1 00:00:00,760 --> 00:00:02,840 Speaker 1: I got a welcome to another installment in the show. 2 00:00:02,880 --> 00:00:05,960 Speaker 1: Of course, it is the Project Tiffany, and Cook is 3 00:00:06,440 --> 00:00:08,559 Speaker 1: not here. She's in the hammock, she's in the jacuzzi, 4 00:00:08,920 --> 00:00:11,080 Speaker 1: she's anywhere but the virtual studio. 5 00:00:11,119 --> 00:00:14,640 Speaker 2: But I tell you who has rocked up driven straight. 6 00:00:14,320 --> 00:00:16,480 Speaker 1: To the virtual studio in his ten year old Volvo 7 00:00:16,520 --> 00:00:19,600 Speaker 1: station Wagon, which I said I wouldn't talk about on air, 8 00:00:19,640 --> 00:00:20,159 Speaker 1: but fuck it. 9 00:00:21,040 --> 00:00:23,400 Speaker 2: David James, Kevin Patrick Gillespie. 10 00:00:22,880 --> 00:00:24,439 Speaker 3: Good I mate. 11 00:00:25,160 --> 00:00:27,319 Speaker 2: I did ask you randomly off air what kind of 12 00:00:27,360 --> 00:00:29,040 Speaker 2: car and you were You. 13 00:00:29,000 --> 00:00:31,760 Speaker 1: Were amused by that, and I was just thinking, just 14 00:00:31,840 --> 00:00:34,440 Speaker 1: because you're a kind of a practical functional dude with 15 00:00:34,560 --> 00:00:36,360 Speaker 1: a practical functional. 16 00:00:35,840 --> 00:00:38,479 Speaker 2: Car, so I wasn't surprised at the answer. 17 00:00:38,560 --> 00:00:41,479 Speaker 1: You've never been a You've never been an ausy bogan 18 00:00:41,560 --> 00:00:43,879 Speaker 1: concern with zero to one hundred and the horsepower and 19 00:00:43,920 --> 00:00:45,680 Speaker 1: Newton meters and all that shit. 20 00:00:46,320 --> 00:00:48,080 Speaker 3: No, No, as long as it gets me from A 21 00:00:48,200 --> 00:00:49,840 Speaker 3: to B, then job done. 22 00:00:50,159 --> 00:00:54,000 Speaker 1: Yeah. Have you been having a squiz at the Olympics. 23 00:00:54,400 --> 00:00:58,520 Speaker 3: I have. I have, indeed, because of my involvement with handball, 24 00:00:58,880 --> 00:01:02,240 Speaker 3: which I think we find course once or twice. You know, 25 00:01:02,320 --> 00:01:05,120 Speaker 3: it's good having a two week long handball competition that 26 00:01:05,160 --> 00:01:07,440 Speaker 3: you can just tune in and watch for free on 27 00:01:07,520 --> 00:01:10,720 Speaker 3: Telly and with an English commentary no less, oh. 28 00:01:10,600 --> 00:01:14,480 Speaker 1: Really of course? And who's I mean who did well? 29 00:01:14,560 --> 00:01:16,520 Speaker 1: Like I didn't see one minute of handball. 30 00:01:16,600 --> 00:01:17,039 Speaker 2: So it's. 31 00:01:18,440 --> 00:01:22,640 Speaker 3: So Denmark won the men and Norway won the women, 32 00:01:22,760 --> 00:01:25,880 Speaker 3: which and neither of those were particularly unexpected results. But 33 00:01:26,840 --> 00:01:28,759 Speaker 3: a lot of them are full of people who've been 34 00:01:28,760 --> 00:01:30,760 Speaker 3: there for a good decade or so, so it's going 35 00:01:30,840 --> 00:01:31,679 Speaker 3: to be a changing of the. 36 00:01:31,640 --> 00:01:33,200 Speaker 2: Guard, okay. 37 00:01:33,560 --> 00:01:36,399 Speaker 1: And who how many countries in the world, Like if 38 00:01:36,400 --> 00:01:38,800 Speaker 1: we look at you know, like for example, I worked 39 00:01:38,800 --> 00:01:41,240 Speaker 1: with the Melbourne Dixens and Melbourne Phoenix and some of 40 00:01:41,240 --> 00:01:44,679 Speaker 1: the Australian netballers and Collingwood in the National Netball League. 41 00:01:44,920 --> 00:01:45,880 Speaker 2: But if we look at. 42 00:01:46,120 --> 00:01:50,120 Speaker 1: Netball as an example as a sport globally, you know, 43 00:01:50,240 --> 00:01:54,680 Speaker 1: it is an international sport, but there's probably about four 44 00:01:54,760 --> 00:01:57,320 Speaker 1: or five countries that are really good at it, four 45 00:01:57,400 --> 00:02:01,280 Speaker 1: or five that are pretty good, five that are emerging, 46 00:02:01,360 --> 00:02:03,360 Speaker 1: and then no one else in the world gives a shit. 47 00:02:03,920 --> 00:02:08,680 Speaker 1: What's the equivalent with handball, Like how many countries really 48 00:02:08,800 --> 00:02:12,000 Speaker 1: play it and really are good at it? 49 00:02:12,440 --> 00:02:15,440 Speaker 3: There's well, all of Europe play it, which is what 50 00:02:15,560 --> 00:02:17,919 Speaker 3: it tends to be called European handball. It's the I 51 00:02:17,960 --> 00:02:21,640 Speaker 3: think it's the third biggest participation sport in Europe behind 52 00:02:23,000 --> 00:02:26,720 Speaker 3: soccer or football as people like to call it, and 53 00:02:27,120 --> 00:02:28,880 Speaker 3: I think the other one there is basketball is a 54 00:02:28,880 --> 00:02:33,560 Speaker 3: big one, but so handball's behind that. The professional leagues 55 00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:36,400 Speaker 3: there are absolutely huge. A lot of the players that 56 00:02:36,400 --> 00:02:39,240 Speaker 3: were running around at the Olympics of you know, earning 57 00:02:39,440 --> 00:02:42,800 Speaker 3: tens of millions of dollars a year playing handball. There's 58 00:02:43,720 --> 00:02:46,320 Speaker 3: three million people in Europe play it. It's huge in 59 00:02:46,360 --> 00:02:51,360 Speaker 3: South America as well, probably the European influence there. North 60 00:02:51,360 --> 00:02:54,560 Speaker 3: America is pretty much like Australia, which is what's regarded 61 00:02:54,600 --> 00:02:57,120 Speaker 3: as a developing nation where you know, I guess, I 62 00:02:57,200 --> 00:03:02,400 Speaker 3: guess what Zimbabwe is to netball is what we are 63 00:03:02,480 --> 00:03:09,679 Speaker 3: to handle. Yeah, but it's massively bigger than netball. Netball's 64 00:03:09,720 --> 00:03:13,120 Speaker 3: wildest dreams couldn't be that big. I mean the gold 65 00:03:13,160 --> 00:03:17,280 Speaker 3: medal match, so the final four matches in the women's 66 00:03:17,320 --> 00:03:20,480 Speaker 3: and men's comp at the Olympics were at a capacity 67 00:03:20,560 --> 00:03:25,079 Speaker 3: stadium with thirty thousand people, so you know, each each 68 00:03:25,160 --> 00:03:28,919 Speaker 3: match thirty thousand people, so it's a big sport. 69 00:03:29,639 --> 00:03:32,680 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's crazy, I am. I'm just trying to find 70 00:03:32,680 --> 00:03:35,520 Speaker 1: something now. I put up a post the other day 71 00:03:36,520 --> 00:03:42,880 Speaker 1: about about the relative kind of per capita medals. Like 72 00:03:43,240 --> 00:03:45,160 Speaker 1: a few people have put up a few things, but 73 00:03:46,040 --> 00:03:48,160 Speaker 1: at the time that I wrote it, which was I 74 00:03:48,240 --> 00:03:50,440 Speaker 1: think Friday night, nine pm or something, New. 75 00:03:50,480 --> 00:03:54,840 Speaker 2: Zealand with a population of five million, they were doing 76 00:03:54,920 --> 00:03:55,320 Speaker 2: very well. 77 00:03:55,800 --> 00:03:59,720 Speaker 1: Yeah, and they finished with nine gold medals, like five million. 78 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:03,040 Speaker 1: You know, there's more than five million people where I live, 79 00:04:03,320 --> 00:04:04,440 Speaker 1: like in Melbourne, right. 80 00:04:04,360 --> 00:04:04,760 Speaker 2: It's yea. 81 00:04:05,360 --> 00:04:09,720 Speaker 1: And I'm thinking, then I extrapolated that out and I'm thinking, well, 82 00:04:10,120 --> 00:04:12,960 Speaker 1: China has when I looked to give or take one 83 00:04:13,160 --> 00:04:16,279 Speaker 1: point four and a bit billion, you know, And I 84 00:04:16,320 --> 00:04:18,359 Speaker 1: was thinking, wow, if they had a similar kind of 85 00:04:18,440 --> 00:04:23,560 Speaker 1: per head ratio, they'd be up to fourteen hundred gold medals, right, 86 00:04:24,800 --> 00:04:27,480 Speaker 1: and like if it was if Obviously it doesn't work 87 00:04:27,520 --> 00:04:29,320 Speaker 1: that way and there's a lot of variables around it. 88 00:04:29,360 --> 00:04:33,160 Speaker 1: But I'm thinking, while I'm very proud of Australia and 89 00:04:33,200 --> 00:04:35,719 Speaker 1: all that, clearly I did no fucking work, neither did you. 90 00:04:35,880 --> 00:04:38,719 Speaker 1: I find that a funny thing. How oh, how well 91 00:04:38,760 --> 00:04:39,400 Speaker 1: are we doing? 92 00:04:39,480 --> 00:04:39,720 Speaker 3: Well? 93 00:04:39,839 --> 00:04:43,560 Speaker 2: I'm not doing anything. I'm just the people. 94 00:04:44,120 --> 00:04:46,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's funny how we take ownership. 