WEBVTT - Lessons, not life sentences: Jeff Fenech Pt. 1 0:00:01.880 --> 0:00:04.880 The public has had a long held fascination with detectives. 0:00:05.360 --> 0:00:07.800 Detective see a side of life the average person is 0:00:07.880 --> 0:00:11.080 never exposed to. I spent thirty four years as a cop. 0:00:11.560 --> 0:00:14.040 For twenty five of those years I was catching killers. 0:00:14.440 --> 0:00:16.200 That's what I did for a living. I was a 0:00:16.200 --> 0:00:20.560 homicide detective. I'm no longer just interviewing bad guys. Instead, 0:00:20.600 --> 0:00:23.120 I'm taking the public into the world in which I operated. 0:00:23.840 --> 0:00:26.400 The guests I talk to each week have amazing stories 0:00:26.440 --> 0:00:28.760 from all sides of the law. The interviews are raw 0:00:28.800 --> 0:00:31.440 and honest, just like the people I talk to. Some 0:00:31.600 --> 0:00:34.640 of the content and language might be confronting. That's because 0:00:34.640 --> 0:00:37.640 no one who comes into contact with crime is left unchanged. 0:00:38.159 --> 0:00:40.320 Join me now as I take you into this world. 0:00:45.960 --> 0:00:48.839 He went from a youth detention center to become the 0:00:48.920 --> 0:00:52.600 four times world boxing champion. Today I'm at the home 0:00:52.640 --> 0:00:53.560 of Ossie Icon. 0:00:53.840 --> 0:00:54.480 Jeff Fennick. 0:00:54.800 --> 0:00:58.320 We're talking about the moment a troublesome teenager walked into 0:00:58.360 --> 0:01:02.040 the Newtown Police Boys Club and change boxing history forever. 0:01:03.760 --> 0:01:07.000 Jeff Faneck, Welcome to I Catch Killers. Thank you well 0:01:07.400 --> 0:01:09.199 on a true crime podcast. 0:01:09.600 --> 0:01:11.480 Always a pleasurement. I love doing this stuff. 0:01:11.520 --> 0:01:14.640 I love being able to share my stories and hopefully 0:01:15.440 --> 0:01:17.480 the stories that I share make people a bit of people. 0:01:17.959 --> 0:01:20.560 Yeah, well, I think and the fact that the life 0:01:20.600 --> 0:01:23.000 that you've lived in boxing, like you know, in the 0:01:23.160 --> 0:01:25.560 in the hurting game, as they say, a professional fighter, 0:01:26.240 --> 0:01:28.039 there's a lot of lessons that can be learned. And 0:01:28.080 --> 0:01:30.400 I see a lot of people's lives have been turned 0:01:30.440 --> 0:01:36.080 around by pursuing like you did, going becoming a professional boxer, 0:01:36.319 --> 0:01:38.120 turning away from a life of crime. There's a lot 0:01:38.120 --> 0:01:39.920 of lessons that can be learned in the boxing ring, 0:01:40.000 --> 0:01:40.320 isn't it. 0:01:40.400 --> 0:01:40.600 Yeah. 0:01:40.640 --> 0:01:44.720 Well, I certainly wouldn't be here without boxing. But the 0:01:44.760 --> 0:01:47.400 reason why boxing because Johnny Lewis saying if I didn't 0:01:47.400 --> 0:01:49.600 meet Johnny, and there's not a chance that I would 0:01:49.600 --> 0:01:51.240 have went back to the gym the next day. I 0:01:51.280 --> 0:01:53.040 didn't want to go back to the gym nexto. I 0:01:53.080 --> 0:01:55.280 got beat up by somebody. Shit, and he's telling me 0:01:55.360 --> 0:01:57.760 I can fight. I'm not stupid. I'm not going back 0:01:57.760 --> 0:02:00.720 to get beat up. It was it was Johnny Lewis, 0:02:00.720 --> 0:02:04.680 who I don't know, had this magnetic force that made 0:02:04.680 --> 0:02:06.680 people fall in love with him to this day. 0:02:06.720 --> 0:02:07.240 I love him. 0:02:07.400 --> 0:02:09.000 We'll try and we'll try and work that out. 0:02:09.520 --> 0:02:12.200 I know I've come into the orbit of Johnny Lewis 0:02:12.200 --> 0:02:13.880 and he has got some magic, hasn't he. 0:02:14.120 --> 0:02:17.400 Yeah, to me, he brings out the best in people. 