Speaker 1: Today I'm recording on Gadigle Country. As part of the urination,
Speaker 1: I'd like to pay my respects to their elders, both
Speaker 1: past and present, and extend that respect all First Nations
Speaker 1: people listening today. I know you've gotta dig this.
Speaker 2: It's like I've.
Speaker 1: Been given like an extra sprinkle of something.
Speaker 3: You've got layers, Yeah, I've got layers.
Speaker 4: I was just.
Speaker 3: Thinking, I'm like, we're just such beautiful storytellers.
Speaker 1: You're making a lot of sense to that girl. No,
Speaker 1: I'm done to honest to go. Hey everyone, it's just
Speaker 1: Maddie today. And as you know, Mother's Day was on
Speaker 1: the weekend, so today I thought i'd do a very
Speaker 1: special episode with somebody who has been the mother figure
Speaker 1: in my life since I was very young.
Speaker 2: She isn't my.
Speaker 1: Biological mother, but she has done everything and more that
Speaker 1: a mother could. And her name is Pips. So we'll
Speaker 1: be getting into that conversation in a little bit, but
Speaker 1: before I do, I just wanted to tell you a
Speaker 1: little bit about my early life before I met Pip.
Speaker 1: There's been a bit of a journey, you know. I
Speaker 1: was born in the western suburbs of Sydney in a small,
Speaker 1: little town called Claymore. It's a part of a much
Speaker 1: bigger town called Campbelltown. So if you know where Campbelltown is,
Speaker 1: it's the poorest suburb in Campbelltown. As told by four Corners,
Speaker 1: I grew up in Claymore with my two brothers, Nathan
Speaker 1: and Aaron, my sister Kayla, and my mum Joanne, and
Speaker 1: we grew up in many different parts of this one suburb,
Speaker 1: continuously moving from house to house after eviction and eviction
Speaker 1: and eviction. I grew up with a mum who was
Speaker 1: mostly single during my childhood. My dad left when I
Speaker 1: was very young, before I even started school, before I
Speaker 1: even attended my first kindergarten class, my dad wasn't in
Speaker 1: the picture. Unfortunately, at that age, I don't have too
Speaker 1: many memories of my dad. I have a photo that
Speaker 1: is a memory of him, and he had long dreadlocks
Speaker 1: and is a very different image to how I now
Speaker 1: see my dad. But that photo meant a lot to
Speaker 1: me at the time because I would talk to the
Speaker 1: photo as if he were still around. But unfortunately, when
Speaker 1: I was very little, around the age of seven, I
Speaker 1: was told that my dad had passed away. And this
Speaker 1: was told to me by my mum, who at the
Speaker 1: time was struggling with her own issues, which included mental
Speaker 1: health issues, alcoholism, and drug addiction. My brothers and I
Speaker 1: spent a lot of our childhood hopping from home to home,
Speaker 1: and when we weren't in our own home, we were
Speaker 1: in women's refuges. And if you don't know what a
Speaker 1: women's refuge is, it is a place that women can
Speaker 1: go when they don't have a home for them and
Speaker 1: their children. It's normally filled with many different families that
Speaker 1: share this same experience. I have so many memories, including
Speaker 1: nine to eleven that very particular day, which is my
Speaker 1: mum's birthday. That memory for me was watching the screens
Speaker 1: from a woman's refuge. At that age, we were surrounded
Speaker 1: by a lot of alcohol, drug use, and trauma. I
Speaker 1: think when I was younger, there were so many moments
Speaker 1: in my life where I could see other moms in
Speaker 1: the community, but also my Auntie be nurturing and caring
Speaker 1: and loving towards their children in a way that made
Speaker 1: me feel like I was missing out on something. It
Speaker 1: made me feel like my mum wasn't able to give
Speaker 1: me what I needed. As I've gotten older, there's definitely
Speaker 1: become an understanding around that, and there's an empathetic nature
Speaker 1: to how I have a relationship with my mum now,
Speaker 1: because when you're a kid, you don't realize that adults
Speaker 1: aren't the superheroes you want them to be. They're not bulletproof,
Speaker 1: they're you know, human beings just like you, and one
Speaker 1: day you will realize that what they've gone through in
Speaker 1: their life impacts the way that they com parent and
Speaker 1: the way that they can be your mum or your dad.
