Speaker 1: She said, it's now never I got fighting in my blood.
Speaker 2: I'm tiff.
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Speaker 2: Or Brithorne. Welcome to Roll with the Punches.
Speaker 4: Thank you, thank you for having me on so blindly know.
Speaker 2: What I'm excited.
Speaker 3: I like I love a bit of woo woo and
Speaker 3: you do a bit of woo woo.
Speaker 2: What do you think of the term woo woo? Do
Speaker 2: you hate it?
Speaker 4: No? I don't care. I personally I like one woo.
Speaker 4: I you know, woo woo is a little much, but
Speaker 4: who I kind of I kind of don't whine. I
Speaker 4: think it wins. Who's Who's saying it and in what spirit,
Speaker 4: you know, like anything cliche or trade, it becomes that way.
Speaker 4: But you know, all in all, we need, we seem
Speaker 4: to need a label for everything. So if you know
Speaker 4: the term woo woo helps some people, you know, embrace
Speaker 4: the more esoteric, mysterious side of life, then hey, use it.
Speaker 2: You know, well, I love a bit of woo woo,
Speaker 2: so woo. I'm gonna call it woo from now. And
Speaker 2: I love a bit of woo. I don't want to
Speaker 2: come in over the top.
Speaker 3: I was having a little So we got introduced by
Speaker 3: Cam McDonald, doctor Cam McDonald's regular on the show, He's Amazing.
Speaker 2: Was recently talking.
Speaker 3: To him on one of our other shows about a
Speaker 3: very woo a little retreat that he went on and
Speaker 3: a great experience he had, and I was telling you
Speaker 3: actually talking about it with a friend this morning, and
Speaker 3: I love and I think that you will fall in
Speaker 3: the same place because when he mentioned you and I
Speaker 3: had a quick look. You incorporate a whole range of
Speaker 3: different things, and one of those things is pH three sixty.
Speaker 3: That's epigenetic personalized health coaching, which I also do. So
Speaker 3: a lot of my listeners, maybe not everyone listening right now.
Speaker 3: But a lot of my listeners are familiar with that,
Speaker 3: and that's a science. And then you've got astrology, and
Speaker 3: you probably should tell me all the other things. Give
Speaker 3: me a give us all an introduction to Aubreythorne.
Speaker 4: Okay, well, I mean you got it. It's I basically
Speaker 4: hobbled together every personalizing modality that i've that you know,
Speaker 4: that I find has integrity and depth. And yeah, that's
Speaker 4: what it looks like today. It looks like astrology, evolutionary
Speaker 4: astrology to be specific, probably, and I can explain what
Speaker 4: that is a little bit of medical astrology becoming more
Speaker 4: and more the more I start combining astrology with health coaching.
Speaker 4: The pH three sixty fits really beautifully and with these
Speaker 4: other personalization systems, and then I lead quite a bit
Speaker 4: of breath work for groups. So I you know, I'm
Speaker 4: sort of after anything that helps people shift into a
Speaker 4: healthier state of consciousness or a happier state of being
Speaker 4: pretty pretty quickly. And astrology is my you know what
Speaker 4: I use as the shortcut to short sort of like
Speaker 4: just cut out all the overthinking and the like the
Speaker 4: over cycle, you know, the too much psychology in the head.
Speaker 4: Let's just get to the awareness piece and turn on
Speaker 4: the lights for who you are. And astrology does that
Speaker 4: better than anything I've ever found. And I've sort of
Speaker 4: been on this personal, personalized health and happiness journey for
Speaker 4: thirty years. And it started with Chinese medicine, and so
Speaker 4: I started off in private practice as an acupuncturist, and
Speaker 4: just that's what really kind of turned turned me on
Speaker 4: to this whole idea of people's health, kind of living
Speaker 4: on a level that was beyond the body. And ever
Speaker 4: since then, I've just been in love with energetic medicine,
Speaker 4: energetic practices, the whole bet.
Speaker 2: When people land at your doorstep.
Speaker 3: Looking at astrology specifically, do you find and I guess
Speaker 3: as the ones who are maybe new to be introduced
Speaker 3: to it, Like someone goes, Okay, what's this astrology?
Speaker 2: Think, I'm going to find an astrologist. I'm going to
Speaker 2: learn about it, talk about it.
Speaker 3: What's the expectation or what do people tend to be seeking?
Speaker 3: And I'd love to know. I guess how do we different?
Speaker 3: How do we have agency in our lives and take
Speaker 3: responsibility and also lean on things like astrology and spiritual
Speaker 3: types of practices that almost give us a path right
Speaker 3: of an ospiving one.
Speaker 4: Okay, uh, there's few a few, I think a few
Speaker 4: points in there. One is the people that land at
Speaker 4: my doorstep are usually the curious ones to begin with.
Speaker 4: So it's people who are doing a significant amount of
Speaker 4: self seeking, whether that and that could be in any
Speaker 4: any wu direction, or it could be through therapy or
Speaker 4: any psychological practices. Though these are seekers to begin with,
Speaker 4: you don't get a lot of skeptics knocking on the door.
Speaker 4: The other piece of it, which I'm glad you actually highlighted,
Speaker 4: is that this this thing called astrology is just a language,
Speaker 4: and people speak at an old different kinds of ways.
Speaker 4: So there are some some schools of astrology. They speak
Speaker 4: in a very deterministic, predictive way. You know, you're a
Speaker 4: Taurus and you have a Harry's moon, and that means
Speaker 4: you always blah blah blah, and you should never date
Speaker 4: a Scorpio. And so there's all these very deterministic ways
Speaker 4: that people can use astrology or feel feel that that's
Speaker 4: astrology's role. I think that's a misuse of astrology, and
Speaker 4: it is. It's actually where astrology has gotten a lot
Speaker 4: of it's bad rap, right because Nobody likes to be pegged.
Speaker 4: No one likes to be told you're this, you're that,
Speaker 4: you know you should never marry this, or that, you know.
