Speaker 1: Welcome to How Do They Afford That? The podcast that
Speaker 1: peeks into the financial lives of everyday Australians. I'm Michael Thompson.
Speaker 1: I'm an author and the co host of the business
Speaker 1: news podcast Fear and Greed. As always, I'm with Canna Campbell,
Speaker 1: financial planner, founder of Sugar Mama TV, the financial literacy
Speaker 1: platform that is just about everywhere YouTube, podcast, books, Instagram, threads,
Speaker 1: TikTok and more. Hello Canna, Hello, how are you? I
Speaker 1: am good, Thank you, and I'm looking forward today's episode
Speaker 1: because it is a timely episode because when now a
Speaker 1: few months past the end of the financial year and
Speaker 1: everyone's hopefully got their tax in hopefully maybe a little optimistically,
Speaker 1: but for some, for the lucky ones, tax refunds getting
Speaker 1: a bit of money back, right, for some people it
Speaker 1: might be a couple of one hundred dollars, maybe a
Speaker 1: few thousands.
Speaker 2: Well, I remember reading that the average tax refund that
Speaker 2: Australian and Australian gets is around two to two and
Speaker 2: a half thousand dollars. But with the gig economy and
Speaker 2: obviously hex stits and things like that, it's actually now
Speaker 2: the average is a lot lower. It's around about one
Speaker 2: and seventy seven dollars fund, so the returns are a
Speaker 2: lot lower.
Speaker 1: So if we assume then that the average is somewhere
Speaker 1: between those two, that may be somewhere between one and
Speaker 1: two thousand dollars. Right, it feels like bonus money, like
Speaker 1: free money. And I'm just like, just even as I
Speaker 1: say this one money, that's right, I could just see
Speaker 1: this that that little twitch in your eyebrow that I
Speaker 1: enjoy seeing when something really stresses you out. But how
Speaker 1: do we actually make the most of it if we're
Speaker 1: thinking of it as bonus money, as free money? Today,
Speaker 1: we're going to make a list, because we love a
Speaker 1: good list on this podcast. We are going to come
Speaker 1: up with five smart ideas to make the most of
Speaker 1: your tax refund. But first, why do they feel like
Speaker 1: free money? I'm assuming this is a risky mindset.
Speaker 2: Well, it's psychological. You know, the refund it really does
Speaker 2: feel like a bonus, particularly if you weren't expecting it
Speaker 2: and you you know, discover oh look the aty of
Speaker 2: deposited you know, one thousand dollars or two thousand dollars
Speaker 2: into my bank account.
Speaker 1: Also, and as you've been paying your tax, the whole
Speaker 1: way through the year, and that that year has passed.
Speaker 1: Now you're kind of a few months into the new
Speaker 1: financial year. It feels like it is kind of ancient history.
Speaker 1: And then all of a sudden, this money just lobs.
Speaker 2: And because that money is not part of our you know,
Speaker 2: regular income, you know, it does feel like we haven't
Speaker 2: physically worked for that money. You know, it feels like,
Speaker 2: you know, literally you've won some money. It's it's you've
Speaker 2: manifested it even But the thing is, in reality, it
Speaker 2: is just our own money. It's just been returned back
Speaker 2: to us, and we were just overpaid, well we overpaid
Speaker 2: tax through the financial year, and it's just been given
Speaker 2: back to us. So we somehow seem to treat it
Speaker 2: like it's free money, and we're more likely then to
Speaker 2: go and blow it and spend it impulsively rather than
Speaker 2: actually think strategically, which is a bit of a trap
Speaker 2: when you do get as a surprise tax refund that
Speaker 2: you weren't expecting, because you don't have that if you
Speaker 2: know that you're going to be getting, say a two
Speaker 2: thousand dollars tax refund or a five hundred dollars tax refund,
Speaker 2: you have that time to go, Okay, well when I
Speaker 2: get that refund yep, I will. I got that gap
Speaker 2: to actually think, okay, what do I want to do
Speaker 2: with that money, rather than going, what a great surprise,
Speaker 2: I'm gonna go shopping?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Is that? Is that the biggest mistake with tax
Speaker 1: refunds that you had worn against blowing it just treating
Speaker 1: it as free money and just going you know what
Speaker 1: this is?
Speaker 2: It is not free money.
Speaker 1: But if it's if it's outside of your budget. Right,
Speaker 1: it looks.
