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Speaker 1: And as this did, Clayton started to drink more. Now

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Speaker 1: Gene was also had a well and truly established drinking

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Speaker 1: problem as well. But as they were doing this more

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Speaker 1: people seem to be wising up to the scam as well.

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Speaker 1: It was becoming less successful, they were making less money

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Speaker 1: and there was definitely several instances where the intended target

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Speaker 1: fought back.

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Speaker 2: I'm Jen Kelly from the Herald Son and this is

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Speaker 2: in Black and White, a podcast about some of Australia's

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Speaker 2: forgotten characters. Today we'll hear the story of jean Lee,

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Speaker 2: the last woman executed in Australia. Jeane was a thirty

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Speaker 2: one year old mother when she was hanged for murder

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Speaker 2: at Penridge Prison in Melbourne in nineteen fifty one. Did

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Speaker 2: she do it or did she confess to save her lover.

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Speaker 2: Today we're joined by Damian Beard, a tour guide at

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Speaker 2: Penridge Prison Tours part of the National Trust. For part

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Speaker 2: one of the story, make sure you return on Thursday

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Speaker 2: for part two. Welcome to the podcast, Amien, Thank you now.

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Speaker 2: Jeanie Lee was of course the last woman executed in Australia,

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Speaker 2: but there is a lot more to this story. So

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Speaker 2: why have you chosen this particular character from the many

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Speaker 2: stories from Penridge Prison's history to share with us today.

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Speaker 1: Well, there's a few reasons, the first being she was

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Speaker 1: the only woman executed at Penridge of the eleven people

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Speaker 1: executed there. And the thing with women and Pentridge is

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Speaker 1: a lot of people don't actually realize that they are

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Speaker 1: a huge part of the story. The Pentridge operator as

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Speaker 1: a woman's prison three times during the one hundred and forty

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Speaker 1: seven years that it was open. But also her story

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Speaker 1: just has some big questions surrounding it, I guess, you know,

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Speaker 1: of terms of culpability and whether she was coerced to confess,

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Speaker 1: whether she confessed to potentially save her lover, who actually

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Speaker 1: did the murder, and sort of speaks to some larger

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Speaker 1: questions about levels of responsibility and things like that. It

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Speaker 1: also was the last execution before Ronald Ryan's execution in Victoria's,

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Speaker 1: so it was almost the run up to all the

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Speaker 1: big debate about the death penalty and things like that.

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Speaker 2: There's still so many aspects of the case that are

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Speaker 2: still unresolved this day, which is why I find it

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Speaker 2: so fascinating. And we'll hear more about that later on.

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Speaker 2: To begin with can you tell us what do we

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Speaker 2: know about jen Lee's early life.

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Speaker 1: So she was born on the tenth of December nineteen

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Speaker 1: nineteen at Dubbo, with her birth name being Marjorie gen

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Speaker 1: maud Wright. Her father was a railway worker and she

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Speaker 1: family was working class, but they're often described in the

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Speaker 1: newspaper Counts as respectable. So I don't think that means

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Speaker 1: particularly well off. But if you can kind of imagine

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Speaker 1: it almost as like the kind of family where their

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Speaker 1: clothes are threadbare and their shoes are falling through the souls,

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Speaker 1: but they're always immaculately pressed and washed, and you know,

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Speaker 1: she's always sent off to school with clean hair tied

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Speaker 1: up in ribbons and normal kind of stuff. The fact

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Speaker 1: that her dad was a railway worker as well probably

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Speaker 1: meant that they were quite insulated from the depression.

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Speaker 3: It was a steady government.

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Speaker 1: Job, and so in nineteen twenty seven they moved to Chatswood,

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Speaker 1: where she intended a convent school. She didn't finish year twelve,

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Speaker 1: but she did train in what was the kind of

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Speaker 1: roles that were available for women at that time, So

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Speaker 1: as a typist stenographer, she learned shorthand and she spent

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Speaker 1: some time leaving school, several jobs She did an office

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Speaker 1: junior at a motor company, she was a millner, she

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Speaker 1: was a stenographer, and she worked in the can goods factory.

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Speaker 2: It's interesting that, as you say, she was from a

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Speaker 2: respectable family, so there was no hint of crime in

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Speaker 2: her family background. Now I don't know if it was

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Speaker 2: bad luck or bad judgment, but when it came to

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Speaker 2: picking men, she seemed to partner up with some real

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Speaker 2: shockers from a young age.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and I mean I tend to be sympathetic to this.

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Speaker 1: You know, what options did she have? She got kind

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Speaker 1: of quite a bit of a bad start with her

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Speaker 1: romantic life, and I think things went downhill from there

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Speaker 1: because as she moved on throughout her life, the doors

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Speaker 1: and the options closed to where the ladders were pulled

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Speaker 1: up and those.

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Speaker 3: Kinds of things.

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Speaker 1: So in March nineteen thirty eight, at the age of

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Speaker 1: eighteen years old, she married a guy named Raymond bres.

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Speaker 1: He was a house painter who was seven years her

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Speaker 1: senior and apparently had known her since childhood. And poor Jean,

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Speaker 1: she had to deal with Raymond being frequently unemployed. Again,

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Speaker 1: we're in the still in the lingering after effects of

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Speaker 1: the depression and things like that. And as he was

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Speaker 1: spending a lot of time unemployed, he was spending a

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Speaker 1: lot of time drinking, and when he was drunk he

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Speaker 1: was abusive. A year after their marriage, she gave birth

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Speaker 1: to her daughter, who is her only child, and in

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Speaker 1: the same year Raymond was convicted of auto theft. But

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Speaker 1: World War Two broke out and so he signs up

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Speaker 1: with the first Australian Heavy Anti Aircraft Artillery training Regiment

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Speaker 1: and does service with them. It's not clear from what

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Speaker 1: I could see from his records whether he actually did

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Speaker 1: go overseas. But like many of the men she became

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Speaker 1: involved with, he wasn't a particularly good soldier. He was

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Speaker 1: court martialed several times for being absent without leave or

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Speaker 1: failure to appear on parade and things like that. And

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Speaker 1: she separated from Raymond sometime around nineteen forty three, and.

