1 00:00:05,680 --> 00:00:08,520 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Fear and Greed Business Interview. I'm Sean Alma. 2 00:00:08,760 --> 00:00:13,760 Speaker 1: Female investment managers consistently out for men, yet only nineteen 3 00:00:13,800 --> 00:00:17,880 Speaker 1: percent of portfolio managers in Australia are women. Now, a 4 00:00:17,960 --> 00:00:21,720 Speaker 1: new female led fund is aiming to challenge inequality by 5 00:00:21,760 --> 00:00:25,319 Speaker 1: bringing a gender lens into investment decisions. Kickstarted with a 6 00:00:25,360 --> 00:00:28,440 Speaker 1: one hundred million dollar commitment from Andrew and Nicola forres 7 00:00:28,520 --> 00:00:33,360 Speaker 1: Mindarou Foundation, Future Generation Women will be entirely run by 8 00:00:33,520 --> 00:00:37,000 Speaker 1: female portfolio managers. It's an unlisted trust in the Future 9 00:00:37,000 --> 00:00:40,440 Speaker 1: Generation Group, which we've spoken about before, an ASX listed 10 00:00:40,479 --> 00:00:43,479 Speaker 1: fund manager that gives investors access to leading Australian and 11 00:00:43,520 --> 00:00:48,400 Speaker 1: global portfolio managers while also raising millions of dollars for charity. 12 00:00:48,720 --> 00:00:51,440 Speaker 1: It was founded by Wilson Asset Management's Jeff Wilson back 13 00:00:51,479 --> 00:00:53,680 Speaker 1: in twenty fourteen as a way for the funds management 14 00:00:53,680 --> 00:00:56,600 Speaker 1: and finance sector to make a difference. Caroline Gurney is 15 00:00:56,680 --> 00:01:00,000 Speaker 1: the chief executive officer of Future Generation. Caroline, Welcome back 16 00:01:00,080 --> 00:01:00,800 Speaker 1: to Fearing Greed. 17 00:01:01,040 --> 00:01:02,440 Speaker 2: Thanks so much, Tomitabiger. 18 00:01:03,160 --> 00:01:06,760 Speaker 1: This is about Future Generation women. But firstly, just give 19 00:01:06,840 --> 00:01:10,720 Speaker 1: us the thumbnail pitch on how Future Gin works. 20 00:01:11,440 --> 00:01:14,240 Speaker 2: Oh, that's a really good question because obviously we've used 21 00:01:14,240 --> 00:01:19,280 Speaker 2: that model for Future Generation women. So originally Future Generation 22 00:01:19,520 --> 00:01:23,759 Speaker 2: was dreamed up by Jeff Wilson his obviously the CIO 23 00:01:23,840 --> 00:01:27,600 Speaker 2: and founderer of Wilson Essett Management. He went to London 24 00:01:27,640 --> 00:01:31,160 Speaker 2: and he basically read an article talking about how a 25 00:01:31,200 --> 00:01:35,120 Speaker 2: fund manager have raised a serious amount of money for cancer. 26 00:01:35,560 --> 00:01:38,080 Speaker 2: So he said, right, we can do this in Australia. 27 00:01:38,240 --> 00:01:40,520 Speaker 2: So he came back and it's more than ten years 28 00:01:40,560 --> 00:01:44,480 Speaker 2: ago now and he basically spoke to dead Paradise. He 29 00:01:44,520 --> 00:01:47,000 Speaker 2: spoke to Peter Cooper, he spoke to sort of you know, 30 00:01:47,040 --> 00:01:50,720 Speaker 2: the real the legends of investing now in Australia and said, 31 00:01:51,080 --> 00:01:55,160 Speaker 2: will you work for free if I raise the money 32 00:01:55,520 --> 00:01:59,480 Speaker 2: from our shareholders and will you not charge us any management? Please? 33 00:01:59,600 --> 00:02:02,240 Speaker 2: All before woman's speed, so we can give one percent 34 00:02:02,400 --> 00:02:06,160 Speaker 2: of our total net assets to not for profits in Australia. 