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Speaker 1: Bobby Capuccio, Welcome back to the show, my friend. How

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Speaker 1: are you.

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Speaker 2: I'm doing all right. I think I feel like I

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Speaker 2: got this Princess Leia thing going on with these headsets.

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Speaker 2: I just noticed that.

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Speaker 1: You look beautiful, and you're in a new place. I

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Speaker 1: said to him, he's moved. I won't tell you what

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Speaker 1: city lives in. Well, I can probably tell them you

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Speaker 1: live in San Diego. That's not a big deal, is it,

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Speaker 1: But I said.

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Speaker 2: It's nothing to be ashamed of it.

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Speaker 1: He's recently moved houses. And I said, oh, where do

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Speaker 1: you live now? And he said, I'm not far. I

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Speaker 1: just moved across the car park to a close I'm like,

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Speaker 1: that doesn't help, which, yeah, I didn't even know which city.

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Speaker 2: So other than I'm right across the car park from

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Speaker 2: here on Hampton by the seven to eleven, I live

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Speaker 2: there now.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's hilarious.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Well, and you've got a new studio. Your studio is

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Speaker 1: very nice. And you did tell tell me in secret

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Speaker 1: that you've got fake bricks, So I won't tell anybody

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Speaker 1: what looks like real bricks behind you, but they're fake.

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Speaker 2: But it trusted you with that. Ye last time I

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Speaker 2: discussed my bricks.

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Speaker 1: With you, Hopes. Yeah, yeah, don't tell me any state

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Speaker 1: secrets because all they need to do is threat to

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Speaker 1: pull my fingernails, and I'm just coughing up everything. There's

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Speaker 1: no water boarding happening at my joint, that's for sure.

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Speaker 1: Could you imagine dealing with that? I often think about

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Speaker 1: because I watch a lot of bullshit and I listened.

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Speaker 1: Have you ever listened to The Gray Man the book series?

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Speaker 1: Now you heard of The Gray Man?

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Speaker 2: Now?

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Speaker 1: Ah? Oh god, oh if you're a I'm being very

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Speaker 1: sexist here, but it's probably more a guy thing than

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Speaker 1: a girl thing. But if you ever just want to escapism.

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Speaker 1: Although I'm sure some women listen to espionage and spy

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Speaker 1: stuff and killy stabby you know, good guys, bad guys stuff.

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Speaker 1: I'm sure some ladies do, but I've never listened to like,

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Speaker 1: in the last I don't know, thirty years, I probably

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Speaker 1: have not read a book that's been fiction. I'm always

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Speaker 1: just like you, just reading stuff that I think on

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Speaker 1: some level I'm going to learn something, but about.

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Speaker 2: I don't know.

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Speaker 1: Not that many months ago, three or four months ago,

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Speaker 1: I went, I'm going to listen to just something which

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Speaker 1: is just it's bullshit. It's not real. It's a story,

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Speaker 1: and I'm not going to listen to something to learn

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Speaker 1: to educate. I'm not going to learn about the brain,

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Speaker 1: or the mind or the And since then, I've listened

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Speaker 1: to nine books in the gray Man series, and I'm

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Speaker 1: a little bit addicted, a little bit in this character

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Speaker 1: called Court Gentry, who's the best assassin in the world.

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Speaker 1: And of course he only kills bad people. So yeah,

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Speaker 1: I reckon you should take a listen at some stage.

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Speaker 2: Well, he seems like a very likable game.

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Speaker 1: He is.

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Speaker 2: He kills a very important job. He's doing a great

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Speaker 2: job for society, kind of like that stuff. So is

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Speaker 2: it the character? Is there something specific within the play?

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Speaker 1: Oh, it's just it's the whole. Like they're really good stories.

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Speaker 1: It's really well written. You know, it's bullshit, you know,

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Speaker 1: it's fictions. So the fact that people are getting killed

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Speaker 1: left and right doesn't really matter. As my mum says,

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Speaker 1: he only kills baddies and he protects the goodies, right,

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Speaker 1: that's what mums. Everything's goodies and baddies. So it's been Yeah,

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Speaker 1: for me, who's always got my face in an actual

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Speaker 1: book or my ears in an actual book or reading

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Speaker 1: like you reading a paper or talking about the meaning

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Speaker 1: of life and going down these philosophical, psychological rabbit holes.

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Speaker 1: It's good to just get out of the rabbit hole

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Speaker 1: and do something that doesn't you know, that's just enjoyment.

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Speaker 1: And so for me, it's been probably an hour or

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Speaker 1: a day. I reckon when I'm out walking, I often

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Speaker 1: just listen to the Gray Man. So when was the

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Speaker 1: last time you read something like just a story?

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Speaker 2: Oh wow, that's very long time ago. I think it's

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Speaker 2: a blind spot of mine. I think fiction. I think

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Speaker 2: fiction is more real than real. And here's the reason

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Speaker 2: why I'll say that. So right now, Wicked has become

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Speaker 2: popular again because it was in cinema and you know,

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Speaker 2: it was it was, It was okay, I kind of

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Speaker 2: liked it. I just it's very hard to cinematically reproduce

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Speaker 2: what happens on the stage, and the book Wicked is

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Speaker 2: so different than the actual play. But when you're reading

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Speaker 2: that book, you realize that if you were reading a

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Speaker 2: nonfiction book, you would not extract from it the same

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Speaker 2: depth and lessons because all of your cognitive biases would

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Speaker 2: pop up, and all of your filters that you navigate

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Speaker 2: through life with would be ever present there, and you'd

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Speaker 2: start to edit and dissect. I agree with this. I

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Speaker 2: don't like this, Oh she's good, she's bad. But when

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Speaker 2: you're reading about a fictitious character, sure a lot of

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Speaker 2: those filters are lowered, and it's talking about very serious,

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Speaker 2: real life issues. It's talking about how we're told to

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Speaker 2: look at things as a society is not necessarily how

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Speaker 2: things are, and at your first glance you know very

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Speaker 2: little to nothing about what's actually going on in the

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Speaker 2: lives of people in the world around you. It tackles

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Speaker 2: things like fascism, fanaticism, racism, like all of the really

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Speaker 2: bad isms, and I think that you wouldn't really be

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Speaker 2: able to connect with the lessons that Gregory maguire is

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Speaker 2: trying to convey through the storyline if it was not fictitious.

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Speaker 2: I think fiction is in a lot of ways more

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Speaker 2: real than real. I mean, obviously there's not a green

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Speaker 2: woman flying around on a broomstick, but what she's dealing

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Speaker 2: with and the backdrop of that storyline and the arc

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Speaker 2: it is is just as real as anything that we

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Speaker 2: need to contend with in our lives. So I think

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Speaker 2: my lack of delving into fiction is is a blind spot.

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Speaker 2: I mean, of course, you know, my wife is former filmmaker.

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Speaker 2: We watch we watch a lot of stuff like on Netflix,

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Speaker 2: good shows, and we discuss it and what's the lesson

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Speaker 2: we can extract from that, and and what really drove

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Speaker 2: the character arc? What were the series of challenges that

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Speaker 2: had to be overcome in order to facilitate the transformation.

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Speaker 2: There's there's so many things that that we dialogue. We

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Speaker 2: never just watch something just to watch something. But I

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Speaker 2: think it's it's a lot different when you're reading because

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Speaker 2: so so much of that multi century storytelling is not there,

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Speaker 2: so you have to project that in the backdrop of

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Speaker 2: your mind.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, yeah, I don't know, I think. But also

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Speaker 1: you're right in the middle of the fiction, like so

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Speaker 1: this guy was you know, her government, Operative CIA, all

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Speaker 1: these things and I won't ruin it, but anyway, he's

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Speaker 1: always in these very very you know, high pressure situations.

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Speaker 1: And although it's fiction, it's based in like there's a

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Speaker 1: lot of truth in the organizations that they talk about

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Speaker 1: and the roles that these people fulfill, and the kind

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Speaker 1: of scenarios and situations and challenges that actually get dealt with,

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Speaker 1: probably more than we mere civilians could possibly comprehend. Right,

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Speaker 1: there's so much shit going on all of these like

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Speaker 1: literally covert operatives that government sanctioned, but not government you know,

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Speaker 1: they're not government employees, but they're anyway. And I just

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Speaker 1: thinking about and listening to these people dealing with pressure,

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Speaker 1: like a kind of pressure that we probably wouldn't although

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Speaker 1: pressure is subjective and blah blah blah, but and objective.

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Speaker 1: But you know, I'm just thinking about this guy dealing

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Speaker 1: with all of this stuff and wondering how how would

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Speaker 1: I I would go, Not necessarily with being a fucking assassin,

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Speaker 1: of course, but just the kind of situations that you

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Speaker 1: need to be in and to be able to self regulate.

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Speaker 1: You know, your emotions, your nervous system, you're breathing, your

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Speaker 1: heart rate, your words, your actions, your responsors, like and

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Speaker 1: I think that translates well, of course, that translates to

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Speaker 1: life is how do I deal with pressure? How do

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Speaker 1: I navigate situations and circumstances that I didn't choose or

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Speaker 1: didn't want? And it's almost like everyone's a bit of

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Speaker 1: a theoretical self help personal development human behavior genius until

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Speaker 1: the shit hits the fan and then we're all fucking

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Speaker 1: blithering idiots, you know. So it's like, how do I

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Speaker 1: how do I be that stuff? How do I apply

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Speaker 1: that stuff? How do I make this operational functional? So

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Speaker 1: that all of these these ideas and lessons that I

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Speaker 1: kind of lean into, am I actually doing something with

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Speaker 1: that practically, so that I'm building a version of me

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Speaker 1: that can cope with stress, that can climb the mountain,

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Speaker 1: that can have the hard conversation, that will actually go

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Speaker 1: to the gym when I don't want to go to

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Speaker 1: the gym, that will do the thing that's inconvenient because

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Speaker 1: it works like That's the the I don't know. That's

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Speaker 1: the ongoing thing I think is being able to overcome that,

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Speaker 1: you know, that innate desire to take the easy path

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Speaker 1: or to the quick fix or the magic pill, and

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Speaker 1: then you wake up and you're five years down the

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Speaker 1: track and you're still languishing.

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Speaker 2: You see, But even listen to what you're saying, there

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Speaker 2: are certain belief systems and principles and assumptions and that,

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Speaker 2: and you've got to ask how much of that did

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Speaker 2: you arrive at from your own life experiences and conclusions,

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Speaker 2: which I'm sure is a bit, and how much of

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Speaker 2: that did you arrive at because of story, because people

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Speaker 2: have figured out there are certain patterns in life that

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Speaker 2: work out best for the community, for society, and make

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Speaker 2: life easier for the individual. Like if you're someone who

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Speaker 2: is working hard and you're focused on something and it's

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Speaker 2: serving yourself, Like think about every single archetype. It's about

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Speaker 2: somebody who is living in the status quo. But then

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Speaker 2: there's an activating event, something that is disrupting someone's life

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Speaker 2: for better or for worse, and they have to go

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Speaker 2: out and meet that challenge. At first, they're reluctant because

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Speaker 2: we want to seek the path of least resistance, but

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Speaker 2: eventually not engaging with that thing is more precarious than

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Speaker 2: engaging with it. And then when we go out and

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Speaker 2: we engage with that thing, we produce certain outcomes, and

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Speaker 2: some of those are not expected and some of those

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Speaker 2: are not desirable. So they present in terms of challenges,

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Speaker 2: and we have to overcome those challenges. And we can't

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Speaker 2: overcome all of those challenges alone, so we have to

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Speaker 2: then find allies and people to take this journey with us.

