1
00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:04,600
Speaker 1: This episode of Headgame was recorded on gadigal land Is.

2
00:00:04,680 --> 00:00:09,080
Speaker 2: August twenty nineteen. Matt Caldwell, better known to music fans

3
00:00:09,119 --> 00:00:12,400
Speaker 2: of three point sixty, is grappling with anxiety and depression.

4
00:00:13,320 --> 00:00:16,880
Speaker 2: He spent years self medicating with alcohol and painkillers, and

5
00:00:17,000 --> 00:00:20,800
Speaker 2: multiple stints in rehabit. It's left him without the motivation

6
00:00:20,880 --> 00:00:25,880
Speaker 2: to even shower or brush his teeth. Despite three top

7
00:00:25,920 --> 00:00:29,360
Speaker 2: ten albums, a string of hit singles, and sellout shows

8
00:00:29,360 --> 00:00:32,760
Speaker 2: across the country, three point sixty is stuck in a rut.

9
00:00:33,720 --> 00:00:37,200
Speaker 2: Seeking help from his GP. He receives a blunt assessment

10
00:00:37,240 --> 00:00:42,320
Speaker 2: that changes his life. His doctor labels him a fat junkie.

11
00:00:42,920 --> 00:00:46,040
Speaker 2: Those brutal words help shock the musician out of his

12
00:00:46,120 --> 00:00:49,159
Speaker 2: spibal and seek the help he needs to get his

13
00:00:49,200 --> 00:00:55,800
Speaker 2: life back on track. I'm at Middleton and this is

14
00:00:55,920 --> 00:01:00,600
Speaker 2: head Game today. Three sixty on how he got himself

15
00:01:00,640 --> 00:01:08,720
Speaker 2: out of a dark place and back into the spotlight. Matt,

16
00:01:08,760 --> 00:01:10,200
Speaker 2: thanks ever so much for coming on.

17
00:01:10,280 --> 00:01:10,480
Speaker 3: Now.

18
00:01:10,520 --> 00:01:13,720
Speaker 2: You've got quite the story mate, from being a rapper

19
00:01:14,160 --> 00:01:17,120
Speaker 2: to the highs in front of thousands of people's to

20
00:01:17,240 --> 00:01:21,559
Speaker 2: the loads of addiction. First and foremost, did you grow

21
00:01:21,640 --> 00:01:24,840
Speaker 2: up always wanting to be a musician, always wanting to

22
00:01:24,840 --> 00:01:27,039
Speaker 2: be a rapper because I come from that sort of

23
00:01:27,080 --> 00:01:30,640
Speaker 2: eighties nineties era where you know, R and B and

24
00:01:30,800 --> 00:01:33,400
Speaker 2: rap was really coming through, and you know, I suppose

25
00:01:33,400 --> 00:01:35,800
Speaker 2: everyone wanted to be a sort of rapper at that age.

26
00:01:36,520 --> 00:01:38,720
Speaker 2: How did it come about? And what was your childhood

27
00:01:38,760 --> 00:01:39,360
Speaker 2: like growing up?

28
00:01:40,520 --> 00:01:44,520
Speaker 1: So my first dream was to be a basketballer.

29
00:01:44,760 --> 00:01:46,440
Speaker 2: Do you know what when you walked in, I saw

30
00:01:46,440 --> 00:01:49,120
Speaker 2: you and I thought, the guy's tall. You know you've

31
00:01:49,160 --> 00:01:51,360
Speaker 2: got that You've got that basketball look about you make it?

32
00:01:51,440 --> 00:01:54,240
Speaker 1: If I'm being honest, although I had no hops. I

33
00:01:54,240 --> 00:01:54,880
Speaker 1: couldn't jump.

34
00:01:55,120 --> 00:01:56,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, there you go at all.

35
00:01:56,680 --> 00:01:58,240
Speaker 1: But I cannot jump.

36
00:01:58,480 --> 00:02:04,240
Speaker 4: So my upbringing come from a very close, tight middle

37
00:02:04,240 --> 00:02:05,080
Speaker 4: class family.

38
00:02:06,760 --> 00:02:07,240
Speaker 1: My dad.

39
00:02:07,280 --> 00:02:10,000
Speaker 4: I started playing basketball when I was five and my dad,

40
00:02:10,440 --> 00:02:13,600
Speaker 4: my dad loved basketball and he was like, I'm going

41
00:02:13,639 --> 00:02:17,880
Speaker 4: to turn him into a professional basketball player. So from

42
00:02:17,919 --> 00:02:20,720
Speaker 4: the age of five, me and him would just join

43
00:02:20,800 --> 00:02:23,760
Speaker 4: at the hip and he was he was. He taught

44
00:02:23,760 --> 00:02:29,480
Speaker 4: me how to work hard. We Yeah, it was everything

45
00:02:29,800 --> 00:02:32,480
Speaker 4: to me. I lived and breathed that. I was obsessed

46
00:02:32,520 --> 00:02:33,000
Speaker 4: with it.

47
00:02:32,960 --> 00:02:36,720
Speaker 2: And obsessed with basketball, basketball, and was just obsessed with

48
00:02:36,760 --> 00:02:39,240
Speaker 2: your father as well. Was there like a great connection there.

49
00:02:39,360 --> 00:02:40,959
Speaker 2: Did you did you push your mum out or was

50
00:02:41,000 --> 00:02:42,919
Speaker 2: it just a father and something?

51
00:02:43,400 --> 00:02:44,440
Speaker 1: It was a deep bond.

52
00:02:45,480 --> 00:02:48,040
Speaker 4: It was more a father and something, but the whole

53
00:02:48,080 --> 00:02:51,560
Speaker 4: family was involved, so we were all very tight in

54
00:02:51,560 --> 00:02:56,640
Speaker 4: that regard and it, Yeah, I very much was like

55
00:02:57,360 --> 00:02:59,960
Speaker 4: I loved my dad so much that I wanted his

56
00:03:00,080 --> 00:03:02,679
Speaker 4: approval for everything. So it was like that was a

57
00:03:02,720 --> 00:03:05,320
Speaker 4: way to get it was by focusing on basketball, but

58
00:03:05,360 --> 00:03:07,600
Speaker 4: I wanted to do it at the same time. But

59
00:03:07,680 --> 00:03:09,480
Speaker 4: I think when it got probably got to when I

60
00:03:09,520 --> 00:03:13,720
Speaker 4: was about probably late teens, is when I started to

61
00:03:14,120 --> 00:03:16,480
Speaker 4: drift away and realize that it probably wasn't for me.

62
00:03:16,800 --> 00:03:18,520
Speaker 4: But I didn't want to break my dad's heart at

63
00:03:18,520 --> 00:03:19,200
Speaker 4: the same time.

64
00:03:19,760 --> 00:03:21,560
Speaker 2: So you were trying to make him happy at the

65
00:03:21,600 --> 00:03:24,440
Speaker 2: same time as doing something that you loved. But when

66
00:03:24,440 --> 00:03:27,399
Speaker 2: you were sort of growing out of love with what

67
00:03:27,440 --> 00:03:30,440
Speaker 2: you were doing, you still wanted to keep that your

68
00:03:30,440 --> 00:03:32,920
Speaker 2: father happy, right, And I suppose every child does that,

69
00:03:33,000 --> 00:03:36,320
Speaker 2: especially every boy. You know, your father's your hero, You

70
00:03:36,360 --> 00:03:38,480
Speaker 2: look up to him, you want to make him happy,

71
00:03:38,480 --> 00:03:40,280
Speaker 2: and sometimes that can be at your detriment.

72
00:03:40,560 --> 00:03:43,520
Speaker 4: Yeah, man, Yeah, well said he was like a god

73
00:03:43,560 --> 00:03:46,800
Speaker 4: to me, and he was a superhero, Like I just

74
00:03:46,920 --> 00:03:52,160
Speaker 4: idolized him so much. And then like he had been

75
00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:55,200
Speaker 4: just instilling this work ethic into me. So like before

76
00:03:55,240 --> 00:03:58,360
Speaker 4: school we go to through this special training at six

77
00:03:58,400 --> 00:04:01,280
Speaker 4: point thirty before school. Then after school we'd do all

78
00:04:01,280 --> 00:04:02,640
Speaker 4: these drills and stuff like that.

79
00:04:02,720 --> 00:04:05,120
Speaker 2: Oh so you'd get up early early before he went

80
00:04:05,160 --> 00:04:05,640
Speaker 2: to school.

81
00:04:05,800 --> 00:04:08,240
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, And I probably didn't want to be doing that,

82
00:04:08,320 --> 00:04:11,040
Speaker 4: but it was like he was like, if you if

83
00:04:11,080 --> 00:04:14,560
Speaker 4: you want something this badly, this is the kind of

84
00:04:14,640 --> 00:04:16,039
Speaker 4: work that you have to do to do it.

85
00:04:16,800 --> 00:04:18,760
Speaker 2: And he done. He was doing what he's putting in

86
00:04:18,760 --> 00:04:19,520
Speaker 2: the work with you.

87
00:04:19,600 --> 00:04:23,560
Speaker 4: Yeah, but it's wild because he was working full time

88
00:04:23,600 --> 00:04:26,120
Speaker 4: as well, so he was like he was doing a

89
00:04:26,200 --> 00:04:29,680
Speaker 4: job that he couldn't stand. He was an accountant, but

90
00:04:29,800 --> 00:04:34,760
Speaker 4: he was just just sacrificing his soul to provide for me,

91
00:04:34,960 --> 00:04:39,400
Speaker 4: my mother and my brother because he came from poverty

92
00:04:39,560 --> 00:04:42,080
Speaker 4: and he wanted us to have a life that he

93
00:04:42,120 --> 00:04:45,560
Speaker 4: didn't and he just man, he was such a gun

94
00:04:45,560 --> 00:04:47,800
Speaker 4: in that he's still a gun man. He's like he's

95
00:04:48,279 --> 00:04:52,880
Speaker 4: he's eighty, so he's quite old and he's pretty frail now.

96
00:04:52,920 --> 00:04:57,040
Speaker 4: But you're not what you'd imagine, not what you would

97
00:04:57,040 --> 00:05:00,239
Speaker 4: imagine someone at eighty, like he's still going every day

98
00:05:00,320 --> 00:05:03,560
Speaker 4: like he's a Machine's just constantly working around the house

99
00:05:03,600 --> 00:05:06,240
Speaker 4: and just doing things like he's a He's a very

100
00:05:06,240 --> 00:05:07,080
Speaker 4: impressive man.

101
00:05:08,160 --> 00:05:10,360
Speaker 1: But along along this journey, like.

102
00:05:10,360 --> 00:05:18,080
Speaker 4: At about fourteen, I started skateboarding. I really looked up

103
00:05:18,120 --> 00:05:20,840
Speaker 4: to the to the to the boys that we skated with,

104
00:05:20,880 --> 00:05:23,760
Speaker 4: the older dudes, and they were all listening to rap

105
00:05:24,160 --> 00:05:25,240
Speaker 4: and hip hop and stuff.

106
00:05:25,279 --> 00:05:29,200
Speaker 1: So that was my introduction to rap music and hip hop.

107
00:05:29,680 --> 00:05:31,320
Speaker 2: And so it was at the park while she was

108
00:05:31,360 --> 00:05:34,800
Speaker 2: skating and just listening to your mate's music.

109
00:05:34,920 --> 00:05:38,160
Speaker 1: And yeah, very much like that, like hanging around them.

110
00:05:38,880 --> 00:05:40,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that's what you do. Like you'd hang around

111
00:05:40,680 --> 00:05:44,320
Speaker 2: the park, you know, you all skate and get up

112
00:05:44,320 --> 00:05:47,000
Speaker 2: to a bit of mischief and listen to music and

113
00:05:47,000 --> 00:05:48,919
Speaker 2: pretend you were that rapper or whatever it may be.

114
00:05:49,000 --> 00:05:51,760
Speaker 2: But I understand the ear that you talk about, because

115
00:05:51,760 --> 00:05:53,600
Speaker 2: that was the same ear as me. You know, we

116
00:05:53,720 --> 00:05:55,880
Speaker 2: go to the park and be rap music playing, and

117
00:05:56,279 --> 00:05:58,600
Speaker 2: you know, you're just and then you'd wear your track

118
00:05:58,680 --> 00:06:01,400
Speaker 2: suits and you know you just the impudence by that world,

119
00:06:01,400 --> 00:06:01,800
Speaker 2: wouldn't you.

120
00:06:01,920 --> 00:06:05,520
Speaker 1: Oh man, I got swallowed by it. I was like

121
00:06:05,560 --> 00:06:07,799
Speaker 1: a really innocent.

122
00:06:08,920 --> 00:06:11,760
Speaker 4: Kid from a good family, and because I was trying

123
00:06:11,800 --> 00:06:15,440
Speaker 4: to fit in with that world, I started pretending like

124
00:06:15,520 --> 00:06:17,960
Speaker 4: I wasn't from that. Like I started act shaving my

125
00:06:18,040 --> 00:06:20,520
Speaker 4: head and like wearing like just thinking I.

126
00:06:20,440 --> 00:06:22,600
Speaker 1: Was a gangster, you know, and I never was.

127
00:06:22,880 --> 00:06:26,680
Speaker 4: Yeah, but I thought if I wanted to fit in

128
00:06:26,760 --> 00:06:29,560
Speaker 4: with the rap world, I had to pretend to be

129
00:06:29,760 --> 00:06:35,520
Speaker 4: like that. So I got obsessed with writing raps. By

130
00:06:35,560 --> 00:06:40,800
Speaker 4: about fifteen, I started entering in these rap battle competitions

131
00:06:40,839 --> 00:06:44,880
Speaker 4: where they were underage. They would probably put about twelve

132
00:06:44,960 --> 00:06:47,480
Speaker 4: people's names in a hat and they would draw them

133
00:06:47,480 --> 00:06:48,200
Speaker 4: out of a hat.

