Speaker 1: I get a gang. It's the You Project. It's Tiffany Ankook,
Speaker 1: It's Kelly Margaret Smith and I made that up. We'll
Speaker 1: find out what it really is in a Mama. Craig
Speaker 1: Anthony up the Bloody Project. That's you. It's a Friday afternoon.
Speaker 1: This my third third podcast. Today it's been big Patty
Speaker 1: UNI meeting. I've been writing my thesis. I met Scottie
Speaker 1: Douglas this morning for some caffeine lifted heavy shit at
Speaker 1: the gym. I spoke to Kelly on Messenger. That's a
Speaker 1: weird format to make a phone call on. It even
Speaker 1: sounds like you're ringing from Mars. And have you ever
Speaker 1: called anyone tip on Messenger when you don't have their
Speaker 1: actual phone number?
Speaker 2: No, no use.
Speaker 1: It's weird. It's weird. It's a little bit like you're
Speaker 1: talking underwater. It's not quite a normal phone call.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a bit weird. What don't't you two weeks?
Speaker 1: I don't know. I should actually have her number, Kell,
Speaker 1: What is it? Just give it to me now? So
Speaker 1: it's it's zero four, Yeah, it's one eight hundred hot.
Speaker 1: That's it, Kelly Smith. Yeah, what's your middle name?
Speaker 3: Kel It's Marie, So you.
Speaker 1: Were close Kelleen, Marie Kelley Marie, Well that that kind
Speaker 1: of Tiffany and Craig Anthony.
Speaker 2: Kelley Marie Jane or An, wasn't it?
Speaker 3: Or just nothing so front of the three. A few
Speaker 3: people in my family don't have a middle name.
Speaker 1: Yeah what Yeah, it doesn't really serve any purpose, does it?
Speaker 1: A middle name? I've never really thought about this till
Speaker 1: right now in sixty two years, and I'm sure we
Speaker 1: don't really need a conversation around it, but fuck it
Speaker 1: does it serve any purpose a middle name?
Speaker 3: I think sometimes it does if people don't. I know
Speaker 3: a few people who don't like the first name that
Speaker 3: they were given, so they've jumped in their middle name
Speaker 3: and just started using that.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, well, I guess there's that. There's that, or
Speaker 1: people just make up a name. They just they just
Speaker 1: have a nickname and they go by that, like jay Z.
Speaker 1: That hasn't worked out well for him.
Speaker 3: No, no need.
Speaker 1: It is either one that's in the big house at
Speaker 1: the moment, or am I getting my rappers mixed up?
Speaker 3: I think you're getting the rappers with the hyphens mixed up?
Speaker 1: Oh? Is it? I don't know, someone's in the big house.
Speaker 1: I don't know. I get them, you know me, I'm
Speaker 1: all over the rappers. I mean, if you want an
Speaker 1: update on all things rap or hip hop, I'm not
Speaker 1: your guy. Tiff. How's your day been? How's your Friday been?
Speaker 2: I've really enjoyed. It's been good. The sun's out, I've
Speaker 2: been out and about. I've done some work, I've done
Speaker 2: a potty with you, I'm doing my second one with you.
Speaker 2: I've lifted me. Shit, could it get any better than that? Really?
Speaker 1: Oh wow? What a dream day. I mean people think about,
Speaker 1: you know, the best day of their life, and you've
Speaker 1: just had it today. It's like wow, I mean it's
Speaker 1: only downhill from here, isn't it? Seeing me twice on
Speaker 1: the interwebs my pretty little face and cal did you
Speaker 1: have a good day? Also?
Speaker 3: I've had a great day, had a great weekday, and
Speaker 3: now I get to finish it with you guys.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's really I mean most people would It's a
Speaker 1: dream end to any week. I mean most people would
Speaker 1: aspire to do a podcast with Tiff and I on
Speaker 1: a Friday at five point thirty.
Speaker 3: Absolutely?
Speaker 1: How many people do you reckon? Would be? If I said,
Speaker 1: who wants to come on the you project and interview me.
Speaker 1: How many people, like, out of typically out of ten,
Speaker 1: how many would want to do that? And how many
Speaker 1: would be terrified?
Speaker 3: I think ten would say yes and ten would be terrified.
Speaker 1: Oh so they'd say yes, but do it being terrified.
Speaker 3: That's what I did.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I really don't think that many people would
Speaker 1: want to do it. But anyway, you did it. Here
Speaker 1: you are and now you fucking just like Tiff, You've
Speaker 1: just wormed your way into my heart, into the hearts
Speaker 1: of the listeners. Hey, here we go. What are we
Speaker 1: talking about? What are we talking about? Quick? Hit me
Speaker 1: up up while my brain's still working, because I think
Speaker 1: it's about to come to a cognitive grinding hold at
Speaker 1: about six point thirty.
Speaker 3: All right, let's get this done quick. So I have
Speaker 3: a little story before my question today.
