1
00:00:04,920 --> 00:00:10,719
Speaker 1: Welcome to the mentor I Mark, Boris and Anderson, welcome

2
00:00:10,840 --> 00:00:12,160
Speaker 1: to the mental mate.

3
00:00:12,360 --> 00:00:13,840
Speaker 2: Thanks having me really excited about this.

4
00:00:14,000 --> 00:00:16,919
Speaker 1: You came all the way down from Queensland. It must

5
00:00:16,920 --> 00:00:18,720
Speaker 1: have been a lot of probably good place to get

6
00:00:18,720 --> 00:00:21,240
Speaker 1: out of after you guys losing the state of origin.

7
00:00:21,079 --> 00:00:25,680
Speaker 2: Straight away, mate, straight away.

8
00:00:24,720 --> 00:00:28,280
Speaker 1: I don't want to. Why wouldn't. I'm a new South Welshman.

9
00:00:28,760 --> 00:00:31,800
Speaker 1: For years we could get hammered by you guys. Even

10
00:00:31,800 --> 00:00:33,560
Speaker 1: in the last time I think we won. That's the

11
00:00:33,720 --> 00:00:37,440
Speaker 1: third time I think in the history start of origin

12
00:00:37,479 --> 00:00:39,680
Speaker 1: that we wanted to decide up in Queensland.

13
00:00:39,720 --> 00:00:41,120
Speaker 2: That is, we've got to keep your hopes up something.

14
00:00:41,479 --> 00:00:44,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, well I give you one. We don't worry. Don't worry, mate,

15
00:00:44,680 --> 00:00:46,440
Speaker 1: next year it will be the same thing anyway. I

16
00:00:46,479 --> 00:00:52,360
Speaker 1: am more importantly Lee, you're and I don't even know

17
00:00:52,360 --> 00:00:56,560
Speaker 1: what it is actual fact in a technical sense, but

18
00:00:57,440 --> 00:01:01,240
Speaker 1: you you're a paramedic. What is a paramedic?

19
00:01:02,160 --> 00:01:06,440
Speaker 2: That's a very good question. A paramedic the traditional definition

20
00:01:06,480 --> 00:01:10,000
Speaker 2: would be you respond in an emergency to help someone

21
00:01:10,040 --> 00:01:15,679
Speaker 2: medically who's injured trauma, typically trauma or some sort of

22
00:01:15,720 --> 00:01:17,040
Speaker 2: medical condition or illness.

23
00:01:17,360 --> 00:01:19,120
Speaker 1: As an ambulance gone an ambulance.

24
00:01:19,200 --> 00:01:22,039
Speaker 2: Yeah, so you respond in an emergency to help someone.

25
00:01:22,080 --> 00:01:26,920
Speaker 2: But recently, with technology and everything and the changing in

26
00:01:27,200 --> 00:01:32,000
Speaker 2: diversity of the general public, that role has changed. It

27
00:01:32,080 --> 00:01:35,240
Speaker 2: has it's got a lot more complex now. You know,

28
00:01:35,319 --> 00:01:38,080
Speaker 2: the mentors that I have that very experienced people that

29
00:01:38,120 --> 00:01:41,960
Speaker 2: I admire look up to, they've been around for thirty

30
00:01:41,959 --> 00:01:46,280
Speaker 2: five forty years. They will go to essentially carry no medicine.

31
00:01:46,680 --> 00:01:48,400
Speaker 2: They wouldn't have a lot of drugs, they would have

32
00:01:48,480 --> 00:01:50,880
Speaker 2: very limited equipment. They would go and they would basically

33
00:01:50,920 --> 00:01:52,600
Speaker 2: stretch a barriers, they would load them in the back

34
00:01:52,640 --> 00:01:54,440
Speaker 2: of the ambulance, drove them as fast as you could

35
00:01:54,440 --> 00:01:57,320
Speaker 2: get them to hospital. They would see a lot more

36
00:01:57,360 --> 00:02:00,400
Speaker 2: trauma than I would see today or the typical ParaMed today.

37
00:02:00,440 --> 00:02:02,840
Speaker 2: They would see gross trauma with car accidents. You know,

38
00:02:02,960 --> 00:02:05,440
Speaker 2: no safety features, people would fly out the window, no

39
00:02:05,520 --> 00:02:09,680
Speaker 2: seat belts, no airbags, no crush mechanism in vehicles. So

40
00:02:10,440 --> 00:02:12,400
Speaker 2: the things that they saw back then were far worse

41
00:02:12,440 --> 00:02:16,280
Speaker 2: than what we see now. But the complexity has changed.

42
00:02:16,320 --> 00:02:21,919
Speaker 2: It's the medicine has improved, so paramedics have evolved. They're

43
00:02:21,919 --> 00:02:24,640
Speaker 2: gone from like an apprenticeship where you're kind of like

44
00:02:24,919 --> 00:02:27,280
Speaker 2: a plumber or something on the job, learn on the

45
00:02:27,360 --> 00:02:30,920
Speaker 2: job to studying at tertiary level. You've got to get

46
00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:33,320
Speaker 2: a degree now and then you're do an apprenticeship after

47
00:02:33,360 --> 00:02:37,040
Speaker 2: the degree. And medicines come very complex, so you carry

48
00:02:37,200 --> 00:02:40,600
Speaker 2: you know, over thirty to forty drugs. Now, you see,

49
00:02:40,840 --> 00:02:42,919
Speaker 2: patients are very more complex now. They've got a lot

50
00:02:42,960 --> 00:02:46,360
Speaker 2: more diseases, particularly in the West, a lot of complication

51
00:02:46,400 --> 00:02:50,200
Speaker 2: of the diabetes, inphysema, heart conditions. You know, they might

52
00:02:50,440 --> 00:02:54,200
Speaker 2: have multiple conditions instead of just the one. So now

53
00:02:54,200 --> 00:02:58,480
Speaker 2: it's more important than ever to try and help people

54
00:02:58,480 --> 00:03:00,760
Speaker 2: clear their mind so they can make good decisions because

55
00:03:00,800 --> 00:03:02,840
Speaker 2: the inputs that they have now and the knowledge they

56
00:03:02,840 --> 00:03:05,080
Speaker 2: have now is far higher than whatever you used to be.

57
00:03:05,480 --> 00:03:09,640
Speaker 1: So if you just so, paramedic is I don't know

58
00:03:09,639 --> 00:03:13,560
Speaker 1: why they're called paramedic, but para means beyond beyond. Okay,

59
00:03:13,639 --> 00:03:16,520
Speaker 1: So so it's beyond the medic Yeah, so beyond the medics.

60
00:03:16,520 --> 00:03:20,440
Speaker 2: So it first started out of the World War.

61
00:03:20,440 --> 00:03:22,280
Speaker 1: I was going to say medics were a war thing,

62
00:03:23,040 --> 00:03:25,760
Speaker 1: and they weren't necessarily doctors, but they were called medics

63
00:03:26,320 --> 00:03:28,480
Speaker 1: and they could have been a doctor as well, but

64
00:03:28,520 --> 00:03:31,040
Speaker 1: they were medics. Who went out and when there was

65
00:03:31,160 --> 00:03:33,520
Speaker 1: when the war was on in the field, they would

66
00:03:34,040 --> 00:03:37,600
Speaker 1: you know, put people back together again basically. And paramedic

67
00:03:37,720 --> 00:03:40,200
Speaker 1: is you know, as you say, it's it's sort of

68
00:03:40,240 --> 00:03:44,000
Speaker 1: like a higher version or a more multitudinous version of

69
00:03:44,080 --> 00:03:47,400
Speaker 1: a medic of what medical requirements need to be done.

70
00:03:48,040 --> 00:03:50,800
Speaker 1: If you, if I go back to you know, when

71
00:03:50,880 --> 00:03:53,400
Speaker 1: you were a young man and you decided to undertake

72
00:03:53,440 --> 00:03:56,240
Speaker 1: this career, what are the drivers of somebody who wants

73
00:03:56,280 --> 00:03:58,280
Speaker 1: to become one of these individuals? I mean, why does

74
00:03:58,280 --> 00:04:01,560
Speaker 1: someone want to become a paramedic. I guess initially you

75
00:04:01,560 --> 00:04:07,600
Speaker 1: become an amber but we used to call it amber. Yeah, people, Yeah,

76
00:04:07,640 --> 00:04:11,360
Speaker 1: and then you become a paramedic after that. That is

77
00:04:11,440 --> 00:04:15,280
Speaker 1: that is the course. So when did do you remember

78
00:04:15,320 --> 00:04:17,960
Speaker 1: when why you decided and when you decided to become

79
00:04:18,000 --> 00:04:18,600
Speaker 1: one of these dudes?

80
00:04:18,640 --> 00:04:20,240
Speaker 2: Because it is interesting if you said to me now,

81
00:04:20,279 --> 00:04:24,480
Speaker 2: it's like, why don't you sign up to no sleep working,

82
00:04:24,560 --> 00:04:29,359
Speaker 2: Christmas Day, Easter nights, weekends. You're going to be abused,

83
00:04:29,560 --> 00:04:32,840
Speaker 2: You're going to be assaulted, and it's you know, why

84
00:04:32,839 --> 00:04:36,640
Speaker 2: would you sign up for that? But really it actually

85
00:04:36,680 --> 00:04:40,640
Speaker 2: starts back to my rugby league career. You know, I

86
00:04:40,680 --> 00:04:42,520
Speaker 2: had a I have a big passion for rugby league.

87
00:04:42,920 --> 00:04:45,200
Speaker 2: I thought I was going to be the next Aaron Lockyer.

88
00:04:46,680 --> 00:04:48,120
Speaker 1: All sounds too good.

89
00:04:49,720 --> 00:04:55,040
Speaker 2: Well that's why I guess I chose a different bath. I.

90
00:04:55,080 --> 00:04:58,120
Speaker 2: You know, I thought Queensland was my goal to play

91
00:04:58,160 --> 00:05:00,599
Speaker 2: for the Marines. It's ironic that you mentioned that at

92
00:05:00,640 --> 00:05:03,240
Speaker 2: the start, because that's where I wanted to head as

93
00:05:03,279 --> 00:05:05,920
Speaker 2: a young fella. But it was I was doing really well.

94
00:05:05,960 --> 00:05:08,840
Speaker 2: My brother signed a contract with Melbourne Storm when he

95
00:05:08,880 --> 00:05:12,480
Speaker 2: was fifteen and I was only about thirteen. So I idolized

96
00:05:12,400 --> 00:05:14,200
Speaker 2: my brother at the times, like, oh, that's the path

97
00:05:14,279 --> 00:05:18,279
Speaker 2: I want to go. He was signed by Peter o Sullivan.

98
00:05:18,360 --> 00:05:21,560
Speaker 2: He was one of the first. He was the first

99
00:05:22,920 --> 00:05:27,440
Speaker 2: what they call it. Oh yeah, but you know, and

100
00:05:27,520 --> 00:05:29,800
Speaker 2: Peter O'Sullivan started when I was fifteen, started coming to

101
00:05:29,880 --> 00:05:33,640
Speaker 2: watch some of my games and.

102
00:05:32,800 --> 00:05:36,480
Speaker 1: He was a recruitment officer I had a recruitment at initially.

103
00:05:36,560 --> 00:05:40,480
Speaker 1: Now he's I think he's at the Brisbane now back

104
00:05:40,480 --> 00:05:43,599
Speaker 1: of Brisbane at Dolphins. Dolphins, that's right.

