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Speaker 1: Five Double A Nights with Matthew Pantalas you know yesterday

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Speaker 1: a teen h boy this morning rather charged with rape

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Speaker 1: after a homeless woman was assaulted at Hawthorne. The sixty

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Speaker 1: four year old allegedly set upon while sleeping rough just

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Speaker 1: near the Mitcham Library. The seventeen year old boy from

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Speaker 1: Parkside charged with causing serious harm to another person serious

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Speaker 1: criminal trespass after a series of breakings and businesses along

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Speaker 1: Belair Road leading up to the assault. The woman in

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Speaker 1: a serious but stable condition in hospital now. And it

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Speaker 1: just shows what we all know it the vulnerabilities of

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Speaker 1: people sleeping rough on our streets. Chris Burns, CEO Hunt

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Speaker 1: Street Center on the line, Chris, just a despicable attack.

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Speaker 1: But no doubt you'd probably have heard stories from people

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Speaker 1: coming to the Hunt Street Center for help over the years.

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Speaker 2: Certainly, Matthew, that is the case. A tragic story. This

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Speaker 2: is a dear lady who may well be someone's mother

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Speaker 2: or even grandmother, and for some reason, and it happens

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Speaker 2: too often these days, she's in a position where she

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Speaker 2: has nowhere else to stay at night but to sleep rough,

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Speaker 2: and to be confronted with this is just disgusting and

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Speaker 2: a bad reflection on our society. I can't talk to

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Speaker 2: the case because no knowledge.

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Speaker 1: No that's right, and we should anyway because before the

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Speaker 1: courts and all that, but just despicable.

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Speaker 2: But we've seen a very concerning increase in people generally

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Speaker 2: experiencing homelessness, and just the last four years alone since

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Speaker 2: COVID concluded, we've seen a forty two percent growth in

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Speaker 2: demand for our services in our well Being center. But

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Speaker 2: what is more concerning is in that same four hyperiod

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Speaker 2: we've seen a seventy seven percent and growth in females

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Speaker 2: accessing our services. That's a huge jump, and that's a

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Speaker 2: reflection of the cost of living crisis and the housing

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Speaker 2: crisis that we've got that we don't have enough emergency

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Speaker 2: accommodation or social housing to allow people to not have

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Speaker 2: to sleep on the street.

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Speaker 1: And you know, years ago you'd never see a woman

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Speaker 1: in this situation. But as you say, increasing numbers and

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Speaker 1: those stats are frightening really just in terms of the

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Speaker 1: numbers now it is.

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Speaker 2: And you know, there's the other very sad part of

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Speaker 2: it is that the level of domestic and family violence involved,

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Speaker 2: and the one thing you want to do when someone

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Speaker 2: comes seeking your support when they've been exposed to domestic

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Speaker 2: and family violence is if you don't want them to

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Speaker 2: go back on the street or back into an unsafe situation.

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Speaker 2: And we had a situation last week and Melbourne Cup

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Speaker 2: Pay was on Tuesday. It's a day we know there's

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Speaker 2: increased domestic and family violence for reasons we'll all understand.

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Speaker 2: On Wednesday, we had one poor lady coming and that

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Speaker 2: was the night of a very significant concert in the

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Speaker 2: town and we absolutely could not get any emergency accommodation

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Speaker 2: for her at all. Every hotel was booked out, all

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Speaker 2: the costs of a room was so extreme it just

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Speaker 2: couldn't be achieved. And unfortunately we had to take this

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Speaker 2: lady back to her to a family residence. We weren't

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Speaker 2: sure of her safety. But we've got to be able

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Speaker 2: to ensure that dear ladies like this aren't in that position,

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Speaker 2: that there is an emergency accommodation available. Regardless of the demand.

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Speaker 2: We would never want to see things like big concerts

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Speaker 2: or car races or whatever not happen big rate society

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Speaker 2: and for the state, but we do have to think

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Speaker 2: of this growing demand that we have for people who

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Speaker 2: for often reasons that they're no doing it, but that

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Speaker 2: wasn't of their doing. They're in this very unfortunate system

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Speaker 2: where they're forced to go and sleep on the street.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, just unreal. So would that be the first

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Speaker 1: time you've had to turn someone away in those circumstances.

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Speaker 1: I know you recently were talking about the demand growing

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Speaker 1: to the point you'd have to start doing that, not

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Speaker 1: being able to take on any more people.

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Speaker 2: Well, it is, and it's totally against our ethics to

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Speaker 2: turn anyone away, and we felt we did the very

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Speaker 2: very best on that night to place this person in

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Speaker 2: the safest place. Whatever it was, it was better than

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Speaker 2: the circumstance is of sleeping on the street. Particularly for

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Speaker 2: women at night, they don't sleep, and quite often we

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Speaker 2: find that if they've been rough sleeping for a while,

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Speaker 2: they're attracted to alcohol and drugs because that allows them

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Speaker 2: to stay awake because they're so scared of being asleep

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Speaker 2: at night and being attacked. And so when you get

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Speaker 2: to that level, your physical health diminishes significantly, and with that,

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Speaker 2: your mental health diminishes significantly, which just becomes another barrier

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Speaker 2: to getting out of homelessness. And what we've got to

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Speaker 2: find is more social housing. When we raise the issue

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Speaker 2: of homelessness, we keep getting told, but we're building lots more,

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Speaker 2: thousands and thousands of more affordable homes for our clients

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Speaker 2: for the homeless, and affordable home is a middle class issue.