Speaker 4: We were intelligently resistant to being pegged like that. What
Speaker 4: drew me to astrology, specifically evolutionary astrology, was the fact
Speaker 4: that it was the natal chart would describe all of
Speaker 4: these tendencies a lot like the pH three sixty describes
Speaker 4: a lot of tendencies. Right, there's your genetics and then
Speaker 4: there's your epigenetics. Right. Not every person with the same
Speaker 4: set of genes turns into the same kind of person
Speaker 4: with the same sort of health outcomes, health experiences, the
Speaker 4: whole bit. A lot of it depends on our lifestyle,
Speaker 4: which is, you know, a fancy word for choices. So
Speaker 4: astrology is much the same way where we could boil
Speaker 4: someone down to twelve of the Sun sign types, twelve
Speaker 4: of the Moon sign types, twelve of the Venus sign tips,
Speaker 4: and go through other planets. So you've like all these combinations,
Speaker 4: and each person is going to use those tendencies in
Speaker 4: a completely different way, depending on the external conditions they're
Speaker 4: born into, depending on the people they hang out with,
Speaker 4: depending on the struggles they encounter. You know, what they
Speaker 4: have to do versus what they can do. So all
Speaker 4: of that kind of elicits pretty much nothing but free will.
Speaker 3: I have done a little not done. I've been interested
Speaker 3: in human design previously. I'd heard about that before, and
Speaker 3: I know one percent of it, but I like the
Speaker 3: I it interests me and intrigues me. And one thing
Speaker 3: as you were talking, one thing I had done recently
Speaker 3: was looking at the correlations between who is to the
Speaker 3: activator in pH Three sixty and what does that mean behaviorally,
Speaker 3: and then aligning that with also who is tiff in
Speaker 3: human design and what tendencies come and overlap and overlay.
Speaker 3: And it's really interesting how there's so many different systems
Speaker 3: that we can start to.
Speaker 2: Understand our tendencies.
Speaker 3: And it's for me as both a seeker and a skeptic,
Speaker 3: a healthy doses of both. It's really nice to explore
Speaker 3: different things and see them overlap and go, oh that
Speaker 3: makes sense.
Speaker 2: Oh that makes sense too.
Speaker 3: We've all got these different things, different areas we can
Speaker 3: look at to learn about ourselves.
Speaker 4: Yeah, And the point is to learn about ourselves. It's
Speaker 4: it's to use a tool or a language in a
Speaker 4: way that sparks some insates, right, It's the whole point
Speaker 4: is insates not just a big fire hose of information.
Speaker 4: That's why I can't stand when people like speak like
Speaker 4: speak astrology like you know, it's it's uh. We can't
Speaker 4: just sort of spew a bunch of information at people.
Speaker 4: This is an awareness tool. The whole point is to
Speaker 4: get somebody to see themselves in a way that suddenly
Speaker 4: feels actually very true, and then they can't unsee it.
Speaker 4: And then from that picture of truth, there there tend
Speaker 4: to be lots of aha moments that kind of just
Speaker 4: continue to unfold throughout life, where you see yourself behaving
Speaker 4: in a certain way, you're like, oh, that's what south
Speaker 4: Noe libra means because you see it in action. But
Speaker 4: you wouldn't see it in action unless someone had shined
Speaker 4: a spotlight on this amazing thing called a natal chart.
Speaker 4: So it's for me the way I use it, it's all
Speaker 4: about consciousness. It's like, do you see yourself fully? And
Speaker 4: can you continue to see yourself more and more and
Speaker 4: more fully because the whole, the whole, that's the whole point.
Speaker 4: The whole point is to see see all the little
Speaker 4: pieces of ourselves that we're either not using and that
Speaker 4: need to be expressed, or that we're overusing and we're
Speaker 4: causing damage and self sabotage because we just keep on
Speaker 4: doing the same old thing. You know, But if the
Speaker 4: whole point is to see it, then you see it
Speaker 4: and then you make a new choice.
Speaker 2: Much like I guess.
Speaker 3: Other the labels, you know, like mental health labels and
Speaker 3: personality labels can astrology if this if the person like yourself,
Speaker 3: I don't know, astrologer or practitioner.
Speaker 2: Or whatever the I mean? Yeah, if.
Speaker 3: Are you responsible for ensuring that that these these labels
Speaker 3: don't become anchors and excuses rather than insights and ways
Speaker 3: that can unlock choices of behavior.
Speaker 2: They think about. You know, we go, oh, like I'm
Speaker 2: a tourist.
Speaker 3: Oh well, I'm just stubborn, you know how we like
Speaker 3: to go, Yeah, well I'm under I'm adhd so I'm
Speaker 3: always this instead of using it in a way to
Speaker 3: go I understand I have a tendency for this type
Speaker 3: of behavior, so I can do this, this and this
Speaker 3: about it is the same or no.
Speaker 4: It should be, Yeah it should be. It's it doesn't
Speaker 4: tend again, it doesn't. That's that's not the way I
Speaker 4: see it most popularly being spoken about and used. I am.
Speaker 4: I teach in a school to train other astrologers to
Speaker 4: become a professional astrologers, and they're the most brilliant students,
Speaker 4: and yet everyone, including myself, sometimes has to stop in
Speaker 4: their tracks and say, wait a second, I'm doing the
Speaker 4: labeling thing of astrology. It's a very easy trap to
Speaker 4: fall into because that's kind of how we've always known
Speaker 4: astrology in this label lee way. What I try to
Speaker 4: do is to constantly remember that it's not that you're
Speaker 4: a Taurus. Are you a Taurus?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 4: Okay, good guess okay before that, that it's not that
Speaker 4: you are a Taurus. It's that you came here to
Speaker 4: learn how to be a fantastic taurtis. You came here
Speaker 4: to learn how to do Taurus like at the highest level.