Speaker 1: I'm ready. I was in a.
Speaker 3: Meeting at work the other day where it was like
Speaker 3: it was a cross department meeting and the person running
Speaker 3: it she was I think a little bit nervous, and
Speaker 3: so the meeting time was scheduled. Everybody that needed to
Speaker 3: be there accepted that meeting time. We get to the meeting,
Speaker 3: all of the information was given, all of the action
Speaker 3: items were decided on really good, really concise. We finished
Speaker 3: about half an hour early. So we finished the meeting
Speaker 3: and she said to me, how do you think I went,
Speaker 3: I said, yeah, great, you know, everybody got what they
Speaker 3: needed from it. We have action items. We can move forward.
Speaker 3: She was okay, good, and I said, why were you
Speaker 3: talking so fast in this meeting? She's like, oh, I
Speaker 3: just felt like I needed to give their time back
Speaker 3: because mine isn't as important as theirs. And I went, oh,
Speaker 3: I said, can you please stop undervaluing yourself because they
Speaker 3: actually agreed to that meeting time and they were, you know,
Speaker 3: they were happy to have that conversation with you and
Speaker 3: give you that time, so therefore you're just as valuable
Speaker 3: as them. And the next day she came back to
Speaker 3: me and she was like, wow, that was a really
Speaker 3: good reframe because I didn't actually think that I was
Speaker 3: as valuable as the other people there. And it just
Speaker 3: made me think, well, how many other people are in
Speaker 3: that position, and why do we kind of go your
Speaker 3: time's more important than mine, I'm not adding as much
Speaker 3: value as you are, And what can we do to
Speaker 3: change that perception.
Speaker 1: That's a really interesting experience and I think we think
Speaker 1: and this me just thinking out loud and I did
Speaker 1: not know this was coming everyone, and to feel for
Speaker 1: to jump in. I think, like a lot in our culture,
Speaker 1: we kind of think that we are worth whatever our
Speaker 1: hourly rate is. Like we get our sense of self
Speaker 1: and our sense of maybe self worth and value from
Speaker 1: either our brand or our profile, or our annual salary
Speaker 1: or our hourly rate or what people will pay to
Speaker 1: have us do a thing or provide a service. And
Speaker 1: maybe she's paid less than some of the others in
Speaker 1: the meeting, so she sees herself as less than or
Speaker 1: I'm not sure is that the case. Is she on
Speaker 1: perhaps a lower annual salary than other people in the meeting.
Speaker 3: Look, I'm not sure. I don't know what anyone is paid.
Speaker 3: I think it's more kind of profile. So therefore us
Speaker 3: like this person is a bit more visible than I am.
Speaker 3: So therefore they must be contributing more. And I've got
Speaker 3: to speed up what I need to tell them that
Speaker 3: they can get back their valuable time.
Speaker 1: So what do you think self worth ties into? Like,
Speaker 1: what do you think where does the what I'm worth
Speaker 1: story come from? Does it come from what we think
Speaker 1: of us? Or what other people think of us, or
Speaker 1: our position in the organization, or the perception that we
Speaker 1: have about certain things based on past experiences. I know,
Speaker 1: I've just turned it around on you. You're welcome. Well,
Speaker 1: maybe it's all of it, right.
Speaker 3: I think it's all of it, And then I think
Speaker 3: it's also Is this one of those few times when
Speaker 3: you can actually rely on a bit of external validation
Speaker 3: because you kind of you I know, for me, like
Speaker 3: being in the position of doing all of the work
Speaker 3: and getting to a point of going, okay, now I'm
Speaker 3: ready to use my voice, I'm ready to contribute. But
Speaker 3: is anyone going to deem that any value? So is
Speaker 3: it one of those few moments that you can kind
Speaker 3: of go, hey, can I rely on someone to give
Speaker 3: me some really constructive feedback and I can take that
Speaker 3: on board and go, okay, Yeah, what I'm doing is
Speaker 3: adding something.
Speaker 1: It's very hard for any of us. Well, it's not hard,
Speaker 1: it's impossible. It's impossible for any of us to be
Speaker 1: objective about ourselves because you know, the me experience for me,
Speaker 1: the Kelly experience for Kelly, and same for Tiff is
Speaker 1: completely subjective, and because I'm always assessing me through my
Speaker 1: own mind and my own experiences, my own beliefs, and
Speaker 1: my own self esteem and my own fear. But I
Speaker 1: can recognize that perhaps Tiff, who knows me quite well,
Speaker 1: could watch me do a presentation, or Kelly, who knows
Speaker 1: who's heard a lot of podcasts, could listen to something
Speaker 1: or see something that I do and give me a
Speaker 1: perspective that I can't have because I'm the person in
Speaker 1: the middle. So I think that capacity or that willingness
Speaker 1: to seek feedback, and I mean actually seek feedback, be
Speaker 1: it good or bad. I'm not saying seek approval or
Speaker 1: seek endorsement or seek affirmation, but rather just seek real,
Speaker 1: genuine feedback, whatever it is from other people. Is it's
Speaker 1: a really smart idea because we can't give that to ourselves.
