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Speaker 1: June five, two thousand and five, Australian Paul Hockey stands

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Speaker 1: at the summit of Mount Everest.

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Speaker 2: After more than eighteen months of training.

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Speaker 1: It's a feat he's completed in his mother's honor, after

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Speaker 1: she died the year prior. It's an accomplishment made more

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Speaker 1: special by the fact that Paul had become the first

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Speaker 1: person with a disability to climb Mount Everest from.

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Speaker 2: The north side.

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Speaker 1: I'm at Middleton and this is head game today, amputee

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Speaker 1: Paul Hockey on constantly challenging perceptions of disability, always believing

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Speaker 1: in himself.

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Speaker 2: And the power of the chasing dreams.

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Speaker 1: Paul, absolutely amazing to speak to you, buddy, And like

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Speaker 1: I said, it's phenomenal to have a fellow Everest Summer

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Speaker 1: on the podcast with me. And in a snap phrase,

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Speaker 1: what was it like standing on top of the world.

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Speaker 3: I've got to say, mate, like most of my life,

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Speaker 3: it was at once one of the best things in

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Speaker 3: my life and one of the worst because I knew

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Speaker 3: I was only halfway and I was completely can you

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Speaker 3: swear on this podcast?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, go for it, mate, mate.

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Speaker 3: I was completely fucked and I knew that I was

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Speaker 3: only halfway, So it was also a daunting moment knowing

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Speaker 3: I had to get back down and made I just

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Speaker 3: about another left mate.

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Speaker 1: I love that And the reason why I went straight

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Speaker 1: to that moment is because we're going to rewind now

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Speaker 1: back to when you were born. And I said that

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Speaker 1: you've done it with a twist. You've done it in in.

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Speaker 2: A super special way.

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Speaker 1: Talk about what happened to you when you were born

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Speaker 1: weeks after you were born?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, well, basically, I was born with cancer and the

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Speaker 3: cancer was luckily for me, in the right arm and

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Speaker 3: it hadn't actually spread anywhere else at that point. But

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Speaker 3: story short, my parents, you know, when I was born,

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Speaker 3: the doctor and my parents had no idea. So I

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Speaker 3: went home as a so called for one of a

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Speaker 3: better word, able bodied, healthy baby. And it was my

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Speaker 3: mother who a couple of weeks after I was born,

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Speaker 3: noticed a lump in my upright arm. So she went

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Speaker 3: back to the doctor with me, and you know, he

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Speaker 3: told her. At the time he still thought it was

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Speaker 3: nothing to really worry about. But they did some tests

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Speaker 3: and mate straight away into the hospital. It turned out

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Speaker 3: to be bone cancer and at three weeks of age, Yeah,

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Speaker 3: the arm was amputated to save my life and I

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Speaker 3: became a one arm bandit. Wow.

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Speaker 1: So Paul, you say that you were born with cancer,

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Speaker 1: does that mean that your mother had cancer before that

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Speaker 1: or how does that work?

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Speaker 3: Mate? It was just one of those one and a

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Speaker 3: billion things, no explanation. My mother was a very healthy,

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Speaker 3: clean living you know, young lady. No drugs and alcohol

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Speaker 3: and nothing like that. Just mate, Just but there's a

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Speaker 3: lot of funny things going on back in those days.

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Speaker 3: I was not a for little mind baby at all.

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Speaker 3: I was just two, our baby, you know. But as

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Speaker 3: you know, back in those days, a lot of kids

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Speaker 3: had the forlio minde so they had the tiny sort

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Speaker 3: of deformed arm. You know, there were things going on

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Speaker 3: back in the day. Who knows. But mate, Look, it

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Speaker 3: was just one of those things that there's no real explanation.

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Speaker 3: It just is what it is. And luckily they saved

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Speaker 3: my life by taking the arm off, so you know,

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Speaker 3: it wasn't the first time I nearly died. But I'm

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Speaker 3: still here.

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Speaker 2: We'll get to your lifelines, mate, along the journeys.

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Speaker 1: So obviously, and I say obviously, you know you don't

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Speaker 1: know life with a right arm. Did you have a

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Speaker 1: tough gig growing up and what did that look like

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Speaker 1: going through school?

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Speaker 3: I did and I did not, because I come from

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Speaker 3: a very loving family, a very close family, and I've

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Speaker 3: got an older brother. He's two and a half years

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Speaker 3: older me, and you know, he used to beat the

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Speaker 3: shit out of me as a kid all the time

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Speaker 3: as he was older.

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Speaker 2: And of course he did.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and at that age, two and a half years

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Speaker 3: older than he's a lot, you know, He's always a

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Speaker 3: head taller, he's always a stone heavier in the old measurement.

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Speaker 3: So I always copped it. But I like that because

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Speaker 3: he just treated me, you know, normally, as his equal.

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Speaker 3: So handing out a beating to me was was great.

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Speaker 3: I could just wrestle with him, fight with him. But

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Speaker 3: then when I went to school, all of a sudden, teachers,

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Speaker 3: other students, everybody started, you know, treating me differently, and

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Speaker 3: I couldn't really work it out. I mean, I had

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Speaker 3: a prosthetic arm when I was a kid. I wouldn't.

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Speaker 3: I'm with a hook on the end. Some way, Nipna

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Speaker 3: became captain hook.

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Speaker 2: Of course it did. Of course it did that bother you.

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Speaker 3: Well, mate, look, honestly, I'll give you some examples of

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Speaker 3: what it was like on the weekends, I'd play rugby

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Speaker 3: with my mates. Yeah, I like a bit of footy,

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Speaker 3: and that was a fast I was athletic and I

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Speaker 3: did fine there's on the weekends. But at school the

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Speaker 3: coach would let me play rugby. He said, oh, you know,

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Speaker 3: your arm might hurt another kid the prosthetic arm. So

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Speaker 3: I said, yeah, but I'll take it off and he said, oh,

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Speaker 3: you know, like, I don't think you can play football

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Speaker 3: with one arm. So the biggest handicap as a kid

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Speaker 3: was not the actual disability or the so called handicap made.

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Speaker 1: It was the attitudes of other people, adults putting obstacles

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Speaker 1: in the way that didn't didn't understand the disability, didn't

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Speaker 1: know how to manage the disability. So the easiest thing

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Speaker 1: to do was to exclude you, to go right, yeah,

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Speaker 1: step step aside. We don't know how to deal with

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Speaker 1: this or where you go.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. And another thing was like we had social dance.

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Speaker 3: I don't know if you remember that, you mate, you're

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Speaker 3: you're a lot younger than me. I think you're about

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Speaker 3: forty five on your name, I free, but yeah, you're

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Speaker 3: a young man to me. But look back in the day, mate,

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Speaker 3: kids were cruel.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's why I mentioned it.

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Speaker 1: They were called back in my day, let loan, you know, go,

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Speaker 1: you know, go back and up a decade or so.

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Speaker 3: Well, they give you some idea. In social dance. They

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Speaker 3: would have all the girls down one side of the

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Speaker 3: hall and all the boys down the other, and they'd say, okay,

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Speaker 3: it's the girls turn to pick a partner, and they'd

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Speaker 3: come flying across that hall and there'd be about five

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Speaker 3: kids left sitting there and the girls would not touch them.

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Speaker 3: And there was me, the two fattest kids, a Chinese kid,

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Speaker 3: and back in those days, he was different because there

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Speaker 3: was no Chinese kids. There was a kid with very,

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Speaker 3: very thick glasses he could hardly see without them, and

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Speaker 3: I'm not making this up, a one eyed kid. And

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Speaker 3: we'd be sitting there and the girls wouldn't want any

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Speaker 3: part of us. Mate, And that's when I started to realize, Okay,

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Speaker 3: I'm different, and myself and those other kids, who you

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Speaker 3: probably would say were the losers, we all sort of

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Speaker 3: gravitated towards each other.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely, yes, to form a sense of belonging, because you

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Speaker 1: feel like you didn't belong anywhere, and you know you

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Speaker 1: belong in this in this group.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, And you know what, I didn't realize that

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Speaker 3: until I was an adult looking back to me, they

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Speaker 3: were just my mates, they were my friends. And obviously

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Speaker 3: looking back, it's because we were all sort of the losers,

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Speaker 3: you know, for one of a better world. But you

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Speaker 3: know what happened here, it was and I don't want

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Speaker 3: to be too cliche, but at my age, what happened

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Speaker 3: when I was about nine was a gentleman by the

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Speaker 3: name of Bruce Lee.

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Speaker 2: They Bruce Lee, the legend mate. I remember being.

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Speaker 1: Obsessed with Bruce Leete when I was young, and before

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Speaker 1: we get on to Bruce Lee, because I'm trying to

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Speaker 1: keep this chronological of you growing up and that mindset shift.

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Speaker 2: So at home, nothing nothing appeared wrong.

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Speaker 1: It was just a case of you were going through

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Speaker 1: life and your parents were just treating you like normal

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Speaker 1: and you're getting kicked kicked, kicked in by your brother.