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Speaker 2: Really it just went downhill from there, didn't.

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Speaker 3: It it did.

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Speaker 1: I mean, she was a single mother in the nineteen forties,

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Speaker 1: in the middle of the war. You know, a lot

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Speaker 1: of huge amount of the men were overseas. Being a

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Speaker 1: single mother at the time was incredibly taboo. She is

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Speaker 1: from a somewhat impoverished background and things like that. So

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Speaker 1: she's trying to basically stay alive and support her daughter

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Speaker 1: as well.

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Speaker 2: How did she manage to do that?

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Speaker 1: So what ends up happening is her daughter ends up

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Speaker 1: going to live with Jean's mother, and this is where

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Speaker 1: she ends up spending most of her life. In fact,

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Speaker 1: Jeane doesn't have much contact with her daughter for the

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Speaker 1: rest of her life. Jean moves up to Brisbane, where

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Speaker 1: there is a lot of work for women, doing sort

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Speaker 1: of waitressing work and stuff like that, because Brisbane was

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Speaker 1: of course the staging ground for the Pacific War, so

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Speaker 1: a lot of Australian, American, Dutch soldiers up there. And

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Speaker 1: she gets a job working as a waitress at Lennon's Hotel,

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Speaker 1: and sometime around then that she starts changing her name

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Speaker 1: to Jean, starts calling herself Jeane as well, And in

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Speaker 1: nineteen forty three she meets a man named Maurice Diace

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Speaker 1: who is a petty criminal, and they travel back from

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Speaker 1: Brisbane down to Sydney, then Adelaide and finally ending up

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Speaker 1: in Perth. Sort of from what I've been able to gather,

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Speaker 1: sort of staying one step ahead of the cops each

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Speaker 1: time they move. As Morris's ending up in trouble for

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Speaker 1: various petty offenses like theft, burglary and stuff like that,

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Speaker 1: they spend eleven months in Perth and des again, like

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Speaker 1: many men in her life, he is a drinker and

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Speaker 1: he's abuse when he's drunk, and to cope with this,

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Speaker 1: Gene starts to drink heavily as well. Now she's actually

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Speaker 1: asked later on in her life, after everything happens, why

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Speaker 1: she didn't leave DS at this time, which I think

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Speaker 1: is I mean, when we talk about people leaving domestic

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Speaker 1: violence situations today, it's an incredibly insensitive question, you know.

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Speaker 1: I think we understand these days how difficult it is

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Speaker 1: to leave from those situations. But you also have to

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Speaker 1: understand that she's in wartime Perth, so just simply getting

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Speaker 1: out of the city, let alone having somewhere to go,

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Speaker 1: having the means to get there, all that kind of

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Speaker 1: stuff is a lot difficult. In Perth at the time

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Speaker 1: is much much a separate part of Australia, separated from Australia,

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Speaker 1: I should say, compared to it is these days, and

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Speaker 1: there are wartime restrictions on travel and things like that.

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Speaker 2: And it's hard to imagine Damien as well, the sadness

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Speaker 2: that she must have carried about being separated from her child,

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Speaker 2: to not be able to look after her child, so

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Speaker 2: having to leave that child behind.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely now, Jean's child does not pay a play a

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Speaker 1: huge part in her story. I have to say, there's

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Speaker 1: not a lot on her and I do wonder if

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Speaker 1: a lot of it has actually been sort of scrubbed

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Speaker 1: from the records or kept from the records to protect her,

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Speaker 1: Like I wasn't even able to find her name looking

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Speaker 1: through the newspaper articles.

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Speaker 3: Now.

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Speaker 1: Of course, as soon as I say that, someone's going

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Speaker 1: to be able to answer in the comments right away

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Speaker 1: what her name was and things like that, but which

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Speaker 1: please do, I'd love to know. But so you would

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Speaker 1: think that she would be feeling that pain, you know,

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Speaker 1: that failure is a mother and things like that. She

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Speaker 1: would definitely be being viewed in that context at the time.

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Speaker 1: Single mothers are absolutely taboo second class citizens, but ones

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Speaker 1: who can't even afford to look after their kids, they've

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Speaker 1: you know, failed the requirements of their gender and their

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Speaker 1: sex somehow. But I also do wonder, you know, maybe

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Speaker 1: she was happier apart from the kid. Maybe she was

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Speaker 1: content with the fact that the kid was actually being

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Speaker 1: looked after that unfortunately we just don't know.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's true. That's a good point. And what did

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Speaker 2: you do after the war?

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Speaker 1: So in nineteen forty five she returned to Sydney and

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Speaker 1: Ds was arrested on outstanding warrants and so she's now

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Speaker 1: on her own with no sort of methods of support,

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Speaker 1: so she turns to sex work to raise money for

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Speaker 1: his bail. He gets bailed out and in nineteen forty

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Speaker 1: six they moved to Tasmania again because he now has

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Speaker 1: further outstanding warrants on him, and this is where she

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Speaker 1: finally actually managed to escape the relationship with Maurice Ds

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Speaker 1: and she.

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Speaker 3: Moves back to Sydney.