Speaker 1: It's one of the few things like we can't give
Speaker 1: ourselves an objective opinion of us. We can't and even
Speaker 1: for you too, to give me objective feedback about me
Speaker 1: is kind of hard because you already have an opinion
Speaker 1: of me, right, But it's definitely more objective than I
Speaker 1: can give myself, right, So I think that I think
Speaker 1: that is part of it. I also think self doubt
Speaker 1: and undervaluing oneself is ah super duper common. I think
Speaker 1: it becomes a real negative when the self doubt spills
Speaker 1: into self loathing. But and I don't know other than
Speaker 1: you know, like, is somebody giving us feedback on no Kel,
Speaker 1: you actually did great. I know you think that was
Speaker 1: a three out of ten, but I actually think it
Speaker 1: was a six and maybe a seven. And here's how
Speaker 1: I think you could make it an eight or a nine.
Speaker 1: Right then that's really constructive and positive. But I think, also,
Speaker 1: you know, the only way that we can build confidence
Speaker 1: and confidence and skill is just by just showing up
Speaker 1: and doing that anyway, which I know is cluche. But
Speaker 1: I do have one story then I'll shut up. So
Speaker 1: I remember when I first started personal training. I was
Speaker 1: working at Trackside Sports in Hampton, near the railway line.
Speaker 1: I was earning twelve dollars now I was the gym manager.
Speaker 1: I was working forty hours a week, so my gross
Speaker 1: wage was four hundred and eighty. I think my net
Speaker 1: wage was somewhere in the low four hundreds, so I
Speaker 1: was probably clearing about ten dollars seventy an hour, and
Speaker 1: that was not terrible. So this was like forty years ago,
Speaker 1: nine eighty three or four. It wasn't terrible money. I
Speaker 1: was also working in nightclubs getting punched in the face
Speaker 1: for about twelve to fourteen dollars an hour. And so
Speaker 1: because every hour that I worked, I got paid, give
Speaker 1: or take twelve thirteen fourteen dollars an hour, that's what
Speaker 1: I understood as my value monetarily, you know, financially, it's well,
Speaker 1: if I'm going to do something for someone, whatever the
Speaker 1: something is, what they're probably going to give me is
Speaker 1: twelve to fourteen dollars an hour. And that's that's about
Speaker 1: what I because that was my experience. You know, over
Speaker 1: six years, I was always paid or let's say I
Speaker 1: was twenty four at that stage, so six years of work,
Speaker 1: I was always paid around that. So that's six years
Speaker 1: of programming, six years of getting about the same money
Speaker 1: per hour of work. And so after six years of
Speaker 1: repetition and familiarity with a certain relationship with money, you think, oh,
Speaker 1: I'm worth twelve dollars an hour. So when my first
Speaker 1: client came to the gym, we're talking about value and
Speaker 1: perceived value of my first client, to be Max. He
Speaker 1: came in and he wanted to be trained. He didn't
Speaker 1: want a gym membership. Well, he wanted a gym membership,
Speaker 1: but he wanted someone to take him through his workouts,
Speaker 1: which we didn't even call personal training at that stage.
Speaker 1: And him and I hit it off and he said,
Speaker 1: would you take me through my workouts? I'm like, well,
Speaker 1: that's not even a thing. He said, what if I
Speaker 1: pay you and every time I come in, rather than
Speaker 1: getting my workout card out of the filing cabinet and
Speaker 1: going in the gym like the rest of the masses,
Speaker 1: you take me through it every time? What would that
Speaker 1: cost me? Now? I was earning twelve bucks an hour,
Speaker 1: and I'm good at maths, and I went, well, if
Speaker 1: he gave me fifty bucks for three workouts, that's give
Speaker 1: or take seven eight dollars an hour, that's good because
Speaker 1: twelve seventeen that's good money. And in some rare moment
Speaker 1: of courage or delusion, I said to him one hundred
Speaker 1: dollars for three workouts. And as it came out of
Speaker 1: my mouth, I regretted that i'd said it because I
Speaker 1: knew he would say no, because who the fuck's going
Speaker 1: to pay the twelve dollar guy thirty three dollars? And
Speaker 1: I go one hundred bucks, and he looks at me
Speaker 1: and he goes, he you're sure, And I went, I
Speaker 1: fucked it up. I fucked this up. And I go yeah,
Speaker 1: and he goes, that seems cheap, and I'm like, oh
Speaker 1: my god. Right, And so I started training him for
Speaker 1: one hundred dollars for three workouts, so thirty three dollars
Speaker 1: an hour. All of a sudden, Right, I'm the same guy,
Speaker 1: working in the same place. I need no new skills,
Speaker 1: no more knowledge. The problem wasn't that I wasn't thirty
Speaker 1: worth thirty three dollars or fifty dollars or whatever. Now,
Speaker 1: the problem was that I didn't believe I was. So
Speaker 1: I always had the capacity to earn triple that or
Speaker 1: quadruple that depending on the context, especially at that point
Speaker 1: in time with six years experience and six years knowledge
Speaker 1: and leadership and management experience. And so it's that it's like,
Speaker 1: what we're capable of is not the problem. What we
Speaker 1: think we're capable of is the problem. What we're worth
Speaker 1: is not the issue. What we think we're worth is
Speaker 1: the issue. Does that make sense? Yeah?
