1
00:00:04,000 --> 00:00:06,960
Speaker 1: From The Australian. Here's what's on the front. I'm Claire Harvey.

2
00:00:07,000 --> 00:00:13,120
Speaker 1: It's Monday, March twenty three, twenty twenty six. The countdown

3
00:00:13,200 --> 00:00:15,760
Speaker 1: is on for the giant clash between One Nation and

4
00:00:15,840 --> 00:00:19,680
Speaker 1: the Federal Coalition. After the weekend's huge result for Paul

5
00:00:19,760 --> 00:00:23,759
Speaker 1: En Hanson's party in the South Australian election, Labor Premier

6
00:00:23,760 --> 00:00:27,640
Speaker 1: Peter malnawskis one easily, but One Nation got a whopping

7
00:00:27,800 --> 00:00:31,160
Speaker 1: primary vote and now all eyes are on the federal

8
00:00:31,200 --> 00:00:36,160
Speaker 1: by election for the seat of Farah on May three.

9
00:00:36,200 --> 00:00:41,800
Speaker 1: Britain is backing Australia's hardline on copyright protections for artists, authors,

10
00:00:41,880 --> 00:00:46,240
Speaker 1: musicians and journalists against AI companies who want to hoover

11
00:00:46,360 --> 00:00:50,879
Speaker 1: up creative works without paying. That story's live now in

12
00:00:50,920 --> 00:00:55,400
Speaker 1: The Australian's Media section, and so is Steve Jackson's Unmissible

13
00:00:55,480 --> 00:00:59,920
Speaker 1: Weekly Onslaught of Yarns in the Diary are weekly media

14
00:01:00,040 --> 00:01:04,560
Speaker 1: gossip column. This week, the star of television's most excruciating

15
00:01:04,640 --> 00:01:08,320
Speaker 1: viral moment is taking on her network, and Kyle and

16
00:01:08,440 --> 00:01:12,119
Speaker 1: Jackie O are teaming up in the most surprising way.

17
00:01:12,560 --> 00:01:21,600
Speaker 1: Jacko's here in just a moment. Steve Jackson is The

18
00:01:21,600 --> 00:01:24,720
Speaker 1: Australian's Media Diary editor and JACKO. Today, you're writing about

19
00:01:24,720 --> 00:01:27,679
Speaker 1: someone who is famous in New South Wales for being

20
00:01:27,760 --> 00:01:31,080
Speaker 1: Channel nine Sydney weather presenter Ambas Sherlock. She's famous throughout

21
00:01:31,080 --> 00:01:33,760
Speaker 1: the rest of the galaxy for being at the center

22
00:01:33,800 --> 00:01:36,160
Speaker 1: of jacket Gate. What was jacket gate all about?

23
00:01:36,400 --> 00:01:38,280
Speaker 2: Look, Claire, before we get into it, I'd just like

24
00:01:38,319 --> 00:01:40,640
Speaker 2: to thank you for wearing something different to meet it.

25
00:01:41,040 --> 00:01:42,720
Speaker 2: I'm disappointed in what I wear myself.

26
00:01:43,200 --> 00:01:45,479
Speaker 1: I told you two hours ago. We know a'm by room.

27
00:01:45,520 --> 00:01:49,200
Speaker 3: This is not I'm sorry, I've been flat out wardrobe.

28
00:01:49,600 --> 00:01:52,200
Speaker 2: This is exactly what what Jackie Gate was about. Three

29
00:01:52,240 --> 00:01:55,520
Speaker 2: people turned up to do precursor toil podcast, a little

30
00:01:55,520 --> 00:01:57,240
Speaker 2: bit of a chinwag about the issues of the day

31
00:01:57,280 --> 00:02:00,960
Speaker 2: on nine in their afternoon news bulletin, and unfortunately they

32
00:02:01,000 --> 00:02:04,320
Speaker 2: all turned up wearing white jackets, and but Sherlock let

33
00:02:04,520 --> 00:02:07,280
Speaker 2: one of the reporters. Then nine News reported julie'snook no

34
00:02:08,200 --> 00:02:10,880
Speaker 2: uncertain terms that she should change not be wearing a

35
00:02:10,880 --> 00:02:15,160
Speaker 2: white jacket. Julie took umbrage to this suggestion, and the

36
00:02:15,160 --> 00:02:18,600
Speaker 2: withering stairs from both of them. I think even made

37
00:02:18,639 --> 00:02:21,440
Speaker 2: people who were not in the industry. Blush. Yeah.