Speaker 1: And unfortunately, for what my mum had been through, she
Speaker 1: wasn't able to be the mum that I needed. So
Speaker 1: after we moved from house to house, from women's refuge
Speaker 1: to women's refuge, my mom's mental health declined massively and
Speaker 1: unfortunately we were taken from my mum and put into
Speaker 1: the care system. So this included not just myself but
Speaker 1: my brothers, Nathan and Aaron, and at first we were
Speaker 1: taken and put into one home where we all lived together,
Speaker 1: and unfortunately that became too much of a burden for
Speaker 1: the care who was looking after us at the time,
Speaker 1: so we were split up. We were put into separate
Speaker 1: homes for the remainder of our time.
Speaker 2: In care.
Speaker 1: But during our time in care, there was a miracle
Speaker 1: that happened, and until this day, I still see it
Speaker 1: as almost a dream like moment. It was the moment
Speaker 1: that we were told as young kids that our dad
Speaker 1: was alive. We were missing our mum throughout our time
Speaker 1: in care and we didn't think too much about our
Speaker 1: dad because we thought there was no way that we
Speaker 1: would ever see him again because we were told that
Speaker 1: he had passed away. Little did we know this was
Speaker 1: the man who was going to come and save the
Speaker 1: day like a superhero in a kid's book or film.
Speaker 2: He did.
Speaker 1: He worked really hard for many years to get us
Speaker 1: out of the care system. Once we had moved with
Speaker 1: my dad, it was like all our dreams had come true.
Speaker 1: This man who was no longer alive came back from
Speaker 1: the dead and was able to look after his kids.
Speaker 1: But once we had moved back to Tamworth and on Country,
Speaker 1: we still had that missing part of ourselves, which was.
Speaker 3: The love of a mother.
Speaker 1: But luckily, there was somebody who came into our lives
Speaker 1: not too many years after this moment who filled that
Speaker 1: gap so amazingly, and her name is Pip. She came
Speaker 1: into our lives when I was at the end of
Speaker 1: primary school and she has been in my life ever since.
Speaker 1: She has filled that gap of a mother. She has
Speaker 1: given me the love and care and nurture of a mother,
Speaker 1: and she has been somebody who has been my stability
Speaker 1: since the day that I met her. She's had the
Speaker 1: most profound impact on my life. And I don't think
Speaker 1: that I would be anywhere close to where I am
Speaker 1: at in my life right now if she didn't walk
Speaker 1: into my life. And today I feel so excited because
Speaker 1: I get to share with you our story of how
Speaker 1: we met, our journey and what it's taken to get
Speaker 1: me through my life to this point, and how extremely
Speaker 1: grateful I am for having this person in my life.
Speaker 1: And she is here today. So please welcome the incredible PIP.
Speaker 3: Thanks Maddie. Glad to be here, Happy to be here.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm so excited to be able to have you
Speaker 1: on the podcast. Obviously, you came into my life now
Speaker 1: twenty years ago, and that seems like a lifetime. You know,
Speaker 1: it's for somebody, but it seems like such a long
Speaker 1: time ago, and I can't I don't have too many
Speaker 1: memories of my life without you in it. Now that
Speaker 1: I'm you know, thirty years old.
Speaker 3: How did we get here?
Speaker 2: How did we get here? It has been a journey.
Speaker 1: I wanted to have you on the podcast because this
Speaker 1: is a Mother's Day episode and you've obviously come into
Speaker 1: my life at a very young age, and you've been
Speaker 1: the mother figure since you know, I was around ten
Speaker 1: years old. Wow, which is, you know, a long time ago.
Speaker 1: And I know that it didn't start off with you
Speaker 1: coming in as the mother figure, and it wasn't something
Speaker 1: that you know, any of us imagined this relationship would
Speaker 1: be like. But I think this is a conversation to
Speaker 1: have on the podcast because I think there are many
Speaker 1: kids out there that maybe are in the same circumstances
Speaker 1: or have disconnection with their biological parents, and somebody else
Speaker 1: has come into their life, filled that gap and supported
Speaker 1: them through their life and got them to a part
Speaker 1: a part of their journey that you know, is normally
Speaker 1: what a parent would do, or a mum would do,
Speaker 1: or a dad would do. But sometimes they're not biological
Speaker 1: to us. Sometimes they're our foster cares. Sometimes they are
Speaker 1: people who just genuinely care about us. Sometimes it's our
Speaker 1: auntie's uncle's grandparents. So the word mother, I think has
Speaker 1: many different m you know it can it can, it
Speaker 1: can have many different people take on that role. It
Speaker 1: doesn't have to be your biological mum. But I wanted
Speaker 1: to talk to you about, you know, our journey, our relationship.
Speaker 1: And I want to go back to the start because
Speaker 1: I met you through Sunday School. You did and when
Speaker 1: we were younger, what was your initial memory of me?