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Speaker 2: And then we have adversaries. They want something that's in

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Speaker 2: conflict with what we want. But you have to keep

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Speaker 2: on the path and stay disciplined and overcome challenge. You

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Speaker 2: have to challenge until you grow into the type of

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Speaker 2: person that can transcend that and then you're a different person.

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Speaker 2: That's from story. So a lot of the societal like

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Speaker 2: principles about how you should be to live an effective life,

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Speaker 2: it comes from fiction. It comes from those archetypes. So

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Speaker 2: those narratives, I think kind of help to shape us

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Speaker 2: and guide us. That's what makes a great character. Can

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Speaker 2: I identify with this person? Now, obviously I'm not an assassin.

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Speaker 2: I would make a horrible decision. I mean, don't give

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Speaker 2: the Turette's guy a gun. You might as well give

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Speaker 2: a chimpanzee like a gun and cocaine and let him loose.

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Speaker 2: It would probably be a better idea than giving the

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Speaker 2: Tourette's guy a gun. But like, there's certain things that

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Speaker 2: you see that make this person effective at well killing people,

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Speaker 2: but at their job. You know, it's it's your job.

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Speaker 2: You don't want you know, you don't want to judge

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Speaker 2: people because of what they do for a living. And

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Speaker 2: you're like, oh, okay, you know I can relate to that.

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Speaker 2: Or there's a little bit something even at like one percent,

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Speaker 2: I can emulate. I did an interview with someone recently.

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Speaker 2: He was he was a senior intelligence officer for the CIA.

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Speaker 2: That was an interesting guy listening to, Like, Okay, when

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Speaker 2: you're a senior intelligence officer and you have people under

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Speaker 2: you that are spies, was it really take to be

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Speaker 2: an effective leader? That was That was a very very

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Speaker 2: interesting conversation.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm sure it would have been. I'm sure I

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Speaker 1: would love to check to that guy. But I think

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Speaker 1: also though I could connect. And there are people who

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Speaker 1: do get dealt hard hands, or people who do have

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Speaker 1: challenges arise, and not everyone always takes that challenge like

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Speaker 1: some people capitulate, like some people, you know. And that's

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Speaker 1: the like learning, learning from these stories and these archetypes

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Speaker 1: and you know, all the stoic kind of messaging that

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Speaker 1: we're getting these days, which seems to be super prevalent,

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Speaker 1: which is good because most of it's pretty solid. But

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Speaker 1: at the same stage, there are some people that are

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Speaker 1: going to be Two different people are confronted with the

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Speaker 1: same what appears to be the same challenge. One runs

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Speaker 1: into it and grows and evolves and adapts and becomes

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Speaker 1: fucking amazing, and the other one sits in the corner

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Speaker 1: and has a meltdown. So there's there's still something on

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Speaker 1: an individual level that the person in the middle of that,

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Speaker 1: whatever it is, has got to be able to overcome

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Speaker 1: that nobody can overcome for them. And so while I'm

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Speaker 1: all for allies and support and lavav and all of that,

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Speaker 1: but I actually think for many people, it's what they

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Speaker 1: do when no one's looking, no one's cheering, no one's supporting,

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Speaker 1: no one gives a fuck for me personally. And I'm blessed,

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Speaker 1: I'm lucky. There's no silking here. But most of my

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Speaker 1: breakthroughs and most of my achievements were not because of

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Speaker 1: anyone else. I've had great people, but I've had more

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Speaker 1: resistance than support, especially early days trying to get personal

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Speaker 1: training operationalized in Australia and building all the shit that

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Speaker 1: I did. But for me, it was more I achieved

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Speaker 1: more through the falling down and getting up and the

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Speaker 1: pain and the mess than somebody cheering or clapping me on.

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Speaker 1: That's my story anyway.

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Speaker 2: And I think that's a common story. And in every

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Speaker 2: story and archetype, there's a point where you're confronted with

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Speaker 2: the abyss, where you have to go in that alone,

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Speaker 2: you have to confront the big epic trial and the story.

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Speaker 2: And in order to do that, which is really hard,

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Speaker 2: because something has to die, whether literally, like if you

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Speaker 2: don't if you don't succeed in this challenge, it means

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Speaker 2: your life or maybe it's the person that you used

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Speaker 2: to be, the life used to live. Something has to

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Speaker 2: be sacrificed. But what's on the and your allies can't

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Speaker 2: help you. But what's on the other side of that

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Speaker 2: is meaningful transformation. But I think in my experience it

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Speaker 2: always involves other people. Like the better you do, the

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Speaker 2: more resistant, you're probably coming up with a lot more resistance.

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Speaker 2: I think that's true for most people than assistance for

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Speaker 2: a lot of reasons. But then I think there are

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Speaker 2: times where there's nothing you can do alone. Like I

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Speaker 2: was in a company meeting the other day and my

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Speaker 2: boss started off this exercise where we went around the

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Speaker 2: room and said, Okay, talk about your biggest accomplishments that

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Speaker 2: you brought to fruition this year. That's a really great

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Speaker 2: way to start a meeting because it won. It creates

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Speaker 2: acknowledgment two. It identifies what we the people, the resources, strategies,

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Speaker 2: environments that help you succeed. What was it about you

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Speaker 2: that you can duplicate? There's just I think it sets

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Speaker 2: up a more creative open meeting. But when he got

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Speaker 2: to me and I was kind of, I don't know,

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Speaker 2: I kind of I'm dramatic sometimes with things. I don't

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Speaker 2: know if you've noticed that said what I was being

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Speaker 2: half facetious, but I really meant it, and I wanted

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Speaker 2: to make a point. And I was like, you know,

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Speaker 2: this is a little bit awkward for me because I

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Speaker 2: don't have any wins for twenty twenty four the last year.

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Speaker 2: And the reason why I said that is because we

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Speaker 2: launched a coaching program and it's going really well. But

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Speaker 2: you know, sitting next to me is my operational partner

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Speaker 2: and she's amazing. You love her. She's just she's just

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Speaker 2: mental in all the best ways and brilliant and committed.

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Speaker 2: And I love work when hard. I'm looking over at

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Speaker 2: my coaches there and I'm like, I'm not sitting in

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Speaker 2: those sessions, you know, like day after day with all

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Speaker 2: of these clients. Yeah, I developed the curriculum, Yes, I

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Speaker 2: trained them. We constantly developed, but if it wasn't for

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Speaker 2: their commitment and dedication. I can't see these people by myself,

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Speaker 2: they would be they wouldn't be served. And then I'm

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Speaker 2: looking across the table at my former team and I'm like, yeah,

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Speaker 2: we have created and I wrote the content for it,

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Speaker 2: I organized the information, and I delivered it in the field.

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Speaker 2: We have twenty signature seminars that we deliver. They can

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Speaker 2: all be disassembled and reassembled to meet eighty percent of

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Speaker 2: our requests. So there's customization and expedience there their modular tracts,

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Speaker 2: which so there's continuity. I know they've made a difference

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Speaker 2: with our client base, but it's set up those meetings

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Speaker 2: and operationalized that. I couldn't have done any of that

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Speaker 2: without my three partners that I used to have sitting

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Speaker 2: across the table. And then I'm looking at a series

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Speaker 2: of managers around the table. I'm like, I'd be useless

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Speaker 2: without all of you. So yeah, without those allies, I

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Speaker 2: could have really done anything last year.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, but at the same yeah, I get it.

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Speaker 1: But without the syllabus, the content that you created, there

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Speaker 1: wouldn't have been that to deliver and to operationalize and

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Speaker 1: to share with people.

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Speaker 2: So right, so no one could say it's me it's weak.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, but there's still I mean, look, I get it,

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Speaker 1: I get you, but I mean I think I'm for

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Speaker 1: the average punter listening to this. They don't do what

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Speaker 1: you do. They don't do what I do. Right, I'm

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Speaker 1: thinking more, and what you're saying makes sense, But I'm

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Speaker 1: thinking about for the average person who's gone. My life

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Speaker 1: sucks at the moment, my back'sare I'm not making enough though.

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Speaker 1: You know, it's like I struggle to stay motivated. It's like, fuck,

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Speaker 1: my old man's a prick or whatever it is.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 1: I just think for the average person that it's it's

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Speaker 1: it's going to be you know, of course, peaks and troughs.

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Speaker 1: It's going to be a grind, it's going to be

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Speaker 1: it's going to be good days and shit days. It's

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Speaker 1: going to be laughter and tears. And I think our.

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Speaker 3: This.

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Speaker 1: I could be wrong on this, but I feel like

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Speaker 1: in twenty twenty five, there are a percentage of people,

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Speaker 1: there is a percentage of people who can't kind of

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Speaker 1: do anything unless there's somebody cheering them on. And I

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Speaker 1: think while we all love being cheered on and we

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Speaker 1: love approval and support me included, right, I love recognition.

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Speaker 1: I'm an only child, I'm insecure. Fucking tell me I'm amazing.

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Speaker 1: But if I can only do the work when someone's

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Speaker 1: doing that, I'm in trouble. And so I think for me,

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Speaker 1: it's really very much about if there's support and love

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Speaker 1: and connect and all of that, great, but not everyone

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Speaker 1: has that. Like a lot of people listening to this

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Speaker 1: do not have what you're talking about. They don't have

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Speaker 1: a team, they don't have people that tell them they're good,

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Speaker 1: they don't have people that cheer them on. So like

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Speaker 1: I'm talking to those people, I'm like, yeah, it's great

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Speaker 1: if it's there, but it's like, motivation's awesome, but you

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Speaker 1: don't need to be motivated to do something like you

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Speaker 1: don't need to be in that state. And I think too,

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Speaker 1: you know, for the average punter who is just trying

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Speaker 1: to i don't know, improve their life a bit, or

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Speaker 1: their health a bit, or the bank balance a bit,

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Speaker 1: or their relationships a bit, or to be a little

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Speaker 1: bit less unreliable and a bit more reliable and a

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Speaker 1: bit more consistent. And you know, these are the things

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Speaker 1: where I reckon. It's in those moments of self awareness

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Speaker 1: and self reflection and a little bit of self control

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Speaker 1: where you can start to take ownership of your own story.

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Speaker 1: And that's not to the exclusion of other people in

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Speaker 1: your story, and it's not to the exclusion of you

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Speaker 1: helping others and serving others. But yeah, I just think

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Speaker 1: that that's important.