134
00:06:48,000 --> 00:06:50,480
Speaker 1: And you'd have to jump up and just freestyle battle

135
00:06:50,640 --> 00:06:51,960
Speaker 1: like eight miles.

136
00:06:52,120 --> 00:06:52,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly.

137
00:06:53,240 --> 00:06:59,000
Speaker 4: And from about fourteen I got a really I think

138
00:06:59,040 --> 00:07:01,120
Speaker 4: I got a really good under standing of the art

139
00:07:01,200 --> 00:07:03,520
Speaker 4: behind it and the technical side of rap. So I

140
00:07:03,680 --> 00:07:06,400
Speaker 4: was pretty dialed in by the time I was doing that.

141
00:07:06,440 --> 00:07:09,440
Speaker 4: I understood the technical side of it, understood what it

142
00:07:09,480 --> 00:07:11,920
Speaker 4: meant to do punchlines and stuff like that. So I

143
00:07:12,000 --> 00:07:15,640
Speaker 4: was going in there with the just thinking I was

144
00:07:15,680 --> 00:07:17,720
Speaker 4: going to kill everyone that I came up against.

145
00:07:17,760 --> 00:07:20,360
Speaker 1: And I didn't win.

146
00:07:20,200 --> 00:07:23,040
Speaker 4: Them, but I came twice, and I was always getting

147
00:07:23,080 --> 00:07:25,800
Speaker 4: close to winning every single one. That's how I got

148
00:07:25,800 --> 00:07:28,520
Speaker 4: my name out there in Melbourne, and I ended up

149
00:07:28,560 --> 00:07:33,320
Speaker 4: getting signed to a record label by the age of sixteen.

150
00:07:34,080 --> 00:07:37,200
Speaker 4: Oh wow, which was a dream come true. I got

151
00:07:37,560 --> 00:07:42,240
Speaker 4: randomly messaged by this guy that I completely idolized growing up,

152
00:07:42,320 --> 00:07:44,640
Speaker 4: and I thought I was being trolled by one of

153
00:07:44,640 --> 00:07:45,080
Speaker 4: my mates.

154
00:07:45,120 --> 00:07:46,880
Speaker 1: I thought they were just having to go.

155
00:07:46,920 --> 00:07:50,960
Speaker 4: Get yeah, and he hit me up and he was like,

156
00:07:51,000 --> 00:07:53,080
Speaker 4: we've listened to some of the songs you've put out.

157
00:07:53,160 --> 00:07:55,800
Speaker 4: We think you've got a lot of potential. Started working

158
00:07:55,800 --> 00:07:59,760
Speaker 4: really close with these guys. But mind you, the Aussie

159
00:07:59,800 --> 00:08:05,160
Speaker 4: rap scene back then was very meshed with the graffiti world,

160
00:08:05,320 --> 00:08:09,920
Speaker 4: so it was quite it was quite a big street influence.

161
00:08:10,280 --> 00:08:13,640
Speaker 4: So like, there's some hectic dudes from the graffiti world

162
00:08:13,640 --> 00:08:18,720
Speaker 4: where they would stab people if they wrote over their piece.

163
00:08:18,560 --> 00:08:19,520
Speaker 1: Or something the tag.

164
00:08:20,000 --> 00:08:24,120
Speaker 4: Yeah, it was very intense and so that kind of

165
00:08:24,160 --> 00:08:26,960
Speaker 4: made me start thinking I had to be more like

166
00:08:27,040 --> 00:08:29,800
Speaker 4: them even more. So I was putting on this front

167
00:08:29,800 --> 00:08:34,280
Speaker 4: pretending I was like that, and I was doing this

168
00:08:34,360 --> 00:08:37,920
Speaker 4: simultaneously while I was playing basketball quite seriously as well.

169
00:08:38,200 --> 00:08:41,600
Speaker 4: And it's really interesting looking back because like Mum and

170
00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:44,960
Speaker 4: Dad didn't like that I was walking into this world

171
00:08:45,040 --> 00:08:47,440
Speaker 4: where people were. They thought I was going to get

172
00:08:47,480 --> 00:08:50,560
Speaker 4: caught up in the wrong crowd, which I probably was,

173
00:08:50,600 --> 00:08:53,520
Speaker 4: to be honest, but they still supported me anyway. Like

174
00:08:53,960 --> 00:08:56,960
Speaker 4: I remember, I had my first gig ever at the

175
00:08:57,040 --> 00:09:01,160
Speaker 4: Laundry Bar in Melbourne when I was sixteen, and they

176
00:09:01,280 --> 00:09:04,160
Speaker 4: drove me out there. They parked out the front. I

177
00:09:04,200 --> 00:09:06,320
Speaker 4: got up on stage. Because I was under age, I

178
00:09:06,320 --> 00:09:08,240
Speaker 4: had to get straight out as soon as I was done.

179
00:09:08,640 --> 00:09:11,040
Speaker 4: And then they drove me home. And even though they

180
00:09:11,080 --> 00:09:12,840
Speaker 4: didn't want to be there, I could feel it was

181
00:09:13,000 --> 00:09:15,400
Speaker 4: causing a lot of tension. They knew how much I

182
00:09:15,440 --> 00:09:18,120
Speaker 4: loved it, and they were supportive of it. And then

183
00:09:18,240 --> 00:09:23,560
Speaker 4: fast forward to about nineteen. I was playing quite serious basketball,

184
00:09:23,600 --> 00:09:26,000
Speaker 4: like I was playing a few leagues below the NBL

185
00:09:26,559 --> 00:09:32,440
Speaker 4: and playing in the ABA as well, and suddenly my

186
00:09:32,840 --> 00:09:37,000
Speaker 4: vision started going weird in my right eye. I noticed

187
00:09:37,360 --> 00:09:41,720
Speaker 4: everything started going blurry. I got my eyes checked and

188
00:09:41,880 --> 00:09:44,920
Speaker 4: they let me know that I had a disease in

189
00:09:44,960 --> 00:09:50,400
Speaker 4: my eyes called keraticonus and I had to get all

190
00:09:50,440 --> 00:09:53,560
Speaker 4: these operations on it. I had a cornea transplant in

191
00:09:53,640 --> 00:09:54,439
Speaker 4: my right eye.

192
00:09:54,880 --> 00:09:55,640
Speaker 1: And then what does that.

193
00:09:55,600 --> 00:09:58,959
Speaker 2: Look like a corner, they extract the eyeball. How do

194
00:09:59,000 --> 00:09:59,800
Speaker 2: you recover from that?

195
00:10:00,160 --> 00:10:02,240
Speaker 4: So it's wild that they can even do it because

196
00:10:02,280 --> 00:10:05,480
Speaker 4: it's so it's so small, like it's just that little

197
00:10:05,559 --> 00:10:09,760
Speaker 4: curve curve bit the lens of your eye. So I

198
00:10:09,800 --> 00:10:12,840
Speaker 4: went in there and they were like, this disease is

199
00:10:12,880 --> 00:10:16,480
Speaker 4: going to eradicate your eye until it pops. So if

200
00:10:16,480 --> 00:10:18,920
Speaker 4: you don't get it done, it will pop and then

201
00:10:18,920 --> 00:10:23,120
Speaker 4: we explode. It's like it'll randomly just burst and that

202
00:10:23,200 --> 00:10:25,560
Speaker 4: their fluids will go into it and then you'll get

203
00:10:25,600 --> 00:10:29,600
Speaker 4: like a cloudy eye and it'll be super painful. So

204
00:10:30,280 --> 00:10:33,400
Speaker 4: they were like, you've got to get this transplant. So

205
00:10:33,440 --> 00:10:37,000
Speaker 4: I went in there. They just they cut off your corner,

206
00:10:37,000 --> 00:10:39,000
Speaker 4: how they put someone else's on there, and then they

207
00:10:39,440 --> 00:10:42,680
Speaker 4: put stitches in it. And the stitches lasted probably about

208
00:10:42,720 --> 00:10:46,000
Speaker 4: six months. This is tiny little stitches. He couldn't even

209
00:10:46,040 --> 00:10:48,920
Speaker 4: see him unless you were like really close up with

210
00:10:49,000 --> 00:10:53,319
Speaker 4: a torch, and I was. I would go in every

211
00:10:53,559 --> 00:10:57,560
Speaker 4: probably week or two, and the doctor would take a

212
00:10:57,559 --> 00:11:00,400
Speaker 4: few of the stitches out at a time, and it

213
00:11:00,440 --> 00:11:03,400
Speaker 4: was really really interesting. Each time they'd take the stitches out,

214
00:11:03,400 --> 00:11:05,840
Speaker 4: it would change the vision because it was pulling on

215
00:11:06,200 --> 00:11:08,600
Speaker 4: areas of the corneer and by the time they took

216
00:11:08,679 --> 00:11:11,440
Speaker 4: all the stitches out, I was blind in my right eye.

217
00:11:11,480 --> 00:11:13,719
Speaker 4: It was just the vision was gone. The disease had

218
00:11:13,720 --> 00:11:18,959
Speaker 4: stopped spreading. But my vision is like looking underwater. So

219
00:11:19,040 --> 00:11:24,280
Speaker 4: that happened, and that, honestly, looking back to it, I

220
00:11:24,320 --> 00:11:27,000
Speaker 4: didn't have the heart to tell my father that I

221
00:11:27,000 --> 00:11:30,079
Speaker 4: didn't want to play basketball, But that for me was

222
00:11:30,120 --> 00:11:32,960
Speaker 4: a blessing in disguise because it just took away.

223
00:11:32,760 --> 00:11:33,640
Speaker 1: Made me that game.

224
00:11:33,720 --> 00:11:36,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, it gave you that out. Yeah yeah, And how

225
00:11:36,960 --> 00:11:39,480
Speaker 2: heavily influenced at this stage when you come up to

226
00:11:39,520 --> 00:11:42,680
Speaker 2: your operation. Are you in the rap scene? Are you

227
00:11:42,840 --> 00:11:45,559
Speaker 2: in that sort of street life, not the underground life

228
00:11:45,600 --> 00:11:47,680
Speaker 2: as such, but that street life of And I know

229
00:11:47,720 --> 00:11:49,360
Speaker 2: it all too well that you know they tagging the

230
00:11:51,320 --> 00:11:56,360
Speaker 2: music scene the rap scene. That's completely different to the

231
00:11:56,400 --> 00:11:59,880
Speaker 2: life that you have playing basketball, where you structured discipline,

232
00:12:00,160 --> 00:12:02,120
Speaker 2: going home, your mom and dad are there for you,

233
00:12:02,360 --> 00:12:05,200
Speaker 2: they're training with you, they're feeding you. You know, it's

234
00:12:05,200 --> 00:12:07,320
Speaker 2: almost like you're living two lives, and they feel like

235
00:12:07,320 --> 00:12:08,280
Speaker 2: you were living two lives.

236
00:12:08,720 --> 00:12:14,920
Speaker 4: Definitely, it definitely felt like I was portraying myself in

237
00:12:14,960 --> 00:12:19,480
Speaker 4: a light that wasn't me. And but I think the

238
00:12:19,520 --> 00:12:23,880
Speaker 4: way my dad taught me to go hard in basketball,

239
00:12:23,960 --> 00:12:26,880
Speaker 4: I just applied that to music. To be honest, I've

240
00:12:26,880 --> 00:12:30,160
Speaker 4: applied it to everything I've ever done, even negative things

241
00:12:30,240 --> 00:12:33,880
Speaker 4: like drugs and stuff like that. I was conditioned to

242
00:12:33,920 --> 00:12:36,000
Speaker 4: that from a very young age.

243
00:12:36,720 --> 00:12:39,280
Speaker 1: So it was like living two lives. But it got me.

244
00:12:39,400 --> 00:12:40,240
Speaker 1: It gave me an out.

245
00:12:40,280 --> 00:12:44,400
Speaker 4: Like because I had this operation, they said you could

246
00:12:44,480 --> 00:12:47,200
Speaker 4: wear like a glass contact lens and it would help

247
00:12:47,200 --> 00:12:50,079
Speaker 4: improve the vision. So I started doing that. But during

248
00:12:50,120 --> 00:12:52,800
Speaker 4: the games, it would like it would fall out, or

249
00:12:52,840 --> 00:12:56,199
Speaker 4: it would like drop from like where my eyes. It

250
00:12:56,240 --> 00:12:58,960
Speaker 4: would go into my eyelid down there, and they'd have

251
00:12:59,000 --> 00:13:01,559
Speaker 4: to stop the game and till it's like pushed back

252
00:13:01,640 --> 00:13:04,040
Speaker 4: up again, or they'd have to search on the basketball

253
00:13:04,040 --> 00:13:06,000
Speaker 4: court to try and find the lens because it's so

254
00:13:06,040 --> 00:13:11,199
Speaker 4: expensive the whole game. It was kind of embarrassing. And

255
00:13:11,240 --> 00:13:12,960
Speaker 4: then it was it just got to a point where

256
00:13:13,000 --> 00:13:16,360
Speaker 4: we kind of all accepted, Okay, this isn't for me anymore.

257
00:13:16,440 --> 00:13:18,600
Speaker 4: You know, this isn't the path I'm going to go.

258
00:13:19,160 --> 00:13:23,760
Speaker 4: And then so I started doing an apprenticeship as a chippy,

259
00:13:25,320 --> 00:13:27,600
Speaker 4: thinking that I had to do that, and me and

260
00:13:27,640 --> 00:13:30,120
Speaker 4: my friend were just writing raps, thinking that that week

261
00:13:30,200 --> 00:13:32,040
Speaker 4: that was only a hobby. I didn't think it would

262
00:13:32,080 --> 00:13:34,760
Speaker 4: be a full time job. I didn't think we could

263
00:13:34,800 --> 00:13:35,120
Speaker 4: ever do it.