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Speaker 3: It was the opposite. If you had a victim mentality

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Speaker 3: in front of mind mother, you were going to get

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Speaker 3: drop kicked into the wall. Yes, and if I check

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Speaker 3: this out, and you'll appreciate this. Being an ex military man,

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Speaker 3: when I was a young boy, there was still a

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Speaker 3: lot of World War Two veterans around. Now. In Sydney

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Speaker 3: where I was at the time, there was a great,

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Speaker 3: big place I'm not making this up. You can look

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Speaker 3: it up called the Limb Factory. Now, the limb Factory

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Speaker 3: was a place where they would make plaster casts and

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Speaker 3: prosthetic limbs for people with missing limbs, especially World War

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Speaker 3: Two veterans. And when I went to this limb factory

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Speaker 3: with my mother one day, there was a waiting room

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Speaker 3: and the door was violently kicked open, violently kicked open,

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Speaker 3: and it was a young man with no arms, and

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Speaker 3: he used his legs for everything. And my mother whispered

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Speaker 3: to me, you see, there's always someone worse off than you.

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Speaker 3: You know. One day we were there and a little

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Speaker 3: girl got wheeled in and she had no arms and

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Speaker 3: no legs, just a torsol and a head mate. And

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Speaker 3: you know, my mom used to say to me, you know,

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Speaker 3: having one arms, nothing, look at these people. So it

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Speaker 3: was a funny childhood because you know, I've never ever

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Speaker 3: had a victim mentality. Mate, even when I was a kid,

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Speaker 3: I mean older how to fight and started fighting one

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Speaker 3: with the bullies as I got older.

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Speaker 1: But how did that mentality shift because you're being treated

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Speaker 1: like this at home, of course, you know, of course

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Speaker 1: you are. You know, you go to school and you

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Speaker 1: get treated completely different. How did you manage that sort

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Speaker 1: of mindset shift from you know, being completely normal at home.

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Speaker 1: Did you almost go to school and could you not

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Speaker 1: wait to get home? How does that work from such

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Speaker 1: a young age.

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Speaker 3: Yeah? Well, going back to that prosthetic arm that I

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Speaker 3: used to wear, I hated it and I wanted to

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Speaker 3: keep my mother happy. So when I left home to

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Speaker 3: go to school in the morning, i'd take it off

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Speaker 3: and put it in my bag, and just before I

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Speaker 3: got home, i'd put it back on because I wanted

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Speaker 3: to keep my un happy. But at school, I wanted

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Speaker 3: no part of it because I wanted to play sports

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Speaker 3: and roll around and you know, all this kind of thing.

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Speaker 3: I was never I was never a victim theate, never

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Speaker 3: have me, never will be. But even back in those days,

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Speaker 3: I didn't like it. When we had the social dance,

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Speaker 3: I hated it. When the girls had They're scared of me,

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Speaker 3: and no way am I going to go dancing with

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Speaker 3: him and all this kind of thing. Kids were very cruel.

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Speaker 3: They'd say some very cruel things to me. They're little things,

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Speaker 3: and they're things that people wouldn't think of. But I

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Speaker 3: think what happened was I had an inbuilt, deep insecurity

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Speaker 3: that I wasn't even really aware of. But when I

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Speaker 3: discovered Bruce Lee at about nine years of age and

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Speaker 3: I discovered martial arts, I kind of went over the

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Speaker 3: top with it. And I think it was that insecurity

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Speaker 3: deep down that I wasn't even aware of fueling it.

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Speaker 3: You know, my dream was to beat up the bullies

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Speaker 3: and my brother, you know, and Mate, I'm sure you'll

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Speaker 3: agree with me, you know, knowing the bit that I

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Speaker 3: do about you. But to me, perspective and attitude, just everything.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely showing up being present, you know, yeah, just you know, yeah,

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Speaker 1: you know, swallowing your pride and you know, just showing

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Speaker 1: people that you're there, that you're not going to shy

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Speaker 1: away from a challenge, that you're not going to back down.

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Speaker 2: That I get it. I get it.

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Speaker 1: And I suppose that was that's a defense mechanism that

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Speaker 1: you needed to sort of not to replace your disability

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Speaker 1: you are, but just to show people that it's not

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Speaker 1: a disability. No.

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Speaker 3: Well, I went to my first martial arts lesson at

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Speaker 3: nine or ten which was a judoism and mate, as

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Speaker 3: fate would have it, there's a fair bit of fate

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Speaker 3: in my story. The judo instructor had all the fingers

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Speaker 3: missing off his off his off his hand.

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Speaker 2: So how did that makes you feel.

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Speaker 3: Really fucking happy? This is the first lesson in perspective

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Speaker 3: and attitude. I had. The judo instructor who had all

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Speaker 3: his fingers missing off his right hand. He said to me.

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Speaker 3: He looked at me, and he goes, you, you're gonna

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Speaker 3: have to be careful because you're going to be dangerous.

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Speaker 3: And I'm like, what for me? Because mate, at this time,

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Speaker 3: I'm like nine years old, I'm a bedwetter. I'm insecure,

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Speaker 3: probably and not even knowing it. I've got all these

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Speaker 3: issues and probably not even really aware of what they are.

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Speaker 3: But I've got this thing in me. And he said

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Speaker 3: to me, look at my hand, and he showed me.

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Speaker 3: He said, I don't have any fingers on this hand,

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Speaker 3: and it looked like a club. And he said to me,

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Speaker 3: I've got an inbuilt club. He said, I can beat

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Speaker 3: people to endo unconsciouness with this club. It's an advantage.

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Speaker 3: And he said to me, he said to me, you've

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Speaker 3: only got one arm, he said, so, I bet it's

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Speaker 3: really strong. He said, because you know what're ten years

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Speaker 3: old and you've been using it for ten years. One arm,

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Speaker 3: he said, that'll be stronger than someone else's arm. He said,

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Speaker 3: you can hit two or three times harder than anybody else.

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Speaker 3: He said, how are your legs? And mate, as a kid,

256
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Speaker 3: I used to kick light switch is on and off,

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Speaker 3: holding a plate in hand at night out of necessity.

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Speaker 3: And so he said to me, you know your legs

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Speaker 3: must be really good. And I thought, yeah, well they are.

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Speaker 3: And he said to me, so you're going to be dangerous.

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Speaker 3: You have to be careful. And that was a prospective

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Speaker 3: and attitude thing. He just saw the advantage in the

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Speaker 3: so called disability. And what he taught me was the

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Speaker 3: hip throw into an armbar. And I was bored out

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Speaker 3: of my brain right, But you know what, he wouldn't

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Speaker 3: let me do anything else for the first made It

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Speaker 3: must have been six weeks. He wouldn't let me do

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Speaker 3: anything else. He made me perfect at it and on

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Speaker 3: my first grade into the yellow belt. And it was

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Speaker 3: only about eight weeks later. A couple of months later,

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Speaker 3: this big kid with red hair on and forget it

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Speaker 3: is quite scary freckles near an orange belt. So I

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Speaker 3: thought he was amazing and he was bigger, an a

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Speaker 3: bit older and made the instructor looked at me and

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Speaker 3: he said, you know what to do. And as soon

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Speaker 3: as they started, I went straight into the hipsow on

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Speaker 3: the arm bar. This kid tapped out. I got my

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Speaker 3: yellow belt and late the rest is history.

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Speaker 1: You continued this, this progression into martial arts, and you

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Speaker 1: made your way through through through about elaborate on that.

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Speaker 2: What do you mean way too much?

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Speaker 3: Mate? I was doing martial arts in my late twenties.

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Speaker 3: I ended up with a second dan black belt and

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Speaker 3: hap keto. I don't know if you know what that is.

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Speaker 1: Do just explain that as well to the listeners.

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Speaker 3: Hap Keto's a Korean martial arts. It means the way

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Speaker 3: of coordinated power. And it all revolves around a concept

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Speaker 3: called key And when you talk about key energy, most

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Speaker 3: people go, oh funk, I'm out here, we go wanka

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Speaker 3: key energy. From a very young age, Mate allowed me

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Speaker 3: to do things like ride motorbikes with one other and

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Speaker 3: everyone said I couldn't. I did, allowed me to drive

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Speaker 3: manual cars. They would let me approve I could so

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Speaker 3: I did you know? It went into other parts of

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Speaker 3: my life and Kenagey has a concept made and taught

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Speaker 3: me that the mind is everything. The mind is everything.

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Speaker 3: And you know, it doesn't matter who the bloke is.

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Speaker 3: If you've got the mind, it's your mind versus his mind.

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Speaker 3: And if you've got the better mind and you've got

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Speaker 3: the right techniquet, the right man, and it doesn't matter

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Speaker 3: who it is, mate, you can take him out. This

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Speaker 3: is real martial arts. I'm not talking about Hollywood stuff.

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Speaker 3: I'm talking about the real, brutal, quick, nasty shit that

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Speaker 3: actually works. And I got deep, deep into that.

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Speaker 1: Was there a bit of was there a bit of

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Speaker 1: a fuck you attitude along with it, as in, you know,

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Speaker 1: people say that I can't do it, What fuck you?

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Speaker 1: I'm going to go out and prove it, and I'm

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Speaker 1: going to prove it, and I'm not just going to

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Speaker 1: prove it. I'm going to tear the ass out of it.

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Speaker 3: All right, we'll check this out. I was about probably

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Speaker 3: twenty one twenty two in Sydney. There's a big building

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Speaker 3: called the Town Hall in the middle of Sydney and

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Speaker 3: once a year that had the Kalkashinkai Karate tournament's there

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Speaker 3: full contact karate, and I did a lot of that

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Speaker 3: in Japan as an older man too, but that's another story.

