WEBVTT - Meth addict to miracle worker: Peter Lyndon James Pt.1 0:00:01.960 --> 0:00:04.960 The public has had a long held fascination with detectives. 0:00:05.440 --> 0:00:08.119 Detective see a side of life the average persons never 0:00:08.200 --> 0:00:11.160 exposed to. I spent thirty four years as a cop. 0:00:11.640 --> 0:00:14.080 For twenty five of those years I was catching killers. 0:00:14.480 --> 0:00:16.280 That's what I did for a living. I was a 0:00:16.280 --> 0:00:20.600 homicide detective. I'm no longer just interviewing bad guys. Instead, 0:00:20.640 --> 0:00:23.200 I'm taking the public into the world in which I operated. 0:00:23.880 --> 0:00:26.480 The guests I talk to each week have amazing stories 0:00:26.480 --> 0:00:28.840 from all sides of the law. The interviews are raw 0:00:28.880 --> 0:00:31.520 and honest, just like the people I talk to. Some 0:00:31.640 --> 0:00:34.680 of the content and language might be confronting. That's because 0:00:34.720 --> 0:00:37.720 no one who comes into contact with crime is left unchanged. 0:00:38.200 --> 0:00:40.559 Join me now as I take you into this world. 0:00:46.479 --> 0:00:48.720 Welcome to another episode of I Catch Killers. 0:00:49.520 --> 0:00:49.840 Now. 0:00:49.920 --> 0:00:53.599 I normally prepare the introduction for the guests when they 0:00:53.600 --> 0:00:55.840 come on I Catch Killers. But I've decided to do 0:00:55.920 --> 0:00:59.400 something a little bit different today. Today's guest is Peter 0:00:59.600 --> 0:01:03.080 Linden James, and this is how he's described on a website. 0:01:03.560 --> 0:01:07.000 After twenty six years as an addict, drug dealer and criminal, 0:01:07.040 --> 0:01:09.800 Peter turned his life around to create Australia's largest and 0:01:09.840 --> 0:01:13.240 toughest rehab housing over one hundred and fifty residents no 0:01:13.360 --> 0:01:16.760 cost to the community. Peter has upended everything we know 0:01:16.840 --> 0:01:20.080 about addiction and rehab. Now, I figure with an introduction 0:01:20.200 --> 0:01:22.319 like that, I don't need to add anything because this 0:01:22.440 --> 0:01:24.280 is going to be an interesting chat and I'm looking 0:01:24.319 --> 0:01:27.720 forward to speaking to Peter Lindon James on I Catch Killers. 0:01:28.160 --> 0:01:30.559 Peter Lindon James, Welcome to I Catch Killers. 0:01:31.080 --> 0:01:33.080 They're goody, it's good. 0:01:32.880 --> 0:01:35.760 To be a well, it's good to sit down and 0:01:35.800 --> 0:01:37.360 have a chat with you. I've had quite a few 0:01:37.360 --> 0:01:39.360 people drop your name and the work that you're doing 0:01:39.400 --> 0:01:43.080 at Shalom as Shalem House and quite impressive. So a 0:01:43.080 --> 0:01:45.800 lot of people have been pointing me in that direction. 0:01:45.959 --> 0:01:49.080 And so the work you're doing over there is reaching 0:01:49.120 --> 0:01:52.040 the east coast of the country because you're over in Perth. 0:01:52.520 --> 0:01:54.279 Yeah, it's good getting around. 0:01:54.600 --> 0:01:57.960 Well, you're doing something that's making a difference. So you 0:01:58.040 --> 0:02:02.400 should be proudiest often happy that the reputations traveling. 0:02:02.640 --> 0:02:03.360 Yeah, thank you. 0:02:03.520 --> 0:02:04.360 In prepping for this. 0:02:05.120 --> 0:02:08.240 Chat with you, I've got to say you've certainly had 0:02:08.240 --> 0:02:09.240 an interesting life. 0:02:09.560 --> 0:02:11.919 Yeah, you could say that a bit of variety. 0:02:12.280 --> 0:02:18.880 Yeah, a variety incarcerated, addictions, crime, time in prison, all 0:02:18.960 --> 0:02:21.960 sorts of things. And here you are turning your life around. 