0:02:17.560 --> 0:02:21.880 Yea, he makes you want. He's very very smart. 0:02:22.160 --> 0:02:24.000 He doesn't tell you when to go to the Olympics 0:02:24.040 --> 0:02:26.239 in the first time we sees you, but he tells 0:02:26.280 --> 0:02:28.000 you if you keep working hard and you prepare to 0:02:28.080 --> 0:02:30.440 roll your sleeves up, things will happen. And he's very 0:02:30.520 --> 0:02:33.440 very smart in the way that he will set you 0:02:33.520 --> 0:02:36.520 goals that are rechievable and then when you start achieving them, 0:02:36.560 --> 0:02:38.720 then he'll know. He'll put you on that next level. 0:02:38.760 --> 0:02:40.800 And I don't think there's anybody better than him that. 0:02:41.200 --> 0:02:45.040 Yeah, it's fascinating the influence that Johnny has and the 0:02:45.080 --> 0:02:48.239 amount of respect he's got in regards to you. It's 0:02:48.240 --> 0:02:51.520 not a fast stretch of the imagination on a podcast 0:02:51.520 --> 0:02:53.200 that if you didn't find boxing, I could have been 0:02:53.240 --> 0:02:56.520 talking about your time, your time inside and all the 0:02:56.520 --> 0:02:59.160 crimes that you've committed because you were heading down the 0:02:59.200 --> 0:03:00.000 path as a young. 0:03:00.320 --> 0:03:02.519 Yeah, it wouldn't be I would like you wouldn't be 0:03:02.560 --> 0:03:06.799 talking about Yeah, I don't know where i'd be aware. 0:03:07.000 --> 0:03:09.119 We all most either still be in jail or I'd 0:03:09.200 --> 0:03:11.239 be dead today. So I'm just yeah, I'm blessed. I 0:03:11.320 --> 0:03:14.760 found a sport that I am that I was I 0:03:14.800 --> 0:03:16.320 think I was born to be involved in. 0:03:16.360 --> 0:03:18.440 I mean, I never boxed in my life. I was 0:03:18.440 --> 0:03:19.200 seventeen and a half. 0:03:19.280 --> 0:03:22.480 I never watched any but of course i'd heard of 0:03:22.520 --> 0:03:25.280 my armed Ali, But yeah, I never dreamt of being 0:03:25.280 --> 0:03:26.760 a fight. I want to be a first grade football 0:03:26.760 --> 0:03:28.919 and that's all I that's all I wanted to do. 0:03:29.080 --> 0:03:30.160 That was your passion. 0:03:30.360 --> 0:03:32.520 I actually saw you play at Cumberland Oval when you 0:03:32.560 --> 0:03:35.600 had your break from boxing and you signed with the 0:03:35.680 --> 0:03:38.440 NRL Paramatta and I think it was reserve grade and 0:03:38.800 --> 0:03:41.720 I'll see what happens when you took the field. So 0:03:42.080 --> 0:03:44.800 that was an experience. We'll talk about that later. I 0:03:44.880 --> 0:03:47.640 just want to ask up front, like you are and 0:03:48.280 --> 0:03:51.200 I think the eighties when you start having your success 0:03:51.240 --> 0:03:55.120 in boxing, Australia was devoid of sporting heroes and we're 0:03:55.120 --> 0:03:58.680 a sporting nation. And your success in the in the 0:03:58.680 --> 0:04:01.400 eighties and mid eighties when you won the world title, 0:04:02.240 --> 0:04:05.280 you became virtually an icon. You know, everyone knew who 0:04:05.280 --> 0:04:08.240 you were. How was that being Jeff Ferneck at that stage. 0:04:08.400 --> 0:04:11.920 Again, it was pretty strange. You know, I don't think 0:04:11.920 --> 0:04:13.480 I was really ready for it, and I don't think 0:04:14.280 --> 0:04:15.720 even to this day, there are a lot of people that 0:04:15.720 --> 0:04:17.919 aren't really ready to cope. 0:04:17.600 --> 0:04:18.119 With that stuff. 