WEBVTT - Credlin | 21 October

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<v Speaker 1>Peter Credlin, live from News 24.

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<v Speaker 2>Good evening. Welcome to the program. Here's what's coming up

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<v Speaker 2>tonight on Credlin. That very sad update this afternoon from

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<v Speaker 2>the family of critically injured MP Helen Haynes from the

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<v Speaker 2>Alfred in Melbourne about an hour ago, confirming earlier today

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<v Speaker 2>that the grandmother has lost her other leg following that

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<v Speaker 2>amputation on Monday night. More from her husband in a

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<v Speaker 2>moment as he was joined with the media by the

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<v Speaker 2>Governor-General at his request. On the cusp of an election,

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<v Speaker 2>the brazen push by Victorian Labor to rush through planning amendments,

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<v Speaker 2>stripping councils of power and paving the way for massive

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<v Speaker 2>new wind farms across country Victoria. And the Premier Ben

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<v Speaker 2>Carroll today admitting he drove off without paying for his

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<v Speaker 2>petrol on Monday night. chased up by a service station

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<v Speaker 2>the day later. We'll cross live to London for an

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<v Speaker 2>historian's take on protests playing out across Europe, including the

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<v Speaker 2>tough line taken by Hungary and Poland, saying they will

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<v Speaker 2>not go down the French path. And Phil Haynes, as

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<v Speaker 2>I said, the husband of Helen, speaking to the media

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<v Speaker 2>for the first time since the horrific incident on Monday.

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<v Speaker 2>But the good news in all this is Helen is alive.

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<v Speaker 3>And she's stable.

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<v Speaker 4>That is the most important thing for our family.

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<v Speaker 2>But first, what happened to Helen Haynes is absolutely catastrophic

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<v Speaker 2>for her personally and those who love her. But it

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<v Speaker 2>also presents a terrible risk to the open movement currently

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<v Speaker 2>enjoyed by our political leaders in the communities they represent. Rightly,

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<v Speaker 2>there are calls to re-evaluate the security provided to politicians

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<v Speaker 2>and to demand more civil debate. Well, fair enough. But

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<v Speaker 2>it's a bit rich for the Prime Minister to call

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<v Speaker 2>for the temperature to be lowered when his own office

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<v Speaker 2>is accused of circulating a dirt sheet about the critically

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<v Speaker 2>injured MP after she criticised his $ 6 million grant to

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<v Speaker 2>a local golf course that's just 200 metres from the

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<v Speaker 2>back fence of his Marrickville home.

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<v Speaker 5>The dirt file that the Labor people put on many

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<v Speaker 5>politicians who may go against the Albanese Labor government, what

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<v Speaker 5>they're doing, is wrong.

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<v Speaker 6>Well, I think it goes to the character of the

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<v Speaker 6>Prime Minister and his office that they seek to denigrate

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<v Speaker 6>the reputation of Helen Haynes with the media to get

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<v Speaker 6>a bad story up. simply because she was asking legitimate

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<v Speaker 6>questions about why he was awarding $ 6. 05 million to the

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<v Speaker 6>Marrickville Golf Club, that that was their first response to.

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<v Speaker 2>Now, those hearings began today in the Parliament. Bridget McKenzie

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<v Speaker 2>was there. She'll join me a little later. But as

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<v Speaker 2>reported today in a post by Drew Pavlou, metadata information

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<v Speaker 2>contained within the dirt sheet confirmed it was written by

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<v Speaker 2>someone under the account name of Lloyd Joshua. And the

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<v Speaker 2>account was connected to the Department of Prime Minister and Cabinet. Well,

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<v Speaker 2>the records show that one Joshua Lloyd is the Deputy

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<v Speaker 2>Director of Communications in the Prime Minister's office. Never one, though,

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<v Speaker 2>to admit fold, as we know. Today, the Prime Minister

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<v Speaker 2>repeatedly dodged direct questions on this from my colleague, Kieran Gilbert.

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<v Speaker 8>Were you aware or give approval to your office to

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<v Speaker 8>distribute to the press gallery information about Helen Haynes, about

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<v Speaker 8>grants that she'd sought after she criticised you over the

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<v Speaker 8>$ 6 million Marrickville grant?

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<v Speaker 3>Helen Haynes is a good local member.

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<v Speaker 9>She puts forward applications like other members do for grants.

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<v Speaker 3>And that's what good local members do.

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<v Speaker 8>So did the office send that out? Do you regret

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<v Speaker 8>that in hindsight, given the events of recent days?

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<v Speaker 3>Well, Helen Haynes is a strong advocate for her community.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, answer the question, Albanese. Now, Haynes was right

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<v Speaker 2>to raise a red flag over his integrity, given the

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<v Speaker 2>grant was announced six months before his government had even

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<v Speaker 2>set up a process to look at the funding. No

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<v Speaker 2>less a legal authority than constitutional expert Professor Anne Toomey

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<v Speaker 2>labelled the $ 560 million program as grey corruption in her

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<v Speaker 2>evidence to the parliamentary inquiry that began today. But as

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<v Speaker 2>much as this exposes the Prime Minister's hypocrisy over Haynes,

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<v Speaker 2>it goes to much deeper things. It speaks about both

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<v Speaker 2>his character and the ideological bent of modern Labor. Take

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<v Speaker 2>your mind back to the immediate aftermath of last December's

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<v Speaker 2>terror attack in Bondi. Remember how slow the Prime Minister

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<v Speaker 2>was to address the horror of radical Islam the police

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<v Speaker 2>will allege inspired the massacre. Remember how conspicuously absent he

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<v Speaker 2>was from Sydney, apart from those flowers he laid the

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<v Speaker 2>following morning before he slipped away and, of course, the

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<v Speaker 2>crowd was disquiet about his attendance, to say the least.

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<v Speaker 2>He flew back then to Canberra, holing up at his

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<v Speaker 2>office and avoiding the trauma that beset Sydney and our nation.

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<v Speaker 2>CHEERING Back then, Albanese failed the test of prime ministers

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<v Speaker 2>before him who were always courageous enough to hold a

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<v Speaker 2>press conference in the midst of a crisis to do

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<v Speaker 2>their best to reassure the public while taking responsibility as

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<v Speaker 2>every leader must. But not so this man. It's always

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<v Speaker 2>the fault of others as he continues to expose himself

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<v Speaker 2>as one of the weakest individuals to ever occupy the Lodge.

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<v Speaker 2>As soon as the political leanings of the alleged Haynes attacker,

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<v Speaker 2>Brendan Nugent, appeared to show him as an individual with

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<v Speaker 2>a leftist ideology, Albanese quickly pivoted into using the attack

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<v Speaker 2>on the well-liked MP as an argument for his digital

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<v Speaker 2>duty of care legislation. And yet, as we can see

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<v Speaker 2>from charges laid against Nugent today, police already have all

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<v Speaker 2>the powers they need to deal with what's alleged to

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<v Speaker 2>have occurred.

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<v Speaker 10>He will face three charges. The first is a Commonwealth

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<v Speaker 10>charge of causing harm to a Commonwealth public official. Second

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<v Speaker 10>two offences are state offences. The first of intentionally causing

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<v Speaker 10>serious harm. And the second, dangerous driving causing serious harm.

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<v Speaker 2>That was a press conference earlier today. That's the head

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<v Speaker 2>of Victorian Police. But in that press conference, there was

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<v Speaker 2>no suggestion from police that indicate Haynes received online threats

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<v Speaker 2>from Nugent. In this case, so far as we can

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<v Speaker 2>tell and has been put out there by police, his

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<v Speaker 2>alleged violence against the member for Indi was of the

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<v Speaker 2>physical threat type well known to authorities. Yet the commentary

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<v Speaker 2>from the Prime Minister and senior ministers like Tony Burke

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<v Speaker 2>has focused almost exclusively on the online threat environment in

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<v Speaker 2>the aftermath of the Haynes attack.

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<v Speaker 9>Many of the threats and criticisms and abuse that women

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<v Speaker 9>have to endure, unfortunately, or are enduring, they shouldn't, but

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<v Speaker 9>are sexualised in their nature. And Katie Gallagher and Tania

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<v Speaker 9>Plibersek and others have outlined that. Annika Wells, the Minister

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<v Speaker 9>for Communications. You know, I'm very conscious that the nature

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<v Speaker 9>of those threats can be different.

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<v Speaker 2>On and on he went. But where's the consistency from

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<v Speaker 2>the Prime Minister? I mean, right now in this country,

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<v Speaker 2>we've got radical imams spewing hate-filled sermons out of mosques

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<v Speaker 2>and prayer halls into the bedrooms of teenagers.

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<v Speaker 7>By Allah, the.

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<v Speaker 4>Day you will be kicked out of Palestine is coming.

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<v Speaker 7>A day when the stones and the trees will speak

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<v Speaker 7>and say, O Muslim, there is a Jew behind me.

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<v Speaker 1>Come and kill him.

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<v Speaker 2>ASIO reports approximately 300 people are currently in programs to

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<v Speaker 2>try and counter violent extremism. with well over 200 of

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<v Speaker 2>them reported as having no change in their concern levels,

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<v Speaker 2>underscoring that the efficacy of these programs is near non-existent

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<v Speaker 2>and that's in line with experience overseas. Where is the

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<v Speaker 2>online removal of this hate? Where are these preachers locked up?

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<v Speaker 2>Where is the deportation of those we can send home?

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<v Speaker 2>In September, Mohamed Barkeed was arrested in Melbourne and charged

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<v Speaker 2>with five terrorism offences, including the online dissemination of 10,000 files,

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<v Speaker 2>including execution videos, suicide bombing footage and guides to carry

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<v Speaker 2>out mass casualty attacks. Now, unbelievably, Barkeed has been bailed.

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<v Speaker 2>In a week's time, the convicted ISIS terrorist, Isaac L. Matari,

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<v Speaker 2>will also be released onto the streets unless the Albanese

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<v Speaker 2>government can get its act together and keep him in prison.

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<v Speaker 2>Don't bother asking questions because the government won't tell you

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<v Speaker 2>anything out of respect for the terrorist's privacy and I

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<v Speaker 2>kid you not.