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Speaker 1: She takes up a job at the Liverpool Arms Hotel

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Speaker 1: which is on Pitt Street, and supplants her income there

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Speaker 1: as well with sex work in a brothel. And it's

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Speaker 1: sometime around this that she meets the third man who

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Speaker 1: is going to be a huge figure in her life

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Speaker 1: and in many ways was the love of her life,

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Speaker 1: which was Robert Clayton. It's also this time when she

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Speaker 1: becomes Genie. This is one of the aliases she uses

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Speaker 1: when she's picked up for prostitution.

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Speaker 2: Do we know anything about that name? Why she's chosen

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Speaker 2: the Jean Lee? Is there any background behind that?

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Speaker 1: I have no idea, to be honest. The Gene is

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Speaker 1: obviously her second name, you know, Marjorie Gene. Where the

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Speaker 1: Lee comes from? I have no idea.

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Speaker 2: So tell us about Robert Clayton. What do we know

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Speaker 2: about him?

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Speaker 1: He was born on the twenty second of January nineteen

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Speaker 1: seventeen in Sydney. He worked for schweps for a little

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Speaker 1: bit after high school, but enlisted in theaf at the

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Speaker 1: outbreak of war and was kicked out in nineteen forty

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Speaker 1: one following discipline breaches. Sometime around this time he married

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Speaker 1: a woman named Nancy Lewis. He enlisted in the army

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Speaker 1: and he was sent to Palestine but didn't see combat,

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Speaker 1: and he returned to Australia in nineteen forty two or

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Speaker 1: three as there was this big thing going on with

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Speaker 1: our bringing back the Australian Imperial Force that had been

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Speaker 1: sent over there to fight with the British in the

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Speaker 1: Desert campaigns. But there was now a lot of worry

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Speaker 1: about a potential for a Japanese invasion, and so the

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Speaker 1: decision was made, to the big objection of Churchill to

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Speaker 1: bring Australian forces back. So when Robert returned to Australia,

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Speaker 1: he found that Nancy had taken up with an American

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Speaker 1: serviceman and he initiated a divorce with it. In nineteen

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Speaker 1: forty three, he was discharged as unfit for service because

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Speaker 1: he has also been having a lot of situations of

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Speaker 1: absence without leave, drunkenness on duty and stuff like that,

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Speaker 1: and in fact he's eventually caught marshal for this. He

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Speaker 1: was a frequent heavy gambler and was running sort of

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Speaker 1: small time scams and petty theft things and stuff like

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Speaker 1: that in Sydney. And that's at this point that he

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Speaker 1: meets Lee.

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Speaker 2: And did they immediately strike up a relationship.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely, It almost appears like it was love at first sight,

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Speaker 1: and everything that they go through in the next six

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Speaker 1: years or more it very much. Whatever he does to Lee,

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Speaker 1: she seems absolutely devoted to him. So they move in

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Speaker 1: for a while with Jean's mother, but Clayton absolutely hates

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Speaker 1: the domesticity of it and particularly being around Jean's child,

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Speaker 1: and so he's off and out running around on gene

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Speaker 1: and stuff like that. And in nineteen forty seven he's

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Speaker 1: arrested with a friend of his name, Norman Bolger. They

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Speaker 1: are charged with the attempted rape of two teenage girls. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: he's sentenced to twenty more months in Long Bay. Now

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Speaker 1: Lee Jeane is now again without means of support, so

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Speaker 1: she returns to sex work at this time, but she

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Speaker 1: also worked in the cafe and worked doing sort of

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Speaker 1: housework and support for a disabled American soldier who was

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Speaker 1: stuck in Sydney. And this guy obviously had some kind

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Speaker 1: of positive effect on her life because he was eventually

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Speaker 1: moved back his family took charge of him and moved

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Speaker 1: back to America. But he wrote her all the way

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Speaker 1: up until the end of her life, including when she

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Speaker 1: was actually in Pendrick Prison. Really, yeah, not a whole

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Speaker 1: lot we've been able to find out about here, but

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Speaker 1: it's just it's an interesting fact, you know, if possible,

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Speaker 1: what could have been?

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Speaker 3: I guess.

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Speaker 2: So where are the letters now? Are those letters still

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Speaker 2: at the prison?

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Speaker 3: No, they are not.

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Speaker 1: They will be probably in the custody of her surviving

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Speaker 1: family or something like that. This is just something I

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Speaker 1: came across as just a random n note in a

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Speaker 1: book about her. There's nothing else more about it, now, Jean,

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Speaker 1: she frequently visited Clayton in Long Bay, and you know,

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Speaker 1: he's not a great guy. He's abusive, he's unfaithful, and

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Speaker 1: in Long Bay he's very very self pitying, you know,

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Speaker 1: woe is me. And she tries to talk to him

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Speaker 1: about her life outside and what she's doing, and he

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Speaker 1: doesn't want to hear about it. He's very critical of

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Speaker 1: anything she's doing, but her devotion to him is still

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Speaker 1: absolutely genuine. So in nineteen forty nine, he is released

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Speaker 1: in September and they begin a particular scam called the

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Speaker 1: Badger scam.

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Speaker 2: And this is not just a scam that these two

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Speaker 2: pull off. This is actually a common scam at the time.

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Speaker 3: Isn't it It is. It's very well known.

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Speaker 1: I mean I first encountered this in the novels of

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Speaker 1: James Elroy, so it was obviously something that was very

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Speaker 1: much being done at the time. But the plan was

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Speaker 1: this that Clayton would steal a car, he would park

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Speaker 1: it somewhere dark, and Jeane, who was quite an attractive

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Speaker 1: young woman, she would lure a man hopefully married, into

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Speaker 1: the car. So they could get up to, you know,

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Speaker 1: and then Clayton would come out of the darkness knocking

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Speaker 1: on the window and be like, you know, I'm the

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Speaker 1: wronged husband. What are you doing if with my wife

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Speaker 1: in here and start a fake argument and things like that.