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Speaker 3: But the Kiyalkishin kai karate guys contacted me because I've

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Speaker 3: been on the cover of a martial arts magazine and

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Speaker 3: the story about it was about this one armed guy

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Speaker 3: that was a really good martial artist with a black

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Speaker 3: belt arm. Anyway, they had a black belt their organization

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Speaker 3: with one arm as well, so they contacted me and

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Speaker 3: they said, we want you to to have an exhibition

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Speaker 3: fight at the town hall. And it pissed me off

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Speaker 3: that much. I said, I'll tell you what. I will

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Speaker 3: fight your current champion full contact you're able body champion

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Speaker 3: at my weight at the town hall. I said, I'm

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Speaker 3: not fighting the fucking guy with one arm. And he goes, mate,

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Speaker 3: you've got one arm, and I said, mate, do you

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Speaker 3: know what I'm going to do to a fucking bloke

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Speaker 3: with one arm? I said, it's just not going to

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Speaker 3: last fucking thirty seconds anyway. He said, but you've only

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Speaker 3: got one arm, and I thought, yeah, fair call, but no,

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Speaker 3: I mean yeah, but anyway, that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I will mess him up if I Yeah, you're

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00:17:09,320 --> 00:17:11,879
Speaker 1: in that mentality. Right, that's the head space that you

337
00:17:11,880 --> 00:17:14,399
Speaker 1: were in. Do you think it was a positive and

338
00:17:15,320 --> 00:17:17,920
Speaker 1: mentality to be in or was it a bit of

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Speaker 1: a delusional mentality headspace?

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Speaker 3: It was both because prior to this, I'd been very

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Speaker 3: much involved in martial arts that you would say is

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00:17:29,480 --> 00:17:32,080
Speaker 3: a bit suburban, a bit sort of creative kid, bit

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Speaker 3: Hollywood inspired, do you know what I mean? And look

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Speaker 3: at that age. I started working in a garage and

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Speaker 3: back in those days, a garage in Sydney. This is special.

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Speaker 3: That was a full service garage where you pump the petrol,

347
00:17:47,240 --> 00:17:50,840
Speaker 3: checked the oil, check the tires. But funny thing about

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00:17:50,880 --> 00:17:53,400
Speaker 3: that garage made if I can quickly tell you, I

349
00:17:53,440 --> 00:17:56,600
Speaker 3: was obsessed with the Essays when I was in my

350
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Speaker 3: late terms early twenties, I was obsessed with the Essays,

351
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Speaker 3: martial arts and the SAS. I read everything I could

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00:18:04,359 --> 00:18:08,359
Speaker 3: get my hands on about the SAS and I kept

353
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Speaker 3: on associating the SAS boys with the ninja whose real

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00:18:13,520 --> 00:18:16,720
Speaker 3: name and actual factor is the Shenobi now the Shanobi,

355
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Speaker 3: with the true special forces of ancient Japan, and the

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00:18:20,920 --> 00:18:23,399
Speaker 3: correlation between them and the ss to me was fascinating.

357
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Speaker 3: But long story short, I worked at this garage. I

358
00:18:26,119 --> 00:18:28,040
Speaker 3: told you about no one else had given me a

359
00:18:28,080 --> 00:18:29,880
Speaker 3: job back in those days, because they had one armed.

360
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Speaker 3: One day I went in there to get the job

361
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Speaker 3: and there's this big, burly, red headed guy with his

362
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Speaker 3: piercing green eyes. He owned the garage. And he looked

363
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Speaker 3: at me, and I'd already been turned away from all

364
00:18:42,560 --> 00:18:44,800
Speaker 3: these places they wouldn't give me a job. And he

365
00:18:44,840 --> 00:18:47,520
Speaker 3: looked at me and he said, I've got my reservations

366
00:18:47,520 --> 00:18:51,280
Speaker 3: about your own, but I'll give you a chance. You

367
00:18:51,320 --> 00:18:53,560
Speaker 3: can work for free this afternoon. If I think you're

368
00:18:53,640 --> 00:18:57,320
Speaker 3: up for it, you can start tomorrow. I worked with

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Speaker 3: this guy for about six years, and about three years

370
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Speaker 3: in here's me obsessed with the fucking Sas. About three

371
00:19:04,960 --> 00:19:09,399
Speaker 3: years in I see a fully uniformed major from the

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Speaker 3: Australian Sas walk into the garage. I'm like, what the fuck?

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Speaker 3: He had the brain and everything, mate. I couldn't believe it.

374
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Speaker 3: And when he left, I said to the assistant manager,

375
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Speaker 3: I said, why is that bloke here? He said, I

376
00:19:23,960 --> 00:19:25,480
Speaker 3: had to see Ross, and Ross was the owner of

377
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Speaker 3: the garage. You got the job, mate. Ross was before

378
00:19:28,720 --> 00:19:30,679
Speaker 3: he owned the garage. He was a fucking captain in

379
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Speaker 3: the Australian Sas.

380
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Speaker 2: Fucking no way, and he kept that quit.

381
00:19:34,760 --> 00:19:36,560
Speaker 3: When I found out he's in the SAS, I became

382
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Speaker 3: a fanboy in a fucking nuisance.

383
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Speaker 2: You know.

384
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Speaker 3: I wouldn't leave him alone. But mate, he taught me

385
00:19:41,560 --> 00:19:46,600
Speaker 3: so much about life, just in a general perspective, and

386
00:19:46,960 --> 00:19:51,320
Speaker 3: that coupled with my martial arts teaching, it really formed

387
00:19:51,320 --> 00:19:54,360
Speaker 3: do I eventually became as an adult him and these

388
00:19:54,400 --> 00:19:56,760
Speaker 3: martial arts teachers. I had an eighth Dan black belt

389
00:19:56,760 --> 00:19:59,439
Speaker 3: prime master teach me have keto. I had a private

390
00:19:59,440 --> 00:20:02,680
Speaker 3: instructor who was from China in Northern child and gong Fu.

391
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Speaker 2: You were deep in it.

392
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Speaker 3: Oh, it's deep in it late.

393
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Speaker 1: So it sounds like that you had without even realizing it.

394
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Speaker 1: You had some great role models around you. You had

395
00:20:11,359 --> 00:20:13,239
Speaker 1: some great people that you could look up to that

396
00:20:13,280 --> 00:20:16,719
Speaker 1: would influence you in a positive way just through you

397
00:20:16,720 --> 00:20:19,720
Speaker 1: know their actions, let alone what they're they're they're telling you.

398
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Speaker 1: And I think that's super important growing up and always say,

399
00:20:22,440 --> 00:20:26,960
Speaker 1: you know, children and teenagers, even young adults, they learn

400
00:20:27,119 --> 00:20:30,280
Speaker 1: from what they see, not necessarily from what they what

401
00:20:30,320 --> 00:20:32,800
Speaker 1: they you know, what they read, or what they are,

402
00:20:32,840 --> 00:20:35,720
Speaker 1: what they hear you know, just just being a visual

403
00:20:35,840 --> 00:20:39,479
Speaker 1: sort of role model is super important, isn't it.

404
00:20:40,040 --> 00:20:42,359
Speaker 3: Mate? Look, I don't want to sound like a typical

405
00:20:42,359 --> 00:20:44,720
Speaker 3: old blake. I'm nearly sixty three. I'll probably sound like

406
00:20:44,720 --> 00:20:49,800
Speaker 3: an old man, but I'm sincerely worried about the young people. Now, Mate,

407
00:20:50,800 --> 00:20:53,119
Speaker 3: what I would say to people through my years of

408
00:20:53,200 --> 00:20:56,879
Speaker 3: martial arts and adversity and overcoming it is, Mate, honestly,

409
00:20:56,920 --> 00:20:59,360
Speaker 3: I see people as just playing people. I don't see

410
00:20:59,359 --> 00:21:01,200
Speaker 3: the color of the skin, and I don't see the culture.

411
00:21:01,480 --> 00:21:04,000
Speaker 3: It's just people. And to me, it's all about love

412
00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:07,800
Speaker 3: and be loved. It's all about respecting each other, and

413
00:21:07,880 --> 00:21:10,440
Speaker 3: it's all about not being a victim and being positive.

414
00:21:10,560 --> 00:21:11,879
Speaker 2: Mate? Is that? What is that?

415
00:21:11,920 --> 00:21:14,680
Speaker 1: Why you decided to get above the clouds and climb

416
00:21:14,760 --> 00:21:15,320
Speaker 1: out everest?

417
00:21:15,560 --> 00:21:17,720
Speaker 2: And know it's a bit of a zegwe, But.

418
00:21:19,480 --> 00:21:23,040
Speaker 1: Why I love climbing is because when I'm above the clouds, mate,

419
00:21:23,680 --> 00:21:28,120
Speaker 1: I don't see all the chaos and all the you know,

420
00:21:28,800 --> 00:21:31,840
Speaker 1: the rat race that happens, you know, I don't.

421
00:21:32,040 --> 00:21:33,520
Speaker 2: I don't hear any of it.

422
00:21:33,680 --> 00:21:35,960
Speaker 1: And you know, when I get to a certain stage

423
00:21:36,000 --> 00:21:37,680
Speaker 1: which you can relate to, where you just look and

424
00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:41,480
Speaker 1: it's just all you see peaks rising above the clouds,

425
00:21:41,480 --> 00:21:44,959
Speaker 1: and you see nothing else. It's almost like a new world.