264
00:13:35,440 --> 00:13:37,520
Speaker 2: Just you're just you're just doing that for the for

265
00:13:37,559 --> 00:13:39,800
Speaker 2: the moment, you're going to write your music and something's

266
00:13:39,840 --> 00:13:40,280
Speaker 2: going to give.

267
00:13:40,559 --> 00:13:41,680
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah.

268
00:13:41,720 --> 00:13:45,480
Speaker 4: And my best mate at the time, we were writing

269
00:13:45,520 --> 00:13:47,520
Speaker 4: all these wraps together and we were just in this

270
00:13:47,559 --> 00:13:50,040
Speaker 4: little bubble where it was just like so much fun.

271
00:13:50,760 --> 00:13:53,080
Speaker 4: We were pushing each other to be better, and it

272
00:13:53,200 --> 00:13:55,959
Speaker 4: was all we really did. And then he just randomly,

273
00:13:56,400 --> 00:14:00,000
Speaker 4: for some reason, he's had this belief, this unshakable faith

274
00:14:00,040 --> 00:14:01,760
Speaker 4: that we could do anything if we put our mind

275
00:14:01,760 --> 00:14:05,040
Speaker 4: to it. And he was like, dude, just quit your

276
00:14:05,120 --> 00:14:07,560
Speaker 4: job and we'll just become the biggest rappers in the country.

277
00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:09,520
Speaker 1: And I was like, I don't know if.

278
00:14:09,400 --> 00:14:11,880
Speaker 4: We could do that, man, but he believed it, and

279
00:14:11,880 --> 00:14:13,960
Speaker 4: he was like, we can definitely do it. And so

280
00:14:14,760 --> 00:14:16,920
Speaker 4: because he had that belief, I saw it and I

281
00:14:16,960 --> 00:14:19,720
Speaker 4: was like, all right, I'll do it, and I just

282
00:14:19,800 --> 00:14:23,080
Speaker 4: quit the next day and ended up going on Center

283
00:14:23,160 --> 00:14:26,640
Speaker 4: Link and just like we were just started going.

284
00:14:26,400 --> 00:14:39,880
Speaker 5: Hard dealing with these two three lives from playing basketball

285
00:14:39,920 --> 00:14:42,640
Speaker 5: structured being you being at home with the family, for

286
00:14:42,840 --> 00:14:45,960
Speaker 5: being you know, skateboarding on the streets as such, doing

287
00:14:46,000 --> 00:14:47,280
Speaker 5: your wrap, et cetera, et cetera.

288
00:14:49,000 --> 00:14:51,400
Speaker 2: Did you lead a healthy life in both of them

289
00:14:51,520 --> 00:14:54,920
Speaker 2: or did you see your sort of health starting to

290
00:14:55,000 --> 00:14:56,880
Speaker 2: deteriorate in one of them.

291
00:14:57,120 --> 00:14:57,160
Speaker 5: No.

292
00:14:57,320 --> 00:15:00,680
Speaker 4: Once I was out of basketball, it was like it

293
00:15:00,800 --> 00:15:04,240
Speaker 4: was all just the wrap life. That was very much

294
00:15:04,320 --> 00:15:06,440
Speaker 4: what we would do it because I was only on Centalink,

295
00:15:06,480 --> 00:15:09,480
Speaker 4: so I was like barely making any money. We were

296
00:15:09,520 --> 00:15:12,600
Speaker 4: just riding raps during the week and then on the weekends.

297
00:15:12,040 --> 00:15:13,480
Speaker 1: We just go out and party.

298
00:15:13,480 --> 00:15:13,800
Speaker 5: That's it.

299
00:15:14,120 --> 00:15:19,680
Speaker 4: Yeah, So that became every single week pretty much. I

300
00:15:19,720 --> 00:15:23,600
Speaker 4: think what happened was because I was basically letting my

301
00:15:23,720 --> 00:15:26,720
Speaker 4: dad decide everything that I was doing from a young age.

302
00:15:27,080 --> 00:15:29,320
Speaker 4: By the time I got to that part where I

303
00:15:29,400 --> 00:15:31,800
Speaker 4: was going out by myself, I was like, now I

304
00:15:31,840 --> 00:15:32,960
Speaker 4: can do whatever I want.

305
00:15:33,480 --> 00:15:34,600
Speaker 1: So I felt free.

306
00:15:35,040 --> 00:15:37,440
Speaker 4: I was like, I can do everything, even though he

307
00:15:37,560 --> 00:15:41,000
Speaker 4: raised me to be to be disciplined and to be

308
00:15:41,080 --> 00:15:43,880
Speaker 4: healthy and to not go down the path of drugs

309
00:15:43,920 --> 00:15:46,560
Speaker 4: and alcohol, like he's lost so many family members to that.

310
00:15:48,040 --> 00:15:50,720
Speaker 4: When I felt like I was old enough to make

311
00:15:50,760 --> 00:15:52,440
Speaker 4: my own decisions. I was like, well, now I'm just

312
00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:55,400
Speaker 4: going to do everything, and there's going to be I'm

313
00:15:55,400 --> 00:15:56,520
Speaker 4: just going to go hard.

314
00:15:56,520 --> 00:15:58,640
Speaker 2: There's no real do what I want to do now.

315
00:15:58,920 --> 00:15:59,560
Speaker 1: Yeah.

316
00:15:59,640 --> 00:16:03,560
Speaker 4: Yeah, And that's sort of what happened. And because I

317
00:16:03,600 --> 00:16:06,760
Speaker 4: was uncentlink, it was only a weekend thing. But then

318
00:16:06,880 --> 00:16:10,000
Speaker 4: once the music took off, It's like suddenly you got

319
00:16:10,080 --> 00:16:13,840
Speaker 4: all this money and I've never had money like that before.

320
00:16:14,040 --> 00:16:16,400
Speaker 4: It was like, well, why stop, might as well just

321
00:16:16,520 --> 00:16:19,480
Speaker 4: keep the party going. And that kind of lasted from

322
00:16:19,520 --> 00:16:22,200
Speaker 4: about early twenties till thirty five.

323
00:16:22,240 --> 00:16:24,800
Speaker 2: I reckon, Well, so take me back to the moment

324
00:16:24,960 --> 00:16:29,680
Speaker 2: that I suppose in the vocabulary nowadays, you went viral.

325
00:16:29,760 --> 00:16:32,440
Speaker 2: You know, when you started making good money you realized, wow,

326
00:16:32,720 --> 00:16:35,200
Speaker 2: this is a career where I'm making really good money.

327
00:16:35,280 --> 00:16:37,600
Speaker 2: My name's out. There was ever a moment of a

328
00:16:37,640 --> 00:16:42,000
Speaker 2: song or a rap that brought that to that brought

329
00:16:42,080 --> 00:16:44,480
Speaker 2: that sort of dream into a reality.

330
00:16:45,240 --> 00:16:46,360
Speaker 1: Yeah.

331
00:16:46,560 --> 00:16:49,680
Speaker 4: So at the time, we got very much into this

332
00:16:49,800 --> 00:16:53,400
Speaker 4: documentary called The Secret, which was like all about I

333
00:16:53,440 --> 00:16:56,880
Speaker 4: think it's called the law of attraction, where you can

334
00:16:57,520 --> 00:17:01,120
Speaker 4: visualize everything you want and if you work to attain it.

335
00:17:01,160 --> 00:17:03,680
Speaker 4: You can have whatever you believe in. So we were

336
00:17:03,720 --> 00:17:06,280
Speaker 4: doing that. We were like writing down all these goals.

337
00:17:07,160 --> 00:17:09,840
Speaker 4: I remember I put out my first album and it flopped.

338
00:17:09,880 --> 00:17:12,679
Speaker 4: Nothing happened, and I thought, maybe this is just all crap,

339
00:17:12,840 --> 00:17:13,040
Speaker 4: you know.

340
00:17:13,680 --> 00:17:14,440
Speaker 1: And then.

341
00:17:15,760 --> 00:17:18,879
Speaker 4: Pez was working on his album and he had this song.

342
00:17:19,600 --> 00:17:23,359
Speaker 4: It was called Summer Days, and he felt like he

343
00:17:23,480 --> 00:17:26,679
Speaker 4: wanted to rewrite the song together and do it about

344
00:17:26,720 --> 00:17:30,480
Speaker 4: going to festivals. So we ended up writing this song

345
00:17:30,560 --> 00:17:34,720
Speaker 4: called the Festival Song about our experience going to different

346
00:17:34,800 --> 00:17:38,040
Speaker 4: festivals over the years when we party and just have fun.

347
00:17:38,119 --> 00:17:40,440
Speaker 2: And I suppose so many people can relate to that,

348
00:17:40,520 --> 00:17:44,560
Speaker 2: right because it's like how many millions of people go

349
00:17:45,000 --> 00:17:45,760
Speaker 2: to festivals.

350
00:17:46,520 --> 00:17:49,439
Speaker 4: We weren't expecting that, Like, we didn't realize that it

351
00:17:49,520 --> 00:17:52,960
Speaker 4: was the relatability of music that takes it to the

352
00:17:53,000 --> 00:17:55,679
Speaker 4: promised Land. So when we put that song out, we

353
00:17:55,680 --> 00:17:58,399
Speaker 4: were like, it feels like it should be good. Pez

354
00:17:58,480 --> 00:18:01,239
Speaker 4: was He was actually like like I can feel this

355
00:18:01,320 --> 00:18:04,120
Speaker 4: is going to be the one. And then we put

356
00:18:04,160 --> 00:18:06,600
Speaker 4: it out and it just went bananas, Like, it just

357
00:18:06,640 --> 00:18:11,199
Speaker 4: started going crazy. Triple J started smashing it, and then

358
00:18:11,200 --> 00:18:13,960
Speaker 4: Nova started smashing it, and Fox and all of every

359
00:18:14,080 --> 00:18:17,680
Speaker 4: radio just jumped on board and it was like it

360
00:18:18,200 --> 00:18:21,600
Speaker 4: it was bizarre. Man, Suddenly Pez has just launched into

361
00:18:21,680 --> 00:18:26,359
Speaker 4: the stratosphere. He starts touring around Australia and I'm touring

362
00:18:26,400 --> 00:18:30,280
Speaker 4: with him to play that song. He's supporting every rapper

363
00:18:30,320 --> 00:18:33,960
Speaker 4: that comes over from America, and it was like, suddenly

364
00:18:34,160 --> 00:18:37,359
Speaker 4: we got this taste of what we were always working towards.

365
00:18:39,160 --> 00:18:42,159
Speaker 4: And for me, it was like this confirmation. It was

366
00:18:42,240 --> 00:18:44,919
Speaker 4: like we can do we can actually do this, Like

367
00:18:44,960 --> 00:18:47,800
Speaker 4: if we really go hard and believe we can do it,

368
00:18:48,119 --> 00:18:48,760
Speaker 4: we can do it.

369
00:18:48,840 --> 00:18:49,600
Speaker 1: So I just.

370
00:18:49,720 --> 00:18:54,800
Speaker 4: Doubled down, man, and started writing even bigger goals, things

371
00:18:54,800 --> 00:18:57,560
Speaker 4: that were way beyond what I thought we could actually do.

372
00:18:57,640 --> 00:18:59,480
Speaker 4: It was just like, might as well shoot for the fence,

373
00:18:59,560 --> 00:19:04,080
Speaker 4: you know, and start over. The next probably a couple years,

374
00:19:04,119 --> 00:19:06,919
Speaker 4: started working on an album which would have been my

375
00:19:07,040 --> 00:19:11,320
Speaker 4: second album, and I put that out and had all

376
00:19:11,359 --> 00:19:14,159
Speaker 4: these goals, thinking it was going to do really well,

377
00:19:14,520 --> 00:19:17,840
Speaker 4: and then it ended up exceeding everything that I thought

378
00:19:17,840 --> 00:19:19,880
Speaker 4: it was going to do. I ticked every single goal

379
00:19:19,920 --> 00:19:23,520
Speaker 4: that I had and it just went way way beyond

380
00:19:23,640 --> 00:19:27,720
Speaker 4: what I thought possible, and then life was different from

381
00:19:27,720 --> 00:19:31,840
Speaker 4: then on. It was like I'd always desired fame, I'd

382
00:19:31,840 --> 00:19:35,960
Speaker 4: always desired money, I'd always desired access to women. I

383
00:19:36,080 --> 00:19:39,040
Speaker 4: thought those things would make me happy, and then I

384
00:19:39,119 --> 00:19:41,720
Speaker 4: got them and it was pretty fun, Like I won't lie,

385
00:19:41,760 --> 00:19:45,560
Speaker 4: it was great to reach that kind of goal, but

386
00:19:45,680 --> 00:19:50,200
Speaker 4: it very quickly became toxic and it was like, I thought,

387
00:19:50,280 --> 00:19:52,840
Speaker 4: this is everything I wanted, but it wasn't.

388
00:19:53,200 --> 00:19:55,760
Speaker 2: So from album one, which you said it was a

389
00:19:55,800 --> 00:20:01,239
Speaker 2: flop with the success of the second album and like

390
00:20:01,320 --> 00:20:05,200
Speaker 2: you said, with accessibility to absolutely everything, for money, to fame,

391
00:20:05,320 --> 00:20:08,479
Speaker 2: to women, to you name it, drugs, alcohol, whatever it

392
00:20:08,520 --> 00:20:12,560
Speaker 2: may be. Did you find that once you had all

393
00:20:12,600 --> 00:20:16,439
Speaker 2: of what you wanted and more, did that drive and

394
00:20:16,640 --> 00:20:20,840
Speaker 2: hunger does that naturally go or or do you get

395
00:20:20,880 --> 00:20:25,960
Speaker 2: even hungrier and even more driven but for the wrong things.