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Speaker 3: That that we we realize that ultimately, like despite all

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Speaker 3: the resources and people and friends and teammates and colleagues

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Speaker 3: and all of that, which are great if they're there,

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Speaker 3: but ultimately, you've got to rely on you because the

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Speaker 3: only constant in your life, the only constant person in

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Speaker 3: your life from birth to death, is you.

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Speaker 1: And the only person that's always with you is you,

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Speaker 1: you know. And it's so much about that. And I'm like,

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Speaker 1: you like, when you and I work together and we've

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Speaker 1: done it a bit, I love it, and I love

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Speaker 1: working with you, and hopefully that's reciprocal. But there are

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Speaker 1: times when you're like, all right, well, if I'm not

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Speaker 1: doing this, no, it's not going to get done, you know.

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Speaker 2: And I think those are so many airpoints. Yeah, but

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Speaker 2: you know, I think there's I think there's a nuance

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Speaker 2: here where I mean, with anything I'm pulling this from

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Speaker 2: the meeting as well. Another question I was asked is

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Speaker 2: what was what is one skill that you do not

385
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Speaker 2: currently possess that you would really want to develop. And

386
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Speaker 2: for some weird reason, so many people on the team

387
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Speaker 2: wanted to do things around construction, like I, you know,

388
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Speaker 2: I want to do like corpentry, I want to make stuff.

389
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Speaker 2: I want to design things, electric work. It's like, okay, wow,

390
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Speaker 2: we could be a bunch of builders. And the point

391
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Speaker 2: there is if you don't show up for your bit,

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Speaker 2: you're not going to attract allies. You're probably not going

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Speaker 2: to attract a lot of adversaries either, which is the

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Speaker 2: other side of that, Like if you don't have adversaries,

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Speaker 2: if you're not getting criticism, because this is something that

396
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Speaker 2: I have struggled with a lot, and it's like, it's

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Speaker 2: not I don't think it's your job to go out

398
00:23:01,080 --> 00:23:06,119
Speaker 2: there and purposely so division. There's there's already enough of

399
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Speaker 2: that in the world. That position has been filled. You

400
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Speaker 2: don't need to do that. But if you're not encountering

401
00:23:11,119 --> 00:23:16,280
Speaker 2: resistance and criticism from people, you're probably not doing anything

402
00:23:16,359 --> 00:23:21,680
Speaker 2: really impactful. Because people have their own reasons and conflicting interests,

403
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Speaker 2: and I think that's one of the markers you're gonna

404
00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:26,720
Speaker 2: show up for your job. Otherwise you're not gonna You're

405
00:23:26,720 --> 00:23:30,600
Speaker 2: not gonna have anybody willing to work with you. So absolutely,

406
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Speaker 2: I believe in the power of teams, but I also

407
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Speaker 2: believe in the power of individual effort and contribution and excellence.

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Speaker 1: Well, most of us are going to be by ourselves

409
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Speaker 1: more than we're going to be around a team or

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Speaker 1: a group, like over the context of our life.

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Speaker 2: And I mean, in my case, that's not a choice.

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Speaker 2: I get it.

413
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Speaker 1: I've got a lot of issues. But but yeah, I

414
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Speaker 1: mean I've said this too many times on the show.

415
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Speaker 1: But one of my lecturers or one of my in fact,

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Speaker 1: one of my professor's first time around at the university,

417
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Speaker 1: he said to me, he said this to harper if

418
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Speaker 1: if What did he say? Basically, he said, if you

419
00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:13,760
Speaker 1: don't want to piss anyone off, then say nothing, do nothing,

420
00:24:13,920 --> 00:24:17,199
Speaker 1: be nothing, and stand for nothing, you know. And I'm like,

421
00:24:17,359 --> 00:24:21,240
Speaker 1: it's so true, Like I'd never heard that, and I went, oh, yeah,

422
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Speaker 1: that's you know, that the moment that you stand something,

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Speaker 1: the moment that you have an opinion, and it's okay,

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Speaker 1: people don't need to agree. A lot of people disagree

425
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Speaker 1: with me. I'm fine with that. A lot of people

426
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Speaker 1: have diametrically opposed ideas, and over time, I've changed my

427
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Speaker 1: ideas over time. I mean, I think this is the

428
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Speaker 1: other bit to this, too, mate, is our willingness to go.

429
00:24:42,160 --> 00:24:43,960
Speaker 1: I used to think this, but I don't think that

430
00:24:44,080 --> 00:24:47,520
Speaker 1: anymore because I changed my mind. And these are the

431
00:24:47,520 --> 00:24:50,639
Speaker 1: reasons I changed my mind. Is because I met this person,

432
00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:53,480
Speaker 1: or I had this experience, or I had this conversation,

433
00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:56,439
Speaker 1: or I did this thing, and then I had this

434
00:24:56,520 --> 00:25:02,560
Speaker 1: fucking epiphany about you know whatever, like just that even

435
00:25:02,640 --> 00:25:05,560
Speaker 1: down to and it sounds contradictory because I own a

436
00:25:05,600 --> 00:25:07,760
Speaker 1: business and you own a business and you work in

437
00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:12,000
Speaker 1: an organization as well, But like sometimes I just go

438
00:25:13,080 --> 00:25:17,479
Speaker 1: what matters, just that, just that, what matters. And I

439
00:25:17,520 --> 00:25:19,919
Speaker 1: sit with people. I sat with somebody earlier this week,

440
00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:22,520
Speaker 1: and I said, in the middle of all of these

441
00:25:22,640 --> 00:25:25,520
Speaker 1: variables and moving parts in your life and your relationships

442
00:25:25,520 --> 00:25:27,359
Speaker 1: and your health and your body and your business and

443
00:25:27,359 --> 00:25:30,239
Speaker 1: your money, and I go, what matters, like what's like?

444
00:25:30,320 --> 00:25:32,360
Speaker 1: What matters? And they go about what? I go, you

445
00:25:32,400 --> 00:25:36,600
Speaker 1: just tell me what matters? Because I don't know. I

446
00:25:37,840 --> 00:25:40,119
Speaker 1: put up my hand and I think I've wasted so

447
00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:44,159
Speaker 1: much time, effort and energy on things that in that

448
00:25:44,359 --> 00:25:46,760
Speaker 1: really for me anyway, I look back, I go, that

449
00:25:46,840 --> 00:25:50,680
Speaker 1: was such a bad investment. It's like that shit does

450
00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:53,720
Speaker 1: really it really doesn't matter, you know. And I mean

451
00:25:53,720 --> 00:25:56,800
Speaker 1: it's easy to be philosophical when people that you love

452
00:25:56,880 --> 00:25:58,560
Speaker 1: get sick or die and all of that. We have

453
00:25:58,600 --> 00:26:01,439
Speaker 1: our moment of reflection and we get back onto the

454
00:26:01,480 --> 00:26:04,920
Speaker 1: treadmill of life. But yeah, I just think going, does

455
00:26:04,960 --> 00:26:07,959
Speaker 1: it matter? Does this matter? Does it matter that I

456
00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:10,040
Speaker 1: do this? Does it matter that they liked that? Does

457
00:26:10,080 --> 00:26:12,159
Speaker 1: it matter that I think A and you think B?

458
00:26:12,920 --> 00:26:15,560
Speaker 1: Or is it just all okay? Like do we all

459
00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:18,480
Speaker 1: need to agree? And also do we all need to

460
00:26:18,520 --> 00:26:21,160
Speaker 1: fucking hate each other? You know? For sure?

461
00:26:21,520 --> 00:26:21,600
Speaker 3: Not.

462
00:26:22,560 --> 00:26:26,840
Speaker 2: There's there's this show that I was watching with my

463
00:26:26,920 --> 00:26:30,919
Speaker 2: wife and it's called Dying for Sacks.

464
00:26:31,880 --> 00:26:34,880
Speaker 1: Can you just say Amy? You don't have to say

465
00:26:34,880 --> 00:26:37,159
Speaker 1: my wife all the time. You can just say Amy.

466
00:26:38,560 --> 00:26:41,919
Speaker 2: Well Amy, But not anybody knows who Amy is. If

467
00:26:41,920 --> 00:26:45,040
Speaker 2: I make Amy, he's watching because you're always my wife,

468
00:26:45,200 --> 00:26:49,080
Speaker 2: you understand the relief because you understand Amy's relationship. I

469
00:26:49,160 --> 00:26:51,399
Speaker 2: mean not everybody's going to understand that, Like Amy is

470
00:26:51,440 --> 00:26:53,960
Speaker 2: my wife. So that's why I preface my wife.

471
00:26:54,400 --> 00:26:58,080
Speaker 1: All right, let's let's let's asterisk this moment on the

472
00:26:58,119 --> 00:27:01,760
Speaker 1: you project from here moving forward, everyone, When Bobby says,

473
00:27:01,760 --> 00:27:03,800
Speaker 1: I'm he's talking about his wife. But then of course

474
00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:06,800
Speaker 1: there'll be new people. So maybe my wife.

475
00:27:06,880 --> 00:27:11,879
Speaker 2: My wife, Amy, We we are, we are a creative

476
00:27:11,960 --> 00:27:13,280
Speaker 2: forced to be reckoned with.

477
00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:16,840
Speaker 1: All right, going your wife, I me go on.

478
00:27:17,520 --> 00:27:21,520
Speaker 2: So and there's this show Dying for Sex and it's

479
00:27:21,560 --> 00:27:25,479
Speaker 2: about it's about this woman and it's not all about sex,

480
00:27:25,600 --> 00:27:29,919
Speaker 2: which was very disappointing, titles completely misleading. And she's in

481
00:27:29,960 --> 00:27:34,520
Speaker 2: remission from cancer. Cancer comes back and it's her only

482
00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:37,680
Speaker 2: in like, she just has this feeling this is a

483
00:27:37,760 --> 00:27:41,480
Speaker 2: little bit different than the first time coming out of remission.

484
00:27:41,520 --> 00:27:44,600
Speaker 2: This this might be it and you know, I don't.

485
00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:47,439
Speaker 2: Oh god, there's a lot of spoilers in this. But

486
00:27:47,760 --> 00:27:52,280
Speaker 2: she she has no choice but to confront the brutal

487
00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:55,440
Speaker 2: reality of her life and the things that she's avoiding

488
00:27:55,480 --> 00:27:58,840
Speaker 2: and what really matters to her, and the whole thing

489
00:27:58,880 --> 00:28:03,320
Speaker 2: with sex. Has has a backstory about something horrible happened

490
00:28:03,359 --> 00:28:07,840
Speaker 2: to her when she was she was a kid, a child,

491
00:28:08,240 --> 00:28:10,879
Speaker 2: and it was her mom's boyfriend and you know, you

492
00:28:10,920 --> 00:28:13,240
Speaker 2: could fill you could fill in the gaps of what

493
00:28:13,440 --> 00:28:18,960
Speaker 2: happened there, and she it had affected her in her relationships,

494
00:28:19,119 --> 00:28:23,560
Speaker 2: her romantic, really intimate relationships, and she's find like, I

495
00:28:23,680 --> 00:28:27,760
Speaker 2: have to I have to explore this, I have to

496
00:28:27,760 --> 00:28:30,000
Speaker 2: figure this out because I don't have a lot of time.