38
00:02:21,480 --> 00:02:23,400
Speaker 1: Julie was doing a lot of like big eyes, like

39
00:02:23,480 --> 00:02:26,400
Speaker 1: what's going on here? I don't understand, And Amber was

40
00:02:26,440 --> 00:02:28,480
Speaker 1: doing a lot of like, honey, this is not my

41
00:02:28,520 --> 00:02:30,639
Speaker 1: first radio you got it tapping a pen and she

42
00:02:30,720 --> 00:02:34,680
Speaker 1: was furious, and the point that she made was kind

43
00:02:34,720 --> 00:02:37,240
Speaker 1: of right. I actually thought Amber Sherlock was right in

44
00:02:37,280 --> 00:02:39,800
Speaker 1: that moment. Her delivery might not have been good, but

45
00:02:40,160 --> 00:02:41,760
Speaker 1: you know they did look like they were in a

46
00:02:41,800 --> 00:02:43,320
Speaker 1: chemist warehouse infomercial.

47
00:02:43,680 --> 00:02:46,040
Speaker 2: Well yeah, and I'll tell you what, Like, she was

48
00:02:46,160 --> 00:02:48,000
Speaker 2: right whether or not you have to be worn to

49
00:02:48,320 --> 00:02:50,560
Speaker 2: wear different clothes. It's one of those things when you

50
00:02:50,560 --> 00:02:53,000
Speaker 2: go out on a television shoot you got to tell

51
00:02:53,000 --> 00:02:56,600
Speaker 2: the talent block colors, no patterns that will disrupt the camera,

52
00:02:57,160 --> 00:03:00,640
Speaker 2: no piercings or visible tattoos. But when you're a reporter,

53
00:03:00,720 --> 00:03:02,960
Speaker 2: you know those rules yourself, so you should turn up

54
00:03:03,000 --> 00:03:05,920
Speaker 2: presentable and she should have also clocked it. But it's funny,

55
00:03:06,000 --> 00:03:08,720
Speaker 2: within moments I was at nine at that time, working

56
00:03:08,800 --> 00:03:11,600
Speaker 2: at sixty minutes, and within moments of that happening, it

57
00:03:11,800 --> 00:03:15,240
Speaker 2: just went around the station like wildfire. Everyone's pulling it

58
00:03:15,320 --> 00:03:18,720
Speaker 2: up on the system. Unfortunately, one person pulled it up

59
00:03:18,720 --> 00:03:20,960
Speaker 2: on that system. It was too good to keep within nine,

60
00:03:21,040 --> 00:03:23,399
Speaker 2: and next thing you know, it was out to every network,

61
00:03:23,560 --> 00:03:25,280
Speaker 2: and then it was out to all and sundry and

62
00:03:25,680 --> 00:03:26,840
Speaker 2: they became famous.

63
00:03:27,320 --> 00:03:30,160
Speaker 1: Now now Amber Sherlock has left nine to spend a

64
00:03:30,200 --> 00:03:32,280
Speaker 1: lot more time with her family, probably more than she

65
00:03:32,320 --> 00:03:35,360
Speaker 1: wants to be spending. She was sacked. She was made

66
00:03:35,400 --> 00:03:38,240
Speaker 1: redundant by nine earlier this year, shortly after she celebrated

67
00:03:38,280 --> 00:03:42,760
Speaker 1: her fiftieth birthday, and surprisingly or maybe not, given her

68
00:03:42,760 --> 00:03:45,000
Speaker 1: conduct in jacket Gate, she's not taking it quietly.

69
00:03:45,200 --> 00:03:47,640
Speaker 2: Well, there's a few weaering glances going at the moment

70
00:03:47,680 --> 00:03:48,160
Speaker 2: as well.

71
00:03:48,360 --> 00:03:50,920
Speaker 1: On Nne's going, what, I don't know what you're talking about.

72
00:03:51,200 --> 00:03:54,120
Speaker 2: There, they're surprised. And the thing is, she's come out

73
00:03:54,160 --> 00:03:56,800
Speaker 2: and she's spoken about she's saying that she thinks that

74
00:03:56,920 --> 00:03:59,320
Speaker 2: her age was a key factor in it. They're already

75
00:03:59,360 --> 00:04:03,880
Speaker 2: saying we are not ages. That is completely untrue. And

76
00:04:03,920 --> 00:04:05,160
Speaker 2: I got to say I agree with him.

77
00:04:05,280 --> 00:04:08,080
Speaker 1: Well, this is the network though, that you know in

78
00:04:08,160 --> 00:04:10,960
Speaker 1: our working lives. Jacko So in the past couple of

79
00:04:10,960 --> 00:04:15,200
Speaker 1: decades has been hiring women for their effability. Well, I'm

80
00:04:15,240 --> 00:04:16,280
Speaker 1: not being shy about it.

