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Speaker 1: Oh, get a team. It's the you project. We've got

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Speaker 1: a new friend to come and play. I'm super bloody excited.

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Speaker 1: But before we talk to him, old Tiff, you know,

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Speaker 1: when I gave Shazzad the briefing, I probably should have

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Speaker 1: mentioned that I swear a bit.

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Speaker 2: Ye?

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Speaker 1: Should I tone that down for him? Long it all

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Speaker 1: last though, absolutely? You know it would have been funny

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Speaker 1: if he said, fuck, no, don't do that, Tiff. How

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Speaker 1: are you?

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Speaker 3: I'm cold? I'm so cold that the motorbike wouldn't start

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Speaker 3: this morning, which is annoying.

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Speaker 1: Well, zero degrees in Melbourne this morning. Everyone thinks Australia's

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Speaker 1: this big land of fucking sunny beaches and warm weather.

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Speaker 1: And it's zero this morning, which is about I think Shazad,

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Speaker 1: welcome to the show. I think that's about thirty degrees

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Speaker 1: in your language. But zero celsius over here this morning,

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Speaker 1: so it's a cold one. How are you? I am?

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Speaker 2: Well? Well? San Francisco also has a game called Summers

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Speaker 2: for us, so I can I can relate.

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Speaker 1: What's the temperature? Make us a little bit jealous? What's

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Speaker 1: the temperature over there today give or take.

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Speaker 2: Well, we are on fahrenheit, so it's eighty degrees fahrenheit.

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Speaker 2: I'm guessing that's a balmy thirty two degrees or something,

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Speaker 2: but that's a rough gas.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, listening over there suffering TIF. That's terrible, isn't it?

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Speaker 2: So?

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Speaker 1: Hi, welcome to the show. How are you. How's your

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Speaker 1: day been?

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Speaker 2: Has been fantastic as yours been?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's been good so far. Just some early morning

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Speaker 1: caffeine and Tips. Had a tough one and motorbike wouldn't

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Speaker 1: start water tip with all.

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Speaker 3: The days, I've got to move it by tomorrow morning

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Speaker 3: because our back car parks getting repaid reserves. If my

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Speaker 3: box sitting there, I'm going to get a big fine.

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Speaker 1: Well, you've got to get rid of it. So we

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Speaker 1: did discuss how you can get at mobile, so we'll

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Speaker 1: talk about that later. But she's had, rather than me

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Speaker 1: read out a bio, read something off a website or

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Speaker 1: some other kind of forum. Can you give us a

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Speaker 1: snapshot of who you are, your background and the work

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Speaker 1: that you do so my audience can get to know

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Speaker 1: you a little bit.

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Speaker 2: Yes. My passion there is and i'm here is changing lives,

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Speaker 2: and I have a very specific way of looking at that,

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Speaker 2: which is I believe every single one of us is

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Speaker 2: very actively and profoundly sabotaging ourselves every single day, sabotaging

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Speaker 2: our well being, performance, and relationship. I discovered that I

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Speaker 2: do that years ago. I figured out how to do

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Speaker 2: less of that years ago, and I am passionate about

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Speaker 2: helping others do less self sabotage and being more in

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Speaker 2: self mastery change their own lives. And that's what I do.

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Speaker 2: I come at it from a more science science background,

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Speaker 2: so a lot of what I'm into is making sure

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Speaker 2: that what we do is first of all easy to do,

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Speaker 2: secondly based on research and science, and third it results

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Speaker 2: in lasting change rather than often we do things that

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Speaker 2: get us excited for a temporary period and then we're

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Speaker 2: back to old behavior. So I'm very passionate about how

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Speaker 2: do we create sustained transformation rather than the usual you know,

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Speaker 2: temporary blips and how we feel and what we do.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's absolutely paramount, isn't it. Because we're so good

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Speaker 1: at at changing things for a minute, or changing behavior,

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Speaker 1: or changing our operating system for a moment. And you know,

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Speaker 1: when you look at the fundamentals, like for example, just

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Speaker 1: trying to get in shape, whatever that means, you know,

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Speaker 1: lose a few pounds, gain a bit of muscle, improve fitness,

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Speaker 1: you know, change change something about our physiology. Like gyms

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Speaker 1: can almost rely in fact not almost gyms can rely

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Speaker 1: on the fact that people will make decisions that they

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Speaker 1: won't follow through on. And I don't know what I

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Speaker 1: don't know what the stat is in the States, although

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Speaker 1: I've spoken in the States a bit, But in Australia

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Speaker 1: there's a very act the people who use the gym consistently,

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Speaker 1: which is called active gym membership is very low. It's

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Speaker 1: somewhere around fifteen percent. And it means She's add that

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Speaker 1: for every hundred current paid up members, most of them

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Speaker 1: don't go why do you reckon we make? Why do

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Speaker 1: we make decisions that we don't ultimately follow through on?

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Speaker 2: Well, I mean that's the whole point of my research

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Speaker 2: where I look at how our bad old behavior they

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Speaker 2: are habitual and the reason they are habitual as they

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Speaker 2: live in the brain and form of neural pathways that

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Speaker 2: are muscle power and generate those behaviors instantly. Now, when

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Speaker 2: you read a book or attend a lecture or talk

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Speaker 2: to somebody who inspire is you to do something different?

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Speaker 2: I go to the gym that's an inspiration that is

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Speaker 2: not muscle power. It's just an inspiration. So you make

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Speaker 2: decisions based on those moments of inspiration. Oh my god,

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Speaker 2: this is a life changing thing I'm going to do.

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Speaker 2: And what I talked about is that you can't fight

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Speaker 2: muscle with insight. You need to fight muscle with muscle.

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Speaker 2: So that inspiration until it becomes neuropathways in the brain

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Speaker 2: muscle power, it doesn't mean much. It evaporates. And most

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Speaker 2: of us have these life changing experiences that are based

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Speaker 2: on insights, and we fail to convert those insights into

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Speaker 2: neuropathways into muscles in the brain. At the end, the

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Speaker 2: muscle power of the old ways keeps winning over.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's that's so true because it's almost like inspiration

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Speaker 1: is the spark that lights the fire, but we need

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Speaker 1: to fire to keep burning, you know. And it's so

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Speaker 1: so I guess part of like intertwined with creating new

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Speaker 1: neural pathways and a new for one of a more

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Speaker 1: academic term, a new behavioral default setting or a new normal,

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Speaker 1: or a new set of habits that work for us

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Speaker 1: that are hardwired into our brain. But what's that? Because

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Speaker 1: we know that we get excited and motivated and inspired,

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Speaker 1: and we also know that we give up. So what's

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Speaker 1: the that's is it about? Accountability? Is about having a

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Speaker 1: coach or a mentor or a training partner. How that

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Speaker 1: spot between I got excited for three days and then

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Speaker 1: I gave up, and now I've got new neural pathways

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Speaker 1: and this is my new version of normal. What's the

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Speaker 1: bit in the middle.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think the big issue is that we treat

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Speaker 2: the symptoms and not look at the problem. Why we

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Speaker 2: go back to the old behavior at the root cause.

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Speaker 2: So all of our research has been about the root

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Speaker 2: cause problem. What we did with working with more than

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Speaker 2: a million participants by now with it an assessment of

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Speaker 2: how we self sabotage. And what we determine is that

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Speaker 2: there are ten ways we self sabotage. These characters in

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Speaker 2: our head are the ones that have muscle power, that

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Speaker 2: have the bad patterns of our life. And the reason

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Speaker 2: we don't stick with the new things we want to

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Speaker 2: do is that these characters in our mind are very

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Speaker 2: powerful beings and they win over and so, and they

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Speaker 2: have names like the judge, the controller, the stickler, the victim,

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Speaker 2: the pleaser, the avoid the restless. So they got muscle

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Speaker 2: power they got, they got habits, and so being inspired,

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Speaker 2: they come back and sabotage the new ways that we

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Speaker 2: want to set in place, because these characters are like

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Speaker 2: being in power and like to take take command from us.

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Speaker 2: And until and unless we deal with this root level

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Speaker 2: what we call saboteurs and our our brain, we'll keep

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Speaker 2: building castles on sand because we don't have a strong

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Speaker 2: enough foundation.

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Speaker 1: And how do we deal with them? I mean, I

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Speaker 1: know it's I'm sure it's not. I think it's a

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Speaker 1: sure it's multi dimensional. But you know, all of these

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Speaker 1: hard wirde characters in our brain that kind of derail

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Speaker 1: us and sabotage us. Where do we begin?

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Speaker 2: Well, where we begin is to first of all call

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Speaker 2: them on the lie that they have which the reason

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Speaker 2: that they're in power is that they have fooled us

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Speaker 2: into believing that they are our friends and that we

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Speaker 2: need them. So I work with a lot of CEOs,

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Speaker 2: and every single one of them, you know, tells me,

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Speaker 2: you know what I mean, not all of them have

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Speaker 2: the controllers out or what most of them do. And

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Speaker 2: they say, without controller, nothing gets done. You know. The

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Speaker 2: stickler says, without the stickler, there will be no quality

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Speaker 2: in the work that I do, and the restlesses. Without

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Speaker 2: the restless, I won't have any fun. So these ways

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Speaker 2: are ways where we tell ourselves we have survived until now.

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Speaker 2: These characters are actually agents of survival that we all

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Speaker 2: have them because in our childhood we learned to do

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Speaker 2: these things in order to get more love, in order

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Speaker 2: to feel more safe, in order to be more independent.

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Speaker 2: So they are our go to operating system of our

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Speaker 2: five year old version, and they have convinced us that

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Speaker 2: we need them in are to survive, and by the

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Speaker 2: time we are adults, we think we can't live without them.