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<v Speaker 11>Home Affairs today, I've been informed, have refused to answer

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<v Speaker 11>questions whether the Commonwealth is representing the people of Australia

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<v Speaker 11>to keep this person in beyond his sentence because of

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<v Speaker 11>privacy concerns. Now, they're taking the privacy concerns of a

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<v Speaker 11>convicted terrorist above the rights of Australians to know whether

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<v Speaker 11>one of our most prolific terrorists is going to be

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<v Speaker 11>free in about 12 days' time.

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<v Speaker 2>We have another preacher, the Melbourne man, Samir Abu Hamza Mokhtari,

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<v Speaker 2>that I exposed here last week, whose organisation is still

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<v Speaker 2>set to pick up $ 600, 000 of your money to help

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<v Speaker 2>build Australia's largest Islamic centre in Melbourne's northern suburbs, despite

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<v Speaker 2>his sermons condoning the rape and beating of wives and

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<v Speaker 2>foul references about Jews. Now, any other PM with a

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<v Speaker 2>backbone would immediately suspend funding to anyone with views like

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<v Speaker 2>that that are so at odds with Australian values, let

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<v Speaker 2>alone the allegations made by the UAE foreign minister connecting

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<v Speaker 2>his local Muslim organisation to the co-pilot who's claimed to

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<v Speaker 2>have been responsible for the attempted hijack of that fly-to-buy airline. Now,

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<v Speaker 2>thank goodness, at least Liberal leader Jess Wilson's got a spine.

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<v Speaker 6>We say to the planning minister, do not approve this

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<v Speaker 6>planning permit.

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<v Speaker 12>Do not do so before the election. I will not

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<v Speaker 12>allow this to proceed.

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<v Speaker 13>I will not approve this planning permit and we will

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<v Speaker 13>not see another taxpayer dollar go to this centre.

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<v Speaker 2>Labor likes to talk tough about the online world when

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<v Speaker 2>it needs to change the conversation and seeks ever more

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<v Speaker 2>draconian laws to curb free speech, but does nothing about

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<v Speaker 2>the clear and present danger of radical Islam that's already

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<v Speaker 2>metastasizing online and can be brought under control with existing laws,

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<v Speaker 2>provided political leaders have the spine to use them. But

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<v Speaker 2>what can we expect from a Prime Minister that never

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<v Speaker 2>even prepared a submission for the Bondi Royal Commission into

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<v Speaker 2>our worst ever terror attack, as recent FOI documents show?

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<v Speaker 2>Nor has he ever fronted to give public testimony in

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<v Speaker 2>the way that countless predecessors, former Prime Ministers, have to

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<v Speaker 2>pass inquiries. But he's not alone. Yesterday's stunt of a

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<v Speaker 2>staged photo-op involving the AFP Commissioner Chrissie Barrett in Melbourne,

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<v Speaker 2>alongside the PM, Burke, and her Victorian police counterpart, Mike Bush,

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<v Speaker 2>plus the embattled Victorian Premier, Ben Carroll, well, that speaks

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<v Speaker 2>to everything that's wrong with politics in this country. Here

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<v Speaker 2>was Barrett, herself also a Bondi no-show, being used to

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<v Speaker 2>help Carroll look like a leader in a fiercely fought

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<v Speaker 2>state election, when she would have been better off back

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<v Speaker 2>in Canberra in the war room alongside the boss of

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<v Speaker 2>ASIO getting briefed before the return of federal parliament next week.

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<v Speaker 2>The fact that Netball Australia gave evidence under oath to

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<v Speaker 2>Commissioner Bell and we saw nothing of Barrett says everything

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<v Speaker 2>about the performative use of uniforms and useful idiots by

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<v Speaker 2>the Albanese government. And don't even get me started on

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<v Speaker 2>the spineless Carol who even this week as that shocking

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<v Speaker 2>sermon from Abu Hamza resurfaced still refuses to cancel the

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<v Speaker 2>taxpayer largesse that he's paying out to Hamza's Melbourne Muslim

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<v Speaker 2>group called My Centre. Now, all we want as Australians

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<v Speaker 2>is for police to enforce the laws they already have,

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<v Speaker 2>for judges to err on the side of community safety

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<v Speaker 2>and for our leaders to lead. We're a bit jumpy

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<v Speaker 2>with the button tonight, fellas. All right, let's go to

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<v Speaker 2>camera now for the headlines with our political reporter, Trudy McIntosh.

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<v Speaker 12>Good evening.

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<v Speaker 14>Helen Haynes, alleged attacker, has faced court for the first time.

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<v Speaker 14>Brendan Nugent didn't apply for bail and will remain in

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<v Speaker 14>custody until his next appearance in February. Police are not

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<v Speaker 14>ruling out further charges. The Prime Minister is hoping the

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<v Speaker 14>attack on the independent MP doesn't change how politicians can

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<v Speaker 14>interact with the community. Security briefings were held today for

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<v Speaker 14>MPs who are unsettled by the horrific act of violence.

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<v Speaker 9>And this is an opportunity for people who feel anxious

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<v Speaker 9>to be able to ask questions as well of the

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<v Speaker 9>security agency.

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<v Speaker 2>Are we safe, you know, in our own community?

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<v Speaker 15>But it's sort of like a dark cloud, I think,

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<v Speaker 15>hanging over all of us at the moment.

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<v Speaker 14>It's been revealed around one person a week is being

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<v Speaker 14>charged by police with threats directed at MPs.

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<v Speaker 12>Of course it's concerning. It is one of our biggest

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<v Speaker 12>parts of the business. We have extensive resources dedicated to

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<v Speaker 12>that work.

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<v Speaker 14>The Prime Minister has sidestepped questions about why his office

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<v Speaker 14>had shopped around a so-called dirt sheet about Helen Haynes

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<v Speaker 14>earlier this year when she was key to prosecuting the

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<v Speaker 14>case about government pork barrelling.

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<v Speaker 8>So did the office send that out? Do you regret

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<v Speaker 8>that in hindsight given the events of recent days?

0:15:41.000 --> 0:15:43.960
<v Speaker 9>Well, Helen Haynes is a strong advocate for her community

0:15:44.760 --> 0:15:46.540
<v Speaker 9>and she advocates for funding.

0:15:46.600 --> 0:15:50.310
<v Speaker 15>Yeah, they were seeking to undermine her because she was

0:15:50.410 --> 0:15:55.470
<v Speaker 15>asking those questions. Well, you know, that's something that I

0:15:55.510 --> 0:15:57.910
<v Speaker 15>think the Prime Minister needs to reflect on.

0:15:58.070 --> 0:16:00.480
<v Speaker 2>Any dirt shit on Helen Haynes would be pretty dim.

0:16:01.220 --> 0:16:02.400
<v Speaker 14>Trudy McIntosh, News 24, Canberra.

0:16:05.080 --> 0:16:07.330
<v Speaker 2>Well, let's bring in the panel now. News24 host James

0:16:07.380 --> 0:16:11.450
<v Speaker 2>Morrow and our senior reporter from Sydney, Carolyn Marcus. Well, James,

0:16:11.470 --> 0:16:14.970
<v Speaker 2>I want to go to the hypocrisy today we saw

0:16:14.990 --> 0:16:18.390
<v Speaker 2>from the Prime Minister. So he says since Monday night,

0:16:18.430 --> 0:16:21.670
<v Speaker 2>let's turn down the temperature. He has, to be fair

0:16:21.690 --> 0:16:23.710
<v Speaker 2>to the Prime Minister, said that in the past as well.

0:16:24.470 --> 0:16:28.500
<v Speaker 2>But we know that his office... distributed that dirt sheet

0:16:28.740 --> 0:16:32.260
<v Speaker 2>on Helen Haynes after she had the temerity to raise

0:16:32.350 --> 0:16:35.370
<v Speaker 2>questions about the $ 6 million that went to his mates

0:16:35.410 --> 0:16:37.450
<v Speaker 2>at the golf course long before there was ever a

0:16:37.510 --> 0:16:40.750
<v Speaker 2>process to award the money. And we know it's fair

0:16:40.790 --> 0:16:45.150
<v Speaker 2>income because of the metadata in the document now confirmed

0:16:45.210 --> 0:16:48.450
<v Speaker 2>as coming out of Prime Minister and Cabinet and connected

0:16:48.510 --> 0:16:52.030
<v Speaker 2>to an individual on the payroll in the Prime Minister's

0:16:52.250 --> 0:16:53.720
<v Speaker 2>own personal office.

0:16:54.760 --> 0:16:58.180
<v Speaker 7>Peter, this is, what's the old saying? Your tax dollars

0:16:58.520 --> 0:17:01.400
<v Speaker 7>at work. And I think that this gets to the

0:17:01.600 --> 0:17:06.560
<v Speaker 7>absolute heart of why people are so mistrustful of Anthony

0:17:06.619 --> 0:17:10.850
<v Speaker 7>Albanese in particular, but also more broadly the political class.

0:17:10.890 --> 0:17:13.590
<v Speaker 7>Because what we just saw here today, we lifted the

0:17:13.710 --> 0:17:17.710
<v Speaker 7>rock up and we saw the way that things work,

0:17:17.970 --> 0:17:21.450
<v Speaker 7>you know, underneath the surface in Canberra, the whole dark

0:17:21.530 --> 0:17:25.230
<v Speaker 7>arts thing These dirt sheets is the polite term for

0:17:25.270 --> 0:17:29.560
<v Speaker 7>them that people send out, governments send out about their opposition.

0:17:29.600 --> 0:17:34.409
<v Speaker 7>But anybody asking uncomfortable questions, even somebody like Helen Haynes,

0:17:34.430 --> 0:17:38.890
<v Speaker 7>who is known as an absolute pillar of integrity, suggesting,

0:17:39.270 --> 0:17:42.080
<v Speaker 7>you know, with all sorts of insinuations that there was

0:17:42.119 --> 0:17:45.320
<v Speaker 7>something wrong with grants that she was involved in, all

0:17:45.440 --> 0:17:49.929
<v Speaker 7>again as a distraction and a warning about going after

0:17:50.150 --> 0:17:53.810
<v Speaker 7>the prime minister for this $ 6 million that was announced

0:17:53.850 --> 0:17:57.070
<v Speaker 7>before the program even got underway for the golf course

0:17:57.170 --> 0:18:00.429
<v Speaker 7>down the road from his house. It stinks, and I

0:18:00.470 --> 0:18:04.310
<v Speaker 7>think Albanese has absolutely zero credibility on this, and when

0:18:04.350 --> 0:18:06.950
<v Speaker 7>he tells people to turn down the temperature, You know,

0:18:06.970 --> 0:18:10.179
<v Speaker 7>he's not talking about himself. He'll keep playing hardball as

0:18:10.240 --> 0:18:12.500
<v Speaker 7>long as he needs to. He's just trying to get

0:18:12.560 --> 0:18:15.510
<v Speaker 7>the other side to cool it and shut up.

