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Speaker 1: Appoge Production. Well, welcome to episode two of The Missing Matter.

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Speaker 1: Ar'm here with Joony. Hello everybody, Thank you for joining

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Speaker 1: us again. Yeah, thanks for joining us. And in this episode,

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Speaker 1: we're actually going to do a bit of a deep

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Speaker 1: dive into the drama that was my life following the

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Speaker 1: findings concluding in February last year. And if I think

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Speaker 1: back to that time, I literally felt like I was

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Speaker 1: standing on an island by myself and I know you

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Speaker 1: were there, and I know Chris was there, and there

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Speaker 1: were beautiful people around me. That's nothing to do with you, guys.

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Speaker 1: It was just my inner self. Felt like. I spoke

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Speaker 1: to the lawyers, that was the last time I spoke

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Speaker 1: to them. I spoke to the Crown Solicitor's office. They

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Speaker 1: all gave me a big hug and wished me well,

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Speaker 1: and that was it. Allison and Brian did their interview

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Speaker 1: and left. It just doesn't stop just because we got

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Speaker 1: an answer today from the coroner and I was like,

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Speaker 1: oh my god, I'm standing here by myself. I don't

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Speaker 1: have any idea what to do moving forward. There is

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Speaker 1: no guidebook here, so the coroner hands down her findings.

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Speaker 1: Coroner's just told me officially my mum's deceased, says what

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Speaker 1: she thinks should happen.

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Speaker 2: Recommending it now be referred to homicide detectives.

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Speaker 1: That's it. You sort of left to sort of fumble

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Speaker 1: your way through and work out what's actually happened.

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Speaker 2: She'd been dating a man named Rick Bloom, who lied

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Speaker 2: about his identity. She found Bloom preyed on vulnerable women

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Speaker 2: and withheld crucial information about Marian from the inquest.

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Speaker 1: I haven't even had an apology, if I can put it,

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Speaker 1: put it out there, you know, I still haven't from

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Speaker 1: the police, had any apology for how I've been treated.

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Speaker 1: In my case, I heard that my mum would deceased

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Speaker 1: for the first time in twenty seven years of her

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Speaker 1: being missing, and that was massive for me. It was

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Speaker 1: a huge moment in time, and by having that said

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Speaker 1: by the coroner that allowed me to apply for a

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Speaker 1: death certificate, which when you have a missing person, if

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Speaker 1: you don't have a death certificate or they don't believe

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Speaker 1: that your person is deceased, well you've got no chance

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Speaker 1: of getting any information because their privacy matters. I kept

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Speaker 1: getting told a comment that really rolled me a lot through.

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Speaker 1: This whole thing is it's not a crime to go missing.

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Speaker 1: And I think about all the people who have gone

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Speaker 1: missing and then found, and the time that the police

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Speaker 1: spend trying to find and there's yellow alerts and there's

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Speaker 1: police fluffing around. It takes time and energy and money

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Speaker 1: to do these things. So essentially having a death certificate

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Speaker 1: was a really important part of this journey for you

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Speaker 1: and me when we were discussing what still needed to

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Speaker 1: be done, Because what people who are listening won't know

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Speaker 1: is that you and I were sitting in the court

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Speaker 1: and we were feeding the lawyers all the information that

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Speaker 1: we had. We'd spoken to people, we've interviewed people, We've

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Speaker 1: got all the details, and we had to do that

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Speaker 1: because the police weren't doing it and we were writing

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Speaker 1: dossier's Like Johnny Gosh, by the time we'd finished, we

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Speaker 1: probably had a law degree. Seriously, you know, I've learned

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Speaker 1: so much in this time, in this space, But you

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Speaker 1: get to that point, or I got to that point

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Speaker 1: where I walked out of the coroner's court and went right, oh,

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Speaker 1: what do I do now? My first point of call

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Speaker 1: was to call burst Essa Marriages and ask them to

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Speaker 1: help me to get a death certificate. For my mum

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Speaker 1: so we could start accessing her private information. So I

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Speaker 1: called Queensland and they said, well, we're really sorry, we

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Speaker 1: can't help you. You've got to do it online and

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Speaker 1: I said, yeah, but your online document doesn't allow me

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Speaker 1: to put two names. And I have a problem where

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Speaker 1: my mum changed her name, but she only changed her

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Speaker 1: name legally on her passport and she had an international

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Speaker 1: driver's license in the new name of Florabella Ramkel. Everything

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Speaker 1: else remained in the name of Barta, her bank accounts,

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Speaker 1: her superannuation, her medicare, anything that I wanted to try

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Speaker 1: and gain access to to find out her tax return.

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Speaker 1: In the taxi ba Ato, everyone knew her as Marian Barter,

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Speaker 1: so it was essential. And I kept saying this and

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Speaker 1: barking about it at the inquest, and that's why the

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Speaker 1: coroner kept saying Flora Bella Natalia Marian Ramkeel, formerly known

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Speaker 1: as Marian Barter. So I was banging my head against

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Speaker 1: the wall. I was in tears a lot of the

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Speaker 1: time because none of these people showed any compassion or

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Speaker 1: empathy or understanding about what it was that I was

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Speaker 1: trying to ask. Goodness, I don't even know where to

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Speaker 1: start with this week. Seriously, you know, when you're dealing

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Speaker 1: with a missing person, that is horrendous to sit there.

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Speaker 1: I'm going, I don't know where my mum is, I

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Speaker 1: don't have a funeral director, i don't know what day

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Speaker 1: she died. I've got a date from the coroner who's

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Speaker 1: saying she died on or around the fifteenth of October,

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Speaker 1: so I'm assuming that's the date you want. And that

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Speaker 1: wasn't satisfactory. So nothing was working. So then I rang

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Speaker 1: the coroner's court and for some weird instance of craziness,

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Speaker 1: I find out that Coroner Teresa o Sullivan actually has

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Speaker 1: her own dedicated team of people, and I'm like, wow.

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Speaker 1: So I've just been through the coroner's process for three

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Speaker 1: years and I never knew that I could contact Terresa

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Speaker 1: O'Sullivan's team. I always had to go through it through

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Speaker 1: the right channels, is what I was told. So that

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Speaker 1: meant I had to go through my lawyers, to go

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Speaker 1: through their lawyers being Crown solicitors, to go through the police.

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Speaker 1: If I had something for the police, the police would

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Speaker 1: tell me, you have to go through the right channel.

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Speaker 1: Sally can't tell us anything anymore. It's got to go

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Speaker 1: through your lawyers to Crown solicitors to get to us,

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Speaker 1: and I was just like, this is so convoluted and

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Speaker 1: ridiculous and time wasting, like we do not have time

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Speaker 1: for this, especially after waiting that long to actually even

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Speaker 1: get to the point of having an inquest right. So

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Speaker 1: I was speaking to the Coroner's court. I end up

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Speaker 1: emailing him back and forth and he's like, I'm really sorry,

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Speaker 1: I can't help you. My question to him was I

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Speaker 1: need the coroner to put in writing for me some

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Speaker 1: sort of document so that I can go to Burst

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Speaker 1: Desca Marriages and get a death certificate for my mum

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Speaker 1: because at this point no one's giving me one. And

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Speaker 1: I didn't know whether to go to Queensland because that's

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Speaker 1: where she was last living as we changed her name

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Speaker 1: and she changed her name in Queensland, or did I

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Speaker 1: have to go to New South Wales because it was

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Speaker 1: with the New South Wales Coroner's Court she said that

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Speaker 1: she's deceased and she was last known to be in

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Speaker 1: Byron with drawing eighty thousand dollars out of a bank account,

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Speaker 1: supposedly on the fifteenth of October nineteen ninety seven, and

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Speaker 1: her last digital footprints were in New South Wales, so

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Speaker 1: very confusing. And again someone should have sat there and

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Speaker 1: said to me, this is the process, now, this is

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Speaker 1: what we need to do, will help you. But I

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Speaker 1: didn't get any of that, and I'm sure I'm not

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Speaker 1: the only one in these circumstances. After hitting brick walls

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Speaker 1: with them again, I just had a bit of a

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Speaker 1: light bulb moment. And you know, there's that saying in life,

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Speaker 1: it's not what you know, it's too you know, right,

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Speaker 1: And this is definitely definitely the point in toe because

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Speaker 1: while I was sitting into in the findings, so we've

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Speaker 1: just walked in, We're sitting down therese people everywhere, media everywhere,

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Speaker 1: and I'm flustered. I'm like, wow, I'm overwhelmed, super grateful

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Speaker 1: for the support by everyone, but overwhelmed at the same time.

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Speaker 1: And a lady who i'll keep her name confidential, but

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Speaker 1: she did come up to me and she said hello, Sally,

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Speaker 1: and I went, oh, my gosh, how are you. And

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Speaker 1: this lady had welcomed me to come to the coroner's

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Speaker 1: court back in twenty nineteen, and I met with her

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Speaker 1: and another lady from friends and family of missing persons

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Speaker 1: so that was the first I'd ever heard that there

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Speaker 1: was actually this little body of good humans who actually

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Speaker 1: were supporting people with missing persons. And she'd done a

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Speaker 1: document and a booklet to help people get through the

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Speaker 1: coronial process. And so I had met her back at

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Speaker 1: that point, and she was a very kind lady. She

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Speaker 1: gave me information, she answered my emails, which was a

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Speaker 1: very rare thing for me. So I was like, oh

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Speaker 1: my god, I finally found somebody who actually does listen

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Speaker 1: and does actually respond positively, which was great. So I

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Speaker 1: just had this moment in my head, maybe I should

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Speaker 1: ring her. I still had her number, and I did,

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Speaker 1: and I explained the situation to her, and I said,

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Speaker 1: I need some help. I need the coroner's court to

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Speaker 1: be able to give birth, dess and marriage as a

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Speaker 1: clear understanding of what is going on in this space.

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Speaker 1: That I can have both mum's names put on her

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Speaker 1: death certificate. It's essential for this. Why did you need

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Speaker 1: to have that happen? Well, because I needed to have

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Speaker 1: access to I mentioned before, like Medicare and ATO and

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Speaker 1: her bank accounts and her superannuation. They're all in marrying Barta.

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Speaker 1: But essentially we were wanting to go overseas and we

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Speaker 1: needed to get information about my mum and her passport

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Speaker 1: was in the name of Florabella Ramckel, so I needed

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Speaker 1: to be able to prove that I was next to

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Speaker 1: kin and I had grant of access to Florabella Ramckel

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Speaker 1: and also Marian Barter, so that's why it was really important.