Speaker 2: It's smoking mirrors. It looks like it's free money, but
Speaker 2: it ain't free money. It's your own money just being
Speaker 2: given back to you. The atas just overtaxed you and says,
Speaker 2: oh sorry, I gave you the wrong change, back your
Speaker 2: correct change.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but okay, it's your money, therefore go nuts. Right.
Speaker 1: I taught you, Narli, You've taught me a lot. You
Speaker 1: have not taught me this, though, No, you have. Let's
Speaker 1: do our five ideas. Let's start with number one idea,
Speaker 1: number one smart idea, number one, not just any random idea.
Speaker 2: Michael's smart idea. And this holds the latest iPhone.
Speaker 1: Well, yes, but that was a that's a tool for work.
Speaker 2: Technically, yes, it was an investment.
Speaker 1: Indeed, it is idea number one please can I.
Speaker 2: Would be to top up your emergency money. Okay, So
Speaker 2: I was actually reading that most Australians, something like one
Speaker 2: in three Australians kind of come up with two thousand
Speaker 2: dollars in an emergency, which is very very concerning. So look,
Speaker 2: even just a couple of hundred dollars put a side
Speaker 2: into a separate savings account away from your normal everyday spending,
Speaker 2: can massively reduce some financial anxiety and it actually creates
Speaker 2: a place to build upon from that point going forwards.
Speaker 2: So as she was combak where I read that one
Speaker 2: in three couldn't actually come up with even five hundred
Speaker 2: dollars in an emergency, not two thousand dollars. That's really
Speaker 2: really frightening. Yeah, so yes, this is not the most
Speaker 2: glamorous idea, but it's going to help you sleep a
Speaker 2: little better at night, and it gives you some breathing room.
Speaker 2: And you know, if you get hit with some you know,
Speaker 2: a tough time.
Speaker 1: And especially if you're not expecting this refund necessarily or
Speaker 1: you are, you're not budgeting for it, so you're not
Speaker 1: going to miss it necessarily. If you tuck it away
Speaker 1: straight into emergency money. It's not as though it's like
Speaker 1: you're having you're wrenching it out of your budget and
Speaker 1: trying to kind of clear space for it in your budget,
Speaker 1: and you're cutting all of these other things. You were
Speaker 1: just reallocating something that has just arrived. So it's probably
Speaker 1: the best possible time to do it right, to bring it.
Speaker 2: Come back to your idea about it being free money.
Speaker 2: It's like you go to the coffee shop with a
Speaker 2: fifty dollar note and you buy coffee, and the coffee
Speaker 2: say dollars, and you get back.
Speaker 1: Say forty four dollars. Yes, I was helping you.
Speaker 2: No, no, no, you don't get no. Hang on, you're
Speaker 2: not helping me. You actually now nest my idea up.
Speaker 2: You get back forty two dollars, and the barista says,
Speaker 2: hang on, Michael, stop, I didn't give you the right
Speaker 2: change back. Here's an extra two dollar coin that I
Speaker 2: didn't give you previously. Is that free money? No, it's
Speaker 2: your money, and so therefore you I just killed your idea.
Speaker 2: Now of free money.
Speaker 1: Nowhere near as fun as it used to be. But
Speaker 1: I do like this idea of the fact that because
Speaker 1: you haven't actually been relying on it, or it hasn't
Speaker 1: been part of your household budget, it hasn't just been
Speaker 1: floating around that it's probably the ideal time to put
Speaker 1: it into some of those things that are a little
Speaker 1: bit more dull because you're not having to sacrifice anything
Speaker 1: for it.
Speaker 2: You know, it's an opportunity to create a bit more
Speaker 2: headwind in your financial journey.
Speaker 1: That's idea number one, with including a very confusing amalgry.
Speaker 2: I just came to it, just hit me, and I
Speaker 2: just had to share it with you. I feel like
Speaker 2: you're still stuck thinking a tax refund is a winning
Speaker 2: or a bonus money, and you can it's probably where
Speaker 2: you how you bought that new iPhone of yours kind.
Speaker 1: Of still feels like a bonus.