Speaker 4: And if I do my job correctly in a reading,
Speaker 4: what you leave with is the very clear sense of
Speaker 4: what it looks like when you're doing a great job
Speaker 4: making high choices for your chart, and what it looks
Speaker 4: like when you're not. And that's what you see and
Speaker 4: you're like, oh, so that that's stuckness, then that Taurus
Speaker 4: like stasis that Taurus loves to be comfortable and likes
Speaker 4: to be practical and kind of don't don't make any
Speaker 4: changes here. You can see when you're making that choice
Speaker 4: for stability out of maybe like a fear response, a
Speaker 4: fear of change, a fear of you know, just not
Speaker 4: liking change, or you can see when it's adding practical
Speaker 4: value to the situation. There's no one way to be
Speaker 4: a good Taurus. It's just that are you in the
Speaker 4: situation or the context specific you know event, and what's
Speaker 4: called for? Like are you are you doubling down and
Speaker 4: repeating old patterns or does does your excellent skill set
Speaker 4: come in handy right now?
Speaker 2: I love that. I love that. That's really cool. You
Speaker 2: mentioned evolutionary astrology astrology before. Can you talk about that.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's it's a it's a name that was so
Speaker 4: it was. It's a Western astrology, just like we know
Speaker 4: astrology as opposed to like you know, Asian forms of astrology,
Speaker 4: Chinese astrology, betach astrology. Western astrology tends to be very psychological.
Speaker 4: Evolutionary astrology has this added layer to it a real well,
Speaker 4: it's a it's a real it's a specific lens that
Speaker 4: it basically says, every single person is able to grow
Speaker 4: through through their natal chart. It's so My teacher, Stephen Forrest,
Speaker 4: was one of the founders of evolutionary astrology, and he's
Speaker 4: the one who, for the first time when I heard
Speaker 4: him talk about astrology, was the one who loosened up
Speaker 4: these labels and taught me like, oh, I mean, I'm
Speaker 4: not a pisces. I'm learning how to bet a pisce's
Speaker 4: I'm growing into becoming a better and better and better
Speaker 4: and more well expressed pisces. So it's an evolutionary astrology
Speaker 4: is an astrology of consciousness. Ultimately, it's to help people grow,
Speaker 4: to help people heal, and to help people make really
Speaker 4: great choices based on who they individually are and what
Speaker 4: they individually need because everybody, everybody's version of everything is
Speaker 4: so different on their natal chart. No one person's fear
Speaker 4: is the same as another person's fear. No one's person's
Speaker 4: courage is the same as another person's courage. No one's
Speaker 4: relationship like karma is the same as another person's relationship karma.
Speaker 4: And that's another big piece of evolutionary astrology is like,
Speaker 4: is what did you incarnate with? What lessons did you
Speaker 4: did you were you born with? What issues did you
Speaker 4: come in with? What automatic reaction to life was yours
Speaker 4: when you came in there? We all have an emotional
Speaker 4: reaction to life. It's instant. It's anyone who's ever met
Speaker 4: a baby, that first two three seconds of life. We
Speaker 4: see there's a personality there, there's someone home, and so
Speaker 4: you know, you can suppose that that personality, that sort
Speaker 4: of automatic reaction to life from another time and place
Speaker 4: or space. Now that said people have to like fall
Speaker 4: like right into and buy into reincarnation, but it is
Speaker 4: it is a big piece of the puzzle that I
Speaker 4: think makes perfect sense.
Speaker 2: What about the medical astrology.
Speaker 4: So I I love medical astrology because it kind of
Speaker 4: was the first that was that was more how astrology
Speaker 4: was initially used. I mean it astrology as it was
Speaker 4: practiced in the medieval times and before and you know,
Speaker 4: during the early Renaissance, you know, before the before the Enlightenment.
Speaker 4: It was it was medical astrology. It was well, there
Speaker 4: was a lot of predictive work, but there was a
Speaker 4: lot of using it to figure out how the human
Speaker 4: body worked and how the human body sort of syncd
Speaker 4: up with seasons, and to understand the different energetics of
Speaker 4: the body as they went out of balance, you know
Speaker 4: or not or you know, there was a lot of there.
Speaker 4: There was a lot of correlation between the natural world
Speaker 4: and the human experience, and that was translated really forensically,
Speaker 4: like very in a very detailed way into what we
Speaker 4: now know is medical astrology. But it's it's just these
Speaker 4: old correlations that go way way back that that that
Speaker 4: take each each sign of the zodiac and each planet
Speaker 4: and assigned body parts and body functions to to the
Speaker 4: symbols in the chart, and you can tell a lot
Speaker 4: about someone's innate strengths and weaknesses and maybe like genetic tendencies.
Speaker 4: Not I don't use it in such a detailed way
Speaker 4: that maybe other medical astrologers are emboldened to use it
Speaker 4: because I'm not a classical medical astrologer. In the classical
Speaker 4: they've practiced more in an ancient Greek kind of way.
Speaker 4: They're they're going to dive a lot more boldly and
Speaker 4: deeply into the territory of sort of reading a chart
Speaker 4: to say, oh, you need more warm drinks this month,
Speaker 4: and be careful when you're walking, and you know, they'll
Speaker 4: get very detailed about it, which can be helpful, and
Speaker 4: I would imagine with the wrong client could make you
Speaker 4: quite neurotic to so what I what I'll bring this home.
Speaker 4: But what I really love about the medical astrology piece
Speaker 4: is you can see where and how someone might get
Speaker 4: easily stressed, and that could be mental stress, or physical stress,
Speaker 4: or even spiritual stress. When we can describe the nature
Speaker 4: and potential of how someone experiences stress, we've just gone
Speaker 4: a long way towards how to mitigate stress. And since
Speaker 4: stress is like eighty ninety percent of the root cause
Speaker 4: for all chronic disease, you know, untreated, that's where I
Speaker 4: really fall in love with medical astrology, where like I
Speaker 4: can talk to someone about their stress, what may be
Speaker 4: causing it, how to remedy it, best practices for this
Speaker 4: particular person versus that person, that person, that person, and
Speaker 4: sort of it kind of Deboogyman's stress, Right, Stress is
Speaker 4: not just this one thing that we're all trying to avoid.