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Speaker 1: And then we are on the phone. I'm explaining this

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Speaker 1: to her. She's completely understanding what I'm saying, and she says,

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Speaker 1: I can see that that is really important. I know

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Speaker 1: someone I'm going to send them corners findings and that

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Speaker 1: will be clear to them. And then I had a

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Speaker 1: phone call from a gentleman who worked in New South

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Speaker 1: Wales birth deaths and marriages, and I just felt like

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Speaker 1: he was an angel for me, because again a rare

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Speaker 1: moment where someone actually comes in and just sits down

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Speaker 1: and takes time to actually help me do what I

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Speaker 1: need to do. And he sat on the phone with

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Speaker 1: me for probably the best part of two hours, and

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Speaker 1: he explained to me, I want you to fill it

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Speaker 1: out your end, and I'm going to fill it out

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Speaker 1: my end as well. And so we were word perfect

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Speaker 1: going through the entire document and he said I want

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Speaker 1: you to word it exactly like this, so it was

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Speaker 1: worded such as surname ramakerl formally known as Bart. Given

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Speaker 1: name Flora Bella, formerly known as Marian. Middle names you know,

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Speaker 1: Natalia Mary and formally known as Marian. So we had

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Speaker 1: to make sure that his document and my document areligned.

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Speaker 1: And thank god I had him because at the end

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Speaker 1: of the day, there was questions in there about what

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Speaker 1: date did and this was for all, like my mum

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Speaker 1: was married three times and this caused a big drama

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Speaker 1: and a big stir because the police would often say

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Speaker 1: comments like, oh, well, she's a three times divorced woman

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Speaker 1: who's in her fifties. She's capable of this behavior, not

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Speaker 1: her fault. You know, no one should make judgment on

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Speaker 1: those sorts of things. But it has caused me quite

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Speaker 1: the drama because she's had multiple names, and I had

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Speaker 1: to know the day they all got married, So every

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Speaker 1: single wedding, I had to know what each of the

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Speaker 1: men's full names were. Yes, so I needed to know

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Speaker 1: what Johnny Warren's middle name is, how old he was

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Speaker 1: when they got married, what is his date of birth,

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Speaker 1: what year did they get married, and where where was

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Speaker 1: the location? As they got married. I'm like, I don't

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Speaker 1: know any of this. So he was able to pull

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Speaker 1: up mum's file from their end and actually add it

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Speaker 1: into the mix. And I was like, thank God, Like

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Speaker 1: I would just be absolutely stuck if you had not

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Speaker 1: been able to help me with that. So he was

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Speaker 1: a godsend. And he's like, you just have to pay

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Speaker 1: for it and you'll get the desert to figot like

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Speaker 1: it's going to come as per this. And he was

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Speaker 1: an age, so I was really grateful and that was awesome.

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Speaker 3: Because ultimately, if he hadn't have helped you, then you

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Speaker 3: would have had to have requested all of those documents

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Speaker 3: from birth, deaths and marriages to be able to then

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Speaker 3: put the information into your form to then send it in.

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Speaker 3: So that would have been a delay and lots of money,

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Speaker 3: and whether you would have got them or not is

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Speaker 3: another question altogether.

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Speaker 1: And this is how ridiculous it is. Right. So, and

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Speaker 1: this is another drama because my mum went missing before

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Speaker 1: I got married. So my name is Barta because I

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Speaker 1: took on Ray Barta's name when I was only twelve.

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Speaker 1: They thought that was a good idea because we'd relocated.

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Speaker 1: I was starting a new school, so I was known

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Speaker 1: as Sally Barter, and Mum had written her will and

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Speaker 1: I was known as Sally Barter in the will. So

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Speaker 1: that meant that when I'm applying for these documents and

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Speaker 1: I'm now Sally Layden, I then had to go and

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Speaker 1: get an official marriage certificate, which we paid for to

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Speaker 1: be able to show that I was Bart and now

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Speaker 1: I'm Leyden. So it just never ended. It was just

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Speaker 1: this big starter's web of crazy that I was getting

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Speaker 1: stuck in, and I'm like, I don't know, I've got

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Speaker 1: to pay for this. I've got to pay for that.

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Speaker 1: I've got to jump through this hoop and jump through

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Speaker 1: that hoop. And this just continued for months. So I've

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Speaker 1: gone to the post office and there's a registered male

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Speaker 1: waiting for me at the post office and I get

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Speaker 1: in it and I'm sitting in the car and I

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Speaker 1: open it and I had to share it with everyone

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Speaker 1: immediately and post about it and say, oh my god,

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Speaker 1: I got it. And it's in both names. Massive, It's

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Speaker 1: actually good. The spelling's correct, her date of birth is correct.

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Speaker 1: Like all the things that we've had challenges with throughout

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Speaker 1: the whole journey, highlight it doesn't need to come out.

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Speaker 1: Goodness me. I'll read you with the post, just to

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Speaker 1: bring us all back to where I was and how

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Speaker 1: I was feeling in that moment. So it was the

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Speaker 1: tenth of April twenty twenty four. I just posted a

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Speaker 1: photo of the death certificate that shows the family name.

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Speaker 1: It says deceased. It says family name Ramichel formerly known

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Speaker 1: as Barta Flora Bella Natalia. Marian formerly known as Marian

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Speaker 1: Sometime on or around the fifteenth of October nineteen ninety

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Speaker 1: seven is her date of death. Her place of death

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Speaker 1: unable to determine sex and age female fifty two. Place

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Speaker 1: of birth Marrickville, New South Wales. I write from my

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Speaker 1: missing person Marian Barter Instagram and Facebook. I want to

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Speaker 1: share with you all I finally received Mum's death certificate

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Speaker 1: dot dot dot. As always, there's a story to tell.

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Speaker 1: I am sure you'll all feel so relieved to see

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Speaker 1: both names have been included. This did not come without

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Speaker 1: a fight. So I now have the death certificate in

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Speaker 1: both names and the will another bittersweet day but very important.

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Speaker 1: I found the solicitor you did. How that came about

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Speaker 1: was I did a walk around on the Gold Coast,

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Speaker 1: if you remember, that's right. And I just had it

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Speaker 1: in me that I needed to find the a state agent.

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Speaker 1: So we had that lady actually up in cans who Yes,

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Speaker 1: that's how we found this because she actually did the

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Speaker 1: property search and she was able to tell us that

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Speaker 1: the name of the person who bought Mum's house yes,

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Speaker 1: And then from that the girls Le Sluthy Girls actually

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Speaker 1: then found a whole bunch of people with that same

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Speaker 1: name who still lived on the Gold Coast. And miraculously,

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Speaker 1: the first person I called was the guy who bought

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Speaker 1: Mum's house. I then sort of went through the process

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Speaker 1: of him trying to work out where the real estate

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Speaker 1: agent was that he had the house from, because I

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Speaker 1: had always said that maybe Mum had explained to the

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Speaker 1: real estate agent what she was doing, and she had

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Speaker 1: actually kept all the records in her garage. She just

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Speaker 1: sold the business and the guys who when I worked

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Speaker 1: out where it was, so he couldn't remember where it was.

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Speaker 1: I sort of just went and did a walk around

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Speaker 1: and asked the question and they said, yes, we've just

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Speaker 1: bought it from Partner Royalty, and they said, let me

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Speaker 1: ring Louise because she said that she's got a whole

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Speaker 1: bunch of all her documents from all the houses she's

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Speaker 1: sold in the years. So she gave me those documents

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Speaker 1: and I was able to see on there that there

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Speaker 1: was a document that had the solicitor's name on it,

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Speaker 1: and so I rang them and when I spoke to him,

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Speaker 1: he said, oh, I've heard about your mom's story in

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Speaker 1: the news. I knew your mum. She taught my son

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Speaker 1: at TSS. And so he said, when my secretary comes back,

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Speaker 1: I'll get her to have a look and i'll get

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Speaker 1: her to ring you if we have anything. I don't

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Speaker 1: remember having anything, but if we do, And he literally

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Speaker 1: rang me back in a minute and said, oh my god,

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Speaker 1: I've just had a look and we have her will,

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Speaker 1: which is weird because we don't even do wills. But

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Speaker 1: he was unable to give me that well without a

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Speaker 1: de certificate. So even though my mum is missing, my

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Speaker 1: brother is deceased, and he is the only other person

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Speaker 1: on the will, he was still unable to He told

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Speaker 1: me about it, but he didn't actually give me the

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Speaker 1: original copy until such time as I had the destiny.

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Speaker 1: So you know, you got to go through these processes, right,

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Speaker 1: So and if you hadn't have done all of that

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Speaker 1: and all the circles and looping looping, then we would

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Speaker 1: have been looking at the will that she made down

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Speaker 1: in New South Wales.

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Speaker 3: So this was a new will that you happened to

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Speaker 3: discover with all of your So there's been so many

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Speaker 3: instances of that kind of thing over the years.

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Speaker 1: And the will didn't even matter really because the house

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Speaker 1: that she sold was in the will. I was executor

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Speaker 1: of the will to what to nothing. Everything's missing or

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00:17:32,041 --> 00:17:36,880
Speaker 1: stolen or gone sold. So there was literally nothing in

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Speaker 1: the will except to show that she had nominated me

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Speaker 1: as executor, and you know I was her next of kin,

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Speaker 1: so that did give me somewhare power to be able

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Speaker 1: to go and get these documents and you know that

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Speaker 1: had nearly a thousand people like it and comment on

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Speaker 1: it and just showing the power of actually pushing forward

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Speaker 1: and still getting and garnering something that I really really needed.

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Speaker 1: So from there we did some live shows, right, and

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Speaker 1: that was just my mind, like that is that is

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Speaker 1: an amazing time in life. I just was shocked and

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00:18:09,681 --> 00:18:11,721
Speaker 1: blown away by those shows.

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Speaker 2: From Salad Jone where they are at and about their plans.

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Speaker 2: Really bored now the inquest has concluded and the search continues.

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Speaker 1: Buying Marry now there do please welcome. Sal was a

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Speaker 1: good energy from there. We did a raffle and I

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00:18:38,921 --> 00:18:40,840
Speaker 1: was a bit crazy on the raffle because I love

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Speaker 1: doing things like that and I love people winning things

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Speaker 1: and prizes, and it was just a good fundraiser for

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Speaker 1: us as part of the live events. And there were

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Speaker 1: two ladies who won gifts and I emailed them and

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Speaker 1: then they came back to me with an email, and

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Speaker 1: some of them I spoke to and one of the

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Speaker 1: ladies said to me, you've actually emailed myself and one

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Speaker 1: of my friends. We both came to the show in

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Speaker 1: Brisbane and we've both won a prize and I said,

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Speaker 1: oh amazing. Would you like me to hand deliver it

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00:19:12,120 --> 00:19:14,681
Speaker 1: to you? And they agreed and said yeah, let's meet

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Speaker 1: for coffee. So we met for coffee down at the

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00:19:17,561 --> 00:19:21,041
Speaker 1: gas works here in Brisbane and I'm in my very

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Speaker 1: casual shorts and T shirt and they rocked up in

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Speaker 1: suits and I went, holy, okay, this is very official.

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Speaker 1: And then they said, oh, let us buy you a

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Speaker 1: coffee and so we just sat there having a chat.