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Speaker 2: So first and foremost we have to debunk that and

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Speaker 2: tell you, as a matter of fact, you do not

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Speaker 2: need them, and there is a far better way of living.

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Speaker 2: The Stanford students that have lectured on this they call

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Speaker 2: this work Jedi mind training, and what they say, really

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Speaker 2: the work here is about recognizing that inside your mind

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Speaker 2: there are these dark waters and then there's the energy Jedi.

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Speaker 2: And we got to really call the dart waters for

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Speaker 2: their lives, debunk them, discredit them, and lean into our Energjedi,

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Speaker 2: which we call the sage. So it's the Sage versus

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Speaker 2: Sabbator going on inside of our head, and it starts

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Speaker 2: with awareness. Awareness is critical. It's just that awareness is

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Speaker 2: twenty percent the starting point, and eighty percent is getting

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Speaker 2: into building muscles.

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Speaker 1: Such I was about to say, it sounds like high

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Speaker 1: level self awareness, you know. It's like and being able.

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Speaker 1: You know. I think about this a lot like stuff

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Speaker 1: because you and I kind of are in the same

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Speaker 1: space human behavior and thinking and metacognition and theory of

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Speaker 1: mind and understanding how others think and what we think.

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Speaker 1: But it takes courage, and it takes self control to

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Speaker 1: be able to recognize your own self limiting thinking and

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Speaker 1: self limiting habits and self limiting behaviors, and and the

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Speaker 1: way that you get in your own way, you know,

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Speaker 1: the way that you know. It's like I do a

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Speaker 1: lot of corporate speaking, and I did one the other

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Speaker 1: day and there was two hundred and fifty people and

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Speaker 1: I said, put up your hand if you're an overthinker.

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Speaker 1: Every hand goes up, and then I go, how's that

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Speaker 1: working for you? And everybody laughs because we all do it,

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Speaker 1: but it doesn't work, you know, And so so then

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Speaker 1: being able to without self loathing, I think this is

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Speaker 1: the key. You know is that that to be able

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Speaker 1: to be self aware without beating yourself up, without being

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Speaker 1: overly self critical.

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Speaker 2: You know, absolutely, And here's the challenge that of these

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Speaker 2: ten characters sense abators I talked about, the only one

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Speaker 2: that everybody has is the judge Sabator, and the judged

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Speaker 2: Sabator is the one that amplifies the negative in yourself,

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Speaker 2: in our and in circumstances. So it's the one that's

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Speaker 2: constantly finding what's wrong with yourself with others amateur circumstances.

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Speaker 2: And it's the one that sabotages our attempt to change

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Speaker 2: because of exactly what you said, the self loading, because

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Speaker 2: it discourages us. It just waits for a moment to say, hey,

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Speaker 2: you're not going to make it. Look you're just wired

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Speaker 2: this way. Forget about it. And so all of our

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Speaker 2: attempts at change, first and foremost are discredited by unsabotaged

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Speaker 2: by the Judge Sabatur. So what we do in our

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Speaker 2: work is one of the metaphors. One of the things

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Speaker 2: that we keep using is you know, metaphors related to

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Speaker 2: physical fitness. So we say, okay, if you if you

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Speaker 2: try to learn a new sports, have you you can

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Speaker 2: have you ever imagined anybody learning a new game and

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Speaker 2: just starting and being good and then better and better

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Speaker 2: and better and better and better every single day. The

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Speaker 2: answer is no. When you start trying to learn a

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Speaker 2: new game, you have a good day, you take two

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Speaker 2: steps forward and then a step back, to steps forward

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Speaker 2: a step back, and when you take that step back

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Speaker 2: in an attempt to improve, that judge character is going

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Speaker 2: to come beat the crap out of you and say,

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Speaker 2: shame on you, your piece of shit. I told you you

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Speaker 2: cannot improve. Forget about it. You know you're not gonna ever.

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Speaker 2: This is not going to work, and it discourages you

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Speaker 2: from going on and what we do instead saying that

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Speaker 2: as you take that step back, as you fall again,

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Speaker 2: it is critical to watch this voice coming and beating

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Speaker 2: you up and say no, no, I'm not going to let

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Speaker 2: you do that. I'm going to give myself a big,

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Speaker 2: loving hug. It's the sage part of you, the positive

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Speaker 2: part of you that brings compassion to you. When you're done, alan,

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Speaker 2: let this judge character beat the crap out of you.

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Speaker 2: So if you truly want to improve in a sustained way,

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Speaker 2: self compassion versus self judgment is a critical fork in

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Speaker 2: the road that you need to keep really watching.

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Speaker 1: For now, I'm going to let you know how we've

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Speaker 1: obviously we've got a long way Togo, but so should.

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Speaker 1: I wrote a book called Positive Intelligence New York Times bestseller.

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Speaker 1: No less, of course you did Positive Intelligence, so have

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Speaker 1: a look for that. But also if people want to

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Speaker 1: see where they kind of lay in this space, you've

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Speaker 1: got an online quiz that people can do that like

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Speaker 1: five minutes or less. Can you just while we're in

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Speaker 1: this space, can you tell them how to access that?

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Speaker 2: Please? Yeah, it's just five minute online sabatur assessment. In

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Speaker 2: five minutes you get a bar chart that shows you

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Speaker 2: which of these ways of self sabotage is strongest in you?

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Speaker 2: Is it the avoider, the controller, the victims? What is it? Whatever? Again?

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Speaker 2: There are ten altogether, and you access it through Positive

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Speaker 2: Integions dot com slash assessment Positive Intelligence dot com slash assessment,

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Speaker 2: and it's free and of course strictly confident information just

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Speaker 2: for you.

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Speaker 1: Out of interest. How much does the environment, the situation,

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Speaker 1: the friendship, groups, the family, the social constructs around us

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Speaker 1: influence how we see ourselves? Like if I'm a really supportive,

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Speaker 1: loving environment and people Am I going to be less

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Speaker 1: likely to have that internal sabotur going off the meta

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Speaker 1: all the time?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? Great question, and maybe I can answer it by

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Speaker 2: talking about my two kids. I have two beautiful kids

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Speaker 2: who are not twenty one and twenty five years old.

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Speaker 2: They were born from day one. Day were night and

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Speaker 2: day opposites from each other. My son was this very

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Speaker 2: easy going, even keel you know, life is a bullet cherries. Hey,

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Speaker 2: let's take it easy, let's just have fun. That kind

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Speaker 2: of a flexible, adoptable personality. My daughter was born and

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Speaker 2: it's very sweet and introverted. My daughter was a raging

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Speaker 2: extrovert from day one, and she was a hard charger

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Speaker 2: and she was very goal oriented and very very different

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Speaker 2: in blueprint. Both of these are so I basically say,

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Speaker 2: you know, you're born a rose or you're born a carnation.

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Speaker 2: Rose can never be a carnation. Cornation can never be

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Speaker 2: a rose. You got to really lean into the beauty

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Speaker 2: that you're born to be. So there you're born with

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Speaker 2: different essences. Now, those ways of being under the same

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Speaker 2: exact environment when they were grown up resulted in them

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Speaker 2: developing different saboteurs. So my son, who had that very

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Speaker 2: sweet temperament and life is a boll cherries. When he

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Speaker 2: was facing challenges and stresses in life, he overused that strength,

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Speaker 2: which became the avoid sabaturs, and instead of tackling challenges,

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Speaker 2: he said, this is unpleasant. Life is supposed to be pleasant.

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Speaker 2: I'm not going to deal with this, and so his

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Speaker 2: sabatur became the avoid. My daughter, on the other hand,

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Speaker 2: who was very hard charging and all had those strengths.

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Speaker 2: When facebook challenges, she overused those strengths and in the

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Speaker 2: process she developed the controller sabaturs, so controller sabator versus

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Speaker 2: the avoider sabator. So basically, what I believe is that

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Speaker 2: we are born with predisposition for different natural strengths, which

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Speaker 2: when they're overused, they've become their saboteurs. Because we over

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Speaker 2: use our strengths and insult by overusing them and abusing them,

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Speaker 2: they become the way we sabotage ourselves. And then the

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Speaker 2: degree of difficulty that we have in childhood affects how

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Speaker 2: strong these saboteurs become. But I think, but I believe

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Speaker 2: that the development of sabaturs is a completely normal part

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Speaker 2: of human beings growth. My son and daughter grew up

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Speaker 2: with the best of haarenting. Of course, as you can imagine,

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Speaker 2: and right in front of my eyes they developed the

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Speaker 2: avoid and the controller sabaturs. It's unavoidable.

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Speaker 1: And so what was what was your form of self

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Speaker 1: sabotage growing up or even in your even in your

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Speaker 1: early kind of adult years or maybe even now, do

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Speaker 1: you still get in your own way? Yeah? What what's

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Speaker 1: your think?

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Speaker 2: Absolutely, I believe we all do this every day. It's unavoidable.

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Speaker 2: And the mind, a strong one was the victim sabator.

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Speaker 2: And I was diagnosed with clinical depression when I was

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Speaker 2: about thirty years old. I had no idea that the

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Speaker 2: first three years of my life I had lived in

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Speaker 2: colnicol depression. And the reason that the sabateor was the

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Speaker 2: survival strategy. These sabators are survival strategies. The reason I

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Speaker 2: had that is I was growing up in a in

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Speaker 2: a in poverty, in a in a ghetto with my

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Speaker 2: with force siblings, a tiny little apartment. My father a

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Speaker 2: terrifying man. He was very angry and scary to me.