35 00:02:06,720 --> 00:02:09,519 Speaker 2: And they all said yes. And so you know, that's 36 00:02:09,560 --> 00:02:12,520 Speaker 2: ten years ago when we first launched Future Generation Australia 37 00:02:13,280 --> 00:02:16,360 Speaker 2: and then here later Future Generation Global is launched. So 38 00:02:16,720 --> 00:02:19,239 Speaker 2: we have over a billion under management, we have fifteen 39 00:02:19,320 --> 00:02:23,480 Speaker 2: thousand shareholders and we've given nearly ninety million to not 40 00:02:23,560 --> 00:02:24,520 Speaker 2: for profits. 41 00:02:25,000 --> 00:02:27,640 Speaker 1: Okay, so these are investors giving the money via the 42 00:02:27,680 --> 00:02:30,680 Speaker 1: Future Gen to David Parrice for fragment's sake, he hasn't 43 00:02:30,680 --> 00:02:33,760 Speaker 1: started a new fund. He's just including that money as 44 00:02:33,800 --> 00:02:37,120 Speaker 1: part of his absolute fund and it's warehoused and therefore 45 00:02:37,280 --> 00:02:39,960 Speaker 1: then he's not charging management fees on that. The money 46 00:02:39,960 --> 00:02:43,440 Speaker 1: goes to charity, which is a fantastic, fantastic way of working. 47 00:02:43,560 --> 00:02:47,639 Speaker 1: Ninety million dollars over ten years. Future Gen Women, what's 48 00:02:47,680 --> 00:02:49,359 Speaker 1: that about? Ah? 49 00:02:49,400 --> 00:02:52,600 Speaker 2: So this this actually is slightly different, but it is 50 00:02:52,800 --> 00:02:55,560 Speaker 2: very much along the same model. So here we have 51 00:02:55,639 --> 00:02:59,959 Speaker 2: twelve female fur managers and the Future Generation Women is based. 52 00:03:00,360 --> 00:03:05,320 Speaker 2: You can invest as a shareholder in Australian Australian equities, 53 00:03:05,400 --> 00:03:09,720 Speaker 2: all global equities within one wrapp up. And what that 54 00:03:09,800 --> 00:03:12,400 Speaker 2: then allows us to do is to give one percent 55 00:03:12,800 --> 00:03:16,920 Speaker 2: again and that's going to be too not for profits 56 00:03:17,280 --> 00:03:20,160 Speaker 2: that are for women and their children in terms of 57 00:03:20,280 --> 00:03:25,400 Speaker 2: you know, economic literacy, empowerment, making sure that you know 58 00:03:26,160 --> 00:03:30,200 Speaker 2: certain coborts so perhaps you know aren't perhaps funded or 59 00:03:30,240 --> 00:03:32,960 Speaker 2: don't have those opportunities you know can get them. So 60 00:03:33,040 --> 00:03:35,520 Speaker 2: for example, women and you know over the age of 61 00:03:35,520 --> 00:03:38,400 Speaker 2: fifty five that are you know, living living in their cars. 62 00:03:38,440 --> 00:03:41,200 Speaker 2: I mean that sort of you know, a real issue 63 00:03:41,240 --> 00:03:44,400 Speaker 2: for Australia. In fact, you have a massive homelessness problem 64 00:03:44,720 --> 00:03:47,840 Speaker 2: for women through no fault of their own. But this 65 00:03:47,880 --> 00:03:50,640 Speaker 2: way we're hoping to help them through various not for profits. 66 00:03:51,280 --> 00:03:54,040 Speaker 2: And I think the fact that these female filt managers 67 00:03:54,040 --> 00:03:56,640 Speaker 2: are willing to do exactly the same how you manage 68 00:03:56,680 --> 00:04:00,600 Speaker 2: shareholder money within their fund and charge no fees amazing. 69 00:04:00,920 --> 00:04:03,360 Speaker 2: And we're very lucky as well because we have City Group, 70 00:04:03,560 --> 00:04:07,400 Speaker 2: we at Equity trustees, and we also have boardroom working 71 00:04:07,440 --> 00:04:10,680 Speaker 2: pro bono, so you know, we're really hoping to make 72 00:04:10,720 --> 00:04:11,800 Speaker 2: a big difference there. 