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Speaker 1: And turns out that their lawyers, and they said to me,

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00:19:36,160 --> 00:19:38,120
Speaker 1: we've spoken to our boss and we've asked can we

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Speaker 1: help you to get your grant of probate? And I went, oh,

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Speaker 1: my god, I feel so blessed that there are such

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Speaker 1: nice people in this world, because when I've just gone

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00:19:48,880 --> 00:19:51,880
Speaker 1: through all of that, to have someone in power and

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00:19:51,921 --> 00:19:54,801
Speaker 1: who knows what they're doing and the knowledge that I

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00:19:55,001 --> 00:19:58,001
Speaker 1: just don't have, and even just to take a little

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00:19:58,041 --> 00:20:00,960
Speaker 1: bit of energy from my self and give it to

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00:20:01,001 --> 00:20:02,761
Speaker 1: somebody else to be able to go, you can take

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00:20:02,801 --> 00:20:06,521
Speaker 1: that on a little bit for me. Amazing. So once again,

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00:20:06,640 --> 00:20:09,640
Speaker 1: good humans coming out in every form. So I worked

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00:20:09,640 --> 00:20:13,001
Speaker 1: with those beautiful humans for a couple of months and

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00:20:13,241 --> 00:20:16,400
Speaker 1: we sorted out getting the grant of probate done. And

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Speaker 1: then the most shocking thing that I was so shocked

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Speaker 1: about for me personally and quite devastated, was that the

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Speaker 1: Supreme Court demands that you actually give them the death

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Speaker 1: certificate for them to be able to process the grant

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00:20:31,360 --> 00:20:34,801
Speaker 1: of probate. So I've physically just got this piece of

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00:20:34,880 --> 00:20:37,281
Speaker 1: paper that I have been eager to get so I

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00:20:37,321 --> 00:20:41,640
Speaker 1: can access information about my mum. And then they're like,

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00:20:41,721 --> 00:20:44,160
Speaker 1: we need to give them the original so then I

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00:20:44,201 --> 00:20:46,241
Speaker 1: had to run off and go and get them all

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00:20:46,281 --> 00:20:49,521
Speaker 1: certified and make sure I had copies of everything. Right,

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00:20:50,080 --> 00:20:52,161
Speaker 1: So I've got them all certified and I hand over

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00:20:52,201 --> 00:20:54,440
Speaker 1: that precious document, said, here you go, he's the de

385
00:20:54,521 --> 00:20:57,240
Speaker 1: certificate that I just worked really hard to get. You

386
00:20:57,281 --> 00:20:59,521
Speaker 1: can have the original. I now don't have a copy

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00:20:59,561 --> 00:21:02,001
Speaker 1: of the destinicate, but I did get the grant of

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00:21:02,080 --> 00:21:06,241
Speaker 1: probate certificate from the Supreme Court. So on the second

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00:21:06,281 --> 00:21:09,440
Speaker 1: of August twenty twenty four is the day that I

390
00:21:09,561 --> 00:21:11,600
Speaker 1: received the grant of probate. And for those of you

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00:21:11,640 --> 00:21:14,721
Speaker 1: who haven't connected that dot Mum actually flew back into

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00:21:14,721 --> 00:21:17,960
Speaker 1: Australia on the second of August nineteen ninety seven. But

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00:21:18,321 --> 00:21:21,840
Speaker 1: a granted probate is really important because it opens the doors.

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00:21:21,880 --> 00:21:25,121
Speaker 1: So it actually makes me the next of kin with

395
00:21:25,160 --> 00:21:28,241
Speaker 1: my missing mother who's been declared de ceased by the coroner.

396
00:21:28,681 --> 00:21:32,521
Speaker 1: Gives me access to her information for things like I

397
00:21:32,561 --> 00:21:35,480
Speaker 1: can go and act on her behalf with the ATO,

398
00:21:35,521 --> 00:21:38,281
Speaker 1: I can go and act on her behalf for Medicare.

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00:21:38,681 --> 00:21:41,681
Speaker 1: And the information that we wanted to get from those

400
00:21:41,761 --> 00:21:45,161
Speaker 1: sources and from those entities is important because it could

401
00:21:45,160 --> 00:21:48,480
Speaker 1: have led us down a path to having knowledge and

402
00:21:48,561 --> 00:21:52,881
Speaker 1: information about what she did, where she was, what was happening,

403
00:21:53,281 --> 00:21:57,240
Speaker 1: her location addresses and things like that, which is what

404
00:21:57,281 --> 00:22:01,281
Speaker 1: we were hoping to get from those certificates. And also

405
00:22:01,441 --> 00:22:03,840
Speaker 1: it does enable you to access a lot of the

406
00:22:03,921 --> 00:22:08,480
Speaker 1: Commonwealth base information that even the New South Wales Police

407
00:22:08,561 --> 00:22:10,321
Speaker 1: can't access. Yeah, that's right.

408
00:22:10,441 --> 00:22:12,600
Speaker 3: So it really did unlock a bit of a key,

409
00:22:12,961 --> 00:22:15,400
Speaker 3: and that's why you really wanted it to happen.

410
00:22:15,481 --> 00:22:17,721
Speaker 1: And you think about things like when I found out

411
00:22:18,001 --> 00:22:21,001
Speaker 1: about mum's name change. If you go back and listen

412
00:22:21,001 --> 00:22:23,201
Speaker 1: to the last episode, you would have heard me say

413
00:22:23,681 --> 00:22:26,761
Speaker 1: and I saw her name for a bleeping second. I

414
00:22:26,801 --> 00:22:30,120
Speaker 1: saw it probably for two minutes. And I was spelling

415
00:22:30,120 --> 00:22:33,321
Speaker 1: it phonetically for years. Even on my Facebook page, I'm

416
00:22:33,360 --> 00:22:37,521
Speaker 1: spelling it as Ramckel, not Reemckel. I was spelling it

417
00:22:37,561 --> 00:22:40,360
Speaker 1: with an A, not an E. So we got to

418
00:22:40,441 --> 00:22:43,041
Speaker 1: a point we'd started the podcast The Lady Vanishes, and

419
00:22:43,041 --> 00:22:46,001
Speaker 1: we were going along and I'd met you, and then

420
00:22:46,001 --> 00:22:48,561
Speaker 1: I learned about archives. I didn't know that that was

421
00:22:48,561 --> 00:22:50,401
Speaker 1: a big thing and we could ring them and converse

422
00:22:50,441 --> 00:22:54,680
Speaker 1: with them, and so I rang Queensland Archives and I said, Hi, there,

423
00:22:55,080 --> 00:22:57,801
Speaker 1: my mum is a missing person and she changed her

424
00:22:57,880 --> 00:23:02,200
Speaker 1: name to this name, Ramckeurl. I'm just wondering if you

425
00:23:02,241 --> 00:23:04,760
Speaker 1: can help me with the correct spelling. I just want

426
00:23:04,801 --> 00:23:07,441
Speaker 1: to make I've got the spelling right. And she said

427
00:23:07,441 --> 00:23:10,400
Speaker 1: to me, I'm really sorry, we can't give you that

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00:23:10,400 --> 00:23:14,360
Speaker 1: information due to privacy. And I said, okay, well, in

429
00:23:14,400 --> 00:23:17,201
Speaker 1: the event that my mum is declared deceased, does that

430
00:23:17,321 --> 00:23:20,281
Speaker 1: then void the privacy issue. She goes, no, it doesn't.

431
00:23:20,281 --> 00:23:22,321
Speaker 1: There's one hundred year long on that and I'll never

432
00:23:22,360 --> 00:23:24,561
Speaker 1: ever get it. I said, also, my kids won't even

433
00:23:24,561 --> 00:23:27,321
Speaker 1: be able to find out how this actual spelling. And

434
00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:29,600
Speaker 1: just to clarify, this is before we were going to

435
00:23:29,640 --> 00:23:32,681
Speaker 1: the coroner's court, so the coroner hadn't said that she

436
00:23:32,761 --> 00:23:34,521
Speaker 1: was going to do a findings at this point, so

437
00:23:34,600 --> 00:23:37,120
Speaker 1: I'm really just grappling at any bit of information I

438
00:23:37,120 --> 00:23:41,640
Speaker 1: can get. And I rang back later on a different day,

439
00:23:41,721 --> 00:23:44,360
Speaker 1: probably months later, and in instead of saying my mum

440
00:23:44,481 --> 00:23:49,280
Speaker 1: was missing, I just said, Hi, my mum changed her

441
00:23:49,360 --> 00:23:52,321
Speaker 1: name in nineteen ninety seven and I'm just trying to

442
00:23:52,321 --> 00:23:54,440
Speaker 1: get the correct spelling. Would you be able to help me?

443
00:23:54,801 --> 00:23:57,961
Speaker 1: And the lady told me every big date she did it,

444
00:23:58,721 --> 00:24:04,360
Speaker 1: what the spelling is, how she did it? I was like, well, okay, interesting.

445
00:24:04,441 --> 00:24:06,480
Speaker 1: So if I say she's a missing person, there's a

446
00:24:06,521 --> 00:24:09,281
Speaker 1: big block on that and no one wants to tell

447
00:24:09,321 --> 00:24:11,561
Speaker 1: me anything. But if I just simply asked the question, hey,

448
00:24:11,921 --> 00:24:13,480
Speaker 1: my mum changed her name, can you tell me what

449
00:24:13,521 --> 00:24:19,120
Speaker 1: the spelling is? Openslaver get told the whole sabang. So

450
00:24:19,360 --> 00:24:22,160
Speaker 1: I found things like that to be quite unbelievable in

451
00:24:22,201 --> 00:24:24,241
Speaker 1: the missing space, and why would you make it more

452
00:24:24,241 --> 00:24:28,681
Speaker 1: difficult for somebody who's already going through such a difficult process,

453
00:24:29,041 --> 00:24:31,161
Speaker 1: Like they just make it more difficult by doing those

454
00:24:31,201 --> 00:24:33,840
Speaker 1: sorts of things. And I think people need to really

455
00:24:34,441 --> 00:24:37,561
Speaker 1: listen to that and make changes and make that process

456
00:24:37,561 --> 00:24:42,080
Speaker 1: easier and better. So this same problem came with the

457
00:24:42,120 --> 00:24:46,281
Speaker 1: deed Pole documents. So my mum changed her name to

458
00:24:46,481 --> 00:24:49,441
Speaker 1: Florabella and Natalia Marry Ramckel on the fifteenth of May

459
00:24:50,201 --> 00:24:54,321
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety seven. And for years I was trying to

460
00:24:54,360 --> 00:24:57,360
Speaker 1: get the actual document because we had a lot of people,

461
00:24:57,360 --> 00:25:00,360
Speaker 1: didn't we Journey, who were saying, you need to put

462
00:25:00,400 --> 00:25:03,080
Speaker 1: on that document why you're changing your name, and there

463
00:25:03,120 --> 00:25:05,521
Speaker 1: needs to be a witness on that document. So who

464
00:25:05,600 --> 00:25:08,161
Speaker 1: was the witness and what reason did your mum give

465
00:25:08,281 --> 00:25:11,160
Speaker 1: to changing her name? So that was important and we

466
00:25:11,241 --> 00:25:13,920
Speaker 1: needed to get those depot documents mainly for that. That

467
00:25:14,041 --> 00:25:16,200
Speaker 1: was the reason I needed to get it. So I

468
00:25:16,321 --> 00:25:19,521
Speaker 1: was in contact with the Supreme Court for years, and

469
00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:22,241
Speaker 1: every time i'd put in a request for that document,

470
00:25:22,281 --> 00:25:24,201
Speaker 1: I got told no, and then I'd have to give

471
00:25:24,321 --> 00:25:26,720
Speaker 1: reasons as to why I wanted the document and they

472
00:25:26,721 --> 00:25:29,120
Speaker 1: still said no. This went on and on and on.