Speaker 2: ID Number two, Please all right, pay down high interest
Speaker 2: debt like so credit cards by now, pay later, personal loans,
Speaker 2: you know, they are those expenses that really do drain
Speaker 2: our cash flow. And credit cards can charge like twenty
Speaker 2: percent sometimes I've seen twenty two percent, even a little
Speaker 2: bit more. So you've got say two thousand dollars oring
Speaker 2: on a credit card and you get a tax refund,
Speaker 2: you know, depending on the refund, you potentially are saving
Speaker 2: four hunder dolls and interest that you would have had
Speaker 2: to pay over the year on that on that loan.
Speaker 2: So the benefit of this is is you're facing your
Speaker 2: financial demons. You know, you know you need to pay
Speaker 2: it off. He's an opportunity to help make a dance
Speaker 2: or to help clean it and wipe it away instantly.
Speaker 2: That's going obviously going to improve your fine health. You
Speaker 2: can start afresh and start building savings and building maybe
Speaker 2: investments and obviously reduce your stress levels and improve your
Speaker 2: credit store.
Speaker 1: Even is there a risk, right, And I don't mean
Speaker 1: to be cynical, no, never. If you do that, you're
Speaker 1: just going to build it straight back up again, because
Speaker 1: paying it off is one thing, but you need to
Speaker 1: also have an adjustment in your mindset at the same time, right,
Speaker 1: because otherwise you will pay it down. Yes, you will
Speaker 1: not pay the interest then moving forward on that, but
Speaker 1: unless you actually change your spending habits, you're just going
Speaker 1: to build it straight back up again. And I've seen
Speaker 1: this very much firsthand.
Speaker 2: Absolutely, if you don't confront the actual I guess parasite
Speaker 2: or the problem at hand that's creating this credit card
Speaker 2: dead of course you're going to be back in it again.
Speaker 2: This is just an opportunity for you to actually restart.
Speaker 2: That's why I said, you know, start with a fresh
Speaker 2: plate or turning over a fresh leaf is probably a
Speaker 2: better way of saying this. And I really do believe
Speaker 2: when you're in credit card debt or any type of debt,
Speaker 2: it's so toxic because it kind of keeps you trapped
Speaker 2: in that you don't feel good about yourself, so you
Speaker 2: go and spend more. Yeah, and you know, this is
Speaker 2: why we see people get deeper and deeper into debt.
Speaker 2: You know, think, O, well, I'm already in two and
Speaker 2: a half thousand dollars with a debt, what's another three
Speaker 2: hundred dollars? You know? And then it's oh, well I'm
Speaker 2: in eighteen two thousand, eight hundredars with a debt. Well
Speaker 2: what if it just goes to a flat three thousand?
Speaker 2: And that's where I see people really get themselves into
Speaker 2: a hole. So when these opportunities come, you know, you've
Speaker 2: got to jump on them, and jump on them quickly
Speaker 2: before temptation comes in and go all right, I don't
Speaker 2: want to I'd love to go and blow that money
Speaker 2: and spend it. But the truth and reality is is
Speaker 2: I need to confront this credit card debt and I
Speaker 2: need to start working on myself and learn about managing
Speaker 2: my cash flow better to fix this so I don't
Speaker 2: have The next tax refund I get goes to me,
Speaker 2: It goes to my savings, it goes to my investing,
Speaker 2: it goes to my super or whatever you want it
Speaker 2: to go to.
Speaker 1: I know that we're veering off into credit cards and
Speaker 1: things here, but if you were to do that, if
Speaker 1: you were to pay down, say you have a thousand
Speaker 1: dollars come in from the ATO and you pay that
Speaker 1: off your credit card, would you recommend, say, then, reducing
Speaker 1: your credit limit on your card by that same amount
Speaker 1: so that it limits your ability to keep doing it
Speaker 1: or you don't have to do it as a full
Speaker 1: credit limit change. A lot of providers allow you to
Speaker 1: put in place a spending cap on that credit card.
Speaker 1: Is that a smart move?
Speaker 2: Definitely? I think that's a great idea. And I said
Speaker 2: a lot of people, you know, if you keep getting
Speaker 2: yourself back into this cycle of pay credit card data,
Speaker 2: often then find six months out of your back in
Speaker 2: it all over again. Perhaps it's time that you don't
Speaker 2: actually have a credit card at all, so, you know,
Speaker 2: reducing the cap and then eventually canceling it is definitely
Speaker 2: a great plan. You know. It's the idea of having
Speaker 2: being on a diet, But then your fridge is full
Speaker 2: of chocolate and lollies and cheeses and all those delicious
Speaker 2: but very naughty foods that don't help us achieve our
Speaker 2: weight loss or fitness goals. So why make life harder?