Speaker 4: That that's how we talk about it, you know, like, hey, Tiffany,
Speaker 4: you got to avoid stress or lower that stress or
Speaker 4: it's so generalized, But how you experience stress or have
Speaker 4: a relationship to stress is completely different than I experience stress.
Speaker 4: It's like it doesn't. It might not even it might
Speaker 4: be so different it might deserve a completely different name.
Speaker 4: So that's how I use medical astrology to look at
Speaker 4: that that innate level of potential weakness or things that
Speaker 4: drain drain us like how to and how to how
Speaker 4: to stop the drain, support the weakness, and maybe like
Speaker 4: play up the strengths in someone's physiology or someone's like constitution.
Speaker 3: How did you come across pH v sixt And what
Speaker 3: was the draw card for you?
Speaker 2: What made you want to explore this.
Speaker 3: And how has it overlayed what you know about medical astrology?
Speaker 4: So I came across pH three sixty. I believe I
Speaker 4: was taking a course with an Australian astrologer and naturopath,
Speaker 4: Kira Sutherland, and I really I really love her work
Speaker 4: and the way, you know, I sort of love everything
Speaker 4: she does. And she might have mentioned blah blah blah
Speaker 4: health types or blah blah blah decision health like I
Speaker 4: don't even know, because I've taken so many of her courses,
Speaker 4: but I'm sure I looked it up. That would be
Speaker 4: the only way I would have found it and guessing
Speaker 4: and yeah, I'm pretty sure it was through Kira. It
Speaker 4: was a fantastic She is more of a classical medical
Speaker 4: astrologer as opposed to the way I'm using it. I'm
Speaker 4: using it in a very evolutionary astrology way where I
Speaker 4: want I want to arm people with not that she doesn't.
Speaker 4: She does all of that. She arms people and empowers
Speaker 4: them to do what they can to. Why don't I can't.
Speaker 4: I can't speak for her. I don't know what she does.
Speaker 4: She's brilliant. She's brilliant, she knows what she's doing. And
Speaker 4: I have tried to learn from her and then apply
Speaker 4: it to my evolutionary astrology ideas, which is, where are
Speaker 4: you leaking energy and repeating that Haber habits and causing
Speaker 4: yourself stress? And what can you do about it? And
Speaker 4: then so the pH three So it has been let's see,
Speaker 4: we have the health types sort of framework, and we
Speaker 4: have the astrological framework, and I, honestly I don't try
Speaker 4: to overlap them at all. I tried for years to
Speaker 4: overlap like Chinese medicine, Chinese astrology and Western astrology, and
Speaker 4: I drove myself batshit crazy, like I was. I was.
Speaker 4: It's impossible. It's like trying to constantly compare French and
Speaker 4: German and see how they overlap root word wise and
Speaker 4: how they don't. And after a certain point you're like,
Speaker 4: who cares, Like, let this one be a language and
Speaker 4: this one be a language, right, So I don't really
Speaker 4: overlap them. What I do is I kind of dip
Speaker 4: in and out depending on how depends on what somebody needs.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 4: I have a feeling that over over the course of time,
Speaker 4: I will start to seem more overlap, especially in the
Speaker 4: psychological profile parts of the gauge three sixty. You know,
Speaker 4: there's really interesting psychological insights and reflections. Yeah, but I
Speaker 4: don't see any overlap between say, like you know, all
Speaker 4: diplomats tend to be Taurus and Capricorn. I don't see
Speaker 4: that at all. I see every possible element being represented
Speaker 4: in the precision health types, and it doesn't seem to
Speaker 4: correlate really. So that's not to say that it doesn't somewhere,
Speaker 4: but I haven't I haven't cracked it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, does it give you.
Speaker 3: More clarity or is it like, how do you know
Speaker 3: which of the two to lean into when you're dealing
Speaker 3: with somebody? Or is it is it personality wise that
Speaker 3: dictates which of the two modalities you want to speak
Speaker 3: to more.
Speaker 4: Uh. Now, it's it's pretty much like what's someone looking
Speaker 4: for in my coaching. So if they've got like for
Speaker 4: my weight loss clients, I'm I use pH three point
Speaker 4: I sort of point them to pH three sixty much
Speaker 4: more right. We have a lot to look at in
Speaker 4: the natal chart, but when it comes to figuring out
Speaker 4: like what foods are right for somebody, we go to
Speaker 4: pH three sixty or movement like the natal chart will say.
Speaker 4: The natal chart will say you need to move, you
Speaker 4: need to move, and you need to move your big
Speaker 4: muscle groups like like thighs and glutes and like. I
Speaker 4: can see that in the natal chart, but pH three
Speaker 4: sixty is going to get much more detailed about your
Speaker 4: whole your whole body and different ways to move it. Right,
Speaker 4: Because I'm not a trainer, so I'm not going to
Speaker 4: try to advise someone from natal chart you know, how
Speaker 4: they should move their body. And I'm also non a nutritionist,
Speaker 4: so I probably could pass an exam in mind at
Speaker 4: this point, but I'd mean much more comfortable pointing someone
Speaker 4: to the pH three sixty so they can individualize their
Speaker 4: diet as opposed to a natal chart where I could say,
Speaker 4: you know, you have a sweet tooth problem. It's just
Speaker 4: baked in, like it's in your nature, like loving sweets,
Speaker 4: loving carbs, the sort of hormonal things like this is
Speaker 4: in your nature. And I can sort of describe pretty
Speaker 4: intricately why that is and what it looks like behaviorally.