95 00:04:46,839 --> 00:04:50,960 Speaker 3: But anyway, and in my case, I'm not even watching Australians. 96 00:04:51,000 --> 00:04:53,560 Speaker 2: Well that's exactly right, but you know there's a reason 97 00:04:53,600 --> 00:04:53,840 Speaker 2: for that. 98 00:04:54,680 --> 00:04:59,719 Speaker 1: But yeah, they ended up with nine gold medals in 99 00:04:59,760 --> 00:05:03,240 Speaker 1: a country of you know, five million people. When you 100 00:05:03,320 --> 00:05:05,640 Speaker 1: think there's something like forty million people that live in 101 00:05:05,680 --> 00:05:06,920 Speaker 1: California or something. 102 00:05:07,600 --> 00:05:10,120 Speaker 2: It's you know, it's fucking amazing. 103 00:05:10,320 --> 00:05:12,960 Speaker 3: But you always punches above their weight. I mean you 104 00:05:13,040 --> 00:05:15,920 Speaker 3: just look at them in the rugby for starters. Yeah, 105 00:05:15,960 --> 00:05:18,440 Speaker 3: you know, they're always they are a sports mad nation. 106 00:05:18,680 --> 00:05:23,599 Speaker 3: They they're the sports crazy state of Australia. They don't 107 00:05:23,640 --> 00:05:25,640 Speaker 3: like being referred to that way, but that's pretty much 108 00:05:25,640 --> 00:05:28,160 Speaker 3: how I think of them. 109 00:05:28,640 --> 00:05:29,920 Speaker 2: It's hilarious. 110 00:05:30,880 --> 00:05:34,160 Speaker 3: And hey, what did you make of the Big Girl controversy? 111 00:05:34,600 --> 00:05:36,240 Speaker 3: Oh do you know what? 112 00:05:38,040 --> 00:05:41,520 Speaker 1: Okay, everyone, so we're talking about the breakdown, to which 113 00:05:41,560 --> 00:05:43,200 Speaker 1: in the Olympic call it breaking. 114 00:05:44,720 --> 00:05:46,120 Speaker 2: I don't want to get in trouble. 115 00:05:47,040 --> 00:05:48,640 Speaker 3: I just gone have an opinion. 116 00:05:48,680 --> 00:05:52,400 Speaker 2: Harp, No, well my opinion, you know, like so part 117 00:05:52,440 --> 00:05:53,480 Speaker 2: of me is like, well done. 118 00:05:53,720 --> 00:05:56,600 Speaker 1: You had to go when I first saw it, Honestly, 119 00:05:56,680 --> 00:05:59,080 Speaker 1: and this is just I didn't know if it was 120 00:05:59,560 --> 00:06:01,000 Speaker 1: a parent or if it was. 121 00:06:02,600 --> 00:06:04,560 Speaker 2: I don't know. I don't know. Look, I think good 122 00:06:04,560 --> 00:06:05,560 Speaker 2: on her for having. 123 00:06:05,440 --> 00:06:09,320 Speaker 1: A go, but and people like I saw people coming 124 00:06:09,320 --> 00:06:12,160 Speaker 1: out going, oh stop stop putting women down and that, Like, 125 00:06:12,200 --> 00:06:14,200 Speaker 1: for me, it's got nothing to do with gender. It's 126 00:06:14,240 --> 00:06:21,320 Speaker 1: got everything to do with skill and ability. And yeah, 127 00:06:19,440 --> 00:06:23,240 Speaker 1: I want to sit on the fence because I don't 128 00:06:23,240 --> 00:06:27,120 Speaker 1: want to get in trouble. But yeah, well clearly, clearly 129 00:06:27,240 --> 00:06:30,440 Speaker 1: she wasn't at the same level as the other competitors. 130 00:06:32,000 --> 00:06:33,080 Speaker 2: I don't know, I don't know. 131 00:06:33,120 --> 00:06:36,240 Speaker 3: It's just isn't that Isn't that the equivalent of saying, 132 00:06:36,839 --> 00:06:39,760 Speaker 3: you know, qualifying for one hundred meters knowing that your 133 00:06:39,760 --> 00:06:43,000 Speaker 3: best time in one hundred meters is twenty seconds, and 134 00:06:43,000 --> 00:06:44,760 Speaker 3: you're going to be racing against people who do ten 135 00:06:44,800 --> 00:06:48,720 Speaker 3: seconds and then and then rather than running against them 136 00:06:48,720 --> 00:06:50,960 Speaker 3: and doing your twenty seconds, you decide, you know what, 137 00:06:51,000 --> 00:06:54,640 Speaker 3: I'm going to skip. Yeah, you know, I don't know 138 00:06:54,640 --> 00:06:55,800 Speaker 3: if that's what happened. 139 00:06:55,839 --> 00:07:00,159 Speaker 1: But yeah, I mean obviously, well, you know, we're we 140 00:07:00,160 --> 00:07:02,640 Speaker 1: think about the Olympics. I'm generalizing, we think about the 141 00:07:02,640 --> 00:07:06,760 Speaker 1: best athletes on the planet. With the best fitness, best strength, power, 142 00:07:06,800 --> 00:07:11,480 Speaker 1: speed skill like the elite of the elite, and. 143 00:07:11,600 --> 00:07:13,600 Speaker 2: I don't know like good on a like. 144 00:07:13,680 --> 00:07:16,680 Speaker 1: I think good on a for having a go, and 145 00:07:16,720 --> 00:07:19,560 Speaker 1: I think if she's happy and people enjoyed it, then 146 00:07:19,960 --> 00:07:20,680 Speaker 1: I think it's good. 147 00:07:20,760 --> 00:07:25,600 Speaker 3: Well, I worry. I mean, I don't know breakdancing from 148 00:07:25,640 --> 00:07:28,400 Speaker 3: anything else. I know zero about breakdancing. I don't know 149 00:07:28,440 --> 00:07:30,640 Speaker 3: how good, bad her and different her performance was. All 150 00:07:30,680 --> 00:07:35,480 Speaker 3: I'm talking about is a controversy about it. And the 151 00:07:35,600 --> 00:07:38,640 Speaker 3: thing that concerns me coming from I guess a sports 152 00:07:38,680 --> 00:07:43,760 Speaker 3: administration perspective, you know, being involved in handball is who 153 00:07:43,800 --> 00:07:47,360 Speaker 3: missed out on that place? Is the question that occurs 154 00:07:47,400 --> 00:07:52,400 Speaker 3: to me. You know, I struggle to believe that there 155 00:07:52,440 --> 00:07:54,360 Speaker 3: are very you know, I suspect there's a lot of 156 00:07:54,440 --> 00:07:58,320 Speaker 3: dance schools around Australia with lots of people who do breakdancing. 157 00:07:59,160 --> 00:08:01,440 Speaker 3: I presume I don't know anything about it, but I 158 00:08:01,480 --> 00:08:05,040 Speaker 3: presume there must be where there are no other people 159 00:08:05,080 --> 00:08:06,400 Speaker 3: to choose from. I don't know. 160 00:08:07,160 --> 00:08:09,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, Well, I think the answer to that is again, 161 00:08:09,960 --> 00:08:14,920 Speaker 1: so anyone listening to these two are white middle aged men. 162 00:08:15,440 --> 00:08:18,640 Speaker 2: We both will acknowledge it. We both acknowledge. We do 163 00:08:18,760 --> 00:08:19,960 Speaker 2: not know anything about this, No. 164 00:08:20,080 --> 00:08:23,800 Speaker 1: But what I think I do know is that I 165 00:08:23,840 --> 00:08:28,240 Speaker 1: think there was like essentially trials, and she was she won. 166 00:08:29,080 --> 00:08:31,040 Speaker 3: I think she was the best, and then she deserved 167 00:08:31,080 --> 00:08:33,000 Speaker 3: to be there, didn't she exactly exactly? 168 00:08:33,120 --> 00:08:35,440 Speaker 1: So if that was the process and she came out 169 00:08:35,480 --> 00:08:38,760 Speaker 1: and she was the best of the people who tried 170 00:08:38,760 --> 00:08:41,240 Speaker 1: to qualify for the team and she won that well, 171 00:08:41,240 --> 00:08:44,200 Speaker 1: got through that process being number one, then han't absent. 172 00:08:44,320 --> 00:08:45,400 Speaker 2: She deserves to be there. 173 00:08:45,920 --> 00:08:49,360 Speaker 3: Then really the only critique critique people can give her is, well, 174 00:08:49,559 --> 00:08:52,160 Speaker 3: you know, if you came through a fair trial process, 175 00:08:52,200 --> 00:08:54,760 Speaker 3: just like everybody else, and you and you were the 176 00:08:54,800 --> 00:08:57,520 Speaker 3: one selected, then you have just as much right to 177 00:08:57,520 --> 00:09:00,280 Speaker 3: be there as anybody else. And and and then what 178 00:09:00,440 --> 00:09:03,520 Speaker 3: you're really doing is critiquing the artistry of what she did. 179 00:09:03,559 --> 00:09:06,400 Speaker 3: And given that this is a dance thing, not not 180 00:09:06,600 --> 00:09:08,560 Speaker 3: I mean, I might inflame people by saying this, but 181 00:09:08,600 --> 00:09:13,559 Speaker 3: it's dance, not sport in my view, then artistry is 182 00:09:13,600 --> 00:09:16,480 Speaker 3: part of the deal. So what you're really saying is 183 00:09:16,640 --> 00:09:18,480 Speaker 3: I don't like the routine she chose. 184 00:09:19,320 --> 00:09:23,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, well, I think also, you know, the artistry slash 185 00:09:23,400 --> 00:09:27,160 Speaker 1: creative expression, like you think about like I've literally tried. 186 00:09:27,440 --> 00:09:30,719 Speaker 1: I've trained a bunch of Olympic athletes and one of 187 00:09:30,760 --> 00:09:35,160 Speaker 1: the girls that I trained was in I can't of 188 00:09:35,160 --> 00:09:39,560 Speaker 1: remember which games, but anyway, she was a synchronized swimmer. 