Speaker 2: And I don't own a credit card, and I really
Speaker 2: like not having a credit card. And that's nothing to
Speaker 2: do with credit card debt, just one most thing not
Speaker 2: to think about.
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, that makes sense, all right. So they are
Speaker 1: the first two ideas. Let's take a very quick break
Speaker 1: and come back with the next three on our list
Speaker 1: of the top five smart ideas for using a tax refund?
Speaker 1: Can are We are going through five smart ideas for
Speaker 1: using your tax refund. This is assuming that you have
Speaker 1: received one. Maybe you are expecting to receive one, and
Speaker 1: in which case this is just getting in early. So far,
Speaker 1: we've had top up your emergency money and pay down
Speaker 1: high interest debt at toxic debt, your credit card or
Speaker 1: personal loans. Things like that. Smart idea number three.
Speaker 2: What is it invested? My favorite idea?
Speaker 1: Excellent? What are we talking?
Speaker 2: Well, you could look at say a listed investment company,
Speaker 2: which is my personal favorite investment. Or you could look
Speaker 2: at an ETF exchange traded fund, or even look at
Speaker 2: a micro investing account, but obviously don't stay there for
Speaker 2: too long. Once your account grows and you're ready to
Speaker 2: fly to spread doings, get out of those micro investing apps.
Speaker 2: But you know, even you know users to start your
Speaker 2: financial journey of investing. You know that one thousand dollars
Speaker 2: could be used to buy your first passable shares and
Speaker 2: that is the birthplace of your passive income stream, and
Speaker 2: then you can regularly contribute and build it upon it
Speaker 2: from there. But you've started, and that's the hardest part
Speaker 2: done for you through your tax refund. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I was reading some research recently that said that basically,
Speaker 1: and I'm paraphrasing here, that even a lot of high
Speaker 1: income earners don't start investing because they feel, I haven't
Speaker 1: got enough money to get going, even though they do
Speaker 1: actually have it. But it's almost a confidence thing. It
Speaker 1: is almost just a mindset thing of just kind of
Speaker 1: getting going, doing some research and just getting started and
Speaker 1: once you've started, then it's easier to continue going. And
Speaker 1: maybe this is that that kind of trigger that having
Speaker 1: that money sitting there, not how allocated to anything else,
Speaker 1: might just be that that little push that you need.
Speaker 2: Definitely, And like the thousand dollars project that I created,
Speaker 2: you know, started as just that you literally just hustle
Speaker 2: one thousand dollars. That first one thousand dollars was the
Speaker 2: hardest to come up with. But once I went and
Speaker 2: invested it, it just compounded and just grew, and I
Speaker 2: became addicted to watching it grow. And now it's worth
Speaker 2: over three hundred and sixty five thousand dollars. Yeah, and
Speaker 2: that is literally one thousand dollars at a time.
Speaker 1: That is incredible.
Speaker 2: But it started and that was the hardest part.
Speaker 1: Yeah. And of course remember that everything we're talking about
Speaker 1: here is general in nature.
Speaker 2: You guys are my favorite resident is investment company, right, It.
Speaker 1: Is not personal investment strategic product advice. We don't know
Speaker 1: your financial circumstances.
Speaker 2: Well, the time frame for your financial goals.
Speaker 1: And this is financial education purposes only, and you should
Speaker 1: seek professional advice before making decisions. I got very formal.
Speaker 2: There in the middle of it that was my fault.
Speaker 1: Number four, So that was investing number four or idea
Speaker 1: number four. Is this a smart one or a fun
Speaker 1: one or somewhere in between.
Speaker 2: It's sexy, it's super okay, So.
Speaker 1: It's neither okay. It is definitely smart, it's not necessarily fun.
Speaker 1: I wouldn't describe it necessarily as sexy.
Speaker 2: Well, that's your personal choice. It is. You could use
Speaker 2: that money as a one off personal contribution. Now you've
Speaker 2: got to be careful with this because if you have
Speaker 2: limits in place that you have come close to, and
Speaker 2: these limits are per financial year, not per calendar yet,
Speaker 2: you just could just double check. But there's also a
Speaker 2: way of potentially not doubling your money, but getting a
Speaker 2: much better return on your money, and that is by
Speaker 2: looking at the government's co contribution scheme. So if you're
Speaker 2: earning it's forty seven thousand or four hundred and eighty
Speaker 2: eight actually or less, you can and it obviously tapers
Speaker 2: off and I think it stops it around about sixty
Speaker 2: two thousand if I remember correctly. But you can put
Speaker 2: up to one thousand dollars into your superannuation and the
Speaker 2: government will put up to five hundred dollars. So it's
Speaker 2: like an instant return, guaranteed return.