0:02:22.680 --> 0:02:25.040 Did you think you would make it this far at 0:02:25.040 --> 0:02:27.120 the low point in your life? Like what goes through 0:02:27.200 --> 0:02:29.360 your mind when you're going in and out of jarle 0:02:29.440 --> 0:02:32.800 you're addicted and your habitual offender and addict. 0:02:32.880 --> 0:02:35.880 Basically, yeah, mate, telling the truth. 0:02:35.960 --> 0:02:38.880 I don't actually I don't look ahead. I just I 0:02:39.000 --> 0:02:40.440 just try now, just get up to be the best 0:02:40.520 --> 0:02:42.639 me I can be. I mean, and my whole life, 0:02:42.680 --> 0:02:45.320 I just wanted to be a geek, normal person and 0:02:45.480 --> 0:02:47.400 just doing normal stuff and I want my life to matter. 0:02:47.480 --> 0:02:50.320 And unfortunately, because of the way they grow up and 0:02:50.360 --> 0:02:52.679 what I went through, I grew up on the wrong 0:02:52.680 --> 0:02:54.240 side of the fence doing stuff that I didn't want 0:02:54.280 --> 0:02:57.040 to do. But yeah, just sort of the cards that 0:02:57.080 --> 0:02:57.520 were dealt. 0:02:58.120 --> 0:03:01.520 Yeah, So even that those those lower points in your life, 0:03:01.560 --> 0:03:03.880 you were just still looking I want to get out 0:03:03.960 --> 0:03:05.639 of this life, but I'll just get through the day 0:03:05.680 --> 0:03:07.079 and we'll worry about it the next day. 0:03:07.120 --> 0:03:08.400 Is that the sort of the way you rolled? 0:03:08.800 --> 0:03:11.840 Yeah, just day by day, just whatever came came. Just 0:03:11.880 --> 0:03:15.120 accepted who I was, what I did, and like most people, 0:03:15.160 --> 0:03:16.680 you just accept it and thing's going to be a 0:03:16.680 --> 0:03:19.280 lot to hit the big wall and then I sort 0:03:19.280 --> 0:03:21.280 of recalibrate and then just do it again and again. 0:03:21.360 --> 0:03:24.120 It's like groundhole day, just doing what you don't want 0:03:24.120 --> 0:03:26.679 to do, and it's sort of just your life follows you. 0:03:27.880 --> 0:03:30.000 Yeah, you're a slave to it. Well, you have been 0:03:30.120 --> 0:03:33.080 quoted somewhere. I just read this quite out because it's 0:03:33.080 --> 0:03:36.080 pretty heavy, but it sort of gives an insight. I 0:03:36.120 --> 0:03:38.280 hated who I was, what I stood for. I hated 0:03:38.320 --> 0:03:41.280 everything that I'd become, but I didn't know who I was. 0:03:42.120 --> 0:03:45.840 That's confronting and sad on a lot of different fronts, 0:03:45.840 --> 0:03:47.440 but that how you felt. 0:03:47.880 --> 0:03:50.360 That's how I felt from probably the age of eight onwards. 0:03:51.600 --> 0:03:54.240 Just the whole life just hated me. So what I 0:03:54.280 --> 0:03:57.920 stood for, what I did, how I smelt people, I 0:03:58.000 --> 0:04:02.080 hurt my life, I lived family, you name it. 0:04:02.720 --> 0:04:06.000 You carry a lot, don't you. Well, look you've turned 0:04:06.000 --> 0:04:08.240 your life around, and there's something and we want to 0:04:08.280 --> 0:04:11.640 talk about that. And now you're the CEO and you 0:04:11.720 --> 0:04:15.680 actually established it, the Shalem House and it's been described 0:04:15.720 --> 0:04:20.280 as Australia's strictest rehabilitation center where you employ a tough 0:04:20.360 --> 0:04:23.159 love approach that has been seen Shalom become the most 0:04:23.160 --> 0:04:25.200 successful rehab center in Australia. 