189 00:09:40,360 --> 00:09:44,880 Speaker 1: Her name is Bethany Walsh. And honestly, when I her 190 00:09:44,960 --> 00:09:47,320 Speaker 1: dad approached me and went, would you work with my daughter? 191 00:09:47,400 --> 00:09:51,040 Speaker 1: She's an Olympian? And I went, what sport? And he 192 00:09:51,120 --> 00:09:53,360 Speaker 1: told me and I went, not a sport, though, is it? 193 00:09:53,559 --> 00:09:53,760 Speaker 1: You know? 194 00:09:55,040 --> 00:09:56,640 Speaker 2: I didn't really I didn't really think that. 195 00:09:56,720 --> 00:10:00,920 Speaker 1: I just my idea and then I I was completely wrong. 196 00:10:00,920 --> 00:10:03,160 Speaker 2: By the way, before anyone sends me an email, I 197 00:10:03,200 --> 00:10:05,200 Speaker 2: went and watched them, tray, I went and. 198 00:10:05,120 --> 00:10:09,240 Speaker 1: Watched what these girls have to do and how fucking 199 00:10:09,480 --> 00:10:13,600 Speaker 1: strong and fit and talented, and I mean, it is 200 00:10:13,800 --> 00:10:18,560 Speaker 1: a demanding sport. But then there are other things, like 201 00:10:19,559 --> 00:10:23,680 Speaker 1: you know, I think, like we have these like contrasting 202 00:10:23,720 --> 00:10:27,360 Speaker 1: events like the Wimmens one hundred meters you know, or 203 00:10:27,400 --> 00:10:31,040 Speaker 1: blokes hundred meters where it's just power speed like which 204 00:10:31,559 --> 00:10:35,200 Speaker 1: you know is like a completely athletic it seems to 205 00:10:35,240 --> 00:10:35,880 Speaker 1: be event. 206 00:10:36,040 --> 00:10:41,920 Speaker 2: And then other things like you know, the rhythmic gymnastics, which. 207 00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:45,000 Speaker 1: Is still very strong, very fit, but a much more 208 00:10:45,080 --> 00:10:46,640 Speaker 1: kind of creative subjective. 209 00:10:47,160 --> 00:10:52,199 Speaker 3: There's no clear subjective elements, don't but it has objective 210 00:10:52,200 --> 00:10:54,520 Speaker 3: elements to it because it's part of the gymnastics stuff. 211 00:10:54,559 --> 00:10:58,080 Speaker 3: But it's also got some artistic subjective elements to it, 212 00:10:58,120 --> 00:10:59,280 Speaker 3: doesn't it. Well. 213 00:10:59,360 --> 00:11:02,720 Speaker 1: Yeah, and then there's the sports like you know, weightlifting 214 00:11:02,920 --> 00:11:05,640 Speaker 1: and rowing and basketball. 215 00:11:05,200 --> 00:11:07,600 Speaker 2: And sprinting and just watch. 216 00:11:08,160 --> 00:11:11,199 Speaker 1: Yeah, there's someone's whoever's got the best or the right number, 217 00:11:11,200 --> 00:11:14,199 Speaker 1: the lowest time, or the heaviest weight or the most 218 00:11:14,240 --> 00:11:15,000 Speaker 1: points on the. 219 00:11:14,960 --> 00:11:17,840 Speaker 2: Board that they just win as long as they work 220 00:11:17,880 --> 00:11:18,520 Speaker 2: within the rules. 221 00:11:18,559 --> 00:11:21,200 Speaker 1: But then there's this other thing where we go and 222 00:11:21,320 --> 00:11:25,040 Speaker 1: even diving, Like I look at the diving and I go, oh, 223 00:11:25,040 --> 00:11:28,880 Speaker 1: that was fucking incredible, and then they're like scored lower 224 00:11:29,040 --> 00:11:29,600 Speaker 1: what do I know? 225 00:11:29,720 --> 00:11:32,000 Speaker 2: And someone else who I think, yeah, that was You. 226 00:11:31,920 --> 00:11:33,920 Speaker 3: Can tell that there's a lot of subjectivity in something 227 00:11:33,960 --> 00:11:36,480 Speaker 3: like diving because you see them even the way they score. 228 00:11:36,559 --> 00:11:38,160 Speaker 3: You know, I don't know how many judges they have, 229 00:11:38,240 --> 00:11:39,840 Speaker 3: but it's like seven or eight judges, and then they 230 00:11:39,920 --> 00:11:42,080 Speaker 3: knock out the highest and lower scores, which tells you 231 00:11:42,360 --> 00:11:44,680 Speaker 3: that even the people who are professionals are judging this 232 00:11:45,320 --> 00:11:48,839 Speaker 3: get it wrong from their perspective, and that's why they 233 00:11:48,920 --> 00:11:51,320 Speaker 3: take out the highest and lower scores. Yeah. 234 00:11:51,400 --> 00:11:54,360 Speaker 1: Well, also even in the boxing, I watched fair bit 235 00:11:54,360 --> 00:11:57,040 Speaker 1: of boxing, and there was numerous times where of the 236 00:11:57,360 --> 00:12:02,480 Speaker 1: five judges, three awarded it to the blue corner and 237 00:12:02,559 --> 00:12:05,280 Speaker 1: two awarded it to the red corner. And they just 238 00:12:05,360 --> 00:12:08,800 Speaker 1: watched the same thing. And I'm like, sixty percent of 239 00:12:08,840 --> 00:12:13,840 Speaker 1: the judges said Brian one and forty said fucking Dave one, 240 00:12:14,440 --> 00:12:18,319 Speaker 1: and they just watched this. Yes, do you know what 241 00:12:18,360 --> 00:12:20,560 Speaker 1: I mean? So it ends up in a split decision. 242 00:12:20,640 --> 00:12:23,800 Speaker 1: But yeah, I don't think you and I intended to 243 00:12:23,840 --> 00:12:25,280 Speaker 1: bang on about the Olympics, but. 244 00:12:25,240 --> 00:12:28,280 Speaker 3: There we already didn't know. I thought it was interesting. 245 00:12:29,760 --> 00:12:34,000 Speaker 1: Look what it is is, it's a phenomenon that you know, 246 00:12:34,200 --> 00:12:36,400 Speaker 1: a few people have spoken about, let's just keep going 247 00:12:36,400 --> 00:12:38,560 Speaker 1: with a few people have spoken about the reality that 248 00:12:38,600 --> 00:12:42,199 Speaker 1: it generates billions of dollars, but the athletes don't get 249 00:12:42,280 --> 00:12:46,160 Speaker 1: any of that. And then then you look at the 250 00:12:46,400 --> 00:12:49,720 Speaker 1: even within countries, like if you win a gold medal 251 00:12:49,760 --> 00:12:53,440 Speaker 1: in Australia, I've seen two different reported numbers, but it's 252 00:12:53,440 --> 00:12:56,199 Speaker 1: either fifteen or twenty thousand bucks, which to me seems 253 00:12:56,559 --> 00:13:00,840 Speaker 1: fuck all for an Olympic gold medal, but especially when 254 00:13:01,520 --> 00:13:04,040 Speaker 1: you if you're a first round loser at Wimbledon, I 255 00:13:04,080 --> 00:13:07,160 Speaker 1: think you get seventy or eighty grand if. 256 00:13:07,000 --> 00:13:10,440 Speaker 3: You're to get to winner. Pardon the trick is to 257 00:13:10,440 --> 00:13:12,480 Speaker 3: get to Wimbledon, I guess. 258 00:13:12,240 --> 00:13:15,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, I know, but there's still like yeah, but still 259 00:13:15,520 --> 00:13:17,640 Speaker 1: you know it's you're losing a match of tennis and 260 00:13:17,679 --> 00:13:20,599 Speaker 1: you're getting one hundred or whatever. I guess so, But 261 00:13:21,280 --> 00:13:23,840 Speaker 1: but then you're winning an Olympic gold medal for Australia 262 00:13:23,880 --> 00:13:28,319 Speaker 1: and you get fifteen or twenty grand. Live in Singapore, 263 00:13:28,400 --> 00:13:30,000 Speaker 1: you get seven hundred and fifty grand. 264 00:13:30,800 --> 00:13:35,600 Speaker 3: Yeah, although if you are at least an individual who 265 00:13:35,679 --> 00:13:39,400 Speaker 3: wins a gold medal at an Olympics, yes, you're probably 266 00:13:39,480 --> 00:13:41,080 Speaker 3: going to be able to turn that into some money 267 00:13:42,120 --> 00:13:45,600 Speaker 3: through sponsorships, endorsement, speaking career, et cetera, et cetera. 268 00:13:46,960 --> 00:13:52,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, of course, Like I think the technically all gold 269 00:13:52,440 --> 00:13:56,040 Speaker 1: medals are Olympic gold medals, they're all equal, but financially, 270 00:13:56,080 --> 00:13:58,880 Speaker 1: commercially they're definitely not all equal, are they in terms 271 00:13:58,880 --> 00:14:03,080 Speaker 1: of you know, like a a friend of mine is 272 00:14:03,080 --> 00:14:08,319 Speaker 1: an Olympic gold medalist, Lauren who won the Lauren Burns 273 00:14:08,360 --> 00:14:12,760 Speaker 1: who won the Taekwondo Olympic gold for US Australia in 274 00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:17,160 Speaker 1: the two thousand Olympics. And you know, she's a great athlete. 275 00:14:17,200 --> 00:14:19,600 Speaker 1: She deserved a gold medal. She's amazing. She's also got 276 00:14:19,640 --> 00:14:24,560 Speaker 1: a PhD. She's also a corporate speaker. But you know, 277 00:14:24,880 --> 00:14:28,200 Speaker 1: she will tell you she earns about nine dollars thirty 278 00:14:28,200 --> 00:14:31,120 Speaker 1: a year through that gold medal. You know, it certainly 279 00:14:31,160 --> 00:14:34,600 Speaker 1: doesn't hurt, but you know she has to work, she 280 00:14:34,680 --> 00:14:36,400 Speaker 1: has to study, she has to grind. 