Speaker 2: Actually, I want to know that question. When did you
Speaker 2: what's your first memory of me?
Speaker 4: I remember you at Sunday School being very curious, very inquisitive,
Speaker 4: wanting to know, always asking questions, constantly asking questions and
Speaker 4: wanting to know more, and then just wanting to expand
Speaker 4: your horizon basically away from where you were.
Speaker 3: And so it was just who.
Speaker 4: You were, an inquisitive, curious child who really stayed with
Speaker 4: me all the time. After we'd finished Sunday School, you'd
Speaker 4: be there waiting for the bus and you'd be the
Speaker 4: last one on because you'd be asking questions.
Speaker 3: So where do you come from? Where do you live?
Speaker 3: Can I come up to your place?
Speaker 4: So many questions and I'd say no, that would be
Speaker 4: abduction because I don't know your mom and dad. And
Speaker 4: then I remember the first day you said, but I
Speaker 4: can get permission from my dad, and I said, well,
Speaker 4: I would have to meet your dad.
Speaker 3: I'd have to go to your house and Dad might
Speaker 3: not be happy about that totally. So you went home
Speaker 3: and asked your.
Speaker 4: Dad if I could come round to your house, which
Speaker 4: I did about two weeks And I.
Speaker 3: Remember that really clearly.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and your dad and I met and we really
Speaker 4: got on well from day one and we still do.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: He said something to me just on the weekend as
Speaker 1: I was home, and he said, he is so grateful
Speaker 1: for what you've been able to do for his kids,
Speaker 1: because it's not just me, it's my brothers, but also
Speaker 1: you know, the wider family. The amount of impact and
Speaker 1: positive input that you've had in our lives is just astronomical.
Speaker 1: I don't think we'd be anywhere near where we are
Speaker 1: if it wasn't for you.
Speaker 3: And that was a positive effect.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 1: No, Dad really recognizes the amount of love and nurturing
Speaker 1: care that you've put in over the years. And he
Speaker 1: said that to me on the weekend, and I thought,
Speaker 1: I know that you know that because there's been many
Speaker 1: times where he's mentioned it to you and said to
Speaker 1: you that he's so grateful and so happy that you've
Speaker 1: come into our lives. But I also think that he
Speaker 1: to say that to us is also super important because
Speaker 1: I believe that sometimes over the years you've actually taken
Speaker 1: on the role of both parents for me, you know,
Speaker 1: as much as because we've also been in the same city.
Speaker 1: You know, you've you took me through boarding school and
Speaker 1: that whole process, and with Dad, you know, supporting on
Speaker 1: the wings and always giving the approval and always and your.
Speaker 3: Dad always did give approval. He was so good.
Speaker 4: And that that's why I respect your dad so much,
Speaker 4: because he recognized the fact that he couldn't be looking out,
Speaker 4: that he could not look after you, and he was
Speaker 4: the one who said, please look after my boys, and
Speaker 4: I trust you and I know you'll never harm them. Yeah,
Speaker 4: And to say that to somebody who really had only
Speaker 4: met probably for a year, and that you could have
Speaker 4: decision rights and make decisions on their behalf, on behalf
Speaker 4: of him was of that was a huge thing.
Speaker 3: For your dad to do.
Speaker 1: Totally recognizing how much gratitude Dad has for the impact
Speaker 1: you've had on our lives is something very special to
Speaker 1: me because we know my dad's heart and we know
Speaker 1: he's a good man, and he's somebody who would want
Speaker 1: to do as much as he can for his kids,
Speaker 1: and unfortunately, for many different reasons, he hasn't been able
Speaker 1: to contribute in a way that you've been able to.
Speaker 1: And I think that you know, recognizing that Dad is
Speaker 1: grateful and so thankful that you've been able to, you know,
Speaker 1: really take on that role is amazing.
Speaker 2: It did.
Speaker 1: When I wanted to ask when you were working in
Speaker 1: Sunday School and Children's Church, did did you because you
Speaker 1: started off as a preschool director? Yes, I did, And
Speaker 1: so did your passion always revolve around children?
Speaker 3: Yes?
Speaker 4: Over the years I developed more and more passion towards children.
Speaker 4: And because I had experienced so many children and their
Speaker 4: backgrounds and their parents and all the traumas and all
Speaker 4: the things that happened to kids and parents, I just
Speaker 4: developed a real interest in helping. So that's why I
Speaker 4: went to Sunday School in the area that you were
Speaker 4: living and not my own area, because there was a
Speaker 4: call out to people anyone in Townworth to go if
Speaker 4: they could to help at the Sunday School there. Somebody
Speaker 4: bought a bus and they were picking kids up from
Speaker 4: all around cold Ale and providing that as a free service,
Speaker 4: and a lot of people were doing some good things there,
Speaker 4: and I thought.