497
00:28:30,040 --> 00:28:34,480
Speaker 2: And you know, throughout the throughout the whole the whole show,

498
00:28:34,520 --> 00:28:39,360
Speaker 2: there's these beautiful moments where her friend is everyone looks

499
00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:42,320
Speaker 2: at her as a screw up because she's this free spirit.

500
00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:44,000
Speaker 2: You know, it's like the person that you know just

501
00:28:44,080 --> 00:28:46,400
Speaker 2: got like everything fallen out of a purse when she

502
00:28:46,440 --> 00:28:49,360
Speaker 2: walks into a room and maybe not really focused. But

503
00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:54,920
Speaker 2: it turns out that this person is a beautiful, loyal, compassionate,

504
00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:58,960
Speaker 2: strong person who is the rock for her friend as

505
00:28:59,000 --> 00:29:04,440
Speaker 2: she's and she's walking down that aisle towards the inevitable

506
00:29:04,480 --> 00:29:06,600
Speaker 2: with someone she loves more than anyone else in the world.

507
00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:10,080
Speaker 2: And then the relationship between her mom and her and

508
00:29:10,160 --> 00:29:13,440
Speaker 2: how strained it is, and when she's in hospice, they're

509
00:29:13,480 --> 00:29:17,400
Speaker 2: just holding each other crying because that shit doesn't matter

510
00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:20,720
Speaker 2: in the last few days of your life. It's like, God, like,

511
00:29:20,880 --> 00:29:24,920
Speaker 2: why does it take this to get us to that.

512
00:29:25,880 --> 00:29:29,320
Speaker 1: You know, Yeah, I'm with you. I've thought about that

513
00:29:29,360 --> 00:29:33,080
Speaker 1: a lot, especially the last couple of years. You know.

514
00:29:33,080 --> 00:29:34,720
Speaker 1: I had a friend of mine, a really good friend,

515
00:29:34,760 --> 00:29:37,640
Speaker 1: die about six months ago. I had another my second

516
00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:40,560
Speaker 1: mom died a few months ago, and you know, and

517
00:29:40,600 --> 00:29:42,760
Speaker 1: the crab died at the gym six years ago and

518
00:29:42,800 --> 00:29:45,680
Speaker 1: then didn't die. And like just those moments in time

519
00:29:46,600 --> 00:29:50,160
Speaker 1: where and everybody experiences what I'm experiencing. So there's no

520
00:29:50,200 --> 00:29:54,080
Speaker 1: self pity here, and there's but it just I think

521
00:29:54,120 --> 00:29:59,480
Speaker 1: because in a way, the busyness of life, or the

522
00:29:59,560 --> 00:30:01,640
Speaker 1: boxes we've got to tick, the things we've got to do,

523
00:30:01,720 --> 00:30:04,000
Speaker 1: the money we've got to make, the conversations we've got

524
00:30:04,040 --> 00:30:06,080
Speaker 1: to have, the car rides we've got to you know,

525
00:30:06,160 --> 00:30:11,320
Speaker 1: that just hijacks your your attention. And it's understandable because

526
00:30:11,360 --> 00:30:14,560
Speaker 1: they are a thing that on a practical, real world

527
00:30:14,680 --> 00:30:18,120
Speaker 1: day to day they need our energy and our focus

528
00:30:18,160 --> 00:30:23,360
Speaker 1: and our attention. And so but that doesn't mean that

529
00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:28,080
Speaker 1: underneath all that that other things aren't more important in

530
00:30:28,160 --> 00:30:32,240
Speaker 1: the context of life. But I do think our our

531
00:30:32,320 --> 00:30:37,120
Speaker 1: mind and our attention does get hijacked. But I think also,

532
00:30:38,200 --> 00:30:41,040
Speaker 1: like I have this little process that I do every morning,

533
00:30:41,080 --> 00:30:44,480
Speaker 1: which I share with people too, mate, and it's a

534
00:30:44,560 --> 00:30:47,760
Speaker 1: version of I sit at the cafe that you and

535
00:30:47,800 --> 00:30:52,200
Speaker 1: I have had breakfast at many times, and I ask

536
00:30:52,320 --> 00:30:54,280
Speaker 1: myself in terms of what I want to do be

537
00:30:54,400 --> 00:30:57,120
Speaker 1: create today, in other words, in terms of the things

538
00:30:57,160 --> 00:30:59,160
Speaker 1: that I want to do and get done, what's the

539
00:30:59,200 --> 00:31:03,080
Speaker 1: best use of me today, Like what's the best use

540
00:31:03,120 --> 00:31:05,960
Speaker 1: of my time and energy based on what I want

541
00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:09,640
Speaker 1: to achieve? And that that sets me up, you know,

542
00:31:09,680 --> 00:31:13,320
Speaker 1: not for a perfect day, but a more conscious day

543
00:31:13,360 --> 00:31:18,120
Speaker 1: than an unconscious, reactive day, a more focused, conscious, proactive

544
00:31:18,240 --> 00:31:21,720
Speaker 1: day where when I do that properly, which is not always,

545
00:31:22,200 --> 00:31:24,600
Speaker 1: but when I do that properly, I tend to be

546
00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:31,280
Speaker 1: more productive. But yes, it is that. I think the

547
00:31:31,360 --> 00:31:33,720
Speaker 1: answer to your question is, like, why do we wait

548
00:31:33,800 --> 00:31:37,360
Speaker 1: for the last whatever? I just think that because it's

549
00:31:37,400 --> 00:31:39,680
Speaker 1: not in our face, and it's not you know, and

550
00:31:39,720 --> 00:31:43,840
Speaker 1: it's so easy to just go down a rabbit hole

551
00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:48,320
Speaker 1: of you know, nothing in particular. And I don't think

552
00:31:48,360 --> 00:31:50,480
Speaker 1: that's bad, by the way, I just think that's human.

553
00:31:51,040 --> 00:31:53,160
Speaker 1: I don't think we need to hate ourselves for this,

554
00:31:54,280 --> 00:31:58,360
Speaker 1: you know. And even if it was a flaw like

555
00:31:58,480 --> 00:32:00,000
Speaker 1: hating yourself doesn't fix it.

556
00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:06,560
Speaker 2: Sorry, that's that's actually that's the worst path forward. So

557
00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:10,520
Speaker 2: Barbara Frederickson, she's brilliant. I love her work. I love

558
00:32:10,520 --> 00:32:12,880
Speaker 2: her research. You know, a lot of times when we

559
00:32:12,920 --> 00:32:18,840
Speaker 2: think about self compassion, we think about that is being

560
00:32:19,000 --> 00:32:23,960
Speaker 2: soft or overly permissive with ourselves. But that's not the case.

561
00:32:24,120 --> 00:32:31,120
Speaker 2: Like self compassion is grit, it's rigor. And it's just

562
00:32:31,800 --> 00:32:36,959
Speaker 2: people who are compassionate with themselves and their evaluation of

563
00:32:37,120 --> 00:32:42,560
Speaker 2: what they've done and why are far more likely to

564
00:32:42,760 --> 00:32:47,560
Speaker 2: do the work, especially when it gets hard around changing.

565
00:32:48,240 --> 00:32:51,840
Speaker 2: It's people that don't engage in that. It's people that

566
00:32:52,320 --> 00:32:56,200
Speaker 2: have this shame based identity about what I've done versus

567
00:32:56,200 --> 00:32:59,000
Speaker 2: what I should have done, and fucking hell, I'm the one,

568
00:32:59,040 --> 00:33:03,240
Speaker 2: to the point to finger here that gets stuck in

569
00:33:03,320 --> 00:33:07,200
Speaker 2: that identity loop. It's it's almost like facing the shadow

570
00:33:07,280 --> 00:33:12,520
Speaker 2: aspects of your personality and understanding that and say, okay,

571
00:33:12,520 --> 00:33:16,000
Speaker 2: well I accept and I embrace this, But who do

572
00:33:16,080 --> 00:33:17,440
Speaker 2: I really want to be?

573
00:33:17,600 --> 00:33:17,800
Speaker 3: Now?

574
00:33:18,320 --> 00:33:20,720
Speaker 2: Now? What you know? What I mean?

575
00:33:20,800 --> 00:33:24,959
Speaker 1: What is that? So two questions? My first question is

576
00:33:25,480 --> 00:33:28,360
Speaker 1: if you can remember those two first question is all right,

577
00:33:28,440 --> 00:33:30,960
Speaker 1: let's just go with one. Then the other, what does

578
00:33:31,000 --> 00:33:35,120
Speaker 1: self compassion look like? Practically? Give us an example, because

579
00:33:35,280 --> 00:33:38,600
Speaker 1: I'm I love the idea, I don't know exactly what

580
00:33:38,640 --> 00:33:39,160
Speaker 1: it looks like.

581
00:33:40,680 --> 00:33:48,080
Speaker 2: Okay, so self compassion like today today at a meeting, right,

582
00:33:48,600 --> 00:33:50,800
Speaker 2: I hope that. I hope nobody's at this meeting was

583
00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:53,760
Speaker 2: listening to this. It's kind of a workshop, and I

584
00:33:53,880 --> 00:33:56,800
Speaker 2: meet with I meet with this, this, this group at

585
00:33:56,840 --> 00:34:00,560
Speaker 2: a school site once a month, and I really like

586
00:34:00,640 --> 00:34:02,600
Speaker 2: these people for a lot of reasons. And it was

587
00:34:02,600 --> 00:34:08,320
Speaker 2: someone's birthday and they brought in obviously like cakes and candies,

588
00:34:08,400 --> 00:34:10,759
Speaker 2: and I was feeling a little bit off today, so

589
00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:12,600
Speaker 2: I was like, I definitely don't want to eat that.

590
00:34:12,680 --> 00:34:15,480
Speaker 2: And then I was like, okay, I'm hoping this is

591
00:34:15,520 --> 00:34:17,080
Speaker 2: a good example. I was like, I don't want to

592
00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:20,439
Speaker 2: be like rude. It's someone's birthday. It's like, oh yeah,

593
00:34:20,480 --> 00:34:23,040
Speaker 2: I would love it. I would I would love one.

594
00:34:23,160 --> 00:34:25,680
Speaker 2: I ate one. And then I was feeling really sick,

595
00:34:26,160 --> 00:34:28,120
Speaker 2: not just sick to my stomach. I was like feeling

596
00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:31,200
Speaker 2: dizzy like and confused, like like you know when you're

597
00:34:31,200 --> 00:34:34,920
Speaker 2: just like taking way too much sugar, and you know

598
00:34:35,200 --> 00:34:38,319
Speaker 2: I have had a propensity in the past. Fucking hell,

599
00:34:38,960 --> 00:34:42,000
Speaker 2: the fuck. You're such a people pleaser. God, you couldn't

600
00:34:42,040 --> 00:34:44,480
Speaker 2: just say no and have a little bit of discipline

601
00:34:44,520 --> 00:34:49,719
Speaker 2: and self respect. Fuck you always do this? God the fuck?