281 00:14:37,160 --> 00:14:39,440 Speaker 3: Oh, I'd heard of her, so it's worth something. 282 00:14:40,120 --> 00:14:41,960 Speaker 2: Oh have you heard of her? 283 00:14:43,040 --> 00:14:45,360 Speaker 3: When you said her name, it rung a bell with me. 284 00:14:46,040 --> 00:14:49,720 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, well I think yeah she was. Who's 285 00:14:49,720 --> 00:14:54,280 Speaker 1: her dad? Was it Ronnie Burns? I think the Australian anyway, 286 00:14:56,400 --> 00:14:58,800 Speaker 1: So let's just quickly talk about what we were going 287 00:14:58,880 --> 00:14:59,360 Speaker 1: to talk about. 288 00:14:59,360 --> 00:15:01,240 Speaker 3: We're actually going to all is. Yeah. 289 00:15:01,280 --> 00:15:05,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, well you mentioned to me the just about chatting 290 00:15:05,600 --> 00:15:08,920 Speaker 1: about the what seems to be the increasing prevalence of 291 00:15:09,960 --> 00:15:14,160 Speaker 1: you know, people being people pulling knives on police and 292 00:15:14,200 --> 00:15:18,920 Speaker 1: the subsequent you know, goings on of people with mental. 293 00:15:18,560 --> 00:15:20,480 Speaker 2: Health issues, who are you know. 294 00:15:20,480 --> 00:15:24,040 Speaker 1: Either being tasered or shot or and it seems like 295 00:15:25,360 --> 00:15:28,480 Speaker 1: is it disproportionate in Queensland or we just get more 296 00:15:28,520 --> 00:15:29,400 Speaker 1: exposure to it. 297 00:15:30,200 --> 00:15:34,400 Speaker 3: I don't know. I haven't done any sort of comprehensive 298 00:15:34,520 --> 00:15:36,880 Speaker 3: analysis of it. But what prompted me to raise this 299 00:15:36,960 --> 00:15:39,200 Speaker 3: with you is it's been on the news a bit 300 00:15:39,320 --> 00:15:41,600 Speaker 3: here in Queensland on the weekend because there's been a 301 00:15:41,600 --> 00:15:46,200 Speaker 3: police shooting of a fellow who pulled a knife on 302 00:15:46,240 --> 00:15:50,280 Speaker 3: police in a hospital and I think he survived it, 303 00:15:50,320 --> 00:15:53,720 Speaker 3: but there's been a lot of reporting about it because 304 00:15:55,160 --> 00:15:58,360 Speaker 3: they are saying this is the sort of third time 305 00:15:58,400 --> 00:16:02,840 Speaker 3: it's happened recently, and I think the Queensland Police Union 306 00:16:02,840 --> 00:16:05,320 Speaker 3: are saying there needs to be there needs to be 307 00:16:05,400 --> 00:16:11,600 Speaker 3: an inquiry in relation to mental health in Australia that 308 00:16:12,040 --> 00:16:14,160 Speaker 3: most of what police are dealing with when they go 309 00:16:14,240 --> 00:16:16,480 Speaker 3: out on calls now is dealing with people with mental 310 00:16:16,520 --> 00:16:20,200 Speaker 3: health issues. Now, he didn't cite any statistics for that, 311 00:16:20,440 --> 00:16:23,800 Speaker 3: so I don't know, but just going on his word, 312 00:16:23,920 --> 00:16:26,840 Speaker 3: and I guess head of the Police union probably knows 313 00:16:26,840 --> 00:16:31,600 Speaker 3: something about it, it does seem logical that a lot 314 00:16:31,640 --> 00:16:35,240 Speaker 3: of what police spend their time doing is dealing with 315 00:16:35,920 --> 00:16:39,120 Speaker 3: people with mental health issues. In the community. And so 316 00:16:39,160 --> 00:16:40,720 Speaker 3: what I did do is going to have a look 317 00:16:40,760 --> 00:16:46,040 Speaker 3: at the statistics on this and have the rates of 318 00:16:46,120 --> 00:16:50,040 Speaker 3: reported mental health issues in the community increase. So when 319 00:16:50,080 --> 00:16:52,680 Speaker 3: you talk about mental health issues in the community and 320 00:16:52,760 --> 00:16:56,560 Speaker 3: you start looking at the health statistics on it, they 321 00:16:56,600 --> 00:16:59,840 Speaker 3: divide him into sort of three groups, which is anxiety, depression, 322 00:17:00,080 --> 00:17:05,280 Speaker 3: what they call effective disorders, and drug abuse related disorders. 323 00:17:05,320 --> 00:17:08,000 Speaker 3: So mental health is a kind of a vague word 324 00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:10,040 Speaker 3: to use, and the media uses it a lot, but 325 00:17:10,080 --> 00:17:15,240 Speaker 3: it really only means those things. Right. There's people who 326 00:17:15,280 --> 00:17:21,000 Speaker 3: are schizophrenic slash psychotic and people who aren't. And this 327 00:17:21,040 --> 00:17:25,639 Speaker 3: is all seen as a spectrum. So anxiety is at 328 00:17:25,640 --> 00:17:29,840 Speaker 3: the light end of that spectrum. It progresses towards schizophrenia 329 00:17:30,320 --> 00:17:34,159 Speaker 3: and are sorry to psychosis, which is an isolator or 330 00:17:34,160 --> 00:17:39,160 Speaker 3: a single event of extreme paranoia, through to schizophrenia, which 331 00:17:39,160 --> 00:17:43,480 Speaker 3: is recurring events of extreme paranoia. Now those are all paranoia. 332 00:17:43,600 --> 00:17:47,800 Speaker 3: Is another way of saying anxiety about the intentions of 333 00:17:47,840 --> 00:17:51,480 Speaker 3: other humans. Right, So if you think about what anxiety is, 334 00:17:51,560 --> 00:17:56,119 Speaker 3: anxiety is an overestimation of risk. So you look at 335 00:17:56,119 --> 00:18:00,159 Speaker 3: the environment, and you all of us do this all 336 00:18:00,160 --> 00:18:02,920 Speaker 3: the time. We look at the environment and we estimate 337 00:18:03,280 --> 00:18:08,440 Speaker 3: a potential danger to us in that environment. And people 338 00:18:08,440 --> 00:18:12,160 Speaker 3: who don't have mental health issues, I guess you want 339 00:18:12,160 --> 00:18:14,320 Speaker 3: to call them normal if you want estimate, to say 340 00:18:14,359 --> 00:18:16,680 Speaker 3: the environmental risk. You might be looking around you now 341 00:18:16,720 --> 00:18:18,840 Speaker 3: and thinking about the environmental risk and see nothing that's 342 00:18:18,880 --> 00:18:22,919 Speaker 3: particularly threatening to you, and nothing that's putting you in 343 00:18:22,960 --> 00:18:26,800 Speaker 3: fear of your life or any sort of danger to you. 344 00:18:27,040 --> 00:18:33,000 Speaker 3: But a person who is suffering from anxiety is overestimating 345 00:18:33,160 --> 00:18:37,240 Speaker 3: that same risk set in your environment. So I don't 346 00:18:37,240 --> 00:18:39,359 Speaker 3: know what's in your environment. There might be some electronics 347 00:18:39,400 --> 00:18:43,080 Speaker 3: to do with this podcast, for example, and a person 348 00:18:43,160 --> 00:18:46,199 Speaker 3: with extreme anxiety might be looking at those electronics and 349 00:18:46,240 --> 00:18:51,119 Speaker 3: be worried about being electrocuted. Even though you might say, 350 00:18:52,040 --> 00:18:54,040 Speaker 3: you know, I'm assessing the risk here as load and 351 00:18:54,119 --> 00:18:58,520 Speaker 3: non existent. What anxiety does is change the risk assessment 352 00:19:00,000 --> 00:19:02,840 Speaker 3: materior in your brain. And we've talked about before how 353 00:19:02,880 --> 00:19:06,840 Speaker 3: that happens. So that's because too many hits of dopamine 354 00:19:06,920 --> 00:19:11,920 Speaker 3: caused by either a too stressful environment or addiction raises 355 00:19:12,000 --> 00:19:16,960 Speaker 3: are tolerance level, which adjusts the input values for your 356 00:19:17,000 --> 00:19:19,880 Speaker 3: brain in terms of assessing risk. So the higher that 357 00:19:20,000 --> 00:19:23,600 Speaker 3: threshold goes, that is the more stress you are under, 358 00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:28,480 Speaker 3: or the more addiction you are exposed to, the worse 359 00:19:28,600 --> 00:19:33,479 Speaker 3: you become at assessing assessing environmental risk. So the more 360 00:19:33,520 --> 00:19:37,040 Speaker 3: addicted you are, the more stressed you are, the more 361 00:19:37,200 --> 00:19:40,760 Speaker 3: likely you are to significantly overestimate the risk in your environment. 