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Speaker 1: Today the global toy giants that is taking the world

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Speaker 1: by storm, though that's a fair chance you haven't actually

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Speaker 1: heard of it. I'm Michael Thompson from Fear and Greed

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Speaker 1: Business News, and I'm joined by Stefan from Oldstock Co,

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Speaker 1: the alternative market research that you need to be a

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Speaker 1: better investor. Stefan, Hello, welcome back, Good to see you man. Now,

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Speaker 1: before we get started, obviously, none of this is financial

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Speaker 1: advice or investing advices. Is a starting point for your research,

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Speaker 1: and if you hear something that's relevant to you, then

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Speaker 1: it's always a good idea to get professional advice before

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Speaker 1: making investment decisions. PopMart, this is what we're talking about today.

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Speaker 1: Have I been living under a rock or something? Where

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Speaker 1: did this company come from and how did it get

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Speaker 1: to the size that it is without me being fully

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Speaker 1: aware of it.

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Speaker 2: Well, there's a little country the east, not too many

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Speaker 2: people heard of it. It's called China, and a whole

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Speaker 2: lot of stuff happens there. It turns out that you

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Speaker 2: know the angles far doesn't you know? Usually pay attention

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Speaker 2: to until you know things get really big. Well, PopMart

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Speaker 2: is one of those things. It's starting to get extremely

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Speaker 2: big and people are definitely starting to notice. You know,

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Speaker 2: there's really nothing like this company in the Western world.

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Speaker 2: You know, the Western world has like the Mattel and

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Speaker 2: has Bro, and probably the closest thing to PopMart would

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Speaker 2: be like Funko, right, the makers of Funko Pop. But

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Speaker 2: you know, Popmart's on a whole other scale. I mean,

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Speaker 2: just to put it in perspective, you know, Funko has

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Speaker 2: you know, Funko is is basically one hundred and twenty

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Speaker 2: times less valuable than PopMart. One hundred and twenty times

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Speaker 2: less valuable. They have three stores. PopMart has thousands of stores.

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Speaker 2: So it is really kind of like operating on a

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Speaker 2: whole entirely different scale.

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Speaker 1: So let's rewind then and for people like me, what

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Speaker 1: exactly are they doing, what are they making? What is

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Speaker 1: it about these products, these toys that is just so appealing.

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Speaker 2: Well, both, you know, Funko and PopMart are in the

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Speaker 2: business of basically making figurines, primarily vinyl figurines, right, So

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Speaker 2: if you've seen a Funko Pop, it's just very lightweight, detailed, colorful.

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Speaker 2: That's essentially what PopMart does only does is toys, is

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Speaker 2: vinyl and other you know, toys, figurines, collectibles. What PopMart

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Speaker 2: has done differently though, Like where Funko pop, their approach

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Speaker 2: has always been to like license like crazy, right, yeah,

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Speaker 2: so that's expensive. That means, you know, you're paying a

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Speaker 2: lot of licensing fees and you're using existing IP. It'll

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Speaker 2: sell well because it's recognizable right when you see you know,

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Speaker 2: recognizable figures, but it's not fundamentally yours. PopMart took the

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Speaker 2: opposite approach. They all of their stuff is created by them,

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Speaker 2: so they own the IP. In fact, now that the

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Speaker 2: characters are getting big, they are licensing that IP to

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Speaker 2: other you know, companies and soon to be movies and

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Speaker 2: TV shows and stuff like that. But that's fundamental difference

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Speaker 2: is that they own all of the characters. Now you

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Speaker 2: may not have heard of them. I certainly hadn't heard

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Speaker 2: of them until recently, but you know, there their IP characters.

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Speaker 2: You know, no different than you know Mickey Mouse or

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Speaker 2: anything else.

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Speaker 1: This company, I mean, it only started what in twenty ten,

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Speaker 1: I think it was, And it started just as a

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Speaker 1: single store listed on the Hong Kong Stock Exchange in

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty and here we are in twenty twenty five,

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Speaker 1: and what it's it's bigger than Mattel, bigger than has

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Speaker 1: Bro combined. I think that is that is spectacular growth.