602
00:34:49,760 --> 00:34:53,680
Speaker 2: What's wrong with you? It's like that is a great

603
00:34:53,760 --> 00:34:59,680
Speaker 2: way to repeat these patterns constantly versus Yeah, you know

604
00:35:00,080 --> 00:35:02,640
Speaker 2: that probably didn't make me feel as good as I

605
00:35:02,680 --> 00:35:06,560
Speaker 2: want to feel. But you were basically considering someone else's

606
00:35:06,600 --> 00:35:12,080
Speaker 2: feelings and celebrating the birthday of a participant that you value.

607
00:35:12,840 --> 00:35:16,000
Speaker 2: You know, I think if you looked at anybody else

608
00:35:16,080 --> 00:35:19,799
Speaker 2: doing that behavior, you'd have no negative opinion. You know,

609
00:35:19,920 --> 00:35:22,719
Speaker 2: next time, you might want to consider doing this a

610
00:35:22,760 --> 00:35:28,400
Speaker 2: little bit differently given the outcome you're experiencing. That is

611
00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:31,920
Speaker 2: self compassion, That is, like I am, I'm not an

612
00:35:32,040 --> 00:35:35,359
Speaker 2: undisciplined person, you know what. That was actually fairly empathetic

613
00:35:35,440 --> 00:35:39,239
Speaker 2: of you. Didn't you know, didn't really do this, or

614
00:35:39,719 --> 00:35:42,319
Speaker 2: maybe you said something at some point to somebody that

615
00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:44,919
Speaker 2: in a way that you shouldn't have said it. It's

616
00:35:44,960 --> 00:35:48,760
Speaker 2: not your identity, it was how you behaved in the moment.

617
00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:50,359
Speaker 2: Does that make sense?

618
00:35:50,480 --> 00:35:51,040
Speaker 3: Yeah?

619
00:35:51,080 --> 00:35:56,440
Speaker 1: I does. My only question your honor is in that scenario.

620
00:35:57,239 --> 00:36:00,400
Speaker 1: Either way, you're eating the cake you're eating the cake

621
00:36:00,640 --> 00:36:03,680
Speaker 1: and feeling guilty and like a piece of shit, or

622
00:36:03,680 --> 00:36:06,360
Speaker 1: you're eating the cake with a bit of self awareness

623
00:36:06,400 --> 00:36:11,200
Speaker 1: and self compassion. Cool. What about the third scenario where

624
00:36:11,239 --> 00:36:13,440
Speaker 1: you go, hey, thank you.

625
00:36:13,400 --> 00:36:18,160
Speaker 2: But no, but that doesn't that doesn't do you any

626
00:36:18,280 --> 00:36:22,680
Speaker 2: good after you've already eaten the key. Yeah, yeah, okay,

627
00:36:22,719 --> 00:36:25,440
Speaker 2: all right, if you're about to eat the cake.

628
00:36:25,320 --> 00:36:29,080
Speaker 1: Well when you fucking do that because you didn't want

629
00:36:29,080 --> 00:36:31,640
Speaker 1: the cake, you say you doesn't want the cake.

630
00:36:32,040 --> 00:36:36,680
Speaker 2: Because in that moment, other things came up for me

631
00:36:37,200 --> 00:36:39,799
Speaker 2: which caused me to reach out and eat it. One.

632
00:36:40,560 --> 00:36:43,359
Speaker 2: It wasn't grand theft auto. It wasn't like, oh it's

633
00:36:43,360 --> 00:36:46,600
Speaker 2: my birthday and I really like to carjack people this

634
00:36:46,719 --> 00:36:49,200
Speaker 2: time of year. All right, let's go do that. Okay.

635
00:36:49,239 --> 00:36:52,719
Speaker 2: That's an epic fail on a lot of different levels.

636
00:36:53,080 --> 00:36:55,520
Speaker 2: It was cake. Do I eat cake all the time?

637
00:36:55,600 --> 00:36:55,640
Speaker 1: No?

638
00:36:56,000 --> 00:36:59,920
Speaker 2: And it's it's probably not discipline. I just really cannot.

639
00:37:00,080 --> 00:37:03,279
Speaker 2: I don't like cake very much, and when I eat it,

640
00:37:03,520 --> 00:37:05,880
Speaker 2: I pay for it, so it happens very rarely. But

641
00:37:06,280 --> 00:37:08,520
Speaker 2: the point is I eat the cake. Now, I could

642
00:37:08,520 --> 00:37:11,839
Speaker 2: tell myself, oh, you should have just said no, no shit.

643
00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:16,799
Speaker 2: I could have said yes, no, whatever, how I communicate

644
00:37:16,880 --> 00:37:19,600
Speaker 2: myself dictates the probability.

645
00:37:18,960 --> 00:37:22,799
Speaker 1: Of doing that again. You know, yeah, gotcha, Okay, that

646
00:37:22,880 --> 00:37:25,279
Speaker 1: makes sense, but next time, done it the cake, but

647
00:37:25,400 --> 00:37:32,640
Speaker 1: also don't cake. Tell me about the relationship between self compassion,

648
00:37:32,719 --> 00:37:37,680
Speaker 1: question without notice, self compassion, self awareness, and self loathing.

649
00:37:38,400 --> 00:37:44,040
Speaker 1: How they kind of like the interplay. I feel like, yeah,

650
00:37:44,440 --> 00:37:47,279
Speaker 1: I feel a few things, but you tell me so

651
00:37:47,440 --> 00:37:51,680
Speaker 1: self awareness, self compassion, self loathing. What's the kind of

652
00:37:51,719 --> 00:37:56,600
Speaker 1: the interplay between those kinds of I guess state.

653
00:37:57,080 --> 00:37:59,560
Speaker 2: Well, I think defining them first, because the interplay is

654
00:37:59,560 --> 00:38:02,760
Speaker 2: a little bit a little bit harder. You know. Self

655
00:38:02,800 --> 00:38:07,120
Speaker 2: awareness is the ability to kind of like step back

656
00:38:07,600 --> 00:38:14,200
Speaker 2: and observe in the moment how you are engaging with

657
00:38:14,280 --> 00:38:19,239
Speaker 2: the world around you people around you, mostly the impact

658
00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:25,560
Speaker 2: that that's having, and being able to self regulate behaviorally

659
00:38:25,680 --> 00:38:30,600
Speaker 2: regulate in the moment in order to in order to

660
00:38:30,640 --> 00:38:33,879
Speaker 2: adapt to like what information is coming up for you.

661
00:38:34,640 --> 00:38:39,040
Speaker 2: So ah, man like, like, if we're we're going through

662
00:38:39,239 --> 00:38:43,120
Speaker 2: some interviewing processes right now, and you know, me and

663
00:38:43,160 --> 00:38:45,880
Speaker 2: my team we get on so well, and I have

664
00:38:45,960 --> 00:38:49,960
Speaker 2: one person on my team where the thing that concerns

665
00:38:50,000 --> 00:38:53,520
Speaker 2: me is I always find myself agreeing with this person

666
00:38:53,600 --> 00:38:56,439
Speaker 2: and vice versa. But there's another person on the team

667
00:38:56,480 --> 00:39:00,960
Speaker 2: we disagree on not on mission, but almost everything else.

668
00:39:01,760 --> 00:39:04,600
Speaker 2: And I love that now we're we're really tight. Like

669
00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:07,360
Speaker 2: if he was like, you know what that idea you

670
00:39:07,480 --> 00:39:11,200
Speaker 2: just presented, You're a fucking idiot, I would laugh and go, Okay,

671
00:39:11,200 --> 00:39:14,080
Speaker 2: tell me more about that. But let's say, you know,

672
00:39:14,680 --> 00:39:17,760
Speaker 2: you look at somebody like, well, that's not gonna work, Jane.

673
00:39:18,239 --> 00:39:20,440
Speaker 2: You know we've already tried that, and if you would have,

674
00:39:21,239 --> 00:39:24,160
Speaker 2: if I'm not aware of how I'm coming off, i

675
00:39:24,200 --> 00:39:27,120
Speaker 2: can't adjust my approach. And I'm not gonna get any

676
00:39:27,160 --> 00:39:29,959
Speaker 2: further with Jane, and I'm probably gonna I'm probably gonna

677
00:39:30,040 --> 00:39:34,359
Speaker 2: hurt Jane, not accomplish what I'm seeking to accomplish. And

678
00:39:34,680 --> 00:39:38,480
Speaker 2: there's there's basically no constructive reason to do that. And

679
00:39:38,520 --> 00:39:40,319
Speaker 2: you're a bit of a cock on top of it,

680
00:39:40,840 --> 00:39:43,200
Speaker 2: where if I could go, you know what, I'm a

681
00:39:43,239 --> 00:39:46,759
Speaker 2: little bit heated right now, and based on my emotional

682
00:39:46,880 --> 00:39:51,080
Speaker 2: intensity and state and how and how I'm delivering this,

683
00:39:51,160 --> 00:39:54,160
Speaker 2: I could hear this in my cadence. Let me step

684
00:39:54,200 --> 00:39:58,439
Speaker 2: back and ask Jane a question or try to try

685
00:39:58,440 --> 00:40:02,120
Speaker 2: to ask try to point out what Jane's concern might

686
00:40:02,200 --> 00:40:05,280
Speaker 2: be that's driving her perspective and ask her a question

687
00:40:05,360 --> 00:40:08,359
Speaker 2: that opens up the door for a different discussion. We

688
00:40:08,360 --> 00:40:11,319
Speaker 2: can have the same conversation, but self awareness is going

689
00:40:11,320 --> 00:40:14,759
Speaker 2: to make that conversation a lot more impactful. I think

690
00:40:14,840 --> 00:40:21,399
Speaker 2: self loathing comes from shame. It comes from a which

691
00:40:21,440 --> 00:40:24,360
Speaker 2: is different than guilt. Guilt is where you feel bad

692
00:40:24,520 --> 00:40:31,000
Speaker 2: about something that you've done, like cake related offenses, for example,

693
00:40:31,880 --> 00:40:37,280
Speaker 2: where shame is feel good. I'm using that as an example.

694
00:40:37,560 --> 00:40:40,400
Speaker 2: I don't think people should feel guilty about or you

695
00:40:40,520 --> 00:40:45,279
Speaker 2: do something that hurts somebody's feelings and it's like, that's

696
00:40:45,360 --> 00:40:47,760
Speaker 2: not the person I want to be. Guilt is really

697
00:40:47,800 --> 00:40:50,520
Speaker 2: good because you can look back and go, that is

698
00:40:50,680 --> 00:40:53,560
Speaker 2: not acceptable behavior and that's not who you want to be.

699
00:40:54,360 --> 00:40:58,080
Speaker 2: Where shame becomes destructive is it's not about the behavior,

700
00:40:58,120 --> 00:40:59,160
Speaker 2: it's about the person.