426
00:21:45,000 --> 00:21:49,320
Speaker 1: It's almost like a new new platform. That's why I climb, Maate,

427
00:21:49,520 --> 00:21:51,359
Speaker 1: is to get away from all the noise, get away

428
00:21:51,359 --> 00:21:53,520
Speaker 1: from all the chaos, get away from all the confusion,

429
00:21:53,560 --> 00:21:55,960
Speaker 1: all the frustration, all the anger, all the violets that's

430
00:21:56,320 --> 00:22:02,880
Speaker 1: underneath these clouds that that transpires. Why in the hell

431
00:22:03,359 --> 00:22:06,239
Speaker 1: and how in the hell did that come up when

432
00:22:06,280 --> 00:22:07,320
Speaker 1: you just forced yourself?

433
00:22:07,359 --> 00:22:09,760
Speaker 2: Do you know what? I'm going to take.

434
00:22:09,560 --> 00:22:14,000
Speaker 1: On the highest mountain in the world, the most dangerous

435
00:22:14,000 --> 00:22:16,040
Speaker 1: mountain in the world, which it is because of the

436
00:22:16,080 --> 00:22:19,479
Speaker 1: altitude where people die all the time, and I'm going

437
00:22:19,520 --> 00:22:21,640
Speaker 1: to take it on with one arm.

438
00:22:21,920 --> 00:22:24,359
Speaker 3: See, people kept telling me I couldn't do shit. Do

439
00:22:24,359 --> 00:22:27,240
Speaker 3: you have an example motorbikes. I couldn't ride a motorbike, right,

440
00:22:27,280 --> 00:22:29,159
Speaker 3: They wouldn't let me. But I meant you know what

441
00:22:29,160 --> 00:22:31,040
Speaker 3: I did, Mate, I sent a made of mine in

442
00:22:31,160 --> 00:22:33,439
Speaker 3: back in the day. There's no photos to say that

443
00:22:33,520 --> 00:22:36,160
Speaker 3: he was mew. I bought him a cart and a beer,

444
00:22:36,560 --> 00:22:39,800
Speaker 3: and then he got me a learners permit and Mate,

445
00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:41,920
Speaker 3: I rode the motorbike around the streets of Sydney for

446
00:22:41,960 --> 00:22:44,480
Speaker 3: a year, never got pulled out of by the cops.

447
00:22:44,520 --> 00:22:47,640
Speaker 3: Once went back to the motor industry and the guy

448
00:22:47,720 --> 00:22:50,560
Speaker 3: is there looking at me, gone, how did you get

449
00:22:50,600 --> 00:22:53,320
Speaker 3: this learner's permit? I said, I just walked in here

450
00:22:53,359 --> 00:22:55,360
Speaker 3: and got it. He said, what about your arm? I said,

451
00:22:55,400 --> 00:22:57,800
Speaker 3: I don't know. No one noticed, and he's like, what's

452
00:22:57,800 --> 00:23:00,600
Speaker 3: wrong with your arm? I said, I've only got one arm.

453
00:23:00,840 --> 00:23:04,040
Speaker 3: And he's like, you just can't ride a motorbike. I said,

454
00:23:04,080 --> 00:23:07,080
Speaker 3: might've been riding for a year. Selling story short. They

455
00:23:07,119 --> 00:23:09,159
Speaker 3: had to give it the fest. I passed and I

456
00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:12,879
Speaker 3: got the license. Now to answer the question about Everest,

457
00:23:12,920 --> 00:23:15,000
Speaker 3: this mindset I had was people keep telling me I

458
00:23:15,000 --> 00:23:18,520
Speaker 3: can't do shit, but of course I could. Yeah. So

459
00:23:19,080 --> 00:23:21,640
Speaker 3: I was even told I couldn't teach martial arts. Mate,

460
00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:24,160
Speaker 3: after that service station I told you about, I taught

461
00:23:24,200 --> 00:23:26,879
Speaker 3: martial arts for a living for three years.

462
00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:27,880
Speaker 2: Amazing.

463
00:23:28,760 --> 00:23:30,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, but it was you know, you can't write a motorbike.

464
00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:32,480
Speaker 3: I did it. You can't teach martial arts. I did

465
00:23:32,520 --> 00:23:37,200
Speaker 3: it and successfully. And then I went to Japan and

466
00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:41,600
Speaker 3: they said you can't train with Naslama Kyoka Shinkai. He's

467
00:23:41,640 --> 00:23:44,040
Speaker 3: too famous, You're nobody. So I just went to Japan

468
00:23:44,119 --> 00:23:46,760
Speaker 3: and went to his dojo, he's school, and knocked on

469
00:23:46,800 --> 00:23:51,760
Speaker 3: the fucking door right. Subsequently, three weeks in I had

470
00:23:51,760 --> 00:23:53,240
Speaker 3: a fight with one of his black belts and I

471
00:23:53,280 --> 00:23:57,199
Speaker 3: got kicked out. Not proud of that, but I won

472
00:23:57,280 --> 00:24:01,560
Speaker 3: that fight too, and then to teach in English for

473
00:24:01,600 --> 00:24:03,840
Speaker 3: a living, and I stayed there, got married to a

474
00:24:03,880 --> 00:24:07,919
Speaker 3: Japanese lady, had kids, So then I became this. I

475
00:24:07,960 --> 00:24:10,720
Speaker 3: came back to Australia mate, because my stepfather was dying

476
00:24:10,760 --> 00:24:13,080
Speaker 3: of cancer and I was with him and he took

477
00:24:13,119 --> 00:24:18,840
Speaker 3: his last breath. Then my father not long after that,

478
00:24:19,080 --> 00:24:21,800
Speaker 3: couple of years later he got terminal cancer and he

479
00:24:21,880 --> 00:24:23,119
Speaker 3: died and I was with him when he took his

480
00:24:23,200 --> 00:24:27,199
Speaker 3: last breath. And then by this time, Mate, I was

481
00:24:27,240 --> 00:24:30,920
Speaker 3: sort of out of shape. I was smoking, drinking, gambling,

482
00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:35,680
Speaker 3: married with three kids, working my ass off. And then

483
00:24:35,680 --> 00:24:38,640
Speaker 3: my mother told my brother and my sister that shared

484
00:24:38,720 --> 00:24:42,359
Speaker 3: terminal cancer. So there I was. Mate. I'd sort of

485
00:24:42,359 --> 00:24:45,480
Speaker 3: lost my way with martial arts. I was late thirties

486
00:24:46,359 --> 00:24:49,040
Speaker 3: and I sort of got pissed and I went to

487
00:24:49,080 --> 00:24:52,639
Speaker 3: my best mate's house and I said, I can't believe it.

488
00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:58,200
Speaker 3: I'm gonna lose mom as well. And I said to him, mate,

489
00:24:58,200 --> 00:24:59,679
Speaker 3: you know what I'm going to do it? And I

490
00:24:59,680 --> 00:25:04,960
Speaker 3: was He said what I said, I'm going to I'm

491
00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:06,800
Speaker 3: going to find out if for one armed dude's climbed

492
00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:10,399
Speaker 3: Everest and if he hasn't, I'm going to climb. It

493
00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:14,680
Speaker 3: turned into a fundraise of kid's cancer research and I'm

494
00:25:14,680 --> 00:25:16,800
Speaker 3: going to do it all in mum's name. My mother's

495
00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:18,480
Speaker 3: name was Dorothy Bridge. And I said, I'm going to

496
00:25:18,480 --> 00:25:22,040
Speaker 3: form an expedition called the Dorothy Bridge Expedition and I'm

497
00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:24,639
Speaker 3: going to climate it raise money for kids cancer research

498
00:25:24,680 --> 00:25:28,760
Speaker 3: and her name. And my best mate looked at me

499
00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:31,880
Speaker 3: and he said, I've seen you build a house. I've

500
00:25:31,920 --> 00:25:33,959
Speaker 3: seen you hit the dag. I saw I still hit

501
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:35,840
Speaker 3: the punching bag, you know. He said, I've seen you

502
00:25:35,880 --> 00:25:37,399
Speaker 3: ride You made white, he said made. If anyone can

503
00:25:37,480 --> 00:25:40,560
Speaker 3: do it, it's yeah. But then after that, mate, I couldn't

504
00:25:40,640 --> 00:25:44,760
Speaker 3: raise one cent from the Australian corporates or sponsors to

505
00:25:45,119 --> 00:25:49,000
Speaker 3: do it. I couldn't. So I went to my mother

506
00:25:49,080 --> 00:25:53,760
Speaker 3: who who was dialing Therman Cancer and with her permission

507
00:25:54,520 --> 00:25:59,160
Speaker 3: and my wife's permission, because I needed their permission, I said,

508
00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:02,720
Speaker 3: can I can I climb Everest? And my mother's attitude was,

509
00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:06,320
Speaker 3: it's so dangerous. She's got three little kids. But my

510
00:26:06,359 --> 00:26:08,600
Speaker 3: wife had no idea about Everest. And she said, oh,

511
00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:12,000
Speaker 3: is it hard? And I said, well, yeah, I said

512
00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:13,679
Speaker 3: it'll take a while. She said how long and I

513
00:26:13,680 --> 00:26:16,040
Speaker 3: said probably a couple of months. Oh, it must be

514
00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:19,600
Speaker 3: very hard. I said it'll be fine. I didn't tell