0:04:18.120 --> 0:04:20.800 Although we had managers and back back then we had 0:04:20.800 --> 0:04:23.919 nobody had John Lewis, you know. And you know, I 0:04:24.000 --> 0:04:26.560 made money and I spent it, and I have no 0:04:26.680 --> 0:04:30.360 doubt that I could have had millions and millions more 0:04:30.040 --> 0:04:32.080 if I was managed to properly, if I had somebody 0:04:32.120 --> 0:04:35.560 who knew what the numbers were. But like I said today, 0:04:35.600 --> 0:04:37.400 when I look at who I am and what I've got, 0:04:37.880 --> 0:04:40.680 I didn't need. I'm happy to have what I've got. 0:04:41.160 --> 0:04:43.679 I feel very, very blessed to a found the sport. 0:04:43.720 --> 0:04:46.839 Like I said, I believe that everybody has a gift, 0:04:47.279 --> 0:04:49.240 and sometimes we find it, sometimes we don't. 0:04:49.720 --> 0:04:53.120 Well, it's virtually become folk law and we'll dive into 0:04:53.160 --> 0:04:55.599 the nitty gritty of it about how you got in 0:04:55.640 --> 0:05:00.320 the boxing. But having the profile that you do must 0:05:00.320 --> 0:05:02.440 come with a weight too, Like there's a good and 0:05:02.520 --> 0:05:04.720 the bad of having a profile. But do you feel 0:05:04.760 --> 0:05:07.760 the responsibility as a role model, Yeah, definitely. 0:05:07.520 --> 0:05:10.960 So I've made some mistakes, but my mistakes all the 0:05:11.000 --> 0:05:14.480 more mistakes I've made just been guilty by association. I mean, 0:05:14.520 --> 0:05:18.239 I got charge with having a fight with the green grocer. 0:05:18.960 --> 0:05:21.200 I didn't even throw a punch. I was just stand there. 0:05:21.680 --> 0:05:26.039 And I've been pulled over for different things. And maybe 0:05:26.080 --> 0:05:27.560 back in the day they were the good things, because 0:05:27.600 --> 0:05:29.239 you know, the police would talk to you, you know, 0:05:29.400 --> 0:05:30.480 obviously because of my name. 0:05:31.080 --> 0:05:32.240 Most of the times I'd get off. 0:05:32.240 --> 0:05:34.839 But yeah, some of the things, Like I said, my 0:05:34.920 --> 0:05:37.920 wife and I were in the Gold Coast Valentimee's day, 0:05:38.040 --> 0:05:40.760 we end up having an agent because I was pouring 0:05:41.360 --> 0:05:44.920 as a special guest. I was pouring some girls champagne 0:05:44.960 --> 0:05:46.919 there and she's standing on her own. So we go 0:05:47.000 --> 0:05:49.599 downstairs at the back of a car park. We stand 0:05:49.600 --> 0:05:53.200 there to talk and she was pretty rowdy, you know. 0:05:53.680 --> 0:05:56.159 All of a sudden, the police go comes and we 0:05:56.240 --> 0:05:58.320 explained that to my wife and we have an am 0:05:58.760 --> 0:06:00.640 not nothing's happened, as I could see. 0:06:00.520 --> 0:06:03.040 My wife was no normal. 0:06:03.920 --> 0:06:06.240 We go outside, we stand back up and then three 0:06:06.279 --> 0:06:08.480 police cars coming and I end up getting arrested because 0:06:09.440 --> 0:06:10.120 you had done nothing. 0:06:10.120 --> 0:06:11.840 So I'm going to stand up for myself, you know. 0:06:12.240 --> 0:06:14.200 So like I said, there's good and bad, but like 0:06:14.279 --> 0:06:16.080 I think, the thing that I like the most to 0:06:16.120 --> 0:06:20.240 get what comes with it. But I have an opportunity 0:06:20.320 --> 0:06:22.960 now to give back, and I mean this beautiful outsgoing. 0:06:23.040 --> 0:06:25.680 I accredit that to the people who follow me. Am. 0:06:25.720 --> 0:06:28.360 You know, you don't own anything if you're not popular, 0:06:28.440 --> 0:06:31.719 So I am. I accredit this to Yeah, thanking the 0:06:31.760 --> 0:06:35.039 people for what I've done. But my main aim play 0:06:35.040 --> 0:06:36.400 is just to give back. And like I said, if 0:06:36.400 --> 0:06:38.680 I have to give back from experiences that I've had 0:06:38.720 --> 0:06:42.039 and made mistakes and hopefully people won't make the same ones, 0:06:42.480 --> 0:06:44.600 I'm happy to've gone through that roller coaster. 