473
00:25:29,441 --> 00:25:33,361
Speaker 1: I finally found a lady who actually was quite lovely

474
00:25:33,521 --> 00:25:36,120
Speaker 1: and helping me and emailing me and discussing with me,

475
00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:38,401
Speaker 1: and she's like, look, send me the documents. I'll see

476
00:25:38,441 --> 00:25:40,960
Speaker 1: what I can do. I said, I've got to this

477
00:25:41,001 --> 00:25:44,280
Speaker 1: point where we've gone to the findings the coroner is like,

478
00:25:44,321 --> 00:25:46,400
Speaker 1: I knew what the coroner was going to say because

479
00:25:46,441 --> 00:25:50,080
Speaker 1: I was privy to that information from what the Crowns

480
00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:53,041
Speaker 1: listeners were telling my lawyers and legal team. So I'd

481
00:25:53,080 --> 00:25:56,600
Speaker 1: given her that information and she said, I still can't

482
00:25:56,600 --> 00:25:58,441
Speaker 1: give it to you until each such time as you've

483
00:25:58,481 --> 00:26:00,801
Speaker 1: got a death certificate, and then it has to be

484
00:26:00,840 --> 00:26:03,120
Speaker 1: assessed whether we'll still give it to you. So it

485
00:26:03,201 --> 00:26:05,241
Speaker 1: was just a big drama. I'm like, I just want

486
00:26:05,241 --> 00:26:08,201
Speaker 1: to get the document of her changing her name. So anyway,

487
00:26:08,600 --> 00:26:10,840
Speaker 1: I did get a document in the brief of evidence

488
00:26:10,921 --> 00:26:13,961
Speaker 1: because the coroner had requested it from the Supreme Court

489
00:26:14,041 --> 00:26:16,880
Speaker 1: in Brisbane and they handed it over. But the document

490
00:26:17,840 --> 00:26:20,801
Speaker 1: has information there, but not everything. I Actually what I

491
00:26:20,921 --> 00:26:23,840
Speaker 1: was asking them for, which I thought I would require

492
00:26:24,521 --> 00:26:27,120
Speaker 1: to go with the dea certificate and the grant of probate,

493
00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:30,481
Speaker 1: was the physical name change certificate, so like a birth

494
00:26:30,521 --> 00:26:34,440
Speaker 1: certificate or a marriage certificate showing that this person has

495
00:26:34,521 --> 00:26:37,200
Speaker 1: legally changed her name to this, because I thought that

496
00:26:37,241 --> 00:26:40,120
Speaker 1: would correlate and all fit together like the jigsaw puzzle.

497
00:26:40,281 --> 00:26:42,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, and basically the file as well. Like I remember

498
00:26:43,001 --> 00:26:45,721
Speaker 3: at the time, we were thinking if there was anything

499
00:26:45,761 --> 00:26:49,921
Speaker 3: sitting behind that that hadn't been submitted to the currner's court,

500
00:26:50,001 --> 00:26:53,281
Speaker 3: there could be little morsees of information there that might

501
00:26:53,321 --> 00:26:56,041
Speaker 3: be helpful, such as the reason for the name change,

502
00:26:56,041 --> 00:26:59,961
Speaker 3: which I didn't see within the brief of evidence itself.

503
00:26:59,600 --> 00:27:02,920
Speaker 1: So we were still chewing it. That mak showing Okay,

504
00:27:03,001 --> 00:27:06,120
Speaker 1: let's go. So I go to this lay all in

505
00:27:06,281 --> 00:27:09,921
Speaker 1: email and she's like, Okay, send me everything you've got now,

506
00:27:09,961 --> 00:27:12,480
Speaker 1: so I need the death certificate, I need granted probate

507
00:27:12,481 --> 00:27:14,880
Speaker 1: blah blah blah blah blah, and we'll process it and see,

508
00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:17,761
Speaker 1: but I'll need originals. I went, okay, I'll bring them

509
00:27:17,801 --> 00:27:24,641
Speaker 1: to you. Okay, So I'm out Supreme Court. Today is Wednesday,

510
00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:28,081
Speaker 1: the thirteenth of November, and I've just gone and spoken

511
00:27:28,120 --> 00:27:34,521
Speaker 1: to the lady who's been helping me trying to get

512
00:27:34,561 --> 00:27:41,801
Speaker 1: access for mum. So they've been declined multiple times, and

513
00:27:43,120 --> 00:27:47,041
Speaker 1: I spoke to her. I rang her and spoke to

514
00:27:47,080 --> 00:27:51,200
Speaker 1: her last week or actually might have even been was

515
00:27:51,321 --> 00:27:53,360
Speaker 1: that was last week? I rang and said I was

516
00:27:53,400 --> 00:27:58,921
Speaker 1: coming into the city. Lo and behold, they approve it.

517
00:27:59,681 --> 00:28:03,401
Speaker 1: And they say, oh, we've good news. We've approved it.

518
00:28:03,521 --> 00:28:06,481
Speaker 1: We can give you the documents and you just need

519
00:28:06,521 --> 00:28:09,440
Speaker 1: to pay this fee and we'll send it to you.

520
00:28:09,481 --> 00:28:11,761
Speaker 1: And I said, that's amazing. I'll pay the fee right now,

521
00:28:11,801 --> 00:28:13,321
Speaker 1: so i'd send it back. I said, I have paid,

522
00:28:13,360 --> 00:28:15,360
Speaker 1: thank you very much. Can you email it to me

523
00:28:15,481 --> 00:28:17,921
Speaker 1: because I would like it in email form, but i'd

524
00:28:17,961 --> 00:28:20,600
Speaker 1: also like it in hard copy. So she goes, no

525
00:28:20,600 --> 00:28:22,561
Speaker 1: problem at all, I'd email it to you. And guess

526
00:28:22,561 --> 00:28:25,801
Speaker 1: what it was? Exactly what was in the ruth of evidence.

527
00:28:26,360 --> 00:28:28,721
Speaker 1: So I just paid for a document and was put

528
00:28:28,761 --> 00:28:30,960
Speaker 1: through the absolute ringer to get exactly what that was

529
00:28:30,961 --> 00:28:34,241
Speaker 1: given to the coroner. So null and void didn't tell

530
00:28:34,321 --> 00:28:36,961
Speaker 1: us anything. We were kind of hoping to have someone's

531
00:28:37,041 --> 00:28:39,441
Speaker 1: name on there. That would have been a really important

532
00:28:39,441 --> 00:28:44,641
Speaker 1: part of the search, but no. And it's so exhausting,

533
00:28:45,001 --> 00:28:47,280
Speaker 1: seriously to hear the yeses and the nose, and then

534
00:28:47,281 --> 00:28:48,681
Speaker 1: the yeses and the nose, and then you think you

535
00:28:48,721 --> 00:28:50,281
Speaker 1: get a win, and then you just get the door

536
00:28:50,321 --> 00:28:52,681
Speaker 1: slammed in your face because it's actually not what you

537
00:28:52,721 --> 00:28:55,121
Speaker 1: needed anyway, and it's cost you money and time of

538
00:28:55,281 --> 00:28:58,161
Speaker 1: doing it. So it seems to be just be like

539
00:28:58,601 --> 00:28:59,921
Speaker 1: a common denominator.

540
00:29:00,961 --> 00:29:03,801
Speaker 3: It's very much round peg in the square hole situation.

541
00:29:04,481 --> 00:29:07,721
Speaker 3: Because of all the multiple and the complexities around it.

542
00:29:07,801 --> 00:29:09,801
Speaker 3: I think some people just put it in the two

543
00:29:09,881 --> 00:29:13,481
Speaker 3: hard basket because you know, from a process point of view,

544
00:29:13,561 --> 00:29:16,720
Speaker 3: everything needs to tick, so you can't have a single

545
00:29:16,761 --> 00:29:19,961
Speaker 3: cross on any of those elements or else it gets rejected.

546
00:29:20,601 --> 00:29:23,161
Speaker 3: So it's a bureaucratic thing, and I think that things

547
00:29:23,201 --> 00:29:26,961
Speaker 3: need to change so that there's more ability, because as

548
00:29:27,001 --> 00:29:30,241
Speaker 3: you hear there sales having to really, which is one

549
00:29:30,281 --> 00:29:33,361
Speaker 3: thing that I greatly admire about you is that you

550
00:29:33,441 --> 00:29:36,881
Speaker 3: are an absolute networker till the cows come home.

551
00:29:37,041 --> 00:29:39,361
Speaker 1: So you call on people that.

552
00:29:39,521 --> 00:29:43,401
Speaker 3: Show any kind of kindness or the ability to be

553
00:29:43,481 --> 00:29:47,161
Speaker 3: flexible or stretch or move to be able to try

554
00:29:47,201 --> 00:29:48,241
Speaker 3: to get.

555
00:29:48,001 --> 00:29:50,881
Speaker 1: Done what you need to get done. And it really

556
00:29:50,921 --> 00:29:53,561
Speaker 1: shouldn't be that way. Yeah, I shouldn't have to call

557
00:29:53,561 --> 00:29:56,801
Speaker 1: on people, I don't think. But people are generally happy

558
00:29:56,801 --> 00:29:58,761
Speaker 1: to help to which has been amazing and I've said

559
00:29:58,761 --> 00:30:00,361
Speaker 1: it a million times. I wouldn't have been able to

560
00:30:00,401 --> 00:30:03,641
Speaker 1: do any of this without the help of the general

561
00:30:03,681 --> 00:30:07,241
Speaker 1: public and the media too, you know, who have been helpful.

562
00:30:07,441 --> 00:30:10,121
Speaker 1: If we stepped to the next phase of this moment

563
00:30:10,161 --> 00:30:13,481
Speaker 1: in time, for me, I am at a position where

564
00:30:13,521 --> 00:30:17,240
Speaker 1: I know that there's money sitting in my mum's superannuation account.