515
00:26:19,680 --> 00:26:21,359
Speaker 3: that it was going to cost to fortune and that

516
00:26:21,440 --> 00:26:24,040
Speaker 3: it was going to take years of training. But long

517
00:26:24,119 --> 00:26:27,439
Speaker 3: story short, mate, I went to the record books. No

518
00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:30,520
Speaker 3: disabled climb I had ever been able to make it

519
00:26:30,600 --> 00:26:32,760
Speaker 3: up the north side of Everest from Tibet, up the

520
00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:36,520
Speaker 3: northeast route, which I believe you climbed as well. Correct,

521
00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:41,080
Speaker 3: and yeah, And there had been had been too up

522
00:26:41,119 --> 00:26:44,359
Speaker 3: the south side, and an American with one arm and

523
00:26:44,359 --> 00:26:46,800
Speaker 3: a bloke with half a leg. Now the bloke with

524
00:26:46,840 --> 00:26:49,560
Speaker 3: half a leg, he'd gotten two thirds of the way

525
00:26:49,640 --> 00:26:51,720
Speaker 3: up the northeast rout but he couldn't do it, so

526
00:26:51,760 --> 00:26:55,399
Speaker 3: he ended up going round to the south. So the

527
00:26:55,440 --> 00:26:58,199
Speaker 3: south side had two people with disabilities he'd done it,

528
00:26:58,480 --> 00:27:00,960
Speaker 3: but the north had none. And then I looked further

529
00:27:01,040 --> 00:27:04,480
Speaker 3: into the statistics and many many people disabilities had tried.

530
00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:08,600
Speaker 3: So I thought that's for me. So I said to it, mate,

531
00:27:08,800 --> 00:27:10,720
Speaker 3: you know, I'm gonna I'm gonna climb the north side

532
00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:13,919
Speaker 3: of Mount Everest, but it get make it a wall first,

533
00:27:14,119 --> 00:27:17,160
Speaker 3: you know, first decided what ascent the north side of Everest.

534
00:27:24,560 --> 00:27:29,679
Speaker 1: H And that decision was made because it was the

535
00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:34,119
Speaker 1: tougher side. And also just knowing you now and people

536
00:27:34,280 --> 00:27:36,919
Speaker 1: were failing it with disabilities that you were just like

537
00:27:37,520 --> 00:27:40,480
Speaker 1: again the attitude, fuck this, I'm gonna do it.

538
00:27:40,560 --> 00:27:42,840
Speaker 3: Yeah. And also at the time, because it was way

539
00:27:42,880 --> 00:27:45,200
Speaker 3: back in the day, a lot cheaper, a lot cheaper

540
00:27:45,240 --> 00:27:49,320
Speaker 3: than the south side. So mate, I thought that's for me.

541
00:27:49,440 --> 00:27:52,520
Speaker 3: But mate, I couldn't raise one cent for sponsorship.

542
00:27:54,320 --> 00:27:55,960
Speaker 2: But I do.

543
00:27:56,119 --> 00:27:57,840
Speaker 3: I don't always do. I found out who's the best

544
00:27:57,880 --> 00:28:00,760
Speaker 3: climber to teach me to climb in the area and

545
00:28:00,800 --> 00:28:04,280
Speaker 3: it's on an Aussie. But you've read the book in

546
00:28:04,280 --> 00:28:07,399
Speaker 3: the Thin Air, Yes, so have you Guy Cotter. He

547
00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:10,280
Speaker 3: was in the book. In the movie if you've seen it,

548
00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:13,679
Speaker 3: Guy Cotter is played by the actor Sam Worthington. So

549
00:28:14,200 --> 00:28:16,199
Speaker 3: this is when an email first came out. No one

550
00:28:16,200 --> 00:28:17,880
Speaker 3: had never heard of it. This is how long ago

551
00:28:17,920 --> 00:28:21,720
Speaker 3: it was an our emailed guy Guy Cotter, and I said, mate,

552
00:28:21,760 --> 00:28:23,360
Speaker 3: I've got one arm. I want to climb the north

553
00:28:23,400 --> 00:28:25,320
Speaker 3: side of Everest and get a record or get a

554
00:28:25,320 --> 00:28:29,520
Speaker 3: world first. Can you train me? And he emailed me

555
00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:32,840
Speaker 3: back and he said, mate, at your age, no experience

556
00:28:32,880 --> 00:28:35,280
Speaker 3: one arm? He said, good luck. He said, but if

557
00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:37,760
Speaker 3: you want to come to New Zealand, he said, I'll

558
00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:40,000
Speaker 3: certainly try and help you. So I went to New Zealand.

559
00:28:41,400 --> 00:28:43,520
Speaker 2: So he offered you an olive branch.

560
00:28:43,600 --> 00:28:46,280
Speaker 1: He didn't just say no, He was like, right, listen,

561
00:28:46,800 --> 00:28:49,760
Speaker 1: you know, let's see come to newsic and what do

562
00:28:49,760 --> 00:28:52,520
Speaker 1: you know? What I love about you, Paul is you're

563
00:28:52,600 --> 00:28:56,000
Speaker 1: always showing up. You know you you They told you

564
00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:57,880
Speaker 1: you couldn't do marsh ks, you couldn't train with a

565
00:28:57,920 --> 00:29:01,000
Speaker 1: certain individual. You tip up on his door step. Someone

566
00:29:01,560 --> 00:29:03,520
Speaker 1: tells you something that you can't really do it, but

567
00:29:03,720 --> 00:29:08,120
Speaker 1: you know, come along. It's you're turning up for yourself

568
00:29:08,640 --> 00:29:11,440
Speaker 1: every single time, and you're consistent.

569
00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:15,120
Speaker 3: But you know the thing is, mate, and you know

570
00:29:15,200 --> 00:29:21,160
Speaker 3: this better than anybody. Anybody. Anybody can anybody can do it.

571
00:29:21,160 --> 00:29:24,440
Speaker 3: It's just a choice, that's all it is. Uh, you

572
00:29:24,520 --> 00:29:27,000
Speaker 3: want to be an optimist or a pessimist. You want

573
00:29:27,000 --> 00:29:28,600
Speaker 3: to be a victim or you want to be a winner.

574
00:29:28,640 --> 00:29:30,680
Speaker 3: I mean, it's just a choice, and it's so simple.

575
00:29:30,680 --> 00:29:36,520
Speaker 3: But look, I went there and make martial arts and

576
00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:40,479
Speaker 3: you'd probably appreciate this. And mountaineering, even though there are

577
00:29:40,480 --> 00:29:44,080
Speaker 3: different disciplines, they're kind of the same because you've got

578
00:29:44,080 --> 00:29:47,600
Speaker 3: to be in the middle of now. As I call it, mind,

579
00:29:47,640 --> 00:29:50,320
Speaker 3: body and spirit, in the middle of now. The Japanese

580
00:29:50,320 --> 00:29:52,440
Speaker 3: call it knacker Ema, which means the middle of now.

581
00:29:52,680 --> 00:29:54,760
Speaker 3: So mind, body and spirit in the middle of now,

582
00:29:55,240 --> 00:29:59,640
Speaker 3: no past, no future, just now, complete focus and you

583
00:29:59,720 --> 00:30:03,280
Speaker 3: just give up. And when I finished over there with

584
00:30:03,600 --> 00:30:06,080
Speaker 3: Guy's head, Guy, we'd spent a couple of weeks up

585
00:30:06,080 --> 00:30:08,280
Speaker 3: in the Alps of New Zealand. That was brutal. That

586
00:30:08,360 --> 00:30:12,640
Speaker 3: was fucking brutal up there, mate, that was the New

587
00:30:12,720 --> 00:30:14,480
Speaker 3: Zealand Alps. I mat if you ever climbed up there,

588
00:30:14,480 --> 00:30:18,840
Speaker 3: made or hiked up there, but it's it's harsh. And

589
00:30:18,920 --> 00:30:21,520
Speaker 3: a childhood hero of mine was also Sir Rebend Hillary,

590
00:30:22,720 --> 00:30:25,040
Speaker 3: the first guy with attending Norgay to climb Everest in

591
00:30:25,040 --> 00:30:28,400
Speaker 3: fifty three and he's New Zealand. But anyway, guy quite

592
00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:33,680
Speaker 3: a trained me. His lead guide trained me. And I said,

593
00:30:33,720 --> 00:30:36,440
Speaker 3: the guy can I I want to climb Everest And

594
00:30:36,480 --> 00:30:39,480
Speaker 3: he said, mate, you don't have a resume, you don't

595
00:30:39,480 --> 00:30:43,040
Speaker 3: have the experience. There's no way anyway. I wanted to

596
00:30:43,120 --> 00:30:46,080
Speaker 3: do this before my mom passed away. So I said,

597
00:30:46,080 --> 00:30:48,560
Speaker 3: the guy, you sent me a test. I didn't give

598
00:30:48,560 --> 00:30:52,479
Speaker 3: a shit what it is. I'll do it. And he said, okay.

599
00:30:53,120 --> 00:30:57,360
Speaker 3: Now that and Cagua in the Andes almost seven thousand

600
00:30:57,400 --> 00:31:00,480
Speaker 3: meters highly in our oxygen. He said, if you can

601
00:31:00,520 --> 00:31:06,280
Speaker 3: do that, maybe maybe we're getting squeezed into an expedition.