Speaker 3: Absolutely, It's the self limiting beliefs that just stop you
Speaker 3: in your tracks. So the other thing I wanted to
Speaker 3: ask you on this, given that you've trained so many people.
Speaker 3: What's it been like when you've seen that shift happen
Speaker 3: with people, And what's been kind of the catalyst for
Speaker 3: that shift that they've actually stepped into believing that they're
Speaker 3: capable and adding value.
Speaker 1: It's the same thing every time. It expresses differently and
Speaker 1: manifest in different ways, but it is the same thing,
Speaker 1: and that is they do something they didn't think they
Speaker 1: could do. They do something or achieve something, or change
Speaker 1: something that they didn't think was truly possible for them.
Speaker 1: They wanted it, and they hoped and they crossed their fingers,
Speaker 1: but when they actually did that thing, they're like, oh,
Speaker 1: and the physiological change. And I said this for me
Speaker 1: when I went from Jumbo, the unfittest kid to the
Speaker 1: fittest kid in my school through work and a bit
Speaker 1: of self control and a bit of application. Not genetics,
Speaker 1: not brilliance, not anything, but the biggest transformation for most
Speaker 1: people when they do something radical with their body or
Speaker 1: their fitness or their health, the biggest transformation and the
Speaker 1: biggest value is what happens to their thinking. Because all
Speaker 1: of a sudden you go, oh, I've seen myself the
Speaker 1: same way for thirty years or twenty five years. Oh,
Speaker 1: I can actually be an athlete, or I can actually
Speaker 1: be fit and strong and healthy and functional. Or I
Speaker 1: can actually be a boxer in Tip's case, who gets
Speaker 1: in a ring and un people in the face and
Speaker 1: wins titles. Or in my case, I can write a book.
Speaker 1: Oh fuck, I didn't think I could write a book. Oh,
Speaker 1: and now I've written seven books. Ah, I'm an author,
Speaker 1: but everyone thinks I can't. I can't until they do.
Speaker 1: And the book achievement is good. The boxing achievement is good, right.
Speaker 1: The getting on the you project achievement and interviewing me
Speaker 1: is good. All of those things are nice achievements. But
Speaker 1: the real value is the learning and the growth in
Speaker 1: the doing. It's who you're becoming, and it's how you're
Speaker 1: expanding your ideas and understanding of what's possible for you.
Speaker 1: It's like climbing the mountains, climbing the mountain, that the
Speaker 1: gift is who you become climbing the mountain, what you
Speaker 1: learn climbing the mountain, how you develop climbing the mountain.
Speaker 1: So for me, I loved getting people in shape, and
Speaker 1: I loved training people for events and all of that.
Speaker 1: But I loved seeing this fucking this cognitive and emotional
Speaker 1: and psychological metamorphosis where like the body is different, that's cool,
Speaker 1: different body, but oh my god, the person's different. The
Speaker 1: person has really transformed because once the person changes, because
Speaker 1: you're not training bodies, you're working with people who live
Speaker 1: in bodies. And anyone can understand a body anatomy, physiology,
Speaker 1: bio mechanics, fucking nutrition, sleep, breast recovery, cellular health, the
Speaker 1: immune system, gut by. I'm cool, you can google all
Speaker 1: that shit, right, that is relatively easy. But understanding the
Speaker 1: fucking human who walks around in that body, that's a challenge. Now,
Speaker 1: when you can get to that point where you are
Speaker 1: impacting the human not just the body, then that's fucking magic.
Speaker 1: And sorry, I don't get excited at all.
Speaker 3: No, didn't catch the excitement off that. I would also
Speaker 3: dare say that was it a it addictive to be
Speaker 3: able to support people to transform in that way? Like
Speaker 3: like what did you get from that?
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's not a word I would use, but I
Speaker 1: understand the question. It's it's I yeah, I think like
Speaker 1: it's almost like I think it's a this sounds cliche,
Speaker 1: and people might go, oh fucking HELLY just says shit,
Speaker 1: that sounds I truly think this. I think it's a gift. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I think, not that I have I've been given a gift,
Speaker 1: or that I have an innate gift. I think it's
Speaker 1: a gift that I have been given in that me
Speaker 1: helping people is precious and I'm blessed and unfortunate and
Speaker 1: I'm gifted to be able to do that right and too.