362 00:19:40,920 --> 00:19:45,720 Speaker 3: And we call that anxiety, which is stress about risk 363 00:19:47,560 --> 00:19:51,080 Speaker 3: overestimating the danger to you. Now, what happens is that 364 00:19:51,119 --> 00:19:54,800 Speaker 3: if you allow that to go for too long, that 365 00:19:54,920 --> 00:19:59,600 Speaker 3: then transfers into an overestimator of the overestimation of the 366 00:19:59,680 --> 00:20:03,520 Speaker 3: dane of other humans. So you start to worry about 367 00:20:03,520 --> 00:20:06,480 Speaker 3: the intentions of others. So you might be in an 368 00:20:06,560 --> 00:20:10,840 Speaker 3: environment where there's nothing there other than another person, but 369 00:20:11,520 --> 00:20:14,320 Speaker 3: you are overestimating the risk of that person. You start 370 00:20:14,480 --> 00:20:17,080 Speaker 3: thinking that they are there to do you harm, even 371 00:20:17,080 --> 00:20:19,840 Speaker 3: though there's nothing to a normal person sitting in the room, 372 00:20:20,440 --> 00:20:22,639 Speaker 3: there's nothing about them that suggests that they might do 373 00:20:22,680 --> 00:20:26,320 Speaker 3: you harm, you know them or whatever. As this risk 374 00:20:26,359 --> 00:20:30,359 Speaker 3: assessment gets pushed out of whack by addictional stress, you 375 00:20:31,720 --> 00:20:36,440 Speaker 3: start to have fears about the intention of others, and 376 00:20:36,480 --> 00:20:41,120 Speaker 3: when that becomes extreme it gets called a psychotic event, right, 377 00:20:41,160 --> 00:20:45,960 Speaker 3: which is that you are so upset or in fear 378 00:20:46,040 --> 00:20:48,320 Speaker 3: of your life because of the intention of another person 379 00:20:48,359 --> 00:20:52,359 Speaker 3: that you are forced to act against them. So you 380 00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:54,840 Speaker 3: are in a place where you've got to stop them 381 00:20:54,880 --> 00:20:58,680 Speaker 3: before they hurt you, even though there's nothing that would 382 00:20:58,680 --> 00:21:01,760 Speaker 3: suggest they are going to, you know, in a normal assessment, 383 00:21:02,600 --> 00:21:05,560 Speaker 3: that's their view of things, and often when police called 384 00:21:05,600 --> 00:21:09,960 Speaker 3: out that's what they're encountering. They're encountering someone who's in 385 00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:15,239 Speaker 3: that state. So a person who sees the police as 386 00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:19,080 Speaker 3: an imminent threat, and obviously they are. But to a 387 00:21:19,119 --> 00:21:21,240 Speaker 3: normal person, it's all I've got to do is stop 388 00:21:21,280 --> 00:21:24,720 Speaker 3: behaving weirdly and the police will stop being an imminent threat. 389 00:21:24,840 --> 00:21:29,760 Speaker 3: But that calculation is not possible when your brain's risk 390 00:21:29,800 --> 00:21:35,639 Speaker 3: assessment capability is out of whack. So the question is 391 00:21:36,240 --> 00:21:39,199 Speaker 3: has there been an actual increase in the things that 392 00:21:39,240 --> 00:21:41,920 Speaker 3: are being measured here, And the answer is very definitely yes. 393 00:21:42,800 --> 00:21:44,879 Speaker 3: So if we look at the last time it was 394 00:21:44,920 --> 00:21:49,359 Speaker 3: surveyed in two thousand and nine, estimated that there was 395 00:21:49,440 --> 00:21:56,280 Speaker 3: about eleven percent of the population, we're suffering depression, anxiety, 396 00:21:56,359 --> 00:22:00,359 Speaker 3: or other serious mental illness, so usually drug related about 397 00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:03,280 Speaker 3: eleven percent in two thousand and nine at any given 398 00:22:03,560 --> 00:22:06,200 Speaker 3: moment in time, right, So well, it's actually reportab within 399 00:22:06,240 --> 00:22:09,840 Speaker 3: the last twelve months. So in twenty twenty one, when 400 00:22:09,880 --> 00:22:12,800 Speaker 3: they did the same survey again, it was nineteen percent. 401 00:22:13,359 --> 00:22:15,120 Speaker 2: Wow, that is so acid. 402 00:22:15,680 --> 00:22:20,320 Speaker 3: So that's almost doubling in a ten year period. So 403 00:22:21,480 --> 00:22:25,280 Speaker 3: that's significant. You've gone from one in ten people to 404 00:22:25,359 --> 00:22:30,720 Speaker 3: one in five people in ten years. And if that's 405 00:22:30,840 --> 00:22:33,760 Speaker 3: what's going on in the environment, it's little wonder that 406 00:22:33,840 --> 00:22:38,879 Speaker 3: police are finding themselves increasingly facing people who have no 407 00:22:39,040 --> 00:22:42,800 Speaker 3: control over the fact that their brain is telling them 408 00:22:43,119 --> 00:22:47,280 Speaker 3: that these people are an imminent threat to me, not 409 00:22:47,440 --> 00:22:53,439 Speaker 3: just the police, but everybody around them, and to me, 410 00:22:54,200 --> 00:22:56,399 Speaker 3: that's a concern. It's a concern that this is a 411 00:22:56,440 --> 00:23:00,640 Speaker 3: surprise to anyone. It's a concern that it isn't headline 412 00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:03,120 Speaker 3: news every day of the week. And it's a concern 413 00:23:03,240 --> 00:23:06,320 Speaker 3: that the best anyone can ask for is a Royal 414 00:23:06,320 --> 00:23:09,520 Speaker 3: Commission into mental health. We don't need a Royal Commission 415 00:23:09,560 --> 00:23:12,240 Speaker 3: into mental health, which is what the police union fellow 416 00:23:12,280 --> 00:23:16,160 Speaker 3: was asking for. I could look at those stats. I don't. 417 00:23:16,400 --> 00:23:18,800 Speaker 3: I'm not a Royal commissioner. I just looked up the 418 00:23:18,800 --> 00:23:22,920 Speaker 3: stats on the Australian Institute of Health and Welfare's website. 419 00:23:23,800 --> 00:23:27,480 Speaker 3: It tells the story immediately, which is something is going 420 00:23:27,480 --> 00:23:29,520 Speaker 3: on here. Now. You and I have talked in the 421 00:23:29,560 --> 00:23:34,480 Speaker 3: past about why would that be, Why would suddenly the 422 00:23:34,720 --> 00:23:40,040 Speaker 3: incidents of this stuff have doubled, And we know the answer. 423 00:23:40,400 --> 00:23:44,119 Speaker 3: We flooded the population with the very things we know 424 00:23:44,920 --> 00:23:49,840 Speaker 3: are just that threshold measure of risk. We know that 425 00:23:49,920 --> 00:23:52,720 Speaker 3: when you make someone an addict, which is why, by 426 00:23:52,760 --> 00:23:56,400 Speaker 3: the way, drug related psychosis is lumped in with these 427 00:23:56,440 --> 00:24:00,359 Speaker 3: mental illnesses, when you make someone an addict, you are 428 00:24:00,560 --> 00:24:05,600 Speaker 3: just that threshold determinant of risk. Now, before two thousand 429 00:24:05,640 --> 00:24:09,520 Speaker 3: and nine, that was relatively rare. It only affected one 430 00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:13,720 Speaker 3: in ten people. Since two thousand and nine, it's gone 431 00:24:13,760 --> 00:24:17,800 Speaker 3: off like a rocket. What have we done that has 432 00:24:17,840 --> 00:24:22,800 Speaker 3: introduced massive amounts of addiction into the population since two 433 00:24:22,880 --> 00:24:25,640 Speaker 3: thousand and nine. Any clues? 434 00:24:26,160 --> 00:24:30,320 Speaker 2: Oh, yes, I would think tech technology, scraps. 435 00:24:30,640 --> 00:24:37,240 Speaker 3: We've importantly, we've put access to software designed to addict 436 00:24:37,320 --> 00:24:42,439 Speaker 3: the human brain in the hands of every teenager in 437 00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:47,119 Speaker 3: the country, which is the point in life where this occurs, 438 00:24:47,480 --> 00:24:51,760 Speaker 3: that is where all addictions start. We've put devices in 439 00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:54,639 Speaker 3: their hands that are the equivalent of a dopamine button 440 00:24:55,119 --> 00:25:00,080 Speaker 3: that gives repeated, continuous hits of dopamine, the thing we 441 00:25:00,320 --> 00:25:05,320 Speaker 3: know are just risk tolerance, and then we are surprised 442 00:25:05,760 --> 00:25:07,720 Speaker 3: when that is exactly what occurs. 443 00:25:08,359 --> 00:25:12,439 Speaker 1: Yeah, I wonder, I mean, like when I listen to 444 00:25:12,480 --> 00:25:15,280 Speaker 1: you break this down, which I've listened to similar things 445 00:25:15,280 --> 00:25:19,120 Speaker 1: with you before, and it makes complete sense. Is there 446 00:25:19,119 --> 00:25:24,159 Speaker 1: anyone else sharing this gospel or sharing this this line 447 00:25:24,200 --> 00:25:29,560 Speaker 1: of thinking? Like is anyone else drawing these putting these 448 00:25:29,640 --> 00:25:33,000 Speaker 1: jigsaw pieces together like you do? 449 00:25:33,560 --> 00:25:37,399 Speaker 3: Like because yeah, you know you go on, you know, 450 00:25:37,440 --> 00:25:38,920 Speaker 3: you finished and finish. 