Speaker 3: Yeah, this would be a really good thing to do.
Speaker 4: And then the more I got to know you and
Speaker 4: your family and your siblings, and your dad was saying,
Speaker 4: take the boys, do whatever, take them to the farm,
Speaker 4: give them the experiences.
Speaker 3: That's how our relationship developed.
Speaker 4: I always talked about what we were I was going
Speaker 4: to do, and I would always get his permission, but
Speaker 4: he didn't ever say no. Yeah, and I really respect
Speaker 4: your dad for that because he wanted the best for
Speaker 4: you even though he could not give you.
Speaker 3: The best at that time. Yeah, So he was amazing.
Speaker 1: I mean it's I love dad for that. I love
Speaker 1: that dad has an openness and are willing to not
Speaker 1: you know, he doesn't have any ego, which I think
Speaker 1: is amazing because some parents might feel like, oh well,
Speaker 1: if I can't do it, nobody else should.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, but he.
Speaker 2: Never had that no, you know, he never had.
Speaker 1: That viewpoint, which which I love. But you know, I
Speaker 1: think so our for the people who are listening. Pip
Speaker 1: and Ized relationships started when I was around ten years old,
Speaker 1: and she also was taking my older brother to youth
Speaker 1: group on a Friday afternoon with a number of other
Speaker 1: kids in the community, and it was a way to
Speaker 1: keep the kids, you know, occupied, but also connect than
Speaker 1: with church and it was such a fun time for
Speaker 1: us as kids, you know. I remember I was too
Speaker 1: young at one point and I was nagging every time
Speaker 1: you would come and pick up Nathan. I would be
Speaker 1: at the front door and I would say, Hey, when
Speaker 1: can I come? When can I come? And you had
Speaker 1: to be in high school. And so the moment I
Speaker 1: got into high school, I was able to take part in,
Speaker 1: you know, the youth group on a Friday, and then
Speaker 1: we would go to the Saint Peter's on a Sunday night.
Speaker 1: And those two moments in the week are such highlights
Speaker 1: for me growing up because it took us outside of
Speaker 1: our own community in terms of the experience, you know,
Speaker 1: having a different experience outside of our own community, but
Speaker 1: also allowed us to connect, you know, with God. And
Speaker 1: I think that that was such such a a refreshing
Speaker 1: thing for us as kids, because I know my dad's
Speaker 1: connection with God, you know, he told me about when
Speaker 1: he was growing up in and the connection that he
Speaker 1: had with Sunday school and great memories that he had
Speaker 1: through his mom, through his mum, that's right through my
Speaker 1: nan Irene. So he has such great memories of going
Speaker 1: to Sunday School and always feeling you know, connected to God.
Speaker 1: And I think that's something that you brought into our
Speaker 1: lives that I don't think many people would.
Speaker 3: Know about me. No, they probably do know they don't
Speaker 3: a man of faith.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So it's it's it's.
Speaker 1: Something that you know, I've had you know, ups and
Speaker 1: downs with in terms of that relationship with God over
Speaker 1: the years. And I think that there's been moments where
Speaker 1: I felt really strongly connected to my faith, and there's
Speaker 1: been moments where I felt like I was maybe lost
Speaker 1: and had other priorities.
Speaker 3: So which you did?
Speaker 2: Which I did?
Speaker 1: Yes, basically all of my twenties, you know, I was
Speaker 1: they go where they're about to leave, aren't they? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm about sent thirty. I wanted to talk about some
Speaker 1: of the major milestones that we've achieved together in our relationship,
Speaker 1: and one of them was going off to boarding school.
Speaker 1: And this was such a big moment in my life.
Speaker 1: It changed my life. It was, you know, a tough
Speaker 1: journey for both me and I would say, you know,
Speaker 1: it was something that I was the first ever Indigenous
Speaker 1: kid to attend this boarding school, so the Shaw School, And.
Speaker 2: This was in two thousand and nine, and.
Speaker 1: I want to tell the listeners or tell our audience
Speaker 1: how that moment came about. And it was a moment
Speaker 1: that we went and visited the boarding school's exposition in Tentworth.
Speaker 1: And do you want to tell us about that day?
Speaker 4: Okay, Well, there was a boarding school expo in Tamworth.
Speaker 4: All the private schools came from Sydney and Brisbane and
Speaker 4: Orange and different rural areas too, and I decided I
Speaker 4: would go down there because I really felt that I
Speaker 4: should do that.