105
00:05:44,240 --> 00:05:46,359
Speaker 2: Yeah. So he started to come to my game, speak

106
00:05:46,360 --> 00:05:48,840
Speaker 2: to me afterwards, and then the he goes i'll see

107
00:05:48,880 --> 00:05:51,840
Speaker 2: you next week and literally that game I discoded my

108
00:05:51,920 --> 00:05:56,120
Speaker 2: kneecap tour. Some of my ligaments ended up in the

109
00:05:56,120 --> 00:06:00,120
Speaker 2: back of the ambulance. They treated me really well, and

110
00:06:00,120 --> 00:06:02,680
Speaker 2: then after that I had surgery and I ended up

111
00:06:03,240 --> 00:06:05,960
Speaker 2: coming back the next year and the surgery went really well.

112
00:06:06,080 --> 00:06:09,039
Speaker 2: And then I did my other knee a year later,

113
00:06:09,400 --> 00:06:11,640
Speaker 2: and that surgery didn't go too well at all. I

114
00:06:11,720 --> 00:06:16,000
Speaker 2: ended up getting sepsist, going into a good infection, got

115
00:06:16,000 --> 00:06:18,400
Speaker 2: septic shock, had to call the ambulance to come get me.

116
00:06:18,520 --> 00:06:21,440
Speaker 2: I was quite ill, and at this time I thought, oh,

117
00:06:21,480 --> 00:06:25,400
Speaker 2: my dream's over. At sixteen seventeen, I thought that was it.

118
00:06:25,480 --> 00:06:27,440
Speaker 2: My life's over. You know, this is all I ever wanted,

119
00:06:27,440 --> 00:06:31,080
Speaker 2: and it ended through this injury. But then it became

120
00:06:31,160 --> 00:06:33,680
Speaker 2: really worrying. It's like after that I couldn't bend my

121
00:06:33,760 --> 00:06:36,200
Speaker 2: leg and I thought, wow, I'm going to be disabled now,

122
00:06:36,240 --> 00:06:39,120
Speaker 2: like I couldn't quite literally had about twenty degrees bend

123
00:06:39,320 --> 00:06:43,560
Speaker 2: in my knee, and things like reality hit hard. Then

124
00:06:43,600 --> 00:06:47,360
Speaker 2: it's like, you know, sports not everything, and life taught

125
00:06:47,400 --> 00:06:50,000
Speaker 2: me a real lesson that, you know, there's far more

126
00:06:50,040 --> 00:06:54,160
Speaker 2: important things than rugby league. As much as I loved it,

127
00:06:54,839 --> 00:06:57,520
Speaker 2: and you know, I was really suffering at that time,

128
00:06:57,920 --> 00:07:03,320
Speaker 2: and that injury caused me to push me towards studying education,

129
00:07:05,279 --> 00:07:07,400
Speaker 2: you know, doing better at my school work, because at

130
00:07:07,400 --> 00:07:08,800
Speaker 2: the time I couldn't care less. I just wanted to

131
00:07:08,839 --> 00:07:14,400
Speaker 2: play sport. But without that injury, I wouldn't have studied.

132
00:07:15,400 --> 00:07:17,600
Speaker 2: And then I thought, you know, those paramedics looked after

133
00:07:17,600 --> 00:07:19,440
Speaker 2: me really well, and I spired like they were like

134
00:07:19,480 --> 00:07:21,800
Speaker 2: heroes to me at the time, and I thought that's

135
00:07:21,840 --> 00:07:24,200
Speaker 2: something I wanted to do. So I got triggered into that.

136
00:07:24,320 --> 00:07:28,080
Speaker 1: And they gave you the inspo they did.

137
00:07:28,160 --> 00:07:30,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, the way they treated me, and they were just

138
00:07:30,800 --> 00:07:33,520
Speaker 2: you know, they're really kind. They showed a great empathy.

139
00:07:33,920 --> 00:07:36,800
Speaker 1: Was it just or did the whole process fascinate you.

140
00:07:36,800 --> 00:07:39,760
Speaker 2: The whole break? Yeah? Yeah, And I was always fascinated

141
00:07:39,800 --> 00:07:43,560
Speaker 2: about the body. I thought there was a period there

142
00:07:43,600 --> 00:07:45,320
Speaker 2: I thought, oh, I'm going to do like a pe

143
00:07:45,360 --> 00:07:49,720
Speaker 2: teacher or some sort of physiotherapy or something to try

144
00:07:49,760 --> 00:07:51,680
Speaker 2: and still be involved in the sport. I thought, you know,

145
00:07:51,720 --> 00:07:56,840
Speaker 2: I might do exercise scientists or something like that and

146
00:07:57,640 --> 00:08:00,000
Speaker 2: be a coach in regular league. That's where I originally started.

147
00:08:00,160 --> 00:08:03,280
Speaker 2: But when I saw paramedic on the page for the

148
00:08:03,400 --> 00:08:05,000
Speaker 2: university enrollments.

149
00:08:05,400 --> 00:08:08,239
Speaker 1: It just like that's the course, is it?

150
00:08:08,240 --> 00:08:11,000
Speaker 2: It is a course, yeah, it's in university now.

151
00:08:10,880 --> 00:08:12,840
Speaker 1: And which university talking about now?

152
00:08:13,440 --> 00:08:15,880
Speaker 2: I went to Sunshine Case. I was the first group

153
00:08:16,280 --> 00:08:17,520
Speaker 2: to go through the Sunshine case.

154
00:08:17,640 --> 00:08:19,400
Speaker 1: It in health sciences or something like that, is it?

155
00:08:19,640 --> 00:08:22,080
Speaker 2: Yeah? I know, it's just called paramedic science, right. It's

156
00:08:22,120 --> 00:08:24,440
Speaker 2: usually fits alongside nursing or medicing.

157
00:08:25,000 --> 00:08:27,600
Speaker 1: It's not in the okase. And I was just trying

158
00:08:27,600 --> 00:08:30,000
Speaker 1: to work with which faculty was not that it's that important,

159
00:08:30,040 --> 00:08:33,560
Speaker 1: but it's I think they have I don't know back ways,

160
00:08:33,679 --> 00:08:36,440
Speaker 1: but I know the University of South Wales has health sciences,

161
00:08:36,440 --> 00:08:38,800
Speaker 1: so to City University, and they sort of have a

162
00:08:38,800 --> 00:08:41,760
Speaker 1: whole lot of people in their biologists and you know

163
00:08:42,480 --> 00:08:45,839
Speaker 1: my medical engineers, and they have doctors and nurses and

164
00:08:45,840 --> 00:08:49,640
Speaker 1: every there's a whole whole suite of people. And because

165
00:08:49,760 --> 00:08:51,920
Speaker 1: university has changed a lot since I went to university.

166
00:08:51,960 --> 00:08:54,839
Speaker 1: But so you you you applied for.

167
00:08:54,800 --> 00:08:58,439
Speaker 2: It, it got in. And then now I look back

168
00:08:58,480 --> 00:09:01,000
Speaker 2: at that injury and that suffering I went to and

169
00:09:01,040 --> 00:09:02,640
Speaker 2: I look back now and go, that was probably the

170
00:09:02,679 --> 00:09:05,120
Speaker 2: greatest thing to ever happen to me. But at the time,

171
00:09:05,200 --> 00:09:07,480
Speaker 2: I thought it was the worst. And then as years

172
00:09:07,520 --> 00:09:10,120
Speaker 2: go on as a paramedic itself, I realized that I

173
00:09:10,160 --> 00:09:11,680
Speaker 2: was becoming a witness to suffering.

174
00:09:11,920 --> 00:09:13,839
Speaker 1: Well, can I before we go into because I think

175
00:09:13,880 --> 00:09:16,600
Speaker 1: that's sort of fairly meaty stuff and needs a bit

176
00:09:16,720 --> 00:09:20,920
Speaker 1: it needs to be properly looked at. But before you

177
00:09:21,000 --> 00:09:24,720
Speaker 1: go into just in terms of a course at university,

178
00:09:25,600 --> 00:09:28,520
Speaker 1: I'm presuming like we're talking to a degree university, a

179
00:09:28,520 --> 00:09:31,880
Speaker 1: paramedic degree. It's a Bachelor of Paramedical, Bachelor of Science

180
00:09:31,960 --> 00:09:34,440
Speaker 1: or something that Bachelor of Science or something or whatever

181
00:09:34,480 --> 00:09:37,000
Speaker 1: it is. And but what are the sort of things

182
00:09:37,040 --> 00:09:40,360
Speaker 1: that you learn at a at a scholarly level as

183
00:09:40,360 --> 00:09:43,120
Speaker 1: opposed to an experiential level, the sort of stuff you

184
00:09:43,160 --> 00:09:46,240
Speaker 1: do on the on the tools. What are the sort

185
00:09:46,240 --> 00:09:48,200
Speaker 1: of the scholarly things that you're looking at in an

186
00:09:48,240 --> 00:09:52,480
Speaker 1: academic sense. You know, you're learning about biology, you're learning

187
00:09:52,480 --> 00:09:57,800
Speaker 1: about you know, physiology. What are they teaching you?

188
00:09:57,960 --> 00:10:01,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, so the fundamental cli eical knowledge that you need

189
00:10:01,480 --> 00:10:07,360
Speaker 2: is basically anatomy, physiology. Pharmacology is quite important.

190
00:10:07,520 --> 00:10:08,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, of course you've got no drugs.

191
00:10:08,880 --> 00:10:14,920
Speaker 2: Drugs. Yeah, Pathophysiology which a study of diseases and then

192
00:10:14,920 --> 00:10:19,840
Speaker 2: you go into more emergency medicine courses, so medical courses

193
00:10:19,920 --> 00:10:24,960
Speaker 2: specific to paramedicine. Obviously it has like an emergency focus

194
00:10:25,160 --> 00:10:29,520
Speaker 2: rather than chronic disease, but that is changing. And then

195
00:10:30,080 --> 00:10:33,480
Speaker 2: so you get your fundamental knowledge right of the basic sciences,

196
00:10:33,520 --> 00:10:36,920
Speaker 2: and then you start going into niche paramedic courses and

197
00:10:37,120 --> 00:10:38,280
Speaker 2: subject units.

198
00:10:38,200 --> 00:10:40,840
Speaker 1: And what about things like this sort of sounds a

199
00:10:40,840 --> 00:10:42,560
Speaker 1: bit more simple, but it's probably not that simple. But

200
00:10:42,600 --> 00:10:46,960
Speaker 1: what about things like, you know, interaction with a patient

201
00:10:47,120 --> 00:10:51,960
Speaker 1: in other words, not professionals or not biological stuff, but

202
00:10:53,120 --> 00:10:56,360
Speaker 1: how do I deal with someone who's you panicking or

203
00:10:56,480 --> 00:11:03,200
Speaker 1: somebody who's so fucked up that they're completely traumatized and

204
00:11:03,360 --> 00:11:07,000
Speaker 1: you have to somehow calm the farm? I mean, do

205
00:11:07,080 --> 00:11:07,800
Speaker 1: they teach.

206
00:11:08,120 --> 00:11:09,360
Speaker 2: Through They didn't.

207
00:11:09,400 --> 00:11:10,800
Speaker 1: They didn't have that. That's amazing.

208
00:11:10,920 --> 00:11:14,240
Speaker 2: No, that was learned experience, because that.