81
00:04:16,560 --> 00:04:19,599
Speaker 2: Yeah right, that's the famous John Westercock quote. And I

82
00:04:19,600 --> 00:04:22,120
Speaker 2: think anyone who worked with John Westercott and I spent

83
00:04:22,240 --> 00:04:25,520
Speaker 2: two weeks of work experience under him, knows full worll

84
00:04:25,600 --> 00:04:28,560
Speaker 2: that that is how he spoke. I actually did do

85
00:04:28,600 --> 00:04:31,800
Speaker 2: the numbers last year, and it might have changed, but

86
00:04:31,839 --> 00:04:35,640
Speaker 2: I added up the ages of the thirty most prominent

87
00:04:36,040 --> 00:04:39,400
Speaker 2: women in commercial media across seven nine and ten and

88
00:04:39,839 --> 00:04:43,720
Speaker 2: the thirty most prominent males on air at seven nine

89
00:04:43,760 --> 00:04:46,680
Speaker 2: and ten, and the women came out marginally older on

90
00:04:47,040 --> 00:04:51,680
Speaker 2: average than the blokes.

91
00:04:53,960 --> 00:04:56,719
Speaker 1: There's a massive audience out there who wants to hear

92
00:04:56,760 --> 00:04:59,680
Speaker 1: women's opinions and that's been the secret of the success

93
00:04:59,720 --> 00:05:02,480
Speaker 1: of ten Looks three. This is the podcast hosted by

94
00:05:02,520 --> 00:05:05,720
Speaker 1: Annabel Crab and Lee Sales, two of the smartest and

95
00:05:06,000 --> 00:05:11,360
Speaker 1: dare I say over fifty women in Australian media. Well, hello, missy, Hi,

96
00:05:12,160 --> 00:05:13,960
Speaker 1: I have been watching something.

97
00:05:15,320 --> 00:05:18,360
Speaker 2: They started this podcast twelve years ago and back then

98
00:05:18,400 --> 00:05:20,640
Speaker 2: it was like, this little site doesn't know what's a podcast?

99
00:05:20,720 --> 00:05:22,120
Speaker 2: What are you talking about? How do I get one

100
00:05:22,120 --> 00:05:22,440
Speaker 2: of those?

101
00:05:22,680 --> 00:05:22,760
Speaker 3: Have?

102
00:05:22,800 --> 00:05:24,960
Speaker 2: I got to download an app? And they've been along

103
00:05:24,960 --> 00:05:26,599
Speaker 2: to the whole ride and they've seen it evolved. So

104
00:05:26,640 --> 00:05:30,200
Speaker 2: when we see people like Jackie o Henderson and her

105
00:05:30,320 --> 00:05:35,320
Speaker 2: agent Slash would be co presented Gemmer O'Neil trying to

106
00:05:35,360 --> 00:05:38,680
Speaker 2: do the same thing on couches, cuddled up with pillows

107
00:05:38,720 --> 00:05:41,760
Speaker 2: talking about what they're reading, they're all mimicking a very

108
00:05:41,760 --> 00:05:45,200
Speaker 2: successful formula that Annabel Krab and Lee Sales sort of

109
00:05:45,240 --> 00:05:47,839
Speaker 2: pioneered in that space in at least Australia.

110
00:05:47,400 --> 00:05:50,960
Speaker 1: And they certainly did. And they bring huge smarts, They're

111
00:05:51,040 --> 00:05:53,960
Speaker 1: very relatable, they're very warm, They genuinely are really.

112
00:05:53,800 --> 00:05:55,040
Speaker 2: Good friends and funny.

113
00:05:55,160 --> 00:05:58,800
Speaker 1: Yeah. And the challenge though, which they're facing, as everyone

114
00:05:58,839 --> 00:06:01,839
Speaker 1: in audio, I think is, is monetization. We're seeing a

115
00:06:01,920 --> 00:06:06,359
Speaker 1: huge contraction in audio now where either podcast creators are

116
00:06:06,560 --> 00:06:08,720
Speaker 1: creating a premium stream where you have to pay to

117
00:06:08,760 --> 00:06:11,680
Speaker 1: subscribe for certain episodes, or you have to go and

118
00:06:11,680 --> 00:06:14,559
Speaker 1: see them live to help support their podcast being free.

119
00:06:14,920 --> 00:06:18,520
Speaker 1: That's certainly been the case with the world's most successful podcast, Chatters.

120
00:06:18,560 --> 00:06:21,880
Speaker 3: Hello, if you are a regular listener of this podcast,

121
00:06:22,000 --> 00:06:24,839
Speaker 3: we would so appreciate it if you would consider subscribing

122
00:06:24,880 --> 00:06:26,800
Speaker 3: to us to help us meet the costs of production

123
00:06:26,960 --> 00:06:29,520
Speaker 3: and social media and all the other things that go

124
00:06:29,600 --> 00:06:30,479
Speaker 3: into putting it together.

125
00:06:30,520 --> 00:06:32,200
Speaker 1: If you go to our web now, Annabella Lee are

126
00:06:32,240 --> 00:06:35,000
Speaker 1: saying the same thing, although that's still not going to

127
00:06:35,000 --> 00:06:36,400
Speaker 1: be enough. Yeah, what's the solution.

128
00:06:36,480 --> 00:06:38,440
Speaker 2: Well, they're already doing the live shows, as you know.

