sort of a chuckle there,
Speaker 2: but that will be it for the That's it now.
Speaker 1: It's just straight talk, nothing lose. I don't think many
Speaker 1: people really know about your background, Like, you know, where'd
Speaker 1: you grow up?
Speaker 2: I grew up in Melbourne. I'm a Melbourne boys, sort
Speaker 2: of southeastern suburbs glen Waverley. Is that a good area
Speaker 2: it is now but almost perfectly timed by the Blake
Speaker 2: family too. We got in in nineteen eighty, held on
Speaker 2: for twenty years. House prices went sideways for twenty years
Speaker 2: that we got out just before the boot A good time.
Speaker 2: It's super popular because there's like, you know, good schools
Speaker 2: and stuff out there. But when I grew up it
Speaker 2: was I look had a great time. It was a
Speaker 2: pure kind of like suburban you know, especially like those
Speaker 2: early years before teens. And then then I moved schools
Speaker 2: a couple of times, like I ended up going to
Speaker 2: school still in Melbourne, but like way down like Bayside
Speaker 2: area we moved to. So but I had a pretty
Speaker 2: fun childred. I've been thinking about my childhood a lot
Speaker 2: later because I'm trying to explain to my kids, like
Speaker 2: just really what boredom is and how it's good for
Speaker 2: you and how it makes you imagine things and you
Speaker 2: have to you know, just explaining to them, like we
Speaker 2: didn't have screen time, not because our parents were like
Speaker 2: you can't have screen times. Like we physically couldn't have
Speaker 2: screen time. We didn't have screens. And the one screen
Speaker 2: in the house we had wasn't showing shit for kids,
Speaker 2: so like we couldn't have it. We could watch the microwave,
Speaker 2: we could, like, we just didn't have screens, guys. So
Speaker 2: just trying to get the kids now, like what did
Speaker 2: you do? I was like, well, I remember, you know,
Speaker 2: I speaking to my little boy, who's eleven. I was
Speaker 2: like number one summer around, you know. I was about
Speaker 2: your age, Like we just ride bikes all the time,
Speaker 2: like you just you know, that was the perfect childhood
Speaker 2: and just get home and be back by dark. I
Speaker 2: was like there was a building site nearby that must
Speaker 2: have run into financial problems or whatever because it was
Speaker 2: just a stalled building site for months. And I was
Speaker 2: like they had builders sand and like clay there and
Speaker 2: we're just chuck lumps of clay at each other. I'm like,
Speaker 2: and that was that was great, that that was how
Speaker 2: that was our time. We did not need complicated stuff.
Speaker 1: So what does your son say to that? That's very
Speaker 1: interesting because you know today they're entertained all the time,
Speaker 1: all the time.
Speaker 2: And I fight against this as well, but you know
Speaker 2: that's this is the way of the world. But you know,
Speaker 2: he's eleven now, so I know we haven't hit the
Speaker 2: the waters starting to get a little bit choppy, but
Speaker 2: we haven't hit the full rapids of the teenage years yet.
Speaker 2: That is a big thing for me actually as a dad,
Speaker 2: is trying to just do things that are just connected
Speaker 2: to either just nature or just for the fun of adventure,
Speaker 2: rather than being stuck inside or stuck on a screen.
Speaker 1: Do you do this to make sure that you can
Speaker 1: try and try to help your kids develop the need
Speaker 1: to become creative as a result of being bored, you know,
Speaker 1: go and pick up the clay and perform it through
Speaker 1: each other. I mean that's creativity.
Speaker 2: That is creativity, and we all have it in us.
Speaker 2: You know. It's also just that letting creating the conditions
Speaker 2: for imagination, Like I think play and imagination is a
Speaker 2: huge It's a huge part of childhood, but I think
Speaker 2: it's a huge part of life, like it is a
Speaker 2: big part of what my professional career is. I think
Speaker 2: kind of trying to hang on to that part of
Speaker 2: your childhood that's imaginative and playful and just doing things
Speaker 2: literally just for fun. You know that when you're a kid,
Speaker 2: doing things just for the fun of it seems like
Speaker 2: a good enough goal for an activity. And then as
Speaker 2: we get older, doing things just for the fun of it,
Speaker 2: well it just seems you know, it's regardless, that's frivolous,
Speaker 2: that's like, well, there's more important things to do. But
Speaker 2: I do think doing things just for the fun of
Speaker 2: it should be is a high is high on the
Speaker 2: hierarchy of importance, like you should do things just for
Speaker 2: the fun of it. So yeah, as a as a parent,
Speaker 2: like I think especially with little kids, and I again
Speaker 2: i'm kind of really with any experience of what it's
Speaker 2: like to have a child up to the age of eleven,
Speaker 2: but just creating the conditions for them to be imaginative,
Speaker 2: I think sometimes that's all you need. I was really
Speaker 2: guilty of it too, especially when my little boy was young.
Speaker 2: Did all the stuff, Like you know, I remember buying
Speaker 2: him a Lego set that this was before the leg
Speaker 2: the Lego Show came along. I was gonna say, then
Speaker 2: I got Lego for free. I don't actually I still
Speaker 2: have to buy it, but people think I get it
Speaker 2: for free.
Speaker 1: So you pick a little piece up every now in
Speaker 1: the store.
Speaker 2: I steal a lot from the show. But yeah, but
Speaker 2: then when people see me with a set, they're like, oh, God,
Speaker 2: must be nice, you know, get free Lego, And I go, yeah,
Speaker 2: I do, and I don't know. I have to buy
Speaker 2: it from came up like everyone else. But I remember
Speaker 2: my boy and like he loved Batman and I bought
Speaker 2: him this like you know, quite complicated Batman twelve year
Speaker 2: old one for a few like a fifteen year old,
Speaker 2: and I was like a Batman bill that split into
Speaker 2: four pieces and I loved it. So I was like, yeah,
Speaker 2: this is awesome. And he's five, and I'm like, you're
Speaker 2: a very smart five year old, like we'll sort this
Speaker 2: out together. And of course it's just like way too much.
Speaker 2: I don't think he could even do small Lego at
Speaker 2: that stage you're still kind of on duplo. I remember,
Speaker 2: like it was a great parenting lesson because I forced
Speaker 2: it a bit. He really didn't want to do it
Speaker 2: was getting a bit angsty. I ended up having to
Speaker 2: like spend boxing day on the twenty seventh of December
Speaker 2: building it. And then I looked over and he had
Speaker 2: made out of duplow like ten bricks stuck together and
Speaker 2: he's zooming it around and he's like, I've made this
Speaker 2: is the batmobile. And I was like, yeah, of course,
Speaker 2: that's what you meant to do when you five just
Speaker 2: put ten things together and it's in your head. It's
Speaker 2: in your imagination. So I love that about kids in
Speaker 2: general and my kids, and I think, yeah, I think
Speaker 2: it's you know, as much as we can, I reckon.
Speaker 2: That's the antidote to kind of you know, that's the antidote.
Speaker 2: Screen time is and letting him have the space and
Speaker 2: the time to just imagine things and draw and just
Speaker 2: you know, tinker around in nature.
Speaker 1: It's interesting to talk about nature, and I know you
Speaker 1: talk about natural things, but you know, we all talk
Speaker 1: about nature and nurture. As a kid, yourself, homish, what
Speaker 1: do you think you got from your parents in a
Speaker 1: natural sense?
Speaker 2: Question? My mum was incredibly is incredibly loving and caring,
Speaker 2: and so I think I think in terms of the
Speaker 2: nurture and Mum's Mum was a you know, a literature teacher,
Speaker 2: you know, loved you know, I was like, you know,
Speaker 2: I was trying to teach a Shakespeare and stuff when
Speaker 2: we're in year six, which we weren't interesting. But I
Speaker 2: do look back and I go, Mum, the cultured side
Speaker 2: of Mum had a real impact too, you know, She's
Speaker 2: it's that funny thing of like, no six year old
Speaker 2: really cares about opera, but if it is, if you're
Speaker 2: being shown these things, it has some kind of an
Speaker 2: impact on you, particularly later on you've got some you say, mum.
Speaker 2: Mum had that side. It wasn't really forced down a throat.
Speaker 2: But when I think back to it, I'm like, yes,
Speaker 2: somehow I know Vivaldi's Four Seasons and I never learned
Speaker 2: an instrument or play it, but like it was, you know,
Speaker 2: that was the kind of stuff mum, you know around
Speaker 2: So Mum was that the intelligence side. I think Mum
Speaker 2: was always very very keen for us to to sort
Speaker 2: of intellectually expand ourselves as much as we could, and
Speaker 2: but was also extremely loving and kind and Dad in
Speaker 2: a funny way, in a funny way, this, this is this,
Speaker 2: this sounds a bit in the inaccurate. I think I
Speaker 2: got my sense of humor from Dad, but almost because
Speaker 2: I was trying to get a rise out of him,
Speaker 2: because he was quite It's not as he's not serious,
Speaker 2: but he was. He was, you know, focused on what
Speaker 2: he had to do, like Dad. So Dad worked for
Speaker 2: most of his life, like he worked with my grandpa
Speaker 2: farming until until I was kind of like five or
Speaker 2: six that had farms like on the outskirts of Melbourne,
Speaker 2: like cattle farms and market garden. And then Dad got
Speaker 2: out of farming and he was he was doing irrigation,
Speaker 2: so putting in like big large level like sprinkler systems
Speaker 2: and you know, basic digging. It was just in the
Speaker 2: dirt all day, like digging the hall and pipes and stuff.
Speaker 2: So Dad was like, you know, he's he's driving a you.
Speaker 2: He's always outside loading the you up with you tools
Speaker 2: and diggers and pipes out of the shed. And like
Speaker 2: Dad had big jobs going on, and so you know,
Speaker 2: and I've always just wanted to make people laugh. I
Speaker 2: don't know where that comes from, but I've just always
Speaker 2: thought that. You know, I'm always just in any situation
Speaker 2: looking for what's the funniest thing that could happen here.
Speaker 2: So I'm trying to make Dad laugh. He's not in
Speaker 2: the mood, but I know it's in there somewhere.
Speaker 1: I'm going to find it.