209
00:11:14,200 --> 00:11:16,440
Speaker 1: Would be a shock. It is because because you know,

210
00:11:16,520 --> 00:11:19,199
Speaker 1: you you don't learn that stuff. You're learning all the

211
00:11:19,200 --> 00:11:22,640
Speaker 1: theoretical stuff, so to speak. You know, what drug is,

212
00:11:23,320 --> 00:11:27,000
Speaker 1: help per responder on a certain drug, what signs you

213
00:11:27,000 --> 00:11:30,319
Speaker 1: should be looking for in terms of maybe diagnostics, how

214
00:11:30,320 --> 00:11:32,760
Speaker 1: to use instruments and or whatever machines you might have

215
00:11:32,760 --> 00:11:38,320
Speaker 1: in the back of the ambulance, et cetera. The two

216
00:11:38,400 --> 00:11:40,240
Speaker 1: things I would imagine would have shocked this shit out

217
00:11:40,240 --> 00:11:44,120
Speaker 1: of here was one the hours, because you know, everything

218
00:11:44,120 --> 00:11:46,360
Speaker 1: happens between seven at nine and seven in the morning.

219
00:11:46,360 --> 00:11:48,520
Speaker 1: That's when the greatest ambulance callouts are.

220
00:11:49,400 --> 00:11:51,200
Speaker 2: Particularly about seven to eleven.

221
00:11:51,480 --> 00:11:55,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, and particularly heart attacks, Like you know, people have

222
00:11:55,679 --> 00:11:57,600
Speaker 1: their heart attacks at lead three, four or five in

223
00:11:57,600 --> 00:11:59,800
Speaker 1: the morning early in the morning. Yeah, yeah, and as

224
00:11:59,840 --> 00:12:01,800
Speaker 1: you like, then they get up and maybe get a

225
00:12:01,840 --> 00:12:03,920
Speaker 1: toilet or something like that, and then bang they're gone

226
00:12:04,480 --> 00:12:09,480
Speaker 1: or not gone, but it's much more serious. Those things

227
00:12:09,480 --> 00:12:12,360
Speaker 1: would be a shock because you're turning up to pick

228
00:12:12,400 --> 00:12:16,600
Speaker 1: these people up and sometimes they're big and you have

229
00:12:16,640 --> 00:12:19,720
Speaker 1: to haul them out of the joint, you know, way

230
00:12:19,720 --> 00:12:23,160
Speaker 1: of weight or whatever the case may be, or inebriated

231
00:12:23,640 --> 00:12:32,040
Speaker 1: or drugged or abusive. What was the how confronted? I mean,

232
00:12:32,080 --> 00:12:33,520
Speaker 1: apart from the fact you have to try and fix

233
00:12:33,559 --> 00:12:36,680
Speaker 1: them or get them into recovery process or some sort

234
00:12:36,679 --> 00:12:38,880
Speaker 1: of stabilization process in order to get them back to

235
00:12:38,960 --> 00:12:43,520
Speaker 1: uspit to get them sorted. That part's enough challenging enough,

236
00:12:43,520 --> 00:12:46,680
Speaker 1: But how did you give them that down? Teaches University

237
00:12:47,520 --> 00:12:49,880
Speaker 1: how did that shock confront you and what sort of

238
00:12:50,000 --> 00:12:51,640
Speaker 1: processes did you put in place.

239
00:12:53,160 --> 00:12:55,839
Speaker 2: It is confronting, particularly the first time you see a

240
00:12:55,880 --> 00:13:01,400
Speaker 2: dead body, for example, other than I loved one traumatized.

241
00:13:02,720 --> 00:13:05,520
Speaker 2: The best way I can say it is that you

242
00:13:05,679 --> 00:13:08,280
Speaker 2: still do an apprenticeship as such, so you still do

243
00:13:08,400 --> 00:13:10,480
Speaker 2: you do your degree, and then you work with a mentor.

244
00:13:10,840 --> 00:13:14,480
Speaker 1: Right, so you're mentored, they allocate you somebody yes, or

245
00:13:14,520 --> 00:13:16,600
Speaker 1: somebody gets allocated to you.

246
00:13:17,280 --> 00:13:21,160
Speaker 2: Allocates just rosted. And then that mentor is the one

247
00:13:21,200 --> 00:13:24,760
Speaker 2: that's really you're looking for for some leadership from them

248
00:13:24,800 --> 00:13:28,760
Speaker 2: and to support you through the process. The first time

249
00:13:28,800 --> 00:13:31,760
Speaker 2: I saw a dead body, I was walking in. The

250
00:13:31,840 --> 00:13:35,560
Speaker 2: patient was pretty much like he'd been then dead for

251
00:13:35,600 --> 00:13:40,360
Speaker 2: about two weeks, so from a clinical perspective, from paramedic perspective,

252
00:13:40,360 --> 00:13:43,080
Speaker 2: there's nothing to do. So it's like a to put

253
00:13:43,080 --> 00:13:45,079
Speaker 2: this down. But it's an easy job for us. It's

254
00:13:45,120 --> 00:13:48,040
Speaker 2: just a good paperwork and off we got. But when

255
00:13:48,040 --> 00:13:50,600
Speaker 2: you walk in, you know this person's lying on like

256
00:13:50,640 --> 00:13:53,160
Speaker 2: pretty much a mountain of empty beer bottles. I'll never

257
00:13:53,160 --> 00:13:57,679
Speaker 2: forget it. He bloated that he was alone, and you

258
00:13:57,760 --> 00:14:01,719
Speaker 2: know the neighbors smelt him and then called the amus.

259
00:14:02,200 --> 00:14:04,000
Speaker 1: No one you get as strong, there's a strong spell

260
00:14:04,120 --> 00:14:05,160
Speaker 1: is out for a period of time.

261
00:14:05,280 --> 00:14:06,559
Speaker 2: After a period of time, yeah.

262
00:14:06,480 --> 00:14:07,440
Speaker 1: Is that like rotting?

263
00:14:07,760 --> 00:14:10,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, they get bloated and they get like.

264
00:14:10,040 --> 00:14:13,920
Speaker 1: Gaseous, right, dreadful thought.

265
00:14:14,360 --> 00:14:18,760
Speaker 2: Yeah. I've had ones where you like, very old and

266
00:14:19,400 --> 00:14:23,520
Speaker 2: where it's like the the maggots have turned into flies,

267
00:14:23,560 --> 00:14:24,680
Speaker 2: and then the flies have died.

268
00:14:24,920 --> 00:14:27,320
Speaker 1: I said, the person be dead there for that that

269
00:14:27,440 --> 00:14:31,520
Speaker 1: the fliers gone and dropped their lava in there. The

270
00:14:31,600 --> 00:14:34,960
Speaker 1: lavas turned into maggots, and the maggots have evolved into

271
00:14:35,000 --> 00:14:35,400
Speaker 1: a fly.

272
00:14:35,880 --> 00:14:36,800
Speaker 2: And then the flies died.

273
00:14:37,040 --> 00:14:37,320
Speaker 1: Wow.

274
00:14:37,400 --> 00:14:40,280
Speaker 2: And I remember walking in just like little black dots

275
00:14:40,280 --> 00:14:43,480
Speaker 2: on the floor everywhere, scattered, like what the hell is that?

276
00:14:43,680 --> 00:14:45,280
Speaker 2: And I looked in and I'm like, oh, it's flies,

277
00:14:45,520 --> 00:14:48,200
Speaker 2: dead flies, dead flies. And then you saw this body,

278
00:14:48,240 --> 00:14:49,400
Speaker 2: It's like, oh wow.

279
00:14:49,440 --> 00:14:52,320
Speaker 1: Is it an old person or a young older middle aged?

280
00:14:52,600 --> 00:14:56,080
Speaker 2: Yeah? And you know you can talk about loneliness. You know,

281
00:14:56,160 --> 00:15:00,400
Speaker 2: loneliness kills because this person's completely alone and no one

282
00:15:00,440 --> 00:15:01,960
Speaker 2: even knew that he was dead.

283
00:15:02,440 --> 00:15:04,320
Speaker 1: How was it that you did get called or the

284
00:15:04,320 --> 00:15:05,200
Speaker 1: ambulance got called?

285
00:15:05,280 --> 00:15:08,080
Speaker 2: Is it somebody like it's usually something like that it's

286
00:15:08,160 --> 00:15:10,760
Speaker 2: usually a third party, concerned family member, haven't heard from

287
00:15:10,840 --> 00:15:12,440
Speaker 2: him for a couple of weeks. Can you go check?

288
00:15:13,120 --> 00:15:15,840
Speaker 1: Do you just fall apart if you move it?

289
00:15:15,880 --> 00:15:19,520
Speaker 2: No, it's usually stiff initially. Yeah, get what's called rigan mortis.

290
00:15:19,760 --> 00:15:23,080
Speaker 2: So you get stiffness, you get lividity, which is like

291
00:15:24,360 --> 00:15:27,760
Speaker 2: blood pooling because gravity will push the blood down, so

292
00:15:27,800 --> 00:15:29,680
Speaker 2: then you get pooling of blood. So you get like

293
00:15:29,680 --> 00:15:31,480
Speaker 2: this lividity of this blood in the skin.

294
00:15:31,880 --> 00:15:34,520
Speaker 1: It's in the skins, not around the floor or something

295
00:15:34,840 --> 00:15:37,360
Speaker 1: in the skin, so that the skin actually contains everything

296
00:15:37,400 --> 00:15:41,040
Speaker 1: for you, but the body doesn't. Sort of after a

297
00:15:41,040 --> 00:15:43,840
Speaker 1: certain period, does it start to sort of dismember itself,

298
00:15:43,920 --> 00:15:45,200
Speaker 1: like fall apart so to speak.

299
00:15:46,120 --> 00:15:50,200
Speaker 2: No, we well, typically like that the poor policemen have

300
00:15:50,280 --> 00:15:52,880
Speaker 2: to come or the undertaker has to come right and

301
00:15:52,880 --> 00:15:56,680
Speaker 2: collect the body. So we typically we just check obvious death.

302
00:15:56,880 --> 00:15:58,600
Speaker 2: We don't really move the body.

303
00:15:58,640 --> 00:16:01,040
Speaker 1: Oh right, So you because there's nothing you can do.

304
00:16:01,040 --> 00:16:04,480
Speaker 2: Nothing we can do. Yeah, you know it sounds unempathetic,

305
00:16:04,560 --> 00:16:06,360
Speaker 2: but we treat the living, not the dead. Yeah.

306
00:16:06,440 --> 00:16:09,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, So if it's something like like that bad, you

307
00:16:10,040 --> 00:16:11,600
Speaker 1: don't pick it up and put in a bag.

308
00:16:11,640 --> 00:16:15,360
Speaker 2: And no, there's some circumstances, you might when like I've

309
00:16:15,360 --> 00:16:18,160
Speaker 2: done it, when I've worked in really remote communities and

310
00:16:18,200 --> 00:16:21,480
Speaker 2: there is no one else, so we will transport a body.

311
00:16:22,120 --> 00:16:25,480
Speaker 2: But it's quite rare that we actually put people in

312
00:16:25,480 --> 00:16:28,200
Speaker 2: body bags. Most stations don't carry bodybags.

313
00:16:28,280 --> 00:16:31,480
Speaker 1: How old you when you first started on the tools?

314
00:16:31,840 --> 00:16:35,080
Speaker 2: I was young. No, my first placement I was nineteen.

315
00:16:35,920 --> 00:16:37,600
Speaker 1: And did you finish a course at that stage?

316
00:16:38,200 --> 00:16:40,240
Speaker 2: I was a student. So we did some like placement

317
00:16:40,760 --> 00:16:43,240
Speaker 2: in our first year where you're actually third on the truck,

318
00:16:43,280 --> 00:16:47,560
Speaker 2: so you're basically an observer, right, you'll go along and

319
00:16:47,600 --> 00:16:50,200
Speaker 2: as an observer. Yeah, I think it was nineteen or

320
00:16:50,200 --> 00:16:54,840
Speaker 2: twenty and then I qualified and I was twenty one.