Speaker 1: Like I was going to say, nothing excites me more,
Speaker 1: that might be a lie, but I can't. Nothing springs
Speaker 1: to mind than helping people to realize, and I mean
Speaker 1: realize in both ways, realize as in develop and operationalized,
Speaker 1: but also realize cognitively their own potential. I see people
Speaker 1: all the time and I think, oh, wow, you do
Speaker 1: not know how good you are. You don't know how
Speaker 1: good you can be, you know. And I'm going to
Speaker 1: throw him under the bus, right, But someone who's been
Speaker 1: on this show and this is a compliment for him,
Speaker 1: Scotty Douglas, who Tiff met today. It had brunch and
Speaker 1: I had fucking coffee with him. He's the typ slut.
Speaker 1: I'll just say it. Fuck it you know you are
Speaker 1: you know you are Scott, and he doesn't realize how
Speaker 1: fucking incredible he is. Like he's got a bit of
Speaker 1: an insight. But that dude is clever. That dude has
Speaker 1: got a kind of intelligence and creativity. He's a gift
Speaker 1: to the world. That motherfucker. He's a gift, you know.
Speaker 1: And he's he underestimates himself. I think he's got an idea,
Speaker 1: but he still underestimates himself. And you know, this is
Speaker 1: one of the beautiful things about being a you know,
Speaker 1: somebody who cares about other people is helping them to
Speaker 1: really understand that they are the solution to all of this.
Speaker 1: You know, Craig's not the solution. Tift's not the solution.
Speaker 1: You know, I'm not special. Tift's not special. You're not special.
Speaker 1: We're just people who want to help people and serve people.
Speaker 1: And when you can help people to become the biggest
Speaker 1: asset in their own life, that's that's amazing.
Speaker 3: That's such a really high accolative. I was here, I'd
Speaker 3: be like getting an audio snippet of that and just
Speaker 3: looping it over my Instagram.
Speaker 1: You'll probably make it his fucking phone ring, Yeah, ring
Speaker 1: time that's it. Yeah, I don't know. I just yeah,
Speaker 1: I think it's I think it's a g I reckon,
Speaker 1: I've got the best job in the world, like doing this,
Speaker 1: you know, having a show that people listen to, be
Speaker 1: and sponsored, you know, going to talk to people and companies,
Speaker 1: you know, doing the stuff that I do. Where if
Speaker 1: I had another job, like if I was an accountant,
Speaker 1: I'd be listening to podcasts and reading all the shit
Speaker 1: I read now, and I'd be fascinated with the stuff
Speaker 1: I'm fascinated in, you know, Like, how lucky am I
Speaker 1: that it's actually what I do for a job.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's pretty cool. Pretty cool. I'm going to change
Speaker 3: change my question now.
Speaker 1: I'm ready. I'm ready to change direction. Hang on, let
Speaker 1: me put on new pants and I'm good. You're good,
Speaker 1: Good to go.
Speaker 3: What I'm realizing at the moment, and I'm sure this
Speaker 3: is well, I think it's something that a lot of
Speaker 3: people probably go through as well. But one of the
Speaker 3: biggest realizations for me at the moment is that it's
Speaker 3: such a huge relief to be able to put up
Speaker 3: your hand and say, hey, I need help with something,
Speaker 3: and whether that's coming to going to a psychologist, going
Speaker 3: to a trainer, engaging with the right people. But it's
Speaker 3: for me at the moment, like it's something letting go
Speaker 3: of control of almost everything and just saying, hey, you're
Speaker 3: the right person for this. I know that you've got
Speaker 3: the skills. How can you help me? And so I'm
Speaker 3: not really framing this as a question, but it's what
Speaker 3: do you think or what's the kind of insight around
Speaker 3: that in Is it like a letting go of wanting
Speaker 3: to control everything? Is it just being more insightful? For instance,
Speaker 3: like I've dabbled in a lot of things in terms
Speaker 3: of creativity, so I can spice together some videos, I
Speaker 3: can take photos, I can do a whole bunch of
Speaker 3: things at a kind of average level, and I've always
Speaker 3: just kind of thought I can do it, so therefore
Speaker 3: I will. And now I'm at a space where I'm like,
Speaker 3: I know other people well that can do it incredibly well,
Speaker 3: so I'm engaging them to do it and getting better results.
Speaker 3: And there's a sense of freedom in releasing the control over.
Speaker 3: I can do it in a half past way, so
Speaker 3: therefore I'm going to keep doing it in a half
Speaker 3: last way.
Speaker 1: Yes, does that make sense? This is what this is
Speaker 1: what I ask myself in life and in business, and
Speaker 1: I think everyone should just just my thoughts. I think
Speaker 1: everyone should ask themselves in terms of their career, and
Speaker 1: it really helps get clarity around what should I be doing?
Speaker 1: And you know, should I be the person making the
Speaker 1: videos or is there someone else who's better at it
Speaker 1: and we'll do it quicker and more effectively. So that's cost.