Speaker 3: And I just chatted to some of the.
Speaker 4: Schools down there and I inquired about whether there were
Speaker 4: any scholarships for Indigenous children. And I spoke to Shaw
Speaker 4: School and they and I said, I have a child.
Speaker 4: He's not mine, I have no money, and he's black,
Speaker 4: and I would like to.
Speaker 2: Give him an opportunity to go to a boarding School's.
Speaker 3: Right, And I had our dad.
Speaker 4: We'd consulted and Dad said yes, he thought it was
Speaker 4: a good idea. So anyway, they said no, they didn't
Speaker 4: have any and then I walked away. And then as
Speaker 4: I walked away. The head of boarding was one of
Speaker 4: the teachers there, and he came back and he said, look,
Speaker 4: we have talked about this at school, so I'll go
Speaker 4: back and I'll talk to the principal. And then we
Speaker 4: didn't hear for a couple of months, so we thought
Speaker 4: that was not going to happen. And then I had
Speaker 4: a call and they said, bring him for an interview.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And we went down in our Sunday best Yes,
Speaker 1: we're dad, we' dad, and I did a bit of
Speaker 1: a speech, you know, in front of who was it
Speaker 1: was it the board principal and a few hours board members,
Speaker 1: and they got to know me. I remember where it was.
Speaker 1: It was above the dining hall in the in the
Speaker 1: boarding area, and I remember that moment. It was such
Speaker 1: a turning point in my life, you know. And I
Speaker 1: was constantly looking for an out. And what I mean
Speaker 1: by an out is broader horizons.
Speaker 3: And a better situation, and a better situation.
Speaker 1: You're right. I was constantly battling the path to go down,
Speaker 1: what path I should go down, because I was wanting
Speaker 1: to do good. I always wanted to better my circumstances
Speaker 1: but also change my life. Break cycles that I had
Speaker 1: seen in my world. But I was also a teenager,
Speaker 1: and there was a lot of you know, opportunity to
Speaker 1: go down.
Speaker 3: The wrong path, a lot of influence, a lot of influence.
Speaker 1: And I knew that if I was to stay in
Speaker 1: the community that I was growing up in, that maybe
Speaker 1: I wouldn't be able to achieve what I've achieved at
Speaker 1: this point, and maybe I would have gone down the
Speaker 1: road that we see so many young people go down,
Speaker 1: you know, the tough road, the challenges that are faced
Speaker 1: by many young people in rural and remote communities, especially
Speaker 1: First Nations mob And I didn't want that for myself.
Speaker 2: You didn't.
Speaker 4: You had a firm grip on that idea, and you
Speaker 4: stuck to that through thick and thin, the bad times
Speaker 4: and good times.
Speaker 3: You kept that dream alive.
Speaker 2: I did.
Speaker 1: And even when we were told that my grades needed
Speaker 1: to improve, I remember, yes, you know, we had sent
Speaker 1: at my report cards and they said, well, you know,
Speaker 1: the grades aren't as great as they would like. And
Speaker 1: I remember going.
Speaker 3: I've forgotten that bit.
Speaker 1: There I did, and I went and improved all my grades.
Speaker 1: You know, I won all the awards at the end
Speaker 1: of the year at Peel High and I won the
Speaker 1: Student of the Year award I won. There were a
Speaker 1: few awards that I won at that assembly, and it
Speaker 1: was all because I went from basically getting d's and
Speaker 1: e's to I went and got a's and b's. And
Speaker 1: it was because I applied myself and I saw that
Speaker 1: I had a goal on the horizon. I was working
Speaker 1: towards something. And I think I've taken that way of
Speaker 1: approaching life and I've refound it recently where I've been
Speaker 1: able to implement goals and see something that I'm working
Speaker 1: towards and I know that that worked for me. Then
Speaker 1: you know it did, And I was able to get
Speaker 1: a scholarship and moved to Sydney and attend Shore for
Speaker 1: four years. And it wasn't easy. You know, I was
Speaker 1: the guinea pig.
Speaker 5: Absolutely, It was definitely the guinea pig. What the school
Speaker 5: was also the guinea pig totally. What were some of
Speaker 5: your memories of me in boarding school? What was challenging
Speaker 5: for you during that time.
Speaker 4: I think I knew more more than probably you knew
Speaker 4: about what you were getting up to at boarding school.
Speaker 4: That was a challenging because it was so difficult because
Speaker 4: I didn't want to control you I didn't want to
Speaker 4: stop you from being your indigenous person and your white
Speaker 4: person the blend. And I didn't want And I thought, oh,
Speaker 4: if he's going out of school, and he shouldn't, he's
Speaker 4: probably just going walk about.