321
00:16:55,360 --> 00:16:59,720
Speaker 1: And then when you're over a period of years obviously,

322
00:16:59,720 --> 00:17:03,440
Speaker 1: but I would imagine for me anyway, I don't know,

323
00:17:04,000 --> 00:17:05,720
Speaker 1: just imagine because I've never done it. But one of

324
00:17:05,720 --> 00:17:07,399
Speaker 1: the most confronting things would be for me would be

325
00:17:07,400 --> 00:17:11,760
Speaker 1: seeing kids. But what are the really confronting things that

326
00:17:11,800 --> 00:17:12,880
Speaker 1: you had to deal with.

327
00:17:15,119 --> 00:17:19,160
Speaker 2: Well, there's confronting I think dead children, of course, there's

328
00:17:19,359 --> 00:17:21,000
Speaker 2: I can you know the first time I ever went

329
00:17:21,040 --> 00:17:22,960
Speaker 2: to a dead child, I was actually in a remote

330
00:17:22,960 --> 00:17:27,160
Speaker 2: community working by myself. It was a three year old.

331
00:17:27,680 --> 00:17:28,720
Speaker 2: It was on the side of the road, but it

332
00:17:28,720 --> 00:17:31,520
Speaker 2: actually wasn't a car accident. They went into had a

333
00:17:31,520 --> 00:17:35,240
Speaker 2: medical condition, went into cardiac arrests. Heart stopped. I arrived

334
00:17:35,280 --> 00:17:37,960
Speaker 2: start doing CPR. You know, I'm hight and I'm stressed,

335
00:17:38,600 --> 00:17:41,920
Speaker 2: very I was pretty much became overwhelmed at this, working

336
00:17:41,920 --> 00:17:44,840
Speaker 2: by myself, first child, and you had, you know, in

337
00:17:44,880 --> 00:17:48,160
Speaker 2: the background, you've got parents screaming like save him, save him,

338
00:17:48,160 --> 00:17:50,680
Speaker 2: bring him back to life, please do something. And I'll

339
00:17:50,680 --> 00:17:53,320
Speaker 2: never forget that case because the father. It was along

340
00:17:53,600 --> 00:17:55,840
Speaker 2: out western Queensland, so you had like a coal train

341
00:17:56,640 --> 00:17:58,520
Speaker 2: and there was a train next to it, and the

342
00:17:58,560 --> 00:18:00,960
Speaker 2: father ran up on the railway line trying to commit

343
00:18:00,960 --> 00:18:06,080
Speaker 2: so a soor whilst I'm trying to perform CPR. You know,

344
00:18:06,160 --> 00:18:09,520
Speaker 2: we the best survival of any sort of cardiac arrest

345
00:18:09,560 --> 00:18:12,840
Speaker 2: is when you can shock them with the defibierator. Unfortunately,

346
00:18:12,920 --> 00:18:14,960
Speaker 2: this child had a a sisty, which is like a

347
00:18:14,960 --> 00:18:18,800
Speaker 2: flat line, so the shocking doesn't work. And I remember

348
00:18:18,840 --> 00:18:21,159
Speaker 2: when I was worried about this father and I was

349
00:18:21,160 --> 00:18:23,000
Speaker 2: trying to get him back down. I had to get

350
00:18:23,000 --> 00:18:25,159
Speaker 2: the police to actually arrest him, which was, you know,

351
00:18:25,200 --> 00:18:28,080
Speaker 2: a horrible decision, but the right thing to do at

352
00:18:28,080 --> 00:18:31,280
Speaker 2: the time. But when I looked at the machine, I

353
00:18:31,280 --> 00:18:34,240
Speaker 2: thought I saw a rhythm, and I'm like, Okay, let's go.

354
00:18:34,400 --> 00:18:37,520
Speaker 2: This is great. Let's shock the patient. Shocked him, I'm

355
00:18:37,640 --> 00:18:40,800
Speaker 2: starting to get a bit of hope built up. But yeah,

356
00:18:40,880 --> 00:18:43,040
Speaker 2: unfortunately that didn't work, and we worked on the trail

357
00:18:43,080 --> 00:18:45,520
Speaker 2: for about forty minutes and then had to call life extinct.

358
00:18:46,080 --> 00:18:48,000
Speaker 2: But I don't forget. I got back to the station,

359
00:18:48,560 --> 00:18:53,040
Speaker 2: printed the the ECG the rhythm, and I realized that

360
00:18:53,040 --> 00:18:56,919
Speaker 2: I made a mistake. I actually it wasn't a shockable rhythm.

361
00:18:57,080 --> 00:19:00,000
Speaker 2: It was CPR. So when you do CPR, it creates

362
00:19:00,080 --> 00:19:02,720
Speaker 2: a way for and because I was so stressed and

363
00:19:02,760 --> 00:19:06,200
Speaker 2: overwhelmed with that situation, I didn't make a very good

364
00:19:06,200 --> 00:19:09,120
Speaker 2: decision and I ended up shocking the It doesn't cause

365
00:19:09,160 --> 00:19:12,879
Speaker 2: any harm, it's basically shocking a dead heart anyway, but

366
00:19:12,960 --> 00:19:15,879
Speaker 2: it's still it was a mistake, and that's the first real.

367
00:19:16,119 --> 00:19:19,080
Speaker 1: Mistake, a mistake of interpretation, not not necessarily.

368
00:19:19,200 --> 00:19:21,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, it wouldn't have changed the outcome, yeah, but it

369
00:19:21,880 --> 00:19:24,240
Speaker 2: was a good learning for me on this path that

370
00:19:24,320 --> 00:19:27,120
Speaker 2: I am now. It was like how I became overwhelmed

371
00:19:27,119 --> 00:19:29,720
Speaker 2: because of the stress of the situation. Because the task

372
00:19:29,760 --> 00:19:33,600
Speaker 2: itself of doing CPR I could teach.

373
00:19:33,440 --> 00:19:35,399
Speaker 1: You on tenute. Well I did it. It's sort of

374
00:19:35,480 --> 00:19:38,080
Speaker 1: I probably can't really do it, but I recall it

375
00:19:38,119 --> 00:19:39,240
Speaker 1: was fairly mechanical.

376
00:19:39,560 --> 00:19:43,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's easy, like the skill basic, the task easy,

377
00:19:43,600 --> 00:19:46,000
Speaker 2: your follow a system, off you go. It's like, so

378
00:19:46,200 --> 00:19:48,320
Speaker 2: it wasn't because the task was hard or the skill

379
00:19:48,400 --> 00:19:51,280
Speaker 2: was difficult. It was just that I became overwhelmed from

380
00:19:51,320 --> 00:19:54,280
Speaker 2: the pressure of the moment that caused a mistake. So

381
00:19:54,320 --> 00:19:56,760
Speaker 2: then that's why it sort of maybe you start thinking

382
00:19:56,760 --> 00:19:58,920
Speaker 2: about how can I clear my mind so I can

383
00:19:58,960 --> 00:20:01,760
Speaker 2: make better decisions because it wasn't that I didn't have

384
00:20:01,760 --> 00:20:04,680
Speaker 2: the knowledge or information, it was the situation and how

385
00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:05,520
Speaker 2: I interpreted it.

386
00:20:05,800 --> 00:20:08,399
Speaker 1: That's interesting. It's sort of like the responsibility that's on

387
00:20:08,440 --> 00:20:12,520
Speaker 1: your shoulders that can sort of overwhelm. You're there to

388
00:20:13,720 --> 00:20:16,600
Speaker 1: You're there to sort of deploy a skill and it's

389
00:20:16,720 --> 00:20:20,040
Speaker 1: sort of not your responsibility. Is that would that be right?

390
00:20:21,119 --> 00:20:23,359
Speaker 2: Responsibility gives you resilience.

391
00:20:24,000 --> 00:20:27,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, that's interesting. Yeah, so you don't sort of

392
00:20:27,119 --> 00:20:34,080
Speaker 1: try and divorce yourself from the situation. My cousins. And

393
00:20:34,119 --> 00:20:35,800
Speaker 1: I was only talking him yesterday about this, I believe

394
00:20:35,800 --> 00:20:39,200
Speaker 1: it or not. He's a head of ice ice intensive

395
00:20:39,200 --> 00:20:41,520
Speaker 1: care unit for the PARAMIT for the embOS here in

396
00:20:41,560 --> 00:20:44,560
Speaker 1: New South Wales, and he's telling me that he's seen

397
00:20:44,960 --> 00:20:47,520
Speaker 1: he's much older, but he said he's seen so many

398
00:20:47,560 --> 00:20:52,800
Speaker 1: of these things, terrible things, that he's sort of these days.

399
00:20:52,960 --> 00:20:57,439
Speaker 1: It doesn't really affect him anymore, unfortunately, he said to me,

400
00:20:57,440 --> 00:20:59,880
Speaker 1: because I've seen so many and.

401
00:20:59,880 --> 00:21:01,520
Speaker 2: I sort of normalized.

402
00:21:01,680 --> 00:21:03,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, it sort of becomes normalized. And I thought to myself,

403
00:21:04,040 --> 00:21:05,840
Speaker 1: is that because I knew I was talking you, I

404
00:21:05,880 --> 00:21:07,920
Speaker 1: thought to myself about you? I thought, is that? Does

405
00:21:07,920 --> 00:21:11,119
Speaker 1: that mean you sort of can divorce yourself? Not divorce

406
00:21:11,119 --> 00:21:13,280
Speaker 1: yourself is sort of draw a line in the sense

407
00:21:13,320 --> 00:21:17,200
Speaker 1: say look, I'm over here, the individual's over there. This way,

408
00:21:17,440 --> 00:21:20,919
Speaker 1: I'm safer over here. It's sort of like an emotional

409
00:21:23,840 --> 00:21:27,639
Speaker 1: an emotional strategy which might be knowingly or even unknowingly

410
00:21:27,680 --> 00:21:30,679
Speaker 1: you're doing it, but it's much more comfortable to the

411
00:21:30,680 --> 00:21:33,400
Speaker 1: on other sideline. Is that a fair thing to say?

412
00:21:33,560 --> 00:21:37,560
Speaker 2: It is? But it's more you're an acceptance of reality,

413
00:21:38,080 --> 00:21:41,719
Speaker 2: so you accept that life is harsh. Yeah, happened. And

414
00:21:41,760 --> 00:21:44,359
Speaker 2: then because the risk of doing that is also that

415
00:21:44,520 --> 00:21:47,640
Speaker 2: your patient care will you care for the patient will

416
00:21:47,640 --> 00:21:51,359
Speaker 2: diminish because a key to paramedicine is having empathy. And

417
00:21:51,400 --> 00:21:53,680
Speaker 2: the thing about empathy is that you need to walk

418
00:21:53,720 --> 00:21:57,679
Speaker 2: in their shoes. Yeah, but I think we have a

419
00:21:57,720 --> 00:22:02,280
Speaker 2: really good understanding of when empathy is required, because you know,

420
00:22:02,359 --> 00:22:05,439
Speaker 2: my wife would say I'm unempathetic, but actually, when you

421
00:22:05,480 --> 00:22:08,080
Speaker 2: do any sort of personality test, I have a lot

422
00:22:08,080 --> 00:22:11,080
Speaker 2: of empathy. But it's only when I think it's required.

423
00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:14,560
Speaker 1: It's quite empathy when you feel like it when.

424
00:22:14,400 --> 00:22:16,840
Speaker 2: My daughter fell over and graized and I would like

425
00:22:17,320 --> 00:22:21,120
Speaker 2: get up. Yeah, yeah, it's like it's not behind your head.