73 00:04:12,720 --> 00:04:14,600 Speaker 1: And the kick after the fund came from the Mindru 74 00:04:14,640 --> 00:04:18,440 Speaker 1: Foundation Andrew Nicola Forrest's family foundation one hundred million dollars 75 00:04:18,560 --> 00:04:21,000 Speaker 1: that they're not giving you cash what they're doing this 76 00:04:21,080 --> 00:04:23,839 Speaker 1: and giving you one hundred million dollars to invest, and 77 00:04:24,120 --> 00:04:26,840 Speaker 1: that certainly kicks things along because those fund managers, that 78 00:04:26,880 --> 00:04:30,240 Speaker 1: the twelve women fund managers have got money to start investing. 79 00:04:30,440 --> 00:04:33,520 Speaker 1: How much are you hoping to grow this fund too? 80 00:04:34,480 --> 00:04:37,400 Speaker 2: I think that's a really important point that you made, 81 00:04:37,440 --> 00:04:42,760 Speaker 2: Sean for it, because it's actually coming from Mindaru Investment Committee. 82 00:04:42,960 --> 00:04:45,159 Speaker 2: So they're the ones that are actually investing that one 83 00:04:45,200 --> 00:04:47,600 Speaker 2: hundred million in US. So it has to be an 84 00:04:47,600 --> 00:04:51,760 Speaker 2: investment first and foremost, and then we will also give 85 00:04:51,800 --> 00:04:53,800 Speaker 2: you know, the WARB cent to non profits. You know, 86 00:04:54,440 --> 00:04:56,640 Speaker 2: I would love to get to one hundred and fifty, 87 00:04:56,960 --> 00:04:59,400 Speaker 2: you know, in the year's time. That would be a 88 00:04:59,440 --> 00:05:02,280 Speaker 2: really great achievement. And we've had a lot of interest, 89 00:05:02,760 --> 00:05:05,440 Speaker 2: but you know, let's just wait and see. 90 00:05:05,720 --> 00:05:08,040 Speaker 1: We'll be back in a moment. We're talking to Caroline 91 00:05:08,080 --> 00:05:18,080 Speaker 1: Gurney see our Future Generation group. So you had twelve 92 00:05:18,080 --> 00:05:21,280 Speaker 1: women fund managers and you had a launch recently. They 93 00:05:21,279 --> 00:05:23,680 Speaker 1: were all there. What is it about women that make 94 00:05:23,920 --> 00:05:25,560 Speaker 1: them better investors? 95 00:05:26,000 --> 00:05:30,120 Speaker 2: Ah, I mean that's a really good question. I mean 96 00:05:30,120 --> 00:05:32,880 Speaker 2: there's lots of data out there that you know, women 97 00:05:32,960 --> 00:05:35,680 Speaker 2: fund managers, you know, perform better the men. I mean 98 00:05:35,680 --> 00:05:37,880 Speaker 2: there's also data out there that you know, men perform 99 00:05:37,920 --> 00:05:42,560 Speaker 2: better than women. But realistically, we feel that, you know, 100 00:05:42,800 --> 00:05:45,800 Speaker 2: this is one way to get more women with their 101 00:05:45,839 --> 00:05:48,560 Speaker 2: finger on the doorn daughter, as Eleanga Rubin said, she 102 00:05:48,760 --> 00:05:51,719 Speaker 2: was on our advisory committee because we really want to, 103 00:05:52,160 --> 00:05:57,200 Speaker 2: you know, help women become bigger investors within Australia at 104 00:05:57,200 --> 00:05:59,680 Speaker 2: the moment. You know, as you said, there's around nineteen 105 00:05:59,720 --> 00:06:03,040 Speaker 2: percent that some figures say that are on eleven percent 106 00:06:03,080 --> 00:06:06,000 Speaker 2: of female farm managers in Australia. But I think by 107 00:06:06,040 --> 00:06:08,680 Speaker 2: having this sort of pool of capital, we can really 108 00:06:08,760 --> 00:06:13,159 Speaker 2: encourage more women to manage money. But also on the 109 00:06:13,200 --> 00:06:15,800 Speaker 2: other thing that we're trying to do with our investment committee. 