0:04:25.920 --> 0:04:27.080 That's something to be proud of. 0:04:27.640 --> 0:04:27.920 I am. 0:04:28.440 --> 0:04:31.440 I love my staff, love my residence. I'm really proud 0:04:31.440 --> 0:04:33.440 of or the effort to put in and it's taken 0:04:33.480 --> 0:04:35.920 a lot over the probably the last thirteen fourteen years 0:04:36.000 --> 0:04:40.000 to establish the culture and now it's not one person 0:04:40.040 --> 0:04:42.960 carrying it, it's all of us who carry it. 0:04:42.960 --> 0:04:45.800 It's nice when you set something up that's worthwhile and 0:04:45.800 --> 0:04:48.719 you create that lineage, isn't it where people are it's 0:04:48.760 --> 0:04:49.760 not all to you. 0:04:49.760 --> 0:04:52.400 You've passed on the torch and people are out actually 0:04:52.440 --> 0:04:53.039 doing it with you. 0:04:53.120 --> 0:04:53.360 Now. 0:04:53.680 --> 0:04:56.159 Yeah, right from day tod always, I learn it, I 0:04:56.240 --> 0:04:58.800 teach it, I delegate it, I let go, and I 0:04:59.000 --> 0:05:01.240 just I want it to run, not because of me, 0:05:01.320 --> 0:05:03.159 but in spite of me. So I'll get you by 0:05:03.200 --> 0:05:07.600 a truck tomorrow. It'll just keep going. It's definitely laid 0:05:07.600 --> 0:05:08.680 on a good solid foundation. 0:05:09.880 --> 0:05:10.120 Yeah. 0:05:10.120 --> 0:05:13.440 Well, that's a pretty good insight into running anything or 0:05:13.480 --> 0:05:16.400 doing anything, is that you create it to the situation 0:05:16.520 --> 0:05:19.320 where you set it up so it doesn't need you. 0:05:19.720 --> 0:05:23.320 That's a perfect, perfect thing. We're going to talk. 0:05:23.560 --> 0:05:25.440 We're going to talk in great deal about what you're 0:05:25.440 --> 0:05:28.080 doing at Shalam House because I think it's fascinating and 0:05:28.080 --> 0:05:30.440 to give people an insight into why it is so 0:05:30.480 --> 0:05:33.719 successful and why people are coming there and knocking on 0:05:33.760 --> 0:05:37.359 the door to get in because of the reputation. But 0:05:37.480 --> 0:05:40.040 before we do, I want to talk about your upbringing. 0:05:40.120 --> 0:05:42.040 Get a sense of where you've come from, because I 0:05:42.080 --> 0:05:44.440 think people are you know, it's one thing to say 0:05:44.680 --> 0:05:46.880 this is my life, now, look how successful I am, 0:05:47.040 --> 0:05:49.080 but people have got to understand where you came from 0:05:49.080 --> 0:05:51.280 because it's your life experiences that have got you to 0:05:51.320 --> 0:05:53.760 this point. So tell us about your upbringing. 0:05:55.400 --> 0:05:58.720 Well, ninety percent of the people that we will actually help, 0:05:58.800 --> 0:06:00.720 the root cause of what they are like they are 0:06:00.839 --> 0:06:05.559 is actually childhood trauma. Me Lockridge, which is in Perth, 0:06:05.600 --> 0:06:07.599 is a bit like the Bronx type stuff. I gore 0:06:07.680 --> 0:06:09.680 up in Lockridge, some second eldest of five kids. I 0:06:09.800 --> 0:06:13.239 got an older sister, two younger brothers, and the younger 0:06:13.279 --> 0:06:19.440 sister the Lockridge scanned. The way where everything started going 0:06:19.480 --> 0:06:24.000 wrong was when I was probably six or seven. My 0:06:24.080 --> 0:06:26.840 dad actually went out with my mum and they had 0:06:26.839 --> 0:06:28.960 a baby sitter stay over the night and looked after 0:06:29.040 --> 0:06:32.120 us five kids, and I come back, and they come back, 0:06:32.160 --> 0:06:33.039 and I wake up in the morning. 0:06:33.120 --> 0:06:34.360 All I could hear was screaming and yell. 0:06:34.440 --> 0:06:36.000 And there's a five year old, six year old I 0:06:36.000 --> 0:06:38.760 can actually remember it. And we're on a two story place. 