129
00:06:38,960 --> 00:06:42,960
Speaker 2: They're also have pre roll ads in all their programs

130
00:06:42,960 --> 00:06:45,599
Speaker 2: that they're putting out more podcasts, they're doing one a week,

131
00:06:46,080 --> 00:06:48,880
Speaker 2: and they're selling like everyone else merch and I'm still

132
00:06:48,880 --> 00:06:51,520
Speaker 2: waiting to get my merch from the front. Hopefully that's

133
00:06:51,560 --> 00:06:52,160
Speaker 2: coming soon.

134
00:06:52,279 --> 00:06:56,039
Speaker 1: But thanks to an apron, I'm like, at you win

135
00:06:56,120 --> 00:06:56,560
Speaker 1: you jumper.

136
00:06:56,560 --> 00:06:58,440
Speaker 2: Actually I could deal with one as long as it's

137
00:06:58,440 --> 00:07:00,560
Speaker 2: not a white jacket. But I don't know what the

138
00:07:00,560 --> 00:07:03,280
Speaker 2: solution is, and telling ly, they don't know what it is.

139
00:07:03,520 --> 00:07:06,600
Speaker 2: I mean, you obviously listen to a lot more podcasts

140
00:07:06,640 --> 00:07:09,920
Speaker 2: than me, but it seems everyone's doing the same things.

141
00:07:10,240 --> 00:07:13,680
Speaker 2: So by virtue, you know, where is the money to

142
00:07:13,720 --> 00:07:14,160
Speaker 2: be made.

143
00:07:14,240 --> 00:07:16,400
Speaker 1: I think audiences have to get used to the idea

144
00:07:16,400 --> 00:07:19,040
Speaker 1: that if you like something and value it, just like television,

145
00:07:19,120 --> 00:07:21,000
Speaker 1: you are now going to have to pay because the

146
00:07:21,040 --> 00:07:24,680
Speaker 1: old fashioned model of advertising support that doesn't work in

147
00:07:24,720 --> 00:07:27,440
Speaker 1: the age of giant tech companies like Google and Facebook,

148
00:07:27,600 --> 00:07:30,480
Speaker 1: which can undercut any publisher. So it doesn't matter whether

149
00:07:30,520 --> 00:07:33,960
Speaker 1: you're an independent podcast publisher or a giant news organization.

150
00:07:34,320 --> 00:07:36,840
Speaker 1: You cannot compete with Google and Facebook in terms of

151
00:07:36,880 --> 00:07:40,240
Speaker 1: ad revenue, so ads don't work as a source of funding.

152
00:07:40,640 --> 00:07:42,960
Speaker 1: That means you need subscriber revenue. You need people to

153
00:07:42,960 --> 00:07:45,120
Speaker 1: pay to be part of the club. A lot of

154
00:07:45,120 --> 00:07:48,880
Speaker 1: Australia's most popular podcasters have already done this. They're also

155
00:07:49,040 --> 00:07:51,920
Speaker 1: turning them into videos. I mean, that is why podcasters

156
00:07:51,920 --> 00:07:54,440
Speaker 1: are going to YouTube, because it's much easier to monetize,

157
00:07:54,560 --> 00:07:58,640
Speaker 1: and YouTube will do the monetization for you. So yeah,

158
00:07:59,200 --> 00:08:02,960
Speaker 1: it's a shame because there is something beautiful about the

159
00:08:03,000 --> 00:08:06,800
Speaker 1: audio only conversation. There's a level of warmth and depth

160
00:08:06,800 --> 00:08:09,880
Speaker 1: that I think you can get from listening to too

161
00:08:10,440 --> 00:08:13,200
Speaker 1: smart people like Annabella and Lee talk while you're walking

162
00:08:13,240 --> 00:08:16,080
Speaker 1: the dog or doing the dishes or reading a boring

163
00:08:16,160 --> 00:08:16,920
Speaker 1: report at work.

164
00:08:17,320 --> 00:08:19,160
Speaker 2: Well, clearly that's what a lot of people are doing,

165
00:08:19,240 --> 00:08:22,960
Speaker 2: because I had a look today, so for their audio podcasts,

166
00:08:22,960 --> 00:08:26,160
Speaker 2: one hundred thousand listeners almost every episode, and they're chadding

167
00:08:26,200 --> 00:08:29,280
Speaker 2: away for an hour and forty minutes, sometimes sometimes only

168
00:08:29,280 --> 00:08:32,400
Speaker 2: thirty three minutes. I suppose it depends on what tickles

169
00:08:32,400 --> 00:08:34,480
Speaker 2: their fancy that week. But when you have a look

170
00:08:34,520 --> 00:08:38,160
Speaker 2: at their YouTube audience, obviously a lot of people are

171
00:08:38,200 --> 00:08:41,720
Speaker 2: rusted onto the old format because they'll have two thousand

172
00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:45,960
Speaker 2: views or five hundred views, and their subscription base is

173
00:08:46,080 --> 00:08:49,719
Speaker 2: really quite modest, it's three and a half thousand subscribers.