Speaker 2: Basically, just trying to like needle it out of him
Speaker 2: the whole time. And so then if they did crack him,
Speaker 2: I was like, yeah, great, this is good. I'm getting
Speaker 2: to him. And so it's not like he didn't want
Speaker 2: to have fun, but he was just busy doing other shit,
Speaker 2: but serious with his work, serious with his work. In
Speaker 2: terms of the nature nurture. I was saying that somehow
Speaker 2: it was in my nature to maybe be wanting to
Speaker 2: you know, like comedy was in my nature. And so
Speaker 2: it was like Dad it but he was like good
Speaker 2: resistance training for it.
Speaker 1: But did you get a rise out of me? I mean,
Speaker 1: like you've got him to react to.
Speaker 2: Laugh, going to react and so and it's that funny thing,
Speaker 2: like I think it's not unusual for comedians or people
Speaker 2: in the comedy world to boil it down like we're
Speaker 2: all trying to get attention. Really, like it is a
Speaker 2: bit of an attention economy now it is, it is,
Speaker 2: and but I think comedy has always had that aspect.
Speaker 2: I think if people got really honest, most you know,
Speaker 2: anyone is there is like, oh yeah, there's someone in
Speaker 2: their life they're trying to get the attention of. And
Speaker 2: it was probably my dad. I mean probably there's still
Speaker 2: a little part of me that's that little boy trying
Speaker 2: to get these dat's attention.
Speaker 1: I mean, you guys have been extraordinarily successful over a
Speaker 1: long period of time, so you know, you success can
Speaker 1: be measured lots of different ways, but for me, one
Speaker 1: of the really important ways of measuring success is being
Speaker 1: able to evolve perhaps or stay relevant in anyway and
Speaker 1: have different types of shows over a long period of time.
Speaker 1: And you guys have been extraordinarily good at that. What
Speaker 1: role does curiosity play because jurisum me is really important? Well,
Speaker 1: as a businessman, I'm a business funny hundred you're funny.
Speaker 2: Yeah, But I think exactly the same thing though, because
Speaker 2: you're being led by what interests you and man, I
Speaker 2: think when you do it with the reverse, that's when
Speaker 2: trouble starts. Because I think that's very kind of you
Speaker 2: to say, like we've evolved and adapted. But it would
Speaker 2: be wrong, I think would be wrong for people to
Speaker 2: hear that, to be like, oh, we saw a trend
Speaker 2: coming and we moved to it, because I don't think
Speaker 2: that ever works, because then you're following what you are
Speaker 2: assuming to be other people's interests and hoping you match them,
Speaker 2: and you can't lose you lose connection with your inner voice.
Speaker 1: And there's nothing unique either.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you're not curious anymore. You just trying to do
Speaker 2: the best job fitting in. And so for Ferrando and
Speaker 2: I together and then and then even separately, the one
Speaker 2: thing we've always prought ourselves on is going there's no
Speaker 2: guarantees in any of this. There was never a guarantee
Speaker 2: when we started, Like it just you just don't have
Speaker 2: any guarantee. It's like you're putting things out there and
Speaker 2: hoping it connects with an audience, and if it does,
Speaker 2: that's great, and if it doesn't, well, I'd still rather
Speaker 2: have put it out there and tried it anyway than not.
Speaker 2: But there's just no guarantee. The only thing you can control,
Speaker 2: like if you look at it from that perspective, like,
Speaker 2: the one controllable you can control is is this interesting
Speaker 2: to us, like is this interesting? And are we curious
Speaker 2: about this? And curiousity is such a good word for it,
Speaker 2: because you're like you're being led by what you think
Speaker 2: is other funny, interesting, or just a fun way to
Speaker 2: spend your day and in the pursuit of, you know,
Speaker 2: an interesting problem to solve, Like a lot of TV
Speaker 2: shows and even with the podcasts we do and separate stuff,
Speaker 2: I'd say you could classify all those things as interesting
Speaker 2: problems to solve, like something like Lego Masters. If I
Speaker 2: look at an episode, I go, all right, what's this
Speaker 2: episode about? How can we solve the presenting of this?
Speaker 2: Like how can we solve communicating this to the audience
Speaker 2: in the funnest, most interesting way? Like that's kind of
Speaker 2: how my brain would think about my job regard And
Speaker 2: same with the podcast with Andy, Like every week we
Speaker 2: get together on the Hamishanny podcast and go, what's the
Speaker 2: what's the funnest thing we could do? What's the thing
Speaker 2: that would excite us the most that we think would
Speaker 2: also bring our audience along for the ride, because we
Speaker 2: know if we're excited and where passionate, that's the best
Speaker 2: bet we've got. Like that, we do think that's the
Speaker 2: best way to kind of connect with your audience. So
Speaker 2: long way of answering that question. But curiosity is huge
Speaker 2: because it's your inner voice, like that's your gut. Your
Speaker 2: gut is your curiosity, and if you're being led by that,
Speaker 2: I kind of think you can't go wrong because if
Speaker 2: something hits, it's going to be the best kind of
Speaker 2: content because it's authentically what you're interested in. And if
Speaker 2: it doesn't hit, you can't still being true to yourself.
Speaker 2: So that's fine too.
Speaker 1: You know, it's funny. I was just when you're talking
Speaker 1: to me, then I was seeing a bet my brother.
Speaker 1: My brother's a lot younger than men. When he Leo
Speaker 1: came in, there was a thing called Meccano.
Speaker 2: I'm contractually Nola had to play with.
Speaker 1: It was that they were sort of a competitor.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know why Lego's worried about but no, no,
Speaker 2: and I'm not just saying this because I'm a Lego boy.
Speaker 2: It's so shit. The big bolts on him sheets I
Speaker 2: had one as I did too, because you know, a
Speaker 2: well meaning auntie had given me the crane or something
Speaker 2: made Ada mcconnough. I was like, oh my god, this
Speaker 2: is like when you look at Lego. And again I'm
Speaker 2: not being paid to say this, but I think we
Speaker 2: can all agree the engineering of Lego is like quite amazing.
Speaker 1: It's brilliant.
Speaker 2: These things click together, they stick. If you want to
Speaker 2: get really deep in at that little circle on top's
Speaker 2: called a stud and the gap on the bottom of
Speaker 2: a Lego, but it's called the anti stud. And the
Speaker 2: pressure with which they connect is called the clutch power
Speaker 2: of the brick. It's actually quite scientific. Anyway, they stick together.
Speaker 2: It's easy. You go over to mccano, you literally have
Speaker 2: to put mini bolts and was nuts.
Speaker 1: You know, you're screwing on well, and a lot of
Speaker 1: people wuldn't even know what it was. And I remember
Speaker 1: when then Lego came out and brought six years younger.
Speaker 1: Then when Lego came out. One of the things I
Speaker 1: know about my brother is he was very good at
Speaker 1: the detail. Like he would sit for like a little
Speaker 1: five year old kid or whatever. He would sit there
Speaker 1: for hours and I was like ten or eleven, I'll
Speaker 1: be looking at what the fuck you do? And he
Speaker 1: would five six hours. He do it all day long.
Speaker 1: And but what's interesting about that is my brother and
Speaker 1: I now do business together and my brother's a lawyer
Speaker 1: and he does all our legal stuff.
Speaker 2: The detail guy.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And then I look at you and Andy Leo, Yeah,
Speaker 1: are you the creative and here's the detailed guy? Or
Speaker 1: is sometimes because that's how you might be presented, or
Speaker 1: sometimes it is actually the reverse In real life.
Speaker 2: I'd say, as we've got older, we've probably got better
Speaker 2: at the other guy's discipline. Do you know what I mean?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 2: The reason I do the show down is because I
Speaker 2: think he's so fun. He makes me laugh so much,
Speaker 2: so it's not true to go I'm creative and he's not.
Speaker 2: Because when he brings things, I you know, I love it,
Speaker 2: Like we just make each other love. That's the that's
Speaker 2: the lottery we've won, is we found this other person
Speaker 2: that we just kind of have like a telepathy with
Speaker 2: and we're just so aligned on what we think is
Speaker 2: funny and a good adventure too. I think from the
Speaker 2: moment we met.
Speaker 1: Like do you remember that moment?
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, definitely, And it was at Melbourne UNI.
Speaker 1: What were you doing?
Speaker 2: I took a year off and moved with my mum
Speaker 2: to Sydney in the year two thousand. I come up
Speaker 2: for the Olympics. I went to Synee and I was like, oh,
Speaker 2: this should be fun. So I took a year off
Speaker 2: and but and he went straight to You.
Speaker 1: Watch me sort of compete in the bits.
Speaker 2: Yeah, a little bit late to get selection. I rolled
Speaker 2: up as wild card, couldn't get I was like, maybe
Speaker 2: I could do a shooting.
Speaker 1: No.
Speaker 2: I was just bumming around Sydney, just trying to sneak
Speaker 2: into the beach holleyball and stuff, and it was it was.
Speaker 2: It was a great fun time. But Ander had gone
Speaker 2: straight to UNI. Then I moved back to Melbourne to
Speaker 2: go to Union. He had gone straight to UNI, and
Speaker 2: one of my mates from high school had become friends
Speaker 2: with him. Got called Pete, and Pete's like, oh, mate,
Speaker 2: I reckon. You got to make this guy Andy like
Speaker 2: he actually reminds me a lot of you. I reckon.
Speaker 2: You guys are get on. And so we really Opeede
Speaker 2: a lot because yet me and Andy Mett and immediately we're
Speaker 2: like best friends and probably cut Pete out a bit
Speaker 2: and Pete out to go up and find some other people.
Speaker 2: So apologies Nlsey, But yeah, no. Then we were like,
Speaker 2: you know, we were thick as thieves and I think
Speaker 2: it was just sort of a sense of adventure that
Speaker 2: we had with each other because we still talk and I,
Speaker 2: in fact, the other day had a deep and meaningful
Speaker 2: about this, like we still are interested in, like why
Speaker 2: does this thing we do work?
Speaker 1: Like how do we feel.