565
00:30:18,081 --> 00:30:21,001
Speaker 1: There's not a lot of money sitting there. Just to clarify,

566
00:30:21,121 --> 00:30:24,480
Speaker 1: because one of the things, if you remember from the

567
00:30:24,521 --> 00:30:27,961
Speaker 1: Bonus episode about where We're at, I talked about how

568
00:30:28,041 --> 00:30:31,081
Speaker 1: I was making suggestions to Gary Sheen of all these

569
00:30:31,121 --> 00:30:32,561
Speaker 1: other things that we should be looking at, and one

570
00:30:32,601 --> 00:30:35,161
Speaker 1: of them was had she touched her super and he

571
00:30:35,241 --> 00:30:39,881
Speaker 1: had told me her super was untouched, so I had

572
00:30:39,921 --> 00:30:42,561
Speaker 1: no idea, Like I've never had been privy to the information.

573
00:30:42,721 --> 00:30:44,561
Speaker 1: I don't know how much money my mum had in

574
00:30:44,561 --> 00:30:48,520
Speaker 1: her superannuation. I managed to find going through my dad's

575
00:30:48,561 --> 00:30:50,081
Speaker 1: things one time. I was going through a bunch of

576
00:30:50,161 --> 00:30:52,841
Speaker 1: letters and stuff at his house and I found a

577
00:30:52,921 --> 00:30:55,921
Speaker 1: letter that was actually written to mum from the Department

578
00:30:55,921 --> 00:30:59,241
Speaker 1: of Education in New South Wales when she was pregnant

579
00:30:59,241 --> 00:31:01,881
Speaker 1: with me. I was born in nineteen seventy three, and

580
00:31:01,921 --> 00:31:04,041
Speaker 1: it talks about her going on maternity leave and her

581
00:31:04,081 --> 00:31:06,921
Speaker 1: superannuation being so all I had to go on was like, well,

582
00:31:06,921 --> 00:31:11,481
Speaker 1: she's been getting super since nineteen seventy two, so let's

583
00:31:11,521 --> 00:31:15,241
Speaker 1: look at that. I don't know what that means. And

584
00:31:15,401 --> 00:31:18,561
Speaker 1: once we got the brief of evidence, it showed us

585
00:31:18,601 --> 00:31:22,000
Speaker 1: because they actually had got that information and showed us

586
00:31:22,001 --> 00:31:26,041
Speaker 1: that she actually withdrew all her SUPER when she moved

587
00:31:26,041 --> 00:31:28,401
Speaker 1: from New South Wales to Queensland to go and work

588
00:31:28,441 --> 00:31:31,921
Speaker 1: at TSS. And I'm still a bit baffled by that

589
00:31:32,001 --> 00:31:34,401
Speaker 1: today as to how you could actually do that. Even

590
00:31:34,441 --> 00:31:37,001
Speaker 1: when I spoke to the ATO, they're like, I don't

591
00:31:37,001 --> 00:31:39,921
Speaker 1: know how she did that. How did she actually manage

592
00:31:39,921 --> 00:31:42,001
Speaker 1: to do it. So whether it was because she was

593
00:31:42,041 --> 00:31:43,921
Speaker 1: single and she was trying to buy a house up

594
00:31:43,961 --> 00:31:45,801
Speaker 1: in Queensland and we use the money to buy the

595
00:31:45,841 --> 00:31:48,521
Speaker 1: house because we know for a file she was still

596
00:31:48,561 --> 00:31:50,561
Speaker 1: holding the house in New South, that's all right, So

597
00:31:50,601 --> 00:31:52,881
Speaker 1: she still had a house in Jerringong for a whole

598
00:31:52,881 --> 00:31:56,681
Speaker 1: twelve months for sale. Yeah, so she had that house

599
00:31:56,721 --> 00:31:59,401
Speaker 1: and bought the house at Marinda Court. So that also

600
00:31:59,441 --> 00:32:01,240
Speaker 1: tells us how much money she sort of had in

601
00:32:01,281 --> 00:32:03,281
Speaker 1: the mix as well, doesn't it. Because I never asked

602
00:32:03,321 --> 00:32:05,281
Speaker 1: my mom how much money she had, Like I knew

603
00:32:05,441 --> 00:32:08,280
Speaker 1: we were okay, but I never really we didn't discuss it.

604
00:32:08,921 --> 00:32:13,240
Speaker 1: So that was important in getting the information from the

605
00:32:13,281 --> 00:32:16,881
Speaker 1: ATO as to what her superannuation was looking like. And

606
00:32:17,441 --> 00:32:19,641
Speaker 1: I knew that there was an amount in there wasn't

607
00:32:19,641 --> 00:32:21,521
Speaker 1: a big amount you can probably imagine. So I'm going

608
00:32:21,601 --> 00:32:24,841
Speaker 1: to tell you all in nineteen ninety four, when she

609
00:32:24,921 --> 00:32:28,521
Speaker 1: started at TSS, she put five hundred dollars fresh into

610
00:32:28,561 --> 00:32:32,881
Speaker 1: that account she's missing three years later. Yeah, okay, So

611
00:32:32,921 --> 00:32:35,280
Speaker 1: that gives you an idea of how much super it

612
00:32:35,321 --> 00:32:35,761
Speaker 1: was going to be.

613
00:32:35,801 --> 00:32:38,480
Speaker 3: Two hundred and fifty dollars and then she upped it

614
00:32:38,521 --> 00:32:41,561
Speaker 3: to five hundreds, so she doubled the amount yeap to

615
00:32:41,601 --> 00:32:43,401
Speaker 3: go into her super with TARSS.

616
00:32:43,441 --> 00:32:47,161
Speaker 1: So she had the two houses she had Marinda Court,

617
00:32:47,401 --> 00:32:50,641
Speaker 1: and then she also had Croft Place in Durangong and

618
00:32:50,681 --> 00:32:52,561
Speaker 1: then she sold Croft Place, so she would have had

619
00:32:52,561 --> 00:32:55,161
Speaker 1: an injection of money there, but that didn't go into

620
00:32:55,161 --> 00:32:59,921
Speaker 1: her super. So I had to jump through huge hoops

621
00:33:00,241 --> 00:33:04,561
Speaker 1: to access the small portion of money from mum Super.

622
00:33:05,441 --> 00:33:08,361
Speaker 1: And oh my god, I thought I was going to

623
00:33:08,441 --> 00:33:10,881
Speaker 1: have a complete melt down at this point, because this

624
00:33:11,001 --> 00:33:15,720
Speaker 1: started in August, the Taxation Department didn't actually pay it

625
00:33:15,721 --> 00:33:19,000
Speaker 1: out until December. And I don't know if you want

626
00:33:19,041 --> 00:33:21,000
Speaker 1: to think about that for a second, but that's just

627
00:33:21,321 --> 00:33:23,681
Speaker 1: an ongoing trauma of me sitting on the phone for

628
00:33:23,721 --> 00:33:26,161
Speaker 1: sometimes up to two and a half hours for them

629
00:33:26,201 --> 00:33:27,961
Speaker 1: to put me through to the next person. For them

630
00:33:27,961 --> 00:33:29,721
Speaker 1: to put me through to the next person, I've got

631
00:33:29,761 --> 00:33:34,121
Speaker 1: to explain the whole rigmarole about her having one name

632
00:33:34,201 --> 00:33:37,201
Speaker 1: and the other name. And I can tell you that

633
00:33:37,281 --> 00:33:40,761
Speaker 1: while we were in Luxembourg, Chris actually got the letter

634
00:33:40,801 --> 00:33:44,601
Speaker 1: in the mail and he said that they have completely

635
00:33:44,761 --> 00:33:47,440
Speaker 1: ignored the whole fact that her name was Marian barter

636
00:33:48,081 --> 00:33:51,001
Speaker 1: and said, we've done all these checks under Florabella Ramckel,

637
00:33:51,521 --> 00:33:54,081
Speaker 1: and it just listed off, like I think there's ten

638
00:33:54,201 --> 00:33:57,281
Speaker 1: or so things that they've listed off that Florabella and

639
00:33:57,361 --> 00:34:00,041
Speaker 1: Italia Marian Ramickel has not done a tax return in

640
00:34:00,041 --> 00:34:03,480
Speaker 1: the last three years. I'm like, no shit, she's actually

641
00:34:03,481 --> 00:34:06,281
Speaker 1: a missing person. She's been missing for twenty seven years

642
00:34:06,281 --> 00:34:08,881
Speaker 1: and you're not reading. Like every time I do this,

643
00:34:08,961 --> 00:34:11,681
Speaker 1: I have to do a full on document which actually

644
00:34:11,721 --> 00:34:15,601
Speaker 1: shows everybody exactly what's happening in this space. Because it

645
00:34:15,681 --> 00:34:19,081
Speaker 1: is hard, it's convoluted, it's confusing, and I try to

646
00:34:19,121 --> 00:34:21,081
Speaker 1: make it as clear as I possibly can for these

647
00:34:21,121 --> 00:34:24,041
Speaker 1: people so that they have an understanding and there's no question.

648
00:34:24,481 --> 00:34:29,721
Speaker 3: But just remember too, that whole counterbalance between us seeing

649
00:34:29,801 --> 00:34:33,001
Speaker 3: basically half of one of the volumes of the brief

650
00:34:33,201 --> 00:34:36,921
Speaker 3: was all of these letters coming from the superannuation which

651
00:34:36,961 --> 00:34:40,521
Speaker 3: had care of Leslie Loveday in it. So basically they

652
00:34:40,561 --> 00:34:43,041
Speaker 3: had sent her things the same with the bank every

653
00:34:43,081 --> 00:34:43,841
Speaker 3: six months.

654
00:34:44,041 --> 00:34:46,001
Speaker 1: There was all these letters that were produced.

655
00:34:46,041 --> 00:34:49,121
Speaker 3: Remember, and then you're in Luxembourg and we get the

656
00:34:49,161 --> 00:34:56,001
Speaker 3: correspondence saying no superannuation located for this person, and it's

657
00:34:56,081 --> 00:35:00,041
Speaker 3: just crazy because you actually see that there is superannuation there.

658
00:35:00,761 --> 00:35:02,881
Speaker 3: If they had have talked to each other, then it

659
00:35:02,921 --> 00:35:06,241
Speaker 3: would have been sorted and done. Quickers that we're.

660
00:35:06,041 --> 00:35:08,361
Speaker 1: Back and forth with then paid the accountant and they

661
00:35:08,441 --> 00:35:10,921
Speaker 1: started looking into it and they're like, oh, no, they

662
00:35:10,961 --> 00:35:13,841
Speaker 1: have found the money. Confirmed that they found the money,

663
00:35:14,161 --> 00:35:16,881
Speaker 1: but then they couldn't access it. I had to go

664
00:35:16,921 --> 00:35:19,281
Speaker 1: back and do it myself and sit on the phone again,

665
00:35:19,601 --> 00:35:21,561
Speaker 1: and I was in tears in some of those phone

666
00:35:21,561 --> 00:35:24,921
Speaker 1: calls and absolutely losing my mind that they were not

667
00:35:25,441 --> 00:35:28,481
Speaker 1: listening to me. And it's like their robots. They just

668
00:35:28,561 --> 00:35:31,881
Speaker 1: don't show any compassion or understanding of what I'm trying

669
00:35:31,881 --> 00:35:35,161
Speaker 1: to explain to them. And I was like, I could

670
00:35:35,241 --> 00:35:39,161
Speaker 1: care less about the money. I want to finalize her life.