426
00:22:21,200 --> 00:22:26,399
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah. Correct. Empathy is an emotional or a

427
00:22:26,520 --> 00:22:31,480
Speaker 1: virtue you can call on when necessary. So in other words,

428
00:22:31,520 --> 00:22:35,040
Speaker 1: because I think if you're like super empathetic and it's

429
00:22:35,080 --> 00:22:38,400
Speaker 1: like it's just a it's an overlay of your whole personality.

430
00:22:39,359 --> 00:22:43,240
Speaker 1: And if you were in your business, you'd be completely stuffed. Yeah,

431
00:22:43,320 --> 00:22:44,560
Speaker 1: you would be able to operate.

432
00:22:44,800 --> 00:22:47,000
Speaker 2: Because you would you would bear that, you'd take it

433
00:22:47,000 --> 00:22:48,560
Speaker 2: home and you would bear their burdens.

434
00:22:48,680 --> 00:22:52,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I know people actors can be like that.

435
00:22:53,800 --> 00:22:56,199
Speaker 1: They can be very good actors because they're quite empathetic

436
00:22:56,240 --> 00:22:59,480
Speaker 1: about the character they're playing. And when actors are sitting

437
00:22:59,560 --> 00:23:03,359
Speaker 1: there watching movie or listening to something that's maybe sad

438
00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:07,560
Speaker 1: or even exciting, they tend to take on that persona.

439
00:23:08,040 --> 00:23:10,720
Speaker 1: That's why they're good at acting, because they're not acting,

440
00:23:10,960 --> 00:23:14,679
Speaker 1: they're actually taking on the persona. And you know, I've

441
00:23:14,720 --> 00:23:17,119
Speaker 1: had some experience with those sorts of people, but it

442
00:23:17,160 --> 00:23:22,480
Speaker 1: can be quite a debilitating personality trait if you're surrounded

443
00:23:22,480 --> 00:23:25,439
Speaker 1: by lots of bad stuff or traumatic stuff.

444
00:23:25,800 --> 00:23:28,960
Speaker 2: That's why you've got to You got to talk to

445
00:23:29,000 --> 00:23:31,479
Speaker 2: someone after the fact, so you turn your you can

446
00:23:31,480 --> 00:23:34,159
Speaker 2: turn your emotions off during the incident, but then you

447
00:23:34,160 --> 00:23:35,200
Speaker 2: can turn it back on later.

448
00:23:35,680 --> 00:23:38,879
Speaker 1: And would you say, and would you say, this is

449
00:23:39,240 --> 00:23:41,280
Speaker 1: sort of the mindset of a paramedic. I mean, is

450
00:23:41,600 --> 00:23:46,320
Speaker 1: this what you want to Let's call it prosecute because

451
00:23:46,520 --> 00:23:47,919
Speaker 1: I want to talk about your book when I come

452
00:23:47,920 --> 00:23:50,480
Speaker 1: back from the break. But is that what your your

453
00:23:50,560 --> 00:23:53,080
Speaker 1: deal is? Is that the mindset of a paramedic As

454
00:23:53,119 --> 00:23:54,359
Speaker 1: far as you're concerned.

455
00:23:54,160 --> 00:23:57,320
Speaker 2: I call it it's poise. It's having poise, so it's

456
00:23:57,320 --> 00:24:01,000
Speaker 2: being able to have self assurance, composure, despite all the

457
00:24:01,040 --> 00:24:04,639
Speaker 2: stress and pressure and chaos around you. It's that person

458
00:24:04,680 --> 00:24:06,840
Speaker 2: that walks through the storm that like, I've got this,

459
00:24:06,880 --> 00:24:11,399
Speaker 2: don't worry follow me. It's that leader having poises about

460
00:24:11,600 --> 00:24:14,199
Speaker 2: being able to stay true to your values, hold fast

461
00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:17,520
Speaker 2: in those difficult times. And it's really about being true

462
00:24:17,520 --> 00:24:20,720
Speaker 2: to yourself despite those pressures and everyone's trying to tell

463
00:24:20,760 --> 00:24:24,320
Speaker 2: you to do something different. That's what a paramedic mindset is, essentially,

464
00:24:24,359 --> 00:24:27,040
Speaker 2: this idea of having poise under pressure.

465
00:24:27,119 --> 00:24:28,240
Speaker 1: I'm going to go to the break and to come

466
00:24:28,280 --> 00:24:32,879
Speaker 1: straight back. I want to talk to you about the

467
00:24:33,080 --> 00:24:37,919
Speaker 1: concept of poise and is that and how much of

468
00:24:39,240 --> 00:24:44,119
Speaker 1: how much of poise is engulfed or engulf so I

469
00:24:44,119 --> 00:24:48,480
Speaker 1: should say actual knowledge and experience and how important is

470
00:24:48,520 --> 00:24:51,639
Speaker 1: knowledge and experience in order to exercise poise. But I

471
00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:53,200
Speaker 1: go to the break and going to come straight back.

472
00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:04,480
Speaker 1: I'm Anderson. Here's the author a book called Paramedic Mindset,

473
00:25:04,640 --> 00:25:07,000
Speaker 1: which is a book he's released recently. He is a

474
00:25:07,040 --> 00:25:09,639
Speaker 1: paramedic and I've seen lots of different things over his

475
00:25:09,680 --> 00:25:14,680
Speaker 1: fourteen years of being in the industry. And Lee's just

476
00:25:14,720 --> 00:25:19,720
Speaker 1: said to me that a word that he used uses

477
00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:22,840
Speaker 1: to describe the actual mindset of a paramedic, which, by

478
00:25:22,880 --> 00:25:25,760
Speaker 1: the way, this mindset could be employed in business too.

479
00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:33,359
Speaker 1: It's not just it's not exclusive to a paramedic as such.

480
00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:35,919
Speaker 2: We're just the you know, we all have the same physiology,

481
00:25:36,000 --> 00:25:38,640
Speaker 2: same biology. Yeah, we all respond to stress exactly the same.

482
00:25:38,680 --> 00:25:42,480
Speaker 1: And the word you use is poise. I need to

483
00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:45,240
Speaker 1: open that up a bit like, because you know you've

484
00:25:45,359 --> 00:25:49,800
Speaker 1: just given me five letters. I think it is and

485
00:25:50,240 --> 00:25:55,359
Speaker 1: to describe a myriad of things depth with and probably

486
00:25:55,520 --> 00:25:57,280
Speaker 1: there's a third dimension to it, which I don't know

487
00:25:57,280 --> 00:25:59,560
Speaker 1: what the word is, but maybe just give me a

488
00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:01,560
Speaker 1: bit more explanation around this word poise.

489
00:26:02,080 --> 00:26:05,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, you're seeing when most people see a paramedic

490
00:26:05,400 --> 00:26:07,840
Speaker 2: turn up like this chaotic scene, they see someone that

491
00:26:07,880 --> 00:26:10,640
Speaker 2: get out of the car, they walk around, they grab

492
00:26:10,680 --> 00:26:13,840
Speaker 2: their bags, they're looking at the scene, they're composed that

493
00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:17,120
Speaker 2: they walk into the scene and they seem to have control.

494
00:26:17,680 --> 00:26:20,399
Speaker 1: Well, sometimes I see, I've seen it, and sometimes I

495
00:26:20,400 --> 00:26:24,159
Speaker 1: think to himself, actually, it's as a horrible thing to say,

496
00:26:24,400 --> 00:26:27,040
Speaker 1: and hopefully any paramedics of this thing do mean you

497
00:26:27,040 --> 00:26:28,680
Speaker 1: ever have to come and pick me up an ambulance.

498
00:26:28,680 --> 00:26:30,399
Speaker 1: So I didn't really mean in a bad way, but

499
00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:32,400
Speaker 1: they look like they don't give a shit. I mean

500
00:26:32,600 --> 00:26:34,639
Speaker 1: it really it looks like that. You really think, come on,

501
00:26:34,680 --> 00:26:37,200
Speaker 1: hurry up, a bit like there's someone in trouble here.

502
00:26:37,720 --> 00:26:40,200
Speaker 1: It looks a bit that way. It can in certain

503
00:26:41,280 --> 00:26:45,560
Speaker 1: it's it's nearly like they're a loofah from the situation.

504
00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:47,840
Speaker 1: And by the way, poised people can look like they're

505
00:26:47,840 --> 00:26:50,840
Speaker 1: a loof just generally, I'm not not necessarily in yours.

506
00:26:51,040 --> 00:26:53,919
Speaker 2: It might be a stressful event for you, but it

507
00:26:53,960 --> 00:26:54,800
Speaker 2: won't be for them.

508
00:26:55,240 --> 00:26:58,040
Speaker 1: But what, okay, take me through it them poise poise.

509
00:26:58,119 --> 00:27:02,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, So it really it's about out well, the mindset.

510
00:27:02,760 --> 00:27:05,480
Speaker 2: You mentioned experience, and that's very important as well, because

511
00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:07,199
Speaker 2: you know, you can buy anything in life, but you

512
00:27:07,240 --> 00:27:11,119
Speaker 2: can't buy experience. So it really starts off about having

513
00:27:12,600 --> 00:27:15,920
Speaker 2: your training and this base. So I talk about mindset

514
00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:19,679
Speaker 2: is super important, but you have to come with it.

515
00:27:19,760 --> 00:27:21,080
Speaker 2: You have to have a knowledge, you have to have

516
00:27:21,080 --> 00:27:23,200
Speaker 2: a base. You imagine, you know, middle of a crisis

517
00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:24,679
Speaker 2: and you go, oh, hang on, guys, I'm just going

518
00:27:24,760 --> 00:27:27,080
Speaker 2: to have thirty minutes of meditation now and then I'll

519
00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:30,119
Speaker 2: get involved. So it's not about that. It's actually about

520
00:27:31,119 --> 00:27:33,960
Speaker 2: being able to have poise in the moment in real

521
00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:36,480
Speaker 2: time when you're under the pump, Like right now, I

522
00:27:36,520 --> 00:27:39,480
Speaker 2: could having this conversation with you. We're being film, We've

523
00:27:39,480 --> 00:27:41,439
Speaker 2: got cameras and all that sort of thing. So I

524
00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:45,040
Speaker 2: feel like you now are having poise for this conversation

525
00:27:45,640 --> 00:27:50,080
Speaker 2: because you're performing. So it's all about all stress is

526
00:27:50,640 --> 00:27:53,480
Speaker 2: performance based. It's like goal orientated.

527
00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:56,840
Speaker 1: So I would say, I'm telling I could say to

528
00:27:56,840 --> 00:27:58,840
Speaker 1: you now as an observer of people who sit opposite

529
00:27:58,840 --> 00:28:01,640
Speaker 1: me all the time, your mouth is dry, and I

530
00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:04,400
Speaker 1: think that I know that it means you a little

531
00:28:04,440 --> 00:28:07,960
Speaker 1: bit nervous because you're not used to that camera there

532
00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:12,119
Speaker 1: that's on my left example of yeah, and you being

533
00:28:12,480 --> 00:28:15,159
Speaker 1: in the medical game, you know what that means. That

534
00:28:15,240 --> 00:28:19,320
Speaker 1: means usually means adrenaline and some other things from around

535
00:28:19,359 --> 00:28:22,159
Speaker 1: your veins as a result of fight a flight, and

536
00:28:23,160 --> 00:28:24,680
Speaker 1: one of the things happens as a mouth gets right.

537
00:28:24,720 --> 00:28:27,240
Speaker 1: And I've experienced this in the fight game, and I

538
00:28:27,320 --> 00:28:29,000
Speaker 1: used to fight. That's how I used toe it before.