Speaker 2: About We do a lot of analyzing, and like great,
Speaker 2: it's full of gratitude, like great for analyzing because we
Speaker 2: know how lucky we are to have each other. But
Speaker 2: one of the things we often talk about is we've
Speaker 2: probably got a pretty similar risk appetite as well, like
Speaker 2: we like to have a go at some big things,
Speaker 2: and especially when we're in our teens and twenties, Like
Speaker 2: that's exactly what you should be doing in your teens
Speaker 2: and twenties, Like this idea of going of just having
Speaker 2: a crack at things, And it made it so much
Speaker 2: easier though, to have a mate doing it. Like I
Speaker 2: think one of the things Andy gave me, especially in
Speaker 2: my twenties, that I'm way more grateful for any of
Speaker 2: the kind of like normal markers of success, like any
Speaker 2: of the financial rewards or you know, career longevity. One
Speaker 2: of the best gifts I reckon Andy gave me was
Speaker 2: at that time in my life is you just sort
Speaker 2: of just finding your feet coming out of your teenage
Speaker 2: years into your twenties. But he was a catalyst for courage.
Speaker 2: I think, like you meet a best friend and then
Speaker 2: you're like, all right, let's do it together. And I
Speaker 2: am so grateful for that too, because you know when
Speaker 2: you get a bit further down the track and it
Speaker 2: will bit of gray in your beard. All you want
Speaker 2: to do is tell people in their twenties just take
Speaker 2: massive risks. Who cares, Like, just pedal as hard as
Speaker 2: you can and to the extend you can be reckless,
Speaker 2: not massive personal risks, like you're not massive careless risks,
Speaker 2: but put yourself out there. Sorry, risk embarrassment, risk, risk
Speaker 2: getting it wrong, risk, you know, humiliation. If you want
Speaker 2: to have a business idea, if you want to have
Speaker 2: a if you want to get up on stage, or
Speaker 2: you want to release an album, or you want to
Speaker 2: decide to be a dancer or whatever it is you
Speaker 2: want to do, that's when you should do it in
Speaker 2: your twenties because you've got the agility to bounce back
Speaker 2: and it's always going to Any failure is going to
Speaker 2: be great.
Speaker 1: Lean into being vulnerable there, Yeah, who is a fuck yeah.
Speaker 2: Because but also come unfortunately well for me anyway, it
Speaker 2: comes on at a time in your life where you
Speaker 2: you're looking at the big wide world and you you
Speaker 2: I definitely was at risk of going, you know, just
Speaker 2: waiting until things seemed right.
Speaker 1: Or like, Okay, I've got this.
Speaker 2: You would that's yours that I reckon. I would have
Speaker 2: at that age waited a lot longer thinking I was,
Speaker 2: you know, that that fallacy of thinking that just wait
Speaker 2: until a few more things fall into place, and you know,
Speaker 2: suddenly a few years have gone by and you actually
Speaker 2: haven't done the thing that scares you. And I think
Speaker 2: by meeting ando and having someone by your side, you
Speaker 2: can gee each other up into doing the thing that
Speaker 2: scares you. And it's always the best thing to like,
Speaker 2: you know, have this conversation Evey when the kids as
Speaker 2: they're a little like this. The feeling that we all
Speaker 2: want in life is almost always on the other side
Speaker 2: of fear and the thing that scares you. And we
Speaker 2: know that feeling. We love that feeling when we get there,
Speaker 2: and we always like, oh, that's you know, I'm not
Speaker 2: going to be scared anymore. And of course we always
Speaker 2: it's a permanent process of trying to face those fears
Speaker 2: all the time, to remember to keep pushing through them.
Speaker 1: I think it is how our brain has evolved. It
Speaker 1: gets a way of survival. Yeah, when you say the
Speaker 1: two of you you feel better having two of you
Speaker 1: to do something. Is that because you feel better of
Speaker 1: both fail and you can sort of say to each other, like,
Speaker 1: let's say you're going to do somebody's.
Speaker 2: Going to fail, you're alone.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's about not being alone. And you said something
Speaker 1: really interesting a moment ago. You use the word courage,
Speaker 1: and I love the word, but also fear. Courage sort
Speaker 1: of sits somewhere between being completely fearful, in other words,
Speaker 1: you know, stone dead, you won't do anything nothing, And
Speaker 1: at the other end of the spectrum is reckless, where
Speaker 1: you don't give a fuck. You do everything and you
Speaker 1: don't give a shit about the outcomiscy and you don't
Speaker 1: care if it hurts anyone either. That's reckless. Courage sort
Speaker 1: of sits somewhere in the middle of that.
Speaker 2: Well, don't think courageous without being scared, because that's great.
Speaker 1: I love hearing that.
Speaker 2: Courage is the overcoming of fear. Courage is being scared
Speaker 2: and doing it anyway. Courage isn't the absence of fear,
Speaker 2: because that is where you could be a psychopathy. You know,
Speaker 2: it could just be like I don't assuming you're normal, Yeah,
Speaker 2: assuming you're normal, like you, So you have to be
Speaker 2: scared for the opportunity to be courageous, Like that's the
Speaker 2: gift of fear. I suppose if you want to frame
Speaker 2: it in that sense, you go, great, I'm scared, so
Speaker 2: now I've got a chance to do something with it
Speaker 2: and to see if I can overcome that fear.
Speaker 1: And finding someone who has the same mindset was like minded, Yeah,
Speaker 1: in a better way putting it like minded, that's pretty powerful.
Speaker 1: Did you recognize that at the time. Did you feel
Speaker 1: there's power in this?
Speaker 2: I think for a second, because I just got to
Speaker 2: UNI too, I think for a second I was like, Oh,
Speaker 2: this is great. This is what UNI was meant to be.
Speaker 2: You meant to meet all these great people, and then
Speaker 2: I just expected to meet heaps more like Andy because
Speaker 2: it was like day one I think we met and
Speaker 2: then I went I actually, hang on a second, maybe
Speaker 2: this is he's just one of one and we'll stick together.
Speaker 2: So you know, we're really really lucky that we have that,
Speaker 2: like mind and us, but simultaneously we're extremely different people too,
Speaker 2: So I think that's the that's the that's the beauty
Speaker 2: of it. We have so much that we have a
Speaker 2: ven diagram overlap on, and then we have a heap
Speaker 2: that we don't and that's what makes it. That's great.
Speaker 2: We don't want two hamishes and we don't want to Andy's.
Speaker 1: It wouldn't work.
Speaker 2: It doesn't work. So that's the alchemy, you know. That's
Speaker 2: that's one on one equals three is somehow we've got
Speaker 2: We've got that. We've got that enough in common that
Speaker 2: we completely understand each other, and then enough not in
Speaker 2: common that we are our own kind of unique people.
Speaker 2: So I think this was this this began because we're
Speaker 2: talking about like, you know, the details guy and the
Speaker 2: creative guy, and is extremely gifted at at at details.
Speaker 2: I mean, he's we have a segment on the show
Speaker 2: that makes fun of how detailed Orientity is. It's called
Speaker 2: upset Andy just because he loves everything to be neat
Speaker 2: organized like that.
Speaker 1: For real, that's for real, that's real. Yes, And I
Speaker 1: Gore just taking the Pierce.
Speaker 2: No no, no, proberly. Now it's probably an undiagnosed something
Speaker 2: that it's like it's all good fun. But you know,
Speaker 2: he has a drawer at home that's like, you know,
Speaker 2: batteries and like he has like everything labeled, and it's
Speaker 2: whereas my house is just piles and complete chaos. So
Speaker 2: I do. I mean, that's probably a little snapshot of
Speaker 2: our brains too, Like my brain is quite chaotic, he isn't.
Speaker 2: But I also think a big out of our relationship
Speaker 2: is we love the other guys. We love the other
Speaker 2: guy for their brain. So I think he likes what
Speaker 2: comes out of my chaotic brain, and I know I
Speaker 2: get so much benefit from his from the way he
Speaker 2: does things, and I think that's an important part of
Speaker 2: a partnership. I think you have to love the other
Speaker 2: person's brain rather than go, mate, why are you so ain?
Speaker 2: Or be more like me? It would be terrible if
Speaker 2: he was more like me. And at the same time,
Speaker 2: I don't think he's sitting there being like, hey, mate,
Speaker 2: be more you go to be more structured in this stuff.
Speaker 2: I think, you know, thankfully he's he's always kind of
Speaker 2: making space for me to just be like, yeah, that's
Speaker 2: the way Haym does things. But we know we'll get
Speaker 2: a result at the end, he'll spit something out and
Speaker 2: that will be good for the show.
Speaker 1: And did you always have that empathy between each other?
Speaker 1: I mean it or take time?
Speaker 2: It did take time. It probably did take to I reckon,
Speaker 2: I reckon, especially early days, likereing in your twenties and
Speaker 2: you're doing like you're doing a national radio show, and
Speaker 2: there's no rule book for any of that stuff, like
Speaker 2: you do learn by doing. And we're lucky to have
Speaker 2: good people around us too that we made communication a
Speaker 2: really big part of our team. So we did do
Speaker 2: a lot of checking in with each other. And because
Speaker 2: it's funny, you're growing as well at the same time,
Speaker 2: so it's not like you come to the table as
Speaker 2: complete humans. We came to each other as growing boys.
Speaker 2: Like we're like twenty two, so you're growing with each
Speaker 2: other and you go to keep checking in with each
Speaker 2: other as you're growing up together to keep it working.
Speaker 2: We always sort of joke that our partnership was we're like,
Speaker 2: it's a nuclear reactor. We have to notice cracks before
Speaker 2: someone else does, Like if we don't notice the cracks,
Speaker 2: it could be catastrophic, and we're also aware of like
Speaker 2: it's this. It was very strange thing that we ended
Speaker 2: up doing with our lives because we're like we've commercialized
Speaker 2: a friendship, like we we're mates, but now we're mates
Speaker 2: for our job. Quick. Now that's what we build a
Speaker 2: brand with two names in it. Yeah, it's us, Like
Speaker 2: it's not like we it's not characters. It's like it's us.
Speaker 2: So like you feel it, really you feel it because
Speaker 2: you're like, shit, if this people don't like the show,
Speaker 2: they don't like us. So it's kind of you're hanging
Speaker 2: a lot on it. So that takes a little bit
Speaker 2: of time to get your head around.
Speaker 1: But talking to each other, is it like for real?
Speaker 1: Like do you sit down, do you have a cadence?