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Speaker 1: Now he would then buttonhole the man and demand compensation.

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Speaker 1: What form this would take would, you know? Usually be

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Speaker 1: like I need money to divorce this Harlot sort of

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Speaker 1: thing or something like that, or maybe just I'd need

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Speaker 1: money otherwise I'm going to tell your wife. But it

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Speaker 1: was quite a popular scam, and they it was quite

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Speaker 1: profitable for them as well, because by October they had

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Speaker 1: raised two hundred and fifty pounds.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's amazing that word didn't get around, you know,

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Speaker 2: that people didn't sort of catch on that this was

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Speaker 2: a thing and that it still worked.

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Speaker 1: I'm just trying to think of a polite way to

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Speaker 1: put this. Of men being enticed by a young, attractive women,

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Speaker 1: sometimes all sense goes out the window and they're not

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Speaker 1: necessarily thinking with the right part of their brain. I

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Speaker 1: imagine it's something that still happens today. I mean, you know,

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Speaker 1: people still get catfished online today and things like that,

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Speaker 1: So that is true.

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Speaker 2: So they raised a lot of money with this scam,

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Speaker 2: didn't they Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Two hundred and fifty pounds in the space of a month.

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Speaker 2: Astonishing.

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Speaker 1: So they decided to head down to Melbourne where the

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Speaker 1: Spring racing carnival was beginning, and try and enact the

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Speaker 1: same scam down in Melbourne.

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Speaker 2: So they actually did it at the races.

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Speaker 1: Around the races, you know, I mean even today you

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Speaker 1: can see there's a lot of people stumbling home from

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Speaker 1: Flemington in sort of the worst state to wear and

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Speaker 1: stuff like that. So there are quite a few targets

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Speaker 1: from there.

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Speaker 2: We'll be back shortly to find out what happened next,

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Speaker 2: so stay with us, so tell us more about their

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Speaker 2: life of crime in Melbourne.

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Speaker 1: So the money started to dwindle pretty quickly. They stayed

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Speaker 1: in quite a nice hotel to start with that then

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Speaker 1: moved into less salubrious accommodations and the circumstances started to

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Speaker 1: get quite precarious as this did, and as this did,

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Speaker 1: Clayton started to drink more. Now Jane was also had

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Speaker 1: a well and truly established drinking problem as well. But

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Speaker 1: as they were doing this more people seemed to be

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Speaker 1: wising up to the scam. As well, it was becoming

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Speaker 1: less successful. They were making less money, and there was

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Speaker 1: definitely several instances where the intended target fought back and

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Speaker 1: when this happened, Clayton would be humiliated, drunk and angry,

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Speaker 1: and he would take this out on jen Is definitely

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Speaker 1: at least one instance where he attacked her and left

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Speaker 1: her with a bruised face and cuts across her nose

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Speaker 1: after a failed scam. But they persisted and October twenty

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Speaker 1: sixth they went out to Werriby to a race meet

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Speaker 1: there and that is where they met a man named

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Speaker 1: Norman Anthees, otherwise known as Norman Andrews.

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Speaker 2: And Andrews had a pretty colorful criminal background himself, didn't.

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Speaker 3: He He did so. Andrews.

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Speaker 1: He was born in nineteen ten in Orange and New

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Speaker 1: South Wales. He worked as an electrician and a projectionist.

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Speaker 1: Married in nineteen thirty one and had a daughter, but

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Speaker 1: by nineteen forty he was divorced and living a pretty

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Speaker 1: itinerant lifestyle. We're just turning to petty crime to survive,

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Speaker 1: like many people were at the time. I think something

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Speaker 1: that's maybe not clear to a lot of people is

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Speaker 1: how common that was in the wartime. Era, now, the

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Speaker 1: wartime era. It kind of reminds me of almost like

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Speaker 1: the sort of the first decades of colonization, where you know,

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Speaker 1: if you're a free settler, you know, you run into

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Speaker 1: trouble in one town or one city, you just move

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Speaker 1: to another one, change your name, and you know, I'm

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Speaker 1: a completely new guy. And also, by the way, I'm

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Speaker 1: a doctor or something like that, and start set up

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Speaker 1: shop again. And this is kind of a similar thing.

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Speaker 1: In the wartime era, there's lots of movement of men

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Speaker 1: from place to place, and lots of people jumping ship

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Speaker 1: or jumping train and disappearing into the chaos and confusion,

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Speaker 1: you know, less police officers to run things up. We have,

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Speaker 1: particularly in in many of the cities, we have brownouts

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Speaker 1: or blackouts, which are better opportunities for crime.

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Speaker 3: You know.

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Speaker 1: We obviously have in Melbourne the famous case of the

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Speaker 1: brown out strangler, Eddie Leonski, who was possibly an American soldier,

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Speaker 1: possibly the criminal that although that's a whole other podcast,

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Speaker 1: and so this just this itinerant lifestyle and this lifestyle

363
00:18:20,040 --> 00:18:22,320
Speaker 1: of petty crime. It was quite possible at the time,

364
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Speaker 1: but in nineteen forty he did enlist in the Army

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Speaker 1: and he became a signalmant and he was actually injured

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Speaker 1: by a shrapnel to brook but he wasn't also again

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Speaker 1: not a great soldier. On four separate occasions he was

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Speaker 1: court martialed, the last being in nineteen forty four for

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Speaker 1: robbing and assaulting a civilian and that's when he got

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Speaker 1: three years in Long Bay, which is where he met Clayton.

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Speaker 2: And how did they meet.

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Speaker 1: They met at a race meet at Werribe, so just

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Speaker 1: obviously ran into each other in the crowd somewhere.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: And then did Clayton and Andrews instantly form a criminal association?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely they did.