0:06:44.920 --> 0:06:45.160 Yeah. 0:06:45.160 --> 0:06:47.960 Well, you're very forthright in your opinions too, and that 0:06:48.080 --> 0:06:51.400 sort of polarizes people and steers people. The first time 0:06:51.480 --> 0:06:54.640 I saw you, you're actually helping the helping the cops. 0:06:54.680 --> 0:06:57.520 I had just joined the police and they had the 0:06:57.520 --> 0:06:59.640 dollar drug drug dealer in. 0:07:00.040 --> 0:07:01.880 I was on the wall of me and Garf were they're. 0:07:01.720 --> 0:07:03.560 Just out there. 0:07:04.160 --> 0:07:06.440 If you look, did you see with me and Migado 0:07:06.560 --> 0:07:11.360 behind bars? Yes, the one below it there's the commissioners. Yeah, okay, 0:07:11.400 --> 0:07:14.600 well that's I was. I was there answering the phone. 0:07:14.640 --> 0:07:17.160 So you know what what happened to be? For that? 0:07:17.280 --> 0:07:20.160 My house was egged every day what the drug dealer 0:07:20.160 --> 0:07:23.400 has got? Yeah, yeah, well. 0:07:23.280 --> 0:07:25.760 I don't have to do because I'm very energized. I've 0:07:25.760 --> 0:07:27.040 never had a drug in my life, never had a 0:07:27.080 --> 0:07:29.520 coffee in my life. After I spoke and just telling 0:07:29.520 --> 0:07:32.040 about not doing drugs, it said dobbing a drug dealer. 0:07:32.680 --> 0:07:33.679 So I was the enemy. 0:07:33.880 --> 0:07:37.440 Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's funny. Well it's not funny, it's yeah, terrible. 0:07:37.560 --> 0:07:40.520 It wasn't funny time they come every morning clean the 0:07:40.560 --> 0:07:41.960 eggs and shells from the house. 0:07:41.880 --> 0:07:43.640 Well for what that's where if I was excited, So 0:07:44.000 --> 0:07:46.800 it was been following you your career and senior there, 0:07:46.840 --> 0:07:50.040 so I was excited the last time I was here 0:07:50.080 --> 0:07:52.440 at your place. We're down here standing in front of 0:07:52.440 --> 0:07:56.600 this wall, and Michael fran sees the New York Mafia 0:07:56.720 --> 0:07:59.120 capo was we've been out for dinner and we came 0:07:59.160 --> 0:08:01.720 back here. I think we were shaping up and you 0:08:01.760 --> 0:08:07.080 were a refereeing or whatever. But like Michael Francis, he's 0:08:07.120 --> 0:08:09.520 been on the podcast and I know him fairly well, 0:08:09.560 --> 0:08:12.280 and you know he was a big deal mafia dude 0:08:12.320 --> 0:08:15.720 before he saw the light and got out of the mafia. 0:08:16.480 --> 0:08:19.840 But the respect for someone like Michael Frances he shows you. 0:08:19.920 --> 0:08:23.200 And I've seen that. We're talking about the function down 0:08:24.080 --> 0:08:28.320 down in Melbourne for Barry Michael, and there was a 0:08:28.360 --> 0:08:30.560 lot of colorful characters there. There were some bikis and 0:08:30.640 --> 0:08:33.640 business people and I was watching you mix between the 0:08:34.160 --> 0:08:35.400 two worlds quite easily. 0:08:36.600 --> 0:08:38.160 I just seem to attract people. 0:08:39.440 --> 0:08:41.600 Like I said, respect isn't given. 0:08:41.600 --> 0:08:44.160 It's you know, I've a knock some of my doors 0:08:44.160 --> 0:08:47.040 and some of the biggest bikes and other people back 0:08:47.080 --> 0:08:48.280 in the days stand Smith and all. 0:08:48.320 --> 0:08:49.480 They were friends, my. 0:08:51.160 --> 0:08:54.240 Outlook and my way of life and shot out of 0:08:54.280 --> 0:08:57.280 everybody shake their hands and that's it, you know. Like 0:08:57.320 --> 0:09:00.439 I said, I don't know if I'm lucky run like you, 0:09:00.520 --> 0:09:02.959 But like I said, because of I'm the fighter, and 0:09:03.120 --> 0:09:05.200 everybody wants to be around. And when I used to fight, 0:09:05.360 --> 0:09:08.080 all those guys from the good old days were their 0:09:08.400 --> 0:09:09.400 supporting me and stuff. 