396
00:20:26,080 --> 00:20:30,679
Speaker 4: M Yeah, it was like I attained all these things

397
00:20:31,000 --> 00:20:35,720
Speaker 4: and then it wasn't enough, So the drive only increased.

398
00:20:35,880 --> 00:20:37,639
Speaker 1: Yeah, but I just needed more.

399
00:20:38,160 --> 00:20:38,400
Speaker 3: Yeah.

400
00:20:38,480 --> 00:20:41,480
Speaker 1: It was like I needed more money, more fame.

401
00:20:41,400 --> 00:20:44,680
Speaker 2: More women, more yeah, yeah, yeah, more more of everything.

402
00:20:44,400 --> 00:20:44,920
Speaker 1: Right, yeah.

403
00:20:45,160 --> 00:20:48,280
Speaker 4: Yeah, nothing was ever enough, you know, And that was

404
00:20:48,359 --> 00:20:50,960
Speaker 4: kind of the running theme. It was like it was

405
00:20:51,040 --> 00:20:54,959
Speaker 4: like my self worth was tied to my success as

406
00:20:55,000 --> 00:20:57,920
Speaker 4: an artist as well. So if my success was, if

407
00:20:57,920 --> 00:21:00,560
Speaker 4: I was killing it and my career was, then I

408
00:21:00,640 --> 00:21:03,879
Speaker 4: was happy. I was fulfilled, I was I was loving life.

409
00:21:03,920 --> 00:21:07,480
Speaker 4: But then when things started going downhill, that kind of

410
00:21:07,640 --> 00:21:09,760
Speaker 4: made I was unhappy. It was like everything was just

411
00:21:09,840 --> 00:21:11,800
Speaker 4: tied to the charts, if that makes sense.

412
00:21:11,840 --> 00:21:14,600
Speaker 2: And then what you do ultimately is you try and

413
00:21:14,760 --> 00:21:18,280
Speaker 2: chase that high, right, you know, that natural high that

414
00:21:18,440 --> 00:21:22,560
Speaker 2: you obtained through grafting, through being obsessed from the first

415
00:21:22,560 --> 00:21:27,440
Speaker 2: album to the second album, that sort of goes Did

416
00:21:27,480 --> 00:21:30,119
Speaker 2: you start looking for synthetic highs? Did you start, you know,

417
00:21:30,320 --> 00:21:33,080
Speaker 2: going down the drugs and down the alcohol route? And

418
00:21:33,119 --> 00:21:36,440
Speaker 2: how easy is it when you've got absolutely everything at

419
00:21:36,440 --> 00:21:39,000
Speaker 2: your disposal, when you're at the top of the how

420
00:21:39,040 --> 00:21:40,720
Speaker 2: easy is it to fall into that?

421
00:21:41,480 --> 00:21:41,680
Speaker 5: Man?

422
00:21:41,720 --> 00:21:44,080
Speaker 1: It was very easy. Or was it progressive or was

423
00:21:44,080 --> 00:21:45,920
Speaker 1: it just it was.

424
00:21:46,440 --> 00:21:49,160
Speaker 4: It was progressive early, but then when the money was there,

425
00:21:49,160 --> 00:21:51,119
Speaker 4: it was like, oh, I was all in. And I

426
00:21:51,520 --> 00:21:54,359
Speaker 4: remember I used to I used to read books like

427
00:21:54,440 --> 00:21:58,919
Speaker 4: Scar Tissue by Anthony Ketis and the Motley Crue autobiographies,

428
00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:02,600
Speaker 4: and I used to read about them being these rock

429
00:22:02,640 --> 00:22:05,960
Speaker 4: stars living this sex, drugs and rock and roll lifestyle

430
00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:08,280
Speaker 4: and I was like, I want that. To look back

431
00:22:08,320 --> 00:22:11,439
Speaker 4: on it, it's bizarre because, like I remember, Anthony Keatis

432
00:22:11,520 --> 00:22:13,600
Speaker 4: was a full blown heroin addict and lots of the

433
00:22:13,680 --> 00:22:17,080
Speaker 4: Motley Crew were as well, and I romanticized that too.

434
00:22:17,440 --> 00:22:20,040
Speaker 4: Like I was like, if I I think being a

435
00:22:20,080 --> 00:22:23,160
Speaker 4: heroin addict is gross, but if it's coupled with being

436
00:22:23,160 --> 00:22:25,600
Speaker 4: a rock star and having a lot of money, then

437
00:22:25,640 --> 00:22:28,080
Speaker 4: that's actually quite attractive to me. And that was appealing

438
00:22:28,119 --> 00:22:32,280
Speaker 4: to me. So all the partying that we were doing,

439
00:22:32,320 --> 00:22:35,040
Speaker 4: I was like going up on the weekends. Everyone knew

440
00:22:35,080 --> 00:22:37,120
Speaker 4: me as this guy who was so loose and could

441
00:22:37,200 --> 00:22:39,720
Speaker 4: drink a lot and do all these drugs, but they

442
00:22:39,800 --> 00:22:42,840
Speaker 4: didn't know that on the days afterwards, when I was

443
00:22:42,880 --> 00:22:45,720
Speaker 4: coming down and when I was having a hangover, that's

444
00:22:45,760 --> 00:22:49,520
Speaker 4: when I started reaching towards the prescription pills like oxyconton

445
00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:53,840
Speaker 4: and stuff like that, or Xanax and things like that

446
00:22:53,840 --> 00:22:56,639
Speaker 4: that would help me mask.

447
00:22:57,160 --> 00:22:57,520
Speaker 5: Yeah.

448
00:22:57,840 --> 00:23:00,840
Speaker 2: Try you thought you were countering, yes, but it was

449
00:23:01,119 --> 00:23:03,280
Speaker 2: you were just, yeah, you're just digging yourself a deeper

450
00:23:03,320 --> 00:23:04,320
Speaker 2: hold of addiction, right.

451
00:23:04,480 --> 00:23:04,720
Speaker 5: Yeah.

452
00:23:04,760 --> 00:23:07,720
Speaker 4: I was navigating the calm downs and navigating the lows,

453
00:23:07,760 --> 00:23:09,960
Speaker 4: and then I would have drugs to bring me up again.

454
00:23:10,000 --> 00:23:13,560
Speaker 4: It was like constantly trying to figure my way through

455
00:23:13,640 --> 00:23:18,240
Speaker 4: with chemicals, and that spiraled out of control super quickly,

456
00:23:18,400 --> 00:23:19,480
Speaker 4: like it.

457
00:23:19,400 --> 00:23:21,640
Speaker 1: Was by the third album.

458
00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:26,040
Speaker 4: I was full blown an addict, like out of control,

459
00:23:26,400 --> 00:23:31,000
Speaker 4: trying to trying to just it was weird. It was

460
00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:35,080
Speaker 4: like I was willing to sacrifice Matt Colewell if it

461
00:23:35,119 --> 00:23:38,080
Speaker 4: meant that three sixty was killing it. You know, it

462
00:23:38,119 --> 00:23:41,720
Speaker 4: didn't matter how what happened to me personally. As long

463
00:23:41,760 --> 00:23:44,159
Speaker 4: as my career was doing well and I was successful

464
00:23:44,160 --> 00:23:47,320
Speaker 4: in making money, I was cool with whatever whatever I

465
00:23:47,359 --> 00:23:48,080
Speaker 4: had to go through.

466
00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:50,359
Speaker 2: Do you think coming off of the natural high of

467
00:23:50,400 --> 00:23:54,760
Speaker 2: your second album that could you identify what was a

468
00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:57,080
Speaker 2: natural high and what was a synthetic high or did

469
00:23:57,080 --> 00:23:59,600
Speaker 2: they all feel like highs to you from the success

470
00:23:59,600 --> 00:24:02,520
Speaker 2: of your second album, Because I get going down the

471
00:24:02,560 --> 00:24:05,400
Speaker 2: alcohol and drugs route because it is it's a way

472
00:24:05,440 --> 00:24:08,560
Speaker 2: of getting yourself back up there or thinking that you're

473
00:24:08,600 --> 00:24:10,480
Speaker 2: back up there. But it's not like a natural high

474
00:24:10,480 --> 00:24:11,600
Speaker 2: as nah nah.

475
00:24:11,640 --> 00:24:15,439
Speaker 4: So before before the career really took off, I was

476
00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:19,359
Speaker 4: I could differentiate between the two. But then when the

477
00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:22,720
Speaker 4: career took off, they were both joined together. So all

478
00:24:22,760 --> 00:24:25,720
Speaker 4: the natural highs were fueled together with synthetic ones at

479
00:24:25,760 --> 00:24:28,840
Speaker 4: the same time, so it was like both at the

480
00:24:28,840 --> 00:24:29,199
Speaker 4: same time.

481
00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:31,280
Speaker 2: You couldn't Yeah, you couldn't separate the two. You were

482
00:24:31,320 --> 00:24:34,320
Speaker 2: just going on, going down what you thought was the

483
00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:39,440
Speaker 2: right route, but was a spiral. Do you recognize yourself

484
00:24:39,680 --> 00:24:42,840
Speaker 2: from your second album to your third album looking back

485
00:24:42,880 --> 00:24:45,959
Speaker 2: at it now, are you're a completely different person at

486
00:24:45,960 --> 00:24:46,359
Speaker 2: the stage?

487
00:24:46,440 --> 00:24:52,359
Speaker 4: Or I remember with my second album, I was very

488
00:24:52,480 --> 00:24:55,040
Speaker 4: much just embracing who I was. I feel like it

489
00:24:55,119 --> 00:24:58,600
Speaker 4: was a very authentic album. And then once it got

490
00:24:58,720 --> 00:25:02,919
Speaker 4: launched and became six cessful, it's a lot of the

491
00:25:03,040 --> 00:25:07,160
Speaker 4: rap community turned on me because it was a very

492
00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:11,760
Speaker 4: commercially successful album, which is not cool in those circles.

493
00:25:11,880 --> 00:25:14,960
Speaker 4: Like I was suddenly label to sell out, I was

494
00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:17,600
Speaker 4: labeled to pop star. People were like, he can't even

495
00:25:17,680 --> 00:25:20,159
Speaker 4: rap kind of thing, And because I come from a

496
00:25:20,240 --> 00:25:24,960
Speaker 4: background of rapping and really kind of worshiping the art

497
00:25:24,960 --> 00:25:28,280
Speaker 4: of rap, I was just I got consumed by trying

498
00:25:28,280 --> 00:25:32,399
Speaker 4: to prove myself to them. It's like before my career,

499
00:25:32,440 --> 00:25:34,600
Speaker 4: I was trying to prove myself by pretending I was

500
00:25:34,640 --> 00:25:38,879
Speaker 4: something I wasn't and then when the success came up,

501
00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:40,600
Speaker 4: I was like, now I've got to pretend I can.

502
00:25:40,920 --> 00:25:42,800
Speaker 4: It wasn't like pretending I've got to prove that I

503
00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:43,600
Speaker 4: can rap to them.

504
00:25:43,880 --> 00:25:44,280
Speaker 1: That's what.

505
00:25:44,320 --> 00:25:47,000
Speaker 4: If you listen to my third album, a lot of

506
00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:48,640
Speaker 4: it was driven by that motivation.

507
00:25:49,040 --> 00:25:50,520
Speaker 1: It still had the poppy.

508
00:25:50,200 --> 00:25:53,480
Speaker 4: Elements and the radio songs on there, but a lot

509
00:25:53,480 --> 00:25:56,120
Speaker 4: of the songs was kind of almost directed to try

510
00:25:56,160 --> 00:25:57,160
Speaker 4: and appease them.

511
00:25:57,520 --> 00:25:59,200
Speaker 2: Do you think that that was there was an element

512
00:25:59,240 --> 00:26:02,440
Speaker 2: of jealousy and envy, and you know, people always want

513
00:26:02,440 --> 00:26:04,160
Speaker 2: to see you do well, but when you're doing better

514
00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:06,240
Speaker 2: than them, you know that they want to pull you

515
00:26:06,280 --> 00:26:08,400
Speaker 2: down and they use anything against you. Like you said,

516
00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:11,959
Speaker 2: commercialization like a pop star other than a rap artist.

517
00:26:12,160 --> 00:26:13,920
Speaker 2: Do you think there was an element of that as well.

518
00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:16,719
Speaker 4: Yeah, for sure. Like in Australia, there's a lot of

519
00:26:16,720 --> 00:26:21,480
Speaker 4: tall poppy syndrome. And one thing I always think about

520
00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:24,560
Speaker 4: is I remember there was like there was these group

521
00:26:24,600 --> 00:26:27,680
Speaker 4: of young dudes who were so supportive of that exact

522
00:26:27,800 --> 00:26:30,440
Speaker 4: same album right when it first came out, and then

523
00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:33,600
Speaker 4: by the time it was like really successful, they had

524
00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:36,840
Speaker 4: completely turned on me and called me a sell out. Personally,

525
00:26:36,840 --> 00:26:39,720
Speaker 4: It's like I knew them personally. It was like, what

526
00:26:39,840 --> 00:26:42,000
Speaker 4: is happening here? It's the same music, I don't know.

527
00:26:42,200 --> 00:26:44,159
Speaker 2: Jealousy and envy, that's what that is.