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Speaker 2: There'll never be in a position to buy all rents

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Speaker 2: and affordable home. What we need to do is focus

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Speaker 2: on social housing, and that's government owned or controlled housing

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Speaker 2: where there's subsidized rentals.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's true, gets hard, isn't it. So it is

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Speaker 1: increasing numbers, as we know. And again, years ago you

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Speaker 1: wouldn't see too many people sleeping rough and these days

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Speaker 1: there are. You know, it almost feels like there are

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Speaker 1: people on just about every doorway, every corner. And it's

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Speaker 1: where we're at as a society today, and it's just terrible.

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Speaker 1: I don't know what we do about it. Ultimately, the housing,

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Speaker 1: as you say, but not enough to cope.

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Speaker 2: Well, I gave you the statistics of the growth that

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Speaker 2: we're experiencing. And the sad thing is we don't see

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Speaker 2: any solution to the cost of living or housing crisis

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Speaker 2: in the near future. And extrapolated our trends out and

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Speaker 2: we've identified that our Wellbeing Center we're capped, we're not

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Speaker 2: allowed to expand at our current facility, so we know

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Speaker 2: that by the end of twenty twenty eight we're probably

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Speaker 2: we're going to have to have another well being center established,

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Speaker 2: and already we're looking at that option and highly likely

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Speaker 2: that that facility will have to be a designated gender

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Speaker 2: specific for women and children only, because that's where the

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Speaker 2: demand is increasing. The challenge for us is our wellbeing center,

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Speaker 2: which is if you imagine it's the emergency department for

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Speaker 2: the homeless in Adelaide. It's the first point they come to.

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Speaker 2: It's where they get that point of triage, a hot

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Speaker 2: meal or shower, a change of clothes, and then eventually

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Speaker 2: joined up with a case manager. That wellbeing center we

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Speaker 2: rely solely on the generosity of South Australians to donate,

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Speaker 2: be it money or material or their own time as

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Speaker 2: volunteers to keep that place open. So if we're looking

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Speaker 2: at expanding or creating another well being center, we have

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Speaker 2: to find a source of resources to operate that all

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Speaker 2: in an environment where it's harder and harder for people

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Speaker 2: to donate to charities and it's more and more difficult,

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Speaker 2: so it's a real challenge of doing trying to do

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Speaker 2: more with less at the moment. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely. Look, I know you can't speak for Catherine House,

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Speaker 1: and I don't expect you to, but I do wonder

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Speaker 1: if this lady had tried there. I mean, this is

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Speaker 1: a homeless shelter for women in exactly the situation. I

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Speaker 1: just wonder how overwhelmed they are as well. And they

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Speaker 1: wouldn't be any different, I imagine.

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Speaker 2: I'm sure Katherine House wouldn't mind me. I know that

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Speaker 2: they are always full, and they always have a wait list,

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Speaker 2: and they do provide that intermediate accommodation before housing occurs.

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Speaker 2: But normally, if people are rough sleeping, they're going to

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Speaker 2: come to our facility, which is as I said that

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Speaker 2: ed or West Care over on Wimore Square. They're the

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Speaker 2: two facilities where we do that primary care, that immediate triage,

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Speaker 2: stabilize people and get them ready to go to people

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Speaker 2: like Catherine House or Vineys or various other support services.

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Speaker 2: But they're all full. That's the story is there's nowhere

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Speaker 2: for people to go, and we have to address that

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Speaker 2: issue because it's not going to get any better in

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Speaker 2: the near future.

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Speaker 1: Is that the immediate concern, then the immediate demand is

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Speaker 1: you know, if government can do anything, and there's lots

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Speaker 1: of government can do. You know, Tom kotzantanas some five

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Speaker 1: double a breakfast just yesterday morning saying, you know, we

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Speaker 1: have contingencies in the state budget for emergencies, and he

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Speaker 1: cited Wayela as you know, something that popped up, and

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Speaker 1: you know other things too. So is that emergency housing

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Speaker 1: the number one priority?

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Speaker 2: It is is having emergency accommodation dedicated for people who

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Speaker 2: are either at risk of or even experiencing homelessness, but

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Speaker 2: also focusing more on social housing as opposed to affordable housing.