602
00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:08,560
Speaker 3: If an expedition leader is willing to give you a

603
00:31:08,560 --> 00:31:11,880
Speaker 3: game well made. As luck would have it, into thin

604
00:31:11,920 --> 00:31:15,240
Speaker 3: air of the book and Georgie Shuper in the book

605
00:31:16,040 --> 00:31:17,840
Speaker 3: turned out he was the one leading the climb Dack

606
00:31:17,840 --> 00:31:18,320
Speaker 3: and Cagua.

607
00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:21,800
Speaker 2: Oh really, yeah, I've done that Cocagua, mate.

608
00:31:21,800 --> 00:31:24,600
Speaker 3: I jumped on a plane with then Georgie and a

609
00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:27,520
Speaker 3: guy called Bill Krauss, And as fate would have it,

610
00:31:27,720 --> 00:31:28,720
Speaker 3: and George and I did.

611
00:31:28,680 --> 00:31:31,520
Speaker 2: It together, and you summited Oncagua.

612
00:31:32,480 --> 00:31:34,760
Speaker 3: Some of that in Cagua and all the way down

613
00:31:34,800 --> 00:31:35,800
Speaker 3: we got caught in the storm.

614
00:31:35,960 --> 00:31:37,440
Speaker 1: How long did it take you to get up to

615
00:31:37,440 --> 00:31:39,760
Speaker 1: get up to the summit from from base camp?

616
00:31:40,920 --> 00:31:42,920
Speaker 3: Fuck, it's a long time ago, now, mate, I reckon.

617
00:31:42,920 --> 00:31:46,640
Speaker 3: I was there for about just over two weeks or

618
00:31:46,640 --> 00:31:51,480
Speaker 3: three weeks. It was tough, but we got caught in

619
00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:55,520
Speaker 3: the storm on the way down. And as you naming

620
00:31:55,600 --> 00:31:58,120
Speaker 3: George and the storm whenever it's to ninety six, he

621
00:31:58,200 --> 00:32:00,920
Speaker 3: was quite affected by it and he wasn't happy to

622
00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:02,680
Speaker 3: be stuck up there with this one armed climber with

623
00:32:02,720 --> 00:32:05,800
Speaker 3: the storm, you know. But I but I did everything

624
00:32:05,880 --> 00:32:08,160
Speaker 3: he told me to do. I didn't panic. I listened

625
00:32:08,200 --> 00:32:11,720
Speaker 3: to him and he didn't say anything. But when we

626
00:32:11,760 --> 00:32:14,400
Speaker 3: got back down underknowns to me. He said to Guy

627
00:32:14,520 --> 00:32:17,160
Speaker 3: Cat he said, this, this one armed guy is fucking crazy.

628
00:32:17,200 --> 00:32:20,120
Speaker 3: He can do it. He said, he's tough and he

629
00:32:20,520 --> 00:32:22,840
Speaker 3: can he can do Everest. He gave Guy cut On

630
00:32:22,840 --> 00:32:24,440
Speaker 3: the heads up and said, I think this guy can

631
00:32:24,480 --> 00:32:27,800
Speaker 3: do it. And it was the martial arts, mate. Guy

632
00:32:27,880 --> 00:32:29,800
Speaker 3: couldn't figure it out. He said, how come you doing

633
00:32:29,800 --> 00:32:31,840
Speaker 3: this stuff? It was the martial arts from years ago,

634
00:32:31,880 --> 00:32:34,479
Speaker 3: the training, the mindset, the philosophy.

635
00:32:34,400 --> 00:32:39,360
Speaker 1: And muscle memory, the mindset, you know, the positivity that

636
00:32:40,000 --> 00:32:41,080
Speaker 1: fuck you attitude.

637
00:32:41,240 --> 00:32:41,760
Speaker 2: Everything.

638
00:32:42,720 --> 00:32:44,840
Speaker 3: Well, I had to get the money, and I couldn't.

639
00:32:46,080 --> 00:32:48,200
Speaker 3: I write all kinds of people, Mate. I didn't even

640
00:32:48,240 --> 00:32:51,000
Speaker 3: get replies, mate, you know. And when I did get replies,

641
00:32:51,080 --> 00:32:53,480
Speaker 3: they were just computer generated bullshit that didn't even make

642
00:32:53,480 --> 00:32:57,080
Speaker 3: the radical sense, you know. So I couldn't do it.

643
00:32:57,120 --> 00:32:59,120
Speaker 3: So I went to my I went to my wife

644
00:32:59,160 --> 00:33:02,479
Speaker 3: and I said, look, do you mind if I mortgaged

645
00:33:02,520 --> 00:33:07,360
Speaker 3: the house. I mortgaged the house and Mate went Everest

646
00:33:07,960 --> 00:33:11,560
Speaker 3: to the North Side in two thousand and four and

647
00:33:11,600 --> 00:33:14,320
Speaker 3: I got two hundred and eighty meters from the summit,

648
00:33:16,040 --> 00:33:19,840
Speaker 3: ran out of oxygen, got hit by a storm, and

649
00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:23,000
Speaker 3: the expedition leader, who's Russell Bryce, he radiated me. He

650
00:33:23,080 --> 00:33:27,120
Speaker 3: was watching me, threw a telescope from camp one and

651
00:33:27,200 --> 00:33:30,840
Speaker 3: he said, bandit. I'm sorry, mate, it is summer day.

652
00:33:31,440 --> 00:33:33,800
Speaker 3: You're nearly there, he said, but you've got to turn around.

653
00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:36,840
Speaker 3: And I know I'm on the radio. Say fuck that.

654
00:33:36,920 --> 00:33:39,720
Speaker 3: I'm not turning around. And he said, you promised me

655
00:33:40,160 --> 00:33:42,400
Speaker 3: when you undertook this that you'd listened to me, and

656
00:33:42,440 --> 00:33:44,760
Speaker 3: I'm telling you now, I turn around. He said, if

657
00:33:44,800 --> 00:33:47,280
Speaker 3: you don't turn around, you will die. And I'd already

658
00:33:47,320 --> 00:33:51,479
Speaker 3: passed a couple of dead bodies, so I thought, I'm

659
00:33:51,480 --> 00:33:53,520
Speaker 3: a kid, so I thought of my wife and family,

660
00:33:53,560 --> 00:33:55,200
Speaker 3: and I thought of my mom. Mom was still alive,

661
00:33:56,240 --> 00:33:59,160
Speaker 3: and it really hurt me because I didn't think Mum

662
00:33:59,200 --> 00:34:03,480
Speaker 3: would be alive if I had another crack. Later. I

663
00:34:03,560 --> 00:34:07,920
Speaker 3: came home roughly late in May two thousand or early

664
00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:14,040
Speaker 3: June two thousand and four. Mum died in September. So

665
00:34:14,160 --> 00:34:22,560
Speaker 3: between September of four and March of five, I had

666
00:34:22,560 --> 00:34:24,080
Speaker 3: to go back to Everest. Might do it again and

667
00:34:24,120 --> 00:34:27,400
Speaker 3: get to the summer, but I had no money. And

668
00:34:27,440 --> 00:34:30,920
Speaker 3: the bank manager said to me, Mate, we can't help you.

669
00:34:31,320 --> 00:34:33,600
Speaker 3: He said, you're in trouble. You're already going to lose

670
00:34:33,600 --> 00:34:35,879
Speaker 3: your house. And I hadn't told my wife for this, right,

671
00:34:37,160 --> 00:34:39,120
Speaker 3: So now I've got a mother who's about to diet.

672
00:34:40,000 --> 00:34:42,840
Speaker 3: And Mate. My mother she was at that point, probably

673
00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:48,760
Speaker 3: late a month away from dying, bedridden. She'd been against

674
00:34:48,760 --> 00:34:51,279
Speaker 3: me climbing because she was terrified something would happened to me.

675
00:34:51,320 --> 00:34:52,880
Speaker 3: And I've got the kids, you know, the three kids,

676
00:34:54,120 --> 00:34:56,080
Speaker 3: And she said, I think you should have any rich

677
00:34:56,120 --> 00:34:58,040
Speaker 3: She said go back, and she said, in this time

678
00:34:58,280 --> 00:35:01,600
Speaker 3: I'll be with you know, what she meant. She wouldn't

679
00:35:02,239 --> 00:35:04,239
Speaker 3: she was not. Yeah, she wasn't going to say I

680
00:35:04,239 --> 00:35:06,399
Speaker 3: love another six months. Mate. So what I did, Mate,

681
00:35:06,520 --> 00:35:08,600
Speaker 3: I went back and you'll get this. You'll get this

682
00:35:08,680 --> 00:35:11,480
Speaker 3: from your your past. I know you will. I went

683
00:35:11,520 --> 00:35:14,600
Speaker 3: back to that backpack with the phone books, right. I

684
00:35:14,640 --> 00:35:17,640
Speaker 3: had twenty five kilos in that pack, and I did

685
00:35:17,680 --> 00:35:19,919
Speaker 3: six and a half kilometers up the mountain and back

686
00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:23,160
Speaker 3: on the road every day for training, every second day. Sorry,

687
00:35:24,239 --> 00:35:28,319
Speaker 3: in that six months, I put forty kilos of phone

688
00:35:28,320 --> 00:35:31,239
Speaker 3: books in that pack and I went eight and a

689
00:35:31,280 --> 00:35:34,000
Speaker 3: half kilometers up that mountain and I had back every

690
00:35:34,360 --> 00:35:40,160
Speaker 3: fucking day for the whole six months. And Mate, the chafing,

691
00:35:40,280 --> 00:35:45,479
Speaker 3: the rashes, the sprayings, the injuries. And this basketball coach

692
00:35:45,560 --> 00:35:48,800
Speaker 3: contacted me. He said, Mate, I've read about your training

693
00:35:48,840 --> 00:35:50,880
Speaker 3: in the paper. He said, you're doing it all wrong.