0:18:17.580 --> 0:18:19.320
<v Speaker 2>And push his digital duty of care.

0:18:19.400 --> 0:18:19.600
<v Speaker 4>Yes.

0:18:19.800 --> 0:18:21.660
<v Speaker 2>Just before I go to Caroline, I want to point

0:18:21.700 --> 0:18:25.700
<v Speaker 2>out something very interesting. We saw it first on Monday night.

0:18:25.780 --> 0:18:29.669
<v Speaker 2>We saw it again yesterday in that photo opportunity involving

0:18:29.690 --> 0:18:30.869
<v Speaker 2>the Premier in Victoria.

0:18:30.890 --> 0:18:30.960
<v Speaker 12>Yes.

0:18:31.369 --> 0:18:36.760
<v Speaker 2>There's been a subtle shift in the three-flag ideology of

0:18:36.780 --> 0:18:40.220
<v Speaker 2>the Prime Minister. He's always had this Monday night, you

0:18:40.240 --> 0:18:42.660
<v Speaker 2>can see the Australian flag is in the middle. He's

0:18:42.720 --> 0:18:46.550
<v Speaker 2>always had the Australian flag out to the left flank.

0:18:47.609 --> 0:18:49.929
<v Speaker 2>It's long been criticised by my viewers, not only that

0:18:49.950 --> 0:18:52.570
<v Speaker 2>there are three flags, but that the Australian flag has

0:18:52.670 --> 0:18:56.570
<v Speaker 2>always been out on the edge. That's his normal layout.

0:18:56.690 --> 0:18:59.490
<v Speaker 2>But he made that decision on Monday night. That's been changed,

0:18:59.970 --> 0:19:02.170
<v Speaker 2>replicated again. That's what it normally looks like there, whether

0:19:02.190 --> 0:19:04.650
<v Speaker 2>you've got the Australian flag out there on the side.

0:19:05.410 --> 0:19:09.210
<v Speaker 2>Change of heart, James, ever since Monday night. What's going

0:19:09.310 --> 0:19:09.810
<v Speaker 2>on here?

0:19:10.030 --> 0:19:13.850
<v Speaker 7>It's pretty interesting, isn't it? You know, this is not

0:19:13.890 --> 0:19:17.190
<v Speaker 7>a government that I would... really ranks high on the

0:19:17.250 --> 0:19:21.240
<v Speaker 7>protocol or patriotism stakes. Now, according to the PM &amp;

0:19:20.660 --> 0:19:24.540
<v Speaker 7>C' s own guidance, actually, the place of honor for the

0:19:24.600 --> 0:19:28.040
<v Speaker 7>Australian flag is on the left. from the perspective of

0:19:28.119 --> 0:19:30.420
<v Speaker 7>the viewer. I was just looking at that and confirming

0:19:30.440 --> 0:19:32.560
<v Speaker 7>that a little while ago. But it's interesting that he's

0:19:32.580 --> 0:19:35.300
<v Speaker 7>put it in the center now. I think that he's

0:19:35.340 --> 0:19:38.460
<v Speaker 7>going against protocol or his office is going against protocol,

0:19:38.760 --> 0:19:41.650
<v Speaker 7>but somehow trying to say, oh, hey, hey, hey, hey,

0:19:41.730 --> 0:19:45.210
<v Speaker 7>we are the patriotic, wrap ourselves in the flag, national

0:19:45.350 --> 0:19:48.350
<v Speaker 7>unity party. But I'll tell you what, if they really

0:19:48.650 --> 0:19:52.420
<v Speaker 7>wanted to do something about national unity and flags, they'd

0:19:52.460 --> 0:19:53.489
<v Speaker 7>get rid of the other two.

0:19:55.210 --> 0:19:58.430
<v Speaker 2>You are right about the protocol point. I think I've

0:19:58.750 --> 0:20:01.810
<v Speaker 2>pointed that out to people when they've sent me an email.

0:20:02.190 --> 0:20:04.520
<v Speaker 2>But I think he's copying a lot of criticism for

0:20:04.540 --> 0:20:06.940
<v Speaker 2>the fact that when you do that tight shot, James,

0:20:07.300 --> 0:20:10.340
<v Speaker 2>you're not seeing the Australian flag. You're seeing predominantly the

0:20:10.420 --> 0:20:11.320
<v Speaker 2>Aboriginal flag.

0:20:11.359 --> 0:20:12.139
<v Speaker 4>I think he's.

0:20:11.920 --> 0:20:15.440
<v Speaker 2>Responding to polling. I think he's responding to polling on

0:20:15.480 --> 0:20:21.520
<v Speaker 2>that one. Let's go to criticism today, Caroline. The Islamophobia

0:20:22.140 --> 0:20:26.480
<v Speaker 2>Special Envoy, and I have italics around that term, I

0:20:26.500 --> 0:20:30.420
<v Speaker 2>don't like it at all, he's pretty cranky about needing

0:20:30.480 --> 0:20:33.640
<v Speaker 2>to have a definition on the table with universities by

0:20:33.740 --> 0:20:38.790
<v Speaker 2>January the 1st next year. And, of course, I'll give

0:20:38.810 --> 0:20:43.470
<v Speaker 2>you a comment here now from UAE political analyst Amjid Taha,

0:20:43.570 --> 0:20:46.709
<v Speaker 2>who I spoke to in June in London, about the

0:20:46.750 --> 0:20:50.270
<v Speaker 2>whole concept of of Islamophobia. Have a listen.

0:20:51.510 --> 0:20:57.200
<v Speaker 16>The moment they criticise those Islamists, those Muslim Brotherhood, they

0:20:57.400 --> 0:21:01.060
<v Speaker 16>will call them Islamophobia. But that terminology itself, it was

0:21:01.119 --> 0:21:05.780
<v Speaker 16>created by the Muslim Brotherhood's radical Islamists, is to censor

0:21:06.220 --> 0:21:11.620
<v Speaker 16>your right to criticise those and is to stop you

0:21:11.740 --> 0:21:12.580
<v Speaker 16>from doing so.

0:21:12.600 --> 0:21:17.980
<v Speaker 2>Okay, Carolina Muslim Scholar rejecting the term of Islamophobia. So

0:21:18.020 --> 0:21:19.650
<v Speaker 2>why are we going down this path?

0:21:20.810 --> 0:21:23.230
<v Speaker 17>I mean, I think Amjad really belled the cat here

0:21:23.270 --> 0:21:27.550
<v Speaker 17>that this idea, this concept of Islamophobia has really been

0:21:27.630 --> 0:21:32.350
<v Speaker 17>manufactured to silence criticism about radical Islam, and Australia should

0:21:32.410 --> 0:21:36.950
<v Speaker 17>have no part of that. The Islamophobia Envoy's position itself

0:21:37.090 --> 0:21:42.090
<v Speaker 17>was only created after October 7 because the government was

0:21:42.190 --> 0:21:46.909
<v Speaker 17>too gutless to appoint an anti-Semitism envoy, which was desperately needed,

0:21:47.270 --> 0:21:50.080
<v Speaker 17>by itself. It wanted to appoint envoys.

0:21:50.420 --> 0:21:50.620
<v Speaker 2>for.

0:21:50.560 --> 0:21:54.419
<v Speaker 17>Both kinds of hatred. And so it actually delayed the

0:21:54.480 --> 0:21:57.580
<v Speaker 17>appointment of Gillian Siegel for it to find someone for

0:21:57.600 --> 0:22:00.369
<v Speaker 17>the Islamophobia envoy role. So that's the first thing you

0:22:00.400 --> 0:22:02.929
<v Speaker 17>need to know about that position. The other thing is

0:22:02.990 --> 0:22:05.889
<v Speaker 17>the timeframe that universities have been given to come up

0:22:05.950 --> 0:22:09.990
<v Speaker 17>with a definition of Islamophobia is more than six months.

0:22:10.030 --> 0:22:13.110
<v Speaker 17>They've had since July. They've got to come up with

0:22:13.190 --> 0:22:15.570
<v Speaker 17>one from January. And the fact that this still isn't

0:22:15.750 --> 0:22:19.030
<v Speaker 17>enough time, according to this envoy, tells you everything you

0:22:19.070 --> 0:22:21.010
<v Speaker 17>need to know about it. And the final point I'll

0:22:21.050 --> 0:22:23.490
<v Speaker 17>make is is that a phobia is meant to be

0:22:23.520 --> 0:22:27.800
<v Speaker 17>an irrational fear about something, you know, maybe small spaces

0:22:28.000 --> 0:22:31.340
<v Speaker 17>or heights that doesn't relate to the real risk. Whereas

0:22:31.500 --> 0:22:35.660
<v Speaker 17>I would argue that the fear of radical Islam, which

0:22:35.700 --> 0:22:39.550
<v Speaker 17>has proven to be very real to Western societies, including

0:22:39.590 --> 0:22:45.310
<v Speaker 17>here in Australia after Bondi, is entirely justifiable and entirely rational.

0:22:45.390 --> 0:22:49.720
<v Speaker 17>So I think we shouldn't be part of any definition

0:22:49.800 --> 0:22:52.600
<v Speaker 17>of this and giving it any sort of legitimacy at all.

0:22:54.290 --> 0:22:57.149
<v Speaker 2>I could not agree with you more, particularly on that

0:22:57.190 --> 0:23:00.119
<v Speaker 2>last point. about a phobia. It's not a phobia to

0:23:00.160 --> 0:23:04.510
<v Speaker 2>fear radical Islam. Absolutely not. Let's go to that shocking

0:23:05.609 --> 0:23:08.770
<v Speaker 2>bad luck, let's call it, for Ben Carroll in Victoria,

0:23:08.869 --> 0:23:11.670
<v Speaker 2>if I can, James. He fills up the tank with

0:23:11.730 --> 0:23:15.290
<v Speaker 2>petrol on Monday night. He drives off. forgets to pay.