Speaker 4: But we go over to pH three sixty if we
Speaker 4: really want to do something about it and they have
Speaker 4: some support in their pocket, yeah, so I you know,
Speaker 4: and if someone doesn't really have you know, a lot
Speaker 4: of people have their health pretty well dialed in, you know,
Speaker 4: not everyone needs a health coach, so they're gonna you know,
Speaker 4: I have one client who's I mean, I think she
Speaker 4: only opened up pH three six to the Shay app
Speaker 4: to figure out her chronobiology because we're working on her sleep,
Speaker 4: but everything else she's like, I got that right. She's
Speaker 4: got the diet part, she's got the exercise, you know,
Speaker 4: she's but she's not sleeping. So did that answer your question?
Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah?
Speaker 3: What are some surprising for us not fluent in astrology?
Speaker 3: It is definitely me and I'm sure a lot of listeners.
Speaker 3: What are some things that it can help with God
Speaker 3: with What do people get out of it that, yeah,
Speaker 3: that might surprise us.
Speaker 4: Okay, so I don't know what will surprise people, but
Speaker 4: I can just tell you that.
Speaker 2: I'm just tell us all of the things.
Speaker 4: Yeah, so you can use this magical wheel. I'm sure
Speaker 4: everyone has at least seeing the circle with all the
Speaker 4: little pie pieces and all the little symbols that scatter around.
Speaker 4: You can use that in pretty much any possible way
Speaker 4: or you know, life contexts that you want. There are
Speaker 4: financial astrologers that there are people that work the stock
Speaker 4: market according to astrology. I don't know how to do. Yeah,
Speaker 4: here are people that you can use astrology to understand
Speaker 4: world events. You can use astrology to you can literally
Speaker 4: use it to understand like this conversation we could have.
Speaker 4: I could pull up a chart and be like, Okay,
Speaker 4: what's really going on with this conversation, what's the nature
Speaker 4: of it? If I want to understand like a moment
Speaker 4: in time. But for the work I do, most people
Speaker 4: find their way into a consultation with me because because
Speaker 4: of a handful of things, they're at a life stage
Speaker 4: where they feel that things are changing and they don't
Speaker 4: know what's next, and there's this sort of sense of
Speaker 4: uncertainty and question about the where am I going? Right?
Speaker 4: So I call it having a case of the in betweens,
Speaker 4: and someone's neither here nor there and is trying to
Speaker 4: get some a sense of grounding or where they are,
Speaker 4: because sometimes, you know, we go through periods of time
Speaker 4: that are confusing and ungrounding, and so astrology does a
Speaker 4: really good job of saying this thing, this period of
Speaker 4: time will last for X amount of weeks, months, years,
Speaker 4: blah blah blah, blah blah. It'll give someone a sense
Speaker 4: of not being in indefinite uncertainty. So I can I
Speaker 4: can say, And I can also tell someone not me.
Speaker 4: Any astrologer, if you know they know what they're doing well,
Speaker 4: can tell someone this is the reason, this is the
Speaker 4: this is the nature of what you're meant to be
Speaker 4: experiencing right now, whether it's some kind of loss or
Speaker 4: confusion or breakup or addiction or you know, frustration, whatever,
Speaker 4: whatever life experiences. We can we can frame it in
Speaker 4: the context that's evolutionary, meaning everybody came in to work
Speaker 4: out how to use this whole magical set of symbols
Speaker 4: in a very highly conscious way. And so but we
Speaker 4: don't have to do we don't get to perfect the
Speaker 4: whole thing all at once. Thank god. I mean that
Speaker 4: would be really crazy, right, we have life stages here
Speaker 4: verse we're fifteen and we have all the awkwardness of that,
Speaker 4: but then hopefully we have a couple of victories, and
Speaker 4: then we get to be seventeen and then twenty one,
Speaker 4: and along the way we're unfolding ourselves. So astrology maps
Speaker 4: this unfolding really nicely, and we unfold our entire life,
Speaker 4: where just our whole life is. This is a never
Speaker 4: ending cycle made up of smaller cycles. And when those
Speaker 4: are described for somebody, they kind of know where they
Speaker 4: are in that cycle. They know where they are in
Speaker 4: time and space, and so they can get more grounded
Speaker 4: so that you can find your life. Purpose is a
Speaker 4: big you know, that's a big buzzword or term, right.
Speaker 4: Everyone wants their purpose to find meaning in their life
Speaker 4: or their work. Relationships are a big topic of how
Speaker 4: to have better relationships, whether that's with a romantic partner
Speaker 4: or finding a romantic partner, you know what. That process
Speaker 4: isn't always a straight line for people to put it
Speaker 4: wildly now, for how to get along with their children,
Speaker 4: But some of my favorite work is working with parents
Speaker 4: to sort of point out and be like, hey, hey,
Speaker 4: this person is not you like you know, and that
Speaker 4: is like like, oh my god, they aren't. I'm like, no,
Speaker 4: they are so different. They have different needs. They're little.
Speaker 4: These are little people with different needs, and this is
Speaker 4: what it looks like when they're quiet, when they're talkative,
Speaker 4: when they're frustrated. And it's a very helpful map for parenting,
Speaker 4: great for couples. Let's see what else you know. You
Speaker 4: can use it to figure out where to live. There's
Speaker 4: a thing called astrocartography or astrolocation, and you can use
Speaker 4: your natal chart to learn about your relationship to every
Speaker 4: single piece of the globe and how each little piece
Speaker 4: of this Earth's land like relates to you, you specifically
Speaker 4: as opposed to me. Like it'll explain or give like
Speaker 4: really really yeah, it can give very good explanation for
Speaker 4: why you feel a certain way on certain land or
Speaker 4: why you really had like a terrible relationship you know
Speaker 4: when you went to this peninsula over here. It's because
Speaker 4: we have we have connection to everything. It's it's really
Speaker 4: I mean, I guess one of the things I would
Speaker 4: say about astrology is it's the it's the study of relationships.