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Speaker 1: Now there's no convictions that I've been able to trace

378
00:19:03,040 --> 00:19:06,040
Speaker 1: or anything like that, but they did absolutely pale around

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Speaker 1: committing petty crimes, attempting these scams still and doing a

380
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Speaker 1: hell of a lot of drinking, all three of them,

381
00:19:12,560 --> 00:19:16,040
Speaker 1: and their funds started to run out, which leads us

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Speaker 1: up to the fateful day that would end up with

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Speaker 1: all three of them seeing scaffold.

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Speaker 2: Now, I love the way that you've been introducing the

385
00:19:23,920 --> 00:19:26,159
Speaker 2: key characters in this tale like a who Done it?

386
00:19:26,200 --> 00:19:28,520
Speaker 2: So we get to know them one by one. I'd

387
00:19:28,600 --> 00:19:31,120
Speaker 2: love you to do the same with Pop Kent. He's

388
00:19:31,160 --> 00:19:34,959
Speaker 2: obviously the next most important character in this story. So

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Speaker 2: what do we know about him?

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Speaker 3: Yeah? So William George Kent.

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Speaker 1: He was born the twenty third of October eighteen seventy

392
00:19:40,680 --> 00:19:44,880
Speaker 1: four in the Western Districts and his life absolutely revolved

393
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Speaker 1: around horse racing. So as a young man he was

394
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Speaker 1: a jockey and then he owned race horses while he

395
00:19:51,200 --> 00:19:53,040
Speaker 1: worked doing things like farming and stuff like that in

396
00:19:53,040 --> 00:19:55,760
Speaker 1: the whim era. He married in nineteen oh three and

397
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Speaker 1: fathered nine children. But life didn't go well for him either,

398
00:19:59,160 --> 00:20:01,840
Speaker 1: because by the midnight forties he was living apart from

399
00:20:01,880 --> 00:20:05,080
Speaker 1: his wife and running a boarding house in Dorrit Street

400
00:20:05,119 --> 00:20:08,400
Speaker 1: in Carlton. While he was doing this, he also worked

401
00:20:08,440 --> 00:20:11,440
Speaker 1: as a bookie, taking illegal bets and he frequently drank

402
00:20:11,480 --> 00:20:14,000
Speaker 1: in the University Hotel, which is just a few blocks

403
00:20:14,080 --> 00:20:17,320
Speaker 1: over from Dorritt Street on Lygon Street. And he was

404
00:20:17,400 --> 00:20:19,600
Speaker 1: known in the area that on Monday he would collect

405
00:20:19,640 --> 00:20:22,359
Speaker 1: all the takings from these illegal gambling rings that he

406
00:20:22,480 --> 00:20:22,919
Speaker 1: was running.

407
00:20:23,960 --> 00:20:26,240
Speaker 2: So he's an older guy, seventy three, is that right?

408
00:20:26,720 --> 00:20:28,720
Speaker 3: Yeah? Much older, much much older. Yeah. Yeah.

409
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Speaker 2: Okay, so now we know all the main characters. Can

410
00:20:31,960 --> 00:20:33,800
Speaker 2: you set the scene for us and tell us about

411
00:20:33,840 --> 00:20:35,280
Speaker 2: the events leading up to the murder.

412
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Speaker 1: Sure so, on the eighth of November, the money is

413
00:20:38,880 --> 00:20:42,640
Speaker 1: so tight that they pawned Andrew's coat and traveling bag,

414
00:20:43,359 --> 00:20:45,919
Speaker 1: and then they went to the University Hotel on Lygon Street.

415
00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:48,359
Speaker 1: Now I don't know if they had actually heard of

416
00:20:48,400 --> 00:20:51,400
Speaker 1: this guy beforehand or this was just chance, but they

417
00:20:51,440 --> 00:20:57,480
Speaker 1: did run across him. How much is this they targeted him?

418
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Speaker 1: How much it was just circumstance. We're really just not known.

419
00:21:01,040 --> 00:21:03,840
Speaker 1: But they began drinking together and eventually they went back

420
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Speaker 1: to his house. Now this is where things get murky,

421
00:21:07,600 --> 00:21:12,240
Speaker 1: because we're basing everything on confessions from this point on,

422
00:21:12,359 --> 00:21:15,320
Speaker 1: and these confessions were later disputed several times in court.

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Speaker 3: So when I.

424
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Speaker 1: Say what happens next, please take it with a grain

425
00:21:19,240 --> 00:21:23,760
Speaker 1: of salt. But according to Clayton, they went back to

426
00:21:23,800 --> 00:21:26,680
Speaker 1: his house to buy cigarettes and grog, and Gene noticed

427
00:21:26,680 --> 00:21:29,280
Speaker 1: a roll of cash in his pocket and she and

428
00:21:29,280 --> 00:21:32,280
Speaker 1: Clayton went outside I believe there was a backyard toilet

429
00:21:32,320 --> 00:21:36,840
Speaker 1: or something like that, and she proposed robbing him. Now

430
00:21:37,280 --> 00:21:40,200
Speaker 1: the place they're at is Mallow House on fifty Dorit Street,

431
00:21:40,880 --> 00:21:43,240
Speaker 1: and it started life as a really nice two story

432
00:21:43,280 --> 00:21:45,199
Speaker 1: place for an immigrant family, but by this point it

433
00:21:45,280 --> 00:21:48,600
Speaker 1: was absolutely run down and filthy and operated as a

434
00:21:48,640 --> 00:21:51,879
Speaker 1: rooming house. Pop He had one room in the front

435
00:21:52,119 --> 00:21:56,480
Speaker 1: of the house, and his furniture in there was all

436
00:21:56,520 --> 00:21:59,480
Speaker 1: dilapidated and broken as well. So when Andrews sat on

437
00:21:59,520 --> 00:22:02,040
Speaker 1: a chair and immediately broke, he fell to the ground.