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Speaker 2: My mother was running around terrified of him. And I

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Speaker 2: was a very sensitive kid, terrified and not getting much

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Speaker 2: love or attention, and one of my survival strategies was

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Speaker 2: the victim sabatur And what that meant is instead of

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Speaker 2: confronting and having fights and all of that stuff, I

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Speaker 2: withdrew from it all. I would go to a quiet,

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Speaker 2: a little corner in the room, and I would create

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Speaker 2: this cocoon of depression, of just being, of self pity,

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Speaker 2: and in so doing, the reason it was helpful for

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Speaker 2: my survival it was two reasons. One, I was removing

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Speaker 2: myself from the hostility and the pain to some extent,

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Speaker 2: so I wasn't triggering much by moving myself to that corner.

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Speaker 2: The second thing is which I later I later realized

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Speaker 2: years later, is that in the absence of getting love,

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Speaker 2: what I had found is that actually self pity is

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Speaker 2: was very suited. So instead of getting love, I learned

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Speaker 2: to give my self pity because that was a very

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Speaker 2: soothing way. And it only took me years and years

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Speaker 2: and years. At some point you realize, you know what

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Speaker 2: I actually deserve love, I don't deserve self pity. So

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Speaker 2: as an adult, I was playing victim all over the place,

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Speaker 2: and it took me forever to realize that I was

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Speaker 2: still trying to bring my self pity and get pity

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Speaker 2: from others. And at some point I woke up and said,

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Speaker 2: you know what, I actually deserve love, not pity, and

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Speaker 2: that was the end of my playing the victim sabator

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Speaker 2: in such a powerful way. And to your point, is

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Speaker 2: this salator still with me or not? This veritor is

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Speaker 2: definitely not running me. I no longer am I in depression.

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Speaker 2: It is not my go to thing every time something

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Speaker 2: doesn't go well, and I still find self pity to

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Speaker 2: be incredibly seductive. I don't go there, but I know

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Speaker 2: that it's a seductive thing when something doesn't go well,

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Speaker 2: but I catch it, don't go there. I may go

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Speaker 2: there a few times a year. It's not very common. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: so it's no longer running me, but it's still absolutely

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Speaker 2: their sabotage never go away. That you can make them

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Speaker 2: much smaller, but they never fully go away.

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Speaker 1: Wow, thank you so much. I love it when I

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Speaker 1: get someone on who's an expert in something written, a book,

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Speaker 1: spoken all over the world, done all the stuff that

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Speaker 1: you do, and then still go But by the way,

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Speaker 1: I'm still a bit broken. You know, I'm better than

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Speaker 1: I was, but I'm still a work in progress. And

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Speaker 1: I love that because I think, you know, it actually

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Speaker 1: encourages the rest of us, you know, and it's so true.

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Speaker 1: I think we're all a bit brilliant, all a bit flawed,

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Speaker 1: all a bit amazing, all a bit ridiculous. And it

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Speaker 1: takes courage, I think, especially because I don't know if

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Speaker 1: men do have bigger egos or not, but I feel

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Speaker 1: like we always want to be seen to be the

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Speaker 1: best and the shiniest and the most flawless. And yeah,

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Speaker 1: my curiosity with human behavior, and you knowsogy is really

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Speaker 1: out of all of my own ineptitude and all of

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Speaker 1: my own flaws and bullshit and self doubt and insecurity,

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Speaker 1: and yeah, it is. I feel like it is definitely

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Speaker 1: a work in progress. I've got to I don't know

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Speaker 1: if you've ever been asked this question, but is there

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Speaker 1: what are the you probably have? What are the benefits

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Speaker 1: or what is the upside to self sabotage? Because there

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Speaker 1: must be something in it for us or we wouldn't

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Speaker 1: do it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. What I talk about with the saboteurs is that

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Speaker 2: they are the ones in us that generate all of

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Speaker 2: our negative emotions. Negative emotions like stress, anger, shame, guilt, disappointment,

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Speaker 2: regret all of these things. And the question is aren't

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Speaker 2: these negative emotions helpful? If they weren't, why would we

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Speaker 2: have them? And the answer and in order to answer

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Speaker 2: the question, you know, aren't negative emotions helpful? I ask

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Speaker 2: a religate that question. I asked people, what do you

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Speaker 2: think about pain? Do you think pain is helpful? Is

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Speaker 2: it helpful? Is it helpful to have pain? And you

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Speaker 2: know the answer is obvious. Of course, it's helpful to

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Speaker 2: have pain. Why because if the stove is left on

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Speaker 2: accidentally and you put your hand on the out stove,

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Speaker 2: it's good to feel pain. If you don't feel pain,

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Speaker 2: you're going to keep your hand on the out stove

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Speaker 2: and burn to the bone. So therefore, pain is very

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Speaker 2: helpful as an ARTH signal. But here's the million dollar question.

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Speaker 2: How long would you like to feel the pain of

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Speaker 2: your hand on the hot stove before you get the

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Speaker 2: message and before you move a hand? And hopefully we'll

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Speaker 2: all say, oh, that's quickly as possible. Pain is helpful

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Speaker 2: as an alert, but once the alert is delivered, it

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Speaker 2: is then the definition of insanity to keep your hand

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Speaker 2: on the hot stove. And same exact thing with negative emotions,

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Speaker 2: is it good to feel shame, guilt, disappointment, regret, stress

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Speaker 2: or anger or all of these They are absolutely incredibly helpful.

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Speaker 2: Without them, we will have no conscience. We will do

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Speaker 2: horrible stuff and not feel bad about it. We will

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Speaker 2: you know, make mistakes and not even notice that anything wrong.

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Speaker 2: All of this stuff right, They are incredibly it's incredibly

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Speaker 2: helpful to feel these negative emotions. But for how long?

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Speaker 2: For just one second as a wake up call that says, hey, buddy,

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Speaker 2: pay attention, something is going wrong here. But once that

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Speaker 2: message is delivered, then staying angry, staying upset, staying stressed,

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Speaker 2: stay disappointed, staying in shame or guilt is absolutely counterproductive

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Speaker 2: because what you need is in order to figure out

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Speaker 2: how to respond to a tough situation, you want to

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Speaker 2: shift to the positive part of your brain. Get in

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Speaker 2: touch with deep empathy and curiosity and creativity and calm,

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Speaker 2: clear head, that laser for focused action. We need the

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Speaker 2: positive brain to actually deal with challenges in the best way.

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Speaker 2: So in that sense, what we would say is that

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Speaker 2: you know, saboteurs are the one does that keep your

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Speaker 2: hand on the hot stove? Have you continue to suffer

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Speaker 2: and responding to things that are challenging and a big,

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Speaker 2: big transformation we seek its. How quickly do you shift

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Speaker 2: from an initial negative reaction to things so positive? Embrace

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Speaker 2: I've got the challenges.

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Speaker 1: Do you think that I feel? Like with me? There's

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Speaker 1: been times in my life where I am, for whatever reason,

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Speaker 1: I'm more open to hear what I need to hear,

432
00:25:31,240 --> 00:25:35,359
Speaker 1: or to be honest with myself, or to I don't

433
00:25:35,359 --> 00:25:39,200
Speaker 1: know even sometimes I've got this funny story. What's it called?

434
00:25:40,560 --> 00:25:44,960
Speaker 1: Do you know who Eckhart Toole is? Hold the spirit? Yeah,

435
00:25:45,240 --> 00:25:49,239
Speaker 1: the spiritual writer. So when I was younger, I mean

436
00:25:49,359 --> 00:25:52,440
Speaker 1: quite young, maybe twenty five, one of my friends gave

437
00:25:52,480 --> 00:25:55,080
Speaker 1: me the Power of Now. I don't know when it

438
00:25:55,119 --> 00:25:58,080
Speaker 1: came out, but can you just find out when did

439
00:25:58,119 --> 00:26:01,440
Speaker 1: the Power of Now come out? When was that? Anyway?

440
00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:06,359
Speaker 1: Please and thank you. I remember I remember reading it

441
00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:08,480
Speaker 1: when it just came out. A friend of mine gave

442
00:26:08,520 --> 00:26:10,040
Speaker 1: it to me and said, you've got to read this.

443
00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:12,520
Speaker 1: This is life changing. It'll blow your head off. It's

444
00:26:12,560 --> 00:26:13,040
Speaker 1: it's like.

445
00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:16,640
Speaker 3: Tiffy sixteen.

446
00:26:18,119 --> 00:26:21,159
Speaker 1: No, No I came out, Am I thinking about the

447
00:26:21,160 --> 00:26:21,720
Speaker 1: wrong book?

448
00:26:22,760 --> 00:26:27,040
Speaker 2: Public came out before twenty sixteen, I thought.

449
00:26:27,800 --> 00:26:31,760
Speaker 3: Originally published two thousand and two, I think it might

450
00:26:31,800 --> 00:26:32,840
Speaker 3: have come out on audible.

451
00:26:34,280 --> 00:26:36,159
Speaker 1: I think it was like in the nineties. Anyway, it

452
00:26:36,160 --> 00:26:39,240
Speaker 1: doesn't matter, but I read it and I thought it

453
00:26:39,280 --> 00:26:42,600
Speaker 1: was junk. I read the first twenty pages Chazzad and

454
00:26:42,640 --> 00:26:47,520
Speaker 1: I'm like, this is bullshit. It's like spiritual mumbo jumbo, right.

455
00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:51,879
Speaker 1: And then about five years later, I don't know, five years, six,

456
00:26:52,000 --> 00:26:55,240
Speaker 1: seven years later, I just saw the book in all

457
00:26:55,240 --> 00:26:58,520
Speaker 1: of my books and I can't remember why, but I

458
00:26:58,680 --> 00:27:01,399
Speaker 1: just felt compelled to pick it up and read it again.