Speaker 4: It's our relationship to the planets, the planet's relationship to
Speaker 4: each other, as that's reflected in us our and our
Speaker 4: relationship to other people, and our relationship to the land
Speaker 4: that we stand on, and so it describes all of
Speaker 4: these relationships visually.
Speaker 2: It's so fascinating to me.
Speaker 3: I'm such a sometimes way too deep thinker, So as
Speaker 3: you're talking, I'm like just imagining just how this whole
Speaker 3: system gets developed. But it reminds me of just even
Speaker 3: Petry sixty when I first came across that and explored
Speaker 3: it and did the course, and.
Speaker 2: Just the power in understanding.
Speaker 3: So in a world where we now more than ever
Speaker 3: are faced with constant comparison and subliminal messaging about should
Speaker 3: would and what life is and what you should chase
Speaker 3: and who you need to be to be in the world,
Speaker 3: I just remember at that time learning about my health
Speaker 3: type and my personality type, and just almost this visceral
Speaker 3: sense of relief in going, oh, not only are some
Speaker 3: of these things that I've been internally subconsciously judged about
Speaker 3: myself as a negative, Not only are they not negative,
Speaker 3: They're actually a gift, Like this is a part of
Speaker 3: me and I fall back on that all the time,
Speaker 3: even just in business of going well as a business,
Speaker 3: I should be doing this, and I'm not doing it,
Speaker 3: so I should be. And then you start to wrestle
Speaker 3: in and trying to overrule yourself. And then I'll go
Speaker 3: back to some of these personality profiling tools and just
Speaker 3: be like, oh, like one of them I think I
Speaker 3: was looking at.
Speaker 2: I was playing with the life Path number recently. So
Speaker 2: I had Daniel Millman.
Speaker 3: On my show years and years ago, and I had
Speaker 3: no idea his work. And then for some reason, the
Speaker 3: one of his books came up in conversation with three
Speaker 3: different people at a certain time, and I was like, oh,
Speaker 3: I've I didn't know, like, I've interviewed that bloke. And
Speaker 3: then so I went back and read that book and
Speaker 3: I was like, oh, that's really interesting. So I was
Speaker 3: looking at that, looking at how it overlays with human design,
Speaker 3: looking at how it overlays with being an activated and
Speaker 3: looking at my traits and just going One of the
Speaker 3: things I was trying to squeeze into my business was
Speaker 3: this like being continuous and having programs locked in, and
Speaker 3: it was like, it's not in my nature. It's like
Speaker 3: like one of like I was putting stuff in chat
Speaker 3: GPGGO and help me figure. It's like this is these
Speaker 3: are my profiles here, tell me a bit about how
Speaker 3: it's working out for me. And it was just literally like,
Speaker 3: don't do that, don't do that, like got you go
Speaker 3: where you're energy. And I was like reinforcing what I
Speaker 3: would say anyway, but what felt like me just being petulant,
Speaker 3: like child like I don't want to dig that. But
Speaker 3: it was like, you don't, don't do it, and I'm like, oh,
Speaker 3: yay for me, but also, bloody hell, it's really hard
Speaker 3: to run a business.
Speaker 4: But isn't that bring to have an appreciation for I mean,
Speaker 4: that's that's that's truly what drew me to astrology was
Speaker 4: that it celebrates the diversity of human experience, Like we
Speaker 4: all have like such a wildly like vastly different experience
Speaker 4: of every single moment. Yeah, and if we don't appreciate
Speaker 4: that about ourselves at least, we can't really appreciate that
Speaker 4: about somebody else.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Right, It's like we have this epidemic of sort of
Speaker 4: assumption and judgment and narcissism and it's all it's all
Speaker 4: just because people don't know them their own selves, because
Speaker 4: we would never expect people to behave according to our
Speaker 4: expectations if we had a little more consciousness about our
Speaker 4: own gifts and weaknesses and struggles, and we're kind of
Speaker 4: like okay with all of it, Like are we really?
Speaker 4: I don't think anyone expects themselves really to be amazing
Speaker 4: at everything, but we sort of get this idea that
Speaker 4: we have to pretend to be ray.
Speaker 3: I've seen myself and other people like you can wrestle
Speaker 3: yourself into a way of being for an amount of
Speaker 3: time and get a short term result. Like I've had
Speaker 3: pH three sixty clients that have been so ingrained to
Speaker 3: the way of eating and training in chronobiology, and I'm like,
Speaker 3: that's cool, that'll work, and you can look like a
Speaker 3: bodybuilder for five minutes, but in six months, twelve months,
Speaker 3: two years, whatever it is, you will be so far
Speaker 3: on the other side of that that you will spend
Speaker 3: far more time trying to fix what you've now broken. Like, yes,
Speaker 3: your body will respond and you can look like that,
Speaker 3: but what's happening underneath the surface And it's the same
Speaker 3: thing as like if I try to be too structure
Speaker 3: and routine and locked in with not like it took
Speaker 3: me forty years.
Speaker 2: I'd already nailed half of That's what I think in
Speaker 2: the beauty of this stuff was.
Speaker 3: For me. It proved I'd already found out a lot
Speaker 3: about how I need to be, but was still internally
Speaker 3: grappling with the fact that I was that. And it
Speaker 3: was like, it took me forty years to realize how
Speaker 3: much spontaneity and variety I needed in my working life
Speaker 3: in order to just fucking not hate it and have
Speaker 3: to move on every five minutes. It's like, I need
Speaker 3: to do a little bit of this and have a
Speaker 3: little bit of chaos, and then I have to have
Speaker 3: a little bit of structured routine and then that works
Speaker 3: really well. But you know, prior to that, I look
Speaker 3: at my resume and it was like three years in jobs,
Speaker 3: and I know that the last year and a half
Speaker 3: I was itching for change because it was too monotonous,
Speaker 3: because there wasn't enough variety. There wasn't enough stuff there
Speaker 3: to keep me. But yeah, it's interesting to.