438
00:22:02,520 --> 00:22:04,639
Speaker 1: And there is a broken chair in there that's going

439
00:22:04,720 --> 00:22:07,000
Speaker 1: to come up very importantly soon.

440
00:22:07,640 --> 00:22:09,320
Speaker 3: Might even call it Chekhov's chair leg.

441
00:22:10,160 --> 00:22:14,320
Speaker 1: Now Lee turned the conversation flirtatious, sitting in Kent's lap

442
00:22:14,920 --> 00:22:17,240
Speaker 1: as all four of them keep drinking. They're absolutely housing

443
00:22:17,280 --> 00:22:19,119
Speaker 1: cheek wine at this point, so you know, all of

444
00:22:19,160 --> 00:22:23,080
Speaker 1: them are quite drunk. Now, Andrews and Clayton eventually find

445
00:22:23,119 --> 00:22:24,840
Speaker 1: an excuse to leave and head out and for a

446
00:22:24,880 --> 00:22:27,399
Speaker 1: walk around the block while Lee attempts to become intimate

447
00:22:27,440 --> 00:22:30,240
Speaker 1: with Kent, and she's hoping to pick his pockets while

448
00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:34,600
Speaker 1: he's otherwise occupied, but she can't get access to them.

449
00:22:35,359 --> 00:22:38,160
Speaker 1: Andrews and Clayton come in, see them in flagrante and

450
00:22:38,280 --> 00:22:41,919
Speaker 1: leave again. Jean tries again, but by this time Kent

451
00:22:42,080 --> 00:22:46,800
Speaker 1: is suspicious, so according to her again disputed confession Lee

452
00:22:46,920 --> 00:22:49,639
Speaker 1: said that she did her nut, and she hits him

453
00:22:49,680 --> 00:22:51,480
Speaker 1: with a wine bottle, breaking it over his head and

454
00:22:51,520 --> 00:22:54,440
Speaker 1: slashing open her hand, and then picking up the chair

455
00:22:54,520 --> 00:22:57,399
Speaker 1: leg and beat him about the head. Andrews and Clayton

456
00:22:57,480 --> 00:22:59,800
Speaker 1: standing out in the backyard at this time, they hear

457
00:22:59,840 --> 00:23:03,640
Speaker 1: this altercation and they run in. They overpower Kent. They

458
00:23:03,640 --> 00:23:06,840
Speaker 1: tear up his sheets, tie him together, bind him with

459
00:23:06,880 --> 00:23:09,600
Speaker 1: his sheets, use his bootlaces to bind his thumbs together.

460
00:23:10,440 --> 00:23:12,679
Speaker 1: And then once they've got the role of money in

461
00:23:12,720 --> 00:23:15,439
Speaker 1: his pocket, they think, well, this guy's bookie, so he

462
00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:18,320
Speaker 1: probably has other cash hidden around the place, and so

463
00:23:18,359 --> 00:23:21,600
Speaker 1: they start beating him and torturing him, trying to get

464
00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:24,960
Speaker 1: him to tell them where the money is, and inflicting

465
00:23:25,000 --> 00:23:28,200
Speaker 1: quite horrific injuries on him, you know, bashing him, putting

466
00:23:28,200 --> 00:23:30,480
Speaker 1: out lit cigarettes on him, all kinds of stuff like that.

467
00:23:31,440 --> 00:23:34,720
Speaker 1: So the thing is, though Pop probably actually didn't have

468
00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:37,639
Speaker 1: any end of money in the house. So it's, you

469
00:23:37,680 --> 00:23:39,879
Speaker 1: know the old story with torture. You can torture someone,

470
00:23:39,920 --> 00:23:41,640
Speaker 1: but they're just going to tell you what they want

471
00:23:41,640 --> 00:23:44,080
Speaker 1: to hear. And unfortunately Pop can't tell them what they

472
00:23:44,119 --> 00:23:45,880
Speaker 1: want to hear. There is no other money in the house.

473
00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:49,680
Speaker 1: They're nearly interrupted a couple of times. A neighbor from

474
00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:52,120
Speaker 1: across the street, Mary McWilliam. She was in the habit

475
00:23:52,200 --> 00:23:54,840
Speaker 1: of coming over for a nightcap with pot every night,

476
00:23:55,560 --> 00:23:57,399
Speaker 1: and so she comes and knocks on the door, and

477
00:23:57,520 --> 00:24:00,439
Speaker 1: as she does, Andrews opens the door and says, you know,

478
00:24:00,520 --> 00:24:03,720
Speaker 1: go away, we're having a private party. At the same time,

479
00:24:03,960 --> 00:24:07,320
Speaker 1: Clayton has his hands around Pop's neck, strangling him to

480
00:24:07,359 --> 00:24:12,040
Speaker 1: keep him quiet. And it's probable that it's at this

481
00:24:12,119 --> 00:24:16,000
Speaker 1: point when he is actually murdered. Now, whether this was

482
00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:19,360
Speaker 1: intentional or just the byproduct of him, you know, strangling

483
00:24:19,400 --> 00:24:22,400
Speaker 1: him to keep him quiet, is again no one will

484
00:24:22,400 --> 00:24:27,320
Speaker 1: ever know. But they obviously they now have a dead

485
00:24:27,359 --> 00:24:30,840
Speaker 1: man in a trash rooming house room, and they decide.

486
00:24:30,600 --> 00:24:32,800
Speaker 3: They need to get out of there very very quickly.