459
00:27:01,760 --> 00:27:05,520
Speaker 1: And the next time I read it, I'm like, how

460
00:27:05,600 --> 00:27:09,280
Speaker 1: long has this been around? All this brilliant wisdom and insight,

461
00:27:09,800 --> 00:27:12,000
Speaker 1: And it was like I was reading a different book

462
00:27:12,040 --> 00:27:15,600
Speaker 1: for the first time, and it blew me away. Obviously

463
00:27:15,640 --> 00:27:18,560
Speaker 1: the book was the same, but I was different, and

464
00:27:18,600 --> 00:27:21,919
Speaker 1: without being too spiritual or weird, it's like, oh, well,

465
00:27:22,040 --> 00:27:25,280
Speaker 1: now I was ready to have this message. Or two,

466
00:27:26,520 --> 00:27:28,160
Speaker 1: how'd you go tift? Did you? It doesn't matter?

467
00:27:28,960 --> 00:27:29,200
Speaker 3: Seven?

468
00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:30,120
Speaker 2: Yeah?

469
00:27:30,200 --> 00:27:35,240
Speaker 1: Right, thank you? Perfect? Yeah yeah yeah. But it's it's

470
00:27:35,280 --> 00:27:38,480
Speaker 1: almost like when the students ready, the teacher will appear, right.

471
00:27:38,640 --> 00:27:45,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely. And sometimes people don't wake up to the

472
00:27:45,240 --> 00:27:50,520
Speaker 2: need for transformation until the pain becomes unbearable. And I

473
00:27:50,560 --> 00:27:52,520
Speaker 2: know that that was the case for me. I mean,

474
00:27:52,560 --> 00:27:56,639
Speaker 2: one of the most pirital moments of my life was

475
00:27:58,040 --> 00:28:03,440
Speaker 2: after Stanford Business School I had I'd worked in high

476
00:28:03,480 --> 00:28:06,439
Speaker 2: tech marketing for a while, and then I started a

477
00:28:06,480 --> 00:28:11,160
Speaker 2: new venture back software company. I was a visionary thinker

478
00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:15,280
Speaker 2: in technology, and I was able to attract luminaries in

479
00:28:15,320 --> 00:28:19,119
Speaker 2: Silicon Valley to be my investors, my board members. He

480
00:28:19,280 --> 00:28:22,440
Speaker 2: Attackered was our first client. It was a huge hit,

481
00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:25,639
Speaker 2: and so I attracted all these great people also to

482
00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:30,840
Speaker 2: work for me, including one of my classmates from Stanford

483
00:28:30,840 --> 00:28:35,200
Speaker 2: Business School. So here I'm a visionary leader attracting all

484
00:28:35,200 --> 00:28:38,800
Speaker 2: this good stuff and leading a company. Two years into

485
00:28:38,840 --> 00:28:42,800
Speaker 2: this product was late, customer was unhappy. I was under

486
00:28:42,840 --> 00:28:46,640
Speaker 2: a lot of stress, and we were in downtown Palo Alto.

487
00:28:48,320 --> 00:28:50,720
Speaker 2: One day, I went out for lunch, got my lunch,

488
00:28:50,800 --> 00:28:54,560
Speaker 2: came back, came up upstairs with the second floor offices

489
00:28:54,800 --> 00:28:59,680
Speaker 2: was and my heart sank because what I saw was

490
00:28:59,720 --> 00:29:02,680
Speaker 2: in the boardroom. Was see that my chairman of the

491
00:29:02,720 --> 00:29:08,560
Speaker 2: board and the president I had hired and vice presidents,

492
00:29:08,600 --> 00:29:12,200
Speaker 2: they were sitting in the board Basically it was a

493
00:29:12,240 --> 00:29:16,520
Speaker 2: palace school. Because what had happened is my president and

494
00:29:16,680 --> 00:29:20,280
Speaker 2: VPS went to the board and said, sure Zod is

495
00:29:20,320 --> 00:29:26,320
Speaker 2: being such a horrific controller and micromanager as a leader

496
00:29:26,400 --> 00:29:30,360
Speaker 2: that we cannot stand working for him anymore. He is

497
00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:36,040
Speaker 2: destroying the division of the companies he started. And that

498
00:29:36,120 --> 00:29:39,280
Speaker 2: was the most painful professional moment of my life. And

499
00:29:39,320 --> 00:29:41,280
Speaker 2: that day I was demoted from being CEE of the

500
00:29:41,320 --> 00:29:44,720
Speaker 2: company I had started. And I couldn't walk away because

501
00:29:44,720 --> 00:29:47,680
Speaker 2: I'd brought in all the investors and all the clients

502
00:29:47,720 --> 00:29:50,440
Speaker 2: and employees. I couldn't just walk away and abandon them.

503
00:29:50,480 --> 00:29:52,440
Speaker 2: So I had to keep going back into the office

504
00:29:52,440 --> 00:29:54,560
Speaker 2: where I had been the model, working with people that

505
00:29:54,640 --> 00:29:58,760
Speaker 2: I thought had stabbed me in the back profoundly painful.

506
00:29:58,880 --> 00:30:01,040
Speaker 2: And then to get to I had to figure out

507
00:30:01,040 --> 00:30:03,840
Speaker 2: what the heck is going on here? Who am I?

508
00:30:03,840 --> 00:30:07,400
Speaker 2: Am I this visionary neither or had attracted all this

509
00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:11,120
Speaker 2: positive stuff to me? Or am I this horrible micromanager

510
00:30:11,160 --> 00:30:15,840
Speaker 2: or nobody could stand working for? Who am I? The answer, finally,

511
00:30:15,880 --> 00:30:20,080
Speaker 2: I realized, as I got into getting over my pain discovery,

512
00:30:20,320 --> 00:30:25,320
Speaker 2: was I am both. I am that beautiful sage positive

513
00:30:25,440 --> 00:30:28,800
Speaker 2: visionary who attracted and created all this great stuff and

514
00:30:28,960 --> 00:30:33,280
Speaker 2: under stress, which is something that fuels or the saboteurs

515
00:30:34,000 --> 00:30:38,400
Speaker 2: instead of my beautiful sage self. I had become more

516
00:30:38,480 --> 00:30:43,960
Speaker 2: and more of my saboteurs, and including the controller and

517
00:30:44,080 --> 00:30:47,280
Speaker 2: the judge, and with all of their negativity. So I

518
00:30:47,320 --> 00:30:50,400
Speaker 2: am both. And the question is which one am I

519
00:30:50,480 --> 00:30:52,560
Speaker 2: in the moment based on how much stress am I

520
00:30:52,600 --> 00:30:56,840
Speaker 2: experiencing and how powerful these characters are relative to each other.

521
00:30:57,760 --> 00:31:02,160
Speaker 1: Wow, thank you again, what a great story and also

522
00:31:02,280 --> 00:31:08,480
Speaker 1: what great insight, and also how it's hard to be

523
00:31:08,560 --> 00:31:13,480
Speaker 1: objective about ourselves because we are us, right, and we're

524
00:31:13,520 --> 00:31:16,880
Speaker 1: always looking at everything through the I'm always looking at

525
00:31:16,880 --> 00:31:20,080
Speaker 1: the world through the Craig lens. And even though you,

526
00:31:20,320 --> 00:31:22,840
Speaker 1: I and TIF are all in the same moment now,

527
00:31:22,880 --> 00:31:26,640
Speaker 1: we're not having the same experience, right, And to be

528
00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:31,040
Speaker 1: able to not lose your shit when those people do

529
00:31:31,160 --> 00:31:34,200
Speaker 1: that to you, If I get to academic, let me

530
00:31:34,240 --> 00:31:37,520
Speaker 1: know to not lose your shit and to be able

531
00:31:37,560 --> 00:31:43,360
Speaker 1: to reflect on that with humility and self awareness and

532
00:31:43,400 --> 00:31:48,800
Speaker 1: then come to that kind of awakening. Ain't many people

533
00:31:48,840 --> 00:31:54,280
Speaker 1: doing that? That's good for you? And so does this

534
00:31:54,360 --> 00:31:59,040
Speaker 1: speak to our capacity for equanimity, you know, to be

535
00:31:59,120 --> 00:32:01,640
Speaker 1: the calm in the else, to be able to be

536
00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:04,360
Speaker 1: a best self when things aren't going well.

537
00:32:06,640 --> 00:32:09,720
Speaker 2: It absolutely does. And the thing that I tell my

538
00:32:09,800 --> 00:32:11,560
Speaker 2: audience is as I look them in the eye and

539
00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:13,640
Speaker 2: I say, I have good news and I have bad

540
00:32:13,680 --> 00:32:17,960
Speaker 2: news for you. The bad news is you are sabotaging

541
00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:21,560
Speaker 2: yourself far more bootally every single day than you have

542
00:32:21,600 --> 00:32:25,040
Speaker 2: any clue you are, that these characters inside of you,

543
00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:28,920
Speaker 2: these saboteurs, are far more devastating than you realize. That's

544
00:32:28,920 --> 00:32:32,880
Speaker 2: the bad news. The good news is that the sage

545
00:32:32,920 --> 00:32:36,600
Speaker 2: part of you is far more profound and powerful than

546
00:32:36,640 --> 00:32:39,520
Speaker 2: you have any clue. And the good news is a

547
00:32:39,560 --> 00:32:42,320
Speaker 2: lot better than the bad news. And so what I

548
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:46,400
Speaker 2: believe is profound capacity of the human being once they

549
00:32:46,520 --> 00:32:49,560
Speaker 2: really begin to tab into the power of their sage,

550
00:32:50,440 --> 00:32:53,280
Speaker 2: we have no clue how magnificent we are.