701
00:40:59,560 --> 00:41:00,360
Speaker 1: It's about me.

702
00:41:00,840 --> 00:41:04,400
Speaker 2: This is who I am, and I hate that aspect

703
00:41:04,440 --> 00:41:07,280
Speaker 2: of me that's going to come out in really ugly ways,

704
00:41:07,800 --> 00:41:15,520
Speaker 2: either perpetuating that pattern or creating strong suits that are

705
00:41:15,600 --> 00:41:20,040
Speaker 2: not really constructive or even narcissistic traits. To kind of

706
00:41:20,080 --> 00:41:23,719
Speaker 2: deal with that, with that self loathing. Yeah, so, and

707
00:41:24,480 --> 00:41:26,200
Speaker 2: what was the other one you were talking about?

708
00:41:27,600 --> 00:41:30,120
Speaker 1: What you were talking about so self awareness, self loathing,

709
00:41:30,200 --> 00:41:33,000
Speaker 1: self compassion. But what is interesting? As you were talking

710
00:41:33,040 --> 00:41:36,919
Speaker 1: about this, I was thinking, if only we knew someone

711
00:41:36,960 --> 00:41:41,320
Speaker 1: who's doing a PhD in metaperception is understanding that you experience.

712
00:41:42,480 --> 00:41:44,719
Speaker 2: But yeah, that's that guy would have great insights.

713
00:41:45,200 --> 00:41:47,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, well I don't know. I reckon, I reckon, you

714
00:41:47,920 --> 00:41:50,040
Speaker 1: got me covered half the time, more than half the time.

715
00:41:50,080 --> 00:41:53,239
Speaker 1: But yeah, that that that is part of that. I

716
00:41:53,360 --> 00:41:56,760
Speaker 1: talk about that affair bit in you know, in business

717
00:41:56,800 --> 00:42:00,200
Speaker 1: with leaders and with teams and staff, is just just

718
00:42:00,239 --> 00:42:04,560
Speaker 1: even that simple question where people can respond somewhere on

719
00:42:04,560 --> 00:42:09,680
Speaker 1: the scale between fascination and curiosity and anger and defensiveness

720
00:42:09,880 --> 00:42:12,439
Speaker 1: when you say, what do you think it's like being

721
00:42:12,480 --> 00:42:16,400
Speaker 1: around you? And they're like some people are like, oh fuck,

722
00:42:17,400 --> 00:42:20,400
Speaker 1: that's such a good question, and other people are like

723
00:42:21,080 --> 00:42:27,120
Speaker 1: what are you saying? Like your how? How? I'm literally

724
00:42:27,400 --> 00:42:32,880
Speaker 1: just asking you what you think that you experience is

725
00:42:33,120 --> 00:42:36,239
Speaker 1: like for the rest of your workmates or your team

726
00:42:36,320 --> 00:42:38,000
Speaker 1: or your colleague.

727
00:42:37,680 --> 00:42:40,440
Speaker 2: I go, I'm interested in such a great question.

728
00:42:41,200 --> 00:42:44,000
Speaker 1: It's like, just let's not be defensive. Let's not be

729
00:42:44,080 --> 00:42:47,439
Speaker 1: positive negative. Let's be curious, like, what do you think

730
00:42:47,480 --> 00:42:50,279
Speaker 1: that you experience is like? Because I think that's a

731
00:42:50,400 --> 00:42:55,759
Speaker 1: question worth asking and a curiosity worth having and some

732
00:42:55,920 --> 00:43:01,040
Speaker 1: knowledge worth gaining, some insight worth gaining, because you know,

733
00:43:01,280 --> 00:43:05,680
Speaker 1: whatever you think of you isn't more than likely, isn't

734
00:43:05,680 --> 00:43:09,000
Speaker 1: what they think of you? And also how you think

735
00:43:09,040 --> 00:43:13,560
Speaker 1: they see you statistically is very unlikely how they actually

736
00:43:13,600 --> 00:43:19,439
Speaker 1: see you now without feeling judged or evaluated. The more

737
00:43:19,520 --> 00:43:23,400
Speaker 1: insight you have into how other people see you, the

738
00:43:23,440 --> 00:43:27,880
Speaker 1: more accurate insight, the better for you, because now you

739
00:43:27,920 --> 00:43:30,000
Speaker 1: can create a level of connection and a poor and

740
00:43:30,080 --> 00:43:34,160
Speaker 1: trust and interaction that you couldn't without that knowledge, right,

741
00:43:34,760 --> 00:43:37,719
Speaker 1: because you are operating on an erroneo assumption, which is

742
00:43:37,760 --> 00:43:41,680
Speaker 1: called the false consensus effect, that they think like you

743
00:43:42,200 --> 00:43:46,720
Speaker 1: and they don't, so rather than assuming how they think

744
00:43:46,840 --> 00:43:51,600
Speaker 1: or or guessing like lean in you know, and that's

745
00:43:52,400 --> 00:43:55,359
Speaker 1: I'm sure it happens with you. But every time, nearly

746
00:43:55,440 --> 00:43:57,680
Speaker 1: every time I do a corporate gig, I get feedback

747
00:43:58,480 --> 00:44:01,520
Speaker 1: and I get sometimes they say me, all the evaluations,

748
00:44:01,520 --> 00:44:03,960
Speaker 1: it might be one hundred and fifty evaluations that I

749
00:44:04,000 --> 00:44:08,000
Speaker 1: can access online, and I never read one hundred and fifty,

750
00:44:08,000 --> 00:44:11,360
Speaker 1: but I'll often read twenty or thirty or forty. I'm like, oh,

751
00:44:11,719 --> 00:44:13,520
Speaker 1: some of this is really good. Some of this is

752
00:44:13,560 --> 00:44:17,920
Speaker 1: like a little bit emotionally oh olch. But nonetheless, if

753
00:44:17,920 --> 00:44:24,080
Speaker 1: people think something, I actually want to know, because even

754
00:44:24,120 --> 00:44:26,520
Speaker 1: though we like to tell ourselves, oh, I don't give

755
00:44:26,520 --> 00:44:29,719
Speaker 1: a fuck what people think of me, Well, if you

756
00:44:29,880 --> 00:44:32,359
Speaker 1: don't care how people see you or what they think

757
00:44:32,400 --> 00:44:34,840
Speaker 1: of you, you're an idiot because it actually matters in

758
00:44:34,880 --> 00:44:38,279
Speaker 1: the real world. That's not to be obsessed with. Do

759
00:44:38,360 --> 00:44:41,399
Speaker 1: they like me? We're not talking about being insecure, We're

760
00:44:41,560 --> 00:44:46,400
Speaker 1: talking about literally what you're talking about awareness and being informed.

761
00:44:47,840 --> 00:44:51,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, does people's opinion of me inform me or define me?

762
00:44:52,200 --> 00:44:57,200
Speaker 2: Those are two totally different things. Perfect explanation, and you

763
00:44:57,280 --> 00:44:59,960
Speaker 2: can get absorbed in that. When I first started speaking,

764
00:45:00,640 --> 00:45:05,360
Speaker 2: I would go through evals like like like it was

765
00:45:05,920 --> 00:45:08,879
Speaker 2: Crystal Math, not like I haven't offenditedy for Crystal Math.

766
00:45:08,960 --> 00:45:11,319
Speaker 2: I don't, but like someone who has an offended if

767
00:45:11,320 --> 00:45:13,520
Speaker 2: for Crystal Math will go after cross that. I went

768
00:45:13,600 --> 00:45:15,640
Speaker 2: after it like an addict, and I.

769
00:45:15,600 --> 00:45:18,040
Speaker 1: Would work analogy of all time. Can you come up

770
00:45:18,080 --> 00:45:20,680
Speaker 1: with another one that doesn't involve a legal drugs place.

771
00:45:21,560 --> 00:45:23,479
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was, I was. I was like a dog

772
00:45:23,520 --> 00:45:24,120
Speaker 2: on a bone.

773
00:45:24,440 --> 00:45:29,640
Speaker 1: Okay, here you go, here you go, or like me

774
00:45:29,760 --> 00:45:34,839
Speaker 1: in a cake shop? Yeah, may at the talk shop?

775
00:45:35,320 --> 00:45:36,960
Speaker 1: Do they have talk shops? So what do you call

776
00:45:37,000 --> 00:45:39,560
Speaker 1: a you call them a canteen or a chaos? What

777
00:45:39,560 --> 00:45:44,440
Speaker 1: do you call them in the states that that at school? Oh?

778
00:45:44,880 --> 00:45:50,239
Speaker 2: Can it would be a canteen? Or just right, cafeteria?

779
00:45:51,000 --> 00:45:52,880
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, cafeteria. It's funny.

780
00:45:52,920 --> 00:45:54,680
Speaker 2: Canteen is basically the worst.

781
00:45:54,880 --> 00:45:57,400
Speaker 1: Anyway, I digressing touch shop? There you go. What's the

782
00:45:57,520 --> 00:45:59,840
Speaker 1: etymology of tuk shop? Yeah?

783
00:46:00,080 --> 00:46:03,080
Speaker 2: But Gelling, so I would, I would look through everything,

784
00:46:03,160 --> 00:46:07,280
Speaker 2: and mostly I would look for the worst comments.

785
00:46:07,800 --> 00:46:08,520
Speaker 1: Yes, and I would.

786
00:46:08,520 --> 00:46:11,880
Speaker 2: I would just get so hung up on that. And again,

787
00:46:12,200 --> 00:46:14,439
Speaker 2: you know, there's a couple of ways that I look

788
00:46:14,480 --> 00:46:16,000
Speaker 2: at evaluations.

789
00:46:16,040 --> 00:46:16,279
Speaker 1: Now.

790
00:46:16,960 --> 00:46:19,960
Speaker 2: One if I don't if I don't get enough criticism,

791
00:46:20,280 --> 00:46:22,000
Speaker 2: if there's not a few, And I don't want to

792
00:46:22,000 --> 00:46:24,480
Speaker 2: get a ton of criticism because you're there to serve people.