174
00:08:49,720 --> 00:08:51,760
Speaker 1: There's a real gender thing here. I think some of

175
00:08:51,800 --> 00:08:54,720
Speaker 1: the men who started out in podcasting have transitioned almost

176
00:08:54,760 --> 00:08:57,920
Speaker 1: wholly to video. So Joe Rogan, for example, is a

177
00:08:57,920 --> 00:09:00,839
Speaker 1: YouTube play. That's where Carl Stefanovic is going. I think

178
00:09:00,880 --> 00:09:04,520
Speaker 1: it's something about the difference between the audiences. Men want

179
00:09:04,559 --> 00:09:07,880
Speaker 1: to watch their conversation, women want to listen to it.

180
00:09:07,920 --> 00:09:10,480
Speaker 1: And you know, without being a sexist, I think it's

181
00:09:10,520 --> 00:09:13,640
Speaker 1: partly because women are busy. Women are driving to pick

182
00:09:13,720 --> 00:09:16,920
Speaker 1: up kids, they're cooking, they're cleaning. Even when they're having

183
00:09:17,000 --> 00:09:21,439
Speaker 1: their downtime, they're doing something. They're multitasking, whereas I think

184
00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:24,199
Speaker 1: men spend a bit more time sitting on the sofar watching.

185
00:09:23,920 --> 00:09:29,640
Speaker 2: YouTube derek, absorbing more information, getting really delving into the weeds.

186
00:09:29,760 --> 00:09:32,679
Speaker 1: I know that sometimes you will use YouTube as a

187
00:09:32,679 --> 00:09:35,199
Speaker 1: search engine, won't you you're interested in an issue. Let's

188
00:09:35,240 --> 00:09:38,120
Speaker 1: say it's you know the horme was straight, and you'll

189
00:09:38,440 --> 00:09:40,600
Speaker 1: search for that on YouTube and you want to watch

190
00:09:40,600 --> 00:09:41,640
Speaker 1: an explainer about it.

191
00:09:41,720 --> 00:09:45,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, I know everyone ten five years ago were saying,

192
00:09:45,480 --> 00:09:47,719
Speaker 2: let's make minute long explainers, but I have Look, I

193
00:09:47,760 --> 00:09:49,840
Speaker 2: don't want to minute long explainer. That's not enough. I

194
00:09:49,880 --> 00:09:52,200
Speaker 2: want ten minutes. I don't want half an hour. I

195
00:09:52,200 --> 00:09:54,240
Speaker 2: want ten minutes. And you're right, I want to watch it.

196
00:09:54,280 --> 00:09:56,280
Speaker 2: I want to see the maps. I want to get

197
00:09:56,280 --> 00:09:58,680
Speaker 2: my head around. And maybe that's just a way different

198
00:09:58,679 --> 00:10:01,760
Speaker 2: people absorb information. I need those visual cues, and I

199
00:10:01,800 --> 00:10:03,920
Speaker 2: really enjoy being able to see what people are saying

200
00:10:04,360 --> 00:10:07,480
Speaker 2: and their body language. But I mean, when you listen

201
00:10:07,559 --> 00:10:11,120
Speaker 2: to Chat ten looks three, is that you're just listening

202
00:10:11,160 --> 00:10:11,400
Speaker 2: to it.

203
00:10:11,720 --> 00:10:14,720
Speaker 1: I would rather just listen to it because I find

204
00:10:15,360 --> 00:10:18,719
Speaker 1: shows like that a companion to my life rather than

205
00:10:18,760 --> 00:10:21,040
Speaker 1: being something I want to sit down and watch. I'm

206
00:10:21,080 --> 00:10:23,720
Speaker 1: too busy watching below deck Sailing. You're jack, I don't

207
00:10:23,720 --> 00:10:25,640
Speaker 1: have time to for watching Chat ten looks three.

208
00:10:25,679 --> 00:10:28,959
Speaker 2: Well, the difference, I suppose is because we're in journalism,

209
00:10:29,120 --> 00:10:32,080
Speaker 2: big advocates of paying for people's journalism. I know I

210
00:10:32,080 --> 00:10:35,240
Speaker 2: have subscriptions to half a dozen websites. Even the ones

211
00:10:35,280 --> 00:10:37,280
Speaker 2: I could get for free through work I pay for.

212
00:10:37,360 --> 00:10:38,760
Speaker 2: I make a point of paying for them because you

213
00:10:38,840 --> 00:10:42,920
Speaker 2: want to support people at other mastheads. So probably for you,

214
00:10:43,640 --> 00:10:45,520
Speaker 2: happy to pay, But do you reckon? You know a

215
00:10:45,520 --> 00:10:48,240
Speaker 2: lot of people go, oh, now that you're charging two bucks,

216
00:10:48,240 --> 00:10:51,360
Speaker 2: I can get a clone copy of this podcast somewhere else.