551
00:32:55,040 --> 00:32:57,720
Speaker 1: Do you think it's a good idea? And I guess

552
00:32:57,760 --> 00:33:00,600
Speaker 1: the answer on this would be well, cry pens, but

553
00:33:00,640 --> 00:33:02,280
Speaker 1: I'm just going to ask it, and then you can

554
00:33:02,360 --> 00:33:06,000
Speaker 1: just riff on the question is it a good idea? Like,

555
00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:09,840
Speaker 1: for example, Tiff and I know each other well, and

556
00:33:09,880 --> 00:33:13,480
Speaker 1: so there are times when we kind of started off

557
00:33:13,600 --> 00:33:17,320
Speaker 1: as mentor mentee, and then she began to work with me,

558
00:33:18,200 --> 00:33:20,560
Speaker 1: so there are times when she would ask me things

559
00:33:20,600 --> 00:33:24,640
Speaker 1: about her work or a performance element or something like

560
00:33:24,680 --> 00:33:28,280
Speaker 1: that where I can have a level of objectivity about

561
00:33:28,320 --> 00:33:33,920
Speaker 1: her that she can't because she's her right when we're

562
00:33:33,960 --> 00:33:37,040
Speaker 1: looking to build the best version of us and recognize

563
00:33:37,080 --> 00:33:42,640
Speaker 1: these saboteurs and move forward in a more positive direction,

564
00:33:43,400 --> 00:33:47,200
Speaker 1: do you think it's good to invite people into provide

565
00:33:47,240 --> 00:33:52,480
Speaker 1: you with feedback purely just because they can see things

566
00:33:52,480 --> 00:33:55,440
Speaker 1: about us that we can't. Obviously that need to be

567
00:33:55,480 --> 00:34:00,120
Speaker 1: the right people and all of that.

568
00:34:00,120 --> 00:34:03,000
Speaker 2: That's what I have done, Like that's what we have

569
00:34:03,120 --> 00:34:06,080
Speaker 2: done as a family. So when I started developing this work,

570
00:34:06,560 --> 00:34:09,680
Speaker 2: the first place I held myself accountable was with my

571
00:34:09,760 --> 00:34:13,440
Speaker 2: own kids. So I told my kids, I said, look,

572
00:34:15,160 --> 00:34:18,480
Speaker 2: I have this judge sabatur amongst other sabbateurs, and I

573
00:34:18,520 --> 00:34:20,400
Speaker 2: want to work on it. And I want you to

574
00:34:20,440 --> 00:34:23,520
Speaker 2: hold me accountable for my judge. And how do you

575
00:34:23,560 --> 00:34:26,440
Speaker 2: know my judge is talking if I'm screaming at you,

576
00:34:26,920 --> 00:34:29,319
Speaker 2: if if I've lost control, I'm screaming at you and

577
00:34:29,320 --> 00:34:32,520
Speaker 2: taking advantage of my parental authority. I am in my

578
00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:35,239
Speaker 2: judge mode. You do not need to follow what I'm

579
00:34:35,280 --> 00:34:38,879
Speaker 2: asking you to do, because I am in my judge mode.

580
00:34:38,880 --> 00:34:41,799
Speaker 2: You don't need to follow what I say. However, if

581
00:34:41,840 --> 00:34:44,400
Speaker 2: I calm down and shift to the positive part of

582
00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:46,839
Speaker 2: my brain and then the home clear that way, I say,

583
00:34:46,880 --> 00:34:49,680
Speaker 2: would you please do this, then maybe you should follow

584
00:34:50,120 --> 00:34:53,839
Speaker 2: what I'm asking. But and then my daughter, even when

585
00:34:53,840 --> 00:34:57,320
Speaker 2: she was like seven years old, she always held me

586
00:34:57,320 --> 00:35:00,920
Speaker 2: accoontole because I'll be screaming, and she say, duddy, who's

587
00:35:00,960 --> 00:35:03,280
Speaker 2: doing the talking right now? And every time she would

588
00:35:03,280 --> 00:35:06,880
Speaker 2: catch me absolutely in being in my judge. And also

589
00:35:06,920 --> 00:35:10,000
Speaker 2: I told them about my other savators, and in so doing,

590
00:35:10,320 --> 00:35:14,960
Speaker 2: I was not just holding myself accountable, but also creating

591
00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:18,120
Speaker 2: an environment in which my kids and my wife got

592
00:35:18,120 --> 00:35:23,560
Speaker 2: to witness what's possible in this transformation of a human being.

593
00:35:23,640 --> 00:35:26,680
Speaker 2: Saying I'm not perfect. I have these nasty characters in

594
00:35:26,719 --> 00:35:29,880
Speaker 2: my head. I want to be better. I want to

595
00:35:29,920 --> 00:35:31,640
Speaker 2: catch them in the act, and I want to shift

596
00:35:31,800 --> 00:35:36,600
Speaker 2: help me do that. And also, and after I would

597
00:35:37,440 --> 00:35:40,480
Speaker 2: have what I call a sabbator hijacking, I would always

598
00:35:40,520 --> 00:35:43,240
Speaker 2: go back to them and say, ooh, sorry, the judge

599
00:35:43,320 --> 00:35:46,440
Speaker 2: was doing the talking. And what my sage would want

600
00:35:46,440 --> 00:35:48,000
Speaker 2: to say is a very different thing. Here is what

601
00:35:48,080 --> 00:35:50,879
Speaker 2: my sage right now would want to say so. And

602
00:35:50,920 --> 00:35:53,759
Speaker 2: that's the way that my son and daughter in particular

603
00:35:54,480 --> 00:35:57,200
Speaker 2: got to be so inspired by this framework that they

604
00:35:57,200 --> 00:36:01,000
Speaker 2: are not practicing it themselves. So my daughter, who's twenty

605
00:36:01,080 --> 00:36:03,160
Speaker 2: five years old now, I'm living in New York City.

606
00:36:03,480 --> 00:36:06,560
Speaker 2: Every few months, she says, she texts me this Barchart,

607
00:36:07,120 --> 00:36:10,919
Speaker 2: and he says, says, Dad, I just started dating this guy.

608
00:36:11,040 --> 00:36:14,560
Speaker 2: This is his Savator assessment Barchard that yes, what do

609
00:36:14,600 --> 00:36:17,520
Speaker 2: you think, Let's talk about it. It's just fascinating because

610
00:36:17,520 --> 00:36:20,719
Speaker 2: it is so helpful for her in helping to understand

611
00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:23,880
Speaker 2: other human beings unrelated to them better. And it also

612
00:36:24,719 --> 00:36:27,000
Speaker 2: I was holding myself accountable and modeled it.

613
00:36:27,719 --> 00:36:30,120
Speaker 1: I love that. Imagine that first date where you say,

614
00:36:30,200 --> 00:36:32,279
Speaker 1: before we go to the second date, you're going to

615
00:36:32,320 --> 00:36:35,440
Speaker 1: have to fill out this online test that my dad created,

616
00:36:35,880 --> 00:36:39,440
Speaker 1: and depending on the data, and depending on a subsequent

617
00:36:39,480 --> 00:36:42,200
Speaker 1: discussion about your data with my dad, there may or

618
00:36:42,239 --> 00:36:45,680
Speaker 1: may not be a second date. That'd be so good.

619
00:36:46,000 --> 00:36:49,839
Speaker 1: I would love that. Oh my goodness, that'd be an

620
00:36:49,880 --> 00:36:56,120
Speaker 1: interesting family dynamic. This is what I feel about something,

621
00:36:56,600 --> 00:36:59,200
Speaker 1: and I want to know what you feel. I feel

622
00:36:59,280 --> 00:37:03,520
Speaker 1: like because I'm I've been working for forty three years,

623
00:37:03,600 --> 00:37:06,120
Speaker 1: right since I was eighteen, So forty three years of work.

624
00:37:06,160 --> 00:37:10,120
Speaker 1: I'm sixty one, and I feel like less than ever

625
00:37:10,680 --> 00:37:16,080
Speaker 1: people actually want feedback. I feel like we say we

626
00:37:16,120 --> 00:37:19,879
Speaker 1: want feedback, but what we really want is praise. What

627
00:37:19,920 --> 00:37:24,640
Speaker 1: we really want is endorsement. And so when you know,

628
00:37:24,840 --> 00:37:29,680
Speaker 1: invited to give it depends on the situation, of course, circumstance, environment, person,

629
00:37:30,120 --> 00:37:34,200
Speaker 1: but being able to give people real feedback that's coming

630
00:37:34,239 --> 00:37:37,040
Speaker 1: from a good place, that's as objective as I can be.

631
00:37:37,800 --> 00:37:41,120
Speaker 1: I think sometimes when we tell people what we truly see,

632
00:37:42,360 --> 00:37:45,400
Speaker 1: if it isn't what they want to hear, they shut down.

633
00:37:46,000 --> 00:37:50,000
Speaker 1: So talk to us a little bit about giving feedback

634
00:37:50,040 --> 00:37:51,200
Speaker 1: in twenty twenty five.

635
00:37:54,960 --> 00:37:58,520
Speaker 2: And this goes to the whole idea of how do

636
00:37:58,560 --> 00:38:01,879
Speaker 2: you get somebody to want to do the work and

637
00:38:01,960 --> 00:38:06,560
Speaker 2: change themselves. And we can't get people to want to

638
00:38:06,680 --> 00:38:13,759
Speaker 2: change by confronting them, by pushing them, by you know,

639
00:38:13,840 --> 00:38:18,520
Speaker 2: wanting them to wake up and change, and we disciplined

640
00:38:18,560 --> 00:38:21,160
Speaker 2: and all of that stuff, and because what's going on

641
00:38:21,360 --> 00:38:27,120
Speaker 2: is that when we do those things inadvertently, we are

642
00:38:27,239 --> 00:38:32,040
Speaker 2: energizing their saboteurs. And as we energize somebody Sabbators that

643
00:38:32,080 --> 00:38:35,440
Speaker 2: are even more likely that they will want to avoid

644
00:38:35,760 --> 00:38:39,560
Speaker 2: changing anything because that Sabators are interested in survival. So

645
00:38:39,600 --> 00:38:43,800
Speaker 2: the most important thing is we need to energize somebody's stage.