Speaker 1: Like you sort of sit down and say, well, once
Speaker 1: a month, we get this is we're at.
Speaker 2: It's never been good at formalizing it. I think we
Speaker 2: it just has we've learned to do it organically, you know.
Speaker 2: Even I mean honestly, yesterday we had a similar chat
Speaker 2: and we were just just you know, we were into
Speaker 2: the year in Owstoned podcast. We're seeing how we're going,
Speaker 2: like you know, and a lot of the time, especially
Speaker 2: at the you know, at the moment, because I feel
Speaker 2: like we're in a great part of our lives. You know,
Speaker 2: it's just it's a lot of times. So it's just
Speaker 2: a real gratitude to just be like this is this
Speaker 2: is great, Like we're really lucky, Like you have the
Speaker 2: team we've got, you say that to each other, and
Speaker 2: we've been us this before, took. I think the thing
Speaker 2: that we're one of the other lotteries we want was
Speaker 2: we didn't just find a person that makes us laugh,
Speaker 2: and didn't just find a person that makes the performance
Speaker 2: side of things really easy. We also found a person
Speaker 2: who thinks we have the same definition.
Speaker 1: Of what good is in terms of values.
Speaker 2: Yeah, in terms of values, but I think it's as
Speaker 2: well as to what we do professionally. But actually yeah,
Speaker 2: in terms of values too. Like we want to have
Speaker 2: a team around us that's having a good time. We
Speaker 2: want to look after people. We want this to be
Speaker 2: enjoyable for everyone. We want people to feel, whether it's
Speaker 2: our audience or our team around us. I think we
Speaker 2: want people to I think we want to stand for
Speaker 2: what the good in life is. And like I said before,
Speaker 2: like the just for fun element, the laughter and the
Speaker 2: and the connection you can get to people in the
Speaker 2: same room as you, but also listening by simply having
Speaker 2: a great time.
Speaker 1: But is that a luxury that you can deal in
Speaker 1: now because you're so successful and you know you can
Speaker 1: you know, you make good money, et cetera. Got good
Speaker 1: coin you've accumulated or is that something that you guys
Speaker 1: had from the very beginning.
Speaker 2: I know it's easy to say it was there from
Speaker 2: the very beginning, but I do think it has been.
Speaker 2: I think it's been a core tenant of ours to go.
Speaker 2: We like, if you were like, what does this show
Speaker 2: stand for? Even back in early radio days, I think
Speaker 2: we would have honestly said this before any this is
Speaker 2: before a paycheck land, and like we stand for people
Speaker 2: have the people we engage with having fun. We always
Speaker 2: always at our happiest. I reckon when it's like listeners
Speaker 2: or other people in the show coming up with funny
Speaker 2: things and where like it's making us laugh, because I'd
Speaker 2: be like, I think that's what we've always stood for,
Speaker 2: the connection that humans can feel with each other when
Speaker 2: sort of silliness is in the air, and that's that's
Speaker 2: I think that's just what's always floated our boat. You know,
Speaker 2: the first radio show we did for many years, we
Speaker 2: did it for we were like, we'll work for free.
Speaker 2: We did Monday nights. Yeah. Our first actual first contract
Speaker 2: with this was with ostereo. Back in the days. This
Speaker 2: was on Fox FM in Melbourne, like and it wasn't
Speaker 2: national at that stage. We wanted to do the Drive
Speaker 2: Show because we'd always loved drive radio because I don't know,
Speaker 2: it's kind of similar these days too, but like breakfast
Speaker 2: shows are about like breaking news and gossip and like headlines,
Speaker 2: which has just never been our bag, and the Drive
Speaker 2: Show felt like you could be silly. It's like escapism.
Speaker 2: You can just talk about dumb stuff and make people laugh.
Speaker 2: And we're like, that's what we want to do. We
Speaker 2: want to do something this escapism. So we went to
Speaker 2: them and we were like, you know, they kind of
Speaker 2: were happy to have, like we're kind of happy to
Speaker 2: give you guys the show, but they they offered us
Speaker 2: Monday day to Thursday, and they're like, we can't afford
Speaker 2: to pay you guys five days a week, which I've
Speaker 2: never heard of before or whatever. Like then I was
Speaker 2: sort of just hedging their beds. Maybe wanted to do music,
Speaker 2: but the reason they gave us was like, well, we
Speaker 2: can't afford, we can't afford five days a week for
Speaker 2: the show, and we went, all right, well, we'll do
Speaker 2: Fridays for free because we don't want to do a
Speaker 2: Monday to Thursday show because then all our listeners on
Speaker 2: Friday will just not have a show to listen to
Speaker 2: and they'll go somewhere else. So yeah, for the first
Speaker 2: year we did Fridays for free, we got them back.
Speaker 2: In subsequent years we did make them.
Speaker 1: I think Ostereo over time has probably paid their way got.
Speaker 2: To pay Fridays. But so I can honestly say, hand
Speaker 2: on hut, like that was our It was never our
Speaker 2: mission to you know, we never got into this to
Speaker 2: make money. The money is an extremely happy side effect,
Speaker 2: but I've never it just so of course you appreciative
Speaker 2: and cognizant of like how lucky you are to be
Speaker 2: in a position to make money out of this thing.
Speaker 2: But it absolutely never a driver.
Speaker 1: So you're you're the it's sort of like a a
Speaker 1: straight guy and not so straight.
Speaker 2: Guy sometimes, And I guess I guess that I kind
Speaker 2: of sound why people do say that, because it's like
Speaker 2: it's it's I don't know, there's a thing where that's
Speaker 2: kind of like one of the rules people know about
Speaker 2: duos like you know, you go Laurela Hardy or straight straight.
Speaker 2: I've never thought of any and I like that. I
Speaker 2: just think we have different I actually think we're great
Speaker 2: at playing like bass and treble and flipping. You know.
Speaker 2: I just think I think. I just feel like it's
Speaker 2: two different vibrations that kind of work with each other.
Speaker 1: That sounds very scientific.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I've started off going music and then I switched
Speaker 2: to physics.
Speaker 1: But I just think music and physics are related, so
Speaker 1: it's okay, yeah.
Speaker 2: Well there we go. There's mum's influence. Again. I wouldn't
Speaker 2: know about bass and treble if it wasn't for Mum.
Speaker 2: But do you know what I mean, I'd never have
Speaker 2: gone like, I've never thought like, Okay, Andy's in the
Speaker 2: suit and I'm the clown. We just it does feel
Speaker 2: like a dance. Like Honestly, I'll go I'll stick with
Speaker 2: physics because that is actually what I was studying at UNI.
Speaker 2: I just think we know exactly in any given moment,
Speaker 2: how to counterbalance.
Speaker 1: Which character you need to be, how to.
Speaker 2: Counterbalance each other, to keep the center of gravity in
Speaker 2: the same spot so we can move all over the place,
Speaker 2: and the center kind of the show stays on track.
Speaker 1: And what most people don't probably realize about you, because
Speaker 1: you know you have sometimes you play loose and you're
Speaker 1: probably more reputationally that that person and you totally.
Speaker 2: That is the way I add.
Speaker 1: But what's interesting you just said you talk about physics,
Speaker 1: and the way you explain that was very logical and
Speaker 1: very structured. And the way you talked about LEGO.
Speaker 2: I am a bit of a science nerd.
Speaker 1: I can see that, and Lego is very structured, and
Speaker 1: it is about structured creativity, lateral and vertical strengths and engineered.
Speaker 1: Nearly it is engineered, and I'm not saying nearly it
Speaker 1: is engineered as brilliantly engineered. Most of you probably don't
Speaker 1: know that about you. I mean, they don't get that
Speaker 1: about you. Yes, it just seemed you for a bit
Speaker 1: of a giggle.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I am I suppose I got a
Speaker 2: you know, like anyone, you've got a lot of different
Speaker 2: sides to the to the twelve side of dice, or
Speaker 2: how many sides you've got. But I was doing maths
Speaker 2: and physics at UNI. I was doing pure maths for
Speaker 2: a little while, not quite full Adam Spencer level, but.
Speaker 1: He is a free adam, but he's very.
Speaker 2: Good, so I can't I'm not quite in his echelon.
Speaker 2: But and because I did maths at school and I
Speaker 2: found it like I've got a bit of a mathsy brain,
Speaker 2: so I didn't find it difficult. And then I got
Speaker 2: to Uni thinking like, oh this is great, Like I
Speaker 2: was really good at maths at school, and then I
Speaker 2: got to university. And when you roll into pure advanced
Speaker 2: mathematics at Melbourne University, that's when you go, Okay, these
Speaker 2: kids are smart. I think I might not be in
Speaker 2: the right place here. I was sort of thinking I'd
Speaker 2: breeze in a couple of times a week, miss a
Speaker 2: few lectures here and there. These guys are really serious
Speaker 2: about maths, so I squeaked through and then I dropped it.
Speaker 2: I dropped it out a bit.
Speaker 1: But do you still feel as though that that style
Speaker 1: of thinking is one of your strengths. I do.
Speaker 2: I do because I think going back to looking at
Speaker 2: creativity in comedy is a bit of a puzzle, and
Speaker 2: a puzzle with many solutions. I think there is a
Speaker 2: mathematical overlap to the way you can look at.
Speaker 1: Creative nearly an algorithm to get to the end.
Speaker 2: It is. It is, and it's kind of about pattern recognition,
Speaker 2: like I remember in you know, for anyone that enjoys
Speaker 2: maths like it, you can see numbers move and kind
Speaker 2: of you know, the way you look at you can go, okay, well,
Speaker 2: I know that this slips under that denominator and this
Speaker 2: cancels that out, and you can kind of see the
Speaker 2: equation moving before your eyes. That's the way maths works
Speaker 2: when you get good at it, or like at a
Speaker 2: certain level, and that's the way your brain kind of
Speaker 2: you can you can see as you kind of get
Speaker 2: into it, whether you doing like whether you're presenting, whether
Speaker 2: you're kind of like freestyling a bit of like whether
Speaker 2: we're doing stuff on the podcast. Your brain's always like
Speaker 2: running the algorithm as fast as it can for what
Speaker 2: are the possible outcomes here and what what could lead
Speaker 2: off onto something else and what could branch into another
Speaker 2: chain of thoughts. I think there is an overlap, like
Speaker 2: I think I think I think speed of thought is
Speaker 2: a fun thing to exercise too, Like I think that's
Speaker 2: that's something.