Speaker 1: Is it a good use of my time and energy
Speaker 1: and focus? In data DA? So my question is what
Speaker 1: excites me? Well, building websites? Fuck no, producing videos, fuck no,
Speaker 1: editing the podcast, fuck no, doing all the shit that
Speaker 1: Melissa as Fucknah. Most of what Tiff does not. Some
Speaker 1: of what Tiff does, yes, because there's overlap. But I think,
Speaker 1: and of course there will be things that I need
Speaker 1: to do that. It just it is logic and reasonable,
Speaker 1: logical and reasonable that I do that. But you know,
Speaker 1: the things that you need to do change as you
Speaker 1: evolve and as you earn a few bucks, and as
Speaker 1: your career changes and develops. Right, So there were things
Speaker 1: that I really needed to do that didn't excite me,
Speaker 1: but I needed to do them. Year one of Harper's,
Speaker 1: Year twenty five of Harper's and it went for twenty
Speaker 1: five years. That was very different. And so now year
Speaker 1: eight of the podcast, year six of my PhD, which
Speaker 1: has nearly finished, year sixty two of my life. I
Speaker 1: want to do the things that fucking excite me and
Speaker 1: have a team around me that if they want to
Speaker 1: be involved with me, and I'm of value and service
Speaker 1: to them, and there's synergy and we all want to
Speaker 1: kind of head in the same direction that we're all
Speaker 1: doing our own stuff. Like it doesn't excite me to
Speaker 1: do a lot of you know, it's like every time
Speaker 1: I every time I travel, it's like everything's organized. I
Speaker 1: don't want to be booking shit. I don't want to
Speaker 1: be I don't want to be having countless phone calls
Speaker 1: with potential clients for things. I don't want to book
Speaker 1: airfairs and transfers and hotels. And I can do it,
Speaker 1: but it's not a great use of my time. And
Speaker 1: what I want to do is I want to talk
Speaker 1: to you know, once the deal's done and I know
Speaker 1: I'm doing a gig, I want to talk to the
Speaker 1: person that's running the event so I can get a
Speaker 1: bit excited and get them excited, which I did that
Speaker 1: this morning with someone I take notes, I start to
Speaker 1: plan for the event, and then I want to turn
Speaker 1: up and hopefully blow their fucking socks off and then
Speaker 1: fly home. That's what I want to do, right, But
Speaker 1: also there'll be times when it's not all shits and giggles.
Speaker 1: But yeah, and then if you said to me, I
Speaker 1: love fucking doing videos, I love being creative, I love
Speaker 1: producing content put out to the world, I would say,
Speaker 1: do it, even if you're not great at it, even
Speaker 1: if you're not the best person for it. If you
Speaker 1: said I love it, I really want to develop at it.
Speaker 1: I want to maybe monetize it eventually, maybe not, don't know,
Speaker 1: I would say that is what you should do if
Speaker 1: you can still survive financially doing whatever it is you're
Speaker 1: going to do as well as that. But yeah, I
Speaker 1: think so few people get excited about shit, especially when
Speaker 1: they're beyond eight. Talk to any fucking forty year old
Speaker 1: about something that really excited about not much. Not much.
Speaker 1: Talk to a sixty two year old like me. Fucking hell.
Speaker 1: And I'm not trying to be negative. I'm like, how
Speaker 1: good is it when there is something that we are
Speaker 1: actually passionate about that we can dive into that might
Speaker 1: help us grow, learn, evolved, become better, but also do
Speaker 1: something good for the world. And at the same time,
Speaker 1: like that shit excites me, like genuinely excites me.
Speaker 3: See, I've been feeling that kind of passion and excitement
Speaker 3: about And Tiff knows about this, but my TikTok shit
Speaker 3: posts and it's this space where no one I know
Speaker 3: follows me on there. So it's like this safe space
Speaker 3: of just putting stuff out there that I wouldn't put
Speaker 3: anywhere else. And it's really stupid, and I love it
Speaker 3: and it makes me smile, and I just thought, I'm
Speaker 3: going to keep doing it because I'm having so much
Speaker 3: fun with it, and it's You're right, And I think
Speaker 3: it's also the lack of excitement correlates with lack of fun,
Speaker 3: and this is something that just is fun and so
Speaker 3: I'm probably wasting way too much time on it, but
Speaker 3: it's fun and I love it, so I'm going to
Speaker 3: keep doing it.
Speaker 1: I think making joy is more important than making money.
Speaker 1: I think we have to make money. We have to
Speaker 1: make money. Of course, I'm not saying don't make money.