646
00:38:43,960 --> 00:38:48,240
Speaker 2: Not sabatur have the stage in them, see the possibility

647
00:38:48,320 --> 00:38:51,719
Speaker 2: for that for who they are. And often what I

648
00:38:51,760 --> 00:38:55,320
Speaker 2: tell people is that's why when I start by saying

649
00:38:55,320 --> 00:38:57,840
Speaker 2: I have bad news. But if all I have for

650
00:38:58,320 --> 00:38:59,839
Speaker 2: you is the bad news, you're not going to want

651
00:38:59,840 --> 00:39:03,560
Speaker 2: to and you're going to run away. I have really awesome, awesome,

652
00:39:03,600 --> 00:39:07,319
Speaker 2: awesome news, which is how extraordinary your stage is. And

653
00:39:07,360 --> 00:39:09,319
Speaker 2: in that I even tell people, you know, I'm not

654
00:39:09,400 --> 00:39:12,000
Speaker 2: here to change you. I'm here to hope you remember

655
00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:16,800
Speaker 2: who you truly are. Because my son and my daughter,

656
00:39:17,560 --> 00:39:20,759
Speaker 2: when they were born, they were born with extraordinarily beautiful

657
00:39:20,920 --> 00:39:24,960
Speaker 2: essence beings, and those two essences were completely different from

658
00:39:24,960 --> 00:39:29,160
Speaker 2: each other. Each person is born as a unique beautiful

659
00:39:29,280 --> 00:39:33,920
Speaker 2: essence being, unique as their fingerprints. And one of the

660
00:39:33,960 --> 00:39:35,880
Speaker 2: most important things I want to help people do is

661
00:39:35,960 --> 00:39:40,479
Speaker 2: remember who they are in their gorgeous, beautiful essence being

662
00:39:40,680 --> 00:39:43,960
Speaker 2: and by the way, that essence being never changes. And

663
00:39:44,640 --> 00:39:49,879
Speaker 2: I play this I play this game with my son

664
00:39:50,000 --> 00:39:52,839
Speaker 2: likes tickling. My daughter didn't like tickling. But I played

665
00:39:52,880 --> 00:39:55,960
Speaker 2: this game with my son. I had recognized that one

666
00:39:55,960 --> 00:39:58,359
Speaker 2: of the biggest problems with people is that they grow

667
00:39:58,480 --> 00:40:02,759
Speaker 2: up feeling conductiontionally loved. I am conditionally loved if I

668
00:40:02,960 --> 00:40:06,360
Speaker 2: do well, if I do the right things, if I

669
00:40:06,360 --> 00:40:10,040
Speaker 2: I'm good in sports or whatever. So unconditional love is worthless,

670
00:40:10,080 --> 00:40:14,759
Speaker 2: and so conditions a conditional love is worthless. Unconditional love

671
00:40:14,840 --> 00:40:17,319
Speaker 2: is about being loved for your essence. So in order

672
00:40:17,320 --> 00:40:20,680
Speaker 2: to make sure my son didn't grow up with conditional

673
00:40:20,719 --> 00:40:24,000
Speaker 2: love and he knew how to love himself, I played

674
00:40:24,000 --> 00:40:27,640
Speaker 2: this tickling game with him, where I would I taught

675
00:40:27,680 --> 00:40:30,320
Speaker 2: him to give me all the right answers, so I

676
00:40:30,320 --> 00:40:33,239
Speaker 2: would stop tickling himself start tickling him and say, so, kem,

677
00:40:33,320 --> 00:40:35,640
Speaker 2: why I love you so much? And he had learned

678
00:40:35,640 --> 00:40:37,040
Speaker 2: to say and he would say, I don't know that

679
00:40:37,200 --> 00:40:39,400
Speaker 2: he idea love me so much. And I would take

680
00:40:39,520 --> 00:40:41,160
Speaker 2: him some more and say, well, is it because you

681
00:40:41,200 --> 00:40:43,719
Speaker 2: are so handsome? And he is very handsome. It looks

682
00:40:43,760 --> 00:40:46,440
Speaker 2: like my wife and him say no, that it's not

683
00:40:46,480 --> 00:40:49,479
Speaker 2: because I'm handsome, taking him some more, Is it because

684
00:40:49,520 --> 00:40:52,000
Speaker 2: you're so good in sports? Know that it's not because

685
00:40:52,040 --> 00:40:54,160
Speaker 2: of that. Is it because you're so good in math

686
00:40:54,239 --> 00:40:56,400
Speaker 2: and literature and whatever. No, that is not because of that.

687
00:40:56,520 --> 00:40:58,360
Speaker 2: Is it because you're so kind of generous? No, that

688
00:40:58,520 --> 00:41:03,279
Speaker 2: is not so. At the end, I would faint great frustration.

689
00:41:03,400 --> 00:41:05,160
Speaker 2: I would say, so, why is it, John, why do

690
00:41:05,280 --> 00:41:07,560
Speaker 2: I love you so much? And he had learned to

691
00:41:07,600 --> 00:41:10,840
Speaker 2: say and he would say, that is because I am me.

692
00:41:12,400 --> 00:41:15,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's beautiful.

693
00:41:16,520 --> 00:41:20,400
Speaker 2: That is because okay. I would ask him, so what

694
00:41:20,440 --> 00:41:23,000
Speaker 2: does that mean? And he would say, you know, my

695
00:41:23,160 --> 00:41:25,280
Speaker 2: true self is the person you held in the hospital.

696
00:41:25,320 --> 00:41:27,600
Speaker 2: That person has never changed, will never change. I don't

697
00:41:27,600 --> 00:41:29,160
Speaker 2: have to perform for it. I don't have to do

698
00:41:29,160 --> 00:41:32,520
Speaker 2: anything for it. I am that person, and so in

699
00:41:32,600 --> 00:41:36,399
Speaker 2: that I think the most important work here is that

700
00:41:36,520 --> 00:41:40,799
Speaker 2: the Sabbateurs have created the false identity of us. They

701
00:41:40,840 --> 00:41:44,439
Speaker 2: have told us a different version of who they say

702
00:41:44,480 --> 00:41:48,239
Speaker 2: we are. And as we quiet the voice of these Sabaturs,

703
00:41:48,280 --> 00:41:51,680
Speaker 2: we begin to see the beautiful, true ess and self

704
00:41:51,760 --> 00:41:53,839
Speaker 2: that we are, and we fall in love with ourselves

705
00:41:54,560 --> 00:41:56,560
Speaker 2: and what I One of the ways I talk about

706
00:41:56,560 --> 00:41:59,160
Speaker 2: our work is I want to help you move from

707
00:41:59,200 --> 00:42:03,800
Speaker 2: the self brute metality of your saboteurs the unconditional self

708
00:42:03,840 --> 00:42:07,680
Speaker 2: love of your sage. And that's the good news that

709
00:42:07,680 --> 00:42:11,600
Speaker 2: that sage is profound, beautiful and has everything that you

710
00:42:11,680 --> 00:42:13,879
Speaker 2: need in or to be very happy and very successful.

711
00:42:14,640 --> 00:42:17,440
Speaker 2: And it starts by being less of our false self.

712
00:42:17,800 --> 00:42:18,879
Speaker 2: Who are the sabators?

713
00:42:20,080 --> 00:42:23,400
Speaker 1: I love it? Hey, tip before we wind up, what's

714
00:42:23,400 --> 00:42:26,160
Speaker 1: what's at the top of your self sabaturist or your

715
00:42:26,160 --> 00:42:27,920
Speaker 1: sabatur list? What do you? What do you?

716
00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:30,480
Speaker 3: I've already done that, I've already done.

717
00:42:30,239 --> 00:42:32,680
Speaker 1: The Oh you've done the test.

718
00:42:32,560 --> 00:42:36,560
Speaker 3: Yep, we've done it. Hyperachiever and the restless at my

719
00:42:36,680 --> 00:42:37,160
Speaker 3: top two?

720
00:42:38,400 --> 00:42:42,240
Speaker 1: Really, so what is hyperachiever?

721
00:42:43,320 --> 00:42:43,800
Speaker 3: Yeah?

722
00:42:44,600 --> 00:42:49,520
Speaker 1: And and restless? Well, we've got the guru here with us.

723
00:42:49,560 --> 00:42:52,560
Speaker 1: He might as well unpack that with you a little bit.

724
00:42:52,640 --> 00:42:55,000
Speaker 1: What have you got a question based on that?

725
00:42:55,440 --> 00:42:55,880
Speaker 3: Fix me?

726
00:42:58,040 --> 00:43:00,880
Speaker 1: I think that's an instruction. You got a question?

727
00:43:03,960 --> 00:43:05,600
Speaker 3: Well, I want to go in and read more about

728
00:43:05,640 --> 00:43:06,880
Speaker 3: it now. I'm really interested.