Speaker 1: As an intellectual exercise, because if you're watching that, most
Speaker 1: people just watching your outcome, they're not getting what you do,
Speaker 1: what you've put into that to get to that point.
Speaker 1: You know you are freestyling. Then for pure John, your
Speaker 1: brain's working, and I love that. How important is it
Speaker 1: for you to deconstruct it like you do Lego and
Speaker 1: then reconstruct it. See there's a problem, I'm going to
Speaker 1: pull it out into his various parts and then I'm
Speaker 1: going to put it all back together and hopefully you
Speaker 1: don't have any pieces left over, and there's your outcome.
Speaker 2: Totally, And I think that's the fun of it. That's
Speaker 2: what I love.
Speaker 1: That's what you do is that's what I love about what.
Speaker 2: We get to do. You get infinite combinations basically. I
Speaker 2: mean there's a thing in Lego which I think I'm
Speaker 2: going to get this wrong, but if you take six bricks,
Speaker 2: like two by four bricks, which is like eight studs
Speaker 2: on the top, I think there is three million combinations
Speaker 2: you can put those together in just those six bricks.
Speaker 2: And so you know, for a Lego set that has
Speaker 2: hundreds of bricks in it, it'd have to be in
Speaker 2: the trillions.
Speaker 1: Of combinations of combination of possibilities.
Speaker 2: Not all of them look like a pirate ship. There's
Speaker 2: a couple that look aesthetically pleasing, but you know you've
Speaker 2: got to You've got under in combinations and.
Speaker 1: That's but none of them are wrong.
Speaker 2: None of them are wrong. Well well no, and there's
Speaker 2: none of them are wrong. Some would be more.
Speaker 1: Interesting, yeah, yeah, totally. So it's different.
Speaker 2: Not all of them would work as a set. But
Speaker 2: I think that's the fun of going, Okay, well, what
Speaker 2: can we put together that would be appealing. So you know,
Speaker 2: you're sitting down with any looking at a show, looking
Speaker 2: at a podcast, or doing my own TV show or
Speaker 2: whatever you have to do creatively, the fun is sitting
Speaker 2: down and going, Okay, right now we have nothing, and
Speaker 2: later on we're going to have something, and at some
Speaker 2: point in between then we're gonna it's gonna come.
Speaker 1: And that's your fun. I love that, that's your fun.
Speaker 2: That's my fun. So somewhere in there a spark is
Speaker 2: going to happen, and then from the tiniest spark, we're
Speaker 2: going to fan those flames and then we're gonna that's
Speaker 2: going to grow into something and I love. One of
Speaker 2: the things I find most satisfying about a job is
Speaker 2: like we get to the end of the year, and
Speaker 2: particularly with the podcast, with with Ando, like we get
Speaker 2: to go on these you know, awesome adventures, like either
Speaker 2: physically going on an adventure or just creatively going on
Speaker 2: a wild journey for something. And I love looking back
Speaker 2: at where it started because so often it's it's that
Speaker 2: it's it's a like one word or one sentence that
Speaker 2: because we're in that environment where we're like, what what else,
Speaker 2: what could happen? What could possibly come of this? And
Speaker 2: you and you, but you have the experience of knowing
Speaker 2: what feels like a good idea, what feels like a
Speaker 2: bit of a shit idea, Like does that feel like
Speaker 2: it has a rich vein of gold under it? Or
Speaker 2: does it this feel like just dry ground. You know,
Speaker 2: you're using all of those instincts to to end up
Speaker 2: on a great adventure like we did this thing at
Speaker 2: the end of the year and some of the fellas
Speaker 2: in here until from their t shirts their podcast listeners,
Speaker 2: but we did a we did a.
Speaker 1: He's a fanboy total fambod Adam, well.
Speaker 2: Adam, I mean you remember berg Boys from last year. Yep.
Speaker 2: So the end of the year, the last show of
Speaker 2: the year was a surprise show that we did from
Speaker 2: Mildura where we robbed an accounting firm meeting about it.
Speaker 2: The boss knew, but no one else knew. Right, are
Speaker 2: you familiar with the film from the nineties I think
Speaker 2: was Sneakers with Robert Redford. So this is what I
Speaker 2: mean about a very random idea. Way earlier last year,
Speaker 2: like a round about April, I happened to be flicking
Speaker 2: through TV and Sneakers was on, and I was like, oh,
Speaker 2: I remember this film and I loved this film. The
Speaker 2: plot line of Sneakers was it was a bunch of
Speaker 2: like ex hackers, like CIA people that now is it
Speaker 2: called red hat teams or black black hat? Yeah, so
Speaker 2: before that term existed. You know, they go to banks
Speaker 2: and they go, we'll break in. They need the boss's approval,
Speaker 2: you know. The chairman of the board goes, sure, break
Speaker 2: into our bank. See if you can get in, tell
Speaker 2: us where our vulnerabilities are, you know. So the opening
Speaker 2: scene is like they've robbed a bank. They give this
Speaker 2: guy a check for twenty million dollars. So you think
Speaker 2: it's a you know, you think it's a robbery film,
Speaker 2: but they're actually good guys. And then you know, the
Speaker 2: cham's like, all right, we got to fix this whatever.
Speaker 2: And then they go off on their adventures. Now, I
Speaker 2: was like, I don't know if this exists as a
Speaker 2: job where you can just break into places they can
Speaker 2: burgle people. But I was like, we should do our
Speaker 2: own sneakers. So we start chatting on the shows. Then
Speaker 2: we go if you are the boss of a business,
Speaker 2: like you have to be the boss. You can't and
Speaker 2: it has to be your business. You can't just make
Speaker 2: us rob your mate's motorbike shop or your enemy's motorbix shop.
Speaker 2: Like write in, tell us, like what you want us
Speaker 2: to do. So we get thousands of entries from people
Speaker 2: going yeah, like you know, I'm an optrometrist. Could you
Speaker 2: see how many glasses you can steal? Whatever? So we're
Speaker 2: sifting through them all, but we're like, well, we're not
Speaker 2: going to talk about this because we don't want to
Speaker 2: tip anyone off. But this lovely guy Rob wrote in
Speaker 2: and was like, look, I listened to the show with
Speaker 2: my son every week. You know, he's eighteen. I've got
Speaker 2: an accounting firm in Mildura. It's about twenty people that
Speaker 2: work here. We have a company, Suzuki Swift. Do you reckon?
Speaker 2: You could break in and steal the company? Car and
Speaker 2: we're like love this. So didn't talk about it all year.
Speaker 2: We had heaps of off air meetings that we were
Speaker 2: like recording how are going to rob in? And we
Speaker 2: came with this plan to like fake a gas leak,
Speaker 2: and we you know, made up a gas truck and
Speaker 2: we got a fake one eight hundred number. What A
Speaker 2: lot of effort was put into this is how we're
Speaker 2: going to get in. This is how we get the keys.
Speaker 2: But anyway, it was so funny.
Speaker 1: Are you in disguise?
Speaker 2: Yeah, we wore like has camp. So the plan was
Speaker 2: get there at five in the morning, tape up the building,
Speaker 2: and then the first people that arrive at shipping they
Speaker 2: had the keys to go, hey, there's been a gas leak.
Speaker 2: You know you can call this number. Can you let
Speaker 2: us in and we'll check it out. It actually worked
Speaker 2: unbelievably well. Like I was there the whole time, going goes,
Speaker 2: I don't know what's going to happen, but I promise
Speaker 2: you it's not going to go the way we planned,
Speaker 2: but kind of actually did. Got in. I got through
Speaker 2: reception first raw, I opened almost Suzuki keys. I was like,
Speaker 2: oh my god, this is unbelievable, right, out the back,
Speaker 2: stole the car, hooting and hollering, and they're great people,
Speaker 2: Like I think, where are those gas guys going? We
Speaker 2: haven't seen them for ages. So he's had so much
Speaker 2: fun doing that. But you know, and there were legends
Speaker 2: and we went back to you know, gave the car back,
Speaker 2: met everyone at the office. But to us, it was
Speaker 2: like this is one of This is to us like
Speaker 2: almost the podcast in its funest form. You know, it's
Speaker 2: listeners getting involved this this this this guy who is
Speaker 2: the head of an accounting firm in Madura like love that.
Speaker 2: He's like, I'm up for this. This just just seems
Speaker 2: like fun.
Speaker 1: It seems to me that you like to get as
Speaker 1: many people in to enjoy what you're going to enjoy.
Speaker 1: You you want everybody to have fun of this.
Speaker 2: It's just always funnier because.
Speaker 1: It's it funnier for everybody or funnier to you or
Speaker 1: is it because you want to share this.
Speaker 2: I I think it's infectious too. I think there's a
Speaker 2: part of it. You love it because you're like we
Speaker 2: all have it in us, Like we all, like I
Speaker 2: was saying before, like we all want to play and
Speaker 2: I love that it can be you know, we've I've
Speaker 2: always said, like, we do not want people standing there
Speaker 2: watching us on the roller coaster. I would much rather
Speaker 2: we take everyone on the roller coaster and we're all
Speaker 2: on it together. It's just infectious. It's just more fun
Speaker 2: if everyone's on board.
Speaker 1: I don't reckon most of us change. We've still got
Speaker 1: the boy in this.
Speaker 2: But we do. We do because I mean, I'm sure
Speaker 2: you know, I think it's commonly understood that it's like
Speaker 2: we don't we just you know, we're a tree. We
Speaker 2: just grow more layers on the air.
Speaker 1: We think we grow up, but we don't.
Speaker 2: We don't. We just we have the same care.
Speaker 1: I'm still boy. I mean, I'm still the same kid
Speaker 1: that I'll always always have been. You know, you know,
Speaker 1: there's not too many guys like you and Andy like
Speaker 1: together for a long time. I mean, I look at
Speaker 1: there's a younger version of you today that's the down
Speaker 1: the inspired unemployed boys. I mean, they're very similar.
Speaker 2: To you two guys, and I love those boys.