Speaker 4: Me and how different the experience of awning that those traits.
Speaker 4: You know, it's it just it'll change your experience of
Speaker 4: any experience, like it'll just if you know if you
Speaker 4: know why you're sticking with something, like take you, for example,
Speaker 4: what you just described. If you if you know why
Speaker 4: you're sticking with something, even though it doesn't feel like
Speaker 4: what you know, like it's in your best interest, like
Speaker 4: you're it doesn't feel like that's what your nature is craving,
Speaker 4: but you know that you're doing it for these other
Speaker 4: reasons your values or you know, your long term goals
Speaker 4: or to prove something to yourself, Like those are valid reasons,
Speaker 4: then you'll stick with the thing. Or you know that
Speaker 4: this thing that you're trying to make yourself stick with
Speaker 4: isn't going to deliver what it promises to deliver on
Speaker 4: the level of values or long term goal or proving
Speaker 4: something to yourself, then you'll know, like it's okay to leave. Yeah,
Speaker 4: Like it's it's never just one thing. It's not just well,
Speaker 4: it's not in my nature to stick with something. It's
Speaker 4: like there is such a deeper description as opposed to
Speaker 4: like there's a deeper description for what what that's rooted
Speaker 4: in the need for change, like the need for change
Speaker 4: where at work, in relationships, friend groups. Do you need
Speaker 4: to travel, do you need to move your home a lot?
Speaker 4: Like like the need for change is. It's not just
Speaker 4: like a chaotic toxic quality. It's actually a prescription for
Speaker 4: healthy living in a like for you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it is interesting.
Speaker 3: Years ago I had gyms and I chose what ours
Speaker 3: I would be in those days, so I made the chooses.
Speaker 3: It was like, all right, TIF, Wendy want to be
Speaker 3: there and when don't you? So I picked that and
Speaker 3: within a month or two I felt so stuck by
Speaker 3: I hated it, right, I was like, oh, and that's
Speaker 3: one of the times I remember being this is before
Speaker 3: PHT sixty. I remember thinking, you're just broken, like you
Speaker 3: just you literally picked this the best possible outcome, like
Speaker 3: you dream day? Did you dream week of work? And
Speaker 3: now you hate it, like you're just an impossible human.
Speaker 3: And now when in terms of the PT clients I
Speaker 3: do have, which isn't it isn't a lot. Now I
Speaker 3: split my time over different things. But it's so funny
Speaker 3: because over the last five years they're all PT clients.
Speaker 3: They're not classes so and they're always at the same times,
Speaker 3: so it's the same situation playing out like but the
Speaker 3: feeling that.
Speaker 2: It's my choice and that.
Speaker 3: Each week I message them and agree to it and
Speaker 3: it's my choice. There's no, it's not me doing that
Speaker 3: for a class that needs to be that someone would
Speaker 3: need to feel and it's just my own obligation to me.
Speaker 3: And it's so weird that that feels so different to me.
Speaker 3: I remember thinking how that I don't know, like stress
Speaker 3: and irritation about it was completely removed when that was
Speaker 3: the only change that was made.
Speaker 2: It wasn't really about.
Speaker 3: The time that I was created to It was the
Speaker 3: sense of feeling trapped by someone that was someone that
Speaker 3: wasn't me.
Speaker 2: It wasn't just my decision every day.
Speaker 4: Yeah. I mean funny how human beings like freedom. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 4: we like to make our own choices. You know, although
Speaker 4: I shouldn't even say that, because there's some people that
Speaker 4: dislike to take orders because they don't they have a
Speaker 4: hard time making choices. I mean, I for every time
Speaker 4: I make a general assumption about human beings, I can
Speaker 4: I can make I can disagree with it the next Yeah, it's.
Speaker 2: How do you use it?
Speaker 3: Do you have practices that God you with With astrology?
Speaker 4: I mean I check my chart frequently to see how
Speaker 4: current astrological weather, the transits, the you know, the moving planets,
Speaker 4: how they're affecting me, or how they're what part of
Speaker 4: my natal chart is being you know, are being sort
Speaker 4: of lit up and activated because I want to. I
Speaker 4: try to stay conscious of the opportunities that might pose themselves.
Speaker 4: I really do. I think I use astrology my practice
Speaker 4: is to be constantly scanning for opportunity and possibility with it,
Speaker 4: because that's that's really how I see it. It's everything
Speaker 4: at all time. I don't care how hard the struggle is.
Speaker 4: There's there is a there is a there's an opportunity
Speaker 4: and a possibility for growth that's available always. And it
Speaker 4: might be you know, a little too much silver lining
Speaker 4: all the time for people. It doesn't mean I don't
Speaker 4: acknowledge the tough stuff, but I I I don't think
Speaker 4: that's like I don't believe in the good luck bad
Speaker 4: luck sort of language for astrology. I don't think there
Speaker 4: are any bad planets, there are no bad charts there.
Speaker 4: It's all just right for where we are and how
Speaker 4: we are evolving at every moment. So I just check
Speaker 4: in with my you know, on my phone or my
Speaker 4: computer to see what's up, and then I kind of
Speaker 4: look ahead to see what's coming up. Because I like
Speaker 4: to use it as a as a visioning tool, where
Speaker 4: you know, I want to I want to be sure
Speaker 4: that I don't squander certain opportunities by either not being
Speaker 4: aware of them or just being maybe like a little
Speaker 4: legacy or you know, I just I want to see
Speaker 4: what's available to me.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 4: And the good news is is that sometimes, you know,
Speaker 4: we do miss things, like we don't maximize things. I
Speaker 4: even I'll miss something. I'm like, oh, I didn't know
Speaker 4: that great thing was, you know, Jupiter was, you know,
Speaker 4: offering me this sort of position, you know, activating this
Speaker 4: in this way right now. But I can you still
Speaker 4: use it after the fact, you know, they don't go anywhere.