0:23:15.310 --> 0:23:19.510
<v Speaker 2>A car is obviously registered with Premier and Cabinet. They

0:23:19.550 --> 0:23:23.970
<v Speaker 2>make contact or the servo makes contact with them. He

0:23:24.010 --> 0:23:26.130
<v Speaker 2>gets a call, mate, you forgot to pay for your petrol.

0:23:26.670 --> 0:23:29.430
<v Speaker 2>Off he goes and pays for it. I assume Victorians

0:23:29.470 --> 0:23:31.260
<v Speaker 2>are actually paying for the petrol. It's not coming out

0:23:31.280 --> 0:23:33.920
<v Speaker 2>of his own pocket. It happens on the same day

0:23:33.960 --> 0:23:36.359
<v Speaker 2>as the RACV has gone out and said over the

0:23:36.480 --> 0:23:42.020
<v Speaker 2>last three months alone we've had 8,000 flat tyres. These

0:23:42.060 --> 0:23:46.740
<v Speaker 2>are blowouts from potholes. And 71% of people that responded

0:23:46.920 --> 0:23:49.600
<v Speaker 2>to the survey said this is the biggest concern they

0:23:49.640 --> 0:23:53.709
<v Speaker 2>have now in relation to road safety. And every one

0:23:53.750 --> 0:23:57.129
<v Speaker 2>of those people with a blowout, they are a voter.

0:23:57.190 --> 0:23:57.290
<v Speaker 6>Yeah.

0:23:58.369 --> 0:24:02.170
<v Speaker 7>That's right, Peter, and that's expensive business if you've ever

0:24:02.250 --> 0:24:05.590
<v Speaker 7>hit a pothole, particularly if you've got low-profile tires or

0:24:05.609 --> 0:24:09.190
<v Speaker 7>something like that. It's really pricey. You're blowing out tires.

0:24:09.230 --> 0:24:13.410
<v Speaker 7>You're busting rims, and it's not getting any better under labor.

0:24:13.450 --> 0:24:15.770
<v Speaker 7>A few years ago, I did a big drive through

0:24:15.850 --> 0:24:18.020
<v Speaker 7>country Victoria from one end to the other on my

0:24:18.040 --> 0:24:21.220
<v Speaker 7>way to South Australia. And the state of country roads,

0:24:21.300 --> 0:24:24.899
<v Speaker 7>even back then, it was rainy that summer. And it was,

0:24:25.320 --> 0:24:27.520
<v Speaker 7>I felt like I was back in Kenya. It reminded

0:24:27.560 --> 0:24:31.020
<v Speaker 7>me of the roads in Kenya when I was there.

0:24:31.200 --> 0:24:33.500
<v Speaker 7>And it was, you know, the shoulders were falling off

0:24:33.560 --> 0:24:35.740
<v Speaker 7>the sides. In many places, it was only one and

0:24:35.760 --> 0:24:39.050
<v Speaker 7>a half lanes between the two. So really terrifying stuff.

0:24:39.590 --> 0:24:43.190
<v Speaker 7>The fact that a state government cannot fix roads, that's

0:24:43.230 --> 0:24:45.550
<v Speaker 7>like the basic thing that a state government has to

0:24:45.590 --> 0:24:48.429
<v Speaker 7>do in terms of service delivery. And it's just another

0:24:48.490 --> 0:24:52.760
<v Speaker 7>reason to hope that this pathetic, incompetent government, Peter, gets

0:24:52.960 --> 0:24:54.580
<v Speaker 7>turfed out next month.

0:24:56.359 --> 0:24:58.199
<v Speaker 2>And credit here to the Liberals. I think I've got

0:24:58.220 --> 0:25:01.320
<v Speaker 2>a picture to put up on the screen. He forgot

0:25:01.359 --> 0:25:03.580
<v Speaker 2>to pay for the petrol at his local station in

0:25:03.820 --> 0:25:05.280
<v Speaker 2>Nidri on Monday night.

0:25:05.300 --> 0:25:05.660
<v Speaker 7>Look at that.

0:25:05.980 --> 0:25:08.040
<v Speaker 2>They've already got ads up there saying, hey, Ben, don't

0:25:08.220 --> 0:25:13.260
<v Speaker 2>forget to pay. Victorians are sick of paying for labour.

0:25:13.760 --> 0:25:15.960
<v Speaker 2>I think it's a cracker. That's a quick turnaround there

0:25:16.000 --> 0:25:19.130
<v Speaker 2>by the Liberal campaign team. Thank you to you both.

0:25:19.150 --> 0:25:23.070
<v Speaker 2>We'll see you next week. Let's go now to the

0:25:23.150 --> 0:25:25.990
<v Speaker 2>corner that the Prime Minister sort of painted himself into

0:25:26.070 --> 0:25:30.179
<v Speaker 2>following that attack on Helen Haynes. Won't admit to the

0:25:30.220 --> 0:25:34.020
<v Speaker 2>dirt file that's been circulated. It has been proven today

0:25:34.060 --> 0:25:38.300
<v Speaker 2>to have come from his office, but still he's shameless.

0:25:38.800 --> 0:25:42.139
<v Speaker 2>He's out there calling for a more respectful political debate

0:25:42.280 --> 0:25:45.990
<v Speaker 2>in Australia. Here to discuss this and more, Victorian Senator

0:25:46.330 --> 0:25:51.040
<v Speaker 2>Bridget McKenzie. Well, you know, I'm sorry. You know, it

0:25:51.080 --> 0:25:55.100
<v Speaker 2>has been a traumatic week for everyone. You, staff in

0:25:55.140 --> 0:25:58.399
<v Speaker 2>Parliament House, I particularly think of the staff tonight, Bridget. But,

0:25:58.420 --> 0:26:00.700
<v Speaker 2>I mean, Australians look at this bloke and say, stop

0:26:00.840 --> 0:26:03.629
<v Speaker 2>talking out of both sides of your mouth.

0:26:05.410 --> 0:26:06.430
<v Speaker 12>Oh, I hear you, Peter.

0:26:06.690 --> 0:26:11.440
<v Speaker 6>I mean, honestly, don't look at what people say. Look

0:26:11.460 --> 0:26:15.020
<v Speaker 6>at what they do. And when this Prime Minister was

0:26:15.080 --> 0:26:20.150
<v Speaker 6>confronted by Kieran Gilbert today with the fact that his

0:26:20.250 --> 0:26:25.070
<v Speaker 6>office had shopped around a dirt file on Helen Haynes, why?

0:26:25.350 --> 0:26:31.760
<v Speaker 6>Simply because she'd actually had the courage. to put on

0:26:31.800 --> 0:26:35.980
<v Speaker 6>the public record her concerns with the $ 6.

0:26:35.880 --> 0:26:39.600
<v Speaker 12>05 million grant to Marrickville Golf Club. What was his

0:26:39.660 --> 0:26:40.510
<v Speaker 12>first response?

0:26:41.410 --> 0:26:43.410
<v Speaker 6>Was to actually shop out a dirt file to trash

0:26:43.430 --> 0:26:46.689
<v Speaker 6>her reputation with the media, to get a negative story

0:26:46.770 --> 0:26:47.310
<v Speaker 6>up on her.

0:26:47.330 --> 0:26:47.389
<v Speaker 10>So.

0:26:48.350 --> 0:26:51.630
<v Speaker 6>Look at what people do. Don't look at what they say.

0:26:51.670 --> 0:26:55.730
<v Speaker 6>It's very easy to have empathy. It's very easy to say,

0:26:55.750 --> 0:27:00.409
<v Speaker 6>let's take the temperature down. Meanwhile, the Prime Minister and

0:27:00.450 --> 0:27:06.010
<v Speaker 6>his office are actually taking action to trash Helen Haynes'

0:27:06.050 --> 0:27:07.590
<v Speaker 6>reputation in that same moment.

0:27:09.490 --> 0:27:13.790
<v Speaker 2>You were in the Senate inquiry today. It kicked off, obviously,

0:27:13.890 --> 0:27:20.120
<v Speaker 2>into the $ 560 million grants program. And we heard evidence

0:27:20.900 --> 0:27:23.540
<v Speaker 2>on the back of that submission, of course, from Anne Toomey,

0:27:24.020 --> 0:27:27.000
<v Speaker 2>calling it grey corruption. I mean, she went into sort

0:27:27.020 --> 0:27:31.359
<v Speaker 2>of quite significant constitutional detail about all the ways in

0:27:31.420 --> 0:27:34.970
<v Speaker 2>which she would regard this is completely out of line

0:27:34.990 --> 0:27:38.330
<v Speaker 2>for a federal government to run these programs as they have.

0:27:39.510 --> 0:27:41.730
<v Speaker 2>What else did you make of today's evidence?

0:27:43.470 --> 0:27:47.100
<v Speaker 6>Well, I think the main thing out of today's evidence

0:27:47.340 --> 0:27:53.060
<v Speaker 6>was that, you know, integrity experts and Toomey but also

0:27:53.340 --> 0:28:01.970
<v Speaker 6>Geoffrey Watson said slammed these closed invite-only grant programs run

0:28:01.990 --> 0:28:05.640
<v Speaker 6>by the government where an announcement is made and then

0:28:05.680 --> 0:28:12.140
<v Speaker 6>the department is retrospectively writing guidelines so that... you know,

0:28:12.500 --> 0:28:16.590
<v Speaker 6>all of those election commitments actually fit inside these very

0:28:17.550 --> 0:28:21.650
<v Speaker 6>loose guidelines. I did ask Professor Toomey how it would

0:28:21.670 --> 0:28:24.379
<v Speaker 6>be possible to fail to meet the guidelines, given they

0:28:24.400 --> 0:28:28.300
<v Speaker 6>were actually written post the election coming down.

0:28:28.810 --> 0:28:30.950
<v Speaker 12>There were a number of other issues.