Speaker 3: You knows how to look after him. He'll go back.
Speaker 3: And I used to have justify all.
Speaker 4: These things in my head to enable me to cope
Speaker 4: with all the different stories that I was hearing. And
Speaker 4: so that was interesting and just I would look at
Speaker 4: him coming out of the boarding school and I think, oh, he's.
Speaker 2: So different totally.
Speaker 1: I was not like anyone else in that school. I
Speaker 1: remember always feeling different. I felt like I had to
Speaker 1: make up stories about my family and what my dad did,
Speaker 1: and what's right?
Speaker 3: You pretended your dad was somebody totally different.
Speaker 1: I pretended that he was a detective, and I said
Speaker 1: I couldn't talk about his work. You know what a
Speaker 1: crazy little story that, you know, But this is what
Speaker 1: happens when teenagers feel out of places. They try to
Speaker 1: do anything they can to be accepted. And I remember
Speaker 1: that everyone else they called themselves the one percenters. You know,
Speaker 1: some of these boys, but their parents were lawyers, doctors, QCs.
Speaker 3: Very wealthy, very well, everything had.
Speaker 1: Everything multimillion dollar farm holders, so farmers and the you know,
Speaker 1: the people that I was surrounded by were completely different
Speaker 1: to the people who were in my lounger in my
Speaker 1: home when I went home in the school holidays. So
Speaker 1: I was living a double life.
Speaker 3: Absolutely was.
Speaker 4: But you know, I didn't know a lot of that,
Speaker 4: probably thankfully, yes, And I probably didn't realize how traumatic
Speaker 4: that was for Maddie because he's such a people person
Speaker 4: and able to present so well.
Speaker 1: Yeah, a bit of a people pleaser as well, and
Speaker 1: people please.
Speaker 4: Yeah, you were just trying to fit in, as every
Speaker 4: teenager is. So we could tell you a hundred stories,
Speaker 4: but we won't tell them today.
Speaker 1: But I remember some great moments during that time, and
Speaker 1: that was you know, us as a team, really, you know,
Speaker 1: working with the school to break down barriers. Absolutely, and
Speaker 1: now there are four scholarships a year that get to
Speaker 1: go to this school. I feel like it should be
Speaker 1: called the Philip A. Powell Scholarship because you know, you
Speaker 1: were so pivotal in making this happen for me, and
Speaker 1: I also believed that we create a change in the
Speaker 1: art space.
Speaker 3: Oh totally.
Speaker 4: I think that was a major breakthrough for sure, well
Speaker 4: for you and for other boys hopefully, because going outside
Speaker 4: of school, to go in musicals and plays with Queenwood
Speaker 4: in particular, that had never been allowed before allowed. And
Speaker 4: then the principal, doctor Wright, he was great, he was great,
Speaker 4: and he and I said, look, additionally, Aboriginals dance, they sing,
Speaker 4: they communicate in all these different ways. Not they didn't write,
Speaker 4: They had all sorts of other languages. And he took
Speaker 4: that on board and he agreed that Matt could go
Speaker 4: and be involved in the artistic, you know, areas of
Speaker 4: life in other places outside the school. And after that
Speaker 4: year other boys were also allowed to do it, white
Speaker 4: boys and the black.
Speaker 1: Boys, both all of us, because it was it was
Speaker 1: something that we pushed for and had changed in the school.
Speaker 2: And it was.
Speaker 1: This change is what created my dream, you know, to
Speaker 1: be an actor, and it went and to be in
Speaker 1: this industry. So now I'm living my dream. I get
Speaker 1: to do exactly what I want to be doing when
Speaker 1: I wake up, I get to go to work and
Speaker 1: enjoy every moment of it. And that's because the seeds
Speaker 1: were planted during that time at school, you know, the
Speaker 1: creative arts. So I'm so grateful for that and I'm
Speaker 1: really thankful for all the effort you put in, especially
Speaker 1: you know, whether it was financial, emotional, it were there
Speaker 1: was there's so much that you've done during that time,
Speaker 1: those pivotal years of growing up that I look back
Speaker 1: now and that I'm in a place, a place where
Speaker 1: i can be reflective and I look back on those
Speaker 1: which is great. Yeah, and I'm more clear about how
Speaker 1: much that you put in, the effort you put in,
Speaker 1: you know, I'm very grateful for everything you did during
Speaker 1: that time and beyond school. You know, you were there
Speaker 1: on the weekends to take me to sport, you would
Speaker 1: pick me up and take me to rehearsals. Everything that
Speaker 1: could a kid could have in a parent or a
Speaker 1: mum you gave me.