110 00:06:16,080 --> 00:06:18,440 Speaker 2: At the moment, it's some fifty to fifty. We have 111 00:06:18,600 --> 00:06:22,359 Speaker 2: some amazing women who are CIOs of super funds that 112 00:06:22,440 --> 00:06:24,320 Speaker 2: are going to be on that investment committee. But we're 113 00:06:24,400 --> 00:06:29,520 Speaker 2: really hoping to get more women to become supermanent observers, 114 00:06:29,560 --> 00:06:32,880 Speaker 2: to learn how to actually construct a portfolio, how to 115 00:06:33,000 --> 00:06:37,120 Speaker 2: manage risk, all of those things that may make everybody 116 00:06:37,160 --> 00:06:39,479 Speaker 2: better investors, but we want to do it for women. 117 00:06:40,120 --> 00:06:41,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, there are kind of quite a few 118 00:06:41,680 --> 00:06:43,440 Speaker 1: paths to what you just said there. So it's about 119 00:06:44,560 --> 00:06:46,800 Speaker 1: encouraging women to be fund managers. For one of a 120 00:06:46,800 --> 00:06:52,200 Speaker 1: better term, it's about providing money to people who need it. 121 00:06:52,200 --> 00:06:55,680 Speaker 1: But also the whole philanthropic thing about investing in Australia. 122 00:06:55,760 --> 00:06:59,720 Speaker 1: In the US is such an incredible history of philanthropy. 123 00:07:00,120 --> 00:07:04,200 Speaker 1: Now we have some great philanthropists here, but what Jeff 124 00:07:04,200 --> 00:07:06,920 Speaker 1: Wilson has done is kind of a first. We don't 125 00:07:06,920 --> 00:07:07,800 Speaker 1: have a long history of it. 126 00:07:07,920 --> 00:07:10,720 Speaker 2: Caroline, I would agree with you, but you know, there's 127 00:07:10,760 --> 00:07:14,320 Speaker 2: some amazing individuals out there who are very philanthropic, and 128 00:07:14,360 --> 00:07:17,480 Speaker 2: I think with these vehicles, you know everybody you know 129 00:07:17,560 --> 00:07:20,880 Speaker 2: Son every day philath fists. Everybody can be a philathpist. 130 00:07:22,040 --> 00:07:24,280 Speaker 2: People need money to live, so you want to do 131 00:07:24,400 --> 00:07:27,760 Speaker 2: well with your investments. But also if you can give 132 00:07:27,800 --> 00:07:30,880 Speaker 2: to the community and do good, I mean, that's an 133 00:07:30,920 --> 00:07:34,120 Speaker 2: amazing model. And I think with these models you can 134 00:07:34,200 --> 00:07:37,200 Speaker 2: do that. And as you said before, we've given you 135 00:07:37,680 --> 00:07:40,960 Speaker 2: nearly ninety million to not for profits and we've managed 136 00:07:41,000 --> 00:07:43,520 Speaker 2: to give a really good return to our shareholders. So 137 00:07:44,160 --> 00:07:46,880 Speaker 2: I think these models can definitely be replicated, and I 138 00:07:46,880 --> 00:07:50,880 Speaker 2: think everybody can get involved, and I think that's a 139 00:07:50,960 --> 00:07:52,360 Speaker 2: wonderful vehicle to offer. 140 00:07:53,280 --> 00:07:54,920 Speaker 1: So if I was going to put money into the 141 00:07:54,920 --> 00:07:57,160 Speaker 1: fund that I kind of get how it's invested. I 142 00:07:57,320 --> 00:07:59,440 Speaker 1: like the model. I like what I want to know 143 00:07:59,520 --> 00:08:01,760 Speaker 1: is weird is the money go to charities? As a 144 00:08:01,760 --> 00:08:04,280 Speaker 1: generic term, how do you work out who gets the 145 00:08:04,320 --> 00:08:06,360 Speaker 1: money and who has gotten that ninety million dollars? 