217
00:10:51,440 --> 00:10:54,280
Speaker 1: I really think if people value a product, they will pay.

218
00:10:54,320 --> 00:10:57,520
Speaker 1: But just like Netflix, all the streaming services, HBO, they

219
00:10:57,559 --> 00:10:59,360
Speaker 1: don't make it optional. It's like, if you want this,

220
00:10:59,440 --> 00:11:01,160
Speaker 1: you're going to have to pay, And really is not

221
00:11:01,200 --> 00:11:04,720
Speaker 1: that much eight dollars a month really for the streaming platforms,

222
00:11:04,720 --> 00:11:08,360
Speaker 1: something similar for most news products. I imagine Annavilla and

223
00:11:08,440 --> 00:11:11,160
Speaker 1: Lee could very easily charge that, and they might not

224
00:11:11,160 --> 00:11:14,400
Speaker 1: be getting one hundred thousand downloads for those episodes. Maybe

225
00:11:14,400 --> 00:11:16,960
Speaker 1: they'll get twenty thousand. But if each of those people

226
00:11:16,960 --> 00:11:18,920
Speaker 1: are giving them eight dollars a month, that's a lot better.

227
00:11:19,160 --> 00:11:20,600
Speaker 2: Well I'm just doing a maths on that. That's eight

228
00:11:20,679 --> 00:11:22,880
Speaker 2: hundred thousand a month. They won't be on the ABC

229
00:11:23,120 --> 00:11:24,440
Speaker 2: very long at those rates.

230
00:11:27,600 --> 00:11:30,280
Speaker 1: Coming up, I try to start another fight with JACKO

231
00:11:30,440 --> 00:11:44,600
Speaker 1: about our favorite topic, Kyle and Jackie O. Now I

232
00:11:44,600 --> 00:11:46,720
Speaker 1: love fighting with you about Cole and Jackie O JACKO,

233
00:11:46,760 --> 00:11:48,800
Speaker 1: and I'm hoping we can have a fight today. What's

234
00:11:48,920 --> 00:11:52,720
Speaker 1: the latest with our favorite breakfast radio presenters who are

235
00:11:52,760 --> 00:11:53,160
Speaker 1: know more?

236
00:11:53,280 --> 00:11:55,240
Speaker 2: Right, I can tell you this for free. It's happened

237
00:11:55,280 --> 00:11:58,200
Speaker 2: when you would. Kyle has filed his statement of claim

238
00:11:58,240 --> 00:12:01,240
Speaker 2: in the federal court against his former employer An. He

239
00:12:01,320 --> 00:12:04,200
Speaker 2: wants his money. He wants what he was promised, he

240
00:12:04,240 --> 00:12:06,240
Speaker 2: wants what he says he is owed, and he's not

241
00:12:06,280 --> 00:12:07,600
Speaker 2: going to settle for a cent less.

242
00:12:07,640 --> 00:12:09,960
Speaker 1: That's one hundred million dollars the balance of what he

243
00:12:10,000 --> 00:12:10,960
Speaker 1: wants to be paid out.

244
00:12:10,840 --> 00:12:14,240
Speaker 2: One hundred million minus fourteen months work. And he says

245
00:12:14,320 --> 00:12:17,040
Speaker 2: he wants a whole kind kaboodle. He's not interested in

246
00:12:17,080 --> 00:12:19,880
Speaker 2: a quick little Hey what about twenty million and we

247
00:12:19,920 --> 00:12:23,200
Speaker 2: call it quits. He wants everything, and I kind of

248
00:12:23,200 --> 00:12:26,040
Speaker 2: think for mine, he's probably entitled to it, because a

249
00:12:26,080 --> 00:12:26,680
Speaker 2: deal is a deal.

250
00:12:26,840 --> 00:12:28,520
Speaker 1: This is going to turn on whether or not he

251
00:12:28,640 --> 00:12:30,880
Speaker 1: was able and willing to deliver on the services they

252
00:12:30,920 --> 00:12:33,760
Speaker 1: were paying him for. He would say, I was absolutely willing.

253
00:12:34,000 --> 00:12:36,000
Speaker 1: I was absolutely able, But you didn't let me talk

254
00:12:36,000 --> 00:12:38,040
Speaker 1: to Jackie to resolve this situation, right.