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Speaker 2: It has been. They had an absolutely bonkers twenty twenty

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Speaker 2: four and it really has has been fueled by one

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Speaker 2: particular toy, which is known as the Laboo Boo doll. So,

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Speaker 2: Laboo Boo dolls are kind of like have you ever seen, like,

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Speaker 2: you know, where the Wild Things Are? Ever read that book? Right? Like, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: they kind of look like those kind of characters. They're

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Speaker 2: kind of wild, they're kind of like ugly cute as

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Speaker 2: they call them. Well, these have taken off, especially online,

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Speaker 2: with a lot of influencers and and you know, celebrities

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Speaker 2: and endorsements. The most famous probably is Lisa from the

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Speaker 2: K pop bin Black Pink and also if you watch

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Speaker 2: White Lotus.

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Speaker 1: White Lights, I was gonna says she had a starring

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Speaker 1: role in that show.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, she her star is getting very big and so

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Speaker 2: she's been a huge fan of Laboo Boo dolls and

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Speaker 2: has really promoted them on her Instagram and stuff like that.

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Speaker 2: So this is what's fueling Popmart's net income, which surged

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Speaker 2: you know, one hundred and eighty eight percent in twenty

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Speaker 2: twenty four a year over year, La Boo Boo dolls

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Speaker 2: are up seven hundred and fifteen percent year over year,

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Speaker 2: So they're kind of like the new global obsession for

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Speaker 2: like you know, gen Z and below.

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Speaker 1: I'm not surprised when you say that, because just even

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Speaker 1: in recent days, right, there have been stories in Sydney

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Speaker 1: in Australia where I live, and there are people queued

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Speaker 1: around the block for a store in Sydney at the

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Speaker 1: moment that is selling these La Boo Boo dolls. And

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Speaker 1: that was when I saw this name in recent days,

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Speaker 1: going why are all these people queuing up? And it's

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Speaker 1: because of the release of these whether it's a new

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Speaker 1: release or something, this is huge enthusiasm. Is there a

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Speaker 1: risk though, that it's just kind of a flash in

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Speaker 1: the pan? Is this like as as trends tend to do,

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Speaker 1: they come and go. Is PopMart kind of banking too

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Speaker 1: heavily on ongoing love for these things when it might

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Speaker 1: only be a brief kind of fascination.

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Speaker 2: Well, I think if you're going to create characters and

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Speaker 2: really that really stand the test of time, you've got

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Speaker 2: to make sure that everyone knows who they are. And

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Speaker 2: so Popmart's been doing this in a couple of ways. First,

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Speaker 2: they have, like I said, way more stores than other

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Speaker 2: traditional like toy companies, like way more than Funko. Obviously.

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Speaker 2: You also see them in a lot of vending machines

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Speaker 2: in Asia. There's some in Melbourne actually as well. They're

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Speaker 2: just Popmarke vending machines, and like they're in like high traffic,

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Speaker 2: high foot traffic, highly pedestrinized areas, so that helps the

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Speaker 2: brand as well well. But what's really going to prevent

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Speaker 2: PopMart characters from you know, kind of turning into the

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Speaker 2: next Hello Kiddy or something like that, is they've got

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Speaker 2: to expand beyond just the toys. And that's what they're

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Speaker 2: they're planning on doing, is you know, opening up to

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Speaker 2: mass media, so that means TV movies. That way, people

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Speaker 2: all around the world can really understand these characters and

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Speaker 2: the company can bring these characters to life and create,

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Speaker 2: you know, something that's everlasting value as opposed to a

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Speaker 2: flash in the pan.