0:06:38.800 --> 0:06:41.560 I walked out in the bedroom and I've seen Dad 0:06:41.600 --> 0:06:44.320 going down the stairs and Mum just through this pot 0:06:44.960 --> 0:06:46.839 and like a cooking pot at the back of Dad's head. 0:06:47.520 --> 0:06:48.640 And for me, that was. 0:06:48.640 --> 0:06:51.359 Where all life started going skew with. So I'm a 0:06:51.360 --> 0:06:53.160 six year old kid. Dad's moved out of home, moved 0:06:53.200 --> 0:06:56.640 into moto and my mom she started drinking lots, and 0:06:56.720 --> 0:06:59.120 I remember the repossession of people coming through after Dad 0:06:59.440 --> 0:07:03.040 moved out, took our TV lounge fridge because Mom couldn't 0:07:03.040 --> 0:07:05.600 afford the payments, and our quality of life kept going down. 0:07:05.680 --> 0:07:07.640 But as a kid, all I can remember was Mum 0:07:07.720 --> 0:07:11.800 throwing the pot. When I was going to school lock 0:07:11.800 --> 0:07:14.080 Whose Primary school, I'd pull in the Eaton Hill Pub. 0:07:14.120 --> 0:07:16.320 My dad was starting at the motel on the way 0:07:16.360 --> 0:07:18.200 to school. So Dad do it something from the shops. 0:07:18.520 --> 0:07:20.800 He gave me ten backs and get us a pack 0:07:20.840 --> 0:07:24.200 of fags, and I lay for bread and so I'd 0:07:24.240 --> 0:07:25.600 go down the shop give him matt and he said, 0:07:25.600 --> 0:07:27.600 I keep the change. And I really loved my dad. 0:07:27.640 --> 0:07:29.840 I was really close to my dad. He was a mechanic, 0:07:29.880 --> 0:07:32.760 deeds a mechanic. And I'd done that for like three 0:07:32.840 --> 0:07:35.760 four weeks. And one day I went knocked on the 0:07:36.120 --> 0:07:38.760 motel and knocked on the motel. No one was there, 0:07:39.280 --> 0:07:40.920 and so I went to get on my pushbite right off, 0:07:40.920 --> 0:07:43.000 and the garden was in the car park and I 0:07:43.000 --> 0:07:44.640 said to himself, you seen my dad, and goes, oh, 0:07:44.640 --> 0:07:47.560 your dad doesn't live anymore. He's moved up north. And 0:07:47.600 --> 0:07:49.320 when he said that, I just broke down and cried. 0:07:49.320 --> 0:07:52.080 I can remember it clear as day. I just felt 0:07:52.160 --> 0:07:56.280 that he abandoned me. And from then onwards just life 0:07:56.400 --> 0:07:59.160 just went crap mate. My mom started moving from house 0:07:59.160 --> 0:08:01.320 to house. I went from gool to school, and by 0:08:01.360 --> 0:08:03.040 the time I was eight, I'd been at like six 0:08:03.080 --> 0:08:08.400 different schools, seven different schools. She started drinking lots abused alcohol. 0:08:09.080 --> 0:08:11.600 One in particular fellow that she was with. He used 0:08:11.600 --> 0:08:14.400 to discover her by the hair and I'd walk out 0:08:14.600 --> 0:08:16.160 and the lander at three o'clock in the morning, all 0:08:16.200 --> 0:08:18.480 the screaming had stopped. I had my brothers and sisters 0:08:18.520 --> 0:08:20.200 hit under the bed, but I walk out in the 0:08:20.280 --> 0:08:22.120 lander and mumby sitting on the end of the lounge, 0:08:22.480 --> 0:08:24.680 and her face would be mad in blood, two black eyes, 0:08:24.960 --> 0:08:27.080 her false teeth to be smashed in half, and she'd 0:08:27.080 --> 0:08:29.320 be sitting on the lounge like that, the superlo trying 0:08:29.360 --> 0:08:30.360 to glue her teeth back together. 0:08:31.480 --> 0:08:33.360 The alcohol, no food in the cupboards. 0:08:33.720 --> 0:08:36.000 Every school, you go to your height behind the library, 0:08:36.000 --> 0:08:38.600 and because other kids would picked on you, you never 0:08:38.640 --> 0:08:41.160 had a fixed group of friends, never had school clothes 0:08:41.200 --> 0:08:44.160 like other kids. I was going through all this stuff 0:08:44.440 --> 0:08:46.880 as a young kid, and I shouldn't have been subjected 0:08:46.880 --> 0:08:50.280 to it. But eventually mumy going to a rehab and 0:08:50.600 --> 0:08:52.760 my brothers and sisters went to my grandma, and I 0:08:52.800 --> 0:08:56.200 tried to stay with my mom. So Gavin Judy and 0:08:56.880 --> 0:08:59.240 Gavin Shrean Gray went to grandma's. My sister went to 0:08:59.280 --> 0:09:02.040 her best friends, and I went into her Wansley Children's 0:09:02.040 --> 0:09:04.800 Home and then into Foster Cany. Mom at the rehab 0:09:05.520 --> 0:09:06.959 and then when she get out of the rehabit all 0:09:06.960 --> 0:09:09.120 she did was drink and spend time with his bloke. 