528
00:26:44,600 --> 00:26:47,679
Speaker 4: Yeah, but that really got to me man, like I

529
00:26:47,760 --> 00:26:51,199
Speaker 4: really wanted people's approval, Like that was something that was

530
00:26:51,400 --> 00:26:54,480
Speaker 4: always important to me, was other people's validation.

531
00:26:54,720 --> 00:26:57,000
Speaker 2: It's like with your dad, right, they started off this

532
00:26:57,119 --> 00:27:01,480
Speaker 2: conversation and going back to approve where you know you

533
00:27:01,560 --> 00:27:03,880
Speaker 2: wanted to do everything to make your dad happy, even

534
00:27:03,920 --> 00:27:06,439
Speaker 2: if it was at your detriment. And it sounds like

535
00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:09,240
Speaker 2: that that was a theme that carried on through your career.

536
00:27:09,680 --> 00:27:13,600
Speaker 2: But it's very hard not to fall into that appeasing

537
00:27:13,640 --> 00:27:16,080
Speaker 2: because what you do when you fall into when you

538
00:27:16,080 --> 00:27:19,399
Speaker 2: want external validation, it takes you off of your goals,

539
00:27:19,400 --> 00:27:21,200
Speaker 2: It takes you off your direction, it takes you off

540
00:27:21,200 --> 00:27:24,679
Speaker 2: your path into the unknown, because all you're trying to

541
00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:26,840
Speaker 2: do is appease all these people. Where's the end goal,

542
00:27:26,880 --> 00:27:30,000
Speaker 2: where's the destination? Where's the next milestone? And it sounds

543
00:27:30,040 --> 00:27:33,199
Speaker 2: like that you went off on that, And could you

544
00:27:33,240 --> 00:27:33,639
Speaker 2: feel a.

545
00:27:35,320 --> 00:27:39,800
Speaker 3: Deterioration in your in your mental health. Yeah, absolutely, it's

546
00:27:39,880 --> 00:27:44,800
Speaker 3: like I feel like it. It's like I was so

547
00:27:45,080 --> 00:27:48,480
Speaker 3: in tune with what people approved of that I knew

548
00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:52,159
Speaker 3: how to navigate in the world to target them. So

549
00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:55,399
Speaker 3: it's like I had I had a few instances early

550
00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:57,520
Speaker 3: on in my career where I said some things that

551
00:27:57,680 --> 00:28:00,560
Speaker 3: caused a lot of controversy and a lot of backlash

552
00:28:00,600 --> 00:28:02,680
Speaker 3: that I wasn't ready for and I wasn't even expecting.

553
00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:05,160
Speaker 4: I was just being honest with how I felt, and

554
00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:10,000
Speaker 4: then got just bombarded with all this stuff. And at

555
00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:13,040
Speaker 4: that time, because I wanted everyone to approval so much,

556
00:28:13,119 --> 00:28:15,439
Speaker 4: it was very confronting to me. It's like, I just

557
00:28:15,480 --> 00:28:17,920
Speaker 4: want these people to really like me, and they don't

558
00:28:18,040 --> 00:28:20,199
Speaker 4: like me, so it made me feel like I have

559
00:28:20,320 --> 00:28:23,359
Speaker 4: to change. It's like I felt I was bad, so

560
00:28:23,400 --> 00:28:25,960
Speaker 4: I have to rearrange my life to appease them. And

561
00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:30,280
Speaker 4: I started navigating all my interviews from then on being

562
00:28:30,359 --> 00:28:33,760
Speaker 4: really diplomatic and instead of saying what I actually thought,

563
00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:36,840
Speaker 4: I was saying I was like a career politician trying

564
00:28:36,840 --> 00:28:37,600
Speaker 4: to win the votes.

565
00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:38,760
Speaker 1: You know, I was just.

566
00:28:38,720 --> 00:28:41,760
Speaker 2: Saying being you na, what people fell in love with,

567
00:28:42,080 --> 00:28:45,600
Speaker 2: how you vote your music, how you expressed yourself through

568
00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:49,000
Speaker 2: your rap lyrics, and ultimately what got you, you know,

569
00:28:49,080 --> 00:28:52,160
Speaker 2: to the success that you've got Now you're you're turning

570
00:28:52,200 --> 00:28:54,520
Speaker 2: against that, and but you're you can't win iver way,

571
00:28:54,640 --> 00:28:56,440
Speaker 2: right because the moment you turn against that and you're

572
00:28:56,440 --> 00:29:00,360
Speaker 2: trying to peace, you're not being yourself. You become you're

573
00:29:00,360 --> 00:29:02,840
Speaker 2: no longer to sell out your fake yeah, yeah, one

574
00:29:02,880 --> 00:29:05,560
Speaker 2: hundred percent man to navigate man.

575
00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:09,200
Speaker 4: And when you start doing that, like I remember when

576
00:29:09,280 --> 00:29:11,800
Speaker 4: I was thirty five, it's like I'd been living this

577
00:29:11,920 --> 00:29:15,040
Speaker 4: life trying to appease everyone else, not being authentic to

578
00:29:15,080 --> 00:29:17,560
Speaker 4: who I was. And then it's like I woke up

579
00:29:17,560 --> 00:29:19,640
Speaker 4: and was like I don't even know who I am,

580
00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:21,520
Speaker 4: Like I don't even know what I stand for. I

581
00:29:21,560 --> 00:29:25,040
Speaker 4: don't know what my morals or principles are because I'm

582
00:29:25,080 --> 00:29:29,080
Speaker 4: trying to appease other people. It's like my identity was

583
00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:32,800
Speaker 4: based on what people approved of, So my identity was

584
00:29:32,840 --> 00:29:35,400
Speaker 4: always up for grabs depending on the culture and the

585
00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:37,440
Speaker 4: tides at the time. You know what I mean, it's

586
00:29:37,520 --> 00:29:38,400
Speaker 4: constantly shifting.

587
00:29:48,240 --> 00:29:51,560
Speaker 2: Is the drug addiction getting more? Are you using more

588
00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:54,120
Speaker 2: and more and more at this stage? Just because your

589
00:29:54,240 --> 00:29:56,720
Speaker 2: escape was the other way that you dealt with things,

590
00:29:56,960 --> 00:29:57,720
Speaker 2: how did that work?

591
00:29:57,800 --> 00:29:59,560
Speaker 1: So for me it wasn't an escape.

592
00:29:59,680 --> 00:30:02,280
Speaker 4: It was like I was only doing it to make

593
00:30:02,320 --> 00:30:06,120
Speaker 4: a good time better, and then it became so common

594
00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:10,360
Speaker 4: and so consistent that it quickly became an addiction. So

595
00:30:10,400 --> 00:30:13,320
Speaker 4: I wasn't actually trying to escape anything, but before I

596
00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:16,080
Speaker 4: knew it, I was a full blown addict and I

597
00:30:16,120 --> 00:30:19,360
Speaker 4: couldn't stop. So then I was trying to escape something.

598
00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:21,960
Speaker 2: When did you realize that that was a moment that

599
00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:26,480
Speaker 2: you thought for me, I've got so much myself out man.

600
00:30:26,560 --> 00:30:30,040
Speaker 4: It was on the third album. I had done one

601
00:30:30,120 --> 00:30:33,040
Speaker 4: tour which was massive. It was the biggest tour I've

602
00:30:33,080 --> 00:30:37,280
Speaker 4: ever done in Sydney. It was five thousand people, big

603
00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:41,080
Speaker 4: crowd big, big crowds, really big crowds. But at the

604
00:30:41,120 --> 00:30:44,560
Speaker 4: same time it was hard to be present in all

605
00:30:44,600 --> 00:30:48,280
Speaker 4: of that while I was so inebriated on and intoxicated.

606
00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:52,080
Speaker 2: Used to get on stage intoxicated, oh yeah, yeah.

607
00:30:52,000 --> 00:30:52,400
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah.

608
00:30:52,440 --> 00:30:55,560
Speaker 4: I just got super loose, and I remember like I

609
00:30:55,600 --> 00:30:58,720
Speaker 4: would do like the big day Out festival and just

610
00:30:58,800 --> 00:31:02,160
Speaker 4: party the entire time without sleeping, And every time i'd

611
00:31:02,160 --> 00:31:04,280
Speaker 4: get off stage, I remember I'm a manager coming back

612
00:31:04,320 --> 00:31:06,400
Speaker 4: and being like, whatever you're doing, just keep doing it

613
00:31:06,400 --> 00:31:07,440
Speaker 4: because you're killing it.

614
00:31:07,480 --> 00:31:10,320
Speaker 1: So I was like okay, and just kept going harder

615
00:31:10,360 --> 00:31:14,400
Speaker 1: and harder. Yeah, it was. It was pretty pretty big.

616
00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:18,480
Speaker 2: You're on form, so listen, if you're performing well intoxicated,

617
00:31:18,520 --> 00:31:20,880
Speaker 2: and that's when you're at your most relaxed, and you

618
00:31:21,760 --> 00:31:24,720
Speaker 2: keep doing it because obviously you're bringing in you're bringing

619
00:31:24,720 --> 00:31:27,800
Speaker 2: in numbers, therefore you're bringing in money. Therefore you you know,

620
00:31:28,160 --> 00:31:32,200
Speaker 2: the management of a sitting pretty you know. Yeah, yeah, wow,

621
00:31:32,280 --> 00:31:37,080
Speaker 2: that's a that's a huge ask and pressure on you

622
00:31:37,800 --> 00:31:40,000
Speaker 2: to perform like that.

623
00:31:40,880 --> 00:31:44,040
Speaker 4: Yeah, they like Looking back, I don't think they had

624
00:31:44,080 --> 00:31:47,520
Speaker 4: my best interest, you know what I mean. And by

625
00:31:47,600 --> 00:31:51,320
Speaker 4: the second tour for that third album, it was a

626
00:31:51,360 --> 00:31:54,800
Speaker 4: regional tour, but my addiction had gone out of control,

627
00:31:54,920 --> 00:31:57,400
Speaker 4: Like it was to the point I was going weekly

628
00:31:57,440 --> 00:32:00,600
Speaker 4: to the doctor and getting oxyconton, which I was getting

629
00:32:00,600 --> 00:32:04,080
Speaker 4: on eighty milligram tablets, which is for people dying of cancer.

630
00:32:04,720 --> 00:32:07,200
Speaker 4: But my tolerance was that high that I needed whatever

631
00:32:07,480 --> 00:32:09,680
Speaker 4: I could get, really and I would just go in

632
00:32:09,680 --> 00:32:11,600
Speaker 4: there and say I had a sow back and just

633
00:32:11,840 --> 00:32:14,920
Speaker 4: get refills every week kind of thing. And I had

634
00:32:14,920 --> 00:32:17,440
Speaker 4: this tour coming up in about a week, so I

635
00:32:17,480 --> 00:32:19,320
Speaker 4: went in there. I got stocked up with all the

636
00:32:19,360 --> 00:32:22,520
Speaker 4: prescription stuff I thought oh, you know, I'll hold this

637
00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:23,240
Speaker 4: until the tour.

638
00:32:23,280 --> 00:32:24,400
Speaker 1: It'll help me get through it.

639
00:32:24,760 --> 00:32:27,360
Speaker 4: But typical addict fashion, I went through it in probably

640
00:32:27,400 --> 00:32:30,120
Speaker 4: two or three days, and then I had a few

641
00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:33,400
Speaker 4: days before the tour and I had nothing. And by

642
00:32:33,480 --> 00:32:35,440
Speaker 4: that point it was that bad that if I didn't

643
00:32:35,440 --> 00:32:38,360
Speaker 4: have the oxy cotton, I would either have to get

644
00:32:38,360 --> 00:32:41,200
Speaker 4: heroin or I would go to a pharmacy and get

645
00:32:41,600 --> 00:32:46,120
Speaker 4: neurop and plus, which is it's got coatine and iyberprofen

646
00:32:46,200 --> 00:32:48,800
Speaker 4: in it. And I was having three boxes of those

647
00:32:48,840 --> 00:32:51,680
Speaker 4: at a time, which is ninety tablets, just to because

648
00:32:51,720 --> 00:32:54,560
Speaker 4: my tolerance was that high and it would stop me

649
00:32:54,600 --> 00:32:58,000
Speaker 4: going through withdrawals. So we were three or four shows

650
00:32:58,040 --> 00:33:00,960
Speaker 4: in and I was just doing that every day, trying

651
00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:03,280
Speaker 4: to get through it. The tour was going really well,

652
00:33:03,640 --> 00:33:06,320
Speaker 4: and then on the fourth show, I was like, I

653
00:33:06,360 --> 00:33:08,720
Speaker 4: just want to feel something, so I had one hundred

654
00:33:08,760 --> 00:33:13,800
Speaker 4: and twenty instead of ninety tablets, and I started convulsing

655
00:33:13,800 --> 00:33:17,480
Speaker 4: on the floor. I woke up in hospital. I was

656
00:33:17,640 --> 00:33:18,960
Speaker 4: on suicide Watch.

657
00:33:19,440 --> 00:33:22,440
Speaker 2: So you're free shows in, you're killing it, and then

658
00:33:22,520 --> 00:33:25,080
Speaker 2: you take instead of your night fucking ninety. I was surprised.

659
00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:27,200
Speaker 2: Ninety didn't really I'm surprised thirty didn't put you on

660
00:33:27,240 --> 00:33:30,080
Speaker 2: your Yeah. Yeah, so one hundred and twenty. And then

661
00:33:30,160 --> 00:33:35,080
Speaker 2: obviously you've owed deed. And when you wake up, what's

662
00:33:35,120 --> 00:33:37,680
Speaker 2: going on? So one minute you're going to you're going

663
00:33:37,720 --> 00:33:40,400
Speaker 2: to walk on stage. The next minute, well, you wake

664
00:33:40,480 --> 00:33:41,160
Speaker 2: up in the hospital.