539
00:28:29,359 --> 00:28:31,359
Speaker 1: When I walk in the ring, my heart to be

540
00:28:31,359 --> 00:28:33,960
Speaker 1: beating a thousand miles an hour, but I used to

541
00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:36,600
Speaker 1: have to try. And that's an interesting thing you should

542
00:28:36,640 --> 00:28:38,160
Speaker 1: say is about poicts because what I used to do

543
00:28:38,240 --> 00:28:39,800
Speaker 1: is I used to put it on a performance in

544
00:28:39,800 --> 00:28:44,600
Speaker 1: front of my opponent that I was complete control. And

545
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:46,640
Speaker 1: because I knew the ring, I knew what I had

546
00:28:46,680 --> 00:28:49,280
Speaker 1: to do. I knew that I trained for a period

547
00:28:49,280 --> 00:28:50,840
Speaker 1: of time before I jumped in the ring. I knew

548
00:28:50,840 --> 00:28:52,840
Speaker 1: exactly what was going to happen. I knew what it

549
00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:55,640
Speaker 1: felt like to get hit in the head. You know,

550
00:28:55,920 --> 00:28:57,600
Speaker 1: I shouldn't be telling you these things because you'd be

551
00:28:57,600 --> 00:28:58,960
Speaker 1: probably saying, what the hell are you to get hit

552
00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:01,160
Speaker 1: in the head for mark from a biological point of view,

553
00:29:01,360 --> 00:29:02,840
Speaker 1: But I did. But I knew what it felt like

554
00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:05,480
Speaker 1: because I'd done the work, I've done the training I

555
00:29:05,560 --> 00:29:09,880
Speaker 1: done that I had the experience many times over. So

556
00:29:10,200 --> 00:29:12,600
Speaker 1: maybe if you could put it in that context for us,

557
00:29:12,600 --> 00:29:14,120
Speaker 1: because a lot of business people would be this in

558
00:29:14,120 --> 00:29:20,520
Speaker 1: this show, that context about poison, trauma or anxiety or pressure,

559
00:29:21,120 --> 00:29:23,680
Speaker 1: whatever's causing the drama. Can you just give us a

560
00:29:23,680 --> 00:29:28,640
Speaker 1: bit of context around how you perform in these situations.

561
00:29:28,720 --> 00:29:32,479
Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, Well, that's perfect example and one of the

562
00:29:32,480 --> 00:29:35,520
Speaker 2: things that is allowing me to be here and still

563
00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:37,880
Speaker 2: talk to you and not freeze and hide away and

564
00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:39,080
Speaker 2: stumble and mix my.

565
00:29:39,040 --> 00:29:40,360
Speaker 1: Word, which does happen sometimes it.

566
00:29:41,080 --> 00:29:44,040
Speaker 2: Is because of my perception. So I see this as

567
00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:47,479
Speaker 2: an opportunity, as a challenge, rather than as a threat.

568
00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:51,560
Speaker 2: So when there's this idea of this challenge and threat perception,

569
00:29:52,640 --> 00:29:56,040
Speaker 2: well you can have both, but it's how you view

570
00:29:56,320 --> 00:29:58,600
Speaker 2: the world and your situation that you're in at the moment.

571
00:29:58,920 --> 00:30:01,360
Speaker 2: So if I see this as a challenge, it's an opportunity,

572
00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:05,440
Speaker 2: it's an opportunity to grow and learn, and I see

573
00:30:05,600 --> 00:30:08,600
Speaker 2: feel like I have the resources to overcome it, and

574
00:30:08,920 --> 00:30:11,440
Speaker 2: I'm planned for it and I'm ready for it to prepare.

575
00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:14,080
Speaker 2: Where if I saw this as a fact, I would

576
00:30:14,120 --> 00:30:18,240
Speaker 2: actually curl up. I would feel become overwhelmed. I feel

577
00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:21,040
Speaker 2: like I wouldn't have the resources to cope with this situation.

578
00:30:21,440 --> 00:30:27,920
Speaker 2: I'd stop talking, I'd freeze. And so what they found

579
00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:32,240
Speaker 2: there is what I find really interesting is that this

580
00:30:32,320 --> 00:30:35,760
Speaker 2: perception of challenging threat relates to your physiology. So you

581
00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:42,280
Speaker 2: mentioned adrenaline, know how your body responds physiology physiologically, So

582
00:30:42,320 --> 00:30:45,240
Speaker 2: you mentioned adrenaline before, So that's your sympathetic nervous system

583
00:30:45,280 --> 00:30:48,280
Speaker 2: you have your person, So synthetic parasynthetics, your rest and digest.

584
00:30:49,120 --> 00:30:51,800
Speaker 2: Your sympathetic can be broken into two and there's one

585
00:30:51,840 --> 00:30:56,240
Speaker 2: called the HPA, which is the hypothalamus pituitary adrenal axis.

586
00:30:56,160 --> 00:30:58,360
Speaker 1: And so that's when you're that's when your hypothemis is

587
00:30:58,360 --> 00:31:00,840
Speaker 1: sending a message. Told you, glam sends a message to

588
00:31:00,840 --> 00:31:02,720
Speaker 1: your adrenaline gains, which produces a trailing.

589
00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:05,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, And there's all these like little messenger mediator hormones

590
00:31:05,600 --> 00:31:08,280
Speaker 2: and stuff. And then there's another pathway called the SAM,

591
00:31:08,320 --> 00:31:13,040
Speaker 2: which is your sympathetic medullay adrenal access. And they found

592
00:31:13,120 --> 00:31:15,760
Speaker 2: that the SAM is the one where you release adrenaline

593
00:31:15,880 --> 00:31:20,840
Speaker 2: or adrenaline. It travels through your nervous system, so that's

594
00:31:20,920 --> 00:31:27,360
Speaker 2: it's lightning quick and it basically instantaneous. That's your instantaneous response.

595
00:31:27,520 --> 00:31:30,160
Speaker 2: The other one travels through your bloodstream, so it's a

596
00:31:30,200 --> 00:31:32,120
Speaker 2: little bit slower still within like a second or so,

597
00:31:32,560 --> 00:31:37,640
Speaker 2: but it travels within the bloodstream and releases cortisole, which

598
00:31:37,760 --> 00:31:41,960
Speaker 2: is the stress hormone, which is okay, but cortersole is

599
00:31:42,000 --> 00:31:45,480
Speaker 2: really important. But if you see things as a threat,

600
00:31:45,760 --> 00:31:48,680
Speaker 2: it activates your HbA system more so you actually have

601
00:31:48,760 --> 00:31:51,280
Speaker 2: more cortisole in the body. But if you see things

602
00:31:51,280 --> 00:31:53,479
Speaker 2: as a challenge, your body will relact differently and you'll

603
00:31:53,520 --> 00:31:56,760
Speaker 2: use adrenaline or adrenaline you'll respond to the challenge, and

604
00:31:56,800 --> 00:31:59,040
Speaker 2: then it will resolve the problem is when you have

605
00:31:59,160 --> 00:32:01,880
Speaker 2: overuse in you see things as a continual threat for

606
00:32:01,920 --> 00:32:04,080
Speaker 2: a long period of time, you have that high levels

607
00:32:04,160 --> 00:32:09,120
Speaker 2: of quartersole, and so the cortisole will actually constrict your

608
00:32:09,160 --> 00:32:14,200
Speaker 2: blood vessels. It decreases your cardiac outputs, the amount of

609
00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:17,160
Speaker 2: blood that's pumped through your heart, where the other system,

610
00:32:17,200 --> 00:32:19,480
Speaker 2: if you see it as a challenge, will actually dilate

611
00:32:19,480 --> 00:32:23,360
Speaker 2: your blood vessels, increase your blood flow, increase your cardiac output,

612
00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:25,840
Speaker 2: which means it will increase the blood flow to your brain.

613
00:32:26,560 --> 00:32:29,440
Speaker 2: So this simple thing of perceiving things as a challenge

614
00:32:29,480 --> 00:32:34,760
Speaker 2: or a threat has a great reaction to your body.

615
00:32:35,360 --> 00:32:37,600
Speaker 2: So by seeing things as a challenge, you'll be able

616
00:32:37,680 --> 00:32:40,080
Speaker 2: to overcome them far better than if you saw it

617
00:32:40,080 --> 00:32:40,640
Speaker 2: as a threat.

618
00:32:40,800 --> 00:32:45,200
Speaker 1: It's interesting. The biology for me is very interesting, particularly

619
00:32:45,200 --> 00:32:49,960
Speaker 1: when you explain it that way, because as I understand it,

620
00:32:50,600 --> 00:32:53,800
Speaker 1: and you're saying, you sort of manipulate which one of

621
00:32:53,800 --> 00:32:59,440
Speaker 1: the reactions that you want to have being the better

622
00:33:00,080 --> 00:33:02,280
Speaker 1: that a reaction which is going to equip you better

623
00:33:02,280 --> 00:33:05,480
Speaker 1: because something as I understand, something like cortersole also shuts

624
00:33:05,520 --> 00:33:08,760
Speaker 1: down lots of systems, and it's such sandy digestive systems,

625
00:33:08,800 --> 00:33:13,400
Speaker 1: so shuts down your reproductive and sexuality, et ceter and

626
00:33:13,480 --> 00:33:15,800
Speaker 1: other words almost have a have a root when they've

627
00:33:15,800 --> 00:33:19,200
Speaker 1: got a major drama on. It also shuts down your

628
00:33:19,240 --> 00:33:22,760
Speaker 1: ability to make proper judgments as well, so your prefront

629
00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:26,920
Speaker 1: of cortex gets closed down because it's really just mate,

630
00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:29,320
Speaker 1: I'm either going to jump all over you and try

631
00:33:29,320 --> 00:33:30,680
Speaker 1: and beat you to death or I'm going to get

632
00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:31,920
Speaker 1: the fuck out of you. I'm going to get out

633
00:33:31,920 --> 00:33:34,560
Speaker 1: of it really fast. So and if you have to

634
00:33:34,640 --> 00:33:39,920
Speaker 1: make some if you have to speak in these situations,

635
00:33:40,320 --> 00:33:45,240
Speaker 1: let's take it away from paramedic industry BDA like, well, actually, paramedic,

636
00:33:45,320 --> 00:33:46,680
Speaker 1: you have to make some calls. You have to say,

637
00:33:46,840 --> 00:33:49,960
Speaker 1: hang on this person here if I'm if you're overwhelmed

638
00:33:49,960 --> 00:33:52,840
Speaker 1: and your cortisole has gone mental, but you have to say, well,

639
00:33:52,880 --> 00:33:55,080
Speaker 1: hang on, I've got to diagnose this problem and I've

640
00:33:55,080 --> 00:33:56,560
Speaker 1: got to fix this problem because I've got to pick

641
00:33:56,600 --> 00:33:58,520
Speaker 1: that chemical from there and an injective or whatever I've

642
00:33:58,520 --> 00:34:00,840
Speaker 1: got to do. Same as if your business you know

643
00:34:01,560 --> 00:34:05,000
Speaker 1: it's probably virtually impossible to do that whilst you're going

644
00:34:05,000 --> 00:34:08,160
Speaker 1: down that quartisol channel. You really want the other one

645
00:34:08,200 --> 00:34:10,960
Speaker 1: where everything's dilated and you're getting lots of blood go

646
00:34:11,040 --> 00:34:15,080
Speaker 1: through your brain and you can make good decisions and decisions.

647
00:34:15,080 --> 00:34:18,080
Speaker 2: That's what poises is about. Making that good decision.