Speaker 4: The transits are work all connected to this constant cycle,
Speaker 4: this constant dance. We can become aware of something that
Speaker 4: happened last month and still use it, especially once it
Speaker 4: kind of explains a tone shift, you know in life,
Speaker 4: like oh, that's why I was such to Christmas or
Speaker 4: whatever it was, Like it would explain and validate, like
Speaker 4: it explains and validates sort of the experience we're already having,
Speaker 4: whether we're aware of it and can describe it for
Speaker 4: ourselves or not.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but we can then make some additional meaning. So
Speaker 4: that's how I use it. I use it to reflect
Speaker 4: and just to not miss not miss the good stuff.
Speaker 4: I want to maximize the powerful sort of windows of
Speaker 4: opportunity so I can try to be courageous and bust through.
Speaker 3: Even think that the idea that we can like hope
Speaker 3: and having something greater than us is such a human
Speaker 3: need at times, like the world can be when when
Speaker 3: we feel alone and like we're going through tough stuff,
Speaker 3: sometimes just too just to be able to believe in
Speaker 3: something that takes a little bit of the burden because.
Speaker 2: If you know, like.
Speaker 3: People hang shit on the whole unit, and so do
Speaker 3: I at times are they are in averse like just
Speaker 3: ask the universe. But sometimes it's like, well, if we
Speaker 3: can just believe that there's a purpose, there's a reason,
Speaker 3: if it can just take a little bit of the
Speaker 3: burden off of us which makes us feel stressed, then
Speaker 3: we were able to take action on things a little
Speaker 3: bit easier rather than feeling the weight of the world.
Speaker 4: Yeah. And I do think it has been that that
Speaker 4: terminology the universe has been woified, you know, but it
Speaker 4: does you know, I I mean, I think anyone who's
Speaker 4: made it this far in the conversation, it likely believes
Speaker 4: in something, right, like we have to believe in something.
Speaker 4: It's we have to believe in something ourselves are and
Speaker 4: what does that mean? Like is it just cells and
Speaker 4: fluids and you know, or is it is there something
Speaker 4: else flowing through us, like there is a divine intelligence
Speaker 4: to the to the world, running through everything, growing plants
Speaker 4: and creating the orbits and and I think that the
Speaker 4: idea of hope is that you brought up is really
Speaker 4: really important because it kind of cuts for me the
Speaker 4: heart of the heart of the matter of asking, like
Speaker 4: you know, when we're saying, like believe in the universe
Speaker 4: or ask the universe, you know, it's a for people
Speaker 4: who use that language are usually I would say, like
Speaker 4: avoiding the word God, which is fine because God has
Speaker 4: been so religified. I don't know if that's a word,
Speaker 4: but it is now. Yeah. So if you don't have
Speaker 4: if you don't follow a religion, but you still have
Speaker 4: to believe in some sort of intelligence running the show,
Speaker 4: it's going to boil down to kind of one of
Speaker 4: one of two beliefs. I think one is the You
Speaker 4: either believe that the universe is a chaotic dangerous place,
Speaker 4: or you believe that it's a benevolent place that has
Speaker 4: your best interests in its intelligent mind. Yeah, and I
Speaker 4: sort of think that's much more plausible seeing as how
Speaker 4: there is a natural order that is reliable. I know
Speaker 4: that the sun is going to rise tomorrow. I mean
Speaker 4: ninety nine point nine percent sure the sun is going
Speaker 4: to rise tomorrow. You know. I know that it's going
Speaker 4: to be summer here in the US on Friday, Like,
Speaker 4: I know that I can count on that cycle. So
Speaker 4: I think the universe is reliable and has its best
Speaker 4: interests at heart as far as how growth and life unfolds.
Speaker 4: And then the very next step of that is like,
Speaker 4: and we're a part of that life, natural world growth,
Speaker 4: We're not set from it. It's not humans and nature.
Speaker 4: It's I mean, it's not humans and nature separate. It's
Speaker 4: humans are nature. So I that's a very long winded
Speaker 4: way of saying I agree with you. But that's a rand,
Speaker 4: a long way of saying.
Speaker 3: Yes, good because I have a really long way of
Speaker 3: asking questions.
Speaker 2: I realize that. So when someone else.
Speaker 3: Takes the ball and runs with it, I feel seen
Speaker 3: and I feel validated.
Speaker 4: That's like Gemini rising having a field day. Yes, Hope
Speaker 4: is everything. It is. It's everything. We need it, especially today.
Speaker 4: You know, we need something, We need some We need
Speaker 4: a horizon to look at and say, you know what,
Speaker 4: I'm going to get there. I can get there. There
Speaker 4: is a there there right, that's hope.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 3: How can my listeners follow you and find you and
Speaker 3: learn more about you and what you do?
Speaker 4: Super easy? My with My website is Aubrey Thorn dot
Speaker 4: com and it's Aubrey not Audrey.
Speaker 2: Yes, Aubrey Marcus not Audrey Hipburn.
Speaker 4: There you go. So Aubrey Thorn dot com and I'm
Speaker 4: on Instagram at Aubrey Thorn. So those are the two
Speaker 4: easiest places to find me.
Speaker 2: Awesome, Well, thank you. You've been a star today.
Speaker 3: So what did that?
Speaker 4: Well, thanks, Jeff, I see what you did there, Mistress
Speaker 4: of puns.
Speaker 2: It's been fun and interesting.
Speaker 3: I feel like I'm going to go and get off
Speaker 3: and go down a little astrology rabbit hole now and.
Speaker 2: Get back into it. Yeah, we shaid, thank you so
Speaker 2: much for the conversation.
Speaker 4: Oh, thank you. I really appreciate you having me on
Speaker 4: to chat.
Speaker 1: She said, it's now never I got fighting in my blood.
Speaker 3: Got it. Quite a coast got it, got it hot
Speaker 3: a coast got it