Speaker 1: That is free money.
Speaker 2: That is free money, and that is super sexy.
Speaker 1: Actually that is quite quite erotic.
Speaker 2: I don't know how I feel about erotic, but I
Speaker 2: know I use the word sexy, but six seems a
Speaker 2: bit more PG than erotic. But you know, super innuation
Speaker 2: is one of the most tax effective long term asset
Speaker 2: building vehicles that is available to all Australians, well most Australians,
Speaker 2: and really can make a huge impact in improving people's
Speaker 2: the quality of people's retirement.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and again, great opportunity to do it when you
Speaker 1: suddenly have this extra money as you weren't necessarily expecting,
Speaker 1: go for it.
Speaker 2: And also it's away from temptation because you once that
Speaker 2: money's in, you can't get it back out, which I
Speaker 2: think is a blessing in disguise.
Speaker 1: I completely agree with you on that, ok. Idea number
Speaker 1: five we are moving right away from the sexiness of
Speaker 1: superannuation into.
Speaker 2: Spending it on self care or something that improves your future.
Speaker 1: So you know, I was not expecting this from you.
Speaker 2: I thank you. I do like to surprise education, upskilling
Speaker 2: or even you know, a side hustle idea that you've
Speaker 2: been wanting to work on. Now use that money to
Speaker 2: buy that equipment, or use that course of that software program.
Speaker 2: You know, self help course is a great one. I
Speaker 2: recently did one and I absolutely loved it. So these
Speaker 2: are things that you can invest your money in. They're
Speaker 2: going to hopefully have I guess you could say a
Speaker 2: multiplier effect on your income or your potential income. So
Speaker 2: that's quite exciting, and you know, I think this is
Speaker 2: really important to ask yourself, like, what can I use
Speaker 2: this refund to help create more income or help build
Speaker 2: my knowledge or my experience or my opportunities to improve
Speaker 2: my finances end?
Speaker 1: Oh oh boy? What this No. I'm just thinking that
Speaker 1: if you are doing something that is a side hustle
Speaker 1: or that is helping you to actually make money, and
Speaker 1: you're investing in something that is potentially going to help
Speaker 1: make you money, there is a chance that, with advice
Speaker 1: from your accountant, that that spending might in fact be
Speaker 1: tax deductible as well, in which case then your tax
Speaker 1: refund spending becomes tax deductible in the following year.
Speaker 2: That's really really good point I missed that? Have I
Speaker 2: missed that?
Speaker 1: You know what? There is a moment in one's life
Speaker 1: where the student becomes the teacher. Oh my god, and
Speaker 1: I think we've just we just crossed that threshold.
Speaker 2: I'll let you think that.
Speaker 1: Oh thank you. Okay, So there are five ideas. Can
Speaker 1: you use it for fun? What can we just.
Speaker 2: Can I mean, god, I'm not the fun police.
Speaker 1: Yes you are, but can we just get a little
Speaker 1: bit of it? Like if you're just say is? Because
Speaker 1: again I don't want to be kind of silly with it,
Speaker 1: but it does make sense right to just go a
Speaker 1: little bit at ten percent or something. Whatever I'm going
Speaker 1: to spend that, I can actually have a bit of
Speaker 1: fun with that, and the rest I'm going to be
Speaker 1: smart with because otherwise you run the risk of coming
Speaker 1: very boring, and the money side of it can become
Speaker 1: a chore.
Speaker 2: Absolutely. Look, it is about balance. So you might say, okay,
Speaker 2: and this is why I think it's really important not
Speaker 2: to react when you see that in an impulsive manner.