146 00:08:06,800 --> 00:08:10,880 Speaker 2: Well, it's actually very long process that we go through. 147 00:08:11,240 --> 00:08:14,760 Speaker 2: So maybe if I talked to Future Generation Global, because 148 00:08:14,760 --> 00:08:17,520 Speaker 2: actually we just freed through that whole process. So we 149 00:08:17,560 --> 00:08:20,840 Speaker 2: put out and expressions of interest because we really wanted 150 00:08:20,840 --> 00:08:24,880 Speaker 2: to fund use mental health prevention. As you would probably know, 151 00:08:24,960 --> 00:08:27,559 Speaker 2: one percent of the government dollar in terms of mental 152 00:08:27,560 --> 00:08:30,880 Speaker 2: health goes to prevention, the rest goes to intervention and treatment, 153 00:08:31,360 --> 00:08:34,040 Speaker 2: and so we wanted to make a difference in that area. 154 00:08:34,160 --> 00:08:36,560 Speaker 2: So when we put in expressions of interest app three 155 00:08:36,640 --> 00:08:39,640 Speaker 2: years ago to the market, we said, you know, please, 156 00:08:39,720 --> 00:08:42,240 Speaker 2: you know, write in and we would love to find 157 00:08:42,600 --> 00:08:44,720 Speaker 2: more about what you do and would like to fund you. 158 00:08:45,160 --> 00:08:47,560 Speaker 2: And we had a theory of change. We basically had 159 00:08:47,559 --> 00:08:50,319 Speaker 2: a body of evidence to show that if we invested 160 00:08:50,480 --> 00:08:53,320 Speaker 2: in certain areas we can make a real difference in 161 00:08:53,440 --> 00:08:56,559 Speaker 2: prevention and mental health and well being. And so we've 162 00:08:56,600 --> 00:08:59,640 Speaker 2: now got forteen not for profits we fund and we've 163 00:08:59,640 --> 00:09:03,480 Speaker 2: actually just measured all of their impact you know, vary 164 00:09:03,559 --> 00:09:06,120 Speaker 2: with taking their short term, their medium term, and their 165 00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:09,199 Speaker 2: long term outcomes, and we know we've reached five point 166 00:09:09,240 --> 00:09:13,160 Speaker 2: three million young people in Australia around their mental health 167 00:09:13,360 --> 00:09:16,080 Speaker 2: and that's that is an amazing number and I think 168 00:09:16,080 --> 00:09:18,920 Speaker 2: we are one of the first to actually measure fourteen 169 00:09:19,000 --> 00:09:21,559 Speaker 2: not for profits in this way. It's just as you 170 00:09:21,600 --> 00:09:25,720 Speaker 2: said before, like we measure our fund manager's performance, everybody says, okay, right, 171 00:09:25,840 --> 00:09:28,800 Speaker 2: we've got one percent above the or lords for FGX, 172 00:09:28,800 --> 00:09:31,600 Speaker 2: that's fantastic, but what about your social impact? And now 173 00:09:31,600 --> 00:09:33,880 Speaker 2: we can say what we're doing. And we intend to 174 00:09:33,880 --> 00:09:36,440 Speaker 2: do the same with future generational women. You know, we 175 00:09:36,559 --> 00:09:39,400 Speaker 2: will go out market. We will you know, look at 176 00:09:39,400 --> 00:09:42,800 Speaker 2: what's out there, and then we will select maybe ten 177 00:09:42,880 --> 00:09:45,160 Speaker 2: not for profits and we will fund them on a 178 00:09:45,200 --> 00:09:48,720 Speaker 2: three to four year basis of untied funding, which is 179 00:09:48,760 --> 00:09:52,520 Speaker 2: best for unprofit practice, and we will measure what they achieve. 