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Speaker 1: Something else that they have going for them is this

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Speaker 1: is the concept of blind boxes. And I think this

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Speaker 1: is it is very very clever, this idea that you

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Speaker 1: don't know which toy you're actually going to get when

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Speaker 1: you open it up, It is sealed from the outside,

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Speaker 1: nobody knows what it is until you get it, and

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Speaker 1: so it is really praying on this idea that hey,

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Speaker 1: you might be getting the really rare one that is

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Speaker 1: potentially going to be worth a lot of money.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's it's a concept that's really big in Asia,

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Speaker 2: goes back to Japan and the eighteen high hundreds. But basically,

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Speaker 2: you're right, it's the idea of you know, you're basically

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Speaker 2: getting a mystery pack. Some of the items in the

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Speaker 2: pack won't be that valuable, most will be pretty okay,

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Speaker 2: and some could be spectacular. It's really no different from

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Speaker 2: opening you know, a slab, you know, trading cards or whatever. Right,

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Speaker 2: So it's that sense of like mystery, and like you know,

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Speaker 2: it also plays really well to like social Like I'm

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Speaker 2: not big on watching like the unboxing videos and stuff,

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Speaker 2: but I mean there are thousands of them, like people

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Speaker 2: opening up the mystery boxes.

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Speaker 1: And I've seen them and I haven't certainly haven't gone

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Speaker 1: looking for them, but I have seen these videos of

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Speaker 1: people opening up their opening up their their blind boxes,

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Speaker 1: and just the anticipation of the excitement, I get drawn

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Speaker 1: into it. I get sucked into it, so no wonder

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Speaker 1: these things are taking off, and even my kids. It's

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Speaker 1: not with the PopMart toys as some other ones, and

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Speaker 1: a lot of these brands are doing it now at

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Speaker 1: this idea of blind boxes, and it's actually kind of addictive.

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Speaker 2: It's definitely like, I'm in the minority. I can't think

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Speaker 2: of a worse way to spend twenty minutes than watching

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Speaker 2: someone on YouTube open a package or a gift or whatever.

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Speaker 1: But no, no, no, fast forward to the end. I'm like,

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Speaker 1: come on, come on, come on, come on, there we go,

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Speaker 1: that's what's in it and move on to the next one.

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Speaker 2: Even the payoff as a big I personally could kill it.

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Speaker 2: But look, I'm in the minority here. I mean, this

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Speaker 2: stuff is big. You're right, and you should definitely understand that.

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Speaker 2: If you're going to understand this company, it's a big

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Speaker 2: part of what they do with the blind boxes.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Absolutely, Now you mentioned that they are they have stores,

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Speaker 1: they've also got vending machines. They are obviously very big

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Speaker 1: in Asia. Are we seeing more stores opening in the

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Speaker 1: US Australia? Kind of what is the rollout kind of

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Speaker 1: strategy the retail strategy here for that and is there

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Speaker 1: a risk as well of kind of trying to go

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Speaker 1: too hard, too fast into markets like Australia, where obviously

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Speaker 1: if they're going to have dedicated stores, that's an expensive process.

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Speaker 2: I wouldn't worry about their ability to go too hard,

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Speaker 2: too fast. I would. I do think it's going to

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Speaker 2: be a challenge though, to enter the American market, specifically

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Speaker 2: just culturally. It's not obviously the brands aren't as strong,

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Speaker 2: the characters aren't as strong. Yet, that takes time. I

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Speaker 2: think that, you know, PopMart is definitely serious about the market.

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Speaker 2: They've added like hundreds of employees now that work in America.

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Speaker 2: It's link LinkedIn is showing they have twenty two stores,

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Speaker 2: thirty nine robo shops in California, you know, New York.

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Speaker 2: But you know it won't be it won't be easy,

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Speaker 2: It won't be a cakewalk. Also that the tariffs kind

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Speaker 2: of play into things a little bit. I don't pretend

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Speaker 2: to know you. Depending on the date of this recording,

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Speaker 2: that could all change tomorrow.

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Speaker 1: Who knows absolutely, But you would think it as a

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Speaker 1: currently major challenge for them. If they're importing goods from China,

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Speaker 1: which is where these are developed, produced, manufactured.