Speaker 2: And that's really.
Speaker 1: Really something that I will forever be grateful for, and
Speaker 1: especially during those those years, because there's no way I
Speaker 1: would have been able to achieve anything that I've achieved
Speaker 1: at this point up until this point if I didn't
Speaker 1: have those years with you. So I'm really really grateful
Speaker 1: for that.
Speaker 3: Thank you. I appreciate that.
Speaker 1: But you know, beyond school, we've continued to grow our relationship.
Speaker 1: You helped put me through a UNI as you know
Speaker 1: parents do for their kids.
Speaker 3: It's only for one year, which was great.
Speaker 2: Which was great.
Speaker 1: You know, I went over to Whopper and left everything
Speaker 1: I knew behind on the East Coast and when and
Speaker 1: you know, random, I would say, I ran a mark
Speaker 1: on the West Coast. I don't know how much I learned,
Speaker 1: but it was a year for me to go and explore,
Speaker 1: you know, And I think that there's many pros and
Speaker 1: cons to that year away. But and then I came
Speaker 1: back to Sydney, and I think this is one of
Speaker 1: the funniest parts of our stories that when I had
Speaker 1: to move to Sydney for school, miraculously you moved to
Speaker 1: Sydney as well for a completely different reason. It was
Speaker 1: and so if that I don't know if that you know,
Speaker 1: that's a god given thing.
Speaker 3: But I think it was.
Speaker 2: I think that, you know, we're put.
Speaker 1: In the same place at the same time so that
Speaker 1: that you know, I think I was going to say that,
Speaker 1: so that we can have each other, but I think
Speaker 1: I just needed how.
Speaker 2: Much you needed.
Speaker 3: Well, it was a lot of trouble, but.
Speaker 1: I definitely feel like, yeah, those the years after school. Also,
Speaker 1: you know, you've continuously supported me through my life You've
Speaker 1: provided a lot of stability for me.
Speaker 3: I think that's the key thing. Really.
Speaker 4: It's that stability and constancy where you say you're going
Speaker 4: to do something and you do it. You say you'll
Speaker 4: be there, you show up. You don't leave that open
Speaker 4: to it. I might, I might not, depends how I
Speaker 4: feel on the day, you know, you do it. And
Speaker 4: I think that's what my aim was, to give you
Speaker 4: that stability so that you could actually grow from a
Speaker 4: place of sense of safety, knowing you had backing, knowing
Speaker 4: that somebody was there for you, because everybody needs that.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 4: And I know my dad died when I was twenty one,
Speaker 4: and when I lost that, that was really hard.
Speaker 3: So I thought, well, look at you, and I felt
Speaker 3: so sorry for you, you know, And.
Speaker 4: That's why, you know, I really consistently kept that at
Speaker 4: the forefront of my mind so that I would always
Speaker 4: be there and I wouldn't just go I've had enough now.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I think that's quite remarkable and profound in a way
Speaker 1: that you made the decision early on and you stuck
Speaker 1: by what you said you were going to do always.
Speaker 1: I say this to my partner, Denny, I say, there's
Speaker 1: one person in this world who I trust entirely, and
Speaker 1: that is you. I trust you completely. You've never let
Speaker 1: me down, you know. Oh it's a big no, you haven't.
Speaker 1: You've never let me down. You've never gone against your word,
Speaker 1: You've never lied to me, you haven't ever made me
Speaker 1: feel less than you know, even in the early days
Speaker 1: of being a little run around kid, rough kid from
Speaker 1: cold al you know, you just showed me a lot love.
Speaker 1: And I think that that's what kids need.
Speaker 4: Absolutely, that's the key, That's what everybody needs. But you
Speaker 4: know where that's lacking you, it's a gap. You can
Speaker 4: be a gap fillow for that, and any body, as
Speaker 4: you say, can be that gap fellow.
Speaker 3: You can be a grandmother, an aunt and uncle.
Speaker 4: A random stranger whoever, who supports just one person in
Speaker 4: their lives and that can completely change a life.
Speaker 1: I wanted to ask you, if you look back on
Speaker 1: the journey of taking on this role, what have been
Speaker 1: some of the highlights for you?
Speaker 4: Oh? I just think the fact that there are so
Speaker 4: many successes, and you know, you have your ups the
Speaker 4: downs and you just have to ride those waves. But
Speaker 4: to see you where you are today, knowing that you
Speaker 4: always had talent, that you had an ability that you
Speaker 4: really wanted to make a better life and I've.