0:28:31.010 --> 0:28:37.130
<v Speaker 6>The infrastructure department in the guidelines, I think it's guideline 13.4,

0:28:37.130 --> 0:28:41.560
<v Speaker 6>tells proponents of the grant program that they can't discuss

0:28:41.620 --> 0:28:46.840
<v Speaker 6>the details of their project or conversations with the department

0:28:46.880 --> 0:28:50.730
<v Speaker 6>without the written approval of the department itself. I found

0:28:50.770 --> 0:28:56.340
<v Speaker 6>that type of non-disclosure framework incredibly troubling when it comes

0:28:56.400 --> 0:29:01.260
<v Speaker 6>to transparency. And we also had the mayor... in Anthony

0:29:01.340 --> 0:29:05.200
<v Speaker 6>Albanese's seat come before us. They are hosting the grant

0:29:05.220 --> 0:29:08.930
<v Speaker 6>for the Marrickville Golf Club. What is it now, October?

0:29:08.970 --> 0:29:13.750
<v Speaker 6>The announcement was made a long time ago, May 2025.

0:29:13.750 --> 0:29:18.450
<v Speaker 6>April last year. And we still haven't seen the application.

0:29:18.850 --> 0:29:20.970
<v Speaker 6>So my question is how did you know it was

0:29:21.010 --> 0:29:21.950
<v Speaker 6>going to cost $ 6.

0:29:21.550 --> 0:29:27.250
<v Speaker 12>05 million 18 months ago? because we still haven't got

0:29:27.290 --> 0:29:28.210
<v Speaker 12>the design done.

0:29:28.810 --> 0:29:31.860
<v Speaker 6>It also is supposed to include sewerage. Turns out New

0:29:31.900 --> 0:29:35.340
<v Speaker 6>South Wales governments pay for the sewerage. So a lot

0:29:35.360 --> 0:29:39.390
<v Speaker 6>of questions to come. We've got the infrastructure department tomorrow,

0:29:39.650 --> 0:29:42.580
<v Speaker 6>Prime Minister. and Cabinet, so we will be following up

0:29:42.680 --> 0:29:46.440
<v Speaker 6>with them around the lists, who was in, who was out.

0:29:46.500 --> 0:29:50.080
<v Speaker 6>But I think the main thing was it's not competitive,

0:29:50.220 --> 0:29:54.440
<v Speaker 6>it's not open, it's not transparent, it's not public. Huge

0:29:54.500 --> 0:29:56.740
<v Speaker 6>concerns about the transparency of this grant program.

0:29:58.390 --> 0:30:01.650
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I'll come back to tomorrow after tomorrow's hearings, obviously, Bridge,

0:30:01.810 --> 0:30:05.090
<v Speaker 2>but I'm interested in the fact that the department was

0:30:05.170 --> 0:30:09.570
<v Speaker 2>not involved in the list of potential applicants. The applicants

0:30:09.610 --> 0:30:12.930
<v Speaker 2>were mostly announced during the campaign period when the government's

0:30:12.990 --> 0:30:16.810
<v Speaker 2>in caretaker. So there's no probity and oversight from the

0:30:16.870 --> 0:30:19.360
<v Speaker 2>public servants. And of course... We know it was a

0:30:19.410 --> 0:30:22.940
<v Speaker 2>closed shop program anyway. You had to be tapped on

0:30:22.980 --> 0:30:26.800
<v Speaker 2>the shoulder to get the money. And I've played from

0:30:27.460 --> 0:30:31.860
<v Speaker 2>middle of last year quite extraordinary Facebook footage from that

0:30:31.920 --> 0:30:35.940
<v Speaker 2>mayor that you've had in the stand today basically saying

0:30:36.000 --> 0:30:38.000
<v Speaker 2>we've got our $ 6 million from the Prime Minister, now

0:30:38.040 --> 0:30:39.780
<v Speaker 2>let's run off and decide what we're going to spend

0:30:39.820 --> 0:30:42.580
<v Speaker 2>it on. So it was a blank cheque. It's clear

0:30:42.620 --> 0:30:45.080
<v Speaker 2>it was a blank cheque. And I'm not surprised there's

0:30:45.100 --> 0:30:47.380
<v Speaker 2>been no application to date. Hey, I've got to ask

0:30:47.400 --> 0:30:49.760
<v Speaker 2>you about the front page of the Weekly Times today

0:30:49.840 --> 0:30:55.680
<v Speaker 2>in Victoria. This is huge. Victoria Labor is ramming through

0:30:55.740 --> 0:30:57.780
<v Speaker 2>as they head to the election a whole lot of

0:30:57.860 --> 0:31:02.920
<v Speaker 2>planning amendments. This is ahead of Caretaker. Caretaker will start

0:31:03.040 --> 0:31:08.310
<v Speaker 2>next weekend. And this is to override planning permissions. They're

0:31:08.370 --> 0:31:12.270
<v Speaker 2>pushing on with these huge wind turbines near Warwick, Nabil.

0:31:12.290 --> 0:31:17.470
<v Speaker 2>There's 200-odd turbines there. The local community, the mayor's in

0:31:17.490 --> 0:31:21.690
<v Speaker 2>the Weekly Times today, they have not been consulted. I

0:31:21.730 --> 0:31:24.770
<v Speaker 2>spoke to Jess Wilson on Monday about the plans for

0:31:24.810 --> 0:31:27.959
<v Speaker 2>this massive Islamic school in Melbourne. She says, if I'm elected,

0:31:27.980 --> 0:31:30.450
<v Speaker 2>I'll tear it up. I'm not going to cop these

0:31:30.550 --> 0:31:34.190
<v Speaker 2>plans being approved by Labor, you know, at the 11th hour.

0:31:34.950 --> 0:31:38.270
<v Speaker 2>But you're a country MP. I mean, this is not

0:31:38.290 --> 0:31:38.910
<v Speaker 2>going to wash.

0:31:40.440 --> 0:31:41.980
<v Speaker 12>No way, Peter.

0:31:42.000 --> 0:31:44.720
<v Speaker 6>You know, the Wimmer is saying no to this, the Warwick-Nabil.

0:31:45.280 --> 0:31:50.200
<v Speaker 6>Energy Zone is a 26,000 hectare project. The community has

0:31:50.280 --> 0:31:53.520
<v Speaker 6>not been consulted. Their rights have been stripped away. Their

0:31:53.600 --> 0:31:55.120
<v Speaker 6>appeal rights have.

0:31:55.000 --> 0:31:55.960
<v Speaker 12>Been stripped away.

0:31:56.640 --> 0:32:01.050
<v Speaker 6>And I think Emma Keeley, the National Party MP and

0:32:01.070 --> 0:32:04.050
<v Speaker 6>Deputy Leader, local member there, I've spoken to her today,

0:32:04.690 --> 0:32:07.570
<v Speaker 6>they are going to be reviewing these decisions. And unless

0:32:07.610 --> 0:32:12.110
<v Speaker 6>a shovel is in the ground post this election, these

0:32:12.170 --> 0:32:16.400
<v Speaker 6>projects will not be continuing. because the community hasn't had

0:32:16.460 --> 0:32:20.370
<v Speaker 6>a say. We don't understand the social, economic or environmental

0:32:20.490 --> 0:32:25.390
<v Speaker 6>impacts because the minister is more interested in rushing through

0:32:25.410 --> 0:32:30.470
<v Speaker 6>these projects prior to losing government than actually allowing communities

0:32:30.690 --> 0:32:33.020
<v Speaker 6>and individuals to have their say. And so I'm very

0:32:33.100 --> 0:32:37.210
<v Speaker 6>proud of the National Party with their Liberal colleagues, being

0:32:37.230 --> 0:32:40.910
<v Speaker 6>prepared to stand up against these projects with their community

0:32:41.970 --> 0:32:44.930
<v Speaker 6>and get a better outcome where communities are properly consulted.

0:32:45.750 --> 0:32:47.950
<v Speaker 6>And there's buffer zones, et cetera, which is all part

0:32:47.970 --> 0:32:48.520
<v Speaker 6>of our plan.

0:32:50.340 --> 0:32:54.620
<v Speaker 2>Bridget, thank you. I look forward to following you tomorrow

0:32:54.700 --> 0:32:57.020
<v Speaker 2>and taking up the fight for the poor old taxpayer

0:32:57.420 --> 0:33:01.030
<v Speaker 2>on this grants program. Thank you for your time. All right,

0:33:01.070 --> 0:33:02.390
<v Speaker 2>quick break after the break. We're going to go to

0:33:02.410 --> 0:33:05.430
<v Speaker 2>the historian that I love, Rafe. I'm going to talk

0:33:05.450 --> 0:33:08.410
<v Speaker 2>about everything that's playing out in Europe. The warnings, obviously,

0:33:08.470 --> 0:33:12.410
<v Speaker 2>for Australia. But Poland in particular today, a shot across

0:33:12.430 --> 0:33:16.380
<v Speaker 2>the bow in relation to huge levels of migration. They

0:33:16.450 --> 0:33:21.200
<v Speaker 2>say it will not be allowed in their country after

0:33:21.220 --> 0:33:21.460
<v Speaker 2>the break.

0:33:30.180 --> 0:33:30.600
<v Speaker 7>Welcome back.

0:33:30.920 --> 0:33:35.060
<v Speaker 2>Let's get into those continuing issues plaguing Europe. We saw

0:33:35.080 --> 0:33:38.140
<v Speaker 2>the riots, obviously, over the weekend, and there have been more,

0:33:38.160 --> 0:33:42.470
<v Speaker 2>although I must say, Giorgio Maloney in Milan has got

0:33:42.610 --> 0:33:48.310
<v Speaker 2>the whole of the Duomo ringed with police and vehicles.

0:33:48.950 --> 0:33:53.610
<v Speaker 2>Nothing much is happening there, thank goodness. But it's reignited

0:33:53.630 --> 0:33:55.590
<v Speaker 2>a whole debate that we are having in Australia about

0:33:56.000 --> 0:33:59.810
<v Speaker 2>about the loss of Western civilisation, our culture, the fight

0:33:59.850 --> 0:34:05.000
<v Speaker 2>about open borders and the failure to address difficult social

0:34:05.060 --> 0:34:08.590
<v Speaker 2>issues and tensions that we have seen here building, of course,

0:34:08.750 --> 0:34:12.490
<v Speaker 2>since Bondi and October 7. Here to give us his take,

0:34:12.969 --> 0:34:17.680
<v Speaker 2>UK historian Rafe Hadall-Mercou. Rafe, thank you for your time.

0:34:17.800 --> 0:34:21.160
<v Speaker 2>Great to have you on the program. You're in the

0:34:21.219 --> 0:34:23.839
<v Speaker 2>hot seat over there. I was going to say in Europe,

0:34:23.860 --> 0:34:26.000
<v Speaker 2>but of course you're not. You're in Britain and thankfully

0:34:26.020 --> 0:34:28.560
<v Speaker 2>you're out of the EU, at least for the moment.