671
00:35:39,321 --> 00:35:42,881
Speaker 1: She has been declared deceased. This is important part from

672
00:35:42,881 --> 00:35:45,401
Speaker 1: my family that we just go through the process when

673
00:35:45,441 --> 00:35:48,440
Speaker 1: someone passes away. You close their bank accounts, you sell

674
00:35:48,481 --> 00:35:50,241
Speaker 1: their car, you do the things that you need to

675
00:35:50,321 --> 00:35:53,881
Speaker 1: do to finalize them as a person. And I felt

676
00:35:53,921 --> 00:35:56,521
Speaker 1: like it was a rite of passage for me to go, Okay,

677
00:35:56,601 --> 00:35:59,441
Speaker 1: we've got through this stage and now I can actually

678
00:35:59,481 --> 00:36:01,681
Speaker 1: go Okay, we're going to do all these things. She

679
00:36:01,721 --> 00:36:03,881
Speaker 1: had money sitting in her bank account as well, right,

680
00:36:04,001 --> 00:36:06,761
Speaker 1: so I had to jumps through a million hoops with

681
00:36:06,881 --> 00:36:09,481
Speaker 1: the Commonwealth Bank. They were probably the best out of

682
00:36:09,521 --> 00:36:11,601
Speaker 1: all of them, but I had to fill in forms

683
00:36:11,601 --> 00:36:14,001
Speaker 1: and documents and show them the death certificate, show them

684
00:36:14,041 --> 00:36:16,121
Speaker 1: the grand a probate. So this is why they were

685
00:36:16,121 --> 00:36:18,641
Speaker 1: all important documents. But they don't even give you the

686
00:36:18,641 --> 00:36:20,961
Speaker 1: courtesy of giving you a letter to say, hey, we're

687
00:36:20,961 --> 00:36:22,961
Speaker 1: paying it out. Money just showed up in my bank

688
00:36:23,001 --> 00:36:26,440
Speaker 1: account and it was a couple of grand and so

689
00:36:26,881 --> 00:36:30,321
Speaker 1: the next hoop for me to jump through was I

690
00:36:30,361 --> 00:36:33,721
Speaker 1: speak to the ATO and I got onto a guy

691
00:36:33,961 --> 00:36:35,841
Speaker 1: and he says, I'm going to have to call you back.

692
00:36:35,881 --> 00:36:37,921
Speaker 1: And I said, you are going to have to swear

693
00:36:38,121 --> 00:36:40,761
Speaker 1: on my children's lives that you are going to call

694
00:36:40,801 --> 00:36:42,321
Speaker 1: me back, because I've just sat on this call for

695
00:36:42,401 --> 00:36:45,441
Speaker 1: another two hours and I've been bumped from one person

696
00:36:45,481 --> 00:36:47,801
Speaker 1: to the next. He said, there's just something on here

697
00:36:47,841 --> 00:36:50,641
Speaker 1: that doesn't look right. I'm going to have to call

698
00:36:50,681 --> 00:36:52,641
Speaker 1: you back, and I promise you I will ring you back,

699
00:36:52,841 --> 00:36:56,001
Speaker 1: and thank goodness he did. He rang me back and

700
00:36:56,041 --> 00:36:58,921
Speaker 1: he said, I'm going to apologize to you because there

701
00:36:58,961 --> 00:37:03,041
Speaker 1: has been an error our end. I went, well, surprise

702
00:37:04,121 --> 00:37:07,601
Speaker 1: sally laden as an error or there's a problem, But

703
00:37:07,641 --> 00:37:10,161
Speaker 1: thank you for acknowledging that. And I said, I really

704
00:37:10,161 --> 00:37:12,201
Speaker 1: hope that you explained to the person who made the

705
00:37:12,321 --> 00:37:14,681
Speaker 1: error how diabolic all this has been for me, and

706
00:37:14,921 --> 00:37:17,961
Speaker 1: that I've been fighting for this since August. It's now December.

707
00:37:18,681 --> 00:37:21,241
Speaker 1: This is already hard and it's already trauma. I should

708
00:37:21,281 --> 00:37:23,201
Speaker 1: not have to sit here and just be put through

709
00:37:23,241 --> 00:37:26,321
Speaker 1: more pain and more stress and more time and anxiousness

710
00:37:27,361 --> 00:37:30,241
Speaker 1: to go through to get something that is rightfully made

711
00:37:30,281 --> 00:37:33,601
Speaker 1: available to me like it did to everybody else, Like

712
00:37:33,681 --> 00:37:36,281
Speaker 1: I've had multiple people who have passed away in the

713
00:37:36,321 --> 00:37:39,641
Speaker 1: same time as my mum was granted as deceased. They're

714
00:37:39,881 --> 00:37:43,521
Speaker 1: will gone through all the processes of closing up everything

715
00:37:43,561 --> 00:37:46,441
Speaker 1: and finishing without any hassle. But because my mum's missing,

716
00:37:46,521 --> 00:37:48,841
Speaker 1: I have to jump through a million hoops to get

717
00:37:48,881 --> 00:37:52,081
Speaker 1: a decertificate to get granted probate to then have access

718
00:37:52,121 --> 00:37:56,241
Speaker 1: to her files. And the kicker here was that I said,

719
00:37:56,401 --> 00:37:59,001
Speaker 1: how will you pay out the superinnuation? And he said,

720
00:37:59,041 --> 00:38:01,721
Speaker 1: I will send you a check. So I said, well,

721
00:38:01,721 --> 00:38:03,921
Speaker 1: my bank doesn't actually accept check. So is there any

722
00:38:03,961 --> 00:38:06,641
Speaker 1: other way we can do it? No, that's the only

723
00:38:06,681 --> 00:38:10,521
Speaker 1: way we can do it. So that afternoon I decide

724
00:38:10,721 --> 00:38:14,921
Speaker 1: to go to the A and Z. Okay, folks, this

725
00:38:15,001 --> 00:38:22,161
Speaker 1: is just getting wildly ridiculous. I am seriously about to

726
00:38:22,241 --> 00:38:24,921
Speaker 1: lose my mind. I've just had a phone call from

727
00:38:24,961 --> 00:38:29,681
Speaker 1: the A and Z bank who informed me that when

728
00:38:29,721 --> 00:38:32,121
Speaker 1: they would when the girl was doing up the application

729
00:38:32,441 --> 00:38:36,761
Speaker 1: for an account to be a beneficiary for my mum's

730
00:38:36,921 --> 00:38:41,001
Speaker 1: state so that when the ATO finally send me a

731
00:38:41,161 --> 00:38:45,521
Speaker 1: check for mum's superannuation, I can bank it into that account.

732
00:38:46,281 --> 00:38:47,721
Speaker 1: When she did it, I said to her, you do

733
00:38:47,841 --> 00:38:49,601
Speaker 1: need to put both names. She goes, well, I'm going

734
00:38:49,681 --> 00:38:51,761
Speaker 1: to put Marion Barter because that's the name of the

735
00:38:51,841 --> 00:38:53,801
Speaker 1: checks going to be. And I said, well, that's correct,

736
00:38:53,801 --> 00:38:55,841
Speaker 1: but you'll probably need to put both names because she's

737
00:38:55,841 --> 00:38:59,801
Speaker 1: officially Florabella Ramichel, formerly known as Marion Barta, which is

738
00:38:59,841 --> 00:39:02,641
Speaker 1: on her de certificate, which is on the grant of probate.

739
00:39:04,241 --> 00:39:07,321
Speaker 1: She only put Marrion bar We just thought we'd see

740
00:39:07,321 --> 00:39:09,321
Speaker 1: how we go. She's come back to me saying, oh,

741
00:39:09,321 --> 00:39:12,201
Speaker 1: well they've declined it, and saying, well, she's a formerly

742
00:39:12,241 --> 00:39:16,081
Speaker 1: known as Flora Bella, Natalia Marian Ramckel, not Marian Barter.

743
00:39:16,161 --> 00:39:17,801
Speaker 1: And I said, well, yes, that's why I explained to

744
00:39:17,881 --> 00:39:22,121
Speaker 1: you that you'd have to put both names on the application,

745
00:39:22,281 --> 00:39:25,401
Speaker 1: because I thought that would be the case. And she goes, oh, well,

746
00:39:25,441 --> 00:39:27,681
Speaker 1: we can't put both names. We can only put one name.

747
00:39:27,961 --> 00:39:30,441
Speaker 1: And I said, well, I've had to go through a

748
00:39:30,481 --> 00:39:33,761
Speaker 1: million hoops and fight tooth and nail to have mums

749
00:39:33,881 --> 00:39:37,681
Speaker 1: both mums' names put on My god, I can't believe

750
00:39:37,721 --> 00:39:41,401
Speaker 1: this is happening. I just seriously cannot believe that this

751
00:39:41,481 --> 00:39:47,721
Speaker 1: is still happening. The whole name changed thing is the biggest, absolute,

752
00:39:47,761 --> 00:39:52,281
Speaker 1: biggest debarkle of my entire life. Anyway, you can hear

753
00:39:52,321 --> 00:39:55,440
Speaker 1: the frustration in my voice. I'm just so tired of this.

754
00:39:55,641 --> 00:40:04,921
Speaker 1: I am absolutely exhausted. So then she tells me that

755
00:40:05,121 --> 00:40:12,241
Speaker 1: at the next problem is that the granted probate that

756
00:40:12,321 --> 00:40:15,161
Speaker 1: I just paid for through the lawyers to do this

757
00:40:15,241 --> 00:40:20,081
Speaker 1: granted probate has since expired because they're only valid for

758
00:40:20,281 --> 00:40:23,801
Speaker 1: ninety days. I said, how can it be expired? Only

759
00:40:23,841 --> 00:40:25,440
Speaker 1: just got it in August. She goes, oh, they only

760
00:40:25,521 --> 00:40:28,841
Speaker 1: have a ninety day period. I said, I only applied

761
00:40:28,841 --> 00:40:32,481
Speaker 1: to the ATO after I got granted broke probate, which

762
00:40:32,921 --> 00:40:35,561
Speaker 1: was on the sixth of August, and it's taken them

763
00:40:35,601 --> 00:40:40,081
Speaker 1: till December to pay me the damn checks. Like I

764
00:40:40,161 --> 00:40:43,561
Speaker 1: have to fight every way, every single pathway I go,

765
00:40:44,801 --> 00:40:46,961
Speaker 1: and she goes, well, I'm really sorry, but that's what

766
00:40:47,001 --> 00:40:51,681
Speaker 1: they're telling me. Also, your passport and everything that you've

767
00:40:51,721 --> 00:40:56,281
Speaker 1: sent through has expired. I'm like, that is just not true,

768
00:40:56,321 --> 00:41:01,601
Speaker 1: Like I have I have the documents anyway, So that's

769
00:41:01,641 --> 00:41:03,121
Speaker 1: the next thing. And then she said to me, I

770
00:41:03,161 --> 00:41:05,601
Speaker 1: need to ask you who Owen Clifford Brown is. I said, oh,

771
00:41:05,681 --> 00:41:10,161
Speaker 1: Clifford Brown's my deceased brother I told you about. She goes, okay, well,

772
00:41:10,761 --> 00:41:14,121
Speaker 1: we need his death certificate. I said, well, I don't

773
00:41:14,161 --> 00:41:16,961
Speaker 1: have his death certificate and I don't have access to it.