451 00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:43,199 Speaker 1: I was also this is like an adjacent conversation. But 452 00:25:43,280 --> 00:25:45,239 Speaker 1: the other thing that occurs to me with all of this, 453 00:25:45,359 --> 00:25:47,760 Speaker 1: and so andswer which one you want first, is that 454 00:25:48,720 --> 00:25:51,600 Speaker 1: like on top of the people with elevated anxiety and 455 00:25:52,320 --> 00:25:56,840 Speaker 1: paranoia and situational whatever that the cops go into, then 456 00:25:56,880 --> 00:26:00,960 Speaker 1: there's the cops themselves that have been anxious and traumatized 457 00:26:01,080 --> 00:26:06,080 Speaker 1: and potentially elevated. Like I work with police, and that 458 00:26:06,320 --> 00:26:09,840 Speaker 1: there aren't too many cops who don't have their own trauma. 459 00:26:10,640 --> 00:26:15,360 Speaker 1: Who are you dealing with something because of they need 460 00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:17,400 Speaker 1: to be perpetually hyper vigilant. 461 00:26:17,640 --> 00:26:21,879 Speaker 3: I mean, well, remember the other way to induce this 462 00:26:22,040 --> 00:26:25,760 Speaker 3: state is of stress. So they're going the other pathway, 463 00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:29,480 Speaker 3: which is if you're constantly exposed to stress, then you'll 464 00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:33,240 Speaker 3: have the same thing. Now that's by design, by the way, 465 00:26:33,280 --> 00:26:36,879 Speaker 3: because you want to be hyper vigilant and hyper alert 466 00:26:36,920 --> 00:26:39,639 Speaker 3: if you are in an environment where you are constantly 467 00:26:39,760 --> 00:26:44,720 Speaker 3: in very real danger. So that is a pro evolutionary thing. 468 00:26:44,760 --> 00:26:47,760 Speaker 3: It's not good for your mental health, you know, which 469 00:26:47,760 --> 00:26:48,240 Speaker 3: is why. 470 00:26:48,080 --> 00:26:51,560 Speaker 1: It's it's good for in the moment survival, but it's 471 00:26:51,600 --> 00:26:55,320 Speaker 1: a nervous system all for anything over the long time, no. 472 00:26:55,359 --> 00:26:58,240 Speaker 3: Because it leaves that risk. The risk assessment doesn't change 473 00:26:58,280 --> 00:27:00,480 Speaker 3: as soon as you are in a non threatening environment. 474 00:27:00,520 --> 00:27:03,600 Speaker 3: So it's it's the same thing as happens with addiction, 475 00:27:03,760 --> 00:27:05,879 Speaker 3: which is that you are left with that risk assessment 476 00:27:06,240 --> 00:27:11,080 Speaker 3: set too high. And so the other interesting thing is 477 00:27:11,080 --> 00:27:14,040 Speaker 3: that there's massive crossover then between someone who's in that 478 00:27:14,080 --> 00:27:18,639 Speaker 3: state and addiction. So a person exposed to chronic stress 479 00:27:18,880 --> 00:27:22,240 Speaker 3: is most likely to be addicted to something. Someone who 480 00:27:22,320 --> 00:27:24,440 Speaker 3: is addicted to something is most likely to be in 481 00:27:24,480 --> 00:27:28,119 Speaker 3: a situation of chronic stress. So there's massive overlap between 482 00:27:28,160 --> 00:27:29,080 Speaker 3: those two things. 483 00:27:30,880 --> 00:27:35,280 Speaker 1: Well, obviously there's no quick solution, but and this is 484 00:27:35,480 --> 00:27:42,480 Speaker 1: very left field, but do do police in Coinsland carry tasers. 485 00:27:42,880 --> 00:27:46,240 Speaker 3: They do, yes, right, and and the use of those 486 00:27:46,359 --> 00:27:49,399 Speaker 3: has increased. I think I saw in the story about 487 00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:52,399 Speaker 3: this that the use of those has increased massively in 488 00:27:52,440 --> 00:27:53,280 Speaker 3: the last year or so. 489 00:27:53,920 --> 00:27:58,679 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, Well, I mean it's a you know, 490 00:27:59,200 --> 00:28:01,200 Speaker 1: I'm sure no one wants to be tasered, but I'd 491 00:28:01,320 --> 00:28:03,280 Speaker 1: rather be tasered than shot with a bullet. 492 00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:06,800 Speaker 3: Well, I mean, the guidelines for use of a taser 493 00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:10,200 Speaker 3: is a policeman is only supposed to draw it when 494 00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:15,800 Speaker 3: they feel under imminent threat. Yes, so under personal threat. 495 00:28:16,359 --> 00:28:20,520 Speaker 3: So it's so the fact that it's being used more 496 00:28:20,520 --> 00:28:23,440 Speaker 3: frequently tells you that there's more threat. It's a more 497 00:28:23,480 --> 00:28:29,280 Speaker 3: threatening environment. Yeah. So, you know, the problem we've got 498 00:28:29,320 --> 00:28:32,280 Speaker 3: here is that we now have, you know, in the 499 00:28:32,320 --> 00:28:35,119 Speaker 3: space of a decade, double the number of people in 500 00:28:35,119 --> 00:28:39,400 Speaker 3: the population who are likely to be a threat, and 501 00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:44,440 Speaker 3: we are doing nothing about that. We are you know, 502 00:28:44,920 --> 00:28:48,680 Speaker 3: we've done it using a device designed to create exactly 503 00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:53,760 Speaker 3: this issue, and we are doing exactly nothing about it. 504 00:28:55,120 --> 00:28:58,680 Speaker 3: So don't expect solutions to appear soon, no matter how 505 00:28:58,760 --> 00:28:59,920 Speaker 3: many Royal commissions are held. 506 00:29:00,840 --> 00:29:05,120 Speaker 1: And also, you know, the use of tech is not 507 00:29:05,200 --> 00:29:07,719 Speaker 1: going to go down, No, no, people are not going 508 00:29:07,760 --> 00:29:09,240 Speaker 1: to be using these things less. 509 00:29:09,480 --> 00:29:14,560 Speaker 3: I mean, well, because because it's addictive. 510 00:29:15,720 --> 00:29:19,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's what I'm saying. So what's the answer then, 511 00:29:19,960 --> 00:29:22,320 Speaker 2: or what's part of the answer. 512 00:29:23,520 --> 00:29:25,520 Speaker 3: The part of the answer is exactly the same answer 513 00:29:25,840 --> 00:29:28,520 Speaker 3: as if we were having this conversation I don't know 514 00:29:28,560 --> 00:29:30,480 Speaker 3: fifteen years ago when I first wrote about sugar, the 515 00:29:30,520 --> 00:29:35,120 Speaker 3: answer would be exactly the same. Stop using it. Understand 516 00:29:35,160 --> 00:29:37,840 Speaker 3: And people say, well, you know, how do I do that? Well, 517 00:29:37,840 --> 00:29:41,160 Speaker 3: you have to understand where it is and how you're ingesting. 518 00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:43,840 Speaker 3: You know, if you talk to a smoker, for example, 519 00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:48,000 Speaker 3: no one accidentally shoves a cigarette in their mouth and 520 00:29:48,080 --> 00:29:51,640 Speaker 3: lights it. They understand exactly what they're doing. And when 521 00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:54,080 Speaker 3: we have this conversation with people, like I said fifteen 522 00:29:54,120 --> 00:29:59,000 Speaker 3: years ago about sugar, you know, it's the accidental ingestion. 