694
00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:54,920
Speaker 3: And I said, mate, I'm not training to look good.

695
00:35:55,440 --> 00:35:57,560
Speaker 3: I'm not training to be an athlete. I'm not training

696
00:35:57,600 --> 00:36:00,960
Speaker 3: to play a sport. I said, this is just bullshit,

697
00:36:01,120 --> 00:36:03,080
Speaker 3: tough endurance. So I know, and get to the summer,

698
00:36:03,120 --> 00:36:07,200
Speaker 3: to that fucking mountain and check this out. Mate, I'm

699
00:36:07,200 --> 00:36:10,520
Speaker 3: on that mountain one day hiking with my pack, with

700
00:36:10,600 --> 00:36:12,239
Speaker 3: my forty kilos, and I had two and a half

701
00:36:12,280 --> 00:36:16,720
Speaker 3: kilo ankle weights around each angle. Because you remember Rocky

702
00:36:16,719 --> 00:36:19,200
Speaker 3: Mate back in the day, I've watched too many I'd

703
00:36:19,200 --> 00:36:23,200
Speaker 3: watch Rocky Mate anyway. Mate. The mayor of Cans went

704
00:36:23,239 --> 00:36:28,319
Speaker 3: past me in his car and he pulled over and

705
00:36:28,360 --> 00:36:31,719
Speaker 3: he said, you're crazy, bastard. Are you going back? And

706
00:36:31,760 --> 00:36:34,279
Speaker 3: I said I want to. He said when do you

707
00:36:34,280 --> 00:36:35,640
Speaker 3: want to go back? I said, mate, I want to

708
00:36:35,640 --> 00:36:37,880
Speaker 3: go back in a few months. He said, what do

709
00:36:37,920 --> 00:36:43,000
Speaker 3: you need? I said money. Anyway, the local newspaper contacted

710
00:36:43,040 --> 00:36:45,560
Speaker 3: me and I went in there for a meeting and

711
00:36:45,600 --> 00:36:48,680
Speaker 3: they said we can donate five thousand dollars. I needed

712
00:36:48,719 --> 00:36:52,239
Speaker 3: forty thousand, which is cheap by today's standards, but it

713
00:36:52,280 --> 00:36:54,960
Speaker 3: was a fortune. Fortune then mate, they said we can

714
00:36:54,960 --> 00:36:58,240
Speaker 3: give you five thousand. A lady rang up from Canberra

715
00:36:58,600 --> 00:37:00,879
Speaker 3: and she said, my pairent, it's for a mountain years

716
00:37:01,320 --> 00:37:03,040
Speaker 3: and their dream was to go to the top of emirates,

717
00:37:03,120 --> 00:37:05,719
Speaker 3: but they never did. And I've got their ashes. If

718
00:37:05,760 --> 00:37:11,040
Speaker 3: you take their ashes, I'll give you five thousand, ten thousand.

719
00:37:11,480 --> 00:37:14,439
Speaker 3: Then the boy Scouts got involved and they said we'll

720
00:37:14,480 --> 00:37:17,719
Speaker 3: do car washes and have movie nights and barbecues. And

721
00:37:17,719 --> 00:37:20,680
Speaker 3: they put in about tucking eight thousand. So now I

722
00:37:20,719 --> 00:37:24,040
Speaker 3: had like eighteen grand. Mate, I was getting there. Then

723
00:37:24,280 --> 00:37:27,279
Speaker 3: a printer had this new material and he said, I've

724
00:37:27,280 --> 00:37:30,200
Speaker 3: got the lightest material there is to print on. Right,

725
00:37:30,840 --> 00:37:33,640
Speaker 3: and he said, I can. I can make up a

726
00:37:33,640 --> 00:37:36,040
Speaker 3: big flag for you. Because I had this idea. I

727
00:37:36,080 --> 00:37:38,600
Speaker 3: would sell people's names on the flag for twenty bucks,

728
00:37:39,239 --> 00:37:43,000
Speaker 3: and local businesses for five hundred their logos, and the

729
00:37:43,000 --> 00:37:46,080
Speaker 3: local newspaper helped me and Mate. One day we finally

730
00:37:46,280 --> 00:37:48,880
Speaker 3: almost made it. I was about five grand short, and

731
00:37:48,920 --> 00:37:50,680
Speaker 3: the local newspaper said, fuck it, we'll give you the

732
00:37:50,760 --> 00:37:53,000
Speaker 3: other five grand. So Mate, I had the forty grand.

733
00:37:54,400 --> 00:37:58,840
Speaker 3: So Mate, I went back to Everest, Mate, and I

734
00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:03,080
Speaker 3: was the fittest, the strongest, and the most fuck You've

735
00:38:03,080 --> 00:38:07,719
Speaker 3: ever been in my life. And in the newspaper every

736
00:38:07,800 --> 00:38:11,000
Speaker 3: day people are writing letters. A lot of them were

737
00:38:11,080 --> 00:38:13,480
Speaker 3: very positive, saying yeah, good on ego, get them, and

738
00:38:13,520 --> 00:38:15,080
Speaker 3: most of them were positive, but made some of them

739
00:38:15,120 --> 00:38:18,520
Speaker 3: are complete pricks and make they were criticizing me right,

740
00:38:18,719 --> 00:38:20,680
Speaker 3: and I never experienced that in my life. I didn't

741
00:38:20,680 --> 00:38:23,280
Speaker 3: even know it existed. This is the first time I experienced.

742
00:38:22,800 --> 00:38:25,120
Speaker 2: Me with success, you're always going to get a pile

743
00:38:25,160 --> 00:38:25,520
Speaker 2: of shit.

744
00:38:25,680 --> 00:38:29,920
Speaker 1: And the more success you you get to or the

745
00:38:30,000 --> 00:38:33,360
Speaker 1: higher you get, the bigger the pile of shit grows.

746
00:38:33,360 --> 00:38:37,120
Speaker 1: But listen, in perspective, you got ninety five percent of success.

747
00:38:37,239 --> 00:38:40,360
Speaker 1: Five percent of shit is you just got. You've just

748
00:38:40,400 --> 00:38:41,920
Speaker 1: got to learn to ignore it.

749
00:38:41,920 --> 00:38:43,719
Speaker 3: It took me a long time to mature because at

750
00:38:43,719 --> 00:38:47,080
Speaker 3: forty one years of age, before I went back for

751
00:38:47,200 --> 00:38:50,760
Speaker 3: my second attempt, I wrote a letter to the local

752
00:38:50,800 --> 00:38:53,960
Speaker 3: newspaper to all the you know, the piss takers, and

753
00:38:54,000 --> 00:38:56,800
Speaker 3: I said, hey, I'll meet any one of you anywhere,

754
00:38:56,840 --> 00:38:59,480
Speaker 3: anytime and give you a fucking three parate lesson. No

755
00:38:59,480 --> 00:39:02,960
Speaker 3: no problem, like, don't be anonymous, come and face me

756
00:39:03,640 --> 00:39:06,320
Speaker 3: and I'll give you a bit of a lesson. I mean, honest,

757
00:39:06,480 --> 00:39:09,960
Speaker 3: immature in that way. But anyway went mate. I went

758
00:39:10,000 --> 00:39:13,120
Speaker 3: to Everest, and Mate, the devil himself was.

759
00:39:13,120 --> 00:39:15,160
Speaker 2: Not did you use it as fuel?

760
00:39:15,160 --> 00:39:15,279
Speaker 1: Though?

761
00:39:15,280 --> 00:39:17,280
Speaker 2: Because I do that, you know, any of the native

762
00:39:17,280 --> 00:39:20,359
Speaker 2: I'll just use it as fuel. I always say, as

763
00:39:20,400 --> 00:39:21,040
Speaker 2: long as your.

764
00:39:20,920 --> 00:39:24,719
Speaker 1: Plow is positive then you know, and it's heading in

765
00:39:24,760 --> 00:39:28,880
Speaker 1: a positive direction, then fuel it with negativity because it

766
00:39:28,920 --> 00:39:32,200
Speaker 1: will act as as a super fuel as long as

767
00:39:32,239 --> 00:39:36,200
Speaker 1: your direction and your outcome is positive. If you haven't

768
00:39:36,239 --> 00:39:39,560
Speaker 1: got that under that plow, if you haven't got that direction,

769
00:39:40,080 --> 00:39:42,600
Speaker 1: then you're you're you know you you will probably you'll

770
00:39:42,640 --> 00:39:46,080
Speaker 1: probably spiral out control somewhere along the line. But if

771
00:39:46,120 --> 00:39:50,279
Speaker 1: you've got a positive motivator, and that's exactly what I do.

772
00:39:50,840 --> 00:39:53,880
Speaker 1: Positive motivator, positive outcome, I will use that.

773
00:39:53,920 --> 00:39:56,160
Speaker 2: Negativity is fuel to get to where I need to be.