487
00:24:33,080 --> 00:24:35,119
Speaker 1: At the same time, it's a rooming house, so the

488
00:24:35,160 --> 00:24:38,119
Speaker 1: noise of the party is being heard by other people,

489
00:24:38,119 --> 00:24:42,680
Speaker 1: and across the hallway there is another lady living named

490
00:24:42,720 --> 00:24:46,239
Speaker 1: May Howard. Now she hears all this noise, and then

491
00:24:46,240 --> 00:24:50,640
Speaker 1: she hears it all stop, and she becomes quite concerned.

492
00:24:51,560 --> 00:24:55,920
Speaker 1: She then hears Clayton, Andrews and Lee leaving and Clayton

493
00:24:55,960 --> 00:24:58,439
Speaker 1: calls out in the hallway, goodbye, Pop, we'll see you

494
00:24:58,480 --> 00:25:03,120
Speaker 1: tomorrow double some kind of alibi obviously, but there's no response,

495
00:25:03,960 --> 00:25:06,560
Speaker 1: and so she goes and gets a fellow neighbor in

496
00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:09,160
Speaker 1: the rooming house, Bill Simmons, and they try to.

497
00:25:09,200 --> 00:25:09,720
Speaker 3: Enter the room.

498
00:25:10,680 --> 00:25:12,520
Speaker 1: They can't get entry to the room and Pop is

499
00:25:12,560 --> 00:25:15,879
Speaker 1: not responding, so they are worried, so they end up

500
00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:18,600
Speaker 1: now having to call the police. Now, interestingly, Bill Simmons

501
00:25:18,680 --> 00:25:20,920
Speaker 1: he was a disabled war veteran, he only had one leg,

502
00:25:21,760 --> 00:25:24,359
Speaker 1: so he was unable to go to the police. So

503
00:25:24,400 --> 00:25:26,480
Speaker 1: it ended up being May Howard that ran to the

504
00:25:26,520 --> 00:25:30,040
Speaker 1: nearest phone box and she called the police. The police

505
00:25:30,040 --> 00:25:32,399
Speaker 1: forced entry to the room and they found an absolutely

506
00:25:32,440 --> 00:25:38,399
Speaker 1: trashed rooming house room and the body of poor popkin Ah.

507
00:25:37,280 --> 00:25:38,919
Speaker 2: And then the three of them are on the run.

508
00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:41,440
Speaker 3: The three of them are on the run, okay.

509
00:25:41,720 --> 00:25:44,240
Speaker 1: They as they're making their way back into the city,

510
00:25:44,320 --> 00:25:46,879
Speaker 1: they go to a payphone and they book flights for

511
00:25:46,920 --> 00:25:50,360
Speaker 1: the seven am TAA flight to Adelaide and then back

512
00:25:50,359 --> 00:25:52,720
Speaker 1: to their rooms at the Great Southern Hotel near Spencer Street.

513
00:25:52,880 --> 00:25:55,440
Speaker 1: They changed out of their bloody clothes and went to

514
00:25:55,480 --> 00:26:01,359
Speaker 1: the copa Kabana nightclub, where they resumed they're drinking, and

515
00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:03,359
Speaker 1: they were eventually asked to leave in the early hours

516
00:26:03,400 --> 00:26:06,639
Speaker 1: of the morning because gene had become worse for drink. Apparently,

517
00:26:07,880 --> 00:26:10,280
Speaker 1: in the meantime, the police are undertaking a man hunt

518
00:26:10,560 --> 00:26:14,479
Speaker 1: because they've headed up to the University Hotel where they

519
00:26:14,480 --> 00:26:17,240
Speaker 1: know Pop Drinks got a quick description of these three

520
00:26:17,240 --> 00:26:19,320
Speaker 1: people who have been seen drinking with him all afternoon

521
00:26:19,320 --> 00:26:22,919
Speaker 1: and evening pretty quickly, and they're now just canvassing everywhere

522
00:26:22,960 --> 00:26:25,520
Speaker 1: in the local area to see if anyone has met

523
00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:28,960
Speaker 1: these descriptions. At about twenty to four in the morning,

524
00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:32,400
Speaker 1: a clerk at the Great Southern Hotel recognized the description, says, yep,

525
00:26:32,440 --> 00:26:35,280
Speaker 1: these three people are staying here in two rooms, and

526
00:26:35,359 --> 00:26:38,480
Speaker 1: the police gained entry to those rooms and they found

527
00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:42,760
Speaker 1: bloodstained clothing. They waited at the hotel and about four

528
00:26:42,800 --> 00:26:46,000
Speaker 1: twenty am Clayton, Andrews and Lee returned and they are

529
00:26:46,080 --> 00:26:49,280
Speaker 1: arrested by squad of detectives led by senior detectives Cyrial Kura.

530
00:26:50,600 --> 00:26:52,920
Speaker 2: They weren't very hard to catch, were they. I mean,

531
00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:55,600
Speaker 2: they made a lot of mistakes, I guess because they

532
00:26:55,600 --> 00:26:58,159
Speaker 2: were all so drunk and not thinking straight.

533
00:26:58,280 --> 00:27:00,800
Speaker 1: Made a lot of noise, and I mean this is

534
00:27:00,840 --> 00:27:05,000
Speaker 1: also what my personal opinion is, this wasn't so much

535
00:27:05,040 --> 00:27:08,080
Speaker 1: premeditated as circumstance. They were drunk, they were desperate, They

536
00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:10,120
Speaker 1: saw the opportunity, they took it. They didn't really think

537
00:27:10,160 --> 00:27:13,920
Speaker 1: through the consequences. And you know, look, they were trying

538
00:27:13,920 --> 00:27:16,080
Speaker 1: to get out of Melbourne with that seven am flight.

539
00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:19,080
Speaker 1: But they didn't just go back to their rooms quietly

540
00:27:19,119 --> 00:27:20,840
Speaker 1: and wait until seven am, did they.