Speaker 2: When you see that money, sit down, deep breath. This
Speaker 2: is exciting. Yes, this is something you didn't expect. Yes
Speaker 2: it's bigger than you thought even but go, okay, how
Speaker 2: do I do this? Enjoy some money today and spend
Speaker 2: it and feel good about myself, but then also feel
Speaker 2: proud of making an intelligent decision that's going to benefit
Speaker 2: me for many, many years to come. Don't forget like
Speaker 2: there are going to be other tax refunds, hopefully in
Speaker 2: the future. But you know, yes, so you know it
Speaker 2: might be something like a holiday. It might be you know,
Speaker 2: a new wardrobe, or it might be a new piece
Speaker 2: of equipment, or it might be a weekend away, or
Speaker 2: it might be a massage. Yes, like you do need
Speaker 2: to have that sense of fund to help keep you motivated.
Speaker 2: As you say, like it makes you very dull and boring,
Speaker 2: and I amazingly do agree with that. So the question
Speaker 2: I like to ask myself is would I buy this
Speaker 2: if it was coming out of my normal after tax
Speaker 2: money or not. And that doesn't mean yes or no
Speaker 2: to proceed ahead. It means just just have that awareness
Speaker 2: that you are spending mindfully.
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, that makes sense. Just very quickly, you mentioned
Speaker 1: a couple of times we're talking about investing, We were
Speaker 1: talking about adding to your superannuation. If you had a
Speaker 1: couple of thousand dollars right that you've received for your
Speaker 1: tax refund, just what impact could that make long term?
Speaker 2: Well, if you took say two thousand dollars, and you
Speaker 2: went in invested it in to say an ETF, and
Speaker 2: you looked at a return, a net return of say
Speaker 2: seven percent per annum over a period of ten years,
Speaker 2: set and forgetting that just reinvest you have about just
Speaker 2: over twenty seven and a half thousand dollars over ten years.
Speaker 1: That's incredible.
Speaker 2: So that's sorry. And I should say that's two thousand
Speaker 2: dollars each year for.
Speaker 1: Chan year if you keep on dolls. I assumed that
Speaker 1: you were doing the same thing each year with the
Speaker 1: same tax return.
Speaker 2: So that one refund and you can go and blow
Speaker 2: all your other income if you want, But that one
Speaker 2: refund of say two thousand dollars each year is turning
Speaker 2: into a significant amount of money, you know, and you
Speaker 2: can eventually use that money to help prepare for retirement,
Speaker 2: help pay for home loan, you know, help pay for
Speaker 2: a holiday. And this is why I was talking about
Speaker 2: the consistency and the compounding growth over the long run.
Speaker 1: Okay, if someone is listening to us right now, with
Speaker 1: a tax refund burning a hole in their pocket, what
Speaker 1: is the one thing that they can go and do
Speaker 1: or should do? Single first step they should take Sorry,
Speaker 1: I get very pointy, I wave my pen around, I
Speaker 1: get very gestural.
Speaker 2: Pause, do nothing, don't let emotions take over. You want
Speaker 2: to be clear headed. You wanted to be methodical, rational,
Speaker 2: and you want to make sure that you have no regrets.
Speaker 2: I remember talking to someone who got a really big
Speaker 2: tax refund and they went out and bought a car,
Speaker 2: and they said to me, the moment I drove out
Speaker 2: of the car yard, I instantly felt like it embarrassed
Speaker 2: and regretted what I'd done. And it was too late
Speaker 2: because I'd already driven there in the car. So yeah,
Speaker 2: and they had to sit with that for that decision
Speaker 2: for a really long time.
Speaker 1: Wow. All right, those five ideas they were top up
Speaker 1: your emergency money, pay down high interests debt, get started investing,
Speaker 1: add to your super And then the one I found
Speaker 1: really interesting was that that kind of self care education,
Speaker 1: upskilling or getting started in a side hustle, because those
Speaker 1: are all basically investments in your own future, which is terrific. Now,
Speaker 1: if anybody wants more information from you, where do they?
Speaker 2: Sexy superinuation, It does feel like you are targeting a
Speaker 2: very niche audience with that.
Speaker 1: There might be a following for it. They go to
Speaker 1: your Instagram.
Speaker 2: Yes, at Sugar Mama TV or at Canna Campbell Official.
Speaker 1: Excellent and you can hear me every day with Sean
Speaker 1: Aylmer on Fear and Greed business news you can use.
Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to how Do They Afford That?
Speaker 1: And remember to follow on the podcast. Tell somebody else
Speaker 1: about the podcast, Betty Yet, send them a link to
Speaker 1: this very episode and spread the word about how do
Speaker 1: they Afford that? Thank you for your company. Join us
Speaker 1: again next week