523 00:29:59,120 --> 00:30:03,240 Speaker 3: It's not understanding what you're doing that's the problem. And 524 00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:06,480 Speaker 3: once you know what you're doing, people are smart enough 525 00:30:06,520 --> 00:30:09,360 Speaker 3: to stop it. You know, people are smart enough to 526 00:30:09,400 --> 00:30:11,920 Speaker 3: stand back from an addiction once they understand that it 527 00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:15,520 Speaker 3: is an addiction and do something about it. Most people 528 00:30:15,560 --> 00:30:18,800 Speaker 3: will People are not self destructive. Most people will say 529 00:30:19,160 --> 00:30:22,080 Speaker 3: I actually don't want to do this. I don't want 530 00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:24,600 Speaker 3: my brain messed with. I want to step back from it. 531 00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:28,320 Speaker 3: But at the moment, the prevailing narrative is not only 532 00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:31,840 Speaker 3: is this safe, this is necessary, and we have to 533 00:30:31,880 --> 00:30:36,360 Speaker 3: give our kids these devices to use in schools. We 534 00:30:36,480 --> 00:30:38,440 Speaker 3: have to be able to step back from that and 535 00:30:38,640 --> 00:30:43,120 Speaker 3: realistically say no, oops, sorry, made a bit of a mistake, 536 00:30:43,280 --> 00:30:47,840 Speaker 3: accidentally distributed highly addictive stuff to school children. But it's okay, 537 00:30:47,960 --> 00:30:49,680 Speaker 3: we're on it. We'll stop doing that now. 538 00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:54,120 Speaker 1: But I guess the difference between you know, in the 539 00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:58,920 Speaker 1: cigarette analogy, the difference is that you know, technology is 540 00:30:59,080 --> 00:31:04,440 Speaker 1: integrated into every like literally every component of our existence now. 541 00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:08,320 Speaker 3: But a person who smokes a cigarette today knows exactly 542 00:31:08,360 --> 00:31:12,240 Speaker 3: what they are doing and they don't care. Okay, they 543 00:31:12,280 --> 00:31:15,360 Speaker 3: know what they're doing, they know the potential damage. They 544 00:31:15,400 --> 00:31:17,600 Speaker 3: know it's addictive, which is why there's only about thirteen 545 00:31:17,600 --> 00:31:21,200 Speaker 3: percent of people who still do it. But and there'll 546 00:31:21,240 --> 00:31:23,640 Speaker 3: be a component of that no matter what you're talking about, 547 00:31:23,760 --> 00:31:25,760 Speaker 3: people who will say, you know what, I know it's addictive. 548 00:31:25,760 --> 00:31:28,360 Speaker 3: I don't care. I enjoy it. It's a pleasurable thing 549 00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:30,520 Speaker 3: for me. I need it. I'm doing it anyway. I 550 00:31:30,560 --> 00:31:33,920 Speaker 3: don't care. But the vast majority of people who indulge 551 00:31:33,960 --> 00:31:37,760 Speaker 3: in addictive behavior don't want to be doing it, and 552 00:31:37,800 --> 00:31:40,680 Speaker 3: once they know that that's what they're doing, they will 553 00:31:40,760 --> 00:31:42,560 Speaker 3: take steps to stop doing it. 554 00:31:44,840 --> 00:31:46,959 Speaker 1: I feel like with and this is just a feeling, 555 00:31:47,000 --> 00:31:49,960 Speaker 1: not a bloody fact, but I feel like with technology, 556 00:31:50,600 --> 00:31:53,040 Speaker 1: you know, people will be listening to this, nodding along, 557 00:31:53,080 --> 00:31:55,360 Speaker 1: going yeah, people should do something about that. 558 00:31:56,000 --> 00:31:59,920 Speaker 3: But it's not. Well, there's an asset test, isn't there, 559 00:32:00,320 --> 00:32:01,960 Speaker 3: you know, And this is the one I put out 560 00:32:02,000 --> 00:32:04,720 Speaker 3: to people when I speak to groups, which is people 561 00:32:04,760 --> 00:32:06,760 Speaker 3: will often say, I'll say, you know what all you've 562 00:32:06,760 --> 00:32:09,720 Speaker 3: got to do is stop doing it, you know, stop 563 00:32:09,800 --> 00:32:12,000 Speaker 3: using Instagram. People not their heads and say yeah, yeah, 564 00:32:12,000 --> 00:32:14,160 Speaker 3: I can stop doing that, no worries at all, And 565 00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:16,280 Speaker 3: I say, oh, excellent, all right, so just delete the 566 00:32:16,320 --> 00:32:18,239 Speaker 3: app from your phone. I'll go, yeah, yeah, I can 567 00:32:18,280 --> 00:32:22,000 Speaker 3: do that, and you'll say, oh, that's good. But you know, 568 00:32:22,200 --> 00:32:23,640 Speaker 3: I know you're thinking in the back of mind, I 569 00:32:23,640 --> 00:32:27,520 Speaker 3: can just reinstall later if I get desperate. So now 570 00:32:27,600 --> 00:32:31,840 Speaker 3: delete your account then, and people start having a roll. 571 00:32:34,880 --> 00:32:37,000 Speaker 2: Yeah that's different, isn't it. That's different. 572 00:32:37,840 --> 00:32:38,640 Speaker 3: That's permanent. 573 00:32:39,360 --> 00:32:43,840 Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, So so I know we're going to wind up, 574 00:32:43,880 --> 00:32:49,800 Speaker 1: but pursuant to this, your honor, have you been and 575 00:32:49,880 --> 00:32:52,240 Speaker 1: I know your kids are mostly older now, but have 576 00:32:52,360 --> 00:32:58,160 Speaker 1: you consciously kind of created framework or rules or you know, 577 00:32:58,320 --> 00:33:02,760 Speaker 1: standards in your house with your kids around all this stuff? 578 00:33:03,320 --> 00:33:05,880 Speaker 3: Oh? Absolutely, absolutely so. One of the books I wrote 579 00:33:05,880 --> 00:33:08,360 Speaker 3: about this, teen Brain, which was the first one I wrote, 580 00:33:09,080 --> 00:33:12,200 Speaker 3: I think, came out twenty sixteen something like that. It 581 00:33:14,760 --> 00:33:21,440 Speaker 3: actually described what we do in our household, and we unfortunately, 582 00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:27,880 Speaker 3: they attended a school where devices were mandatory, so hipads 583 00:33:27,880 --> 00:33:33,320 Speaker 3: were mandatory. So it took every gram of willpower and 584 00:33:35,720 --> 00:33:40,320 Speaker 3: sticking to the cause approach to things to regulate their 585 00:33:40,440 --> 00:33:42,520 Speaker 3: use of those, because they come home with the device right, 586 00:33:42,840 --> 00:33:44,720 Speaker 3: and then they're off to their bedroom or whatever. And 587 00:33:46,040 --> 00:33:48,520 Speaker 3: unless you're prepared to ride them like a pony on 588 00:33:48,560 --> 00:33:51,680 Speaker 3: this stuff right and get that device back and put 589 00:33:51,720 --> 00:33:53,800 Speaker 3: it in a public place and make sure it is 590 00:33:53,840 --> 00:33:58,640 Speaker 3: not touched again and keep monitoring it, then they're just 591 00:33:58,720 --> 00:34:02,760 Speaker 3: too quick and it's too easy and too portable unless 592 00:34:02,760 --> 00:34:05,320 Speaker 3: you are. So. One of my kids, the eldest, who 593 00:34:05,360 --> 00:34:09,040 Speaker 3: were sort of pre this area, created a little stand 594 00:34:09,040 --> 00:34:11,040 Speaker 3: he made out of wood, which which they could all 595 00:34:11,080 --> 00:34:14,040 Speaker 3: sit on to be charged, and it was just made 596 00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:15,960 Speaker 3: it really really easy to keep an eye on, you know, 597 00:34:16,000 --> 00:34:17,800 Speaker 3: you just had to be able to count. Then right, Okay, 598 00:34:17,800 --> 00:34:20,280 Speaker 3: there's four kids and there's four devices. That's it. They're 599 00:34:20,280 --> 00:34:22,080 Speaker 3: all in that in one place. I know it. If 600 00:34:22,160 --> 00:34:24,160 Speaker 3: one's missing, you know, you've got to go hunting. But 601 00:34:25,200 --> 00:34:27,440 Speaker 3: that's just what the device the school required them to do. 602 00:34:27,560 --> 00:34:30,560 Speaker 3: With phones, we ban them entirely, not in I mean, 603 00:34:30,960 --> 00:34:33,400 Speaker 3: they had phones, but they were the twenty dollars cheapies 604 00:34:33,400 --> 00:34:34,839 Speaker 3: you get from came up. But all they can do 605 00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:39,239 Speaker 3: is make and receive phone calls. They didn't have the 606 00:34:39,360 --> 00:34:42,440 Speaker 3: kind you know, they didn't have smartphones, and which was 607 00:34:42,480 --> 00:34:45,000 Speaker 3: fortunate because when the only thing a phone does is 608 00:34:45,040 --> 00:34:47,919 Speaker 3: make and receive phone calls, it gets lost a lot. Yeah, 609 00:34:48,000 --> 00:34:51,400 Speaker 3: so it was good that they were cheap, yes, yes. 610 00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:53,759 Speaker 1: And now that now that there will some of them 611 00:34:53,840 --> 00:34:55,480 Speaker 1: are how old is your youngest? 612 00:34:55,600 --> 00:34:58,000 Speaker 3: My youngest now are twenty. Well they're turning twenty one 613 00:34:58,040 --> 00:34:58,399 Speaker 3: this year. 614 00:34:58,840 --> 00:35:02,319 Speaker 1: Okay, so all your are adults, and do they ever 615 00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:05,319 Speaker 1: talk to you about growing up in that environment and 616 00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:09,680 Speaker 1: their pleasure or displeasure or at that, you know, is 617 00:35:09,719 --> 00:35:12,440 Speaker 1: it like I'm glad you did that, dad, or you 618 00:35:12,440 --> 00:35:13,840 Speaker 1: were a fucking tyrant dad. 619 00:35:14,480 --> 00:35:16,600 Speaker 3: I don't ever expect to be thanked for stuff like 620 00:35:16,680 --> 00:35:22,040 Speaker 3: this by your kids. I they now because they're adults. 