774
00:41:17,241 --> 00:41:19,521
Speaker 1: I would have to apply through birth, death and marriages,

775
00:41:19,561 --> 00:41:21,161
Speaker 1: and even then it would have to be my eighty

776
00:41:21,201 --> 00:41:24,321
Speaker 1: one year old father to apply for a death certificate

777
00:41:24,921 --> 00:41:28,321
Speaker 1: because I'm not his next of kin. So I don't

778
00:41:28,361 --> 00:41:30,801
Speaker 1: have his death certificate. I said. It states on my

779
00:41:30,921 --> 00:41:35,161
Speaker 1: mum's death certificate that Owen Clifford Brown is deceased because

780
00:41:35,201 --> 00:41:37,921
Speaker 1: he's named in the will, right, he gets three pieces

781
00:41:37,961 --> 00:41:40,561
Speaker 1: of furniture whatever he wanted in mum's will. So this

782
00:41:40,601 --> 00:41:43,641
Speaker 1: is why they want to get a desertificate for Owen.

783
00:41:43,881 --> 00:41:46,121
Speaker 1: I just told her to can it. I said, forget it.

784
00:41:46,241 --> 00:41:48,281
Speaker 1: Just don't even bother going through it. I'll have to

785
00:41:48,281 --> 00:41:53,081
Speaker 1: find an alternative way to try and get this check cashed.

786
00:41:53,481 --> 00:41:56,001
Speaker 1: I said to her, she's a really beautiful girl, Like,

787
00:41:56,161 --> 00:41:58,361
Speaker 1: I really like this girl. She took a really big

788
00:41:58,401 --> 00:42:00,641
Speaker 1: interest in the case, and she's going to listen to

789
00:42:00,721 --> 00:42:03,841
Speaker 1: the podcast and everything. This is not her fault. This

790
00:42:03,961 --> 00:42:09,321
Speaker 1: is just how our these departments and businesses are in

791
00:42:09,441 --> 00:42:13,721
Speaker 1: not dealing with missing persons cases. People. You need to

792
00:42:13,761 --> 00:42:17,841
Speaker 1: wake up and listen far out like this should not

793
00:42:17,881 --> 00:42:19,201
Speaker 1: be this hard. I just said to who this is

794
00:42:19,241 --> 00:42:25,361
Speaker 1: trauma on repeat Today's sixth and December twenty twenty four

795
00:42:26,321 --> 00:42:33,241
Speaker 1: just does not get any easier. So at that point

796
00:42:33,761 --> 00:42:36,121
Speaker 1: I felt like all my options had literally run out.

797
00:42:36,361 --> 00:42:40,041
Speaker 1: I actually met up with the Lovely Ladies who actually

798
00:42:40,041 --> 00:42:42,521
Speaker 1: offered to help me get the grant of probate, and

799
00:42:42,681 --> 00:42:47,401
Speaker 1: she offered to receive the ATO check and put it

800
00:42:47,441 --> 00:42:49,921
Speaker 1: in their account in a trust account for Mum. But

801
00:42:50,521 --> 00:42:54,201
Speaker 1: thankfully they actually helped me manage all of that, which

802
00:42:54,321 --> 00:42:56,561
Speaker 1: was a massive saving for me as well, and just

803
00:42:56,761 --> 00:42:58,961
Speaker 1: because I just had no way around any of those.

804
00:42:59,401 --> 00:43:01,761
Speaker 1: So again it came down to just good people helping me.

805
00:43:02,281 --> 00:43:04,440
Speaker 1: Otherwise I would still be stuck, and I don't think

806
00:43:04,521 --> 00:43:06,521
Speaker 1: we would have overseas we wouldn't have been able to

807
00:43:06,521 --> 00:43:10,321
Speaker 1: do half of what we had done. So while I'm

808
00:43:10,361 --> 00:43:14,441
Speaker 1: trying to deal with ATO and multiple other entities trying

809
00:43:14,481 --> 00:43:18,161
Speaker 1: to get this information deepole document, Supreme Courts, you name it,

810
00:43:18,281 --> 00:43:21,801
Speaker 1: I am in this world of hurt. And the last

811
00:43:22,161 --> 00:43:24,241
Speaker 1: other thing that I really wanted to get, and I

812
00:43:24,281 --> 00:43:26,321
Speaker 1: know you were keen for this journey as well, was

813
00:43:26,361 --> 00:43:30,041
Speaker 1: to get the Medicare reports about Mum, where she went,

814
00:43:30,641 --> 00:43:33,681
Speaker 1: what she was doing, and who she was with. Yes,

815
00:43:33,881 --> 00:43:36,201
Speaker 1: do you remember what was the key part of that

816
00:43:36,241 --> 00:43:39,401
Speaker 1: for us to get that Medicare report? So look at this.

817
00:43:39,561 --> 00:43:42,481
Speaker 3: In regards to the Medicare stuff, we didn't really know

818
00:43:42,761 --> 00:43:45,841
Speaker 3: exactly what we were going to receive with that information.

819
00:43:45,961 --> 00:43:49,641
Speaker 3: We were hoping for a lot more detail, so names

820
00:43:49,681 --> 00:43:52,201
Speaker 3: addresses how she paid as well.

821
00:43:52,401 --> 00:43:56,521
Speaker 1: All week I've spent on the phone, you will know

822
00:43:56,561 --> 00:44:00,281
Speaker 1: that I've been chasing information from Medicare for some months

823
00:44:00,321 --> 00:44:03,481
Speaker 1: now after sending them an email, because last time I

824
00:44:03,521 --> 00:44:05,441
Speaker 1: went in there they said, oh, look we don't have it.

825
00:44:05,481 --> 00:44:09,841
Speaker 1: You'll have to send them an email. And without any

826
00:44:10,721 --> 00:44:15,041
Speaker 1: conversation or communication from Medicare, I just received an envelope

827
00:44:15,081 --> 00:44:17,521
Speaker 1: in the mail two days ago. Just the front page

828
00:44:17,761 --> 00:44:23,241
Speaker 1: says sensitive personal Dear Miss Leyden read Sally Laden slash

829
00:44:23,281 --> 00:44:26,241
Speaker 1: Marion Barter, thank you for your request for release information.

830
00:44:27,681 --> 00:44:30,841
Speaker 1: Please find Medicare reports attached. A lot of this stuff

831
00:44:30,881 --> 00:44:33,161
Speaker 1: we already had out of the brief of evidence, but

832
00:44:33,561 --> 00:44:35,601
Speaker 1: there's some things in her here we didn't have, so

833
00:44:36,481 --> 00:44:39,561
Speaker 1: I classify that as a win service. History they've given

834
00:44:39,561 --> 00:44:41,681
Speaker 1: me is from the first of January nineteen ninety four

835
00:44:41,721 --> 00:44:45,161
Speaker 1: to the first of January twenty fifteen, and it lists

836
00:44:45,321 --> 00:44:49,081
Speaker 1: all of the doctors that mum saw between nineteen ninety

837
00:44:49,081 --> 00:44:52,641
Speaker 1: four and nineteen ninety seven before she left. Then we

838
00:44:52,761 --> 00:44:59,121
Speaker 1: have a number and item number and description for every

839
00:44:59,161 --> 00:45:03,641
Speaker 1: category that she's had against her Medicare card, which is

840
00:45:03,721 --> 00:45:05,761
Speaker 1: great because we can go through that and have a

841
00:45:05,801 --> 00:45:10,921
Speaker 1: look and she do a bit more deep digging into

842
00:45:11,241 --> 00:45:14,561
Speaker 1: what some of those mean. Then I asked for the bill,

843
00:45:14,681 --> 00:45:18,921
Speaker 1: type and description of her payment, and particularly we were

844
00:45:18,921 --> 00:45:23,761
Speaker 1: looking for the transaction at the optometrists that she went

845
00:45:23,801 --> 00:45:28,401
Speaker 1: to on the thirteenth of August nineteen ninety seven in Grafton,

846
00:45:29,161 --> 00:45:34,561
Speaker 1: because that was the last digital footprint of her physically

847
00:45:34,961 --> 00:45:36,961
Speaker 1: doing something. We don't know if she was taking the

848
00:45:37,001 --> 00:45:38,681
Speaker 1: money out of her bank account or if that was

849
00:45:39,481 --> 00:45:42,961
Speaker 1: being done by somebody else, So that date is quite important,

850
00:45:43,001 --> 00:45:47,641
Speaker 1: and I wanted to know did she pay cash, did

851
00:45:47,681 --> 00:45:51,641
Speaker 1: she pay by card? How did she get her rebate

852
00:45:51,801 --> 00:45:55,401
Speaker 1: sent to her? What? Did they have an address potentially

853
00:45:55,481 --> 00:45:59,561
Speaker 1: of where that would be sent to. And unfortunately, because

854
00:45:59,641 --> 00:46:02,321
Speaker 1: they've just done a generic print off, they haven't actually

855
00:46:02,361 --> 00:46:06,241
Speaker 1: read the detail of the information that I'm requesting asking

856
00:46:06,321 --> 00:46:08,721
Speaker 1: for those finer details, so I don't know if they

857
00:46:08,761 --> 00:46:11,361
Speaker 1: had an address for her. They haven't told me that.

858
00:46:11,921 --> 00:46:15,601
Speaker 1: What it does tell me is that that optometrist appointment

859
00:46:15,641 --> 00:46:20,761
Speaker 1: with Dean Evans at the OPSM was the payment method

860
00:46:20,961 --> 00:46:23,841
Speaker 1: was bog bill, so that means that she didn't have

861
00:46:23,841 --> 00:46:26,321
Speaker 1: to pay for anything. That means that she didn't get

862
00:46:26,361 --> 00:46:30,641
Speaker 1: a refund from Medicare, which is really devastating because I

863
00:46:30,841 --> 00:46:34,201
Speaker 1: was thinking if she'd did get a refund and it

864
00:46:34,321 --> 00:46:36,521
Speaker 1: was sent to her in a check, which is how

865
00:46:36,521 --> 00:46:38,561
Speaker 1: they used to do it back in nineteen ninety seven.