0:34:29.960 --> 0:34:34.280
<v Speaker 2>Give me your assessment on the weekend and the fallout since.

0:34:35.680 --> 0:34:38.359
<v Speaker 4>Well, what can I say? You know, I'm a Europhile,

0:34:38.420 --> 0:34:39.920
<v Speaker 4>even if I'm not a European.

0:34:39.940 --> 0:34:42.120
<v Speaker 18>And all I could think of was, you know, in

0:34:42.219 --> 0:34:45.960
<v Speaker 18>ancient times, well, for hundreds of years, cities had big

0:34:46.000 --> 0:34:49.299
<v Speaker 18>walls around them to keep the barbarians and the, you know,

0:34:49.320 --> 0:34:53.330
<v Speaker 18>the brutish hordes out of civilization. And now, of course,

0:34:53.370 --> 0:34:56.510
<v Speaker 18>thanks to open borders, the enemy has not only entered,

0:34:56.570 --> 0:35:00.100
<v Speaker 18>they've been welcomed in. and they now are embedded in

0:35:00.140 --> 0:35:03.469
<v Speaker 18>the core of our cities. And this is not just

0:35:03.950 --> 0:35:07.290
<v Speaker 18>happening in France. We may have a longer fuse in Britain,

0:35:07.670 --> 0:35:10.350
<v Speaker 18>but that fuse has already been lit here too. This

0:35:10.410 --> 0:35:13.250
<v Speaker 18>is a contagion. You've seen the scenes that you now

0:35:13.330 --> 0:35:17.320
<v Speaker 18>see in Italy, and this is going to spread elsewhere. Germany, Belgium,

0:35:17.340 --> 0:35:20.100
<v Speaker 18>they all suffer from these same problems. And that's why

0:35:20.140 --> 0:35:23.180
<v Speaker 18>it's so ironic when you see someone like President Macron

0:35:23.580 --> 0:35:27.060
<v Speaker 18>addressing the nation, asking, How could French people do this

0:35:27.260 --> 0:35:30.370
<v Speaker 18>to France, he asked. Well, look, let's call this out.

0:35:30.670 --> 0:35:34.250
<v Speaker 18>There's nothing French about the scenes that we saw. And

0:35:34.290 --> 0:35:36.750
<v Speaker 18>there's nothing French about many of those people who were,

0:35:36.810 --> 0:35:42.700
<v Speaker 18>you know, gleefully participating in this. Proust, Voltaire, Debussy, Cezanne

0:35:43.010 --> 0:35:46.100
<v Speaker 18>mean nothing to these people. And a lot of people say, oh, well,

0:35:46.120 --> 0:35:48.339
<v Speaker 18>the French always do this sort of thing. It's part

0:35:48.380 --> 0:35:52.230
<v Speaker 18>of their revolutionary DNA. Whenever you saw French people take

0:35:52.270 --> 0:35:55.399
<v Speaker 18>to the streets, it was to improve their society, even

0:35:55.440 --> 0:35:57.040
<v Speaker 18>if they went about it in violent ways.

0:35:57.440 --> 0:35:58.600
<v Speaker 4>This was nihilistic.

0:35:58.660 --> 0:36:03.009
<v Speaker 18>This was an attack on beauty, the destruction of the

0:36:03.110 --> 0:36:05.970
<v Speaker 18>Limoges Town Hall. And this, of course, was an attack

0:36:06.050 --> 0:36:08.290
<v Speaker 18>on France and Western civilisations.

0:36:10.040 --> 0:36:13.630
<v Speaker 2>I think that's what's upset so many of us around

0:36:13.650 --> 0:36:17.350
<v Speaker 2>the world, that Paris in particular is a city of beauty.

0:36:17.390 --> 0:36:20.040
<v Speaker 2>La Manche is beautiful as well, but Paris is a

0:36:20.080 --> 0:36:24.560
<v Speaker 2>standout city. And to see so much destruction to monuments

0:36:24.600 --> 0:36:29.130
<v Speaker 2>that have survived world wars... at the hands of citizens

0:36:29.230 --> 0:36:33.359
<v Speaker 2>and migrant arrivals is heartbreaking. And, of course, I've seen

0:36:33.450 --> 0:36:38.420
<v Speaker 2>plenty of footage of Jewish businesses targeted. There are reports

0:36:38.460 --> 0:36:42.120
<v Speaker 2>that the rioters had lists of people to go after,

0:36:42.219 --> 0:36:46.220
<v Speaker 2>places and streets where there were synagogue and Jewish traders.

0:36:46.820 --> 0:36:49.259
<v Speaker 2>But also I have seen footage where they've gone to

0:36:49.300 --> 0:36:51.299
<v Speaker 2>a store that was run by a Muslim woman and

0:36:51.320 --> 0:36:53.940
<v Speaker 2>she's there in Muslim garb and they're saying, you know,

0:36:53.980 --> 0:36:58.920
<v Speaker 2>she is a sister, do not attack, this business. That's

0:36:58.980 --> 0:37:00.140
<v Speaker 2>also very disturbing.

0:37:01.520 --> 0:37:01.800
<v Speaker 4>Yes.

0:37:01.820 --> 0:37:04.560
<v Speaker 18>What we have here is a story which we're all

0:37:04.600 --> 0:37:07.850
<v Speaker 18>too familiar with. There's an alliance between the hard left.

0:37:08.450 --> 0:37:10.890
<v Speaker 18>It's now called the ultra left. It's funny, you never

0:37:10.950 --> 0:37:13.150
<v Speaker 18>hear about the ultra right. Everything is far right, but

0:37:13.170 --> 0:37:15.549
<v Speaker 18>they're drawing a distinction between the far left and the

0:37:15.650 --> 0:37:20.339
<v Speaker 18>ultra left and the Islamic extremists and those people who

0:37:20.400 --> 0:37:24.520
<v Speaker 18>are dispossessed the ethnic criminal gangs and the ethnic youth

0:37:24.580 --> 0:37:28.469
<v Speaker 18>living in these banlieues, these terrible ghettos, they've all joined

0:37:28.530 --> 0:37:32.009
<v Speaker 18>forces together. We see the same thing happening across Europe.

0:37:32.330 --> 0:37:35.450
<v Speaker 18>If you look in, as you said, they had lists

0:37:35.530 --> 0:37:38.410
<v Speaker 18>of Jewish businesses. As far as I know, no Muslim

0:37:38.450 --> 0:37:41.430
<v Speaker 18>businesses in Paris were attacked here at all. In the

0:37:41.570 --> 0:37:44.360
<v Speaker 18>UK now, there's been a schism within the Islamic community.

0:37:44.640 --> 0:37:47.460
<v Speaker 18>The older Muslims have stuck with the traditional Labour Party,

0:37:47.780 --> 0:37:51.230
<v Speaker 18>but the younger Muslims, the radicals, the Islamists... They have

0:37:51.290 --> 0:37:55.330
<v Speaker 18>basically taken over the Green Party in Britain because they've

0:37:55.350 --> 0:37:58.140
<v Speaker 18>realised on their own these Muslims don't have enough votes

0:37:58.219 --> 0:38:02.560
<v Speaker 18>to get their own candidates into Parliament as independent Muslim MPs.

0:38:03.000 --> 0:38:06.219
<v Speaker 18>They need to ally with the useful idiots, or as

0:38:06.260 --> 0:38:09.320
<v Speaker 18>the Soviets called people in the West who were on

0:38:09.340 --> 0:38:14.890
<v Speaker 18>the left, ally with these Europeans who are useful idiots

0:38:14.910 --> 0:38:16.870
<v Speaker 18>who are our allies, and that way we can get

0:38:16.910 --> 0:38:19.719
<v Speaker 18>more MPs into Parliament. And you're seeing the same thing

0:38:20.280 --> 0:38:23.339
<v Speaker 18>in France now, a deliberate attempt by both the left

0:38:23.580 --> 0:38:24.780
<v Speaker 18>and the Islamic extremists.

0:38:24.840 --> 0:38:25.319
<v Speaker 4>Why is that?

0:38:25.360 --> 0:38:28.740
<v Speaker 18>Because both the left and the Islamists are utopians. They

0:38:28.780 --> 0:38:31.770
<v Speaker 18>both believe in this promised land. But to get there

0:38:32.090 --> 0:38:34.990
<v Speaker 18>requires the death of thousands, if not hundreds of thousands

0:38:35.050 --> 0:38:37.190
<v Speaker 18>or millions. They are both sharing those same sort of

0:38:37.510 --> 0:38:38.410
<v Speaker 18>cultish qualities.

0:38:40.410 --> 0:38:43.049
<v Speaker 2>I want to get your reaction on comments from both

0:38:43.090 --> 0:38:46.710
<v Speaker 2>Hungary and Poland who say that they will not catch

0:38:46.770 --> 0:38:50.390
<v Speaker 2>the French disease. You've got Poland's Donald Tusk saying that

0:38:50.450 --> 0:38:54.330
<v Speaker 2>Poland will not repeat the mistakes of other European countries,

0:38:54.390 --> 0:38:58.049
<v Speaker 2>nor will it pay for them. This is obviously going

0:38:58.070 --> 0:39:00.830
<v Speaker 2>to be a fight at the EU Council in Brussels.

0:39:00.870 --> 0:39:05.690
<v Speaker 2>He vowed to defend the borders, reject asylum applications and

0:39:05.750 --> 0:39:08.260
<v Speaker 2>deport anyone who breaks Polish law.

0:39:10.020 --> 0:39:12.680
<v Speaker 18>Yes, well, of course, you see, the difference between Western

0:39:12.780 --> 0:39:16.319
<v Speaker 18>Europe and Eastern Europe is that Poland and Hungary, these

0:39:16.380 --> 0:39:19.000
<v Speaker 18>countries were wiped from the face of Europe whilst they

0:39:19.040 --> 0:39:22.910
<v Speaker 18>were under communist control. They lost their culture. They lost

0:39:22.930 --> 0:39:29.680
<v Speaker 18>their heritage. They lost their symbols of independence, their parliament, democracy,

0:39:29.700 --> 0:39:30.880
<v Speaker 18>their free speech.