621 00:35:22,200 --> 00:35:24,959 Speaker 3: You know, they have their own phones, they use them, 622 00:35:25,640 --> 00:35:28,600 Speaker 3: and they probably spend way too much time on them. 623 00:35:28,640 --> 00:35:32,759 Speaker 3: But I think I can detect that they're not addicted 624 00:35:32,800 --> 00:35:35,080 Speaker 3: to them. And that's because a critical thing to remember 625 00:35:35,080 --> 00:35:39,960 Speaker 3: about this is it is growth stage dependent. All addictions 626 00:35:40,000 --> 00:35:44,160 Speaker 3: start between the onset of puberty and about eight to 627 00:35:44,239 --> 00:35:49,000 Speaker 3: nine years later. So that's because that's the particular part 628 00:35:49,080 --> 00:35:51,920 Speaker 3: of the growth of the human brain when something that 629 00:35:51,960 --> 00:35:57,319 Speaker 3: protects us against addiction is turned off, and that is 630 00:35:57,360 --> 00:36:00,600 Speaker 3: turned off to allow puberty to happen and to allow 631 00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:04,000 Speaker 3: a certain part of the brain to grow. This has 632 00:36:04,040 --> 00:36:08,239 Speaker 3: been known long before we had devices that all addictions 633 00:36:08,280 --> 00:36:13,040 Speaker 3: start in the teens. Alcoholics became alcoholics in their teens. 634 00:36:14,680 --> 00:36:18,839 Speaker 3: All smokers became smokers in their teens. It's not just 635 00:36:19,120 --> 00:36:22,560 Speaker 3: you know, anecdotes, that's what the evidence says. So it 636 00:36:22,640 --> 00:36:28,319 Speaker 3: is singularly the worst possible time to expose anybody to 637 00:36:28,520 --> 00:36:32,120 Speaker 3: anything potentially addictive, and yet that's exactly what we are doing. 638 00:36:32,960 --> 00:36:35,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's when the door's open widest last one before 639 00:36:35,520 --> 00:36:39,719 Speaker 1: we go. With all of these what seems to be 640 00:36:39,800 --> 00:36:44,640 Speaker 1: an upsurge in knife attacks if we're correlating it to, 641 00:36:45,960 --> 00:36:48,920 Speaker 1: you know, in some way, and the increase in mental 642 00:36:48,960 --> 00:36:52,840 Speaker 1: health anxiety, depression, drug related mental health to doubling in 643 00:36:52,920 --> 00:36:55,799 Speaker 1: ten years, blah blah blah, and one of the byproducts 644 00:36:55,840 --> 00:36:58,840 Speaker 1: of that might be these knife attacks. But at the 645 00:36:58,880 --> 00:37:01,960 Speaker 1: same time, or it's just interesting to note that the 646 00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:08,960 Speaker 1: vast majority of the knife attack ers men. So yeah, like, well, 647 00:37:09,440 --> 00:37:12,200 Speaker 1: maybe that's not true, but like I rarely, you know, 648 00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:13,839 Speaker 1: all of the stuff that we see on. 649 00:37:13,800 --> 00:37:16,760 Speaker 2: The news is invariably it's men with knives. 650 00:37:17,440 --> 00:37:19,839 Speaker 3: Well, I don't know if you've noticed, Craig, but there's 651 00:37:19,880 --> 00:37:23,680 Speaker 3: a difference between men and women, and it's. 652 00:37:23,280 --> 00:37:26,279 Speaker 1: A lot when you're sarcastic, it's a good thing that 653 00:37:26,320 --> 00:37:27,320 Speaker 1: you're in another state. 654 00:37:28,000 --> 00:37:28,640 Speaker 2: You on the nose. 655 00:37:30,000 --> 00:37:32,600 Speaker 3: There's a there's a key difference. It's a really really 656 00:37:32,600 --> 00:37:38,799 Speaker 3: important difference. It's a little hormone called testosterone, and testosterone 657 00:37:40,200 --> 00:37:44,839 Speaker 3: has a significant effect on impulse control. So when you're 658 00:37:44,880 --> 00:37:48,560 Speaker 3: loaded to the eyeballs with testosterone, as any male, particularly 659 00:37:48,560 --> 00:37:51,719 Speaker 3: a male between the start of puberty and sort of 660 00:37:51,719 --> 00:37:57,720 Speaker 3: their early thirties. Is they have significantly less impulse control 661 00:37:58,400 --> 00:38:03,040 Speaker 3: than a female of the same and I'm talking massively less, 662 00:38:03,880 --> 00:38:07,440 Speaker 3: which is which is why violent crimes tend to be 663 00:38:07,520 --> 00:38:11,640 Speaker 3: committed by people who fit that age and gender. And 664 00:38:12,719 --> 00:38:19,040 Speaker 3: it's it's that when you wire someone to consider the 665 00:38:19,040 --> 00:38:23,000 Speaker 3: world more dangerous than the average person would regard it, 666 00:38:23,840 --> 00:38:27,120 Speaker 3: and then you dial their impulse control down to zero, 667 00:38:28,719 --> 00:38:30,040 Speaker 3: predictable things happen. 668 00:38:30,800 --> 00:38:35,799 Speaker 1: M So I mean, yeah, so it's that combination really, 669 00:38:35,800 --> 00:38:39,560 Speaker 1: because we're not even though women are subjected to the 670 00:38:39,600 --> 00:38:44,160 Speaker 1: same stressors and I would think anxiety depression and you know, 671 00:38:44,400 --> 00:38:47,719 Speaker 1: is as high or higher in some instances, but they're 672 00:38:47,719 --> 00:38:51,719 Speaker 1: not running around with knives. So another significant factor is 673 00:38:51,760 --> 00:38:53,800 Speaker 1: that is that is testosterone? 674 00:38:54,040 --> 00:38:57,400 Speaker 3: Well absolutely, and you see it come through in suicide statistics, 675 00:38:57,520 --> 00:39:02,520 Speaker 3: so yes, you see. I mean I really don't like 676 00:39:02,640 --> 00:39:07,560 Speaker 3: referring to it as success, but success suicides are more 677 00:39:07,600 --> 00:39:08,880 Speaker 3: often performed by males. 678 00:39:09,960 --> 00:39:13,560 Speaker 1: And such a crazy term that that isn't it. It's like, yeah, 679 00:39:13,680 --> 00:39:15,560 Speaker 1: but that is the term, So don't send us an 680 00:39:15,600 --> 00:39:18,840 Speaker 1: email because that is the term that is used everyone. 681 00:39:18,920 --> 00:39:23,959 Speaker 3: Yeah, So it's it's the same thing at play, which 682 00:39:24,000 --> 00:39:29,760 Speaker 3: is less impulse control, more testosterone, more ability to complete 683 00:39:29,800 --> 00:39:33,800 Speaker 3: the act. And you see that in the methodology of suicide. 684 00:39:33,800 --> 00:39:39,439 Speaker 3: It's chosen as well. So females frequently will choose a 685 00:39:39,560 --> 00:39:43,080 Speaker 3: you know, like an overdose or something that doesn't involve 686 00:39:43,080 --> 00:39:47,400 Speaker 3: a violent, you know, attack on themselves, whereas a male 687 00:39:48,280 --> 00:39:53,080 Speaker 3: will will have no concerns about it being a train whatever. 688 00:39:53,200 --> 00:39:55,239 Speaker 3: I don't want to talk about this in detail, but 689 00:39:55,280 --> 00:39:59,399 Speaker 3: it's but there are very obvious differences to that. There's 690 00:39:59,440 --> 00:40:03,240 Speaker 3: a lot of research on why, and it does come 691 00:40:03,320 --> 00:40:08,440 Speaker 3: back to that difference in testosterone loading and impulse control. 692 00:40:09,239 --> 00:40:11,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, amazing, amazing. 693 00:40:12,000 --> 00:40:14,200 Speaker 1: Well we started on a high and finished kind of 694 00:40:14,239 --> 00:40:17,480 Speaker 1: on a low. But it's all interesting. It's all interesting, 695 00:40:17,560 --> 00:40:21,840 Speaker 1: and just quickly back to something momentarily more positive. 696 00:40:21,880 --> 00:40:26,560 Speaker 2: Thirty seconds. So, how did the Australian handballers go? 697 00:40:27,840 --> 00:40:31,040 Speaker 3: There were no Australian handballs Australia for an Olympics in 698 00:40:31,040 --> 00:40:36,440 Speaker 3: a pink fit honestly, Oh really, So there's I think 699 00:40:36,800 --> 00:40:40,560 Speaker 3: there's sixteen countries make it qualify to the Olympics, and 700 00:40:40,600 --> 00:40:46,600 Speaker 3: the qualification pathways very long and through various pathways. Australia 701 00:40:47,080 --> 00:40:50,719 Speaker 3: would have almost zero hope of it we were there 702 00:40:50,760 --> 00:40:52,759 Speaker 3: in two thousand because we're the host country, and we'll 703 00:40:52,760 --> 00:40:54,880 Speaker 3: be there in twenty thirty two because we'll be the 704 00:40:54,920 --> 00:40:57,719 Speaker 3: host country. But that'll be baud it. I'd say, all right, 705 00:40:57,840 --> 00:41:00,399 Speaker 3: might appreciate you as year later.