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Speaker 2: It certainly won't make things easier, that's for sure. I

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Speaker 2: don't pretend to know the ins and outs of exactly

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Speaker 2: how it's going to affect things. But I think the

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Speaker 2: bigger thing is kind of just more like the awareness,

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Speaker 2: you know, I mean, brands take time to develop. But again,

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Speaker 2: I think what could really help is if they can

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Speaker 2: get a couple of movies. Although you know those are

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Speaker 2: getting tariff now too, so who knows, But if they

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Speaker 2: can get some TV shows and movies and get them,

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Speaker 2: you know, globally, you know, that could really boost the

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Speaker 2: character awareness and boost the sales.

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Speaker 1: Okay, So really it comes down to it's really almost

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Speaker 1: a marketing challenge for them, then, isn't it just to

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Speaker 1: actually get that that name, that brand, those images and

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Speaker 1: if you, as you say, it is making the characters

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Speaker 1: become part of people's lives. And since they own the IP,

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Speaker 1: then that's their ticket to success.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, they may have already kind of like

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Speaker 2: peaked in a way, like they don't really need like

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Speaker 2: the American market to just be a huge, like thriving

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Speaker 2: company for decades. So if they can't crack it, it's

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Speaker 2: not like the company's you know, going to blow up.

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Speaker 2: Or go to zero or anything like that. But if

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Speaker 2: they can crack it, yeah, I mean, it'll definitely put

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Speaker 2: a dent in a lot of it. Ip rather from

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Speaker 2: you know, Mattelan has Bro and that, especially with the

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Speaker 2: younger gener and so that's why it's important to understand

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Speaker 2: these these new characters who they are and like kind

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Speaker 2: of like what their personalities are and stuff like that,

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Speaker 2: because you know, they kind of do have competition in

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Speaker 2: a way, right for eyeballs for attention from younger generations.

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Speaker 2: So it'll be very interesting to watch.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, last question, because I mean I can't miss the

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Speaker 1: opportunity to ask you about the secondary market kind of

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Speaker 1: assuming the expansion is successful into the US and other markets,

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Speaker 1: even if it's not. Kind of, what's the value here

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Speaker 1: is it in some of the rarity of the toys

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Speaker 1: for the secondary market people kind of buying and selling

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Speaker 1: these things. If you do find a rare one is

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Speaker 1: sitting on a gold mine kind of what's the opportunity here?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there's definitely rare pieces, and there's definitely you know,

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Speaker 2: a scarcity element with some of the most in demand pieces.

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Speaker 2: I mean, so like you know, I wouldn't definitely consider

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Speaker 2: this investment grade by any stretch, right, But if you

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Speaker 2: are a collector and you are looking to add your collection,

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Speaker 2: there's definitely you know, grails out there. Really the first

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Speaker 2: wild things Laboo Boo dolls, those seem to be the

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Speaker 2: ones that are you know, garnering the highest prices on

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Speaker 2: secondary markets. And you know a lot of it's like

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Speaker 2: kind of hype driven too. There's there's a lot of

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Speaker 2: trends and fads and stuff like that. But the stuff

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Speaker 2: produced between two thousand and six twenty twelve, maybe twenty

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Speaker 2: seventeen at the latest. You know, the legacy kind of IP,

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Speaker 2: those characters, they they're holding the value quite well.

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Speaker 1: So basically we can say if you haven't heard of

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Speaker 1: Laboo Boo dolls, if you were in the minority like

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Speaker 1: I was, chances are you will be hearing about them

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Speaker 1: very soon.

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Speaker 2: That's a safe bet, and hopefully you heard about them

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Speaker 2: through through us.

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Speaker 1: Right here, absolutely absolutely now. To find out more, you

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Speaker 1: can head to altz dot co, sign up to the newsletter.

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Speaker 1: This episode is based on an edition of that newsletter,

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Speaker 1: and start learning about the future of alternative investing. Thank

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Speaker 1: you very much the fun Thanks Michael. Michael Thompson from

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Speaker 1: fear and great business news for people to make their

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Speaker 1: own decisions. Thanks for your company