Speaker 1: They're great, they're awesome, and but there are much younger versions.
Speaker 1: So they haven't actually stood the test of time yet.
Speaker 1: But like over time, I mean they've gone through lots
Speaker 1: of ups and downs and they have.
Speaker 2: But and I think I do sometimes correct people when
Speaker 2: they're like they're the next time is shandy because I'm like,
Speaker 2: they're so nice in a good way, like they're they're
Speaker 2: they're different, great thing that they've discovered themselves. But one
Speaker 2: thing I love about those guys too is and that
Speaker 2: I really admire about them is their risk appetite. You know,
Speaker 2: their willingness to put themselves out there is what has
Speaker 2: earned them. They're very deserved rewards and following. It's so
Speaker 2: that's really infectious to watch the honesty with the way
Speaker 2: they put themselves out there. And it's those boys. Plus
Speaker 2: I love that they've got all them's around them too.
Speaker 2: There's like the supporting cast, and I just think they're great.
Speaker 2: They're actually really good humans at heart too, which I
Speaker 2: think you can feel. But again, they have a real
Speaker 2: just for fun element. They love it, they love their
Speaker 2: their there's like the they're a great example I think
Speaker 2: of going this is what this is. This is the
Speaker 2: fun you can have if you're willing to as much
Speaker 2: as you can, like put ego aside and and you know,
Speaker 2: embrace the silliness in life and and go on an
Speaker 2: adventure and and that's what I mean by you know,
Speaker 2: taking a big sweet teacher.
Speaker 1: The lms are very close similar to you and Andy.
Speaker 1: I mean, would you say that? And I don't want
Speaker 1: to a bit weird, but you love Andy, yeah, get weird.
Speaker 1: You love love Andy?
Speaker 2: Yeah, you love Death and of course I do because
Speaker 2: he's just like yeah, a thousand per of course, you know.
Speaker 2: And I love a lot of my mates, but it's
Speaker 2: a it's a really well of all, my mate. I
Speaker 2: don't want any mates looking this going have I made
Speaker 2: the cut? I love you. I like you, Darren.
Speaker 1: I get that.
Speaker 2: So you feel you feel a love for your mates,
Speaker 2: but for any it's a really special kind of love
Speaker 2: because it's also a love forged by fire, because you've
Speaker 2: been in places that only the other guy would understand experiences.
Speaker 1: And so the two of you must be sitting back
Speaker 1: at the moment and looking at other long term partnerships
Speaker 1: like Colin Jacky at the moment, like you must be
Speaker 1: reflecting on that sort of situation and think fuck like totally.
Speaker 2: I mean, that's that's on a partnership level too. That's
Speaker 2: sad because no one ever wants it to end, like
Speaker 2: it's really fun doing things with when you find that
Speaker 2: special person, it's really fun doing things with that person.
Speaker 1: Does that galvanize you into being that that that event?
Speaker 1: Watching that from afar? Does that galvanized you two to
Speaker 1: sit back and be a bit more grateful about what
Speaker 1: you've got And does it remake give you a little
Speaker 1: bit reminder, let's make sure we don't go down that path.
Speaker 1: It ended up that way no matter what.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I wouldn't say it's that event particularly, but you
Speaker 2: you always are aware that, hey, we're going to have
Speaker 2: extra pressures on us because we our relationships in the open.
Speaker 2: And and that carries with it every single day. Like
Speaker 2: when you're on radio. Every day you're on air, you're
Speaker 2: you don't know what you're going to say every day,
Speaker 2: No one does because there's too much talking. Would be
Speaker 2: physically impossible to script a radio show. There's too much talking,
Speaker 2: so you never know what you're going to say. So
Speaker 2: it's a huge trust exercise with the person you're on
Speaker 2: air with. And it's you know, it's the dance, and
Speaker 2: anyone in radio knows this dance, whether it's two people,
Speaker 2: four people, five people, You're like all every day trying
Speaker 2: to create something out of nothing with each other, and
Speaker 2: you're taking tons and tons of risks thousands of times
Speaker 2: a day to just see how it goes with each
Speaker 2: other with each other because you've thrown something out there
Speaker 2: about the other person, about yourself, and you're always seeing
Speaker 2: how each other responds. And so you know, anyone that
Speaker 2: does that dances is it has to be really skilled
Speaker 2: at it. And like you know, obviously Colin Jackyo are
Speaker 2: the They've been around for twenty four twenty four years,
Speaker 2: I think it was. It's like unbelievably skilled and experienced people,
Speaker 2: so and successful, crazily successful because of their skill, because
Speaker 2: of their their talent as broadcasters. And so you know
Speaker 2: you're in this game. And but you also know looking
Speaker 2: ahead the road is littered with you know, eventually most people,
Speaker 2: that comes to an end, like every good band and
Speaker 2: every you know, there's that's so you know, you're so
Speaker 2: aware that partnerships come to an end. So it's not
Speaker 2: like and and I have looked at the klan Jack
Speaker 2: situation in particular, but we're always aware that, like, well,
Speaker 2: we don't want this to end, and that's why we
Speaker 2: check in. We're like are you still having fun? Are
Speaker 2: you still having fun. And we've always checked in along
Speaker 2: our career because there have been times we've done full
Speaker 2: time radio. There have been times we've done full time
Speaker 2: and full time television and that was just wild. Then
Speaker 2: we've done a little bit of radio and full time TV,
Speaker 2: and we've always ebbed and flowed. But all those changes,
Speaker 2: I would say have happened because preemptively we've gone, hey,
Speaker 2: before it gets too much, before this burns us out.
Speaker 2: I can feel it coming, not now, but maybe in
Speaker 2: a year. How would you feel about, you know, would
Speaker 2: we step back from the Drive show? Could we do
Speaker 2: something different? And that's probably one of the things I'm
Speaker 2: most grateful for too. We've always, I reckon so far,
Speaker 2: pre empted a load that would break us and stayed
Speaker 2: ahead of each one of you. Yeah, and then you know,
Speaker 2: and I've had kids, and A doesn't have kids, or
Speaker 2: it doesn't have kids yet too, so we've known there's
Speaker 2: different life pressures coming too. And so once the kids
Speaker 2: came along, and I said, Danna, look, we've had a
Speaker 2: great time in our life being super ambitious, and you
Speaker 2: know we could have we could afford to just kind
Speaker 2: of prioritize TV and whatever we wanted to do, I think,
Speaker 2: but now with kids. And it was awesome with this,
Speaker 2: and I said, I'm just not I said, you know
Speaker 2: what I think I've I've known. I know enough people
Speaker 2: that are further down the road that look back and go, Man,
Speaker 2: I can't believe I didn't go in a family holiday
Speaker 2: because I had a big deal at work going on,
Speaker 2: or any of that. And I said, I I know
Speaker 2: enough to know that I will regret if I don't
Speaker 2: prioritize the kids, especially being in the extremely fortunate position
Speaker 2: that I can do this. I can be not busy,
Speaker 2: I can afford to be not busy, and I can
Speaker 2: afford to be there and around the kids and make
Speaker 2: time and space to just to pick ups drop offs,
Speaker 2: take him out of school and go on adventures. And
Speaker 2: I'm going to do that. And he was great. He
Speaker 2: was like, all right, let's let's adapt and we can
Speaker 2: shift our life.
Speaker 1: Because because I was going to ask you, you're married
Speaker 1: to Zoe, and your she's she has her own business.
Speaker 1: Important is it that she's not? How important has it
Speaker 1: been for you? I should say, not generally speaking, but
Speaker 1: how important is for you that she has her own
Speaker 1: purpose in life and outside of your joint purpose being
Speaker 1: your family. But how important has that been to make
Speaker 1: these things work? Well, yeah, in your case.
Speaker 2: So how important is it for me that Zoe has
Speaker 2: her own Well, well, it's important for me because so
Speaker 2: needs that. If she didn't want to run a business,
Speaker 2: I would not be saying.
Speaker 1: Hey, go and get a business, Go get a business.
Speaker 2: It's important to me. It's important to me because it's
Speaker 2: important to her. So my you know, Zo's an extremely driven,
Speaker 2: like unbelievably, she's a polymath. She's all like she's good
Speaker 2: at everything, saying to her all the time. Hey, I
Speaker 2: think the reason you might be feeling like pretty like
Speaker 2: pretty lot overloaded is you have like three full time jobs,
Speaker 2: like running you know, being a founder of skincare company
Speaker 2: and coming up with new lie and you you know,
Speaker 2: cool new products and doing package redesigns and launching new
Speaker 2: you know, variants, and like having this company that has
Speaker 2: you know, forty fifty people and as successful as like
Speaker 2: that's a full time job. Writing books that is also
Speaker 2: a full time job. Being a mum that's also a
Speaker 2: full time job. You have three full time jobs and
Speaker 2: you're trying to kind of do them all at once,
Speaker 2: and they don't. A lot of the jobs don't.
Speaker 1: Know about each other so or care about it.
Speaker 2: So it's going to.
Speaker 1: Create like kids don't care about all that.
Speaker 2: There's going to be some tectonic plates that hit each
Speaker 2: other here and so so. But that's just has always
Speaker 2: been Zis Bay. She's unbo like from a young age,
Speaker 2: like she's just been like she has a restless mind
Speaker 2: in the best possible way, because.
Speaker 1: She's like a force of nature.
Speaker 2: Now, she is a force in nature. So I love
Speaker 2: that about her because that's who she is. So that's
Speaker 2: why it's important for me to make space for that
Speaker 2: and support her in the best ways I can. Sometimes
Speaker 2: that just means getting out of the way, which I
Speaker 2: do so, which I do lovingly. And then other times
Speaker 2: that means being the person that she can, being a
Speaker 2: rock that she can confide in and Lena when when
Speaker 2: she needs that.
Speaker 1: So did you notice any change then in regards to
Speaker 1: your relationship with Andy, Like when that happens? So you know,
Speaker 1: you meet him when you first meet her, and then
Speaker 1: you start going out with her and spending more time
Speaker 1: with her and maybe less time with him, perhaps I
Speaker 1: don't know. And then he knows you're going to get
Speaker 1: married and then long come the kids. How how do
Speaker 1: you guys manage that process you as an open conversation,
Speaker 1: Hey mate, I'm married, I got kid.