774
00:39:57,239 --> 00:40:02,480
Speaker 3: One mate, look, I know it's controversial these days, and

775
00:40:02,520 --> 00:40:05,800
Speaker 3: you'll probably have a laugh, but another great motivator of mine,

776
00:40:06,160 --> 00:40:08,000
Speaker 3: and I know it's not even his real name, and

777
00:40:08,040 --> 00:40:12,200
Speaker 3: you'll laugh at this was Andy McNabb because i'd read

778
00:40:12,239 --> 00:40:15,440
Speaker 3: the book Bravo to Zero, and I also read the

779
00:40:15,440 --> 00:40:17,839
Speaker 3: subsequent books you wrote, and I was a real fan.

780
00:40:17,960 --> 00:40:20,520
Speaker 3: I know that that hasn't laded well and that and

781
00:40:20,560 --> 00:40:21,600
Speaker 3: he might be a bit of a.

782
00:40:22,680 --> 00:40:25,919
Speaker 1: Polarizing no some what he needed to do. Listen, fair

783
00:40:25,920 --> 00:40:27,480
Speaker 1: play to him, he's listening, he's service.

784
00:40:27,800 --> 00:40:28,920
Speaker 2: Well, you know you can't.

785
00:40:28,680 --> 00:40:30,960
Speaker 1: You You've got to take your house to that and

786
00:40:30,960 --> 00:40:32,920
Speaker 1: and ignore them.

787
00:40:33,520 --> 00:40:36,399
Speaker 3: My training a lot of it came from his books, mate,

788
00:40:36,880 --> 00:40:41,160
Speaker 3: I was copying that that sort of s a s

789
00:40:41,160 --> 00:40:42,920
Speaker 3: sort of you know berg and the sort.

790
00:40:42,760 --> 00:40:45,520
Speaker 2: Of training, you know, and.

791
00:40:47,480 --> 00:40:52,280
Speaker 3: I bringing it up because but when it were devers

792
00:40:52,320 --> 00:40:55,080
Speaker 3: the next time, I just yeah, it was always like.

793
00:40:55,120 --> 00:40:57,720
Speaker 1: Do you feel different the second time? Did you feel stronger?

794
00:40:57,760 --> 00:40:58,759
Speaker 2: Did you feel it?

795
00:40:58,920 --> 00:41:01,560
Speaker 1: Was it easier because obviously you were already trodd in

796
00:41:01,600 --> 00:41:02,120
Speaker 1: most of it?

797
00:41:02,800 --> 00:41:03,520
Speaker 2: How did it feel?

798
00:41:04,800 --> 00:41:09,600
Speaker 3: Mate? I was feeling so strong and mate, we climbed

799
00:41:09,600 --> 00:41:13,000
Speaker 3: that mountain and we got to the summit, and May

800
00:41:13,040 --> 00:41:14,680
Speaker 3: it wasn't like it is now. It was just me

801
00:41:14,719 --> 00:41:18,560
Speaker 3: and NeiMa, just him and I on the summit, and

802
00:41:18,600 --> 00:41:20,719
Speaker 3: I thought, fuck, it's like Sir Red and Tensing back

803
00:41:20,760 --> 00:41:24,480
Speaker 3: in fifty three, you know. And we mate, we were

804
00:41:24,480 --> 00:41:27,960
Speaker 3: there for thirty minutes. Fifteen minutes later, the first Irish

805
00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:29,880
Speaker 3: wanted to climb the north face of Everest turned up.

806
00:41:30,160 --> 00:41:33,560
Speaker 3: I knew her shoes on the same expedition, but for

807
00:41:33,560 --> 00:41:37,600
Speaker 3: fifteen minutes it was just me and them. And ironically,

808
00:41:37,960 --> 00:41:40,360
Speaker 3: the Irish woman Surper was the sheper I climbed with

809
00:41:40,680 --> 00:41:44,759
Speaker 3: the year before. But Nina was incredibly proud that we'd

810
00:41:44,800 --> 00:41:46,839
Speaker 3: both got in the summit. It's his first time I've

811
00:41:46,840 --> 00:41:50,799
Speaker 3: got one arm. He was so happy but mate, that's

812
00:41:50,800 --> 00:41:53,800
Speaker 3: how I became the first person with a disability to

813
00:41:53,840 --> 00:41:56,200
Speaker 3: climb and all side of evereston. One more thing i'd

814
00:41:56,200 --> 00:41:57,879
Speaker 3: share with it, which is a bit weird, mate, it's

815
00:41:58,120 --> 00:41:59,960
Speaker 3: a bit of a toss, but you might like it.

816
00:42:00,800 --> 00:42:05,160
Speaker 3: I lost my arm on end Zac Day in nineteen

817
00:42:05,160 --> 00:42:11,520
Speaker 3: sixty three, forty two years and forty two days later

818
00:42:12,080 --> 00:42:15,239
Speaker 3: at seven forty two am, I still have sumon of

819
00:42:15,239 --> 00:42:16,719
Speaker 3: Everest and picked up some rocks and when I got

820
00:42:16,719 --> 00:42:18,359
Speaker 3: home and countered and they were fucking forty two.

821
00:42:19,520 --> 00:42:22,080
Speaker 2: Fucking hell mate, there you. I won't ask what your

822
00:42:22,160 --> 00:42:25,440
Speaker 2: lucky number is then, Paul, Well.

823
00:42:25,239 --> 00:42:27,920
Speaker 3: It doesn't mean anything. It doesn't mean it.

824
00:42:27,880 --> 00:42:32,560
Speaker 1: Does to you, mate, it does, but like you said,

825
00:42:32,960 --> 00:42:34,680
Speaker 1: it's there in your mind.

826
00:42:35,200 --> 00:42:38,680
Speaker 2: It's your journey. Mate. One last question, what would you

827
00:42:38,760 --> 00:42:39,640
Speaker 2: say to.

828
00:42:41,320 --> 00:42:47,920
Speaker 1: Anyone who allows the obstacles of disability to get in

829
00:42:47,960 --> 00:42:51,759
Speaker 1: their way and rather than knocking them down, climbing over them,

830
00:42:51,840 --> 00:42:55,640
Speaker 1: finding a way through under or over, turning around and

831
00:42:55,680 --> 00:42:57,560
Speaker 1: walking away, what would you say to those people?

832
00:42:58,280 --> 00:43:00,680
Speaker 3: I'll tell you this, mate, They've got one arm, but

833
00:43:00,719 --> 00:43:05,000
Speaker 3: it's not a disability at all at all. But I

834
00:43:05,160 --> 00:43:08,400
Speaker 3: have met and worked with and had a bit to

835
00:43:08,440 --> 00:43:11,319
Speaker 3: do with a lot of people with true disability, like

836
00:43:11,360 --> 00:43:15,560
Speaker 3: heavy disability, and Mate, honestly, they're the most amazing people

837
00:43:15,600 --> 00:43:18,880
Speaker 3: I've ever fucking met. I feel like an impostor in

838
00:43:18,920 --> 00:43:21,120
Speaker 3: the world of disability. Mate. I'm not really disabled, but

839
00:43:21,160 --> 00:43:23,560
Speaker 3: these people with these very heavy disabilities, they've got one

840
00:43:23,560 --> 00:43:29,480
Speaker 3: thing in common. Mate, their disability doesn't denote who they are,

841
00:43:30,719 --> 00:43:33,719
Speaker 3: and they're all very positive and the last thing they

842
00:43:33,800 --> 00:43:35,640
Speaker 3: want to be seen for and talk about is their

843
00:43:35,680 --> 00:43:38,439
Speaker 3: so called disability. They just want an equal game, mate,

844
00:43:38,480 --> 00:43:44,400
Speaker 3: that's all they want, just a chance, yes, perspective and attitude.

845
00:43:44,600 --> 00:43:46,480
Speaker 3: And in finishing, Mate, I would just say to anybody

846
00:43:46,480 --> 00:43:49,279
Speaker 3: who's listening, in my humble opinion at nearly sixty three,

847
00:43:49,880 --> 00:43:53,160
Speaker 3: life's all about love. That's it. That's the meaning of life.

848
00:43:53,160 --> 00:43:57,880
Speaker 3: Love and be loved, have faith, never give up, and

849
00:43:57,960 --> 00:44:00,120
Speaker 3: never be a fucking victim. And Mate, that's the That's

850
00:44:00,120 --> 00:44:02,200
Speaker 3: what I would say. Just just love and be loved.

851
00:44:02,200 --> 00:44:05,600
Speaker 3: I me, my three children, my two grandchildren. Mate, that's

852
00:44:05,640 --> 00:44:07,480
Speaker 3: my success. That's amazing.

853
00:44:08,480 --> 00:44:10,640
Speaker 2: Love it Mabe. Thank you ever so much for coming

854
00:44:10,640 --> 00:44:12,720
Speaker 2: on my podcast, head Game. Cheers.

855
00:44:13,080 --> 00:44:16,360
Speaker 1: Thanks brother, thanks for joining me on this episode of

856
00:44:16,440 --> 00:44:19,640
Speaker 1: head Game. If you enjoyed this episode, please share it

857
00:44:19,760 --> 00:44:20,400
Speaker 1: with a friend.

858
00:44:21,160 --> 00:44:24,040
Speaker 2: I'm Att Middleton. See you again next time.