Speaker 1: I'm not saying don't make lots of money. But if
Speaker 1: you're doing things that truly give you joy and happiness,
Speaker 1: and you know, if you can weave in there some purpose,
Speaker 1: and you know, I think that these things don't need
Speaker 1: to live in isolation, you know, or silos where oh
Speaker 1: I can I can do good things for people and
Speaker 1: be hopefully a mentor or a coach or a role
Speaker 1: model in some capacity for a few dysfunctional people who
Speaker 1: want a role model like me. And I can also
Speaker 1: make some dough. And I can also you know, entertain
Speaker 1: people and be funny and inappropriate. And you know, that's
Speaker 1: like all of these things can coexist. And you can
Speaker 1: have your job, which I know you love, your job,
Speaker 1: which is very meaningful and purposeful, and an environment and
Speaker 1: a culture that you love, but also you can have
Speaker 1: this so i'd hustle, or this side interest that is
Speaker 1: just a different world where you're developing or expressing in
Speaker 1: another way. And I think that I think whatever gets
Speaker 1: you excited, do not fucking let that go, because I
Speaker 1: you know, maybe it's just my observation and my experience,
Speaker 1: so I'm not drawing any broad conclusions. But the filter
Speaker 1: through which I see a lot of things going on
Speaker 1: around me, and you know, in media and in social
Speaker 1: media is that they're just ain't a lot of joy
Speaker 1: or excitement, and I understand a lot of it because
Speaker 1: of what's going on in the world. But yeah, I think.
Speaker 1: I think also we have a responsibility individually to go
Speaker 1: I'm going to I'm going to create a life as
Speaker 1: much as I can, as much as that is possible
Speaker 1: for me. That is a good place to be. You know,
Speaker 1: it's not TIFF's job to make my life good. It's
Speaker 1: not Kelly's job to make me happy. As Ricky Gervais says,
Speaker 1: you know, your feelings are not my responsibility. That doesn't
Speaker 1: mean we should be, you know, heartless pricks, lacking empathy.
Speaker 1: But at the same time, it's nobody's job. For Craig Harper,
Speaker 1: it's nobody's job to fix me, save me, or make
Speaker 1: me better. That's my job. You know, it's your job, Kelly,
Speaker 1: to make your life good. Nobody's else else's. It's your
Speaker 1: job to make a good career. It's your job to
Speaker 1: keep you in shape. And you know that's that that's
Speaker 1: the human experience. Doesn't mean that other people can't support
Speaker 1: or help or cheer. But yeah, that's my takee So
Speaker 1: my question to you too, I don't mind who answers
Speaker 1: this is is there anything that like, I know this
Speaker 1: is pie in the sky stuff, but like if there was,
Speaker 1: if you did have no fear and if you knew
Speaker 1: that you would succeed, Like you knew you would succeed
Speaker 1: twelve months twenty four months now from now, you know
Speaker 1: you've succeeded at a level and there's been a few
Speaker 1: speed bumps, but it's now going great. What is it
Speaker 1: that you would like to be doing? TIF We might
Speaker 1: start with you twelve to twenty four months from now
Speaker 1: where you're going, you know that where you might currently
Speaker 1: have some fear or apprehension. But what would you dive
Speaker 1: into if you couldn't fail?
Speaker 2: Ah? Well, I'm already doing it. But more like the speaking,
Speaker 2: we're going to do more speaking in events and being
Speaker 2: around people. I feel like I miss being around people
Speaker 2: and holding events. You know, when I used to run
Speaker 2: the overseas boxing retreats. I love that. I love creating communities,
Speaker 2: and I just feel like maybe I missed that. So
Speaker 2: in whatever context that rolled out, it didn't have to
Speaker 2: be speaking in events, but something where I'm doing things
Speaker 2: and bringing people together, hosting things.
Speaker 1: Hmmm, and what so? Okay, other than speaking in events
Speaker 1: like the here's what I'm Here's what I think like
Speaker 1: speaking at events corporate gigs is largely dependent on you
Speaker 1: getting bookings right, which is happening and developing. Is there
Speaker 1: something that you like, a concept that you want to
Speaker 1: develop where you could do like a weekend or a
Speaker 1: three or a four day program where you do what
Speaker 1: you've just described to me, where you're taking a bunch
Speaker 1: of people away and you're you're leading it and it's all,
Speaker 1: you know, diving into the human experience and helping people
Speaker 1: kind of with breakthroughs and breakdowns and breakups and all
Speaker 1: of the human stuff. Is there something that you would
Speaker 1: like to develop over the next year or two.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And that's always been in my mind. And I
Speaker 2: think we mentioned this morning. Patrick and I had a
Speaker 2: chat recently and thought we might explore some ideas together
Speaker 2: because boxing tai chi him. So, but yeah, it's always
Speaker 2: been in my mind, and I definitely find that really appealing.
Speaker 1: Cal What about you? Is there something that pie in
Speaker 1: the sky that if you weren't, if you couldn't fail,
Speaker 1: that you would do?