Speaker 2: I think we've actually always been pretty good at that
Speaker 2: side of things, because even from yeah, no, there was
Speaker 2: no point right to kick Andy out of the bed,
Speaker 2: to be like I'm sorry mate, No, no, sorry mate,
Speaker 2: we probably can't do this anymore. I actually think we
Speaker 2: were pretty well set up for that even from radio days,
Speaker 2: because we we started doing like the show was national
Speaker 2: and we were twenty five, I reckon maybe twenty six,
Speaker 2: like we're pretty young, and the show was national and
Speaker 2: it was successful like it was in its heyday, and
Speaker 2: that was a lot like that was. You know, you're
Speaker 2: traveling every week, you're in different capital cities and doing
Speaker 2: crazy things with the radio show. And I think from
Speaker 2: that pressure cooker we also learned in the early days
Speaker 2: that like, okay, we need to kind of cultivate our
Speaker 2: own lives outside of each.
Speaker 1: Other, like an agreement, like an unseated agreement, so to speak.
Speaker 2: It's just mentally we understood that, like, hey, we're probably
Speaker 2: not going to see each other this weekend for two reasons.
Speaker 2: A we've already seen each other for about one hundred
Speaker 2: hours this week. But also so I'm good love seeing you,
Speaker 2: but I do have other people I need to see,
Speaker 2: and same with Ando. But we also realize we have
Speaker 2: to live our own lives because thenhen we get back
Speaker 2: together to the radio show, we need to have something
Speaker 2: to talk about.
Speaker 1: Yeah, some new experience, some new exeriences.
Speaker 2: We can't start every story and have the other guy go, yeah,
Speaker 2: I was there. So we we actually got pretty good
Speaker 2: by necessity at having our own lives early early doors.
Speaker 1: Does your experience being married and having children? Does that
Speaker 1: then inspire you? Did that then inspire you to have
Speaker 1: you know that you have a podcast about dad's being
Speaker 1: dads like you know, because it seems like you nearly
Speaker 1: turn the curiosity into a show, which turns into a business.
Speaker 1: Like in other words, I'm interested in this this thing,
Speaker 1: I wouldn't mind finding out more about it from other dads,
Speaker 1: So therefore I might make a show about it, and
Speaker 1: that show becomes part of your infantry.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, we never to be a business. We did
Speaker 2: have a sponsor to pay Tim who had to quit
Speaker 2: his job to edit the show, but doing much how
Speaker 2: the dad's dad that was a actually, you know, because
Speaker 2: we both have experience being at podcast networks. The podcast
Speaker 2: network we do, they have a shaning podcasts. But they
Speaker 2: were like, please give us this show so we could
Speaker 2: and especially for a season. When I was like, day
Speaker 2: I ask you or you put it to them, they
Speaker 2: asked me because they were like, oh, you're doing it, yeah,
Speaker 2: please do it with us like you're doing a show.
Speaker 2: And I said, with the greatest love and respect, it's
Speaker 2: more important that I just do this in a little
Speaker 2: apartment in Bondi with my mate Tim, and we don't
Speaker 2: do it's not sponsored, because I think I would. I
Speaker 2: would hate for it to feel because it was really
Speaker 2: from the heart, like that show How Are the Dad's Dad?
Speaker 2: We've done three seasons and we are coming back to it.
Speaker 2: It's so from the heart. I was like, I was
Speaker 2: just I think this whole thing falls apart if it
Speaker 2: feels like it was for combak or whatever. Yea, even
Speaker 2: though I think audiences understand like at some point you
Speaker 2: do have to pay the bills and you have to
Speaker 2: pay people that have you know, can't just do this
Speaker 2: for fun. That was a really important one. And so
Speaker 2: How Are the Dad's Dad? I love doing, and it
Speaker 2: was a bit of a scary. That was a bit
Speaker 2: of a leap for me to like purely curiosity led
Speaker 2: but without the safety blanket of comedy, because I also
Speaker 2: sort of made the decision earlier. I was like, I
Speaker 2: think this has to be not a funny show. And
Speaker 2: that was really scary for me to do.
Speaker 1: But it's not meant to be funny.
Speaker 2: Not meant to be funny. I mean, I'm I don't
Speaker 2: stop recording if someone makes a joke, But I was like,
Speaker 2: I think it'll lose its meaning to if people come
Speaker 2: to the show thinking we have to find funny things
Speaker 2: about being There's plenty of that, and there's like great
Speaker 2: millions of hours of great stand up on parenting. But
Speaker 2: I was like, I don't think. I don't want to
Speaker 2: do that for this. I think there's a deeper thing
Speaker 2: at play here. I think men really do want to
Speaker 2: talk about being dads and the fact that when you're
Speaker 2: anyone that's a younger dad or any dad is trying
Speaker 2: to do it different than their dad did it, and
Speaker 2: sometimes you're borrowing from your father's playbook, but other times,
Speaker 2: and I'd include myself in this, with all due respect
Speaker 2: to my old man. I'm not borrowing from his playbook.
Speaker 2: I feel like this whole thing started because I was like,
Speaker 2: I feel like a lot of the ways that i'm
Speaker 2: a dad, if I really dig down on it, some
Speaker 2: of my core philosophies are just like things I overheard
Speaker 2: someone say at a barbecue, and I'm like, Oh, that's
Speaker 2: a cool thing to do with you.
Speaker 1: I'll try that.
Speaker 2: I might do that. And I was like, I think
Speaker 2: we're doing that a lot as dads, because there's not
Speaker 2: tons of resources necessarily for dads these days. There are
Speaker 2: good resources, but we're not flooded. And I was like,
Speaker 2: I think I would like to listen to this show
Speaker 2: where you're essentially just stealing the wisdom of other men
Speaker 2: that I think are good dads, and we're sharing it,
Speaker 2: and you're picking up some of those picking up some
Speaker 2: of those tips and philosophies and overarching ideas. And I
Speaker 2: also just think I'd never get sick of hearing examples
Speaker 2: of good dads. Ever, I could just hear it all day.
Speaker 1: It's funny you said something interesting. I mean, I borrow
Speaker 1: from my dad's playbook, but that was just be dad.
Speaker 1: Go out and earn as much more as you can
Speaker 1: work as hard as you can. It doesn't really matter
Speaker 1: what happens with the kids. That then matter if they
Speaker 1: see you, they don't see you. If you don't turn up,
Speaker 1: but you do turn up, that playbook piece might be
Speaker 1: made today might be the wrong way to go about
Speaker 1: it unless you had the perfect dad. You know, the
Speaker 1: playbook piece because I just employed the playbook and then
Speaker 1: I'm a lot older than you, and I just took
Speaker 1: something out of something that happened in the sixties, you know,
Speaker 1: and today the world's different. Kids want more things, kids
Speaker 1: expect something not to expect. But kids, well, there's more
Speaker 1: opportunities for us to share every moment with them. And
Speaker 1: I think what you're doing is a great job. You know,
Speaker 1: Like you said, you don't you can manage your life
Speaker 1: around spending more time with the kids, which is probably
Speaker 1: what your dad didn't do because he was so busy
Speaker 1: putting the irrigation pipes in and leaving at seven o'clock
Speaker 1: in the morning was six thirty morning to get to
Speaker 1: someone by seven am. Because he's a trading and he
Speaker 1: got home late and he's probably stuffed. And probably the
Speaker 1: reason you're trying to get a rise out of may dad,
Speaker 1: you just always think about work.
Speaker 2: And that's that balance, and I reckon a lot of
Speaker 2: guys have these days, you know, people with young, young
Speaker 2: or youngish kids. You're at the same time, I think, going, Okay,
Speaker 2: I understand why dad had to do what he did,
Speaker 2: so I'm not there's no resentment there, there's a there's
Speaker 2: no resentment. He was a man doing the best he
Speaker 2: could with what he had, and I understand his decisions.
Speaker 2: But at the same time, I'm not going to do that.
Speaker 2: So when you make that choice to go, well, I'm
Speaker 2: not going to be like that, you go all right,
Speaker 2: so what am I going to be? And that's that
Speaker 2: I think, especially when you have new to fatherhood, they
Speaker 2: have that feeling of going, all right, well, I'm going
Speaker 2: to I'm going to write my own playbook here and
Speaker 2: and where am I going to get that information from?
Speaker 1: Yeah, for me, that's a pretty cool position to be.
Speaker 1: And I mean, do you actually sit down with Zoe
Speaker 1: and say to her, look, how lucky we are that
Speaker 1: we can actually do this. You know, we're going to
Speaker 1: write our own playbook?
Speaker 2: Absolutely, and and and it's scary and you make a
Speaker 2: lot of mistakes, and that part's Okay, that's fine. That's
Speaker 2: probably one of the greatest if terms of gratitude, you know,
Speaker 2: the fact that you get to kind of try again.
Speaker 2: And kids just generally are so forgiving, especially when they're little.
Speaker 1: They don't remember anyway, thank god, Yeah, they don't. There's
Speaker 1: anultystemic but like you know, there.
Speaker 2: Is that old thing that they don't remember anything you say.
Speaker 2: They just remember how they felt and what they saw
Speaker 2: you do and what they saw you do. So and
Speaker 2: that's that's a huge part of it too. And and
Speaker 2: I do believe what they you need to be there
Speaker 2: for them to see.
Speaker 1: For them to see what you do, as opposed to
Speaker 1: them just seeing or that just goes to work all
Speaker 1: the time.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I know that's really for a lot of dads,
Speaker 2: and there's zero judgment there and there's a lot of
Speaker 2: you know, and that's that's a lot of people's reality.
Speaker 2: So it's certainly not saying you've got to be in
Speaker 2: your kids face twenty four seven, of course not because
Speaker 2: they also you know, for the moms and dads that
Speaker 2: are out there like working hard, and that's more and
Speaker 2: more the reality these days, Like I think things are
Speaker 2: harder and harder. Kids do see that, and there's a
Speaker 2: huge I think there's a huge benefit to that. They're like,
Speaker 2: this is what it takes to be an adult. This
Speaker 2: is what takes to do this for you guys. And
Speaker 2: then there's the other bits where you are there and
Speaker 2: how do you manage those and what do you stand
Speaker 2: for and what are your pillars when you're there?