0:39:31.000 --> 0:39:32.580
<v Speaker 4>All their flags went. So they lost.

0:39:32.520 --> 0:39:35.960
<v Speaker 18>Everything that made them distinctively a people. And as soon

0:39:36.120 --> 0:39:40.060
<v Speaker 18>as communism collapsed, they restored their old flags. They restored

0:39:40.100 --> 0:39:42.610
<v Speaker 18>their national anthems. So they know what it's like to

0:39:42.640 --> 0:39:44.790
<v Speaker 18>lose that, and they are determined not to go down

0:39:44.830 --> 0:39:46.950
<v Speaker 18>the path that we did. What happened to us in

0:39:46.969 --> 0:39:49.819
<v Speaker 18>the West is we've taken for granted too long our

0:39:49.880 --> 0:39:52.080
<v Speaker 18>liberties and our freedoms. We don't know what it's like

0:39:52.180 --> 0:39:55.279
<v Speaker 18>actually to suffer invasion. And that's why we've been so

0:39:55.340 --> 0:39:57.840
<v Speaker 18>willing to actually have it. We're the frog in the

0:39:57.880 --> 0:40:02.860
<v Speaker 18>boiling water. My mother is Polish. My ancestor led the

0:40:02.910 --> 0:40:05.130
<v Speaker 18>right flank of the cavalry at the siege of Vienna

0:40:05.690 --> 0:40:09.250
<v Speaker 18>in 1683 that stopped the Turks, the Muslims from coming

0:40:09.270 --> 0:40:12.370
<v Speaker 18>into Europe in 1683. So Poland and Hungary have a

0:40:12.530 --> 0:40:15.790
<v Speaker 18>long history of repelling people who are trying to invade.

0:40:16.190 --> 0:40:18.009
<v Speaker 18>And they don't want to make the same mistake that

0:40:18.050 --> 0:40:19.390
<v Speaker 18>they can see happening in the West.

0:40:21.250 --> 0:40:24.469
<v Speaker 2>A quick comment before we go. We're, what, three weeks

0:40:24.570 --> 0:40:28.470
<v Speaker 2>out now from Remembrance Day. It's a huge day in Britain.

0:40:29.430 --> 0:40:31.200
<v Speaker 2>We commemorate it here in Australia but not to the

0:40:31.239 --> 0:40:34.540
<v Speaker 2>same scale that you do. We tend to favour Anzac

0:40:34.580 --> 0:40:37.200
<v Speaker 2>Day here. But obviously the poppy is a huge symbol.

0:40:37.239 --> 0:40:41.250
<v Speaker 2>We recognise it right around the world. There's a British

0:40:41.489 --> 0:40:46.359
<v Speaker 2>Pakistani doctor who, He suggests that Israel is a cancer.

0:40:46.960 --> 0:40:49.480
<v Speaker 2>And he's now causing headlines over there. He's designed a

0:40:49.540 --> 0:40:53.739
<v Speaker 2>poppy for Remembrance Day, but it's a Palestinian flag on

0:40:53.760 --> 0:40:54.400
<v Speaker 2>the poppy.

0:40:56.060 --> 0:40:58.799
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, I can't think of anything more disrespectful.

0:40:58.840 --> 0:41:02.130
<v Speaker 18>You know, the poppy in Britain, certainly in Canada, I'm

0:41:02.150 --> 0:41:05.450
<v Speaker 18>not quite sure about Australia, but it's a huge symbol

0:41:05.469 --> 0:41:08.390
<v Speaker 18>of national remembrance and unity. And what they've done is

0:41:08.410 --> 0:41:11.170
<v Speaker 18>they've weaponised it and turned it into a sort of

0:41:11.210 --> 0:41:14.690
<v Speaker 18>a badge of protest. You know, they have 364 days

0:41:14.750 --> 0:41:18.090
<v Speaker 18>or 11 months a year to go on about Palestine.

0:41:18.350 --> 0:41:20.990
<v Speaker 18>This is something that is supposed to unite people together.

0:41:21.270 --> 0:41:24.089
<v Speaker 18>But what can you expect from a Palestine movement that

0:41:24.150 --> 0:41:27.029
<v Speaker 18>thinks nothing about, you know, trampling on poppy wreaths? They've

0:41:27.070 --> 0:41:30.279
<v Speaker 18>climbed onto the Battle of Britain Memorial. They've desecrated the

0:41:30.510 --> 0:41:33.740
<v Speaker 18>cenotaph over here. You know, we've lost religion in Britain

0:41:33.760 --> 0:41:35.919
<v Speaker 18>to a great degree. But the one thing that's almost

0:41:36.060 --> 0:41:39.480
<v Speaker 18>become a civic religion is our Remembrance Sunday service. And

0:41:39.739 --> 0:41:41.960
<v Speaker 18>we remember, of course, whether you're from the left or

0:41:41.980 --> 0:41:44.390
<v Speaker 18>the right, all of those who gave their today for

0:41:44.489 --> 0:41:47.009
<v Speaker 18>our tomorrow, to give people the freedom to go on

0:41:47.050 --> 0:41:47.750
<v Speaker 18>these protests.

0:41:48.110 --> 0:41:50.469
<v Speaker 4>And it's caused huge upset over here.

0:41:50.489 --> 0:41:56.029
<v Speaker 2>Ralph Hadle, Mancoo, thank you again for joining me. He's good,

0:41:56.090 --> 0:41:58.580
<v Speaker 2>isn't he? Fabulous historian from Britain that I caught up with.

0:41:59.140 --> 0:42:01.359
<v Speaker 2>In a recent trip, okay, quick break. After the break,

0:42:01.380 --> 0:42:03.180
<v Speaker 2>we'll get into things with the panellists. There's a lot

0:42:03.719 --> 0:42:07.580
<v Speaker 2>of pain for business with small businesses with red tape.

0:42:08.540 --> 0:42:11.799
<v Speaker 2>Let me explain to you just how bad some of

0:42:11.860 --> 0:42:19.759
<v Speaker 2>it is at the moment. All right, let's just bring

0:42:19.780 --> 0:42:22.200
<v Speaker 2>in my panel straight away. Nick Cater, of course, from

0:42:22.219 --> 0:42:26.710
<v Speaker 2>the Menzies Research Centre and Sky News host, or News

0:42:26.710 --> 0:42:29.529
<v Speaker 2>24 host Sunday night, of course, Jamie Rogers. Welcome to

0:42:29.570 --> 0:42:32.570
<v Speaker 2>you both. Nick, I'm going to go to you first.

0:42:32.570 --> 0:42:35.250
<v Speaker 2>$ 25, 000 a year is what we are told by the

0:42:35.310 --> 0:42:40.070
<v Speaker 2>Small Business Ombudsman is the cost of red tape across Australia.

0:42:40.570 --> 0:42:43.990
<v Speaker 2>But what's shocking here, it goes through some detail about

0:42:44.090 --> 0:42:50.570
<v Speaker 2>Australia's anti-slavery obligations. These are just a whole new impost

0:42:50.670 --> 0:42:53.879
<v Speaker 2>on a small business that a poor old baker... has

0:42:53.940 --> 0:42:57.920
<v Speaker 2>to substantiate to government that the flour he uses and

0:42:57.940 --> 0:43:00.500
<v Speaker 2>the milk and the eggs or whatever is not in

0:43:00.540 --> 0:43:05.930
<v Speaker 2>the slave, modern slavery supply chain. I mean, this is

0:43:06.030 --> 0:43:08.130
<v Speaker 2>overkill beyond compare.

0:43:10.230 --> 0:43:11.310
<v Speaker 4>Where will it stop, Peter?

0:43:11.430 --> 0:43:14.680
<v Speaker 1>I think the small business right now is just inundated

0:43:14.739 --> 0:43:18.110
<v Speaker 1>with this stuff. I mean, we've had the workplace laws

0:43:18.140 --> 0:43:21.830
<v Speaker 1>that have come into effect, the same job, same pay,

0:43:23.610 --> 0:43:26.710
<v Speaker 1>the thing about people on temporary employment. We've had all

0:43:26.750 --> 0:43:28.969
<v Speaker 1>the environmental laws that have come in. We've had the

0:43:29.030 --> 0:43:32.569
<v Speaker 1>health and safety. The list goes on and on. And

0:43:32.610 --> 0:43:35.750
<v Speaker 1>it's not one individual piece of legislation that in the

0:43:35.810 --> 0:43:37.770
<v Speaker 1>end is going to push people out of business. It

0:43:37.830 --> 0:43:41.290
<v Speaker 1>is the cumulative effect. I'd be surprised if 25,000 was

0:43:41.330 --> 0:43:43.690
<v Speaker 1>the actual bill. It would be much bigger than that.

0:43:43.770 --> 0:43:46.190
<v Speaker 1>But it's creating a culture where people are just too

0:43:46.250 --> 0:43:49.190
<v Speaker 1>scared to go into business because they just think that

0:43:49.230 --> 0:43:52.939
<v Speaker 1>the burden is too heavy. On that modern slavery thing,

0:43:53.160 --> 0:43:55.839
<v Speaker 1>for instance, if they want to introduce that, maybe they

0:43:55.880 --> 0:43:58.640
<v Speaker 1>can have a look at the solar panels and batteries

0:43:58.700 --> 0:44:02.480
<v Speaker 1>that we're importing because the US is banning them from

0:44:02.540 --> 0:44:06.469
<v Speaker 1>certain countries where they use slave or forced labour. We're

0:44:06.510 --> 0:44:08.670
<v Speaker 1>not looking at that at all. We're just piling it

0:44:08.710 --> 0:44:09.390
<v Speaker 1>on small business.

0:44:11.130 --> 0:44:13.490
<v Speaker 2>Jamie, I know you've been fighting really hard in relation

0:44:13.510 --> 0:44:18.430
<v Speaker 2>to Victoria Barracks in Sydney. Comments today from the RSL

0:44:18.719 --> 0:44:20.960
<v Speaker 2>New South Wales president. Let's listen.