665
00:33:41,240 --> 00:33:45,120
Speaker 4: YEP, in hospital with someone sitting there told me that

666
00:33:45,160 --> 00:33:47,800
Speaker 4: I try to kill myself and I was like, dude,

667
00:33:47,880 --> 00:33:49,720
Speaker 4: I would never ever do that.

668
00:33:50,080 --> 00:33:51,040
Speaker 1: They wouldn't believe me.

669
00:33:51,480 --> 00:33:54,000
Speaker 4: Then they bring out my suitcase and they're like look,

670
00:33:54,400 --> 00:33:56,959
Speaker 4: and it was like half was full of my clothes,

671
00:33:57,000 --> 00:33:59,440
Speaker 4: but the other half was just boxes of neuroprom plus,

672
00:34:00,120 --> 00:34:02,480
Speaker 4: Like you're clearly trying to kill yourself. And I was

673
00:34:02,520 --> 00:34:04,400
Speaker 4: like this is every day man, Like this is just

674
00:34:04,480 --> 00:34:06,360
Speaker 4: me trying to sustain my.

675
00:34:06,360 --> 00:34:07,239
Speaker 1: Addiction, you know.

676
00:34:07,840 --> 00:34:10,759
Speaker 4: And then and then someone just come up to me

677
00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:13,360
Speaker 4: and they're like, here's the phone, and it was my

678
00:34:13,480 --> 00:34:16,840
Speaker 4: mum and I had to break it to her. And

679
00:34:16,280 --> 00:34:18,680
Speaker 4: they knew that I was a bit of a party animal,

680
00:34:18,680 --> 00:34:20,800
Speaker 4: but they didn't know what was going on with this stuff.

681
00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:22,799
Speaker 4: So I just had to break it to her and

682
00:34:22,840 --> 00:34:26,480
Speaker 4: be like, look, I'm addicted to prescription stuff. I've just

683
00:34:26,520 --> 00:34:28,360
Speaker 4: had an overdose. We're going to have to cancel the

684
00:34:28,400 --> 00:34:30,360
Speaker 4: whole tour. I'm going to have to come back and

685
00:34:30,400 --> 00:34:33,560
Speaker 4: get into a rehab center. And yeah, I did that.

686
00:34:33,719 --> 00:34:35,239
Speaker 1: And man, the.

687
00:34:35,200 --> 00:34:37,520
Speaker 4: Effect that that had on them was pretty brutal, you know,

688
00:34:37,680 --> 00:34:43,560
Speaker 4: Like for my dad to sacrifice so much and dedicate

689
00:34:43,680 --> 00:34:47,040
Speaker 4: so much into raising us to be these men with

690
00:34:47,120 --> 00:34:50,239
Speaker 4: integrity and to only do the very thing that he

691
00:34:50,360 --> 00:34:55,160
Speaker 4: tried to steer us away from was very very confronting

692
00:34:55,200 --> 00:34:58,440
Speaker 4: for them. I think it broke them. It also makes

693
00:34:58,880 --> 00:35:00,879
Speaker 4: it hurts me to think of about what I've put

694
00:35:00,920 --> 00:35:04,799
Speaker 4: them through. But at the same time, I didn't have

695
00:35:04,840 --> 00:35:07,720
Speaker 4: the heart to tell anyone I was I was hiding it.

696
00:35:07,800 --> 00:35:10,399
Speaker 4: So this forced my hand. It forced me to come

697
00:35:10,440 --> 00:35:13,759
Speaker 4: out about my addiction, which was a blessing. It was

698
00:35:13,840 --> 00:35:15,719
Speaker 4: that was the silver lining of it, even though there's

699
00:35:15,719 --> 00:35:17,200
Speaker 4: not much of a silver lining in there.

700
00:35:17,680 --> 00:35:19,120
Speaker 1: That was that was a gift.

701
00:35:19,160 --> 00:35:23,160
Speaker 2: There's that out that a glimpse of positivity, which was

702
00:35:23,200 --> 00:35:25,880
Speaker 2: that that gift where you were like, I've got a problem.

703
00:35:26,360 --> 00:35:28,160
Speaker 2: I need to know, I need to sort myself out.

704
00:35:28,200 --> 00:35:30,479
Speaker 2: Because if you didn't have had that, then the next

705
00:35:30,520 --> 00:35:31,759
Speaker 2: time you probably wouldn't be here.

706
00:35:31,800 --> 00:35:32,480
Speaker 1: You'd probably be.

707
00:35:32,480 --> 00:35:36,880
Speaker 2: Dead in a way, Your your willingness to need to

708
00:35:37,040 --> 00:35:38,920
Speaker 2: need to turn up, to need to show up, to

709
00:35:39,000 --> 00:35:44,279
Speaker 2: need to to you know, be present, ultimately ultimately took

710
00:35:44,320 --> 00:35:46,719
Speaker 2: such a big hit on you that it nearly took

711
00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:50,480
Speaker 2: your life. Do you remember or ever with ever a

712
00:35:50,520 --> 00:35:52,520
Speaker 2: feeling that you that you felt like that you needed

713
00:35:52,560 --> 00:35:55,200
Speaker 2: to perform, that you needed to you know, people were

714
00:35:55,200 --> 00:35:57,440
Speaker 2: coming to see you, and that you that you needed

715
00:35:57,440 --> 00:36:00,200
Speaker 2: to turn up no matter how much you were suffering.

716
00:36:00,760 --> 00:36:02,000
Speaker 2: Was there an element of that you think.

717
00:36:01,880 --> 00:36:04,400
Speaker 4: One hundred and it was like, but it was very

718
00:36:04,520 --> 00:36:07,279
Speaker 4: much tied to the fact that if I don't.

719
00:36:07,040 --> 00:36:09,080
Speaker 1: Do it, then I'm going to lose their approval.

720
00:36:09,239 --> 00:36:09,479
Speaker 5: Yeah.

721
00:36:09,600 --> 00:36:11,800
Speaker 4: So that was the thing that was fueling the whole

722
00:36:12,400 --> 00:36:15,480
Speaker 4: the whole charge to try and keep chasing my career

723
00:36:15,640 --> 00:36:19,680
Speaker 4: was like if I don't have this, I lose myself,

724
00:36:19,960 --> 00:36:21,520
Speaker 4: you know, because this defines me.

725
00:36:22,880 --> 00:36:23,160
Speaker 5: Wow.

726
00:36:23,800 --> 00:36:27,480
Speaker 2: So, now that you wake up in hospital and you've

727
00:36:27,520 --> 00:36:31,480
Speaker 2: spoken to your mom, does that flip into putting everything

728
00:36:31,640 --> 00:36:37,600
Speaker 2: into getting clean that I know that probably sounds easier

729
00:36:37,640 --> 00:36:40,160
Speaker 2: than it is, but you know, was there did you

730
00:36:40,560 --> 00:36:43,480
Speaker 2: push everything aside and think I've got to or was

731
00:36:43,520 --> 00:36:46,040
Speaker 2: there still an element of that I've got to get

732
00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:47,280
Speaker 2: out and perform.

733
00:36:47,360 --> 00:36:47,480
Speaker 3: Na.

734
00:36:48,280 --> 00:36:51,719
Speaker 1: I went to detox for a month, fully fully committed.

735
00:36:52,040 --> 00:36:55,239
Speaker 4: No no, no, I was all I was committed to

736
00:36:55,360 --> 00:36:58,640
Speaker 4: was getting back out and touring. And I wasn't even

737
00:36:58,680 --> 00:37:01,640
Speaker 4: ready to stop. But they put me on this medication.

738
00:37:01,800 --> 00:37:04,520
Speaker 4: It was a replacement, so I couldn't get high. I

739
00:37:05,080 --> 00:37:07,680
Speaker 4: could just live my life, but I had to take

740
00:37:07,719 --> 00:37:14,279
Speaker 4: this thing every single morning, and that I wasn't ready

741
00:37:14,280 --> 00:37:16,520
Speaker 4: to stop. So I still had these habits. Anytime I

742
00:37:16,600 --> 00:37:20,160
Speaker 4: was feeling off or anxious, I was reaching for tablets

743
00:37:20,200 --> 00:37:22,720
Speaker 4: and stuff and did you get them?

744
00:37:22,920 --> 00:37:27,440
Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, I was easily. Yeah. Yeah.

745
00:37:27,440 --> 00:37:30,960
Speaker 4: So that was like a that was probably from about

746
00:37:30,960 --> 00:37:35,240
Speaker 4: twenty fourteen to twenty twenty.

747
00:37:35,560 --> 00:37:40,719
Speaker 2: So like on a treadmill, you know you're taking one

748
00:37:40,800 --> 00:37:43,640
Speaker 2: step forward, but you know the treadmills taking you back.

749
00:37:43,800 --> 00:37:45,040
Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, yeah.

750
00:37:45,080 --> 00:37:48,040
Speaker 4: At about twenty nineteen, I was so overweight. I was

751
00:37:48,160 --> 00:37:53,319
Speaker 4: thirty five kilos heavier. I was unhappy and just just no,

752
00:37:53,440 --> 00:37:54,600
Speaker 4: good man, I'm.

753
00:37:54,440 --> 00:37:56,520
Speaker 2: Going to say that you look an incredible shape right now.

754
00:37:56,840 --> 00:37:57,759
Speaker 1: Thank you man, thank you.

755
00:37:57,920 --> 00:38:02,319
Speaker 4: That's that's been a crucial part of it. But it

756
00:38:02,440 --> 00:38:04,680
Speaker 4: was like I remember going to my doctor and he

757
00:38:04,800 --> 00:38:08,160
Speaker 4: was like dude, you are an overweight drug addict.

758
00:38:08,280 --> 00:38:10,799
Speaker 1: You look disgusting. You need to sort your life out.

759
00:38:10,880 --> 00:38:11,760
Speaker 1: Oh is that brutal?

760
00:38:11,880 --> 00:38:12,040
Speaker 5: Was he?

761
00:38:12,280 --> 00:38:14,719
Speaker 4: And I remember being self ended man, like I was

762
00:38:14,800 --> 00:38:16,239
Speaker 4: so so sensitive.

763
00:38:16,719 --> 00:38:17,279
Speaker 2: Truth hurts.

764
00:38:17,560 --> 00:38:19,719
Speaker 4: Yeah, I was like, oh, I'm triggered, I want to

765
00:38:19,719 --> 00:38:22,120
Speaker 4: make a complaint, you know, and all this stuff. But

766
00:38:22,160 --> 00:38:24,759
Speaker 4: then I thought it dwelts on it and thought about it, like, well,

767
00:38:25,160 --> 00:38:27,799
Speaker 4: he's actually right. You know, no one's telling me this.

768
00:38:28,239 --> 00:38:30,719
Speaker 4: A lot of people around me were probably just enabling me,

769
00:38:31,400 --> 00:38:33,800
Speaker 4: probably didn't want to hurt my feelings, like trying to

770
00:38:33,880 --> 00:38:38,360
Speaker 4: navigate how to support me without saying the brutal, honest truth.

771
00:38:38,480 --> 00:38:40,960
Speaker 4: So I remember thinking back to that and thinking like

772
00:38:41,000 --> 00:38:42,480
Speaker 4: that was a bit of a moment for me.

773
00:38:42,560 --> 00:38:44,240
Speaker 1: That kind of turned me in the right direction.

774
00:38:44,480 --> 00:38:48,160
Speaker 4: So I think saying the brutal, honest truth sometimes is

775
00:38:48,520 --> 00:38:52,719
Speaker 4: what needs to be done. So I remember it was

776
00:38:52,760 --> 00:38:54,200
Speaker 4: just like I think I got to go to rehab.

777
00:38:54,200 --> 00:38:55,880
Speaker 4: I've got to try and get off all this stuff,

778
00:38:55,920 --> 00:38:58,319
Speaker 4: but actually give it a shot. So I went into

779
00:38:58,440 --> 00:39:00,840
Speaker 4: rehab for like four and a half months in twenty

780
00:39:00,880 --> 00:39:05,200
Speaker 4: twenty during the COVID lockdowns. I went in before it started,

781
00:39:05,239 --> 00:39:07,040
Speaker 4: and then got out while it was popping off, So

782
00:39:07,080 --> 00:39:07,840
Speaker 4: it was bizarre.

783
00:39:09,719 --> 00:39:12,720
Speaker 1: I thought that I was going to be sweet.

784
00:39:12,880 --> 00:39:15,000
Speaker 4: I thought that I was going to be have a

785
00:39:15,040 --> 00:39:17,480
Speaker 4: switch of my mindset, but I wasn't.

786
00:39:17,800 --> 00:39:19,240
Speaker 1: I was still in the rehab.

787
00:39:19,239 --> 00:39:22,600
Speaker 4: I was still getting high in the rehab, which is

788
00:39:22,680 --> 00:39:26,160
Speaker 4: really frowned upon while you're there. I got out, and

789
00:39:26,360 --> 00:39:28,759
Speaker 4: once I had been reduced off all the medications, I

790
00:39:28,840 --> 00:39:31,799
Speaker 4: was in such a bad state of mind that the

791
00:39:31,840 --> 00:39:34,759
Speaker 4: only option for me was to well. I thought the

792
00:39:34,800 --> 00:39:36,719
Speaker 4: only option was to go down to the pub and

793
00:39:36,760 --> 00:39:38,840
Speaker 4: have a drink to try and numb these feelings. But

794
00:39:38,880 --> 00:39:40,480
Speaker 4: I was like, if I do that, Mum and Dad

795
00:39:40,520 --> 00:39:42,719
Speaker 4: are going to know and I can't put them through

796
00:39:42,760 --> 00:39:48,400
Speaker 4: that again. And then so my option then this is crazy,

797
00:39:48,520 --> 00:39:53,319
Speaker 4: Like this is just so bad. But I went and

798
00:39:53,400 --> 00:39:56,839
Speaker 4: got listerine mouthwashed and just started chugging on that because

799
00:39:56,840 --> 00:40:00,320
Speaker 4: it has alcohol in it, and I would take twouffls

800
00:40:00,360 --> 00:40:02,240
Speaker 4: of it and it would give me this numb feeling.