0:09:09.760 --> 0:09:12.040 And I met some young kid in the caravan park 0:09:12.160 --> 0:09:15.800 and it's become mates. And one night I said, Mum, 0:09:15.840 --> 0:09:18.199 can I stay with it my mate's carry and he 0:09:18.200 --> 0:09:20.880 goes yeah, And then I started with my mate's caravan 0:09:21.280 --> 0:09:23.280 and I wake up three o'clock at the morning and 0:09:23.320 --> 0:09:25.960 my mate's uncle was giving me oral sex and I'm 0:09:26.040 --> 0:09:31.600 laising their frozen solid and mate year old kid and yeah, 0:09:31.640 --> 0:09:32.960 this bloke was doing stuff to me and I had 0:09:33.000 --> 0:09:35.400 to pretend I was asleep. And the reason I share 0:09:35.400 --> 0:09:37.720 that is that that's one of the root causes of 0:09:37.760 --> 0:09:40.800 why I was like I was. And I remember geting 0:09:40.840 --> 0:09:42.320 up in the morning and walked out of the carrian 0:09:42.320 --> 0:09:44.560 park and I heard a voice and it says, tell you, mum, 0:09:44.800 --> 0:09:47.560 And then I heard another voice and now, stuff ya suffer. 0:09:47.679 --> 0:09:49.760 She doesn't love you. She loves this man or the 0:09:49.760 --> 0:09:52.000 alcohol more than she loves you. And I remember thinking, 0:09:52.000 --> 0:09:54.439 as night year old kid, yeah, stuffa, she loves him 0:09:54.440 --> 0:09:56.319 more than she loves me. If she loved me, I 0:09:56.320 --> 0:09:58.040 wouldn't have been molested. I would have been all these 0:09:58.080 --> 0:10:00.640 children's homes. I mean, I would to be in all 0:10:00.720 --> 0:10:03.520 these different schools. And so from the age eight, I 0:10:03.559 --> 0:10:06.480 literally hated her guts and every chance I could, I 0:10:06.559 --> 0:10:08.960 just ran away. I'd run away from her to sleep 0:10:09.000 --> 0:10:11.400 under my mate's floorboards. And if it wasn't and that 0:10:11.480 --> 0:10:13.720 I was in Good Samaritan bidness. I was living on 0:10:13.760 --> 0:10:18.040 the streets from the age eight. Age of nine, they 0:10:18.040 --> 0:10:22.079 put me into another children's home even Perth called Parkaol 0:10:22.120 --> 0:10:25.439 Children's Home, and I spent three sins in there. From 0:10:25.440 --> 0:10:27.280 the age of nine, I used to run away back 0:10:27.320 --> 0:10:30.040 up there for two weeks run away again the third 0:10:30.080 --> 0:10:32.640 time they caught me from the good run away from Parky. 0:10:33.559 --> 0:10:35.040 I was sleeping in the Good samaran been at the 0:10:35.080 --> 0:10:37.760 middle of Gate Shoping Center. And I remember waking up 0:10:38.120 --> 0:10:40.160 in the morning five o'clock, four o'clock on the morning 0:10:40.160 --> 0:10:42.240 with the coppers with a big torch light on my head. 0:10:43.000 --> 0:10:44.760 And so they took me back up to Parklor So 0:10:44.800 --> 0:10:47.319 I hadn't seen me dad since he took off when 0:10:47.320 --> 0:10:50.160 I was six. From now nine, they took me out 0:10:50.160 --> 0:10:52.400 to park with children's aims and I walked walked into 0:10:52.400 --> 0:10:54.559 this room right and I had my dad sitting on 0:10:54.600 --> 0:10:56.520 the right and I had the counselor sitting on the left. 0:10:57.040 --> 0:10:59.079 And again I remember this as clear as day, and 0:10:59.160 --> 0:11:02.599 she said, listen Pete, you obviously don't want to be here. 0:11:02.400 --> 0:11:06.000 You're wasted down time and our resources. You can either 0:11:06.040 --> 0:11:08.000 go with your dad or you're going a lot more. 0:11:08.360 --> 0:11:10.440 And I didn't realize long more was a boy's prison, 0:11:10.559 --> 0:11:13.280 like with bars and all that sort of stuff, actual prison. 