180 00:09:53,000 --> 00:09:55,840 Speaker 2: And that's something I'm really excited about because I think 181 00:09:55,880 --> 00:09:58,320 Speaker 2: there's so many amazing not for profits in Australia that 182 00:09:58,360 --> 00:10:00,800 Speaker 2: are doing great work and we will find out more. 183 00:10:01,800 --> 00:10:03,680 Speaker 1: I mean, I think you said five million then, which 184 00:10:03,679 --> 00:10:05,600 Speaker 1: is set up a number hard to get your head around, 185 00:10:05,720 --> 00:10:07,760 Speaker 1: but I think I'm sure what you're saying that it's 186 00:10:07,760 --> 00:10:10,800 Speaker 1: not just the direct recipient. It might be the siblings 187 00:10:10,920 --> 00:10:13,319 Speaker 1: or the parents, or the carers or the school teachers, 188 00:10:13,480 --> 00:10:17,920 Speaker 1: people that live around that individual. They also benefit from 189 00:10:18,520 --> 00:10:22,480 Speaker 1: in this example intervention in youth mental health, Like it's 190 00:10:22,480 --> 00:10:24,679 Speaker 1: not just the individual, it's a whole community that can 191 00:10:24,720 --> 00:10:25,080 Speaker 1: win in this. 192 00:10:25,640 --> 00:10:29,080 Speaker 2: It definitely can be. And also we don't know with 193 00:10:29,200 --> 00:10:31,480 Speaker 2: the way we count whether the same child has gone 194 00:10:31,480 --> 00:10:34,360 Speaker 2: to three different services. So for example, if you have 195 00:10:34,480 --> 00:10:36,680 Speaker 2: reached Out, I mean reach Out is sort of the 196 00:10:36,760 --> 00:10:39,880 Speaker 2: number one of mental health charity that basically us a 197 00:10:39,920 --> 00:10:42,440 Speaker 2: platform so you can go to them as many times 198 00:10:42,440 --> 00:10:46,480 Speaker 2: as you like. But it's an easy one to contact. 199 00:10:46,520 --> 00:10:49,679 Speaker 2: So a lot of young people, especially during COVID and 200 00:10:49,800 --> 00:10:53,680 Speaker 2: since then, will reach out as the naborcauisd winch set 201 00:10:53,800 --> 00:10:56,960 Speaker 2: like that. But yeah, so we can travel that now 202 00:10:57,040 --> 00:10:59,160 Speaker 2: and it is really great for us to know and 203 00:10:59,200 --> 00:11:01,920 Speaker 2: our shareholders and also for the not for profits themselves 204 00:11:01,960 --> 00:11:04,480 Speaker 2: to measure their impact to see what they can do 205 00:11:04,559 --> 00:11:08,880 Speaker 2: better or what they're doing really well. It's measurement is 206 00:11:09,280 --> 00:11:11,320 Speaker 2: a great thing. It just helps you all the time. 207 00:11:12,120 --> 00:11:13,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, look, it's a great initiative and good lik up 208 00:11:13,960 --> 00:11:15,839 Speaker 1: with it. Caroline, thank you for joining Fear and Greed. 209 00:11:16,200 --> 00:11:17,920 Speaker 2: Thank you so much, lovely to be here. 210 00:11:18,280 --> 00:11:21,560 Speaker 1: That's Caroline Gurney, CEO our Future Generation Group. This is 211 00:11:21,559 --> 00:11:24,199 Speaker 1: the Fear and Greed business Interview. Remember this is general 212 00:11:24,240 --> 00:11:27,320 Speaker 1: information only, and you should always seek professional advice before 213 00:11:27,320 --> 00:11:30,360 Speaker 1: making investment decisions. Join us every morning for the full 214 00:11:30,400 --> 00:11:32,920 Speaker 1: episode our Fear and Greed. Daily business years for people 215 00:11:32,920 --> 00:11:35,880 Speaker 1: who make their own decisions. I'm sure i Elma enjoy 216 00:11:35,880 --> 00:11:37,319 Speaker 1: your day.