Speaker 3: Achieved it, and I'm just so thrilled.
Speaker 4: I can't be more happy about that than what I am.
Speaker 4: And even seeing your brothers as well, and the nieces
Speaker 4: and nephews and really wanting them to do well as well,
Speaker 4: that gives me so much pleasure. Yeah, gives me so
Speaker 4: much gratification. And oh it's a bit teary, but it's
Speaker 4: like it's a delight to do it, absolute delight to
Speaker 4: do it. Because when things turn around for people and
Speaker 4: lives have changed and you're part of that part of that,
Speaker 4: then you feel as over you've achieved something really great. Yeah,
Speaker 4: nobody else might know about it, but you are achieving
Speaker 4: something that you can hold on to and to say, well,
Speaker 4: look where we've come from.
Speaker 3: We were here, now we're here.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: And I think that's a really important point to make.
Speaker 1: It's that you know, if you're a young person or anyone, yeah,
Speaker 1: and you don't have the people around you who can
Speaker 1: show you support, love, guidance, nurture you or care for
Speaker 1: you in a way that you need, there are people
Speaker 1: out there that will that will.
Speaker 4: They are and you know if you can't find them,
Speaker 4: find a friend, one friend who wants to have a
Speaker 4: better life, and do it with them. Sometimes it's somebody
Speaker 4: your own age and you have to take each other's
Speaker 4: hands or not literally, but you do, and you you
Speaker 4: forge your future together. You can do it even as
Speaker 4: children adolescents. You decide no, I want to go out
Speaker 4: and get a job and work and earn money and
Speaker 4: end up having the things that I need in life.
Speaker 4: There's always a way. There are places you can go.
Speaker 4: We went to the Aboriginal Strategy I think in Tamworth,
Speaker 4: and I know we had one of the girls. She
Speaker 4: was able to get help there and support. They're going
Speaker 4: to TAFE and doing courses and there's an Aboriginal support
Speaker 4: place at TAFE. So there are places that you can
Speaker 4: go and very quick little courses you can do to
Speaker 4: get skilled up, weekend courses and go walk on the
Speaker 4: work on the road or the rail and then build
Speaker 4: from their Yeah, well paid jobs.
Speaker 3: Yeah you just got to go. I go to do it.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Thank you so much for coming on, Thank you
Speaker 1: for having me first podcast.
Speaker 3: For all the lovely things you've said to.
Speaker 1: I really mean them, immed back to you mean them.
Speaker 1: I feel so grateful I was writing in a journal
Speaker 1: as part of my seventy five Hard Challenge, and so
Speaker 1: many of those pages have your name in it because
Speaker 1: the gratitude that I was feeling, just because I know
Speaker 1: that I wouldn't be at where I'm at right now
Speaker 1: without your love and support. So thank you for that,
Speaker 1: and thank you for your continued love and support. And
Speaker 1: for all those out there who don't have you know
Speaker 1: their mums in their lives. You know, I hope that
Speaker 1: you're feeling okay around Mother's Day. Maybe you can find
Speaker 1: that love in other people as well, because there's always
Speaker 1: someone out there who's, you know, willing to show you love.
Speaker 1: So if you love what you hear on our podcast,
Speaker 1: make sure you reach out. Our inbox is always open
Speaker 1: for a chat and you can find me at its
Speaker 1: Maddie Meals. And I don't think you have Instagram, do you, Pip?
Speaker 1: You don't want to be talking to the viewers. Your
Speaker 1: phone is constantly calling. And one of the things that
Speaker 1: I will just wrap up on is that most people
Speaker 1: who've been able to have you in their lives always
Speaker 1: say that you're a godsend.
Speaker 2: So I want to ask you the.
Speaker 1: Serious question, are you real or are you an angel?
Speaker 3: I'm definitely real and weaknesses and all the things that
Speaker 3: go up and down in.
Speaker 1: Life, because there are so many people that are just
Speaker 1: like she's an angel, she's a godsend, and I say,
Speaker 1: I agree, but she's real.
Speaker 4: I'm real.
Speaker 2: Well, that's all we will wrap it up.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for listening to First things first,
Speaker 1: if you love what you hear, leave us a rating
Speaker 1: and the litter review. And if you want us to
Speaker 1: cover anything on the podcast, make sure you let us
Speaker 1: know so you can hit me up at It's Maddie Meals.
Speaker 1: And you can hit Brook up at at Brook dot
Speaker 1: Blurton or catch all the nov podcast action over at
Speaker 1: over podcast Official.
Speaker 2: All right, have a great day by