0:09:09.440 --> 0:09:11.720 So I was never going to turn my back on anybody. 0:09:11.760 --> 0:09:13.600 If you know, like I said, to this day, if 0:09:13.640 --> 0:09:16.000 something happens to you along with you, Gary, I'm going 0:09:16.080 --> 0:09:16.720 to jar with him. 0:09:16.720 --> 0:09:18.959 Brother. If somebody bashes you or hits you, They've got 0:09:18.960 --> 0:09:20.160 to hit me as well. I'm with you. 0:09:20.360 --> 0:09:22.120 My father taught me one thing. When you go out 0:09:22.120 --> 0:09:23.880 with your friend, you go home with him. And I 0:09:23.920 --> 0:09:25.760 don't care who I am, or who you are, or 0:09:25.760 --> 0:09:28.280 where I am. If somebody's got the audacity's to say 0:09:28.280 --> 0:09:30.800 something to me, they're copping the back. You know. 0:09:30.840 --> 0:09:33.280 It's the old Bible said an eye for an eye. 0:09:33.600 --> 0:09:34.440 Forget about this. 0:09:34.360 --> 0:09:36.880 New bullshit world we live in there, you know, I 0:09:36.960 --> 0:09:39.199 go by the old Testament where it says, yeah, if 0:09:39.200 --> 0:09:41.600 somebody is good enough to say something, will do something, 0:09:41.679 --> 0:09:43.760 you give it back, and I'll give it back a 0:09:43.840 --> 0:09:46.360 lot harder than they can because they're cowards. They're just 0:09:46.480 --> 0:09:50.040 you know, people who get on keypad keypads and they 0:09:50.040 --> 0:09:52.040 think they're worried because they're tougher. So I said something 0:09:52.080 --> 0:09:54.320 to Jeff Enny, I put my address on there'll put 0:09:54.400 --> 0:09:56.679 my phone number, and they came say to my face. 0:09:56.920 --> 0:10:00.679 Well, I think loyalty is something that's it's lost, and 0:10:01.800 --> 0:10:04.800 being a stand up guy is almost frowned upon these days. 0:10:04.840 --> 0:10:09.000 But I haven't got a problem with those values. And yeah, 0:10:09.640 --> 0:10:11.520 it's a funny world now, and you can get shouted 0:10:11.600 --> 0:10:12.840 down for those values. 0:10:12.880 --> 0:10:15.080 But you know, Gary, some people say to me, Jeff, 0:10:15.240 --> 0:10:16.520 what did you write that on Facebook? 0:10:16.520 --> 0:10:17.360 What would you say? Listen? 0:10:17.360 --> 0:10:19.440 I said, they're good enough to say something about my family, 0:10:19.920 --> 0:10:21.400 I'm going to give it back. And if they don't like, 0:10:21.559 --> 0:10:23.800 oh you see this, will shut your mouth up and 0:10:23.840 --> 0:10:25.040 don't say anything about me at the start. 0:10:25.120 --> 0:10:26.000 Don't listen. 0:10:26.559 --> 0:10:28.400 The reason why it was such a great fighter is 0:10:28.440 --> 0:10:30.480 because I've got that switch, and when the switch goes off, 0:10:31.000 --> 0:10:34.760 I'm unbeatable, much as unbetible. I'm not scared of anybody 0:10:34.800 --> 0:10:39.240 in the world. So don't turn that switch on. And yeah, 0:10:39.600 --> 0:10:41.400 you'll find that eye side of me. 0:10:41.600 --> 0:10:41.960 Yeah. 0:10:42.000 --> 0:10:46.800 Well, I think loyalty is a strong value that's underestimated 0:10:46.840 --> 0:10:50.040 the importance of it these days. And I saw it 0:10:50.120 --> 0:10:50.680 in the police. 0:10:50.920 --> 0:10:52.640 Yeah. I had a lot of mates in the police. 0:10:52.679 --> 0:10:54.640 But when things went bad for me in the police. 