255
00:12:37,960 --> 00:12:40,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, he says it's like a catch twenty two, given

256
00:12:40,120 --> 00:12:44,640
Speaker 2: no chance to resolve the issues. Says as we've all

257
00:12:44,640 --> 00:12:47,280
Speaker 2: been saying, which we argued about last time, is that

258
00:12:47,720 --> 00:12:50,200
Speaker 2: he's been doing the same content for twenty years, and

259
00:12:50,240 --> 00:12:52,040
Speaker 2: no one at any point has ever said, hey man,

260
00:12:52,640 --> 00:12:55,560
Speaker 2: we've changed the script. That's no longer cool. This character

261
00:12:55,600 --> 00:12:58,480
Speaker 2: he's been playing, that is the character he leans into

262
00:12:58,520 --> 00:13:01,320
Speaker 2: on air. And I know everyone's sort of intimating he's

263
00:13:01,320 --> 00:13:05,000
Speaker 2: a much warmer, charismatic, caring guy off air than he

264
00:13:05,120 --> 00:13:07,920
Speaker 2: is the character he plays on the show. But he's saying,

265
00:13:07,960 --> 00:13:10,200
Speaker 2: I've done that, I've done what you asked, You've promoted

266
00:13:10,240 --> 00:13:13,960
Speaker 2: as radio gorn rogue, I attract all the vitriol, I

267
00:13:14,200 --> 00:13:17,240
Speaker 2: soak it up, and now you've said, not cool anymore?

268
00:13:17,679 --> 00:13:18,240
Speaker 2: What gives?

269
00:13:18,320 --> 00:13:20,600
Speaker 1: He's always known too, And I think this whenever I

270
00:13:20,640 --> 00:13:23,640
Speaker 1: read someone writing about what a misogynist Kyle is. Yeah. Sure,

271
00:13:23,679 --> 00:13:26,160
Speaker 1: he's behaved like an absolute buffoon on air, which is

272
00:13:26,200 --> 00:13:28,080
Speaker 1: what they were paying him to do and which is

273
00:13:28,080 --> 00:13:30,520
Speaker 1: what the audience tuned in for. But he's also the

274
00:13:30,520 --> 00:13:33,000
Speaker 1: one who insisted that Jackie get paid the same amount

275
00:13:33,000 --> 00:13:34,839
Speaker 1: as him. I haven't seen many other men in media

276
00:13:34,920 --> 00:13:35,120
Speaker 1: do that.

277
00:13:35,320 --> 00:13:37,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, and if you listen to the show, a lot

278
00:13:37,240 --> 00:13:40,360
Speaker 2: gets made of like, oh they did this crazy stunt

279
00:13:40,440 --> 00:13:44,160
Speaker 2: and headlines about he said something stupid. The truth is

280
00:13:44,280 --> 00:13:46,559
Speaker 2: they plan those things. They know, Hey, we're going to

281
00:13:46,640 --> 00:13:48,719
Speaker 2: do this, and everyone's going to beat up on us,

282
00:13:48,840 --> 00:13:50,959
Speaker 2: but it's going to be great because the rating survey

283
00:13:51,000 --> 00:13:53,920
Speaker 2: and in radio it's still a survey. You fill in

284
00:13:53,960 --> 00:13:56,920
Speaker 2: which shows, So you have this crazy stunt just as

285
00:13:56,960 --> 00:13:59,439
Speaker 2: the survey goes and oh yeah, Kyle and Daki I

286
00:13:59,520 --> 00:14:01,800
Speaker 2: did listen to so I know about that. So all

287
00:14:01,840 --> 00:14:05,400
Speaker 2: these things are planned. They're not just being vile and

288
00:14:05,640 --> 00:14:09,959
Speaker 2: careless and stupid just because you know he's an idiot.

289
00:14:10,040 --> 00:14:13,600
Speaker 2: He's actually very intelligent. It's all planned, and it's what

290
00:14:13,760 --> 00:14:16,880
Speaker 2: the whole show has been centered around and advertised on radio.

291
00:14:16,880 --> 00:14:20,000
Speaker 1: Goes rogue And you're writing today that Jackie is going

292
00:14:20,040 --> 00:14:21,720
Speaker 1: to stand back and wait to see what happens with

293
00:14:21,800 --> 00:14:25,080
Speaker 1: Kyle's lawsuit before she foils her own. So actually, Kyle

294
00:14:25,200 --> 00:14:28,040
Speaker 1: might be Australia's leading feminist here Jacko, he's paving the

295
00:14:28,040 --> 00:14:30,760
Speaker 1: way for his female former co host to get her

296
00:14:30,760 --> 00:14:31,880
Speaker 1: one hundred million dollars too.

297
00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:33,840
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, it's going to be interesting to see what

298
00:14:33,880 --> 00:14:37,360
Speaker 2: she does there. Because her contract also torn up, she's

299
00:14:37,400 --> 00:14:39,640
Speaker 2: missing out on the better part of one hundred million

300
00:14:39,640 --> 00:14:42,640
Speaker 2: dollars paid over ten years as well. The difference is

301
00:14:42,840 --> 00:14:45,240
Speaker 2: Aarn is going, all right, Kyle, we're going to just

302
00:14:45,280 --> 00:14:49,720
Speaker 2: tell everyone you're reckless and that serious misconduct, because they

303
00:14:49,720 --> 00:14:52,720
Speaker 2: know that'll play to a large portion of the community

304
00:14:53,080 --> 00:14:55,480
Speaker 2: who already hate him and made it their mind, even

305
00:14:55,520 --> 00:14:59,240
Speaker 2: though they're not his listeners. But for Jackie, they're going, hey,

306
00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:02,080
Speaker 2: stick with House. We've got a show for you. You

307
00:15:02,160 --> 00:15:04,880
Speaker 2: can one hundred million and ten years. No, no new deal.