0:11:13.440 --> 0:11:16.800 But I looked at my dad and I heard his 0:11:16.960 --> 0:11:19.280 voice again and said, he doesn't love you. He loves 0:11:19.280 --> 0:11:21.360 the babysitter more than he loves you, because it turned 0:11:21.360 --> 0:11:23.240 out that he ended up running off with a babysitter, 0:11:23.520 --> 0:11:25.599 had two kids with her, and went out to the 0:11:25.600 --> 0:11:26.120 marble bar. 0:11:26.960 --> 0:11:28.360 That's where he'd been for the last three years. 0:11:28.720 --> 0:11:30.360 But I looked at me Dad, and I heard this voice, 0:11:30.400 --> 0:11:32.160 I don't love you now, And so I said to 0:11:32.200 --> 0:11:33.200 this chick, I got a lot more. 0:11:34.080 --> 0:11:35.840 And then I heard this voice and making a mistake, and. 0:11:35.840 --> 0:11:38.679 Then I heard these other ways, nice stuff stuff he 0:11:38.760 --> 0:11:39.839 make him pay for what he's doing. 0:11:39.880 --> 0:11:40.360 Yeah, I mean. 0:11:41.240 --> 0:11:44.360 And so my dad was the one who drove me 0:11:44.400 --> 0:11:47.000 a lot more eleven o'clock at night, and when we 0:11:47.040 --> 0:11:48.800 pulled it up at the gates, nine year old kid, 0:11:49.360 --> 0:11:50.960 and I tell you what, my heart mate was going 0:11:51.000 --> 0:11:52.400 fin in a mile and hour. I've never been so 0:11:52.400 --> 0:11:54.960 scared and we're like And I walked up to these 0:11:55.000 --> 0:11:56.840 big bars, this prison offs to come down with all 0:11:56.840 --> 0:11:59.040 these keys, and I went through the gates and I 0:11:59.040 --> 0:12:00.959 looked back and the dad walking back to the car 0:12:01.320 --> 0:12:02.559 and with the baby sit in the front of the 0:12:02.559 --> 0:12:05.520 passage seat or his wife. And they took me into 0:12:05.559 --> 0:12:10.240 the into the prison. They took me into the prison 0:12:10.280 --> 0:12:15.480 and the train, and they stripped me naked. They put 0:12:15.760 --> 0:12:17.640 nick cream on my hair, crab cream on me nuts, 0:12:17.640 --> 0:12:21.800 and they gave me six comic books and eat the 0:12:21.840 --> 0:12:23.880 toilet shoders. And they marched me down these right prison 0:12:23.920 --> 0:12:26.559 cells and there's like nine cells to the left, nine 0:12:26.559 --> 0:12:27.320 cells to the right. 0:12:27.760 --> 0:12:28.640 I'm getting put. 0:12:28.440 --> 0:12:29.920 In prison just because I want my mom and my 0:12:30.000 --> 0:12:35.200 dad and I done nothing wrong. And I remember when 0:12:35.240 --> 0:12:36.840 they marched me down about six cell and the left 0:12:36.840 --> 0:12:38.520 down side open the door, pushed me in the slot 0:12:38.800 --> 0:12:41.440 and the bolted the door shut. I remember chucking me 0:12:41.720 --> 0:12:44.080 comic books that we crap on the steel bench, jumping 0:12:44.160 --> 0:12:46.480 on the bed, just grabbed a hold on my pillow, 0:12:47.000 --> 0:12:49.160 started to bottomie out, crying saying, if you let me 0:12:49.160 --> 0:12:52.360 out now, I'll behave. I won't run away again. 0:12:52.840 --> 0:12:55.599 That experience of getting put in a prison as a 0:12:55.679 --> 0:12:57.679 nine year old kid. Kid scared the liver crap out 0:12:57.679 --> 0:12:57.839 of me. 0:12:59.000 --> 0:13:01.440 I'm rocking side to side and I heard a voice 0:13:01.480 --> 0:13:03.120 in me cell Again, I'm going to refer to a 0:13:03.200 --> 0:13:05.319 voice quite often, but I heard a voice of Mesell 0:13:05.720 --> 0:13:08.040 and I said, Peter, from this stay forward. You're going 0:13:08.080 --> 0:13:10.839 to have to look after yourself. And so I made 0:13:10.880 --> 0:13:12.520 a vow from they stay forward. I'm going to look 0:13:12.559 --> 0:13:14.960 after myself when I get stressed. Now I'm a fifty 0:13:15.000 --> 0:13:17.800 four year old fellof, but I cut on my slow 0:13:18.280 --> 0:13:18.840 to get to sleep. 