0:10:55.400 --> 0:10:59.280 Couldn't believe how quickly the rats scurried, and people that 0:10:59.480 --> 0:11:01.840 I thought would back me up to the hip that 0:11:01.880 --> 0:11:03.640 I would have been prepared to back up to the hilp, 0:11:03.880 --> 0:11:05.320 I couldn't see him, see him the. 0:11:05.400 --> 0:11:06.560 Just yeah, it's the same. 0:11:06.559 --> 0:11:08.840 When you win to lose the fight, you Johnny Luis 0:11:08.920 --> 0:11:12.040 was famous to saying you when you when. 0:11:11.920 --> 0:11:14.439 You walk in the dress room, you can't move. When 0:11:14.600 --> 0:11:15.400 when you're lose. 0:11:15.240 --> 0:11:16.520 You and you get a dog by the tail, and 0:11:16.559 --> 0:11:18.760 when there's plenty of room in there, nobody comes in there. 0:11:19.040 --> 0:11:21.559 But like I said, that's that's part and past of 0:11:21.640 --> 0:11:24.280 what of the sport I'm in. But the great thing 0:11:24.320 --> 0:11:27.680 is because you're talking about lilting and and there's anybody 0:11:27.679 --> 0:11:31.280 more little to people than Johnny. Johnny am was somebody 0:11:31.320 --> 0:11:33.600 who instilled it any me. Like I said, I talked 0:11:33.640 --> 0:11:36.480 to Johnny about the good old days, the Terry Balls 0:11:36.480 --> 0:11:38.440 and all these fans that he had, Loopy and all 0:11:38.480 --> 0:11:41.240 those guys, and if anything happened to anybody, and they'd 0:11:41.240 --> 0:11:43.160 be the first person there, I'll never forget what. I'll 0:11:43.200 --> 0:11:47.520 let you down at RSIL, and Johnny stopped the fight 0:11:47.559 --> 0:11:50.640 a little early with obviously with his influence and some 0:11:50.640 --> 0:11:52.839 people screaming at Johnny calling away. I jumped down and 0:11:52.920 --> 0:11:55.680 next I've got a gun put to my head. I 0:11:55.760 --> 0:11:57.560 jumped down because I swear it at my trainer. You know, 0:11:57.640 --> 0:11:59.360 if Johnny walked down the street in front of any 0:11:59.400 --> 0:12:02.080 of us, our team over there and we're all jump 0:12:02.120 --> 0:12:03.199 in there and take a bullet. 0:12:02.920 --> 0:12:06.199 Foot And I think that's the character of that He 0:12:06.240 --> 0:12:07.920 instills that that you feel it. 0:12:08.000 --> 0:12:09.200 You definitely feel it. 0:12:09.240 --> 0:12:12.880 And I consider myself very lucky having an association with 0:12:13.280 --> 0:12:16.880 him now and lessons that I'm learning. I'm learning late 0:12:16.920 --> 0:12:20.000 in life, and just he sort of reinforcing. 0:12:19.880 --> 0:12:23.120 Think of this Kangaroo tools. They took him away there, 0:12:23.160 --> 0:12:25.360 but he wasn't and it wasn't for boxing. Was just 0:12:25.400 --> 0:12:28.080 for that company, was for that band. That he could 0:12:28.080 --> 0:12:30.960 sit down with somebody and make them the happiest guys world. 0:12:30.960 --> 0:12:33.160 He could sit down and if you were third best, 0:12:33.200 --> 0:12:34.640 he'd make you feel that you were the best in 0:12:34.679 --> 0:12:36.800 the world. Yeah, he had that ability in it. It's 0:12:36.800 --> 0:12:38.680 always great. That's one of those people around you. 0:12:38.960 --> 0:12:44.280 Yeah, the most. Definitely your early early days. So you 0:12:44.320 --> 0:12:47.440 tell us about your childhood growing up before you discovered boxing. 