801
00:40:02,480 --> 00:40:05,840
Speaker 4: It would numb those feelings and then I would feel okay.

802
00:40:05,880 --> 00:40:07,719
Speaker 4: I was able to navigate through my day like that.

803
00:40:07,840 --> 00:40:10,800
Speaker 4: And then I started googling the effects of what drinking

804
00:40:10,840 --> 00:40:14,040
Speaker 4: that would actually do, and if you drink the alcohol enlistine,

805
00:40:14,080 --> 00:40:16,200
Speaker 4: you can go blind. So I was like, I'm already

806
00:40:16,239 --> 00:40:18,400
Speaker 4: half blind. I can't do that. So I went to

807
00:40:18,440 --> 00:40:22,280
Speaker 4: the doctor and told him, which is progress, I guess

808
00:40:22,280 --> 00:40:25,000
Speaker 4: because I was actually honest when I'm not usually honest

809
00:40:25,040 --> 00:40:28,080
Speaker 4: about it. He put me on some different medications and

810
00:40:28,120 --> 00:40:34,440
Speaker 4: that I was on like probably like six different medications. Yeah, brutal.

811
00:40:34,640 --> 00:40:37,799
Speaker 4: And from then on I was like, Okay, I need

812
00:40:37,840 --> 00:40:40,000
Speaker 4: to sort my life out and just get my act together.

813
00:40:40,080 --> 00:40:44,359
Speaker 4: But I was so unhappy and depressed that I had

814
00:40:44,440 --> 00:40:47,439
Speaker 4: no motivation. I was like, how do I get myself back?

815
00:40:47,440 --> 00:40:50,120
Speaker 4: Because I remember there was one time I got after

816
00:40:50,160 --> 00:40:53,359
Speaker 4: that detox. I got really fit and I got in

817
00:40:53,400 --> 00:40:55,040
Speaker 4: really good shape and I was going to the gym

818
00:40:55,080 --> 00:40:58,120
Speaker 4: and eating really well and I felt the best I'd

819
00:40:58,160 --> 00:40:58,720
Speaker 4: ever felt.

820
00:40:59,040 --> 00:41:03,680
Speaker 1: But that didn't last. Relapse Yeah, yeah, what's the trigger?

821
00:41:03,719 --> 00:41:05,719
Speaker 2: What are you fighting? You know when you're when you're

822
00:41:05,760 --> 00:41:08,440
Speaker 2: in great shape and you're feeling good, and you know,

823
00:41:09,520 --> 00:41:12,759
Speaker 2: how easy is it to relapse? Or where are the

824
00:41:12,800 --> 00:41:15,520
Speaker 2: triggers for the readerup there? So a whole crash again,

825
00:41:15,560 --> 00:41:15,800
Speaker 2: isn't it?

826
00:41:15,960 --> 00:41:16,160
Speaker 1: Yeah?

827
00:41:16,880 --> 00:41:19,880
Speaker 4: Yeah, so for me it was. It wasn't an escape

828
00:41:19,960 --> 00:41:21,759
Speaker 4: kind of or a trigger kind of thing. It was

829
00:41:21,840 --> 00:41:24,200
Speaker 4: like I put in four or five months in the

830
00:41:24,239 --> 00:41:26,600
Speaker 4: gym and then I remember leaving it and going like,

831
00:41:26,640 --> 00:41:28,640
Speaker 4: I'm doing so well, I might as well have a

832
00:41:28,880 --> 00:41:32,279
Speaker 4: treat myself to a bit of a high. And I

833
00:41:32,320 --> 00:41:34,040
Speaker 4: was doing that, and it would be I'd probably do

834
00:41:34,080 --> 00:41:36,520
Speaker 4: it every few weeks, but then out of nowhere, it

835
00:41:36,760 --> 00:41:39,120
Speaker 4: snowboard out of control again, you know what I mean.

836
00:41:39,200 --> 00:41:42,279
Speaker 4: So it wasn't an escape thing. It was just a

837
00:41:42,320 --> 00:41:43,960
Speaker 4: reward and.

838
00:41:44,680 --> 00:41:48,759
Speaker 2: Will it will it always always snap you up? Yeah,

839
00:41:48,840 --> 00:41:50,800
Speaker 2: one one way or another.

840
00:41:50,960 --> 00:41:54,200
Speaker 4: It was like, I feel like I had such a

841
00:41:54,200 --> 00:41:57,560
Speaker 4: low self esteem and low opinion of myself. I didn't

842
00:41:57,560 --> 00:42:01,480
Speaker 4: trust myself to make my own decisions. I was able

843
00:42:01,560 --> 00:42:06,160
Speaker 4: to lie to myself and manipulate myself into using drugs

844
00:42:06,840 --> 00:42:09,800
Speaker 4: through anything that I was going through. I would believe

845
00:42:09,880 --> 00:42:12,400
Speaker 4: the lies that I would tell myself that Okay, I

846
00:42:12,480 --> 00:42:14,839
Speaker 4: need drugs now, and I would just go and do it.

847
00:42:15,160 --> 00:42:18,720
Speaker 4: And now fast forward to after getting out of rehab

848
00:42:19,200 --> 00:42:22,440
Speaker 4: and I was still slipping up. I was drinking the

849
00:42:22,440 --> 00:42:26,240
Speaker 4: listrine and stuff like that. I then went and started

850
00:42:26,760 --> 00:42:29,680
Speaker 4: smoking weed like because it was prescribed by the doctor.

851
00:42:29,719 --> 00:42:32,160
Speaker 4: So that was like the justification in my head, even

852
00:42:32,239 --> 00:42:34,120
Speaker 4: though I knew deep down it wasn't right for me.

853
00:42:34,600 --> 00:42:39,279
Speaker 4: And then about two years ago I became I was

854
00:42:39,320 --> 00:42:42,760
Speaker 4: probably about two years ago my friend became born again Christian,

855
00:42:43,440 --> 00:42:47,960
Speaker 4: and I was very anti religion and very against it,

856
00:42:48,000 --> 00:42:51,120
Speaker 4: but I saw the way it changed him and healed

857
00:42:51,160 --> 00:42:54,160
Speaker 4: him in such a radical way so quickly that I

858
00:42:54,239 --> 00:42:56,480
Speaker 4: was like, maybe there's something to this, and I started

859
00:42:56,520 --> 00:42:59,919
Speaker 4: exploring it for myself. And then about a year ago,

860
00:43:00,440 --> 00:43:02,600
Speaker 4: my wall came down to it and I believed in

861
00:43:02,800 --> 00:43:05,640
Speaker 4: the Gospel. I started believing in the whole story of

862
00:43:05,680 --> 00:43:09,319
Speaker 4: the Bible. And then the moment I gave my life

863
00:43:09,320 --> 00:43:12,640
Speaker 4: to God was the moment that I was able to

864
00:43:12,760 --> 00:43:16,840
Speaker 4: completely stop manipulating myself, because it was like suddenly I

865
00:43:16,920 --> 00:43:22,320
Speaker 4: had someone I had the highest authority there.

866
00:43:22,160 --> 00:43:23,600
Speaker 2: Is in me accountable to.

867
00:43:23,920 --> 00:43:28,120
Speaker 4: Yeah, not myself anymore. I'm no longer relying on my

868
00:43:28,160 --> 00:43:31,040
Speaker 4: own decision making skills, which have always been so poor.

869
00:43:31,440 --> 00:43:34,920
Speaker 4: I'm relying on Him. And it's almost like it was

870
00:43:35,160 --> 00:43:38,239
Speaker 4: very instant. Like I was on all these medications, I

871
00:43:38,280 --> 00:43:39,600
Speaker 4: didn't want to get off of them because I was

872
00:43:39,640 --> 00:43:41,880
Speaker 4: just cruising. And then as soon as I gave my

873
00:43:41,920 --> 00:43:44,200
Speaker 4: life to God is like, bang, You've got to get

874
00:43:44,239 --> 00:43:47,200
Speaker 4: off all this stuff, and it's just streamlined the process.

875
00:43:48,040 --> 00:43:52,040
Speaker 4: I've had moments where I would have used in the past,

876
00:43:52,080 --> 00:43:54,760
Speaker 4: like I get anxious or whatever, and I just haven't.

877
00:43:54,800 --> 00:43:57,440
Speaker 4: I've just gone into prayer because I know I can't

878
00:43:57,480 --> 00:43:59,680
Speaker 4: do that, and it's like having him there is the

879
00:43:59,719 --> 00:44:00,400
Speaker 4: reason for that.

880
00:44:00,680 --> 00:44:02,480
Speaker 2: And were you writing, you know, when you were going

881
00:44:02,560 --> 00:44:05,719
Speaker 2: just before you found God, all through your rehab, were

882
00:44:05,760 --> 00:44:06,520
Speaker 2: you still writing?

883
00:44:06,800 --> 00:44:10,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was. It wasn't that great, no, but it

884
00:44:10,160 --> 00:44:12,920
Speaker 1: was so yourself. Yeah, I was. I was still writing.

885
00:44:13,120 --> 00:44:17,440
Speaker 4: Yeah, And then when I got out, I was. I

886
00:44:17,480 --> 00:44:20,800
Speaker 4: wrote I wrote this album probably about over the last

887
00:44:20,800 --> 00:44:26,440
Speaker 4: three years. But yeah, that shift towards God shifted everything.

888
00:44:26,440 --> 00:44:28,799
Speaker 4: And I used to I used to mock God. I

889
00:44:28,920 --> 00:44:32,319
Speaker 4: used to mock Christians in my songs. There's so many

890
00:44:32,320 --> 00:44:36,520
Speaker 4: songs where I just completely disrespect it. I thought that

891
00:44:36,600 --> 00:44:40,200
Speaker 4: if anyone became born again Christian or started proclaiming the

892
00:44:40,280 --> 00:44:43,520
Speaker 4: name of Jesus Christ, that they were brainwashed or in

893
00:44:43,560 --> 00:44:46,680
Speaker 4: a cult. And then when I actually explored it, for

894
00:44:46,800 --> 00:44:49,040
Speaker 4: i'd never looked into it. I was speaking from a

895
00:44:49,080 --> 00:44:52,160
Speaker 4: place of ignorance. And then when I actually looked into

896
00:44:52,200 --> 00:44:53,799
Speaker 4: it and explored it with an open mind.

897
00:44:53,800 --> 00:44:54,720
Speaker 1: It changed everything.

898
00:44:55,560 --> 00:44:58,360
Speaker 2: And then when you say it changed overnight, you're talking

899
00:44:58,400 --> 00:45:02,200
Speaker 2: about you know, cold turkey on absolutely everything, no alcohol.

900
00:45:02,560 --> 00:45:03,600
Speaker 2: How did that work?

901
00:45:03,920 --> 00:45:07,880
Speaker 1: So it was like the weed was instant. Stop that.

902
00:45:09,320 --> 00:45:13,080
Speaker 4: Then it was like I was on mood stabilizers, I

903
00:45:13,200 --> 00:45:19,200
Speaker 4: was on antidepressants, I was on other stuff of bipolar

904
00:45:19,200 --> 00:45:23,120
Speaker 4: and stuff, and I just completely stopped them. Wow, which

905
00:45:23,200 --> 00:45:25,840
Speaker 4: was and it wasn't even that difficult, which is bizarre.

906
00:45:26,160 --> 00:45:28,719
Speaker 4: I was on the drug replacement thing that they put

907
00:45:28,760 --> 00:45:30,399
Speaker 4: me on in the past. I was also on that.

908
00:45:30,680 --> 00:45:33,040
Speaker 4: I've been able to stop that and I've got two

909
00:45:33,080 --> 00:45:35,800
Speaker 4: more to go that I'm just gradually weaning off slowly.

910
00:45:36,400 --> 00:45:39,040
Speaker 2: Amazing mate. And so your work, now, let's talk about

911
00:45:39,080 --> 00:45:42,279
Speaker 2: your work, because you know, your whole career has been

912
00:45:42,520 --> 00:45:46,440
Speaker 2: about music. Your whole career has been you know, about writing.

913
00:45:46,560 --> 00:45:50,080
Speaker 2: I suppose from the heart right you write all life experiences?

914
00:45:50,239 --> 00:45:51,000
Speaker 1: Is it all? You know?

915
00:45:51,360 --> 00:45:51,400
Speaker 5: What?

916
00:45:51,600 --> 00:45:53,160
Speaker 2: What's it about?

917
00:45:53,600 --> 00:45:57,920
Speaker 4: My music has always been whatever I'm going through because

918
00:45:57,960 --> 00:46:01,440
Speaker 4: I've struggled being honest with people in person or like

919
00:46:01,680 --> 00:46:05,560
Speaker 4: with my friends or family. I've always struggled sharing whatever's happening.

920
00:46:06,080 --> 00:46:08,279
Speaker 4: Music was the way that I spoke about it, so

921
00:46:09,120 --> 00:46:10,960
Speaker 4: that was quite confronting for a lot of people who

922
00:46:10,960 --> 00:46:13,200
Speaker 4: would be around me. I'd be like seeming like I'm

923
00:46:13,239 --> 00:46:15,480
Speaker 4: happy and like I'm enjoying life and there's nothing to

924
00:46:15,520 --> 00:46:18,040
Speaker 4: worry about. But then I'm doing these songs that are dark,

925
00:46:18,120 --> 00:46:21,120
Speaker 4: talking about, you know, struggling with all sorts of stuff.