729
00:43:08,320 --> 00:43:12,480
Speaker 2: Well, Tiffany, the hyperachiever that the reason we put the

730
00:43:12,560 --> 00:43:14,960
Speaker 2: hyper in front of it is being an achiever is

731
00:43:15,000 --> 00:43:19,759
Speaker 2: really awesome, It's wonderful. And the hyper achiever is the

732
00:43:19,840 --> 00:43:24,160
Speaker 2: part that has your self love be completely conditioned on

733
00:43:24,200 --> 00:43:28,839
Speaker 2: your achievement. And the problem with the hyperachiever is that

734
00:43:28,880 --> 00:43:32,759
Speaker 2: there is never enough achievement for you to feel validated

735
00:43:32,880 --> 00:43:36,479
Speaker 2: enough to love yourself. So the hyperachiever, you know, sets

736
00:43:36,520 --> 00:43:38,720
Speaker 2: this big target and you have to climb this mountain,

737
00:43:38,800 --> 00:43:40,400
Speaker 2: and you work really hard to clim in mound and

738
00:43:40,400 --> 00:43:43,440
Speaker 2: get to the top. Then the hyperachiever allows you to

739
00:43:43,520 --> 00:43:46,640
Speaker 2: celebrate for I don't know, a minute an hour a

740
00:43:46,719 --> 00:43:48,839
Speaker 2: day if you're lucky, and then it says, well, that's

741
00:43:48,880 --> 00:43:50,640
Speaker 2: not enough to that was the old achievement. Now you

742
00:43:50,640 --> 00:43:53,200
Speaker 2: have achieve this for me so you can be worthy

743
00:43:53,800 --> 00:43:57,560
Speaker 2: of love and respect. And most hyperachievers, the problem is

744
00:43:57,560 --> 00:44:01,799
Speaker 2: the hyperchiever takes you to the graves still setting new

745
00:44:01,840 --> 00:44:05,240
Speaker 2: conditions for you to prove to yourself that you're worthy

746
00:44:05,320 --> 00:44:07,880
Speaker 2: of love. And so the big thing we want for

747
00:44:07,920 --> 00:44:12,280
Speaker 2: the hyper achieve is very much to disconnect your self

748
00:44:12,320 --> 00:44:16,080
Speaker 2: love from your most recent achievement, so that you can

749
00:44:16,120 --> 00:44:18,400
Speaker 2: look yourself in the mirror even at the end of

750
00:44:18,440 --> 00:44:20,200
Speaker 2: the day when you have made a mess of things,

751
00:44:20,640 --> 00:44:24,560
Speaker 2: and feel deep, unconditional self love for yourself, and then

752
00:44:24,760 --> 00:44:27,759
Speaker 2: absolutely go after your achievements, but have the achievement, be

753
00:44:27,880 --> 00:44:32,200
Speaker 2: joyful and enjoy the steps towards the achievement, not just

754
00:44:32,239 --> 00:44:34,840
Speaker 2: wait for the achievement, and as you are present to

755
00:44:34,880 --> 00:44:39,440
Speaker 2: every step. The game you're playing is inherently valuable and useful,

756
00:44:39,520 --> 00:44:41,879
Speaker 2: not just because of the outcome, because but the game

757
00:44:41,920 --> 00:44:46,719
Speaker 2: itself is inherently valuable and enjoyable. You will achieve more,

758
00:44:46,840 --> 00:44:50,520
Speaker 2: not less, because you're more energized, You recover faster from

759
00:44:50,600 --> 00:44:53,439
Speaker 2: problems and failures, and you actually achieve more, not less.

760
00:44:53,440 --> 00:44:55,560
Speaker 2: If you're less of a hyperachiever.

761
00:44:56,840 --> 00:45:01,839
Speaker 1: That'll be two hundred and fifty dollars. And that's that's

762
00:45:02,000 --> 00:45:07,279
Speaker 1: like with the tell you why page. All right, let's

763
00:45:07,320 --> 00:45:09,719
Speaker 1: just quickly let's wind up. Thank you so much for that.

764
00:45:09,760 --> 00:45:17,920
Speaker 1: Shoz add so Positive Intelligence dot com, Positive intelligence dot

765
00:45:17,960 --> 00:45:21,040
Speaker 1: com and also the book is Positive Intelligence. Is that

766
00:45:21,120 --> 00:45:24,040
Speaker 1: your main website, Positive intelligence dot com is that where

767
00:45:24,040 --> 00:45:24,880
Speaker 1: we steer people.

768
00:45:25,880 --> 00:45:28,359
Speaker 2: Yes, and in particular I would love everybody to do

769
00:45:28,400 --> 00:45:32,040
Speaker 2: the Sabbator assessment, So pasin thurs dot com. Slash assessment

770
00:45:32,280 --> 00:45:35,520
Speaker 2: is how you do the five minute online Sabator assessment.

771
00:45:35,840 --> 00:45:39,239
Speaker 2: All the discovery starts there, and then there are these

772
00:45:39,360 --> 00:45:42,520
Speaker 2: nor science based techniques about how to shift your brain activation.

773
00:45:42,719 --> 00:45:45,960
Speaker 2: So when you detect yourself in sabator or you can

774
00:45:46,000 --> 00:45:49,200
Speaker 2: shift to more of the brain activation of the sage

775
00:45:49,239 --> 00:45:52,440
Speaker 2: so you have access to that. So it's a systematic,

776
00:45:52,480 --> 00:45:54,759
Speaker 2: step by step process that you get to learn. First

777
00:45:54,760 --> 00:45:56,480
Speaker 2: step is to the sabator assessment.

778
00:45:58,280 --> 00:46:00,600
Speaker 1: Wow, sounds good that tift.

779
00:46:00,600 --> 00:46:01,000
Speaker 2: Did you do?

780
00:46:01,160 --> 00:46:01,920
Speaker 1: Did you enjoy that?

781
00:46:02,239 --> 00:46:02,439
Speaker 2: Yeah?

782
00:46:02,440 --> 00:46:03,800
Speaker 3: What's yourself to hearts?

783
00:46:05,040 --> 00:46:09,880
Speaker 1: Oh, get in, get in the queue. Well I have,

784
00:46:10,280 --> 00:46:13,720
Speaker 1: I embarrassingly haven't done the test. I'll do the test

785
00:46:13,760 --> 00:46:16,520
Speaker 1: after this, which is not the right order. But I

786
00:46:17,440 --> 00:46:22,560
Speaker 1: think probably a little bit of self loathing, a bit

787
00:46:22,560 --> 00:46:24,439
Speaker 1: of a like I never think I'm good enough even

788
00:46:24,440 --> 00:46:27,760
Speaker 1: when I do well, but not so much high achiever.

789
00:46:27,920 --> 00:46:31,680
Speaker 1: I like achieving stuff, but I feel like like when

790
00:46:31,719 --> 00:46:34,960
Speaker 1: people say nice things to me directly, part of me

791
00:46:35,160 --> 00:46:36,680
Speaker 1: likes it, part of me doesn't want to hear it

792
00:46:36,680 --> 00:46:39,759
Speaker 1: because I feel unworthy of what they're saying, you know,

793
00:46:40,040 --> 00:46:43,160
Speaker 1: So I definitely need some therapy.

794
00:46:43,880 --> 00:46:45,560
Speaker 3: Any band aids for that. She's at.

795
00:46:47,239 --> 00:46:49,680
Speaker 2: A lot of the high achievers I work with have

796
00:46:49,800 --> 00:46:52,560
Speaker 2: the impostor syndrome, and there's a voice in their head

797
00:46:52,600 --> 00:46:56,840
Speaker 2: that says, your your success has come from luck and circumstance.

798
00:46:57,000 --> 00:47:00,440
Speaker 2: You're a fraud, and any day you'll be exposed for

799
00:47:00,440 --> 00:47:03,719
Speaker 2: for the impostor that you are. And those are all

800
00:47:04,400 --> 00:47:08,800
Speaker 2: elements of the judge. And I believe that the judges.

801
00:47:09,200 --> 00:47:11,680
Speaker 2: We call it the master sabator or the key one,

802
00:47:12,360 --> 00:47:15,760
Speaker 2: because the judge starts the whole thing. And I found

803
00:47:15,880 --> 00:47:19,480
Speaker 2: my judge was so devastating as a character. I gave

804
00:47:19,560 --> 00:47:23,520
Speaker 2: him a nickname. I called my judge the executioner because

805
00:47:23,560 --> 00:47:27,400
Speaker 2: he was so dark. And he's basically his staying watchers.

806
00:47:27,480 --> 00:47:30,760
Speaker 2: Or you're unworthy of any love, of any success, anything

807
00:47:30,840 --> 00:47:35,239
Speaker 2: that goes well, you don't deserve it. And and by

808
00:47:35,239 --> 00:47:38,279
Speaker 2: the way, that voice has never gone away. So that

809
00:47:38,360 --> 00:47:41,040
Speaker 2: judge is in my head every day. Except he used

810
00:47:41,080 --> 00:47:42,719
Speaker 2: to be a client. I used to trust him. I

811
00:47:42,800 --> 00:47:45,759
Speaker 2: used to believe that he's just telling the truth. And

812
00:47:45,880 --> 00:47:48,120
Speaker 2: now it's just a whisper where I say, oh, where

813
00:47:48,120 --> 00:47:49,840
Speaker 2: have you been. I haven't heard from you for a while.

814
00:47:50,840 --> 00:47:53,080
Speaker 2: But what he tells me has not changed at all.

815
00:47:53,120 --> 00:47:56,040
Speaker 2: And the judge is absolutely the number one sabbator we

816
00:47:56,120 --> 00:47:57,000
Speaker 2: all want to tackle.

817
00:47:57,800 --> 00:48:01,320
Speaker 1: It's all myst like, when something bad happens, it's because

818
00:48:01,320 --> 00:48:04,880
Speaker 1: of me, and when something bad good happens, it's in

819
00:48:04,960 --> 00:48:07,879
Speaker 1: spite of me. Do you know what I mean it's

820
00:48:08,040 --> 00:48:11,400
Speaker 1: like yeah, but that yeah, like you said, that was luck.