0:12:47.480 --> 0:12:48.920 What was What were you like then? 0:12:49.320 --> 0:12:53.480 Well, I played football every afternoon. Soon a school was done, 0:12:53.520 --> 0:12:57.040 I first of all, I have a paper. I'd go 0:12:57.120 --> 0:12:59.959 and sell my papers to have some money, and then 0:13:00.040 --> 0:13:02.120 I would go to the park and play football with 0:13:02.160 --> 0:13:04.640 my friends. But I was one of the smart guys. 0:13:04.679 --> 0:13:06.640 I got out of school ten minutes early every day. 0:13:06.720 --> 0:13:08.800 So because I had this letter saying because my father 0:13:08.880 --> 0:13:10.800 was so sick with our lives, they had to be 0:13:10.840 --> 0:13:12.720 the paper shop first. And when I get the paper 0:13:12.720 --> 0:13:15.200 shop with the guys who had seventy or lady papers 0:13:15.200 --> 0:13:16.719 of each, I'd take five or ten out of each 0:13:16.720 --> 0:13:18.800 of their barrow put in the mine because I worked 0:13:18.800 --> 0:13:21.520 on the highway down near the Southern Cross Hotel, and 0:13:21.520 --> 0:13:24.439 I would sell papers, but I'd make a good extra 0:13:24.480 --> 0:13:27.360 five or ten dollars every day just yeah from. 0:13:27.760 --> 0:13:32.280 Yeah, Yeah, that's where you always had that street smart, 0:13:32.320 --> 0:13:35.079 the rat, cunning and the starter as a paperboy and 0:13:35.880 --> 0:13:36.880 learn how the play the game. 0:13:37.080 --> 0:13:39.959 And then, like I said, my father was so strict. 0:13:40.040 --> 0:13:43.360 When my friends would go out and do things that 0:13:43.480 --> 0:13:45.679 rob things, I never went with them. But after they 0:13:45.800 --> 0:13:48.520 would bring him back and hide them everybody in the US, 0:13:48.559 --> 0:13:50.800 I would go and get them and I would I 0:13:50.800 --> 0:13:52.360 would sell them, would do whatever I had to do. 0:13:53.800 --> 0:13:55.959 So you were you're heading for a path of trouble 0:13:55.960 --> 0:13:58.160 because you did you did some time in the Yeah. 0:13:58.360 --> 0:14:01.360 I went to the boys for a couple of months, 0:14:01.360 --> 0:14:06.319 and I went to or Wonder, Yeah, and I got 0:14:06.360 --> 0:14:08.240 out of there in a month because good behavior. 0:14:08.280 --> 0:14:09.600 I mean we went and played. 0:14:09.360 --> 0:14:12.160 Football while we're there and there. Yeah, I mean I 0:14:12.200 --> 0:14:13.800 was in a streaking. I used to go out and 0:14:13.800 --> 0:14:17.520 had fight sam. At that time, the street violence was 0:14:17.559 --> 0:14:19.800 really really bad. I was twelve, thirty years old. They 0:14:19.840 --> 0:14:22.480 made an example out of me. They nobody said it 0:14:22.480 --> 0:14:24.360 was actually me. I was just in the game. So yeah, 0:14:24.720 --> 0:14:26.480 they locked up quite a few of us, and then 0:14:26.520 --> 0:14:29.520 me and my brother, Yeah, we both got locked up. 0:14:29.560 --> 0:14:31.680 And like I said, for me, it was a great lesson. 0:14:31.960 --> 0:14:33.960 The only thing that I regret the iced to think, Oh, 0:14:34.000 --> 0:14:36.280 you're a tough guy who just did this. You did 0:14:36.280 --> 0:14:37.840 a little bit of time or whatever it is, and 0:14:37.880 --> 0:14:40.320 you went into these boys arms. You're fighting everybody. I 0:14:40.320 --> 0:14:43.480 didn't realize. I didn't realize the hurt that I put 0:14:43.520 --> 0:14:45.320 on my family. You know, it's not just a little 0:14:45.320 --> 0:14:48.560 tough guy. And I didn't realize how how hard I 0:14:48.600 --> 0:14:50.320 am made it for mom and dad. 0:14:50.400 --> 0:14:51.440 My dad couldn't even travel. 0:14:51.440 --> 0:14:54.400 And see my brother was in there, he was in Gosford, 0:14:54.440 --> 0:14:57.680 and my mom and dad through Hill And to any 0:14:57.760 --> 0:15:00.760 kid out there that we are, I think we're tough 0:15:00.760 --> 0:15:02.360 and stuff at a young age, and we think we 0:15:02.400 --> 0:15:05.520 can do this. I don't think about you think about 0:15:05.520 --> 0:15:08.800 the pain and hurt you put your mom and dad 0:15:08.840 --> 0:15:09.600 and your family through. 0:15:09.600 --> 0:15:11.120 If I thought. 