308
00:15:04,920 --> 00:15:06,560
Speaker 2: We've torn that one up, but we've got a new

309
00:15:06,600 --> 00:15:09,720
Speaker 2: deal for you, not quite as lucrative, but you're welcome back.

310
00:15:10,240 --> 00:15:13,920
Speaker 2: And she's not. My sources are saying she's not engaging

311
00:15:14,040 --> 00:15:16,360
Speaker 2: with that so far. She's going to wait and see,

312
00:15:16,560 --> 00:15:19,960
Speaker 2: quite cleverly, how much does Kyle get before I decide

313
00:15:19,960 --> 00:15:20,600
Speaker 2: what I'm going to do.

314
00:15:25,600 --> 00:15:28,440
Speaker 1: The bosses at a are in clearly thought they were

315
00:15:28,680 --> 00:15:31,080
Speaker 1: geniuses for coming up with this idea of like, oh,

316
00:15:31,160 --> 00:15:32,840
Speaker 1: I know, we could say that he hasn't fulfilled his

317
00:15:32,840 --> 00:15:34,320
Speaker 1: contract and then we don't have to pay one hundred

318
00:15:34,320 --> 00:15:37,200
Speaker 1: million dollars If this goes wrong for them. They are

319
00:15:37,200 --> 00:15:40,360
Speaker 1: going to be paying one hundred million dollars plus legal costs,

320
00:15:41,080 --> 00:15:42,160
Speaker 1: plus interest.

321
00:15:42,320 --> 00:15:44,840
Speaker 2: Plus probably paying with their jobs, like this is a

322
00:15:44,840 --> 00:15:46,880
Speaker 2: massive gamble for them. And there's a joke that goes,

323
00:15:46,920 --> 00:15:48,880
Speaker 2: how do you make a small business investment make a

324
00:15:48,960 --> 00:15:51,680
Speaker 2: large business investment in a media company? Right, So they

325
00:15:51,680 --> 00:15:54,120
Speaker 2: know at this time they have to get rid of

326
00:15:54,200 --> 00:15:58,320
Speaker 2: this contract. The new CEO's taking charge in January. Michael Stevenson,

327
00:15:58,400 --> 00:16:02,040
Speaker 2: smart guy from my former sales boss there. He's coming

328
00:16:02,080 --> 00:16:03,560
Speaker 2: in and goes, we've got to get rid of this.

329
00:16:03,600 --> 00:16:07,400
Speaker 2: The whole market cap of AARN is only one hundred

330
00:16:07,440 --> 00:16:10,160
Speaker 2: and one million dollars and we're paying these two guys

331
00:16:10,640 --> 00:16:13,920
Speaker 2: like two hundred million. He's inherited this deal. He can't

332
00:16:13,960 --> 00:16:18,080
Speaker 2: believe how bad it is. Unfortunately for him, both Kyle

333
00:16:18,320 --> 00:16:21,640
Speaker 2: and Jackie O have signed this in good faith. And

334
00:16:22,080 --> 00:16:26,040
Speaker 2: you know, if you make a deal, I'm sorry, it's

335
00:16:26,200 --> 00:16:28,960
Speaker 2: very unfortunate that you're that you're stuck with this. But

336
00:16:29,440 --> 00:16:34,240
Speaker 2: to at least what Kyle's saying, proactively plot to blow

337
00:16:34,280 --> 00:16:38,640
Speaker 2: it up and call him unprofessional, which is what they've

338
00:16:38,640 --> 00:16:41,600
Speaker 2: done by saying serious misconduct, He's just not going to

339
00:16:41,640 --> 00:16:43,240
Speaker 2: copy it. Right, and I don't think he should.

340
00:16:43,360 --> 00:16:45,160
Speaker 1: Well, maybe they could join Annabelle and Way on the

341
00:16:45,160 --> 00:16:47,520
Speaker 1: couch and bringing you well up to chat ten look three.

342
00:16:47,720 --> 00:16:50,120
Speaker 2: I'm telling you, if it's one dollar per subscriber a

343
00:16:50,160 --> 00:16:52,800
Speaker 2: month eight hundred thousand, I'll be signing up to see

344
00:16:52,800 --> 00:16:54,840
Speaker 2: if I can help cut some of their stories.

345
00:16:55,280 --> 00:16:57,080
Speaker 1: Jacko, thank you very much, Thank you for having me on.

346
00:17:04,400 --> 00:17:07,840
Speaker 1: Steve Jackson edits The Media Diary in the Australian. It's

347
00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:11,000
Speaker 1: live now at the Australian dot com dot au