926
00:46:22,160 --> 00:46:25,160
Speaker 4: And that's what I've always I've always channeled whatever is

927
00:46:25,200 --> 00:46:28,920
Speaker 4: going on, and I think that's been so helpful and

928
00:46:28,960 --> 00:46:34,040
Speaker 4: therapeutic for me. But with this album. I started writing

929
00:46:34,080 --> 00:46:39,440
Speaker 4: this album when life started turning towards being fun again,

930
00:46:39,640 --> 00:46:43,239
Speaker 4: like I was. I feel like from twenty to thirty five,

931
00:46:43,320 --> 00:46:47,320
Speaker 4: everything was black and white and gray scale. And then

932
00:46:47,560 --> 00:46:51,400
Speaker 4: after probably three years ago, is like when I started

933
00:46:51,400 --> 00:46:53,800
Speaker 4: realizing there was color coming back into my life. It

934
00:46:53,920 --> 00:46:57,000
Speaker 4: started feeling like going from two D to three D again.

935
00:46:57,080 --> 00:46:59,960
Speaker 4: It was like, oh, this is good. I was optim

936
00:47:00,040 --> 00:47:03,520
Speaker 4: mystic about life. I felt like I can actually get

937
00:47:03,520 --> 00:47:07,400
Speaker 4: my life back together. But it wasn't It wasn't driven

938
00:47:08,320 --> 00:47:12,480
Speaker 4: towards trying to build my career back. That was part

939
00:47:12,520 --> 00:47:14,560
Speaker 4: of it, but it was more about, Okay, I just

940
00:47:14,640 --> 00:47:18,440
Speaker 4: need to be healthy now, Like I'm so over being unhealthy.

941
00:47:18,480 --> 00:47:20,920
Speaker 4: And constantly miserable all the time. I want to do

942
00:47:21,040 --> 00:47:21,920
Speaker 4: what's right for me.

943
00:47:22,560 --> 00:47:25,560
Speaker 2: You're stepping into life, right, Well yeah, yeah.

944
00:47:25,360 --> 00:47:31,759
Speaker 4: So I started going so hard into the gym, started kickboxing,

945
00:47:31,920 --> 00:47:37,320
Speaker 4: started dialing in my diet, and just basically I put

946
00:47:37,400 --> 00:47:40,720
Speaker 4: that all or nothing mentality to everything that was healthy.

947
00:47:41,200 --> 00:47:45,799
Speaker 4: And then over a few years just started losing all

948
00:47:45,840 --> 00:47:49,239
Speaker 4: the weight and got really fit. And that has been

949
00:47:49,360 --> 00:47:53,280
Speaker 4: like instrumental. Man, like that when you go and smash

950
00:47:53,320 --> 00:47:56,160
Speaker 4: yourself with a brutal workout, if you like, if I

951
00:47:56,200 --> 00:47:59,120
Speaker 4: wake up, if I go to bed any time past

952
00:47:59,200 --> 00:48:01,600
Speaker 4: midnight next day, I feel super seedy.

953
00:48:01,760 --> 00:48:04,160
Speaker 1: I'll be very tired and I won't want to do much.

954
00:48:04,440 --> 00:48:06,720
Speaker 4: But if I go straight to the gym and destroy

955
00:48:06,840 --> 00:48:10,160
Speaker 4: myself for like forty five minutes to an hour doing

956
00:48:10,200 --> 00:48:14,320
Speaker 4: some hectic cardio workout, I will feel like I've slept

957
00:48:14,360 --> 00:48:14,960
Speaker 4: like a baby.

958
00:48:15,080 --> 00:48:17,799
Speaker 1: You know it brings me to life. Yeah, of course

959
00:48:17,840 --> 00:48:18,160
Speaker 1: it does.

960
00:48:18,840 --> 00:48:22,560
Speaker 2: You know, you endoorphins are flowing, you start to see

961
00:48:22,560 --> 00:48:24,840
Speaker 2: a physical change, You start to think a lot clearer.

962
00:48:24,880 --> 00:48:27,759
Speaker 2: This is what I say to people about exercise. You know,

963
00:48:28,120 --> 00:48:30,480
Speaker 2: you clear your head, you start to think a lot clearer.

964
00:48:30,760 --> 00:48:34,680
Speaker 2: That brain fog just goes what you're doing. Now, how's

965
00:48:34,680 --> 00:48:37,319
Speaker 2: that evolved your music? How's it evolved yourself? Because you're

966
00:48:37,600 --> 00:48:40,759
Speaker 2: from what we've just spoken about to you sitting in

967
00:48:40,800 --> 00:48:43,399
Speaker 2: front of me, you look like you're healthy. I gave

968
00:48:43,440 --> 00:48:45,560
Speaker 2: you a hug when you came in. You're a solid guy.

969
00:48:45,680 --> 00:48:47,520
Speaker 2: You know, you can tell that you work out. You

970
00:48:47,560 --> 00:48:50,640
Speaker 2: seem like you're very clear minded. Now, how's that affected

971
00:48:50,640 --> 00:48:54,520
Speaker 2: your work and how what's next for you moving forward?

972
00:48:54,640 --> 00:48:57,000
Speaker 4: Yeah, I feel like I'm in the best place that

973
00:48:57,040 --> 00:48:59,360
Speaker 4: I've ever been in. I don't feel like. I know

974
00:48:59,560 --> 00:49:02,279
Speaker 4: addicts should never say never that they'll never go back,

975
00:49:02,320 --> 00:49:05,360
Speaker 4: but I genuinely feel like I won't. Like, I feel

976
00:49:05,400 --> 00:49:08,520
Speaker 4: like the faith element of my life has been such

977
00:49:08,520 --> 00:49:12,200
Speaker 4: a big part of it that that.

978
00:49:12,239 --> 00:49:13,799
Speaker 1: Is the center of my life now.

979
00:49:15,280 --> 00:49:19,640
Speaker 4: My music, the album that's coming out next this Friday,

980
00:49:19,680 --> 00:49:25,399
Speaker 4: actually is is channeled from a place of hope. It's

981
00:49:25,440 --> 00:49:28,000
Speaker 4: a very optimistic album that is like I feel like

982
00:49:28,080 --> 00:49:31,440
Speaker 4: if anyone is going through some dark stuff, it is

983
00:49:32,320 --> 00:49:34,600
Speaker 4: a good one that will motivate you in that regard.

984
00:49:34,800 --> 00:49:38,200
Speaker 4: Like I went through some hectic stuff during that, like

985
00:49:38,239 --> 00:49:42,840
Speaker 4: a really horrible breakup, and just channeled it all into God.

986
00:49:42,960 --> 00:49:47,040
Speaker 4: And also exercise. Like I was in a dark place

987
00:49:47,080 --> 00:49:50,919
Speaker 4: and just just committed to going into prayer and kickboxing

988
00:49:51,000 --> 00:49:54,040
Speaker 4: rather than turning to something unhealthy.

989
00:49:54,280 --> 00:49:57,560
Speaker 2: Faith and exercise. Yeah, great combination, yeah.

990
00:49:57,440 --> 00:50:02,120
Speaker 4: Man, And I feel like going forward. Faith is the

991
00:50:02,120 --> 00:50:05,920
Speaker 4: most important thing to me now. It has become the

992
00:50:05,960 --> 00:50:09,719
Speaker 4: center of my life and I'm not sure what it

993
00:50:09,840 --> 00:50:12,040
Speaker 4: looks like for me, but I feel like incorporating it

994
00:50:12,080 --> 00:50:17,320
Speaker 4: into my music and talking about my faith quite boldly

995
00:50:18,000 --> 00:50:20,560
Speaker 4: is what I feel like He's got. What I feel

996
00:50:20,560 --> 00:50:24,080
Speaker 4: like God's plan is for me is to come from

997
00:50:24,120 --> 00:50:28,399
Speaker 4: a pretty dark industry where so much stuff is normalized,

998
00:50:28,520 --> 00:50:31,080
Speaker 4: like a lot of debauchery, like a lot of that.

999
00:50:31,680 --> 00:50:33,080
Speaker 2: There's a darkness to it, isn't that.

1000
00:50:33,360 --> 00:50:35,880
Speaker 4: Yeah, Like the sex, drugs, and rock and roll lifestyle

1001
00:50:35,960 --> 00:50:39,400
Speaker 4: is very attractive in that industry, and I feel like

1002
00:50:40,640 --> 00:50:42,879
Speaker 4: I feel like He's calling me to go back into

1003
00:50:42,960 --> 00:50:45,279
Speaker 4: that industry and shine his light in there.

1004
00:50:46,000 --> 00:50:48,640
Speaker 2: Amazing. So what's the name of your album that's coming

1005
00:50:48,680 --> 00:50:50,320
Speaker 2: out this Friday.

1006
00:50:50,560 --> 00:50:52,959
Speaker 4: It's called Out of the Blue. Out of the Blue, Yeah,

1007
00:50:53,080 --> 00:50:57,040
Speaker 4: first album in eight years, So that title is quite

1008
00:50:57,040 --> 00:50:59,480
Speaker 4: fitting because it's pretty much coming out of nowhere. But

1009
00:50:59,600 --> 00:51:02,160
Speaker 4: also the Blue just represents the darkness.

1010
00:51:02,520 --> 00:51:05,880
Speaker 2: Got you amazing, mate, Well listen, make sure that I

1011
00:51:05,920 --> 00:51:08,960
Speaker 2: get a signed copy. Yes please, Matt. Yeah, it's been

1012
00:51:09,000 --> 00:51:13,360
Speaker 2: an absolute pleasure talking to you. May How important is

1013
00:51:13,440 --> 00:51:15,080
Speaker 2: it to be honest with yourself?

1014
00:51:15,760 --> 00:51:20,840
Speaker 4: M Being honest with yourself is everything. Like if I

1015
00:51:20,880 --> 00:51:23,320
Speaker 4: had have been honest with myself, I would have saved

1016
00:51:23,360 --> 00:51:27,080
Speaker 4: myself so much heartache and so much pain, if I

1017
00:51:27,120 --> 00:51:29,680
Speaker 4: had have just shared what was going on instead of

1018
00:51:29,719 --> 00:51:32,759
Speaker 4: being in denial about it. It is everything. But for me,

1019
00:51:32,840 --> 00:51:36,680
Speaker 4: I found that just so difficult to do. I felt

1020
00:51:36,680 --> 00:51:39,200
Speaker 4: like I was a burden, and I never wanted to

1021
00:51:39,239 --> 00:51:41,160
Speaker 4: be a burden, so I would just hide it and

1022
00:51:42,080 --> 00:51:45,720
Speaker 4: keep it moving, you know. But now where my life

1023
00:51:45,760 --> 00:51:46,880
Speaker 4: is at at the moment, I.

1024
00:51:48,600 --> 00:51:48,920
Speaker 1: Don't.

1025
00:51:49,640 --> 00:51:52,360
Speaker 4: I no longer care like I think when you're a

1026
00:51:52,360 --> 00:51:55,239
Speaker 4: people pleaser for so long, you desire people's approval all

1027
00:51:55,280 --> 00:51:59,040
Speaker 4: the time. But lately I don't really need it anymore.

1028
00:51:59,080 --> 00:52:01,560
Speaker 4: I don't care if people approve or they don't approve.

1029
00:52:01,640 --> 00:52:04,600
Speaker 4: Like once you start talking about faith in God, a

1030
00:52:04,640 --> 00:52:06,480
Speaker 4: lot of people don't approve of that. Like if you

1031
00:52:06,520 --> 00:52:09,560
Speaker 4: say the name of Jesus Christ, people turn on you.

1032
00:52:09,640 --> 00:52:13,359
Speaker 4: And that's what's been happening. I've been quite vocal about it,

1033
00:52:13,400 --> 00:52:17,359
Speaker 4: but now my identity no longer is tied to what

1034
00:52:17,440 --> 00:52:20,480
Speaker 4: people think of me anymore. So I'm able to let

1035
00:52:20,520 --> 00:52:23,120
Speaker 4: go and just say it's okay. I understand where they're

1036
00:52:23,120 --> 00:52:25,480
Speaker 4: coming from, but it doesn't phaze me anymore.

1037
00:52:26,000 --> 00:52:29,680
Speaker 2: Amazing, mate, Listen, thank you so much. Out of the Blue,

1038
00:52:30,080 --> 00:52:33,360
Speaker 2: your next album out this Friday. Mate. It's been a

1039
00:52:33,400 --> 00:52:35,640
Speaker 2: pleasure talking to you, and I wish you all the best,

1040
00:52:35,680 --> 00:52:38,200
Speaker 2: not only with your next album but with your future.

1041
00:52:38,360 --> 00:52:40,120
Speaker 1: Thank you so much, Thanks so much for having me

1042
00:52:40,160 --> 00:52:41,920
Speaker 1: Man three sixties.

1043
00:52:42,080 --> 00:52:45,240
Speaker 2: New album, out of the Blue is out now, featuring

1044
00:52:45,280 --> 00:52:48,960
Speaker 2: the single Save My Soul. He's also on tour and

1045
00:52:49,000 --> 00:52:52,160
Speaker 2: I'll put the details in the show notes. Thanks for

1046
00:52:52,239 --> 00:52:55,680
Speaker 2: joining me on this episode of Headgame. If you enjoyed

1047
00:52:55,680 --> 00:52:59,400
Speaker 2: this episode, please leave me a review. I'm at Middleton.

1048
00:52:59,680 --> 00:53:01,279
Speaker 2: See you again next time.

1049
00:53:02,239 --> 00:53:08,959
Speaker 5: MHM.