Speaker 1: So you've just kicked off your podcast again for twenty
Speaker 1: twenty six. Put it starts in March or something, but
Speaker 1: you have a quite a long break. I love this part.
Speaker 1: I love this man.
Speaker 2: Thank god someone loves it because I it's tough, but
Speaker 2: it is the government mandated podcasting.
Speaker 1: Can you just go through that? Because at this government mandate,
Speaker 1: this is a what do you have three months? What's
Speaker 1: the deal?
Speaker 2: Yeah? I was getting ready to go to the podcast
Speaker 2: a few months ago, walking out the door, and kids like,
Speaker 2: where are you going? I was like' podcasting. You're like,
Speaker 2: you haven't done that for ages. I was like, I mean, well,
Speaker 2: sneaks up on you, guys. It's been eight weeks. And
Speaker 2: then Zo Goo's twelve mate, I was like, has it
Speaker 2: been twelve? That has been twelve? Again? With the work
Speaker 2: life balance, we kind of just sat down at the
Speaker 2: start of podcasting and went and you know this about podcasts,
Speaker 2: and it's like, you make your own rules. You could
Speaker 2: be like, hey, guys, we're going to do a season
Speaker 2: of the show and it's eight weeks and everyone goes
Speaker 2: all right, Or you could do a season and it's
Speaker 2: one hundred episodes and everyone goes all right. You just
Speaker 2: kind of make your own rule. So we thought it
Speaker 2: felt about right to do forty weeks a year, and
Speaker 2: then it did, I mean, it did over time evolve
Speaker 2: into I guess we would rather just say, hey, we
Speaker 2: want twelve weeks off. It's become known as the government
Speaker 2: mandated podcasting break, which is it's really it's it's it's
Speaker 2: difficult for us, but that's I don't know if you
Speaker 2: know this or not, but the government to avoid podcasts
Speaker 2: to burnout, which is one of the government's big priorities.
Speaker 2: They yeah, they make us take most food.
Speaker 1: Don't know that that audience audience.
Speaker 2: But we spend most of the break fighting the bastards
Speaker 2: that so far just bloand ad. You just blocked at
Speaker 2: every road. But we'll never stop the fight, and who knows,
Speaker 2: maybe we'll see a future where that break could come
Speaker 2: down to ten weeks or.
Speaker 1: Because you're just waiting, you just can't wait to get it.
Speaker 2: When we're just at home rehearsing, that's making sure you're
Speaker 2: lining up at pen in our pads, like just getting
Speaker 2: really ready, doing mite checks, charging out the batteries, just
Speaker 2: for the cameras.
Speaker 1: Just practicing in front of the mirror, ready to go,
Speaker 1: ready to go.
Speaker 2: But then that twelve weeks that does fly by, and
Speaker 2: then you're back into it for forty relentless weeks a year.
Speaker 1: What's interesting about that too, you know, is in terms
Speaker 1: of the way you think you mentioned something interesting there.
Speaker 1: You just you said, okay, well that's what we want
Speaker 1: to do for work life balance, call it that. But
Speaker 1: what we'll do is we'll turn this into an algorithm.
Speaker 1: We'll talk about a season, forty week season and we
Speaker 1: need and we'll take twelve weeks off, but that twelve
Speaker 1: weeks will actually allocate something around that. We call it
Speaker 1: the you know, the government mandated period and the whole thing.
Speaker 1: You know, like most people are looking to go, oh
Speaker 1: that makes sense, Yeah, yeah, that's good. But all you've
Speaker 1: done is you delivered some logic. It's mathematical.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, and it makes it.
Speaker 1: It's logical.
Speaker 2: I do think it makes the show better because we
Speaker 2: you know, it kind of like gives a good rece
Speaker 2: I actually actually think it's good for you.
Speaker 1: Yes, I really like that.
Speaker 2: Twelve week holiday.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but do you think people hang out and saying, oh,
Speaker 1: I'm missing out on the show I wanted to.
Speaker 2: I think we pushed it to the limit. We do
Speaker 2: get people towards you and being like, hey, guys.
Speaker 1: The foot shoe. So you're starting a fucking show.
Speaker 2: Yeah, fifty minutes a week when you start, I'm back
Speaker 2: on to do the show. But it does, it does
Speaker 2: work for us for you know, recharging. We also kind
Speaker 2: of knock off, you know, you can wrap up other
Speaker 2: TV projects at the end of the year.
Speaker 1: It creates a little bit of doing nothing.
Speaker 2: But it again, it is that thing that we sort
Speaker 2: of to actually peel the curtain back a little bit.
Speaker 2: It's that making sure you've got that it never becomes
Speaker 2: a burden. I would hate, especially for our podcast, everything
Speaker 2: like it doesn't. Our podcast is one thousand percent our
Speaker 2: favorite part of the week. We are like busting to
Speaker 2: get in there. We deliberately cap the shows about forty
Speaker 2: five fifty minutes, because as podcast listeners ourselves, we're like,
Speaker 2: I know, I've had comedy shows that I really enjoy,
Speaker 2: but I've haven't listened to for a few weeks. And
Speaker 2: then I look at the I'm like, oh my god,
Speaker 2: I'm thirty episodes behind, and I just mentally am like, eugh,
Speaker 2: it's too you know, it's too many.
Speaker 1: Yeah, We've always tried to.
Speaker 2: Keep it that amount just so it feels like everyone
Speaker 2: can still be up to date with it. So it
Speaker 2: is a bit of a chance for people to kind
Speaker 2: of get through the backlog towards the end of the year.
Speaker 2: And our main goal is to never ever ever have
Speaker 2: the podcast feel like it it's thin, like every episode
Speaker 2: is always jam packed. We have too much We record
Speaker 2: too much stuff for an episode. That's fine. That's kind
Speaker 2: of the way we like it because we're so excited
Speaker 2: to be in there. We've had the podcast in people
Speaker 2: come and go We'll just do two epps a week,
Speaker 2: and I'm like, yeah, then if it's if we had two,
Speaker 2: like just enough episodes, it just isn't the same energy
Speaker 2: as one jam packed one.
Speaker 1: So that's the way we like it. I just love
Speaker 1: the way you guys structure everything again, and I have
Speaker 1: to say, like, this's mean a lot of fun to me.
Speaker 1: By the way, I'm just finding about how you think,
Speaker 1: because the most exciting days of my week is when
Speaker 1: I'm doing my podcast and I get to meet people
Speaker 1: like you and I get to find it learn how
Speaker 1: people think it's crazy.
Speaker 2: I agree there is an energy to that too, isn't
Speaker 2: there When talking about how are the Dad's Dads? Sometimes
Speaker 2: we will record three of those in a day, Like,
Speaker 2: I know you do a fair few of these in
Speaker 2: a day too. Do you get tired from it or
Speaker 2: do you get energized?
Speaker 1: I get tired after yes, Like when I get home,
Speaker 1: I'm like, I'm gone, But like during the process, I'm okay.
Speaker 1: I don't know whether it's because I know a lot
Speaker 1: of confidence between.
Speaker 2: But I think it's funny because when we did how
Speaker 2: the Dad's Dad, I was like, I was expecting to
Speaker 2: be cooked, but I was like buzzing afterwards. And I
Speaker 2: think it has something to do with when you're curious
Speaker 2: and you're like mentally engaged. I don't know, you're just
Speaker 2: in the right place. I think it's a good indicator
Speaker 2: that you're in the right spot. Brain's energized.
Speaker 1: But I should come on your dad's dad's dad because
Speaker 1: I got four sons and I've got five green kid's
Speaker 1: so I'm granddadding as well. And it's a completely different
Speaker 1: process to being a dad. Howm I F I love it,
Speaker 1: but it's a and the kids all got different characteristics
Speaker 1: and personalities, et cetera, the grand kids that is, and
Speaker 1: and I just yeah, it's it's an amazing experience for me.
Speaker 2: Do you reckon? What do you reckon? You are doing
Speaker 2: differently as a granddad than you did as a dad.
Speaker 1: Much more present, interesting and doing silly things like like
Speaker 1: on Sunday, I had Billy come over and he's too
Speaker 1: and we lay down on the bunk bed. You know,
Speaker 1: I've got bunk beds and every even all the kid grand.
Speaker 2: Which is a beautiful not every grandpa does that.
Speaker 1: And I'm laying on the bunk bed with him and
Speaker 1: he loves this so silly, but he wants to go,
Speaker 1: I've got a table chance seven. We got two orange
Speaker 1: type tennis balls. He holds me and go and get
Speaker 1: two orange table tennis balls. And we would just lay
Speaker 1: on the bed on the bottom bank bunk and he
Speaker 1: wants me to throw the ball my one up and
Speaker 1: then hit the top bunk and bounce down. He laughs,
Speaker 1: he said off and he does exactly the same. And
Speaker 1: I thought, this is entertaining kid. I could have sat
Speaker 1: there for hours doing it so easily and tained and
Speaker 1: just laughing and giggling. And my life is fairly complex
Speaker 1: into my business world, and and I thought, how nice
Speaker 1: is this? Like it's therapy, therapy, it's the best mate.
Speaker 2: It makes me get a little bit teary, because I
Speaker 2: think that's that's the point of life, you know, it's
Speaker 2: it's actually the connections, like it's in the little moments.
Speaker 2: I think it's easy to think that it's the trips
Speaker 2: to Disneyland, or it's not. It's not.
Speaker 1: They're not in this by the way, Yeah, exactly. I
Speaker 1: lost one kid in Disneyland. I lost him.
Speaker 2: So you had five, did you? You got him back?
Speaker 1: I got him back. That's quick, very good. Sorry.
Speaker 2: You know we're meant to be going to l a Disneyland. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I think we're going next year. I have to keep
Speaker 2: a look up for it.
Speaker 1: It's mental there by the way.
Speaker 2: If I see a kid that looks like you would
Speaker 2: about twenty five, maybe even a bit older, just say
Speaker 2: I know your dad mate, Come with me. I know
Speaker 2: where your dad is.
Speaker 1: Take your hat, still got your passport. Good to see him.
Speaker 1: That was awesome, so good