866
00:46:39,481 --> 00:46:41,441
Speaker 1: They'd post you out a check we would have an

867
00:46:41,441 --> 00:46:47,241
Speaker 1: address for her. So you know, it's quite devastating because

868
00:46:47,561 --> 00:46:50,401
Speaker 1: you know, if we could find out an address for

869
00:46:50,441 --> 00:46:53,521
Speaker 1: her after she returned to Australia, that would have been massive, massive,

870
00:46:53,561 --> 00:46:59,681
Speaker 1: massive find And those forms are trauma on repeat, so

871
00:47:00,041 --> 00:47:03,281
Speaker 1: you're looking at the form online and it's asking you

872
00:47:04,081 --> 00:47:08,841
Speaker 1: who is the funeral director, where is the body, what

873
00:47:09,041 --> 00:47:12,761
Speaker 1: date did they die, how did they die, among other.

874
00:47:12,641 --> 00:47:16,441
Speaker 3: Things, so whether it was check, whether it was by cash,

875
00:47:16,481 --> 00:47:18,081
Speaker 3: and that sort of thing, just to see if we

876
00:47:18,121 --> 00:47:21,641
Speaker 3: could actually work out a her health history over that

877
00:47:21,721 --> 00:47:25,081
Speaker 3: whole time, because there was a little bit of interesting

878
00:47:25,161 --> 00:47:28,281
Speaker 3: stuff around the liver function test that was done in

879
00:47:28,401 --> 00:47:33,041
Speaker 3: nineteen ninety seven, considering that there was another woman in

880
00:47:33,081 --> 00:47:36,361
Speaker 3: Belgium who had a similar kind of liver test done,

881
00:47:36,681 --> 00:47:37,521
Speaker 3: So that was one.

882
00:47:37,401 --> 00:47:38,521
Speaker 1: Thing we wanted to look at.

883
00:47:38,561 --> 00:47:41,841
Speaker 3: And the second thing was that little ping that happened

884
00:47:42,041 --> 00:47:45,881
Speaker 3: on the thirteenth of August nineteen ninety seven, where after

885
00:47:46,121 --> 00:47:50,641
Speaker 3: arriving back into Australia, her Medicare card was put through

886
00:47:50,801 --> 00:47:53,881
Speaker 3: as Dean Evans, the optometrist said on the stand at

887
00:47:53,881 --> 00:47:58,081
Speaker 3: one of those old click clack credit card type machines

888
00:47:58,721 --> 00:48:02,161
Speaker 3: at the optometrist in Grafton. So we wanted just to

889
00:48:02,201 --> 00:48:06,281
Speaker 3: see if there was more information there, because fortunately on

890
00:48:06,321 --> 00:48:09,561
Speaker 3: the stand Dean Evans did state that there would have

891
00:48:09,641 --> 00:48:13,521
Speaker 3: been a new client card done for that service and

892
00:48:13,601 --> 00:48:16,561
Speaker 3: so therefore that could have had or it would have

893
00:48:16,601 --> 00:48:22,041
Speaker 3: had an address and a contact phone number. Now, because

894
00:48:22,081 --> 00:48:26,001
Speaker 3: that card wasn't able to be located it was too

895
00:48:26,041 --> 00:48:29,921
Speaker 3: long ago, we were hoping that possibly Medicare might have

896
00:48:30,041 --> 00:48:32,841
Speaker 3: changed their address or their phone number based on the

897
00:48:33,001 --> 00:48:33,641
Speaker 3: client card.

898
00:48:34,441 --> 00:48:36,201
Speaker 1: None of that really came.

899
00:48:36,081 --> 00:48:39,001
Speaker 3: About with the documents that we got. But one thing

900
00:48:39,121 --> 00:48:43,321
Speaker 3: that we were able to concretely cement, which is something

901
00:48:43,401 --> 00:48:46,241
Speaker 3: that people have been wanting to sort of know for

902
00:48:46,281 --> 00:48:49,761
Speaker 3: a long time, is that this was actually the sixth

903
00:48:49,961 --> 00:48:55,201
Speaker 3: time in her post moving to Queensland where she had

904
00:48:55,281 --> 00:49:00,001
Speaker 3: gone to an optometrist with a single visit not in

905
00:49:00,041 --> 00:49:03,881
Speaker 3: her local area, and this was actually the sixth time

906
00:49:03,921 --> 00:49:07,721
Speaker 3: that she had done that, So that to me shows

907
00:49:07,721 --> 00:49:10,841
Speaker 3: a pattern of behavior. So this wasn't just some ping

908
00:49:11,161 --> 00:49:13,601
Speaker 3: of going to see an optometrist that came out of

909
00:49:13,641 --> 00:49:17,001
Speaker 3: the middle of nowhere. This was actually in line with

910
00:49:17,321 --> 00:49:19,561
Speaker 3: what she'd been doing for the past couple of years

911
00:49:19,641 --> 00:49:21,281
Speaker 3: since she arrived in Queensland.

912
00:49:21,681 --> 00:49:23,761
Speaker 1: And the other thing that was a big standout for

913
00:49:23,881 --> 00:49:27,041
Speaker 1: us was that she was billed for that service and

914
00:49:27,081 --> 00:49:30,361
Speaker 1: that was a real bummer because if she'd got a

915
00:49:30,481 --> 00:49:33,361
Speaker 1: check back, they would have posted the check to an

916
00:49:33,361 --> 00:49:35,601
Speaker 1: address and it would have been listed as to where

917
00:49:35,601 --> 00:49:38,841
Speaker 1: the check went, and that would have been a massive,

918
00:49:39,201 --> 00:49:42,681
Speaker 1: massive find for us. So you know, and there's a

919
00:49:42,681 --> 00:49:45,361
Speaker 1: lot of undercarriage with that as well, because the police

920
00:49:45,481 --> 00:49:49,281
Speaker 1: initially back in twenty eleven found this information about her

921
00:49:49,321 --> 00:49:51,601
Speaker 1: going and using her Medicare card or her Medicare card

922
00:49:51,681 --> 00:49:54,001
Speaker 1: being used in Grafton and they were looking for a

923
00:49:54,081 --> 00:49:57,881
Speaker 1: doctor and they were not looking for an optometrist, and

924
00:49:57,961 --> 00:50:00,801
Speaker 1: so that information back in twenty eleven, they would have

925
00:50:00,841 --> 00:50:03,441
Speaker 1: had the records and we could have actually pulled like

926
00:50:03,561 --> 00:50:06,601
Speaker 1: even OPSM said that because we found them. The lady

927
00:50:06,601 --> 00:50:09,241
Speaker 1: didn't we She's now living in Coffs Harbor and we

928
00:50:09,281 --> 00:50:11,561
Speaker 1: were like, did you keep records? Do you still have records?

929
00:50:11,601 --> 00:50:14,321
Speaker 1: She's like no, we destroyed them. And I was like,

930
00:50:14,361 --> 00:50:18,201
Speaker 1: that's so disapposed because some missed opportunity and they weren't

931
00:50:18,201 --> 00:50:20,641
Speaker 1: looking properly. They just made an assumption that he was

932
00:50:20,681 --> 00:50:24,681
Speaker 1: a doctor and not an optometrist. Doesn't even say doctor

933
00:50:24,721 --> 00:50:28,681
Speaker 1: on there, it just sees Stevens. So, you know, another

934
00:50:28,721 --> 00:50:33,241
Speaker 1: missed opportunity from the police to maybe garner some information,

935
00:50:33,361 --> 00:50:36,361
Speaker 1: and that was really vital. But the flip side is

936
00:50:37,281 --> 00:50:40,201
Speaker 1: Medicare sent me every single detail. They sent all of

937
00:50:40,201 --> 00:50:42,721
Speaker 1: my information as well, which is a lot more than

938
00:50:42,761 --> 00:50:45,841
Speaker 1: my mum's, and we were able to look at certain things.

939
00:50:45,921 --> 00:50:48,201
Speaker 1: And you know, for those of you who are questioning

940
00:50:48,241 --> 00:50:51,401
Speaker 1: about the liver test before, there is a little bit

941
00:50:51,441 --> 00:50:53,561
Speaker 1: of information in there which we might talk about on

942
00:50:53,601 --> 00:50:56,440
Speaker 1: Facebook and answer some questions on there, because we did

943
00:50:56,521 --> 00:50:59,241
Speaker 1: go into deep on that. In the Lady vanishes as well,

944
00:50:59,641 --> 00:51:06,201
Speaker 1: and there's a storyline behind my mum and Girlaine, who

945
00:51:06,401 --> 00:51:09,921
Speaker 1: is another lady who had dealings with mister Rick Blum,

946
00:51:10,481 --> 00:51:13,921
Speaker 1: who both ladies had. My Mum and Laine both had

947
00:51:14,121 --> 00:51:23,321
Speaker 1: liver function tests whilst they were allegedly engaged with Rick Blum.

948
00:51:23,401 --> 00:51:26,281
Speaker 1: In the next episode of The Missing Matter, the lady

949
00:51:26,321 --> 00:51:29,440
Speaker 1: warned me in the letter not to try and look

950
00:51:29,521 --> 00:51:33,681
Speaker 1: for her and said it would be detrimental to my children.

951
00:51:34,481 --> 00:51:40,441
Speaker 1: That's when the nightmare started. A reoccurring dream I had

952
00:51:40,521 --> 00:51:43,241
Speaker 1: on repeat for years, where Chris and I drove to Maurie.

953
00:51:43,721 --> 00:51:46,561
Speaker 1: We found a house just outside of town where there

954
00:51:46,601 --> 00:51:49,241
Speaker 1: was a dip in the road and had a big,

955
00:51:49,321 --> 00:51:52,441
Speaker 1: long concrete footpath that went up to the front door.

956
00:51:53,961 --> 00:51:58,641
Speaker 1: And in the dream, i have Darcy on my hip

957
00:51:58,841 --> 00:52:03,521
Speaker 1: as a baby, and I'm holding Ella's hand, who is three.

958
00:52:03,961 --> 00:52:05,961
Speaker 1: Chris is waiting in the car. He's got the window down.

959
00:52:06,041 --> 00:52:10,281
Speaker 1: As I'm walking up to the door, I knock on

960
00:52:10,321 --> 00:52:14,401
Speaker 1: the door and my mum opens the door and she

961
00:52:14,521 --> 00:52:20,321
Speaker 1: closes the door in my face, doesn't say anything, and

962
00:52:20,841 --> 00:52:22,961
Speaker 1: I turn around and I walk back up to Chris

963
00:52:23,081 --> 00:52:24,961
Speaker 1: and she opens the door and she shoots me in

964
00:52:25,001 --> 00:52:25,321
Speaker 1: the back.