Speaker 3: Write a book? Absolutely, write a book. So for as
Speaker 3: long as I can remember, I've wanted to write, and
Speaker 3: I do. And it's only been in the past six
Speaker 3: months or so that I've been sharing that more so,
Speaker 3: I actually have a plan in place, so I've been
Speaker 3: publishing it to my sub stack probably once or twice
Speaker 3: a week, and in twelve months time, I'm going to
Speaker 3: have a look at all of that and see how
Speaker 3: it all ties in and what there is and what
Speaker 3: I could possibly piece together. So that's been a huge,
Speaker 3: huge thing for me to get over the fear of
Speaker 3: because there's so many people that are amazing writers and
Speaker 3: I've been in all honest, you're probably quite lazy about
Speaker 3: it and just thought, you know, time's been and gone,
Speaker 3: so what's the point. And now I'm like, well, this
Speaker 3: is something that it's always been on my mind. Stop
Speaker 3: being scared. There's absolutely a point to it, and just
Speaker 3: give it a go because I don't want to get
Speaker 3: to however old I get to and think I should
Speaker 3: have tried that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well how about this. Don't stop being scared, be
Speaker 1: scared and do it, like in the middle of your fear.
Speaker 1: Do the book in the middle of your fear. Fucking
Speaker 1: join the gym in the middle. You know, it's like, well,
Speaker 1: if you wait until you're not scared to write a book.
Speaker 1: You're probably not going to write a book and you're
Speaker 1: writing the book and you're talking about it publicly, which
Speaker 1: is good, or you know you're planning the book. I mean,
Speaker 1: I think it's in the writing or the book of
Speaker 1: the book, or the joining of the gym, or the
Speaker 1: going to jiu jitsu or the signing up to do
Speaker 1: a course at university or whatever it is. For people
Speaker 1: that are fearful, it's actually doing the process that removes
Speaker 1: the fear. It's like, oh, when I'm not scared of this,
Speaker 1: I'll go and do that. Well, No, that's how you
Speaker 1: get rid of the fear is by you start scared,
Speaker 1: and that's how the you know. It's like when I
Speaker 1: started my current course, I was you know, by the
Speaker 1: time it actually came around where I had to physically
Speaker 1: show up and sit in a cubicle monash on November one,
Speaker 1: nine two sorry, two thousand and nineteen, I was almost
Speaker 1: resenting the fact that I'd said, yes, I was. I
Speaker 1: was definitely wasn't. It wasn't a massive regret, but it
Speaker 1: was like a low level regret. I'm like, a fuck,
Speaker 1: what if I like the idea of this is not
Speaker 1: the reality of this. And yeah, and I had, however
Speaker 1: much fear you've got to write a book. I mean,
Speaker 1: we can't compare, but I'm pretty sure my fear of
Speaker 1: all of the potential bad outcomes of me thinking I
Speaker 1: could do a fucking PhD. Like I constantly had these
Speaker 1: dialogues with myself about why did you even like your
Speaker 1: ego is so big that you couldn't recognize that this
Speaker 1: is not for you, Like you couldn't recognize you're not
Speaker 1: a PhD student. You know, you fell through your first degree.
Speaker 1: And by the way, it's not the hardest degree. I
Speaker 1: did a degree, and I did quite well. But it's
Speaker 1: like it's exercise science. It's not fucking nuclear medicine. Is it?
Speaker 1: Like you're not curing cancer or fucking launching space shuttles.
Speaker 1: You can't, So fucking hell, what made you think you
Speaker 1: could do this? And yeah, but you just got and
Speaker 1: like six months in, I'm like less terrified, and then
Speaker 1: down the track you think, like I look back, now,
Speaker 1: I understand the fear, I understand the apprehension. I understand
Speaker 1: the anxiety, and it wasn't without foundation or reason. It's
Speaker 1: like I totally get it. But also I know, oh
Speaker 1: so now that fear has gone. Now I've got more understanding,
Speaker 1: more knowledge, more experience, and now I'm in a position
Speaker 1: where I can, with not just theoretical understanding, but experiential understanding,
Speaker 1: really support people who want to do, you know, kind
Speaker 1: of higher education later in life. I'm I'm like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I get it, I get it. Trust me, no one
Speaker 1: was less prepared than me. So you know, all of
Speaker 1: that stuff I think is you know, you'll write your book,
Speaker 1: Your book will sell one copy or a million copies,
Speaker 1: who knows, doesn't matter, because the real challenge is in
Speaker 1: the writing and the doing and the producing and the creativity,
Speaker 1: and then just then whatever happens with that happens. But
Speaker 1: that's that's out of your control to an extent. So yeah,
Speaker 1: I think you can do I think you can both
Speaker 1: do it. So consider yourselves encouraged, both you both you
Speaker 1: if not slightly reprimanded and still my pants, yeah you
Speaker 1: still you can still be shitting your pants.
Speaker 2: All right?
Speaker 1: Well, I feel that was brief and that was good.
Speaker 1: Tiff any closing thoughts or questions or comments or are
Speaker 1: you about to go and eat some chicken?
Speaker 2: I'm definitely going to go and eat some chicken. I'm chuffed,
Speaker 2: so thank you very much
Speaker 3: All right, Thankskel, Thanks Tiff, Thanks guys,