793
00:46:24,800 --> 00:46:27,320
Speaker 2: But if you get one hundred evals back and five

794
00:46:27,440 --> 00:46:30,400
Speaker 2: people do not like what you had to say, you

795
00:46:30,480 --> 00:46:32,640
Speaker 2: really didn't say much at all. Going back to your

796
00:46:32,680 --> 00:46:35,480
Speaker 2: point about what your teacher told you in school. So

797
00:46:35,640 --> 00:46:40,359
Speaker 2: five to ten percent, that's fine. But I would get

798
00:46:40,560 --> 00:46:43,000
Speaker 2: even if ninety percent came back and said, I love

799
00:46:43,080 --> 00:46:46,680
Speaker 2: this presentation, was amazing, and five percent was like, oh

800
00:46:46,719 --> 00:46:49,800
Speaker 2: this was good, it was all right. If five percent

801
00:46:49,800 --> 00:46:52,239
Speaker 2: of the room is like I couldnot stand this guy,

802
00:46:52,719 --> 00:47:00,120
Speaker 2: which happens, I would just ruminate over those. But from me,

803
00:47:00,200 --> 00:47:03,480
Speaker 2: it's like, if I get to like twenty percent of

804
00:47:03,480 --> 00:47:06,560
Speaker 2: people saying the same thing and not not I didn't

805
00:47:06,680 --> 00:47:09,080
Speaker 2: like him. I've had people say it like he talks

806
00:47:09,120 --> 00:47:12,560
Speaker 2: too fast, he doesn't speak fast enough, too many stories,

807
00:47:12,600 --> 00:47:16,799
Speaker 2: not enough stories. You know, he's got Tourette's. It's visibly distracted,

808
00:47:17,080 --> 00:47:20,120
Speaker 2: you know. It's it's like this guy's so short. I

809
00:47:20,120 --> 00:47:22,000
Speaker 2: can't even see him behind the podium. Where is he

810
00:47:22,080 --> 00:47:23,920
Speaker 2: It's like, is there anybody up there at all? You know,

811
00:47:24,000 --> 00:47:27,880
Speaker 2: so you get only just up. Yeah, I'm kind of

812
00:47:27,920 --> 00:47:32,880
Speaker 2: making he embellishes, So all of this criticism, I can't

813
00:47:32,880 --> 00:47:35,320
Speaker 2: do anything with that. But if it's like, well, I

814
00:47:35,360 --> 00:47:39,000
Speaker 2: don't like the way he answers questions, because I feel

815
00:47:40,000 --> 00:47:42,359
Speaker 2: my first question is who else is saying that? Right?

816
00:47:43,200 --> 00:47:45,840
Speaker 2: If it gets to about twenty percent, I need to

817
00:47:45,880 --> 00:47:49,160
Speaker 2: make a change because I'm having a negative impact on

818
00:47:49,280 --> 00:47:52,920
Speaker 2: people if it's kind of like ten percent, Because you

819
00:47:52,960 --> 00:47:55,120
Speaker 2: got to ask, where have I heard this before? Is

820
00:47:55,160 --> 00:47:57,920
Speaker 2: this a patent? You know, if somebody says, well, you

821
00:47:57,960 --> 00:48:00,640
Speaker 2: know what, I think you're rude. If a lot of

822
00:48:00,640 --> 00:48:03,800
Speaker 2: people tell you that, often, I guess what you're probably like.

823
00:48:04,280 --> 00:48:06,600
Speaker 2: You know, if a fight breaks out in every pub

824
00:48:06,680 --> 00:48:10,759
Speaker 2: you go to, you'll have the problem most likely. But

825
00:48:13,760 --> 00:48:17,879
Speaker 2: you've got a weigh that. Because I with the CIA guy,

826
00:48:17,960 --> 00:48:21,560
Speaker 2: this was interesting if I could sum up what he

827
00:48:21,600 --> 00:48:25,640
Speaker 2: said was the most important skill for leadership and in

828
00:48:25,719 --> 00:48:31,560
Speaker 2: the CIA with stakes are really high emotional intelligence. Yeah,

829
00:48:31,640 --> 00:48:35,080
Speaker 2: if I don't understand how I'm affecting you, and I

830
00:48:35,120 --> 00:48:40,160
Speaker 2: don't understand anything about how you're communicating and your experience,

831
00:48:40,760 --> 00:48:43,839
Speaker 2: and I can't adjust to that, there are a lot

832
00:48:43,880 --> 00:48:46,960
Speaker 2: of consequences. I mean, I guess, if you're a spy,

833
00:48:47,160 --> 00:48:52,880
Speaker 2: the consequences are death. I guess if you're working in

834
00:48:52,920 --> 00:48:57,160
Speaker 2: a certain field, the consequences are career death. Eventually, it's

835
00:48:57,200 --> 00:49:01,200
Speaker 2: going to be slower and painful, not as painful, fair enough,

836
00:49:01,360 --> 00:49:07,480
Speaker 2: But you have to navigate through self and other awareness.

837
00:49:08,480 --> 00:49:10,640
Speaker 1: I did a gig for a friend. It was last

838
00:49:10,719 --> 00:49:14,279
Speaker 1: year so I don't know, eight months ago and it

839
00:49:14,320 --> 00:49:15,919
Speaker 1: was a free to a friend of mine who owns

840
00:49:15,960 --> 00:49:22,080
Speaker 1: a gym, and they anyway, it doesn't matter where or

841
00:49:22,080 --> 00:49:26,279
Speaker 1: how are why but anyway, I said, sure, I'll come

842
00:49:26,320 --> 00:49:29,520
Speaker 1: and talk to your members. And I went down and

843
00:49:29,560 --> 00:49:32,080
Speaker 1: they cleared out the Group X room. So there was

844
00:49:32,200 --> 00:49:34,880
Speaker 1: quite a few people, not millions, but I don't know

845
00:49:34,960 --> 00:49:37,759
Speaker 1: eighty people one hundred people in this room sitting on

846
00:49:38,400 --> 00:49:41,800
Speaker 1: fitballs and whatever, sitting on their ass on the ground.

847
00:49:42,280 --> 00:49:43,919
Speaker 1: And I'm there and I'm doing it for nothing because

848
00:49:43,960 --> 00:49:46,640
Speaker 1: I'm trying to be a good human and I'm just

849
00:49:46,800 --> 00:49:48,960
Speaker 1: off and running and I'm doing my thing and creating

850
00:49:48,960 --> 00:49:51,200
Speaker 1: a bit of fun and engagement. People are laughing and

851
00:49:51,600 --> 00:49:55,080
Speaker 1: asking a few questions. Anyway, there's this one dude about

852
00:49:55,080 --> 00:49:57,359
Speaker 1: twenty feet away from me, and he's just looking at

853
00:49:57,400 --> 00:50:03,480
Speaker 1: me like you are a piece of shit. Right. Nearly

854
00:50:03,520 --> 00:50:08,040
Speaker 1: everyone else in the room's nodding, engaging, smiling, and he

855
00:50:08,280 --> 00:50:10,799
Speaker 1: was just giving me daggers. And I'm like, why the

856
00:50:10,840 --> 00:50:13,880
Speaker 1: fuck would you come? I'm thinking to myself, like and

857
00:50:13,960 --> 00:50:18,600
Speaker 1: I was one hundred percent certain he didn't like me,

858
00:50:18,680 --> 00:50:21,600
Speaker 1: and he didn't like what was going on. Almost to

859
00:50:21,640 --> 00:50:25,440
Speaker 1: the point where I wanted to go, Are you okay, Champ, like,

860
00:50:25,760 --> 00:50:30,200
Speaker 1: is there something anyway? Obviously I didn't, but I will

861
00:50:30,239 --> 00:50:34,400
Speaker 1: say it. It didn't derail what I was doing, but

862
00:50:34,480 --> 00:50:38,520
Speaker 1: it certainly distracted me. Right anyway, I got through, and

863
00:50:39,920 --> 00:50:42,920
Speaker 1: you know, they seem to enjoy it. It seemed to land.

864
00:50:43,320 --> 00:50:47,760
Speaker 1: It wasn't my best, it wasn't my worst. Anyway, After

865
00:50:47,840 --> 00:50:50,720
Speaker 1: the thing, people are coming up, asking questions and saying

866
00:50:50,800 --> 00:50:54,560
Speaker 1: nice things and whatever. And anyway, I see this guy

867
00:50:54,800 --> 00:50:57,759
Speaker 1: making his way towards me, and I'm like, oh fuck,

868
00:50:57,840 --> 00:51:01,359
Speaker 1: here we go, here we go. I'm like, all right,

869
00:51:01,400 --> 00:51:04,440
Speaker 1: batten down the hatches. And he holds out his hand

870
00:51:04,480 --> 00:51:08,080
Speaker 1: to shake my hand and misses my hand and then

871
00:51:08,360 --> 00:51:13,560
Speaker 1: tries to locate my hand and his vision impaired. He

872
00:51:13,600 --> 00:51:17,680
Speaker 1: fucking loved me and loved it, and he goes, that

873
00:51:17,880 --> 00:51:25,000
Speaker 1: was brilliant. That was brilliant. So I am completely misreading something.

874
00:51:26,080 --> 00:51:29,160
Speaker 1: I had made all of these stories, I had drawn

875
00:51:29,320 --> 00:51:33,799
Speaker 1: all of these conclusions. I was creating stress for myself.

876
00:51:34,320 --> 00:51:39,240
Speaker 1: I was getting myself anxious and angry. I almost fucking

877
00:51:39,280 --> 00:51:44,480
Speaker 1: stopped myself to I almost like there was actually no problem.

878
00:51:45,120 --> 00:51:49,040
Speaker 1: Not only was there no problem, he loved it. He

879
00:51:49,160 --> 00:51:51,439
Speaker 1: loved it, and he wanted to know where he could

880
00:51:51,520 --> 00:51:53,200
Speaker 1: hear more of me and all this kind of stuff.

881
00:51:53,239 --> 00:51:56,839
Speaker 1: And I just drove home and I'm like, how funny.

882
00:51:56,600 --> 00:51:57,440
Speaker 2: Is that is?

883
00:51:57,600 --> 00:52:01,640
Speaker 1: Like I looked at something, I didn't know what I

884
00:52:01,680 --> 00:52:04,799
Speaker 1: was looking at, I didn't understand what I was looking at,

885
00:52:05,120 --> 00:52:08,640
Speaker 1: and I drew a conclusion and I created a problem

886
00:52:08,719 --> 00:52:09,400
Speaker 1: out of nothing.

887
00:52:10,360 --> 00:52:12,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think we do that often. I kind of

888
00:52:13,120 --> 00:52:16,360
Speaker 2: thought the story was going there, because I think anybody

889
00:52:16,400 --> 00:52:17,799
Speaker 2: who's ever been in front of a room has had

890
00:52:17,800 --> 00:52:21,359
Speaker 2: an experience like that with an individual or a room.

891
00:52:21,480 --> 00:52:23,920
Speaker 2: Maybe you're in a certain part of the country or

892
00:52:23,920 --> 00:52:28,040
Speaker 2: you're a certain part of the world where people are

893
00:52:28,080 --> 00:52:32,480
Speaker 2: not outwardly expressive and they're just sitting there, Like there

894
00:52:32,480 --> 00:52:35,480
Speaker 2: are some countries in the world and you've spoken in them,

895
00:52:35,480 --> 00:52:38,920
Speaker 2: Where don't you dare ask the audience a question because.

896
00:52:38,640 --> 00:52:40,200
Speaker 1: They're just going to look at you.