0:13:18.880 --> 0:13:19.280 Every night. 0:13:21.640 --> 0:13:24.360 I wake up the next day and we clean your 0:13:24.360 --> 0:13:27.400 cell out, up your floor, stand by yourself door for selling, 0:13:27.400 --> 0:13:29.959 inspects to shirts tucked down, hands behind your back, not talking. 0:13:30.559 --> 0:13:32.240 So I'm sit there in the prison sell with all 0:13:32.240 --> 0:13:35.600 these other kids, and do they inspect you end up 0:13:35.640 --> 0:13:40.560 spending three months in Lonmar. But that three months in 0:13:40.600 --> 0:13:43.360 Nornmore was the first time that I ever found I 0:13:43.400 --> 0:13:43.960 had a home. 0:13:45.320 --> 0:13:49.119 All those other kids in you know, there's about one hundred. 0:13:48.880 --> 0:13:50.640 And forty of them, one hundred and thirty of them, 0:13:50.960 --> 0:13:52.920 but they all had stories like mine, that mum had 0:13:52.960 --> 0:13:54.280 run off with a man, or dad had run off 0:13:54.280 --> 0:13:56.920 with a woman and they were just like me. All 0:13:56.920 --> 0:13:59.160 they wanted was a mum and dad normal, But because 0:13:59.200 --> 0:14:01.920 of the life that they parents have lived, they were 0:14:01.920 --> 0:14:03.840 wearing the consequences of the parents' choices. 0:14:04.320 --> 0:14:07.559 Yeah, I just unpacked that story and I haven't interrupted 0:14:07.600 --> 0:14:11.880 you because it's just it's heavy, mate, that's a sad 0:14:11.920 --> 0:14:13.920 story and that you know, my heart goes out for you. 0:14:14.000 --> 0:14:16.400 And I'm looking at your seeing you're a big tough man, 0:14:16.440 --> 0:14:18.520 but I'm looking at this young kid. 0:14:19.080 --> 0:14:23.000 Yeah, life dealt you some shit cards, But isn't it. 0:14:23.760 --> 0:14:24.440 It wasn't good. 0:14:24.560 --> 0:14:27.640 Just how these things happen, these sliding door moments, and 0:14:27.720 --> 0:14:32.120 just one person's life is just forever stuffed up. I'm 0:14:32.160 --> 0:14:33.880 sitting here and I've heard a lot of stories on 0:14:33.960 --> 0:14:35.600 my catch killers and a lot of people have been 0:14:35.680 --> 0:14:38.760 down some tough paths. But Peter, the way that you 0:14:38.880 --> 0:14:42.360 told that really took me there and thinking what would 0:14:42.400 --> 0:14:44.160 I be thinking at that age as a kid, What 0:14:44.480 --> 0:14:45.800 would be going through my head? 0:14:45.960 --> 0:14:48.320 Like my mom doesn't love me, my dad doesn't love me. 0:14:48.600 --> 0:14:52.560 Violence is the thing you go to a place where 0:14:52.600 --> 0:14:55.040 you feel a little bit more secure, you sexually assaulted, 0:14:55.480 --> 0:14:58.520 then you get locked up in a prison, and it's 0:14:58.520 --> 0:15:00.920 a prison, call it juvenile whatever, it's a prison. 0:15:01.160 --> 0:15:02.000 You're not allowed out. 0:15:03.320 --> 0:15:05.240 You haven't done anything wrong, You're just trying to look 0:15:05.280 --> 0:15:08.200 after yourself. Like fuck me, I do not know how 0:15:08.320 --> 0:15:10.400 people come through that and the stuff that you must 0:15:10.440 --> 0:15:13.480 carry from that. We all carry some sort of childhood trauma. 0:15:13.960 --> 0:15:17.640 But full credit to you that you can sit here 0:15:17.880 --> 0:15:21.280 and talk about it and you survive that. I just 0:15:21.280 --> 0:15:23.320 want to get a sense, like you're in and out 0:15:23.320 --> 0:15:26.160 from the age of nine into those detention centers. Do 0:15:26.200 --> 0:15:29.440 you have an old detention centers does it create Tell 0:15:29.480 --> 0:15:31.240 me how you think when you're in there, because I 0:15:31.240 --> 0:15:34.840 would imagine you'd be thinking, I'm just a worthless piece 0:15:34.880 --> 0:15:37.520 of shit. Nobody cares about me. This is you know, 0:15:37.560 --> 0:15:39.520 and you've become a self fulfilling prophecy. 