541
00:27:22,280 --> 00:27:26,920
Speaker 2: Now you mentioned the confessions. Did they all confess straight away?

542
00:27:27,600 --> 00:27:30,800
Speaker 1: Absolutely not. They're all separated, put in sweat boxes and

543
00:27:30,840 --> 00:27:34,439
Speaker 1: subjected to hours of interrogation and Gene absolutely held fast

544
00:27:34,480 --> 00:27:36,479
Speaker 1: for nearly six hours or more I believe it was.

545
00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:40,000
Speaker 1: But they're all drunk, they're all denied sleep, and you know,

546
00:27:40,400 --> 00:27:43,159
Speaker 1: possibly subjected to other forms.

547
00:27:42,800 --> 00:27:45,879
Speaker 3: Of interrogation and persuasion. You know, whether the phone books

548
00:27:45,880 --> 00:27:46,639
Speaker 3: were brought out or not.

549
00:27:47,040 --> 00:27:50,440
Speaker 2: Oh interesting, Okay, is this speculation.

550
00:27:50,080 --> 00:27:54,560
Speaker 1: Or is this absolutely speculation and cynicism and preconceived bias

551
00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:57,720
Speaker 1: on my part? But it is late nineteen forties, and

552
00:27:57,920 --> 00:27:59,760
Speaker 1: you can imagine, you know, the police back then were

553
00:28:00,280 --> 00:28:03,800
Speaker 1: breed and how they extracted their confessions. Look, maybe I've

554
00:28:04,040 --> 00:28:07,600
Speaker 1: read too many James our Royan novels. But I am cynical.

555
00:28:08,200 --> 00:28:13,679
Speaker 1: But she doesn't budge. However, Clayton does now. He says

556
00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:16,960
Speaker 1: later on that you know, he turned yellow like a dog,

557
00:28:17,880 --> 00:28:20,760
Speaker 1: and that he was just so completely out of it

558
00:28:20,840 --> 00:28:23,280
Speaker 1: from his being worse for the state of where it's

559
00:28:23,320 --> 00:28:26,480
Speaker 1: sleep deprivation and drunk. But he is presented with a

560
00:28:26,560 --> 00:28:29,000
Speaker 1: signed confession and he signs it, and he is then

561
00:28:29,320 --> 00:28:33,520
Speaker 1: dragged tearfully into Gene's cell. And the thing about this

562
00:28:33,600 --> 00:28:36,480
Speaker 1: confession is the implicates Gene. It's she's the one that

563
00:28:36,600 --> 00:28:39,360
Speaker 1: started it all. She's the one that attacked him. She's

564
00:28:39,400 --> 00:28:43,800
Speaker 1: the one that murdered Kent. So he's brought into the

565
00:28:43,840 --> 00:28:46,240
Speaker 1: integration room in front of Jane and him. It's yep,

566
00:28:46,320 --> 00:28:50,880
Speaker 1: I signed that confession, and Gene apparently she scoffed so

567
00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:54,480
Speaker 1: much for the weaker sex when seeing Clayton in this condition,

568
00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:57,800
Speaker 1: and then apparently she said, Bobby, I still love you,

569
00:28:57,840 --> 00:28:59,640
Speaker 1: but if that's the way you want it, you can

570
00:28:59,640 --> 00:29:01,840
Speaker 1: have it. As he was dragged for the room, and

571
00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:03,560
Speaker 1: then she turned to the police and she said, I

572
00:29:03,600 --> 00:29:05,600
Speaker 1: did it. I did it all. Everything that he said

573
00:29:05,640 --> 00:29:06,840
Speaker 1: is true. It's all on me.

574
00:29:08,200 --> 00:29:10,200
Speaker 3: Pretty clear cut confession.

575
00:29:11,120 --> 00:29:13,160
Speaker 1: She was to lay to say, however, that she simply

576
00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:15,000
Speaker 1: admitted it just to get some peace and quiet.

577
00:29:20,160 --> 00:29:22,479
Speaker 2: We'll leave this story here for now, but tune back

578
00:29:22,520 --> 00:29:25,040
Speaker 2: in on Thursday for part two of the story of

579
00:29:25,160 --> 00:29:28,880
Speaker 2: gen Lee to hear what happened after she confessed to

580
00:29:28,920 --> 00:29:32,680
Speaker 2: the murder. Thanks for listening. This has Been In Black

581
00:29:32,720 --> 00:29:36,240
Speaker 2: and White, a podcast about some of Australia's forgotten characters,

582
00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:40,480
Speaker 2: written and hosted by me Jen Kelly, edited by Nina Young,

583
00:29:40,920 --> 00:29:43,880
Speaker 2: and produced by John Ti Burton. You can find all

584
00:29:43,880 --> 00:29:47,680
Speaker 2: the stories and photos associated with our episodes at Heroldsun

585
00:29:47,760 --> 00:29:52,720
Speaker 2: dot com dot au slash ib aw. If you've enjoyed

586
00:29:52,720 --> 00:29:54,840
Speaker 2: this podcast, we'd love you to leave a five star

587
00:29:54,960 --> 00:29:59,400
Speaker 2: rating on Apple Podcasts. Even better, leave a review. Any

588
00:29:59,400 --> 00:30:02,280
Speaker 2: comments of questions please email me at in Black and

589
00:30:02,320 --> 00:30:06,720
Speaker 2: White at Heroldsun dot com dot Au. Any clarifications or

590
00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:09,760
Speaker 2: updates will appear in the show notes for each episode,

591
00:30:10,120 --> 00:30:12,520
Speaker 2: and to get notified when each new episode comes out,

592
00:30:12,760 --> 00:30:15,120
Speaker 2: make sure you subscribe to the podcast feed