821
00:48:12,800 --> 00:48:16,480
Speaker 2: We all have that. And the reason the judges the

822
00:48:16,560 --> 00:48:21,799
Speaker 2: universal savatur is that, for evolutionary reasons, the brain has

823
00:48:21,840 --> 00:48:25,279
Speaker 2: a tendency to amplify the negative by a factor of

824
00:48:25,360 --> 00:48:31,000
Speaker 2: three to five versus the positive, because because being paranoid

825
00:48:31,040 --> 00:48:33,440
Speaker 2: and being stressed and being negative was actually helpful for

826
00:48:33,480 --> 00:48:37,720
Speaker 2: the survival of ancestors to have avoid all the possible

827
00:48:37,800 --> 00:48:41,920
Speaker 2: dangers to their survival. And so I mean, when the

828
00:48:41,960 --> 00:48:46,920
Speaker 2: tree starts shaking, if your ancestry was anxious and assume

829
00:48:47,000 --> 00:48:49,520
Speaker 2: the worst, and it's always assumed that the tiger trying

830
00:48:49,560 --> 00:48:52,880
Speaker 2: to come and eat me alive, and they ran ninety

831
00:48:52,920 --> 00:48:54,680
Speaker 2: nine other of one hundred times they were wrong. They

832
00:48:54,680 --> 00:48:58,160
Speaker 2: were unnecessarily paranoid, but the one time that they were right,

833
00:48:58,160 --> 00:49:01,200
Speaker 2: it saved their life. Imagine if you had an ancestor

834
00:49:01,239 --> 00:49:04,800
Speaker 2: that was very optimistic and positive, the tree starts shaking

835
00:49:04,960 --> 00:49:06,640
Speaker 2: and they would say, you know what, I bet there's

836
00:49:06,680 --> 00:49:09,239
Speaker 2: a call over coming to give me a very hug.

837
00:49:09,680 --> 00:49:12,239
Speaker 2: I'm feeling optimistic today. How long do you think that

838
00:49:12,360 --> 00:49:17,120
Speaker 2: ancestor survived? So we are so the judge being the

839
00:49:17,280 --> 00:49:22,000
Speaker 2: universal saboteur, is there for a reason, amplifying the negative,

840
00:49:22,520 --> 00:49:27,520
Speaker 2: discounting the positive, And it is the number one character

841
00:49:27,600 --> 00:49:31,719
Speaker 2: that we need to expose. And basically you want to

842
00:49:31,800 --> 00:49:33,959
Speaker 2: label it when it comes to here you go again,

843
00:49:34,000 --> 00:49:36,880
Speaker 2: and how isn't a humor? Like I sometimes I judge,

844
00:49:37,280 --> 00:49:39,000
Speaker 2: where have you been? I haven't heard from you calling

845
00:49:39,080 --> 00:49:44,239
Speaker 2: in an idiot like a whole hour? Did you know enough? Yeah?

846
00:49:44,360 --> 00:49:47,920
Speaker 2: So we instill taking them so seriously. We start labeling

847
00:49:47,920 --> 00:49:50,040
Speaker 2: it instantly like oh there goes a judge again, Oh

848
00:49:50,080 --> 00:49:51,959
Speaker 2: there goes a judge again, Oh there you are again,

849
00:49:52,000 --> 00:49:56,560
Speaker 2: where have you been? And then shift our brain activation

850
00:49:57,200 --> 00:50:00,839
Speaker 2: to a different place. There the judge is incredibly system.

851
00:50:01,760 --> 00:50:06,040
Speaker 1: I think there's I think that like in me, there's

852
00:50:06,080 --> 00:50:13,279
Speaker 1: this almost duality of I can intellectually know that I

853
00:50:13,280 --> 00:50:15,640
Speaker 1: did a good job or I'm good enough. I can

854
00:50:15,760 --> 00:50:18,840
Speaker 1: know that because I've got data or evidence or whatever,

855
00:50:19,000 --> 00:50:21,799
Speaker 1: right feedback forms from an audience. Right, So I know

856
00:50:23,320 --> 00:50:27,080
Speaker 1: I did well, but at the same time feel not

857
00:50:27,200 --> 00:50:30,960
Speaker 1: good enough. So these two things can coexist in the

858
00:50:30,960 --> 00:50:35,359
Speaker 1: one human where you know something to be true, like

859
00:50:35,480 --> 00:50:38,359
Speaker 1: I did a good job with this particular thing. I'm

860
00:50:38,360 --> 00:50:41,800
Speaker 1: not a dud. I'm not a failure while also feeling

861
00:50:42,520 --> 00:50:47,000
Speaker 1: concurrently like a failure, which is a really interesting mix.

862
00:50:47,760 --> 00:50:52,240
Speaker 2: And really the reason for it is that the saboteurs

863
00:50:53,560 --> 00:51:00,440
Speaker 2: and the saboteurs tend to live in regions of brain

864
00:51:01,480 --> 00:51:04,160
Speaker 2: that also where a lot of the thinking mind is

865
00:51:04,239 --> 00:51:09,200
Speaker 2: and the ruminating mind the other pilot mind the same.

866
00:51:09,480 --> 00:51:12,080
Speaker 2: And so the harder you think, the less access you

867
00:51:12,200 --> 00:51:15,560
Speaker 2: have to the feelings you want to have, which is

868
00:51:15,600 --> 00:51:19,879
Speaker 2: feelings of self love and compassion, which is a whole

869
00:51:19,880 --> 00:51:23,120
Speaker 2: different part of your brain. And so what we teach

870
00:51:23,239 --> 00:51:28,960
Speaker 2: people is shifting brain activation. So if I'm not feeling

871
00:51:29,000 --> 00:51:31,960
Speaker 2: good about myself right and trying to think my way

872
00:51:32,080 --> 00:51:37,000
Speaker 2: out of that problem and think so that I feel differently,

873
00:51:37,360 --> 00:51:39,920
Speaker 2: I need to shift my brain activation. And we do

874
00:51:40,000 --> 00:51:43,560
Speaker 2: these with ten second exercises that we call the cure apps,

875
00:51:43,560 --> 00:51:48,839
Speaker 2: and the most popular version that people love is and

876
00:51:48,880 --> 00:51:51,120
Speaker 2: if we can practice it together, So if you take

877
00:51:51,160 --> 00:51:55,239
Speaker 2: two fingertips and gently rub two fingertips against each other

878
00:51:55,800 --> 00:51:58,920
Speaker 2: with such attention that you can feel the fingertip bridges

879
00:51:58,960 --> 00:52:03,439
Speaker 2: on both fingers. Yea, with such attention you can feel

880
00:52:03,440 --> 00:52:07,440
Speaker 2: the finger to bridges on both fingers. So if you

881
00:52:07,480 --> 00:52:11,080
Speaker 2: do ten seconds of that, yeah, we just did. If

882
00:52:11,080 --> 00:52:14,080
Speaker 2: you had your head under a functional MRI machine, you'd

883
00:52:14,080 --> 00:52:17,160
Speaker 2: notice that it's ever so quiet, so slightly quite the

884
00:52:17,200 --> 00:52:20,680
Speaker 2: region of your brain that where these feelings are being

885
00:52:20,760 --> 00:52:23,239
Speaker 2: upset and stress and shame and shame and guilt and

886
00:52:23,239 --> 00:52:27,200
Speaker 2: all these things, ever so slightly energize a part of

887
00:52:27,239 --> 00:52:29,840
Speaker 2: your brain where where you are able to feel empathy

888
00:52:29,920 --> 00:52:33,520
Speaker 2: and love and compassion and so much of this work

889
00:52:33,640 --> 00:52:37,600
Speaker 2: is about shifting brain activation and rewiring the brain right

890
00:52:37,640 --> 00:52:39,880
Speaker 2: and trying to think our way from one state of

891
00:52:40,000 --> 00:52:43,440
Speaker 2: being to another state. Thinking is not going to get

892
00:52:43,440 --> 00:52:49,040
Speaker 2: you there. Yeah, I love shut in percent eighty percent

893
00:52:49,040 --> 00:52:50,840
Speaker 2: of that. This is about muscle building.

894
00:52:51,560 --> 00:52:54,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, now that you've been so good, we've got

895
00:52:54,760 --> 00:52:57,440
Speaker 1: to get you back. So can you come back another

896
00:52:57,520 --> 00:53:03,040
Speaker 1: day and we do the ten saboteurs? Can we unpack them? Yeah,

897
00:53:03,040 --> 00:53:06,520
Speaker 1: it'll be glad to Yeah, we'll do that one day.

898
00:53:06,719 --> 00:53:08,560
Speaker 1: We'll give you. We'll give you a break from me,

899
00:53:08,640 --> 00:53:10,799
Speaker 1: because everyone needs a break after they've had a bit

900
00:53:10,880 --> 00:53:15,560
Speaker 1: of me. So Positive Intelligence dot Com. The book is

901
00:53:15,560 --> 00:53:19,799
Speaker 1: called Positive Intelligence. She's ad it's been a pleasure. Thank

902
00:53:19,840 --> 00:53:22,800
Speaker 1: you so much for being on the You project. Loved

903
00:53:22,840 --> 00:53:27,680
Speaker 1: having you. Appreciate your time and wisdom and beautiful nature.

904
00:53:28,120 --> 00:53:30,560
Speaker 1: Thanks for being part of the experience here. We loved it.

905
00:53:32,239 --> 00:53:36,720
Speaker 2: Wonderful Craig, this was a wonderful conversation I enjoyed myself actually,

906
00:53:36,840 --> 00:53:38,600
Speaker 2: and Deviani it was great to meet you too.

907
00:53:39,040 --> 00:53:39,400
Speaker 1: Thank you.