0:15:39.520 --> 0:15:42.800 I would imagine in jail you've got a projected image 0:15:42.800 --> 0:15:45.360 that people perceive to fit in with where you are. 0:15:45.360 --> 0:15:48.200 You've got to adapt to the culture. But what's normal 0:15:48.280 --> 0:15:51.480 in prison is what's normal outside. And prisons don't actually 0:15:51.480 --> 0:15:54.800 make your better, they make your worse. And so when 0:15:54.800 --> 0:15:56.800 you get out of prison, even though you're out of prison, 0:15:57.240 --> 0:15:59.120 you're still in prison. You can take the prisoner out 0:15:59.160 --> 0:16:00.880 of prison. You've got to get the prison out of 0:16:00.880 --> 0:16:04.960 the prisoner. And so all jail did for me, I 0:16:05.040 --> 0:16:07.560 was just institutionalized. If I wasn't locked up, I've been 0:16:07.600 --> 0:16:09.160 living on the streets. But I thought I was away, 0:16:09.280 --> 0:16:12.520 that I wasn't good enough, I didn't belong No one 0:16:12.560 --> 0:16:15.960 loved me, Mum and dad. I was just a mess man. 0:16:16.920 --> 0:16:18.920 And then and then there's stuff I'll be in for. 0:16:19.200 --> 0:16:22.000 I spent seven years a lot more two years in Riverbank. 0:16:22.280 --> 0:16:24.240 When I wasn't locked up, I lived on the streets. 0:16:24.280 --> 0:16:26.800 I was straight kidding Perth from nineteen seventy nine, nine 0:16:26.920 --> 0:16:31.000 eighty eight. Yeah, when I was in jail, mate, I 0:16:31.080 --> 0:16:32.480 was on the on the streets do a lot of 0:16:32.480 --> 0:16:33.600 stuff they shouldn't have done. 0:16:33.760 --> 0:16:36.840 Well, I look at look at your life, per Who 0:16:36.880 --> 0:16:39.760 do you have as a role model there? Like who's 0:16:39.800 --> 0:16:42.080 who's your role model? You like it as a kid, 0:16:42.120 --> 0:16:45.000 you're looking for role models. You're looking for someone that 0:16:45.600 --> 0:16:48.000 I want to follow that person or I want that 0:16:48.040 --> 0:16:49.760 person to help me in life. 0:16:50.000 --> 0:16:51.040 Who is your role model? 0:16:51.560 --> 0:16:54.120 And then again, I've come across a couple of geek fellaws, 0:16:55.320 --> 0:16:59.640 older fellaws. They just feel like they're your dad, and 0:16:59.680 --> 0:17:01.920 I get I get that with Chris DAWs. I met 0:17:02.080 --> 0:17:05.000 Chris DA's West Australian governor at the moment, but I 0:17:05.040 --> 0:17:06.840 met him a fair few years back. 0:17:07.160 --> 0:17:09.640 And form former cop Chris. 0:17:10.280 --> 0:17:13.160 Yeah, he was a police commissioner and then now he's governor. 0:17:14.040 --> 0:17:15.840 But I really related to remember time I sat down 0:17:15.880 --> 0:17:18.000 and how he armed with him and an unpacked. He 0:17:18.119 --> 0:17:19.280 just he felt like my dad. 0:17:19.320 --> 0:17:23.000 I mean, yeah, And. 0:17:21.880 --> 0:17:24.240 So there's a few blakes like that that's come across 0:17:24.280 --> 0:17:27.879 my path since I've been semi normal that I can 0:17:28.000 --> 0:17:28.720 I can download to. 0:17:28.840 --> 0:17:30.320 But otherwise I've got one. 0:17:30.320 --> 0:17:33.520 Hundred and sixty residents and all these stuff, so I 0:17:33.560 --> 0:17:35.880 don't really have time to look up. I'm just focusing 0:17:35.880 --> 0:17:36.720 on what's someone below me. 0:17:37.119 --> 0:17:38.520 Hey, I ask you this question. 0:17:38.560 --> 0:17:42.240 Do you think if at that stage and you know 0:17:42.320 --> 0:17:44.560 the nature of the person that you are or whatever, 0:17:44.600 --> 0:17:47.200