897
00:52:40,280 --> 00:52:43,560
Speaker 2: No one is going to respond to you, and you're

898
00:52:43,600 --> 00:52:48,080
Speaker 2: making all these assumptions and it's impacting how you're delivering, right,

899
00:52:48,800 --> 00:52:51,200
Speaker 2: And then it turns out they loved you. And the

900
00:52:51,239 --> 00:52:54,759
Speaker 2: opposite happens as well, where people are like laughing and

901
00:52:54,920 --> 00:52:57,440
Speaker 2: oh this audience is amazing, and you get the emails

902
00:52:57,480 --> 00:53:01,000
Speaker 2: back it's like, oh, okay, that was not as impactful

903
00:53:01,080 --> 00:53:04,279
Speaker 2: as as it felt like it was. And we're making

904
00:53:04,320 --> 00:53:07,640
Speaker 2: all these assumptions based on stories. Well, what do you

905
00:53:07,680 --> 00:53:13,040
Speaker 2: think is a good litmus test? Like in the moment, yeah,

906
00:53:13,080 --> 00:53:15,359
Speaker 2: to can't say, okay, how much of this is real?

907
00:53:16,080 --> 00:53:18,480
Speaker 1: I did it. I did a gig last week. I'll

908
00:53:18,520 --> 00:53:20,200
Speaker 1: cut it really short. But it was a bunch of

909
00:53:20,200 --> 00:53:22,480
Speaker 1: people who don't normally do things like this. It was

910
00:53:22,520 --> 00:53:25,600
Speaker 1: a bunch of tradees. Do you use that word in

911
00:53:25,640 --> 00:53:30,280
Speaker 1: the States? Tradees now? So trades people?

912
00:53:31,320 --> 00:53:33,040
Speaker 2: Oh right, okay, yeah.

913
00:53:32,760 --> 00:53:36,520
Speaker 1: So all dudes, all dudes who work as tradesmen, right,

914
00:53:36,840 --> 00:53:41,239
Speaker 1: and so this company had never done any professional development

915
00:53:41,320 --> 00:53:46,360
Speaker 1: and anyway, I'm for me. I before I went in,

916
00:53:46,480 --> 00:53:48,719
Speaker 1: the husband and wife around the company, who by the way,

917
00:53:48,800 --> 00:53:52,920
Speaker 1: were great. They're like, so this first time I've done this,

918
00:53:53,440 --> 00:53:55,600
Speaker 1: And I said, what do they think like? And they,

919
00:53:55,760 --> 00:53:59,000
Speaker 1: to be honest, the guys were not excited, like it

920
00:53:59,080 --> 00:54:04,480
Speaker 1: was just a thing to do. And so in that

921
00:54:04,760 --> 00:54:10,560
Speaker 1: on that day, my litmus test was really just how

922
00:54:10,880 --> 00:54:14,160
Speaker 1: present they were with me and how you know, if

923
00:54:14,200 --> 00:54:16,160
Speaker 1: I got a smile, if I got a head nod.

924
00:54:16,480 --> 00:54:19,160
Speaker 1: It's all those like nuanced little things that you and

925
00:54:19,200 --> 00:54:24,319
Speaker 1: I would notice where you know they're engaged. And also

926
00:54:24,440 --> 00:54:27,400
Speaker 1: I had to I had them from eight thirty and

927
00:54:27,440 --> 00:54:31,840
Speaker 1: to one o'clock, so it's a long time, but knowing

928
00:54:31,880 --> 00:54:35,920
Speaker 1: how to like for me that they'd organize. Okay, you're

929
00:54:35,920 --> 00:54:37,520
Speaker 1: going to start talking at eight, then we're going to

930
00:54:37,600 --> 00:54:40,600
Speaker 1: have a break at quarter past ten. At nine point thirty,

931
00:54:40,640 --> 00:54:43,360
Speaker 1: I'm like, I'm not going for another forty five minutes

932
00:54:43,360 --> 00:54:47,680
Speaker 1: because this is about their cognitive threshold in this environment

933
00:54:47,719 --> 00:54:50,520
Speaker 1: with this kind of thing at the minute, like all

934
00:54:50,560 --> 00:54:53,160
Speaker 1: the signs were there, and I said, all right, boys,

935
00:54:53,160 --> 00:54:55,320
Speaker 1: so we're just going to have a little break five minutes.

936
00:54:56,360 --> 00:54:58,480
Speaker 1: Check your phone, have a we have a drink, whatever

937
00:54:58,520 --> 00:55:01,600
Speaker 1: you need to do. And so I just broke it

938
00:55:01,680 --> 00:55:03,680
Speaker 1: up that way where we did about four or five

939
00:55:03,800 --> 00:55:08,400
Speaker 1: fifty minute installments rather than these two hour pre planned slabs,

940
00:55:08,440 --> 00:55:11,600
Speaker 1: which would not have worked. So for me, it's about that,

941
00:55:11,800 --> 00:55:14,080
Speaker 1: I mean, And I think the opposite of that is

942
00:55:14,800 --> 00:55:17,000
Speaker 1: if there are people looking at their phone, for me,

943
00:55:17,120 --> 00:55:21,359
Speaker 1: that's a that's a big red flag. That's that's an

944
00:55:22,040 --> 00:55:24,960
Speaker 1: I've I've Fortunately, I don't get very much of that.

945
00:55:25,080 --> 00:55:28,239
Speaker 1: But I have been in presentations where it feels like

946
00:55:28,400 --> 00:55:31,440
Speaker 1: half the rumors on their phone and not looking at

947
00:55:31,440 --> 00:55:35,000
Speaker 1: the speaker, and I just my heart goes out to them,

948
00:55:35,000 --> 00:55:38,080
Speaker 1: because that is tough, because you can't you can't crack

949
00:55:38,120 --> 00:55:40,160
Speaker 1: the shits and tell people not to look at their

950
00:55:40,160 --> 00:55:42,959
Speaker 1: phone when you're talking to a room full of adults.

951
00:55:43,719 --> 00:55:46,840
Speaker 2: Now, but that is that's the thing, Like I'm always saying,

952
00:55:47,719 --> 00:55:51,520
Speaker 2: just observe what you're observing. Everything else is just a story.

953
00:55:52,120 --> 00:55:54,760
Speaker 2: But that is a little bit rude though, Like because

954
00:55:54,800 --> 00:55:57,719
Speaker 2: on the one hand, it's like, if you're having a conversation,

955
00:55:58,000 --> 00:56:03,000
Speaker 2: that works, but there are certain rules of social etiquette

956
00:56:03,000 --> 00:56:03,600
Speaker 2: you don't do that.

957
00:56:04,800 --> 00:56:05,000
Speaker 3: You know.

958
00:56:05,040 --> 00:56:08,000
Speaker 1: It's just like, wow, I agree with you. But I

959
00:56:08,040 --> 00:56:11,000
Speaker 1: think if you're on stage and you go a version

960
00:56:11,040 --> 00:56:13,600
Speaker 1: of how you people looking at your phone, I'm talking,

961
00:56:13,680 --> 00:56:16,680
Speaker 1: that's rude. You look like a fucking EADI.

962
00:56:16,680 --> 00:56:18,960
Speaker 2: Oh god, yeah, no, you just first of all, you

963
00:56:19,120 --> 00:56:21,319
Speaker 2: just took low status in front of the room and

964
00:56:21,400 --> 00:56:26,520
Speaker 2: not and not in a way that is effective, like

965
00:56:28,200 --> 00:56:31,120
Speaker 2: the way now you're the insecure knob in front of

966
00:56:31,160 --> 00:56:34,279
Speaker 2: the room. So you just made yourself really small. I

967
00:56:34,680 --> 00:56:37,720
Speaker 2: had a friend of mine who someone's phone went off

968
00:56:38,040 --> 00:56:40,920
Speaker 2: in the middle of a lecture, and this lady is

969
00:56:41,560 --> 00:56:47,360
Speaker 2: like quick as anything, and she's super charismatic, lodging life.

970
00:56:47,760 --> 00:56:50,839
Speaker 2: And he goes to answer it in the middle of

971
00:56:50,840 --> 00:56:53,319
Speaker 2: her presentation. And this wasn't like twenty people in room.

972
00:56:53,560 --> 00:56:56,359
Speaker 2: It's like four hundred people in a room, like a

973
00:56:56,440 --> 00:57:01,960
Speaker 2: massive presentation. She's doing her thing. She sees this, flies

974
00:57:02,480 --> 00:57:06,560
Speaker 2: straight down like she's walking towards them, and then walks

975
00:57:06,640 --> 00:57:08,799
Speaker 2: past them but grabs his phone and she's like, Hi,

976
00:57:08,920 --> 00:57:10,560
Speaker 2: this is well, I'm not going to say her name,

977
00:57:10,800 --> 00:57:12,919
Speaker 2: This is so and so. How you doing. Oh yeah,

978
00:57:13,120 --> 00:57:16,080
Speaker 2: so we're having we're having a seminar. So who are

979
00:57:16,080 --> 00:57:17,800
Speaker 2: you looking for? Oh yeah, he can't come to the

980
00:57:17,800 --> 00:57:20,880
Speaker 2: phone right now. And it was just so funny. It

981
00:57:21,000 --> 00:57:23,920
Speaker 2: was such a boss move. But because she was like

982
00:57:24,040 --> 00:57:29,120
Speaker 2: cracking jokes, the whole room is laughing. She owned it

983
00:57:28,800 --> 00:57:31,400
Speaker 2: and it was It was just brilliant because like, you're

984
00:57:31,440 --> 00:57:36,400
Speaker 2: going to take a call in the middle of someone's session.

985
00:57:36,720 --> 00:57:41,640
Speaker 1: Well speaking about emotional intelligence and social awareness and situational awareness.

986
00:57:41,720 --> 00:57:43,680
Speaker 1: I mean, that's the that's the fucking one out of

987
00:57:43,720 --> 00:57:47,000
Speaker 1: ten version. Mate, We're gonna fly. I love chatting to you.

988
00:57:47,160 --> 00:57:50,120
Speaker 1: I'm glad that you've moved across the car I'm glad

989
00:57:50,120 --> 00:57:52,919
Speaker 1: that you've moved across the car park. We all feel

990
00:57:52,960 --> 00:57:56,960
Speaker 1: so much better. Uh, congrats on your fake bricks. They

991
00:57:56,960 --> 00:58:01,360
Speaker 1: look beautiful. How do people find you and connect with you,

992
00:58:01,440 --> 00:58:02,160
Speaker 1: my friend.

993
00:58:02,560 --> 00:58:04,680
Speaker 2: Well, they can just reach out to you, because clearly

994
00:58:04,720 --> 00:58:11,720
Speaker 2: you tell everybody everything. So yeah, they can get me

995
00:58:11,800 --> 00:58:15,960
Speaker 2: on Robert Capuccio dot com, the self help antidote dot com.

996
00:58:16,280 --> 00:58:17,960
Speaker 2: I'm on LinkedIn, You're.

997
00:58:17,880 --> 00:58:20,000
Speaker 1: On all of it. We'll say goodbye here, but my

998
00:58:20,160 --> 00:58:20,920
Speaker 1: thanks again.

999
00:58:21,080 --> 00:58:23,880
Speaker 2: Thank you everyone, Thank you. Craig Jeers,