648
00:34:18,160 --> 00:34:22,240
Speaker 1: I like the way you sort of you've described poise,

649
00:34:24,120 --> 00:34:26,400
Speaker 1: not in a narrative. It is a narrative, but not

650
00:34:26,480 --> 00:34:29,960
Speaker 1: in a descriptive narrative way like a writer would do

651
00:34:30,080 --> 00:34:33,640
Speaker 1: or you know, someone writing this out would do, But

652
00:34:33,680 --> 00:34:35,560
Speaker 1: you've done it in a way that is sort of

653
00:34:35,840 --> 00:34:38,279
Speaker 1: very logical, at least for me, very logical in a

654
00:34:38,320 --> 00:34:44,239
Speaker 1: physiological way. Poise is about is a physiological outcome in

655
00:34:44,320 --> 00:34:47,719
Speaker 1: terms of making sure you understand the two responses and

656
00:34:47,840 --> 00:34:50,680
Speaker 1: responses in this case and choosing the right response.

657
00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:53,160
Speaker 2: You can go back to the before the break. I've

658
00:34:53,160 --> 00:34:57,200
Speaker 2: mentioned the child that was a threat perception totally and

659
00:34:57,239 --> 00:34:59,319
Speaker 2: I made a poor decision. If I saw that as

660
00:34:59,360 --> 00:35:00,840
Speaker 2: a challenge, I would that made that decision.

661
00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:03,359
Speaker 1: So how do you get your head around the two?

662
00:35:03,719 --> 00:35:08,600
Speaker 1: So how do you train yourself to have make the

663
00:35:08,680 --> 00:35:09,200
Speaker 1: right call.

664
00:35:10,360 --> 00:35:13,560
Speaker 2: So it's about clearing up that pre funnel cortex what

665
00:35:13,600 --> 00:35:16,280
Speaker 2: we like to call the cognitive bandwidth. It's the ram

666
00:35:16,320 --> 00:35:19,120
Speaker 2: of your brain, the processing center. So you basically have

667
00:35:19,200 --> 00:35:21,319
Speaker 2: you know, the back of the brain is your hard drive,

668
00:35:21,400 --> 00:35:24,120
Speaker 2: your storage unit, so you have a bunch of filing cabinets.

669
00:35:24,120 --> 00:35:27,080
Speaker 2: That's where all your knowledge and everything's kept. It's like

670
00:35:27,120 --> 00:35:28,799
Speaker 2: when you go into a job interview. You know, it's

671
00:35:28,800 --> 00:35:30,680
Speaker 2: like you've got all the knowledge, you got all the experience.

672
00:35:30,680 --> 00:35:32,640
Speaker 2: You walk in. We've all been there. You walk in,

673
00:35:32,920 --> 00:35:38,080
Speaker 2: you forget everything because you ram, your cognitive bandwidth is

674
00:35:38,080 --> 00:35:41,560
Speaker 2: filled up with fear, doubt, anxiety, stress, and then you

675
00:35:41,600 --> 00:35:43,360
Speaker 2: walk out the moment you walk out of an interview,

676
00:35:43,400 --> 00:35:45,319
Speaker 2: Oh I didn't say this. I should have said this.

677
00:35:45,480 --> 00:35:47,400
Speaker 2: I should have said this. Oh you idiot. It's like

678
00:35:47,560 --> 00:35:51,520
Speaker 2: so obvious, but you completely forgot in the moment. And

679
00:35:51,560 --> 00:35:55,640
Speaker 2: that's because you weren't able to access the hard drive

680
00:35:55,800 --> 00:35:58,040
Speaker 2: and pull out the information and the knowledge and skills

681
00:35:58,080 --> 00:36:01,000
Speaker 2: that you have and brought it to your prefrontal cortex

682
00:36:01,120 --> 00:36:03,640
Speaker 2: to process it and use it. They say, there's only

683
00:36:03,719 --> 00:36:06,839
Speaker 2: a maximum about seven items that you can have in

684
00:36:06,840 --> 00:36:09,360
Speaker 2: that processing in the front and that's max right, Like

685
00:36:09,440 --> 00:36:13,720
Speaker 2: it's probably like me two or three. So it's about

686
00:36:14,120 --> 00:36:17,840
Speaker 2: clearing up that cognitive reducing that coldnative bandwidth so you

687
00:36:17,880 --> 00:36:20,520
Speaker 2: can access the knowledge and skills you have. And the

688
00:36:20,560 --> 00:36:22,919
Speaker 2: best way to do that you can there's what called

689
00:36:22,960 --> 00:36:27,040
Speaker 2: psychological skills. These are little tricks that you can use

690
00:36:27,480 --> 00:36:30,759
Speaker 2: to bring your heart rate down. You know, Andrew human

691
00:36:30,920 --> 00:36:34,439
Speaker 2: main famous about the physiological sigh. So it's the two

692
00:36:34,520 --> 00:36:35,840
Speaker 2: inhales to one exhale.

693
00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:39,640
Speaker 1: And by the way, it's funny, you know my jiu

694
00:36:39,719 --> 00:36:43,719
Speaker 1: jitsu coach says to me sometimes, he said, when I'm

695
00:36:43,760 --> 00:36:46,680
Speaker 1: getting out of breath and I'm feeling stressed, like someone's

696
00:36:46,719 --> 00:36:51,279
Speaker 1: got me in a bad position where I'm vulnerable, he said,

697
00:36:51,600 --> 00:36:54,759
Speaker 1: just breathe like a baby. He said, so baby when

698
00:36:54,760 --> 00:36:58,839
Speaker 1: we're little kids, when they're crying there, you know, a baby,

699
00:36:59,000 --> 00:37:03,480
Speaker 1: little kids, He said, breathe like that. And he said

700
00:37:03,520 --> 00:37:07,040
Speaker 1: that actually does something in a physiological sense. He's not

701
00:37:07,080 --> 00:37:09,319
Speaker 1: a scientist, but he said, there's good when you're in

702
00:37:09,320 --> 00:37:12,239
Speaker 1: the jiu jitsu position where you're a threat, where you're

703
00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:13,480
Speaker 1: under threat and.

704
00:37:13,560 --> 00:37:17,600
Speaker 2: You're doing stuff naturally. Yeah, we sigh every about five minutes,

705
00:37:18,520 --> 00:37:21,600
Speaker 2: but it's about bringing it under conscious control. So we're

706
00:37:21,680 --> 00:37:24,600
Speaker 2: using consciously doing it consciously doing it, choosing having the

707
00:37:24,600 --> 00:37:28,360
Speaker 2: awareness to do it. Yeah, so they're sighing. There's box breathing,

708
00:37:28,360 --> 00:37:31,680
Speaker 2: which is like hold four seconds out for four seconds,

709
00:37:31,880 --> 00:37:34,399
Speaker 2: I mean sorry, in for four seconds, hold for four

710
00:37:34,440 --> 00:37:37,400
Speaker 2: seconds out for four seconds, four seconds. And it's a

711
00:37:37,440 --> 00:37:40,920
Speaker 2: box that's been around forever. It comes from the military.

712
00:37:41,280 --> 00:37:44,120
Speaker 2: There's just some breath to breathing exercises. But there's also.

713
00:37:44,160 --> 00:37:46,839
Speaker 1: Snipers do that. By the way, the US snipers before

714
00:37:46,880 --> 00:37:51,680
Speaker 1: they fire the shot, they actually calm themselves down before

715
00:37:51,719 --> 00:37:52,279
Speaker 1: they do the shot.

716
00:37:52,560 --> 00:37:53,480
Speaker 2: They'll close their eyes.

717
00:37:53,640 --> 00:37:55,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean. And by the way, there are drugs

718
00:37:55,840 --> 00:37:57,399
Speaker 1: that will do this for you too, I mean there

719
00:37:57,440 --> 00:38:00,000
Speaker 1: are you know, there are some BEATA blockers and things

720
00:38:00,040 --> 00:38:03,360
Speaker 1: so that people take. Because I remember when the very

721
00:38:03,360 --> 00:38:05,960
Speaker 1: first speech I of it makeup was just as nervous

722
00:38:05,960 --> 00:38:08,360
Speaker 1: as hell. I was much very you know, I was

723
00:38:08,560 --> 00:38:12,279
Speaker 1: twenty five years ago, and my doctor gave me a

724
00:38:12,280 --> 00:38:15,760
Speaker 1: BEATA blocker and it didn't affect my ability to think.

725
00:38:16,360 --> 00:38:18,800
Speaker 1: It just stopped slows the heart, right, it slows me,

726
00:38:19,000 --> 00:38:20,600
Speaker 1: so my heart rate down, which because my heart rates

727
00:38:20,600 --> 00:38:22,200
Speaker 1: saw down, all the other stuff sort of slowed down.

728
00:38:22,200 --> 00:38:25,200
Speaker 1: Because these all things are all connected. Now your heart starts

729
00:38:25,239 --> 00:38:27,640
Speaker 1: going with there's another thing sensors this and then sends

730
00:38:27,640 --> 00:38:30,480
Speaker 1: another message, sends some other sort of chemical through your system,

731
00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:32,239
Speaker 1: and next thing you know, you're in the fire or

732
00:38:32,280 --> 00:38:34,600
Speaker 1: flight mode and you forget everything you' about to say.

733
00:38:34,760 --> 00:38:37,839
Speaker 2: That's why breathing is so powerful because you can you know,

734
00:38:37,840 --> 00:38:39,879
Speaker 2: people think their heart rate, they can't control their heart rate.

735
00:38:39,920 --> 00:38:44,840
Speaker 2: It's got automaticity, so it's just controlled naturally. But you

736
00:38:44,880 --> 00:38:47,240
Speaker 2: can actually control your heart rate, and that's through breathing

737
00:38:47,360 --> 00:38:49,959
Speaker 2: by activating. When you breathe, you activate your vagus nerve,

738
00:38:50,320 --> 00:38:52,520
Speaker 2: which stimulates the sign of atual note on top of

739
00:38:52,520 --> 00:38:55,120
Speaker 2: your heart. It controls you beat and it actually slows

740
00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:57,640
Speaker 2: your heart rate down. So if you're very stressed and

741
00:38:57,920 --> 00:39:01,080
Speaker 2: even after running or something, try do this three times

742
00:39:01,200 --> 00:39:02,799
Speaker 2: and what's your heart rate come down?

743
00:39:03,239 --> 00:39:06,360
Speaker 1: My dog doesn't. It's it's a silly thing. But my

744
00:39:06,440 --> 00:39:09,080
Speaker 1: dog and I think, you know, because dogs are always chilled.

745
00:39:10,520 --> 00:39:12,160
Speaker 1: It's like it's a dog's I feel like, you know,

746
00:39:12,239 --> 00:39:13,160
Speaker 1: like how good would it be?

747
00:39:13,160 --> 00:39:13,319
Speaker 2: Dog?

748
00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:14,799
Speaker 1: You just don't give a shit as long as they're fair.

749
00:39:14,880 --> 00:39:18,799
Speaker 1: They for if you don't see, they don't care. And

750
00:39:18,840 --> 00:39:21,400
Speaker 1: then they come to bed and she gets on the

751
00:39:21,440 --> 00:39:24,000
Speaker 1: German ship. But she gets on the lady the phone

752
00:39:24,040 --> 00:39:26,760
Speaker 1: thinks she sleeps on and before she goes to sleep,

753
00:39:27,200 --> 00:39:29,759
Speaker 1: And I've noticed this like a lot lately. She goes

754
00:39:31,640 --> 00:39:35,600
Speaker 1: not through her mouth and through a nose and and

755
00:39:35,640 --> 00:39:38,160
Speaker 1: then it just goes to sleep. It just has a

756
00:39:38,200 --> 00:39:43,839
Speaker 1: deep sigh and looks like go sleep and then sleep sleep,

757
00:39:44,280 --> 00:39:45,120
Speaker 1: sleeps my baby the.