0:15:10.960 --> 0:15:12.960 About that when I was younger, I never would have 0:15:12.960 --> 0:15:15.120 gotten on. I still would have been that little shifty 0:15:15.160 --> 0:15:17.680 guy that would try to live in allmal life, but 0:15:18.000 --> 0:15:19.560 I would never have put my mom and dad through 0:15:19.600 --> 0:15:20.680 what I've put them through. Ye. 0:15:20.800 --> 0:15:22.920 It's a good message, Jeff, because I think at that 0:15:22.960 --> 0:15:24.840 age you don't even consider that there. 0:15:25.200 --> 0:15:27.760 You just think you're tough around, your mates are good, 0:15:27.800 --> 0:15:29.080 and the world revolves around you. 0:15:29.280 --> 0:15:29.480 Yeah. 0:15:29.560 --> 0:15:32.760 Yeah, and then you don't realize the hurt and the 0:15:32.800 --> 0:15:36.200 pain you put your family through. And I've seen that 0:15:36.280 --> 0:15:38.160 later on in life. I've seen that as I was older, 0:15:38.160 --> 0:15:41.040 and some of those things that happened to me don't 0:15:41.080 --> 0:15:43.760 want to I wasn't even so I didn't do any 0:15:44.280 --> 0:15:46.280 and see my mom cry and that as I was, 0:15:46.880 --> 0:15:49.720 you know, in my twenties and stuff was really really 0:15:49.800 --> 0:15:50.320 hurtful to me. 0:15:50.440 --> 0:15:50.600 Yeah. 0:15:50.760 --> 0:15:53.920 Yeah, Well, you talk boys home, and there's an interesting 0:15:54.600 --> 0:15:57.920 side story. I think we've made a him and you 0:15:58.000 --> 0:16:00.680 know him real well, he's made the mine. But he 0:16:00.760 --> 0:16:04.880 was talking about a former professional boxer and a genuine 0:16:04.920 --> 0:16:06.280 tough guy isn't he. 0:16:06.480 --> 0:16:08.680 He was one of the toughest guys ever came out. 0:16:09.080 --> 0:16:11.760 There is something something about Nata. 0:16:11.840 --> 0:16:13.840 Him and his group the Legends, and did a lot 0:16:13.840 --> 0:16:15.400 of damage to a lot of different people. 0:16:15.200 --> 0:16:15.920 Even the police. 0:16:16.040 --> 0:16:17.960 Yeah, yeah, well that's why he was in the boys 0:16:18.000 --> 0:16:20.200 home and he got three years and he was up 0:16:20.200 --> 0:16:23.560 at Gosford and he told me the story that you know, 0:16:23.600 --> 0:16:26.360 he was going down the path it would have inevitablely 0:16:26.600 --> 0:16:29.600 ended up in prison. And he read your book and 0:16:29.640 --> 0:16:31.960 that he said he stole your book. But anyway, I 0:16:31.960 --> 0:16:34.720 don't think you can get charged with still in the 0:16:34.760 --> 0:16:36.920 library book. But he read that book and then he 0:16:36.960 --> 0:16:41.520 started telling the other inmates or the people in custody 0:16:41.800 --> 0:16:43.960 and the guards that this life's. 0:16:43.680 --> 0:16:44.040 Not for me. 0:16:44.160 --> 0:16:46.240 I'm going to become a professional boxer. And that turned 0:16:46.280 --> 0:16:47.640 he turned his life around. 0:16:47.800 --> 0:16:50.000 Yeah, I'll never forget the first day he turned up 0:16:50.000 --> 0:16:53.080 in the gym and everybody was talking about this guy. 0:16:53.120 --> 0:16:56.680 And I think he learned the same way I did. 0:16:56.760 --> 0:17:00.200 He sparted his named Pierre Karen, who was pretty good. 0:17:00.520 --> 0:17:02.000 You can be the toughest guy in the world, but 0:17:02.040 --> 0:17:04.280 a few and have never been punched. Reform if you 0:17:04.320 --> 0:17:07.400 never had to throw a proper punch. It was tough. 0:17:07.400 --> 0:17:10.040 So Nata had a tough first bar. But he just 0:17:10.080 --> 0:17:12.399 got better and better and he got more and more dedicated, 0:17:12.640 --> 0:17:14.320 and like I said, he was in the same plus 0:17:14.359 --> 0:17:14.639 as me. 0:17:15.080 --> 0:17:16.960