0:44:22.200 --> 0:44:25.239
<v Speaker 19>It has a strong tie to our military. It is

0:44:25.320 --> 0:44:30.560
<v Speaker 19>in a strategic location. The current government obviously feels that

0:44:30.620 --> 0:44:35.180
<v Speaker 19>it's not strategically placed. We must retain ownership of it

0:44:35.560 --> 0:44:39.250
<v Speaker 19>because in five or ten years' time, when people realise

0:44:39.630 --> 0:44:42.650
<v Speaker 19>that it is a strategic asset and it needs to

0:44:42.710 --> 0:44:44.969
<v Speaker 19>be occupied, it will be too late.

0:44:47.120 --> 0:44:49.489
<v Speaker 2>All right, on the screen now will be details about

0:44:49.530 --> 0:44:52.970
<v Speaker 2>a rally this weekend, Jamie. But, you know, the fight

0:44:53.030 --> 0:44:57.569
<v Speaker 2>hasn't gone. Everybody's, in fact, marshalling their army towards this,

0:44:57.630 --> 0:45:00.040
<v Speaker 2>pardon the pun. Are you going to be able to

0:45:00.080 --> 0:45:00.560
<v Speaker 2>win here?

0:45:01.489 --> 0:45:03.709
<v Speaker 13>Well, Peter, I'll tell you what, I'll be out there

0:45:03.910 --> 0:45:06.630
<v Speaker 13>on Sunday and I encourage all of your viewers, if

0:45:06.670 --> 0:45:09.210
<v Speaker 13>you can, come and join us because this government has

0:45:09.250 --> 0:45:10.310
<v Speaker 13>picked the wrong fight.

0:45:10.469 --> 0:45:11.549
<v Speaker 12>We are not going away.

0:45:11.570 --> 0:45:14.470
<v Speaker 13>It is an absolute disgrace that they are now leading

0:45:14.510 --> 0:45:17.210
<v Speaker 13>to this fire sale. I want to know, Peter, why

0:45:17.270 --> 0:45:19.469
<v Speaker 13>this sudden rush? I know they are desperate for money,

0:45:19.810 --> 0:45:23.770
<v Speaker 13>but why do we suddenly need to urgently evacuate or

0:45:23.790 --> 0:45:29.140
<v Speaker 13>eviction all of the army personnel from the site because

0:45:29.180 --> 0:45:32.140
<v Speaker 13>some units, Peter, have nowhere to go. So why this

0:45:32.200 --> 0:45:34.000
<v Speaker 13>sudden rush? Is it because they want us out of

0:45:34.020 --> 0:45:36.160
<v Speaker 13>the headlines? Well, we're not going anywhere.

0:45:38.320 --> 0:45:41.080
<v Speaker 2>Let's go to comments made by Peter Reid, of course,

0:45:41.140 --> 0:45:44.969
<v Speaker 2>an expert in climate science and the Great Barrier Reef

0:45:45.050 --> 0:45:49.230
<v Speaker 2>over the weekend, because there's now calls after an independent

0:45:49.350 --> 0:45:53.610
<v Speaker 2>audit of the Bureau of Meteorology and errors, evidence errors

0:45:53.750 --> 0:45:58.680
<v Speaker 2>in their methodology, for there to be a full-scale inquiry

0:45:59.100 --> 0:46:02.150
<v Speaker 2>into climate data. Here's Peter Ridd.

0:46:03.270 --> 0:46:06.690
<v Speaker 20>It just shows a general complete lack of quality assurance

0:46:07.489 --> 0:46:10.170
<v Speaker 20>in the Bureau of Meteorology, which is much wider. Now,

0:46:10.230 --> 0:46:12.520
<v Speaker 20>what does it mean for the actual climate record? Well,

0:46:12.540 --> 0:46:15.620
<v Speaker 20>they've adjusted a lot of the old temperatures downwards, which

0:46:15.680 --> 0:46:17.860
<v Speaker 20>makes climate change look a little bit worse than it

0:46:17.940 --> 0:46:18.440
<v Speaker 20>really is.

0:46:19.480 --> 0:46:21.400
<v Speaker 4>But it's the quality assurance thing.

0:46:23.380 --> 0:46:25.819
<v Speaker 2>Well, Nick, Tony Abbott says there's too much information out

0:46:25.840 --> 0:46:28.640
<v Speaker 2>there now to ignore. There must be a full and

0:46:28.780 --> 0:46:30.020
<v Speaker 2>independent inquiry.

0:46:31.920 --> 0:46:33.819
<v Speaker 1>Look, I'm sure there's a lot of historical data that

0:46:33.890 --> 0:46:37.250
<v Speaker 1>isn't 100% correct, but it's important that this is because

0:46:37.610 --> 0:46:39.489
<v Speaker 1>they put so much weight on it in terms of

0:46:39.570 --> 0:46:42.710
<v Speaker 1>current policy. If they're going to say we have a

0:46:42.750 --> 0:46:44.850
<v Speaker 1>warming climate, they have to be able to show that

0:46:44.890 --> 0:46:48.280
<v Speaker 1>they have reliable data. This data set is not reliable.

0:46:48.360 --> 0:46:50.540
<v Speaker 1>We do need a full inquiry into what's gone wrong.

0:46:52.560 --> 0:46:55.440
<v Speaker 2>Notwithstanding the fact, of course, we're spending hundreds of billions

0:46:55.520 --> 0:47:00.120
<v Speaker 2>of dollars on climate policies without the data being corrected

0:47:00.200 --> 0:47:02.380
<v Speaker 2>and not seeing any modelling. I'll leave it there. Thank

0:47:02.400 --> 0:47:04.399
<v Speaker 2>you to you both, Jamie and Nick. All right, quick break.

0:47:04.440 --> 0:47:12.880
<v Speaker 2>After the break, the wonderful Kel Richards. Kel Richards, everybody

0:47:12.950 --> 0:47:16.390
<v Speaker 2>loves you. Let's get straight into it. We might start

0:47:16.430 --> 0:47:18.750
<v Speaker 2>tonight with one from Ian, if we can. Where does

0:47:18.770 --> 0:47:22.430
<v Speaker 2>the expression... I don't care two hoots come from.

0:47:23.010 --> 0:47:25.880
<v Speaker 21>Started in the singular. I'm calling it, hang on, I

0:47:25.880 --> 0:47:28.000
<v Speaker 21>don't give two hoots. It's just making it more emphatic.

0:47:28.480 --> 0:47:31.920
<v Speaker 21>It started in America, 1878. And in those days, in

0:47:31.960 --> 0:47:35.620
<v Speaker 21>American slang, a hoot was a very small amount of something,

0:47:35.680 --> 0:47:38.080
<v Speaker 21>a minute amount of something. I only got a hoot

0:47:38.120 --> 0:47:41.540
<v Speaker 21>of whiskey in this glass, that kind of thing. And

0:47:41.600 --> 0:47:44.030
<v Speaker 21>probably because a hoot is a cry or a shout,

0:47:44.239 --> 0:47:46.469
<v Speaker 21>which is very brief. So if you don't give a hoot,

0:47:46.870 --> 0:47:49.370
<v Speaker 21>then you give so little that you don't care at all.

0:47:50.670 --> 0:47:55.360
<v Speaker 2>All right. Milton is asking us about the phrase butter

0:47:55.540 --> 0:47:56.400
<v Speaker 2>wouldn't melt.

0:47:57.180 --> 0:47:59.299
<v Speaker 21>This is a tricky one. It goes back a long

0:47:59.320 --> 0:48:02.319
<v Speaker 21>way to about 1530. It means someone looks gentle and

0:48:02.360 --> 0:48:04.820
<v Speaker 21>innocent when they are not, when they are the opposite.

0:48:05.700 --> 0:48:07.820
<v Speaker 21>And it first turns up in English in a book by,

0:48:09.160 --> 0:48:12.020
<v Speaker 21>what's his name, John Palsgrove, a book about the French language.

0:48:12.100 --> 0:48:14.400
<v Speaker 21>And it's an old French proverb. Now, when we go

0:48:14.440 --> 0:48:16.930
<v Speaker 21>back to proverbs, we are going back into the dim

0:48:16.969 --> 0:48:20.029
<v Speaker 21>and distant past. So who coined the proverb? We don't know.

0:48:20.440 --> 0:48:24.400
<v Speaker 21>But the idea is clearly someone is looking cool, so

0:48:24.480 --> 0:48:27.739
<v Speaker 21>cool that the butter wouldn't melt. But in fact, they're

0:48:27.780 --> 0:48:31.820
<v Speaker 21>boiling inside. But it goes back to the distant French past,

0:48:31.900 --> 0:48:32.180
<v Speaker 21>I think.

0:48:33.940 --> 0:48:38.180
<v Speaker 2>Lion in the sand, Knowles says. Does this expression come

0:48:38.570 --> 0:48:41.570
<v Speaker 2>from the Alamo? That's what he's been told. Is that true?

0:48:42.130 --> 0:48:45.310
<v Speaker 21>Might be. The real answer is we don't know. It

0:48:45.390 --> 0:48:48.469
<v Speaker 21>might come from the Alamo when Colonel William Travis drew

0:48:48.510 --> 0:48:50.700
<v Speaker 21>a lion in the sand. and said to anyone who

0:48:50.739 --> 0:48:53.270
<v Speaker 21>was prepared to die in the Alamo, step across the

0:48:53.310 --> 0:48:55.930
<v Speaker 21>line and join me. And they all did, every single

0:48:55.989 --> 0:48:58.670
<v Speaker 21>one of them. But before that, the Spartans at Thermopylae

0:48:58.969 --> 0:49:01.690
<v Speaker 21>drew a line and said, we won't retreat any further

0:49:01.710 --> 0:49:04.170
<v Speaker 21>than this. There was a Roman general who drew a

0:49:04.190 --> 0:49:08.420
<v Speaker 21>line facing an opponent saying, step across this, you're at

0:49:08.460 --> 0:49:12.739
<v Speaker 21>war with Rome. But the problem is the expression doesn't

0:49:12.760 --> 0:49:16.240
<v Speaker 21>turn up till the 1950s. So how do you connect

0:49:16.640 --> 0:49:19.390
<v Speaker 21>one historical event from the past with something as late

0:49:19.430 --> 0:49:23.379
<v Speaker 21>as the 1950s? It's a puzzle. All right.

0:49:24.000 --> 0:49:28.319
<v Speaker 2>Great effort. See you next week. Thank you, Kel. Thank

0:49:28.340 --> 0:49:30.100
<v Speaker 2>you to you all. See you tomorrow night. Here's Andrew.