758
00:39:45,120 --> 00:39:48,440
Speaker 2: Whole night through parasympathetic, not the rest and digest.

759
00:39:48,560 --> 00:39:51,000
Speaker 1: And that's obviously an instinctive thing the dog does, because

760
00:39:51,040 --> 00:39:54,040
Speaker 1: the dog doesn't know about that. So your book, talk

761
00:39:54,040 --> 00:39:57,680
Speaker 1: me about the book then, So your book, the Paramedic

762
00:39:57,760 --> 00:40:01,160
Speaker 1: Mindset is a book about just take through. Like, what's

763
00:40:01,200 --> 00:40:02,480
Speaker 1: it going to tell me if I buy this book?

764
00:40:02,520 --> 00:40:03,000
Speaker 1: For example?

765
00:40:03,320 --> 00:40:06,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, so it will teach you how to flourish under pressure,

766
00:40:06,840 --> 00:40:10,200
Speaker 2: how to deal with those really high pressure situations and

767
00:40:10,280 --> 00:40:14,319
Speaker 2: make really good decisions in those moments of stress. It's

768
00:40:14,320 --> 00:40:18,520
Speaker 2: about bringing it into conscious awareness so you can manipulate

769
00:40:18,719 --> 00:40:21,880
Speaker 2: your bio hack your body so you can free up

770
00:40:21,920 --> 00:40:26,120
Speaker 2: that prefrontal cortex so you can go out there and

771
00:40:26,160 --> 00:40:29,400
Speaker 2: make really good decisions in your workplace or whatever goal

772
00:40:29,480 --> 00:40:32,080
Speaker 2: orientated stress you're suffering with.

773
00:40:32,040 --> 00:40:34,480
Speaker 1: It, But it's not and You're not there talking about

774
00:40:34,760 --> 00:40:36,880
Speaker 1: what paramedics do, are you or you?

775
00:40:37,360 --> 00:40:40,920
Speaker 2: So the book is essentially just using paramedics as the

776
00:40:41,040 --> 00:40:46,080
Speaker 2: example because we deal with life threatening, stressful situations daily.

777
00:40:46,560 --> 00:40:49,359
Speaker 2: So it's a really good example to show you how

778
00:40:49,400 --> 00:40:51,680
Speaker 2: to use these things in the field. You know, the

779
00:40:51,760 --> 00:40:54,400
Speaker 2: books made up are basically two parts and ones like

780
00:40:54,680 --> 00:40:59,520
Speaker 2: experiences of cases I've been to. Every chapter has about

781
00:40:59,520 --> 00:41:03,000
Speaker 2: two jobs that I've been to. I share them some failures,

782
00:41:03,000 --> 00:41:05,400
Speaker 2: but some of my greatest successes as well, and the

783
00:41:05,440 --> 00:41:08,600
Speaker 2: other bits research based evidence, and I try and relate

784
00:41:09,120 --> 00:41:12,800
Speaker 2: the stories with the science to make it really practical

785
00:41:12,960 --> 00:41:15,120
Speaker 2: so you can actually take some lessons away from it

786
00:41:15,120 --> 00:41:17,640
Speaker 2: and apply it in your everyday life. Like public speaking,

787
00:41:17,680 --> 00:41:20,640
Speaker 2: for example, you use these things. You know, if you're

788
00:41:20,640 --> 00:41:22,800
Speaker 2: going into a board meeting about to sign a big deal,

789
00:41:23,080 --> 00:41:25,799
Speaker 2: you want to be thinking clearly, so you can use

790
00:41:25,840 --> 00:41:28,439
Speaker 2: these things so you can actually walk into that board

791
00:41:28,520 --> 00:41:30,400
Speaker 2: room full of confidence and boys.

792
00:41:30,520 --> 00:41:32,440
Speaker 1: And someone might want to or someone could be doing

793
00:41:32,440 --> 00:41:37,640
Speaker 1: a pitch to an investor, and we have these we have.

794
00:41:37,760 --> 00:41:40,680
Speaker 1: This stuff is on television, like you know, these people

795
00:41:40,680 --> 00:41:43,640
Speaker 1: get up there and they pitched to you know, either

796
00:41:43,640 --> 00:41:47,360
Speaker 1: an audience or a panel of three people. For people

797
00:41:47,719 --> 00:41:49,680
Speaker 1: trying to get money out of something they spent the

798
00:41:49,680 --> 00:41:52,560
Speaker 1: whole life on. So it is vitally important to them

799
00:41:52,600 --> 00:41:55,080
Speaker 1: to try and to raise dough and they're pitching it

800
00:41:55,160 --> 00:41:57,840
Speaker 1: and the last thing they want to do is be

801
00:41:57,920 --> 00:41:59,280
Speaker 1: made a fool of. So there's a lot of pressure

802
00:41:59,320 --> 00:42:03,239
Speaker 1: on these individuals, and this sort of allows you to

803
00:42:03,239 --> 00:42:05,480
Speaker 1: sort of take control of your situation. I mean, I

804
00:42:05,520 --> 00:42:07,480
Speaker 1: remember the first time I was on live TV. In fact,

805
00:42:07,520 --> 00:42:09,040
Speaker 1: the first tie was on live radio, which you know

806
00:42:09,040 --> 00:42:11,200
Speaker 1: you wouldn't think you should worry about, but the first

807
00:42:11,239 --> 00:42:14,200
Speaker 1: tie was. I was so nervous because it was a

808
00:42:14,239 --> 00:42:18,080
Speaker 1: live interview and I nearly felt like canceling at the

809
00:42:18,160 --> 00:42:20,680
Speaker 1: last minute because I know you can't do this now

810
00:42:21,239 --> 00:42:23,600
Speaker 1: it's his second nature because I'm so I'm familiar with

811
00:42:23,680 --> 00:42:26,279
Speaker 1: it now, I don't use any techniques like you do.

812
00:42:26,400 --> 00:42:28,960
Speaker 1: But this is books more directive for those people who

813
00:42:29,280 --> 00:42:33,160
Speaker 1: aren't used to it, who the.

814
00:42:33,160 --> 00:42:38,880
Speaker 2: Book's about performing under pressure. So it's about increasing performance. Yeah,

815
00:42:39,000 --> 00:42:42,400
Speaker 2: So I like to think it's about helping people flourish,

816
00:42:42,640 --> 00:42:45,359
Speaker 2: which I really like using that word because we live

817
00:42:45,360 --> 00:42:48,040
Speaker 2: in a world that's basically a deficit based approach. It's

818
00:42:48,080 --> 00:42:50,239
Speaker 2: like when you get sick, take these drugs, or when

819
00:42:50,239 --> 00:42:53,319
Speaker 2: you get ill, then exercise. But this is all about

820
00:42:53,360 --> 00:42:56,600
Speaker 2: having a strength based approach. It's about before you're faced

821
00:42:56,640 --> 00:43:00,120
Speaker 2: with it, you build strength, you build your muscle. When

822
00:43:00,160 --> 00:43:03,520
Speaker 2: you come up to it, it feels easy. You train

823
00:43:03,560 --> 00:43:06,680
Speaker 2: one hundred and thirty percent, so when you have to perform,

824
00:43:06,800 --> 00:43:08,560
Speaker 2: you can perform at one hundred percent with ease.

825
00:43:08,920 --> 00:43:10,960
Speaker 1: I think that's the two words I've got out of

826
00:43:11,000 --> 00:43:13,760
Speaker 1: this whole conversation, which is really important to me today

827
00:43:14,440 --> 00:43:16,600
Speaker 1: and a good reminders of me as to why I

828
00:43:16,600 --> 00:43:20,600
Speaker 1: do the way I do things today is one poise.

829
00:43:20,760 --> 00:43:25,319
Speaker 1: I really like that word. Poise is a very short word,

830
00:43:25,400 --> 00:43:30,800
Speaker 1: but it has a huge meaning in relation to challenging

831
00:43:30,880 --> 00:43:34,520
Speaker 1: situations where I get challenged. But I think ultimately the

832
00:43:34,560 --> 00:43:38,759
Speaker 1: reason for me in terms of my poise, it's about performance.

833
00:43:38,920 --> 00:43:43,719
Speaker 1: So I perform. I literally perform the whole time, and

834
00:43:44,040 --> 00:43:47,239
Speaker 1: I've just become good. I've just hone that skill, that

835
00:43:47,360 --> 00:43:50,640
Speaker 1: art of performance. And I don't mean it like an

836
00:43:50,640 --> 00:43:55,719
Speaker 1: actor performs, but I perform in my territory and that

837
00:43:55,760 --> 00:43:58,560
Speaker 1: comes from as you said earlier, but lots of experience

838
00:43:58,560 --> 00:44:01,440
Speaker 1: and lots of knowledge. What would be good if if

839
00:44:01,480 --> 00:44:03,600
Speaker 1: your book does this, and what do and what is

840
00:44:03,680 --> 00:44:07,239
Speaker 1: proposing to do is to bring forward that into and

841
00:44:07,320 --> 00:44:09,920
Speaker 1: give that skill to someone at a much earlier date

842
00:44:09,960 --> 00:44:13,480
Speaker 1: than having to spend fourteen years on the tools.

843
00:44:13,960 --> 00:44:16,200
Speaker 2: Just learning it through experience. You don't have to.

844
00:44:16,840 --> 00:44:17,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's very good.

845
00:44:17,960 --> 00:44:21,080
Speaker 2: And how much the book so retail? Thirty six months?

846
00:44:21,160 --> 00:44:26,320
Speaker 2: Winn You buy it from any bookstore? Yeah, Amazon, bigw

847
00:44:27,120 --> 00:44:29,960
Speaker 2: DIMIs wherever Panmic Mellon's a publisher.

848
00:44:30,200 --> 00:44:33,680
Speaker 1: Excellent. And hell you write the book three and a

849
00:44:33,719 --> 00:44:34,640
Speaker 1: half years wow.

850
00:44:34,880 --> 00:44:38,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, hell's the journey. You know, as a paramedic,

851
00:44:38,960 --> 00:44:43,080
Speaker 2: you're really conscious of giving bad advice. Giving bad advice

852
00:44:43,120 --> 00:44:45,920
Speaker 2: to a patient can probably kill someone.

853
00:44:46,040 --> 00:44:46,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, totally.

854
00:44:47,480 --> 00:44:50,040
Speaker 2: So I wanted to make sure the science was correct,

855
00:44:50,160 --> 00:44:52,560
Speaker 2: the evidence was correct, and to do that it was

856
00:44:52,600 --> 00:44:55,640
Speaker 2: a very long process. And then and then also having

857
00:44:55,680 --> 00:44:58,200
Speaker 2: to be vulnerable and learning how to write.

858
00:44:58,840 --> 00:45:00,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a new scale.

859
00:45:00,520 --> 00:45:00,800
Speaker 2: Yeah.

860
00:45:01,200 --> 00:45:05,920
Speaker 1: Well, Leanderson, author of the Paramedic Mindset, Thanks so much,

861
00:45:05,960 --> 00:45:08,359
Speaker 1: and I appreciate you coming in and I think it's

862
00:45:08,360 --> 00:45:09,400
Speaker 1: a great initiative.

863
00:45:10,200 --> 00:45:12,440
Speaker 2: You. Thank you so much for the platform and opportunity

864
00:45:12,440 --> 00:45:12,920
Speaker 2: to speak to you.

865
00:45:13,000 --> 00:45:13,560
Speaker 1: Most welcome.

866
00:45:31,600 --> 00:45:31,640
Speaker 2: H