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Speaker 2: I think less than four percent of the housing stock

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Speaker 2: in the state is social housing, but with the numbers increasing,

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Speaker 2: the demand is just increasing and there has to be

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Speaker 2: that flow through if you could imagine through our facility,

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Speaker 2: then into organizations like Catherine House and Venus and then

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Speaker 2: on to social housing. Well, if that social housing is

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Speaker 2: not there, there's a backlog, and that causes people to

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Speaker 2: can be held still rough, sleeping on the street. And

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Speaker 2: the longer they are on the street, virtually by the day,

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Speaker 2: the worse it gets for them because, as I said,

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Speaker 2: the physical their mental health declines, they get drawn towards drugs,

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Speaker 2: and alcohol, and then getting them out of homelessness becomes

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Speaker 2: more and more difficult by the day.

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Speaker 1: That's right, how long would you say are you aware of?

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Speaker 1: And there are people who perhaps don't want housing, but

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Speaker 1: of those who do, who are you know? Let you

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Speaker 1: you speak to at the center. What's the longest they've

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Speaker 1: been on the streets against their will?

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Speaker 2: Oh? Look it's years. There who have been on the

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Speaker 2: rough sleeping for years. And I'll be very honest with you, Matthew,

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Speaker 2: I've never had one client say to me I don't

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Speaker 2: want I don't want a roof over my head. I

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Speaker 2: don't want housing. They all do want some form of

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Speaker 2: roof over their head. It's just getting on that list

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Speaker 2: and getting allocated is so difficult. And if you know

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Speaker 2: you're a young and middle aged man at the moment,

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Speaker 2: your chances of getting out of rough sleeping into accommodation

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Speaker 2: is very very limited, which means they rely on our

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Speaker 2: services a lot longer, And so we keep caring for

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Speaker 2: them and trying to find other ways. And there's other

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Speaker 2: things that we can look at besides the expensive option

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Speaker 2: of building more houses. For example, if you look at

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Speaker 2: the CBD of Adelaide in Adelaide. There are ten thousand

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Speaker 2: private residences, privately owned residences. Two thousand of those are empty.

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Speaker 2: And if you could free up and make a way

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Speaker 2: that the people who own those private residences are incentivized

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Speaker 2: to make those accommodateations available for people like the homeless,

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Speaker 2: you know, we could almost solve rough sleeping in a

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Speaker 2: very short period of time.

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Speaker 1: He's talking in the CBD.

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Speaker 2: Just in the CBDA two.

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Speaker 1: Thousand vacant houses or apartments or.

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Speaker 2: Whatever it's there is a private residence of some sort.

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Speaker 2: Then that's not my figures. That's a firm called prop Track.

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Speaker 2: If you go to the twenty twenty one census, on

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Speaker 2: the night of the census in South Australia, there was

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Speaker 2: eighty four thousand vacant privately owned residences in South Australia.

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Speaker 2: Goods their holiday homes, the B and b's their properties

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Speaker 2: being renovated. But there's a lot of land making going on.

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Speaker 2: People who simply buy property up for the purpose of

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Speaker 2: an investment, hold onto it for a few years, don't

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Speaker 2: want to bother us renting it out and then sell

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Speaker 2: it off. Well, if we could make it attractive to

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Speaker 2: the owners of those properties to rent them out. And

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Speaker 2: my experience is that a landlord has two concerns with

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Speaker 2: having a person experiencing homelessness in their houses. They won't

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Speaker 2: pay the rent and they'll do damage. Well for the

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Speaker 2: most of them that they're on some full of welfare,

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Speaker 2: so you can support them through paying their rent, but

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Speaker 2: recognize you're going to have to subsidize their rent anyway,

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Speaker 2: so why not guarantee it? And we find with the

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Speaker 2: vast majority of people we work with is once they

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Speaker 2: get accommodation, they're highly unlikely to damage it because they

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Speaker 2: want to keep it. And if you provide some sort

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Speaker 2: of underwriting of the landlord's insurance that if there is damage,

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Speaker 2: it's ensured, you can appease that the landlord's concerns to

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Speaker 2: a degree. So I think we have to look at

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Speaker 2: other options besides just building more houses or more accommodation,

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Speaker 2: because that's tens of years away, and the issue is

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Speaker 2: with us right now immediately, and last night's tragic situation has.

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Speaker 1: Brought that to the front of our Absolutely just terrible. Chris,

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Speaker 1: appreciate your time tonight and those insights. Thank you, Thank

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Speaker 1: you all the best. Chris Burned, CEO hut Street center.

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Speaker 1: It's just so sad, and this woman she shouldn't have

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Speaker 1: been there as not her fault. It's just not enough accommodation.

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Speaker 1: And you know what of all the things state governments

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Speaker 1: do do and spend money on, and I get the

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Speaker 1: bread and circus, the Adelaide five hundred, and the lift

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Speaker 1: gulfs and the gather rounds and all of that, and

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Speaker 1: they have their place. There is a place for those events.

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Speaker 1: But surely in all of that we can find enough

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Speaker 1: money to find homes for what a thousand people two

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Speaker 1: thousand who are rough sleeping around the place. Surely we can.

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Speaker 1: In a country like Australia, in a state like South Australia,

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Speaker 1: surely we can